#FACEit anticheat is a bad move

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

storm panther
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Considering that the game will only be sold through Steam, and that the Steam Deck user base keeps growing, in what world does it make sense to have an anticheat that doesn't allow Linux players to play?? I know they'll still support EAC but only on community servers, and I'm not about to pay for a game to be prohibited from playing on official servers, or give me a 50% discount since I can't play on half the game.

The dev should either back out of FACEit anticheat or drop EAC, it will be a nightmare to support both and no sane Linux player will buy this game at full price to be treated like a subpar player. I was really enjoying this game, what a shame, it even seemed like it had a very healthy community and support for Linux, what went wrong in just a couple of weeks??

INB4: Switching to Windows is not a solution, some of us don't want to use Windows and have been playing the game nicely so far. I've encountered 0 cheaters so far, so the "Linux will make more cheaters" thing is not a thing either, most if not all cheaters will be on Windows.

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wicked berry
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faceit will only be running in official server

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community servers will still use EAC

storm panther
wicked berry
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oki is not satisfied with EAC and deal is already done so we cant really do anything about it tbh

image.png
storm panther
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I know there is no backing out, but I still wanted to say something, I can't imagine this being the only solution but it's whatever

wicked berry
storm panther
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I was just voicing my opinion man, if you've got nothing to say then don't say anything

fleet inlet
frail zealot
storm panther
frail zealot
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how is it half the game?
you still get community servers which have all the same stuff as official servers

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and if you rent
you can choose faceit or EAC
so those servers may fall under the official database
and at that point your still getting the entire game

now if theyre using different databases for community servers (which is planned) then i could somewhat barley see what your talking about
but with renting theyll most likely fall under official databases vs community/self hosted

storm panther
storm panther
frail zealot
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stats

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ranks etc

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those will be separate from official servers

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rented will most likely follow the official database

storm panther
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That's not even the point, the point is that Linux users will not be able to play official servers

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whether they are renter or whaterver you want it

frail zealot
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they still get to play the game

storm panther
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Yes but it's a slap in the face

frail zealot
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not for me
and i use arch

storm panther
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I'm not gonna buy a game where I'm a second class player

storm panther
frail zealot
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quickplay will most likely put players in their said servers

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and if they cant join official
most likely will put them in the next best thing

storm panther
frail zealot
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i mean look at BF servers

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no one played official

storm panther
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They are not the same game, community servers thrive because either they have a lot of customization (which is not the case) or are better than official (which will not be the case either as they've been quite a pleasant experience)

frail zealot
storm panther
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If you use Linux and play this game then prepare yourself to not be able to play with your friends and to have access to a small portion of servers

storm panther
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and even then, most of the time what people want to play is the vanilla experience which you don't get on customized servers

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Then again, the experience on Linux is subpar compared to Windows, so I think they should not be the same price if the devs want to cater to the Linux folks, which they don't have to if they don't want

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Saying it's compatible with Linux is false and a slap to the face

frail zealot
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  • Will Linux/MacOS be supported?
    We are not officially supporting these operating systems for the time being, However, despite the fact that we haven't tested it thoroughly, our players have reported that Proton 6.3-8 for Linux (and other equivalent compatibility layers for MacOS) work just fine. If you encounter any errors with the compatibility layers, please let me know.
storm panther
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I know, I never said they said that, but they shouldn't dare say it

scarlet narwhal
frail zealot
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spend a few years with linux
dual booting is nothing

scarlet narwhal
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I'd say that, at launch, it'll be a 50/50

frail zealot
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nor care

storm panther
# scarlet narwhal You're assuming a LOT by saying this.

Am I? Even in games like TF2 or CSGO where there are a lot more incentive to play on community servers, no one would say that a majority of people play solely on community servers, you average joe just hops on and clicks on quickplay

storm panther
scarlet narwhal
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And yes, you are

storm panther
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I understand the decision of the devs and I'm not here to say Linux rules and anyone who thinks different is wrong, I'm just saying that I feel it's not a good move and that it's the end for Linux players on this game, which is totally OK if the devs don't want to support Linux

storm panther
storm panther
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I'm not here saying others don't know anything, how would you know if I'm knowledgeable on Linux or not just because I don't want to dualboot??

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And what does it have to do with Linux support on BattleBit?

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The matter was never "Should I dualboot"

scarlet narwhal
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This is a certified mald moment

storm panther
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lmao what even is that

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I'm just saying that the experience between Linux and Windows players will differ significantly, I don't know why the conversation keeps derailing into "Just use Windows"

jagged flare
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First, dualboot is not a solution, it's a workaround.

Second, the problem is the AC Vendor not making a Linux version (That can be perfectly made without any problems). They could do it for CSGO since CSGO runs natively and not using translation layers like Wine/Proton so it can interact with AC drivers (.ko files in this case, .sys for windows)

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At least oki didn't remove EAC completely. If he did that I probably fall into despair

scarlet narwhal
# storm panther I'm just saying that the experience between Linux and Windows players will diffe...

It's either that or play on community servers.
Complaining ain't gonna change anything.

And another thig to note: you can only play on 1 server at a time, so even if half of the servers are unavailable to you, you're going to play the same game in the same way, so idk why you keep bringing up the "only half a game" argument, you're not gonna play less just because you're playing on a custom 144hz server with local moderation instead of a 60hz server without said local moderation.

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You're literally just malding at this point

scarlet narwhal
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He's complaining for the sake of complaining

storm panther
scarlet narwhal
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It's the same game

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same gameplay

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same everything

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We have community servers RIGHT NOW running during the playtests

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You wanna know the difference between them and the official ones?

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Higher tickrate

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that's it

storm panther
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I'm not complaining, I was just voicing my opinion, you tryina make it something else, this is literally the #1019712628970508338 channel, to, you guessed it, give feedback

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this is feedback

scarlet narwhal
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Last playtest the Brazilian servers were shut down cuz everyone was playing on the community hosted ones

scarlet narwhal
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Your points are baseless and you just want to vent your blind frustration

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I'll say it again

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Malding moment

jagged flare
scarlet narwhal
storm panther
# scarlet narwhal You are 100% complaining

How come? I never said anything against the devs, I was stating that Linux doesn't get the same treatment as Windows, and as a Linux user I'm against that, so I gave FEEDBACK

scarlet narwhal
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go for a walk

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etc

storm panther
# scarlet narwhal How does it hurt the experience?

I know it's the same gameplay, but the access to official servers would be restricted, if I want to play with my friends then they would have to accommodate me and find a suitable community server instead of just hoping on and playing like a Windows user would do, and nothing guarantees the quality of community servers like official ones do

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it's a matter of principle

scarlet narwhal
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How's that a problem

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??

storm panther
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you blind man

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I've been saying that since the start of this thread

scarlet narwhal
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You've been saying a load of nonsense since the start of this thread

storm panther
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lmao

jagged flare
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Its ova, just beg FaceIT and a Native version of BBR for Linux

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(I use Linux as daily basis).

storm panther
scarlet narwhal
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The issue is that you're mad, that has been made very clear

storm panther
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Imagine buying COD and being insta-banned from all servers except private ones, it's the same game with the same gameplay but it's not the same thing

wicked berry
jagged flare
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Thanks steam

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Thanks gaben

wicked berry
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faceit reddit filled with ppl asking to linux support HyperXD

storm panther
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I never meant for this thread to become the shithole that it is, it was never about community servers vs official servers, people man

jagged flare
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Imagine being in a competitive game and BAM*, Windows starts doing things in the background lool

storm panther
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that's part of why I'm on Linux but some people can't even fathom the concept of not using Windows

wicked berry
sly dew
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"Half the game" "2nd class player"

Comon, by using anything other then Windows you know some games dont even are supported.

Are you playing all the gamemodes? I am not, I dont like gungame should that give me a discount on the game becasue of that?

I think the community servers will be more popular due to facts as active admins, yeah if you rent a server you will have faceit anti cheat and I can see ppl wanna play there more then on eac servers but this is not the devs fault. Its the cheat makers and the cheaters fault.

Anyway its just crazy talk about you feeling like an 2nd class player and you only get half the game. You have a solution, you dont want it. Accept that and move on.

The offended generation about everything is lame.

storm panther
# sly dew "Half the game" "2nd class player" Comon, by using anything other then Windows...

I'm okay with this game not supporting Linux, I was just pointing out the clear disadvantages of FACEit AC for Linux players.

Linux is technically currently supported, the move to FACEit AC will make Linux unsupported for a big part of the game, so Linux was and could be supported with other AC but I totally understand the devs decision.

Gamemodes it's not a valid comparison, you can still play all gamemodes even if you don't want to, whereas in Linux we'd simply not have access to any official servers even if we wanted to, there would simply be less you can access in Linux.

Whether community servers will be better and more popular than official servers has nothing to do with Linux support, it's the fact that the game will not support Linux on official servers.

For me switching to Windows is not a solution, period, if the game doesn't run properly on Linux then I won't play the game which is totally ok. Or like I suggested I would consider buying the game at a discount if they sell me a community-only servers version, given that I wouldn't be given access to that part anyway, at full price I would be paying for something I cannot access.

Then again, I totally understand the devs decision, that doesn't change the fact that I'm unhappy about the decision because I was really enjoying the game, so I'm giving feedback in the #1019712628970508338 channel, it's the whole point of the channel, if you want to turn it in me being lame and offended sure go for it but it's not the case at all.

hearty valley
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its so pathetic and embarrassing

abstract geyser
storm panther
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nowadays it's not very hard to support Linux, I mean the game is running butter smooth right now with no real effort from the devs to support it, the biggest issue always is anticheats, I hope one day this is becomes a non issue

sleek crag
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Of course this clown also made a thread on top of the bullshit in the other channel. lol

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The Linux community, if you can call it that, itself is already one reason why hardly anyone wants to even try it. For being a tiny minority, they're way too much of a toxic, entitled cesspit.

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Funny how you ask for a compromise to save a few measly bucks, but you're unwilling to use dualboot. The sheer irony.

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So again: Yes. Using Windows is a solution. Dualboot exists for a reason.

storm panther
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You calling me a clown and I'm the toxic and entitled one?? sheesh

fleet inlet
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This is already going into the wrong direction again

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@sleek crag Please refrain from personal attacks.

sleek crag
fleet inlet
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I know what he said, still, no need to escalate it again

storm panther
sleek crag
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He's gotta take at least that much for burning my retinas with that giant ass white picture in the OP. 😭

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At least make the Tux transparent.

storm panther
sleek crag
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And some of your responses there gave me a very entitled impression, hence the "clown" part.

abstract geyser
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And also you need internet to play this game

sleek crag
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If that's not the case, apologies.

storm panther
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It is an option in the same sense that vegetarians have the option to eat meat in a restaurant that doesn't have vegetarians options, vegetarians will not like that restaurant so they wont eat there, in the same sense that if I can't properly play the game with my setup (Linux only, whether people like it or not) then I wont play it, there is no deeper meaning or attack to it

sleek crag
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That metaphor makes sense until you remember that they chose to be vegetarian. An issue of their own creation.

abstract geyser
sleek crag
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I'd get if it was something that was actually hard for you to get around, for an issue you're not responsible for.

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But like...dual boot. It's that simple. 😭

storm panther
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Except it's not an issue, the game not supporting Linux is totally OK, I just wish this game was an option for me because I don't wish to install the spyware that is Window$

sleek crag
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You made a thread for it, it's an issue to you to some degree. Otherwise you wouldn't care and wouldn't be here now.

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Get an ISO of Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC, firewall it on top and you get Windows with 0 spying and other garbage. If it's just for gaming, that much should suffice.

abstract geyser
sleek crag
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It's just so much simpler than hoping for support that may never come.

storm panther
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Point is, there is a (small) portion of the userbase like myself that is only on Linux, there is no argument you can make that will make me install Window$ in any capacity, if the game doesn't want to support Linux then I won't play it, simple as that

sleek crag
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And with that you limit only yourself. 🫡

abstract geyser
sleek crag
storm panther
abstract geyser
sleek crag
sleek crag
abstract geyser
storm panther
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whether you understand it or not it's not my problem

sleek crag
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I am starting to think it's less of a conviction and more of a delusion..oh well. Whatever works for you.

abstract geyser
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Can you point where Windows is a spying software

storm panther
sleek crag
abstract geyser
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@storm panther how expensive is your pc. Just asking

sleek crag
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Next to all games, SP games included, phone home by default, unless firewalled. Just for telemetry, at minimum.

storm panther
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This is not a Windows vs Linux comparison, why does it keep derailing like this 🙃

abstract geyser
sleek crag
storm panther
sleek crag
sleek crag
storm panther
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and no, using a firewall is nowhere near enough, not even a little bit

sleek crag
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That article lost me with that UEFI crap already.
We don't even have access to actual alternatives to that yet. You'll have that with or without Linux...unless you use some ancient hardware.

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Though AMD is working on open sourcing that in the future.

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So rejoice on that front, I guess

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But yeah, generally "Nonfree (proprietary) software is very often malware (designed to mistreat the user). " is a great way to lose any sane reader.

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That's just plain radical.

storm panther
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GNU tends to be quite radical, but I think that their points still stand or are at least food for thought

sleek crag
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Even the sources are sensationalized. 💀

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That part about bitlocker is just omegalul.

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There's no backdoor. Simply don't use an MS account and you don't have to worry about that key ever leaving your side.

sleek crag
storm panther
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alright dude, sure, do whatever, you are clearly not listening and don't want to hear someone else's opinion

sleek crag
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I don't think you can judge that, linking websites like that. 💀

storm panther
storm panther
sleek crag
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Literally making shit up, or at least taking it out of context.

storm panther
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How do you know it's made up?

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it seems pretty on brand to me

sleek crag
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There's virtually zero evidence on this.
And the article linked talks about the key being backed up in your MS account by default.

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Alas it's massively sensationalized at best.

storm panther
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Isn't that a security concern? If I have sensitive data on my encrypted hard drive, why does Microsoft need to be able to read the data I'm trying to secure?

sleek crag
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If it was stored in a way they can access, potentially.
Given E2EE exists, they might not even be able to access it themselves.
And lets be real, anyone using an MS account isn't taking security serious anyway.

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#LocalAccountForever

storm panther
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The issue is that as soon as someone points out that Microsoft spies on Windows users you get treated like a tinfoil hat crazy person when in reality they should demand better treatment from their OS, as soon as someone says anything against Windows people become Microsoft white knights

sleek crag
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Yeah and that's bullshit. I am well aware of Macroshit's issues. I'd rather not use their crap either, but it's the best compromise I have.
Still doesn't mean I am gonna accept people spreading misinformation.

storm panther
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and that's just one issue

sleek crag
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I should be using dualboot, but I switch between gaming and other tasks too often, so I just gotta stick with Windows. HyperXD

sleek crag
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I am using the latest Win11 with a local account.

storm panther
abstract geyser
storm panther
sleek crag
sleek crag
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Like, I have no pity for those that can't even do that.

storm panther
storm panther
abstract geyser
sleek crag
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Technically that is the path of the least resistance.
Instead they go ahead and set up an online account. Whack

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Well, takes the knowledge to use it, I guess.

storm panther
abstract geyser
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@storm panther can you answer what pc you have?

sleek crag
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Yeah but that thread serves no purpose, because Oki is well aware of this already. Yet he made the decision anyway, even left EAC as alternative (partially because he had to, I guess).

storm panther
jagged flare
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Oki simply cares more about the cheaters than the Linux players, but at least he left EAC in the game so i am happy with it

sleek crag
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The good ol Discord trolling people with the autoscroll.

storm panther
jagged flare
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But i get the point of getting excluded just because of the anti cheat

sleek crag
jagged flare
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anyways, nothing to do about it

storm panther
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literally the definition of feedback:
information or statements of opinion about something, such as a new product, that can tell you if it is successful or liked

jagged flare
sleek crag
jagged flare
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Time to buy 16GB of ram to host servers

sleek crag
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Again, the thread is basically nothing more than "You made this decision, but I don't want you to keep this decision". Which he already knows. We're all aware of the downside of it.

jagged flare
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because i have 8GB in my server :(

storm panther
# sleek crag Common sense 🗿

then why did you say that this thread serves no purpose, this is feedback in the feedback channel,

Just a refresher
Feedback: information or statements of opinion about something, such as a new product, that can tell you if it is successful or liked

jagged flare
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lul

sleek crag
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As I just elaborated.

storm panther
sleek crag
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"Today was a nice day" is also feedback.
But it serves no purpose.

storm panther
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if you don't agree with my feedback that's cool, but this thread has a purpose because it's feedback

sleek crag
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No no no, things don't have purpose for the sake of having purpose. 💀

abstract geyser
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@storm panther servers are on Windows too if you didnt know

storm panther
sleek crag
storm panther
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If you wanna say "Today was a nice day" go to the appropriate server and that would be appropriate feedback

jagged flare
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They can run on Linux too but that doesn't matter

sleek crag
jagged flare
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ic

sleek crag
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I've been trying to teach that boy for months.

abstract geyser
jagged flare
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tech

sleek crag
hearty valley
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why do yall get so personal offended in these chats

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its so embarassing actually

sly dew
storm panther
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sure

dense tulip
sleek crag
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Which means they're basically out of almost every online game anyway.

dense tulip
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oh EAC is also running on a kernel level? Why dont users have to reboot after installing?

sleek crag
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Not every service needs to do that.

dense tulip
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Wouldnt kernel level anti cheats need to load with the kernel though? I thought that only happens on boot

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I might be missing something

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Nah now that I think about it some things can be loaded post boot

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I guess it depends on the level of access a driver needs

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like ring 0 access

sleek crag
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Ring 0 is kernel.

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I wonder how many people are anti-kernel AC but use it unknowingly. kittenThinking

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Can't really quickly find any info as to why the reboot is there.

dense tulip
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but ring 0 access programs can only be loaded on boot to my knowledge

sleek crag
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Might just try to access restricted areas in the system files, that might need a reboot.

sleek crag
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Windows can grant ring 0 access to random ass drivers at any time. lmao

dense tulip
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lol

sleek crag
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I don't know to what extend this can affect an instance of Proton, though.

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But don't assume you're "safe" just because it's Linux.

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The majority of security on Linux comes from the fact that it is a tiny market, so almost no one writes malware for it.

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But for the same reason, I doubt EAC could pose much of a harm for it.

dense tulip
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But I still like gaming so I do a few compromises here and there

sleek crag
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What use is open source to you if you don't understand it? kittenThinking

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I mean, I prefer it as well, but unless we can examine the code, we're still just relying on randos.

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And the BIOS ain't open source either way, not yet anyway

dense tulip
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I mean in popular software there's a lower chance of weird stuff being in it as there are people who look into the code. Also it's less financially driven and made with the user in mind (at least most of the time, there are exceptions of course)

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But I'm not gonna pretend I'm examining the code of all.software I use lmao

sleek crag
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Yeah, but we bot hare just relying on trust, in the end.

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If there's suddenly malware being pushed, we rely on others to tell us that, too.

dense tulip
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ye definitely

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It's just a matter on who you put your trust in

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I just happen to trust community driven projects more than profit driven corporations more

sleek crag
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Meanwhile, with open source there, is more (idk why I wrote less) of a risk of getting into any issues with it. We didn't pay for anything, we just use that software. If they decide to fuck us over, what can we even do?
Companies, however, can quickly run into legal issues for that.

dense tulip
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but in the end it's a trust issue unless you're examining everything yourself

sleek crag
dense tulip
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also if microsoft were to do some weird things to windows I just have to accept that

sleek crag
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But if we're being real, 99% of the users can't/will never do that.

dense tulip
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on linux I can just choose to use different pieces of software

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less centralized power

sleek crag
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It's really just a matter of who gets to do the work.

dense tulip
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ofc that isnt a guarantee for the future

sleek crag
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Yup

dense tulip
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gotta go btw, got uni, but nice chat

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have a good one

sleek crag
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You too. 🫡

jagged flare
storm panther
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EAC doesn't use kernel modules, it runs in the user space in Linux, making it a kernel module would force them to open source it or be in a gray legal area like the Nvidia drivers

storm panther
stable blaze
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Info: If they only uset the faceit server side ac you could still play with linux / steamOS

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BUT the linux / steamos market is below 2% of the steam userbase..

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To protect the game against cheaters the client would be good (with hwid bans etc)
if someone got banned on csgo for example for cheating they cant play bbr

dense tulip
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I manually load/unload modules quite frequently so idk why I even said that lol

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I got confused because some require rebooting

sleek crag
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As far as I can see, the kernel level part is mostly due to performance reasons (since Windows is a piece of shit), so it apparently doesn't actually need it on Linux.

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Intriguing.

jagged flare
jagged flare
frail zealot
jagged flare
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HWID checks are easy to bypass too, on windows and Linux

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Kernel level anticheats like faceit just make the development of cheats more harder since they are running at kernel level (Ring 0, the lowest ring at OS level), you need to go deeper, to ring -1 (Hypervisor), -2 (some sort of CPU level) , or even -3 (The CPU itself, or the Co-Processor of the CPU, AMD PSP or INTEL Management engine)

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So at kernel level they can prevent cheating in almost any form, if someone wants to cheat he needs to use a Virtual Machine or the same level of privileges than the AC (Ring 0)

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(I really hate that bot)

jMluSx.png
frail zealot
jagged flare
frail zealot
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yeah

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oki will need to turn it on and off when working with docker n shit

jagged flare
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Oh yeah but if you are on Linux it's running under KVM, the person just needs to make sure to spoof the VM so the AC can't detect it easily right?

frail zealot
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that im not 100% sure

jagged flare
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This is useful :p inv (dot) zzls (dot) xyz/watch?v=L1JCCdo1bG4

sleek crag
bitter tapir
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faceit ac sucks dick and im not about to pay for a game that forces me to install monitoring software that runs/monitors even when im not in game

frail zealot
jaunty crow
frail zealot
#

^^^this!!!!

elder kindle
#

sorry but singe and simple fact completely stomps take of this topic, consider checking at least a bit of data before making one

image.png
frail zealot
elder kindle
frail zealot
elder kindle
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pink better

abstract geyser
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White better and i like my leather jacket

sleek crag
sleek crag
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Good luck finding any competitive online game, made in the past 5 years or so, that has none.

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Even the god damn desktop gachas (genshin, star rail) have them for some cursed reason. The latter doesn't even have any MP at all. HyperXD

jaunty crow
sleek crag
bitter tapir
sleek crag
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Cool story, kid.

storm panther
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Imma close this thread, I hope that something is done for Linux gamers as the game is really good, but I totally get the devs choice

abstract geyser
worn flame
fierce hound
#

Remove steam client authorization
Add a 100% client side anticheat
See no one gets banned and wonder why 😂

wicked berry
wicked berry
worn flame
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Yeah, I'll close this then. Since the OP left the thread.

sleek crag
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You thought you closed it, but you didn't! Hah!

forest hound
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Goim fell asleep and forgot to press lock thread

sleek crag
hard fable