I need suggestions for smart plugs so I can monitor some individual devices, as well as suggestions to be able to monitor PV/batteries (I may use victron gx to do it later one but I need something cheaper for now) and my inverter and generator AC outputs so I know what power is coming from solar/my generator.
#Smart plug for energy monitoring + hardware for monitoring solar
slate oracle
spice flame
I need suggestions for smart plugs so I can monitor some individual devices, as ...
you should include your country when asking stuff about mains power
slate oracle
you should include your country when asking stuff about mains power
oh right lol. 120v 60hz, US standard
spice flame
shelly make some great stuff. including smart plugs, for higher power cable monitoring like AC output from an invertor or generator then a CT clamp based tracker is a pretty good option.
slate oracle
shelly make some great stuff. including smart plugs, for higher power cable moni...
I don't know what brands I should be looking for the clamp
spice flame
I don't know what brands I should be looking for the clamp
shelly make some, the Shelly EM Gen3 for example
i have a couple of the gen1 versions and they are good, i see no reeason why the gen3 versions shouldnt be better 🙂
slate oracle
shelly make some, the `Shelly EM Gen3` for example
that might be a problem
spice flame
that might be a problem
you have some extreme conditions you need it to work in? how extreme?
slate oracle
you have some extreme conditions you need it to work in? how extreme?
gets up to 95% humidity and it shouldn't hit 40C but that's surprisingly low for electronics
spice flame
I think there might be some difference between "humidity" and "relative humidity" your not taking into account.
95% is almost a steam room
you could seal it rated enclosure i guess. thats not going to help the heat issue though
slate oracle
I think there might be some difference between "humidity" and "relative humidity...
I don't think it matters https://www.weather.gov/wrh/timeseries?site=TXKF&hours=72
spice flame
doesn't mean that everywhere will be that. you can measure anywhere on the wire
for example it looks like normal US electrical panels are rated for 60%.
slate oracle
doesn't mean that everywhere will be that. you can measure anywhere on the wire
the house it typically open
spice flame
the gen1 doesnt have a humidity rating if that makes you feel any better 😛 - https://us.shelly.com/products/shelly-em-2-x-120a-clamp?variant=49666054947157
supports woth 50a and 120a clamps too
slate oracle
the gen1 doesnt have a humidity rating if that makes you feel any better 😛 - ht...
why are there so many options lol
actually is the shelly em the only energy monitor?
for the clamp for my needs, I
mean
spice flame
the pro is a din rail mounted unit. the 3EM's are designed for 3 phase. although they can be used for monitoring 3 single phase circuits too.
there are other manufactures that make clamp based monitors. athom make esp32 based unit running esphome in a 2 way and a 6 way model
https://www.athom.tech/blank-1/2-ch-energy-meter-made-for-esphome
https://www.athom.tech/blank-1/6-ch-energy-meter-made-for-esphome
I have a 6 way model which worked okay in testing but its accuracy is not as good as the shelly. specially at higher currents.
i was gunna use it for a project but it got shelved so dont have any long term usage info
slate oracle
all I really need is clamp based (and some smart plugs to monitor energy) for the inverter/generator
spice flame
athom also make smart plugs with monitoring (with and without relays)
slate oracle
they also seem way cheaper
spice flame
i am not saying athom is bad but shelly has a very high quality and you pay for that
slate oracle
what's the difference?
spice flame
in usability? based on my experience, the shelly stuff tends to be more accurate, have a better lifespan. doesn't require any calibration.
if i want to have something that just does its job well and without a fuss then shelly is good.
if i want something i can fully customise and will be messing around with then esphome based stuff is great
most shelly stuff is made in the EU too (Bulgaria) so probably has better quality control as a matter of procedure
i use both esphome based stuff and shelly stuff in my setup and both are great but theres definetly some stuff i prefer shelly for. when stuff in inside panels and walls etc...
slate oracle
I was already going to get an empiria vue and flash it with esp home for the panel
spice flame
yeah, be sure to check the hardware revision you get with those. they have different flashing proceedures i think
heard some good things about them though
slate oracle
vue 3 is the newest, unless there's another revicion deeper down
like a board revision or something
spice flame
i think theres only 1 rev of the 3. but you gotta manually tap onto the board to flash it
slate oracle
i think theres only 1 rev of the 3. but you gotta manually tap onto the board to...
yeah it's like that with all of them. except with rev 3 tx goes o tx an rx goes to rx. with the others apparently it was swapped
willow swan
If you want something less established for power monitoring, I would recommend the tuya zigbee smart sockets which you can get from aliexpress. I bought them pre-tariff era, but I'm guessing these are still a few bucks.
There look like this:
I monitor power usages of a bunch of items and it's been working fairly well for sometime now:
there are wifi variants of these as well if you don't use zigbee.
slate oracle
If you want something less established for power monitoring, I would recommend t...
I wanted both forms, the clamp and normal plugs
I have two inverters, actually. one of them just takes a a normal plug so that's why
slate oracle
There look like this:
there's a LOT of options
slate oracle
I monitor power usages of a bunch of items and it's been working fairly well for...
is that with HA?
hollow dirge
"recommend" and "tuya" are two words that are rarely in the same sentence unless combined with the phrase "running away from"
zigbee tuya devices misbehave and flood the zone with errant signal. wifi tuya devices you are beholden to someone reverse engineering the device type or even specific individual device for support.
and on top of that tuya has little in quality assurance as tuya freely licenses its firmware platform and does not then check if any licensors are making devices that won't malfunction so for numerous reasons, caveat emptor
i say all this but i also have a tuya-based RGB lightstrip controller in the home, it's mostly fine besides the fact that i had to wire it backwards for color to display correctly.
slate oracle
zigbee tuya devices misbehave and flood the zone with errant signal. wifi tuya d...
well by all means suggest me some smart plugs and clamp meters so I have multiple options for both
hollow dirge
iunno i use eve energy plugs around the house and i don't use them on any high power appliances but they're Good Enough ™️
for whatever it's worth they're the one Thread device i have never ever had to reboot to get them to reappear on the network
slate oracle
finding good plugs is surprisingly difficult
willow swan
there's a LOT of options
Aye, if you want the one I specifically got, it's this: https://www.aliexpress.us/item/3256806857854389.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.order_list_main.35.540f1802M8jzMj&gatewayAdapt=glo2usa (make sure you pick the right version you want, i.e., wifi or zigbee)
hollow dirge
i will note Eve Energy plugs are Actually UL Certified and I think using these things are A Bad Idea
willow swan
is that with HA?
Yes, it's a custom graph in HA via HACS (mini-graph-card)
I may have been lucky, I won't disagree with yahooeny's comments on Tuya, but my experience has been more positive than negative with it. I have 12 Tuya devices, and the only reason why I have this many is due to the fact that it's annoyingly difficult to find zigbee devices (I live in a dense city apartment, wifi devices will not work for me).
hollow dirge
i just would not trust anything of this nature that has not been UL tested
willow swan
That being said, these devices are power metering, motion sensors, temp/humidity sensors, door sensors 🙂 I like sensors 😛 Anyways, the point I'm trying to impress upon is, I have no idea at a large scale how dependable these cheap Tuya devices are, but at the scale that I work with, I've only had one odd ball, one particular power meter device, that sometimes just unpairs itself.
hollow dirge
ok i'm not really talking about zigbee network reliability here i'm talking about "Will This Thing Burn My House Down"
willow swan
I hear you, the max power I've pushed through one of these power metering devices is 850 watts
to be fair, I was quite nervous the first time pushing that much power (and I do have a fire ext on hand as well).
but it's been swell for now
slate oracle
Aye, if you want the one I specifically got, it's this: https://www.aliexpress.u...
I can't get anything from ali anyway. I really should have specified
slate oracle
i will note Eve Energy plugs are Actually UL Certified and I think using these t...
are there any closer to $20 per plug that are still good?
willow swan
Ah, are you looking for WiFi plugs or other methods of connectivity ?
I’ve not tested these, but you can get the tplinks kasa smart plugs for sub 20 bucks on amazon
slate oracle
well ethernet would be a bit of a hassle for a plug so yeah, wifi. Bluetooth would be a little harder with trying to connect everything
Kasa has them for $7.50 per plug but that feels too low https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-Kasa-Smart-Wifi-Plug/dp/B07RCNB2L3
willow swan
I bought the Tuya ones for 3 bucks back then.
lol
Tplink isn’t a 2 bit brand tho, presumably they would be safer to use
How much of power draw are you looking at per plug ?
I think the tplink ones are rated at 15A (tho it would be a bit scary to push that much through one of these plugs)
slate oracle
depends on the plug. emporia says it can do 15A but only 10A continuous but others just say 15A with no mention of a coninuous safe rating
willow swan
The tuya one, as I mentioned I’ve pushed 850 watts so about 7.7A continuous for 45 mins (it’s my water heater, that’s how long it takes to boil the water)
I’ve not gone higher on that, I know you’re not looking at tuya, just saying assuming the tplink ones are a lot more safer and those are certified, it should be ok.
You could look at the Phillips hue plus, 25 bucks a piece looks like on Amazon
But it’s BT tho so maybe not
slate oracle
apparently it's supported. just need to connect it to my wifi https://www.amazon.com/Monitoring-Compatible-SmartThings-Tapo-P115/dp/B0D7FZ97T5
apparently kasa and tapo are both tp-link?
willow swan
Yep
slate oracle
that changes things a bit. kasa isn't a no name brand
spice flame
I definitely do NOT recommend kasa/tapo plugs
willow swan
lol
spice flame
there were pretty well supported for a while but some changes recently have made people have alot of problems
slate oracle
oh that's fun
slate oracle
I definitely do NOT recommend kasa/tapo plugs
oh that's even more fun
willow swan
At this rate, I think using your finger for switching and math for power metering might be the way to go
slate oracle
fr
spice flame
kasa was the more open version of stuff. but thats bad for cloud dependency so they are moving stuff over to tapo
the newer models and even newer firmware on older models. has been causing a shit load of issues
willow swan
@slate oracle so why can’t you get anything from aliex?
slate oracle
location stuff. hard as shit to ship from china
currently paying shipping that costs more than the item itself
I don't understand how that happened
willow swan
Ah you can get the tuya smart plugs from Amazon (Amazon US at least)
Just so much more expensive
10A only tho
spice flame
and thats a wifi version. tuya wifi requires china server
willow swan
but no reviews of it combusting
slate oracle
and thats a wifi version. tuya wifi requires china server
gross
willow swan
go zigbee 😛
slate oracle
this shouldn't be this hard lol
willow swan
it's quite annoying to be honest
I wanted smart power outlets
which were nigh impossible to actually find
so I settled for smart plugs, which I bumped into the issue you're facing now
plus, I can't do wifi at where I'm at
so I took a gamble and bought these tuya ones, and fortunately they work fine
you could try enbrighten smart plugs
but if I remember correctly, they do not do power metering
only on/off
err, I'm not sure whether they sell that brand outside of the US
slate oracle
but if I remember correctly, they do not do power metering
that's the sole reason I want them
spice flame
some do and some dont. some do but only if you use their hub that connects to china.
you loose so much time trying to save some money. in most cases its really not worth it.
slate oracle
I need something not chinese
spice flame
if you get something esphome based, it may be built in china but its custom firmware so you don't have the dependency issue. on a big scale consumer grade product: shelly is good. and built in EU.
ikea have some zigbee based stuff. i think it says on the site that it "needs the hub to work" but it doesnt. it just needs a zigbee network but they want to sell to normal people who dont know what a zigbee network is so sell the hub to make it work.
slate oracle
per plug?
spice flame
sounds about right. it would be super cool if they released a new version in the gen4 lineup but i am not sure it will happen
willow swan
they have the gen4 out
spice flame
they have the gen4 out
they are slowly adding to the range though
willow swan
that supports zigbee, I've been checking since I'm looking for in-outlet switches
spice flame
yeah the gen4 supporting zigbee in addition to other stuff is very awesome. but no smartplug version in that gen
slate oracle
jeez
willow swan
well, these are the light side stuff, you want the dark side stuff, it's zigbee tuya
spice flame
cant speak for the US. but in the UK the 4 pack of them usually goes on offer around holidays and on the amazon shop on prime day and stuff. so i bought a few when they were cheaper
slate oracle
reddit is also suggesting sonoff
spice flame
if your happy with wifi then athom stuff is decent.. although not sure how tarrif situation effects it
esphome. so you can customise it a bit too if you want
willow swan
I think Athena exclusively wants wifi support
slate oracle
yeah I have no idea how I'd connect it to HA and you can't exactly network bluetooth
spice flame
they make a no relay, monitoring only version too HERE which is good if your not going to be switching stuff. specifically inductive loads
relays don's take kindly to inductive loads
slate oracle
https://www.athom.tech/blank-1/us-v2-plug-for-esphome
so I guess anthom for both?
and it's $10 per plug which is totally doable
spice flame
can always grab a couple and see how you like them
you dont have to pick one and buy loads of them straight away
slate oracle
I mean I don't have an option to just "try" stuff. I have to get what works from the start
I only need two anyway
willow swan
Is this like a Yoda thing? There is no try, do or do not?
slate oracle
bsaically
shipping here is extremely expensive so I have to be absolutely sure before I do
spice flame
i dont have anyhthing bad to say about athom stuff. but havent used a huge amount of it.
but alot of people have been getting them recently without complaint. they have alot of versions for various world plugs and have monitor only ones too so alot of people like the varity
slate oracle
is athom even on amazon?
willow swan
It looks like what you want, wifi, 16A (tho if you're in the US/CA, my guess is you're only looking for 15A)
spice flame
is athom even on amazon?
i dont think so
slate oracle
yeah that complicates things
slate oracle
It looks like what you want, wifi, 16A (tho if you're in the US/CA, my guess is ...
ironically we have 20A breakers here
willow swan
so do I, but for some reason, I can't find a 20A power receptacle in my house when I bought it
slate oracle
shelly does sell on amazon though
the problem with shelly is that nothing is clear about anything. they all look the same
spice flame
what do you mean? its all in the spec?
spice flame
the pro devices are generally din rail mounted
the wave stuff is zwave. dont bother with that stuff.
the ble stuff is low power sensors like door sensors and stuff
as for the generation stuff. newer gen generally is better but not every device type is in every gen
slate oracle
and pro?
spice flame
the pro devices are generally din rail mounted
slate oracle
what are they?
spice flame
they are versions of the device that are designed to be mounted onto din rail...
if you dont know what din rail is then you probably dont want them
slate oracle
I don't even know what these things are https://kb.shelly.cloud/knowledge-base/shelly-1-gen4
power monitors but they have so many versions
spice flame
the shelly 1 - is not a power monitor. its can be powered from ac or dc and its relay is dry contact so can switch a different power to that its running off of
the 1pm has power monitoring but its not dry contact so has to be powered by the power its also switching
slate oracle
these things are like smart plugs but behind outlets and light switches?
slate oracle
oh that's pretty neat. Hue defeats the purpose of lights though
willow swan
they go into power receptacles or light switches
spice flame
the i4 is a input switch monitor only, no relay
they have quite a big range but its all documented
slate oracle
that's cool af
spice flame
yeah shelly has some optional cloud stuff you can switch on if you want
i have it disabled on all my stuff as i just use HA for data
slate oracle
ah
spice flame
its totally optional. you can just switch it off.
it might be off by default tbh
i cant remember
willow swan
yeah I meant I was about to check until I saw your comment
willow swan
tho I guess if I was using it via zigbee, it's not really possible to report these metadata
spice flame
yeah if you use gen4 stuff and only use zigbee then its not contacting anyone
i let mine check for updates automatically (which then raises an message in HA) but you can switch that off too
willow swan
I'm ok with OTA
slate oracle
surely they have smart plugs
willow swan
I need to buy one of these and test it out
yeah shelly has smart plugs
either I or someone linked it earlier
lol
I forget
spice flame
slate oracle
no idea why it's not showing up on here
willow swan
their website for product navigation is....... bad.
like finding their gen4 stuff is really hard, I literally just use google search to navigate their website
slate oracle
is Sonoff also an option or did we just talk about that?
also what is zigbee and zwave?
willow swan
both of those are communication protocols
think of it as another way to connect to the devices
it solves some challenges that wifi may pose
for instance wifi eats a lot of power for battery operated devices
also wifi in densely populated areas can/may interfere with one another (it's mainly why I use zigbee)
I use to have a wifi light
50% of the time it will turn one when I want it to turn on.
just to give you an example of how much interference I had, anyways wikipedia has a good breakdown of these protocols
spice flame
if you use them you also need a coordinator device to enable your HA server to speak to them through
willow swan
and figure out which of the ways you want to set it up 😛
slate oracle
do I need extra hardware?
willow swan
yeah
slate oracle
heck
willow swan
it's typically a USB coordinator that you will get
so you just plug it into your HA machine
anyways it's a whole other subject that you want to take your time to look into before getting into it
but it's very snappy / fast in terms of responsiveness
and like I mentioned earlier, I have like a bunch of sensors thats zigbee
and you can do interesting stuff that happens really fast
so for instance, I have a door sensor, that when I open the door, and is it's sundown, it will turn on the apartment lights, so I don't walk into a dark apartment
stuff like that, happens really fast and snappy
slate oracle
I could use that lol
willow swan
also all my smart plugs communicate via zigbee, which is the graphs you saw earlier
slate oracle
I'd have to label each switch to know that a device is in there so I don't forget
spice flame
zigbee has a shorter range but its mesh. some devices are "routers" which expand your network range. the more router devices you have the bigger and more reliable the network is
willow swan
yeah
slate oracle
could do the same with wifi
willow swan
but I think all zigbee power plugs are routers, thats just a guess since all of mine are
slate oracle
I might have to go with sonoff since shelly doesnt' sell on amazon
willow swan
also you can get a zigbee IRblaster
tho I guess you can get a wifi IRblaster, not sure never looked
my gf always complains how humid it is in the summer
slate oracle
oh right they're chinese ugh
willow swan
so based on the humidity, I can automate when the AC turns on
to reduce the humidity, using an IRblaster to simulate a remote
again, all of this reliably happen on zigbee, none of these reliably happen on wifi for me lol
slate oracle
do I have to worry about sonoff sending stuff to china?
spice flame
for what sorry? an IR blaster?
spice flame
if its zigbee you are safe because it doesnt talk tcp/ip at all so it cant call anywhere
willow swan
looking at the comments on amazon
spice flame
i dont know about the wifi sonoff stuff
willow swan
some folks are saying you can flash the sonoff plug
with ESPHOME
but..... that would mean you are comfortable doing something like that
Dr. Nick
5.0 out of 5 stars Good for flashing to ESPHome
Reviewed in the United States on June 5, 2025
Verified Purchase
This is a great power monitoring smart plug if you are willing to flash ESPHome to "uncloud" it. This turns it into a locally controlled device that does not "call home" or require proprietary apps to function. Easy to take apart and reassemble after modding. Fixes many of the pain points described by other reviewers (poor WiFi, app pairing issues). Otherwise for the sake of privacy you are better off with a Zigbee model like the S31 Lite.
slate oracle
but..... that would mean you are comfortable doing something like that
I have to flash the emporia vue monitor I wanted to get anyway
spice flame
depends on what the process is for flaashing it
willow swan
yes but... you have to take the plug apart typically for ESPhome flashing
and you have to know how to flash it
it's not like a software / usb flash thingy
spice flame
do not open aa smartplug unless you seriously no what your doing
slate oracle
it's just a PCB
spice flame
the esp pins are referenced to mains voltage and can kill you
spice flame
plus they dont really go back together that well 😛
willow swan
but please do research about it
I'm just making assumptions on what I'm quickly reading
spice flame
there is no low voltage seperation
willow swan
you should probably seriously look into zigbee
the coordinators are not that expensive
and the setup isn't that bad, and I'm pretty sure 29749832748 people on discord can help if you bump into any issues
it would solve your privacy concern easily
spice flame
https://www.home-assistant.io/connectzbt1/ as a coordinator works and supports the project too
slate oracle
aaaaand no amazon
ffs
this is driving me mad
I need to sleep I'll be back later
willow swan
https://www.home-assistant.io/connectzbt1/ as a coordinator works and supports t...
it's never in stock.....
sleep is for the weak.
slate oracle
that doesn't look terrible
willow swan
it doesn't I guess, but don't you also need the flashing h/w pictured there?
slate oracle
wehat exactly do I need?
willow swan
don't get me wrong, unlike Michael I do like taking things apart
but, I'm not sure the effort here is worth it
the USB attached to the board, I'm guessing is the flashing hardware that you need to buy
to flash the sonoff device, which I assume is the one that looks like a plug in that image
spice flame
oh i certainly like taking things apart, i just know its not worth the risks for smart plugs
willow swan
I stand corrected then, but yeah... not worth the effort
spice flame
you can flash shelly stuff too to be fair
but again not worth it
just get something running esphome stock if you wanna go that route
slate oracle
just get something running esphome stock if you wanna go that route
I want to, but is it on amazon?
spice flame
why are you tied specifically to amazon?
slate oracle
why are you tied specifically to amazon?
I thought I takled about this already
spice flame
i may have missed it
slate oracle
I don't live an an area where i can just buy stuff from multiple sites like that. shipping is expensive
slate oracle
I'm wondering if I should abandon getting a smart plug and just get a clamp meter