val need a nerf

[nova bramble]

all i gotta say. you literally cannot contest with that gun in duels, its already ruining games because 6/10 people u run into are using the vals and the only way to counter it is to use the val

[dry jasper]

skill issue

[patent knoll]

I agree it is quite strong, i think it should keep its high damage at close range but should have damage falloff kick in much sooner after 20 meters or so

same with kirss

[patent knoll]

its always funny when someone tries to bring up a really obvious balance issue about a gun being much better than all others for most situations and all the best players only use that gun

and then a bunch of dogs come in and spam "skill issue"

the game is better for everyone when everything is balanced

[nova bramble]

i honestly dont even give a fuck, they both ass players who use the val crutch so its okay. Just val is too op rn all it is everybody whos actually good at the game will agree lmfao

[patent knoll]

agreed, i honestly have the opinion that only the SCAR and FAL assault rifles should get 3 shot to kill, and the heavy barrel that brings other guns guns to the 3 shot to kill threshold should come with much grater recoil nerfs

[nova bramble]

the as val has a faster ttk then both of those weapons too lol the scar by .5 and the fal by. .3

[patent knoll]

lmao

and no recoil XD

[foggy mural]

HWUELL ACSHUALLY most players are running 12 armor or more so the FAL kills faster than VAL...

But regardless of the math I agree the VAL is a little overtuned.

[patent knoll]

most players cant handle the FAL recoil

[wicked beacon]

honey badger better

[foggy mural]

Depends on attachments unlocked. VAL mags are better than HB

[wicked beacon]

this guy is talking about duel 1v1, so if you struggle because mag is too small then its real skill issue

[foggy mural]

Then they're literally the same gun lol

[wicked beacon]

boom thread done, found competition for the gun

[dapper coyote]

both need a nerf

[nova bramble]

when 2 out of like 20+ guns can keep up with the val yk theirs a problem

[wicked beacon]

3 if you count the L8

atleast it isnt like the og Scar or ak 15

if you were around when those 2 ran the place sheeeesh

wild times they were

[foggy mural]

I think while the VAL is strong it is a little overhyped. P90, Vector, AK15 are all also good contenders in general, and not every fight is a duel

[hushed holly]

Nerfing ridiculous metas and seeing ppl mald is fun

[dapper coyote]

engi nerf was funny 😂

[patent knoll]

what got nerfed for engie?

[dry swan]

this is the best opinion about the scar/fal that ive seen.

[foggy mural]

the empty vest used to give 110% percent movement speed

[nova bramble]

bro what ????

theirs no way u said the p90 can contest with the val

[hushed holly]

Val is not overhyped at all.
While the weapons you mentioned have their niche and are quite balanced in general, they don't even come close to the ridiculousness that is the Val and the HB

[nova bramble]

look at the ttk chart, val has shortest ttk across the board. by like .5ms . i can continue to play against its nkt the biggest deal just when everybody is running around with a val you will be able to see the difference

only way ur beating a val is if you use hb or vector or the val itself

kinda stupid

[hushed holly]

And even with the Vector, the ttk difference is still quite massive

[nova bramble]

only gun that comes close is the l89a1 and thats stil a .04 difference

[hushed holly]

The only times where I'd shoot first, hit first and STILL DIE was against the Val and the HB

[hushed holly]

But the L89 in a support weapon and it's slow.
You'll die before you're even able to fully ads with it.

[nova bramble]

exactly

[foggy mural]

Bro whaaaaaaaat I do look at the ttk chart I look at it everyday. You're not shooting everyone in the limbs or on empty helmet / armor all the time - usually it's light.

Aside from that let's go to medium range against things like the AK or vector with very little horizontal recoil. You're going to hit more shots.

I didnt say it wasnt strong. I think people are making it sound like the gap between the VAL and the next few strongest guns is so large that it's absolutely no contest

[nova bramble]

i mean the val and vector are the strongest weapons, those are the 2 strongest in the game rn the val is just easier to use. if Val and vector were S+ tier then the rest of the guns would be A tier or below lol

and even on normal ttk with light armor the ttk time is still .5 faster then most of the guns so

[foggy mural]

Maybe I wasn't clear in my point. I was saying it was a little overhyped but it is still strong. As in, it is absolutely S tier but there are still other competitive guns. I see people talking about the VAL like no other weapon ever has a chance which is just not true. Also we can't decide how strong a gun is in a "duel" scenario because that's the gun's niche.

[nova bramble]

because its true no other weapon besides vector is beating the val and thats the truth, thats not balanced lol. your acting like the val is strongest out of like 4 guns when theirs 20+ guns that cannot even compete with the val. in duel scenarios or group scenarios.

[foggy mural]

so buff the 20+ guns

or nerf all 4

why are we singling out the VAL

[nova bramble]

did u even read what i said

somebody already made a post about the vector

and guns dont need buffs to keep up, that causes power creep and nobody enjoys that. the val and vector are literally the best guns run now at any range and complete demolishes any other gun, thats not balanced

[foggy mural]

At any range really? Maybe a little exaggeration

[nova bramble]

if u have decent recoil control and aim, you can beam with both of those no matter how far

[arctic gulch]

I agree the vals have actually been keeping me away from the playtests. Last 3 plays have been vals and vectors 70% of the time. Gets really boring after awhile

Lower bullet velocity and dmg

[arctic gulch]

No it's not, I've gotten beamed by vectors from over 100ms

[foggy mural]

that's insane, nerf this gun immediately

[vital cliff]

Or... you know.... AS VAL user runs out of ammo while you're chugging away with 50 rounds with the p90 lol.

[nova bramble]

u come across anybody with a 5 year old sense of aim your dead before you even get 3 bullets out of ur p90

[vital cliff]

I'm talking real life scenarios where the wild Val user slaughters 3-4 of your teammates and comes to you, the chad p90 50 round standard user.

lol

Those 15s of reload on the ASVAL is when the chad90 user strikes

I'm memeing obviously, but that's really the only times I kill a VAL or if I have better head aim than them.

[nova bramble]

its hard to tell so many people think the val isnt busted 💀💀

[vital cliff]

we had this discussion in general when we agreed on nerf -> buffs lol

[rain sundial]

a lot of guns need to be brought up to be competitive
the val needs to be brought down
similarly the vector needs to be brought down
as does the m200

[nova bramble]

val n vector need tk be brought down for now

then from that see what needs the buffs

a lot of guns arent bad, just the meta guns are so fuckin good they make the other guns look bad

[patent knoll]

true the aug isnt neccesarily bad, but is outclassed by every other assault rifle imo

[foggy mural]

just in ttk... are we supposed to give every gun exactly the same stats? lol

[patent knoll]

no but guns should be balanced out with higher recoil for higher ttk or mag size downsides etc

[foggy mural]

it's *kinda in that direction

[rain sundial]

no but realistically speaking ttk is the only thing that matters

[patent knoll]

well ttk, weapon range, and shots to kill should all be balanced together

the Kriss and AS VAL should suck at med-longer ranges

but the dont lol

[rain sundial]

doesn't matter how accurate or how little recoil the aug or sg550 has, it's going to get fucking destroyed by pretty much every other gun

[placid scarab]

If only there was more important things to do than balance every weapon every week.

[patent knoll]

ok dweeb

[placid scarab]

Okay, so Val is nerfed. Problem solved? No because next week you'll complain about another weapon.. So unless all weapons have the same damage, firerate, accuracy, you'll always be complaining about a weapon that is used a lot accept the fact that weapons aren't equal in all situations.

[foggy mural]

Then we should only have maybe 2 guns in the game anyways because any gun with higher ttk is going to be pointless? I'm confused

[patent knoll]

no ur being obtuse no offence

[patent knoll]

most can accept that some weapons will be stronger or weaker in certain situations or in general, but as long as the gap in weapon performance isnt too big then its ok

in this siteation, the VAL outperforms other guns by such a wide margin that it really really needs to be brought down a peg

[patent knoll]

i dont understand? saying there is a clear balance issue that most of the top players agree with doesnt automatically mean its a skill issue

[foggy mural]

where are you seeing stats on who are the top players?

[patent knoll]

i saw it in a dream

https://tenor.com/view/car-lamborghini-car-explosion-smooth-slide-in-car-slide-car-gif-22251727

[nova bramble]

your such a square

its actually crazu

[placid scarab]

Facts hurts huh?

[patent knoll]

a balanced game is a better game

hows that fact for you?

[placid scarab]

A game that is still not out yet and has more important things to do than balance weapons every week.?

[patent knoll]

we know they wont be working on balance for a while until at least early access

we are all talking about when we reach the point where they can focus on baalnce

[placid scarab]

So why spend time crying over this, fucking move on kids

[patent knoll]

ur the one that seems very upset

consider consuming a chill pill

[placid scarab]

Reading the same posts over and over with kids crying about nerfing weapons.

[patent knoll]

cope

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1074381665780121664/1074443599346925588/ItIsWhatItIs.png

[nova bramble]

ur such a block

what channel does this say willie

it says feedback

and the feedback is that the val/vector out performs most assault and carbines

[rain sundial]

what's the val damage? 35 or something?

[daring moon]

@rain sundial has earned the Tier II Member role!

[foggy mural]

yes

[rain sundial]

imagine 35 base damage and an integrated suppressor with the val's firerate and then "oh but it only has 20 rounds in a mag"

[patent knoll]

And you can get extended mags lol

[rain sundial]

if memory serves

honey badger is supposed to be the high ammo cap version of the val

which is ironic

because extended mag honey badger has fewer rounds in it than the extended mag val

unless I'm blatantly misremembering

[foggy mural]

Also correct. Hb gets a whopping 28 rounds (4 extra) and Val gets 30 (10 extra)

[rain sundial]

[patent knoll]

clear VAL favoritism

[foggy mural]

AND it still has a lower reload speed

[rain sundial]

fantastic

good shit good shit

[hushed spoke]

i think some weapons like val or vector must be usable only for some leaders or shit, then nobody will cry about it, or nerf it to death and nobody will chose its

[uncut quail]

the AS VAL is an integrally suppressed carbine. the entire point of the gun is that it fires fast with little recoil, but it has shit velocity and falls off hard at range, which it needs to do more

[nova bramble]

damage fallout is virtually nothing on the val

[uncut quail]

you're shitting me @nova bramble

[nova bramble]

bro u can lazer sith that gun from range what are u talking about

[uncut quail]

damn

shits hella not balanced then

nerf that

im tired of getting absolutely domed with vals cross map too

[nova bramble]

i cant tell if ur being sarcastic or not

[vital cliff]

I do not understand why Oki and them continually ignore how bad the ASVAL is

70m fastest TTK

It's tbh kind of whack

[snow minnow]

How about buff the garbage guns so they're actually on par?

[snow minnow]

That's why

[nova bramble]

power creep

why work on 20+ guns

when u can nerf 3 down to the others level

like how foolish can yall be

[snow minnow]

There are weapons underperforming either way

We shouldn't just forget about them

Otherwise idk why even include them

[nova bramble]

you nerf then buff off nerfs

you dont buff then nerf

[snow minnow]

Or how about both

[vital cliff]

You dont do buffs first

[placid ocean]

this is a nice spreadsheet, i would like to make my own copy further separated by weapon types. if it's not too much to ask can you point me to a link?

[nova bramble]

yeah once u do the nerfs first

then u can see what guns are really underperforming to buff

[foggy mural]

What would be an actual reasonable nerf?
Damage? Damage drop off? Reload speed? Where do you see it being too strong?

If it's ttk then the HB and l86 gotta be nerfed simultaneously

[nova bramble]

damage drop off, but that correlates with damage so. its 3 shot at virtually any range, with fast ass fire rate

[vital cliff]

And FAL should get nerfed too

Aint no way 220m 3 tap is ok

[foggy mural]

Id agree if the recoil / accuracy was reasonable for that distance. That's pretty hard to pull off. If you're arguing that, then you need to nerf ak15 and scar too.

[dry swan]

Scar should be nerfed too.

[hushed holly]

Try not to have the shittiest balance takes challenge (impossible)

[nova bramble]

me or ??

[hushed holly]

"FAL should get nerfed too"

I saw a guy saying that both AKs were fine, but the m4 needed to be nerfed

idk what game these ppl are playing

[lime dock]

I think that for now weapon balance could be left alone tbh... I think the devs need to just add more weapons to the game and after that see what needs buffing, nerfing or debuffing or whatever

[foggy mural]

Weapon balance will be left alone til EA anyways.

I think at this point it makes more sense to reduce stat variation and just make different guns reskins of meta weapons.

Ex. Make all the standard rifles have same damage profile and stats. Then do something similar with all the other groups. Leave unique or niche guns as unique (p90 as ex.)

I just feel like adding weapons with more and more different stats will be leaving other guns in the dust even if they look cool. We live in the age of gaming optimization

[lime dock]

I just hope they add more weapons like PKM. And new faction(s). Like China for example.

[foggy mural]

Yeah I'd like that too. But just in the interest of keeping things simple, the PKM could just be a reskin of the M249. Then you're not worried about picking the "best" gun. Just the one you like more from an aesthetic perspective

[lime dock]

PKM has to be lighter. I support optimization but I would also like to feel the aesthetic of the gun

[rain sundial]

"balance is weird and difficult to get right"
"they should focus on giving us new weapons instead"
🤤

[wicked beacon]

Should of seen that thing a year ago, 1 shot headshots

[dapper coyote]

drum mags

https://tenor.com/view/mujikcboro-seriymujik-gif-24361533

no recoil

1 shot headshot

drum mags

https://tenor.com/view/mujikcboro-seriymujik-gif-24361533

[wicked beacon]

What an era that was

[rain sundial]

I miss old battlebit 😢

[dapper coyote]

2022 battlebit*

[lime dock]

An FPS game should not be about "what gun do you like aesthetically more"

If that was to be the case just remove all weapon stats, make then do the exact same damage same fire rate same velocity same attachments but just make them look different

[lime dock]

Ye I think that there should at least be a PKM, this I am sure of. And not only aesthetically but stat-wise

[foggy mural]

Why not. Have your battle rifle, assault rifle, carbine, smg and sniper and just make skins of those. No balancing needed

Just different playstylws

[lime dock]

Lmao

And this is why you're not a game developer

[rain sundial]

that would be pretty cool ngl

[lime dock]

[rain sundial]

worked for trackmania

you won't find a purer expression of the joy of going fast than TM

[lime dock]

are you comparing trackmania a car racing game to a battlefield fps game

[rain sundial]

do you understand the similarities between cars with different stats and guns with different stats

and how these things would behave in their respective genres

[lime dock]

Bruh you seriously saying it might be a fun idea to have the same stats?

[rain sundial]

it worked for basically every shooter before cod popularized the current paradigm

quake, UT, etc etc all had vastly different weapon types

I'm not necessarily advocating that's the path battlebit or any other game should take

but it would be interesting and put far more focus on individual skill

[foggy mural]

And a lot easier to balance

[uneven raven]

Just pull out an rpg and 1 bang the lad

[dry swan]

next feedback post: rpg needs a nerf

[foggy mural]

if you're not blowing through all your rockets as engineer before using primary gun you are really missing out forreal though

[rain sundial]

you mean to tell me there are people who don't do this?

[lime dock]

I don't lol... I use real combat tactics for some reason. I always get overrun by more wild players as ppl are not afraid to bloody die in game

And please don't post the skill issue sticker I will go pancakes otherwise

[rain sundial]

imagine using real combat tactics in a run-and-gun simulator

[lime dock]

Yes I mean, I do sometimes however do something I would never do in real life... but I trust the knowledge I acquired from watching GoPro on soldiers in real battle

I actually find it quite interesting tbh ngl

It kinda works in BB because of how realistic it's supposed to be, but gets outcompeted by players who know the GAME better and have skill

[rain sundial]

I think the realism stops at "it hurts when you get shot"

[lime dock]

New feature for future update??

[lime dock]

next feedback: X gun too overpowered, highest ttk in the game

they just need something to blame when they die

[rain sundial]

don't think it's blame when everyone notices how much easier it is to get kills when using the val

[sleek grotto]

i agree with bossman sho

[tribal current]

To be honest they should buff the rest so they can compete with the AS VAL

[hushed holly]

might as well add shotguns, no?

[tribal current]

Absolutely, and i'm not trolling

[hushed holly]

Make everything one-shot, not trolling, no cap, legit, fr

[tribal current]

Why are you reacting that way? You don't put anything on the table except your feelings

[hushed holly]

nah chief, one shot, everything, it's more balanced.

imagine running and then dying to somebody spraying from god-knows-where and hitting you once, extremely pleasant

[rain sundial]

it was fun this summer so yeah kinda

[snow minnow]

Especially automatics

[snow minnow]

That's so fun

[worldly token]

hey as long as you guys dont make oki nerf or buff snipers, we are chill

[rain sundial]

with the exception of the m200, snipers are almost perfect

[uncut quail]

m200 is kinda busted yeah

it’s a hard gun to balance, like most guns that are extremely good at what they do in real life

large mag capacity, fast bolt pull, heavy hitting cartridge with decent fire rate