Make LMGs and SMGs have more suppression

[hexed tendon]

More suppression as in if you are getting shot nearby, the camera goes darker and becomes harder to aim. That way the support class can support teammates by giving covering fire

[crystal cedar]

Support is one of my favorite classes but I don't see this being a nice addition. Places like Namak or Waki bridge would just have you permanently suppressed which would be extremely annoying and result in a net decrease in enjoyment for everyone involved.

With the last set of attachment changes, LMGs feel a lot better to use and their killing power is already enough of a threat so I don't think further tweaks related to weapons are needed at the moment.

The one thing that severely hampers Support is the extremely silly armor system which mostly just acts as a permanent speed debuff and which doesn't even protect you most of the time because for some reasons getting shot in the limbs just deals full damage.

[hexed tendon]

That is a good point actually, I still feel like support needs a bit of love, specially cause we cant really move and that makes us pretty easy targets for snipers

[outer tree]

armor rework is what they need

[crystal cedar]

Yup yup. I'd like 50% limb damage because in general no matter what class you play, it's extremely annoying getting sniped for the full 60+ damage just because a tiny part of your foot was still showing. And for support, I think just replacing armor HP for an equivalent permanent % reduction would be a good start.

[dark idol]

Youve gotta be joking right

[dark idol]

This has to be a joke right

[robust grotto]

Only this for milsim mode

[crystal cedar]

I can see why I've blocked you, but can't remember why rn, so maybe I'll reconsider if you have some cogent argument to put forward. :)

[hexed tendon]

Literal 0 uuseful critique by @dark idol

[paper ruin]

Suppression and no-recoil was my favorite things in Support class in Battlefield. But no-recoil in stand up state? Armor like +1-2 bullets of other classes? This class is useless. There's @narrow edge tries to give Support something like instabuild, and makes "disbalance as fix for balance". Noway.

Big machinegun can suppress enemy and using bipod you shoot without recoil but cannot move. That was a good idea.

[dark idol]

I did not think this was a serious thread.

OP Has be Blocked so i can assume i have said something too logical for him in the past to comprehend

Saying that the armor system is silly in this game and saying that supoprt armor acts just as a perminent speed debuf is just not true

Exo Armor is statistically stronger than all other armor in the game and is class excusive because of it. You are hindered from moving at the speed of other players because of you having more armor. I will attach the statistical data to back this point up as well

[paper ruin]

Riot shield actually stronger than your all armor. And exo its like "beauty style without speed"

[hexed tendon]

Thats what i though, but @crystal cedar makes a good point about bridges being suppressed to the point of being annoying

[crystal cedar]

I did try to come up with a less annoying and more toned down implementation that could still have some role some time ago. In case you're interested: #1138399550210576466 message

In particular due to the way it's designed to work off of AoE effects on nearby surfaces, it would not trigger so strongly in encounters such as those in the bridge, as most shots are just flying past without hitting something close to the player.

[hexed tendon]

I do like the idea of dust flying when you are getting shot ngl

IIt would add to the chaos

specially behind sandbags

[crystal cedar]

I don't think anybody denies that exo is the strongest armor in terms of extra HP. That's obviously true by just looking at the numbers.

One problem is that limb damage nullify that half of the time as the huge blocky arms take up half of the torso hitbox. It's even worse when prone, you either get shot in the arms for 100% damage or in the face.

The other problem is that it's a one time bonus for a permanent debuff. Medic can literally tank infinitely more damage than exo simply because they can constantly heal themselves back up while Support can't do anything to recover their lost armor.

Furthermore, the extra survivability afforded by movement speed is not considered at all in those numbers and giving an estimate is not trivial but anyone trying to walk out in the open will very quickly see how much easier it is to survive it with lighter armors.

[weary violet]

suppression shouldn't be in the base game**.**
but in the milsim mode that shit needs to happen
as for why smgs need ("more") suppression i can only shake my head
but on the topic of "more", the current suppression is ass, it's a vignette and nothing more, for suppression to be effective it needs to have:

• a slight blur, more intense on the outer part of the screen
• aim punch/flinch
• gun sway, like you got with a long range optic but uncontrollable
• vignette
  but most importantly it has to scale with distance and weapon class/damage
  lmgs at medium range will be very effective for suppressing the enemy while a pistol up close or an ar far away won't be nearly as bad

[dark idol]

1. Limb damage is a thing on every game, this is literally the most barebones form of FPS combat that a developer can make. Low Poly Charachters with simple hit boxes. If you want something more realistic I hate to say this may not be the game for you.

2. The argument that support armor is a one time debuff does not make sense. Having more armor gives the player a much bigger advantage to being able to heal back to full hp. I think I can agree most player would much rather have a better chance at winning a gunfight over being able to heal themselves.

3. No More additional survivablity plays factor where it matters here. As I’ve said many times in the inertia suggestion thread, if you can not deal with high pace players and their movement in this game that’s not their or the game developers fault. It’s the fault of the player. I would be curious as to what other survivibility you are referencing to because other that whay we have deliberated about there is no other advantage to medics vs supports

[weary violet]

the armor part is complete non sense, the one off advantage you get does not counteract the permanent debuffs
as the debuffs serverly impact mobility and reaction speed, both vital things in this game if you want to do good
on the other side you got infinite and instant heal without any downsides apart from not being able to shoot when healing but you got that on the exo armor as well (in worse mind you)
so essentially for your arugment to make sense one would have to assume people only get a 1 or 2 kd at max, which obviously isn't the case

[dark idol]

Dude

How does playing as support affect your reaction time

You’re using an lmg

You move slower yes

But your reaction time is the same on medic or support

Also,

So yeah I believe 2kd max

That’s legit with exactly half an hour of playtime too btw

[weary violet]

the ads speed decrease of the armor lol, but no wonder you don't know a lot about support...

[dark idol]

It’s 5%

[weary violet]

7.5...

+lmg/lsws handling stats

[dark idol]

Big difference

[weary violet]

it actually is

[dark idol]

Not really

[weary violet]

going from heavy to normal/ranger is a good step up in terms of speed

[dark idol]

Also it’s 7.5% ads speed for ~ 27% armor buff

[weary violet]

but essentially, exo armor would only be the meta in your hypothetical 1 to 2 at max kd, healing with speed is better in 90% of cases

[dark idol]

I’d rather have more armor and I have a 3.89

So yeah you’re right man

[weary violet]

well, if you had that armor you'd loose a bunch of mobility and the healing so it's kinda obvious what one would choose, but anyways this crap's off topic

i still don't know why smgs need more suppression

[crystal cedar]

You probably should go read about peeker's advantage instead of just spouting whatever you feel sounds right lol

[dark idol]

Bro

That’s server latency issues

Nothing to do with your class

What are you yapping about

[tame trout]

I shall state this

Longer ADS to begin with

mixed with you tend to be incentived to hold positions which means you are reacting to enemies rather than making them react

[dark idol]

Okay

[tame trout]

otherwise still reading

[dark idol]

I’ve responded to the argument of having a longer ADS time on Support, it’s balanced how it is as it’s reflective of the ammount of armor you have on.

When it comes to your incentive to hold positions more, you are correct but it’s also not like you’re forced to play that playstyle. Nothing is stopping from you from putting on the lightest armor on support

[tame trout]

but exo armor is nice, but sadly doesn't help (Chest) when prone

helmet is consisently decent to useful

[dark idol]

No armor will help your chest armor proning

You’re lying on your chest lol

[tame trout]

aye I get that

Just noting that

it is a big reason why I tend to stick to heavy chest

mixed with just more magazines & such

[dark idol]

I think his argument is about how he can’t ads fast enough not with the armor at this point

[tame trout]

mixed with the whole exo chest is easily avoided

[dark idol]

Bringing up peekers advantage

[tame trout]

anyhow I do agree with jumper on SMGs

I don't see much point in them getting suppression

unless everything can do it at various levels & such

I would agree in cases ADS does effect reaction time on support

very when sprinting

if you are already setup & ADSed than it doesn't

but in cases like you just sprinted into a guy or such

it does limit how fast you can bring your dps to full force

[dark idol]

Yes, like I said it’s relative to the armor you have equipped

[tame trout]

well LMGs & LSWs naturally feature slower ADS times

mixed with any attachment decreases followed by armor decreases

[dark idol]

All things I agree with

[tame trout]

so I suppose a point could be made that they suffer the most per say from these

[dark idol]

From what

[tame trout]

ADS penalties

also sorry about delay, mail

[dark idol]

its by design tho