#Bullet Penetration through Players

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

fair gull
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Hearing a lot of discussion about enemy collision and some are concerned that this will hamper players who have a run and gun play style. Currently they are able to rush into large groups of enemies behind barricades (in the frontlines gamemode this practice is prevalent) and pass into player bodies, scoring many kills if they are quick enough. But with enemy collision, this will hamper this playstyle that will make a lot more skilled players upset with.

This suggestion has probably been debated by many but it should be considered if we are considering enemy collision.
Bullet penetration is a mechanic that is standard in most fps games, ARMA, Call of Duty, Squad, Hell Let Loose, Battlefield, etc. Large caliber weapons such as sniper rifles and LMGs are most well known for their penetration capabilities. SMGs do have penetration capabilities but the bullets lose a lot more damage when exiting out of the wall or person than with an LMG or sniper rifle.
What I am suggesting is that bullet penetration can only go through players and not walls. It should work as a curve like the damage curve that battlebit has already. If farther away, bullets do not retain as much energy to go through someone and inflict damage on another. They but have a percentage of energy loss depending if it hits a certain type of armor and how many people the bullet goes through.

Benefits:
Support classes can become a very powerful class for holding down capture points and clearing groups of enemies.
Snipers will be encouraged to play more aggressively in close quarters due to their huge penetration potential.
Run and gun playstyles will still be as aggressive but hopefully more balanced.
Can allow an individual player to survive more engagements in encountering squads.

Cons:
A risky and big overhaul to the game that may or may not turn away a lot of people.

This is just a suggestion but I want to discuss if this can work or if not, what other suggestions can make it work.

Thank you for hearing me out.

raw trench
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I'm with it if it's only high caliber weapon

fair gull
neon stump
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Make the M2 browning retain ~90% of its dmg when going through players.

late beacon
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i think bullets shouldn't pass through any further as soon as they hit armor

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or just have a severe damage penalty

fair gull
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Everything else works if you consider flesh penetration

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maybe

late beacon
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OR penetration ability could scale with velocity

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higher velocity = less damage lost through players

coral kelp
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That sounds too complicated

late beacon
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probably

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but balancing pen is going to be a bit nuanced

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cause it can easily get out of hand

coral kelp
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True, are we also discussing pen beyond just fleshy materials here?

fair gull
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Could be complicated, i would be satisfied if its distance based

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yeah, low caliber weapons will not go through body armor until armor is destroyed. Other higher calibers would have a significant portion of its damage lost in penetration but still retain some damage

coral kelp
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I feel could greatly benefit support, if they had the capability of shooting through brick and wood

fair gull
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Idk because a lot of the maps are designed without material penetration in mind

late beacon
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yeah i think damage should decrease to about 30-40% after penetrating destructables if that were to happen

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or even less actually

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wallbangs shouldn't be a viable tactic but rather to flush out a hiding player or something

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but this is kinda off topic since wall pen is wildly different from player pen

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another thread should be made for that if people want it

fair gull
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yeah, i was gonna say. but id be on board for material penetration. to a certain extent though

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Honestly, this could be a good suggestion for their future mil sim gamemode

late beacon
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yeah it would fit better in milsim than official servers

cosmic ledge
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Assault and support weapons dont need more buffs

dense mulch
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I'm okay with this suggestion just the armour does indeed need to be considered. I think adding something like this would only make sense if the player you shoot at with said high cal. ammo would only penetrate if armour of that player would already be gone. Knowing how many players this game has it'd be a good balance.

candid acorn
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Whether or not the bullet penetrates should be based off the damage at the initial impact. Ex. At 10m a shot from an mp5 should penetrate but after damage drop off it should no longer penetrate.

fair gull
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interesting

ripe kiln
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More concerned if this is going to make hitreg overall worse because the server has to detect n calc more. Just my 2 cents feel free to correct me if Im wrong abt how hit reg works

gaunt bobcat
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I haven't really seen a issue with not having bullet pen. Majority of the the situations where people get lined up is mosty down to lack of awareness on positioning of enemies or just a angle a enemy already killed like 2-5 people to get to.

fair gull
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We need this upvoted more so that it may be considered by Oki, he'll have the final word

fair gull
gaunt bobcat
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If anything you'll just increase your TTK against groups and make it harder unless you have a entire firing squad

fair gull
# gaunt bobcat If anything you'll just increase your TTK against groups and make it harder unle...

Let me give you a scenario, you are crouched at a half wall and you are looking down a corridor. You see a group of enemies running through. As it is now, it takes around 4 bullets to kill one guy on your average gun. The front enemies sponge up your bullets yet those behind are not affected and shoot through their teammates and kill you even though you had the jump on them first. Doesn’t seem all that fair. If you have a sniper and two enemies are lined up head to head, your bullet will not go through to hit the other guy. You can’t get a collateral. I think that you should.

gaunt bobcat
fair gull
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It can literally be any cover, a half wall, a tree, a pillar, or whatever. The point is that it is frustrating that you cannot suppress a group of enemies as well as you should when they layer behind and are able to shoot through their teammates absorbing the hits.

gaunt bobcat
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Then don't attempt to.

If there was bullet pen in the game, I'd slap on a ultimax and hold a fucked up angle on a choke.

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And just mow down infantry, and I wouldn't be the only one

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The issue here is more the armor system to be completely honest

urban dawn
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Regardless of enemy collision it's an interesting thing to consider, though balancing it would definitely be a problem

gaunt bobcat
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That's my concern

urban dawn
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Using flat multipliers isn't an option because the math heavily favors low damage, high fire rate weapons

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Balancing it on a per-weapon basis isn't desirable because you're adding 49 more values to balance to the game (Less if you do it per category, but my point still stands)

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Simply having it bleed through whatever damage is left over after you kill someone won't make enough of an effect to even have it be noticable

gaunt bobcat
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And if it does, it'll feel like you got deleted because you were behind someone

urban dawn
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That's going to be an issue regardless if you add it

gaunt bobcat
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Yep

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It's cool for the guy sitting on a angle letting off rounds from a box mag, shitty for anyone else on the receiving end.

urban dawn
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Mhm

fair gull
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Is this a problem that Battlefield has? Just curious.

gaunt bobcat
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Nope

urban dawn
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Does battlefield have player penetration?

fair gull
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Yes

urban dawn
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Can't say I ever really noticed it

gaunt bobcat
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Battlefield to my knowledge doesn't have pen for anything other than snipers

urban dawn
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I would've suggested something like distance-based damage dropoff but that... doesn't really work with how you're able to stack players on top of each other

fair gull
urban dawn
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E.g. giving bullets a penetration distance based on their damage, decreasing damage based on the distance between the entrance and exit points, then stopping if the remaining distance falls short of the distance needed

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That would work for surfaces, but I'm not sure if that's something the devs want to consider

urban dawn
gaunt bobcat
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Yeah in practice the TTK is so quick it does really matter

fair gull
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I would compromise it to be something that snipers have but would hope if it could extend to automatics

urban dawn
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I would be perfectly fine with limiting it to snipers, that way you can have a reasonable balance value to play with without having to consider SMG's as well as LMG's

fair gull
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Snipers are less complicated, math wise

gaunt bobcat
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Automatics need larger/better extend mags before we get bullet pen KEKW

urban dawn
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Plus I don't think DMR's really need the buff right now...

fair gull
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You get cucked on the recoil department with a bigger mag option tho

gaunt bobcat
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You get cucked a lot harder that that with extended mags GInevitableHeatDeathOfUniverse

fair gull
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Facts

solid hawk
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bump

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maybe just for certain guns like snipers and marksman rifles, or maybe body armor prevents the bullet over penetrating

fair gull
uncut pilot
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being able to shoot groups instead of just lead dude would be nice. armor should stop it, and it have a damage reduction based on how many people its gone through, 30% maybe?

daring fossil
neon stump
fair gull
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Bumping for more attention

lean lance
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one thing i saw was armour to make it so the damage of the penatration to be lowered

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i honestly think it should just completel stop the penetration all together, while damage in general should be lowered when going trough someone

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could be like 20% less damage per player

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so the guy back 6 teammates wont just instatly die without seeing whatever is on the other side

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but going in while hurt will be suicidal aswell

daring fossil
lean lance
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basically

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it can definetly keep weapons balance

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imagine something like the mg3 with that but no damage is reduced

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would be quite a dopamine hit to supports though

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1 hydrogen bomb vs 20 coughing baby basically

daring fossil