Bring back Mario Kart Voting

[craggy topaz]

Im so fucking sick of waki dude

[rocky token]

the roulette voting just needed some weights adjusted and they just nuked it for whatever reason

[rustic tendon]

the reason is slaz

[tired kestrel]

If so, then please make it that the time isn't lost, meaning if the countdown hits 0 seconds it should already have decided which map is getting played. Previously it started rolling at 0 seconds

[supple jungle]

We are back in waki-sandy-waki territory and it's feeling fairly sweaty again

[opal barn]

shit definitely shouldn’t come back read the steam reviews almost all the negative reviews stem from the map voting system and tons of players leave the game after the map that 5% of the lobby chose got

[grizzled niche]

it should be explained and made more intuitive but it is the better system

also the number of choices could be reduced to 3

to decrease the number of people who didn't get their choice

[rose plaza]

Why can’t we just make it true random

Players are dumb 80% of the time anyway just let fate decide

[grizzled niche]

waki enjoyers will riot

you have to compromise

[rose plaza]

Waki enjoyers can go hold a different choke for once

Like go fucking fight Wine Paradise Dam

It’s literally almost the same

But you don’t see anyone there ever except me because I’m the dumbfuck actually STAYING on side objectives

[vestal jasper]

Imagine not locking maps from appearing in the votes for N amounts of rounds and instead using rng with extra steps like that would satisfy more players

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/829018507010113566.webp?size=48&name=clueless~1&quality=lossless

[tired kestrel]

They should definitely create a Conquest EU and NA official server that always have majority voting consisting of the 3 (or after an update x choices + random) statistically most played maps, if possible it is dynamic and actually checks real time stats, if not just update every update. This server is where the hardliner would always go to that somehow enjoy 24/7 conquest on Wakistan, Zalfi, Basra and Sundy or whatever the most popular are right now.

That or make the opposite and create special servers with Weighted Random. They changed it for server admins, yet community servers are just all the same as official servers - whats the point of them anyway?

Community servers, atleast from my understanding are suppose to suppliment official servers, not be, like most, a 1:1 copy of them.

[grizzled niche]

most waki enjoyers are too lazy to even open the server browser

otherwise we wouldn't have this problem in the first place

but yeah community servers should be able to customize the voting system

[tired kestrel]

They already have the option to return to weighted voting

[solemn notch]

It's only for community servers, and those are dead

If they don't bring back roulette, I will most likely stop playing this game. I'm tired of only being able to play Conquest and the same 3 maps again. The only thing I wanted changed about the roulette system was it automatically picking any maps and game modes with more than 50% of the vote

[opal barn]

you have a good point, no fun only playing 3 maps even if the other maps are as enjoyable its nice to get variety

[compact meteor]

Giive the server some encouragement to pick random. Works more often than you think.

[arctic quiver]

"Pick [Insert option here] or your sexuality is reversed"

[full mesa]

dumb idea put exp bonus on random option

[rotund nebula]

I say yes to this solely because I want the chat to turn into hell when the random option turns out to be a night map that isn’t waki

Sometimes chaos is the best option here

[rocky token]

the god emperor does not approve

[lapis mantle]

fuck wakistan.

[worldly lark]

imo roulette sucked ass, it felt like nobody decides what we play. idk why people like waki, maybe we need servers that have no waki in rotation. Honestly, I'd play just Valley Conquest all day

[summer condor]

sniper heaven effectively

a lot of sniper sight lines

otherwise I wouldn't mind it as much if we didn't have constant back capping

[worldly lark]

never had an issue with that, especially with vehicles in play

I don't get all these complaints, people run in the open and then be sad about getting sniped

[summer condor]

it is mainly on bridge & river

I just build sandbags & such to block their LoS

[worldly lark]

I like Valley, I like Basra, I like Sandy, great maps, and I don't play sniper much

you can positon yourself away from open spaces, or just go ahead and target the snipers with any other class or vehicle

either way, the roulette is garbage

I don't like playing waki all the time(and non-conquest modes in general, as it becomes a clusterfuck in toilet)

but I'd rather have some control over the map than it being random bs

[summer condor]

well it isn't entirely random

it is a weight system

adjustments can be made to it, I do agree

[mild aspen]

Weight system that sucks

[summer condor]

personally no

[mild aspen]

70% of people vote namak, .1% vote eduardovo, and we get eduardovo

[summer condor]

As stated

adjustments could be made

say if 50%+ or such votes, it could force pick the map

with 30% upping it's odds of being chosen

[summer condor]

And 0.1% of the time this happens you will get eduardovo

70% you will get namak

29.9% you will get another option

[worldly lark]

this system doesn't work

just by the feel, it became utter shit

after the change

and if we want get numbers involved, we have 90% vote for map A, but randomly still can get to play map B

[summer condor]

Note what I said prior

#1172239412814430258 message

[worldly lark]

or another case: everyone magically wants same exact map, one dude accidentally missclicks - we have a chance to be sent on the map NOBODY wanted to play

[summer condor]

Green

Note what I said

[worldly lark]

why have any randomness in the first place?

[summer condor]

....

[worldly lark]

...

[summer condor]

Green, Read what I said in the thing I linked or this reply

[summer condor]

so this wouldn't happen as a example with that idea

[worldly lark]

I have, and I replied after

[worldly lark]

threshold or not, why?

[summer condor]

simple if the majority of the server wants a map, it would allow that, but if it is more divided it pleases more parties

aka the 60 to 61 majority vote, 60 votes effectively get tossed away & don't do zip

[worldly lark]

the ordinary system would still be in favor of the majority

[summer condor]

this is for super majority rather than say a 38,38 38 39 type idea

[worldly lark]

otherwise in 60 vs 61 you add a chacne to toss 61

[summer condor]

But if a server is more divided

like how it was generally when I was playing

[worldly lark]

then again, most people get what they want

[summer condor]

it is better to have weighted

[worldly lark]

if people are dividied, it's still majority that is getting what they want

the thing is, it's not the same majority every time

which is what confuses you, I believe

especially now that they reduced the option count, waki is less likely to be listed

[summer condor]

I shall be honest, it didn't feel that way last time I was playing

Got waki so much

[worldly lark]

I don't like waki or tensa clusterfuck either

but the randomly selected map was even worse

what they could try is weighted VOTES system, like Mechwarrior Online does

your vote gets a multiplier each time your voted map doesn't win

so your vote counts as two, three, four etc, each map the map you chose didnt win

same for mode

however, in MWO your mech is locked into game until round is over and people don't leave

so maybe your multiplier is only granted after you've finished a game on map you didn't vote for

naturally, if waki wins all the time, those voting for it won't get the multiplier

this might work

[lapis mantle]

they were weighted btw

[tired kestrel]

Weighted voting, 4 choices + random, + least voted map has 0 chance + most voted map gets 50% bonus chance (of the % it got). Second most voted gets 25% bonus chance (of its %).

Tied votes just have their effect split (so chance halfed for the 2 least voted options, 25% bonus chance for both most voted and 12,5 bonus chance for the tied 2nd place). If there 3 or 4 votes that have the same amount of votes the system just does nothing but remove the one with the least votes. If all 5 have the same amount of votes it just does nothing. Also, when the bonus % is applied and before the roulette begins, there is a 5% chance that night votes are doubled.

For modes:
Split servers into conquest and non conquest servers, the conquest servers have (Infantry)Conquest and Mega Random. Mega Random is just a random non-conquest mode on a random map, if that options wins, map vote is skipped entirely. After 5 games on the same gamemode, that mode is benched for 1 round
The non conquest servers are just all gamemodes + random but without those 2 conquest. After 5 games on the same gamemode, conquest and infantry conquest are added to the vote pool for 1 round (and removed afterwards again).

It's a compromise of everything and while it will piss some people off, this is what I think is the fairest, most healthies approach. Also should weighted voting return please make the roulette finish when the timer hits 0, and not start the roulette when it is 0.

[grizzled niche]

sometimes you need to trust the math more than your feelings

[grizzled niche]

i mean i like this system but its just way too complicated. it will be even harder to explain to people, and they will lose faith in the system

[tired kestrel]

Ignorance shouldnt stand in the way of progress - but yes, explaination in general IS needed, some kind of Manual where everything, every stats of every gadget etc. is noted down

I'd like to know how much HP a Tank has, and all other vehicles, how much damage a tandem does, to the back of an APC for instance

[grizzled niche]

ignorance is the main reason we have this problem. the cycle will just repeat.

i think we should bring back the old system but with 3 options and a big wheel or bar split proportionally to show the probability with a little tick mark moving around.

[worldly lark]

lots of bs on your side, including ignorance from yourself

[tired kestrel]

Guys, lets just say one thing:

It could be visualized pretty well. The previous roulette was understandably animated and it was understandable for MOST people.

When the results are finished, display the percent chance for a few seconds, then show each percent bonus, so +50, +25, -100%, add it up and then do roulette

We cant let the perfect system go to waste just because some people don't understand.

[grizzled niche]

exactly

[grizzled niche]

wanna elaborate?

[fossil mountain]

Whatever gets me away from lonovo night permanently

[supple jungle]

Skill issue

[gaunt iris]

Where’s slaz

[faint flax]

This would work. Alternatively, there's a community server I play on which starts with 3 options, then shows only the 2 that didn't get picked on the next round, and then draws 3 new options. This way least popular option always gets skipped but the other two are guaranteed to be played, just in a different order.
(there's also random in case nobody likes what's left, but this rarely wins)

[midnight sorrel]

I am very much tired with this topic

it's always 2 edge sword

whatever we put to default, always there is a lot of who wants it other way around

I am personally fine with either, honestly liked the mario kart more,

but

too many people hated that as well

[faint flax]

Make it alternate between systems every week 😛

[supple jungle]

Remove voting completely from official servers, game mode vote then random map until all have been played once, then start again

[tired kestrel]

What about this Oki?

[supple jungle]

You're trying to push weird caveats to make a broken system work

[tired kestrel]

There's always the option for a poll on #devs-asking

[midnight sorrel]

I was thinking of weighted voting - 3+1 (random) choices, only top 3 gets be in choices.

[faint flax]

If you do so, please ensure that random isn't allowed to pick something that's already in the pool. Otherwise it just feels pointless if one votes it as a way of saying they don't like any of the current options.

[supple jungle]

If you don't give people a choice, they can't complain 😄

[tired kestrel]

I think the biggest issue is that the devcast was titled "Rollback of our worst decision so far" - because I think that is refering to map voting. Which kinda makes any possibility for change of that system akward

[midnight sorrel]

it's literally their choice of voting

[supple jungle]

😂

What I mean is no matter what map is chosen, someone will hate it because they picked something else. If you remove vote then no one's "responsible" for picking a map so they can't shitpost that "X is always picked!"

[tired kestrel]

? Its always the devs fault because they changed it then

[supple jungle]

If it's randomly picked by the server, then it's no ones fault

Means all maps get played (somewhat) equally too, good for testing

Obv community servers can do what they want, 24/7 Sandy etc.

24/7 Basra snipers only hardcore 1-shot kill

[grave granite]

there is a trend though (poll is like a month old but this is what the population of the subreddit at least thought about the options)

[urban sonnet]

~30% of the voters don't want any lottery system in this poll. I don't see how this is compelling evidence in favor, we should try finding a different method that has a stronger % of people in favor of using it. Not saying balanced lottery is bad, just saying that there's definitely something that could be better.

[craggy topaz]

consider: actually they should just bring back mario kart voting, which is the best one we ever had

[urban sonnet]

That's just a personal opinion, moon. We just strive to make the most people happy, and i don't see why trying new ideas would hurt.

[urban sonnet]

For instance, this new idea seems promising. While i usually think removing options from players i bad, this could solve alot of the frurstaion felt by players who don't get the map they voted for. Perhaps people could playtest it for a week, then we could switch to a new idea, get a poll to see which one they like more.

Wait i replied to the wrong message woops.

Welp my point still stands, being open to new ideas couldn't hurt imo

[grave granite]

70% is bad? I doubt any type of voting system could be any more popular than that

nobody has suggested any over countless debates, at least

[craggy topaz]

70% in any sort of election is considered a "landslide victory"

which is why we should bring back the best and most popular type of voting : mario kart

[urban sonnet]

But it's not 70%, you're adding in the random voting of lottery. Though i do agree that a majority of the votes is in favor of it, which is a good point.

[craggy topaz]

I think the voting here and on that reddit thread shows it's more the haters were super vocal, than there were a lot of them, but given the onslaught of spam I get it.

sorry i didnt mean to ping you there, i forgot to click it off

[grave granite]

the haters were mostly Slazenger

[urban sonnet]

I have had personal experience with seeing some people complain about the voting system ingame, but i do agree it's a vocal minority.

Honestly I'd be okay with the mario kart voting if the weights were more in favor with the higher picked options, just some balance adjustment like you mentioned earlier in the thread moon

I'm sure a lot less people would complain, and the minority would grow quieter.

[craggy topaz]

i think the double weighting for options over 30% handled that pretty well - adding a small minimum to be in contention (5% or so?) to that would wipe out the "one guy voted for it and it won" corner case

[urban sonnet]

If the weights end up being too strong/weak, they could always be adjusted next patch. Great idea!

[grave granite]

we don't have any way to reliably quantify if they're too weak or too strong

but threshold 30% for x2 had good community reception

[grizzled niche]

i suggest making the mario kart voting more visually obvious, perhaps with scaled bars or portions of a circle

i think it would reduce the number of unhappy people

[tired kestrel]

Or just add a "how does map voting work" button

[tired kestrel]

And then this perfect solution

• an explanation when someone presses the button

[craggy topaz]

bonus points if it actually spins

like a roulette wheel

[median wraith]

Yeah, right, cuz fuck that one guy, why should his vote matter?

[solemn steeple]

Why not simply add labels to the various maps - i.e. desert, woodland, urban , snow, etc.
A map should have multiple labels added imho.

Instead of directly voting a map, you were randomly (including the current map-label) provided i.e. 3 labels - woodland, snow, islands - and instead of choosing the map directly , you would choose a map -pack so to say.
Then one map of this label is randomly chosen by the game .

This would come closer to mario kart voting imho as it i.e. would reflect the cups (i.e. rainbow cup) that also contains multiple maps.

So instead of having a system that acts as if a vote counts and is in the end playing the FU-card and randomizes to hell, why not simply let the player vote on a less granular level that can be respected?

[urban sonnet]

If only one or two guys vote a map out of 100+ and it gets picked, it would probably lead to the other 98 to feel quite annoyed. It's to make sure that the most amount of people are satisfied with the vote possible while still letting it pick less popular maps.

[faint flax]

It matters the appropriate amount i.e. none

[median wraith]

I guess you haven't ever been the 1% in life, and with that mentality probably won't ever be, for good or for worse, so you won't find out how it is for your voice to be diminished to 0

[faint flax]

Tbh you're right, my opinions are always objectively correct and instantly popular, sorry you're you

Anyway I think it would be best for the game if it became a realistic golfing simulator instead, I hope Oki doesn't ignore me just because I'm a special boy with special opinions 😔 ✌️

[grave granite]

I wonder if my goofy simulation thing would be rated better if I remove entires below x% of votes. I’ll try a few different values of X and see what it spits out

I'll put in 4 options like we used to have.

x=0: 21.99
x=5: 22.30
x=10: 22.70
x=15: 22.88
x=20: 25.16
x=25: 27.78

ok then

Can't safely go over x=25 as then it becomes theoretically possible for all options to be removed from the voting

so according to the crude set of assumptions this model makes, this is a good idea

[median wraith]

I've run the simulation too

[grave granite]

👏

[rose plaza]

he did the math

[austere gorge]

Mario Kart Voting was superior to the prior simple plurality system, and the people who whined against it need to be disqualified for being too emotionally compromised and the reason democracy devolves into tyranny.

There were plenty of people who simply didn't understand, but given the objections I've seen to Mario Kart voting it's mostly an emotional frustration that votes "don't matter if the map with 4% chance gets picked." "What's even the point of voting?"

It makes ME emotionally compromised.

As loathe as I am to suggest a... compromise... for their sorry asses, here's how Fire Emblem does percentages to soothe babies who can't cope with math being so cruel to their feelings:

Make % a lie. Make them curved. If you see 85% vote for one map, secretly make that 95%.

If you see 15% vote for a map, make that secretly 4.5%.

[sturdy swan]

i love wakistan

[austere gorge]

How to math that: each time the map roulette rolls, secretly roll twice instead of once. Then, average the number rolled and use that instead. For example, if it's 85% Waki vs 15% Tensa, roll a d100 twice, then if the average of that roll is 15 or lower Tensa is chosen, if the average is higher than 15 then Waki is chosen.

"People suck at properly interpreting probability. You show someone a 90% chance of anything and they'll feel utterly robbed if it doesn't go their way. It's ingrained in human nature.

The 'average 2 random numbers' (2RN) system makes things 'feel' better for the voter. Things that should happen, happen more often."

[sturdy swan]

god the map voting is so mixed

[austere gorge]

For the record, I think a 2RN system would be absolute shit because I love transparency and honesty as much as I despise Wakistan. Despite being 'human nature,' it's morally incumbent on people to overcome their shitty emotional responses.

There are plenty of games where percentages are shown raw and people are just forced to 'deal with it.'

[austere gorge]

2RN would solve this problem completely. It means that 1 vote out of 100 actually only has a .03% chance of winning instead of 1%.

[rotund nebula]

People didn’t want to understand, they just wanted to mald about not getting waki, sandy, or namak 24/7

It’s easier to say “bad dev” for most players than it is to understand that a better solution needs to exist for the game to survive long term/not go into a “repetition” problem.

[austere gorge]

True.

[lapis mantle]

sorry had to

[rotund nebula]

Nah you’re right. It’s literally that, people refusing to try new things.

[austere gorge]

But IMO, I think they did understand, and or actual understanding of percentages is irrelevant to the question, and it's a more generalized phenomena than just wanting waki sandy etc.

It's people getting mad at what they feel percentages are than what they actually are.

I've met some people who were outright calling the 15% vote succeeding a lie because they've "seen it happen too often for it to be 15%" that it "feels like it's way too often."

What's important to make a game popular and fun? Emotions or reason? In this episode of False Dichotomy, I'll

[lapis mantle]

conformation bias doing conformation biasing

[austere gorge]

It's also the outsized impact of negative emotional events on our perceptions.

[rotund nebula]

Pretty much. I do think there can be a possible time where it’s not the same few popular maps, but we’re far from that

[lapis mantle]

but tbh, we probably wouldn't have this problem if most the maps weren't that bad

[rotund nebula]

I’m definitely biased when saying this but I think things like district rework didn’t do any favors towards the current pool of maps

For that case specifically, when I got that map there would always be 3-4 people reminiscing about old district.

[lapis mantle]

absolutely not

[rotund nebula]

But then again, US servers + I’m not “skilled” myself so lmao

[lapis mantle]

that map in particular is bad for every class and its respective playstyle

old district wasn't that much better either 💀

[austere gorge]

1. Make all of the maps (subjectively) good is impossible 2. takes way much more time than adjusting voting system. It'd be nice, but

[lapis mantle]

unfortunately

[rotund nebula]

Yeah. Doesn’t help that night causes 1/4 of the lobby to leave as soon as its picked

Which there are probably reasons for too

[austere gorge]

I've literally never seen the mythical Tensa or Frugis night (which is apparently just sunset?) or Isle night (aurora borealis?). I wanna see them at least once before I die 😔

[grizzled niche]

unfortunately people hate night and unless changes are made to appeal to those people we'll basically never see night

[sturdy swan]

the three people that like night mode

[grizzled niche]

i do

but i think it really comes down to how good your eyes/monitor is. night also fucks over recon enjoyers (which i think is a positive)

[sturdy swan]

guy named gamma:

[grizzled niche]

gamma is part of monitor often, but ik there are software

[urban sonnet]

Yeah night mode is sick but as of right now it just limits what you can do in terms of gameplay. There's almost no reason to not wear nvgs unless you're sniper.

I understand why people don't vote it

Maybe next big update they could focus on trying something with it

[faint flax]

Have you ever tried playing Valley night lol

NVG there blinds you to anything past 10m, it's like being inside a permanent blindingly bright smoke cloud

[urban sonnet]

No, cuz no one ever votes for it 💀

[faint flax]

Good 😌

[tardy abyss]

Mario Kart voting mentioned in devstream, the dream is alive boys.

[grizzled niche]

didn't oki say he still preferred mario kart?

[fossil mountain]

Ye

[austere gorge]

As he should, it's the correct preference of good taste.

If it's really intolerable to people's emotional experience when the 10% wins 10% of the time, 2RN and lying percentages is the way to go.

[hushed chasm]

Could add 5 maps per voting + random and make it mariocart the top 3 selected?

With Outskirts + old versions of maps some servers/the OG servers now have 20+ maps to pick from.

[tired kestrel]

Why not a compromise between majority voting and weighted voting.

[faint flax]

That's the idea with the "ignore options with 10% or less votes"

[tired kestrel]

they should rather give extra % to the winners rather so underdogs can still win once every blue moon

[austere gorge]

Honestly I think it needs to be ignore 20% or less because of how beholden people are to their dumbass emotions.

[austere gorge]

This is the RN2 solution I posted about earlier. Elegant, but dishonest af

[rocky token]

an exponential kinda deal would work imo

so for example a map with 50% votes had an 80-90% chance to get picked and then it would diminish heavily for maps with less votes without making it literally impossible to play anything but the map with the most votes

[grave granite]

Interesting concept that has not been suggested before

[rocky token]

yeah yeah

just saying what i think without reading the 250 previous messages

[grizzled niche]

it would be cool if there was an option to auto join another server if the map/gamemode you voted for didn't get picked

[grave granite]

There are not enough servers open at once for that to work

You’d probably need like 50 concurrent for that to sometimes maybe work

[grizzled niche]

no it would send you to a random other server, not specifically based on the map you picked

[grave granite]

Oh

[rocky token]

What

What's the point of that then

[grave granite]

There’s a good chance that would take you to something worse though

[grave granite]

And the chances of not winning the vote are… a majority of cases

Given servers of late, there probably wouldn’t be enough room in the other ones to send the players to

[grizzled niche]

its an option, like a button

not forced

so if you really hate a map you can take a chance

[tired kestrel]

So the ratio on this thread is by far the best from all those mentioned in #dev-wip previously. I think we need a #devs-asking on this, or better, ingame voting.

I am sorry I am bringing this up again as you said you are tired of this topic oki, however you can take your time on this, it is fine.
Here are all other Suggestions (that I could find) that want to change the Map Voting system:
https://discord.com/channels/303681520202285057/1178089243780853790
https://discord.com/channels/303681520202285057/1179143191862186054
https://discord.com/channels/303681520202285057/1172549749593878548

[midnight sorrel]

Planning to implement in game votes (after current update), a lot of people don't follow discord.

[tired kestrel]

That's huge, thank you for listening to us. I think/agree some changes are too big to let it be decided by just discord alone.

Also here someone simulated which map voting systems would satisfy the most players:
https://reddit.com/r/BattleBitRemastered/comments/184k7ms/results_from_simulating_a_bunch_of_voting_systems/
Done by @humble dirge and posted in #1133151405125935307 message

Also, I think in this feedback Thread @grave granite also did some coding and simulation. Sorry for the pings (was the last one).

[grave granite]

Yeah, but it doesn’t seem to line up with player opinion that well.

People generally agree that having the “best” map win every time means it’s too repetitive, but I think in my sim repetitiveness repercussions don’t last long enough for that to have an impact, and they apply to everyone universally when people would get more annoyed by a bad map’s repetitiveness (well, one they don’t like)

[median wraith]

I've suggested to solve map repetitiveness by introducing map cooldown, idependent from voting system change. Like Map cant show up until some % of total pool has been rotated through (eg 80%).

[grave granite]

All that does is increase the randomness in which maps the people play

Which is decreasing the power of the voters to influence the outcome further.

[median wraith]

Yea, ensures variety, let's everyone go through their favourite map at least once in a cycle, and lets 20% of worst maps to be avoided if that's what players want.

[grave granite]

there is a balance that must be struck between variety and voter agency.

[grizzled niche]

i think limiting which maps show up in the vote is a good solution

voters still get choice, but maps are not as repetitive

[grave granite]

what is the use for this data?

[neat willow]

Give everyone an upvote and a downvote to weight the map selection. It will allow those who are essentially voting for anything other than waki/sandy to actually have impact.

[grave granite]

Could just get some results with each cooldown value factored in, and see which (according to the assumptions of the model) users should prefer the most

[rustic tendon]

Please

[trail sapphire]

Why do we need to include a 4th "random" voting option if the initial voting map pool is already randomly generated? Seems redundant and overly complex. Better to make sure the voting pool makes an effort to cover a majority of maps in the rotation before starting over (as shown in the cooldown chart above).

[velvet vector]

True, random never had a place in the system because it really needs to be either random or weighted and having a mix of both is unsatisfying to say the least.

It agitated me that instead of expanding the list of maps we can choose from, it shrunk. Why?

[midnight sorrel]

It is weighted randomized, for example, if a choice has 70% votes, the randomization has 70% chance to choose that.

The problem was, despite it was always weighted, time to time, the least chosen ones would be selected with 2% - 5% and drive people crazy and build strong negative reaction to it despite it was doing exactly what's it supposed to be doing

[random flower]

Couldn't we have a system where the vote is random only if no map has more than 50% of votes?

Just mixing both systems

[floral cape]

I have been summoned

[trail sapphire]

We're on two different pages. On the map voting screen you have something like: Waki, Frugis, River, and "Random" to choose from. The first three maps (e.g. Waki, Frugis, Sandy) are generated randomly from the map pool, correct? What I'm saying is the 4th voting choice, "random", is redundant. The three other maps already contribute a random aspect. Let us have a 4th additional, pre-randomized map option to vote for instead of "random". It just makes the process more elegant and streamlined, IMO.

Before: Waki, Frugis, River, Random
After: Waki, Frugis, River, Sandy

[midnight sorrel]

Nor random, it puts the least played ones, 4th random is random from all maps

[cursive current]

There is no problem with random map voting, have you considered changing the mode selection back to the original one?

[fossil mountain]

that's what he means

4th random should be a 4th map, random option on a random system is a bit wonky

[random flower]

Everyone would be happy if we had lottery BUT if a map gets more than 50% of votes it wins

Best of both worlds, and actually addresses all problems people have with voting

Basically, it's random when we can't agree

and if we can agree, then no need to be random

[whole leaf]

True, its also very confusing for people when the see the roulette animation without random winning the majority of the vote.

[cursive current]

Now the player who dom can't play the dom, and the player who conq can't play the conq

[fossil mountain]

mode selection is going back to normal for frontline, rush and new mode, but not the other ones. no idea why

[cursive current]

i love dom but i cant always play dom

[whole leaf]

Makes the most sense to me. Frontline and rush players are the types to only want to play the same mode over and over, and people will want to play the new mode a lot when it launches

Why did the votes on this announcement get reset? #dev-wip message

[floral cape]

The random mapvoting was some of the most atrocious, disgusting, frustrating, time wasting expereince I have ever had on Battlebit. I would often alt f4 from the game and wait for the potential next map, and my squad that I was playing with would get broken up for a good 25+ minutes - even more if the riddicuously random percentage based voting would pick a mutually unenjoyable map with 7% votes afterwards in a row. Then there was the forced nightmaps, good lord.

The game immediately became playable again in Oceania when the mapvoting was restored to how it was, with the additional inclusion of Random which is how it is supposed to be, instead of EVERY map being random with the percentage based voting.

[whole leaf]

Shut up slaz.

[fossil mountain]

bugged on your end

reacts are fine on my screen

[whole leaf]

They are there but the votes were much higher before

also I had to re vote for some reason, I think the mods cleared the reactions at some point

[cursive current]

When will it be updated? I'm worried that OKI will write a bunch of bugs again Give him a little time to fix the bug himself

[fossil mountain]

then I may be stupid

but my reacts weren't wiped

[whole leaf]

Maybe you reacted after they were wiped

[floral cape]

100% playercounts started bleeding as soon as random maps were forced upon players. I'm gonna check out the reviews on steam. I honestly have not found a single person ingame who enjoyed the random map voting - only ever D^scord and R^ddit users.

[whole leaf]

Part of statistics is understanding biases such as selection bias. Since stats doesnt seem to be your strong suit im not surprised you have not awareness of this.

[vestal jasper]

Gotta love me some isle for 5% votes and dwindling playerbase with half the servers being cringe bridge galore

With only a couple servers with decent maps at a time that are full already

[random flower]

I wouldn't mind random when the votes are too split, but seeing a map get 70% of votes and still lose had me wondering why the fuck do we even bother voting

[vestal jasper]

Forced gamemode swap is the whole another can of worms

[errant ledge]

that guy must've been very confused as community servers are not forced to switch

[whole leaf]

Why am i surprised that there are so many people that actually think their votes matter less in lottery voting than in winner takes all...

[vestal jasper]

Because lottery is not a voting system

It's an rng funny

[whole leaf]

idk what to tell you man, what youre saying is just factually wrong.

[vestal jasper]

Which they made voting system into

[whole leaf]

Unless you only vote for the maps that win the plurality, your vote matters more in lottery than it does in winner takes all. This is just true, there's no debating this.

[floral cape]

WRONG. The mapvoting horror was forced on all players, on all servers globally. It only changed recently This went on for months.

[errant ledge]

game modes not map

[vestal jasper]

I believe forced gamemode swap was never enforced for community servers

Was an optional thing

Not like there's a whole lot of them anyways

[fossil mountain]

classic slaz misinformation post

truly based

[floral cape]

0.0 hrs last two weeks / 212.0 hrs on record (176.0 hrs at review time)
Take note of that 0.0 hours in the last two weeks. Steam reviews are the final point/destination for a lot of gamers. The steam reviews are very telling.

[ocean umbra]

sounds like he’s mad he can’t play Waki 24/7

[whole leaf]

@floral cape Please read up:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selection_bias

[ocean umbra]

id take map variety over playing the same shit 10 out of the 7 days of the week

[vestal jasper]

Unless they change the fact that the current map is not removed from voting entirely for N amount of rounds and can appear to be revoted again at the end of the round it's just been played in this can be the case, but that doesn't mean you should just fix that with rng and call it a day

I'd rather have waki once in a while and not some funny random that will create this exact outcome anyways from time to time

[grizzled niche]

conquest addict cant figure out how to use a server browser 💀

[floral cape]

0.0 hours in the last 2 weeks

[whole leaf]

I dont understand what you are trying to say. If you dont vote for the plurality winner in winner takes all your vote doesnt matter. If you dont vote for the plurality winner or actual winner in lottery, your vote still effected the odds of the outcome.

I dont get why this is so hard to understand.

[floral cape]

only 2 servers active in Oceania. Ask me about Asia now

[vestal jasper]

What you fail to understand that not every solution feels nice to interact with even if it sounds right on paper

[whole leaf]

Slaz how about you stop spending all of your time looking for random steam reviews and instead read the links i sent you

[grizzled niche]

fair point, but calling voting changes a bug is just stupid

[vestal jasper]

The point of the system was to force more diverse map distribution, but it was done in quite often unpleasant way for majority of those voting

[whole leaf]

This has nothing to do with what im saying. I am responding to you, slaz, and some other guy who say that your vote matters more in winner takes all than it does in lottery, which is not true.

[vestal jasper]

I literally said this is correct logic but that doesn't mean random bs is a good solution either

[whole leaf]

Then you dont hold the opinion im arguing against

[grizzled niche]

you can check the dates, the player counts were already in freefall before any voting changes

about the reviews, of course you're only going to find negative reviews on steam about it. people who like the system aren't motivated to post a negative review.

[floral cape]

0.0 hours in the last two weeks

[grizzled niche]

night missions?

[vestal jasper]

It's just a bad design that some maps can appear over and over in the votes and those same 3 maps in the voting are still included in the random option, which just destroys this option's purpose on gamemodes with lower map counts

And slapping some random bs in an attempt to fix it is not the move

[ocean umbra]

Because they haven’t revisited the game to see how the voting changed???

[grizzled niche]

honestly at this point given how many people don't understand how weighted voting works and its benefits i think we should just have winner takes all, but with 3 options only and some sort of cooldown to prevent repetitions

[vestal jasper]

Current system is way better but I'm curious about the top 2 votes oki suggested, seems like a decent middle ground that should please both sides to a certain extent

[floral cape]

Correct. They are likely gone for good. The same exact thing can be expected if monkey changes the map voting again to random voting.

more players will drop off, maybe even myself

[grizzled niche]

good, we don't need players that call devs monkeys

[grizzled niche]

top 2 doesn't address the issue that well because the top 2 will frequently be the popular repetitive maps

[vestal jasper]

Yea, that's why already played maps should go on a rotation cooldown for some rounds that should be dynamic in regards to the total maps available to the mode

Or at least something similar

[grizzled niche]

if there's already a cooldown then top 2 is not doing much but introducing further randomness and unhappiness

[floral cape]

Was gonna post a link to the playercounts but it seems to be banned on discord. Telling. lost 30,000 players in the spawn of 1+ months due to the map voting

[vestal jasper]

True aswell but it's a step in the right direction from a total randomness it was and total domination of certain maps it is now, maybe later this top2 system can be lifted or something

[grizzled niche]

how do you know it was purely because of map voting? it could have been a number of other things

[fossil mountain]

Are you challenged? all links are banned

[ocean umbra]

Links don’t work bozo

[fossil mountain]

slaz truly is the man of time

[ocean umbra]

We aren’t linkist here, no link discrimination

[ocean umbra]

preach

[vestal jasper]

Well I mean, map voting certainly influenced some of the people that left but it's def not the deciding factor, I'd say it just accelerated the natural decay by introducing a not crirical but constantly annoying mechanic into the game

[whole leaf]

How about you take a look at the rest of the reviews instead of cherry picking 3 of them? I just looked at all negative review on the steam page from sept 27 to oct 4 (the time period where voting would have been a major issue). Of those 72 negative reviews, a whopping 4 of them mentioned voting. In the same time frame, there are so many positive reviews I cant even count them in a reasonable amount of time, indicating that players were, in fact, not leaving the game in droves because of voting.

[grizzled niche]

imo it couldve happened both ways, the people who hate repetition would have left instead, so arguing about playercount is pointless

[ocean umbra]

also preach (took time and effort to back up his claim, respectable)

[vestal jasper]

According to the player count charts post launch decay stopped at the end of august and player numbers were pretty much the same the whole september then started declining till almost mid november losing about half the population and now it's on the rise after november 9th, could be a coincidence but could be mention that last changes brought some people back

Ton of factors but something certainly did both decline and the return

[grizzled niche]

yeah hopefully rpk16 news brings a bunch back

[vestal jasper]

Oh yea, most certainly but I wonder if latest changes made a noticeable impact aside from other factors

[still relic]

Oh I see, the fighting moved here

I personally prefer my idea. But Mario Kart Voting was also an idea I proposed once, so I support this because I enjoy gambling

[eternal jolt]

how about we stop trying to make this garbage work

[still relic]

Lmao, I'm down for lobbying with real money

[grizzled niche]

pay 5 bucks to choose the next map

[rich pier]

bring it back

[stone kite]

I'd like if less popular maps get voted more often, so that's why I went with the 3️⃣ choice on the poll.

It sucks to see only top maps, over and over again... it also lowers the play count on the less popular, but now reworked maps, that could use some playing so people might enjoy it / it might have a chance to become popular.

Looping top-2 maps leads to staleness.. I love Namak like any other CQC junkie.. but when it's being played every other match, I want to hit a different scene real quick or I get tired and log off or swap servers.

[agile apex]

a longer lockout on maps would be better imo

[still relic]

I just like knowing that i always have a chance to play what i want

Fuck other peeps yo 😎. But fuck me when I lose lol

[median wraith]

Just put the weighted roulette back in, we don't need players who are emotional about it due to lack of intelligence in the playerbase anyways. If we keep the dumbos, they will keep affecting further development.

[random flower]

We don't need to choose only one or the other, I guess I'll open a new suggestion

might be too similar though idk

[grave granite]

let the users vote on map voting system at the start of each map vote

:trol:

[tired kestrel]

Me: "It is weighted voting which means every votes counts and there is a rare chance the lowest voted maps sometimes wins but that promotes map variety"
: "But then sometimes my vote doesn't win"
Me: "Yes because sometimes other players want to play different maps"
: "This sucks, negative review, make it majority vote"

[fiery topaz]

You spend XP to vote 💀

[median wraith]

You get 1 vote for each prestige you have.

[gloomy mica]

i like this. can't react to it for some reason.
Good idea to keep xp grind alive

also possibly unique? never heard of it before myself

[fiery topaz]

LMAO that was troll, don't do that. Please don't.

Any advantage for choosing, will make people leave.

[nimble ermine]

Or just fix waki bridge rush strat by adding a couple more ways to push across bridges to objectives

[vestal jasper]

Cable cars on waki when

[median wraith]

armed littlebirds available at base in every conquest map and i can live with any voting system

[vestal jasper]

Then I need a deployable flak gun and we have a deal

[full mesa]

There are other way tho people just dont use it a lot

[nimble ermine]

true but they are also easy to counter compared to bridge nade rush

[tardy abyss]

I expected better from you Slaz, at least if you're going to go and have an argument, don't just nit pick the reviews. Why didn't you go and post mine?

[median wraith]

He's obv just trolling

[tardy abyss]

In fact, it's still on the top page for the store page, so I don't think you missed it, I think you intentionally didn't post it to back up your own opinion.

[midnight sorrel]

The votes are pretty obvious

I personally liked the martio kart voting as well

I will get onto this after breakfast

#dev-wip message

[gloomy mica]

All this talk about which system is well and good and we know which Oki prefers. But has he ever said anything about the must-have feature of the last played map being removed from the next possible pool?

just yesterday we went Lonovo > Lonovo on a 5% vote. The 5% winning is fine, but Lonovo should not have been an option

nor should it be in the random pool if that had won

or maybe it should be, for the lulz and chaos factor

[still relic]

There are definitely options other than Mario Kart voting and Majority vote. Majority vote can work I think if you tie game modes to map selection. This would speed up voting and cause popular maps to not necessarily be voted if the game mode wasn't something people wanted to play (waki on invasion vs lonovo on inf conq). Not a perfect solution, but it could work.

I still prefer gambling tho tbh.

Also some servers do still use roulette, and I think I get more variety map wise on those. But it may just be that I don't pay that much attention lol

Majority vote would also work if previous maps had a very low chance to reappear immediately. Like, 5%, then they go up each time they're not picked. With the current 3 choices this would mean that eventually all the popular maps would probably not appear in the list and the less popular maps would be picked.

I honestly just want map tied to game modes during voting just to speed it up a bit as well. Most of the time I miss the game mode vote because I'm just not looking at the screen anymore

Point is, you gotta get real sophisticated (complicated) to have all the positives of majority vote shine through while also allowing for variety in choice.

But the most braindead option that works is still mario kart voting lol

TBH, it's not that complex. Just make sure the game is fun lol.

[floral cape]

He has been given the option and the power to vote for Random. Because he doesn't use the tools he has been given - that we have all been given, he finds himself unsatisfied.

[tardy abyss]

Average Slaz L response

Completely irrelevant to the argument

[floral cape]

Voting random will give you a random map. If you have a greviance about map variety, vote random. Not that you need to anyway, because the end voting screen only has 3 maps. The chance for an "overplayed" map is already incredibly slim.

[still relic]

Who let slaz into the suggestions 💀

[vestal jasper]

Random option would be a neat thing to avoid other 3 options

But these options are included in that random

So it's a clown option

[still relic]

I mean that's the point of random, it's less a variety option and more of a "I'd like to not play on these 3 maps"

but it still can pick the 3 maps lmao

[vestal jasper]

Exactly

[floral cape]

As intended.

[still relic]

maybe one day the game will make sense

[vestal jasper]

Truly, a perfect system

[still relic]

https://tenor.com/view/gigachad-chad-gif-20773266

[stone kite]

I would love to see the "roulette" (I don't play Mario Kart idk what that means, but I assume it's the weighted roulette thing? 😅) voting extended to GAME MODES too.

Right now, it's Invasion 24/7 on every single server. I love giving feedback and testing this new mode, sure, but it's tiresome to play the same thing over and over.

It's just like the maps; Waki 24/7 is annoying and boring.

Invasion 24/7 is the same thing; fun at first, yawn/rage inducing after 2 hours of doing the same thing..

[fossil mountain]

it's not even 24/7 invasion it's 24/7 invasion tensa

just like 24/7 conquest waki

[lapis mantle]

invasion is fun.

[rose plaza]

when your team actually splits to the objs accordingly q-q

[stone kite]

Why split, just stack one OBJ and don't lose it ezpz

[still relic]

Invasion really is waki bridge/battlefield metro/locker 24-7

Fantastic game mode for that kind of gameplay (if the maps were better), but it really does get old quick

[grave granite]

Maybe, but not EVERY GAME :)

I would like to play something else once in a while…

[lapis mantle]

ehh, tbh it's my absolute favorite, would love to see it on more maps than just outskirts, isle, dusty dew, kodiak, wine paradise and valley tho

just imagine the mayhem on wakistan, salhan, frugis or lonovo

so much carnage to be experienced

[stone kite]

I'm guessing it's popularity will die down after the free weekend, but only time will tell!

I'd be all for official servers / default community server setups to include a "can't play the same gamemode more than X times in a row" toggle.

Maybe.. 2 or 3 times? After that, it would hop out of the pick pool for one voting round.

It would let the popular gamemode be played more often, but prevent staleness by forcing one variety game every 3 games.

[tardy abyss]

Is this going to be a part of the next update? Just curious since there's been a bit of silence since this was voted for in #dev-wip

[midnight sorrel]

planning to if I can get time to work on it

[craggy topaz]

[tardy abyss]

Well, that's awkward.

[midnight sorrel]

Couldn't test on it properly so I backed on it, previously I fucked it up and all servers were stuck after 40 min

so had to delay it

[tardy abyss]

I'd do the OkiHeadPat thing but I can't afford nitro so just assume it's in place of this message.

[austere dust]

So, When ?

[whole leaf]

Never

Since he sent that message Oki has confirmed that he thought about it and changed his mind

[midnight sorrel]

Still haven't able to get my hands on it.

[austere dust]

Ok I just wanted to know if it was abandonned or not, take your time 🙂

[midnight sorrel]

@whole leaf Please do not assume without me actually making a statement about it.

[civic crypt]

im fairly sure its still randomised just people didnt like it going like a pinball machine

[grave granite]

It’s not.

[whole leaf]

My bad. I somehow thought this was a different thread.

[floral cape]

The current map voting is spectacular. Only shortcoming is there are enough options to vote for when a server runs the old maps. Needs ideally 4 potential maps + Random.

[rustic tendon]

Shut up slaz

Add this when?

[lapis mantle]

there is no roadmap tho

[grave granite]

That’s just the next patch

[tardy abyss]

At this point I just come in here once a month to check if its implemented, then mention it since it is something the devs had a vote on and it has not gotten fulfilled compared to the other things that got voted for, and then just wait until the next time when it comes up.

[errant ledge]

I highly doubt we'll ever get this considering most official server players just want to chain vote conquest 24/7

[rich pier]

too busy making bad audio updates, seeing the next update list audio is a bad sign

[civic crypt]

who knows maybe they add echoey shooting noises

[rustic tendon]

when

[hushed chasm]

🙏

[zealous mantle]

Aint this a throwback

[craggy gust]

#BringBackPercentageVoting

[feral quiver]

Tzamina mina eh eh
Waka waka eh eh
Tsamina mina Zangalewa
This time for Wakistan

[supple jungle]

Played my first Night Tensa Town yesterday, the first time I've ever been able to play this map in 300 hours of gameplay. It was a lot of fun and very very different

I'm sure there are more untouched gems out there, held back by people demanding maps they can be sweaty on

[rotund nebula]

It isn’t even a “sweat” issue (people could easily make the game bright again by turning up their screen gamma and stomp if they really wanted to.) most night maps are just hard to navigate for newer players who engage with the voting system so they get frustrated or leave when night gets picked

Ever wonder why pretty much all community servers disable them? The lobby dies real fast the second it switches to a night map that isn’t isle, namak, or waki (isle night is saved by good lighting and a cool skybox)

That being said, I wouldn’t mind it playing a factor in mario kart voting, but as it stands night mode needs to take notes from isle night and have better lighting and address the whole gamma screen setting bypass (some sort of engaging skybox would be cool too ofc.)

[zealous mantle]

One of my biggest issues with night is how on some maps, shadows are artificially enabled, despite me clearly clicking the option to disable them

Like, when i click that option to disable them, i expect it to actually do that

It only tanks performance for players with weak pcs and makes maps significantly worse

[barren sapphire]

Wakistan best map

[supple jungle]

I just told you it was really fun and your reply boils down to "no it wasn't"

Community servers disable them because "night maps shit lol", it's such an ingrained meme now that it's self-perpetuating

Again, let me state, this was the first time I've played this night map combo ever, in over 300 hours of gameplay.

[finite finch]

Beautiful isnt it

[faint flax]

Some night maps are little more than a recolor with a nice sky, other maps are unplayable shit. Seems like banning a subset of night maps isn't viable, so.

[zealous mantle]

Yeah night maps are just inconsistent af

Some are pitch black mess and others are just a vibe

[barren sapphire]

the only map where ppl actually vote for the night variant is lonovo

but that's due to the fact that it's "thumbnail" is a night variant

[zealous mantle]

Oh god dont bring that conspiracy theory up please

My brain actively rots from it

[barren sapphire]

but there is no other explanation

it's the only map with such a "thumbnail" and it's the only map ppl actually play night on

like, got 3 night lonovos today

other night maps I played like 2-3 months ago 💀

[zealous mantle]

Lonovo night is such cancer tho

[grave granite]

It could be true, could not be

Intuitively I’d lean towards true but there can always be other explanations

The thumbnail isn’t even night though, that’s the thing

Just gloomy weather in a grey coloured area

[zealous mantle]

Exactly

It vaguely resembles night

If it was actually night you wouldnt see shit

Its just that dark

[barren sapphire]

monkey sees dark
neuron activation
monkey thinks night

but yeah

[zealous mantle]

Also the whole thing of "looks like night therefor night is choosen" doesnt make sense

Cause no sane person would want to play night lonovo

[barren sapphire]

and yet somehow we have players that actually vote for it 💀

[zealous mantle]

Which means that its more likely that people either enjoy night that much or select it for shits anf gigs

[barren sapphire]

they always cry about flare spam tho

[zealous mantle]

I mean

Thats what happens when you only use nvgs

[whole leaf]

When I first joined I always thought that lonovo only had a night version because all the pictures showing it looked dark

also river used to get voted as night a lot and it has a darker thumbnail as well

[zealous mantle]

I cant be the only one who noticed that each map has both day and night versions when i first got bbr

[rotund nebula]

Doesn’t change the fact some maps need better lighting. It’s oddly strange how maps like isle during the night absolutely slap, whilst maps like lonovo arguably suffer from it due to bad lighting

If the poorly lit up night maps had that and attention was drawn to it after such change, I could easily see people voting for it. Time for that orange “reworked” tag to come back.

[craggy topaz]

lono night before everyone just turned gamma up had some really intense floor by floor fights. just fortifying some random apartments or busting down those fortifications was a lot of fun.

then ppl realized with some setting tweaks they could just keep sniping like nothing changed and it killed the feel

anyway, i look forward to Mario Kart Voting returning Soon™️

[grizzled niche]

i love all night maps

its sad that apparently nobody else does

[lapis mantle]

i love being blind

[grizzled niche]

they should just remove flares at night and it will be fine

allow certain scopes with nv

[tired kestrel]

There should be a 5% chance that night votes on the winner gets doubled. Not that it would change the outcome most of the time, but from time to time nightmaps are neat

[whole leaf]

They just need to make the day / night vote be chosen randomly too

[tulip narwhal]

they just need to make night maps interesting so that ppl start voting for them themselves and aren't forced

[tired kestrel]

Frugis night is already beautiful

You can only make so many dawns, evenings, northern lights, nights, pitch black nights, dusk etc. Until you will get repetitive

And if most nights aren't "nights" then that's odd

Tho a red moon night would be lit

[supple jungle]

frugis night is great

[lapis mantle]

ah yes, my favorite, pitch black salhan

(and others just turn up the gamma)

[craggy topaz]

yeah the night maps that are just dawn/dusk are really nice aesthetically

[craggy gust]

Fr.

[summer condor]

Agreed there

[manic portal]

Make official servers random and community whatever they like. How many people remember aurora borealis an Isle night?

[trail sapphire]

Once in 380 hours

[craggy gust]

Still no response from any of the Devs on this about why or why not it is or isn't coming back.

[tired kestrel]

Oki said he hasnt gotten his hands on it. Yet on one devcast he showed that with a simple true/false change he can enable it again and it is available to choose for server admins.

But they literally named one devcast "Rollback of our worst decision so far" refering to mario kart voting. Why? idk, but that was a bad idea

[latent totem]

Personally i don't feel like waki is being selected more than the other maps. That being said, the voting system as a whole could use a loving hand and get an upgrade of sorts. I saw a community server doing that Mario voting thing. That looked super nice, and seemed to be more fair.

[craggy gust]

What region servers you in?

The NA ones are almost all waki at most times.

[latent totem]

Fair, that could be the reason. I'm on EU

[rotund nebula]

I mean when most matches devolve into waki, sandy, tensa, frugis, and namak on a loop.. then yeah.. that’s bad.

I don’t blame the players though, most maps are hot garbage, and the “reworks” are hit or miss, never and inbetween

Example: new district vs old district, new barsa vs old barsa.

Both were seen as worse. The inverse exists too for maps like edvarudo (even though most agree both versions suffer issues)

And on top of that, maps not being able to be played on certain modes. (E.g. no namak conquest or frontline, no zalfi rush atm) limits this already limited pool of maps people like to play even further.

[edgy mortar]

Lots of times Waki wins because the rest of the votes, although higher, gets divided over 2 other maps.
People that hate Waki should unite and agree on all voting for the same not-waki map.
Say perhaps agree to vote for the most left , non-waki option all the time waki comes up ?
That way they would win more elections.

[rotund nebula]

And then the lobby is half of what it once was because people vote kodiak night

It’s a case of “most people prefer bridgefest” over “vilask recon simulator/I can’t see” which happens to be a lot of maps.

Mario kart voting should come back, but so should the hated maps be reworked so that the lobby isn’t dead when the 1% lonovo night vote goes through

instead of old barsa being reworked from an “ok” tier map to a fucking water park where everyone’s afraid to push and the lobby again dies as a result

[edgy mortar]

To keep the lobby full, the win should go to the largest group, but since you can only vote for what map you DO want, and not what map you DONT want, sometimes the smallest group wins.
Perhaps they could change that.
Give people 1 vote, and make it so they can either vote FOR a specific map out of three, or AGAINST a specific map out of the three.

[zealous mantle]

Maybe give a treshhold on what map will be included in the roullette vote?

Like

If a map is voted by 1% of the lobby, that map will be excluded from being randomly picked

If its at or above 10% for example it will be included

[barren sapphire]

we have 4 maps to vote from

top 2 gets mario karted

or threshold like palma said

[whole leaf]

Or just let us vote for any map instead of limiting the selection

[latent totem]

Simple solution would be to just pick the 2 most voted maps and put those up against each other

Like Goofy mentioned above i see

[supple jungle]

Separate out day/night maps into their own unique vote, I've seen it where a day version of a map has the most individual votes, but another maps combined day/night votes are higher so that gets picked

Day/night play so differently they should be treated as separate maps

[zealous mantle]

Maybe make it so that once a map is picked you get a clear cut choice for day and night

Like you show a small thumbnail of map during day and night and let people pick out which one they want

[craggy gust]

Wsg yall

[craggy gust]

.

[trail sapphire]

Played frontline-only server yesterday. Suffered through Waki. Next match: Waki. Granted, it was a community server and they can control this stuff, but it would be great to set a precedent.

Vote from pool of five > one of top three maps gets randomly selected > second page vote for day/night

Or literally anything besides winner take all

[craggy gust]

fR.

[whole leaf]

Its funny you say that because BBC has roulette voting and it also had back to back waki yesterday

[trail sapphire]

The fact that maps aren't removed from the pool for longer is possibly a bigger issue than the voting style

There are 22~ maps? Seems like we should go through at least 10 rounds before going back to the beginning

[zealous mantle]

Wont be a problem if someone came to the brilliant idea of 24/7 servers

For maps i mean

[trail sapphire]

Like a full rotation of all the maps?

I'd be all about it

[whole leaf]

I think he meant a 24/7 server for each map

but idk if he was joking cause that would make this problem way worse

[tulip narwhal]

if we had more than 3 good maps we wouldn't need to circle them

[zealous mantle]

I was joking a bit

Albeit I do find it weird that there arent any community servers that did actually make 24/7 for some maps

[short kestrel]

bringing this back

[barren sapphire]

Bro still eating his breakfest 😭

[marsh nacelle]

Make mario kart voting great again!

[austere dust]

One eternity later....

[zealous mantle]

Please

I need my variety back on officials

[tepid grail]

[patent ledge]

It seems to me that the problem is not in the voting, the problem is that the rest of the maps are bad (the majority of the community does not like them). Maybe they should make more good maps?

[short kestrel]

Not what the problem is

People will continue to vote for the maps they think are best no matter how better they make the other ones

You can't have every map be the best one, so the current voting system is flawed

[zealous mantle]

Most complaints came from people that wanted to play a certain set of maps and disliked everything else (notably wakistan was the one that those people wanted to play)

When they couldnt they complained

[tepid grail]

Cant agree more

[supple jungle]

i sniper 👁️ 👄 👁️ waki only or i leave

[tepid grail]

How many maps we have? 24?

If each match takes about 30 minutes

And in 4 hours of gameplay, you play the same map at least 3 times, the problem are not the maps, but the players

It happened once to play the same map 5 times

[clear burrow]

I remember when for my first 150 hours I saw all of 5 maps total. Waki, Tensa, Frugis, the one night map, and occasionally sandy.

[lapis mantle]

ea launch when people just voted for a thing and had fun
but then the sniper nation attacked...

[patent ledge]

Exactly. It's all the snipers' fault, how could I forget?

Stupid snipers ruined everything

[still relic]

https://tenor.com/view/traewockhardt-sad-jjk-jujutsu-kaisen-gif-16591014784735052511

[tepid grail]

Snipers are not even the majority, but they are the majority that vote for those maps

[blissful oriole]

Fuck waki and valley is just straight broken for me (never loads without me getting kicked by anticheat, also takes 10 minutes of loading before the kick so I just alt f4 anytime it gets voted for since there is never time between end of vote and start of next match and no way to leave while loading).

[zealous mantle]

Iirc older maps apparenly have an issue where they cause a memory leak (for some reason)

[blissful oriole]

Not surprised. Still won’t vote for either when they are fixed, didnt like them anyway.

[still relic]

https://discord.com/channels/303681520202285057/1241480391437717524 plugging my solution again

I don't mind mario kart voting, but just overhauling it to be more streamlined would be better imo. The way the game is heading, we'll have a giant garry's mod grid of maps and modes that'll only get picked by random chance.

Tbh I wouldn't mind mario kart voting but we also vote on the stuff all at once. I didn't specify how things should be picked in the post so servers could still decide

[rotund nebula]

“Wait you mean you DONT want to play conquest? GRRR EVERYONE SHOULD BE PLAYING CONQUEST NO VARIETY ALLOWED HOW DARE YOU MAKE THIS TYPE OF SUGGESTION?”

[finite finch]

you ok there derpster?

[rotund nebula]

Im taking the piss, it’s a good one and think it should be implimented just like mario kart voting

[finite finch]

[rotund nebula]

But I already know people are gonna be pissed that there’s no guaranteed conq loops if we go that route. It should be standard for an all modes server, otherwise what’s the point of calling it all modes?

[lapis mantle]

those mfs can't cope their way around conq or invasion, not enough planning
they need their aas or even better raas
(not like i wouldn't want to have a bbr milsim mode one day [soon™️ cope] but all conq is also just not it)
VOTE INVASION YOU DIPSTICKS IT'S GOT VEHICLES, CQC, ZERGING AND ALL THE OTHER FUN STUFF IT IS THE EPITOME OF ALL THINGS BATTLEBIT RAAAAAAAAAAA

bot didn't 1984

[zealous mantle]

"But guys conquest keeps the game alive" - slaz

[lapis mantle]

"n word" - also slaz

[short kestrel]

i dont like conquest a ton either but to be fair 99% of the other gamemodes just feel unfinished and should be removed until more work is done on them

frontline, invasion, and conquest

those the good ones

[patent ledge]

Lol. People are trying to blame the slazanger for something, not the bad decisions of the development team. Something is wrong with you guys

[rotund nebula]

Slaz had cooked takes. Devs make knee jerk and bandage solutions to problems

[rustic flax]

slaz is the reason for the broken challenges

all started once he tricked terminal into killing oce

[rotund nebula]

I mean as much as we take the piss, I think we can confirm Brazil switching to offcials and conq loops killed it

And SEA being only conq killed it.

[rustic flax]

i'm pretty sure that's when challenges broke too

or was it them trying to fix a 500 capture challenge

[rotund nebula]

People complained about the lowered quality of officials and those that didn’t want to play conq in that region (happened to be a decent chunk) went to na or eu

Oh wait I mean

“GRRRR HOW DARE SOME OF THE BRAZILIAN PLAYERS NOT ENJOY PLAYING THE SAME 2 MODES I LIKE ON THE SAME 4 MAPS WITH A SERVER THAT CONSTANTLY CRASHES AND STUTTERS!!!! THEY SHOULD BE BANNED FROM BBR!!!”

[rustic flax]

he then went to sea after oce died

and somehow convinced those owners to make it constant conq too

[rotund nebula]

Nah brazil just closed their doors because they got tired of dealing with complaints about modes and shit iirc + moving issues

So an official was made

[rustic flax]

#1194048577035579403 message

[rotund nebula]

And wow what a shocker SEA dont do daily resets sometimes with the server performance bug still being around so the quality tanks

[rustic flax]

[rotund nebula]

I mean help me maintain control over NA and we’re good variety wise

We always need more seeders and we know damn well this isn’t going to be in the next update so yeah

[patent ledge]

It's all the snipers and slazanger's fault. Slazanger has been banned, all that remains is to remove the snipers. And the game will be great

[rustic flax]

don't forget vehicles

remove those too

[patent ledge]

truuu

[lapis mantle]

they are already ass they need fixing omg

[blissful oriole]

I wish they actually put effort into fixing invasion cus it had all the potential in the world. I hate inf conquest. More of a running sim than the conq

[zealous mantle]

Delete infy conquest

[tulip narwhal]

[summer condor]

well this has been a interesting read

[wise sand]

dang, missed the 1 year anniversary

[zealous mantle]

Not yet, decemeber is just a month away

[wise sand]

thank god cant wait for them to not change it anyways'

[formal sparrow]

december is now @zealous mantle

[zealous mantle]

Uhuh i am aware

[wise sand]

4 days away

[wise sand]

dang I missed it

[zealous mantle]

You got one more day

[craggy topaz]

Bring back Battlebit

[tepid grail]

Sir, you cannot bump the thread

[tired kestrel]

Lets be honest, if Mario Kart Voting doesnt come back with the next update, then that will paint a dire picture to community involvement.

It's a simply line of code change last time Oki showed it off in the devcast. And there is literally no suggestion that is clearer in favor than this. This might actually be the suggestion with the most green checkmark votes.

The fact that it is not confirmed yet that it will return is worrying.

[tepid grail]

I liked the random map roulette, you had no expectation of where it could land

The maps being reworked it only brings up the excitement of where you gonna play

Plus letting you have a more diverse gameplay

Im not really a fan of playing the same 3 or 4 maps when you have a roster of almost 20 maps to choose from

They all good (for the most part), people just complain because they cant read a map

[tulip narwhal]

no not at all

some are absolute garbage and unless they get reworked I would rather play 5 maps on repeat

[rotund nebula]

I mean we could and should have both (better maps via reworks + additions, and roulette), with it actually rotating though modes besides conq

I said this before and I’ll say it again: calling a server all modes solely for it to just loop between 2 forms of conquest is just misleading

Of course, this also heavily relies on vilask using his map experience well + factoring in community feedback to some degree. (I know he wants to do his own thing, which, fair.

But some old maps just play better than their new counterparts, old district and basra being prime examples. The open and “too large” [think running sim] maps just aren’t fun to play on unless you’re playing conquest. Which I suppose is why people vote that mode the most, but it leads to a burnout problem because eventually people get tired of playing the same maps.)

[zealous mantle]

Only way to remove the constant loop of conq/infy conq, is to simply remove infy conq

[tulip narwhal]

no

[clear burrow]

can anyone actually define what mario cart voting means here? is it just "every vote has a chance to be selected sequentially"?

[tired kestrel]

If 10 people vote for 3 maps.

Map A gets 2 votes
Map B gets 5 votes
Map C gets 3 votes

After voting is finished the System chooses a random map but considers every vote, meaning that:

Map A has 20% chance to be chosen
Map B has 50%
Map C has 30%

[zealous mantle]

Pretty much

Map with more vote = higher chance of being selected

[clear burrow]

ah I see...

need to pay attention to how it works rn

[true socket]

Anything to stop the endless Waki-Frugi cycle

[craggy gust]

Fr fr

[rotund nebula]

Infy conq is just the worst of both worlds, its only played because it’s just another form of conq

You want mode variety on officials, either it has to be linked with normal conq or removed entirely

[zealous mantle]

Exactly

There is practically 0 variety on officials for the sole reason that infy conq exists

[tulip narwhal]

this again?

[rotund nebula]

Cant have true variety without killing the copycat modes that effectively arent different enough on their own imo. This includes elimination as I said months ago

Even if it would most likely be conq and domi looping or conq and invasion it would still be different enough imo

There’s not much difference in how people play infy vs normal conq, one has tanks/APCs/Blackhawks and the other doesn’t, not much changes. Safe zone snipers still snipe there, people still complain about “walking sims”, and those safe zone snipers, maps are the exact same size as normal conq.. etc.

[zealous mantle]

Yes, this again, because officials are so fucking boring

Its just conq and infy conq

Nothing else

And they are identical modes

One is conq, other is conq but less fun

[tulip narwhal]

remove conq and you solve more issues

[rotund nebula]

Remove modes that are effectively repeats of another mode

Infy conq and elimination fall under this.

Then improve maps that are lowest voted/hughly complained about. Find out what works and what doesn’t which im sure Vilaskis will say he’s been doing, I cant see behind the scenes stuff. This way people wont mass leave if it lands on 3% DustyDew/Eduvardo

Then Mario Kart gamemodes and maps so that if a gamemode loop ever happens the loop will at least break at some point

Officials are supposed to be all modes but hilariously fails to accomplish this, acting as a 24/7 conquest server unless people spam chat to push for different modes

speaking of that tho…

I wont say here but Haro knows, assuming the plan goes well ofc

[zealous mantle]

Yes, lets keep the mode where vehicles other than littlebird are useless garbage
Great idea, truly stunning

[tulip narwhal]

remove tank sniping and btr spam, movement and balance of them is so bad anyway that they wont be missed

[lapis mantle]

what else are they supposed to do? they desintigrate in any other use

they need buffs and fixes and maybe then they'll be viable

[tulip narwhal]

or just replace conq with inf conq and remove that issue

no need to waste brain power

[fossil mountain]

I can see no controversy coming from this whatsoever

after all conquest is a really unpopular gamemode that nobody votes for

[tulip narwhal]

ik im in the minority here but conq is just worse inf conq to me

not the other way around

[lapis mantle]

seek help

or go play delta force or cod or some shit smh

[rotund nebula]

I mean he’s not wrong to some degree, safezone camping is dumb as fuck period in a mode where you benefit most from defending/capping objectives. (What are you doing defending your safezone/camping in the middle of nowhere when there’s no real advantage objective wise?)

Vehicles should be reworked or retuned but not in a way that allows a tank/btr/whatever driver to just act as a lone wolf and not help the team. Red/blue zones should not grant total immunity to enemy attacks (via preventing them from shooting and using gadgets) when an enemy manages to successfully flank you in them. That’s just the truth of the matter.

Currently armored vehicles just fail in that imo (but I think most people have the same issues regarding that)

[tulip narwhal]

im sorry that i dont enjoy current armored vehicle gameplay or nade-spam-non-stop-action on inf or domi as much

and we dont talk about invasion. That mode needs 3 years of polishing

[lapis mantle]

invasion is peak.
it is literally battlebit in one gamemode you heretic

[tulip narwhal]

the concept yes everything around it is ass

love me some flat maps with 200 snipers and tanks sniping over 2 caps all game

[lapis mantle]

all true, unfortunatly the problem goes both ways...
vehicles are ass to play (against)

[lapis mantle]

ok yeah tensa but tensa has always been cringe
island is peak though

[tulip narwhal]

the big map they abandoned without reason could have worked really well with invasion with some changes. But no they wouldnt even try

[lapis mantle]

i mean it was only a test to see if the game can handle 4×4km maps
would be great for invasion though yeah, also for a milsim mode

[tulip narwhal]

a test they abandoned with weak reasons

[lapis mantle]

wait huh

wdym they abondoned?

[tulip narwhal]

gimme a sec to finish my food and I'll search for the message

[lapis mantle]

fair i should be doing biology stuff rn but our sub teacher is bad

[tulip narwhal]

seems to be in devcast #22 trying to find the time rn

cant find the exact message i meant but in the stream oki said sth like "big map i dont think its the answer ... we can increase it a little bit but that depends on vil ... but dont make it extremely large"

• several points why big map suck (based on the test)

[lapis mantle]

oh yeah k i remember

[tulip narwhal]

(map was extremely undeveloped and that was the resason for most issues )

[zealous mantle]

Like pepega said below, yes armored vehicles (vehicles in general) should be rebalanced because rn they work in stupid ways to say the least

I like conq more cause at least its a bit interesting with vehicles that can actually kill people with guns instead of the paper mache ahh cars that get used once and never again in infy conq

[zenith wharf]

wakistan is operation locker of battlebit

[tepid grail]

Revival of this thread?

[zealous mantle]

Oki pls bring back mario kart voting to officials

[tired kestrel]

Can we also have Mario Kart as an secondary game inside Battlebit too?