Barbwire - Feedback

[hot saffron]

Please keep it on topic, and civil, we want serious feedback

• No gifs
• No 'skill issue'
• No video's - (Testing video's in the Polygon are fine)

[vivid cypress]

It does the job, but its clearance requirements seem a bit stricter than they should be to me. It’s wire, it should be able to go on just about anything, and between anything.

[winged cape]

Please give us an indicator of what team has placed the barbed wire.
Can In walk through this? Will I take damage? Nobody knows!

Also a general pain point for buildables, the fact that you can just hold the "deconstruct" button makes it feel kinda pointless against enemies as a blockade.

If the time it took to deconstruct barbwires doubled for each wire you removed, it would maybe feel more as a barrier than just deconstructing the entire thing in 4 seconds.
(first write 1 sec, 2nd 2 sec, 3rd 4 sec, 4th 8 sec)

[vivid cypress]

well, the deconstruction is fair enough... requires you to stay still for several seconds and realistically barbed wire gets cut a lot. the point of barbed wire is to slow down rushers and give you a chance to kill them before they get among you

team indicator is really needed though

[fickle grail]

maybe make enemy barbed wires appear slightly tinted?

[dusty temple]

Maybe team colours on the sides or something

[narrow marten]

Add a noise for walking through barbed wire, make it jingle

[mighty veldt]

Allowing vehicles to destroy barbed wire would be welcomed. While few people take vehicles in close quarters, it would be nice to at least start implementing gameplay to encourage it.

This would start to help the mentality that armor should push with the infantry.

(For that matter, armored vehicles should be able to destroy most buildables)

[lapis gazelle]

Currently barbed wire can be stacked on objectives like a bomb site and makes it difficult to plant.

[frigid orchid]

I've seen a lot of my team just crawl under our own barbwire. I think an indicator would be great.

[runic plinth]

They need team colors, I have had my teammates deconstruct my barbed wire pretty consistently.

[broken rapids]

Have you seen this screenshot?
#bb-screenshots message

Amazing

[fickle grail]

works as intended

[zinc swan]

Make them slow down even more, now you can quickly go through it

[vivid cypress]

I would agree with this, though if it doesn’t already make it so this affect does not stack.

Barbed wire can be placed repeatedly

[stone vapor]

oki mentioned this on dev stream that its a bug

that vehicles cant destroy barb wires

[mighty veldt]

Shew, glad to hear that. Seemed to be quite an unnecessary feature lol

[noble compass]

Should cause damage

[narrow marten]

Should cause damage and make noise

[stone vapor]

i want it to deal damage but like wasnt this the problem like people abusing it?

[dusty temple]

People abusing barbwire?

If someone is willing to run through barbs that's on them. Most of the time people dismantle them in a few seconds and it's poofed forever

[stone vapor]

like 2 medics stay on barbwire healing each other for exp

LMAO

[vivid cypress]

It already does damage, no??

[stone vapor]

no it doesnt anymore it only slows

[vivid cypress]

Weird. Could’ve just stopped you from being able to receive healing in barbed wire

[stone vapor]

then they can get out and heal then go back

same story

[vivid cypress]

That would be way slower

[stone vapor]

yeah still free exp

[winged cape]

Wait... it doesnt damage anymore.... ....?
What a bummer

[narrow marten]

Make the damage scale exponentially based on time spent in barbed wire

[vivid cypress]

that could work but would still allow for it if the person in the barbed wire was just careful

[narrow marten]

I mean, if it's making enough noise someone should come along and shoot you eventually, barbed wire shouldn't hurt teammates

[vivid cypress]

from what I can tell people were just doing this on the edge of the map away from the fighting. barbed wire isn't exactly known for its deafening sound.

[uncut slate]

not only is deconstructing easy and fast for enemies, it is SILENT

this kinda goes into the whole soundscape problemt he game has, but its a little goofy that i can place a sandbag to block an area off and then some dude can perfectly silently remove it and then shoot me in the back. if building and deconstructing had some sort of shovel noise or something it would help a lot

i would also like a version that is flat against the ground

[stone vapor]

what if what if they just make it like barbwires just had this temporary bleeding effect

if you stay on it longer you die

if you get out of you your unscathed and unhurt

[uncut slate]

for vehicles destroying buildable, i like baricades being one that would be immune or resistant. i generally find them useless except for cheesy prone looking out sandbags shenanigans and similar because they are too short. having them be something able to actually block vehicles would be nice

[vivid cypress]

hmm... barbed wire making you bleed at any HP would solve the issue entirely

I think that's the best suggestion so far

if it doesn't do much actual damage you will have a long expiry time but having run through it will still put you at a disadvantage

[runic plinth]

Yeah, barbed wire should do something

[uncut slate]

I would actually like a flat version of barbed wire, something i could carpet the ground with in some places

[mighty veldt]

They mentioned adding in tank traps.
Iv had my issues with buildables. A few times if been trolled by a teammate who will just keep building stuff around me to trap me.

[uncut slate]

Nah dude, he was just trying to do like how they burried tanks in the past as bunkers

[mighty veldt]

Oh hey, they just announced vehicles will be able to break buildables

[mighty veldt]

Lol. He was butt hurt because I didn't move out of the way why he came flying down the right side of the road

[cunning fog]

Can the barbed wire fence be changed to be circular spools of razor wire. We could also have it be thrown a short distance, allowing you to just toss out large spools of wire.

[balmy patio]

Maybe barbered wire could cause bleeding instead of doing normal damage, and make so there is no xp gain for stoping the bleeding that was caused by a barbered wire.

[cedar furnace]

Barbed wire should probably be Rainbow-six like or Hell Let Loose like

Hell Let Loose allows you to block off large amounts of unoccupied land to prevent flanks and to funnel infantry, instead of clogging up CQC areas with a minor inconvenience.

[long kettle]

I have tried to use barb wire & have had issues

issues

1. It only slows (Which the faster you are,the easier it is to just jump through to ignore the slow)
2. It can be destroyed by small arms fire (So using it as a defense measure can be dealt with by meerly shooting it, which means it tends to get took out fast)
3. It is fickle in placement (it HATES being near things but you can place it first than place things in it)
4. the enemy can just decon it rather easily due to time
5. identifying which team placed it, I would say just alter the model some to allow easier to identify (so for example have the russian one criss cross in a X type shape with single rather than spooled rows)
6. it could use a audio cue to go "Hey someone got in it"

Summary ; it is a case of it does too little right now,too easy to get rid of and doesn't help deter rushers who will just rush through it with a jump which barely delays them

[cedar furnace]

I would make it feel better if emplacements couldn't be deconstructed by the enemy completely, such that if an enemy removes it there is still the blueprint you can come back to to build again.

[cedar furnace]

Getting it to work on the hill flank of C on wakistan was torture.

[molten sky]

for 5. just add red/green tips on the poles like what we have on the helmets, way clearer

[mighty veldt]

I agree 100% that barbwire is a little too easy to get around.
Bullets shouldn't destroy it, that makes no sense.
It shouldn't be able to be deconstructed by the opposing team.
Friendly barbed wire should have an indicator.
Option: Add a new tool for the engi and support class that among other things, can cut through barb wire, or effectively disassemble it. - repair tool could possibly be given this feature? It is a power tool.

[molten sky]

Assault. Bolt cutter idk

No idea why support or assault of all classes got the trophy 😂

[vivid cypress]

barbed wire being deconstructed has been how barbed wire has been removed throughout history

[mighty veldt]

I would love for you to demonstrate removing placed barbed wire in 8 seconds IRL.

Fun fact, it only takes about 8 seconds to deploy barbed wire IRL.

[lapis gazelle]

It's a video game.....

[mighty veldt]

His comment was refrencing IRL, so I did lol

[lapis gazelle]

Yes, and if you play barb wire IRL anyone with cutters can walk up and destroy it. As it should be allowed in this game

[mighty veldt]

100%, but make them have cutters. Give a tool to the engi.
Helps with one of the larger issues that this game has with infantry, class identity.

You have to make players choose their loadouts, knowing they are in a give take sutiation. Not a "time to choose these items and be ready for any and all situations"

[lapis gazelle]

So then you run into the problem that every class is having at the current moment.

Is anyone using bolt cutters? Anyone running ammo, anyone have a trophy system, anyone running smoke grenades?

[mighty veldt]

RIght. My thought is rename repair tool to multi tool, let it repair and dismantle barbed wire easily.

Maybe even allow it to fortify other buildables. Lets an engi paired with a support class have synergy. And gives enough diversity to the item to make it worth considering.

Also smoke grenades are amazing, they are just slept on.

[lapis gazelle]

Agreed on the smoke grenades but it still comes back down to loadout decisions.

There are other suggestions like you posted about the repair tool in other feedback forums.

Which its a great idea!

In the recon section we have talked about making binoculars better but do you make players sacrifice a slot just to run it to make it better or do you evolve the class.

[mighty veldt]

We just need more of that, but with other equiptment.
And we need more restrictions on what equipment each class can use to force class choice to matter more

For sure, binoculars being able to paint vehicles or infantry for the entire team for instance

would be a good buff

Hell, make it so vehicle turrets have a slight amount of auto aim on any market target too - I don't think that would be op at all, just give good team play synergy. But I digress on the topic at hand lol

[lapis gazelle]

I mean it's a fantastic point to make, and suggesting it doesn't hurt. There is a reason everyone runs C4 so much and so when you start talking about adding more gadgets thats when the discussion has to be had about do you make a multi tool.

[mighty veldt]

right

well, also c4 just shouldn't be on every class lol

its inhernetly strong, and its strength should go into your decision to pick engi over, lets say support

Given support gets some love, like being able to setup stationary MG nests.

[lapis gazelle]

It has a universal purpose and that is the issue, like being able to cut through barbed wire for instance logically every class should be able to cut it. Obviously not everyone is carrying around the right tool but still.

[mighty veldt]

mmm not sure if I agree with that.

Usually in both BF games and RL, historically the job to do something like carry wire cutters, or in this case a multi tool, is given to one person

having a separation of concerns is really enforced.

Your assault guys souldn't be worrying about cutting the barbed wire, they should be giving cover fire and pushing to allow your engi to deal with it

[lapis gazelle]

But in most cases barbed wire can still be walked through it's not going to kill you but it will leave some marks.

[mighty veldt]

It really should cause a bleed

at minimum

have to punish players for being dumb

[lapis gazelle]

I think it shouldnt be a huge bleed.

[mighty veldt]

naw

but it should require you to stop and bandage

which makes you venerable.

that alone with sound queues would make just running through barbed wire be a conscious decision

[lapis gazelle]

It should already do enough, requiring you to bandage while in it to heal is too excessive. If it slows the player down and gives off an audio que that someone is in it then I think that is efficient enough.

[mighty veldt]

no no, not bandage while in it

bandage at some point or you die

[lapis gazelle]

If you want to sprint full force through it then you are going to get heavy bleed

[mighty veldt]

Just requiring a badnage at all is a pretty big penalty

if there are in fact people close by that want to shoot you

even if you can do so after getting through

[lapis gazelle]

Depending on the barbed wire though with the Uniform, Vest, and other equipment you are running IRL you wouldn't take insane bleeding damage from going through it though. That is why suggesting bleeding being required then you are going to have players just avoid it because they see oh look barbed wire dont have a bandage can't do anything about it.

[mighty veldt]

you would, however, get very tangled up

trying to lug 50 pounds of kit through barbed wire isn't exactly easy

though, IRL the quick fix is to throw a blanket or cloth over the wire to make a quick crossing easy

[mighty veldt]

I would be super ok with bleeding being avoided if you moved very slowly, but at that point, getting an engi to destroy it, or going a different way is probably best ha.

[stone lynx]

make enemy disarmed when moving through the wires

And I honestly think wires shouldn’t have IFF

In HLL wires can only be cut by engi, not sure if this game can make similar restrictions (since only engi and support can build, only engi and support are smart enough to remove them?)

[stone lynx]

or perhaps slow down the speed of cutting wire’s significantly and make certain classes cut the wires faster (similar to how medic bandage faster/assault reload faster)

[lapis gazelle]

Potentially a good idea

[long kettle]

Support is defensive class is part of the reason

[long kettle]

been watching guys just sprint & jump through it on my end

[lapis gazelle]

Racer and I's conversation is a good discussion about barbed wire.

[winged cape]

Please return the damage. Remove exp from healing barbed wire damage instead. It's just the most useless thing unless it deals damage. Slow down opponents? How about a wall instead of something that just slows you down a teeny bit.

[uncut slate]

the real problem i have with barbed wire is... where the FUCK do i put it that enemies cant just jump over it or go around it somehow

[winged cape]

Well, that's kind of the point, you force them to circumvent it, which is what it's supposed to do. But right now, they can just.. walk through it no harm done

[uncut slate]

my point is it is pitifully easy to circumvent due to how short it is

[winged cape]

You'd like it to be longer? Would you like a roll?
I don't mind placing several Barbed Wires, but the vertical steel beam makes placing it, and going through them a bit of a hassle

[uncut slate]

its short enough that it is really easy to just climb over it or jump over it at times.

if it was something like a mat i could place on the ground to cover an area with it would be better but as it is you can only effectively use barbed wire in extremely narrow chokes. you only have 20 and it costs what, 30 squad points? its not effective really at all other than shoving over doorways and windows... which then enemies just blow a hole in the wall so it is moot. it is incredibly fragile too in my experience so said explosions will easily destroy it too

even a mat has issues though at the least it isnt something they can so easily jump over and bypass with a single buildable, or at least it wont be depending on the size

[narrow marten]

In doorways

[uncut slate]

Does jack shit, i could just place a sandbag or something to block it. Reread what i said about them being fragile

[stone vapor]

you can palce them in some doorways where they cant hit it

[uncut slate]

Still, for a tool intended to slow the game down a bit they dont do a good job at it. They are just too expensive for what they do and are rather ineffective imo

[mighty veldt]

I do think there are quite a few examples on how to address that issue above

[stone lynx]

I have a rather drastic change proposal, touching the top row of wire halts you completely (prevents speedy jump cheese) and each bar lower provides diminishing speed penalty, so it encourages you to prone and crawl through (fastest). This may require barbewire build/remove be done differently, instead of removing wires in verticality, make barbewire thicker (horizontal depth) or thinner when building/removing

[long kettle]

decon/shoot it with your gun, otherwise blow it up with C4 or a explosive like a mine/claymore to get rid of it

[long kettle]

Too expensive, fickle to place, easily gotten rid of/bypassed and so on

[eager warren]

I have found so few places to even bother using them I just don't bother honestly.

[long kettle]

they effectively must be placed prior to building a fortification to be at all useful (So you effectively need to blueprint a player made structure & hope people choose to blitz through it rather than decon)

[cedar furnace]

Yep. Hold caps lock, that easy

[vivid cypress]

You want a minigame for it or something

[cedar furnace]

Idk maybe make it deconstruct with the thousands of packs of c4 that come standard issue

Deconstruction takes no time at all

[uncut slate]

Part of the issue i think is that deconstructing is too fast, at least for buildables from the other team.

its always irked me how i can run up to a baricade an enemy made in a door and remove it in the blink of an eye without a sound.

At least c4 would be loud. Assuming you dont die to the splash (which competent players will keep away from walls to avoid being splashed from rpgs or c4) you would hear the explosion and be able to turn around and respond.

with deconstructing it is just as fast and silent though

[long kettle]

(thinks of a time a Assault just walked up to a fortified area,with a riot shield, I made & due to no one dealing with him because I was down he deconed the whole thing in less time than it took a support to build it)

[thick furnace]

i still dont get why its a 'wall' type construction
i would much rather prefer a r6 styled 'circle' type where the building level == actual range, the time inbetween damage ticks, and slow %

it being another 'wall' type of construction makes it compete with sandbags and roadblocks that do the same job but better (forcing people to slowdown, by forcing a vault over it vs... walking slowly through it)
converting it to be circle type makes it still do the same job it currently does (slowing down door entries)
but also makes it useful for slowing down people already inside rooms by instead of being a single line to dance around it becomes a radial denial zone

this doesnt fix barb being still kinda useless
but atleast it fixes the weird balancing decision where you can crawl under a level 1 barb wire for some reason
and makes it less useless by covering more area

also we need a way to tell which team the barb wire belongs to

quick and dirty solution:
add glowsticks to the ground under the barb wire denoting team color

[long kettle]

it actually doesn't compete per say

It is a wall constructable that others can be put into (Yes it is odd,effectively place wire down first & you can shove stuff in it, but you can't place others first than place wire close to it)

[thick furnace]

is vaulting speed even slowed down by barb?

[long kettle]

unsure, I suppose it is based where you set it up but I haven't seen people attempt to climb the walls I setup like that

[cedar furnace]

It's funny that support can't do builds like other classes can. Because you build instantly, you can't place blueprints inside others.

[thick furnace]

support can still de-construct buildings

[sick laurel]

see the issue with your argument is your assuming barb wire is a tool used in camping.... which it isnt.

and not to meantion most maps have multiple attack points, which means playing as a support you would need a team that, well, camps with you to cover all of this.

imo, i think barb wire clearance needs to be relagated to c4, grenades, picks and sledge hammers. with the complete disallow of deconstruction for both teams.

this should make it so players either take the right tool to counter, or go in loud and fast anyways.

barb wire atm is something people rarely place down as nobody really cares to build. and camping is discouraged entirely becuase you need to push points to get points to build it.

so optimally, barb wire should be something i spam around a building to give people a headache and to ACCTUALLY slow them down as it cant just be unbuilt or shot out.

[ripe stone]

@sick laurel has earned the Tier I Member role!

[sick laurel]

reading through everything makes me feel like it may be time to consider class vs class type perks. obvious ones... but then the game may overall suffer from such.

hope we can get a overall solution tho

[stone lynx]

Can instant c4 a barbewire but can’t instant c4 a sandbag or barrier

Ngl I wouldn’t waste time building them even if they cost nothing- it’s that bad

[sick laurel]

i agree.

[uneven zephyr]

isn’t barbed wire supposed to do damage? is it bugged?

[uncut slate]

Not bugged, just bad. They removed that

[mighty veldt]

I don't think there is a single person who things it shouldn't do damage lol.

IMO, it should cause a bleed. That is enough.

[stone lynx]

In the video the damage is laughably low for one instance of wires anyways

[mighty veldt]

just damage is kind of meh. Forcing the player to bandage at some point, or the die... that is a real penalty that can get you killed

and make you wish you had walked around or dismanteled the barbed wire

[stone lynx]

At least make it cause bleeding

[uncut slate]

Problem is people have like 20 billion stacks of c4 so they just toss one and boom everything is gone

Or they deconstruct it in a second

[stone lynx]

I think I’ve seen game using barbwire as selective buildable on top of barriers which disables vaulting through and disassemble

[vivid cypress]

Bleeding barbed wire still allows you to bandage spam with medics… but maybe there is a solution. Would take a bit of work but it could be done so that bandaging a person whose bleeding was inflicted by barbed wire doesn’t grant them XP

[mighty veldt]

yeah, barbed wire shouldn't be that easily destroyed. IMO, engine repair tool (maybe better as a multi tool) would dismantal it.

[mighty veldt]

I don't think this is super necessary to worry about. The movement penalty, and the fact somebody has to stop and bandage you should create an opportunity for the enemy to take you out.
Barbed wire needs an audible sound though.

[vivid cypress]

The point is that it’s possible to set this up yourselves on the edge of the map and basically do it with impunity

That’s what was happening with the original wire exploit

[mighty veldt]

Team barbed wire should do nothing to a player, and should be designated as a team structure too

battling xp exploits needs to occur seperately for balacing the gameplay of it

[vivid cypress]

But you only need an enemy to place one further out for it to work.

Can potentially cooperate on it

[mighty veldt]

IMO, get caught, bannable offense

[vivid cypress]

Fair I suppose

[mighty veldt]

no need to adjust mechanics to do that

I mean, it would be pretty damn easy to spot lol

[vivid cypress]

Would need to specify that it’s a bannable offence in the warning thing when you join a server

[vivid cypress]

If someone was looking for it then yes. On a map like sandysunset there are places you simply won’t be found the whole game

[mighty veldt]

TOS stuff 🙂

[mighty veldt]

Devs 100% have captured statistics they can run queries on

[vivid cypress]

True, could automatically flag people who are getting xp like this

[mighty veldt]

Also if engis were the ones to be able to destroy barbed wire, and got xp

I doubt any would be sitting around lol

Though... not giving xp to banage people who go through barbed wire... honestly that culd be part of the penalty for being silly.
So... hind sight, I would agree with you. Remove xp from bandaging on barbed wire bleeds.

[vivid cypress]

Personally I think nobody should be banned for taking advantage of a dev oversight, as the devs should take the blame for it
So I would rather eliminate the issue altogether

[mighty veldt]

I could agree with that. Yeah, I take back what I said, keep the xp from barbed wire bleeds from being applied. Not as a way to prevent exploints, but to punish players for being dumb.

[vivid cypress]

I think it would be both

[mighty veldt]

I mean yeah 🙂

but I will always be fore a change that primarily is there for gameplay impact 😛

[long kettle]

I suppose a simple idea is make your own barb wire unable to damage your team & change the model to add the green & red lights on the posts

[stone vapor]

then ill just find an enemy barbwire and damage myself with my friend so we can heal each other

[long kettle]

hmm true

[sick laurel]

barb wire just shouldnt be dismantled by anything but 2 c4 imo

or a eng tool

or a sledge

seriously i thought the barb wire would have been all well and good cuase i figured that i couldnt dismanlte it cuase i didnt see the prompt. which would have been the basics to making it something.

but nope, were playing space engineers. i can dismantle everything even if it hurts gameplay xD

[stone lynx]

Sledge?

[sick laurel]

sledge :0

the hammer

[stone lynx]

I would be fine if barbwire is completely impassible and as tough as other barrier constructs

Oh plus cannot be vaulted

You get pushed to either side if you attempt to land directly on top

[sick laurel]

and still take dmg ofc

[stone lynx]

The reasoning behind being impassible is soldiers don’t want to touch it at all so it shouldn’t apply damage

[lost rapids]

Then why even have the barbed wire to begin with? it's just an inferior version of the sandbag walls at that point

Barbed wire dealing damage is fine by me, but to prevent abuse, perhaps it should only award assist/kill experience, or possibly experience if it causes a bleed

I love what barbwire can bring to the table in terms of buildables. Day one I made an entire fortification underneith Alpha on Wakistan that was a huge thorn in the enemy's side. I want more of that!

[uncut slate]

barbed wire seems to me like an attempt to slow the game down without being too obnoxious. basically, turns out removing claymore spam caused some problems

[lost rapids]

I can relate to that perception. It's honestly not a bad idea imo

[stone vapor]

how did it caused some problems when it solved a big problem

lmao

[uncut slate]

well, you can check around in other feedback forums and find out. claymores slowed the game down and allowed defenders a chance to actually respond and claymores also helped prevent backcapping from being so easy and slowed those down too

[stone vapor]

bruh the spam was so dumb lmao

[uncut slate]

you can try and disagree, but the game is definitely much faster without claymores. attackers have really easy times just flooding over points with sheer numbers before the other team can react now

[stone vapor]

like a squad can literally cover whole old district with claymore

[lost rapids]

Not saying it wasn't a problem, just traded it for a less toxic problem

[stone vapor]

it was ok before people only discovered that stupid strat and started spamming

i mean big toxic problem

[lost rapids]

Less toxic, not nontoxic

[stone vapor]

lmao almost infinite amount of claymore can be placed that you can literally lock a team on one point

[uncut slate]

fact is, claymores allowed me to defend a point that keeps getting back capped without needing to get my whole squad together to hunt down the one guy hiding in a bush.

had a game on wakistan where the old F point kept having a heli drop an entire squad on it every minute. that stopped once the whole point got claymored up. my squad placed over 100 claymores total across the whole point to make it so that nobody in that heli could jump out anywhere on the point without setting one off. it forced them to go land a distance away and assault on foot.

we even held off a huge enemy push across the bridge with claymores long enough to let the rest of our team spawn in on the point and rally forth.

that was what claymore spam solved

[stone vapor]

it did and it had a big problem causing a team to get lockedup cuz of the claymore spam too

thats why it got nerfed

[uncut slate]

dude, im not disagreeing with you. im just stating that they traded one problem for another and barbed wire is obviously an attempt to slow the game down again

it literally slows you down and covers pretty much the same area a claymore would have

[stone lynx]

bro read the whole article, #1138402163085819965 message

It’s not even a page away

[stone vapor]

back capping should be a thing and spamming 100 claymore is dumb as hell and its a big problem removing the spam only gave minor inconvenience(did i spell that right im dumb)

[stone lynx]

you only see the 100 claymores and not see how long it took to set them up

Especially with the janky tripwire mechanic

[stone vapor]

bruh i know how long it takes since i spammed too lmao

and its not that even hard

[uncut slate]

did i say backcapping shouldnt be a thing?

i swear its like people join a feedback thread and then say like 1 or 2 things without even knowing what the genuine consensus is or what various problems of the game are

backcapping is seriously a problem right now. the whole spawning mechanics thread is full of discussions about how easy it is right now

[stone lynx]

speak to me what’s the angle you need to aim when setting a wire parallel to doorway

[uncut slate]

backcapping should be a thing but it is too easy and doesnt have enough risk for the reward it provides

[stone vapor]

i mean the only thing they should fix is reward for defending

[stone lynx]

Claymore was only “spammed” cuz it doesn’t despawn ngl

[stone vapor]

i agree

and it was dumb a big problem

[stone lynx]

If they despawn they’re just worse ap mines

[stone vapor]

back capping is easy yeah i agree

and people could only back cap cuz no one is defending

and theres no incentive to defend it

[long kettle]

So

[stone lynx]

you can always just take down a building to remove all claymores anyways

[long kettle]

you guys may want to look in the #1138744599905579058 discussion

[stone lynx]

[long kettle]

a good discussion of defense was in there a bit ago

you'll have to scroll up a bit past walk's stuff through

[stone vapor]

its not aboutt he doorways its how people put claymores more than you expect on the whole map that literally teams cant get out their territory and it was funny but it was the problem

[stone lynx]

Doesn’t make much difference it seems, spawn camping still a thing

And super common in any domination game

[stone vapor]

its a thing but way back with those claymore

it was terrible lmao

imagine going out BOOM

[stone lynx]

Not like you can’t see the wires

[stone vapor]

sure you can see the wires but not every wires

its funny people saying this when the nerfed happened cuz it really happened

even people seeing the wired didnt help

cuz of how many was there

[stone lynx]

that makes no sense

I got 0 claymore kills after the nerf btw

Almost feel like they don’t work at all without spamming

[uncut slate]

most mines are like that honestly. its why militaries use these things called minefields

[stone lynx]

Just makes c4 more brainless choice

[eager warren]

Claymores should obliterate what is in its field, if you can't see it you deserve what you're getting. If you step on a mine you and that stairwell should explode.

[molten sky]

I wish floors/ceilings get blown up more easily like walls/stairs

Allows for more whacky barb placement 😂

[long kettle]

(recalls a time a guy downed me before tbagging and sees him walk towards a building I setup two AP mines in) "I wouldn't go in there." (he walks in there with 5 others)

[stone lynx]

we need a setting to allow friendly fire and see claymore spam sending all allies to hell

[long kettle]

#off-topic message

[cedar furnace]

Why be able to run through barbed wire in the first place though

That's never how it was used in any game except R6, and the R6 wire could be electrified to deal actual amounts of damage, they also sprawl a much larger area and make noise when trouncing though it

[stone vapor]

cuz people abusing it to get exp

[cedar furnace]

Oh the horror

[quiet tinsel]

barbwire is nearly useless. ive seen it work twice ever. its too expensive and too fragile.

Wish it was a gadget more similar to in rainbow 6siege

[runic flicker]

Make it hurt enemies and make it cheaper. I think 15-20 points would be nice. Also allow to stack 2 barbed wires on top of each other

[long kettle]

I would say making it less fickle to place would also help and unable to be damaged by gunfire would help as well

[mighty veldt]

Agreeeed! Allow it to shrink or expand

[noble ocean]

Make it 2 stacked by default

[long kettle]

shall be blunt here, one stack doesn't do much at all (just jump through it, you don't take damage and take barely any longer, if I recall you need like 3 stacks or more to slow that down by a bit)

could make it so faster you move, harder it slows you down as well (So trying to sprint jump through it, you effectively become a fly on a spider web, jump through you lose a lot of momentum and slower you move, the less serious the debuff is (so walking would be same as now)

[runic leaf]

I believe that like all other buildings, you should be able to select them on keybinds. It would make building much quicker and easier.

[strong thunder]

Encountered an enemy barbwire the other day. Walked through it on purpose. Nothing happened.

At the very least the slow needs to be much stronger, disable ADS while under its effect and make a lot of noise while you're in contact with it.

[topaz python]

3 words for you.

add. damage. please.

[vivid cypress]

How do you propose they do this without just bringing back the XP exploit?

[long kettle]

suppose two things come to mind

1. make it easier to tell friendly from enemy & have only enemy ones able to hurt

2. Make it so when hurt it gives a XP debuff to healing it (So either a debuff or removal til fully healed)

[vivid cypress]

That helps a bit. Not sure if it’s enough for oki to consider it though

[vivid cypress]

I support this solution if its implementation is practical

[long kettle]

Being honest, it could most likely work off a changed version of the bleed code

simply have barbed wire be the only thing that applies it, and swap the various effects of the bleed for a if player has effect = XP reward x (multiplier here ; could be 0) along with setting the end condition to be player reaches full health rather than player gets bandaged

[vivid cypress]

I do not know how bleeding / healing XP is implemented so I personally wouldn’t comment on how to implement it as it would very likely have to be different to an idea I would have

[long kettle]

Well again

I used the idea of just using the bleeding code as a base to write off of

not make bleeding itself reduce the xp

[long kettle]

Suggestion idea round 2

Friendly fire resistance
Problem
Currently 1-2 C4 can blow up several lines of barbed wire & is easily usable to grief a defensive line in under afew seconds by a teammate (Everytime I have used barbed wire a teammate griefs the wire)

suggestion
50% or greater resistance to C4 from friendlies, possibly just make the wire in general resistant explosives & gunfire

[uneven zephyr]

gunfire in general shouldn't break barbed wire imo

[long kettle]

aye fair there

it is really too easy to break it without much risk right now either way

also possibly add a acceration delay when you pass through enemy barbed wire

(AKA instead of getting to your max speed instantly if you say,jump through it, you will need to actually accerate to it for a short time afterwards)

[long kettle]

this is barb wire feedback?

[wet fox]

Whoooops

[long kettle]

np

[quiet tinsel]

Barbed wire feels like a failed addition. I have never encountered enemy barbed wire since it was first added. i see friendly once in a while but its hard to tell if it ever get somebody or not

[long kettle]

juuling, a bit of the reason why is due to not really working per say

It has the issue of only slowing down but can easily be sprint jumped through

doesn't make much noise to alert to someone going through it

easily destroyed due to C4

no damage

fickle to place

etc

[noble ocean]

(Not placable on objectives, partially defeating their actual purpose)

[long kettle]

that silly no spawn placing mechanic gets annoying & fast

[quiet tinsel]

Barbwire should be a gadget not a building.
Engineer and support can use them. Limit of how about 8-12 like how mines have limits. So it's not squad dependent and not extremely spammy.

Since almost no one uses it and building something repetitive is annoying I think just placing it would be way easier and fluid

[noble ocean]

Have Barbed wire inflict no damage, but inflict bleeding to discourage running through it

[fathom cove]

They came with damaged/Bleed before and immediately was used for xp boosting on a large scale.
(Though it probably isn't as effective than being a repair maid now. )

[alpine notch]

XP boosting. Really? Does it really matter that much?

[fathom cove]

Well the contracts for hosting a official progression community says, it really do,

Not my biggest concern, but it is something people get recorded and banned for I heard somehing about stats being wiped.. Kinda funny if tru.