Minecraft collision box/soft collision

[mellow roost]

add collision hitbox similar to Minecraft but tuned up

[buoyant ridge]

now that this is happening its NEEDED

[split remnant]

much needed change

[valid crater]

Now what is soft cillision

[proper timber]

I am not for Collision at all but if I have to live with collision then it needds to be soft

[proper timber]

you move around the enemy instead of them being a brick wall

[split remnant]

You know when you press the same polarity of a magnet together? Like that

[valid crater]

So basically being able to push the enemy away

[mellow roost]

well ya but you can't completely phase through them

[buoyant ridge]

no, the collision hit box would just be smaller than the body

so you can still squeeze past but not phase through them

[valid crater]

Well thats just a smaller collision box

Not exactly a soft collision i guess

[buoyant ridge]

imo smaller hitbox would achieve approx the same results for less work

[mellow roost]

well ya but it doesn't completely ruin our momentum when running into enemies

[buoyant ridge]

not getting your momentum destroyed as well would be great but i think thats how it works rn

but you cant just slide around people

[valid crater]

I wonder how would it be possible not loosing momentum after crashing into somebody xd

[split remnant]

My idea of soft collision is better imo

[buoyant ridge]

redirect momentum i suppose but idk exactly how

[split remnant]

That what happens in my analogy with the magnets

[buoyant ridge]

if the collision hitbox is a sphere plus smaller than the boddy then i think that would do it

if its a smooth round surface the engine should take care of it

[mellow roost]

it's like a squish ball. you can squeeze the ball but you can't go through it.

[buoyant ridge]

ooooooooooh i see what you mean now

[valid crater]

So just ability to push the enemy

[buoyant ridge]

tremendous idea

[split remnant]

Bruh am I muted

[buoyant ridge]

no

[split remnant]

The fuck yall are saying what I already said lmao

[mellow roost]

no no it's just like a smaller hitbox

[buoyant ridge]

yeah we're just expanding on it

[valid crater]

But if its a smaller hitbox is still the same hard wall

[split remnant]

Ic

[valid crater]

What you explain is ability to push the player

[mellow roost]

okay imagine it a cylinder

[buoyant ridge]

ability to push the player and a cylinder collision box would be it

[mellow roost]

ya that's it

[split remnant]

Kinda like Minecraft but tuned up a bit

[mellow roost]

a cylinder collision box

[buoyant ridge]

this

[valid crater]

Well now just make it in the title and put suggestion to the tops

xD

[buoyant ridge]

^^^

[valid crater]

"No hard collisions, please make soft collision with cylinder collision box and ability to push the enemy like in minecraft"

[buoyant ridge]

^^^^

[mellow roost]

cylinder collision box

[valid crater]

[mellow roost]

cylinder collision box/soft collision

[buoyant ridge]

my brain is goofy aah

[harsh gale]

BUMP

[frank depot]

Rename to minecraft collision please easier for my brain to understand

[valid crater]

Exactly

[mellow roost]

Minecraft collision box/soft collision

[frank depot]

[split remnant]

Premium suggestion, nobel nominee right here

[ocean dawn]

I’m just gonna talk here to bump it up slightly

As far as I’ve seen literally everyone agrees this is better than the hard collision

[mellow roost]

yup

[random moss]

Make sure it has the sound from minecraft. uhh

[red bear]

☝️

[grizzled juniper]

Hitbox needs to be smaller then, not a big fan of collision but let's be real

This is the current distance at wich you are blocked by someone

The box is too big

[woeful vale]

exactly what i was saying in the other thread, player models in this game are too big to use as the whole hitbox for collision, especially if its a hard collision system which we all knew is what they would ship bcos its what already existed

[red bear]

with 127v127 and current boxes movement in some areas will be super awkward

[grizzled juniper]

I can already see it : Riot shields on choking points with trophies behind them while supports are prone bipod spraying like madmans

[ocean dawn]

If you can’t even slide past the enemy it’s going to be a major issue

[woeful vale]

itll for sure get rolled back, all the people who supposedly wanted it so much will realise how bad it feels the first time they run round a corner and are stopped in their tracks

[grizzled juniper]

The collision idea happened, i personally don't wanted it because it would feel clunky. It is a popular decision but, i feel like people that voted for it don't realize how it will end up being in an actual game.
A good compromise would have been to have the speed reduced to half when you collide with someone, a bit like barbewire

[ocean dawn]

Or just softly push them apart like suggested here

[clever lake]

they speak of jelly collosion

[grizzled juniper]

It would demand them propably Months of works to implement that i guess. What determines the push ? Speed ? Proximity ? Both ?

[clever lake]

what momentum, we accerate to max speed instantly last I checked

[grizzled juniper]

Sounds like a Hellhole to handle

[ocean dawn]

…months of work?

That’s super simple

All you need is a simple function on the distance between players

[clever lake]

(jumps through barbwire & doesn't notice the speed debuff)

[clever lake]

I can see 2 issues
RPGs & C4

Than the legs are exposed to rounds

[ocean dawn]

Though actually this game might be an exception to that much simplicity, since there’s no inertia

[clever lake]

I also heard riot shield visor is vulernable to rounds

[ocean dawn]

I think you’d just have to move them apart at a rate determined by the current distance between positions

Which is pretty much the same thing tbh

[buoyant ridge]

correct but stopping when you hit someone, not continuing your run sounds terrible

i still want to go in that direction

i dont want to be stopped by a player

i shouldnt need to move my cursor pretty much. The game should push me around them, similar to minecraft but also shouldnt let me phase into them

[clever lake]

Personally I don't mind the idea of making players have a capsule shape in a sense (so hitbox for collosion is a capsule so you'll slip along the side if you run into them)

[buoyant ridge]

^^ thats pretty much what this is asking for

[ocean dawn]

Right now it’s a cylinder, no? But you don’t slip past them

[buoyant ridge]

plus a little push

[clever lake]

no clue

[ocean dawn]

It’s probably already a capsule tbh

That’s the standard

[buoyant ridge]

not sure. Doesnt look like a capsule lmao

[ocean dawn]

But it doesn’t resolve collisions with other players normally

Based on the clip from oki, it looks like after you move it checks for collision, then moves you back if you have collided?

[buoyant ridge]

yeah probably

[ocean dawn]

Which is not how collision with the terrain works

[buoyant ridge]

or something like that

[ocean dawn]

It means you can’t slide past them

[buoyant ridge]

regardless, we'll see how it goes when the update goes live. There's no way he'll change it between now and then.

[ocean dawn]

I just think a simple function something like this, which determines the distance you are moved away from a player given your hitboxes intersect and the distance between you, would work fine

[buoyant ridge]

actually i think im wrong

it looks like you do slide off them

but it also doesnt look right

imo you should be able to get a bit closer and pushing the enemies, like minecraft, would be really nice

would stop people from blocking doorways or whatever

[grizzled juniper]

But from the ennemy pov, YOU are the ennemy, so they should be the one pushing you

So speeds value must comes into play, not just " Does X collides with Y ? "

[ocean dawn]

wdym? Same logic should apply to everyone

To organise a system for which player has pushing priority or whatever doesn't make sense

you could consider speed, but why and how? What difference should speed make?

[woeful vale]

the person sprinting shouldnt be pushed equally by the guy standing still

[ocean dawn]

So what should happen instead?

ideally collision shouldn't be too intrusive for either party, imo

since momentum doesn't exist in this game you can't exactly just transfer force from one player to another

[woeful vale]

collision will inherently be "intrusive" in the sense that it restricts ur movement, im p sure ur not on the side of not having collision at all so idk what ur getting at

[ocean dawn]

The entire point of this thread is that it shouldn't restrict movement

it should just stop you going right through each other by pushing you apart

[woeful vale]

how so? being pushed by another player like minecraft will in some way restrict ur movement

[ocean dawn]

in minecraft it doesn't restrict your movement even in a flat sea of players, just disrupts it

[woeful vale]

really arguing semantics over my word choice? lol

[ocean dawn]

my suggestion is literally just this

[woeful vale]

alright, how exactly is disrupting movement not intrusive in ur eyes? it is still affecting how u move

[ocean dawn]

I don't think that's what I was doing, no. Sorry if I am misunderstanding your meaning?

[ocean dawn]

it won't, for example, stop you going through a door

or stop you doing anything really, apart from going directly inside the enemy

[woeful vale]

but it still inhibits ur ability to move where u want to, im not sure what u mean by "intrusive" if being able to be moved by another player isnt intrusive to u, but somehow tying it to who is moving faster would be

[ocean dawn]

unless you wanted to move directly in top of the enemy, then

it wouldnt stop you jumping into a pile of them or running through a corridoor of them

sorry for the inspecifity of my definitions

[woeful vale]

but how does "the faster moving player is the one pushing the slower moving player more" an issue in ur eyes?

[ocean dawn]

when I talked about the moving faster thing, I was thinking if someone runs into you it shouldn't just knock you away, basically. You should just be shifted to the side a bit imo

[woeful vale]

theres functionally no difference here lol

[ocean dawn]

That depends on what you meant by it varying with speed

[woeful vale]

i mean i literally said a guy sprinting should be the one pushing a guy standing still, obviously there would be some middle ground where both are moving etc

[ocean dawn]

yeah, which is what I disagreed with

[woeful vale]

and im asking why lol

[ocean dawn]

Simply put I don't think it would feel as nice to play with. If a player sprints into you all of a sudden collision doesn't affect them but you just get shoved

considering the lack of inertia that also makes it a bit janky since you can accellerate instantly

[woeful vale]

where did i say collision wouldnt affect the sprinting player at all? he would of course not keep sprinting at full speed and dragging the other guy along with him

[ancient jacinth]

idk the person sprinting brings more force into the collision so if anything the player standing still should be affected more by the collision than the one sprinting

[ocean dawn]

Not at all but implied a lot less, which on my idea of how strong it should be is pretty negligible

[mellow roost]

potential energy anyone?

[ocean dawn]

the thing is, you can completely invert the vector of your velocity in an instant. So you could knock someone out of the way you weren't even running into just by flicking towards them for a fraction of a second

[woeful vale]

and again, u said its fine if they just get pushed to the side a bit by the sprinting player, which is what i was talking about (bar it being like along a wall where they dont have anywhere to move, in which case they get pushed along a bit more and the sprinting player gets pushed around the side of them)(

[ocean dawn]

I just think the sprinting player should be equally pushed to the side a bit, as it would feel nicer to play with imo.

[woeful vale]

and again, i never said they shouldnt also be moved

i just think it makes far more sense for the guy actually moving to be the one less affected

[ocean dawn]

Nor did I say you did, but you said they would be moved less and that is explicitly what I am disagreeing with

I would say it makes sense were this game to have remotely realistic physics for movement

but within the rules of the game world it would seem a bit janky

[woeful vale]

alright, how in ur mind is it fair or logical for a player standing still to be treated equally in a collision to a max speed engineer sprinting into them

[ocean dawn]

Fair because it treats them equally, logical because momentum doesn't exist in this game

(so a transfer of velocity doesn't make sense since velocity is not a parameter impacted by forces)

[woeful vale]

but its an inherently disadvantageous situation for the guy standing still? why would he be treated equally?

[ocean dawn]

why is it an inherently disadvantageous situation? Or, why should it be? I don't follow where this comes from.

Right now there is no advantage to being on the recieving or giving end of running into someone

[woeful vale]

are u seriosuly suggesting that if u were to be standing still and someone sprinted into u at full speed they would be moved equally to u?

[ocean dawn]

If momentum did not exist then yes

irl it does but attempting to apply its effects in a game where it doesn't exist will be a bit janky

[woeful vale]

alright im very bored of this weird semantics argument

[ocean dawn]

I don't think it is about semantics

[woeful vale]

regardless, the suggestion is literally the minecraft collision system, in which the moving player will push the stationary player out of the way

[ocean dawn]

In minecraft I'm pretty sure it doesn't take velocity into account

But idk

You don't get moved much from someone running through you.

[woeful vale]

it absolutely does, if someone is standing still u can just walk into them and push them around, if u dont even know that then idk why ur arguing with me lol

[ocean dawn]

yeah, and you get pushed as well

[woeful vale]

no u dont, u slide off them if ur off centre, which also makes sense and is a part of what i and others want

[ocean dawn]

That is if you are applying forward force to move past them despite being pushed.

[woeful vale]

it doesnt contradict anything about the fact the player actually moving would be the one influencing the stationary players position more

[ocean dawn]

that is true

That happens either way

if one player is providing force to counteract forces acting upon them and one isn't then it kinda goes without saying their position will be affected less by it. But their acceleration would be affected in the same way, which is what I have been talking about. Perhaps there was a discrepancy there?

[woeful vale]

if it goes without saying why have u been arguing against me saying exactly this for this whole time?

[ocean dawn]

Because I might have inferred you were talking about a concept different to what you intended to convey?

I assumed you meant that the forces acting on the players should be different depending on their velocities, becuase, that's kinda what you said

[woeful vale]

"the person sprinting shouldnt be pushed equally by the guy standing still"

"if one player is providing force to counteract forces acting upon them and one isn't then it kinda goes without saying their position will be affected less by it"

these are the exact same thing, first is my initial message, second what u just said, u were arguing this whole time to ultimately say exactly what i did and then blame me for it somehow

sorry im not being verbose enough ig

[ocean dawn]

Those are entirely different things

one refers to the forces incurred by the collision and one refers to the differences in final positions of the players

[woeful vale]

okay im done with u, either ur unable to read or ur just arguing for the sake of arguing

[ocean dawn]

-_-

[woeful vale]

its literally this, ur being hyper specific about exact wording and terms for no reason and assuming i mean the thing u disagree with despite me saying otherwise, whats the point for me to keep engaging with u?

[ocean dawn]

Sorry if that annoys you. I prioritise specificity to make sure everyone knows what I mean

[woeful vale]

my guy i literally said my initial message and what u then said later are exactly the same and that we agree, and u went "nuh uh u actually meant something else"

ofc its annoying to say "yes we agree on this" and u just keep telling me that im wrong and continuing to argue

[ocean dawn]

Your messages did not seem to refer to the same concept from my point of view. Distinguishing between the forces and the outcome are important as one is not directly dependant on the other

[woeful vale]

how are u doing it again

[ocean dawn]

I am stating what the issue is

[woeful vale]

ur ignoring me saying that we agree to continue arguing and saying im wrong

[ocean dawn]

that wasn't meant to be an argument

it was supposed to be an explanation

(when I say "that" I mean what I just said, not the whole discussion)

[woeful vale]

"no i actually know what u meant better than u do, u used a specific term that i am being needlesly specific about and therefor we actually dont agree and are not saying the same thing, yes im very smart"

[ocean dawn]

The concepts have entirely different implications. I am not going to insult you for not differentiating them but I would appreciate if you could appreciate that I simply took their meanings at face value.

[ocean dawn]

But just for clarity. Do you agree or disagree that this solution would do what you want?

[woeful vale]

u arguing this much to ultimately say the same thing was bad enough, the actual reason i am annoyed is that i literally said "yeah these are functionally the same, this is what i meant in more words, we agree" and u kept arguing with me saying im wrong, u dont get to say im dumb in a roundabout way after that

[ocean dawn]

You switched between what you meant at one point by agreeing with an alternate definition I provided. At that point we agreed because we both said the same thing, but before and after that you went back to implying something else.

[woeful vale]

truly incredible how u can know what i was thinking the entire time

[ocean dawn]

I didn't

which is half of what drove that argument.

What I do know is what you said, is it fair to assume you said what you thought?

[woeful vale]

but u just said i changed my point, which i never did

i have, at all points, been saying my initial message or responding to things u said

my point, my opinion on collision, has not changed at all

so please, tell me where i was switching my point over and over?

all this because u cant accept me simply saying "yeah these are the same, we agree" bcos u feel like ur so much smarter than me by being verbose and overly wordy

[ocean dawn]

you switched from talking about what collision did to where the players moved at some point around here, but it wasn't clear since you didn't define it that well

[woeful vale]

oh my god

[ocean dawn]

you then went on to imply they were the same thing

[woeful vale]

where players are moved by collision literally is what minecraft collision is doing, it is moving the players

ur so needlessly specific about exact wording for no reason at all that it makes u impossible to talk to

[ocean dawn]

(where they end up) and (where collision pushes them) are not the same thing, as the former is affected by their own movements before and during the scenario

which as already established was where the apparent disagreement came from. From my POV you were ambiguous about which you meant - but since you argued against me describing the latter I assumed the former

[woeful vale]

their final position isnt the same thing as their final position? im fucking done bro lmao

[ocean dawn]

"where collision pushes them" was meant to be a simplified way of saying "how their velocity is affected by collision which goes on to affect their movement".

[woeful vale]

those arent even remotely similar things

[ocean dawn]

Sorry, I am trying to be concise.

[woeful vale]

for someone so obsessed with using specific terms thats a massive reach

[ocean dawn]

I assumed the meaning would be obvious given I've already explained both

[ocean dawn]

but anyway, that response only works if collision was the only factor involved in determining position

which it isn't.

[woeful vale]

im done with this bcos its pointless, u wont admit any fault of ur own at all, u refuse to accept me saying we agree, u literally even said u dont know exactly how minecraft collision system works, so whats the point in this continuing

[ocean dawn]

you don't have to end up in the same place collision alone would have determined you went

[ocean dawn]

I have apologised for several things.

What do you want from me

Nor did I reject our agreement, we just started talking about something else

[woeful vale]

i think its very clear i want u to drop it and actually accept that we agreed long ago, and ur just being needlessly hyper specific about terms for the sake of arguing

[ocean dawn]

...It's true that I like arguing

But that is what I tried to do at one point but you did not respond to it

[ocean dawn]

(here)

I wanted to check if we agreed since I still wasn't sure what you intended to mean

[dense olive]

They literally just want barbwire everywhere

Which is something we already discussed in #1175587321916182599. There shouldn't be a in-between for collision, you clearly still want to (with this suggestion) let the people that were so use to abusing the non collision by still being able to going through/in someone and doing a 180 and headshotting them.

We already got soft collision, its called being able to place 20 barbwire anywhere at any given time.

[warped lintel]

Here ya go oki!

From what I gather, Odo essentially is suggesting a version of this, but since players move faster in BB than in mc, it'd probably have to be tuned to be a bit stronger

[mellow roost]

(it went very differently in my head but eh this works too)

[warped lintel]

Hey if you got a better way to explain it please do cuz my ass just woke up and im like 20% functional LMAO

[mellow roost]

I was like add a small cylinder hitbox 💀 so when you walk by you will just slide off

but idk how game development works

[warped lintel]

OH rather than an actual box?

[mellow roost]

ya

[warped lintel]

That makes a lot of sense

[mellow roost]

but the idea is pretty wack

[edgy inlet]

this is pretty cool

[warped lintel]

Honestly a combination of the two could work as well, cylinder collision + mc repulsion

[dense olive]

So in summary you still want people to be able to go through 5-10+ guys? Many people wanted collision for a reason. A player's body shouldn't be a bush

[warped lintel]

No no no, Its more make it so you arent hitting a brick wall

[dense olive]

This whole soft collision thing just never makes sense in the first place as to why you would want to go and try to pass through someone

[warped lintel]

Maybe dont phase through each other like the mc example where you CAN phase through with effort, but essentially just showing off how the repulsion works for that game when hitboxes collide for entities

[dense olive]

yeah I just don't think things from MC would work here

its a military focused game

you shouldn't be able to go through people

[mellow roost]

have you played a community server with collision?

[woeful vale]

literally no one wants collision to just be the same as barbed wire where u walk through slowly lmao

[edgy inlet]

Bruh 💀 He said minecraft to put as example, and you're like "it's not a military game, therefore not relevant" What about it's a cube game like minecraft.

[willow cairn]

Joelus is a master baiter. Top tier, the best i've ever met.

[edgy inlet]

Cube game with cube game

therefore relevant

[dense olive]

I'm mainly going off the soft collision side of the suggestion my guy

literally still don't know how to read and you still stuff words into my mouth

[woeful vale]

ur misrepresenting soft collision by describing it that way, again, literally not one person has recommended player collision be like barbed wire

[dense olive]

holy shit the 2 same fucking poeple that jsut love to argue with me come in every time I'm in a thread

[warped lintel]

Barbed wire doesnt have a repulsion effect lol

[dense olive]

like get out of here dude

[edgy inlet]

Moreover Xgluna said you'd have to make the "magnet force" stronger. So you wouldn't be able to pass through 5 guys 💀

[dense olive]

@frank depot can you like actually do something about rat and Old chum?

[woeful vale]

we say soft collision meaning u arent stopped dead in ur tracks when u collide with another player, ur saying "buhhh u mean just walk through people still but slower"

[mellow roost]

since when did he say barbed wire like collision

[dense olive]

they literally harass me at this point

[woeful vale]

hilarious for u to say that about me

[edgy inlet]

"Oh no they have argument, I need mods"

[dense olive]

It's not an argument at this point

[mellow roost]

you wont get it

[dense olive]

these 2 same fucking people jsut insult me and never read or understand what I actually say

[edgy inlet]

Nice insult. Anyway get blocked.

[woeful vale]

joelus repeatedly has joined in conversations ive been in to insult me, i reply and say hes wrong and suddenyl im harrassing him lmao

[warped lintel]

Maybe we can uh, keep this one on topic? Like, I get where you're coming from, and normally Ill be honest I'd agree, but I think theres a small misunderstanding in what the soft collision suggestion is hoping to accomplish

We dont want people to phase through others, we essentially just dont want it to act as if youre hitting a brick wall

[woeful vale]

everyone but joelus is probably in agreement that minecraft collision is the best way to go

[warped lintel]

Minecraft is PURELY an example, and I did suggest itd have to be stronger since BB and MC are very different games and BB players are much faster than MC players

[edgy inlet]

Fluid gameplay, but still ennemy acting as an opposite force to your movement.

[mellow roost]

well it doesn't have to be Minecraft soft collision. it's just used as a example

[woeful vale]

yeah ik but for the sake of an easy example

[warped lintel]

Plus MC allows you to show hitboxes so its so much easier to see how they interact

[woeful vale]

if they dont wanna let players push eachother make it a smaller, rounded hitbox so u atleast just slide round people

[mellow roost]

cylinder hitbox 💀

[woeful vale]

yeah what many people were saying in the other thread ik lol

[warped lintel]

thats it, spherical hitboxes at crotch level determines collision

10/10 ideas LMAO

[mellow roost]

ya, who has the bigger pp

[edgy inlet]

The magnet thing already does that tho. Since it's center focus, and that hitbox can enter each other.

[woeful vale]

ball in crotch? 😳

[mellow roost]

medic should get the biggest

[ocean dawn]

Most people here have not been suggesting something like that.

[edgy inlet]

Cylinder hitbox would probably just add math for nothing, if you have magnet collision type.

[mellow roost]

it's a wack idea

[warped lintel]

nah support imo, they gotta carry the disappointment of our walk speed + like 100 pounds of gear, they gotta have big spherical crotchboxes

[woeful vale]

hey at least they made support guns have better movespeed

[edgy inlet]

Cylinder hitbox would be the fast fix if you don't want/don't have the time for magnet collision.

But I do think it'd make a lot of bugs 💀

[warped lintel]

The magnet would still produce an interesting interaction at least

[edgy inlet]

Tho

[warped lintel]

Kiss the enemy homie before you whack em type deal, rather than slamming your face at your new gf, the wall

[edgy inlet]

Make the riot shield a hard hitbox

No trepassing the riotshield warrior

[ocean dawn]

Do you have reason to believe we don’t already have cylindrical player collision boxes?

[warped lintel]

Id be okay with that, having riot shields plug entries would be cool

[woeful vale]

yeah all 3 riot shield players deserve to be thrown a bone at this point

[ocean dawn]

If they were a square that didn’t rotate with the player I think that’d be very strange

[edgy inlet]

You have a point.

[ocean dawn]

It looks like, from the clip oki took, that you don’t slide around by default, indicating it might just flat out nullify your movement when you attempt to walk into one?

[edgy inlet]

nvm you're half right

#battlebit-eng message

it's a capsule

[woeful vale]

the video of collision oki showed didnt see to be cylindrical, unless he just hit it pixel perfect every time to hit straight on rather than slide round

[ocean dawn]

Same thing if they’re both at the same height

[ocean dawn]

That’s why I mentioned movement nullifying

Oki has confirmed they are not boxes at least so you’d expect to interact with them like any other terrain

But it looks like you don’t

[edgy inlet]

Well that does mean having a cylinder collisionbox is already the case. So we might not have wall problem. But then someone said they tried it on community server, and it was bad? 🤔 Need to add lube between collision box?

Friction physics?

[ocean dawn]

My theory is it doesn’t collide using the same method as colliding with the terrain, rather if you are moved into the hitbox it simply moves you back to where you were before

You slide past terrain if you run into it at an angle

[edgy inlet]

hmm

It make sense.

[ocean dawn]

I did play a community server once with collision but it was a long time ago so I can’t speak of it with accuracy, but it did feel quite restrictive

You could make stacks of players though which was cool