#The Bad Batch - Season 2 Discussion

567 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

kind trail
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Season 2, Episodes 1 & 2
Aired: January 4, 2023

Synopsis:
Spoils of War: The Bad Batch plans a risky heist.
Ruins of War: The Batch must decide who to trust as they plan their escape.

Created by: Dave Filoni
Directed by: Brad Rau
Written by: Jennifer Corbett

thumb_badbatch_Season2.webp
granite drift
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Anyone else having problems actually watching it? My D+ stream starts, plays for a second or two then immediately starts buffering forever, until it just closes down.

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Then again it's hardly unique to just Bad Batch. D+ is awful in general and has been for a long time

long marlin
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Every time I see Omega with her little bow -- a weapon that originally needed giant reptile muscles to use -- the engineered toyeticness of it because you can't have kiddies with anything that resembles an actual gun makes me grind my teeth

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That said, I felt she was used quite effectively in this story.

unkempt rover
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Its interesting to see them up against a competent commander like Wilko. However you can see how Order 66 flattening out their personality makes him less capable of outwitting them.

long marlin
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Given the city was deserted and it was night time, they should have just been using thermal scanners

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And of course, even though it would mean the expense of new art assets, the Batch really should have at least given their armour a new lick of paint at the very least

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Given their desire to avoid being noticed

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Oh, and does this mark Wilko as the first onscreen "you have failed me for the last time" execution?

dusky flax
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that was... okay

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didn't rise to great heights, but wasn't painfully bad either

unkempt rover
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Kinda felt a mid season story. There's little setting up there

dusky flax
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we might see more about what the episodes were doing as the season develops

then again, maybe not

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at least the stuff about how weird their existence is that was running a little bit in the background could make for an interesting season theme

long marlin
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It's interesting that they're setting up Echo, the closest thing the team have to a reg, as the team conscience.

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We know the Batch meet up with Rex this seasons; my suspicion is that it's them that allow him to extract the chip from Wolffe and Gregor

astral ivy
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They’ve got oranges and yellows and blues now

dusky flax
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Also, Omega's bow never required huge muscles. She was just using it wrong and hadn't trained with it yet.

unkempt rover
plucky condor
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...Fives is dead.

plucky condor
# long marlin Every time I see Omega with her little bow -- a weapon that originally needed gi...

That's not true. When The Clone Wars was marketed back in the day, there were Nerf-knockoff clone blasters (including, IIRC, combo blasters where you could have a DC-17, a DC-15, or a DC-15A) being marketed to kids, so "can't have kiddies with guns" isn't a concern (from marketing's POV) from the look of things.

Seems to me like they mainly just did it for her to have some sort of signature weapon that makes her stand out just a bit more (sort of like Ezra's slingshot in Rebels Season 1 and his combination blaster/lightsaber in Season 2, as well as the fact that among the Bad Batch itself, Hunter regularly uses a knife and Wrecker has a huge-ass machete); I as a writer would do the same thing for a character.

dusky flax
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IIRC, when Kamino is attacked in TCW, kid clones get armed by adult clones and join in the fighting.

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Yup, just checked on D+. It's got kid clones shooting blaster rifles.

long marlin
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There's a difference between kids using toy guns , and marketing a character that's a kid with a gun; it's all about the risk of emulation and the idea of an armed child is somehow different from a child pretending to be an armed adult. Ezra's slingshot is basically something similar, which happily has the effect of helping the character stand out. Even when he does get a blaster saber, it shoots energy balls that resemble the shots fired by his sling rather than standard blaster bolts

dusky flax
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Of course there is a whole bunch of stuff tied up in the topic, but it's a bit more complex than your initial comment suggested, is all.

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We have episodes in TCW from the POV of a kid doing a mass murder, too. There's a lot of elasticity to all this.

long marlin
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I mean, this is a franchise that blithely sells dressup costumes to young kids of storm troopers and genocidal force users

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Just where people draw lines is... uncertain and inexplicible

dusky flax
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They draw the lines where people who can mess up their shit put them. Companies looking to advertise or partner up, lawmakers looking for ways to position themselves as crusaders, etc

long marlin
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Our children's fantasy lives are adversarial. Someone is always relegated to be the bad guy to be defeated, so if you're selling costumes it's not fair, you could say, for the kids being the baddies not being able to dress up the way to goodies do. But at some point that make believe moves into the ancillary stuff, the things that glorify characters like pen bags and backpacks and posters, and suddenly all these terrible vile monstrous people are on the receiving end of the same iconography and veneration as the heroes

fathom bison
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I liked Omeega in these first two episodes. She picks up immediately on her family struggles and instantly decides that she has to try and fix it because it's obviously her fault and they'll abandon her if she can't pull her weight. It's not stated explicitly, but that's how it felt-- she's a fundamentally broken child soldier living with other soldiers and as well-adjusted as she seems, she's still gonna have hella issues. Uncle Tick doesn't help much in this regard, it's gonna have to be up to Dad Mode and Group Conscience to help her.

long marlin
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Uncle Tick?

deft scaffold
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When Wrecker extacts and carries around ||a tank gun,|| I couldn't help but think how a GM would allow that: item has so many ranks of Cumbersome, but he's got so many ranks of Burly. It didn't appear to have ||Slow Firing||, did it?

fathom bison
kind trail
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The Bad Batch - Season 2 Discussion

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Season 2, Episodes 3 - The Solitary Clone
Aired: January 11, 2023

Synopsis: Clones battle against a Separatist hold out.

Created by: Dave Filoni
Directed by: Brad Rau
Written by: Jennifer Corbett

dusky flax
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that was pretty damn good

torn hound
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I really enjoyed that

fathom bison
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This one feels... empty. Lifeless. But, in a good way? It seems like it was crafted to be void of good feelings, to feel lonely and oppressing. Even so early in the age of the Empire it's draining the warmth, light, and color from the galaxy.

long marlin
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I'm 50/50 whether Cody jumped ship or Crosshair put him in a ditch

fathom bison
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Holy shit, I didn't even think about that. I just thought Cody was able to finally overcome the chip and have a change of heart.

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So either Cody was able to become a good guy again, or Crosshair showed that he was even more ruthless than we knew.

dusky flax
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It seems the chip's effects wore off relatively quickly

fathom bison
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Maybe for the clones who defended good people more than they fought the Separatists.

dusky flax
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This ep is a month after last season, and that took us a couple weeks at least away from order 66

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So it's been a while

fathom bison
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More than a month, he was on medical restriction after being picked up.

dusky flax
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Well, a month at least, yeah

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Lets call it a space month

fathom bison
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But you do have a point, Howzer didn't seem to have been changed all that much from how clones usually were in Clone Wars.

dusky flax
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And it just seems more fertile ground for drama if the clones get back to normal after o66 (at least until the chip is triggered again in some way?)

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Having to live with what they were made to do, how it affects them, how they navigate existing in the openly imperialistic military vs the fig-leaf republic one

fathom bison
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Ooh, maybe we'll get a variation on the Kamino rebellion where enough of them revolt that the rest are either put down or put out of service.

dusky flax
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Yeah it's one storyline the show could tackle

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We see the clone veteran beggar in the Obi Wan show; is he an outlier? Or are the clones just thrown out into the world, to fend on their own? Seems unlilely.

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Such a fighting force could still pose a great danger to Sheev

fathom bison
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We've seen four cast-out clones post-Clone Wars, I think they were just retired.

kind trail
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Those cast outs all had their chips removed, right? Did Cody have his removed?

fathom bison
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We only know Rex, Gregor, and Wolffe had theirs out, don't know about the one Kenobi ~~met ~~saw. Cody, if he did leave, likely hasn't yet, if he even knows.

dusky flax
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Crosshair isnt gonna talk about the chip; and the other clones around him bbviously wouldn't listen

astral ivy
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I dunno how I feel about Cody going awol

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The fates of all the clone characters from TCW feel a bit like they’re trying to ‘clean’ up the clones’ involvement in the empire

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They all seem either defect or die very shortly after Order 66

fathom bison
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I mean, transitionary period to the Empire we see in A New Hope. Getting rid of the remnants of the old order, the symbols of freedom or heroism, is the point.

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Anything that won't match up to the mustache-twirling, cartoonishly evil Galactic Empire of 1977 will slowly (or quickly) get phased out, eliminated, or "swept away".

long marlin
unkempt rover
astral ivy
astral ivy
fathom bison
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Filoni's been doing that for a while, but I think it still works, in- and out-of-universe. The clones were always slaves, as much as the droids, and the heroes were and are the ones who could resist that slavery.

dusky flax
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Yeah I've said it before, but the battle droids have it as bad as the clones. It demands a lot more from the audience to consider the droids as victims like the clones, though.

fringe urchin
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So far I'm still enjoying the show a lot and it still doesn't cease to literally feel like a pnp campaign with the group having their brawn, their leader, their techie, and their face, and going on missions that irremediably go wrong.

One thing that really starts to infuriate me though is disney constantly censoring blaster for stun shots every time it would involve the good guys shooting down somebody on screen, yet they have literally no qualms making them blow up ships and vehicles and whatnot

dusky flax
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Is this "Disney" the nebulous entity that controls all storytelling decisions people dislike, or creators working in a field that has a lot of accumulated weirdness from political groups around the presentation of violence?

fringe urchin
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¯_(ツ)_/¯

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Seems to be a really common occurrence on cartoons deemed viewed by kids

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I've seen all kinds of things, sometimes just showing shrooms on screen apparently a bad idea, etc

dusky flax
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Yeah, that's what I'm saying. It's not individual studios, it's a culture of weird-ass conservatism about what can be shown "on TV", laws or not.

fringe urchin
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Oh yes definitely, it's just Disney here that is thoroughly and happily applying it

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It was already kinda present in rebels (and I kinda forgot about TCW), but not 100% there

dusky flax
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Rebels is as much Disney as Bad Batch, though

fringe urchin
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It's also extremely hypocritical since it doesn't seem concerned when it's about shooting droids

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I'm not sure what you're trying to argue about but okay I guess?

dusky flax
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Argue?

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SW will never really treat minion droids as people, it would make the movies' heroes into shitters

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It's fun to discuss droid rights or how they're portrayed, but it is what it is

fringe urchin
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I just don't understand what you're replying this like "though" or whatever, I really don't understand the point you're trying to make

dusky flax
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It seems odd to me to pin a thing on "Disney" and then present a counterexample. Seems to me that the behavior of the bad batch could have other reasons, logically. Like trying to minimize casualties among clones while still operating within a reality that makes the occasional vehicle takedown necessary.

fringe urchin
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Well Disney are the decision makers here

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I don't understand your point still

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You can try to sugarcoat all you want with "in character" explanations of what makes sense, it's besides the point

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I never said it doesn't make sense

dusky flax
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I'm not sugarcoating anything? Much less trying. Not sure why you're coming at me like this, and not interested, frankly.

fringe urchin
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I'm not sure why YOU are

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since your first comment

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???

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not interested either

fathom bison
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I think part of the reason the Bad Batch is stunning instead of killing is because they're facing their own brothers and haven't quite reached the point where killing said brothers is something they're able to do.

long marlin
kind trail
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To me the Batch’s use of the stun setting seemed more of an intentional piece of story telling given their situation and less a interference ala “the studio execs have notes.” But the First Order Stormtroopers in Resistance using stun bolts; yeah, that one felt a bit out of place.

fathom bison
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Never watched it, not sure what conclusions to draw from the VERY wide variety of opinions on it.

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Still, I bet when the Bad Batch goes up against proper stormtroopers they'll step up to killshots. They haven't faced them too much, just once when breaking Gregor out of the Imperial facility.

dusky flax
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The batch use lethal shots against human opponents in season one, too

fathom bison
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Was that Rampage?

long marlin
dusky flax
# fathom bison Was that Rampage?

I don't remember the episode title, but I remember when Hunter is shot by Cad Bane and gets pulled out by the team, we see Wrecker fire regular shots at the troopers that are coming after them.

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There might be other instances, but that's one I remember

dusty pebble
dusty pebble
fathom bison
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He was.

deft scaffold
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Wrecker did fire a tank cannon at clones in this ep

kind trail
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Season 2, Episodes 4 - Faster
Aired: January 18, 2023

Synopsis: The team enters the colorful and dangerous world of racing.

Created by: Dave Filoni
Directed by: Brad Rau
Written by: Jennifer Corbett

long marlin
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About to watch. Please let this reference Droids

long marlin
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Sadly, not that I noticed. Loved the Darkseid vibe the big guy was giving off, though

fathom bison
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I liked the concept of the race, and would love to see more high-octane Star Wars racing games, especially in this sort of style. Balance speed, firepower, and defenses as you fight others on the course. Sort of like GTA 5's races, only with less bullshit.

deft scaffold
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It was totally Mario Kart. Jumps. Alternate patheways, tubes, firing at your enemies, forward and backward....

long marlin
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Ep 5 was a nice bit of fluff with an unexpected 3rd act twist.

dire fossil
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I fully figure that thing was some kind of Celestial war walker.

dusky flax
dusty pebble
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Told me wife, I’m glad I lowered the expectations I initially had going into this season. Enjoying it Far more than i did season 1

deft scaffold
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Thought they were going somewhere with the previous episode, then this unconnected thing. 🤷🏻‍♂️

long marlin
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It expands on the character of the treasure hunter, gives the Batch an adventure not directly related to their current fixer...

fringe urchin
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||Poor Mel ;_;||

fringe urchin
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||She tried so hard||

fathom bison
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||And got so far!||

rigid turtle
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What in the world was that massive construct robot? Who built it? Why?

fathom bison
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An excellent question, the answer to which is "We don't know except they're pre-Republic." Yesterday someone noted similarities to the Zeffo constructs in Fallen Order, which would be cool as hell.

dusty pebble
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Are the zeffo the new Rakatan empire?

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I kinda like the mysteriousness of the giant mech

fathom bison
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Sort of, but not quite? They didn't START as a Dark Side empire, they fell to its corruption after one of their leaders went mad, I think.

dusty pebble
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Ahh.

fathom bison
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So a mirror to the Republic, and a cautionary tale the Jedi could have benefited from.

long marlin
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If they'd known about them

quiet glen
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I'm trying to think where I've seen that sauropod-like robot before.

dusty pebble
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Horizon zero Dawn?

fathom bison
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It's like combining a Tallneck with one of the Divine Beasts from Breath of the Wild.

deft scaffold
quiet glen
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I'm thinking maybe older, like a sci-fi magazine cover

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Star Wars' own Ronto creature is kinda similar.

deft scaffold
kind trail
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Season 2, Episodes 6 - Tribe
Aired: January 31, 2023

Synopsis: The Bad Batch helps bring a new friend home.

Created by: Dave Filoni
Directed by: Brad Rau
Written by: Jennifer Corbett

long marlin
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Man a lot of people got deaded im this one, a couple in quite nasty ways

fathom bison
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I love the fact that the Bad Batch, with zero hesitation, just opened fire for this kid. Also, holy shit, Kinrath. Hell of a thing to bring back from KotOR.

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And apparently this was a set of recycled elements from an unfinished episode of Clone Wars, which is always good.

deft scaffold
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Thought it was good. Brings BB into a larger conflict some more.

fringe urchin
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I liked it, it was grim and had a lot of actual lethal fire

deft scaffold
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Honestly surprised me when he did the jedi thing

fathom bison
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My girlfriend called it that he was Gungi pretty much the moment he was on screen, so I'm proud of her.

long marlin
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The Clone Conspiracy was unexpected and so good

long marlin
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Truth & Consequences was unexpected but in a different way. Just a quality hour of television

mild geyser
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These two episodes were really great. This is what I was hoping to get from a show about the rise of the Empire and a direct sequel to The Clone Wars

fathom bison
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I'm gonna be perfectly honest, I thought Chuchi was going to die here. Also, holy shit Icko leaving hurts.

long marlin
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Chuchi basically having the same accent as Omega was weird.

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Rampart not recognising Omega was...odd, even if it was meant to be emblematic of him not caring about the clones

fathom bison
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I... don't actually remember if she ever interacted with him directly. They were on Kamino at the same time before the Bad Batch escaped with her, but I don't know if they were ever in the same room.

long marlin
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She left with/was taken by them and was a unique/valued 'item' that at least 2 bounty hunters were able to, effectively had that been their target, track CF-99 by. The fact he didn't recognise her on some level speaks volumes of the man (who no doubt died while attempting escape shortly after his arrest).

mild geyser
deft scaffold
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Not sure if Rampart was hiding the fact that he recognized her, only to reveal it later at some critical point…and then he got put in jail. That was a prime Emperor double-trap. He wins, one way or another.

Great speech by Ian McD, BTW.

long marlin
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The voice is really what does it

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There's a wonderful sense of something terrible laying just beneath the surface

fringe urchin
proven crypt
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Welp i guess one of my player's astromech droid works for organa on the side now XD

long marlin
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Droids are great for espionage. You can suborn, mindwipe or just expend their existence when required with a mere fraction of the moral qualms of doing the same thing to an organic

proven crypt
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Nu dont hurt our droid friends

fiery aurora
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wow that last episode was good

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really solid season

dusty pebble
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This duo of episodes were nice and what I was hoping to see. These types of episodes are kinda more my preferred as opposed to stuff like the racing and Indiana Jones-ing. Good character stuff, good story beats, Echo’s decision to stay back and seeing how the team responds to it vs Omega’s response.

kind trail
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Part of me wonders if Echo leaving is the writer's "making room" for Crosshair to come back to the team at some point in the future.

dusty pebble
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I’ll be honest, i thought the assassin was Crosshair at first

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And then when going after the Senator, there were too many misses and I was like “ok, Either it’s Crosshair and he’s hitting the pipes to make steam and hide things more…or it’s not crosshair and those are legit misses”

quiet glen
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I'm genuinely more curious about these 'Believer' clones than the fate of Echo. On a long enough timeline, we all know what happens to the Clones.

dusty pebble
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The believers are really intriguing. With Echo, the interesting part to me was less his fate and more his decision to go with Rex in general. Was a nice resolution to his earlier feelings that the Bad Batch should be doing more.

Though now I realize that something is gonna happen later that separates him a Rex because he isn’t with Rex when Ezra finds the latter in Rebels

long marlin
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The real question is will he get a new hand to slip over his data probe before he dies

proven crypt
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Wasn't there some EU stuff of clones getting there bodies replaced with mechanical pieces?

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Maybe thats what the believers are?

long marlin
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Sounds like a they may have had their biochips messed with? Or that like Crosshair they're making a deliberate choice because they believe in the Empire? They may be an army of one, but we know that they are capable of going against the groupthink

fringe urchin
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I feel the believers are the continuation of crosshair's view, since we have a lot of disgruntled clones shown in the episode, it makes only sense to also have the opposite mindset emerging as well: clones that get a lot more hardline in order to cope and justify everything they've done and gone through. Interested to see more about them

long marlin
dusky flax
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In SW, prosthetics are symbolic, not incidental

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aside from very minor characters like Lobot, at least in the movies they're always there to say something about the character's morality

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so they're not gonna pop up on some random background clone, IMO

proven crypt
long marlin
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Admittedly you wouldn't spot prosthetics under armour but given the life of clones after the war is a story beat that keeps getting returned to, the physical cost of surviving that would be something worth showing

proven crypt
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We also saw the second use of the kill tooth in the star wars universe

kind trail
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Was it only the second?

fathom bison
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First was the Gozanti pilot in Mando, I think. Don't know of any others.

proven crypt
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The gonzanti officer was a true believer inperial. Very scary.

long marlin
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I think it was less true belief and more death was preferable to messing up on Gideon's watch

proven crypt
deft scaffold
long marlin
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Huh. Interesting change of the status quo. Another 2 parter?

dusky flax
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interested to see if the show will continue to change things up like that, or if it's all setup for a big reunion in the long term

long marlin
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The transition from squad to family is interesting territory to explore

fringe urchin
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I liked this episode the most so far, it had gravitas, everything going down the drain, and explored uncertainty and other emotions they've not really used before

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Also appreciated the care to the world building and environments

dusky flax
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The thief is a kid, no?

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The body proportions looked childlike to me

long marlin
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Given the existene of the herd food isn't going to be a problem, and they know where they can find water

quiet glen
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There's a couple of species with 'kid' body proportions, including some literally played by kids.

deft scaffold
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Def a 2-parter.

Started out like a couple fan adventures I know: "Your benefactor has come into possession of a mine. Your job is to go evaluate it and bring them some ore." AS-IF!

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It's an FFG adventure, Debt to Pay. The ore is Oridium instead of Ipsium.

quiet glen
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I do so want to steal Cid's tendency to pare down everyone by some defining wardrobe feature. I'll have to steal that for an NPC in the future.

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I think there was a whole series of memes about thta.

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Meets some venerable Mando and just calls him "T-face"

long marlin
quiet glen
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It is a rather on-the-nose side quest scenario.

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I wouldn't mind, but so many episodes are missing that storytelling layer above 'space adventure' that was present in Clone Wars.

dusky flax
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Everything in TCW being ironically backlit by the viewers' knowledge of the horrors to come elevated a lot of the material. Bad Batch doesn't have that.

long marlin
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I quite like how what seemed like a simple fetch quest side mission evolved into character exploration and at least the threat of continuing change to the status quo (I'm fairly certain they're going to get the Marauder back before the end of the season given the effort to disguise the identity of the thief, but I could be wrong)

rigid turtle
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Wasn't a big fan of this episode but I did appreciate the character development for Tech.

Things I disliked: The ship being stolen by a apparant child, and totally unnoticed.

The end line of "We don't have enough rations!" When Cid said she'd need a couple days. Bruh.. your a soldier and would know you can go without food for a long time as long as you have access to water, way longer than a couple days.

long marlin
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They have water AND a herd of doubtlessly delicious antelope of some description back up the mountain that Mr Nature Boy should have no trouble bagging a couple of.

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The ship theft certainly felt a bit railroady but consider that the access ramp autosealing is rather unusual as not only have they frequently gone off leaving the door open, but they're far from the only ones in the GFFA to do it.

fringe urchin
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I'm more annoyed at the fact that they specifically were watching for "poachers" and set up a watch team, but since the ship was impossible to land in view, they shrugged it off. I would have felt it a lot less jarring if they just didn't know about poachers or any threat at all and thought it was an empty place, to see their ship being stolen

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However I still liked that episode for the sheer character development, and I do hope it eventually converges with the slow descent to darkness that happens in the background (as seen in the previous episodes on Coruscant), that could bring a lot of unexpected hardships to come

quiet glen
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I think the ship theft was a way to elevate some of Omega's personal fears. She just lost Echo, now she's lost the Marauder and her 'room'. The rest of the Bad Batch aren't as frustrated by this because for them, suffering is normal.

dusky flax
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Their upbringing and experience during the war was far more detached and, as weird as that sounds, predictably unstable.

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Omega didn't go to kill school, unlike them.

long marlin
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She also moves through time only half the speed they do.

mild geyser
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She might be "older" but she's still a child, and mentally, the cloens progress rapidly.

long marlin
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Physically, too

mild geyser
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They're used to things gong wrong, people leaving, and even ships being stolen or destroyed.

They do care about this stuff, but they don't dwell on it too much because it won't change anything.

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It was good for Tech to talk to Omega the way he did, since he's the most analytical of the group and tends to think in a more rational way about situations.

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Also Tech gets to understand that Omega isn't a soldier like them, and she's truly experiencing all of this for the first time ever.

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She isn't mentally at the stage where she can shrug things off. Everything is a big deal to her.

long marlin
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Also, in the wake of Red, I wonder if they're going to make a thing of Omega hitting puberty

mild geyser
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Probably not to any strong degree. IF the show goes on long enough, I foresee a sizable timeskip happening at some point.

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Omega's around 12-13 now. So I'd guess at some point they could just age her up to 15-16 and bypass most of that.

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I still would like to know about Omega's origins. What was the purpose of Nala Se creating her, and why did she want to protect her so badly when she didn't much care for most other clones and treated them like nothing more than property and an commodity to be sold (as evidenced in the Fives arc of TCW)

long marlin
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Assuming she didn't hit it during the war and they're just waving it all off screen instead of embracing the opportunity for space dads to deal with it

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My guess is that she was intended to act as part of a breeding pair with Alpha clone Boba

mild geyser
long marlin
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They're just meat droids to them. And I remember conversations regarding the Jango Fett raw material being a resource they need to maintain, implying it's a required component for each batch rather than something they can just 3D print now they have it o record

mild geyser
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Yeah, they emphasized the DNA being strained to make new clones since they didn't have fresh stock of it anymore.

long marlin
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I suspect the plan would have been to have Boba impregnate Omega, engineer a bunch of upgrades in utero, then use that genetic matrix as the basis for a new product line intended for release as the original clones were retired from service

dusky flax
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Nah, that's too rape-y for a kid's show, and from a sci-fi tech perspective too random with how the genetics would combine

long marlin
#

This is a show that routinely kills people in often quite obvious ways, and focuses around a group of effective child slave soldiers raised to die and be cast aside for a future they explicitly have no say in. As long as they don't show it or mention it on screen I think the idea of Omega being intended in-universe as a brood mare before she skipped town isn't out of place for TCW/TBB. The only other logical in-universe explanation was looking at the potential to expand their market to customers wanting amazons

dusky flax
#

Nah, it's a children's adventure story with some darker elements in the background or slightly out of shot. The kind of themes you posit here are very much out of step with what all animated shows and the vast majority, maybe even all the live action material has been doing.

quiet glen
#

Change of topic: was Clone 99 intended to be the first 'enhanced' clone, who just went wrong?

mild geyser
#

I think it's more that since Boba and Omega are pure clones for the most poart. They could extract fresh, unaltered genetic material from them to make new clones.

Though, they also mentioned that Omega is viewed as defective/ enhanced clone during the first few episodes of Season 1, so that still somewhat confuses me.

dusky flax
mild geyser
quiet glen
#

CF-9901 is Hunter, CF-9904 is Crosshair. Presumably Wrecher and Tech are 02 and 03. Clone 99's full designation could have been CT-9900.

fringe urchin
#

It's always been kinda vague and weird the way their genetic material decays and that they would have to get back to the source material (fett) to get fresh material. I'd assume their samples are unique use and then they have to take samples from the clones at each generation (since fett is gone) which see a little more decay and variations each time, or that's how I interpreted it anyway.

If anything while omega is said to be a "pure clone" she still is female, which means that at least 2~% of her genetic code is different (but the rest is pure, on the other hand), which is after all, probably thousand/millionth times more than the deviations between clone generations of males when introducing that second X chromosome variable into the equation. Why and how did they happen to get a female out of it, no idea, but they probably originally had something else in mind than just getting a pure clone dna sample source.

( and since it's star wars we're probably definitely overthinking it )

#

( also I dont even want to think of the genetic disaster it would be to breed two genetically identical individuals btw )

long marlin
#

Actually, incestual mating is one of the keys to establishing new breeds to ensure various genetic traits become enduring.

fringe urchin
#

We're not just talking about incestual here

#

We're literally talking about identical clones

#

And I was expecting that argument, which is still true, but you're literally opening the result to every genetic disease ever due to the total lack of allele diversity

#

( which is also the main problem in the former btw )

quiet glen
#

Dax refers to the Kaminoans as 'cloners', which may suggest that they no longer reproduce biologically. When they want a female or male of a species, they know how to make the necessary changes with little risk.

#

Although we do have dialogue/records stating that Omega is a 1st gen clone of Jango, I still suspect she's a clone of another Mandalorian. Hair color is too common a plot clue to completely ignore.

dusky flax
#

I mean, he calls them cloners because they clone people and sell them

long marlin
quiet glen
fringe urchin
#

I always thought he was dying it as a mark of individuality like most clones tend to do in other ways with their hair

dusky flax
#

yeah no reason to think his hair is "naturally" that color

long marlin
fringe urchin
#

Seems pretty normal to me

dusky flax
#

these are people who will tattoo the republic cog on their whole face

fringe urchin
#

There is a lot of personalities that bleach dye buzzcuts

dusty pebble
#

(Or is that a tattoo? I for some reason thought it was a scar)

quiet glen
#

Everyone but Tech has some kind of facial asymmetry.

long marlin
#

He has the worst helmet to make up for it

#

Except maybe Icko, whose helmet leaves his cybernetic prosthesis completely exposed, but at least has a reasonably airtight seal

mild geyser
#

Guess it was either that or have a big bulge in the back of his helmet.

long marlin
#

It's not like he needed it. The head piece was added after he joined the squad

dusky flax
#

Most, maybe even all armor on SW does not pass the stupidity test

#

His fits right in

long marlin
fiery aurora
#

NOBODY TOLD ME THERE WERE MORE EPISODES

fathom bison
#

Shoulda looked, then.

dusty pebble
#

Hey Wilde. There are more episodes, and another tomorrow

long marlin
#

How many eps this season? 12 or 16?

fathom bison
#

16, I believe.

long marlin
#

Nice Alien vibe, but confused as to whether Tipocca City was meant to be the only settlement on the planet

dire fossil
#

They blew up every city apparently

long marlin
#

Yeah, but outside that 2 parter, the dialogue keeps making it seem like Tipocca was the only site of habitation. Maybe that was the only place they did genetics?

dire fossil
#

It was their capitol, and the primary focus point of their cloning programs, everything else relied on Tipoca's genetic databanks and researchers.

#

They clearly had other settlements, in AOTC we can see a satellite city in the background of Tipoca

Kamino_Tipoca_City.webp
#

These are where most Kaminoans actually lived when not working on the cloning programs or supporting those that did

dusky flax
#

I think the dialogue here about the cities, plural, being destroyed is to clarify that the bombardment really did end Kaminoan civilization, and not just destroy their cloning facility.

long marlin
dire fossil
#

No

deft scaffold
#

The hook at the end was great. They’re finally going after her!

fathom fractal
#

I was wondering when they'd bring it back

#

I was wondering when they'd bring it back

radiant crane
#

Don’t they think she was killed on tipoca city?

dusty pebble
#

Unless with the ousting of Rampart, other elements of his report of Kamino were also questioned.

dusky flax
#

no body, no confirmation

unkempt rover
#

What's the odds Syd is being cagey because she sold them out?

dusky flax
#

if she did, keeping them close (as in, rescuing them when they were stranded) would have made sense, no?

unkempt rover
#

That's the bit I'm trying to work out. Could be why she tried to stall them on the last planet, keep them in place until the Empire arrives

#

Wonder where they're taking her though. She's always been portrayed as unreliable but her shift has been sudden. Wonder if they're setting her up as having other problems

dusky flax
#

Sudden, or inevitable?

#

I'd actually enjoy it if the shifty amoral broker actually turns out to be shifty and amoral

long marlin
#

Wow, this ep managed tobe even darker than last week

torn hound
#

It was definitely a good one

#

Im enjoying this show much more than Mando tbh

#

I was actually sad when mayday didn’t make it ☹️

dusky flax
#

yeah that was a good one

#

Crosshair feeling the full weight of his decisions now

#

probably thought he was among the lucky ones when he saw the clones unceremoniously dumped into civilian life early in the ep

#

turns out having an incompetent sadist for a boss is far worse than being ejected from the military

long marlin
#

So do you think he's going to be programmed into being a true believer?

dusky flax
#

Is it belief when it's programmed?

#

I dont know that turning him into a meat puppet would serve the long term storytelling. It basically removes him as a character.

#

So from that angle it seems unlikely. At least as as permanent change, not a challenge to be overcome.

long marlin
#

The fact he rebelled over the death of his fellow clone and fragged his CO clearly interests the evil doctor. We know that being a True Believer means you're quite willing to murder/suicide your fellow clones for The Cause. The overall thrust of the series is the extent you'll go to for family. I can honestly see Crosshair getting turnef into a TB in order to get a ROTJ!Vader moment where he manages to rebel against his programming to save Omega

deft scaffold
#

Yes, I think they are going to send him back to the Force 99 to infiltrate them so they can get the girl, but then will have his moment of redemption

tranquil remnant
#

Personally I’m hoping that Crosshairs gets turned into a Phase 0 Dark Trooper. They already dropped a ref to that phase of the program in the Mandalorian.

#

That would definitely echo Vader’s arc.

#

I also continue to love the direction of Kiner’s score since the end of CW. Really fits the dystopian sci-fi themes they’re exploring.

fiery aurora
#

finally got caught up

#

what a dope fucking episode

fathom bison
#

Right? I've heard people complaining the writing was bad, but those people are just looking for things to complain about, this episode was awesome.

long marlin
#

The imperial officer was entirely a strawman and completely the ugly=evil trope, but StarWars has never been subtle and the point was to see what would make Crosshair break

fringe urchin
#

I don't know if people meant the story or just the lines when it comes to the "writing" tbh. Lucas was known to do horrible lines but his writing for the story and world building was stellar

#

Anyway I'm kinda amused that this animated series is proving to be more adult (alongside TCW) than the actual live actions like mando in terms of tone

#

Personally I've not been bothered by the writing too much, but maybe it's because this episode is really not about the lines. Characters are not especially expressive and don't talk that much, all the drama goes through unsaid stuff, like looks, glances, visual emotions, and the storyboard

tranquil remnant
#

Good storytelling knows when to let their characters and audience sit with something for a bit. Ghost in the Shell is wonderful example of that particular tool.

gray wing
#

Ever since the episodes back on Coruscant, Bad Batch has really been good. I suspect it's the same thing that went on with Clone Wars and Rebels, where it started decent but really found its stride a little ways in.

long marlin
#

They've been indicating for a while the narrative was going to have the Batch get involved fighting the Empire instead of existing in its periphery, which I guess is really what people want to see. Particularly because we're so invested in the story of the clones we want to see how it all ultimately plays out.

fringe urchin
#

I like the idea of them being on the fringes, EotE style

#

It's fresh and it feels like every story in SW shoehorns their heroes into eventually falling to fight for the good fight alongside the rebels

#

Although tbh I guess there is no rebellion yet besides the partisans at this era and I dont see them joining gerrera at all

#

I just like that they have various options/handlers as a freelance crew, between Cid and Cody

long marlin
grave zinc
tranquil remnant
#

I care more about character development and that can happen regardless of EotE vs Rebellion. The early Empire hasn’t been explored much and because it’s totalitarian it affects literally everything. So their victims could be ordinary folks, rebels, or shady-types.

fringe urchin
#

I agree with this

grave zinc
#

It definitely was a beautiful 'tipping point' for Crosshairs.
I take it he's in the lab where the Zillo beast is, which is how the gang are going to find him?

fathom bison
#

What I want to know is, it's only been a few months since the Empire was formed, maybe a year? Where did Palpy's HR teams find all of these comically evil sociopaths? Were they given hiring instructions that said "go out and look for the most twisted, sneering, bureaucratic shitbags you can find, and start firing anyone who shows even a hint of a conscience"? Were those HR teams already like that?

fringe urchin
#

They seem to have been indicative of some time spent between S1 and S2, but i'ts definitely mega early

#

tbh it's fast yes, but on the other hand I feel like declaring the birth of something like the galactic empire and suddenly shouting very reactionary and fascistic themes all day long after a war that radicalized everybody is bound to draw in a crazy amount of fanatics/lunatics to the fold early on

grave zinc
#

I suppose they need to move the timeline along a bit at a fair rate... the Empire only lasted for what, 25 years (?) and Stormtroopers need to build their reputation.

fringe urchin
#

I also actually like the earlier empire because it's not just stormtroopers everywhere according to lore, and I do hope we'll see more of that even though they seem focused like heck on the creation of the TK program (understandable)

gray wing
long marlin
grave zinc
#

I wouldn't be surprised if he manipulatively put folk into positions that turned them that way (i.e. lesser of two evil decision making) over time.

Similar to what he did with Anakin.

long marlin
#

Even without Sheev's people greasing the wheels

#

They're gonna hate

grave zinc
#

TBH, thats politicians looking at demobbed military after a conflict regardless.

long marlin
#

I suspect that if Sheev hadn't been so keen to mothball clonetech and had waited for the TK program to be more fully implemented, those terrible storms that claimed the cities of Kamino might have had a lot of clone troopers amongst the victims

dusky flax
#

As for the clones - politicians will be eager to dehumanize them, as that makes it easier to get rid of them without running into pesky obstacles like retirement funds or, uh, dignity

grave zinc
#

Im not wanting to get into a barmy over this, but... is there any point (prior to Rebels where we see him again) in Clone Wars that points to that being the case with Yularen? I just thought he'd got dehumanised and tired through the years of fighting?

fathom bison
#

He was definitely jaded and burned out, and part of that was probably the constant barrage of unorthodox tactics Skywalker used that gave Yularen a drinking problem.

#

But in Clown Wars he didn't seem evil, just a bit... set in his ways?

fringe urchin
#

imo Yularen is that military type that is absolutely not concerned by whatever ethics go with the military he's serving in

#

Just a very competent officer that prides himself on discretion and solid results

#

Completely amoral guy

dusky flax
#

You never know which bureaucrat or military officer or dry cleaner or whatever will go all in when the fascists declare their new order.

grave zinc
#

I mean personally for me I think we have to as he's not exactly, 'monstorously evil' in the way you assert till after the rise of the Empire in any of the material I've seen, in the same way we see with Tarkin.

dusky flax
#

I don't think you become evil after choosing to be the boss of the torture brigade

fringe urchin
#

I think he's just a 110% amoral guy that doesn't want to concern himself about ethics, just military career and efficiency. Which in a way makes him evil, just not the same kind of evil

dusky flax
#

the potential for their actions is always there, it's just that with the Empire they have opportunity to act on in

#

well, more openly

fringe urchin
#

You know the difference between a careerist heavy collaborator and the actual political fanatics on top

dusky flax
#

not like the Republic was super ethical LOL

fringe urchin
#

Or pardon me the RL analogies, but the difference between a rommel (<- also works for veers) and a himmler

grave zinc
fathom bison
#

I think I agree with you. He became so absolutely tired of the war that when he was given a chance to, shall we say... "ensure the security of the Empire to prevent war," I think he'd take it. That leads to "Do everything it takes to ensure that security" and "the ends justify the means".

kind trail
#

Isn't that how it goes though? That's sort of just the 'banality of evil' at play; authoritarian regimes aren't rife with mustache twirling villains; they're full of normal people who just constantly look the other way, don't make a fuss out of a sense of self preservation, or just generally lack the sense of moral courage to stand up for what's right.

#

Just because Yularan was on the "good guy" side in Clone Wars doesn't mean he actually was a good guy.

#

It's kind of the inverse of that "Wreck it Ralph" meme.

fathom bison
#

I'm reminded of a webcomic with this exact debate.

"Is there anything more banal than "the greater good"? The things you amateurs actually tell yourselves-- the complexities you invent to obfuscate the simple fact that you've chosen the path of least resistance. It's called evil, Ms. Awning. I suggest you get used to the term."

kind trail
#

God, utilitarians are the worst, aren't they? Deontology all the way.

grave zinc
#

I don't think I was suggesting he was 'a good guy', more that he wasn't obviously a 'monstrously evil' type until we get to Rebels, and I was wondering if maybe the experiences of the Clone Wars could have had an impact on that.

Lightheartedly, I deal with enough young officers who are in charge of me that have great 'maverick ideas' to empathise with Clone Wars era Yularen 😄

fathom bison
#

Oh god, young officers are the worst. Friggin bootenants that think just because they graduated from West Point or Annapolis or Colorado Springs that they're the next Patton or Nimitz.

kind trail
#

Yeah, I think that's just more the fact that the Republic and then the Empire and it's supporting bureaucracy hadn't gone full "mask off" yet and Yularen and others just been put in the right context/situations to see that side of them. But I suspect it was always there.

grave zinc
#

"I've got this great idea, why don't we do x like this? It'll shave loads of time off."
"Are you sure about that? We have SOPs for a reason....."
"Listen here, I'm in charge."
Thing Goes Wrong
suprisedpikachuface.gif

fathom bison
#

My dad called it Officer's Disease, and he claims that he managed to get away with telling a Colonel what it was near the end of his career.

dusky flax
#

That he didn't get a chance to openly act on his impulses does not mean they didn't exist. And considering how he is during the Imperial era, it would be ridiculous to say that he didn't have it in him back during the Republic.

fringe urchin
#

Honestly I could see it both ways without too much of a stretch, either he's just a bureaucrat and efficient military type with no morals and just getting by with ambition and career, or he's indeed hiding deeper beliefs during the clone wars, and perhaps a shift gradually happened as well that we dont know (yet) of

#

It's also an interesting character imo because everything we see of him during ep4, he's the same type that the guy you see in TCW (maybe more shrewd), completely silent and detached, staying in the background and not making waves

fathom bison
#

I lean towards the first. Throughout all the portrayals of him during the Empire, he just feels like he doesn't care about the evil, not necessarily delighting in sadism like some of his peers. The evil is a means to an end, not the end itself.

Unlike, say, Tarkin or Governor Price or any of the Inquisitors.

fiery aurora
long marlin
#

Who'd have thought that "imminent death via tsunami" would be the cheerful and light-hearted instalment of this week's adventures in the GFFA?

radiant crane
#

I wonder where Pabu is based off of? Greece maybe? I would like to live there

long marlin
#

It seemed grossly over populated for the bounty the people were enjoying

fringe urchin
#

I must admit I chuckled at Tech playing against himself. That was a cheap joke, but still funny

radiant crane
#

I thought that too x02. Was wondering where the food came from or what purpose the town had past “refugees hide here”. I honesty thought the mountain was going to be a giant crab and the earthquakes were it waking up

fringe urchin
#

I guess that massive wave was the GM telling the party "don't you fucking dare" 😄

long marlin
radiant crane
#

Well after they woke up the horizon zero dawn robot in the last pirate phee episode, it only makes sense they have to wake up another kaijou for it to battle!

long marlin
#

Now I want the Star Wars version of the Godzilla tv series where the 'heroic' kaiju fights the monster of the week

grave zinc
#

Zillo Beast: A Star Wars Story

long marlin
#

The fact that you see skyscrapers above thd plaza where the mountain tip peaks through is sort of terrifying really.

#

Because you automatically put that in context of Everest. And against that scake, kaiju are so small

long marlin
#

Who else thought the breakout attempt was going to be a trap?

quick mica
#

I'm sure the doctor is going to turn it into one, he seems smart enough

#

I'm glad they made Echo do what he wanted, and he's happy with that

#

but having that appear in the second to last week of the show releasing new stuff. It's beyond obvious they don't know what to do with him

radiant crane
#

God. Every time I see that hole I get pissed off that we lost 1313

long marlin
#

But while I appreciate he's war wounded reoresentation, in-universe they need to give him a prosthetic hand (I can't fathom why the technounion thought he needed a data probe when they were plugged directly into his brain in a lifesupport tube he was never intended to leave)

dusky flax
#

It's been established from right after he's rescued that he freaks the fuck out at droid docs coming near him

#

Understandably, he is not in favor of being cut apart further

long marlin
#

That's the thing. The hand would and should just be an articulated appendage that clips over his scomp link

#

Plus it xoesn't have to be a droid that attaches it

dusky flax
#

Would still require hooking up to nerves, which means highly invasive surgery

#

Like, the show already explained that he's not into further modifying his body. If that changes, cool. If not, that's also cool.

quick mica
#

I don't know how I feel about the season finale. It was good. But fucking A, the whole last episode for me was ruined the moment they revealed where they went back to. ||Why. The. Fuck. DID THEY GO BACK TO CID||

#

I think maybe I'm just disappointed at the slow burn of the season overall tho. I should let these episodes sit with me alittle longer, probably

long marlin
#

Yeah, returning or Ord Mantell just for the medical services of Azi was Hunter catching the Idiot Ball with his face. Given they were splitting with Cid, they should have gone back to her straight after the mine incident to grab Azi before going their own way, because Omega would NEVER have left him with the backstabbing lizard in the first place.

#

Given the clear need of the plot to have Cid sell them out, they could easily have had the marauder sufficiently damaged that it was incapable of making it back to Pabu and made Cid their only viable option within range

mild geyser
#

The finale was enjoyable. But I feel like it didn't really wrap up any plot lines from this season, just left on a cliffhanger and opened up more for later.

#

I did end up enjoying the later quarter of this season though.

#

I hope in season 3 that they're more deliberate with their storytelling and how they utilize the episodes.

#

Also interesting that the female doctor is a clone, an aged up sister to Omega. But that does call into question what's going on with Omega and the doctor. Who was created first? Is the doctor the actual fifth enhanced clone they referenced in the first season since Omega had little genetic tampering.

#

So now we have two female clones created by Nala Se. But then Nala Se didn't seem to react much to seeing Emeri earlier in the season.

quick mica
#

I agree with the feeling of it not feeling wrapped up.

This season didn't really have a goal for our characters, who kinda just went about their day to day, which ended up being alot of nothing

mild geyser
#

I feel like that's been a hindrance for both Bad Batch and The Mandalorian this season. The main characters don't have goals or motivations and are directionless while the secondary characters like Crosshair or Bo-Katan are far more interesting to follow.

long marlin
#

I disagree. Echo very evidently found his direction -- taking against the Empire to help clones escape. Crosshair has been shown dealing with the ramifications of his decision to remain in the military until he decides that he needs to start executing his new superiors. The rest of the Batch realised that their relationship with Cid was toxic and reached the decision they needed to quite The Life and settle down, right up until it sucked them back in.

Similarly, Din was plenty motivated to find a way out of his exile, which has led to him actively fathering Grogu into CotW!Mando culture. Having the show shift focus to Bo-Katan's redemption arc for a while is however probably a good place for the series to head for those who don't vibe with more domestic-themed stories.

fringe urchin
#

What was this lousy demolition job that didn't even bother also targeting the main tower 🤔

#

I feel like this alone makes gerrera pass for a clown just because the plot demanded it

long marlin
#

I think the problem was because of CF99 interfering he was forced to detonate early

dusty pebble
radiant crane
#

Was the weird romance thing between Fi and Tech out of left field or did I just miss things in previous episodes?

dusty pebble
#

It’s been subtle because Tech is…Tech and awkward. But she’s at least been trying to flirt with him

astral ivy
#

Yeah, it’s been subtle

long marlin
fringe urchin
#

Subtle? o:

#

She's been figuratively playing footsies with him for at least 2-3 episodes now

#

Under the guise of getting him out of his shell

#

Churning out the "brown eyes"

dusty pebble
#

Pretty much since she called out that he had brown eyes

dawn elbow
#

All I could think about when Saw got involved.

#

Also I wish I had written it down somewhere because I've been saying to my wife that Tech was getting too much development this season relative to everyone else in a way that bodes ill for him.

#

If he was a villain I'd assume he's coming back, but heroes do actually stay dead from the long falls more often.

#

Especially when making a sacrifice to save their friends.

long marlin
#

Odds were always in favour of the batch getting whittled down or outright terminated by the time of the Rebellion with Omega likely the only one left to carry on their legacy

dawn elbow
#

Well that's a sensible direction to go, but these shows have often found ways to let characters live when the initial setup would make it seem like they shouldn't, and the Bad Batch is less of a narrative hole to fill than Ahsoka or Ezra.

#

This may be a sign they're actually willing to do it this time, we'll see.

#

Though I worry now that crosshair will just die helping them get Omega out and skip the interesting part of reintegrating into the team after switching sides back to his family.

long marlin
#

Legends was full of exiled Order 66 survivors that Luke/Leia managed to dig out of the permafrost after the original trilogy so it's no huge leap that Ezra and Ahsoka would have similar stories in place for them to ensure Luke remains the only viable anti-Vader option come RotJ.

dawn elbow
#

Legends is not a way to establish something as not a huge leap, it's the go-to breeding ground of huge leaps.

long marlin
#

The hugest of leaps is retconning the old dude with the white beard in RotJ Endor strike team as actually being Rex

dawn elbow
#

They found ways to make it work and have done good things with the characters they made survive or brought back, but it required some creative narrative setups.

#

Filoni in particular has a habit of taking terrible fan-fiction sounding ideas and making the result work.

#

But he's less directly involved in Bad Batch, so his style might not leave as big of an imprint on it.

long marlin
#

Having Ahsoka, already a completely wild fanfic, as being essential to the formation of the Rebel Alliance, after having come back to explicitly escape Order 66 after having been carefully put on a bus to avoid it 2 seasons before...

dawn elbow
#

Yeah Ahsoka in particular is obviously a creator's pet character that gets to be deeply involved and important and then conveniently find an excuse to disappear when already established things don't include her. But that's not to say I don't like her, she has some really great moments and has become interesting and complex, there's just this obvious Doylist explanation that undermines certain narrative contrivances for me.

#

And isn't exclusive to her, Ezra and Thrawn get some of the same treatment with the end of Rebels, and we'll still see how the Bad Batch goes.

long marlin
#

I don't have any problems with Ahsoka either, as she really did help flesh out Anakin far far more than the movies ever did. Just pointing out that Legends isn't the exlcusive home of huge ass leaps

mild geyser
#

Heh. I don't have a problem with Ahsoka nor how Ezra and Thrawn were conveniently taken out of the equation for the OT to happen. Yes, it is very convenient to make way for the OT to happen as it did without it feeling weird, but also I think it's creative.

It opens the door for more stories to happen, but doesn't bulldoze over the continuity of the origin 6 Star Wars movies as they are.

#

If nothing else, Filoni is very good at working within the bounds of George's stuff and trying not contradicting any of it. I think that's one of his strengths.

#

For the stuff that he is directly involved with, they really do just add to the Star Wars mythos in mostly good ways.

fiery aurora
#

yo what the FUCK

#

holy crap that ending

#

Bad Batch Season 2 way better than Mandalorian Season 3

#

uncontroversial opinion

long marlin
#

Eh, I felt the "Cid inevitably sells them out" was absolutely lazily executed and honestly had expected them to get captured during the raid on Tarkin's HQ

mild geyser
#

I don't know if I'd call the finale satisfying, but it certainly was unexpected. That's for sure.

#

Hopefully, season 3 will really kick things in to high gear. I really enjoyed the last few episodes of this season, and I hope they keep it up going forward.

dawn elbow
#

It puts them in a position where it would seem like it has to come out the gate swinging next time.

neon brook
#

Soo... just binged the season. That was mostly fun, with some groans and some really awesome scenes.

I loved the Emperor scene in the senate - the whole "Oh no, he planned for us to do this the whole time!" felt a little over the top when it could have just been him seeing one plan go into the trash and improvising on top of the ruins. But the appearance itself was just awesome.

#

The Crosshair stuff was good storytelling start to finish. I joked about the description of the Outpost episode sounding suspiciously like The Honorable Ones and it was funny how the outcome was similar - one character getting disillusioned with the Empire -, though the tone was quite different.

#

I liked the results of the finale and the atmosphere, but I really would have loved it if characters didn't act quite as stupid over the course of it - there were at least three decision points that would have made this less of a fiasco.

long marlin
#

What were those points?

mild geyser
#

Not going back to Cid for one, I think. Haha. Surely, they could've went to another medical place to help Omega. Surely, AZ-3 wasn't the only one able to do that.

dusty pebble
#

I’m kinda curious if season 3 is going to have a tighter narrative focus, now that there’s an actual goal of “get Omega.” Idk if I can see these 3 suddenly doing some of the random type jobs they’ve been doing when they’re hunting Hemlock and trying to get Omega back.

long marlin
radiant crane
#

Watching plan 99 now and I would like to know what blaster pistol hunter has that can take down a star fighter

radiant crane
#

Meh. The finale checked all my bingo boxes. I am still waiting for the drop that omega is force sensitive though.

neon brook
#
  1. Don't just walk out to where Wrecker is being held and just surrender there. Flee with Omega, stand your ground at a choke point (for a while before surrendering or for as long as possible) or walk out and shoot Hemlock (while accepting your death). Just stepping out, talking for a few moments and then surrendering accomplishes nothing.
#
  1. After two people have sacrificed themselves for you, do not ineffectually threaten/negotiate with the villain while giving away your location.
fringe urchin
#

I agree with 1 and 2 but 3 is just omega being a kid tbh

long marlin
#

Yeah, but Omega is meant to be smart AND has been spending the last 2 seasons hanging around a group of veteran special forces operators, so you'd expect her to have picked some basic sense of tactical and strategic assessment such that she'd not stumble so easily into #3

radiant crane
#

For being veteran spec ops they seem to be wildly incompetent at least while omega is around. 🫠
But if they succeeded at everything it would be a boring show so there’s that too.

dusty pebble
#

I like how Hunter worded it. They’re kinda starting to become less soldiers in a way with Omega, and probably time on Pabu, and stuff is changing and getting harder with the Empire’s resources and ruthlessness.

fathom bison
#

I swear to god, it has to be hard as shit to be a therapist in the Star Wars universe, but I bet they make bank.

#

Also, new predecessor to the AT-ST! Looks like a cross between that and an ITT.

dawn elbow
#

Sir, this is a Wendys Bad Batch thread.

dusty pebble
#

Was just about to say that 🙈

radiant crane
#

Sorry wrong channel

#

My b if anyone saw that and hadn’t seen the new mando episode

dusty pebble
#

Fortunately for me, i haven’t seen any of it so i have no context of any of that

astral ivy
#

Of course she’s gonna do something stupid trying to save her family figures

dusty pebble
#

She was entirely ready to walk back to find Tech despite her injuries. She’s smart, and good at dejarik, but she’s not a soldier and still pretty emotional which can get in the way of the smart decisions. Especially if you aren’t trained

radiant crane
#

Isn’t omega also older than the rest of CF-99

dusty pebble
#

She suggests as much, as she wasnt accelerated and talked about seeing them in the lab

long marlin
mild geyser
#

Hm. Yeah, Morrison was around 40 when Attack of the Clones was filming. Although, at the time, he looked youthful enough for it to work. plus the exact science of cloning in Star Wars has always been a bit vague.

#

However, I do think Omega's timeline of her age and when she saw certain things is a bit muddy. That's one of my big gripes with Bad Batch is that it is somewhat muddying the story of the clones and cloning a little bit.

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With the accelerated aging, I'd wager that Omega would have had to be around 4 or 5 to actually remember seeing the Bad Batch in their growth tubes.

#

But then that would make the Bad Batch a bit younger than they actually should be with their accelerated aging.

long marlin
#

There are multiple generations of clones, so for CF99 to be the lab rats they were and to be old enough to fight, they'd have to have started gestation by no later than year3 of the project, and Omega would have to have been cooked up at the same time as Boba for her to have seen them in the tubes. I was always under the impression that the clones were hatched as kids, received their initial bout of training, then got retubed to get them through puberty before getting hatched a second time to do military training. But the episose with Boba disguised as a clone cadet makes it look like they spend 5 years in a tube and then 5 getting trained

dusky flax
#

They went back to Cid because they needed off-the-books medical care, and they can't go back directly to island paradise because they might have been tracked. Which would ruin their sliver of hope for settling down. It's an emotionally driven decision that works out badly for them, yeah. That's why it works for me, despite Cid's betrayal being so obviously coming.

#

All in all, a very solid pair of episodes. I particularly enjoyed the trust in the audience some of the sequences displayed. The jump from seeing the walker and Echo, to Echo having hijacked it. for example. No need to show him do it, just keep the momentum of the episode going.

#

Dr Hemlock & Omega are the villain from Logan and the kid Wolverine. The situation between them & the glove/robot hand the guy has.

#

also, per the trivia guide, Ben Mendelsohn voiced Krennic's one line in this episode

mild geyser
#

All in all though, I'm actually excited to see where Season 3 heads.

dusky flax
#

both Mando and Bad Batch had/have me dropping off from the shows, but the finale here was good enough to pull me back in for the next season

#

hopes for season 3?

#

maybe exploring that genetic ties don't actually mean anything in terms of sisterhood/brotherhood, it's about what you do - could be a lesson Omega will need learning

fringe urchin
#

It's pretty obvious they held off a big part of the end revelations for the start of S3 as a cliffhanger

dusky flax
#

what do you mean?

#

also interesting how casually everyone is about killing now; the bad batch used stun on a few occasions, but for the most part they used regular ol' murder energy against their fellow clones and the other troopers

mild geyser
# dusky flax hopes for season 3?

I really hope to dig into more about Onega's and now Emeri's creation and what their purpose is, as well as what Nala Se was experimenting on besides the Bad Batch.

I hope to see what happens with Crosshair. If he gets turned into some type of proto-death trooper or what have you or if the Batch will end up helping him escape.

And of course, the Batch themselves. Tech is gone. Omega is gone. How will they handle all this?

#

Like the other animated shows, I hope The Bad Batch does "age up" with its audience next season as well.

dusky flax
#

Crosshair leading other death troopers in doing the montage of suicidal robocops from Robocop 2...

#

would be funny if the whole purpose of the female clones was, let's do it because we can

#

for science!

mild geyser
#

It's more than capable of telling serious stories that are still digestible for kids like Clone Wars and Rebels before it.

mild geyser
dusky flax
#

I was listening to the A More Civilized Age podcast, and in their episode on the unfinished arc of TCW with the big kyber crystal, them mention how much more violent the show's gotten over its course

#

re: the aging up, I mean

#

but the stories were still essentially kids fare

#

(which isn't meant dismissively; I'm glad the show never lost its focus)

dusky flax
#

so Omega could be told that she's "just" a science experiment done for the LOLZ, but accept that and find her own purpose

#

with how much work the show is doing to retroactively set up Snoke & returned Sheev, it would fit in neatly

mild geyser
#

Now, what I am interested in now is Emeri's existence. I wonder if she was the first "Omega" and was bred to be a lab assistant or perhaps a calming presence for the regular clones or something. But probably got deemed a failure for whatever reason.

dusky flax
#

Or a secret?

#

Omega's existence wasnt public knowledge exactly

mild geyser
#

Yeah, possibly. Now, I also hope they do give us answers to some of these questions and don't drag it out too much.

Then again, I do have this feeling that season 3 of Bad Batch might be the last one.

dusky flax
#

Why?

mild geyser
#

Just based on how Season 2 went. I could see next season be about saving Omega, and then the Batch just decides to go far away from the Empure abd settle down. Alternatively, they could go hard into fighting the Empire and eventually get whittled down. They already lost Tech. Assuming they don't backtrack his death, it's a possibility that all the others besides Omega won't make it. Though that'd be a very grim conclusion, but not out of the question.

#

It's the Dark Times. Everything's pretty grim for the galaxy anyway.

neon brook
#

I don't see it going that dark - Tech's death was a core element for a season finale, not just punctuation like GoT character deaths. While I wouldn't rule out one more death, I don't think a TPK is in the cards, especially considering how hesitant Filoni generally is about killing off anyone who could be an easter egg in a future series instead.

fringe urchin
#

Tech's death felt a little shoehorned and telegraphed

mild geyser
#

Maybe. But also, Filoni isn't heavily involved in The Bad Batch from what I understand. He created it, but he gives notes to the others now abd takes a hands off approach. The head writer/ showrunner for it is Jennifer Corbett and the supervising director is Brad Rau. So the Bad Batch is their ship more than Filoni's at this point.

dusty pebble
#

When I saw the title “Plan 99”, i had a feeling someone was gonna die/sacrifice. Felt too much of a callback to 99’s death to be otherwise

dusty pebble
fathom bison
gentle briar
#

Besides Wrecker, I only recall TBB using kill on Troopers towards the end of Season 2.

#

Like final arc end.

gentle briar
#

Can we talk about how the anti-aircraft blaster cannons have their bolts explode in-air like a flak cannon?

neon brook
#

We can, but I feel like I've seen that before at some point.

gentle briar
#

Have we?

#

It's the first time I noticed it, but I haven't seen every single Star War media ever.

neon brook
#

I'm not sure where it was, but explosions around a space ship don't feel really new to me.

gray wing
#

It's just the standard thing, the high tech weapons work just like stuff from WWII or so because the point is to hearken back to those stories

dusky flax
#

it happens all the time in SW, yeah

radiant crane
#

Attack of the clones on geonosis I believe and happened quite a bit in clone wars tol

long marlin
#

The X-wings are rocked by flack during the trench run

gentle briar
#

Nah, the blasters just shoot past them into the endless void of space.

dusky flax
#

yeah in the trench run it doesn't happen IIRC, but later on in the media it does

gentle briar
#

🤔

dusky flax
#

even as early as RotJ you can see the pew-pew from starships resulting in explosions mid-space or near starships

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPZigWFyK2o

YouTube
Prometheus of Videos
Star Wars VI: Return of the Jedi - Space Battle of Endor Supercut

The epic space battle above the moon of Endor. The Rebel Alliance gathers up its entire fleet of cruisers and fighters led by Lando Calrissian in the Millennium Falcon and overseen by Admiral Ackbar in the Mon Calamari Cruiser Home One to destroy the second Death Star. Unfortunately by the time they get to the "incomplete/nonoperational" Death S...

▶ Play video
fringe urchin
#

Always thought those were shield deflections, like in the battle of hoth (you can clearly see explosions around snowspeeders not hitting them, but still exploding)

#

Although, in the battle of yavin it's clearly described as flak cannons, no matter the visual depictions

long marlin
#

It's flak because Lucas based all the aerial and space combat vibes on WW2 air combat movie sequences

dusky flax
mild geyser
#

I knew it

#

Lol

dawn elbow
#

It's the good move from where they are.

dusky flax
#

Better this way than how TCW was killed off mid-production.

mild geyser
gray wing
#

yeah it's not as much a matter of Disney taking it on or not but the various production shifts during that period

#

I'm glad the various other shows and the extra two seasons, plus a couple books, have been able to resolve those remaining threads, at least

gentle briar
fringe urchin