Alternative to Tuya (and various rebrand) touch smart switches

[blissful falcon]

Hello! I'll start with saying I'm in the US. So, I've had a Hubitat for some basic stuff for several years now and recently bought a new home and switched over to a HA Yellow. I was poking around for a few simple light switches to start expanding my setup, and came across the Moes ZigBee touch switch line which, is just rebranded Tuya I've come to understand. Now, I'll say that these have been working just fine for me, save a few caveats:

First, they don't actually act as Zigbee Routers. HA registers them as end points, despite their claims that they will route when used with a neutral wire, which they are.

Second, they don't seem to have an offering that will actually function properly as a three-way without using their app.

Third, they have a poor reputation which gives me pause despite not having major issues myself, so I'd want to avoid getting invested in their product line if it's just going to bite me later.

However, all that said, the main problem I'm running in to is that there just isn't anything else on the market that I can find that matches their aesthetic. I am a big, big fan of how the switches look. Black background on a glass panel with a soft blue LED is chef's kiss for my personal tastes, and I am struggling to find anything remotely similar that isn't the same exact Tuya switch with a different label.

I'm looking to see if anyone might have recommendations for similar looking devices or options I have to make the Tuya stuff a bit less "bad"? I'm also open to DIY solutions that get me close.

[blissful falcon]

I guess as a side question, I couldn't find a definitive answer if Livolo was just rebranded Tuya stuff or if they were their own thing.

[gaunt acorn]

You're getting caught out by a common misconception because of the way the manufacturers brand their products on eg Aliexpress

Tuya is more of a platform than a manufacturer - they don't manufacturer much, maybe not anything

Think of "Tuya" as "Works with Tuya" not "Made by Tuya"... it's more akin to HomeKit or SmartThings etc

[blissful falcon]

Hm, I see.

There's dozens of brands all selling the exact same switch, a lot of comments on Reddit and such just call them "tuya rebrands" so I had assumed that they were making the boards or something. Neither here nor there at this point, I suppose.

That is helpful though.

[gaunt acorn]

It's kinda the same thing, they're just white label rebrands of a generic switch, rather than Tuya stuff rebranded

Personally I'm of the opinion that Tuya-ecosystem stuff should be assumed to be low quality until proven otherwise. That's not to say it's bad, I use a ton of it and have at least 10 devices in this room... but I hesitate to use it with mains switches

It's fine for battery devices and low voltage (USB, 12V, maybe 24V) but not something I'm trusting with 230V (or 120V in the US) personally. I'd rather spend the extra £20/switch for a "proper" brand and reduce the chances of setting my family home on fire

[blissful falcon]

I see that claim a lot, but have also never seen any documented evidence of the switches failing in a catastrophic way like that. They seem, at least to me, robust enough for the job they are designed to do. I understand the "why take the risk" aspect of things though. I suppose that brings it back to the options for a switch that isn't considered low quality, but has the aesthetic I'm looking for.

Livolo seems to be a decent option, but as far as I can tell they aren't distributing to the US at the moment.

[gaunt acorn]

It's more just that you're running high voltage through cheap equipment. Obviously if you want to do that, that's up to you - but when ordering from AliExpress (or buying from someone who has) you don't know if you're actually getting the claimed manufacturer

For me, it's just not worth the risk of a badly made device shorting out and causing a fire, however small that risk is, it's not worth saving a measly $10 per device

I'm not gonna judge you if you disagree, just giving a perspective

[blissful falcon]

I didn't buy from aliexpress, but yes I understand the concern, but don't see the evidence to support it, just a bunch of claims of "this one costs more so it's clearly better". I do my own testing, however, so I'm less worried and know how to spot and prevent faulty equipment from being installed. Not everyone has that skillset.

The ones I got are Moes branded, which seems to be slightly better quality than some of the others.

And I'm not using their wifi ones as those were junk. The zigbee stuff seems to be pretty solid, outside the bad firmware.

[blissful falcon]

In any event, doesn't look like there are any known alternatives to suggest, so I'll close this and keep my eyes open for anything new popping up.