kneeled on until he couldn't breath, and death
#politics
elder portal
faint radish
absolutely
dusky raft
plus the two guys shot going after the teen were convicted for crimes also
but its not stated
mystic ermine
I mean, there are some things with that original incident
faint radish
idk how many police interactions there are per year, im guessing a lot, and so these few make up a tiny percentage, and the officers should and will face punishment for what they did.
If we want to make it easier to go after officers in the line, we can talk about getting rid of qualified immunity
mystic ermine
The bodycams of the officers involved showed that he was saying that he couldn't breath well before they had him on the ground
Ofc, that was not released publically
dusky raft
if anything, the first video proves he is defending himself
mystic ermine
Until it was leaked
elder portal
also the fact that black people are 2.8 times more likely to die in a police incident than a white person
dusky raft
he was pushed over
elder portal
280% more likely
faint radish
well wait, its not random whether you get shot or not...
elder portal
Victims were majority white (52%) but disproportionately black (32%) with a fatality rate 2.8 times higher among blacks than whites. Most victims were reported to be armed (83%); however, black victims were more likely to be unarmed (14.8%) than white (9.4%) or Hispanic (5.8%) victims.
its not like a dice is rolled and oops you get shot cause it came up a 6 or something
elder portal
that's going off official reports
imagine the lost or unofficial ones
so many lost reports regarding black people being killed..
faint radish
right, but im saying that percentages don't take into account actions... all it is is an overview of who got shot
dusky raft
I dont think someone who is going to actively shoot up a crowd aimed up being pushed down would have the time to pull the rifle around
elder portal
I mean, sure. Are you saying black people are more likely to be.. Uh, I guess unarmed.. And also lethal?
280% more likely
faint radish
I have no idea. I'm just saying I think that stat is not enough information to have a claim based on it
mystic ermine
It's easy to throw around stats and not circumstances; Why is that the case? Is something leading to cause that, or is that an issue with officers? etc
elder portal
I dunno, looks pretty damning to me
those stats, N=812
.gov site
I mean, I think Occam's Razor plays into this situation you're creating
mystic ermine
Yes, but the question is "why is that the case", not just instant "oh, the cops love to kill black people more"
elder portal
is it more likely that
- We have a systemic racism problem
or - Black people are 280% more lethal than white people, despite a majority being unarmed over white people
mystic ermine
I think that there are multiple issues
elder portal
at N almost 1k
mystic ermine
generalising it as 1 does not solve the problem
valid steeple
the grand old "only two possibilities"
ur actually banned word if u think the world is that black and white
dusky raft
so city police due to racist policies set/ignored by the emcumbant politicians should be removed from office?
elder portal
alright, I would want to know what could cause those kinds of stats though
faint radish
the number of people in the group I think might be one
mystic ermine
You have varying socioeconimic situations
dusky raft
should rephrase that, bad wording
mystic ermine
e.g. black neighbourhoods are often overpoliced, meaning that more people in these neighbourhoods who are already taught to have an adversion to officers can lead to escalation quite easily
dusky raft
so with city police either following racist policies set by politicians, wouldnt you think these people be voted out of office long time ago?
elder portal
sure, there's more than two possibilities. I'm wondering what other explanation there would be for numbers that high, though
faint radish
I think a police officer might be more likely to feel threatened if he/she is faced with a larger number of people. those stats don't take that into account. maybe black people are more likely to be in groups, I have no idea... which is why im sayin its not enough information
elder portal
so a catch-22 where red-lining meant that black people distrust police more, causing more escalation, causing more distrust?
mystic ermine
No
faint radish
what time of day were they shot in? what color clothes were they wearing? do black people tend to wear a dark set of clothing? I have no clue
elder portal
still seems systemic racism
to be fair, I don't think any of us disagree that there is a systemic issue with racism in America
if you do, then.. I dunno, man.
dusky raft
then vote the the people out of office at the city/state level...
elder portal
but the idea here is that that systemic issue also affects the police force
mystic ermine
There are defo issues in varying places where racisim or the impacts of it from the past are still felt
dusky raft
they clearly did a shit job at law enforcement
mystic ermine
I don't think that all of it is attributable to the police force, however
dusky raft
no, and its not all across the board also
elder portal
no, definitely not all of it
but it's an issue that affects the force
and saying "a few bad apples" also invalidates "a few bad apples" in immigration laws, or at the very least "ruins the bunch" plays into effect
mystic ermine
I have to say, that the way you say stuff often comes across to me as acting like "that's the entire issue" vs just being part of a more wider scope of dozens of different issues
what?
elder portal
oh, no, every large issue we face right now is, well, large
was replying to Zyph, there
with the bad apples
faint radish
but you try to boil it down to one thing. systemic racism
mystic ermine
"a few bad apples" means that people want to vet who is entering their country, vs having smuggling sitations across the borders where varying horror stories arise
elder portal
I'm not attributing every bad thing to a single person, org, etc
dusky raft
then change the top of the stack to enforce changes, ie, get rid of the idiots at the top of the chain who were elected
elder portal
but it definitely affects everything, and the escalation we see with more guns is not helping anything
mystic ermine
I don't really see anybody saying that "shut the borders, fuck all the immigrants" ?
dusky raft
by which, I mean city officials
elder portal
systemic racism is one of several issues in this country, and it's quite large so affects a lot of things
mystic ermine
The escalation seen with guns could be solved by taking active measures to quell the violent riot, leaving the people peacefully protesting to do their thing and be heard, vs there being a larger problems at hand
faint radish
https://www.newsweek.com/81-black-americans-dont-want-less-police-presence-despite-protestssome-want-more-cops-poll-1523093 just gonna drop this here
dusky raft
if you want to envoke change in the police force, then tell city/town mayors to change or get voted out
mystic ermine
The thing is that many of these rioters are not affiliated with BLM/ANITFA/whatever
They're literally just there because "any excuse for a riot"
faint radish
black people must sure love having racist police around, or 81% of them wouldn't want the same or more police presence
elder portal
cat, I'm saying we should apply that same logic to the police force. There's very little vetting that happens with it currently, and it's very hard to fire someone already in a police union
dusky raft
do not let these same people who ignored this issue for YEARS to stay in office
mystic ermine
and that should be fixed?
Once again, this isn't something that I see people disagreeing with
elder portal
funny side-note, there was an arsonist who became a fire-foreman so he wouldn't get caught
many years ago
just reminded me of that
mystic ermine
The thing is that you're always going to need somebody to enforce the law
elder portal
yeah, I think we're all on similar pages, but have varying ideas on approx. how it should be accomplished
mystic ermine
If you get rid of the police, what do you have to enforce the law?
elder portal
or who should do it
faint radish
without police... there would be no crime 😛 ok, last time I promise
mystic ermine
ask NYC, crime rates are falling drastically these past few weeks
elder portal
the interesting thing about "defund the police" is that it's vague so there's a ton of ideas on it
the extreme example that's often pointed out is abolishing it altogether
and even those people agree we need to replace it
mystic ermine
Because that's the one we often hear people shouting that they want
elder portal
but the one the majority of people favor or side with is reducing funding for certain tasks and re-appropriating that money elsewhere
keeping the police true to what our idea of them is
mystic ermine
and the thing is that getting rid of the police and replacing it with something new doesn't really solve the issue
faint radish
replace it with what new? I always want to be able to call someone with a gun to wherever I am
elder portal
you won't pass a law completely abolishing the police force
but the extreme example is the one "most often shouted about" and promoted because it's extreme and radical
clickbait
mystic ermine
and that's why nobody trusts the media
elder portal
the ideal situation is far more moderate, re-locating funding for things police shouldn't really be doing anyway to places that can actually do it. What those things are is up for debate.
mystic ermine
defo
My thing is that the general people who are actually causing damage is dems who are more so there for virtue signaling and a reason to go burn shit, and repubs going there to stir heat with those rioting to the point it escalates
Well, that's my view on what I've seen, basically
elder portal
yeah, people can be shit
though promoting people waving guns at other people is not a good result from any of this
I don't care what side
mystic ermine
The thing is, I'm not sure if any form of action will quell the riots bar action specifically on those, I'm somewhat under the belief that most of the destruction is literally just there because people are using it as an excuse, maybe some magical action which makes the entire BLM movement happy, but, I'm not really sure that there is one
elder portal
and also just waving guns at people in general is not a good result or solution
it'll quiet down eventually
tough cedar
i mean they could get rid of qualified immunity and that'd probably make most people happy
elder portal
people get tired, bored
tough cedar
or independent review boards
elder portal
that's not neccesarily a good thing, but maybe the BLM movement inspired some action
hopefully
tough cedar
yea qualified immunity is kinda iffy
mystic ermine
The thing is that in the ideal government, there would be something there to monitor the government for bad action
The issue is that the only real system in place right now is us, once however many years in your country it is
elder portal
that's supposed to be the people, voting
mystic ermine
2/4 for yall iirc
mystic ermine
Yea, that's the 2 I was thinking
faint radish
can actually serve a day under 10 years as pres.
elder portal
except the ones really high up, which are "until death do you part"
faint radish
ya, scotus is lifetime appointment
mystic ermine
The issue is that there isn't really much of a way that the public can stand up and say "fuck you" and get them out bar creating enough of a stir that they're essentially pushed out by the party
and often times you get to the mark and you get essentially a hillary v trump sitation
tough cedar
politics are too partisan right now 😦
elder portal
sorta just got.. Written off..
tough cedar
so yea it didn't stick
elder portal
but he was officially impeached
so there's that
only president to have done so and stayed
at least that I remember from 8th grade history
yeah, looks like the only one to have been acquitted
welp.
elder portal
Johnson*
mystic ermine
clinton was impeached too, wasn't he? just got dismissed further up
faint radish
yeah
elder portal
Clinton was the one I remember. Had to leave iirc
oh, nope, also acquitted
wait a minute..
that's all of them
every single impeached president was acquitted
fuck me, man
pfft.
welp, TIL impeachment is total and utter bullshit
though I suppose at least it does mark you forever
and not in a good way
faint radish
I mean... the news cycle is so fast... no one talks about it anymore
elder portal
well, Trump's acquittal was the only landslide
take from that what you will
got some news last week of "fuckery definitely happened regarding Trump's election"
but otherwise nada
mystic ermine
I've lost track of that whole story
elder portal
Russia colluding with Trump to win the election
Using their power to sway American votes, which is absolutely illegal here
Report from some of the alphabet soup agencies shows that was indeed the case
Also Putin is likely playing Trump like a fiddle
Trump clearly thinks he can outsmart Putin
That's absolutely not the case
Everyone in the world can only guess what those two talked about that one time behind closed doors
Terrifying thought
mystic ermine
From what I'm reading from forbes, it wasn't trump and russia, but, just russia in general doing stuff which swayed people towards him
elder portal
Very much illegal, here
Can't use money in any way shape or form to sway votes. Also can't sway votes unless sanctioned if not American
Can't use money if not American*
If you print "vote for X" cards and you're not American, you go to fed prison
Fun times
faint radish
just cause putin was trying to get trump elected doesn't mean trump was colluding with him tho...
mullers report didn't find evidence enough that they thought could bring an indictment
elder portal
No, no hard evidence of collision
But also I'm sure Putin didn't just draw Trump like one of his French girls for no reason, for free
faint radish
Putin wants to cause chaos
whatever he thinks is the best way to achieve that he will do
china is trying to support biden this election
they don't give a crap what the policies are, they want to foment chaos in america.
elder portal
Still owes that favor
I don't like my leaders owing favors to known enemies
That's not a good feeling
Also need China to GTFO, hopefully we've learned from 2016
faint radish
why would that mean trump owes him something? Trump has been even harsher than obama re: russia sanctions
elder portal
None of it sits well with me
faint radish
I dont like other countries messing with our elections either, but its gonna happen
elder portal
Though I've definitely already gone way too far with sharing my own political beliefs
So enjoy
faint radish
maybe last time it helped trump, maybe this time itll be biden, doesn't matter
elder portal
One of these days they're just going to ask me about my Discord activity and I'm just going to cry
drifting arch
california has been having repeat heatwaves but also lets not forget that trump said global warming is a hoax so we're ok!
regal moss
yeah
dusky raft
@drifting arch you forgot its no longer global warming, but climate change
drifting arch
i can't tell if you're trolling or being serious but those are pretty much synonymous as temperature in almost all climates has been steadily warming...hence the synonym...global warming.
dusky raft
this time I am joking, considering it was changed from global warming to climate change in most news/media spaces since 2010
brisk cradle
largely because it's not just warming, other climatic conditions are changing too
for instance, the Arctic has gotten substantially rainier, while the western US is getting less rain and is in a period of extended drought
BTW, all that Arctic rain is causing more permafrost to entirely thaw
dusky raft
yeah, its why it was changed from global warming to climate change
im not a strict we need green everything in 5-10 years
mystic ermine
We defo need to make moves on it
dusky raft
but we do need to get rid of the notion of everything is disposable
mystic ermine
Just, gotta make sure you don't pull another germany
brisk cradle
I fear we will not be able to avoid at least 50% of the changes at this point, even if we stopped emitting greenhouse gases tomorrow.
dusky raft
we need to mitigate it, not reverse it
thats the issue I see is there is no mitigation action in place to save places
mystic ermine
I mean, in the long run we need to reverse it
brisk cradle
at this point, mitigation is all we can do: stop emitting carbon and prepare for the new climate we will have, whether we like it or not - which will involve some very hard political changes
mystic ermine
But, dealing with getting to the point where we're still throwing out more than we're scrubbing, etc, is defo a priority
brisk cradle
once we mitigate, approaches to reversing it will be the next step
mystic ermine
carbon capture does look interesting, especially as it can also be used to make other projects, it's just, we're not going to get to a carbon neutral point with carbon capture, we need to actually deal with the source
dusky raft
we need to go back to the 1920-50's mentality of quality built items, ie, things that last a stupidly long time
not, oh, new iphone, I gotta get it
brisk cradle
it will seem very likely we will have to, for instance, accept the fact that the Western countries now currently opposed to refugees will have to be forced to accept them
mystic ermine
Well, people are always going to want to upgrade to the latest tech
That's part of where something like that modular phone concept that was sweeped up and dead off was
dusky raft
we have to be forced to accept them?
brisk cradle
they will also have to contend with internal refugees, too
dusky raft
While immigration is important for this nation, I think enmass "jump the border" immigration is not the best idea
we should streamline the process
brisk cradle
I'm sure the people who will be scorching in the 120+ degree Middle East and North African heat of the future would like to have a word with you
dusky raft
we should build the border up to reduce drug/human/sex trafficking
brisk cradle
dusky raft
but also, middle east/african migrants are europe's problem
not the US
europe can do whatever the hell it wants
brisk cradle
My statements are generic and apply to more than the US
Entire regions of the planet are doomed to eventual uninhabitability due to extreme heat, what do you think happens next?
dusky raft
I dont believe migrants from central america are coming due to climate change...
its political stability in the region
brisk cradle
Um, yes, in fact part of why they are coming IS climate change.
dusky raft
considering how corrupt central american countries are
brisk cradle
Not withstanding the extensive history of the US putting in place corrupt regimes with poor human-rights records.
dusky raft
yeah, was about to get to that
considering the US government loves their exotic fruits
I wont deny what the US did
brisk cradle
We'd like to have our cake and eat it too, and that's not possible.
dusky raft
the US did a lot of things wrong in central america/cuba
BUT
in places like cuba, things did get worse when the US was pushed away
even then the central american region was never that stable to begin off with even before the US got involved
though, we would never know what south america would look like without US involvement/meddling
shy gulch
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24397574 putting this here instead
Hacker News
sharp bronze
if people found it offensive he should not have said it
weak wolf
Also, predicting offense is rather difficult oftentimes. Considering the top comment, which clarifies that in the context it was said, it should be obvious that it was a chinese word, prediction of it being offensive is even less likely.
foggy fern
There was a pretty good take in the comments after all, this is basically one class spamming the report button and the dean deciding he'd rather fire the professor than risk pissing off paying customers
weak wolf
Probably because the Students are the paying Customers and not Students in a Government sponsored Institution, you don't want to loose customers so you fire the employee (just a theory)
near glen
Murica
Here profs can say basically anything
Since they are the prof and thus untouchable
Obviously they can't break laws, lol
foggy fern
Tenure is a thing in the US too but you get called professor even if you don't have it
weak wolf
I still fail to see how it would cause pain
You have to be genuinely extra, or have something outside of the professor's control, in order to be pained by such a thing
foggy fern
I'm not saying it isn't dumb, I'm just saying it's probably only a handful of people upset with it
weak wolf
It is simply unacceptable for faculty to use words in class that can marginalize, hurt and harm the psychological safety of our students. We must and we will do better.
He did no such thing. He said 那个. Which is a chinese word seemingly meaning That one (according to google translate)
foggy fern
But depending on class size, how many people went along with them, how many people fought to keep the teacher (guessing zero), etc that means they have to go
Otherwise people might give their sweet sweet tuition to another school
According to the comments it's the Mandarin version of "umm"
weak wolf
Even better tbh
That makes much more sense to randomly say
It's even more of a casual / common use thing, then
Which makes the situation even dumber lol
foggy fern
I blame social media
Something like this probably wouldn't spread past the school newspaper and maybe some alumni groups before, now it can spread to the whole world and might convince people this isn't the school they should go to
Or at least that's the fear
sharp bronze
@weak wolf n*gro is a word in spanish but it still doesn't mean you can go in a black populated area and say it willy nilly because it's ok where you come from
weak wolf
Have you read... any of the link that we're discussing?
sharp bronze
yeah, a chinese professor in america said a chinese word that put black americans in an uncomfortable situation
if he lives in america and teaches to a class with people of all races, he should be considerate to all of them
weak wolf
There is a linked recording of him using the term. Not only does this barely resemble the racial slur, it is indistinguishably used in a context where it's implicitly clear and even explicitly stated that it's a term from another language.```literally every source I can find, it sounds nothing like what you think it sounds like
sharp bronze
if it didn't sound like it why did it offend those black students
weak wolf
Because they're dumb?
weak wolf
Listen if you're trying to get someone fired because you think they said a word that they didn't say, after it was made explicitly clear that it is not the word they're thinking, and the two words don't sound the same
When it's a word they naturally say
sharp bronze
im sure he didn't mean anything bad by it, just like a spanish person saying n+gro to another spanish person isn't being racist, but in the context of being in america and saying it to black people it shows ignorance of the people he's supposed to nurture and teach to
it's like us going to china and calling them a name we don't find offensive but they do
he should not be fired i guess since he didn't mean harm
but just saying "blacks are dumb" like you did shows the kind of people who think calling others slurs even if out of ignorance instead of malice is ok
weak wolf
I didn't?
sharp bronze
weak wolf
Listen if you're trying to get someone fired because you think they said a word that they didn't say, after it was made explicitly clear that it is not the word they're thinking, and the two words don't sound the same
When it's a word they naturally say
Please don't cherry pick my messages out of context
sharp bronze
so your messages can't be taken out of context, but the sensibilites of black students can?
🤣
weak wolf
??????????????
sharp bronze
let's put it like this, if i went to teach in china and "I love peanuts" sounded to chinese people like "dumb chinese", would it be ok for me to say "I love peanuts" to chinese students?
especially if my people had a long tradition of racism towards them
weak wolf
I'm done. I'm not going to discuss someone who has malicious intent.
sharp bronze
🤷 idk where you found the malicious part but ok
weak wolf
Well you managed to conflate me calling someone dumb for getting offended over a chinese word, into me calling someone dumb for being black.
I'd say that's pretty malicious.
sharp bronze
yes, i asked, if the professor hadn't hurt (accidentally or not) the student's well being, why would they get upset at him
and you said it's because they are dumb, as if you have any rights to judge the sensibilites of people that have to deal with the trauma of oppression lasting thousands of years
it's like saying "oh, that guy that fought a war is upset by the sound of fireworks even if they can't harm him"
weak wolf
.
sharp bronze
besides, even if the word didn't sound anything like the slur, if many people find it offensive there is no reason to use it
weak wolf
Greg Patton lectured on use of 'filler words' at University of Southern California
Greg Patton lectured on use of 'filler words' at University of Southern California
Greg Patton lectured on use of 'filler words' at University of Southern California
Greg Patton lectured on use of 'filler words' at University of Southern California
Greg Patton lectured on use of 'filler words' at University of Southern California
Greg Patton lectured on use of 'filler words' at University of Southern California
Greg Patton lectured on use of 'filler words' at University of Southern California
sharp bronze
and?
weak wolf
The word was literally in context
sharp bronze
and?
To Kill a Mockingbird was censored to not offend people
even if it's a book about it
weak wolf
Ok so how do you censor a single word, when discussing said word?
sharp bronze
he should at least have given a warning
and if possible not said it
it isn't about context
it's just about being decent to people of colour
what's disheartening isn't the professor making a mistake and offending people, i can agree he should not be fired. It's the privileged response to people saying the black students are mad or over sensitive
weak wolf
Ah yes another "context doesn't matter". You'd love living in Scotland, aye.
sharp bronze
the racist pug comedian?
sharp bronze
well maybe i shouldn't have taken the effort of putting accidentally before racist :3
weak wolf
In case you didn't know, in the beginning of his video, he states that his girlfriend keeps raving about how cute the pug is. So, as a juxtaposition, he made the pug the least cute and most vile thing he could think of. A nazi.
You're defending nazis. Congrats. Bye.
sharp bronze
bye, im glad we at least figured out why you'd think offending black people isn't a big deal
zenith basin
nazi pug was hilarious ngl
sharp bronze
yiksies
sharp bronze
Dankula sent a picture of his balls in my server years ago@weak wolf
That's the kind of person you're defending
Although I took a look at his twitter and he seems to have turned his life around, which is nice
He seems to be promoting some good causes like BLM so at least it shows its never too late to stop being a garbage human
weak wolf
I'm not defending him, I'm refuting your rather poor arguments and attacks on other people based on your very limited viewpoint.
Again, he's making fun of nazis. I shouldn't have to explain to you that nazis are bad.
If making fun of nazis makes me a garbage person, I'll gladly accept that title.
sharp bronze
Making fun of Nazis by teaching your dog the Nazi salute
Your honour, my client was merely making fun of racists when he went out with a white hood on his head
weak wolf
You heard it here first folks, making fun of something makes you that thing.
sharp bronze
Teaching your dog to do the Nazi salute = making fun of something?
pure jetty
count dankula was fine
sharp bronze
Even he must have realized his mistake
pure jetty
it wasn't a mistake
sharp bronze
But there's people still defending it after he clearly changed page
pure jetty
the joke was "what could be the worse thing i could make my dog do"
weak wolf
Jroy I've already explained the entire context. If you read the entire conversation I've had with this guy you'll know he loves moving goalposts and cherry picking context when it suites his argument, and ignores my arguments when he can't cherry pick context.
pure jetty
ah
makes sense
anyways the law that got him in trouble shouldn't exist in the first place
weak wolf
In case you didn't know, in the beginning of his video, he states that his girlfriend keeps raving about how cute the pug is. So, as a juxtaposition, he made the pug the least cute and most vile thing he could think of. A nazi.
The context couldn't be more clear. But the only word in my explanation that Ond could read was "Nazi"
pure jetty
oh im just reading up now jfc
weak wolf
Anyway gonna take a nap. Have to be up in 2 hours, work decided to have me close then open back to back.
pure jetty
how old are you?
sharp bronze
Dankula is making amends for his offensive character and so should you
weak wolf
No thanks.
pure jetty
you lost a pretty clear cut argument, you went to his twitter to try any find even the most vaguest thing to prove us "wrong"
found a meme
and are using that as an argument?
sharp bronze
@pure jetty I don't need to find anything, he's clearly depicting his fans as Nazis until recently
pure jetty
???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
does humor exist in your world
or is everything literal
near glen
Somebody said Nazi, is my expertise as a german needed?
weak wolf
Yes
sharp bronze
sharp bronze
Does teaching your dog the Nazi salute make you a Nazi
near glen
As a german, I can answer that with a clear no
weak wolf
Nice
near glen
Does teaching your dog the Nazi salute make you a Nazi
@sharp bronze in germany, yes
As doing the hitler Gruß is illegal
weak wolf
Before he tries to pull anything else, lemme bring up the topic again
In case you didn't know, in the beginning of his video, he states that his girlfriend keeps raving about how cute the pug is. So, as a juxtaposition, he made the pug the least cute and most vile thing he could think of. A nazi.
So we're all on the same page
sharp bronze
@weak wolf considering Germany banned the Nazi flag in cod games where you kill Nazis, I doubt his tenuous pretense for a joke would've held there either
Or in Wolfenstein
faint radish
It was always interesting to me that Germany banned a political ideology. Like I understand the history there, but I think it’s a bad idea.
pure jetty
Germany banned everything to do with nazis because they think that will stop anything from happening again
faint radish
Which doesn’t seem like the solution
weak wolf
North korea bans dissent. Your point?
near glen
@weak wolf considering Germany banned the Nazi flag in cod games where you kill Nazis, I doubt his tenuous pretense for a joke would've held there either
@sharp bronze that's not true anymore
faint radish
Plus, I’m against any banning of any speech
near glen
Games are art, and thus depicting Nazi symbols is ok, as long as you don't promote it
sharp bronze
Fair, they changed this recently
sharp bronze
Anyway
near glen
Movies were long before, it's just that nobody tried to make the change to the law, lol
weak wolf
Would the video be considered art as well? In the form of comedy.
near glen
As long as you don't promote it, it's fine
sharp bronze
The discussion went from "are blacks allowed to complain if someone offends them" to "am I allowed to train my dog like a nazi"
near glen
Like promote Nazi shit
sharp bronze
:^3
pure jetty
you're allowed to complain for anything
weak wolf
It was never about that
pure jetty
you are straw maning right now
near glen
It was, should a uni fire a prof because somebody wanted to understand something wrong
weak wolf
It was about FIRING someone over saying a word that sounds similar to the n word, when teaching about words which said word falls under.
pure jetty
it's about a Chinese professor speaking chinese
sharp bronze
And you are repeating all the funny debate words your favourite YouTuber says whenever someone disagrees 
weak wolf
JRoy the professor was teaching about filler words
pure jetty
and then someone who doesn't know chinese saying that a chinese word sounds too much like a english words
weak wolf
Nega is the chinese filler word for "umm"
pure jetty
And you are repeating all the funny debate words your favourite YouTuber says whenever someone disagrees
how old are you
8?
is this your argument everytime you're clearly wrong?
weak wolf
Nah dude strawman is an underground fallacy that only the yootoobers know about!
pure jetty
meanwhile this guy is probably 12 years old, hasn't taken an english course, and watches hasan
weak wolf
Anyone who's passed highschool knows what strawmen and fallacies are my dude. And anyone who ever enters this channel likely knows as well.
sharp bronze
Then why do you keep accusing me of strawmanning
When most of the time in directly quoting
weak wolf
Because you are lol?
sharp bronze
I said multiple times I don't think the professor should've been fired
But you keep repeating that as if I disagree
What I said is that lots of people called the black students dumb for complaining
Which comes from such a place of privilege
pure jetty
You said:
The discussion went from "are blacks allowed to complain if someone offends them" to "am I allowed to train my dog like a nazi"
when vic directly said
Listen if you're trying to get someone fired because you think they said a word that they didn't say, after it was made explicitly clear that it is not the word they're thinking, and the two words don't sound the same
that's a strawman
sharp bronze
Considering that they wouldn't have complained of they weren't upset by what happened
pure jetty
the students who complained were dumb no mater of their race
or were just looking for a race problem were there wasn't one
sharp bronze
Yeah you saying that is what privilege looks like
You've never experienced racism like some people have and can't understand what a traumatic word can evoke
Again, it's like belittling a person with PTSD because he's upset by fireworks
You can't know what he is feeling like and assuming he's over reacting is closed minded and hurtful
pure jetty
tbh it doesn't matter what he's thinking
the guy said a Chinese word
when it was very clear it was a Chinese word
and because it sounded vaguely like an offensive english word
they get fired
someone's job shouldn't depend on the feelings of someone else
sharp bronze
He shouldn't have been fired, but he also should have been more careful
pure jetty
?
careful of what
he spoke Chinese
why tf should he care if it sounds like another word
someone would have to be stupid to get angry at that
sharp bronze
he spoke Chinese
@pure jetty in America, in a class fill of poc
pure jetty
so this is a "you're in America learn english" argument?
sharp bronze
Law classes give warnings before talking about sensitive topics like rape
Why shouldn't a language class do the same with language that can be perceived as hurtful 🤣
pure jetty
if you need a warning in a law class when talking about rape you shouldn't be a lawyer
sharp bronze
Oh wow
plush crypt
"uhh" sounds like "bruhh" and that triggers me so now you're banned.
it's a bad argument. if you're going to attend a chinese class, you must be fine with them speaking chinese...
pure jetty
^^
in an order to solve racism, we're becoming more racist
telling a Chinese person to speak differently because their offending someone who doesn't speak Chinese is racist
pure jetty
a 👏 Chinese 👏 speaking 👏 person 👏 should 👏 not 👏 need 👏 to 👏 understand 👏 the 👏 offensive 👏 words 👏 of every 👏 other 👏 language
sharp bronze
If you're teaching to an American class you should know their sensibilities?
Unless you're telling me he's teaching them Chinese without knowing English
pure jetty
you will survive longer if you stop taking offense at things clearly not intended to be offensive (and perhaps even at things intended to be)
sharp bronze
Yeah again
You were privileged enough that you can afford not to take offense when it's due
Not everyone was so lucky
pure jetty
are you calling me white?
sharp bronze
I'm calling you privileged
pure jetty
do you know anything about me?
do you know anything about my life?
who the fuck are you?
sharp bronze
Only what transpired from your "suggestions"
pure jetty
so because I disagree with you, I'm "privileged"
pure jetty
so because i disagree with your view point
i must automatically be white and privileged
nobody who is not privileged can have my viewpoint?
sharp bronze
When did I say white
pure jetty
forget that
sharp bronze
Who's strawmanning now
pure jetty
just privileged
sharp bronze
You could be brown in Spain and be privileged
pure jetty
i don't know why i'm bothering with you
you clearly will not change your mind
hopefully one day you'll see how your wrong
for now i wish you the best
o7
sharp bronze
Maybe you're hoping to change yours :^3
Be like dankula
And reject your privilege
Bye
solemn bay
NEW POLITIC RULE (very strict) : NO SIMPS
weak wolf
in an order to solve racism, we're becoming more racist
@pure jetty Paradox of Tolerance :^)
Intolerance of intolerance is intolerance.
Also gonna drop it again. Time to regret waking up. 90 minutes of sleep is plenty right?
sharp bronze
The only tolerance we can tolerate is against Bosnians
storm garnet
lol thats so dumb
i know of that chinese filler word that sounds like the n word lol, if your around chinese people you hear it enough to wonder wtf and look it up or ask
faint radish
that word, or apparently now, that literal sound, is so powerful.
A professor was placed on leave for reading the actual word in class, because he was reading one of MLK's famous birmingham jail letters...
valid steeple
wait what happened
faint radish
its not right, if there is a word that cannot be used in an educational setting.
words get their power from people who hear them, not from whatever they meant historically
A professor was "suspended" for saying a chinese filler word (in chinese class) that sounds like the n word
just watch that short video there leaf
valid steeple
lol so he got nuked for that
mystic ermine
basically, yes
faint radish
if you never want someone to be offended by that word again, quit giving it meaning
faint radish
the more punishment that gets laid on someone for saying it, the more "offensive" it gets
zenith basin
that was a fun read
You were privileged enough that you can afford not to take offense when it's due
lmao how is that privilege 😂
more like not being a weak ass bitch who can handle a few "nasty" words
stop giving these words meaning, you'll find life is much better that way.
white wing
Damn I have never seen someone be so tribal like Ondsinet.
I am green clan this random person is wearing red so we should beat him up because red clan bad.
pearl plinth
ok, but, my comments still hold up, this is literally borderline defamation/libel
fuck songoda but she doesnt deserve to be labeled a pedo especially with 0 proof
restive seal
Sure is! I've already reported the post for violating the rule it violates too. But the last time this stuff was posted it was explicitly marked approved. One of the last things I saw before quitting was that in the mod logs.
plush crypt
I'm deleting your link as I believe it'd be in the best interest of the guild as we are no fans of defamation; please contact a mod if you disagree @cedar musk
cedar musk
zenith basin
Sure is! I've already reported the post for violating the rule it violates too. But the last time this stuff was posted it was explicitly marked approved. One of the last things I saw before quitting was that in the mod logs.
@restive seal wtf
ya never told us about that
restive seal
@zenith basin see my big post, click the Google doc link. Last images on it have been up since it went live
dusky raft
oh hey, a new red faction game, and it looks pretty realistic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lk_OWabJUys
storm garnet
lol ya it orange outside for me xD
smells good
thanks to pg&e for not maintaining their grid and the state gov not doing any controlled burns until after a tiny fire leads to the whole state burning
their pension payments are massive
pure jetty
probably going to be hard to have that order to go into effect
faint radish
where was the gender reveal fire started?
pure jetty
since airports or airlines themselves can screen passengers if they want
storm garnet
they arent ordering not to screen I think they are just not ordering to screen anymore
pure jetty
all the feds really have is funding and ordering of the TSA
faint radish
I mean... that'll cost them money. Im guessing the fed was paying for it
pure jetty
yeah probably was the fed
faint radish
so to continue, they have to pay for it themselves, and if its not required...
faint radish
I don't think airports care about bad pr
pure jetty
and yes right now they care about pr
if they get bad covid pr: people stop flying more than they already do
covid is worse than 9/11 for airlines
faint radish
no I understand that
I was saying more in the long run, people are going to use airports, and I don't think the goverment is going to let them go away
sorta like a "too important to fail" situation maybe
storm garnet
see: the bailouts
faint radish
well you were right, they can continue to do it themselves, but they just aren't gonna be the ones doing it
states will probably continue doing it if they want
dusky raft
yeah, the federal government appears to be backing off when it comes to covid and making states do the work
faint radish
totally fine with that.
dusky raft
oh, also, trump appears to have been nominated for the nobel peace prize
according to fox news
let me go check that
brisk cradle
by a right-wing Norwegian MP
dusky raft
eh
faint radish
for his middle east stuff
dusky raft
ita a nomination
faint radish
legit nomination tho
brisk cradle
pretty sure there's no chance in hell he'll get it
pure jetty
yeah ^ lmao
brisk cradle
but then again, Obama got it and I got plenty to quibble with him
pretty sure the only reason Obama got it is because Dubya was 
faint radish
I mean... the relation normalization in the middle east is kinda a big deal
brisk cradle
I am looking forward to the next Nobel Peace Prize going to Joe Biden for the honor of not being named Donald J. Trump
dusky raft
oh, thats going to be such a cringe fest
faint radish
I mean its becoming more of a joke. Not as big a joke as Time's person of the year
if you had to pick the person that has the most affect on the world, its either trump or Xi... doesn't matter if you think its good or bad
faint radish
that doesnt matter for the Person of the Year. whether its positive or negative
brisk cradle
and, well, not being Donald J. Trump is a low bar to clear
dusky raft
I dont think hes done anything too bad,
dusky raft
besides strongarming nations
brisk cradle
anyway I got better things to do than talk about 🅱️olitics
dusky raft
I mean, the fuck has he done that is so bad?
I mean, there is 4 years to sift through utter news cycle crap I lost track
pure jetty
multiple things of which you can google
to name a few politically neutral things: putting large taxes on solar, steel, aluminum; Limited funding for the ACA; Betsy DeVos; Got rid of some national parks just because obama made them lol
dusky raft
im fine with taxes on solar, and other metal industries. Considering solar, and depending on the state, there are tax credits for the common tax payer
im pretty sure I threw my views on solar around here, ill recap if you dont know
the ACA is a shitshow
always was
pure jetty
limiting funding to it without solving its faults doesn't solve anything
it makes stuff worse
dusky raft
where did the funding go anyways?
pure jetty
they cut enrollment funding by 90%
no idea where it went
and what are your "views on solar" anyway
because you should be paid to develop/use solar
dusky raft
im lukewarm on solar. The issue I have with solar is the over zealous activism on it without knowing the issues it causes
pure jetty
what issues does it cause
dusky raft
solar may seem like a clean energy, but have you seen the mining pits to get the metals?
we do have to import them
pure jetty
there have been studies on this
solar panels are far more greener
including the carbon footprint for the mining operations
dusky raft
im not just talking about the mining operations, but what about recovery of the environment when the work is done?
its a big giant hole filled with toxic stuff for plants/animals
pure jetty
and coal mining operations are better?
dusky raft
oh hell no, but thats not what im pointing at
im not saying coal is better
but we do need to understand where our energy sources are coming from
pure jetty
nuclear is clean but the waste sucks to deal with
pure jetty
yeah but if anything goes wrong
dusky raft
the only issue that causes is far in the future when people unearth it
though, I would love to see a more scaled up geo thermal setup
sadly tech doesnt appear to be available for that at the moment
faint radish
eventually it can be launched into space.
The nuclear waste
We’ve launched RTGs before, so it’s not unprecedented. It’s just probably not a good idea until launching something is incredibly reliable.
And fun fact, it takes less resources to send something out of our solar system, than it does to send it into the sun. Getting to the sun is incredibly expensive. You have to bleed off ~67000 mph which is way more than you have to add to get out.
dusky raft
I mean fuck it, we could launch it into a gas giant and it wouldnt matter
toss it anywhere but the inner solar system
pure jetty
brb am tossing all this nuclear waste into ur moms house
shut vine
I personally think the strong sanctions against China are a good thing. The country is in a cold/financial war with the western world. It probably needs to become a hot war, because they are out of control. I suppose you could argue they have been getting worse since the '89 Tiananmen square incident. Just no one has ever really stood up to their shit.
I also think having the lowest unemployment in 50 years may just be a good thing.
dusky raft
I see china as a threat to the world stage, as they envy the US as a super power
like the US, china sees itself as a liberator, so long as they control the world economy and throw third world countries in debt
pure jetty
'89 Tiananmen square incident
shut vine
I don't mind that they are, I mind the abuse of human rights, prisoners of conscience being harvested for organs while they're still alive for instance.
faint radish
lol was no incident
shut vine
We don't want a country like that as a super power.
dusky raft
no
its why I think the US should leave these international organizations, since china is in a large position
shut vine
Yeah true, nothing happened, just has Xi Jinping
faint radish
did yall see Disney thanked a company for helping with the Mulan film that manages some of those friendly "re-education" camps
dusky raft
I dont think the US should be paying for the UN if china/russia are breaking rules
shut vine
You know, there is a prominent person who feels the same.
dusky raft
I also think we should pull out of nato since clearly europe can fund its own military
mystic ermine
“It’s an outrage,” he said. “PG&E’s protecting its power lines, but it’s at the cost of these trees.”
I mean, thats one quote from the interwebs about PG&E cutting trees on private property, etc
Yes
Property owners can tell them to fuck off, however
But, that's literally just asking for fires
I think that it's a double sided thing, PG&E need to trim more trees, and people need to fuck off restricting them so they can get it done; It's essentially a slap in the face
dusky raft
isnt nato meant to be a military defense pact?
mystic ermine
yes
dusky raft
and europe has been mooching off this for a long time
mystic ermine
Nato afaik is basically trash bar concept
faint radish
I mean, at the time, it was mainly to counter the USSR
mystic ermine
Not really followed their stuff bar the yearly news cycle of "fucking morons"
dusky raft
I think we should leave and europe should pay for its own defense
faint radish
im not sure im on board with leaving, but europe should def pay more
mystic ermine
Also, cali's blackouts are their own stupidity
faint radish
yes, CA is a third world country
dusky raft
yes
faint radish
my family is currently under a "planned power outage" so they don't cause any more fires
dusky raft
CA saw PG&E neglected their power lines and decided, oh hey, this green new power is cool, lets push that
nevermind horrible forest management
its also insane that there are a lot of california wildfires compared to other states like colorado
mystic ermine
See, germany basically did the same thing, and look at their energy costs; last I heard, france was building a new nuclear plant just to sell more power to germany
dusky raft
yeah, germany threw so much into solar/wind
mystic ermine
and the cost of their energy has sky rocketed, not to mention that their CO2 emissions actually went up iirc
faint radish
fear of ☢️ power is annoying
faint radish
germany is also building some new pipeline to become more dependent on ol' Vlad Putin
shut vine
The biggest issue with nuclear is no politician wants to back research into it. So we're still using fission and it hasn't advanced a whole lot in recent history (comparatively to how much it should have). The bias towards it is very harmful for a long term solution.
dusky raft
if biden gets elected, I better hope he doesnt sign that agreement, otherwise, the US would be held to a higher standard than the rest of the world
faint radish
I saw something about that? the first commercial one?
mystic ermine
Yea
shut vine
You have to walk before you run, someone has to invest the money into fusion research for it to actually be viable.
faint radish
pretty sure China is putting some serious money there
shut vine
The bias towards it makes it stupidly hard to get any government to back it.
Someone tell Trump, he'll compete with them to finish it first. 🙂
mystic ermine
The issue is right now is that it's heavily a money sinkhole as finding a solution to a massive issue we have right now
faint radish
well im hoping it goes the way that the commercialization of space has gone
get some private companies in the space
shut vine
Well, the first country to produce a reliable, mass producible, nuclear fusion reactor.. will have a lot of power.
Both forms of it 😛
faint radish
lol ya, pun intended
mystic ermine
Well, the issue is the number of challenges still in play
more funding would defo be nice, but, at the same point, it's going to take some time to solve all the issues and work out all the kinks
shut vine
As far as Biden getting elected, I feel like they could have picked anyone else other than Clinton and they would be fine. Like Sanders or Gabbard (personally like Gabbard a lot more). I don't think he'll win, he's too far gone and everyone can see it.
mystic ermine
It's nice to see what we're getting there slowly but surely
The problem with the DNC is how old all the canidates are, as well as the lack of convo
shut vine
I also think Harris was a misstep, she's disliked by a lot of people.
mystic ermine
If you don't want hillary to win, you're a sexist pig, not that you're concerned about her multiple dozen years of botchery, her rampant flipping back and forth on issues
Like, who knows
valid steeple
Ur sexist
shut vine
Well, the problem realistically is both parties until recently had been picking the establishment one party politicians.
mystic ermine
Maybe she supports gay marriage, etc; But, she can't pretend that she's always been for family and rights when she voted against the gay marriage thing
shut vine
Trump seems like he doesn't bow to the establishment, and doesn't give a shit about it. That's one of the things that attracts the working class to him I think.
mystic ermine
I think a huge reason why trump won was because he was the "fuck you" candidate
Yea
dusky raft
yeah, trump doesnt give a damn about who works with him
shut vine
He doesn't tow the party line, doesn't care about the person he's supporting, cares about the legislation.
dusky raft
he chucked quite a few people out of the whitehouse
mystic ermine
The thing is that you look at some of the stuff the media blasted him, and you picture yourself hanging out with your mates, etc; I mean, I've never gone that far, but, like, guys talk shit
meanwhile you have biden groping women...
shut vine
I'm not saying I like him, but I don't dislike him as much as establishment politicians.
white wing
Our politicians are so bad at the top that trump beat them. Wtf man.
dusky raft
but yeah, trump is a business man, and I think his mentality is that if he doesnt like someone, hes going to remove him if its an appointed position, otherwise hes going to give elected officials hell
shut vine
I really hate American politics. People think there are only two choices.. but those choices they think they have are actually one choice.
dusky raft
the US was technically conservative with a bit of liberalism sprinked in
white wing
Yeah we're not a two party country there are other parties and canidates to consider but they're not given the time of day.
dusky raft
both parties were on the right, it just depended on what they promoted
mystic ermine
You are a two party country
The realisticness of another party controlling the gov in any real form of meaningful manner other than to sit their with their most friendly party of the two is basically 0
dusky raft
however republicans never really shifted on the political spectrum much, its the democrats that veered left
mystic ermine
you'd need a huuuuge number of people saying "fuck you" to the two parties and voting for somebody else
shut vine
As an outsider I like Tulsi Gabbard (D-HA) and Ted Cruz (R-TX).
mystic ermine
That's essentially why they say stuff like voting for independents is a wasted vote
faint radish
el why eye en APOSTROPHE Ted 😆 wish trump was in a primary again... was funny times
bleak echo
oh yeah, let's get the zodiac killer for president
shut vine
Yeah that idea is logically wrong, parties don't become strong from people voting for someone because "if I vote for the person I believe in, my vote will be wasted".
It's literally a manipulation by the parties with the power.
mystic ermine
It's the catch22 of the system
I think that you'd need much less... erm... divisive... candiates than there are now to actually make a 3rd or 4th party, etc, actually "worth" the vote
Right now the general battle is people voting for the left because fuck trump, and people voting for the right coz "fuck that"
We have essentially the same split over here in the UK, you're either labour or conservative
Problem is that the conservative party is well...
erm
faint radish
but.... BOJO
faint radish
lol what?
mystic ermine
I literally can't picture boris without picturing ralph
faint radish
well... if you are gonna make a space for other races...
mystic ermine
The university also held another event for students of color, named the “BIPOC Cafe,” using the acronym that stands for Black, Indigenous, and People of Color
faint radish
kinda like milo yiannuopolis (cant spell) scholarship for white men
dusky raft
I havent really seen him in the news cycle over the last year
faint radish
the Privilege Grant
dusky raft
lol
faint radish
only availible to white men
mystic ermine
The university has since apologized for the manner in which the events were described and promoted by the school and said that both events were open to all members of the UM Dearborn campus community and “were never intended to be exclusive or exclusionary for individuals of a certain race.”
wut
dusky raft
it said as it was, white only
they cant complain when they did give the green light
but I really disagree with seperating people based on color, because isnt that racism at its core?
mystic ermine
Well, yes
But note that the complaint is about the whites only one, not that POC one
dusky raft
yeah, exactly
drifting arch
so trump purposefully downplayed covid to "not incite a panic" (according to trump)
in any case, options are:
- actually thought it was not a big deal
- downplayed it purposefully
either case is horrific. pretty sure it's #2 from the recordings they have of him.
trump supporters are BACKING HIM UP SOMEHOW by saying it wasn't his job to inform the citizenry...? they say that's the health dept's job.
the same health dept trump FUCKING SAID WAS SPITTING FAKE NEWS?
i. i am actually blown the FUCk away
opal moat
According to Trump he is also very smart so I'm thinking it's 1
violet quarry
i'm shocked just 'cause it's the thing that happened but when it comes to being surprised, not really.
i see them capable of it and much worse
faint radish
well, I mean everyone was downplaying it... pretty sure at the same time, Pelosi was encouraging people to go out to Chinatown
ofc everyone can react better in hindsight, but trump wasn't the only one downplaying it
I mean... even Fauci said that major lockdowns wouldn't need to happen in the US
mystic ermine
I mean, right now it's pure blame game and hair cuts
faint radish
lol, it was pretty funny how Pelosi "took responsibility for.... falling for a setup"
mystic ermine
Yea, that was just comical, and the worse fucking part that shows how fucked up this world is is that people actually bought it
That's the thing with the DNC in general, however
When they fuck up, they can never put their hand up and say "i'm sorry", it's all "But, she set me up!!"
weary obsidian
or THE RUSSIANS
russians obviously did stuff, but ffs dems throw the russia card way too damn much
bleak echo
yeah, russia can't magic things into existence that aren't already somewhere in america
elder portal
Rip my 7/11
mystic ermine
Wasn't there some DNC candicates fucked on russian ties too?
shut vine
According the the senior health advisors that's what they instructed him to do.
When he wanted to shut the boarders the Democrats were calling him racist.
Also regarding DNC candidates and Russian ties, Clinton was basically slinging that accusation at everyone.
Well not specifically that, that they were Russian spies/colluding.
mystic ermine
well, are you a US persons?
shut vine
No.
mystic ermine
oof, that ruins my joke u fuq
shut vine
LOL
mystic ermine
"did you vote for hillary?"
"no"
"What are you, a sexist fuck?!"
shut vine
Say it anyway, so we can laugh at America
LOL I love it
If you don't vote for Biden you're allegedly not black
Which I think is a rather strange way to determine the skin color of someone
mystic ermine
Because it's all identity politics
That's literally the only thing they actually have a say in these days
mystic ermine
"if your black, you should vote for the DNC" "if you're a woman, you should vote for the DNC" "if you're a CIS white male, you're probs gonna vote for trump you racist sexist asshole"
shut vine
I was acting dumb since I was not American, thought it would add humor.
shut vine
Yeah, that all started with LBJ's "n-word bill". He was quoted as saying "I'll have these n-words voting for me for us for the next 100 years"
What was part of it?
mystic ermine
I mean, the party*
shut vine
ah yea
sharp bronze
Hahahaha
Remember when coronavirus was a Racist conspiracy theory
A mayor in some town raised citizens to hug Chinese travellers to prove they're not Racist
mystic ermine
meanwhile NYC releases all their patients back into care homes
sharp bronze
Oh it was in Europe
mystic ermine
I mean, are you going to attend the POC cafe or the non-poc cafe?
mystic ermine
shut vine
Ah yea, that's because they opened up POC safe spaces/etc.
They basically reintroduced segregation lol
mystic ermine
I mean, I've been joking about that for literally years now
And then they did it, and everybody reacts like everybody expected
How do you NOT see that coming?
shut vine
Yeah, also why was it bad back then but not bad now?
sharp bronze
Black people should not be forced to be exposed to the people that traumatized them for centuries tho
shut vine
They're not, they can stay home.
sharp bronze
It would be like forcing Jewish survivors to live and share utilities with the Nazis that killed their families
shut vine
No
sharp bronze
If black people want to be around other they share a heritage with, they should be allowed to.
shut vine
It would be like forcing a Jewish person to share utilities with a German
mystic ermine
and why should white people be any different?
shut vine
None of them are forced, they have choices.
mystic ermine
Nobody alive and kicking around in these environments had fuck all to do with nazi's, etc
faint radish
Yeah, what if a white person wants to be around people they share a heritage with?
sharp bronze
They didn't have a choice, they do now that they have a separate cafeteria
shut vine
Segregation is not the answer, everyone agreed that was bad.
sharp bronze
@faint radish that would be pretty Racist tho
shut vine
Exactly
mystic ermine
at what point do you accept the fact that we gotta move forward instead of using segregation to make people "happy"?
shut vine
It's racist. Segregation, is, racist.
mystic ermine
This is the entire issue with the DNC
and their followers
It's the persistent hypocricy and the drive to halt any form of discussion
shut vine
Not wanting to associate or be around someone due to the color of their skin, is disgusting.
sharp bronze
@shut vine segregation is bad indeed, but where talking about a space where minorities can feel safer. If they want to be with the other whites they can go to the other cafe
shut vine
"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."
faint radish
And I didn’t traumatize anyone. You are boiling down everything bad done by white people and saying I’m at fault because of it. If that isn’t SUPER racist, idk what is.
Not specifically me, but a random white person
shut vine
That's fine, but it's illegal to prevent a person entering an area due to their skin color.
mystic ermine
but where talking about a space where minorities can feel safer
shut vine
It's also disgusting to suggest a certain skin color of people do not enter.
mystic ermine
So, minorities can have a space, but, nobody else can?
sharp bronze
We can all agree that the state mandating who you can associate with is bad. If the state forces minorities to a separate space, it's bad. But it's equally bad if the state mandates minorities cannot be among who they chose to be with
mystic ermine
People need to grow the fuck up and move on
sharp bronze
If they wish to be among themselves it's not up to you or the state to decide
mystic ermine
More hate is stirred by the anti-racist BS than actual racists
faint radish
Man, I just posted the Racists and Woke people agree on everything video, do I need to post it again? 😂
mystic ermine
Dividing people because "you're scared" does not move the world forward
shut vine
I'm for a business having the right to turn down service for any reason, but I'll happily point out the practice of not serving someone purely based on their skin color is disgusting.
mystic ermine
How the fuck do we expect to one day start getting along if we can't talk to one another?
faint radish
Yep, James is right. If some business does that, like 99.9999% of people are gonna say “F U” and they are gonna be out of business real quick
mystic ermine
In the name of progress, we've taking one step forward, seeing somebody white and fucking back off 100 steps
shut vine
Yeah, court of public opinion.
faint radish
Free market there too
sharp bronze
Yeah racist conservatives jump on that kind of stuff...
I bet they hate female only gyms too
mystic ermine
can we have male only gyms too?
shut vine
Yeah I want a male only gym, don't want to feel unsafe.
mystic ermine
I mean, I think that a part of it is that guys really don't give a shit
faint radish
What about some white person who was traumatized by some black person early in life, and is distrusting of black people? Is that considered racist?
sharp bronze
As I said, the outrage over minority or woman only spaces usually come from people that have no other easy to get women or minorities to associate with them, other than forcing them in a shared space
mystic ermine
I have nothing against female only gyms
Just, you can't say that's not sexist and scream when guys do it themselves
shut vine
I agree they are not sexist, but many feel that boys clubs are, or male only gyms, etc.
sharp bronze
Typically if women-only gyms are allowed in a state, men-only gyms are allowed as well. If women can do it where you live, men can do it too. However, when Curves tried to make gyms that were men-only, no one joined, and the project was canceled within a year. There seems to be less desire for men-only gyms than women-only ones. Perhaps because many gyms already seem geared more towards men than women, and the majority of people working out on average at any particular moment are men. Perhaps it's because men aren't as worried about sexual harassment and modesty, on average.
From some random quora article don't sue me
shut vine
Well, the problem I find with Google searching, and I mean this for myself, I seem to find the answer I want
I have to be really careful about how I word my search in order to avoid confirmation bias bs
faint radish
What about some white person who was traumatized by some black person early in life, and is distrusting of black people? Is that considered racist?
near glen
Lmao
sharp bronze
@faint radish a single bad life experience isn't what causes the fears that bame have to live with in white countries
We're talking about centuries of oppression and brutalisation, when not talking about outright colonization and repessuon
shut vine
So if you had your whole family murdered in front of your eyes as a young child you'd not be damaged and traumatized beyond repair?
faint radish
well wait, if you aren't using life experiences... isnt that pre-judging?
shut vine
Correct, that's racial prejudice
mystic ermine
The thing is that we spend more time blaming past racist laws and past oppressions vs aiming to move the fuck forward
shut vine
^
mystic ermine
Slavery was shit
But, slavery has been illegal for how long now?
At the end of the day, you gotta draw a line in the sand somewhere
shut vine
I'm not going to make reparations for what someone else did. Just like African's shouldn't have to make reparations for all the other African's they sold as slaves.
mystic ermine
Calling "oh, they traumatise us" is literally how you end up with another hitler
sharp bronze
If a green Man from Mars kills your whole family, you shouldn't assume all green people are out to kill you, you think he's a psychopath.
If green martians subjugate your people for centuries, you probably are justified in not liking them
So if you had your whole family murdered in front of your eyes as a young child you'd not be damaged and traumatized beyond repair?
@shut vine
shut vine
You shouldn't no, but the thing with intense trauma like that
Is anything small can trigger a anxiety response
sharp bronze
The people destroying statues in America last mont didn't do so because they were oppressed by those statues themselves
But because those statues represent what oppressed their families for generations
sharp bronze
Yeah remember when blacks invaded America and enslaved them
Or when the Indians invaded England and colonized them too
shut vine
Yeah, good idea, brass tacks
I think we need to stop telling our kids that people with certain skin colors are bad people.
sharp bronze
White people singlehandedly took it upon themselves to go and civilize half the world, and the least they can do is to take responsibility for all the people who could've lived in literal wakanda if whites hadn't filled the whole world with cement and steel
mystic ermine
Yes
shut vine
Sure, let's get the people who did it in court, and make them pay for it.
mystic ermine
We're sorry for what our great great great great great great great grandfathers did that we have fuckall any say over
shut vine
I say execute the lot of them.
mystic ermine
Once again, you gotta draw a line in the sand somewhere
At what point do we move on and take steps to actually work for a better society instead of perpetuating the past?
You don't move forward by sitting in the past
shut vine
I'm for moving forward, not backwards.
sharp bronze
I'm for moving wherever people want to move towards
faint radish
ah a mob
sharp bronze
If towards is in space, go for it. If poc or bame want to integrate, much better
But if they don't want to why force them
shut vine
For the benefit of society as a whole.
faint radish
doesnt matter if its wrong, just as long as its what everyone else wants
mystic ermine
Because you can't scream that the system is opressing them and literally sit in a ball and cuss at everyfucker who wants to try to move forward
We go back to how there is 0 discussion these days bar name calling, etc
You cannot move forward if you refuse to discuss out of fear of being disagreed with or something
shut vine
Yeah dialogue has to happen.
sharp bronze
doesnt matter if its wrong, just as long as its what everyone else wants
@faint radish yeah, we call it democracy, it sucks but it sucks less than everything else we tried so far. Until we can get the socialist utopia, we have to get by a system where most people decide and if they don't like they can only blame themselves
sharp bronze
Yeah that's fair
sharp bronze
But it's still the people deciding what's socially acceptable and not say the church or king
mystic ermine
I mean, I would love to live in the liberal dream where there are no borders, we can all skip around and be happy without fear of being shot, etc; That would be amazing, but, we live in a world with currency, in a world where currency drives innovation, I can't see there being a huge massive shift towards that until the concept of currency basically disappears
shut vine
Progress is driven on inequalities.
sharp bronze
Yeah, the government is slow, but the people have the final and initial say.
If some minorities decide to open a poc only business, people usually love it and support it. If racists make a white only club, people will rightfully throw bricks in it
shut vine
There will be 100's if not 1000's of years before people are capable of living like that.
mystic ermine
but the people have the final and initial say
meanwhile one person in NYC vetos a bill because he doesn't like the co-sponsor after 137-4 votes for it
sharp bronze
Until there's backlash and the law is changed
shut vine
It may not ever be possible, there will always be dissidents.
shut vine
Yeah, and I hope that works out for them.
sharp bronze
A little bar is gonna stand in the way?
shut vine
I hope the police abandon them completely too.
We already had this social experiment, but people didn't learn so.
Guess the lesson needs to be learned again
mystic ermine
Defund police! fuck the police! get rid of the police!
HALP, POLICE, WE'VE BEEN ASSULTED< WHY IS NOBODY HERE?! WTF?!
sharp bronze
Aw man
shut vine
I hope a few of these cities the police just say fuck it and leave a voice recording that plays music and occasionally says "your call is important to us, the next available operator will be happy to take your call"