#Works with Home Assistant ?

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

muted pelican
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What does "Works with Home Assistant" on the package really mean? Sure, it's a cool marketing thing that could benefit both HA and the hardware maker. But it means nothing technically. I recently made a bad assumption that it meant that functions available using the device native app would be available when using the HA integration. Shame on me for assuming. I will never again believe "Works with Home Assistant" to be more than marketing speak that has zero value. Home Assistant, you dropped the ball here. This could have been a good thing.

Further, the vendor was quick to say "...officially tested and certified for HA compatibility with Home Assistant Team." I've used Home Assistant for a very long time and am disappointed to see them selling out.

fleet juniper
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What vendor and/or device are you specifically talking about?

blazing folio
coarse ginkgo
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Miranda here (responsible for the WWHA program). Happy to hear feedback always if you can share further details

fast kayak
fleet juniper
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-# For reference.

fast kayak
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Well, there's really nothing more to say here. 2 way audio is not supported in HA for any camera and it seems like this and the FB post are referring to that exact feature.

coarse ginkgo
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Yes this ^ these cameras were tested extensively for months with our team. It’s just that two way audio is simply not possible in HA. Although we always take feedback like this on board and we are working to better showcase the list of devices and where some functions are missing in HA. Reolink are actively engaging with us to help us work on two way audio as well but there are many architectural factors to consider when trying to develop that on our end. I’d also just encourage people to consider that the 500CH fee is approx 540 euros /640usd. This is per partner not per device. So just imagine how many partners we would need for this to be ‘profit making’ or ‘selling out’.

muted pelican
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My OP DOES NOT have to do with any particular device or function as many have incorrectly assumed!!! It IS NOT seeking advice about 2-way audio or any other function on this or any other device. Reolink 2-way audio was given only as an EXAMPLE of a product function that doesn't work with HA but does work with the OEM app.

Please read the first sentence and take it at face value... What does "Works with Home Assistant" on the package really mean? That is, and always has been, the question. This applies to many devices that have purchased the right to display the badge.

What is the criteria to be considered "working"? Please do not link to the program sales promotion page (https://works-with.home-assistant.io). It does NOT provide any technical details and does not answer the question. "Works With Home Assistant helps clearly indicate to the large Home Assistant community which devices provide the best smart home experience, both now and in the future." Provides nothing specific.

Are the only criteria; being available, use local communication, be updateable and being end device? Nothing about functionality or useability? If all an OEM must do is meet these few criteria then the annual subscription fee appears to me to be potentially profitable. HA established the price, I doubt seriously that they chose a price that would lose money. I only bring up the fiscal end in response to Miranda's implying there is no profit. I don't care about that.

I'm curious now why the question seems to have hit such a hot button receiving such hostility and attempts to divert. It is not a difficult question to answer. What is the criteria for any device to be considered "working"?

fleet juniper
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As a user I interpret "working" to function within the scope of the integration without special workaround.

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Example: when Matter did not support power metering, it was still considered working without, even when the vendor app provided it.

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Meaning: it was working in the scope of the integration, protocol or whatever it is called in the specific case.

muted pelican
pearl plume
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Without any other examples, it's a bit hard to think outside of the Reolink example.
And on the integration page it is clearly stated what is supported and which limitations there are known.
Do you have an example where a Works With Home Assistant product doesn't work according to the information provided in the relevant integration?

vast coyote
fast kayak
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What's even more telling is that you're blocking people who provide these answers to you when they also call you out for what you're really doing: Trying to stir the pot

blazing folio
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Sorry, but posting to each platform with this was lame. It makes it appear like the goal is to broadcast and not discuss. Asking why it hit such a hot button now is disingenuous.

WWHA also means a deliberate effort and intention to cooperate...with an *open-source platform *. "We will work with you" as in "do the work".
It means they see Home Assistant as valid, and they will continue to make a deliberate effort to pay attention and listen.

Yes, it's per device but you found a single exception and continue to claim that exception doesn't doesn't matter. What else do you have to demonstrate that the label is as worthless as you say it is?

vast coyote
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I'm curious now why the question seems to have hit such a hot button receiving such hostility and attempts to divert. It is not a difficult question to answer.
I mean, it also has to do with tone of voice, this isn't trying to "just ask a question" like "Hey, I bought device X and it has been certified but y is missing, how comes?". That approach would've left you with different results

fast kayak
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This question could have been asked so many other ways without it causing a flame fest on every platform. Notice you're getting downvoted on reddit, you've been in mutliple fights on FB. Yet you claim you "aren't here to argue".

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but that's what you're doing, arguing

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and whenever anyone provides any counterpoint, you shut down and say "But no one answered my question". Even though the question has been addressed multiple times by multiple people inside and outside the organization

fleet juniper
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And claiming that other users' interpretations don't matter... why does your though?

fast kayak
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Everything here screams Troll

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Not to mention, this has continued for over 24 hours at this point

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you keep coming back on all platforms

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While your at it, you mine as well make a post on the forums too. Then you can have a 4th place to argue people in

pearl plume
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Don't forget X and Bluesky!

fast kayak
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Are the only criteria; being available, use local communication, be updateable and being end device? Nothing about functionality or useability?

If you provide the api, that provides the functionality. That's what an API is. The usability comes from HA's native functionality on devices in combination with what HA offers through the UI. HA dictates what devices can or cannot do.

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I'm curious now why the question seems to have hit such a hot button receiving such hostility and attempts to divert. It is not a difficult question to answer. What is the criteria for any device to be considered "working"?
The question did not hit a hot button. The way you approached the situation did. You blatantly went to all the social medias that you use and copy/pasted the most passive aggressive slap in the face question you could to garner support for whatever agenda you have.

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That addresses all your questions, so are you gonna keep arguing people on all platforms now @muted pelican or are you going to move on?

gaunt ivy
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One other example too is ThirdReality which makes Zigbee devices. Zigbee devices are well-supported in HA (via ZHA or zigbee2mqtt, for example), but if manufacturers support firmware updates for their devices, they are often only focusing on functionality with their own hub, and updates can actually negatively impact how they perform in ZHA or zigbee2mqtt. However, ThirdReality actually considers ZHA and zigbee2mqtt when releasing firmware updates.

rare mauve
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Don't feed the troll, I think the question is well answered 🤷‍♂️

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And the option to change to Google, Amazon, etc... ecosystems are always there to really feel the difference 🤷‍♂️

fast kayak
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That will just send him into a repetitive loop of "but this is about HA"

coral heart
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@muted pelican What answer are you looking for, bro? You keep claiming no one has answered it, multiple people have actually done so, which means there's an answer here you want and you're asking the wrong questions.

I really dislike having to field a question from a person who's been answered multiple times on 3 different platforms - this eats into my work time and it's honestly exhausting because now we have to watch 3 separate conversations. Either ask the right question or I'm just going to lock this down as non-productive per Rule 8.

short trellis
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don't feed the troll.
/thread