tank camping bad

[south kraken]

is it me or do tank mains never leave safe zone anymore, can we disable tanks ability to shoot from spawn there is no point having tank because every time we try to get in one they get in the tank main gets in so fast so that they can stay in safe zone and camp there until they need more ammo. there's is literally no point of tanks when we could have artillery because that's what all the tanks do all the time now. also when we have these campers that never leave the zone then never get killed not letting anyone else to use them. me personal love going in with a tank ramming then instantly getting killed, that's what made this game fun in the old conquest but now its walk around then get shot by some distant object that you cant even kill. please Devs remove this camping aspect of this game. im going to bet that this will get tons of downs ever because i suck at doing a proposal or because its all those tank main going nooo i want to camp at the safe zone and get free kills.

[digital hound]

imagine knowing the actual issues tanks have (couldn't be me)

also drving in and dying within the first few minutes with your tank is literally griefing your team 💀

[south kraken]

yea that was so i could break the stale mate and it works

[digital hound]

"why yes, i do grief my team instead of effectively fighting the enemy "

i'm an infantry player and even i understand what is wrong with tanks

• lacking offense
• c4
• 32 engies (in 127vs127)

[south kraken]

how is that grifing the team if we get push them and win because we broke there wall for us to go behind them then kill them all basically winning us the game.

[digital hound]

you said something about rolling in and immediatly dying being fun smh

[zealous wasp]

Just press the buttons quickly to occupy the tank. Whoever pressed the fastest took the tank🤷‍♂️

Dying in the first few minutes and not trying to realize the vehicle's potential is soooo fun

[zealous wasp]

Plus drones that can easily one-shot you

You have to run away from them. This is very comical

[weak notch]

Exactly, that's why C4 needs to be limited to engineer and assault only

Engineer for being the anti vehicle class, assault because ASSAULT

Add a breaching charge to other classes

[south kraken]

im just saying tanks shouldent be able to camp in there zone the entire game

[compact stream]

he's absolutely right, tanks are meant to lead the charge !!BUT!! teammates are meant to protect their tank drivers by staying close by and supporting them

[digital hound]

they shouldn't need to camp.

[compact stream]

if you have to spawn camp in a tank you're bad at the game plain and simple

who cares if u get blown up in battle coz guess what another one will be available shortly

[digital hound]

shortly
5mins, from 30
yessir

[unique viper]

Whilst I agree with this, I also agree with the fact that tanks are a glowing rpg and c4 magnet

You try to push, explosive spam says no. I hate safe zone camping as much as the next guy, but let’s be real trying to do anything outside of that is asking to get C4’d or tandemed

[rare whale]

So, few things about that.

1. Barely anyone sits in safe zone (behinde red or blue border) for a long time. That generally happens when nearest point is contested/swarmed by enemies, if its not, vehicles don't sit there, because there is no LoS further than the nearest point. There's also no enemies there if they were just pushed out.
2. I do agree with limiting camping of vehicles, they do play too passively/defendievly, and they don't push much
3. Your proposition of fixing this issue, is to gut only thing tanks are good at right now. Everything else they can do, infantry can do better, faster and at smaller cost and punishment. So you want to make players expireence worse, when it alredy sucks
4. If you want to limit camping, you need to make aggressive gameplay viable and rewarding. Not punishing player for trying with quick death by one of 127 guys with C4 or tandem spam
5. I genuinely doubt that majority of players that try/enjoy AFV gameplay is OK with being forced to camp by the game, and I can bet that if more aggresive playstyle, like in BF, PS2 or even in WW3 will be made possible, we will see definitely less camping

[rare whale]

That will never happen. Randoms don't even repair you unless there is weekly challenge. Not to mention proper protection. Tanks are alone, with thier crew at best, and they should be balanced around that, unless somehow teamplay can be magically eleveted to a point when infantry will consistently cover for tanks weaknesses, which I doubt wilk ever happen.

[rare whale]

True, and they do not. They do camp, yes, sitting far away from the action when possible, and they run away often, but they don't sit in safezone all the time, unless they are spawn locked.

[dusty topaz]

You nerf the c4 and rpgs and then people are going to complain tanks are too strong. Then tanks will get nerfed or the equipment will get buffed again. If you just let assault and engineer destroy tanks then people are going to switch into them because they are already pretty good classes.
The way for stronger tanks is to simply buff them all around. Better speed, acceleration and smaller zoom.
But that just completely changes their role in the game which i dont see happening.
Now regardless of if they will change tanks i think tanks camping at spawn is just bad for any open fps game. Its not like the sniper that camps and can die like any other class.
Tanks are incredibly durable and cant be taken out by counter sniping or ARs/DMRs from range

They need RPGs if they camp at spawn and their reaction times are significantly buffed because the engineers wont ever be close enough to send a quick rpg that cant be dodged

You basically have an incredibly heavily armored sniper inside the base that has access to a machine gun and explosive rounds at the same time

[rare whale]

Buffing tanks will not make them too strong. They are not right now. They have survivability copied from 32v32 game, while existing on 127v127 game.
Better sepped, acxelaration does not fixes the problem of everyone having C4 and 20 engis shooting at you from 20 difere t directions, and each one of them have ability to kill you in 3-5 shots.

Saying tanks are incredibly durable is false, they can esily bo soloed, and with 5 enemies focusing on you, you wilm evaporate.
And yes, they can't be damaged by small arms, but what the fuck is that stupid argument? Saying shit like that implies that's something you expected to happen.

[rare whale]

That happens only if you don't incentives aggressive gameplay. Which every FPS game with vehicles achived to do. BBR can do it also

[dusty topaz]

We are talking about spawn camping. Not in general

[rare whale]

Yes we are

[dusty topaz]

20 or 5 engis are not going to be on the borders of your safe zone to kill that one tank that is camping inside the safe zone

And no im not expecting small arms fire to kill a tank. Im saying that tanks are way more durable when camping in safe zone compared to snipers.
Both can do lots of kills from range but the tank is way more durable and has 2 different options. One of them being explosive

[rare whale]

But the tank doesn't stay in safe zone unless enemies are on the nearest point. 50 to 100 meters from it. There is no reason to sit there, no reward for doing so, when all enemies are 500m away, in a place you lack LoS to.
People don't spend 30 minutes in safe zone. That's stupid, they sit there only when enemies are close to it, which doesn't happens often, unless your team is spawn locked.
The all 'hur dur vehicles camp in spawn' comes from People that sees tank 200m away and calls another point 'spawn'

[dusty topaz]

Saying that tanks camping at the base should be a thing because the game doesnt support aggressive gameplay is just dumb. They are a powerhouse if they cant be approached by infantry or tanks.

[rare whale]

Well, tank is supposed to be durable, but thier implemented in BBR fails at it. They are, literally easiest to kill out of all games I have played, while contributing the least

[rare whale]

Who says camping should be a thing? I do not, read my previous messages.
Amd yes, game doesn't support aggresive gameplay, you will be targeted by everyone when you get close to the point, and then killed very fast. Just observe how long tanks live in a average game. If they don't keep themselves away, they will be killed in under 5 minutes.

[dusty topaz]

If you want tanks to be more durable in 127vs 127 just buff them there.
But that is not related at all to tanks camping at spawn

Yes tanks play a supportive role in this game

They dont go cap objectives

[rare whale]

But not all tanks camp at spawn. Players don't spend 30m in safe zone ffs. They don't even spend 10 minutes there, unless thier team is spawn locked

[dusty topaz]

But even in games where tanks go cap objectives those still get blown up by 1 player

[rare whale]

Then thay should works as mobile artillery and camp. If thay can't push, they should camp. But that's not liked by players, so we have this post

[dusty topaz]

Cause the tank is not meant to just rush by itself

[rare whale]

MUCH, much much more rarely

[dusty topaz]

Well look at bf4

Tanks just die to c4

Rpgs take multiple hits like here

The way tanks avoid those is by dodging them and not overextending

[rare whale]

But infantry doesn't cooperate with you. Teamwork doesn't existsz even devs acknowledge so. There is no 'push with infantry' when infantry plays selfishly, doesn't care about you, and ignores helping you

[dusty topaz]

It doesnt exist in other games as well

You are not meant to just go and cap points with a tank on other games alone

[rare whale]

Tanks in BF have to deal with 4 times less enemies. They have thermals, 3rd person camera, minimap, APS systems, and more resonably balanced survivability. That's why they survive longer

[dusty topaz]

You always have the risk of being blown up

[rare whale]

It does. It's not irl level of coo op. But it's MUCH better than in BBR.

[rare whale]

Yes. But the risk is significantly smaller.

The scale of those games makes a diference

[dusty topaz]

How is it smaller? A guy with c4 still blows you up in bf regardless

An engineer needs multiple shots as well

[rare whale]

Yes, you can be C4ed by some rando in BF, but that doesn't happens as much as in BF. There is only 32 enemies, not 127

[rare whale]

Yes, one engineer needs 3 to 5 shots in a game with max 32 players per team. In BBR with 127 players , you also need 3 to 5 shots

[dusty topaz]

Yes so balance tanks in 127vs127
Or give more tanks for them

[rare whale]

While there is more enemies that can shoot at you

[dusty topaz]

But we are going off topic here. Thats for the other suggestion that was made

[rare whale]

Well, yeah, balance tanks for 127v127, so they can stop camping

[digital hound]

i love "nerf vehicles" suggestions, they're the most non nonsensical and braindead shit ever
or as someone put it
"The vehicle shouldn't be afraid of me, I should be afraid of the vehicle."

[dusty topaz]

Here the question is do you want tanks to be able to camp at spawn?

[rare whale]

I don't want to see them camping

Shooting at guys 50m from you while in spawn zone os different thing

[digital hound]

it's not about if we want them to do that
it's about whether we have vehicles which are capable of aggressive play

[slate shoal]

because it's a dumb thing to use the repair kit instead of rpg to repair randoms

enginer needs to always have the repair kit like medic and support got their boxes

[rare whale]

Yeah, it's wierd thing. You can swap repair tool for C4. No one sane will do that

[digital hound]

no one likes camping, but if you aren't capable of non camping playstyles then wtf are you going to do?

1984'ed

[zealous wasp]

i am sorry bot(

[dusty topaz]

Engineer can have both repair tool and rpg right now

I basically run that

[digital hound]

yes, but it isn't forced is what their point is

[zealous wasp]

People want to solo everything in the game. So let's nerf everything

[digital hound]

❓

buff vehicles, simple as

encourage wanted behavior

don't punish non wanted behavior - especially not when it is the only effective way to play

[slate shoal]

using a slot for the repair kit is just wasted potential if you aren't repairing your own vehicle

[zealous wasp]

Well, they want to be able to cope with any vehicle alone. So definitely needs to be nerfed

[digital hound]

what is your point?

[dusty topaz]

I dont think about it this way. I dont mind repairing

[slate shoal]

but you are the minority

[zealous wasp]

there is no point, I'm just catching the cringe from the constant requests for nerf.

[slate shoal]

ppl repairing vehicles outside of challenges is as rare as seeing a Riot shield

[digital hound]

oh
ok
copium yeah, understandable

[dusty topaz]

Tanks are hard to repair cause they run around all the time

But boats, helis and humvees are easy

[zealous wasp]

Sorry if I misled you

[digital hound]

hmmmmmmmmm

[wicked swift]

tanks are harder to repair cuz they just blowup

[digital hound]

dw

[wicked swift]

instantly

lmao

[digital hound]

fr

they can not not move, they die if they stop

[wicked swift]

wanna push? get fucking 50 people charging to you

with c4

[dusty topaz]

Nah i've tried staying around apcs and tanks to help them out but they press w or s and they are gone. I just cant catch up to them 😆

[wicked swift]

while other 50 are gonna rpg your ass

other 27 are just snipers

[digital hound]

just like in the movie "Speed"
but with rpgs and magic anti vehicle c4
fuck me, why is that shit even effective against heavy armor?
i just need a breaching charge, not some antivehicle super nuke

[dusty topaz]

Yeah well again in this game you cant push on your own

Not with a tank

[digital hound]

you can't even push with infantry support

[dusty topaz]

If you go into a flag by yourself you can easily get blown up.
The idea behind tanks in this game is to be mid range

Supporting the infantry that are trying to push

[wicked swift]

so at the base camping cuz

[digital hound]

hmmmmm

[wicked swift]

thats the effective range?

[zealous wasp]

c4 is literally effective against everything. Have you ever seen those videos where sweaty guys just run around and scatter him, farming tons of infantry?

[dusty topaz]

Why at the base camping? We have very large maps

[slate shoal]

while not getting shot at

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[dusty topaz]

You can definitely be mid range without camping at the base

[digital hound]

yes, which makes sense
it's a high explosive
but it isn't an anti armor explosive

[digital hound]

nope...
map design says no

[zealous wasp]

Maybe

[digital hound]

c4 shouldn't damage a tank.

[rare whale]

Very small minority

[digital hound]

what it should do is a whole lot of damage to buildings and people

[dusty topaz]

Alright then fix those maps that have the issue. I've seen tanks playing that supporting role and they are pretty good

[rare whale]

Eh, it should. But it should be more limited

[slate shoal]

if you are able to place 5 c4 without getting killed in the middle of the enemy, the enemy deserves to get blown up

[wicked swift]

why not just fix c4 and reduce how many class can actually use it

[rare whale]

Like, C4ing vehicles is ok, but its not ok for it to happens AS OFTEN

[digital hound]

literally every map and if vehicles are allowed to do that then snipers and dmrs users will just sit right next to them

think my guy think

[slate shoal]

frugis

[rare whale]

You just need 3. And that takes 3 or 4 sec. That's not long.

[digital hound]

frugis is just a shooting range and farm spot lmao

[slate shoal]

depends on the amount of enemies

frugis best map

[rare whale]

I have seen more tanks dying in a minute after leaving spawn than taks getting 30 kills. This week alone.
Something worng here

[digital hound]

probably got my easiest high kill games on that beautiful depiction of west germany "france"

[dusty topaz]

I saw someone suggest medic shouldnt have them which makes sense.
Maybe i can get behind recon not having them too.
Fix c4 how? Increase the amount it takes to take down a tank?

[slate shoal]

is it France ?

[zealous wasp]

What about drones that one-shot?

[digital hound]

looks like a stereotypical french city 🤷

[slate shoal]

same reason they are loud as fuck and easily shot down

[dusty topaz]

If you want tank to be the mvp then you are asking for a completely different thing than just tanks being useful without having to camp at the base

[rare whale]

Or make it less avalibe. Simply Make it so that not everyone can delete a tank. That's engi's job and identity

[zealous wasp]

Well, try to fight off just one squad that sits in the bushes, respawns and launches the drone on cooldown

[rare whale]

30 kills is not MVP. That's middle of the run score on 64v64

[slate shoal]

split it into two kinds of c4 like suggested a few times already one for walls/infantry and one for vehicles

[slate shoal]

they aren't really an issue then beside how often do you have those?

[digital hound]

making them usable doesn't make them "meta" lmao

[zealous wasp]

I have 10k kills on a tank and drones are the reason why I stopped playing on it for several months now. I was constantly being focused by drones

[dusty topaz]

Ok say you do that. Why would players pick the class that doesnt have the vehicle c4s? Those are strong enough to destroy walls if they can blow up tanks

[slate shoal]

personally I also think you should get extra xp when killing sb next to tanks/btr/other vehicles

[dusty topaz]

Usable how? A tank that goes 30-0 is basically the MVP

[digital hound]

muh guy

30 kills is far from mvp

[slate shoal]

change them to some kind of heat mechanic with a very small explosive. So more like the pickaxe instead of sledgehammer

[zealous wasp]

You start to hear him only when he is close enough and the only way out is to run away, because by the time you understand where he is he will already dive under you and explode

[rare whale]

LMAO. I have seen people getting more kills n 16v16. Lmao my guy. People on 64v64 drop duble of that every game

[dusty topaz]

Yes but 30-0 is really good value

[digital hound]

i easily get 40 as infantry

[rare whale]

On 127v127 even 100+ can not be MVP, WR is 200+

[digital hound]

wr is 335 or smth

[dusty topaz]

You must have contributed a ton to get 30 kills without dying

[rare whale]

No. 50-0 would be, and that really rare.

[slate shoal]

little bird pilots enter the chat

[rare whale]

Not really, you just farm kills selfishly

No armoru taken out, no caps taken or hold

[digital hound]

fr, kills don't matter to teamplay unless they happen on a choke point (c4 cuddlepile moment)

[dusty topaz]

How do you know that the tank didnt take out armor when it has done 30 kills?

[digital hound]

because tank vs tank or tank vs ifv is just a meme

[zealous wasp]

What about tandems that for some reason have splash damage and you don't have to hit the tank directly?

[rare whale]

Because that's rare. Tank vs tank is 60 sec slap fight. Assuming infantry didn't taken it out before you. Which happens a lot

[digital hound]

time to shove that as val down my throat and end it 💀

[rare whale]

Idk, Oki's briliance i guess. HEAT have 2x radious too.
And no other game does that.

[zealous wasp]

When hitting a target, the leading charge detonates first, ensuring penetration of the upper (outer) layer of the target’s protection (in particular, the activation of dynamic protection). The main charge ensures damage to deep layers of armor and direct destruction of equipment

And in this game for some reason he has a splash on the tank

[dusty topaz]

They matter if they are made in pushes

I feel like when people refer to aggressive play they want to be able to just cap points with them without getting blown up which is very hard in any game

[rare whale]

No, be able to cap points. Simply as

[dusty topaz]

You are a huge target rolling into an objective. How can you expect to not be immediately targeted by everyone

[rare whale]

Don't insinuate that people want to be invincible from the get go. That's quite biased thing to do

Ringt now tanks are useless unless they camp, because they either die, or run away very fast, with no contribution.

[dusty topaz]

I've just seen a couple of coversations on this and basically every time i see agressive gameplay for tanks being requested people seem to want to go cap with a tank without being stormed by AT infantry

[rare whale]

Pushing ends up in your death, or disengage in max2 minutes, when fights for points can take much longer

[dusty topaz]

Which in my experience is nearly impossible in every game of this type

[zealous wasp]

they are useless even if they camp. You can't shoot much while sitting on a mountain

[weak notch]

All vehicles are in bad spot thanks to everyone and their grandma having access to C4, only usable and useful ones are the choppers

[rare whale]

Well, they should go for caps, but they shouldn't get killed outright.

If they overextend, fuck up or sth else, death is resonable punishment. But rn you just die, with no or minimal contribution, especially for thier value and intended role as power multipliers

[rare whale]

True, choppers are in ok state, tho they could use some tweeks here and there

[weak notch]

Yup

[dusty topaz]

Players will never let you do that is what im saying. As long as heavy AT options exist infantry will focus the big tank rolling on the flag

[weak notch]

The one and only time I decided to play tank I camped in US side Basra, the moment I decided to contribute to my team I was rushed constantly by C4 users, funny thing is RPGs never hit me, but the moment someone decided to flank me I died because they blew my ass with C4

More armor/hp is not a solution, it will be too much, speed is in a good state

Maybe make machine gun ammo unlimited but add a heat mechanic?

[dusty topaz]

C4 will still blow you up. But yeah unlimited machine gun ammo is fine imo

[rare whale]

Thay will not yes. That's why vehicles need to be able to resonably deal with such opposition. Like on BF, but unlike in BBR

[weak notch]

Solution to the C4 problem: for the bazillion time

Make it engineer and assault exclusive

[dusty topaz]

That was the same in BF. You roll a tank into a flag and everyone is onto you

[unique viper]

And give medic sledge

So I don’t get into awkward “cant res” situations

[dusty topaz]

People would just run these classes way more. You wont stop getting blown up. Both classes have very good weapon options. You'll still get c4 flanked

[unique viper]

But yeah c4 is legitimately just the whole issue, if any class can counter vehicles with it’s own delete button.. that’s going to discourage tanks from doing tank things.

[dusty topaz]

Maybe you'd have to put class number restrictions

[weak notch]

People have their preferences, and assault is already being played a ton, so

It will inevitably tone down the number of rushers a little

[zealous wasp]

Perhaps, by the way, there is no problem in c4. If the sight at the shooter's position did not dangle in different directions from the slightest movement, it could really help you. At the moment the shooter is almost useless if you play the tank aggressively

[wicked swift]

class number restriction on what class/

[weak notch]

It will also encourage the use of other gadgets, btw

[dusty topaz]

Those that have the heavy AT options. In that example assault and engineer

[wicked swift]

so like are you like wanna limit peoples fun or something

[weak notch]

People always complain about grenade spam but they don't let go their precious C4 to pick something useful like anti grenade trophy

[wicked swift]

lmao

[unique viper]

Assault limits would never work

[wicked swift]

limiting assault class

aight

medic meta is back back

[rare whale]

But you died less often for sure. And you had more options to fight back.

[dusty topaz]

Medic would not have the c4 tho

[wicked swift]

just remove c4 on medic support and snipers

[dusty topaz]

That doesnt solve your problem still

[wicked swift]

it doesnt but like it limites people froa ctually being a tank drestroyer

[rare whale]

won't help much, assault is curent go to. Engi and Supp should have AT C4

Because that's thier role

[wicked swift]

i dont think support should have AT c4

[rare whale]

With assault having Breaching charghe or sth for destruction and anty inf

[wicked swift]

but atleast give them more of anti infintry besiddes the large magsize guns

infantry

[unique viper]

“All official servers should have class limits, that will totally fix the problem and not cause people to make new squads”

[slate shoal]

support can't even get close enough with their speed

[slate shoal]

absolutely not

[wicked swift]

they will have enough speed soon

#dev-wip message

ranger armor on support

[slate shoal]

hmm

[unique viper]

That’s the joke, I’m basically saying it’s a dumb idea

[slate shoal]

oh i didnt see the quotation

playing on a server that had sniper limits was the worst experience i had in a long time

[unique viper]

People will make new squads, limits won’t work to counter it

[wicked swift]

theres a server that made that happen

[unique viper]

Unless it’s a general limit but even then

[wicked swift]

that even creating squad wont let you switch to sniper

[weak notch]

Limit the number of squads depending on the player size of the sv, simple

[wicked swift]

i think its one of the oce server? i could be wrong i cant remember

[unique viper]

Perhaps, so long as the limit isn’t stupidly low (like 6 max in 32)

[slate shoal]

❌

[unique viper]

Mainly to account for parties/squad types

But even then it’s.. not something I’d think would work

[unique viper]

Because of situations like this. If you can’t counter snipe and your team’s sniper is currently drunk off whiskey in terms of aim, gg next match ig

Same with engi vs tank.. all your engis are on heli squad? Unlucky no rpg for you we at limit

[slate shoal]

all our sniper where on one spot while the enemy sniper where split. Half of our team was constantly getting sniped with no way to defend ourselves

absolute garbage

besides class limits is accepting defeat. If you had proper balance you wouldnt need it

[rare whale]

That's sounds like accountability for players actions

Idk if that's that bad