Twisted #̵̍͑$̶̄͝%̶̲̕@̶͆̅$̸̑́#̵͂̈́%̵̾@ feedback thread

[mental cloak]

mmmmmm
I guess?

[pale creek]

Fun is subjective

[frank parcel]

What about 2 scouts :3

[mental cloak]

i did a duo and yeah I guess that sounds about right?
I feel like a competent comp could do the same

[pale creek]

Competent comp gonna take longer

[frank parcel]

I beat the boss with So-Cat carrying my ass as rogue and it took around 8-12 mins

[pale creek]

Especially two scouts lol

[mental cloak]

that sounds not very competent then

[frank parcel]

I died around half way through the fight

[pale creek]

That sounds not tcleric more like

[hot yacht]

afaik buff bot hiero bers is like 6 minutes

[mental cloak]

what does that even mean

[pale creek]

Not op

Or less op

[mental cloak]

that sounds less overpowered... what

[pale creek]

However you want to look at bers

[frank parcel]

I died half way through…
They were rogue…

[pale creek]

You tank, do damage, heal, and buff

All in one class

What else can do that

[tranquil oyster]

potions

[pale creek]

Idk it is up to boss creators if they are gonna do something with facetank or they are ok with that

[tranquil oyster]

a Heart of the Jungle, Forgeflame, or Godbrew and a Fruit of Life or Mountain's Dew

[mental cloak]

thorns cleric

[pale creek]

Tcleric was always an issue i feel

[pale creek]

So thorns cleric or thorns cleric

[mental cloak]

oh I thought you were talking about bers

[pale creek]

I think someone run infusion service by afking some bugged mobs spawners on tcleric

Gallery afk farm still most likely works

[long pond]

Not bugged, they afk portal creepers

[pale creek]

Peak

[tranquil oyster]

comical

[frank parcel]

Ok ITEMS!

are they any good?

Opinions?

[tranquil oyster]

they look really fun

Incessance looks so funny I wanna use it

[long pond]

A bunch of them will definitely see use

[frank parcel]

The epic cleric charms seems questionable but maybe cool how are we feeling about

[pale creek]

Apti helm is cool

[mental cloak]

it's funny

[long pond]

Cleric charm seems questionable rn but thats mostly just bcuz of r3 design imo

[frank parcel]

It’s just you lose all burst healing that makes boon useful to pacing for me

[white coral]

bers really felt like a step above literally every other class after i used every spec lol

[long pond]

its designed for a situation currently not applicable to r3

[white coral]

except alch i guess but i feel like it'd just be as good as mage

[long pond]

In some future content i think it could be useful

[tranquil oyster]

Alch does really well in rift phases (expected by nature, Alch excels in crowd control) but lower raw DPS might get fucked by Screamroom

[white coral]

ohh yeah didnt think abt that

[long pond]

You can outrun screamroom -ish

[white coral]

idk didnt try it

[white coral]

wdym

how does that work lol

[long pond]

If you’re fast enough you can just run away until the debuff expires

Nothing can catch up to you anyway

[supple turtle]

u take -30% max health debuff

if u fail kill core

[long pond]

Its just a long duration debuff

[supple turtle]

which will gone after like 30-50 sec

[white coral]

oh really? i thought it like actually did true damage

[frank parcel]

The Bodkin charms very interesting

[supple turtle]

that's why i don't think it deserve skull emoji

[white coral]

after i got fucked by it the first time i just killed the scream room dude everytime 😭

[hot yacht]

i think it one shots if you leave but gives a debuff if it expires?

[white coral]

ohh

ic

[long pond]

It has an instakill mechanic separately from the debuff

[supple turtle]

which is leave room?

[long pond]

Yes

[supple turtle]

i see

[tranquil oyster]

I thought if it ran out you died on the spot

[mental cloak]

mhm
i tried walking away the first time lol

[tranquil oyster]

same

[white coral]

wait sushi how do u kill the scream room dude as tcleric

😭

[tranquil oyster]

I was very quickly taught that that is a terrible idea

[long pond]

LI it

paladin has fuckoff high ability dmg in its kit even with no gear dmg

[tranquil oyster]

give it the Twisted Crusader special and hit it with triple LI rounds

[white coral]

this boss was the first encounter i had with any tormented mobs because i never ran the modifier

[mental cloak]

uh. funny story. you don't

[white coral]

fire

[mental cloak]

if you have a duo, mooch off them and have them help you kill it

[white coral]

wait why do you not have build contributer role

[mental cloak]

it's possible to kill it solo tcleric

[white coral]

oh my god

[mental cloak]

I have not contributed to a build

so it's fine

[white coral]

wait ur suppoesd to get it as soon as u have access

😭

mb

[mental cloak]

💀

allg

green

[mental cloak]

anyways, uh
if you have max stack LI + all your abilities + some buffs, you can probably do it.

but there's not much point when you can just wait it out
if you fail it it should give increasing debuffs every time you fail imo

[tranquil oyster]

wtf GREEN Dumplingsushi

if you fuck it up......let's say 3 times it just kills you

rule of threes

[mental cloak]

real

[long pond]

It is intended to be failable repeatedly

It has an advancement tied to it

Would need to rework the advancement i think

[tranquil oyster]

there's an advancement for that???

[mental cloak]

awha

did I get something for that??

[pale creek]

Failing screamroom is kinda insane

[mental cloak]

it unfortunately isn't like abhorrent and has no damage hitbox

probably for the best

[shy glacier]

It honestly is more common to die by getting KBed out of the screamroom

[shy glacier]

As DoT Apoth: "Uhhhhhhh"

[frank parcel]

Screamroom kinds sucks when getting chased by swords

You kinda just die sometimes with no warning if your ehp isn’t there

[deep kayak]

nerf the blue mini and purple while we are at it and boss is good

[shy glacier]

On that note, it feels really annoying that so few mobs seem to actually respect KBR when using their abilities

[frank parcel]

Kbr and slow resist suck I don’t wanna have to have tons of speed so I can kite a boss imo

It’s understandable though

[acoustic wigeon]

i think being able to tank the bosses default melee and melee ability slash is fine its just stuff like his pronged attacks are just too easily tankable

and most other abilities

[supple turtle]

in my expereince they'll just stop attack

[frank parcel]

Wdym they stop they followed me into the room

[deep kayak]

its just sustain ehp barely matters

[frank parcel]

Swinging!

[supple turtle]

intersting

not happen to me for my 2hr failed solo + 2 other duo run

I litearlly just stop walking, eat some food when screamroom happen

[acoustic wigeon]

sustain = tankable

[deep kayak]

yeah but ehp shohld matter

[shy glacier]

That's pretty much what I do. Though sometimes there is a random mob that makes things really annoying

[acoustic wigeon]

yeah i wished it mattered a little more

[mental cloak]

This tbh

Those still hurt

[frank parcel]

I kinda wish the slash didn’t do kb

[mental cloak]

but they should hurt a bit more

[frank parcel]

But that’s a non issue

[mental cloak]

Maybe apply some debuffs

[frank parcel]

Bro evolved during these talks 🥶

Uncommon dumpling sushi

[hot yacht]

honestly kb is an interesting way of getting the player off the boss without making it unsurvivable as melee, like that one punch bow elite is annoying as melee but non issue with range

unfortunately warrior also has kbr for free

[shy glacier]

Me when they ignore KBR (it seems)

I know that from the fact that a 90% KBR set I used still had me getting constantly flung around by stuff

[hot yacht]

idk at kbr10 i didnt feel knocked around that much, without it and yeah the slash pushed me off

could be placebo i guess i didnt pay that much attention

[shy glacier]

Funnily enough, it still does at 10 KBR 💀

[hot yacht]

yeah bers has gb to counter it anyway

[shy glacier]

Doesn't really work either. You have to aim it away from the enemy

[shrewd hare]

tanking is a problem again? lets slap on another pseudo hp bar

[shy glacier]

GB just sets your KBR to 100%

[hot yacht]

no i just gb at the boss anytime im getting hit off and it works out

[shy glacier]

Ah

[mental cloak]

If they didn't want pure tank to exist why didn't they have a galactic collider spawn every thirty seconds

[stark herald]

I think galactic colliders is anti everything

[ornate mica]

they stop when you're in screamroom
they will follow but not attack
in general swords follow you really closely but it's not hard to dodge their attack

[shy glacier]

Me encountering Galactic Collider for the first time: What if I igno -- dies

[stark herald]

LIVE GALACTIC COLLIDER [💀] REACTION

[mental cloak]

It's actually not particularly clear what you have to do with galactic collider the first time you see it lol

[shy glacier]

Galactic Collider is quite the annoying ability...it's really hard to beat as an AoE class

[mental cloak]

I think this is like, the first time that we've had a stationary "kill me or you explode 100% no dodging" enemy

and the particle clutter doesn't help in a delve

[stark herald]

It doesn't have a clear indicator as nuclear amalgam or prismatic distortion (harb & arcanist)

[shy glacier]

Well, you can run 33 blocks away from the collider

[frank parcel]

Arena design wise what’s the point of the end prongs

[mental cloak]

Looks cool ig

And doesn't really hurt; gives you more space in fact

[stark herald]

It looks cool and lowkey it gives little extra space if u get pinned

[velvet coral]

this is already the case (sort of, the DR seems to be like 99% instead)

unless SA is cheating through the DR

[shy glacier]

Doesn't Sanctified Armor not work on bosses?

[velvet coral]

oh gg then

idk SA does... things

they don't make sense but it is functional?

untapped limitless supply of true damage definitely something

[long pond]

i thought it was just capped?

[mental cloak]

Capped at 200

[devout star]

Does the pink glass sometimes go completely invisible for anyone else? I also sometimes don't get knocked back into the arena from some angles

[mental cloak]

Haven't actually tested if it pierces dr

I assume yes tho

[shy glacier]

💀

What...

[mental cloak]

What what

Level 1: Whenever you are damaged by melee or projectile hits from an undead enemy, deal true damage to the undead based on its max health. For every 1% health the Cleric has above 70% max health, deal 1% of the undead's max health, up to a maximum of 15%. Damage is capped based on current region (R1 30/R2 60/R3 120 damage). This can only affect each mob once every 3 seconds.

Level 2: The Cleric's health threshold is reduced to 60%, and up to 25% of the undead's max health can be dealt (Capped at R1 50/R2 100/R3 200 damage). The undead enemy is also afflicted with 20% slowness for 3 seconds. This can only affect each mob once every 2 seconds.

Enhancement: If the most recently affected mob is killed by any means other than Sanctified Armor or Thorns damage, regain half the health lost from the last damage taken.

[shy glacier]

Bruh

[mental cloak]

Sanctified armor damage % charms should also proportionately increase the cap

[shy glacier]

Should or do?

You said should, but I can't tell if you actually mean should or not

[mental cloak]

Fun fact, even the smallest proc of sanctified armor at 61% deals at least 200 to a 25k health boss

It should but I don't think it does

[shy glacier]

...

[mental cloak]

why is this a stunned silence

it's kinda bad ngl

the only use charms really have is on elites and regular mobs

[velvet coral]

SA dealing true damage but having strange drawbacks and parameters to achieve it that are arguably not fit on a class like Cleric certainly is something

[mental cloak]

I will make a class all about retribution damage next

[small zinc]

Maybe other ability?

[slow drum]

it’s an issue with Entity Culling being overzealous

[small zinc]

One of boss ability have strong knockback too

[mental cloak]

There isn't truly anything that mismatches with cleric
I mean, if it could reliably heal itself at least...

But
Want to be high HP
Does not really mind getting hit by mobs
Undead mob

Those all sound like cleric

[velvet coral]

Cleric does not care about being high HP, in fact it provides you ways to recover from low HP and it randomly deals True damage instead of Magic

only other source of true damage is Coup which makes sense because it's supposed to kill targets

[mental cloak]

Well, I can't imagine allowing repeated % health damage to scale being a good idea, so that sorta makes sense

[velvet coral]

though Coup is hardcoded 9000 damage so making it melee wouldn't change anything so idk

[velvet coral]

well % health also just feels weird

once again Assassin uses it because well that kinda makes sense for efficient 1v1 killer

[mental cloak]

sure

[velvet coral]

why does the ability become useless if I lose 40% of my health

[mental cloak]

imagine if coup threshold increased with % damage

[velvet coral]

I am getting hit why is my onhit insurance ability losing value

[mental cloak]

true

[shy glacier]

INB4 the Coup de Grace fails to kill a mob

[mental cloak]

ah yes, the 45001 health normal enemy

[velvet coral]

does he know

some R3 mobs just sort of forget that Coup kills them

[shy glacier]

Which ones?

[velvet coral]

frequently mobs with totems of undying

which is weird because those mobs are no issue in r2

[fiery pagoda]

boss is 10/10
very healing pilled
lb boss is annoying to hit
i crash after every run

[deep kayak]

yeah very healing pilled

[summer tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/jarvis-jarvis-meme-smirk-tony-stark-iron-man-gif-11885783305913878074

[glass ingot]

yeah as a hunter I had to switch from eating fol+forgeflame to steak+forgeflame just because every hit made me half hp and i needed the saturation

honestly very fun, i had t juggle killing mobs and healing, had to focus on looking for opportunities to max saturation inside the fight while getting chased by the boss, swords and mobs

in this case the scream room helped a lot, with my dps I had enough time to eat twice while inside and still kill it

[summer tusk]

build issue

[glass ingot]

i mean

it made my damage good

and i didnt die as long as I didnt take 3 hits in a row or more with PI

so i'd recommend

(pretty sure I was just playing armor bis with csiege so its not like ym build was novel)

[winged talon]

so whats the deal with pi being on cooldown after the first use

[vivid garnet]

pi has like a 5s cd iirc anywhere, might be bugged in this boss to be longer

nothing indicates intended pi disablement in this boss

unless devs forgor to disable ii

and only disabled pi

[shrewd hare]

my ii was definitely not working for a set of runs one time

i swapped shards to run with someone else and it was working there

[fiery pagoda]

not the shard-based bugs

[shrewd hare]

i do think it wasnt working outside of the boss fight too

[winged talon]

yeah ive been fighting the boss in ring 11, and after the first use i cant use it again, just get hit with the cd

[shrewd hare]

thats funny cuz i think i was also in ring 11 where it didnt work

[mental cloak]

they're doing silent A/B pi nerf testing

[shy glacier]

Coincidentally (well, probably not), I remember the Star Point bell in ring11 being broken

And it was specifically ring11

[shrewd hare]

r11 on its last legs...

[long pond]

Brown rare trader randomly died on rings 1-7

[slow drum]

oh yeah

[shy glacier]

Probably realized that people just are not in the mood to play Brown (it is too long)

Then the trader retired

[slow drum]

drinking a Veilwalker’s Vial (60min regen) grants 67 mins 20 seconds regen in Twisted Jeremy

[shy glacier]

That sounds like you had a piece of equipment with Quench

Quench increases potion duration

[slow drum]

oh ████ even mainhanding a quench item

right

[shy glacier]

Gotta do it each time I drink speed potions for lootrunning 🙂

[spark radish]

Those elites should never instantly kill you in any set, they always give you time to react because their damage is split into partial typed (magic/melee) and partial %hp

So they hit tankier and normal builds about the same since tankier builds would feel the % more and normal builds would feel the flat more

I think not all of them do this rn but I’m planning to move more of them to do this sort of thing to hit most builds the same

[polar narwhal]

I think using too much % damage would make tankier builds less viable than they should be no?

[hoary trellis]

Sustain builds are the best 🥺

[deep kayak]

the boss is just bis dmg + lifedrain soothing regen pot

[blissful dock]

spaming % dmg in general is stupid.
Tanky builds are supposed to take more beating, sure I get it that situational stacking is way too fucking good, but if your solution is to spam % dmg on most attacks then the developer in question should definetly rethink the "solution"

[acoustic wigeon]

i think spamming it defeats the point of running something tankier but there definitely can be specific tank-buster type stuff

[spark radish]

It still makes you much tankier to run a set with more EHP, it just is overall less effective against those key threats

It wouldn’t be an issue for tankier sets to deal with the boss attacks or main mob spawns

since their larger health pool can sponge it

[timid vine]

I don't get the point of nerfing tankier builds though

the simplest counter to tankier builds is having the boss spawn mobs

% hp true damage really just promotes damage builds with sustain

No % HP true damage means there's a balance of EHP and enough damage to kill the spawned mobs in time for those that want to play effectively ( without optimizing time )

Then they can opt in to high damage builds if they want to complete the boss faster while upping the risk of death

and tankier builds that are too tanky are still punished by the fact that they might kill the spawned mobs too slow and get overwhelmed

all 3 existing sounds fairly healthy to me

[vivid garnet]

then thorns cleric appears

[void crown]

It'd be a balance of true + base damage though so it's not like it's just a giga punish for building tanky, it just brings an extreme closer to the average

[timid vine]

the extreme is extreme because it doesn't achieve anything without it being extreme

[spark radish]

I’m not really trying to target the extreme here, mostly trying to up the damage on tanky sustain builds like those found on warrior specs or some arcanists without hurting the lower bracket

Not crazy sustain but enough to make the fight easier if most attacks can be ignored

I do hear you though that if there’s too much true damage it starts to feel awful

that’s why it’s not used in a ton of circumstances here

[timid vine]

Personally I think that's a balance issue with those 2 playstyles in particular

and the lack of challenging DPS phases

[spark radish]

Maybe, but it would also be unwise to leave them both unchecked entirely in my opinion

It’s not a flawless solution and there are holes in it

[timid vine]

ye It's a fair point

I'm just saying that I think largely it favors the high damage playstyles because of it

[spark radish]

I am very open to changes on elites if some don’t feel threatening or if some feel overbearing

[spark radish]

I tend to disagree because of the sheer amount of stuff being thrown at you in the fight

[timid vine]

I don't really have much of an issue with any part of the boss

[spark radish]

There’s a lot of stuff that just dodging won’t solve, and you can view it as a soft EHP check

But I think there’s a lower and upper bound, which is a good thing

[timid vine]

I think that's exactly why it favors lower ehp builds

[timid vine]

The EHP check favors lower damage builds because of the true damage, so if something does 35 dmg + 10% hp, we can imagine without the true damage it dealing just a flat 60 damage

So in this case, the build with 150 EHP takes 40 damage and the tank build with 400 EHP takes 75

and if tank sustain builds would be an issue, I think a better prevention would be having just a single healing mob

or maybe if there's a lot of mobs in the arena, they gain a damage buff

[deep kayak]

you can make it % + raw

[slow drum]

it already is

[deep kayak]

what

[slow drum]

see above

[deep kayak]

i mean the other attacks

elites do a shit ton yes

[deep kayak]

you can run a 170 ehp build if you play well.

and that is 130 + warrior toughness

[icy raven]

As someone who runs a tankier set nothing is threatening besides everything at once and tantrum.

[deep kayak]

so turns out just run bers and a glass build and you can do the boss although u cant facetank the actual boss

[dusty kayak]

kill tantrum before it procs once

[deep kayak]

but oh wow theres a build also for that!

[dusty kayak]

and you win

[deep kayak]

yeah true

[icy raven]

Quite silly tantrum more threatening than Jeremy

[dusty kayak]

most classes have a nuke button so just have to keep that

[deep kayak]

also true dmg spam means healing is really important

and it just so happens we have a healing problem on bers

[dusty kayak]

bers should not have an healing ability methinks

[deep kayak]

it should just not to the degree where you run out of hunger and dont notice

you can basically chug pomes and facetank all attacks except minis on any sort of build

like if you have regen pot soothing rampage and a full satu bar you just cant die regardless of ehp

and honestly running agaric in an agil build might just make it tankier than using other items

also doesnt help that life drain and pauldron exists

[long pond]

Maybe apply more healing reduction effects?

[wanton dock]

@polar narwhal since the waves became pink instead of red could malevolent conduit become any other color than black? it's sometimes hard to see since the particles blend in

i'd run away from the boss but too bad the boss looks identical to the other 20 mobs in the arena

[polar narwhal]

planned

[wanton dock]

op thanks

[tranquil oyster]

the war on Life Drain next balance patch is gonna go crazy

🔥

[stark herald]

[tranquil oyster]

when does this actually happen

unless you're tearin' through pomes otherwise, which at that point is not a Bers-specific issue

[tranquil oyster]

I can have all of these and still die fairly easily, especially to Jeremy, but sure

[wanton dock]

okay so

nerf herald of the secret starts

pls ty

dude does an immense amount of dmg for 0 reason

[tranquil oyster]

what's your magic ehp

[hoary trellis]

I think the first elite of first hallucination is kinda obnoxious

It just combos you with almost zero counter play for some classes

I think shortening the attack's duration and increasing overall dmg would probably fix the issue

[tranquil oyster]

agree

currently does 15 swings but all of them do like no damage

...and I'm like at least 70% certain it doesn't respect KBR but that also might just be me bein' convinced KBR is a placebo stat

could probably be shortened to, like, 7-10 swings so the damage is a bit more concentrated while the combo potential if you can't disengage isn't as obnoxious

[meager token]

what does the second elite, the evoker, even do?

[long pond]

I have 10kbr and it still does this

[spark radish]

It doesn't respect it because if it did you would just die with even less counterplay

The counterplay is to turn around

[tranquil oyster]

🔥

[supple turtle]

it summon a red circle, start from its food, move toward player, when red circle success hit u, it summon weapon from sky hit that red circle spot

[supple turtle]

and so is pretty easy to dodge becuase player usually leave that spot already

[meager token]

"pretty easy to dodge" never once did I see that attack

[tranquil oyster]

...yeah, fair enough

I do think there's a lot of cool tech opened up by the static knockback many things in the fight do when you have a sufficiently tanky build

like surfin' the mini blight walls to get out of danger at the cost of a bit of health
-# god I love the fact that this boss actually respects tanky builds. I love this boss so much
-# I can't wait for him to immediately be made into the next Hexfall boss with the first major balance update so I never want to fight him again
it's a really cool concept that I wish I could mess with in more fights

[meager token]

"The illusion of choice"—give us the option to build tank then MURDER us for it.

You WILL build damage slop and you WILL love it!

[tranquil oyster]

I finally get to see a fight where I'm justified in buildin' primarily for survivability

and immediately thereafter see talks of potential upcomin' nerfs to my class and buffs to the boss

what a time to be a Warrior main

[meager token]

Gonna try to get to the point where I can solo without any Pomes or potions so I can freak the devs out and force a nerf to my class.

[tranquil oyster]

I could probably do that if I locked in, as they say

I've been takin' close note of how all the attacks work since I need to know how they work to write the Jeremy page
and I've gotten to a point where I can reasonably intuit what attacks I can and can't live based on what health I'm at

[long pond]

i wish getting hit off the platform tp'd you to the middle instead of launching you

[meager token]

I wish there were barrier blocks under the platform so you don't get accidentally stuck there and take hundreds of damage.

[spark radish]

I doubt we'll change much about the boss beyond QoL at this point, the beta testing got it into a really solid state that I'm mostly happy with

[meager token]

I wish Jeffrey + Parasomnic wasn't based partially on luck. (#gameplay-discussion message)

I wish Jeffrey couldn't hit you while Jeremy monologues before the final phase.

I wish Screamroom didn't cast before you picked a boon.

[tranquil oyster]

better question why is Screamroom able to cast while a cube is up

[meager token]

I wish boon hitbox was a little larger.

[tranquil oyster]

-# if this wasn't Discord you would be :o'd so hard right now
video :o

[supple turtle]

ah fuck

wrong place

[tranquil oyster]

gg

[long pond]

is orange tesseract supposed to be disabled for this fight

[spark radish]

not really

[long pond]

ok well it resets to 20m cd whenever u die

[meager token]

I also wish Willows miniboss had a slightly longer grace period because getting mauled while still blinded was not fun.

[spark radish]

that is weird.

[long pond]

what happens if you phase transition interloper without having killed the hallucination

[long pond]

correction: it never leaves cd

[spark radish]

i dont know because we didn't think anyone would try

let me know what happens i think it'd be funny

[hoary trellis]

the elite is just your average combo duel player 😭

[polar narwhal]

you cant

[devout star]

it might be conduit

[polar narwhal]

he has 100% dr during it

[devout star]

I have been having some issues where if i fall into the water it doesnt knock me all the way into the arena

[slow drum]

tcleric pierces 100% DR

[polar narwhal]

what

[slow drum]

it respects KBR allegedly

[polar narwhal]

thats a bug

[slow drum]

dumplingsushi completed twisted intruder with all three hallucinations alive

[polar narwhal]

welp ill just make him invulnerable

[devout star]

like i fall into the water , it knocks me into the edge of the arena and back into the water i go

[long pond]

end result: I made it to mist but died

I got to to the mist phase and 10 kbr wasn't enough to keep me in the circle while stuff is constantly hitting me

[long pond]

probably should do this

[long pond]

conduit?

[slow drum]

malevolent conduit

the buff eater

[long pond]

what does that have to do with the cd being reset

[coarse ginkgo]

does the ex-yellow boss dont glow? is that a bug

[mental cloak]

It doesn't, no - its quite annoying

[deep kayak]

yeah so annoying

it even looks the same

[icy raven]

ex-yellow boss??

Haven’t rolled it yet. Does ex-reverie show up?

[mental cloak]

I don't think so? I haven't seen it nor mention of it

[dusty kayak]

lowkey

it should do that during hard mode

@polar narwhal @spark radish

[coarse ginkgo]

well if it isnt, i think tm should add glowing effect

'cause i cant differentiate the boss from the elite 1st time roll the bos

[grand rose]

what if hard mode went thru all of them

[mental cloak]

hard mode idea: parasomnic mist circle is bigger but now it throws knockback projectiles at you

[mental cloak]

What if hard mode has all of them at once

[icy raven]

Going through 7 is just as easy as going through 3 tho it just takes longer

[mental cloak]

540s of time, six bosses surrounding you

[tranquil oyster]

the EX Yellow generals don't glow, no

[dusty kayak]

all 4 ex yellw generals

[tranquil oyster]

so you spend half the uptime just findin' the bastards

[mental cloak]

9 bossess

[tranquil oyster]

[dusty kayak]

on the yellow void part

[tranquil oyster]

me when I send all 4 generals into the void

easy victory

[mental cloak]

spleef boss when

[supple turtle]

finally, veilripper meta

[tranquil oyster]

peak

[ebon dagger]

i think the boss is like kinda fine as is

[deep kayak]

yellow could defenitely use some glowing

its literally a wheres waldo

[mental cloak]

https://tenor.com/view/find-luigi-luigi-discover-luigi-search-for-luigi-where-is-luigi-gif-1696725803543997727

[idle tree]

The entire boss fight

[tranquil oyster]

yeah the EX Yellow generals fight rn is a game of Where's Waldo until you can thin the herd of mobs enough to find the general in question

[spark radish]

it always spawns in the same place though

unless you mean the wandering to the side because it cant aggro

to be honest i dont think it should spawn as far anyways

[icy raven]

it should have glowing

thats all

[ornate mica]

I agree yellow is the hardest to tell
it's zombie which blends in
and also ex yellow has so many mobs that only appears once or twice in the actual dungeon so even if you played it a couple times you might not remember
vs magenta for example you have seen the elites many more times so you don't get confused as much

I mostly end up just killing the adds and whatever left is the boss probably

[hot yacht]

The boss spawns away from adds further down from where the adds are but yeah it should have glowing

Speaking of yellow though it feels really weak im not sure what it’s supposed to do, same with light blue besides the floating gimmick

[tranquil oyster]

I find the Herald of Secret Stars really weak

however:

I also have Magic Prot 7 and, when accountin' for Toughness' health increase, about 300ish magic ehp as a result

the Herald is entirely magic-oriented. as such, the fucker cannot hurt me in any way that matters

so take my word with a grain of salt

[hot yacht]

Im pretty sure it also attacks like a total of one time with a knock back attack

[tranquil oyster]

yeah he also just

kinda

doesn't do anything

so on top of me havin' stupidly high magic health makin' it safe for me to just freely wallop him
he doesn't attack nearly enough to make me appreciate havin' built that much magic health

[whole lava]

[meager token]

Willows meanwhile just ambushes you with mobs and a big worm bodyslam from all sides.

Blindness included.

[shy glacier]

I feel like that is more of a Winged Titan (EX Orange boss) thingy

I remember getting randomly flung around and not knowing what was happening 💀

[meager token]

Winged Titan is polite enough to wait for the blindness to wear off before slamming you.

[shy glacier]

The Willows boss does have some funny KB though

[meager token]

Veiltorn Helminth just goes for the kill the moment you spawn.

You know what's the worst?

[shy glacier]

Them when they meet my Second Wind 7 and Regeneration 4:

[meager token]

The elite that swaps places with you.

[shy glacier]

Guh. That one...

Nowadays, I use some tankier setups, so it is not as bad

[deep kayak]

its easy to lose track since the mobs look the same

[summer tusk]

Make it glow in gray instead of black

Or other noticeable color that matches the theme

[summer tusk]

ngl -80% seems too much as a sideeffect 💀

[undone grotto]

Could we make the boss have less particles, and then make specific skills more visible instead of relying on looking at the bossbar. e.g. Malevoent Conduit, and then reduce the number of particles it sweeps with.
When I first finished it, I was using the arcanists and I had to turn off my skill particles to watch the boss's skills. Then I realized it wasn't even enough, the excessive amount of particles made me sick while not making any sense. For example, some of the red particles (I didn't really know what they did, I wasn't taking damage or getting debuffed)

[spark radish]

I think malevolent conduit is just weirdly telegraphed atm

[undone grotto]

It's just some weird black particles that are then usually covered by the boss's other skill particles

[shy glacier]

It took me a while to even notice the telegraph

[long pond]

The mist ring being red in a field of red pisses me off

[cloud garnet]

thats the gimmick if anything other stats dont justify it being -80%

[slow drum]

+80% res, turn it into annilys 🧌

[mental cloak]

There's just no reason to use it ever but its budget is ok

[slow drum]

if there was a +50% crain dura charm then i could see people using it with malignant neuron

but the downside is uncancellable

[mental cloak]

Welp that's never gonna happen now because of malignant 💀

Too busted

worst part is that you need crain 2 for it to work screw this skill

[summer tusk]

Making it 2-3 cp , lowering the resistance by 10%-15% and increase the duration to -40 to -50

[mental cloak]

No it's supposed to be a parry deal

3s of high resistance

[shy glacier]

For the charm's name essentially being a brain expansion, it does not seem to be quite "big brain" to use the charm...

[summer tusk]

50% dr for 3 second 💀

[mental cloak]

Not "yeah about double"

[summer tusk]

Even if you max build aptit it will only be 25% uptime

[mental cloak]

"gotk but crain"

[shy glacier]

The "big brain" charm is very "small brain"

[summer tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/tiktok-shaquille-shaq-timeout-ethical-gif-9311067668442735802

[shy glacier]

We can say that both financially and in regards to its actual performance

[summer tusk]

Ngl 60% dr isnt even that high 💀

[summer tusk]

The performance is

Not satisfying

[pale creek]

the more i look at ssage epic the more i doubt its worth

[summer tusk]

The only situation I think it maybe viable

Is sskt support

[shy glacier]

The Twisted Intruder's real attack all along was that to our purses

[pale creek]

real

[summer tusk]

The helmet is way more superior

https://tenor.com/view/jarvis-jarvis-meme-smirk-tony-stark-iron-man-gif-11885783305913878074

[mental cloak]

2.5x ehp is not high...?

[pale creek]

helmet should have been an epic

it costs like one

[mental cloak]

It doesn't do anything new though

[pale creek]

eh

[summer tusk]

Aptit 5 build …

[mental cloak]

So I'd just vote for less cost

[pale creek]

its like silverthread raiment but in r3

[summer tusk]

Bro it got max budget

Actual w protection type + regicide 2

[pale creek]

yea ik its good

im saying its worth epic status

[shy glacier]

Not the "big brain" charm? 😦

[mental cloak]

It would get more mw too

[summer tusk]

Make it melee prot 3 and increase the price to 48 mat

[pale creek]

true ig

give it even more stats !

[summer tusk]

( ppl who purchased it b4)

[mental cloak]

No, just make a new enchant

No more stats; do something slightly goofy

[summer tusk]

The last item which got such treatment is grace

[pale creek]

chimera disgrace reference

[summer tusk]

And we all know how it went wrong

[mental cloak]

Every r3 epic has a unique enchantment

[pale creek]

yea but theres like 3 rn

non charms

[mental cloak]

Just because one was meh doesn't mean it should be discontinued

[summer tusk]

Also I think with aptit 5 and dew , you can gain gotk c blessing for 15 second straight without downtime

[summer tusk]

With epoch 5

[pale creek]

creating a new enchant for every epic sounds like too much work imo

[mental cloak]

Okay, then it shouldn't be epic and the price should be cut

[pale creek]

also locking enchants to epic reduces potential item variety

[summer tusk]

Rend :
Tho multiload exist for way too long( it is a thing since r3 release

[pale creek]

multiload being on a single epic is kinda sad

[deep kayak]

no u can full apti stack

and its perma gotk cbless

with boon + cdr pot

oh wait nvm its 35s now

u need apti 14 for full uptime 😭

or 13 ig with wind ichor

[mental cloak]

ah, very achievable

[deep kayak]

u can get apti 8 rn

but yeah not very viable

well the max is technically 9.33

[slow drum]

the cbless u in question

[mental cloak]

can we get an aptitude 50 piece with -30 max health

[deep kayak]

doesnt it apply to only you

[deep kayak]

real

[summer tusk]

https://ohthemisery.vercel.app/builder/m=Courage of the Rampart-4&o=Somnus Tractate&h=Adventurer's Helm&c=Silverthread Raiment&l=Moqqil's Tarnished Legguards-4&b=Liminal Sabatons&charm=None

🗣️ 🔥

[deep kayak]

ywah

[mental cloak]

also, technically BIS thurible set

[slow drum]

well if your teammate does the ritual too

[deep kayak]

wdym

[mental cloak]

you can't drop below 60% hp if you can't drop below 100% hp

[deep kayak]

so it doesnt work for bers

true

[mental cloak]

(without popping like a grape)

[pale creek]

so real actually

glass buffbot

[deep kayak]

but the helmet is too costly yeah

[slow drum]

is it melee / proj / magic or melee / proj / abil rn

[deep kayak]

melee proj abil

idk if bf counts

[pale creek]

well since i alr bought i think we should raise the price some more

[deep kayak]

is it good

[pale creek]

give it regi 3 while at it

on arca felt a bit better than sentinel

and it is on paper bis steel dps

but you lose speed

[deep kayak]

i think i like raw dmg on arc

[pale creek]

i like having spells off cd faster idk

[deep kayak]

but its bis helmet anyways

[pale creek]

and on elites you only lose 10%

[deep kayak]

so ill get it

and u also dont need to mix for bis apti now

[cloud garnet]

why would 60% res have high uptime

lowering res for more duration just changes the gimmick entirely

[mental cloak]

kind of a shame that we will never get another + duration cbless charm because it's not locked

[slow drum]

+dura%

[mental cloak]

it's already +duration%

[tranquil oyster]

I find it incredibly likely that certain existin' charms will be retrofitted with stat locks in the near future

[mental cloak]

base charms are +dura flat

which, are even worse because it's like. one lmfao

[tranquil oyster]

(see also: relevantly, the Gears of the King, which are why we haven't gotten a Celestial Blessing +Duration% charm ever)

[mental cloak]

it's like bloodhound crest making every dmg% charm instantly better because the cooldown was reduced

speaking of that could have probably gotten locked and like -3 stars lmao

oh well

[pale creek]

yea make qd shit again

i dont play it anymore so

[supple turtle]

is fine and balance now leave it alone

[mental cloak]

where is my recoil charm

[pale creek]

erm mr epic...

[mental cloak]

+2 recoil shots -90% cooldown -100% damage locked

[coarse ginkgo]

chat will bers get nerf due to jeremy

[spark radish]

not specifically because of jeremy but it's had it coming for a while

this just kind of reinforced the motive to go and change something

[coarse ginkgo]

RIIP

[vivid garnet]

no

i triggered it as hunter in uamiel once

got message saying cbless extended

[vivid garnet]

it should? rampage or bf counts as an ability

[mental cloak]

why is the enhancement not just... 5s of extra duration?
do we hate people who are out of combat

does it stack or something?

[warm flint]

a few months ago I talked with Aristotle about that enhancement

the idea is that it's playing off Cleric's ability to utilize multiple weapon types

[warm flint]

Nope

it's a unique type of buff extension though

It's not affected by -duration charms

So you can use it with gotk and get a massive uptime boost

[mental cloak]

I guess that's something...

but it sounds like it's made for gotk and nothing else then?

the trigger condition is, whatever
"Play the game"

just feels a tad boring + made for one charm in particular mostly

[warm flint]

you need both melee, proj and ability damage though

idk there's way more boring cleric enhancements

[mental cloak]

Oh you need all three

[warm flint]

Yes

[mental cloak]

... that's kinda annoying then.

[warm flint]

not really

[mental cloak]

Mainly as a buff cleric

If your teammates need to extend it personally then they need to spell + melee + proj? Or you need to, which is less bad but still odd

[warm flint]

for melee classes you just need to have screwdriver in your hotbar

[warm flint]

everyone has to do it themselves

[slow drum]

i really do think that the extension should count all players under its effect instead of having it be per person

[mental cloak]

[slow drum]

then it has MORE team synergy instead of LESS

[warm flint]

it would be nice

[deep kayak]

except its like probably bugged

[deep kayak]

this.

its just a nerf to clerics buffs

also cbless dmg buff is awful

because additive

[polar narwhal]

oh my god the gameplay discussion

chat reminder this is jeremy!!!!

[mental cloak]

twisted boss has gameplay therefore it is gameplay discussion channel

[polar narwhal]

[slow drum]

cbless u would be more useful in jeremy if it counted all players

[vivid garnet]

please make the blades less annoying. i that 75% to 50% hp phase is so annoying not only bc they chip u (rarely even hit on hunter) but also make those sounds constantly. id rather have them be attacking less but harder

[polar narwhal]

planning to rework them at some point

but GUh i hate display entities

[vivid garnet]

my ears sing hymns of joy when they end

[vivid garnet]

arent they slimes

[mental cloak]

No that would be cancer

[polar narwhal]

they are slimes

just for the winged ai

[mental cloak]

Wait what

oh

[vivid garnet]

those blades are invisible slimes

[polar narwhal]

The actual sword is a display entity

[mental cloak]

No hitbox?

[vivid garnet]

yeah i think

[mental cloak]

That makes sense then

Imagine if they had actual hitboxes

[vivid garnet]

hotbox

🔥

[mental cloak]

idk why autocorrect thinks that's a word

[hoary trellis]

which blades

the flying red ones?

[terse raven]

maybe make the mist circle start at middle because if it spawns opposite of me its instant death

and remove the slowness effect on leaving the strider area

[slow drum]

isn’t that only if you fail

[terse raven]

no

you get 3 seconds of halved speed

[polar narwhal]

@spark radish

[terse raven]

or it could start at a fixed distance from where the boss was so it isnt too far

[shy glacier]

I feel that the location of the circle during the deadly floor phase is also not great. It often spawns way too far (30+ blocks) to reach before the surrounding ground becomes deadly

[mental cloak]

I feel like it's way too easy during and the only challenge is actually reaching it

like, you can only die if youre already low.or.theres mobs

[terse raven]

or high ping

it ended like 10% of my runs

[warm flint]

what is your build's walk speed

[shy glacier]

Well, yes, but when the circle does spawn too far, it feels pretty unfair. This is considering a build that has ~140% of the normal movement speed -- and you can only imagine if you have the default movement speed...

[vivid garnet]

best option would to make the circle spawn where the boss was when casting it

[terse raven]

150

[warm flint]

https://tenor.com/view/theres-no-way-no-way-cat-theres-just-no-way-gif-23159398

maybe it's good ping privilege but I've got a 135 speed pala and that's never struggled to get to the circle

[slow drum]

don’t you have cbless illu and allat

[warm flint]

that's with both skills taken into consideration

105 base, plus 30 from skills

[polar loom]

boss was fun

cleared with ssage and dot apoth

https://odetomisery.vercel.app/builder/m=Blightblood Falchion-4&o=Serebrian Wristblade-4&h=Crown of the Lost Beyond-4&c=Darkstar Pauldron-4&l=Duskroot Legguards-4&b=Nature's Failure-4&charm=None

the harb apoth run died before second liminal shadows sadly

[polar loom]

@polar narwhal how tall is the sinking nightmares attack

[polar narwhal]

uh

[polar loom]

as in can i just jump up to avoid it

[polar narwhal]

like 4 blocks?

[polar loom]

(jump boost 5 baby)

[polar loom]

you see i can still jump over this

[frank parcel]

Making Cerebral a 2 star but letting it get to more of a poise 2 level of DR might be nice
Or making the cloud huge for those 3 seconds, making it a strong ally utility

[warm flint]

the reason why cerebral sucks is because cleric has literally no skill points to spare

it could give me 60% DR and I would not use it because the opportunity cost is too high

crusade has to be removed from Cleric

it is imperative

you cannot afford to stay competitive while also investing in rain2 and the charm point

paladin also has basically no charm points to spare because LI is bad without pulsar

😊

there are a mountain of bigger issues that should be tackled before awkwardly chucking duration or res at cerebral until it finds a place in some niche support kit

(this is also the boss feedback thread....)

[frank parcel]

True true I can’t deny that

[tranquil oyster]

🥀

time to place my bets on if the impendin' nerf actually gets at the heart of the issue or just guts a part of normal Bers play for no reason again

[warm flint]

i think that it's entirely possible to nerf the top end of bers without obliterating "regular builds"

we will have to see though

[tranquil oyster]

I already know what the problem point is

(Brute Force stackin' is entirely too potent. seriously, it's actually kind of absurd, and I will concede that that probably does need a nerf)

I just hope the nerf isn't made to the base skill and instead addresses
the charms that make it a problem

[slow drum]

*concede

[tranquil oyster]

thank you

my word choice probably sucks right now, I'm still wakin' up a bit

but you get what I'm tryin' to say, I think

if I'm to be honest

I think a lot of the power comes from Pressure Gauntlet

look at this thing

[slow drum]

that’s not… that significant?

isn’t it Deepslate Chunk and Morel’s Bracers

like sure the -70% wave delay is cool but it doesn’t affect sustained DPS

[tranquil oyster]

does the damage ratio buff not do anything significant?

[slow drum]

second wave is 75% of the first (85% with gauntlet)?

[tranquil oyster]

yeah

goes from 75% to 85% with Gauntlet

i.e. the damage falloff is considerably less steep

combine that with -70% wave delay and it turns enhanced Brute Force into a burst damage monster

[slow drum]

with Morel’s it’s 1 + 0.75 + 0.5625 =2.313
with Gauntlet only it’s 1 + 0.85 =1.85
with Morel’s and Gauntlet both it’s 1 + 0.85 + 0.7225 =2.573

that’s a difference 26% of base… for 3cp

[tranquil oyster]

Morel's Bracer is also

certainly a charm

[slow drum]

Morel’s has more effect

[tranquil oyster]

gimmickless +1 wave is probably

[slow drum]

Deepslate has FAR more effect

[tranquil oyster]

not the best idea

[cloud garnet]

normal bers is also a problem

not just dps bers

[tranquil oyster]

WHAT DID I DO ;c;

[vivid garnet]

gb spam 6s cd meteor nuke

but please dont touch r2 bers

[tranquil oyster]

I was gonna say

yeah this feels like
entirely an enhancement + charm problem

[vivid garnet]

that and r3 is just more forgiving with general ehp-mob dmg ratios

[tranquil oyster]

and I'm gonna be really upset if- no, when I get nerfed in the Valley and/or Isles unnecessarily for something that has nothing to do with them

[long pond]

i'm kind of already resigned to the fact that r1 and r2 warrior are definitely going to be rendered unplayable next balance patch

[slow drum]

it’s fine trust

mscr is probably doing the balance

[tranquil oyster]

the war on Warrior next balance patch is gonna go crazy 🔥

[vivid garnet]

war roar

[long pond]

i will believe TM is capable of doing this when they can go more than 1 balance patch in a row without massive collateral damage

[timid vine]

if it makes you feel better, you already got buffed in the valley

[tranquil oyster]

-# I wonder if it's worth makin' a feedback post about Brute Force and its obscene charm stackin'
ehhhh

[long pond]

might be?

[slow drum]

i think it is

but write out all the math

[rancid bramble]

twisted omencallers earth domain expansion should not have a 90 block vertical hitbox

how was it sniping me from like 30 blocks below

[novel path]

i hate this

[long pond]

Yeah

[mental cloak]

yup!

and it refuses to descend

ever

[hoary trellis]

throw this dude into the trash can and please make the trash can explode

[novel path]

agree!

[hot yacht]

ire of the gods

[novel path]

for one hit

[acoustic wigeon]

kb it into the little window things

beforei t float

[hoary trellis]

this boss is just jank

[acoustic wigeon]

yes

[hoary trellis]

nothing more to say

[cloud garnet]

repeat 30 times

[spark radish]

Why would I touch R1 warrior for a bers change though

[warm flint]

hyegg

[ebon dagger]

the skills

[spark radish]

which are in r2

[ebon dagger]

on another note
if i wanted to solo
are there some classes that are just not usable

[icy raven]

so are we murdering rampag

[spark radish]

I mean just an outright nerf doesnt solve anything and just hurts r2 more

we’ll need to test stuff more

[deep kayak]

remove chausses

[icy raven]

wtf good philosophy in my monumenta balance??

[warm flint]

it's more likely than you think

[shy glacier]

Is it really that commonly used?

[mental cloak]

common or not it's kinda odd how a charm is practically necessary for a skill to exist

[ebon dagger]

yeah

if they remove the charm
then gb is uh
lol

[mental cloak]

oh boy I can't wait to get a stack in this bossfight every eight seconds

[shy glacier]

Am I like one of the few people who prefer the non-Chausses builds?

[shy glacier]

You can GB up...

With level 2

[idle tree]

With chausses you can gb down and crit at the same time and repeat for alotta dps

And it’s also decent for consistent aoe

I mean clearing wise if chausses is removed you’d just switch to brute force stuff and it’ll be pretty similar

[mental cloak]

it's still more convoluted

[shy glacier]

I feel it is not necessary, though, and you seem to do just as well without it

[mental cloak]

cause of this

it's not necessary but it practically turns berserker into a different class

[shy glacier]

I hate the 5⭐ cost to it

[mental cloak]

yeah

that's the other thing

[shy glacier]

It removes the variety

[mental cloak]

you have to take the 5 charm power hit to play this archetype have fun!

[idle tree]

You definitely don’t need it becuase berserker is just strong but it’s very strong

[shy glacier]

Though, perhaps I am being a bit of a hypocrit when I am a meteor slam stacker

[mental cloak]

cursed solution: pull a bloodpact and give -70% glorious battle damage on chausses to turn it into a 1* charm

[shy glacier]

Then we get a Urn of Perpetuity

[mental cloak]

locked
im a genious

[shy glacier]

🔒

[idle tree]

Making hydraulic unusable wouldn’t even do that much

[mental cloak]

good point we should just replace meteor slam
hmm, I wonder what previous skill people would like to see on berserker

[shy glacier]

Please, no. I love meteor slam 😦
It can be a bit powerful, but

[mental cloak]

i have this cool idea called meteor slam where you summon a meteor where you're looking that falls from the sky that sets enemies on fire nearby where it lands

[wanton dock]

make mist a fair attack day 1

[icy raven]

Why is mist unfair

[ornate mica]

problem solved day 0

[wanton dock]

because its allowed to spawn across the entire arena from you

at random as well, it's not predictable

there are edge cases where it's physically impossible to get to it in time

it either has to have a set max distance from you it can spawn or have a set spawn location e.g. always mid or always boss

[vivid garnet]

imo it should be done solely because the actual hard part should not be finding the damn ring

[icy raven]

It should be near the boss 100%

[wanton dock]

i do not mind spotting the ring being a part of the challenge

nor do i mind it being the majority of it, even if it makes little sense

what i do mind however is edge cases being possible

a mechanic that can softlock you from beating the boss at random is as good as a bug and needs fixing

[shrewd hare]

wouldnt increasing the timer also be a solution
i think its quite fast

*the windup for the circle

[long pond]

Something something build issue about not building enough speed or something

Clearly the solution is to bring a speedset lockbox with you or something

We will conveniently ignore the combo of ring is difficult to spot + spawns on the opposite end of the arena

[frank parcel]

Or if you really want to compromise: increase the timer dynamically if it’s farther away and make the indicator for where it is clearer

[devout star]

Maybe 2 rings instead of 1 . Would also help with player collision

[meager token]

Or slightly increase the diameter of the ring.

Though that probably wouldn't help with Jeffrey having some unfunny interactions with the skill.

[deep kayak]

#12676 [misc - N/A] awesome118 ⚪
Add "Twisted Fragments" which can be crafted into Tormented Fragments. To keep it balanced it should require a large amount, or just have Tormented Fragments be a rare drop from T1's. That way you don't have to grind out Tormented with other players if you want to play the new boss.
Closed: You are not forced to run tormented to buy keys (week 2)

errrr

[mental cloak]

correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't this just mean that you can still run around for x seconds to remove the debuff, but for longer

not sure this really means anything to any player with more than 80% speed

[summer tusk]

@spark radish Next week right ?

[mental cloak]

week (x+1)

[summer tusk]

[spark radish]

i was gonna just make a har cost but your wallet will explode i will assure you that

do your tormenteds!

[deep kayak]

so how much

[summer tusk]

Ngl why not 2 har per frag

There were literally ppl buying them for 1.5 surely 2 is reasonable

[deep kayak]

??

thats not reasonable

please just do 32ar per

its not even worth outside of daily rn

[summer tusk]

Just grind your tormented

[deep kayak]

no

[summer tusk]

Then that’s not my problem

[mental cloak]

just do [mildly inconvenient thing] instead of paying [price I set exorbitantly high on purpose]

[summer tusk]

Make the tormented Spawned in the boss drop fragment but increase their stat back to 18 pt

Btw @spark radish Is the 500 damage cap for hallucination intentional

[polar narwhal]

yes

[summer tusk]

Glad it is a thing so it won’t spawn all 3 elite at the same time

[velvet coral]

it would actually forget to spawn some of them

[polar narwhal]

uh

yeah

I can try to make like a real silly debuff

like you see illusions of mobs on ur screen

or something

[hot yacht]

if running the debuff timer down isnt intended why not just make it last the whole fight?

maybe nerf it a bit if it needs one, but like its either too harsh and you have to run it down or its playable and you could go the whole fight with it

[summer tusk]

Curse of the veil 4

[mental cloak]

screamroom is already, like, a complete-non issue for any class that plays the game - but yeah having it incrementally stack up if you keep failing it is a good idea

[supple turtle]

we have 1 advancement is failed screamroom + win, so it'll affect that

if we gonna change to something last whole run

[long pond]

Make the effect permanent + stacking but significantly less dangerous per stack maybe?

[mental cloak]

yeah
+10% per is good I think?
it doesn't have a cap on # of casts afaik

[long pond]

Its on a timer yeah

[mental cloak]

but again it is like not threatening in the slightest unless you are underlevelled or are tcleric

so the actual skill itself should probably be changed not the debuff

[mental cloak]

oh and your teammate can even assist you

so even if you're low dps if you have [literally any damaging class] as a partner, they can just kill your cube for you in about two seconds

[long pond]

Have it semi rapidly apply very low effect but permanent stacks of a debuff the longer its up with a cap per cast

Something like -1% max hp every 1-2s until you kill it

[mental cloak]

that's still not really a problem? dps classes will just win harder

clearly the solution is to kill any class with less than 250 ehp in any stat instantly when screamroom is cast

[long pond]

Is that really an issue though

[mental cloak]

I think it is if they're worried about balancing it which I think the changelog shows they are

or at least, the debuff aspect

[long pond]

Ppl have been complaining about the fight being unreasonably advantageous to tanky builds

[mental cloak]

even the tankiest warrior can kill screamroom in the allotted time

[long pond]

Which doesnt matter in this scenario?

[mental cloak]

if this is the case making it harder to kill will nerf those types of builds, no?

[deep kayak]

what?

[long pond]

The design of twisted intruder is “death by a thousand cuts”, this is an effect that scales dangerousness based on your performance and kills you slowly via a thousand debuffs, and punishes you for dragging the fight out long enough

[deep kayak]

no its doable with close to bis

you dont need ehp that much

only healing

[long pond]

Not what I’m talking about

A reasonably tanky build with some sustain can full facetank, eg ethereal thorns

[mental cloak]

yeah the actual non-ability damage (and even most of the abilities) is ridiculously low

[long pond]

Personally i dont care but a vocal group do

[mental cloak]

combined with no dps checks it's almost a free win which is

[mental cloak]

honestly even I'm a little offput by how comedically easy it is if you know the attacks
the only threat is actual rng rolling lb boss

[long pond]

This is like a 5-in-1 response to a bunch of things ppl complain about

[mental cloak]

I guess I am slightly biased but the danger is really low if you have even a slight amount of healing

[mental cloak]

which things?
I can see pure tank builds

[meager token]

Wow, a fight becomes easy once you learn its attacks.

Let's throw random rng elements in

[mental cloak]

comedically being the key point here
I can walk into the boss and it dies with no struggle

that should almost never be the case

[terse raven]

i sat through solo final phase with sustain apoth and didnt have to move except for scars

i think being able to clear the boss in tanky set is fine because it takes forever, using a damage set will be more worth it

[long pond]

• thematic to the fight design of “death by a thousand cuts”
• rewards being able to nuke it without also being rendered entirely irrelevant, because stacks are unavoidable, it becomes a matter of mitigating stack gain rate
• punishes excessively tanky builds for dragging the fight out
• cannot be waited out by running around
• does not render the advancement too unreasonable to do

If you can come up with any alternative that solves or helps with a similar amount of issues, go for it

[meager token]

Making certain debuffs permenent probably wouldn't be entirely an issue if only black tall guys room wasn't ass sometimes to get out of solo

[long pond]

This is purely about scream room to clarify

[mental cloak]

this is only about screamroom rn

[meager token]

Is it? Alright then, no complaints.

[long pond]

Cognitive is a different can of worms

[mental cloak]

cognitive's main problem is a disparity in solo vs duo I think

completely different attack

well, not really a problem I guess

[deep kayak]

kb mobs:

[long pond]

What about them

[mental cloak]

?

[meager token]

"Death by a thousand cuts" imagine the boss dealt minuscule but permanent damage

[deep kayak]

they kb you outside of screamroom and sometimes u fail

[mental cloak]

welcome back eclipse 8 risk of rain 2

[long pond]

If you get kb out of scream room u just die

In which case does it matter? You’re dead

[mental cloak]

it's not really a fail yeah

so that's irrelevant to the debuff applied

[polar narwhal]

The idea is to make part of the fight more difficult due to debuffs

[polar narwhal]

the way I see it, the boss.is meant to be played on a semi tanky build, rewarding tank playstyles with more leeway in taking damage, dps playstyles are actively discouraged by this boss. (And yet some people still decide to full dps set)

I think an issue is that screamroom had changed roles in the fight midway

perhaps I should reevaluate the different parts of the spell

My current idea of it is to punish not properly killing adds when given the chance, with a minor punishment for failing the dps check of it

[meager token]

Is not picking a boon on time also meant to be punished?

[deep kayak]

full dps set is only viable if you are either god or use consumables

[polar narwhal]

yes

[meager token]

And was the boons' ass hitboxes fixed or at least made easier to pick them?

[deep kayak]

@polar narwhal can u make gates and minis not go on the gray terracotta floor

i literally cant do anything if im melee

[polar narwhal]

uh

just wait

-w-

[deep kayak]

first of all what does -w- even mean here

also thats just bad design

because its literally rng

and its not like you need to instakill the jumper elite

[mental cloak]

:3

cat sits

[polar narwhal]

I can make it not tp onto gray ig

but adds will still walk on it

[mental cloak]

honestly it's whatever if it goes onto grey

[meager token]

I wouldn't exactly mind Screamroom punishing the player for not picking a boon in time if sometimes clicking on a boon didn't just do nothing.

[mental cloak]

just wait

[deep kayak]

just make it not tp to it

[deep kayak]

the elites have attacks that you cant just wait out so like

have you seen how some of them are

[mental cloak]

yes

they are all relatively easy to wait out via moving away slightly

[deep kayak]

you cant hit them on melee after the first few seconds

[meager token]

My favourite elite is the very last one

[deep kayak]

oh god

how do i even land a hit

[meager token]

Adrenaline Rush Guy

On a good day I let my fox do it and maybe land a PStrike and Volley into its face

[slow drum]

fixed this update

[meager token]

On a bad day the fox kills the cube

[slow drum]

(they have 0.1 health instead of 1 now)

[long pond]

Sustain fox build go

[supple turtle]

Fixed Nightmarish Carvings not being able to be claimed while spam clicking

[meager token]

I wasn't exactly always spam clicking whenever picking them failed but ok

[supple turtle]

i don't really know what make u failed but at least that's some improvement

[slow drum]

you could probably replace the gray terracotta with light blocks or something

[deep kayak]

how do you know this

[slow drum]

it was revealed to me by the Dream
(i was playing intruder with jade and i punched it and it didn’t work and she said “yeah it doesn’t work cause it has 1 health and if you spam click you deal less than 1 damage. i’ll probably just change it to 0.1 health”)

[deep kayak]

or just make a punch event

wait can you just shoot it

[slow drum]

i suspect it’s RangeImmune 3 blocks and SkillImmune

[deep kayak]

just make it on melee

[pale creek]

MeleeImmune

[slow drum]

and i’m guessing HVMetal’s issue is that the RangeImmune checks for centre of mass but the punch range of a player is a bit more than that

so it should be RangeImmune 5

[slow drum]

@polar narwhal

[deep kayak]

i dont even know if this is a thing

but

u can do it on melee hit

instead of weird mechanics

[summer tusk]

Increase the intensity of debuffs
For example screamroom
To permanent-40% hp and -30% damage
Conduit providing stackable 25% vulnerability
But allowing an option during carving that removes all debuff

[willow plaza]

not sure any boss tag comes to mind that does that already/allows that kind of selection by default

would probably take plugin changes to do

[summer tusk]

( omen is so useless fr fr )