GrubStomper29's OpenGL Sandbox

[gilded shell]

depends on how that would go on a resume

[night shoal]

doesnt matter

2d is 3d

the important bits are that you can explain how the graphics pipeline works

api doesnt matter

or how you would implement certain things to achieve certain things, like effects or techniques

[kind sparrow]

nobody really cares about the contents of your personal projects unless they are directly pertinent to the job duties

Otherwise it's just another software engineering project

which is still looked at favorably, it's just not going to give them a "wow this is precisely what we need" response

[gilded shell]

I see

[west trail]

btw, you may want to pack every has****Texturefrom your MaterialUbo into single uint to reduce size a bit

[gilded shell]

do you like the code so far

[west trail]

too raw imho, I started loading models only after abstracting buffers,vbo and such stuff

[kind sparrow]

Personal preference

I don't abstract that stuff much

I have a

struct Mesh
{
    std::vector<Vertex> m_vertices;
    std::vector<uint32_t> m_indices;
};

and a

struct GPUMesh
{
    GLuint m_vao;
    GLuint m_vbo;
    GLuint m_ebo;
};

and that's it

[west trail]

talking about this stuff

[kind sparrow]

What about it

If that's in a function and not copy/pasted then it's fine, I do the same

I have a function that just takes in a Mesh, does all that stuff, and spits out a GPUMesh

[west trail]

in main, multiple times creating and filling buffers by hand, I abstract that stuff into single line

[kind sparrow]

It's fine

He can clean it up later semantic-compression style

[gilded shell]

exactly

[west trail]

I know, but as of now -its raw to me

[kind sparrow]

I find it preferable to start with everything out in the open and create abstractions around emergent patterns

[gilded shell]

the effort to make some sort of abstraction is higher than just copy and pasting and changing what i need

if it gets to the point where it does obstruct and cause confusion then ofc its bad

[west trail]

thats why I put "imho" in there

[gilded shell]

yeah

you do have a valid point to an extent

i hate making it seem like “im right and smart and youre wrong and stupid”

just different coding styles

[gilded shell]

i have one variable named vertOffset and another named vertexOffset

[night shoal]

i hope you pick the right one after that incident

[gilded shell]

it didn't matter because I just needed to add both together

i believe vertOffset the amount of vertices already in the buffer

[night shoal]

vertexOffset just says something abuot some vertex Offset

the amount of verticles should be vertexCount

[gilded shell]

and vertexOffset is a parameter to add to each index, used for the amount of vertices already in the scene aside from just the model

so its more like local and scene offsets

[night shoal]

it do be conchfusing this way

[gilded shell]

indeed

ill fix it later™️

just switched to 8bit indices and im saving ~120mb with bistro, now its time to do this

[gilded shell]

I hate trying to name things

maybe just mPrimitiveUniforms and mBlendPrimitiveUniforms

[junior sparrow]

how about mTransparentUniforms

[gilded shell]

transparent is too vague, especially since alpha masked primitives can go in the opaque pipeline but blended primitives can't

[junior sparrow]

how so? It makes sense transparent means that you can see through it

[gilded shell]

you can also see through alpha masked triangles but not in the same way

[junior sparrow]

I mean yeah but it's not like a glass

[gilded shell]

i'm wasting development time bikeshedding names 😭

[junior sparrow]

I would separate masked from opaque and have own shader for masked. Discard is not cheap

In this area you are head of me. I treat every primitive as opaque

[gilded shell]

drawcall-time resolvable if-statements completely do away with this as far as I can tell, and it's not slow, so I don't care lol

[gilded shell]

once you implement deferred shading, adding weighed blend IOT will probably be pretty easy

std::vector<PrimitiveUniforms> mPrimitiveUniforms{};
std::vector<PrimitiveUniforms> mBlendedPrimitiveUniforms{};

settling with this

[junior sparrow]

Does OIT need separate framebuffer?

I have never came around to implement it

[gilded shell]

yeah, for weighed blended at least

[junior sparrow]

that sucks, but there isnt any other way

[gilded shell]

I hated every second of what i just did

[gilded shell]

still searching for gi solutions

scene voxelation is unacceptable imo

unless i can do it dynamically somehow

[night shoal]

RSM

[junior sparrow]

you can do it dynamicaly

[junior sparrow]

strong cope with this one

Light Propagation Volumes is much nicer

[gilded shell]

okay

@oak moat quick question. The result of these culling shaders is not only the new index buffers but also an array of parameters for the MDI?

[oak moat]

no it's just one mdi parameter

[gilded shell]

wouldn't that make it just di then

[oak moat]

yes

[gilded shell]

then I lose my draw_ID 🤔

gl_draw_id or wtv

[oak moat]

and you gain meshletID

[gilded shell]

uhhh

is that stored per triangle?

[oak moat]

per vertex

[gilded shell]

oh wow

actually

its probably not that big of a mem impact

[oak moat]

void main() {
  const uint meshletId = gl_VertexIndex >> 8;
  const uint primitiveId = gl_VertexIndex & 7;
}```

[gilded shell]

oh ig you could pull it that way

but i think meshopt doesn't consistently deliver meshlets with X amounnt of vertices

ig i could store padding vertices

[oak moat]

it doesn't matter

no it doesn't matter

[gilded shell]

huh?

[oak moat]

if you do that preprocessing step it doesn't matter

the data is packed

[gilded shell]

im trying to follow

gl_VertexIndex is defined by ogl, no?

[oak moat]

yes

[night shoal]

no

its gl_VertexID

gl_VertexIndex is bulkan

[gilded shell]

oh well same thing

[oak moat]

vulkan brainrot

[night shoal]

but yeah same thing, but ze compiler will not know it

[gilded shell]

if I can't specify it's value, then I don't understand how that data is packed in there anyways

let me think

[oak moat]

if you bind an index buffer, gl_VertexID is whatever the contents of the index buffer are

otherwise it's just counting the vertex index

[gilded shell]

I see

is there a paper on this I can read so im not constantly annoying you

[oak moat]

you can read Jasmine's blogpost on meshlets

[gilded shell]

zeux?

[oak moat]

https://jms55.github.io/posts/2024-06-09-virtual-geometry-bevy-0-14/#fill-cluster-buffers

I could also just write up a quick example in GL

[night shoal]

i need to learn this too at some point

[gilded shell]

you can do it quickly?

[oak moat]

I've done this a trillion times so it would be weirder if I couldn't

legit it's muscle memory at this point

my dreams are haunted by meshlets

[night shoal]

-meshlets +metis

[gilded shell]

let me see if this blog is enough first

i see, subcommands scale badly

bevy has a nice naming scheme

better than gltf's "primitives"

this is what i was looking for https://jms55.github.io/posts/2024-06-09-virtual-geometry-bevy-0-14/#result-writeout

ohhh I forgot im decoding the indices

so I can just put whatever in there anyways

I get it now

So in conclusion I need to use compute to build a single indirect draw parameter buffer and a large index buffer that is later used to decode meshlet/material IDs an whatnot as well as the actual vertices

now I just need to implement this yikes

[gilded shell]

what about an sdf bvh, can those be dynamic?

[junior sparrow]

sdf takes time to build there is a sdk from amd that should be fast https://gpuopen.com/fidelityfx-brixelizer/

voxelizing scene is rendering scene from 3 axis and writing color to 3d texture and thats it

[oak moat]

you can also just build the sdf itself offline and then just combine them in a global sdf at runtime

[junior sparrow]

also a option

[gilded shell]

i see

[gilded shell]

would this fare well with skinned meshes?

[oak moat]

perhaps

[gilded shell]

perhaps is scary

maybe i can mix BVHs?

sdf for static and something else for skinned

[gilded shell]

there is also this option

i imagine that would fail catastrophically and cause lag if the user just spun around really fast though

[gilded shell]

as some of you saw, I am now pulling vertices from an SSBO

I am getting this warning now though API, PERFORMANCE, MEDIUM, 131218: Program/shader state performance warning: Vertex shader in program 12 is being recompiled based on GL state.

I believe it started once I took the VBO out of the VAO

[kind sparrow]

It's probably fine

It doesn't sound like it's saying there is a performance issue, just that it is specializing your compiled shader for performance reasons and that this message is of medium-grade importance

It's probably medium because it's recompiling it on the fly which could cause hitches if it's happening at random points during gameplay or something

[west trail]

What are the advantages of pulling vertices from ssbo instead of vbo?

[gilded shell]

encoding additional info in indices

[oak moat]

the second you start doing something complex you die

hard to manage vertex types

[west trail]

How many vertex types do you need? At this point I have like 2 and cant imagine how you can overcomplicate that

[oak moat]

I mean even 2 is too much

do you suballocate buffers?

if you don't then you have no issues of course

[west trail]

Suballocate buffers for additional data?

[west trail]

One for animated and one for non animated objects, to spare some memory on joints and weights

[kind sparrow]

lvstri is a terminal bikeshedder he doesn't do animation

[west trail]

Ah

But i still dont get what he meant by "suballocate buffers"

[kind sparrow]

Perhaps he was referring to vertex buffers themselves rather than pipeline layouts

You can still have all your vertex data in one VBO even if you have multiple layouts

[west trail]

I am doing that, vertex type is getting automatically desided based on number of available animations in gltf and then my model structure receives that one vbo

(the code is a mess and anims still dont work)

[kind sparrow]

I mean allocating one VBO for the whole application and allocating chunks of data out of that pool

[gilded shell]

Im really only doing it to put some extra data in the bits of the indices

[oak moat]

the code is a mess
yes exactly

[west trail]

Im planning to do that too eventually

[west trail]

What data?

[gilded shell]

material/meshlet ID stuff

[west trail]

The code is a mess cause I have no clue how to properly implement animations, two vertex types have almost zero influence)

[oak moat]

I could give more concrete examples, but once you get to buffer suballocation then you'll get what I mean

[gilded shell]

im trying to break this draw batching into smaller steps since i dont have the time to write it all in one session

i think the next step could be to get the compute shaders up and establish their inputs

i think it’s two compute passes—meshlet culling then triangle culling

[gilded shell]

I think first the triangle cull pass

it would probably be easier to build off of that

@oak moat I need advice

are the meshlet cull and triangle cull in two different compute passes?

[oak moat]

you can forget about tri culling

get this thing to work

[gilded shell]

regardless I need to build the trangle buffer anyways

[oak moat]

no it's harder

like I said

get this to work first

no culling

[gilded shell]

well yeah I plan to skip the cull step for now

but still, don't I need to batch all the index buffers together into one big one so I can do the single renderpass?

[oak moat]

yes

but forget about culling

you will think about it later

[gilded shell]

then

[oak moat]

no thinking now

[gilded shell]

right right right

however

building the trangle buffer needs a compute pass

do you recommend one thread or whatever the right vocabulary is per triangle?

[oak moat]

yes

[gilded shell]

i see

thank you very much for your help

alright i wrote 5 lines of code im done for the day time to relax

[night shoal]

XD

[gilded shell]

all in on black

[night shoal]

good luck

[gilded shell]

i lost 😢

[night shoal]

back to coding then

[gilded shell]

nah im on minecraft now

ive been productive all day, its time to sit down

[night shoal]

[gilded shell]

i think

one invocation per triangle, as many invocations per work group as possible?

ill need to research

“After reading these section quite a few times over I find the ‘best’ solution is to maximize local invocation size and minimize number of work groups because you then tell the driver to omit the requirement of invocation sets being independent. Fewer requirements mean fewer rules for the platform when it parses your intent into an execution, which universially yield better (or the same) result.”

[gilded shell]

@oak moat Why don't I use a thread per meshlet and loop through all triangles from there? that sounds far easier and looks like what bevy does

sorry if my constant questions are annoying

[oak moat]

it's slower

as far as I've tested

[gilded shell]

i see

im not sure how to go about organizing workgroups and invocations

i might be able to do workgroup per meshlet, but since each meshlet doens't consistently have X triangles, could it waste occupancy?

[oak moat]

sure you could have idle threads

[gilded shell]

wouldn't that suck though

what do you do?

[oak moat]

having idle threads does suck yes

does it suck more than having N * 3 memory ops per thread?

as far as I know no, but you can test both approaches

[oak moat]

I just use mesh shaders

[gilded shell]

I mean

I would definitely have to look and see how often meshopt gets close to 124 tris per meshlet

[oak moat]

just go with the easier approach for you currently and profile

nah

you can simply define a lower bound and use that as workgroup size

i.e 64

and process MAX / 64 + MAX mod 64 triangles per thread if threadId < MAX mod 64

[gilded shell]

I see

effectively splitting the large meshlets over 2 groups?

[oak moat]

which is the correct approach and the fastest one, but as you said it's harder to think about

so just go with one thread per meshlet and big loop

[oak moat]

in that example yes (kinda)

[gilded shell]

alright

[oak moat]

it's just some threads will do 2 tringles and some will do 1

[gilded shell]

yeah that seems easiest

and im sure my gpu wont have much trouble rendering bistro

Oh!

[gilded shell]

should I worry at all about trying to use subgroups here

[oak moat]

no

at best you'll probably do worse than what the driver can optimize for you because they're tricky

plus there's only one usage for them in what you're trying to do

which is atomic scalarization (done automagically by drivers usually)

[gilded shell]

I see

if it wasnt obvious, Ive never used compute shaders before

[gilded shell]

GLSL doesn't have fixed width ints?!?

thats gonna be really finicky

[junior sparrow]

what do you mean?

[kind sparrow]

There are extensions for them I think

uint is always 32 bit

[gilded shell]

right

[kind sparrow]

You can pack into those or use an ext

[gilded shell]

im looking for uint8

ill have to see if the extension works with opengl

[junior sparrow]

vulkan has one 😉

[kind sparrow]

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/GLSL/blob/main/extensions/ext/GL_EXT_shader_16bit_storage.txt

I assume this is implemented and not just a proposal

[gilded shell]

this looks like exactly what im looking for

[gilded shell]

now I have to figure out what exactly I'm writing to

bevy mentions "reserving space" and never elaborates, and I'm pretty sure dynamic allocation is impossible here

maybe they have a large index buffer able to fit every scene triangle, but that seems wasteful

[junior sparrow]

for a hobby project its fine

[gilded shell]

I thought so

im bikeshedding too hard rn

but I want a comprehensive plan before implementing anything

At load time:
Have transforms (per primitive) and materials on GPU
Need array of all clusters

Generate empty index buffer large enough to store every single triangle in scene
Generate empty indirect draw buffer

At run:
Upload per primitive array that notes what clusters need rendered

Loop through each cluster and add all its triangles into a large index buffer, each index being encoded with material/transform data
Update indirect draw buffer

[gilded shell]

i am still alive btw

[gilded shell]

base 128

[gilded shell]

I need a new way to organize my desktops

I just have one for the main task and the other for internet browsing, discord, and music

and a lot of times the main task becomes this:

[night shoal]

i have downgraded from 3 to 1 screen

i dont mind many windows alt+tab works well for me

since it can toggle windows back and forth i always know which window was last or know how many tipes i have to press alt+tab (or shift alt tab)

but yeah 🙂 nvidia nsight doesnt make this better

[gilded shell]

Whenever I get this project in a good enough state, I want to remake my vulkan forest scene on here

1. It will hopefully look much better with pbr and csm or vsm, and hopefully will have some gi approximation or at the very least ibl

2. it should be a solid testament to optimization techniques mattering much more than choice of api, since the original had no frustum/occlusion culling or gpu driven rendering

[gilded shell]

we have triangles

[gilded shell]

closer

I'm messing up on reading the cluster id from the indices

uint index = (clusterId << 6u) | indices[clusters[clusterId].firstIndex + i];
writeIndices[bufferStart + i] = index;

thats the encoding

this is the reading:

uint clusterId = bitfieldExtract(gl_VertexID, 0, 26);
Vertex vertex = vertices[bitfieldExtract(gl_VertexID, 26, 6) + clusters[clusterId].vertexOffset];

@oak moat does this look right?

oh

ig bits are read right to left, not left to right

look at this

before and after optimization

~6 times faster

i still need to get it working with oit but this is very cool

next is culling

[gilded shell]

@night shoal @oak moat how cursed would it be if i kept ogl but integrated vulkan just for hw rt

[night shoal]

no idea

[oak moat]

bad

don't do it

[gilded shell]

👍

[oak moat]

just stay with raster

[gilded shell]

i was looking at radiance cascades

which i dont think benefits from hardware rt in most implementations

ill need to dig deeper

[oak moat]

you're doing meshlets tho

are you willing to throw all of that away for RT

[gilded shell]

will meshlets not work with rt?

[oak moat]

they are kind of incompatible yes

not without huge amounts of extra work

[gilded shell]

darn

a user in this server

i dont remember who, he had fox in his username and was german

iirc he recommended radiance cascades with sdfs, reusing sdfs from the last frame

what are you doing for a gi approximation?

[oak moat]

ddgi

jaker and I will probably move onto more clamplicated methods later

[gilded shell]

ddgi might be a good place to start

[oak moat]

it's nice and shrimple

[gilded shell]

indeed

but doesnt it still need rays lol

[oak moat]

it does

[gilded shell]

i see

[gilded shell]

are you guys proud

[gilded shell]

I should probably upload a picture to this thread thumbnail somehow

@night shoal Do you know how I could achieve this

[night shoal]

if you modify the first message

[kind sparrow]

I think if you just edit the first message to contain a link to a picture it'll work

[night shoal]

yeah or even ctrl+p should do the trick

looks like we never pinned the first message

let me fix that too

you can also fix the first post by uploading a "social preview" image to your repo

turns it into https://github.com/deccer/Hephaestus/

(updating might take a while) and you need to remove the link from the first post and put it back once the social preview is updated

[gilded shell]

i see thank you

any suggestions for what picture i should take with my engine?

i can load most gltf models, but the lightings kinda bad

[night shoal]

i have no idea

a sandpit perhaps 😛

with a big opengl logo shoved half way in

[gilded shell]

Yeah but “GrubStomper” is in there too

maybe i make a scene of a foot stepping on grubs

[kind sparrow]

What do you have against grubs anyways

[night shoal]

https://tenor.com/view/lot-of-energy-in-that-bear-grylls-animals-on-the-loose-a-you-vs-wild-interactive-movie-this-one-can-give-you-a-lot-of-energy-gif-20431684

they are a pest in germany 🙂 they are called Engerling here

[gilded shell]

29 dead, 8 wounded

[gilded shell]

the real reason

I play a little unknown survival game called “rust”

while foraging you can get grubs, which are useless

so me and my friends hate on grubs now

[gilded shell]

yall wanna help me find agartha

[kind sparrow]

What's that

[gilded shell]

funny conspiracy hollow earth city place

[gilded shell]

oddity in the implementation of this algorithm

6 bits was not enough for vertex indexing, which is very odd

6 bits gives the number range 0-63 iirc; and the max vertices in a meshlet are 64, so there should be no problem

yet when rendering with 6 bits there were evident off-by-n errors that were only fixed by upgrading to 7 bits

[gilded shell]

glBindBufferBase(GL_SHADER_STORAGE_BUFFER, 0, scene.ibo);
glBindBufferBase(GL_SHADER_STORAGE_BUFFER, 1, scene.indirectDrawBuffer);
glBindBufferBase(GL_SHADER_STORAGE_BUFFER, 2, scene.clustersSsbo);
glBindBufferBase(GL_SHADER_STORAGE_BUFFER, 3, scene.writeIbo);
glBindBufferBase(GL_SHADER_STORAGE_BUFFER, 4, scene.indirectBlendDrawBuffer);
glBindBufferBase(GL_SHADER_STORAGE_BUFFER, 5, scene.writeBlendIbo);
glBindBufferBase(GL_SHADER_STORAGE_BUFFER, 6, scene.materialsSsbo);

Code like this makes me glad I'm using ogl

I always remember making any data usable to shaders was a huge headache in vulkan

[west trail]

everything is a huge headache if you use raw vulkan,thats why wrappers exist)

[oak moat]

fake

.PushConstants(
  _sceneInfo.MeshletBuffer.GetHandle(),
  _sceneInfo.MeshletInstanceBuffer.GetHandle(),
  _sceneInfo.TransformBuffer.GetHandle(),
  _sceneInfo.PositionBuffer.GetHandle(),
  _sceneInfo.IndexBuffer.GetHandle(),
  _sceneInfo.PrimitiveBuffer.GetHandle(),
  _virtualShadowPass.VisibleMeshletBuffer.GetHandle(),
  virtualShadowClipmapInfoBuffer.GetHandle(),
  _virtualShadowPass.VirtualPageTableImage.GetHandle(),
  _virtualShadowPass.PhysicalMemoryImage.GetHandle(),
  static_cast<uint32>(_sceneInfo.MeshletBuffer->GetSize())
)
.DrawMeshTasks(
  DivideRoundUp<uint32>(_sceneInfo.MeshletInstanceBuffer->GetSize(), 32),
  VIRTUAL_SHADOW_CLIPMAP_COUNT
)

[gilded shell]

There is an error in the way im getting material indices

[gilded shell]

oit works again

[night shoal]

noite

[gilded shell]

now i need to lock in sync and overall cleanup my code

after the compute batch, i use glFinish for sync 💀

[gilded shell]

ah it seems ogl is doing all the sync for me

not sure why I thought it wouldnt

[gilded shell]

for some reason mapping my indirect draw buffers for reading adds 32ms to my frame time

[kind sparrow]

Yeah feedback is no bueno although 32ms seems excessive

Unless that's how long it takes to flush the pipeline

Maybe you need to double buffer the readback

What are you reading back anyway

[gilded shell]

just the amount of triangles being drawn

maybe im doing it in a really bad place?

[kind sparrow]

Is it a persistently mapped buffer

[gilded shell]

no

maybe i should try that

only problem is

there are thousands of atomic operations done on this exact buffer from compute

im scared persistant mapping could ruin that

[kind sparrow]

You don't want to be reading back GPU-local buffers afaik you should make a separate host-visible one

On Vulkan you wouldn't even be allowed to attempt to read back a buffer like that unless you explicitly set it up to be

[gilded shell]

so

I want to copy the GPU buffer to a CPU buffer?

each frame

[kind sparrow]

You want to make a second GPU buffer for the small info that the CPU wants to read back

And hope the driver puts it somewhere that's faster to access

Or create it as immutable storage with the host visible flag

If you want to avoid flushing you can make it a ring buffer of two or three slots and only read back last frame's value not the current one

[gilded shell]

this is a lot of effort to see how many triangles im drawing lol

uhhh

[kind sparrow]

It's basically what you'd do for everything in Vulkan

[gilded shell]

that was why i avoided vulkan 😭

[kind sparrow]

Just don't read back then

Have a compute-powered debug text output and print it to screen from the GPU

Or just try making a second small SSBO for the readback value and do everything else the same as what you're doing now

That alone should make it a lot better

Although reading back the same frame will still require flushing

[gilded shell]

i can defnitely read back the last frame

[junior sparrow]

why do you need to readback? Isnt there way to issue indirect draw using "argument buffer"

[gilded shell]

yeah I do that

its just for debug info

but honestly this is a lot of effort when I can just use nsight

[junior sparrow]

yeah

or draw imgui from gpu

[gilded shell]

sounds bad, no thanks

[junior sparrow]

https://tenor.com/view/copium-gif-766857345458198993

[gilded shell]

welp, meshlets are complete

I just need to clean code and then I can move to culling

thanks for your help @oak moat

[oak moat]

good job chief

[gilded shell]

Should I count a gpu dispatch as a drawcall in the performance counter?

[oak moat]

is it a drawcall

[kind sparrow]

The significance of draw calls kind of goes away when you're doing MDI

You can shit out tens of thousands of indirect draw calls just like you can with Vulkan regular draw calls

[gilded shell]

i mean not really but its a pretty significant command to the gpu

[gilded shell]

yeah but its there for a flex

especially since theres no hidden extra indirect multi draws

its just 4 drawcalls

[oak moat]

I would just stop using drawcalls and dispatch count as meaningful metrics

and instead use actual timings counters for each pass to show the frame's breakdown

[night shoal]

yeah, rendering 1000 tringles or 10000000000000 doesnt matter

important is that you stay within your frametime budget

[gilded shell]

indeed

[gilded shell]

all this time spent and im not even half way through the plans/todo list

[kind sparrow]

This project is like 3 months old lol

[west trail]

Remove "clean code", not gonna happen

[gilded shell]

its more likely than skeletal animation

[gilded shell]

it feels more like 6

its closer to 4 😔

i think i want to use csm for now

vsm seems time consuming

[kind sparrow]

My project is 3 years old lol

[gilded shell]

yeah but yours is very complex

mine is a glorified gltf renderer

[gilded shell]

it is time to do some work

coding in mornings > coding at night

biggest todo: cleanup my resources

i have a habbit of creating them and then not deleting them at program close

[gilded shell]

i have baked

[night shoal]

looks much better than gobi's sad breads 🙂

[gilded shell]

who?

[kind sparrow]

Gob posted a picture of two baguette ends on a toaster tray that looked a little well done lol

[gilded shell]

lol

i need to clarify that these loaves are very large

a little under a foot and a half each

[night shoal]

yeah perfect for a decent sandwich 😛

[gilded shell]

ill spend hours baking bread but 10 seconds to wash lettuce is too much for me

[night shoal]

relatable

[night shoal]

#off-topic-🐸 message is that what you were trying to make? 🙂

[gilded shell]

no that looks gross ngl

if i could get some seasoned chicken breast with bacon and ranch

[gilded shell]

dynamic voxelization of skinned meshes

[gilded shell]

very busy, have not touched project in a while

[gilded shell]

I seek advice

My friend learned Roblox Lua and via networking (career networking, not software networking) managed to make very good money

[night shoal]

dont look at what others do

find something you enjoy and pursue it

[gilded shell]

I know I know

sorry i got busy before i could finish

i should probably stop breaking up my points over multiple messages 💀

[night shoal]

no need for excuses 🙂

[gilded shell]

much more than ive been able to make cashiering for bk

so im wondering

would i be able to try the same thing with C++/GP?

[night shoal]

nobody can answer that for you

but you seem to be able to implement a renderer with some fancyisms, which isnt really a typical borgir flipper skill, gp isnt trivial

[gilded shell]

right

[night shoal]

work on some portfolio

[gilded shell]

but i lack a degree, adulthood, and knowledge in build systems and git

[night shoal]

that doesnt matter

most men never grow up anyway

git and build systems knowledge comes from using it

[gilded shell]

alright

[night shoal]

the degree could be important to companies, but when you make cool shit then it matters less

[gilded shell]

i see

obviously the goal is to be a graphics programmer

[night shoal]

important is that you show interest in and are able to explain a few things

[gilded shell]

this question is about the now

before college

[night shoal]

and also more importantly be able to read code, as you wont be writing a new engine from scratch, you most likely will use existing code

and fix shit in it, or implement a new technique with it

[night shoal]

maybe. maybe not, your github profile says clearly no atm as you dont publish anything, you dont write about your achievements either

[gilded shell]

oh are all my repos private

[night shoal]

show off the shit you do when it comes to GP so that you have something to talk about in an interview

[gilded shell]

okay

should I start writing a blog or something lol

[night shoal]

you dont have to

[gilded shell]

just publish my repos?

[night shoal]

and make them look presentable 🙂

and not just "This is a renderer"

make them work also, so that people dont have to manually install or move shit around. clone, and F5 should just work out of the box

shows that you care and some sort of "professionalism"

[gilded shell]

alright, thats the first step

[gilded shell]

you assume they compile on my own pc 😔

[night shoal]

https://tenor.com/view/dredd-i-knew-youd-say-that-stallone-gif-23229845

I demand that they work on your machine too

[gilded shell]

alright

i have

vulkan forest

and iklob

and this

another problem arises

[kind sparrow]

C++ jobs are much less likely to come by happenstance like the kinds of jobs you get from learning lua though

[night shoal]

im sure its even more impressive when you can see how you progressed in the GP journey as well

[gilded shell]

this is my problem

[night shoal]

know at least one programming language somewhat well, doesnt matter really which one it is

[gilded shell]

i dont think im even going to be able to find anything part-time

[kind sparrow]

But with your C++ knowledge you could get a non-C++ job

[night shoal]

yeah

[gilded shell]

right

which was another option i was considering

[night shoal]

while you cant find anything, improve on your shit, exercise (not leetcode nonsense), make stuff

[kind sparrow]

There aren't part time software jobs there are gig jobs and full time jobs

[gilded shell]

He freelances and writes Roblox scripts

[night shoal]

if you are just after the money, you could do the same, question is if you will enjoy it for longer

[junior sparrow]

this is what got me jobs at 2 companies part time(still in high school so sadly cant do full time) ones doing something completely else than C++

[night shoal]

i personally find roblox absolutely boring and horrid. and the audience is a fucking nightmare

[gilded shell]

for sure

[junior sparrow]

there is load of money in there and perfect for free lancing

[gilded shell]

But the alternative is working in retail at minimum wage

[night shoal]

nah

[gilded shell]

which is both mind numbing and terrible for money

[night shoal]

the roblox "sidequest" could also be an entry into actual roblox engine work, if the company picks you up because you made something cool with it

[junior sparrow]

Done that its fine...

[gilded shell]

right

[night shoal]

factorio modders got hired by wube, minecraft modders same

and same shit happened elsewhere

you just need to keep showing interest in that stuff, and when you have enough to show for, apply at where you want to work at

[gilded shell]

right

[night shoal]

in the meantime understand how git is used, commits/branching/rebase/perhaps exercise a bisect once or twice if possible so that you heard it once at least

same for your code, make it readable, make it runnable out of the box

[junior sparrow]

yeah check how you do merge conflicts

[night shoal]

yeah

also kind of important is "team" work

[junior sparrow]

you will encounter this when you start working at company but never in personal projects if you dont do different branches

[junior sparrow]

learned that hard way 😅

[kind sparrow]

Yes although imo I wouldn't worry about it too much

[night shoal]

yeah

depends on the work in the end, but i wouldnt want a singleplayer in my team whom you never talk to, hear from, or see at all

[kind sparrow]

External motivations for projects like making something profitable or that targets specific experience can take away from the interest in the project

[night shoal]

external motivations are a big factor indeed

[kind sparrow]

I just do whatever tf I feel like without specific reason lol

[junior sparrow]

yeah, you are unlikely to create something profitable as how bad it sounds. I wouldnt worry about it. making it as goal or your source of motivation is stupid

[gilded shell]

I see

[kind sparrow]

I tried numerous times in school to get my friends to do projects, but they could never stop getting hung up on the desire to make something useful

[night shoal]

also because you prooved yourself already at some point and people know what you are capable of

[kind sparrow]

They always came up with technically boring ideas that would be like a startup idea

Rather than something useless and interesting like they should

[kind sparrow]

I'm just talking about projects for projects' sake

[night shoal]

oh

[kind sparrow]

If you do those then the rest follows

[night shoal]

heh, thought you mean at work, my b

[kind sparrow]

At work I also do whatever tf I feel like lmao but that's because I sort of have my pick of projects to work on

[night shoal]

in my real life circle of people there is also nobody who is interested in anything gp or related

[kind sparrow]

But even not GP like one of my friends was into basketball and I tried to get him to make some little CLI basketball team manager simulator

[night shoal]

i also mean computerwise in general

[kind sparrow]

But he never did

Yeah

Well these were my CS study mates

So they were already experienced programmers

But still no personal projects

[night shoal]

i know some who have some personal projects like football betting thingy

[kind sparrow]

Programming?

[night shoal]

yeah

[kind sparrow]

Ah

Yeah that's the kind of thing I tried to get them to do

[night shoal]

some crude web stuff which they started when they were teens

maintained and updated per season

but i have 0 interest in football, or any other sport really

[kind sparrow]

Me neither but if it interests them

One has to find projects that suit your own interest

It's hard to recommend projects for others

[night shoal]

one of my friends is running some sort of newegg kind of thing

[gilded shell]

alright thank you all for your help

ig its back to cashiering

[night shoal]

hehe

[junior sparrow]

at my school we had "company day" basically companies came to our school and had presentations, recruiters and bunch other stuff. They were saying to students the personal projects are really important and also internships(we have those mandatory)

[night shoal]

yeah internships usually suck though

ive seen it in various companies too how they dragged these poor sods through the departments for a week or two or a month

[junior sparrow]

companies pick students from our school and everybody said that they had great experience

[night shoal]

most companies or teams where they end up sitting are not even interested in having interns/trainees, because it means work and effort and nobody got time for that

[kind sparrow]

Public facing jobs are good experience

[night shoal]

you might find a future sugar mommy, who knows 😄 (jk)

[junior sparrow]

[night shoal]

man i think im growing a corn in my left eye

its teasing me for the whole day already

[junior sparrow]

never heard that

[night shoal]

eye barley its called in engrish i think

[junior sparrow]

[gilded shell]

already have

[gilded shell]

but yeah i am taking a break from programming as of right now because this first semester + marching band has me extremely busy

maybe i can please you all with this piano solo i found https://youtu.be/rzEaHmggVGE?si=LUSJVqWL9R0OcF9S&t=854

[junior sparrow]

oh you are at collage now. I thought you are in high school. gl

[gilded shell]

nah

on my senior year oh hs

[junior sparrow]

so last year of hs?

hopefully you dont have same painful school leaving exam as me

[gilded shell]

probably not

[junior sparrow]

Be glad. In my country we have it mandatory and it's painful

Standard is your native language 2 essay, grammar exam and read 20 books and they will ask you questions about everything even authors. Then English or Math, English is an easy essay and grammar and oral. Math is self explanatory. But I am in computer science high school so I have additional programming, databases, networking, hardware and some stuff about boolean algebra, processors, etc... and then also high school thesis(basically bacholar)

[gilded shell]

yeah

this hs is not very challenging at all

i maintain a 3.9 gpa without trying very hard

[kind sparrow]

The American education system is much more relaxed than other countries, you don't specialize until adulthood and you can basically take whatever courses you like as long as you eventually satisfy your degree requirements

It's great tbh

You can enter the tertiary education system at any age too

[junior sparrow]

Kind of jealous but specializing in adulthood is kind of stupid tbh

You should be able to do it early

[kind sparrow]

Idk I didn't know what I wanted to do until I was like 20

I mean you can choose electives all the way through school so you have some choice starting at age 12 or 13 but everyone takes the same core classes until university

I switched majors 3 times in university

[junior sparrow]

In my country after 9 years of elementary school you have to choose what specialization you want

There are some specializations that are universal but majority aren't

[kind sparrow]

I also did another half a degree just for fun on the way to my main degree

Since I had the credits

[gilded shell]

you can

[gilded shell]

6 million dollars in loan debt

[kind sparrow]

Nah $0

I still finished in 4 years

I mean it still cost money but was paid out of pocket

[gilded shell]

how in the world do you pay for college out of pocket

[kind sparrow]

2 years community college and then transfer for a university for the last 2 years

• familial education savings fund

It probably cost about $70k altogether or something

[gilded shell]

ah okay

this server should give scholarships

[kind sparrow]

With whose money lol

[gilded shell]

yours

give me your money

[kind sparrow]

Lmao

[gilded shell]

maybe we can pool money

if everyone in the server gives $20 well have at least $80

[oak moat]

how about you move somewhere where university is free for all

[gilded shell]

where

[oak moat]

anywhere in 🇪🇺 except ireland

[gilded shell]

sounds like a risky move

like it might cost more than staying in the US

besides—you couldnt pay me to live in the UK, and idk if any other countries would have all english speaking professors

[oak moat]

idk I paid 136 euros total for my 3 years in university

[oak moat]

UK isn't EU anymore and also they weren't really on board with free education

so anywhere in the EU except ireland is still true

[gilded shell]

is housing and food also free?

and still the language issue

[oak moat]

grocery costs have gone up but for a single person rent + food + utilities shouldn't go past 2k euros per month anywhere

[gilded shell]

which would be a 24k yearly cost

doesnt seem like i would be saving much money

[oak moat]

it's ok because we have scolarships

where housing and food are free

but you need to find unis that have those services

[gilded shell]

i see

[gilded shell]

what about this

[oak moat]

just learn the lang they're all either germanic langs like english or romance langs like latin

[junior sparrow]

there are classes that are taught in english

in collages/universities

[gilded shell]

okay

while were on the topic, i need to write my college essay and id like to make it about this project

[gilded shell]

@kind sparrow thoughts and opinions

[kind sparrow]

I forget what I wrote in my essays

Don't they give you specific prompts

[gilded shell]

yeah but one of them is pretty much “whatever you want”

[gilded shell]

“For the past X months, I have worked towards writing a 3D renderer.”

[kind sparrow]

I would focus on the why's not the what's

Of all the things you could be doing with your time, why do you specifically choose to spend it on graphics programming, or playing the drums, or whatever it is

What do those pursuits reveal about you as a person

[west trail]

"because reasons"

[gilded shell]

because i just like doing it lol

because uhhh

its a very intellectually challenging hobby

its very productive and applicable to the real world

and the results are beautiful and very visible

at least other people’s results are

i’m sure this can be made into an essay

“why I GP”

[gilded shell]

I should use this project thread to preach sermons

[gilded shell]

Alright, time for peer review

@kind sparrow what do you think?

I do want to expand upon the end a bit more

[kind sparrow]

My ancient mobile discord won't let me view that but I can read later if I get a chance

Idk if I'll have service but we'll see

[gilded shell]

okay

[gilded shell]

@kind sparrow are you an EST pleb? now might be the time

[kind sparrow]

No I'm in PST I'm just on a road trip and going to stay somewhere without electricity tonight

[gilded shell]

oh okay

[gilded shell]

Maybe I could put this up in resume-review

[junior sparrow]

I suck at essays but avoid repeating yourself and generally forcing stuff on paper. I would make it a story. They would expect something like this

[gilded shell]

I see

[junior sparrow]

This came from chatgpt and make it your template and sometimes consult chatgpt along the lines try to improve it, rewrite it, rephrase, etc...

[gilded shell]

Alright thank yoyu

[gilded shell]

I refactored it based on your advice @junior sparrow

You too @kind sparrow whenever you get the chance

[gilded shell]

nvm demon im rewriting it again tmrw

lukasino is making me rewrite it 😞

[junior sparrow]

*refactor 🤓 ☝️ (this song came to my head)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SETnK2ny1R0

[gilded shell]

GrubStomper29 theme song

(except I always get a full 7-8 hours of sleep)

[gilded shell]

@junior sparrow refactored

[junior sparrow]

it is bit better but still you need rewrite it. Try to take look at what I send you in DMs and make it the same way

[gilded shell]

I don't have a hook

oh no

[kind sparrow]

Hook comes last

[gilded shell]

do I really need one

[junior sparrow]

yeah

[gilded shell]

you hvaent sent anything yet

[gilded shell]

@junior sparrow you cant leave me like this 😢

[junior sparrow]

I sent you something on Tuesday

[gilded shell]

oh okay

[gilded shell]

man it sucks seeing everyone elses thread be active while mine is dormant

i wish i had time to work on this

[night shoal]

no reason to feel bad my frog

the project isnt running away 🙂

[kind sparrow]

Consider that I never even started coding until university

[gilded shell]

yeah but the reason i dont have timr is marching band

and our band is a joke

im the drum captain this year and

1. half of my drummers cant play at a fifth grade level

2. the other half of my drummers cant play at an 8th grade level

@kind sparrow one of them couldn’t plays 8ths even with a metronome

[kind sparrow]

damn

Even our freshmen band in HS was pretty great

[gilded shell]

yeah

i’m not really having fun

[kind sparrow]

Have them record themselves playing to a metronome and then listen back to it

Noobs typically can't hear their own timing in real time

but in a recording they'll be like "wow I suck"

[gilded shell]

“playing” is generous, most of them cant read music either

none of them fully know the first part of the field show despite having the music for months now

and i dont even mean memorized, i mean know

its very bad

my only objective is to survive the season because its so unsalvageable

[kind sparrow]

Here is the video of my old HS's marching band lol, not in a year I was there though https://youtu.be/G1fm32R3BTY&t=116

linked right before the cadence for maximum drums

[gilded shell]

oh they sound good but i cant help but notice one of the snares using match grip while the rest use traditional

[gilded shell]

no worried though; thats what i did in my freshman year 💀

[night shoal]

das is a lot of people for a band

[gilded shell]

my mother’s hs was nuts, they filled the field

ive got nothing to do this afternoon, i think ill try and figure out how to record my e drums and show yall

[gilded shell]

ah i need a special cord

maybe later guys

[night shoal]

Drum Simulator 2025

[gilded shell]

For whatever project I make next, I want to have better source control on git

i’ll get real fancy and have a test branch

[gilded shell]

I am sad to announce that I am making a Scratch project

[kind sparrow]

A terminal illness it seems

[gilded shell]

indeed

[gilded shell]

at least its beneficial to my brain

im implementing tipsify sort and LoD trees

[gilded shell]

#showcase message

[kind sparrow]

Crazy lol

[gilded shell]

My old original algorithm took 3 minutes for that same model

500ms is a big upgrade

[kind sparrow]

Why not just program in assembly it's basically just as obtuse of a tool but actually powerful

Handwritten AVX

[gilded shell]

I have a following on Scratch for some reason

[kind sparrow]

Ah

[gilded shell]

people actually make 3D games with Scratch for some reason

they need Nanite too methinks

[gilded shell]

im going to make a separate thread for this

[night shoal]

Grubbi is the Jasmine of the Scratch world

[gilded shell]

who’s that

[night shoal]

#1090390868449558618 message

[gilded shell]

oh yeah him

[gilded shell]

no followers in my other thread 😦

[kind sparrow]

It takes time for them to build a following

[gilded shell]

yeah

[gilded shell]

😔

soon guys

[night shoal]

dont you worry, we will wait for your return

[gilded shell]

Alright I have a drive to do this this morning but I can't even remember what needs cleaning

[gilded shell]

man I barely recognize my own code anymore

what in the world is going on

[night shoal]

when in doubt, rewrite

[gilded shell]

i really need better var names

THREE CONVENTIONS

no prefix, global prefix, and scene prefix 😭

im too lazy to rewrite the miniscule 500ish lines of code, so im just going to rename everything and clean the code

the code itself isn't terrible

[west trail]

When in doubt - rewrite in hungarian notation

[night shoal]

when in doubt - get rid of primitive type obsession

[gilded shell]

wdym

[night shoal]

int, int, int you never know what is what

parameter names can be deceiving

[gilded shell]

dw, ive upgraded it to GLint

[night shoal]

VertexOffset_T vertexOffset, GlobalOffset_T globalOffset, MaterialOffset_T materialOffset 😄

(its an actual thing, primitive type obsession, but im just pulling your leg here)

https://tenor.com/view/sad-pull-leg-stick-man-gif-13137776

[gilded shell]

alright lol

might describe me though

[gilded shell]

i really wish discord would stop automatically unfollowing this thread

[kind sparrow]

Post in it more 🙂

It's the only way

[night shoal]

https://tenor.com/view/book-of-boba-fett-the-mandalorian-this-is-the-way-the-book-of-boba-fett-mandalorian-gif-24825263

[gilded shell]

theres nothing to post

the project remains untouched

[kind sparrow]

Then why shouldn't the thread fall off the list lol

[gilded shell]

bc i dont want it to 😦

[gilded shell]

samplers, textures, texture handles, need dealloc

already done

nice job, past me

The model class is finally cleaned

now theres a ton of resources in main.cpp to dealloc

i dont want to touch main.cpp

@junior sparrow you have a point, this file sucks

[kind sparrow]

Btw visual studio has an automatic todo list aggregator

[spring kelp]

Her* 🙂

[gilded shell]

that actually makes a lot of sense lol

i think that project may interest you, consider following the thread

[spring kelp]

Which one?

[gilded shell]

https://discord.com/channels/318590007881236480/1290658147400155179

[gilded shell]

Bulletin is such a nice word

i need to find a way to use it in my project

[night shoal]

put it on the bulletin board of todo items : >

[gilded shell]

Maybe instead of a “render graph,” I use a “bulletin board”

[gilded shell]

i will certainly need a scene class

[kind sparrow]

Do you?

I don't have one

[gilded shell]

Well

need is a exaggeration

But I think it would greatly simplify things

[gilded shell]

transparent objects have dissapeared lol

[night shoal]

https://tenor.com/view/tims-trims-vanish-magic-its-gif-24307968

[gilded shell]

I dont like these numbers

I don't theres 1.1 billion indices for blended models

especially given that the only blended model is 6 cubes

[night shoal]

smells like uninitialized variables

[gilded shell]

well see

now its 1.6 bil

then 2.5

[gilded shell]

has to be

this is a very bad sign 😭

[junior sparrow]

always initialise or assign value immediately

[gilded shell]

I do, so its probably offsets

[gilded shell]

yeah index count for the opaque indirect draw is absurdly high too

either im messing up when mapping it for reading, or im somehow feeding the compute shader rediculously high numbers

i should most certainly be using nsight rn

Alright, the drawindirect params do have correct values as far as I can tell

its most likely bad vertex/index offsets

?!?!?!?!?

all of a sudden the project refuses to compile because intellisense thinks my shader files are C

[night shoal]

looks like a debug line renderer to me : >

[gilded shell]

@kind sparrow do you think lab internships have the same value as workplace internships?

does this question make sense

[kind sparrow]

No but they are still valuable

I'd say they're like 80% as good overall, and in some ways better, in others worse

I worked in a lab after graduation for 18 months since the internship I had lined up was cancelled when covid lockdowns hit

And my current employer found that experience to be a positive

[gilded shell]

i see

[gilded shell]

time

perhaps the bug has to do with the order im doing things in

[gilded shell]

i know i change my mind a lot about the lighting plans for this project, but right now baking seems like the smartest idea

spherical harmonics for diffuse gi

[gilded shell]

https://tenor.com/view/hop-on-the-cycle-frontier-the-cycle-frontier-hop-on-the-cycle-frontier-gif-26888181

some work has been done

[gilded shell]

relationship between scene and model is interesting

in my engine at least, a model must belong to a scene so the indices are appropriately offset

it would make sense for each model to store a pointer to its scene object

@kind sparrow @night shoal I’ve never used pointers in this manner, so I’m going to consult the wise

[night shoal]

im already thinking how to reply before you pung me 🙂

[gilded shell]

i was think weak_ptr?

[night shoal]

i dont think thats necessary

[gilded shell]

I see

[night shoal]

a "scene" is just a "group" of entities/gameobjects/actors idk how you want to call it

and entities/gameobjects/actors - let me stick to entitity

are just a "container" of "components"

where a component will describe what the entitty is made out of, a name perhaps, some sort mesh, a material, and a transform, perhaps a collider shape for fisiks later, perhaps a healthcomponent and more

[gilded shell]

it does store helpful data that entities would need to access, such as aforementioned offsets

[night shoal]

the offsets are stored elsewhere

the renderer will take care of all that

lets assume a scene

a tree and the deccercubes

and your camera is looking at the 2, but slides to either side and that will make the tree go out of sight

then the main loop, will collect all visible things from the scene, in this case the cubes

that means you go through the scene, and compare each enttity's - lets use the fisiks collider here, as it most likely will be an AABB box pretty much -

so it grabs that component and does a camera frustum vs aabb test to cull objects

the tree doesnt survive that test, but the cubes are, that means the cubes go in a silly list

which the renderer iterates over

[gilded shell]

woah woah woah hold on

[night shoal]

there are 100 different ways how you can do that or in what detail you can do that

holding on

[gilded shell]

renderer should store that state?

[night shoal]

yeah

the scene doesnt care about mesh offsets or whatever

the scene is just a high level descriptor of what objects live in your world

and what behavioouir is attached to them (potentially scripts in form of script components)

[gilded shell]

i see

[night shoal]

scene doesnt know nor doesnt care about how it is rendered to screen

that way you could use those "scene"graphs on a server too where you have no render capabitlitlitlies

lets keep it naive for now... now as you iterate the scene - we could even leave the culling part away for now - its just a minor optimization anyway

so you feed the scene to the renderer ... void Render(RenderContext& renderContext, Scene& scene); perhaps

rendercontext contains timinginfo, camera stuff perhaps, and other things which may be relevant for rendering something, window size or so ... anyway

the renderer walks through the scene, plucking mesh/material/transform information from the entities

and then it checks, did i see that mesh before? yes or no

if no, then grab the name from the mesh, look it up on disk, load it, then create an intermediate structure, inside the renderer, lets lets call it gpumesh, which has vao, vbo, ebo

you load that mesh into your usual vbo/ebo and you create a vao according to what you need, and assign it all to that gpumesh, then you throw that into a list

no offset required

you do the same for material

and you do the same for transforms

if we keep it super super naive, you could even store the material and the transform information in that gpu mesh too

lets do that for now

material means here you load diffuse and normals perhaps, so you load the textures as usual too, stbi et al

and then you keep the texture ids as attributes on the mesh, and the transform is a shrimple mat4

lets ignore hierarchies too for a second

the renderer then just loops through that list of gpu meshes, and does

bindvao(mesh.vao);
bindvbo(mesh.vbo);
bindebo(mesh.ebo);
bindubo(globaluniforms); // usually camera information, proj/view/inversedthisandthant/windowsize/deltatime/...

programuniform(mesh.transform);
bindtextureunit(mesh.diffuse, 0);
bindtextureunit(mesh.normal, 1);
drawelements(...)

if you add hierarchies... like parent and children, you simply brute force the parent's transform before feeding it to the gpumesh, like gpumesh.transform = parent != null ? parent.transform * transform : transform;

[gilded shell]

interesting

[night shoal]

from there you can optimize further if you want/need to

if you want to go with mega buffers for mesh/material/instance data, you can just stuff all the data into one buffer per domain, and store the offsets on gpumesh

[gilded shell]

just to confirm my understanding—your example goes scene->entity->mesh->gpu buffers?

[night shoal]

scene contains "strings" for mesh/material and 3 vectors for your transform, pos,rot,scale (in form of those components, meshcomponent, materialcomponent, transformcomponent, perhaps a namecomponent too that never hurts)

[gilded shell]

oh i see

[night shoal]

those strings are turned into the actual model and that model is deconstructed into mesh buffers (vbo/ebo) inside the renderer

[gilded shell]

the renderer is storing all the gpu stuff and the scene is the high level overview

[night shoal]

yeah

[gilded shell]

thats hot

[night shoal]

thats the demongod way, which keeps shit simple

[gilded shell]

yeah

[night shoal]

might not be the most advanced or most reasonable way, but its a good start, its the most reasonable way to begin such a thing

when you load a model, and its meshes, you can also either calculate it yourself or read it from the model already if present, is its bounding box, you could also store that on the gpu mesh

[gilded shell]

right

[night shoal]

and since you have camera information in your renderer too, you can combine the too for a cheap cpu culling mekanism already

[gilded shell]

problematically, if I want this structure in my project I’ll have to do a ton of rewriting

[night shoal]

or you start from scratch with a version 2 of your thing

[gilded shell]

not happening

[night shoal]

make sure to use version control 🙂

[gilded shell]

well my point is that this is a rendering only application

so i dont think the rewrite would be worth it

i can probably continue my project with the structure it has

[night shoal]

are you facing any problem right now?

[night shoal]

you can also preload all your meshes

stuff them in a dictionary by name, and that name is the one on your components

then when the renderere goes through the scene, it just grabs the mesh/material from those

[gilded shell]

not necessarily, id just like for my models to have a reference to the scene that owns them

[night shoal]

thats the string used in mesh pretty much

or model if you want it modelcomponent

[gilded shell]

how would that let me reference the scene from within my models?

[night shoal]

you dont

why would you need that?

[junior sparrow]

☝️

[gilded shell]

okay

nevermind

thanks for your help wise one

[night shoal]

nah say it 🙂

maybe theres a reason you want it

[gilded shell]

You're right; I do not need it

i should be storing the offsets elsewhere

[night shoal]

ah

[kind sparrow]

I see deccer evangelized you so my assistance is unneeded : )

But yeah the relationship between model and scene is: model lives in a map/array somewhere, scene object stores a name or array index of the model it uses, and that's it

I do have models in the engine side since I need to access it for physics but the actual GPU mesh with the vertex buffer offsets or vao or whatever is a separate array/map stored in the renderer

[gilded shell]

the demon method

[gilded shell]

this shouldn't cause memory leaks

if (!shaderProgram.computePath.empty())
{
    auto computeShader{ compileShader(shaderProgram.computePath, GL_COMPUTE_SHADER) };
    glAttachShader(shaderProgram.program, computeShader);
    glDeleteShader(computeShader);
}

glLinkProgram(shaderProgram.program);

GLint success{};
glGetProgramiv(shaderProgram.program, GL_LINK_STATUS, &success);
if (!success) {
    GLchar infoLog[512]{};
    glGetProgramInfoLog(shaderProgram.program, 512, nullptr, infoLog);
    std::cerr << infoLog << '\n';
}```

the glDeleteShader before glLinkProgram flags the shader for deletion, which hopefully happens after glLinkProgram

[west trail]

shouldn't you query size of info before getting info log?

[gilded shell]

probably but it doesnt matter

[night shoal]

you delete the shader after linking

[gilded shell]

idk why visual studio formats like this

anyways, the major code cleanup is complete : )

onto meshlet culling

[night shoal]

you ackchually dont need all of that 🙂

auto OnOpenGLDebugMessage(
    [[maybe_unused]] uint32_t source,
    uint32_t type,
    [[maybe_unused]] uint32_t id,
    [[maybe_unused]] uint32_t severity,
    [[maybe_unused]] int32_t length,
    const char* message,
    [[maybe_unused]] const void* userParam) -> void {

    if (type == GL_DEBUG_TYPE_ERROR) {
        spdlog::error(message);
        debug_break();
    }
}

[kind sparrow]

I think it's important to point out that while this may be the by the book "idiomatic" way of writing C++ nobody in real life actually writes it this way with all the attribute spam and stuff

[night shoal]

i didnt mean to flex those, they just calmed the static code analyzer, the important bit here was that you only really need the error type

[kind sparrow]

Ah yeah

[night shoal]

and i dont write idiomatic c++, but idiotic c++ 😛

[kind sparrow]

Same

Just a different flavor

[night shoal]

hehe

[junior sparrow]

Hopefully hiz too 😉

[gilded shell]

yes

[gilded shell]

I have developed an IMMACULATE piece of art that perfectly encapsulates the image of the Grub Stomper. I will permanently, if it is the Lord’s will, use it as my profile picture as soon as I can obtain a high quality photograph of it.

[west trail]

proceeds to not show it

[gilded shell]

well it’s a work in progress

i dont want to spoil the surprise

[gilded shell]

If the hype is too much to handle, I can reveal the art style first

[gilded shell]

It is finished

[night shoal]

[kind sparrow]

what do you have against grubs anyways

[gilded shell]

The Grub Stomper gets a euphoric feeling from the titular act

[gilded shell]

maybe when the metal gear solid spree slows down a bit lol

[gilded shell]

the one day I want to write code

[night shoal]

https://learnopengl.com/book/book_pdf.pdf

[gilded shell]

this unfortunately lacks the frustum culling chapter