Engage more people to play Support

[rocky rampart]

For now it is the slowest class and quite boring (due to a reason below) lacking unique secondary gadgets - even though building obstacles is immediate and often saves you a life.

Here is what i suggest:
improve the class to be better at defending buildings -
add portative radars that will highlight enemies at line of sight in very close distance (e.g. 5 or 8 meters), only if supporter has exo helmet and also tags (spots) them in medium range (e.g. 20 meters)

LMGs are good, yeah, though i personally find supporter very weak inside the buildings. Most of LMGs in any setup will lose to SMGs or rifles due to very slow ads and slow movement. Though i do not claim supporter should be as equal as assault, it still should have a chance to win in close range shooting more often

[scenic hare]

Exo helm is already strong (can tank a sniper bolt/rsh shot, both of which would normally kill you) and giving support tools that do spotting/recon related roles kinda just.. defeats the point of recon

[rocky rampart]

did you read my point?

the second article shows the problem in this suggestion

[scenic hare]

Yes, and I think a portable UAV overlaps with recon’s role

[rocky rampart]

arent recons supposed to be defensive class?

[scenic hare]

Mentions support in the title

“Oh this is suddenly a recon suggestion”

????

[rocky rampart]

your manner of speaking is inheretly toxic

[quartz berry]

boring class
suggests making it more boring

[rocky rampart]

please read what i say

[scenic hare]

I did. I gave counter points and you called me toxic

Like idk how to make it more obvious to say that class overlap isn’t a good thing

[rocky rampart]

arguable statement

you do not provide criticism here

"i dislike ur suggestion because ir affects recons"

[scenic hare]

yeah because you started turning this into a “my feelings got hurt” instead of an discussion about an idea

Recon is SUPPOSED to be the class that’s good at spotting/has tools for it. Not support

[rocky rampart]

no? i am trying to keep this topic serious

[rocky rampart]

you certainly did not read the suggestion

[scenic hare]

I mean if you really want we can get other people to tell you the same thing

Objectively speaking:

Recon is supposed to spot/do recon things.

Support is best at building and supply the team. His defenses are how he lives and dies.

If an assault with an SMG/AR beats you, chances are its a positioning issue, not a “support is weak” issue, and making recon’s spotting have less importance would hurt balance.

[indigo schooner]

Could be better in like couple of aspects
Otherwise its fine

Also wdym no unique gadgets ammo boxes literally exist

[quartz berry]

assault has them for some fuckin reason

[indigo schooner]

Small ones yea

[scenic hare]

Small ammo boxes don’t resupply gadgets or nades

[indigo schooner]

But they sorta suck for resupplying everything that isnt just ammo

[fervent tiger]

why should support get spotting?

[quartz berry]

thats what the air drops are for

[rocky rampart]

this has no point in what i wrote in subtitle, naturally nothing stops people to play only supporter and that will reduce your willing to play recon against them, however the "radar" thing only gives a legit weak wallhack to know if some smg is about to ram you in a second later they enter the building, lmgs have much worse ttk than smgs even including supporter armor. You may call it a skill issue but you wont provide a proof for that, either way, you will cherrypick a good streak. I am judging generally (even though it is subjective), and neither it is equalizing the roles, which are supposed to be good at different things.

Besides, worse ttk overlaping slow ads affects gameplay inside buildings even more making it even harder to win against a very skilled player.

Showing people is a way to deal with instant rush, giving the class outstanding value in solo defence

[indigo schooner]

Support already has lowkey busted qualities

[scenic hare]

^

[rocky rampart]

this is a good point, but it is applicable more to 128 lobbies, in 64 or 32 it feels much worse, especially in 1v1

[rocky rampart]

isnt it primary gadget?

[indigo schooner]

You have 2 gadget slots

[rocky rampart]

yeah which are called secondary and primary

[indigo schooner]

Yes

First slot has like mines, c4 and antinades for example

Other one has more class unique gadgets

[fervent tiger]

so you want to give supports close range wallhack to fight smgs (close range weapons) in close range?

[indigo schooner]

Only support has the big ammo box

Which is general good

[scenic hare]

Also:

LMGs/HMGs aren’t supposed to be run and gun weapons, and there’s a reason why knowing when to ADS/where to position is important.

You lose to SMGs/ARs because you got caught out of position- they have to close the distance on you to some degree or get into a decent position, meanwhile you should already have that advantage

[fervent tiger]

beside hip fire works also quite well in close range

[rocky rampart]

my bad then, sry

[indigo schooner]

But like i said support has busted qualities, it can equip BRs and LSWs, antinades, can carry most nades per life with heavy armor, has exo helmet, can build instantly (cheaper too maybe? Idfk remember)

[scenic hare]

Not cheaper but still instant builds is VERY practical

Literally will save you in a lot of gunfights if you learn the mechanics

Even if you opt for a BR instead of LMG and decide to play aggressive for whatever reason, I’ve seen it work.

3/4 BRs are pretty good so it’s not like you don’t have options either

[rocky rampart]

only inside buildings, yes, i find that even worse than recon bc you can peak out, deal noscope 75dmg and pick the pistol. Good only with 75 but you will still kill enemy faster than ads+ttk time with lmg

[fervent tiger]

i dont thing lmgs are that bad in close range if you dont run and gun

[scenic hare]

RPK can still work wonders in CQC, yes. M249 too but imo not as much

[indigo schooner]

You can even be agressive with slow support

Ive made pushes by just instabuilding and antinades

And occasionally unbuilding sandbags

You can absolutely make it work

[rocky rampart]

frugis m249 main kd 0.75, frugis vector main kd 2.2

😕

[scenic hare]

Frugis tunnels is literally CQC tho

[rocky rampart]

wasnt playing in tunnels

[scenic hare]

That being said, try the RPK. See if your milage is any better

[indigo schooner]

Frugis CQC as support is peak

[scenic hare]

Even on roofs its good

[rocky rampart]

worst gameplay it only matters how many cannon fodder you have, though supporters are good in there

[rocky rampart]

will do

[fervent tiger]

sounds more like a gameplay issue and a generall fast pace is superior issue rather than bad close range supports.
Beside supports should get a different buff and not spotting. And no class ever should get wallhacks

[indigo schooner]

We know what happened when spotting got reworked

Before it was patched out

[rocky rampart]

i was trying to max m249 advantages - it is nearly impossible due to fast attacks from sides or roofs, ads is very slow, movement is also very slow to change pos or peak out roofs to shoot people below

what i find better than smgs in buildings is that you can prefire multiple enemies returning yourself an advantage against smgs

but that wont work outside stairs and wide rooms

it does good on C (iirc its plaza with a monument) and the objective i forgor, its in the park on edge of the map

[quartz berry]

play like oki intended aka 1 handed 🗿

[rocky rampart]

but only in squad battles with multi targets

[indigo schooner]

You can

The tactic is called hold W

[indigo schooner]

You can always change gear each class on each side wears

And this sounds a bit like a positioning issue tbh

[rocky rampart]

what is the type of places i have to pick playing support then? Most of the times me (anywhere) holding fire at groups of enemies ends up with m200 headshot or attacks from a side if its not inside a building. I doubt there is a way to do more impact to the game via just supporter's tools, besides supplying team

[indigo schooner]

In general for this game you dont stick to open spaces for too long and dont stand still

Again, you can change support in the character section of the respawn menu

You can change helmets, armor, backpacks etc.

They provide different benefits and disadvantages as well

[quartz berry]

just bribe oki to make support like 2042 support

[indigo schooner]

Utilise the gadgets that support can use, c4 is really good for anything really, antinades if you want to hunker down mostly for example

[ember dune]

add support sex update

[indigo schooner]

Big ammo box can resupply mates with infinite ammo as long as you dont drop it really

[rocky rampart]

imho c4s useless unless you want to crack the buildings

[scenic hare]

I mean I can give him a quick go to for the RPK if you think it would help, but ultimately it would just boil down to "use what SMG uses for the most part"

[rocky rampart]

its just that supporter is so slow you cant use that for anything else

[indigo schooner]

Normal C4 exists

[rocky rampart]

hmm?

[quartz berry]

normal c4 when fucking c4 indicators but anyway

[indigo schooner]

You have suicide c4 and normal c4

Normal c4 is utterly OP

[rocky rampart]

the explosion range is quite bad

ive tried killing people with them

[scenic hare]

obviously comes down to the person at the end of the day but normal mag (quick mag doesnt exist and drum isnt good) brk (for reload speed) short suppessor, and whatever scope you want (I personally use slip with red dot top sight, but you can just use strike fire, reflex, or red dot just fine)

Side rail doesn't really matter as much as the rest (realistically just dont use a flashlight/search light and you're fine), but one of the two lasers work best for hip firing, green is easier on the eyes imo but its solely a preference thing, both do the same thing just different color.

[indigo schooner]

The hell were you doing with it?

Its literally the easiest thing to do

[scenic hare]

I use m249/ultimax a lot more myself though when I do play support, personally (I dont run CQC with support)

[rocky rampart]

the screenshot is cropped i cant see values

[indigo schooner]

Drum can work if you slap a bipod on it but tbh thats for a niche playstyle really

[scenic hare]

my bad

Ultimately like I said you're gonna have to feel it out and see what works for you (this is more so of a starting point), but RPK is probably the best for support CQC with an lmg

[rocky rampart]

throwing it at them or inside the buildings, not in direct los though, but its same as grenades

peaking out corners and doorholes is probably a thing you mean, but if they are close enough i prefer for doing headshots reliably instead

neither i see myself killed with c4. Maybe once per 2 full 127 games

[indigo schooner]

Idk man youd really need to try to fail killing people with c4

[rocky rampart]

1.6 vert recoil

feelsbadman

[indigo schooner]

Ive had success just throwing it in straight to someone and just killing them

[indigo schooner]

Its not as bad as it may seem

Its very managable

[rocky rampart]

not at >100m spraying

[rocky rampart]

m249 with 0.9 vert and 0.8 horiz, without a bipod. Spraying > onetapping. I will send a screenshot if you need, but i cant do that right now

[scenic hare]

you can use a vert grip over brk if that makes it easier (downside is that its a late unlock for the RPK iirc)

I often find it doesn't really matter as much in terms of CQC

[indigo schooner]

I beg the differ

[indigo schooner]

Or VAMB if its ones gist

I personally slap that or flash with shift short

[scenic hare]

shift short my beloved

[indigo schooner]

Shift short best grip

[clear totem]

The "radar" thing should be shift to recon's uav, not provide wallhack even weak, just a indicator that show the estimative direction.

If you want encourage ppl play Support, may you get some referance from brilliant ideas have been suggested, like new kinds of fortification and mortar.

[indigo schooner]

You can indirectly buff support by changing how building works

Idk allow people to build on capture points

[verbal yarrow]

support in cqc sucks no shit, 50-200m ultimax my beloved