Pistols (General) - Feedback

[lapis pasture]

Please keep it on topic, and civil, we want serious feedback

• No gifs
• No 'skill issue'
• No video's - (Testing video's in the Polygon are fine)

[errant wedge]

Feel like all semi-auto pistols are useless

[cold sentinel]

Really not much reason to use a pistol, even in the heat of battle, depending on your gun you'll probably still be better off just reloading your primary than trying to engage with your sidearm.

[jade tartan]

i mean only one thing people want

just faster switching to pistol

[regal zenith]

Only pistols that seem to do much is the high damage and auto pistols. I think the semi auto need a slight buff. And I do think there should be more pistols added overall. Maybe some non pistol secondaries.

[jade tartan]

define non pistol secondary?

like shotguns? cuz if yes then NO

melee weapons? i mean would be cool yes

[vagrant belfry]

Crossbow pistol which deals 10 dmg and a free bleeding lol

[jade tartan]

im up for meme weapons

[cold sentinel]

Personally I think the hammer and pickaxe should be secondaries instead of gadgets.

[regal zenith]

I know they already said no shotguns. I mean could see more utility or maybe unique like a cross bow. Slug weapons. Taser? Lmao maybe not

[jade tartan]

i mean taser would be funny

[regal zenith]

It would be pretty funny

[jade tartan]

getting hit by taser then your body ragdolls for X amount of seconds

[regal zenith]

Yep. Have cartridges and have a long reload maybe. Maybe does only like 5 damage.

[cold sentinel]

A taser would be funny but it'd also be really frustrating and wouldn't make much sense.
A taser wouldn't work through body armor.

[jade tartan]

i agree, but im here up for meme weapons

[weak tusk]

I can't be the only one having issues with switching to my pistol, it's loaded and ready to go, but there's a 1-2 second delay before I'm firing, right? It doesn't seem to happen every time, but enough to warrant me thinking it's a bug.

[tepid pawn]

One annoying thing about pistols is that they pull your view up when you pull them out, which makes firing them as soon as you pull them annoying because you also have to fight your camera.

[cold sentinel]

Personally I'd like less forced camera movement in general.

[tepid pawn]

Also if you fire your pistol as fast as you can, it will drop your inputs pretty frequently. This can make it feel like it's "jamming" when really it's the player that's clicking too fast. For example, if I have a gun that has a fire-rate of say 1 bullet per second, or 60 rpm, and I click twice in a single second, my second click per second will be dropped.

Some games get around this by queueing clicks if it's within a certain time limit. Using the above example, if I click twice in a second, my second click will be "queued" and will be used to fire the shot as soon as it's off cooldown.

[jolly cypress]

All pistols should have a base 1.10 movement speed minimum.

[cosmic mural]

Pistols in general take too long to draw. They should either be drawn much faster (hell some guns barely take longer to reload than to pull out a much worse secondary) or be way stronger (I prefer this option).

[tepid pawn]

On the question of balance though, there needs to be some way to differentiate the semi-auto pistols and make them worth using at all. Titanfall has a similar problem, why would I use the semi-auto pistol when the automatic pistol does its job better?

[jagged night]

This is mostly because of the lower rate of fire on the M9 (400) and USP (500). The MP443 (700) is high enough RoF to register my clicks. IMO all pistols should be this way though.

[green owl]

The first few pistols feel underwhelming due to fire rate caps and missing feature "action queuing", which means some inputs will be ignored if you click too fast. This makes the pistols feel underwhelming and extremely inconsistent and annoying to use.

Action queueing should be implemented, then pistols rebalanced afterwards if still under performing

[brave sierra]

semi auto pistols are kinda ok but dont have nearly enough oompf. same with the glock. the magsize is just too low without the extension(or the damage) to be viable. barely kills that guy in front of u and tickles a second guy. the heavy hitters are my go to choice as they are the only ones offering proper kill potential

[smoky zealot]

remove the firerate cap on all the semi auto pistols, would be good

or at least add input buffer so that we don't 'choke' for tapping too fast

[cosmic mural]

Input queuing is better than removing the cap, without the cap people can use macros to fire them like a vector

[smoky zealot]

true

or they could make the firerate cap just a lil higher

no need for uncap, did not think about the macro lmao

[smoky zealot]

+1 on adding buffered inputs to semis. pistols, dmrs, everything with a semi selectfire option could all really use it

[last shell]

This and a couple more magazines?

[frozen ocean]

i think belts are intended to have different magazine amounts... it just hasn't been implemented yet

[tepid pawn]

only engineers iirc have different belts, and it takes away a sidearm mag for more gadget capacity

[frozen ocean]

yeah it just hasn't been fleshed out

[edgy furnace]

Glock is fine and so are the heavy pistols but most pistols arent super useful. I think a pistol should either offer a fast swap to encourage finishing off a target, or function as a secondary and much weaker primary as a supplementary

[meager wave]

Can switching between your pistol and primary gun be sped up? Maybe you can increase/decrease the weapon swapping by changing the waistbelt?

Also, can the USP overall stats be better? I feel like for being an unlocked gun at lvl 40, it's not any better than the Beretta M9 and the MP433.

[drowsy elbow]

I think damage and fire rate on the semiauto pistols is fine. An input buffer for more consistent semi-auto firing and a faster draw speed would make them fit very nicely into their intended role as a sidearm.

[terse flint]

Handguns are terrible even on cqc combat. Damage dropoff starts too soon! How about 5m like the Vector?

[graceful canyon]

Been trying to use pistols regardless of their underwhelming status. Love them thematically, but I don’t think they excel at what they seem to be trying to excel at.

Here are my ideas for routes to take:

• Buff swap speed.
• Buff run speed.
• Buff damage / armor damage.
• Buff M9 & USP. <-- [ This is sorta extra ]

SWAP SPEED:
• [ Pistols tend to be the ultimate panic gun, giving a quick swap would reinforce this. They already have low damage, so allowing the opportunity to fire some more bullets can help in that regard. ]

RUN SPEED:
• [ One of the reasons I like running MP 443 is the high movement speed, which is amazing for traversal. Buffing this stat beyond 1.10 could give these guns a much needed niche and help make up for their lower damage. ]

DAMAGE / ARMOR DAMAGE:
• [ I say armor damage since the biggest issue with pistols is their inability to kill armored foes in 5, maybe even 6 hits, which is very obvious when using them. A higher damage stat or added damage to armor could help alleviate this. ]

M9 & USP GENERAL BUFF (extra):
• [ In the pistol meta game, MP 443 absolutely dominates the other two options. M9 does better damage, but suffers from much lower fire rate, lower velocity, worse accuracy, and a slightly slower reload. USP is literally a worse version of MP 443: same damage, but slower firerate, less velocity, less accuracy, and slower reload. Both of these guns are worse than the already mid MP 443, so I would buff these options generally on top of a universal pistol buff.

I would give M9 better ranged stats to make it the best mid ranged pistol option that suffers in CQC. I would buff USP to also have better ranged capabilities and maybe a bit more damage, acting as a bridge between the MP 443 and M9. MP 443 could go untouched; high firerate and good reload gives it the best CQC potential. ]

[clever parcel]

Swapping to a secondary pistol should happen faster. As of right now there is barely any reason not to just reload your primary weapon instead. Also, the animation for swapping to secondary seemed to be bugged or non-existent (at least on the Desert Eagle). There is no transition to ADS, you press 2 and eventually the gun just appears in front of you in a single frame.

Pistols are right where they should be in terms of power. I don't feel anything needs a damage buff as they are secondary weapons and not meant to replace your primary as a lot of people seem to be suggesting by asking for buffs to damage. I think an increase to swap speed across the board would go a long way towards making gameplay feel better in general.

[frozen ocean]

semi autos are pretty trash

but otherwise agreed

actually i forgot about the rsh

that's trash too

[clever parcel]

@frozen ocean why do you say theyre trash?

[frozen ocean]

because they're eclipsed by revolvers and the deag

and rsh is just a bad unica

also semi autos in this game, not just the pistol, have really janky firerate chokes

[clever parcel]

So you're saying you want higher fire rates on semis? They're probably worried about macro users

i dont really feel like they're eclipsed theyre just better in different situations. the Heavy cal pistols are slower and stronger but don't leave much room for error. The smaller pistols are weaker but faster and have bigger mags

[smoky zealot]

The RSH should be something other than just a worse Unica. The M9, MP443, and USP are pretty underwhelming compared to the Glock and the Magnums. Perhaps increase the swap speed on those pistols only?

[regal zenith]

I would love to see a super shorty thats a secendary or a gadget that lets you blow holes into walls but only does damage very little damage. i think it could be useful as a utility and not a weapon. I know they said they would add shotguns but thus could be different

[frozen ocean]

perhaps, but right now, the firerate choke fucks over semis in general, not just pistols

and it's part of the reason why DMRs suck

[frozen ocean]

not a bad idea 🤔

though i still think all pistols need a buff to swap speed

[clever parcel]

@frozen ocean DMRs suck because of their absurd recoil and too many shots to kill but this aint the place for dmr talk lol

[green owl]

the reason is missing feature called action queuing, your inputs are sometimes ignored, instead of buffered. So if you click at 251 RPM for a weapon that shoots at 250 RPM, you'll miss a shot, and there will be delay, instead of it just shooting at 250 RPM

[frozen ocean]

they also suck because of what i just described

same issue with pistols

[frozen ocean]

yes, that

[clever parcel]

lets just agree that they suck

[frozen ocean]

it means oftentimes, you don't even hit the advertised firerate

makes the gun more ass than advertised

and it sucks to use

[green owl]

pretty much 100% of the time with semi auto it's impossible to get the advertised firerate without action queuing. You would have to click at EXACTLY 250 RPM, with zero deviation, something which is pretty much humanly impossible, especially in tense situations while aiming and taking fire

even with a macro it wouldn't be possible, since they aren't precise enough due to frame rate dips, varying ping, etc. Basically without action queuing it's impossible 🙂

[frozen ocean]

i believe it

semis feel so shit in this game

[clever parcel]

i mean it doesnt have to be exactly that just not faster than that but i totally get your frustration. Definitely something they need to work on

I click really slow so i havent noticed personally

[desert ivy]

Just want a .45 pistol

[forest ingot]

Funny how it takes so long for pistols to be drawn.

[proven narwhal]

Swapping to a pistol shouldn’t take so long. It needs to be noticing faster than reloading to be worth using.

[forest ingot]

Is it faster to switch to some SMGS than it is to pistols? It feels that way, but I don't have numbers to back it up.

[smoky zealot]

pistols have this weird ass delay where you cannot see the pistol physically being pulled out of your holster, you can see this 'delay' mostly on the deagle iirc

swap to pistol, can't see pistol until like 2 seconds later

speaking of the deagle, let the deagle one shot medium helmet armor up to like, 2 meters or so

[terse flint]

Deagle damage is crazy enough

But yes inputs have such a awful delay especially when you switch gun or throw a grenade

[molten river]

I noticed the deagle delay in animation to, especially when you go from drawing the gun directly to aiming

[hollow lagoon]

I don't think we need faster run speeds, the game already feels like a super super fast paced call of duty modern warfare with everybody running around at Mac 10 speeds, I say keep the pistol running speed and lower the primary running speed for everyone so the game feels a little bit more slower and the bit more tactical

[terse flint]

That is common to all sidearms

But the Deagle is the worst offender

Handguns need a general rebalance for the next big patch

It's absurd the USP is worst than the staarting pistol

But even then sidearms are very weak even at cqc range

[drowsy elbow]

They’re sidearms. They’re not supposed to be as strong as primary weapons.

[frozen ocean]

Aside from the deagle maybe, they aren't

But some of the pistols are very clearly lagging waaaay behind

[graceful canyon]

I like this idea.

[hollow lagoon]

Start with 10% movement reducement on primary. running and walking speed

That way there is more time to set up and move accurately. Right now people can blow a hole in the wall run there shoot through the hole in the wall and disappear in under 1 second

We don't have inertia and people can start running instantly so I think a primary run and walk speed reduction of 10 to 15% would be a good start, we can test this and see how it feels, because right now it feels way too fast paced arcady call of duty modern warfare 1 run speed

When modern warfare 2 came out and it had slower run and walk speed the game felt overall better and more tactical, the only people who did not like this where the people who like the Arcadia feel of modern warfare 1 where people run super fast and you need twitch reaction, but overall modern warfare 2 when it just came out felt much better and solid with the slower movement speed then the first game

[edgy furnace]

Some maps are pretty big and it already takes ages to run across

[hollow lagoon]

I wouldn't mind a stamina system as well so you can't run infinitely and need to choose when you run

Perhaps that will be my suggestion in another topic, but as far as this topic what's not go off track, instead of raising the run speed of secondary just lower the run speed and walk speed of the primaries by 10%.

[edgy furnace]

I think side arms should be balanced by swap speed and power. With fastest weapons being the weakest but you can pull it out in emergencies, then to a balance between speed and power where it may or may not be as fast or faster as a quick reload, and then a slower-than-reload but basically functions as a much weaker primary (like the damage the deagle has)

[hollow lagoon]

I agree. Up the damage on the M9 to balance out the slow fire rate, make the secondary swap speed faster like in battlefield bad company 2 and don't touch the run speed of the secondaries, just lower the run speed and walk speed when holding a primary

[graceful canyon]

I like the concept of slowing things down to nail that tactical feel, but two things I immediately worry about the slow traversal and Exo Armor hell.

Game already has a walk problem for newer players. They get into a fight, kill like one guy, die, no squadmates no objectives are open, then they walk for a couple of minutes then repeat the process. Faster run makes this a bit more bareble, but being slower could hurt this.

However, I've played Support for the most part during my initial purchase, and I didn't want to drown myself even with the slowest class in the game, so maybe the universal 10%-15% run speed nerf will be good. I'd take it if I were a dev (I'd also add MG3 right now I like MG3 please add MG3).

My only real gripe is the Exo speed, which would be absolutely unbelievably slow with the universal mobility nerf. My ideas on this would either be to speed up Exo armors in general or provide a movement buff once your Exo armor breaks.

I like the speed buff on armor break idea but it'd probably be limited to either Heavy and under or Medium and under. Light armor has to stay away, we can't be even faster with that.

Maybe even a specific change like Light and Ranger specifically do not get the speed buff, which would make the Med vs Ranger armor fight a little more interesting. Imo, Ranger absolutely slaughters Med armor, have no reason to use Med.

[mellow warren]

Swapping too the pistol should be much faster, but swapping away can stay the same speed This would give you a meaningful choice, making mid-fire fight reloading a risk VS reward option, as the pistol would be the safer bet to finish off a weakened opponent but generally won't have enough stopping power if you get into another fight right away.

[dry oxide]

The Deagle being a one shot kills feels super weird to me as a side arm, imo secondaries should not be capable of that.

[cold sentinel]

Only as a head shot

[dry oxide]

Sure, but that still feels super out of place. Having handguns with lower TTK than primaries feels inherently incorrect

It doesn't even make sense in a vacuum of just secondaries as the Dessert Eagle isn't even the most powerful handgun in the game but somehow it is the gun that can one shot.

[jade tartan]

it only 1 hit headshots on no helmet

[cold sentinel]

or a face shot

[frozen ocean]

it's fine, it's basically a second primary

if you want a good secondary, the deagle honestly isn't that great

if you want another primary, then the deagle is your dude

for its alpha damage, it's surprisingly balanced

[dry oxide]

I mean I don't think it makes sense to exist as a secondary the way it does, and it doesn't make sense compared to the other weapons in its class

Lowest recoil, highest damage heavy pistol is very strange

[frozen ocean]

have you seen the recoil on it lol

[dry oxide]

I have, and it is lower than the Unica and MUCH lower than the RSH

[frozen ocean]

it's very difficult to actually hit its theoretical rate of fire

because of how long it takes for the sight to get re-aligned

unica is much better for follow-up shots

hipfiring the deagle is a crapshoot too

[dry oxide]

by number Deagle has much lower recoil than the unica. And it isn't even close really ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[frozen ocean]

because the numbers don't tell you visual recoil

[dry oxide]

3.5H, 6V, 1FS vs 4H, 6V, 1.5FS

[frozen ocean]

so looking at the numbers in this case isn't helpful, in the slightest

with most guns, i'd agree with you

but deagle is a bit of a snowflake

[dry oxide]

I'd have to do a side by side, but regardless I still don't think it makes sense. It feels like it is just a meme carryover from counterstrike and the mythical Deagle rather a reflection of the gun or a healthy pistol role in this game

[frozen ocean]

it's a meme, but it's not overpowered, and it's not shit

so i think it's a good addition to the game as-is

whereas something like the rsh is a meme

[dry oxide]

But it should be pretty shit as should all handguns. As rule they should be notably worse than primaries

[frozen ocean]

but not in the good sense of the word

[frozen ocean]

i mean unless you're a god at aiming

if you come across a full health target

you'll be better off with a primary in nearly all circumstances

[dry oxide]

RSH isn't even a meme it is just bad and poorly stated for no reason, if any of the handguns that should have been capable of 1 hitting it should have been it

[frozen ocean]

rather than running a deag

[forest ingot]

I heard the Deagle is actually pretty shit irl, but I'm not a gun guy.

[subtle cloud]

I think the basic pistols should be buffed overall. I also think that there should be another category of pistols. In fact I’ll quote someone who’s already put it succinctly.

#1119772603645702276 message

Let me give credit where it’s due.

[subtle cloud]

Some of the things that were discussed were adding new pistols such as the 1911 and putting it in a medium pistol category along with the USP. Maybe the medium pistols should kill in mostly 3 shots (or 4) with ttk on an unarmoured enemy at ~.7 seconds

[subtle cloud]

Idea with the medium pistols (if added) make them good clean up guns like say you shoot someone once with the m4 and hit them twice with a usp dealing say 35 damage per shot then you can use the handguns to clean up the kill with two shots against an unarmoured target. Then they'd die in 3 shots normally but if you run out with your primary in cqc you can swap to clean up kills easier. If the 1911 was added maybe give it 38 or 40 damage per shot but fewer rounds say, 8+1 . This means if you shot someone twice with the ak74 you could clean up the kill in 1 shot from the 1911 giving it a niche different than the USP. Give the USP a slighty faster rof but worse recoil compared to the 1911. Also now the 1911 is more likely to kill armoured targets in 4 shots whereas the usp will maybe take 5.

[ember pawn]

actually RSH15 is worst than Unica in every possible ways. increase its range at least to +100m so the x8 scope would make sense

[thin wren]

Add full auto pistols
-CZ Auto, 93R Barretta, C96 Mauser, MAC-10, Skorpion, ASTRA A-60, HK45

Revolver
-Python, Anaconda, REX, Raging Bull, S&W M500

[smoky zealot]

93R Beretta
Raffica is only burst, 3 round burst

C96 Mauser
it's a semi-auto pistol, the full auto one is designated M1932/M712 Schenellfeuer

ASTRA A-60
also semi-auto

HK45
also semi-auto

• python and anaconda is basically the same thing

[jade tartan]

pretty sure the m93r barretta is coming no?

[vagrant belfry]

Yes as the same model as the one in BF3 / BF4 so a mocked up 92FS

[dry oxide]

Just give 1911

[wide panther]

Maybe have a fan-fire mode or attachment for the Unica? Massive firerate upgrade with massive accuracy downgrade

[dry oxide]

O.o fanning a double action revolver is just silly

Actually even more silly, the Unica is a semi-automatic revolver so literally not possible to fan it

[smoky zealot]

maybe wild west era revolvers lmao, not a modern double action

[dry oxide]

You could technically fan the RSH, but you would almost certainly fire faster just pulling the trigger through the double action

[drifting adder]

idk if anyone has added this before but why does the rsh do less damage than the deagle despite firing a far larger cartridge
also doesnt it only have 3 rounds?
also also when are we getting pistol bipods for true revolver sniping

[frozen ocean]

because balans is wack

damage only seems extremely vaguely related to the gun's stopping power IRL

[cosmic mural]

Yeah, that bothers me sometimes. I get not trying to make everything realistic because of balance, but if you're gonna have a big heavy pistol that hits hard you're not gonna choose an M9 for that and then make the Deagle the peashooter. At least make it consistent and then tone it up or down for balance.
I was complaining about the same thing on the UMP-45 feedback. Not only is it a worse PP19 at the same niche it is somehow the one SMG they choose to be a laser with low damage, why???

[spring minnow]

Make RSH-12 great again. Why does a gun from such high rank have to be so shit that it gets dogged by not only desert Eagle but even the Unica. Make it have more damage as it has 5 shots only And it has crazy recoil already. Make the reload faster cause it cant have only one good feature, maybe some more control And pulling out time Faster?

[subtle cloud]

we don't need the hk 45 since the usp in game is the 45 acp version (from mag size).

[subtle cloud]

The SAA

The colt single action army

I still think there should be another category of handguns that are medium pistols that are less forgiving than the standard semi auto pistols but offer better time to kill against lightly armored targets.

[dry oxide]

Not sure that needs to be a category, just put them in pistols

like we have multiple types of AR in the AR class

[subtle cloud]

That's fine honestly

Like e.g.
M1911, (or one of the many versions of the 1911 like the TACOPS)
Damage: ~40 (this lets you one tap people you shot twice with most assault rifles provided they aren't wearing armor)
L Armour damage: 1-2
ROF: ~300 rpm
ADS: .08
Mag: 8+1 (yes most full size 1911s nowadays have 8 round mags or can take 8 round mags)
less recoil than the scar more recoil than the current USP.

Another example:
Change the Hk USP .45ACP to
Damage: 38 (this lets you double tap someone who you hit with one round out of I think all or almost all assault rifles provided they aren't wearing armor)
L armour: 1
ROF: ~310 rpm
ADS: .1
Mag: same 12+1
More recoil than the M1911 to represent the fact that it's half polymer and to compensate for the extra magazine size and ROF

@dry oxide how do you think that looks?

[forest ingot]

Like seriously, why does the UMP45 does less damage than the MP5? UMP45 uses a .45 caliber round vs 9mm of the MP5, which is powerful. Yet the MP5 around does more damage than some rifles that uses 5.56 nato rounds.

[frozen ocean]

reasons

[thin wren]

I want Scopion MP9, UZI, HK45, Tec-9, CZ Auto, C96 Mauser, 93R Barretta
also Raging Bull revolver

[high sand]

Desert Easgle drawing animation is bugged.
So far I've found no reason to use Pistols other than DE and Maxed Out Glock (ext mag /w pistol supressor).

[forest ingot]

Slowly getting kills with the glock, but man is it a pea shooter vs armor, but rightfully so.

[frozen ocean]

it's a pea shooter against anything tbh

but rpm makes up for it

[cinder wagon]

I feel like the low damage on the pistols is fine. What i think is an issue is how slow the weapon swap to pistol is, its simply too slow to be really useful

[vagrant belfry]

Make the MP443 USP and M9 draw way faster than the rest and maybe they will be more popular

[jade tartan]

make all pistol draw faster

[tepid pawn]

I think the automatic and high calibre drawing at this speed is fine, they have a thing whether it's fully automatic or high damage. Regular pistols don't have that though

[jade tartan]

regular pistol kills better than automatic i can assure you that

[tepid pawn]

They have better ammo conservation, but you can drill one person with a glock faster than you can with an MP443

[jade tartan]

yeah but you can kill efficiently with a regular pistol doesnt matter tbh your gonna reload on a glock while regular pistol can still kill more people with its mag

doesnt matter all pistol should still have switching speed

[tepid pawn]

If you want to be efficient with ammo then you shouldn't be using a pistol imo, they're backups.
Glock sets itself apart by having extreme ease of use, being fully automatic and very fast. High calibre sets itself apart with raw damage. Semi-autos by comparison don't have that. Sure, maybe all pistols can draw faster but semis should draw even faster since they don't have anything else going for them

[jade tartan]

they are backups yeah exactly doesnt matter if they are efficient or not

should still switch faster

to pistol of any kind

[tepid pawn]

Ok, so all pistols draw faster, but semis draw even faster then?

[jade tartan]

semis dont even draw faster tho

lmao

they ahve the same draw speed

[tepid pawn]

But they should is what yori means

And I agree with them

[jade tartan]

why tho does it matter if they are semi or not?

when the damage balancing is there

the balancing on pistol is actually good

for people who cant click fast glock is for you

for people who can semis is there for you

low damage high RoF vs High damage with ok RoF

[tepid pawn]

Because the semi auto pistols just kinda suck

[jade tartan]

no they dont

lmao

pistol only suck cuz you can do that quick reload faster than switching to it on most gun

[vagrant belfry]

Idk about the Glock I didn't play it that much but the Deagle should stay like it is. It has a huge kill potential

Was already able to kill 3 people with one mag before reloading and killing some more when I emptied my main

Imo there is a big gap between the Deagle and the M9

[flat mesa]

My Feedback:

1. No issues with the draw speed of pistols, usually have plenty of time to pull.
2. Lacking Use- Semi pistols all feel the same way and lack use. Find it that the times I try to pull out the pistol it just ends up not making a difference. Like someone stated above it is almost easier to just reload the primary than swap to the pistol. Ex. Sniping there is better chance of killing individual with 2 quick shots than pull pistol and have to compete with helmet and body armor.
3. Variety- I know someone stated before about redefining the semis which I can agree with. I have no issues with using a semi pistols but currently they all feel the same way. (Glock and the Desert Eagle are the select few that I have used that fill those gaps)
4. OverallAdd some more variety between the secondaries and allow maybe some more attachments. (Currently there is like maybe less than 10 total) Fix action queing and fire rate cap potentially.

[green owl]

kill effeciency is not a very important stat on the pistol; if you are worried about that you are misplaying a ton to begin with. Pistol is usually going to be 1, 2 kills at max.

unica, glock, and deagle are the only good pistols in the game atm. The others suffer dramatically because of poor stats + lack of action queueing. Faster draw speed would be great on them, though action queuing is the most important at this time

[dry oxide]

MP443 doesn't really need action queuing due to the high rate of fire so it is usable at least, M9 and USP are trash though due to lack of it

[frozen ocean]

they're all trash tbh

[tepid pawn]

The mp443 is the only semi-auto pistol without the need for action queueing

[frozen ocean]

and even then, the firerate still stutters

idk if it needs action queueing, but it'd still benefit from it

[tepid pawn]

Oh yeah, it definitely can

It's just not actually garbage without it unlike the M9 or the USP

Still really annoying though

[frozen ocean]

yeh

[cinder wagon]

In every other shooting switching to your pistol is extremely fast.
Pistols don’t need to be strong, thats not the point, they need to be FAST to switch to, otherwise its never worth switching, and its better to just reload

Any gun im running its usually better to just reload than to switch to my pistol.
It really shouldnt be this way, it makes me feel like i dont have a secondary at all, because its just so useless

[subtle cloud]

I'd argue we don't need a hk45 since the USP in game is the .45 version based on mag capacity. Also the two guns look too similar. Now maybe adding the HKP30L would be cool because it's john wick's gun.

[subtle cloud]

I agree but I think they should be fast at cleaning up kills, after the target has taken a shot or two from something else . Also have multiple pistols for different damage thresholds/weapons.

[sinful osprey]

Would like to see swap speed slightly increased for the pistol (as in the semi pistols, M9, USP, and the last one I cant remember the name of), to give them a better niche.

[graceful canyon]

What if Pistols moved faster in ADS? Maybe get some better strafing, see how that goes.

Just randomly had this idea.

[jolly cypress]

It would be nice to see lighter loads/higher running speeds translating better into higher strafe speeds.

[woven flame]

Make the switch to pistols a lot faster and have more mags. Weapons changes are generally too slow as the rest of the game is fast.

[austere depot]

Shouldn't have to bind fire to scroll wheel to be able to use my secondary. Either buffer input or let them fire full auto

[agile compass]

does the deagle take much longer to take out today? it was bad, but I feel like it's even worse now

[graceful canyon]

I've found this issue as well. When this happens to me, it looks like I draw the Deagle out, but it remains invisible for a bit before appearing and becoming usable.

Pretty sure this is a bug, but it does make Deagle pretty bad for emergency switching.

[agile compass]

Yup, it remains invisible for a while, when you fire before it becomes visible it just pops out of nowhere.

[knotty flare]

Magazine mod for pistols yay or nay?

[frozen ocean]

i don't see why not, glock already gets one too

[jade tartan]

yeah give that glock the drum mag

[pale wedge]

quick mags would be a really nice reward for sticking with a particular pistol for an extended period of time

im holding out for cylinder mods too, that'd be neat

[weak tusk]

Has anyone thought about Carbine Conversion Kits for the Automatic Pistols?(M9, 443, USP, and G18) I'm asking because I was playing Recon and fighting with my Pistol , either the 443 Grach or G18, I'm getting steam rolled by every other Primary Weapon. If the Recon Class could get, after say 300(or more) kills with the Auto Pistols, the option of a CCK. It wouldn't be a straight buff, for example you could lose the quick draw and hip fire capabilities but get a soft stat bonus to flinch reduction, V&H recoil, range, and use of mid range optics.

[subtle cloud]

I mean one exists irl...

[jade tartan]

i know]

i mean if they want they can add that full auto deagle

[subtle cloud]

Maybe not...

[jade tartan]

why not?

i mean that would be fun imagine your crosshair flying everywhere

[lone lion]

this isnt super important but i think lowering kill requirements for pistol camos would be nice, having it be the same as primary weapons doesnt make much sense to me

[cinder wagon]

Very true

Youll be hardpressed to get 1500 kills with a pistol

[lone lion]

3000 for the prestige 3 skins :)

[green owl]

I just hit 3rd prestige, once I get the deagle again I'm going for that hot pink

[lone lion]

good luck soldier

[green owl]

can't be too bad, I had like a good 750 kills with it last prestige without trying for it at all. And now kills don't reset anymore 😄

[lone lion]

thats true, especially with the deagle, tis quite fun to use, hopefully i can get a decent skin for it before i prestige again and lose it but im not gonna focus it yet

[worthy quartz]

Allow me to join the quick swap handgun party. They need to do what planetside did and make pistols an actual backup weapon that you can whip out in a hurry

[tepid pawn]

The camera fuckery is a bigger problem for making it a backup imo, please also make it so that taking out my pistol doesn't make me stare at the sun.

[cinder wagon]

Why deagle tho? Doesnt the decreased walk speed bug you

[green owl]

Not enough for me to give up those sweet, sweet 1 taps.

I do wish the deagle didn't have reduced movespeed, though.

imo it's just the most reliable sidearm and can turn a decent clip into a great clip

[cinder wagon]

One tap bodyshots, or headshots? Because doesnt the unica also one tap headshot?

[green owl]

headshots; and the unica does not 1 tap headshots. Deagle is the only pistol capable of that

[frozen ocean]

deagle's a lot of fun, but yeah the movement speed is rough

i prefer the unica now

unless i'm planning to use the deagle as a primay

[cinder wagon]

Yeah unica has been working for me to finish off people, ill give the deagle a shot when im running a fast gun like mp7

[green owl]

not sure what it is about the unica, but it feels very unreliable for me; I'll aim dead center mass of a target that isn't moving and somehow not hit. Not sure if it's accuracy is low or what but I've had more luck with virtually every other pistol

[frozen ocean]

maybe an animation issue, though tbh, i've experienced that more with the deagle than the unica

deagle takes a while to get sights centered

[cinder wagon]

It hits but it only hits the armor. Ive watched clips where i felt like i landed my shot but nothing happened, what happened was that the armor just absorbed the bullet

[desert scarab]

The two starting pistols just don't feel strong enough to use as a panic option. At best the M9 is "serviceable" but I feel like there needs to be a slight buff to Handguns in general.

[frozen ocean]

m9 possibly the worst gun in the game tbh

[desert scarab]

It feels better than the other starting pistol 🤣

[frozen ocean]

you only start with the m9 iirc 🤔

and you unlock the mp443 if that's the one you're talking about

[desert scarab]

You unlock it? Both say Rank 0

[frozen ocean]

oh hmm nvm then

mp443 is technically the better pistol

it technically has the best ttk of the semi-auto pistols

but the semi auto mechanics in this game screw it and all other semi autos in the game

it's better than the m9 still though imo

[worthy quartz]

Worst handgun is probably the USP. It has worse stats than the MP in every possible way.

[frozen ocean]

actually yeah you might be right

USP might just be the worst gun in the game

i actually forgot that it exists

[pale wedge]

USP is just worse MP443, but like, it's still serviceable, because the MP443 is really good if you can mash M1

meanwhile M9 is kinda just straight up garbage. only 5 more damage means it's still 4 bodyshots to kill, same as MP443, but it also fires really fucking slowly

technically it can kill in 3 headshots but like, that's a reach and a half, especially considering helmets exist

[worthy quartz]

I just want something chambered in .45 that hits a nice middle ground between the heavy pistols and the mp and m9

And no, the UMP does not scratch that itch

[latent dawn]

I just want the 93R raffica added to the pool of options already 😭

[drowsy elbow]

93 raffica raffica

[shy fossil]

The Rsh12 feels really weak at 60 damage for what it is. Compared to the Deagle at 90. Just seems wrong considering its a 5 shot heavy revolver with a larger cartridge than .50 AE.

[worthy quartz]

Yeah, it should have the deagles 90 damage, the deagle should go down 5-10 damage, and the rsh should get the pickaxes structure damage.

[shy fossil]

Ha, idk about that last bit. Would be interesting though...

[pseudo willow]

Honestly the thing that kills me is the Headshot Multiplier for Pistols being a flat 1.2x multiplier. We could deal with a complete change for all Headshot Multipliers to reflect the different weapon classes. I would love to see the Pistols change headshot multiplier based on class with 1.2x/1.5x/2.0 being for Automatic Pistols/Pistols/Heavy Pistols. Pistols could also deal with a revamp to damages and fire rates as well damage drop off.

And is it just me or does it feel like the M9 does not reflect the ROF listed, it feels like they have a spam cap on it to prevent people from spam clicking with it, does not feel like 400 rpm

[pseudo willow]

Having a 2x multiplier for headshots would solve Heavy Pistols instantly

[frozen ocean]

lack of input queue

so you have to click at exactly the right speed to get the advertised firerate

[pseudo willow]

It's stupid to have it on the pistols honestly, could deal with that being removed

[frozen ocean]

it's on all semi auto guns

and it's a feature that needs to be added

DMRs get cucked too

[pseudo willow]

DMR makes sense, but pistols are completely different, causes more problems then anything with balancing them to even have a chance in a fire fight

Remove it and re-balance the stats for the pistols entirely, hs multiplier being the biggest change needed

[green owl]

... I don't think you're understanding the topic

[pseudo willow]

Is this not a topic for general feedback on Pistols?

[green owl]

it's not a feature that exists and needs to be removed

action queuing is something that isn't implemented and needs to be implemented still. The weird feeling is a result of a missing feature; not something that was intentionally done. It affects everything in the game, not just shooting.

also called input queuing; if that makes more sense. Right now, your inputs aren't queued, so if you press LMB twice, the second shot will be ignored instead of the gun shooting at it's max fire rate, instead

It won't be until you press it a third time that the gun shoots, but now you've only shot twice for 3 clicks and at a much slower fire rate than the gun is supposed to shoot at

[pseudo willow]

Honestly you can setup a macro and use something like the MP443 or G18 in semi auto to make it full auto with a 1 millisecond click rate. Does not affect those guns as much as it affects M9 and USP, basically its being affected more for the underperforming pistols then the meta.

[green owl]

That's because their fire rate is high enough so it's very hard to click fast enough to get the input ignored. If you were capable of clicking that fast, you would notice the exact same thing

The M9 fire rate is really low so it's very easy to see because it's easy to click faster than it's fire rate

[pseudo willow]

But at that, it should have consistent input loss between certain shots, it's randomized more so than it should.

[green owl]

it should not have ANY input loss

inputs should never be ignored. But for that, we need action queueing(also known as input queuing) implemented by Oki

[pseudo willow]

As you put "action queueing" can be referred to as input loss

Let's just agree to disagree, pistols are in a bad state and should be more of a priority

[green owl]

no, action queuing prevents input loss. Input loss occurs because action queuing is not implemented.

we aren't even disagreeing, you are literally just not understanding the topic.

I tried I'm out.

[tepid pawn]

So to simplify this, let's say you have a semi-auto gun that is 60 RPM. It takes 1 second for the next bullet to be shot, right?
Without action queueing, if you click at like 0.9 seconds, you are too early and that input gets dropped. The next click you make, maybe at 1.8 seconds, will be valid though, but you lost 0.8 seconds of your RoF.
With action queueing, the game says "ok, so you clicked a bit early, but we can hold onto this and if the gun's ready soon then we'll just say it's even and use it for that." So you click at 0.9 seconds, it holds onto that click, and when it goes to 1 second, it says "ah, we still have that input" and pretends you clicked the moment the gun was ready.

This also allows semi-auto weapons to have lower RoF without feeling like they keep jamming or something like they currently do

[pseudo willow]

Wow perfectly explained thank you

[thorn jetty]

can we have the rsh12 do a little more damage. its quite useless and it would be nice to have a good ranged revolver for some fun. the 8x is a pointless attatchment if you cant use it to 1 shot headshot

[winged ocean]

Rsh12 should be a revolver version of the deagle, not a copy of the unica

[coral sapphire]

Higher headshot multipliers across the board would be funny I think

handguns are aggressively eh
you can absolutely get funny kills, but the RMR sight is absolutely an upgrade beyond belief

[spice flicker]

what actually puzzles me about rsh12 is the fact that it's straight up worse than deagle, has weird 8x sight and some literally mad recoil (feel like I'm shooting out of a cannon)
so yeah, definitely would like to see more love to it and pistols in general
from my quite noobish perspective they require some vey good aim or circumstances to have a chance in fight

[frozen ocean]

It's just bad and sad rn

[frozen ocean]

Wow

Deagle got FUCKED

It's one of the few pistols that was fine

And now they fucking butchered it

OK nvm looks like they're giving it a 1.5x hs mult

[spice flicker]

still tho -21 damach and bunch of other nerfs

not sure it's a good change

[jade tartan]

i think its fine it rewards headshots which are hard to do

for most people

[spice flicker]

they are

[jade tartan]

faster swapping still not found

nvm its there

but idk how fast is 2 draw speed LUL

[pale wedge]

unica should not have gotten hit with a running speed nerf, especially when the glock still lets you move at full speed
asides from that, M9 seems like it will remain trash, but MP443 and USP buffs are much appreciated

[spice flicker]

tho as for hs, pistols feel to me as point-blank range weapons (most likely you won't shoot with deagle at someone 100 meters away)
and at point-blank it's either or and hard to land hs unless you have ball and nerves of stell, good aim etc
but I can be wrong obviosuly
just speaking from my experience

[jade tartan]

m9 remains trash?

how did that buff make it trash

more damge? buffed rate of fire?

[pale wedge]

+2 damage doesn't break any thresholds, firerate is still lower than MP443 or USP, and the mag size is still lower than either

[jade tartan]

lul sure

[pale wedge]

not sure why you're getting so worked up over that

[jade tartan]

im not just find it funny

[pale wedge]

M9 was by far the worst pistol in the game and it'll continue to be that

are you really going to take 32 dmg, 600 firerate, 13 mag size over 30 dmg, 650 firerate, 15 mag size?

[jade tartan]

yeah why not

[pale wedge]

then you're just mathematically challenged, and that's fine

[jade tartan]

takes the weakest pistol that got buffed and made it more useful than ever him: you are dumb

aight

the buffed doesnt make it trash mate. sure its the weakest but the buff literally make it more usefull than it was before and pistol can now be more of a preference now than just m443 or deagle or unica or glock

why did he just leave?

or got banned lmao

[pale wedge]

?

[jade tartan]

nothing discord bugging

for some wierd reason

[green owl]

overall good changes TBH even if deagle got slightly nerfed I think the change is acceptable and won't take away it's specialty/niche

only thing I'd like is for deagle to now be put to 1.1 movespeed like all other pistols

[worthy quartz]

I know it doesn't hit any breakpoints, but the glock getting buffed worries me a little

[robust jetty]

It got nerf to nearly double the draw time

Mean swap Glock now even slower

[worthy quartz]

No, draw speed works in a wierd reverse way. The higher the number, the faster you draw

So the standard handguns draw lightning quick, and everything else is faster too

[high sand]

Does the mag size increase on Glock affect the extended mag as well ?

[winged ocean]

USP still a worse MP443

Why 650 ROF when you can have 750

Less fire rate, less velocity, more recoil now, less ammo, for 3 more damage, which by the way still need 4 shots to kill someone regardless

[crude dome]

They should at least give it a higher RoF now. It's a semiauto, you're supposed to fire as fast as you can pull the trigger, just need to have good recoil control.

[spice flicker]

good point imo

[modest sundial]

what we think of new balance update

[austere depot]

I think there's like 1/20th of the people around to experience it because all these updates are too little too late. Should have prioritized balancing and stability in that first month instead of game modes nobody plays

Now 19 out of 20 players have moved on and they'll struggle to convince any to return

[green owl]

first month oki was dealing almost exclusively with keeping the game stable because they were getting ddos 24/7

he did a ton of backend changes that weren't visible to us gameplay wise but otherwise kept the game playable through those attacks

[modest sundial]

real ones didn't abbonden Battlebit after the initial hype died

[crude dome]

I don't think it'll be too hard, as long as you give people what they were actually expecting: silly fun times attempting teamwork with randoms. That is not what you get when you couple low TTK with high mobility.

Show some vids of people having a proper good time during an extended firefight instead of sweats jumping around and racking up dozens of kills, and you'll see the pop flourish again.

[vernal hollow]

Let us throw pistols when they're out of ammo. Let this kill people.

[inland latch]

End them rightly

[coral sapphire]

under ideal scenarios it doesn't but there is potential
not everyone is at perfect health all the time
as well, what's the limb multiplier?

[frozen ocean]

limb multiplier? 1x

[rocky umbra]

I want people’s opinions real quick cause I think a lot of people would agree: Deagle did not need the damage nerf that it got, and should have the 7 bullets it’s meant to have. Pin this message as a response. I want the devs to see this and show how the community feels about this pistol change.

I think this is the primary reason there are so many thumbs down on the new pistol changes

[spice flicker]

Should be good if deagle had 7 bullets. Also I'm not sure that the nerfs were warranted if the only purpose was to make it weaker than rsh12.
Also this is probably a very personal thing but deagle does feel like a heavy&deadly pistol
Rsh12, on the other hand, has a felling of some light pew-pew, which is a bit weird, imo.

[crude dome]

It did not need it, but I also felt it felt a bit sluggish as a semiauto pistol. I think giving it a higher RoF and recoil so it's the "high DPS hard to control" option would keep it strong and be more in line with the way it behaves irl.

[rocky umbra]

True, like a heavier hitting but higher recoil unica while the Rsh does that single shot heavy damage gameplay.

[rocky umbra]

Deagle having 6 bullets is just weird to me especially considering the lowest magazine capacity it has irl is 7 for the 50ae. Yeah it’s not irl but would it really be so bad to add one more round?

[pale wedge]

if you're running around and you're not at full health, you're playing the game suboptimally. medics can heal themselves to full for free, and assault/support have ways of refilling their own bandages

[pale wedge]

i think it deserved to be nerfed. 90 damage was ridiculous, but lowering it to 69 might've been a bit too harsh

more than anything im upset about the unica running speed nerf. it was my go to sidearm. now ill just go back to using either the glock or MP443/USP

[vernal hollow]

I think a lot of you didn't entirely read the patch notes. It did get a big nerf, but not to damage necessarily because of the headshot damage increase it basically still does the same damage to the head (I believe it's 2 lower now). I think the rest of the nerfs were weird, but the damage is fine probably

So it should be able to still 1 tap. It just won't kill to the body as easy. The RSH is basically what the old deagle was now.

If the unica has the headshot multiplier too it'll also 1 tap to the head up close I believe? Didn't do the math on that one

I'm very excited for all the other pistols to actually be useable. I think people are over stating how good the glock will be. You can't whip it out as fast, it doesn't do as much damage now as the other pistols. All the other pistols have a higher rof than they used to as well.

19 compared to 30 damage is a big difference, but we'll have to see how it plays out in game

[pale wedge]

56 x 1.5 = 84. good try though, math is hard

the damage nerf was also kinda unnecessary because it wouldn't have been able to 1 tap headshot with 60 base damage either

[pale wedge]

it still has an insane TTK, and doesn't suffer from a lack of action queuing. it was one of the strongest sidearms by far, only beaten out by the deagle. but with deagle getting butchered and unica getting nerfed for no real reason, glock is 100% going to reign supreme, especially with the buffs across the board

[vernal hollow]

I think the other pistols will also still be pretty good. Depends on how effective at range each is

[dry oxide]

Why make the RSH just worse in every way compared to the Deagle still... Literally no advantage

[drowsy hamlet]

To me they just seem the same, I would just lower or remove Deagles light armour damage, Meaning RSH has the side use of a vehicle finisher for people specing into a Anti vehicle role OR want something to scratch back with when using other gadgets

[dry oxide]

They look mostly the same but with the Deagle getting 7 rounds and slighty more damage and the RSH getting 5

which is silly because if any of them should hit harder it should be the RSH

[drowsy hamlet]

Just doesn't feel right/ worth it though, Adding damage just seems strange to me with both already being two hit kills and adding more just either being wasted or having to be bumped to be a slightly nerfed old deagle

[worthy quartz]

Balancing alone dictates the RSH should get more damage than the Deagle

[dry oxide]

more damage means more/better armor break points

even if it still is a 2 shot

[coral sapphire]

Yesn't.

[drowsy hamlet]

Then it's becoming a secondary primary, Rather than a emergency use as the other pistols trend towards

[dry oxide]

I mean both it and the Deagle already and they are not looking to change that

we work with what we can

[coral sapphire]

I would very much like a universally boosted headshot multiplier of at least 2x, and the RSH could very well do with additional light vehicle damage, while the DE44 has reduced vehicle damage in exchange for its improved clipsize.
I really don't like the idea of straight boosting the damage.

[drowsy hamlet]

The nerf to deagles damage from 90 to 70 makes me disagree

[dry oxide]

I mean it still 1 taps

which means it is still a secondary primary

[drowsy hamlet]

If you get the head, Alot harder to do when someones already atop you with a automatic

[dry oxide]

Which is the same status quo as before

[drowsy hamlet]

disagree, I'm alot less likely to blow some poor sods chest out as he took 10 chip damage from a fall

[dry oxide]

it is a small nerf, but I'd argue it still is a secondary primary in design as it is a secondary with faster TTK potential than a primary ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[worthy quartz]

At what point is the vehicle damage going to matter

Who looks at a humvee and goes "hmm, I should whip out my pistol for this one"

[dry oxide]

Honestly the vehicle damage stat on all guns makes no sense

[drowsy hamlet]

With harder use and more likely to get conned by someone using a primary (ala less ammo)

[drowsy hamlet]

I see use in catching a fleeing vic running to spawn on a repair trip or Pure "I wanna be a prick before I get plastered by a autocannon" when using gadgets other than C4

[dry oxide]

In general I'd much rather vehicles just get a damage modiifer and take damage based on the guns normal damage instead of seperate vehicle stats. Just is WAY more intuative than what we have now where guns like the Aug randomly shred vehicles

[coral sapphire]

Jack the vehicle damage up real high, give the thing a gimmick.

Yes, rifle ammunition should be better at zapping vehicles, but... shrug
it's a game and people really don't like the truth that the RSH is an impractical meme if anywhere close to true to life, so...

[dry oxide]

I mean so is the Deagle to be fair

They're guns that mostly exist because "why not" not because there is a practical use for them

[worthy quartz]

I say give the Rsh the ability to overpen walls, light armor vehicles, and people. Solidifies it as a meme gun, still makes it something fun/viable to use

We all know the real way you take out anything lightly armored is by nailing the driver

[coral sapphire]

We could, actually, give it a little of this.
Ignore passenger damage reduction?

[worthy quartz]

I was thinking basically let the bullet penetrate one object. Gunvee giving you trouble? Aim at the gunners seat and aim well. Little bird? Headshot that pilot with your massive revolver with a scope attached.

I just want to be able to wallbang people with a lucky shot once or twice

[modest sundial]

atleast we know that the devs are actually looking at feedback before they publish balance changes

[worthy quartz]

True

Looks like this most recent change might get looked at again

The amount of "why?" emotes is kinda funny

[drowsy hamlet]

I think those where in response to the Unica change, I initally thought they decreased its damage due to wording and how other pistols got damage buffs

[worthy quartz]

I do like the running speed going back up

[cosmic mural]

Okay so now they just went back to the Deagle being objectively better than the Rsh12?
It deals 2 less damage (misses the breakpoint on one armor)
Has about the same stats in fire rate, recoil and velocity.
BUT
2 less bullets and much worse reload speed.
Why?

[glad raven]

cuz the rsh sounds to sic, objektive af ik

[green owl]

Deagle and rsh move speed increased! Sick. Both still 1hko on helmetless headshot, though not sure why rsh does less dmg than deagle

[glad raven]

that is the dumbest thing i've ever seen, i wanted to use that thing without thinking "yeah the deagle'd be better now" ._.

[cosmic mural]

Same

Maybe extra range on it would be nice

[pale wedge]

RSH and deagle definitely need their damage switched around. RSH has less bullets, it only makes sense for it to deal more damage. either that, or it should have the full running speed

[drowsy elbow]

Nah the rsh sucks, they should make it worse

[rocky umbra]

I like the ammo change to the Deagle but kinda weird the rsh got nerfed. It’s got insane recoil so I don’t think it would be hated if it would at least one shot head on non-exo helmet with more armor damage than the Deagle.

That way people could decide between a sidearm that will one shot head on almost every target, or one shot head on everyone without a helmet. I would say maybe even kill an exo with the rsh-12 and a well placed headshot but I know the support players might be against being one tapped with any gun, no matter how difficult it is to control. I’m interested in seeing how people will respond to this.

[glad raven]

yes please, if you already got that aim on me the gimme dat big long boolet

[vernal hollow]

Lmao to the reverted pistol changes

[twilit lintel]

12.7x55mm, 5v5h recoil, 5 round load on a 4.11 sec reload revolver do less damage than the 12.7x33, 6v4h recoil, 7 round mag with a 2.77 sec reload deag?

why use the rsh? they have the same L damage, is the 50 extra velocity worth an extra second reload, smaller load, lower damage and higher recoil? no lol

[vernal hollow]

I think the RSH should fire stupid slow, but be able to one tap to the head pretty easy. I'm talking like almost a second between shots

It feels like it should be a powerhouse, but it just isn't

[twilit lintel]

i dont get why deag gets to be better in every way

like pistol with larger mag that reloads faster and has lower recoil = less damage imo

oh deag is more accurate and it starts damage falloff at 90m compared to the rsh starting at 60m

[rocky umbra]

Deagle shouldn’t be nerfed just because it’s good, the rsh should be buffed to be the strongest sidearm with the high recoil it has.

By strongest I mean highest damage

As for the 7 rounds that’s just what the gun should have, should’ve had it from the beginning and is a good change. The Rsh just needs to be the powerhouse gun that you switch too for high skill high reward. You should only be able to fire one shot in an even 1v1 and that shot should kill the other player.

[twilit lintel]

The 7 rounds is a good change but is noteworthy next to the rsh stats as they have almost identical rof but the one with 5 rounds takes an extra 1.3 seconds to reload while doing less damage per shot

[rocky umbra]

Agreed, they’re too similar rn, the rsh needs a boost in damage. I don’t think people would mind an absolute beast of a hand cannon if the guy that shoots it at you has to wait for recoil to allow them to shoot again.

[drowsy elbow]

the RSH should be able to one-shot anywhere but shooting it breaks your nose when it flies back from the recoil so you have blurry vision from tears until you respawn

[vernal hollow]

The RSH should disable one arm per shot

[winged ocean]

Input buffer massive W

[terse flint]

Pistols are more powerful but the draw speed seems to be same. Shouldn't be 2 for all of them?

[glad raven]

draw speed done goofed

[worthy quartz]

Bruh, rsh still worse than the deagle

[glad raven]

ye

[worthy quartz]

Oki why must you do this

[winged ocean]

It should have more fire rate no?

[pale wedge]

it's 160 vs 150 firerate. it is, quite literally, nothing. but then you have less ammo (5 vs 7), a longer reload (4.11 vs 2.77), and less damage (70 vs 72). the RSH continues to be an absolute balancing disaster, from a straight unica downgrade, to a straight deagle downgrade

[winged ocean]

I swear it was about the same fire rate as the unica before lol

[pale wedge]

nope. these are the stats before the buff

60 damage, 160 firerate, 1 running speed. literally what was oki thinking. the recent changes were a step in the right direction but it's still completely underwhelming compared to the deagle

in my opinion, it should get 80 base damage, and the old recoil; 9/4 instead of 5/5. maybe even more than that, 10/5 or 12/6. make it the scorpion equivalent of a sidearm; hard as fuck to control, but extremely rewarding to use

[winged ocean]

Bruh

@river cove fix this shit

[river cove]

I don't wanna make it OP + It sound so cool

[winged ocean]

Make it shoot at faster velo and longer damage drop off

[river cove]

It's now more usable compared to before, you are gonna have to deal with it for a bit

A battlebit

[winged ocean]

No, I love to complain

[pale wedge]

usable is not good enough, it needs a niche
if you want to be a rootin tootin cowboy, you use the unica
if you want a hard hitting sidearm, you use the deagle
there is no use case scenario for the RSH except for being a hipster and deliberately using an obsolete weapon just because it's underused

[wise quest]

Want to point out that there's something the stats page doesn't show and that's deagle's insane visual recoil

IDK why but thtat thing chooses to cover your entire screen every shot

so new RSH feels more usable

[modest sundial]

Useable is not enough

It's still just a downgrade of other guns

[rocky umbra]

Making another gun worse doesn’t prop up the rsh

The rsh has absurd recoil, I don’t think it’s a big ask that it has absurd damage to compensate

One shot in the head, that man is dead no matter what he’s wearing. It’ll strike the fear of god into the support players until they realize he has 1 more second till he can actually try to aim again.

[modest sundial]

it has less recoil than deagle

but also less damage

and less ammo

[pale wedge]

RSH has 5/5, deagle has 6/4

so not less, technically. just different

the ONLY things the RSH has over the deagle are 160 vs 150 firerate (lol) and 0.50 vs 1.00 muzzle flash (lmao)

[hexed niche]

Increase draw speed and reload speed in general for handguns

[wise quest]

Like, more?

[hexed niche]

A P90 that has 50 rounds reloads just about as fast as the pistols

I can't understand hows that right

They should feel more like your backup, you dont have as much bullets in you gear compared to primaries, so you are more likely to run out of bullets with it if you try to run them as "primary"

Drawing them to recover some ground to reload your primary for other trades dont feel that good. It shouldnt be lightning speed, but it should be fast enough to do a couple of trades safely before backing out

At least the drop reload should be a lot faster than it is. Handguns are way faster to reload irl compared to rifles and subs

[rocky umbra]

Increasing draw speed for handguns makes no sense, the whole reason they’re quick to draw is because “switching to your secondary is faster than reloading your primary”

[rocky umbra]

So it shouldn’t be fast enough to get kills and reload, but it should be fast enough to get kills and reload then run away? What are you smoking and where can I get some

[hexed niche]

you are somewhat toxic my man

[rocky umbra]

That’s just an issue with the p90

I’m trying to understand your point but you’re contradicting yourself with your own words

[hexed niche]

maybe i used my words wrong

but it isnt because i smoked ffs lmao

pistols in general should be the more agile trading tools compared to primary guns, thats what i want to say

[rocky umbra]

There we go, now I agree

[hexed niche]

if a primary can be just as agile, theres something wrong with pistols or primaries

one way or the other, its wrong

[rocky umbra]

P90 is just broken, tbh

The 50 mag with the reload speed that it has is too much

I don’t even have to switch to a secondary, I just dodge and weave

Or I would if I didn’t just prestige 😦

[graceful canyon]

So glad the pistols are better but the fact the other sidearms also got buffs keeps these guys pretty far behind in the Secondary meta.

M9 is quite good, might actually be a balanced option.

MP 443 used to be by far the best pistol but now it's arguably the worst. I have no idea how to buff it though, since M9 is not incredible but pretty much outshines MP in every way except range, which doesn't matter as Pistols suck at range anyways.

I know the USP should totally get a better reload, that has a bad reload for no real reason.

[lofty tapir]

MP443 has less recoil, higher velocity, more ammo, faster ADS, and faster reloads. i don't think M9 really outshines it at all. more damage is cool but it's not all that impactful all things considered

both of them kill in 4 shots up close disregarding armor (which isn't a factor a majority of the time)

[graceful canyon]

Fair point. M9 really is only better if you're facing armored enemies. Otherwise, straight downgrade.

Also, to be honest, I have been grinding MP and have found success, but the moment I switched to Unica I started sweeping. That doesn't pertain to M9 v MP but I found it annoying anyways.

Maybe the argument should be shifted to helping pistols universally, but idk how.

Best things I got is an extra starting mag and mag customization choices (extended, quick, short, etc...).

[lofty tapir]

yeah id love to see mag customization options. quick mags would be a great reward for grinding out specific pistols

[graceful canyon]

Definitely. Quick mag would feel incredible since these guys would likely have the best reload speed in the game.

[orchid bluff]

@graceful canyon has earned the Tier I Member role!

[graceful canyon]

Wth does that mean.

I'd really like a well balanced extended mag too, but we ought to rework all extended mags to get a feeling on what's well balanced.

Short mag might be dumb since that insinuates that the pistols, AKA the fastest guns in the game, would get even faster.

I'd love that but idk what the general consensus regarding the movement-heavy meta rn.

Could result in a boring meta which uses pistols for their amazing mobility and nothing else. I'd really hate that.

Been bouncing between secondary forums and I think the answer might be to slightly tune Unica and Glock down actually. RSH and Deagle are fair competition to pistols since pistols are great for those who wanna be fast and that's a pretty irreplacable feature.

[jolly cypress]

Weapon swapping is too slow to justify using pistols just for their mobility.

Revolvers and magnum are also pretty goated, IMO. I don't really use the other pistols, so I cannot really speak on them.

[lofty tapir]

i think unica is fine, honestly. it's very rewarding if you hit, but if you miss or hit armor your TTK crumbles. plus you've only got 6 shots, so you have to make them count

it's just glock that needs to be neutered. as long as it's blatantly overtuned, there's no reason to use the MP443, M9, or USP

(that and RSH needs adjusting because it's pretty much objectively a straight downgrade from the deagle)

[jolly cypress]

Didn't they buff the RSH and nerf the Deagle recently? Does the RSH have any better individual stats than the Deagle?

Deagle was kind of insane with the 90 base damage, the rework with lower base and higher crit was a good approach in balancing it while simultaneously maintaining its skill cap.

[graceful canyon]

They did. All RSh has over Deagle now is firerate, which is 10 higher. Otherwise, it's worse.

Less ammo, less damage, much longer reload, etc.

RSh also has higher velocity, forgot about that

[jolly cypress]

How is the recoil?

[graceful canyon]

RSh has 5.00 vert and 5.00 hori while Deagle has 6.00 vert and 4.00 hori.

Both have 1.10 first shot kick.

Both require having to readjust aim after the first shot so I don't think the recoil is way too important.

Deagle does have access to way more muzzle attachments though, so you can kick down that recoil way lower. RSh only has long suppressor which is not good for either gun.

[jolly cypress]

Can it 1 tap?

[graceful canyon]

Both can one tap naked targets to the head

RSh does 70 damage and Deagle does 72.

[jolly cypress]

Not armored though, right?

[graceful canyon]

Damage difference doesn't change anything though

Yeah only unarmored. A helmet will save you.

[jolly cypress]

Yeah, cause it's 1-2 taps anyways.

[graceful canyon]

Mhm. I believe Exo is the only exception, being a 3-tap body.

Two shots to the head will always kill no matter the helmet.

[jolly cypress]

The slight fire rate gives a slight advantage only in 2-3 taps.

But is it worth the 1 less bullet and longer reload?

What's the difference in velocity?

[graceful canyon]

Deagle has 500, RSh has 550.

Firerate for RSh is 160, Deagle is 150.

It's a decent deal, but being able to shoot RSh at 160 rpm is pretty difficult. It's also a problem since you have 2 less bullets (Deagle has 7, RSh has 5) and a much longer reload (Deagle is 2.77 and RSh is 4.11).

[jolly cypress]

2.67 vs 2.5 rounds/sec

It's kind of neglible unless you have 2 players with 300+ hours on the pistols in a 1v1, lol.

How can you differentiate RSH from the Deagle in a way that would make both weapons extremely satisfying?

[graceful canyon]

Agreed, only matters for super mega battlesweats.

[graceful canyon]

Good question, lemme ponder.

[jolly cypress]

I want both to be capable of one tapping headshots.

[graceful canyon]

I agree, I like that as well.

[jolly cypress]

But you also don't want to make the weapons too overbearing on others.

[graceful canyon]

RSh is the only anti-material revolver in existence, so I say it should get a buff to become stronger against vehicles.

[jolly cypress]

Like the RSH could have the body damage increased to pre nerf Deagle, but that wouldn't feel great for the people getting shot at.

[graceful canyon]

That would be a weird but fun distinction. Could be a choice for those who absolutely hate cars.

[jolly cypress]

It could decimate armor. Kill EXOs in 2 shots.

[graceful canyon]

This would be way too strong imo, Deagle was overtuned with 90 in my eyes.

[jolly cypress]

Yeah

[graceful canyon]

Possibly, didn't think about that.

If we do that, we should lower firerate definitely.

Maybe 130?

Actually idk if we should do that, lowest damage that will 2 shot exo is 81.

That's super high, but maybe we could do that at the cost of nerfing other things.

[jolly cypress]

Can't you increase armor damage without increasing base damage?

Or is that just for Light armor?

[graceful canyon]

That would be a pretty good selling point; super high damage, great vehicle damage, but bad reload, ammo, probably high recoil, and slower firerate.

[graceful canyon]

That is possible, forgot about that.

There is an unused armor stat, which would could increase, but that would effectively reap the same results as just increasing damage

Naked targets will still be two shot and one shot head.

Actually, if we increased armor damage or even damage in general, you'd be able to one shot thicker helmets which would be really cheesy.

I wouldn't like one shotting beyond naked head

just my opinion though

[jolly cypress]

Damn.

[graceful canyon]

Yeah balancing is hard damn

[jolly cypress]

I was thinking of a weapon that would always 1sk head, but 3sk body.

Make it unique in a way due to being antimaterial.

[graceful canyon]

That's super interesting actually

[jolly cypress]

The other stats could match Deagle to start and then be fine tuned later.

[graceful canyon]

Played games where you had pistols who did horrible damage to body but evicerated headshots, like 5 shot body vs 1-2 shot head.

[graceful canyon]

Agreed.

I'd personally want to include light vehicle damage buff, make it something super scary like 40 (old deagle light vehicle damage value).

[jolly cypress]

I was thinking of similiar games that put huge emphasis on headshots over body shots.

[jolly cypress]

That would also make it a decent counter to Little Bird pre-nerf.

I think, I'm not sure.

Post your ideas here: https://discord.com/channels/303681520202285057/1138398131109777451
@graceful canyon

[worthy quartz]

Something that does 40 damage per shot but has a 2.5 headshot multiplier would work

[modest sundial]

mp443 theoretically has faster ttk then m9 but no one clicking at 700 rpm so m9 def the better choice

[neon mural]

Unica more reliable at it than either. Glock more than that.

[wise quest]

better swap speed

[umbral sundial]

Please swap scroll wheel up and scroll wheel down for weapon and gadget swapping. I swapped the two and it feels much better.

[neon mural]

Make it so the revolver scopes increase headshot multi by .4

[worthy quartz]

I just want something chambered in the Lords caliber that's like a 3 shot kill

[neon mural]

M1911

[worthy quartz]

Oh please yes

[glad raven]

don't we have an m1911 skin for the m9?

make it boost the dmg

[worthy quartz]

Not like it would be super hard to balance

Literally just give it the Ak5c damage model

[analog nymph]

Weird idea for the sake of realism;

Why don't we allow classes to optionally go without a pistol? 99% of the time, someone with an AR is never going to use it; why not give them a speed increase, or more ammo for going without if they want to?

[neon mural]

More ammo

[analog nymph]

Wdym?

[neon mural]

No pistol = 1-3 more primary mags

[umbral sundial]

If we could pick up other people’s kits, ammo wouldn’t be an issue.

[analog nymph]

Yeah, totally

That'd be great

OR, on a light pack, just more speed

[neon mural]

Same with primary, I want to use the unica as my primary

[hexed niche]

Heavy belt with more secondary mags

Yea

And a vest with no primary mags and option to run without primaries

Vice versa

Belt with primary mags

Something like that right?

More builds

Also with that, making pistols in general reload faster, cuz you have way less bullets than primary guns in general, and you have a full 2-3 second reload with that?

It should be avg 2s for magazine pistols, because you would reload much often compared to primary guns

[coral sapphire]

played with the idea of leaning 8nto that a little
sidesrms can be fired from the hip and very inaccurately even at a sprint
quick draw and reload speeds, as well as expanding clipsizes across the board
downside is eh lethality and horrible armor performance

so like, M9 has 15+1 capacity, MP443 has 18+1 capacity, etc
but

light handguns have highest rof and 6 armor damage, 26ish damage but its a flat damage value across the body so even limb shots will be reliably damaging, making it more consistent
9mm, 5,7x28mm, etc

medium pistol has like 2 armor damage but 40-50 body damage so its possible to shoot someone twice in the crotch and drop them
.357 sig, 10mm, .45 ACP etc.

heavy pistol has like 12-18 armor damage and 50+ damage balanced by slower fire rate
still will reliably boowomp say, snipers with their zero helmet list

generally speaking:
light pistol for everyday use
medium for meme/if you expect to shoot only people not wearing aemor
heavy if you want to meme/see how Unica headshots you can rack up before a Vector beams you

[autumn wave]

revolver/deagle damage dropoff is absurd

if people are allowed to snipe with their rpgs then atleast let me be somewhat efficient with deagle

[modest sundial]

that should be rsh's thing

it has an 8x scope

give it a reason to have one

[neon mural]

Also the unica imo, but not to nearly the same extent

[graceful canyon]

There's a weird interaction where your aim will be thrown off if you ADS while swapping weapons.

I've been aware of this for a while but I thought I'd mention it here if we want to discuss it. I think this should go, makes swapping clunky.

[worthy acorn]

Thoughts on limiting pistol access to different classes?
ex. all classes have normal pistol
Squad Leader - heavy
Assault - automatic
Engineer - heavy
Support - heavy
Recon - automatic

[lofty tapir]

i don't like it. variety is nice

the only problems with the pistols atm is that RSH is objectively worse than the deagle, and the glock is pretty overtuned

and i guess there's also no reason to use M9 over the MP443 or USP (or glock obviously) like, at all

[modest sundial]

M9 is better then the USP and mp443

[neon mural]

Usp is superior to all the other light pistols!

[modest sundial]

usp is worse m9

[lofty tapir]

absolutely not. M9 has worse TTK, and less rounds. 32 damage doesn't really matter like, at all, because you still need 4 shots minimum discounting headshots

well, theoretically worse TTK anyway. no one's clicking fast enough to reach the max firerate of the MP443 and USP. but having less rounds is still kinda bad

imho, M9 should just be rebalanced to be the middleground between the semi autos and the unica. 3 bodyshots to kill, with lower firerate and low ammo capacity

[modest sundial]

32 damage matters because of armor

and ttk is irrelvant because like you said, no one is clicking accurately at 750rpm

[pseudo willow]

You would need to take in account people using macros to reach it, many people do

[modest sundial]

thats literally cheating tho lmfao

[lofty tapir]

hm, you've got a point actually. MP443 and USP need 5 bodyshots for medium armor

i retract my statement. i should give M9 another chance

[modest sundial]

ima give USP a chance lmfao

[lofty tapir]

yeah

ive been enjoying the USP a lot since it was reworked

[modest sundial]

ill have to try it more

generally i only use pistols when im using dmrs or snipers tho

[pseudo willow]

Honestly all of the pistols are decent now up from before buffs, I like them all but I usually stick to USP

[modest sundial]

and i dont think glock is overtuned

you get like 3 kills per mag

[pseudo willow]

Take this into consideration though, Glock and all Heavy Pistols affect run speed even when not equipped.

[lofty tapir]

the TTK is on par with a primary weapon though

[modest sundial]

tru

[lofty tapir]

glock does not have a run speed debuff

i think it really should

[pseudo willow]

Having M9, MP443, or USP allows you to max run speed.

[pseudo willow]

Extended mag does

[lofty tapir]

yeah but extended mag is goofy silly

you can easily win aim duels against rifles or SMGs with just the regular mag

[modest sundial]

extended mags are garbo

like in general

[lofty tapir]

the FAL one is great, it almost doubles your ammo capacity, and you can still zoom around with it

but other than that, yeah, they're pretty sucky

[pseudo willow]

Well technically I am pretty sure run speed on non extended glock is worse compared to pistols, pistols have a base of 1.10 which gives you additional speed even without being equipped

[neon mural]

Honestly the choice between the secondaries is usually just personal preference since actually needing to use your secomdary is pretty rare. The exceptions are if you're using a dmr(other than the G3) or sniper rifle and/or you have a particularly heavy loadout and need a light secondary so that you can move at a decent speed

Tl;dr: Pistols are irrelevant unless you're a sniper or your primary is heavy.

[lofty tapir]

im confident the glock has 1.10 as well

[hexed niche]

M9 and USP

please

and its a shame for pistols to reload slower than subs

[modest sundial]

yeah i think the only change pistols need is reload

they should all be sub 3s

maybe even lower depending on what it is right now

also unica needs a buff

[hexed niche]

they should be low 2s (magazine pistols)

being very honest with you

on many games pistols reload very quick and they are made to be very agile

[hexed niche]

also, to be fair, more secondary mags as standard

at least one or two extra

[lofty tapir]

yeah

more mags would be gr8

especially for something like the RSH (which STILL needs to be buffed because it's STILL objectively worse than the deagle)

[graceful canyon]

Default Pistols all reload faster than every single sub, with the only exception being USP. Glock and Deagle also reload faster, Deagle being (I believe) the fastest reload in the game.

Only exceptions are Unica and RSh-12.

[hexed niche]

and

IT'S USP GOD DAMMIT

[graceful canyon]

I didn't know you were talking about quick mags

[hexed niche]

and M9

[hexed niche]

You have to consider quick mags

Your average player wont use default mag

or extended

Deagle vs PP19 is dreadful btw

fastest reloading sub vs fastest reloading pistol

its a Ferrari vs a Prius

[worthy quartz]

For a second I thought someone was suggesting the UMP SMG get a buff, and I was about to lose it

Glad I was wrong

[hexed niche]

talking about the dmg, their dmg is okay, most of them are 9mm and they are doing almost as much dmg as a UMP

talk about a pistol that kills almost as fast as a sub

if a pistol kills as fast as a UMP rn (185ms ttk) that is broken

they need to be reliable backup weapons, and even maybe a primary option for those who want a different gameplay

[graceful canyon]

wait wtf I wrote ump and not usp

sorry guys

[hexed niche]

and you wrote M4

you wanna see whats a M4?

[graceful canyon]

I also wrote m4 wth

I'm dead rn I think I should retire

[hexed niche]

you welcome

nah, we all dead

you good

gr888

you fixed them

i would repost, lots of rant down here

delete and repost

[graceful canyon]

sure

Been grinding pistols and I’ve always found difficulty with their extremely low damage. They take forever to kill naked enemies, and don’t start on armor.

Pistol Category’s biggest strengths are not too noticeable even with their high numbers. Walkspeed is amazing, but the Unica and Glock 18 have the same amazing 1.10 walkspeed while also being generally better. The seemingly amazing 2.0 swap speed oddly doesn’t help much, and if it does, the amazing Glock 18 has very similar swap speed, so just use that.

Glock is the only good secondary for panic situations. Really good dps. Either overpowered or an example for what sidearms should be, depending on what your views are.

So, I have two ideas on how to give these weapons the damage they need badly. One is a massive buff, the other is a consistency buff.

CONSISTENCY BUFF - Ranges and/or Reloads

Starting Range increased from 25(?)m to 40m.
Ending Range increased from 100(?)m to 135m.

M9 reload speed sped up from 2.90 to 2.50.
USP reload speed sped up from 3.23 to 2.62.
MP 443 reload speed sped up from 2.79 to 2.39.

MASSIVE BUFF - Damage

M9 damage increased from 32 to 34.
• [ Now able to 3-shot NAKED body. ]

USP damage increased from 30 to 32.
• [ Now able to 4-shot MEDIUM armor. ]

MP 443 damage increased from 27 to 29.
• [ Now able to 4-shot LIGHT / RANGER armor and 3-shot NAKED head. ]

*** There may be other damage thresholds exceeded, I haven’t calculated them all. ***

Range buffs are preferred if we want to not buff Pistol CQC performance, and instead help prevent them from dealing absolutely pitiful numbers at range, potentially solving the horrid armor TTK.
Reload buffs are preferred if we want to buff CQC performance without actually buffing ballistics.

Damage buff is preferred if we want to absolutely buff the hell out of these guys and never look back.

If we go with damage buffs, I do think we ought to sneak in some other changes as well since M9 would easily be the best option imo. Below is the “complete” change log that I'd impliment if I were king of BattleBit.

| PROPOSED PISTOL BUFFS |

M9

Damage increased from 32 to 34.
Ending Range increased from 100(?)m to 115m.
Reload Speed increased from 2.90 sec to 2.75 sec.

USP

Damage increased from 30 to 32.
Starting Range increased from 25(?)m to 35m.
Ending Range increased from 100(?)m to 125m.
Reload Speed sped up from 3.23 sec to 2.82 sec.

MP 443

Damage increased from 27 to 29.
Starting Range increased from 25(?)m to 45m.
Ending Range increased from 100(?)m to 135m.
Reload Speed sped up from 2.79 sec to 2.60 sec.

[hexed niche]

now real feedback to pistols:

• A swap to all the stats between the M9 and USP to make sense for the weapons (9mm vs 45 ACP)
• And decrease by 0.5s across all magazine type pistols (0.8s for the USP's current reload of 3.23s)
• No feedback towards the Unica and RSH because i didnt use those guns
  attached a picture to show the difference between the bullets of some pistols

[coral sapphire]

...its almost like the gun is supposed to be a backup weapon and not your weapon of choice

i think personally my wants would be something like the pistol rework i proposed a while back

[hexed niche]

right? you have 1 + 2 mags of reserve

because you only have the normal belt option

[coral sapphire]

I believe heavy armor might give you another mag or something? don't quote me on thay though, I swear I had 1 + 3 as assault or something...

[hexed niche]

still, 5 mags total is not enough

imma also not enter in armors topic, theres a channel for that

[hexed niche]

like i said, one or two extra mags makes a world difference, specially when you are in a kill streak

if you get yourself in a 20+ kill streak you are probably running out of ammo rn, unless you are a support or have a buddy support, youll have to rely on the pistol until you get some ammo

[coral sapphire]

One of the things I've wanted for a while is the ability to resupply off players like BF hardline or a backpack that sacrifices some gadget space for an ammo reserve

so like, when consolidating, your backpack ammo pool of 5 mags or something can be consolidated into empties

[zenith cargo]

i just wish the deagle and revolvers had a bit less vertical recoil. they all kick way too much

[austere crest]

• All semi auto pistols suck. How the hell do I supposed to click 10 times per second (USP has 600RPM, like WHY?) to max their DPS trying to survive? Half the rate of fire, increase damage to 45-49 so it's a 3-4 shot kill, not 4-5
• Glock feels like pocket Vector, the nicest feeling pistol by far. No complaints there
• High powered pistols are way too unpleasant to use. Why choose them over Glock? Why they have so little effective range if they have x8 scope btw?

[jade tartan]

pistols are preference

and last resort weapon

then dont use those pistols if you are having trouble on those hand cannons and normal pistol

just use glock

[austere crest]

There's most pistols. They suck. There's Glock. It's great. That's not how it supposed to be tbh

Also there's snipers. Pistol is not last resort weapon for them. That supposed to be main thing you rely on in CQB

[jade tartan]

idk im doing fine with my m9 and usp

ive seen people rocking those hand cannons and dying from them

[rocky umbra]

I rock the hand cannons, they’re high skill high reward. A Glock will not let you kill 7 players (without helmets or lower health) back to back and make you feel satisfied in your aim. The semi-automatic pistols like the USP have their place as a middle ground weapon for players that want to hit enemies from further away but don’t want to sacrifice ammo capacity. If you’re having trouble with hand cannons then they’re not made for you, you can either train your aim (aka “git good”) or not use them at all.

[lofty tapir]

semi auto pistols don't outrange the glock like, at all

iirc they have the same damage fall-off and glock has little to no recoil

[neon mural]

"Why choose them over Glock"
1 shot kills on injured players and headshots, that's why.

[rocky umbra]

Bro try hitting clean headshots on 3 people with a Glock, you can’t that thing is a spray and pray weapon

[modest sundial]

glock has a max kill potential of like 1 person per mag

unless you hit all your shots and theirs no armoru

[lofty tapir]

that's all you need if you aren't using your secondary as your primary (and at that point you're better off using the unica or deagle over any of the semi autos)

a pistol being able to just hold down M1 and consistently win aim duels against rifles and SMGs is silly. it doesn't suffer at long range any more than the semi autos, and it doesn't slow you down

[jade tartan]

wiith extended mag you can kill 2-3 people

assuming they dont have exo armor

or heavy

[neon mural]

Being the perfect secondary at the cost of shit kpm is the glock's niche, however the light semi-autos have no niche.

[past parrot]

The only pistols that feel even remotely useful are the heavies and the g18. All the other regular ones do way too little damage to even consider bringing, even as a backup weapon.

[past parrot]

This is now made ten times worse by the new audio changes since it's impossible to get the drop on somebody, and even if you do, if you miss once with one of the regular pistols, your target will just turn on you and kill you with an automatic weapon.

[neon mural]

Light pistols need a buff, I feel like extra range might be a good fit.

[lofty tapir]

agreed. semi autos being more viable at range would give them a proper niche

[vernal hollow]

I think each pistol could have a little niche for sure

[modest sundial]

Give semi autos more range

and the heavy pistols should have even higher range

the revolvers have 8x scope but its useless cause the damage dropoff

[vernal hollow]

would be funny

[lofty tapir]

idk about heavy pistols

deagle sniping could become a really degenerate strategy

[spice flicker]

#make_rsh_great

[spice flicker]

finally decided to try rsh to see how bad it is.
well, it's ehh (got 10 kills just to get red dot aim)
I don't get why it has every stat worse than deagle yet unlocks as the last sidearm.
8 less bullets than deagle, less damage, more recoil.
imo, there are two ways:
eitehr swap deagle and rsh so the latter is onlocked at lvl100 and deagle at lvl120 but I'm not a fan of it.
make rsh slap. increase damage to 85-90 since with that recoil it should hit hella hard. I also don't get why it has 8x scope, it's pretty hard to use it and you won't be sniping because of damage fall-off.

[spice flicker]

I also noticed that you can zero up to 500 (!) m with it but ... why?

[neon mural]

Its firerate is faster

It has the firerate of the Unica and nearly the firepower of the deagle

[spice flicker]

bruh, it's 150 vs 160

and Unica has 200

[neon mural]

Oh, damn, my memory is bad.

[modest sundial]

velocity

[real geyser]

when do we have the FN57??

[desert scarab]

Ok, Pistols? Need a speed buff to pulling them out in a panic situation.

They are USELESS unless you actively pull them out before you are going to get slaughtered because your main gun is out of ammo.

[wise quest]

Their speed was doubled already. It's your primary weapons swap speed that is keeping it slow

Run an SMG with shift Angeled and you'll notice instant swap

[desert scarab]

Ah, ok. I guess that makes sense.

[late ermine]

I really really feel the headshot dmg bonus for all weapons, but especially for pistols, is too low. 2 headshots plus some body shots from glock against non-support enemy does not kill sometimes. Getting 2 headshots and not killing feels terribly dissapointing.

[worthy quartz]

Something I've noticed is actually that putting away your pistol and pulling out your AR is way faster than putting away your AR and pulling out your pistol.

[modest sundial]

yeah the weapon swapping is a little funky

[flat hatch]

Semi-auto pistols are bad. Need more options and semi-autos need to be more viable.

[coral sapphire]

Five Seven
Poor damage, but low muzzle flip. Deep magazine, falloff is long and gradual. High headshot multiplier. Somehow, it feels like you should be wearing tri-goggles...

[full elbow]

Any word on this?

I think the biggest issue with pistols in this game is the time it takes to swap to them.

It feels at LEAST 2x longer than it should be, IMO.

And even the heaviest of the options we have wouldn't justify it, both from a balance and real-life perspective.

As someone who's done extensive drills swapping from a rifle to a pistol, I can tell you that most games get it right. There's a reason modern militaries have a quick-attach harness and strap attached to your primary weapon.
This lets you literally drop your gun in the event of a sudden need to continue firing (failure to eject mid-firefight, low/out of ammo in the mag, squib, etc.)

It's a life-saving skill, and one that every military out there trains it's people in as a muscle memory reflex.

But in BBR, our guy is apparently fumbling around with one of those trigger child-safety lock things every time he swaps to his sidearm.

[hexed niche]

Reload speed could use some attention too

[somber plover]

Weapon switch time needs attention. primary drop time to pistol draw time needs a significant boost, countered by pistol drop to primary time nerf. IRL switching drills focus heavily on drop primary draw secondary speed, but holster pistol back to primary is still much slower IRL.

You could further complicate it by having the pistol switch draw one-handed (with primary held by foregrip with offhand). This would make the initial switch time to/from faster, and the first unaimed pistol shot faster, but countered by the first ADS shot with the pistol take longer as it would necessitate the completed primary stowing.

[full elbow]

TBH, just flatout halving swap times would fix everything.

But from an IRL standpoint, swapping back to primary can be done with one hand while holstering with the other.

This is why a decent number of folks expecting to be in close quarters situations will have their holster on the left.
Hold the sidearm in the left, while the right is dedicated to the primary weapon.

[full elbow]

(Worth noting that militaries don't much care for doing that though, because they generally have a whole squad with extreme coordination going, rather than just one dude off on his own like in most modern FPS games.)

[full elbow]

Suggestion for a new Heavy Pistol:
Arsenal AF2011-A1

The damn thing is a total meme, but it would be HILARIOUS! (And it would be a decently acceptable option too.)