#Necromancy Skilling Questions

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lilac sleet
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necromancy Created a thread to focus your lovely feedback! Necromantic_focus

lethal urchin
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  1. I think that one of the strongest parts of Necro skilling rn is the product generation through rituals. That checklist of things to make tickles a completion itch, but kinda dies once you’ve made all the necro armor. I’d like to see more rituals that produce components for armors/crafted masterwork items/etc.

  2. Rituals i think will get better over time with variety. New locations with new disturbances.

  3. I’d like to see new gear pieces to earn/make as sidegrades. Stuff that leans you more into one theme (souls/blood/bloat) of necro over the others. And stuff like abilities and incantations to support different necro builds. Ultimately the skilling side of necro should be bolstering the combat side i think.

fresh timber
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Thanks for reaching out! For me personally I would like to focus mainly on #2 and address the issue I have with upkeeping ectoplasm and (related) inks for the rituals. I would like to see a way to increase my output of ectoplasm and more efficient/less use of the inks. I really enjoy Necromancy combat, but restocking the ectoplasm in particular is quite tedious and takes quite a long time in comparison with how fast you deplete the ectoplasm in combat. The runecrafting aspect for me is totally fine as is 🙂

livid comet
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Personally I'd like to see an "ectoplasm" focused ritual. Currently I think there's just commune (add souls) or essence (convert to necro ess). People have mentioned ectoplasm being quite expensive at the moment so a ritual dedicated to making higher amounts could help with that.

My pain points with rituals were mostly misclicking when trying to do an event and running away from the standing spot for ones that don't need you to move, it was particularly difficult when playing on mobile if there was a shining tile event directly behind the plinth..

As for reward or skilling, potentially a skilling based summon so they wouldn't all be combat based. Eg. summon with ectoplasm and it'll do gathering skills with you slightly buffing the rate for gathering skills (although that idea could be too close to other summoning creatures)?

timid loom
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A bit of a mix of skilling & combat:
Mixing Divination & Necromancy, a Sign of Spiritualism:

  • Made by using an ensoul item ritual on a Sign of Life
  • Use the Sign of Spiritualism on a familiar to apply the effect (limit 1 sign per familiar)
  • Effect when made with...
  • Lesser ensoul material: When your familiar's timer expires, brings it back to life at 25% of the original time. This consumes a pouch from your inventory.
  • Ensoul material: When your familiar dies in combat, brings it back to life at 25% health. This consumes a pouch from your inventory.
  • Greater ensoul material: Combined effects of lesser & regular ensoul. Does NOT consume a pouch from your inventory.

All in all, I think there's a lot of potential with the Ensoul Item ritual if it were opened up to more items, allowing other skills to interact with Necromancy

plush cape
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My biggest pain point is that there's a spot around t80 where you are incentivized to wait until you get the third ring of glyphs before making armor.

Imo it would be a huge upgrade of the multiplication glyph worked as a % chance when the % is below 100 and the yield is only one item. Currently you basically have to wait for 100% for equipment and this is a bigger deal with using things like the subjugation robes

crude cairn
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Ritual specific I feel like switching Rituals could be handled better, now you either need to overwrite or clear all and start over, with ink being pretty expensive and somewhat hard to make considering how much ectoplasm you need it feels like a huge waste to switch ritual to something else.

Oh I need souls so I’ll commune, 10 rituals later you run out of ink, well I don’t have the ectoplasm so you need nuke your site to get the ectoplasm. Then once you have a decent amount you need to nuke it again to do commune … ad infinitum.

Also the daily reward from the shop from diary could perhaps be saved in a chest and saved up for days or a week and claimed in one go. Perhaps part of the reward for hard tier diary.

plush cape
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  1. I'd like a 4th conjure. I think a Skilling conjure could be really interesting but a 4th combat one would be nice
crude geyser
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will focus on #3 since people have covered what id say for the other 2, Reward wise conjure overrides are always nice, an upgrade to life trasnfer to extend conjure life by more than 21 seconds would be nice.

late herald
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  1. Maybe add a perk or item that provides the player the chance of saving / not using an ink when drawing glyphs. Similar to how the scroll of life works.
rose cargo
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I’d love to see city of um achievement diaries completed. Maybe add in some way to generate more ectoplasm

restive sorrel
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  1. An ectoplasm ritual that rewards nothing but ectoplasm at a much higher rate than the other current rituals. This would benefit ironmen ironman players greatly.

  2. Add a toggle that prevents us starting rituals when our alteration glyphs are broken.

I'd like to see overall ectoplasm and ink output increased as well (another ironman specific request)

  1. I'd like to see skilling based summons that could mean that you could create a skilling necromancy offhand using the existing offhands (augmentable as well)
warped basalt
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Posted in wrong channel so I’ll repost here

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Necromancy pain point that isn’t really talked about

The necessity of Rituals to obtain necromancy souls and complete quests kind of messes up natural combat progression by giving you exclusively necromancy exp and neglecting defense exp

IE, players SHOULD after completing their 4th necromancy upgrade have the ability to wield t40 weapons and gear, however due to the different exp sources, they often end up with the necromancy level to equip the weapons, however do not have the defence level to equip the armour. This gets much worse later on when players can have 90 necromancy for the weapons but still can’t equip even the t80 armour

It’s not a game breaking issue, but considering necromancy attempts to streamline entry into combat, it inadvertently forces players to train it in a none streamlined way (catching up their defense exp after the fact)

wanton field
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A use for demon ashes would really fit nicely. Even if it's just a replacement for regular ashes at better ratio (or still 1:1).
Bonfires were developped for a reason, going backwards from that design feels bad. I'd rather run Zammy dungeons for ashes, or AoE lesser demons, even if it's technically worst ashes/h, at least it's not a high intensity+mind numbing method.
A missed opportunity to integrate demon ashes in any ways

Incantations could also be used for skilling or combat support, somewhat like seren spells (crystalize & crystal mask) and lunar spells (spiritual healing, vengeance), maybe your undead buddies can give us an assist in artisan/gathering/support skills, similar to summoning familiars that gives invisible bonuses to skills

I share a bit of frustration with the 80-89 lvls feeling pretty bad, pedestal obstructing the 1 glyph behind it a bit, disturbances always spawning with just a few ticks left on the ritual means it's easy to miss them (feels bad to notice a ghost only halfway through the board and it disappears because the ritual ended) defaulting to "success" on ritual end for all existing disturbances might be too strong, perhaps just moving the interval to be closer to the middle of the ritual would be better?

chilly cairn
shrewd cobalt
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  1. Craftable skilling off hands with interesting buffs
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celest iron
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  1. rituals focussing on generating ectoplasm as a focus, could work with only mementos as input and low/no xp.

3a) ecto funtus ritual site (with rework)
3b) necro sun spear => gain souls with % chance (in canon if they consent = gain souls) and would enable necro on vyre. Optionally works with the ecto funtus has its own souls vessel

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3c) necro blood necklace for DG

celest iron
mild canyon
celest iron
celest iron
livid comet
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Oh I'm also not sure if it'd count as one of the questions but atm Hermod is kinda useless to kill after you have your plates for the power armour. The plates are his only drop and have a limit on how many are ever useful to a player.

There's also a massive abundance of mementos, I trained most of 120 by doing rituals and got up to I think like 90k souls bc I did a ton of commune rituals. I was getting more mementos from the rituals than I was using, I don't have the overall numbers but with me personally getting more than I was using and them being dropped by Hermod and Rasial, there have to be more entering the game than leaving it which has made them worth so little. They should either have additional uses or the supply should be a lot lower than it is (ideally both)

violet eagle
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  1. Ectoplasm ritual with it as the only output, but in increased amount. You will otherwise see ironman grievances in particular in the future as people run out from their normal ritual grind.

  2. Protection glyphs need to be changed, their effect doesn't do anything but negative impact right now. You could for example have it give +base ritual xp (most of the xp come from disturbances) for those who would rather afk with lower but guaranteed xp.

  3. Slayer headslot item. Many options here, like Dragith Nurn's mask ensouled at a ritual, a gem dropped by Nechryael (they have no big drops but is a notable slayer creature, are the spawn of Orcus, and this would make it obtained in a similar method to other slayer headpieces), or something completely new.

  • Sidegrade gear. Gear that focuses on either necrosis, souls, or on minions.
spark yoke
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pain points :

  • double ectoplasm cost on conjure undead army feels excessive (maybe add a high tier / temporary unlock to remove the increased cost)
  • All ritual related items should have a storage on-site
  • Add a bank chest to the Um ritual site, it's already 5 seconds from war's retreat and death's office, make it a task reward if you have to
  • a lot of glyphs aren't worth using, e.g. there's practically no point in speed and none at all in protection

Suggestions :

  • add optional combat disturbances this would allow for opting into more lean forward rituals
  • Attunement rituals, for a long duration buff, think like, an hour.
  • ensouling consumables / production items for bonus xp / output (think ensouling compost for some more herbs)

Benefits :
Attunement ritual, attunements :
Attunements would be limited to 1, increasing this would be a potential reward space
examples

  • slight chance to save runes
  • small chance for a conjure to resummon on expiration
  • burying bones produces ashes
  • increased ushabti capture chance
  • a portent of life effect
  • free death
  • slight increase soul split heal

Ritual equipment( knife / doll / orb / tome / totems ) :

  • ensoul the item, to convert them
  • no combat stats
  • give a bonus to a specific ritual disturbance
  • can be inscribed with a glyph (capped at their tier, can be changed)
  • craftables, allow Foundational glyphs
  • *dropped, allow **Any *glyph
  • give disturbance specific boon(s) (either static, or generated upon crafting)
  • higher tiers could offer more than 1 boon

Ritual site cosmetics :

  • add toggleable decoration unlocks after certain soul thresholds / quests

Incantation :
unlock teleports to various necromancy related locations, after a ritual at the specific location

solemn silo
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Sort of a hybrid of 2 + 3 (And touched on by some others) is the Ectoplasm rates.
Currently feels very meh to run out of Ectoplasm and then spend an absolute ton of time trying to produce more with no dedicated way to do so outside of side benefit from other rituals - Not actually sure how rates compared to arrow/rune production as the equivalent, but it does feel way slower (Albeit does also reward exp...)
So to that end, I'd quite like a dedicated Ectoplasm ritual (For point 2), and as a reward space possibly the ability to automate rituals ala Invention Machines - providing a a more passive supply of Ectoplasm/Souls/Impure Essence etc. at the cost of more resources.

I guess the inverse case of this actually would be ritual options with no rewards in exchange for an increase in exp (Esp if the exp rates were reduced to compensate for the higher resources)

And just as an aside in terms of some QoL changes, the ability to save Ritual presets would be wonderful - change between ritual types and it automatically also moves/redraws the glyphs you've got set for it. And also Ectoplasm currently has no notification when you run out so you're just standing there sadly with no undead friends SAD

minor echo
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Regarding: POINT 2

  1. there should be an "afk" and "active" mode of gathering for each resource (especially now with ecto)

active modes should be outputting a minimum of 50% more than afk modes

  1. not all glyphs are well balanced, only 2 are always used.

there should be considerable pros and cons of each glyph that alters the way you train.

  • you want more exp? you get less resource.
  • you want more resource? you get less exp.

these are 2 simple and straightforward approaches using this 2-d graph to map out where the glyph strengths and weaknesses should lie

maybe

  • glyph 1 has +50% xp and +50% resource
  • glyph 2 has +100% xp only
  • glyph 3 has +100% resouce only
  • glyph 4 has +150% xp and -100% resource
    etc.
minor echo
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Regarding: POINT 1

  1. does "necro skilling" cover the crafting/rc/smithing aspect to it?

each level of necro doesn't have this, does it? or is this already covered in POINT 2?

if it does cover the crafting/rc/smithing aspect, then there should be more benefits to each level of necro itself. we hardly see this in the other artisan and gathering skills.

  • what difference is level-50 smithing versus level-70 smithing aside from gear unlocks?
    -- how does a 20 levels of difference affect the artisan and gathering aspect of the skill?
    -- does haaving level-70 necro mean i can smith gear with less requirements or resources?
  1. is there a profit aspect or design to the non-ritual aspects of the skill?

because the skill was structured to force players to craft items themselves, majority of players no longer need more than 1 type of deathwarden robe top for example.

this is further worsened by the fact that you NEED external resources to fund the skill, thus removing the skill's own ecosystem for profitability

  • like, why should i be farming subjugation items for a necro-based item?
    -- why couldn't hermod have been the one to drop it?
    -- why couldn't we have crafted the resource from existing other resource within the skill? (e.g. require 50,000 ecotoplasm, 500 miasma rune, 1000 mementos)

what can we do for these non-ritual aspect of the skill?
and should there be any further content to it?
or was it just a filler content whose sole and only purpose was to make gear more accessible (which is a great job btw) across tiers?

minor echo
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Regarding: POINT 3

  1. if skilling milestone = levels in the skills, we should have more branches of the talent tree unlocked

necro is in a somewhat good position to have variations of a combat ability

think along the lines of unlocking each version of finger of death, but you can only select 1 version as the active one at the rituatl site's talent tree:

  • version 1 (default)
    -- does 200% + Nx50% ability dmg to single target
  • version 2 (unlocked at level-50)
    -- does 125% + Nx20% ability dmg to 3x3 aoe around target
  • version 3 (unlocked at level-56)
    -- does 165% + Nx35% ability dmg to single target
    -- N maximum = 5
    -- applies a decay-style DOT of 5% every 5 ticks
    -- up to 10 stacks of DOT from any player, lasts for 50 ticks, stacks are individual

this way, similar to how we can utilise stacks of souls for either volley of souls or soul strike in combat

or even alteration to the basic ability, necrosis, and similarly you can only choose 1 version at the ritual site's talent tree

  • version 1
    -- default
  • version 2
    -- does 75% less damage than default
    -- applies 5 stacks of necrosis when used instead
    -- increases maximum necrosis stacks to 20
shrewd cobalt
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  1. Can go deeper in cave where you find new slayer mobs, some kind of boss that drops 4th conjure , activity - anything new really
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celest iron
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nice

patent hound
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As a newer account too the game, so far I've really only had 2 struggles with necromancy.

One struggle would be the quests that are required to be able to create the tier 80/90 tank and power armor.

I can only get into 1 boss currently at the Gwd1 bosses.

As far as the tier 90 gear requirements go, I'm just really not strong enough to be able to kill or likely even survive nex.

I believe it's a bit strange to lock armor behind boss kills when this has never been a system for armor before in the game.

The second struggle would be the souls needed to unlock the talent trees.
As a newer account I do not have the kind of gold that veteran players have. This means I'm not able to purchase the items that veterans can to be able to make the souls process not so painful.

Other than those two issues the skill has been fantastic and a lot of fun.

Thanks for reading my input!

solemn silo
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I believe it's a bit strange to lock armor behind boss kills when this has never been a system for armor before in the game.
It has but it's always been in terms of the raw drops (For which this is better, as it's 1 kill not 500+ to get a single drop). I would say the oddity involved here is more that to get your t80 Necro gear you need level 70 range and strength (And consti/agi, but they're less limiting)

spark yoke
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rune platebody: and i took that personal

minor echo
# spark yoke rune platebody: and i took that personal

that's why players went for rchain back then until they were truly confident to take on elvarg

you gotta understand that death back then was no joke... it could have been a significant loss for someone (especially f2p) to die to that quest

therefore the risk outweighed the reward extremely

mild canyon
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for questions 1 and 3 combined:
This is the perfect moment to pitch what i expected necromancy to be before it was confirmed as a combat skill.
Skilling conjures
basically, you'd act like a foreman while your spirits skill for you (or alongside of you).

the easiest way to do this is to conjure a generic "skiller" spirit.
this skiller would wield a tool relevant to the skill you yourself are training, scaled to the lower of your levels in necromancy and the relevant skill.

so, lets say you are woodcutting, and you are level 60 woodcutting.
at this point, your conjure would use the equivalent of a dragon hatchet.
unless your necromancy is 50; your conjure would be capped at a rune hatchet instead.

This would either make you skill faster like a familiar would do (in this example, compare it to a beaver), or it will gather its own resources, like a waterfiend familiar would do, but deposit the products in your own inventory (allowing them to be portered), or even autobanked with the tome of Um 3 (or 4).

the base skilling speed wouldn't need to be the same as the player, as long as it scales up with tools in the same percentage from the base conure rate.

for artisan skills, the effect of the conjure would be in speed or sucess chance; like the spirit of cooking would lower your burnrate, and a spirit of smithing will increase your progress per swing