sk-lore

[wintry flame]

even the base version of silksong we got which is this lively beautiful adventure filled with colors and a mysterious haunting gets sidelined to talk about the sludge again

[silk dirge]

having the snare just kinda work feels anticlimactic

[sinful nimbus]

At least Lömm was spared from this fate

[hidden crater]

I had a dream where they removed ass jims ass and players got so mad they negative review bombed silksong

[flint wadi]

i mean then you just allocate act 3 content into act 2

[terse warren]

Reminder that TC not only never told us they cut Coral Forest, but even showed a room from Coral Tower to basically make us think it was still there

[wintry flame]

act 3's problems can be summarized (FOR ME) by looking at the final boss:

it's lace, again
covered in void this time
in the abyss

[silk dirge]

i mean then you mess with the acts structure

[solid badge]

so much oil
no US marines in sight

[terse warren]

God it really can

[silk dirge]

theres no point in having acts if you just have 2 acts and i dont like it bc the acts are really cool

[sinful nimbus]

Hi guys this is my tumblr OC its like Lace but all evil and voided

[cobalt coyote]

Yeah kinda wish the final Boss was something more unique.

[sinful nimbus]

Why is the game even broken into acts

[hidden crater]

I thought we were gonna fight the shade lord in act 3 but nope we're just fighting someones rebelious child

[terse warren]

It's about how act 3 was written, not the fact that it's there

[silk dirge]

nah i like lost lace as a final boss

[spark valve]

copying expedition 33

[wintry flame]

shade lord would have been worse

[fading whale]

Tbh yeah third lace recycle felt cheap but the fight was good, I think they know it's their best designed fight so they wanted to keep using it

[sinful nimbus]

Imagine if Subnautica went like ACT 3: ARCHITECTS after the degasi storyline

[silk dirge]

not every final boss needs to be a giant goddess or smth

[cobalt coyote]

I wanted a Giant goddess boss

[edgy barn]

I agree but like

[terse warren]

That explains why Silksong ended up mid

[charred nimbus]

I agree with that, i'm so annoyed i fight Lace 3 times, like, why bro?

[hidden crater]

At least he would have gotten something and not another 10 seconds of screen time

[edgy barn]

We had already fought Lace twice before

[wintry flame]

lace being the final boss makes sense as that's kind of like the crux of silksong's combat mechanics being put into practice you don't want the silksong final boss to be the radiance it doesn't make sense on a game level

[terse warren]

Not ragebait btw I didn't like E33

[cobalt coyote]

Id rather have fought harder GMS tbh

[wintry flame]

https://tenor.com/view/how-i-keep-the-rent-low-in-my-neighbourhoo-chief-keef-gif-5043739507113617112

i like lace as a final boss i don't like the abyss and the void and the everbloom being tied so hard into it

[charred nimbus]

At least we would be fighting the same boss 2 times and not 3

And Lost Lace honestly is just normal Lace with void attacks

[hidden crater]

Fighting Grand mother silk in her youth in pantheon of pharloom trust

[edgy barn]

Ah

[flint wadi]

i feel like sherma right now the more you guys bring this game down the less i wanna play it

[sinful nimbus]

Everbloom has zero thematic importance 😭 🙏

[cobalt coyote]

The entirety of act 3 was a plot to lower bellhome prices

[hidden crater]

How it feels to use rosary cannon

[charred nimbus]

What?

[wintry flame]

another really cool idea for a silksong final boss would have been some form of manifestation of the citadel's greed and failure as a system

[silk dirge]

GRAND MOTHER CAPITALISM

[solid badge]

Sounds like a pile of bug carcasses.

[spark valve]

I mean yeah it's just a macguffin

[hidden crater]

YEAAAAAAH

[sinful nimbus]

Just like the hearts

[valid coral]

That's just the constant bench prices and anti homeless benches

[hidden crater]

And her attacks include throwing loam and several underworks workers at you

[flint wadi]

what if the haunting was caused by a system up top that the citadel installed to essentially run the kingdom like clockwork

[spark valve]

yes which is unfortunate because the hearts could've been more relevant if they kept the themes consistent between act 3 and the rest of the game but no

[sinful nimbus]

Well the hearts do have thematic importance

[cobalt coyote]

What if to fight the final Boss you Had to ascend and fight gorb

[flint wadi]

and it could be like a loom

[edgy barn]

yk the moment I saw the voided enemies with their special void attacks I KNEW that there would be a boss using then down the line. And honestly I kind of feel like those attacks are the worst part of the lost lace fight

[bronze turret]

Not Loam, my Sheyla! 😭

[sinful nimbus]

Its about facing the past which is cool if HK didn't already do that but better

[wintry flame]

yeah hornet even mentions bugs being tied forever to their jobs by the haunting

[hidden crater]

He didnt run fast enough :(

[bronze turret]

OUGH

[silk dirge]

would myla survive underworks

[cobalt coyote]

No

[bronze turret]

https://tenor.com/view/steven-he-emotional-damage-steven-he-emotional-damage-gif-23428142

[flint wadi]

loom automaton with a security system (gms but cooler)

[hidden crater]

Dies from a lung disease 5 minutes later

[wintry flame]

lore wise GMS makes sense on a lore level but silksong's narrative would have been so much stronger if the themes presented and the story went together seamlessly

[solid badge]

How would Myla ever survive anything?

[rose forge]

would underworks survive myla?

[flint wadi]

she actually doesnt

[spark valve]

ok but the problem is just act 3

[wintry flame]

she's the mom of the weavers

[flint wadi]

yeah but her place in the kingdom and timeline is veryyyy muddy

[hidden crater]

Third Chorus boss real

[spark valve]

not really

[silk dirge]

i mean it seems to me a post act 3 dlc would fix a lot of issues people have here with wanting to restore a kingdoms hope

[wintry flame]

true but that is another criticism i had with the game's endings and bosses

[cobalt coyote]

First, second, third chorus plus the remaining sentinels

[silk dirge]

like if there was a dlc to like restore coral forest and verdania

and fix all the towns

[wintry flame]

https://tenor.com/view/patrik-bottle-hat-gif-26508133

it's not happening

[solid badge]

Huh. Sentinels are equivalent to Watchers.

[sinful nimbus]

DLCs aren't really going to be able to live up to the main game

[silk dirge]

nah theyll cook trust

[hidden crater]

The Final Sentinel

[wintry flame]

if we're getting dlc we're going to steel city

[cobalt coyote]

Sentinels

[edgy barn]

Now that's a far fetched concept If I have ever seen one.

[whole holly]

i believe opposite

[cobalt coyote]

There are Like three in second sentinel's arena

[bronze turret]

This feels a little like doomposting, considering there's not a trace to what the DLCs are going to be

[finite cave]

i genuinely don't understand how peoplecan say coral forest still exists in sands of karak like

sands of karak replaced ir and took the coral stuff but that's basically it since coral tower isnt a real area

[wintry flame]

PHARLOOM BAY DLC

[shut harness]

what is Verdania? is it a kingdom or just a small aprt of pharloom

[silk dirge]

do we think silksong is going to get major updates like lifeblood and not just dlc

[sinful nimbus]

Well DLCs just can't really substantially alter what's already there.

We have HK DLCs as reference for this

[silk dirge]

id say very high chance

[finite cave]

probbers the first one

[sinful nimbus]

Godhome tried augmenting the base story and it was terrible

[bronze turret]

Ok the joke flew right over my head-- what is Pharloom Bay?? I need to know!

[finite cave]

they could make big areas for dlcs but not new endings or whateber

[wintry flame]

a lot of what's going to be silksong dlc probably existed before as actual content however

[valid coral]

It's the starting area of zoteboat

[finite cave]

i say this alot but a citadel sized steel city would be awesome

[fading whale]

Another question, if he's in bellhart in act 2, does he just stay there forever? Or does he disappear in act 3?

[wintry flame]

real datamined unused area present in trasilers

[silk dirge]

lore rewrite update incoming

calamity mod did it surely team cherry would do it(i doubt theyd do it and i wouldnt really care if they did or didnt)

[sinful nimbus]

Heck yeah

[bronze turret]

WHAT

[whole holly]

i wonder how team cherry planned God's Glory Mode DLC considering Godseeker is supposed to be dead? unless Flower Ending is canon one and it took her somewhere ( probably to grey mourners homeland )

[wintry flame]

to fix the issue of act 3 feeling grey and weird we're adding another citadel sized weird and gray area

[bronze turret]

Oh gods, I totally forgot to check videos of datamined content!

[finite cave]

exactly🗣🗣 make it shiny this time🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥

[edgy barn]

Do the dreamers die for nothing in the godhome ending?

[finite cave]

make it darker too🗣🗣🔥🔥 and add mass corruption🗣🗣🔥🔥

[silk dirge]

yeah

[fading whale]

It's never said the godseeker is the only body hosting the hivemind, there could be other godseeker bodies out there

[valid coral]

I'm pretty sure he just stays there through act 3 but I could be wrong on this

[rose forge]

big spoiler i think: dream no more is the canon ending

[flint wadi]

its own kingdom that happened to neighbour pharloom

[whole holly]

i just assumed Void affected entire hivemind

[spare pendant]

still not true

[silk dirge]

i am kinda curious what team cherrys plans are now

[wintry flame]

oh my god we're gonna use the elegy of the deep in the putrified duct pit to awaken the lordseeker and fight bosses in lordhome

[fading whale]

You don't know that for sure

[dire lynx]

Their deaths allow THK to leave the black egg

[silk dirge]

it seems theyre just doing bug fixes but we have no idea what their plans are for first major update/dlc

[valid coral]

I'm fully sure he goes to halfway home, 90% sure on bellhart and he'd probably stay there through act 3

[silk dirge]

id guess its probably still in early stages of development

[rose forge]

look at silksongs true ending

[wintry flame]

they seem to be buffing flintslate and nerfing cogwheel for no reason

[bronze turret]

Iirc correctly her dreams and that super rare map you can visit show that Godseeker is part of a kind where godseeking is common practice, so checks out!

[spare pendant]

Silksong doesn't have a true ending. Sisters of void is equally as canon as cursed or weaver queen hornet

[valid coral]

I still hope that datamined Hallownest crest returns

[finite cave]

i think it would be cool if we maybe just got a qol dlc with an elegy of the deep phantom fight for a bit of extra phantom lore (i like phantom)

[fading whale]

To me it looks pretty clear embrace the void with or without flower is canon

[silk dirge]

anyways yeah i dont see why team cherry cant do massive updates to alter the base game many games do this and i think it would be pretty cool

[wintry flame]

i lowkey think we'll be getting an elegy of the deep lugoli and last judge fight

[edgy barn]

Shouldn't their seals dissipate once the Radiance dies, just like the seals holding THK in place?

[finite cave]

are you being serious /genq

[fading whale]

That's a fair point

[silk dirge]

i would just say they need to add a way to access any content that might get removed

[wintry flame]

it's the most crack theory ever

[craggy bison]

Chat what if the butterfly that freed hornet at the start of the game was sherma's doing because butterflies love music and sherma plays music

[flint wadi]

lame, which is why its ambiguous

[dire lynx]

Different types of seal

[finite cave]

also i want a dlc about the choruses and sentinels i want to get jumped by sentinels

[whole holly]

they did that to hollow knight by Lifeblood DLC

[spare pendant]

elegy last judge is the same as normal last judge combat wise

[silk dirge]

like i said i personally dont care at all if they rewrite the lore or not i enjoy silksongs story but if people here want that then sure

[silk dirge]

yeah

[wintry flame]

last judge needs another theme last judge needs more content

[spare pendant]

they confirmed they will

[silk dirge]

silkpost tag missing

[whole holly]

in fact it is most likely given nature of void, God's Glory DLC might bring us equivalents instead of Godseekers

[finite cave]

revered chef lugoli ig

[craggy bison]

... Elegy last judge?

[spare pendant]

it was confirmed in the release bloomberg interview

[spare pendant]

(hypothetical)

[silk dirge]

they said dlc not updates to the game

[craggy bison]

Ohh like a memory i get it

[silk dirge]

im thinking like major changes to already existing content

these are probably guaranteed to happen

[fading whale]

I lean more towards it being simply memory diving in specific locations or even hornet's own memories by simply going in the arena. But who knows. Team cherry does do big unexpected stuff often

[spare pendant]

they did not say dlc, they do free content packs which are included in the game itself

[finite cave]

i do wonder what elegy of the deep phantom could be called

[edgy barn]

Yeah but in-universe what would be the point of having THK's seal release automatically if the radiance is no more if the dreamer seals wouldn't also release.

[silk dirge]

i mean yeah thats what i mean

[whole holly]

i guess i have to agree with you

[fading whale]

Though, the fact that widow has needolin dialogue is big pointer to me that there will be rematching

[finite cave]

they would probably have their full mask and not be so grey (assuming it's phantom before lace)

[silk dirge]

they were referring to stuff like hidden dreams, grimm troupe, godmaster that added additional content

but i have no doubt theyll do updates like lifeblood

[fading whale]

Lifeblood added hive knight

[silk dirge]

admittedly the line between dlc and update is pretty blurred

[finite cave]

and made traitor lord difficult

[edgy barn]

Firstborn of Silk?

[fading whale]

Don't think she's the first

That would be the first sinner

[edgy barn]

She's the first of the children strung from silk

[finite cave]

first sinner is called first sinner because of their sentencing

[dire lynx]

Sinner wasn't born of silk

[finite cave]

iirc theyre just a weaver

[fading whale]

She was altered and created with silk as the main force behind her creation though

[edgy barn]

But she's not made out of and subsisting on silk

[finite cave]

but lace and phantom ARE silk

[edgy barn]

She was also uplifted from a pharlid rather than created from scratch

[bronze turret]

Purely made of silk, yes, but not evolved by silk, as the memory shows

[fading whale]

Yeah sure I mean what we're talking about is just a hypothetical rematch name anyway

[finite cave]

hmmmm

i wonder what it could be

[fading whale]

I wonder if phantom was discarded and forgotten by gms after she started fraying

Or she was cast out to the organ before that and wasted away there

[finite cave]

probably aftee lace they were sent to the organ and became old there

permanent garbage duty is foul

[edgy barn]

Who do we think is stronger lorewise, Phantom or Lace?

[fading whale]

That brings the question then why did GM's even create lace

[finite cave]

well prime phantom might have been stronger? but mmm maybe lace

[fading whale]

I mean clearly lace is stronger she just phantom 2.0 most kinks ironed out edition

I doubt prime phantom was better

If I make pasta for the first time surely it'll be worse than the second time I make it no?

[finite cave]

shrug

lace is kind of held up with the " i'm a mischevious kid " thing

[fading whale]

Does that make her weaker in battle? If anything she'll be more ferocious because she wants to prove herself to mommy

[whole holly]

do you guys think Hornet becomes Higher Being after Binding Eva?

[finite cave]

she plays around alot iirc

[edgy barn]

no

[tribal cargo]

I cried 😭 || so glad to see the knight is ACTUALLY ALIVE and saving his sister || this is so peak 🥹

[bronze turret]

Considering Phantom was considered a failed child, I would assume Lace is stronger lore-wise

[finite cave]

this scene was AMAZING

[fading whale]

No, also binding Eva is nothing compared to binding a weaver or another bug's crest, in terms of indication of power

[whole holly]

Half Higher Being containing Attempt of Higher Being doesn't make higher being

[finite cave]

the knight clearly cared about hornet in hk so this just brought that full circle

[pine garden]

we power scaling Phantom and Lace? Clearly Lace is stronger by virtue of not being a failed child, something something their needolin dialogue at the Exhaust Organ talks about how fragile Phantom is and how her existance is pain or something

[tribal cargo]

I forgot all the pain lost lace inflicted to my soul

It is worthh the grind and the practice to experience that ending

[edgy barn]

Eva is by her own admision weaker than anything you get a crest from.

[fading whale]

Yes

[finite cave]

i wish we could have bound a crest from eva

[fading whale]

However she is alive and the crest bugs aren't

She can also conjure an unbreakable barrier

[finite cave]

curse those weavers for making their experiment too weak

[fading whale]

So she is very weird indeed

[tribal cargo]

Also can we assume then the || godhome ending is prolly || the most canonicall one ??

[edgy barn]

That does not work in her favor lmao

[spare pendant]

NO

[fading whale]

Imo yes

[bronze turret]

I like to think so, yes.

[spare pendant]

i am going to die

[whole holly]

that might be for gameplay reasons but if you include every thing Eva gives us like Vesticrest and infinite Silk she would be superior to any crest

[tribal cargo]

Yea i thought so aswell

[pine garden]

this probably implies that any ending in HK where the knight replaces HK will inevitably lead to the Infection leaking again, as its clear that the Knight does have thoughts and "attachments" the same way the HK did

[dire lynx]

That's what I would say, but an argument can also be made for dream no more

[finite cave]

i mean sylphsong iz probably juzg weaver magic stuff

[spare pendant]

if i see ONE more person saying there is a canon ending to either game i am going to discombobulate myself

[bronze turret]

Commence discombobulation

[tribal cargo]

Yea the || shade lord of void glimpse || pretty much show that the || godhome ending || is prolly the canonical one

[fading whale]

The silk thing could very well be Eva just amplifying hornet's own power to do that though, I mean that's what she's doing when she evolves hunter crest and gives vestis

[whole holly]

physically or generally?

[pine garden]

yeah, after all the Knight is in his Dream No More form, not the Shade lord.

[tribal cargo]

I forgot which one is that?

[dire lynx]

U don't have to put spoilers in this cannel btw

[spare pendant]

radiance ending

[fading whale]

I mean you can cling to words team cherry said like 9 years ago before they even made godhome all you want, that doesn't mean you're right

[tribal cargo]

Its okk just in case someone havent finish it

Its so peak i cant bring myself to spoil people who havent finish it

[spare pendant]

They have never went back on their word or contradicted themselves in 9 years. You're the one going against word of god.

[edgy barn]

"Lady, you are a multitude within a single shell. A being truly unbound. To aid your growth has proved a grand task, even for one as limited as me.
As my last act, permit me to ask a final, selfish request."
Hornet: "Your talents have provided great benefit, Eva. What is it you desire of me?"
"Only to have my own soul, my own memories, bound within your shell... As you have done with those others throughout these lands.
I would not define as a crest within you, but my small strength may still grant a final boon."
"Hornet: You ask to be subsumed? Know your mind would cease to be, in any independent sense. "
"I know. And still I seek it, gladly. To be united with one unbound... This is the kind of escape I once prayed for, though the weight of ages had almost made me forget.
Dear Lady, would you grant me this request?"

[spare pendant]

"Death of the author" does not apply to an ongoing story 😭

[whole holly]

Hornet becoming one will Eva might be candidate of Higher Being though sheer power, she amplifies our raw power, somewhat like ascension

[subtle plaza]

kinda yeah, DNM also works technically

[tribal cargo]

Wait isnt in the DNM ending the knight shell cracked?

[subtle plaza]

ye

[pine garden]

practically speaking the Dream No More and the Godhome endings don't have any major difference for Silksong, both endings have the Radiance die and the Knight kinda unify the void, and the HK presumably survives in both endings

[bronze turret]

I share the same sentiment. 7 is a lot of time, there's no actual unspoken rule that devs can't change their mind regarding what's the canon ending, especially when that same team was planning a DLC, but then they changed their mind and decided to make it a full game

[tribal cargo]

Oh so yall assume he || integrated / become one with the void? || i thought he just dead

[spare pendant]

The devs could have changed their minds literally the next day. There's no evidence they did.

[subtle plaza]

i dont think HK survives after DNM...?

[whole holly]

oh, yeah that makes more sense given context, she is not as powerful as other crest sources

[fading whale]

Yeah but shade lord only exists because of the godseekers focus and attunement being the catalyst for all the SHADES -hence the name LORD OF SHADES- (not the entirety of the void) To unite into the SHADE lord and beat absard.

It makes sense to me that without godseeker focus /Ascension of hollow Knight's player character though that very ritual combat, shade lord wouldn't be their common state of existence

[pine garden]

oh wait yeah his body is missing after DNM I forgot about that

[subtle plaza]

lol

i dont think hk surviving matters too much for ss

[bronze turret]

The Silksong ending passes for evidence to me, in all honesty, the whole "true form flashing above the person's image" is not new, so let's just agree to disagree

[pine garden]

yeah but it would be cool if he was still alive rebuilding Hallownest

[fading whale]

They literally also said they don't even know the details of the world and the story back then but clearly now they do since they keep clarifying and adding stuff?

[whole holly]

i hope he shows up in DLC to aid us against Steelhearts

[tribal cargo]

Hollow knight 3 : reunion

[spare pendant]

This isn't a matter of opinion. You're wrong. Sorry.

[pine garden]

true, my assumption was that as the shades unified under the void heart that being akin to Shade Lord would just, kinda appear

[subtle plaza]

actually yeah kinda, the time gap between hk and silksong is very ambigous so it would be very cool to see that hallownest gets rebuilt in some way

[spare pendant]

The underlying philosophy of respecting player agency has clearly not changed for Silksong.

[bronze turret]

This begs the question, though: you seem upset at the idea of Embrace the Void being the canon ending, is there a particular reason for it?

[valid coral]

Hollow Knight: Skylines

[tribal cargo]

I mean...theres plenty of evidence seems to be proving otherwise while all your argument seems to only be a single line said by team cherry which is 9 years ago (?)

Or did they said it multiple times?

[fading whale]

Yeah that's why they added a bunch of new vague things for us to be arguing about, doesn't mean we should keep arguing about answered questions

[pine garden]

it is prime real estate for rebuilding, most of its infrastructure is still there aside from Forgotten Crossroads being badly damaged near the end of the first game. Its just going to be pretty empty of intelligent bugs for a while aside from small settlements, but since there are intelligent bugs out there like the pilgrims, it could be repopulated easily

[spare pendant]

I'm upset at you and others propagating misinformation as if it's fact against even the developers' statements. Your headcanon is not fact.

[small gate]

the glimpse of shade lord probably doesnt mean too much of anything regarding to literal events

the void is shade lord is the void

[spare pendant]

Is this evidence in the room with us right now?

[tribal cargo]

Yea the true ending ?? I thought its kinda obvious how it invalidates some of the HK ending already

[spare pendant]

It is an answered question. The answer is that there is no canon ending. If that answer ever changes, I'm sure they'll email you personally.

[pine garden]

what was the TC statement anyway? Was it "any ending can be canon" or "no ending is 100% canon"? I forgot

[tribal cargo]

They say
"All ending can be cannon" or smth

But that was YEARS AGO

[pine garden]

cause the non-Radiance related HK endings are clearly non-canon now

[whole holly]

how would Silksong take place after sealed siblings if every ending is equally canon, they also said they would address and account for every ending for next game but that's clearly not true anymore

[subtle plaza]

why are we treating either EtV being canon or DNM being canon as like a political debate lol, I think silksong could take place after either of these endings lol 😭

[spare pendant]

It's never stated to be a true ending, that's just your headcanon. It is one of three possible endings, two of which don't rely on etv/dnm to occur.

[valid coral]

Wasn't that the entire point of flashing the shade lord for a split second

[pine garden]

yeah its nothing too major, but its clear that its either one of those that happened canonically in Hallownest prior to Silksong

[valid coral]

Just a "hey this is also a fully valid ending"

[spare pendant]

Two possibilities for sealed siblings:

1. Silksong doesn't occur (no reason it has to occur in every possible timeline)
2. The citadel uses their established seal-breaking magic to break the black egg seal

[bronze turret]

I said I liked to think Embrace the Void is canon, not that I think it was set in stone. The only argument I can give to support my idea is that the character's true form flashing over their lesser, friendlier form is a visual cinematographic symbology trope I've seen before.

[fading whale]

To me it seems way more likely it's actually massive. Hornet mentions lifeblood aberrations in her home caves, we don't know if that happened before or after events of HK. Not to mention the fact that her voice is much deeper, she's stated to be supremely old, old enough to where herrah wasn't sure hornet could even remember her words when time was right.

She also mentions she fought off multiple separate attempts of the citadel to capture her until they finally succeeded

[pine garden]

Hornet is also taller I think in Silksong

could be wrong tho

[tribal cargo]

Hmmm i get ur point

But its hard to not label it "true ending" when the games pretty much implied it

Just like how often people consider the DNM "true ending" before dlc is added

U cant invalidate how 90% people gonna perceive if the game pretty much "indirectly" points to it being a "true ending"

[small gate]

likely not

[valid coral]

Doesn't hornet say the chains in the black egg would drain her fully if she were to stay in there too long

[spare pendant]

Where is it implied?

[pine garden]

yeah she'd die soon after the seal is put in place

[wooden sphinx]

silly knight at the end of the game

[subtle plaza]

That is a pretty cool observation but i think hornet's voice being deeper could just be a voice actor thing :P

i do agree, though

[tribal cargo]

All ur action leading up to the ending

[spare pendant]

We don't know how much time has to have passed between the two games. It's completely valid that the seals may have been broken not long after sealed siblings. And again, silksong may just not happen in that timeline.

[spare pendant]

What about it?

[valid coral]

Which in that case means that for silksong specifically sealed siblings is no longer canon

[tribal cargo]

Everything u do in game leads to the act 3 ending

Thats why people perceive it as "true ending"

[spare pendant]

That would be fine if so yes

[pine garden]

okay if we're gonna start talking about timelines in a multi-ending game then literally any outcome could be "canon", the knight dying to a starting area random critter in steel soul mode would be as canonically valid as any of the endings in the game

[spare pendant]

If you do act 3, yes, otherwise no. This seems obvious?

[subtle plaza]

i mean, sealed siblings is obviously canon if you don't include silksong? That isn't like a ground breaking observation or smth

[small gate]

if we're talking timelines my christmas wish is for hollow knight 3: hollow knight to be real as a direct etv sequel

[whole holly]

1. you are bringing your own headcanons since timelines as you describe it doesn't exist in Hollow Knight universe, and i don't remember team cherry introducing it 2. requires proof 3. you are ignoring the fact that they also said they would address and account for every ending for next game, even though that is no longer true 4. you were saying you hate how others spread their headcanons as fact even though you are using yours to justify 9 year old statement that is unproven and unfeasible today

[spare pendant]

That's not confirmed though, endings being canon is confirmed

[teal drift]

I mean didnt TC themselves confirm sealed sublings as the canon ending on their most recent ama? It just makes the most sense.

[tribal cargo]

Well yea again back to my point
Just because team cherry themselve dont officialy label it "true ending"

Doesnt mean that 90% people who play through everything cant consider it "true ending" when the game pretty much POINTS to that direction

[pine garden]

the knight dying on its journey in Steel Soul mode is definitely canon

[bronze turret]

What's ama?

[spare pendant]

I'm using "timelines" figuratively, not the literal multiverse theory. They also never contradicted that statement.

[whole holly]

plus if new game doesn't address Timelines/Endings it invalidates them

[spare pendant]

They can, but it's not factual

[small gate]

steel soul jinn is THE MOST canon character in hollow knight

[teal drift]

Anytime the knight dies it just becomes another vessel body for the next knight to find thats canon smh

[spare pendant]

No?

[valid coral]

This is also counting on the citadel bugs actually being able to break the black egg seal

[fading whale]

I don't agree, sure with purely hollow knight to look at someone could very well assume that, but with silksong act 3 ending to me it seems like lord of shades is the lord of like, the actual shades, the siblings and the player character and all the vessels. Not the entirety of the void. That's why while they might be the authority and the master of the void, they aren't the void itself entirely. That's also why they have to cut off the tendrils instead of them simply not attacking, that's why void is hostile towards hornet and literally everything else in general. I don't think player character is evil, and if it and the void are one and the same why is void bringing all this death? In my opinion, the void is a natural force, an element that seeks to consume and end all things. It has no consciousness or identity of its own but it does have a will. Now, the Vessels , their shades, and our old player character actually do have minds of their own in a sense (that's why they failed at holding the radiance in) .

In the end of godhome, all those wills and minds are unified into the shade lord towards a common goal

[pine garden]

there is literally no reason to assume the normal game function of the Knight being able to respawn after dying is canon since every other vessel doesn't function that way. The more canon route for both games is heavily implied (but not 100% confirmed) to be the steel soul routes where they never die

[tribal cargo]

Whats ur fact?

[valid coral]

Which considering the fact that their seal on hornet (which is probably the strongest one they've got) broke after a single lumafly touched it...

[wooden sphinx]

by that logic Silksong isnt canon

[whole holly]

well they said they would account for every ending and they haven't so some endings are at least more prioritized than others

[spare pendant]

The fact is that there is no exclusively canon ending, all endings are canon

[bronze turret]

Ah... who are you addressing?

[pine garden]

there fore the knight dying in the starting area in steel soul mode would be as canon and "valid" as an "ending" as any of the Hollow Knight endings by that logic and that's just silly

[tribal cargo]

And why are u so sure this is a FACT?

[wooden sphinx]

sylenthuntress logic here

[spare pendant]

They have

[bronze turret]

So there's no reason to assume what we see in Silksong can't have been planned with Embrace the Void in mind.

[spare pendant]

because it was stated by the literal creators of the game, I.e God

[teal drift]

I mean we just dont have enough info. We can argue all day about DNM and ETV and shit but we cant say with 100% certainty which ending is canon to skong. Why argue around it instead of saying “most endings can be valid if flexed around”

[bronze turret]

Ah

[pine garden]

their logic is that every ending in HK and SS are equally canon. And in HK endings where radiance isn't killed, then in those timelines SS never happens.

[tribal cargo]

When did they say this? Other than that 1 reddit replies?

[hollow fog]

why does pharloom need so much bells? we got entire tunnels made of bells, caves made of bells, town made of bells. is it even explained in the game or what?

[spare pendant]

The game was planned with every ending in mind, per a statement Nika referenced

[teal drift]

My guess is bells make gms sleepy.

[subtle plaza]

all endings are canon if you disregard silksong, yes 🤦‍♂️

[whole holly]

that doesn't fully address my statement , considering they have contradicted it with only addressing some endings, they promised they would address all endings just like they said all endings are canon, those statements are equally truthful considering fact that they aren't

[fading whale]

1 is as pointless as me saying in another universe Mr mushroom kills the radiance,

2 is disproven by hornet saying she fought off many citadel kidnapping attempts in the past. Unless you assume they broke her own and she killed them in her ultra weakened sealed siblings state even though it is shows in silksong that even a simple cage with some runes (far less powerful seals than black egg) can render her nearly powerless

[spare pendant]

You can't just ignore their statement because they posted it on reddit? lol

[pine garden]

you're being a massive pedant for literally no reason. When discussing whether Dream No More or Godhome endings are canon people are obviously talking in reference to SS's true ending

[spare pendant]

No ...

[whole holly]

how did they account for Sealed Siblings ending? explain without bringing your headcanons in this

[subtle plaza]

how tf is sealed siblings ending canon

[spare pendant]

They didn't disregard any endings.

[pine garden]

its canon but its not canon for Silksong

[teal drift]

Hornet gets out somehow idk boom. They dont need to provide an explicit confirmation of it for that to be possible.

[subtle plaza]

yes, ik that but this guy is claiming that its canon in relation to silksong

[pine garden]

its canon for Hollow Knight but its not canon for Silksong, for Silksong the only canon endings are probably the Dream No More and Godhome endings

[teal drift]

Occams razor indicates its not sealed siblings but that doesnt mean it could never be.

[valid coral]

She's literally a dreamer in that ending how would she free her eternally comatose self

[tribal cargo]

Ok so lemme just confirm this

So ur basiclly putting ur faith on " all ending is canon" just because of a SINGLE REDDIT COMMENT 9 years ago talking about HOLLOW KNIGHT ENDING

Which team cherry prolly never even clarified / repeat again?

And u going to apply that as a law/rule/statement that applied to silksong ending after silksong released years later?

[teal drift]

Idk she gets out somehow.

[pine garden]

she build different, she just woke up duh

[teal drift]

I’m saying its possible not that its likely.

[small gate]

see i understand and agree to this regarding them being separate entities, so i rescind the previous statement. the thing is that, by the time the shade lord is made to appear in etv, the player character is already "one" with the void, or at least has some kind of union to it through the voidheart. the shade lord as i understand it is not the Big Fucking Thing, which is void given extreme focus, but the player character (as it could be any other void being for that matter) that manages to unite the void under its will

[spare pendant]

In the state you're referencing, she is literally still able to fight. It doesn't contradict the idea she could have fought off the citadel or escaped.

[valid coral]

She quit to menu and went back to her last bench

[bronze turret]

That is a rather too loose "it's magic" argument, that's why it doesn't feel as solid as picking an ending where the unfolding of events feels more in line with what sounds more plausible.

[spare pendant]

That's literally, factually, not true when people have been arguing otherwise for the past ten minutes

[whole holly]

like i said? how did they account for Sealed Siblings ending? explain without bringing your headcanons in this, if you bring timelines there would have to be main one considering some aren't addressed in Silksong, Main Timeline( like games we play) = Main Ending

[pine garden]

The canon Steel Soul route fr fr

[spare pendant]

It's not a headcanon that the citadel can break seals

[spare pendant]

Only if you ignore WoG

[teal drift]

I agree its not solid or likely, but its possible. Debating whether something we physically cannot confirm can be confirmed is a waste of all our time

[valid coral]

Nearly everything in the citadel is explicitly mechanical. The only seal we did see them use got broken by a single lumafly

[pine garden]

yeah nothing indicates the citadel could break through the Dreamers seal in the black egg

[whole holly]

not all Seals are same considering Hornet herself is used to Seal Knight it, thus Sealed Siblings

[pine garden]

if it was as simply as applying pressure like the lumafly then the Knight would've done so ingame

[spare pendant]

An official statement from team cherry which has never been contradicted is a better standard for confirmed canon than even in-game dialogue. There are cases where word of god is dubious; a team of three people is not one of them.

[small gate]

the Big Fucking Thing could be a higher being ruler of the void or anything of the sort, but the knight is already something at least capable of containing or at least focusing the voids nature for annihiliation, so theyre at least exherting similar roles

[hollow fog]

why does pharloom need so much bells? we got entire tunnels made of bells, caves made of bells, town made of bells. is it even explained in the game or what?

[tribal cargo]

Ok so idk how to break this to you but that is YOUR OPINION

And not the fact 🥲

If thats what u consider FACTUAL then... welp again your opinion i guess

[small gate]

because it looks cool

[spare pendant]

Not a lumafly, a silk fly, which the citadel created. It's clear they can break seals.

[bronze turret]

And this is what people are trying to get at. We are just stating what we believe or like to believe is the ending the devs decided to follow the closest, not what is factual and what's not because, by the end of the day, even the endings of Hollow Knight can be too contradicting to coexist within the same timeline, so we just parse what we consider the most interesting one

[pine garden]

personally I think Dream No More ending is more likely to be canon to SS's true ending rather than godhome ending. The Knight acts completely differently than normal after transforming into the Shade Lord, it felt to me like the Knight stopped being themselves and were replaced by a higher being in the Shade Lord

[spare pendant]

Nothing contradicts it

[spare pendant]

Doesn't matter. I'm not saying they definitively did break the seal. I'm saying it's an option.

[dire lynx]

Weak seals we see can also break from falling as in the slab

[whole holly]

like i said,they promised they would address all endings just like they said all endings are canon, those statements are equally truthful considering fact that they aren't, Citadel can't break Seal if they haven't proven to be able to.

[spare pendant]

No, it is fact. You're just wrong. Sorry!

[whole holly]

if answer is entirely hypothetical then ending isn't addressed

[pine garden]

The burden of proof is on you to prove that Citadel COULD break the dreamer seal, and there is literally nothing that proves that

[valid coral]

It's clear then that they can break their own seals if the seal on the black egg can stand up to every soul and void adjacent spell the knight has then there's no reason to believe that they could have broken kt

[spare pendant]

They do work as lead ups to weaver queen and cursed, just not SoV

[tribal cargo]

Nahh i dont think so. Your fact is just misguided n misinformed 🥲 😌

[pine garden]

you can't just go "hey the Citadel wasn't explicitly proven to be incapable of doing that". We could go and say "hey it wasn't proven that Citadel can't kill the Radiance!" and then argue that they could do it

[valid coral]

I forgot about the slab seal but even that is weak enough for hornet to break it

[spare pendant]

That doesn't follow

[spare pendant]

That goes for all endings, we have no confirmed details for what happens between games

[fading whale]

Similar official statements also say team cherry literally doesn't know the answers and details to many questions and that they're still figuring it out, I guess that means they still don't have a clue 8+ years later but they decided to make a whole massive game anyway and add massive dlc content in hollow knight as well

[tribal cargo]

Also are we really considering a single redit reply 9 years ago to be "official statement" 😭

[bronze turret]

Then why are you so pressed that Embrace the Void is some people's ending of choice?

[spare pendant]

My claim isn't that they necessarily possessed the ability to break the seal. My claim, which is fact, is that they may have possessed the ability to break the seal (corroborated by evidence shown in-game) and may therefore have done so.

[whole holly]

if we have no confirmed details then ending isn't addressed, they said something that wasn't true nine years ago so clearly it also applies to their statement that all endings are canon, this is also not true then

[spare pendant]

Why would you assume they're using brute force to break the seal?

[spare pendant]

I don't care what you think. You have no argument.

[valid coral]

Your argument consists of a 9 year old message from the devs of a reddit AMA

[tribal cargo]

Oofff said the dude who faithfully hanging on a single reddit reply 9 years ago😭😭

[spare pendant]

Just because they can't answer every question doesn't mean you get to disregard one of the few answers they were sure of.

[pine garden]

and they may have been able to kill the Radiance if they were to arrive at Hallownest, there is nothing disproving that in game, we have ingame prove in the needolin song being able to enter peoples dream!

[fading whale]

Then why show the shade lord at all?

Imo shade lord exists only when godseeker focus and ritual combat ascension stuff plays into it, and is not the permanent state of the shades/siblings after etv

[spare pendant]

That's literally not my issue

[valid coral]

Because the only way we've seen their seals broken is through either brute force or a silk fly which probably wouldn't work on non silk adjacent seals

[spare pendant]

It was true nine years ago, and it's still true now. You keep trying to disregard the literal word of team cherry to support your headcanon.

[dire lynx]

Also the lack of THK's shade could be taken as a sign he's still alive

[spare pendant]

They don't have to reiterate their statements every month for them to remain canon.

[tribal cargo]

U know what...why even bother

[pine garden]

yeah that also makes sense. Godseeker focus also brought the Hollow Knight to his peak as the Pure Vessel, and Radiance to her peak with Absolute Radiance. The Shade Lord definitely follows the same principle

[spare pendant]

Okay? Not relevant to the convo

[pine garden]

it is relevant because what you're saying is silly

[wooden sphinx]

what happens in the game is more important than some ancient reddit AMA that only 6 people know about

[valid coral]

Their opinions also could have changed over 9 years and they just didn't think it important to mention

[spare pendant]

The idea that they can't break "non-silk seals" is just your headcanon.

[spare pendant]

Nothing in-game contradicts team cherry's statement about their own damn game

[pine garden]

you mean to say that Citadel is more capable of destroying a dreamer seal than Hallownest, the kingdom which created it and then couldn't destroy it at all without killing the dreamers

[valid coral]

A headcanon and "we haven't seen them break a single seal that is non silk adjacent" are two very different things

[spare pendant]

Doesn't mean it did

[whole holly]

if them addressing all endings ended up not being true same goes to all endings are equal statement, you keep bringing up your headcanons to say they addressed Sealed Siblings ending when evidence is simply not present therefore the haven't addresses all endings

[dire lynx]

The idea they can break dreamer seals is just your own headcanon

[pine garden]

yeah and a frankly insane one at that

[spare pendant]

I don't disagree we haven't seen it. That doesn't mean it's impossible.

[fading whale]

Yeah tbh,that whole scene was fanservice from the start anyway, and there wouldn't be anything more fanservicey than including thk shade in it as well. Him being missing from that scene could very well be telling that they have plans for him

[spare pendant]

It is true, stop reiterating the same claim I've already debunked

[whole holly]

what is my headcanon??

[pine garden]

"We haven't seen the Savage Beastfly and Radiance fight, therefore it wouldn't be impossible for the former to kill the latter in a fair fight"

[valid coral]

this feels like a playground powerscaling duel

[spare pendant]

That's not my claim. My claim is that they could maybe do so.

[tribal cargo]

Oh also if we assume the godhome is the canon ending from HK now

Does that mean the hollow knight is prolly alive??

[whole holly]

you haven't debunked, you are using headcanon to address Sealed Siblings ending

[pine garden]

my brother we literally saw him in the true ending of SS

[fading whale]

Not that our knight and the other shades are dead, they're just in the void, thk not being there could very well be a hint that he's still in his vessel form

[valid coral]

Probably if hornet didn't kill their ass

[spare pendant]

That whatever endings you support as the true endings are exclusively canon

[tribal cargo]

Nooo not the knight

The hollow knight. The big dude

[valid coral]

No that's explicitly the knight

[dire lynx]

The entire argument that SS is possible whatsoever hinges on your headcanon that they can bust dreamer seals

[whole holly]

making it unsubstantiated claim

[pine garden]

ooh my bad my bad

[valid coral]

The hollow knights shade is the shape of the hollow knight

[spare pendant]

It's not headcanon to say something might be possible.

[tribal cargo]

In the godhome ending the HOLLOW knight technically is still inside the egh

[spare pendant]

I never said that.

[pine garden]

yeah we didn't see him. My headcanon is that if the Godseeker ending is canon, the HK survives and starts rebuilding Hallownest

[whole holly]

when did i state that?

[fading whale]

I'm calling it now, memory dlc in which hornet fights Freed Vessel

Hahahaha

[valid coral]

You just said my point about them probably not being able to break silk adjacent seals headcanon

[pine garden]

he walks out of it, at the end of the ending Hornet notices him and they both prepare for combat

[dire lynx]

Then how is SS accounted for in silksong?

[small gate]

no hes not

[spare pendant]

Logical possibility is not grounded in substance, that makes no sense

[pine garden]

so unless Hornet fucking KILLS the HK he's probably alive

[spare pendant]

That's what you're arguing for...

[tribal cargo]

Is that the Hollow knight?? Or the knight?

[small gate]

the seal is broken in godhome and he appears besides hornet at the temple

[fading whale]

I doubt that's what he would wanna do

[pine garden]

Hollow Knight

[small gate]

the hollow knight

[wooden sphinx]

THK

[pine garden]

let me find the screenshot of that ending

[valid coral]

Definitely the hollow knight you can see the nail

[tribal cargo]

Wait how do yall know that? OH THE NAIL?

I need to rewatch it

[spare pendant]

Those aren't equivalent statements

[small gate]

their cloak too

[whole holly]

you have no proof you are using hypothetical feasibility , they break seals that are radically different Black Egg seals, considering Hornet herself is Seal in Black Egg

[valid coral]

Honestly I wouldn't blame him if he just sits in the forgotten crossroads spa forever

[pine garden]

in this cutscene the Hollow Knight stumbles out of the Black Egg and hornet prepares for battle with it

[tribal cargo]

OOOO 👀

[fading whale]

That's only because you're convinced you're right, I promise you to virtually any observer of the conversation they are pretty equivalent

[tribal cargo]

Wait how did the seal in the egg got broken??

[fading whale]

Yeah that cutscene is clear you can even see part of his mask

[spare pendant]

It IS hypothetical, because by claiming sealed siblings is unaccounted for, you are literally claiming it is impossible for sealed siblings to lead into silksong

[whole holly]

nope, you may have no reading comprehension, my point is they haven't addressed all endings so something they said 9 years ago may not be plan now

[wooden sphinx]

maybe seals react to Radiance

[valid coral]

The citadel being able to break one of the most powerful seals in Hallownest =/= the citadel not being able to break that seal
This makes no sense, and frankly I'm tired of debating this

[pine garden]

I think he would, he sacrificed himself for the kingdom, he clearly had an attachment to the PK. I'd imagine he'd continue looking after the kingdom and become the new monarch, we don't see his shade in the SS True ending so he's either alive out there or dead

[spare pendant]

They are logically not equivalent. I don't care what side you're on. "X may be possible" is a statement of consistency, "X is probably impossible" is a statement of probability

[tribal cargo]

Does that mean the 3 dreamer can potentially be alive ?! i forgot how did u unlock the godhome again? Do u need to kill the dreamer ??

[wooden sphinx]

You need to slay them

and you need voidheart

[tribal cargo]

Ah ok nvm ripp hornet mom

[fading whale]

Not even now, it literally wasn't the plan even like two years later when they decided to make godhome. In hindsight they said that cause they wanted to obscure the fact that literally no ending available at the time is canon because they're ACTIVELY working on a new one that is.

[pine garden]

presumably the dreamers died once Radiance disappeared and their duty was over

[edgy barn]

to get what?

[pine garden]

oh wait you need voidheart yeah I forgot about that

[fading whale]

I mean their bodies disappear and it's stated by many characters that they die so no

[spare pendant]

But they have

[tribal cargo]

How did u get voidheart?

Damn i need to do a replay on HK

[spare pendant]

I never said they're able. I said they might be able.

[whole holly]

again with misrepresenting arguments and zero reading comprehension, Sealed Siblings IS unaccounted for because we lack details , nobody claimed that it is impossible to lead into silksong everybody is claiming that they aren't explained or accounted for if you can't tell difference then there is no point in having argument

[dire lynx]

Kingsouly and dream nail void egg

[bronze turret]

Sylent, the very fact that you saw two people say "IMO yes" and "I like to think so, yes" to Caleb's question and still interpreted our comments as us taking ETV as the definitive, canon ending tells me you're too quick to assume what people mean, so, yeah I agree with Nika's perception of your lack of reading comprehension.

[pine garden]

they didn't, you can only justify all the HK endings being canon in SS is by doing insane back bending headcanon justifications that are clearly never hinted at ingame

[fading whale]

Going in your own memories with the kingsoul and seeing thk looking back at the player character's first failed ascent out of the abyss

[spare pendant]

We lack details on every ending. We lack details on how exactly hornet moved out of the temple. Hypothetically she may have walked out, but she may also have harpooned out or crawled out. "We lack details" is not an argument.

[tribal cargo]

How did we get out of hallownest again?

Or it was still vague / a mystery?

[fading whale]

Still a mystery

[spare pendant]

"X may be possible" is not a headcanon in any reality. Hope this helps

[pine garden]

saying that the Citadel could've found the black egg, destroyed its Hornet dreamer seal and retrieve her before she died inside the black egg is an INSANE reach

[fading whale]

And I doubt it'll never be answered because it doesn't really matter, other vessels have gotten out of the abyss too

[pine garden]

and that Hornet would have 0 dialogue regarding that as well

I dont think Hornet wouldn't mention unfinished business in Hallownest if that course of events happened

[tribal cargo]

Damn the knight really do be getting OUT OUT tho

[spare pendant]

It's not a reach, it's one example of how hornet could possibly have gotten out of the black egg before silksong.

[bronze turret]

And I'd go as far as saying it's a reach because this entire narrative is too convoluted to make for good storytelling.

[pine garden]

she sticked around Hallownest for god knows how long while the HK was inside the black egg, it wouldn't be in character for her to abandon her duty after the Knight replaced HK without fixing the issue of Hallownest

[spare pendant]

This is your own opinion

[dire lynx]

In her retrieval notes it also mentions the losses the citadel sustained. She would no way be capable of putting up a fight if she were drained by the black egg

[pine garden]

true

[fading whale]

I would go as far as to say she wouldn't even be inclined to stay in pharloom any more than she absolutely had to if that was the case.

[spare pendant]

Nobody said it had to be good storytelling, it's just one example of many for how they didn't contradict themselves.

[whole holly]

lacking details IS them not accounting for every ending, considering accounting would include them giving us more information about how things transpired after endings and how every ending after events would lead into silksong, them giving us Lord of Shades and Void Entity is them accounting for DNM and EtV endings

[proud swan]

I may be confused here but why is SylentHuntress position controversial if they are trying to see how could said ending be possible?

[tribal cargo]

Rather than talking about HK

Can someone explain what did GSM do that made hornet wanted to kill her again? Im still kinda confused lol

[proud swan]

You mean in act 3?

[bronze turret]

Excuse me, what...

[tribal cargo]

In bothh

Act 2 and act 3

Well i kinda get how she is gonna destroy the world in act 3 but in act 2 she seems to be doing nothing

[spare pendant]

By your logic, why didn't they give us information on what happened to The Hollow Knight after embrace the void?

[fading whale]

They're claiming that it's factual that there is no chance any specific ending is considered canon internally by team cherry

[dire lynx]

Because they are calling others positions baseless and headcanon while pushing the most unfounded and absurd ideas I've seen in this thread

[spare pendant]

"X could maybe be possible" will never be absurd. Sorry.

[wooden sphinx]

i am pretty sure good story would be more important to developers rather than not cotradicting 9 year old reddit AMA

[whole holly]

in fact them giving us Lord of Shades and Void Entity is argument against that every ending is equally canon

[pine garden]

this literally you right now

[spare pendant]

Stop saying "9 year old reddit AMA" as if it's an argument. It wouldn't be any more or less valid if they said it in a Bloomberg interview. It's still word of God.

[spare pendant]

Sure, the top one, since you forgot to label it?

[pine garden]

delusional

[dire lynx]

Citadel shows up fast enough for hornet to not die from draining from black egg, have the ability to break dreamer seals and also hornet is strong enough to put up a very good fight

[tribal cargo]

Word of God?!

Bruh 😭

[bronze turret]

Aside from being abrasive while doing so. It's giving me hk-lore channel flashbacks, in all honesty.

[fading whale]

For real, there's literally no reason to flash lord of shades in that scene other than to imply etv is canon. Absolutely 0 other reason.

The only imaginable reason is just cheap ass eye candy that is very tacky and unfitting

[whole holly]

because game is not about Hollow Knight, Knight appeared in Void Entity and Lord of Shades forms cementing feasibility of game taking place after their respective endings

[wooden sphinx]

Word of God is in game not in random interviews or AMAs that only fraction of playerbase will see

[spare pendant]

That's not a logical impossibility.

[spare pendant]

Word of God refers to when the author of a piece clarifies details regarding it

[tribal cargo]

They are human
They are not God

Human can be WRONG / change their mind

[spare pendant]

I'm not going to be kind when I'm being ganged up on by a band of incredibly rude, butthurt individuals.

[spare pendant]

Canon to sisters of void does not mean canon to weaver queen, etc

[proud swan]

Well theres a small possibility that everyone in this thread is expecting way too much from TC and may just be eye candy for hk fans

[sinful nimbus]

Inversely there is no reason to show the Void Given Form unless DNM is canon. Absolutely 0 other reason

[spare pendant]

Only for act 3. Not act 2.

[sinful nimbus]

Also the entire cutscene is cheap eye candy so what can you really expect

[spare pendant]

No, word of God can literally never be in-game. That's literally not what word of God is. If it's said in-game, it's definitionally not WoG.

[buoyant rampart]

Events prior to the game dont change depending on what ending you do unless time travel is involved

[sour locust]

does this zylotol line reference zote? "Oho? A new face! Not here to bother, I hope? I've critical studies underway in these twisting tunnels and can afford no distractions! You haven't met Zagon, my assistant, by chance? An indolent sort? Short, slovenly, rather unreliable-seeming?"

[whole holly]

Act 3 is part of game regardless,

[spare pendant]

They can't be wrong about their own work 😭 they literally are the God of their story

[fading whale]

Actually, when they're in normal shade from, all the other shades are in the background too, when the lord of shades flashes, there's no shades in the background, that to me is even more evidence that lord of shades represents all the shades unified in will and power. And that's the true power and the pinnacle of the void, hornet sees that because she can sense the true strength behind the knights presence along with the other shades

[pine garden]

Zagon the assistant is dead, we can find his dead body in the Worm ways

[sinful nimbus]

Retcons can and have happened for Silksong

[spare pendant]

This... this makes your side seem both insane and sane. This is contradictory???

[bronze turret]

So was Stephanie Meyer and she wrote Twilight... Look, I get you may think authors can't be contradicting for whatever reason, but they can.

[proud swan]

The couldve changed their own opinions about it though. Its clear silksong got the story changed somehow in the dev cycle

[sour locust]

ohh i didnt notice that thanks!

[pine garden]

Hornet if she sees the body will report back to Zylotol saying his assistant has died

[whole holly]

you use this timelines argument when you don't even know how they work, SoTV and EtV being connected is argument against your claims

[spare pendant]

Canon to SoV does not mean exclusively canon

[sinful nimbus]

What

[fading whale]

I already gave plenty of feasible reasons for that though. It doesn't go both ways in this case

[sinful nimbus]

Why not

LoS is in control of the void it can assume whatever form it chooses

[spark valve]

vgfocus is los at its most powerful it's not like a different being or whatever

[woven belfry]

How many groups/kingdoms were there before and after the grand mother silk?

[spare pendant]

We simply never see a reality in which THK happens and Hornet does Silk and Soul. Maybe because of her character development.

[spare pendant]

And?

[pine garden]

we know of at least 4 in the Skarr ants, the Coral aream Verdania and Nyleth's shellwood

[spark valve]

uuuh karak, verdania, skarrs, craws, stilkin

[spare pendant]

Writing Twilight doesn't mean she was wrong about her own work, what the hell is this statement?

[bronze turret]

Question... why are we still arguing with Sylent? I feel like it's a waste of time.

[sinful nimbus]

I assume twilight has retcons of some kind

[spare pendant]

But you have to prove they did.

[sinful nimbus]

There's no need to be rude or dismissive

If you don't want to engage in a conversation just leave

[spare pendant]

You keep just saying things...

[pine garden]

Bilewater's group was probably there before GMS, Craws could've came prior or after I'm not sure if there's any specific lore for that

[bronze turret]

Star, she was the one who began...

Anyway

[whole holly]

and it solidifies my point, SoTV and EtV endings being connected and addressing each other makes them more confirmed/prioritized/true endings

[pine garden]

Sylent was quite rude and condescending from the get go, I think its fine

[fading whale]

We had this conversation before, in my interpretation with all current data from both games, I am inclined to believe shade lord is lord of shades specifically and not the entire void, tendrils being hostile in general and especially to hornet goes to show that that's the case. Shade lord is just the most powerful entity, imagine him as a supremely powerful avatar (from the last airbender).

Sure they have mastery and total control of the elements but not of the entirety of nature on the whole planet

[proud swan]

Oh I get the conflict now. You don't think SoTV is reason enough to say a HK ending is canon

[spark valve]

sotv acknowledges both dnm and etv indicating that it is intended to be potentially consistent with either of them

[sinful nimbus]

So...

[pine garden]

what does sotv stand for?

[spare pendant]

That doesn't follow.

[proud swan]

sister of the void

[pine garden]

oh yeah thanks

[sinful nimbus]

Survivors of the Void raaagh https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tnekQAuqmmI

[whole holly]

i agree, but it is tiring when respect and open mindedness is one sided

[pine garden]

yeah SOTV is clearly canonically happening after either DNM or Godhome ending, its weird to even dispute that

[proud swan]

bro you gotta up your espionage game

[spare pendant]

Yes. Because an ending may not be canon to SoV, but still be canon to WQH.

[sinful nimbus]

People can disagree with you without bad faith

[spare pendant]

You are not being respectful or open minded.

[pine garden]

you're not one to talk about open mindedness lol

[proud swan]

I looked at the mirror and I didnt like it

[woven belfry]

Okay so
Before grand mother silks take over: Nyleth, Skarr, Karak, Verdania and, Stiltkin
After: Craws, Skarr and, Stiltkin
Are there any more?

[spare pendant]

I didn't originally hold this opinion, somebody else convinced me with a rational argument.

[whole holly]

they are obvious Plotholes where lore doesn't provide enough information , of course there is going to be questions and by extension discourse

[dapper willow]

I love this

[rain gate]

its the same discourse every time though

[midnight zinc]

I’ll take anything over hollowness debates

[pine garden]

the flies maybe? They're smart and sapient, thought we dont know if they had their own group or were always part of other groups prior to being sentenced for a "sin" to eternity in the slab

[spark valve]

it's arguably an open question where wisp thicket comes from, could be a faction of the same race as species who abandoned the faith to go light fires in a little corner of the world or could've been there before, hard to say given that they cover their heads

[proud swan]

You mean like an ending in HK tying to an ending in SS, but not the others?

[dapper willow]

I'll take anything over retcon debates

[fading whale]

So, shade lord has existed in the past of the silksong canon, which to me is evidence that etv is that past. However, they probably exist in that form only due to godseeker being involved and not casually switch between shade lord from and separate shades from.

[dapper willow]

I'd rather discuss which ending is canon a hundred times

[fading whale]

Though that could still be the case

[woven belfry]

Oh yeah them their entire species got enslaved due to a past action so they were likely a faction that fought against the grand mother

[small gate]

the church was probably established after GMS, so the eternally penitent flies also probably came after

[spare pendant]

Yeah, all HK endings could tie into weaver queen, but I don't deny that only two can tie into sisters of void.

[proud swan]

Retconning isnt all that bad though

[woven belfry]

Completely forgot about them lol

[pine garden]

that wasn't your argument, your argument was that every ending in HK could be canonical to Silksong, including the sealed siblings ending

[sinful nimbus]

The monkeys paw curls. Who wants to talk about Hornet eugenics

[dapper willow]

but the discussion about it is horrid

[whole holly]

open mindedness and respect doesn't mean i have to validate your points even when your explanations is hypothetical and only way to defend them is that it is technically possible(even though it is unfeasible and improbable), we need solid answers from game to conclude every ending is addressed

[spark valve]

that was always their argument

[spare pendant]

You only got here in the second half of the debate. That is my counterargument to Nika's point that TC didn't account for every ending.

[pine garden]

no you're here late, they explicitly argued that the Citadel could've broken the Hornet dreamer seal and rescued her from the black egg before she'd die and then take her to Pharloom for the SS events to happen

[sinful nimbus]

If it weren't for SOTV sealed siblings could work

[dapper willow]

Is hornet genociding the flyes again o_o

[lime gull]

||yo guys i've gotten the caravan to fleatopia completed every sidequest in bellheart songclave and bone bottom but i still haven't got the silk and soul quest do i also need to do those deliveries in bellheart to get the silk and soul quest because im a bit confused||

[proud swan]

Oh yes please add a new cycle to the picture

[spark valve]

which would occur before weaver queen

[spare pendant]

You have still not demonstrated either trait.

[dire lynx]

#sk-help-2

[proud swan]

Yes, some of them!

[dapper willow]

it should be "which ending is canon again" because that comes up a lot

[whole holly]

it is natural because we aren't hivemind and information isn't shared telepathically, not every member who has question is constantly online getting information from discourses, so they might ask the same question

[rain gate]

either etv or dnm is canon to silksong, that doesnt mean silksong is the only canon continuation of hk

[pine garden]

yeah but its such an insane reach to say that could happen, and then say its as valid and potentially canonical as other HK endings in relations to SS

[proud swan]

as much as hornets racial bias against flies

[rain gate]

yeah i might remove the fayforn argument because that hasnt happened in a while

[whole holly]

where did i demonstrate Close Mindedness or lack of respect?

[sinful nimbus]

Frankly Sealed Siblings would've been a better explanation for how the Citadel captured Hornet

[fading whale]

Yeah who knows maybe SpongeBob showed up in one of the continuations of HK too 😑

[pine garden]

by that logic the Knight dying in the starting area to first enemies in the game in steel soul mode could be as canonical to SS as the Dream No More ending

[dapper willow]

but there was a lot of "so x is a higher being right?"

[sinful nimbus]

Mfw a demigod gets mid diffed by like 30 bugs

[obsidian quail]

maybe they laid a trap

a good one

[spare pendant]

Reiterating the same counterargument that I debunked several times, claiming I have no reading comprehension, etc.

[limpid summit]

Snare setter

[obsidian quail]

banana peels

[solemn hinge]

Or that Silksong takes place a while after HK and something else happened

[obsidian quail]

oh yours is better

[limpid summit]

It’s canonically unavoidable that Hornet gets trapped by some ants at certain points in Far Fields

[spare pendant]

Like the hunters march bench

[limpid summit]

She’s not infallible

[obsidian quail]

exactly

[limpid summit]

And they got seals

[pine garden]

the citadel are literally trained to capture weavers and have spend generations doing so, its not that weird for Hornet to get captured offguard by their silk-sealing cages

[obsidian quail]

she also got led into the trap by that ant outcast

[pine garden]

like how she gets captured and taken to the slab

[dapper willow]

a single slab fly can catch hornet if you fumble hard enough
because they have special magic (and also bs hitboxes)

[obsidian quail]

and that fly nabbed hornet in the cage

[edgy nebula]

the gurr trap took me completely off guard ngl

[sinful nimbus]

My goats washed

[spare pendant]

I never got kidnapped into the slab

[sinful nimbus]

Prime Hornet would never stoop as low as SS hornet

[edgy nebula]

to the point i died cause i was hurt as shit from following his tracks

[proud swan]

Can't we just agree that a massive retcon would be necessary to make all hk endings compatible with silksong? It IS possible and I'm with SylentHuntress on that, but I do think the possibility is VERY small. Metroidvanias thrive on lore it would be weird to assume all endings are qually possible

[rain gate]

i was acually thinking about this last night
either gms has been ordering the capture of weavers for 2 generations or the weavers fled over a very long period of time

[buoyant rampart]

High halls has 27 enemies so its not unreasonable

[obsidian quail]

isn’t SS hornet stronger than HK hornet by the end

[spark valve]

they haven't spent generations doing that it's probably pretty new

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet beats high halls

[obsidian quail]

because she has all the weaver stuff

[pine garden]

there are tablets that go over their captured weavers, and they say they captured weavers that were only 1/8th weaver, meaning that many many generations have passed since the Weavers left pharloom

[rain gate]

exactly

[whole holly]

your debunking was unsubstantiated and lacked enough convincing evidence for rational person, you misrepresented my arguments therefore i assumed you didn't do it on purpose and you genuinely didn't understand my point, it was observation not an insult.

[edgy nebula]

no

[spark valve]

the weavers who left left before the citadel was even founded

[fading whale]

Nope, it's clearly stated in silksong hornet fought off multiple attempts of kidnapping which could have not been the case considering she should be nearly dead assuming she's broken out of sealed siblings.

Simple rune cage make her barely able to move, lose almost all her abilities and also literally knocks her unconscious.

Now imagine what black egg seals would do. You really think she would have been able to fight back? Even more powerfully than a 1/8th weaver fragile with age? Who was still captured even though they killed lots of the citadel bugs

[sinful nimbus]

She gets captured 💔 Her mind is also weak

[rain gate]

1/8th part means 3 generations of children

[obsidian quail]

that doesn’t prove they did it for generations though

[dapper willow]

she is according to me

[obsidian quail]

just that it was awhile before they did

[pine garden]

yeah true, but still they've been doing it actively and they're clearly good at it

[cedar skiff]

omg powerscaling

[spare pendant]

My debunk wasn't unsubstantiated, you just repeated your argument in response. That's actually circular; "x -> x"

[proud swan]

3 generations of children, so 4 generations if you count the original one at least

[fading whale]

You didn't "debunk" anything, you just disagree

[edgy barn]

I disagree, Sealed Siblings working requires a series of improbable (and unprovable) events:

-Citadel bugs know how to break the black egg seal.
-Citadel bugs know how to revert Hornet's dreamer state.
-Citadel bugs go in and out of the black egg with Hornet without getting drained into unconciousness in the process.
-Hornet somehow manages to wake up and recover enough strength to fight back before the citadel bugs cage her.
-Hornet decides not to inmediatly run back to Hallownest despite the fact that anyone can now just walk into the black egg and free the Radiance.

[spare pendant]

This is factually wrong. Sorry.

[obsidian quail]

she has all the silk hearts and extra weaver inheritance

[cedar skiff]

nevermind its ending canonity discussion. sigh.

[obsidian quail]

and more gadgets

[whole holly]

well, you are only one who believes that, have good day.

[obsidian quail]

she’s inspector gadget

[proud swan]

hey you wanna powerscale with us

[spare pendant]

Not even true. Be lucky I'm not opening a ticket.

[proud swan]

who would win Iselda or Pilby

[dapper willow]

despite my best attempt I am yet to find a hornet vs debate
So we are early

[pine garden]

oh yeah the last one is particularily insane and true. She'd NEVER leave the knight vulnerable like that and not comment on it

[young harbor]

Pebb for sure

[obsidian quail]

Iselda vs Shakra

[rain gate]

whos the better mapper, cornifer or shakra?

[proud swan]

Nah Iselda is def strong

[dire lynx]

The weavers made the citadel

[candid zinc]

shakra she's locked in

[spare pendant]

Iselda is a retired warrior

[proud swan]

They're fighting over cornifer

[edgy nebula]

i wonder if being mottled is something that happens with age, something youre born with, or a sickness

[obsidian quail]

ur asking me to choose between peak and peak

[proud swan]

Someone pls make this a ship story

[spark valve]

the ones who didn't leave did yes

[whole holly]

well have fun in your reality

[edgy nebula]

the 2nd one i doubt, the other two seem valid

[cedar skiff]

if team cherry was locked in on the retconning they would have made up some bullshit where iselda is actually born to the same tribe as shakra

[spare pendant]

You're an ass. Hope this helps

[whole holly]

i think it is either mutation or sickness, very likely mutation

[rain gate]

i mean in terms of mapping skill

[edgy nebula]

https://tenor.com/view/infinity-train-simon-laurent-disintegrate-face-melt-skeleton-gif-20416232

[proud swan]

Ok no joke though shakra would kick the living bug of Iselda

[cedar skiff]

i know theyre a dfiferent species but this is why im saying that team cherry are washed at retconning

[whole holly]

thanks for proving my point

[spare pendant]

Not even coherent

[dapper willow]

I think cornifer is actually better than shakra
Because he doesn't seem to have much of a combat ability yet he survives and does a pretty good job at mapping hallownest

[obsidian quail]

oh shakra probably since pharloom is bigger and more dangerous

[edgy nebula]

mottled skarr does seem sick though im unsure if it's related

[spare pendant]

Cornifer has better linework than shakra

[woven belfry]

Updated
Before: Nyleth, Skarr, Karak, Verdania, Weavers, Flies, Stiltkin
After: Craws, Skarr, Flies (enslaved), Firebugs, Stiltkin

[cedar skiff]

counterpoint hallownest is really not as dangerous as pharloom

[pine garden]

to be fair Hallownest is a lot more chill, and maybe he has his baddie wife accompany him dunno

[young harbor]

Would love to see her fight someday cuz it would be cool but I doubt that'll be anytime soon, fun to think about tho

[edgy nebula]

just now realizing, how does hornet not know mottled skarr's name but she knows gurr's

[cedar skiff]

yeah infected bugs but theres actual trained warriors just walking around pharloom AND some of them are haunted

[woven belfry]

The reason why I believe the craws are new is because the crawfathers entry says "delivers death to condemned bugs" implying he grew to power after because a bug with a sense of justice like that wouldn't bend the knee to an invading grand mother silk
And for the burning bugs I just doubt they could have lasted that long as their entire cult is built around self immolation which doesnt have any longevity

[sinful nimbus]

-Not implausible, there's also the possibility that the dreamer seal deactivates after Rad breaks out
-I don't know why this wouldn't be reversed after exiting the Black Egg
-They just need to be quick
-Meh? This seems fine
-Why would Hornet "I have already stood the sentinel for one dying land. That role... I will never play again." Hallownest do that

[rain gate]

nah iselda stays up top
hes also scared shitless in deepnest

[limpid summit]

Snitchbugs?

[edgy nebula]

karak still barely lives on in the form of watcher at the edgee

[whole holly]

well you should compare them to other mottled ants, but there are cases where mutation is disease/deadly/sickness

[young harbor]

Cornfier would've gone into the citadel for more than one optional fight he mapped deepnest he's mapping that citadel...that being said shakra my beloved

[woven belfry]

They seem more like the pilgrims imo

[rain gate]

shakra never entered the citadel now that i think about it

[proud swan]

I doubt its ever happening 🙁

[cedar skiff]

thats my goat

[rain gate]

we get all those maps from the models

[spare pendant]

He actually explicitly only mapped like 1/8th of deepnest

[young harbor]

Yeah she's only in that optinal encounter in high halls

[pine garden]

why would the dreamer seal deactivate after Rad breaks out? That doesn't happen in game when forgotten crossroads get completely infected. And the sentinel line clearly meant that she wouldn't let another kingdom die like Hallownest did, not that she wouldn't guard a kingdom

[dapper willow]

watcher at the edge is so sad ngl
Poor guy has been standing thjere for so long that his armor is bleached black by the sands
he is a statue

[limpid summit]

Idk it seems likely that they’re foreign but they could just be scavengers

[fading whale]

Yep, the one that gives cursesickle says in needolin dialogue " our mark is no curse " so clearly it's something that makes them outcasted and scapegoated by the other ants.

And I'd like to point out here, it seems to me like they're the only ones not haunted. Needolin dialogue of the normal ants shows that they are now listening to gms voice/song and are confusing it with their queen from the past

[woven belfry]

I wouldnt count that as living on similar to the weavers their species and by extension kingdom is kept together by an endling (hornet and the watcher at the edge)

[young harbor]

...so I may have forgot about this LMAO

[fading whale]

And that's why they're hostile to hornet

[woven belfry]

Let me check their hunter journals real quick

[edgy nebula]

true

[cedar skiff]

damn that last part is kind of sad

[fading whale]

The mottled ones are for some reason not haunted, they probably just got turned against the other ants when the other ones got haunted.

[rain gate]

actually thats true, gurr only attacks hornet because he wants to go out fighting

[pine garden]

I was shocked at how strong he was after fighting the warriors in CKK's dream realm, that particular soldier was build different fr fr

[fading whale]

Gurr is just a hunter going after stronger and stronger prey that's why he's after hornet

[proud swan]

You are all missing the point. Both shakra and og cornifer are commentaries on how the world may be ending we still gotta win our bread. Real hustlers

[edgy nebula]

all evidence and text of the mottled skarrs point to either mutation or sickness being true, we cant come to many conclusions, though them being able to avoid/being able to resist the haunting is nice

[sinful nimbus]

The seals in the Black Egg are demonstrated to react to whether or not Radiance is in the vessel as demonstrated in The Hollow Knight/Sealed Siblings/Embrace the Void endings

[rain gate]

also they both spit bars

[dapper willow]

Its the gigachad theory of Hollow knight
The stronger you are, the longer you live and more plot relevant you become

[cedar skiff]

kai lai lai lai ooshkalo

[spare pendant]

I mean neither of them are native to the kingdom so idk

[young harbor]

This is the discussion I joined this discord server for

[sinful nimbus]

And idk what to tell you that's just not what Hornet says

[pine garden]

wdym I played the game, when she said "I wont stand sentinel for another dying kingdom" she meant that she'd save Pharloom, not that she wouldn't guard it

[cedar skiff]

replaying this game really makes everything click into place so much more

its like everything makes sense

[edgy nebula]

ai lai lai lai.. wooshkado, wooshkado... kai lai lai lai lai... wooshkado shka...

[proud swan]

can you imagine a battle between shakra and cornifer, both trying to harmonize trying to hit them NOTES

[rain gate]

i like how we all transcribe shakra's singing differently

[woven belfry]

Yeah your right theyre enough of a faction to be considered an entire group like the firebugs so they count

[pine garden]

if she were send back to hallownest I doubt she'd just retire and do nothing if the infection was still raging on

[proud swan]

fleatopia is losing entertainment opportunities

[sinful nimbus]

Sure but not standing sentinel for a dying land ever again is very explicit

[edgy nebula]

mottled skarr's tool descriptions being skarr language is so cool i wish we got more super unique tool descriptions/shop stuff

[fading whale]

Maybe, if they were outcasted before the haunting due to their marks, they were less susceptible to hiveminds and monarchs compared to the very devoted and used to being unified under a monarch's normal ones

[sinful nimbus]

She's not doing that for Hallownest anymore

[woven belfry]

Do I also count the fleas?

[rain gate]

hai lai lai lai.... booshkaro, booshkaro... hai lai lai lai... benyalayyy

[pine garden]

yeah explicit as in she didn't want to see another kingdom die out

not that she didn't give a fuck about Hallownest anymore

[edgy nebula]

possibly

[vocal compass]

Replaying this game shows me hom much i rely on ||double jump|| when i don't need necessarily even it

[fading whale]

I can imagine iselda and shakra fighting over cornifer's long proboscis

[sinful nimbus]

Its not like she can do anything to prevent the infection from escaping

[cedar skiff]

true but the mapping on controller sucks so bad i have to double jump to air stall

[bronze turret]

Fr, I would even argue that her statement of not standing sentinel for another dying kingdom also doubles as her saying she won't let it reach the point of becoming a dying kingdom

[pine garden]

its crazy to read the moment where our hero dramatically says they will save this dying kingdom and assume she instead meant that she was sick and tired of this another kingdom she spend most of her life guarding

[proud swan]

yeah I had the same feelings with hk. Lore as reward for exploration is gold to me

[tribal cargo]

Do yall think godhome will be in silksong? Or is godhome destroyed after the knight ascended ?

[whole holly]

guys does shakra have master?

[spare pendant]

We'll get an equivalent.

[vocal compass]

Me too

[pine garden]

I doubt its going to be Godseekers again, probably something similar instead

[woven belfry]

Her mother

[tribal cargo]

Yes didnt we do a whole burial for her ?

[sinful nimbus]

She calls it a foolish task

[spare pendant]

Yes..........?

[edgy nebula]

her master wasnt her mother

[proud swan]

Theres a last mission with her where you find her master

[rain gate]

adopted mother basically

[whole holly]

okay thanks,haven't finished game

[woven belfry]

Her master raised her right? Basically a mother imo

[vocal compass]

Do you think the tbc in the mister mushroom ending is hinting at another game or dlc?

[young harbor]

Everyone in silksong got mom stuff going on

[proud swan]

To be fair we do not know that, masters could be mothers in a war-oriented culture EDIT: this is bs guys

[cedar skiff]

now that im not set out on reaching the endings i get to look around a lot more. its insane how much there is that just livens up this world, i like for example that in the whispering vaults theres a little room with charis and music racks, its like a lecture hall for the smaller guys there

[tribal cargo]

How long did it take HK to release godhome?

[limpid summit]

Year and a half

Or two

[tribal cargo]

Damn 😭

See yall in 2 years

[limpid summit]

Hidden dreams and GT came out quick

[proud swan]

yeah! the moment that clicked for me were the benches in underworks. I was like wait I think I get this

[tribal cargo]

Oh??

[vocal compass]

She did say she was her mother no?

[cedar skiff]

unironcally betting on silksong dlc in 2026 because of the sheer amount of "cut content", like the steel stuff

[obsidian quail]

what is really annoying is how Weavers and Pure Vessel can teleport but we can’t do it with TK or Hornet

[vocal compass]

No it was like "she was a mother to me"

[bronze turret]

Indeed! There's a lot of environmental storytelling in Silksong, so paying attention to the scenery adds a lot to the experience!

[midnight zinc]

The knight can teleport with the dream gate

[young harbor]

Definetly another game, genuinely no clue what he was referencing in silksong yet tho. Idk if it was the other team cherry games again cuz I couldn't really find a refrence to Hollow Knight, and I swear one sounded like Celeste at some point. May have just been looking at his dialouge from the wrong angle tho

[proud swan]

imma be honest im more like a 2025 guy

[obsidian quail]

not the popping in and out like PV

[tribal cargo]

Coral tower and karmelita kingdom dlc please 😭😭

Both are so peak

[bronze turret]

Pv and First Sinner won the genetic lottery 😂

[heavy gyro]

Soul magic

[proud swan]

I know its almost absurd cause we got 3 months but I believe in cherry

[edgy nebula]

"The fiercest of my tribe, here she lies. I called her master, true, but she was mother just as much, more by far than the bug who bore me."

[pine garden]

I dont get how you got "Hornet doesn't care about Hallownest" anymore after her "I wont stand sentinel for another dying kingdom" line, when this dialogue is immediantly spoken after that

it wasn't even fucking subtext, it was literally just text

[cedar skiff]

its super fun honestly im taking notes and screenshots as i go along , feels like they really upped themselves from hk. seen a lot of complaints about silksong exploring being unrewarding but i think if youre into the story theres so much. fuck that rosary string im looking at the background and how it pieces into citadel history

[young harbor]

I feel like if they cut them from base game they may just wanna do something new for DLC ngl considering they had practically infinite time they could've just had these in base game if they were that interested. Still possible tho, but I don't know how possible

[sinful nimbus]

She literally can't protect Hallownest from the infection it's not that strange

[young harbor]

I love this perspective

[edgy nebula]

karak needs so much more expansion, khann ruled half of pharloom and we get dirt shit

[rain gate]

karak pfp

[stoic topaz]

We can agree Silksong takes place after the events of Hollow Knight right? I feel like the things Hornet says to Second Sentinel after waking them (about how guarding a dead kingdom is foolish) is Hornet realizing how pointless her role as Hornet Sentinel was in hk. How pointless it was just to guard an area when she could have been guarding the people

[proud swan]

She mourns Hallownet and TK quite a bit much

[vocal compass]

It may be a strech but i feel like they have been building up a lot of lifeblood/plasmium in ss and hk. It may have a large role in 3.

[proud swan]

Yes

[sinful nimbus]

🗣️

[vocal compass]

If there is onr

[rain gate]

and the steel clan

[vocal compass]

One

[pine garden]

like she literally calls herself daughter of hallownest

[fading whale]

I don't think she calls it a foolish task, I think she's just arguments she herself had to face and grapple with to whoever she's talking to in that picture (I forgor).

In a way she's like "I've been told, when I was doing this exact thing we're talking about, that it was foolish. And yet I still held true to my charge. Are you a real g like me ? Will you do the same? Some would say it was foolish

[stoic topaz]

Zote Boat for sure

[vocal compass]

Yes, almost forgot

[woven belfry]

Realized I missed a TON of guys but I think this is all of them
Before the grand mother silk: Nyleth, Skarr, Karak, Verdania, Weavers, Flies, Stiltkin, Garmond's Village,
After the grand mother silk: Craws, Skarr, Flies (enslaved), Fire cult, Stiltkin, Fleas, Snitchbugs, Steel Soul Bugs

[tribal cargo]

Did u get to || act 3 true ending yet? || ur question should be answered already if u do

[proud swan]

sorry I'm not agreeing with you because of conflicts of interest. You are clearly a soldier of coral khan

[young harbor]

I feel like I do agree there's something more to lifeblood imo. Like I know it could just be a neutral force but I really feel like there's just something there. I need to look more into the joni dialouge again tho

[pine garden]

its insane to think that she wouldn't care for Hallownest and leave it to fucking die to Radiance if she was taken away from there while the black egg seal was left unguarded and open

[rain gate]

shakras tribe is from outside pharloom

[sinful nimbus]

No she's trying to dissuade the Second Sentinel from doing the same thing she did

[limpid summit]

I don’t think Shakra’s tribe is coming

[stoic topaz]

Nah. I’m getting the last melody of act 2 rn

[tribal cargo]

Ah keep playing thenn

[midnight zinc]

I strongly suggest not reading this chat

[edgy nebula]

no i'm not....

all hail our lord born last to rule

cough

[pine garden]

oh it was a second sentinel dialogue, the screenshot you send. Then that's a different context entirely

[cedar skiff]

hornet can care about hallownest while also accepting that its a dead kingdom, she acknowledges her standing guard over it was foolish but also Literally refers to herself as its daughter I dont understand what the Point of this discussion here is

[woven belfry]

Okay shakra is from out of pharloom i did not know that lol

[sinful nimbus]

Indeed but it proves what I said all the same

[proud swan]

your hero is named after a fast food chain BRO GET A GRIP

[pine garden]

very reasonable

[obsidian quail]

ancient civilization > all these other nerds including Karak

[proud swan]

jk I loved krust king

[stoic topaz]

Eh. I’m really busy with college and don’t have much time to play plus I like seeing others perspective on the stuff

[pine garden]

no it doesnt? You said that Hornet would leave Hallownest to die if the black egg was left open and unguarded

[proud swan]

1000x better than nyleth

[fading whale]

Right, it's the second sentinel, a character she ends up respecting and even liking a lot . I think in that statement she is trying to test its strength of will, she's trying to see if it has the balls to do what she did no matter the words of the haters

[rain gate]

coral tower was an annoying fight but the vibes were immaculate

[vocal compass]

Khan is in my opinion one of the best designed bosses, like the telegraphing is peak. It was just sad that it was ruined by the enemy rushes

[midnight zinc]

Fair enough, I’m in the same boat

[young harbor]

Based and true

[sinful nimbus]

Hallownest's death is inevitable

[bronze turret]

I interpreted it the other way round. That she was stubbornly holding onto something she should've learned to let go, which she eventually did, but only much later in her life. It's part of her character development. Often times, she states something in SS that's her contemplating her past, and the things she used to do, and how her view of things changed since then.

[sinful nimbus]

Hornet cannot do anything to prevent the death of Hallownest

[desert cloak]

i just realized hornet likes fluffy critters because she's a princess

[woven belfry]

It really shows just how destructive the gms was she fought several kingdoms at once and still was able to reduce a proud group of warriors like karak to dirt
I agree though

[edgy nebula]

do not insult our lord krust fried chann

[vocal compass]

Maybe it has something to do with her relation to the bees

[pine garden]

no its fucking not, she spends the entire game of Hollow Knight working towards a solution that in the end saves Hallownest

[whole holly]

we also need DLC for Shakra's Warrior tribe

[pine garden]

you're just making shit up

[rain gate]

at least its not actually spelled krust or the acronym would be uh

[limpid summit]

The game is about putting Hallownestms corpse to rest

[fading whale]

But did she let go of hallownest? Why would she still harbor love towards it and call herself daughter of hallownest above all? I think hornet is wise enough to have no regrets of such kind

[desert cloak]

that as well

[sinful nimbus]

You realize Im talking about Sealed Siblings specifically right

[limpid summit]

Radiance is desecrating it

[proud swan]

again a recurrent theme in hk games so far

[edgy barn]

-I suppose they could have access to the bugs that break seals?
-Maybe?
-Demigod Hornet can only last a few seconds in the main chamber before falling unconscious. Not only would the citadel bugs have a much weaker constitution, they would also not know how the black egg works to begin with.
-The citadel bugs get out of the black egg carrying Hornet, and after spending who knows how long getting drained by the seals, she is able to wake up inmediatly and begin fighting before the bugs have the chance to throw her in the cage.
-That line does not work in the context of sealed siblings unless you are saying the Radiance broke out of the Knight at some point before the citadel arrived. Such an occurance would be so monumental to Hornet's character that its effect would surely be noticeable.

[midnight zinc]

I mean compare that to the Radiance who ruined the lands of not one but two other higher beings (PK and Unn) and it’s not that crazy

[fathom pollen]

whats the memorium lore? why is there fauna from areas on the complete other end of the map?

[cedar skiff]

i love this about the game and thats especially why the conversation between mask maker and hornet is one of my favourite ones. "A complex visage, perhaps, yet still to my sight it looks unresolved." H: If you see a transitional state, it is one I have accepted. My mask has remained defined through lifetimes uncounted." "Aye. Rigid I’m sure, but your kind rarely develop evenly, and the lifetime of bugs are poor measure for one like you. Could be there’s more growth awaiting you yet..."

[rain gate]

nature reserve

[obsidian quail]

those cowards should have made a Lost Sherma

[young harbor]

Chat here goes so fast I'm gonna need eyes like the architect to keep up lmao

[sinful nimbus]

What's she going to do, find another exceptionally strong vessel, make a new kingsoul, and unite the already united void?

[edgy barn]

That doesn't mean the Radiance should be allowed to be freed.

[limpid summit]

I think it’s silly to try and extrapolate a scenario in which the clearly worst ending for both major characters leads into a continuation of the story in any case

[woven belfry]

And that was only after being aggravated by the pk
The grand mother silk making people realize how good the radiance and pale king were 😭

[young harbor]

EVIL!??!?!

[tardy shuttle]

What does excatly happen during the cursed ending?

[pine garden]

yeah and the sealed siblings ending being canonical to SS is just insane. You might as well argue that Hornet could've killed the Radiance herself because we've never seen the two fight directly therefore there is no prove it couldn't happen

[rain gate]

garmond was bad enough my heart can only take so much

[limpid summit]

Hornet is distracted so the parasite takes her over and conveniently grabs GMS too

[proud swan]

Shi happens

[pine garden]

the burden of proof is on YOU to prove that Sealed Siblings is in any way suggested, hinted at or possible in relations to SS

[sinful nimbus]

It wouldn't be insane if TC stuck to their word of all endings being canon, where that would be the BASE assumption, its not too deep

[young harbor]

I'm ngl I genuinely was so afraid for shakra after this

[vocal compass]

And everything else

[midnight zinc]

I wanna see Hornet’s final form, half giant wyrm half giant spider. Make it happen TC

[edgy nebula]

we get most of our context through needolin dialogue and thats just bad

[woven belfry]

Fool sherma could never get lost hes too good with directions

[pine garden]

we cannot prove a negative, we cannot prove that Citadel can't break the Dreamers seal because we never see them interact with it, but its absurd at the face of it

[rain gate]

we need a super godhome mode where we keep the weaver queen stats

[pine garden]

we cannot prove that Zote couldn't kill GMS since we never see them interact

[midnight zinc]

What’s up Kendrick, good question, btw when’s the next album?

[fading whale]

I don't agree, without her help in dream no more for example hallownest would inevitably die because the player character would suffer thk's fate

[sinful nimbus]

You do know TC said all endings were going to be accounted for right

[proud swan]

Cursed ending to me is one of the most elusive ones because we have NO idea of what twisted bud or root gurl is. What became wood? Was that the ending of all lifeforms tied to silk?

[sinful nimbus]

If SOTV didn't exist we would still be assuming that and then Sealed Siblings being canon would be the default assumption

[pine garden]

yeah back when? Like 6 years ago back when Corral Reef was its own region not a dream sequence?

[young harbor]

I saw the ultrakill pfp I knew I'd hear 🔥🔥🔥

[bronze turret]

She let go of the physical kingdom, not of the experiences and her heritage.

[tardy shuttle]

Yeah sooo relisten to tpab or sum there aint no new album gng✌️

[limpid summit]

I mean even without sotv we have Hornet’s dialogue about gods falling

[midnight zinc]

I’m already doing that tho 😭

[edgy barn]

My problem is less with some of the assumptions themselves and more with the amount you have to make.

[pine garden]

death of the author has to be taken seriously after a certain point. Like we dont pretend Harmonie is black just because JKR said so in a random tweet

[limpid summit]

I don’t mind all endings not being canon at all but it’s admittedly not what TC said originally

[cedar skiff]

i think this ones kinda loose because she could just be talking about pk

[limpid summit]

That’s possible

[sinful nimbus]

What am I supposed to do with that nonsensical dialogue though

[limpid summit]

But like in the context of aggression and a domineering vast controlling monarch Rad is implied right

[mint stratus]

Has anyone discussed how interesting it is that arcane eggs in the abyss are the same in silksong as in hollowknight? Did the ancient civilization span over that distance? or did interaction with the void give them similar knowledge on how to make them?

[fading whale]

I wanna see the creature that comes out of the wood in the cursed ending more than anything

[hollow fog]

why does pharloom need so much bells? we got entire tunnels made of bells, caves made of bells, town made of bells. is it even explained in the game or what?

[limpid summit]

Ignore sealed siblings it was a shitty ending anyway

[pine garden]

we can say that "sure every ending is canonically possible" and then say "yeah but they're clearly not actually accounted for and reasonable to assume they happen in the same timeline"

[obsidian quail]

yeah my goats got around

[young harbor]

I've gone back and forth on this. I think she COULD but the plural makes me think it does include Radiance.

[obsidian quail]

they were a void empire

[midnight zinc]

I do think her wyrm half is very underexplored in this game, wouldn’t surprise me if the dlc has way more to do with her godly half. And wyrms aren’t just any gods either, they explicitly have the desire and capability to create kingdoms and affect the minds of lesser bugs. That could all be really interesting to explore, especially since she’s the only (living non void) descendent of a wyrm that we know of

[pine garden]

oh so actual ingame text isn't to be taken as gospel but random one time comments from developers outside the game are?

[proud swan]

What dialogue?

[bronze turret]

It's more symbollic for their association with song and religious uses, like church bells

[sinful nimbus]

Death of the author does not apply to canonical information its moreso about the themes of a story

[fading whale]

I mean she literally resisted kidnapping attempts and was still in hallownest during the one that succeeded even though she knew they were coming. Why didn't she just leave hallownest if that was the case

[mint stratus]

They are also able to change and transform! I believe that’s what makes her so interesting to Eva

[midnight zinc]

Something tells me this is just this game’s sealed siblings ending and it won’t be expanded upon. But I’d love to see what the roots are and how the white lady ties into all of that

[pine garden]

then do you think Harmonie is canonically black because JKR said so in a tweet?

[sinful nimbus]

Bro has zero reading comprehension

[sinful nimbus]

That is a retcon

[hollow fog]

but yeah, that's REALLY a lot of bells, assuming rosaries are the currency, this makes sense

[young harbor]

I actually interpreted her desire to kill and bind GMS as her wyrm side coming out throughout most of the game, and then the weaver side is Sotv, considering we even get her weaver leaning backstory in act 3

[sinful nimbus]

Retcons are canonical even if they are dumb

[pine garden]

I forgot where Hornet says so, but she mentions to Lace I think that she saw gods fall before, so she's confident GMS can be defeated as well

[cedar skiff]

the bells also kind of confuse me

[young harbor]

Yeah same honestly

[cedar skiff]

because did the citadel really just make that many bells or are they a remain of something else

[proud swan]

wym Barthes is clearly mocking the capacity of the author to establish truth over its own story

[midnight zinc]

JKR writing her black character to be against elf slavery and then her white friends make fun of her and tell her that slavery is actually really cool 🔥✍️

[whole holly]

Guys are different chapels for worshipping different gods?

[bronze turret]

That's something she points out herself. It was a lesson she only learned later. There are many passages and dialogues of her musing about her past self and how she used to be.

[cedar skiff]

because that is a lot of bells. like a lot. so many theres entire species that evolved to live around them

[edgy barn]

Eh, I don't think Silksong has a Sealed Siblings equivalent, and nothing in HK can really be compared to Cursed Child.

[spare pendant]

No

[woven belfry]

Reading comprehension has lost all meaning choosing to believe something in game then out of game is not "lacking reading comprehension" we should not resort to silly insults especially if theyre as meaningless as that

[proud swan]

"Tch... Hahahaa. Marvelous! So the spider knows something of fathomless beings, and still it hopes to stand against one, a god... Where do you hide this boundless strength you claim, spider? I’ve watched your struggle towards us. Yours was a painful, broken trek. One needs grace to stand before the divine.Then best you keep watching, child. I’ve found those who claim themselves a god can rarely match the title.And experience tells me, even gods can fall."

[cedar skiff]

the silksong sealed siblings equivalent was cut :c

[grizzled shore]

I was expecting GMS to be more bell related, but she really didn't seem to care.
It was just a thing that the citadel's civilization loved! Which fair enough

[cedar skiff]

i mean depending on what you see as the equivalent, sealed siblings is a failed ending and strung to serve seemed to be the same