Superman

[echo kraken]

Not everyone's going to want to suffer a 3-4 hours Nolan again.

[golden frost]

Bad superhero movie fatigue is

[wind adder]

It is

[golden frost]

He never made a 4 hour movie lol

[echo kraken]

No, not super hero fatigue... shit films fatigue

[wind adder]

Thunderbolts was a good movie and yet it didn’t succeed in the box office. Especially overseas

[golden frost]

Or fatigue of superhero movies that all feel the same no uniqueness whatsoever

[echo kraken]

Oppenheimer felt like 5 lol

[golden frost]

They don’t use a specific genre when adapting comics like they used to

[wind adder]

Lol the complete opposite. People are hyped https://x.com/mejat32/status/1945750188892565809?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

*ਜਤਿੰਦਰ ਸਿੰਘ (@meJat32)

#TheOdyssey has sold over 23K tix at 22 locs across North America. Most of the shows are either SOLD OUT or near. The Chinese Theatre alone has sold over 3K tix.

ONE YEAR OUT.

X · Jul 17, 2025, 7:39 AM

[echo kraken]

It’s not a bad film, but every character is a “slightly different version of an iconic character”

[echo kraken]

Yeah that’s BS and you know it lol…

[wind adder]

Oppenheimer, a slow paced drama made almost a billion. Barbenheimer marketing helped, but Nolan is clearly a big brand himself.

[golden frost]

Well the Thunderbolts in this movie are not the same team from the comics at all

[wind adder]

It’s not BS. Nolan has huge pull internationally

[golden frost]

Oppenheimer was long and R rated yet made 900 million

[wind adder]

It made 975 million

[austere stream]

I am so hyped for Fantastic Four

[golden frost]

Same 😊

[wind adder]

F4 will probably have strong legs

[echo kraken]

What I mean is independent theaters putting up preorder numbers for a film that doesnt even have a run time or full distribution numbers contracted is just hilarious BS

[golden frost]

How

The last F4 movie everyone hated so much that the franchise was set back another 10 years

And now the mcu is facing bad faith

[wind adder]

I think it will have better WOM than Superman. People tend to give MCU more chance.

[wind adder]

It’s still more stable than DCU.

If F4 is acclaimed, then I can see it outgross Superman.

It’s also going to be a more serious movie.

[echo kraken]

I wouldn’t judge it until the full film and numbers are in, but so far from the preview audiences it does seem positive.

[golden frost]

What does that have to do with reception

[echo kraken]

Too early to say “it has legs” just yet lol

[austere stream]

Tuesday

[wind adder]

I think one reason Superman isn’t doing well overseas is James Gunn’s terrible sense of humor, which people are getting tired of.

[echo kraken]

Yup, right now the critics can only say “good/bad/ok”

[craggy pawn]

Superman has already won in terms of critical reception, yes it would be great if it makes money but that isn't the only thing. People tend to forget that Batman begins made only 385 million dollars worldwide back in 2005 when DC was in tatters.. not the same situation of course but DC is being rebooted.

[wind adder]

Batman Begins made that during an era where superhero genre wasn’t even that popular.

Can’t compare

[craggy pawn]

That's your opinion, a lot of us like Gunn's sense of humour and his Guardians movie did very well internationally

[wind adder]

Begins like Spider-Man 1 and X-Men revolutionised the genre

[echo kraken]

Who said that? The reviews from audience and critics are overwhelmingly positive. There’s a very vocal minority that are pushing that perspective very hard, but isn’t the concensus.

[wind adder]

His GOTG movies only did well due to the MCU brand. Without Feige, he’s nothing.

[craggy pawn]

I mean, yes we can .. Spiderman 1 and 2 were already released. DC's Batman was dead as well at that time.

[craggy pawn]

Totally disagree..

[austere stream]

People universally loved Guardians 3 and that was recent so I doubt that the majority is "sick of his humour" ngl

[wind adder]

Suicide Squad flopped for example lol. If Gunn was so great, then it should’ve made huge numbers even during pandemic era.

[craggy pawn]

Superman as a character has never been popular like Batman internationally

[wind adder]

Not only was GOTG 3 a darker film than Superman, it was also less goofy than the previous GOTG films. Besides the MCU brand helped

[craggy pawn]

Oh come on.. that movie was also released in HBO max at the same time as theatres plus it was pandemic.. no way it was gonna make money. What happened to Guardians 3 later??

[wind adder]

It also had more depth than Superman. I’m not surprised GOTG 3 was more universally liked.

[craggy pawn]

The main thing that Gunn had to do with Superman was make it so that majority of people liked or loved it and that's absolutely the case.

Yes it isn't doing well internationally and that's because the DC brand was in tatters.

[austere stream]

Yeah DCEU fucked the brand over hard

Itll take a few films to rebuild trust

[craggy pawn]

I'm actually really surprised it is doing this well domestically actually.. like if we saw past DC reception this movie would have flopped hard

[echo kraken]

I'd say about 45:30:25... there are still a QUARTER dislike

[wind adder]

I wouldn’t be surprised if Supergirl does better💀, but I’m just going to say it will make less than Superman for now.

[craggy pawn]

Also, Gunn isn't gonna direct each and every DC movie.. he has said there will be different tones of DCU movies, Supergirl is gonna be quite dark than Superman.

[wind adder]

Let’s see the final WW for Superman.

[craggy pawn]

My guess is that Gunn will either direct Superman 2 next or Justice league movie later

[craggy pawn]

It doesn't get much better than this for DC movie to be honest. I've seen the movie twice and loved it more second time.

[echo kraken]

WB knows that too, they said so themselves that they are "prepared for a long haul" at a recent investors call... so yeah I think they are actually pleasantly surprised Superman is even getting the numbers it's getting.

[golden frost]

Wait you’re saying Gotg 3 has more depth?

[craggy pawn]

Zaslav ain't stupid if you ask me.. he's gonna give Gunn some time to make DC work

[echo kraken]

Don't get me wrong, I LOOOOOVE the film, but I'm looking at a pure stastical points... it has a much stronger hater voice than I would've expected... not expected, but not surprised either, honestly.

[golden frost]

brings back headline of Zaslav saying The Flash is the best superhero movie ever made

[craggy pawn]

I mean.. there are still Snyder bros around

[golden frost]

Somehow lower than Superman Returns

[golden frost]

They aren’t the only people who aren’t big on this movie, even some Snyder haters don’t like this one

[wind adder]

Hence, I theorise Supergirl would probably make more. There’s a huge appeal to Cavill’s Superman for a particular reason, and it’s not just online. I know it seems baffling because Superman is a traditionally lighthearted hero, but in the modern era, the general audience globally just doesn’t like Boy Scouts.

[echo kraken]

Zaslav IS stupid, but he had been pushed to relinquish control of the DC parts to Gunn by the investors and board, so he has to live with that.

[echo kraken]

Different era... back then people are not cynical about DC, now they are.

[golden frost]

Although Returns does have lower scores on other websites like lb and such

[craggy pawn]

What ??

[golden frost]

Metacritic

[austere stream]

I dont get how returns has a 72 on metacritic

[golden frost]

Maybe the attempt at making a love letter to Superman 1978 🤷‍♂️

[craggy pawn]

That's just one site though

[echo kraken]

No doubt, Superman has a RETURN TO FORM and REBOUND effect that is working for it. But that part doesn't affect the Snyderbros.

[echo kraken]

I like it more than MoS, but that's probably just me lol

[sharp hearth]

either that or doomsday

or spider-man

[wind adder]

Back then superhero genre was still not as popular as it is today.

[sharp hearth]

its not suffering if its peak

[wind adder]

In terms of success, the golden age of CBMs started during the 2010s.

[golden frost]

After Returns it was clear WB wanted a total hard reboot on Superman

[echo kraken]

The Odyssey will have Nolan draw for absolutely sure, but the early teaser isn't helping... anyone but the diehard are going to view it as a Oppenheimer-style slow drama. They have a year to mess with the marketing yet though, so I don't have enough info to draw on to make a conclusion or prediction.

[golden frost]

With no connection to the past era

Btw

Starting in the 21st century

Every decade has had exactly one Superman movie as of now

Maybe this might continue who knows

[wind adder]

The teaser was brilliant. I don’t know what you are on

[craggy pawn]

I will just say, never underestimate Nolan, he has a huge fan base and that's rare for a director

[sharp hearth]

[echo kraken]

As I said, that's the perception... unless the later trailer shows something exciting (and I know it will), there's not as much hype around the film AT THE MOMENT as the Nolan Diehards are predicting.

[sharp hearth]

because its a year away

[echo kraken]

I don't underestimate him, I am saying the preview teaser SUCKED....

[wind adder]

The Odyssey has more action than Oppenheimer as well. It appeals more to the general audience and you underestimate how big Nolan is overseas.

[echo kraken]

HOW?

3 dudes talking, one old man on a broken raft.

[wind adder]

It’s also one of the greatest epics of all time.

[sharp hearth]

no it didnt 😭

[golden frost]

I’m not sure that’s the case

[echo kraken]

Precisely why the teaser sucked, for people familiar with Odyssey, it's underwhelming as hell.

[wind adder]

Says who? You

People who have read the Odyssey, love it. It’s a classic

[golden frost]

I don’t think audiences dislike the Boy Scout trope

[fallen solar]

the teaser if naff though

[wind adder]

Also, it’s Nolan. Many people are hyped for the movie after seeing the teaser.

[echo kraken]

I didn't say Odyssey sucked, I said the teaser sucked because we know there are some really brilliant stuff in Odyssey... show me a glimpse of how he's going to treat THOSE.

[golden frost]

Nolan built that good faith

[fallen solar]

The Odyssey is full of gods and monsters, and the teaser is like 'look at the cast we have'

[wind adder]

In fact, you’re the only person I have seen who thinks the teaser sucked.

[echo kraken]

Even Oppenheimer they did the whole joke marketing of "Nolan is going to use a real nuclear bomb" lol

[golden frost]

Why we talking about Nolan in a Superman chat 😭

[wind adder]

A small teaser is supposed to show all the Gods and monsters

[fallen solar]

no, but it should at least hint at the mystical

[echo kraken]

Precisely... it's not a good Teaser

[echo kraken]

Because the preview is in front of the movie directly... AFTER the lights dimmed... it's related hahaha

[fallen solar]

I have a horrible feeling that all the mythology will be a hallucination after Odysseus is shipwrecked after the war and can't deal with losing all his crew.

[echo kraken]

I don't really care about Telemachus lol...

[golden frost]

Can we stop please and get back to Superman

[echo kraken]

Eren is right though, we need to stop lol

[wind adder]

Ramayan is also releasing in 2026.

[echo kraken]

Stop, back to superman and possibly DC

[wind adder]

Batman: Brave and the Bold will release sooner than you think

If it looks like Supergirl won’t do well.

[visual adder]

why a clayface movie tho

[wind adder]

Wonder Woman is also fast tracked to release

[craggy pawn]

Love all the Easter eggs in this movie.. Gun has said he will release the whole thing

[echo kraken]

Dudes just started on SCRIPT in March THIS YEAR

[echo kraken]

Because Gunn loves side characters lol

[echo kraken]

Oooh I want to see a full of the Justice Hall mural so bad

[wind adder]

They will speed it up

[craggy pawn]

And I think Clayface isn't gonna cost much and it is gonna be a body horror, so if only a few people go watch it.. it maybe profitable like what Blumhouse has done

[craggy pawn]

Same

[wind adder]

It’s clear only Batman can carry DC

DC is no Marvel.

[craggy pawn]

You forget that Aquaman made over a billion dollars before and WW made over 700 million dollars too..

Too soon to tell what's gonna happen

[wind adder]

And the second film was not successful. Aquaman 1 made a billion due to Jason Momoa.

[echo kraken]

What do you even mean? Even if the script is done TODAY, it'll take 2-3 months to greenlight, and 6-8 month of prep... earliest shoot time beginning of next year, add the normal 8-12 months post, we are looking at MINIMUM 2027.
Stop hopium.

[wind adder]

He was pretty popular back then iirc

[craggy pawn]

Only one actor being involved can't make that much money.. come on

And Mamoa is gonna play Lobo in supergirl too

[visual adder]

Gunn himself has said its not that important if Superman makes a shit ton of money

[wind adder]

I think people preferred Jason Momoa’s iteration. Aquaman prior Momoa was seen as lame fish dude.

[wind adder]

Gunn will obviously not claim the opposite. He has to say that.

[visual adder]

Aquaman has been cool in the comics for awhile, he just was mad fun of in cartoon parodies and stuff lol

[wind adder]

The general audience do not care about comics. Before Momoa’s portrayal, he was seen as lame.

[echo kraken]

Did you see that interview with Momoa and Reynold's text to Gunn on the day of the announcements that he's taken over DC? lol

Moma's text: LOBO BABY!!!!!!!!!!!!

Reynolds: Congratulations on becoming the head of DC
Gunn: Want to play Green Lantern again?
Reybolds: Fuck off.

[visual adder]

He was cool in Smallville too

[craggy pawn]

Ya.. it was fun

[golden frost]

I’m still torn on Gunn using the KC logo for a mainstream classic Superman movie

[wind adder]

I mean that’s earlier than expected lol. Supergirl is releasing next year and if that doesn’t do well, then they will definitely have to release a familiar IP.

[echo kraken]

There are so many errors in that statement I don't even....
One actor doesn't do anything, no matter who they are... a film is always a combination of factors which contributed to its success and failure.

And the second film failed because of Depp/Heard and the resulting studio worries, which caused endless re-shoots and reshuffling... in short... STUDIO meddling.

[golden frost]

How did Aquaman 1 make a billion then

[wind adder]

I didn’t say it was just one actor, but he was definitely the main reason.

Momoa was pretty popular back then

[echo kraken]

Just the S designs, and he's not using the black, and it has the classic yellow borders... but I get you

[golden frost]

Yeah just the S design, idm the yellow outline

But I’m also not digging the neck collar

[wind adder]

The second film also failed because the movie was mediocre. Aquaman 1 also had better visuals.

And it was also more goofy

[echo kraken]

I love the Alex Ross S, but yeah, since everything is so silly, why not go back to the original S for a bit more retro lol...
The collars I don't really mind, but it does hurt me for the same reasons reference to KC hurt you... "New 52" blerch

[echo kraken]

FUN, it was FUN... in a time where everything in DC was DARK

[golden frost]

So because it copied the mcu formula

[echo kraken]

I'm not arguing that it's NOT mediocre... fuck that thing looks like a Sony Television commercial... and the story is... cynical... not fun.

[wind adder]

MCU films aren’t even that goofy outside GOTG. If anything James Gunn is the reason behind the goofiness of MCU.

[golden frost]

Maybe Joss Whedon as I see him being blamed a lot

[wind adder]

Whedon’s Justice League definitely had similar humour.

[golden frost]

Which one of these emblems would a casual viewer more easily recognize as the Superman emblem

[echo kraken]

I wouldn't quite say MCU formula... since it also produced WW1984... James Wan had a major hand in making the mishmash of genres work... but NOBODY can take the kind of studio unslaught and negative press on Amber Heard... the fact he made a somewhat watchable film is... already a testament of his abilities lol

[wind adder]

Avengers and Age of Ultron had jokes, but definitely more serious than GOTG.

[golden frost]

Joss Whedon did at least know when to dial it back in Avengers 1

[echo kraken]

Both, the red and the yellow is what made it recognizible, not the full design of the S

[wind adder]

https://tenor.com/view/superman-logo-icon-space-hero-gif-5131467

https://tenor.com/view/superman-superhero-gif-12580882106840783636

This is this logo people are more familiar with

[golden frost]

Obviously

It’s literally the pure default emblem

[echo kraken]

Trust me, there were more divisive S designs lol

I think, as far as overall suit balance, and references, the team under Gunn did VERY well.

Just be glad they didn't go Superman: Year One

[craggy pawn]

https://x.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1945873456895017344?t=iF9xQ9opkDH343DkWyRbqg&s=19

DiscussingFilm (@DiscussingFilm)

James Gunn’s ‘SUPERMAN’ had the biggest Wednesday box office of 2025 domestically with $11.8M

The film also had the biggest Tuesday box office of 2025 this week.

Read our review: https://t.co/3sWy8gsNCU

X · Jul 17, 2025, 3:49 PM

Never seen box office of a movie being analysed so minutely

[echo kraken]

Every film get analyzed that granularly, even down to theaters and regions if you are involved with the film... but rarely do they do that publicly yeah

[craggy pawn]

Not like this though.. it is mostly weekly gross and stuff

[echo kraken]

The Domestic spread is way better than I expected ngl

[craggy pawn]

It's fantastic

[echo kraken]

I've seen actual financial reports on films... but as I said, very rarely are the PUBLIC interested in that

[craggy pawn]

True

[echo kraken]

I suspect that they are waiting for F4, to decide what to do on 2nd wave marketing right now

[craggy pawn]

Ya

[echo kraken]

Because they only have a little fanfare on “number one in the country”… I think they are expecting and L next weekend, then go in guns blazing and burn the marketing they DIDN’T yet spend

[craggy pawn]

Probably

[echo kraken]

I prefer Olsen hehe

[echo kraken]

Napkin math makes me feel that there are at least 20mil still in reserve on marketing

[golden frost]

Just don’t kill him off in the next movie very early

[echo kraken]

He’s Jimmy Olsen, he’s in many iterations as important as Lois Lane….

Jimmy and the Mutant Toes will make a great marketing podcast on DC lol

[wind adder]

Jimmy Olsen is getting a tv spin off

[bold basin]

Ned gotta lock in next movie because jimmy clearly winning

[echo kraken]

https://youtu.be/QUGBOX3dQWg?si=_jB4pPI-GdYYdIqe

He liked it enough to go to a 2pm with wife and 9pm by himself

[austere stream]

First one id say

[echo kraken]

I honestly don’t have a problem or preference with either, it’s the man in the suit that matters for me, not the suit

[echo kraken]

I know I’m reaching, but I just thought that Kat Dennings would work as Lucy Lane hahaha

[night hamlet]

Saw superman

I liked Superman. Left with a smile but a little dissatisfied.

While the cast is amazing, and there are some great scenes and moments…there are also a lot of puzzling choices, tone shifts and overall..the story feels very messy and unfocused for what should be a standalone outing about superman.

Im excited for more though. I give it a 3.5/5

[craggy pawn]

It was a standalone outing for Superman.. the movie was almost wholly focused on him and just like any other movies there were supporting characters..

https://variety.com/2025/film/news/superman-israel-palestine-debate-1236462737/

Of course people will interpret it their way

[tame tangle]

and try to convince others.

[craggy pawn]

Obviously

And Gunn will also absolutely say this..he doesn't want more controversy

[tame tangle]

people think violence in one situation is violence in all situations.

know what i mean, like its all the same reason?

like in another year, they'd draw paralells to george floyd or rodney king or vietnam or somesuch.

[somber bane]

He should do justice league if he was to do one of those two

[tame tangle]

everybody trying to be political for the attention.

[craggy pawn]

Sadly.. that's the time we live in

[craggy pawn]

For me it is Superman 2 and Justice league much later.. Gunn is great at ensemble cast

[tame tangle]

there was a time i'd be worried about james gunn doing Batman...but Gog3 was dark as fuck.

i wanna see it

[wind adder]

Gunn clearly can do dark stuff

He produced Brightburn

Also wrote the remake of Dawn of the Dead

[viscid parcel]

Wait thats funny that gunn fans and Snyder fans hate each other so much

They’ve literally worked together

[wind adder]

Snyder and Gunn are buddies, so yes it is ironic.

Would be funny if Snyder directs a DCU film

[golden frost]

Doubtful

WB would veto it

[wind adder]

I don’t want him to, but it would be funny.

[wind adder]

Yes, they gave this guy a lot of chances.

[golden frost]

After BvS

You’re done

[wind adder]

Pretty soon https://x.com/vhsdvdbluray4k/status/1946028695229177931?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

🖤 Physical Media Forever 🖤 (@VHSDVDBLURAY4K)

Superman Will be coming to PVOD on 8/26

X · Jul 18, 2025, 2:06 AM

[craggy pawn]

That's still more than a month from now and it would have made most of its money by then but this also shows that they aren't too bothered by the box office otherwise they would have kept this movie in theatres for months

[thick arch]

Yikes…. why would they do that

Like I’m happy sure

but might as well give it more time to make cash at box office

[austere stream]

Pandemic stuff releasing immediately at-home has poisoned releasing lol

[wind adder]

https://fxtwitter.com/everythingdcu_/status/1946105957198741706?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

Everything_DCU (@EverythingDCU_)

Matthew Orton has submitted the script for Bane & Deathstroke film to James Gunn & Peter Safran.
︀︀
︀︀(Via @elmayimbe)

**💬 19 🔁 33 ❤️ 416 👁️ 10.2K **

FxTwitter · Jul 18, 2025, 7:13 AM

[karmic holly]

https://x.com/cheesy_cryptid/status/1945864068809798017

Cheesyy🌻 COMMS CLOSED 🍉 (@cheesy_cryptid)

Look up and Roll out

#Transformers #Superman

X · Jul 17, 2025, 3:12 PM

[golden frost]

There was once a time when movies would stay in cinemas for up to half a year

[tame tangle]

dunno if netflix would carry it.

[fallen solar]

I think that's a good measure

[rustic yacht]

https://x.com/ashotmagazine/status/1946186323586359656

A Shot. (@ashotmagazine)

Susan Sarandon praises James Gunn’s ‘SUPERMAN’ on IG:

“Love this movie. Superman stops the nonspecific colonization of indigenous people by a ruthless military, so unless you identify as a colonizer, you shouldn’t be upset”.

X · Jul 18, 2025, 12:32 PM

[unreal widget]

How I wish they met.

[gritty tundra]

Wow

I wonder if this is true

[unreal widget]

I mean wouldn't be bothered cause no one takes it seriously

[digital sparrow]

yes

[rustic yacht]

No, of course it isnt

[echo kraken]

They go VOD on 30-45 for more money, and 90-180 days for streaming

[thick arch]

https://x.com/LuthorCorpNews/status/1945769063847723299

LuthorCorp (@LuthorCorpNews)

LuthorCorp sends their condolences to the friends and family of Malik Ali.

X · Jul 17, 2025, 8:54 AM

[finite oracle]

I saw it, that was Columbia’s reports on opening weekend.

[rustic yacht]

https://youtu.be/oJogzyy5d74?si=BF9pwxwkdaA_mJMV

[lilac sand]

Hi everyone, I have a question.

In Superman (2025), there's a scene where the Justice Gang (Green Lantern, Hawkgirl, and Mister Terrific) fights a massive, floating purple creature shaped like an eyeball with tendrils. Superman identifies it as a "dimensional imp" and matter-of-factly states that the Justice Gang has "got it handled." It doesn't look like Mister Mxyzptlk or Bat-Mite, and it doesn't seem to have their kind of reality-warping powers either.

Is this creature based on an existing DC Comics character or creature? If so, who or what is it?

[tame tangle]

this thing?

[daring trench]

One of these

[tame tangle]

its a starro

[safe geode]

https://tenor.com/view/pelea-dc-super-hero-girls-atacar-super-heroes-super-hero-girls-gif-20537589

honestly I would dig an all girl hero movie

[wind adder]

https://fxtwitter.com/screentime/status/1946274969358307690?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

ScreenTime (@screentime)

James Gunn again says the DCU Batman will not be Robert Pattinson
︀︀
︀︀He says 'BRAVE AND THE BOLD' and any additional DCU Batman movies will not release the same calendar year as Matt Reeves' Batman movies
︀︀
︀︀(via: @joshuahorowitz)

**💬 229 🔁 404 ❤️ 9.5K 👁️ 347.2K **

FxTwitter · Jul 18, 2025, 6:24 PM

[sharp hearth]

Brave and the Bold may be 2028

[tame tangle]

would offend people nowadays.

[safe geode]

you can just say it would offend "soft men, and weak women"

i wouldnt say people

cause im a people

but im not soft either

[unreal widget]

Oh yeah I was wondering that and left it without giving a 2nd thought

[fallen solar]

https://bsky.app/profile/jamesgunn.bsky.social/post/3luavan775c2s

James Gunn (@jamesgunn.bsky.social)

Nick and David first makeup and wardrobe test. 2.20.24 #Superman

Reposts

171

Likes

1743

Bluesky · Jul 18, 2025, 4:41 PM

You know, I think there really is something to be said for Lex to be able to look Superman in the eye, as in, they're the same height

one does not get to be more imposing than the other just by how tall they are

[craggy pawn]

I don't think it is based on any specific character.. it is just an inter dimensional imp

[craggy pawn]

No.. he's talking about in Superman.. when Lois and Clark talk and there's some creature outside

[craggy pawn]

https://youtu.be/sJU6b7fyWak?si=ePFTz_BmqkqM3zK2

This looks so good

[craggy pawn]

https://youtu.be/uZLKemL_rmY?si=1sygecxZ6YcldczW

Would love a directors commentary of the movie

[near drum]

https://youtu.be/OXytSLXvld4?si=Dk4a7-K0ehLAhRLj

great breakdown of the line

[blazing vigil]

https://fxtwitter.com/DarkOfTheMovie/status/1946292003244826983

Alex Coleman (@DarkOfTheMovie)

How I feel knowing James Gunn is lying about this DCU Batman nonsense but I can’t prove it yet

**💬 141 🔁 2.9K ❤️ 59.2K 👁️ 1.26M **

FxTwitter · Jul 18, 2025, 7:32 PM

[stone turret]

DOAKES

[blazing vigil]

Cultured ^

[stone turret]

a lot of people are going to feel very silly in a few years when brave and the bold comes out and it isnt pattinson

[craggy pawn]

James Gunn on a recent interview confirms that the Jor el and Lara message is real..

He also talks about some of the big debates he had while making the movie

Gunn also confirms that DCU Batman is gonna be different and two different Batman movies won't come out on same year

Gunn talks about Cavill and having to tell him that he is no longer Superman

Really interesting interview overall

[wind adder]

I don’t think Cavill will join DCU after what happened. The Rock being the main culprit was obvious.

He also wanted to portray Black Adam more as a hero and have him fight Superman. He even refused to appear in Shazam 2 because he didn’t want to play the villain.

[wind adder]

Cast someone who can act well. Alan Ritchson is a terrible actor and wouldn’t be a good Batman.

[torn heart]

Need more directors on Happy, Sad and Confused

[daring trench]

this man

[blazing vigil]

https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSBvgJ5dD/ awww pure joy

[rustic yacht]

https://x.com/feature_first/status/1946560270983479476

Feature First 🍿🎬 (@Feature_First)

James Gunn's 'Superman' has passed ONE MILLION watches on Letterboxd.

The film becomes the fastest to do so, breaking the record of 12 days held by 'Barbie'.

X · Jul 19, 2025, 1:18 PM

[blazing vigil]

https://vt.tiktok.com/ZSBvs8Gmp/ hehe

[craggy pawn]

I wouldn't say terrible.. He's good in Reacher TV show, I agree he won't be a good Batman in DCU

[craggy pawn]

But Gunn had nothing to do with this and if it is a good role, I think Cavill will take it. He's a actor after all.

[wind adder]

He can’t act lol

[craggy pawn]

Have you watched Reacher?

[wind adder]

I wouldn’t say he does good acting in Reacher.

[craggy pawn]

I wouldn't say he is terrible in Reacher

[wind adder]

Yes. He doesn’t act.

It’s an action heavy role

That’s it

[craggy pawn]

He does what is needed in the role alright.

[wind adder]

Batman is a character with depth. He just doesn’t have the acting ability required for the role.

[craggy pawn]

I agree that he wouldn't fit Batman in DCU and yes he has to improve quite a bit.. I wouldn't go so far as to say he's a terrible actor

[wind adder]

Doesn’t mean Cavill will join DCU. I think dude probably doesn’t want to associate himself with DC after what happened. Superman to another role would be a downgrade.

[craggy pawn]

Not right now I agree but later, who knows and a lot of actors don't think that way. It's just a role for them. Jason Mamoa didn't think Lobo would be a downgrade from Aqua man.

[bold basin]

Cavil is not really doing so well at the box office himself so i wouldn’t be surprised if he joins mcu or dcu

[wind adder]

Jason Momoa should’ve always been cast as Lobo lol

[craggy pawn]

Well the role isn't always available though.. he was a good Aqua man imo

[wind adder]

Pretty sure Gunn said he doesn’t mind having Cavill and Gadot in DCU. He’s just saying that to be diplomatic.

He wouldn’t say the opposite, would he?

[wind adder]

I can see him join MCU.

[bold basin]

Dcu he can play captain atom mcu he can play captain britain

https://tenor.com/view/captain-atom-captain-atom-dc-captain-atom-starman-starman-gif-3029381346549333101

[wind adder]

Or he can play Hyperion

[wind adder]

Yeah, he was not bad. Made the character popular amongst general audience.

[thick arch]

Ngl I don’t fw comic but absolute Batman looks super tempting, the artwork looks fucking great. Maybe Gunn will make a movie down the road based on absolute

[rugged pier]

1A

1A

1A

[rugged pier]

Do you collect?

Hot Toys is outta my scale I only collect 1:12

• it’s pretty expensive

[wind adder]

Absolute Batman is a great comic series.

I don’t know about live action adaptation, but maybe animation?

[rugged pier]

SHF has already made there product announcement too. Gimme a sec

[thick arch]

Oh yeah animation would be great to bring that to life.

[rugged pier]

Yes they did

[craggy pawn]

Oh no I don't.. too expensive for me but I like looking at them

[runic thunder]

I think this might be Gunn's first big hero franchise movie to not have a title card that appears behind the characters

[agile fern]

||https://youtube.com/shorts/X9lheibUeos?si=b68YnQppF_mo9lum||

[rustic yacht]

https://fxtwitter.com/letterboxd/status/1946611856832954549

Letterboxd (@letterboxd)

James Gunn’s #Superman has now joined the Letterboxd One Million Watched Club 🪐 @Superman
︀︀
︀︀The film is now the fastest world premiere to reach one million.

**💬 11 🔁 35 ❤️ 167 👁️ 1.8K **

▶ Play video

FxTwitter · Jul 19, 2025, 4:43 PM

[rugged pier]

Oh ok

Looks cool tho

[tame tangle]

that still only amounts to like 20 million bucks.

if movie tickets are 20 bucks and a million people have seen it

[sharp hearth]

Not everyone who sees movies uses letterboxd lmao

[thick arch]

This is a good point

[tame tangle]

so i guess they dont need to advertise, then.

[karmic holly]

https://x.com/sleepy_marigold/status/1946688709413535794?

✨🖤 marigold🖤✨ (@sleepy_marigold)

better days are ahead of us twin

X · Jul 19, 2025, 9:48 PM

[fresh moat]

@golden frost okay buddy this might be a huge plot twist from me but why this one is heavily political

[golden frost]

Because politics are a part of Superman stories

[fresh moat]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-kitty-kitten-cute-pussy-cat-gif-15745451

[golden frost]

You heard me

[fresh moat]

I’m very undecided

[golden frost]

Batman v Superman was also political

[rustic yacht]

Superman is a very political character

[fresh moat]

Man of Steel wasn’t this political

[golden frost]

Because it wasn’t supposed to be

It was a new Superman origin movie

[fresh moat]

Woow

[rustic yacht]

Well hes a very political character but not every director taps into that as much

[tame tangle]

Superman saves people from all countries. Best policy ever.

[golden frost]

Were any of the Christopher Reeve movies political

[rustic yacht]

His origin is also directly relevant to one of the biggest controversies today

He’s from another planet

[tame tangle]

4 was, to an extent

[fresh moat]

I’m seeing the reason why is not grossing money that much like JW Rebirth

[golden frost]

STOP IT DONT DO IT THE PEOPLE

[tame tangle]

he said that in superman 2 as wel.

[golden frost]

He is after all immigrant, which has ALWAYS been a main part of the character

[rustic yacht]

That’s right

Immigrant comes in and becomes a hero of the world. Of course people will have a problem with that

[golden frost]

People need to shut up about the immigrant stuff like being an immigrant is a bad thing

[fresh moat]

I think could work better

[golden frost]

Man Of Steel itself was literally a fucking immigrant story ffs

[tame tangle]

it isnt, but the prez is trying to prove otherwise.

[fresh moat]

How many post credits has guys?

[golden frost]

2

Tbh

Post credits are annoying

[fresh moat]

Got it

[fresh moat]

The thing now in these days using stuff like that on movies is now very but very complicated knowing real life situations

[rustic yacht]

That should be a good thing is brave to represent them in a big movie

[fresh moat]

I hope this doesn’t cause a controversy

Okayyy just finish

Oh my god is like between 3.5 or 4/5 I can’t decide

The thing is that I not gonna give it a heart ❤️ because…….. it has its moments but I was really expecting more you guys know what I mean

https://tenor.com/view/superman-zod-man-of-steel-versus-fight-gif-4084463

More punching and less talking

[thick arch]

Synder made man of steel hella religious

[austere stream]

What 😭

[thick arch]

There was loads of imagery in man of steel related to a monotheistic religion 🧐

[thick arch]

And also dbz

😁

[fresh moat]

Most accurate deception on the character but you know my taste Karma 😅

[fresh moat]

I really like that for sure once I watch it

[thick arch]

https://tenor.com/view/fat-buu-evil-smile-gif-17048863806021137338

[fresh moat]

If I was a filmmaker definitely I’ll use anime action style for my movies

[thick pivot]

lol i quit watching DBZ cause of this mofo

[fresh moat]

Okay is 3.5/5

[karmic holly]

Classic

[fresh moat]

I think is a draw
Superman — MoS

Both 3.5

Come on!!!! @golden frost those were post credits OH MY GOD

[fresh moat]

https://tenor.com/view/saber-lancer-fate-stay-night-duel-gif-9264405

[spiral ferry]

Did you see Isabella Merced player hawkgirl?

[fresh moat]

My Latina scream queen

https://tenor.com/view/thumbs-up-kay-alien-romulus-well-done-good-job-gif-1164816534464655707

[spiral ferry]

She was very good in Superman

She just ||drops the guy to his death 😂||

[golden frost]

https://tenor.com/view/superman-i-am-jesus-tgwtg-jesus-clark-kent-gif-15907327253826242962

[golden frost]

Just like you I give them an equal rating, mine are just higher

[golden frost]

Mate you can spoil here lol

[spiral ferry]

I keep forgetting that 😂

[opal fog]

Superman expected to cross 400m by tomorrow

https://tenor.com/view/lex-luthor-superman-nicholas-hoult-2025-superman-legacy-gif-4218264750668247503

International box office also growing

[spiral ferry]

Ooo yay

[fresh moat]

Is a hard one like really hard to choose

[golden frost]

I simply don’t choose

I choose 3 of them

1978, 2013, and 2025

Simple easy answer

[craggy pawn]

This is sweet.. Jack is the voice actor of Superman for My Adventures of superman

[golden frost]

I simply choose Not Superman Returns if that helps

[fresh moat]

Idk which one did better with entertainment values

[gritty tundra]

Praying it hits 500

But even now, it's not a flop right?

[golden frost]

It’s not a flop relax

It doesn’t need to be smash hit at the box office

It just needs to make some good profit

This new regime is not money hungry like the last one

This new regime is not greedy with competing with and catching up to Marvel

[opal fog]

It’s their own thing

DC is separating theirselves from Marvel

In the best way possible imo

It’s trying to do way more than the mcu, more genres

But I’ve always been a marvel guy so it’s hard rooting for dc

But I just hope both franchises get better and succeed over this next decade

[golden frost]

DC has a chance now cos people getting tired of Marvel slop

[opal fog]

I hope F4 is a new start for the MCU

To focus on great filmmaking than typical MCU stuff

And after the universe gets rebooted hopefully, I think they should go a more comic book accurate route

And more bright and colorful films like fantastic four first steps

[fresh moat]

You think? Because I really see why is not getting enough money

[golden frost]

Wdym

[golden frost]

Mate since 2016, we’ve been mostly long past the era of CBMs that feel nothing like CBMs

[fresh moat]

I’m guessing people were expecting more action and intensity because on my screening a lot of people weren’t that happy

[golden frost]

Wow, really? Did you talk to any of them

[fresh moat]

Even the post credits scenes were disappointed

[golden frost]

What did they say

[fresh moat]

What you want me to said

[fresh moat]

“Man this is what we wait for? Come on Warner Bros gives us more!!!”

[keen mural]

Ngl I was expecting superman to fly around the earth so fast that he goes back in time to 1066

[fresh moat]

Good thing I not a comic book nerd because I would be very disappointed

[golden frost]

I was expecting Superman to snap a neck

[fresh moat]

A bit of more style over substance won’t hurt

[golden frost]

https://tenor.com/view/sky-cloud-hero-batman-vs-superman-gif-15518804

So much style

[austere stream]

Post credits dont necessarily need to be setup tho

[golden frost]

“Save us Superman”
“I will, just hold on, I need a good shot for the wallpaper”

[fresh moat]

I agree but come on did I really need to wait for that

[austere stream]

So they just wanted 2 hours of punching with no story 😭
General audience is cooked

[keen mural]

None of the post credits are gonna be setups for Gunn someone said

I am general audience

[golden frost]

Maybe Chrome had a point earlier today

[fresh moat]

So you think I have a horrible taste

https://tenor.com/view/superman-zod-man-of-steel-versus-fight-gif-4084463

[golden frost]

It wouldn’t be just you according to him

Every non movie critic is stupid apparently

[fresh moat]

Is what Superhero action are right?

[austere stream]

Story and character dev is needed!
Wouldn't you be bored by 2 hours of action with no story?

I am phrasing that genuinely, curious

[opal fog]

Treating him like Jesus the biggest mistake

From Snyder

Like he made his whole character just a comparison to Jesus

[golden frost]

I mean

Superman being linked to Jesus is a part of the character

It’s just that Snyder was not subtle at all about it

[daring trench]

i always thought that DC characters were close to gods compared to Marvel characters

[golden frost]

@daring trench I got a request

[daring trench]

about?

[golden frost]

Rewatch the Snyder trilogy

But

Keep a count on Superman T posing

I’m sure the count is big

[fresh moat]

Is he the one?

[wind adder]

That’s not specific to Snyder

Superman was always a stand in to a Godlike being in DC comics.

In this case it’s Jesus, which is what Joe Shuster and Jerry Siegel intended. He’s supposed to be an otherworldly being who protects humanity, which is similar to Lord Ram from Hinduism, Jesus Christ from Christianity etc.

[wind adder]

Gunn completely dismissed Superman’s Kryptonian heritage and made it seem like migrating to the U.S. is the best thing imaginable. Superman shouldn’t be ashamed of his native culture.

Portraying Jor-El and Lara Lor-Van as evil conquerors was a poor choice. Jor-El was just as pivotal as Clark’s human parents in instilling good morals in him. There’s a reason Clark often turned to his holographic father for guidance in the comics, and in earlier adaptations as well.

[golden frost]

Once again, it’s just Snyder is not subtle about it all it’s kinda funny in a way

[wind adder]

Snyder isn’t subtle about anything. Even his best work, Watchmen, couldn’t capture the complexity of the comic book.

[golden frost]

He takes pride in his lack of subtlety I think

[sharp hearth]

(This isn't the comics)

[thick arch]

🤞🏾🤞🏾 Alan is look maxed we need him.

[thick arch]

https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZP8hWpykc/

Ts woulda been so tough

[fallen solar]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CR09VEq0VOI

just a bit of silliness

[fallen solar]

https://bsky.app/profile/jamesgunn.bsky.social/post/3lufprmf6us2d

James Gunn (@jamesgunn.bsky.social)

On the stage at Trilith shooting the barrel roll through the mountains. All the plates were shot previously in Svalbard. 7.26.24

▶ Play video

Bluesky · Jul 20, 2025, 2:47 PM

[golden frost]

Oh so now being not accurate to comics is excusable

[fresh moat]

@echo kraken is solid but…… just heavy political

https://boxd.it/aoW1eb

[thick arch]

https://youtu.be/CzvtgDBjQ2I?si=92YrYZ6szRZ_fJ1o

[craggy pawn]

https://youtu.be/QM1Af17hJis?si=Tu1EgdLw5z-R_ecK

I watched the whole thing, interesting stuff

[short fulcrum]

Has anyone actually read all star Superman. I did, wanted to try and understand what was the way they try to portray this Superman.

[sharp hearth]

Always was

[golden frost]

Except when Zack Snyder is in charge 😁

[sharp hearth]

nah

nobody gets special treatment

[golden frost]

Todd Phillips did

James Gunn did

Tim Burton

Even Nolan

[austere stream]

Who ever cared about that

I just watch the films

I dont read comics
So
Who cares

[golden frost]

EVERY SINGLE COMIC NERD ON THIS PLANET 😭

[austere stream]

Kinda silly

Are filmmakers not allowed to have creative input then?
Thats lame

[sharp hearth]

not from me

[sharp hearth]

EXACTLY

[sharp hearth]

theyre wrong and dumb

[thick arch]

But… remember how civil war, and infinity war was 1-1… marvel has always done amazing job doing 1-1 adaptions. They never deviate from the comics one bit. 🧐

[wind adder]

Pretty sure Gunn was bragging about comic accuracy

[civic marten]

It’s so lame

I’ll never understand the obsession with having one version of everything forever

Why shouldn’t these symbolic characters be interpreted by different artists in different ways

[wind adder]

This clown https://fxtwitter.com/everythingdcu_/status/1946999910114709641?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

Everything_DCU (@EverythingDCU_)

James Gunn on Jor El and Lara
︀︀
︀︀“I don’t really even think of Jor-El and Lara as being totally evil. They just have this mindset that humans are less than what they are. We’re sea turtles to them. They’re just trying to keep the Kryptonian genes alive.”
︀︀
︀︀(Via @RollingStone )

**💬 38 🔁 21 ❤️ 358 👁️ 17.2K **

FxTwitter · Jul 20, 2025, 6:25 PM

[civic marten]

God forbid someone have an idea that contradicts Issue #493 of The Sensational Superman as written by some guy

[rugged pier]

Wrong.

You’re just wrong dude lmfao

If you think thag Superman is a dumb punchy character, you have a limited understanding as to who this character is.

While I understand Superman fights he also does this

https://townsquare.media/site/622/files/2011/07/supercat.jpg

[fresh moat]

Dude I not a comic book nerd

[rugged pier]

And this

[fresh moat]

Just a passionate action and horror fan

[rugged pier]

Then don’t make statements like “it’s more accurate to the character”

When you don’t know what you’re talking about

Go watch death battle then .

[short fulcrum]

I feel like it needed more of that personal perspective of saving than just “saving the world”

[sharp hearth]

Corenswet's Superman personally saved multiple people lol

[short fulcrum]

Not like save from danger. More like save from themselves.

[sharp hearth]

ah

[short fulcrum]

That shows the human aspect

He understands them

[sharp hearth]

maybe we'll get that later on

his last scene with Lex was kinda like that though

it didnt work because Lex is a petty asshole but he at least tried to save him

[short fulcrum]

He was. There was a conversation about it. But then kyrpto…

That’s why that ending speech didn’t click with me. Cause yeah, human and I save. But gardner does the same thing but for glory and admiration. Does that make him human or just showing off.

Terrific does the same thing but it’s behind the scenes cause he’s a tech hero. Does that mean he just doesn’t want to be glorified as a hero because he already knows how to save.

He lived among the people for what 3 years but didn’t show how he relates to them. Feeling isn’t relatability, it’s understanding.

[wind adder]

The Justice Gang wasn’t needed. Superman could’ve easily done the job solo

[short fulcrum]

The only moment I saw that he really cared about the people was in the interview with Lois

[short fulcrum]

That’s what I’m saying.

[wind adder]

Mr Terrific was a cool character, but this is a Superman movie.

The inclusion of JSA or Justice Gang makes Clark look like a chump.

[short fulcrum]

I wanted to see Superman do Superman things as a hero. Not only by the form of powers and fighting, also as a person who cares about the small things

[wind adder]

I couldn’t stand Guy Gardner tbh. Never liked the character in the comics and he’s more annoying in the film.

Superman lowkey should have heat visioned Gardner.

[short fulcrum]

He save a squirrel, cool. But it was a wild squirrel. It’s like those videos when people save a stray cat from a high place, you save it and runs away.

Big woop

Everyone leaves

[wind adder]

I think a solo battle between Superman vs Kaiju would’ve been more interesting.

[short fulcrum]

For sure. I really didn’t like that he didn’t fight that one monster because the gang got it.

Like wtf. You’re afraid of public criticism so you don’t fight even the easiest monsters

[sharp hearth]

they were good characters in the movie so its good

[agile fern]

||https://youtube.com/shorts/8XjeWqx7X7o?si=51kKKtb2ZQXROLKn ||

[wind adder]

https://tenor.com/view/superman-superman-laser-eyes-superman-heat-vision-gif-16702537591180467252

[short fulcrum]

See this was fine. But like you cause destruction here but not while fighting the gaint lizard.

[wind adder]

If I was Superman, I would’ve been pissed lol. People beneath me trying to take credit

[agile fern]

i wonder if we'll see krypto again in supergirl after this unless the movie is set before or something😭

[sharp hearth]

he doesnt see other people as "beneath him"

thats not how superman is 😂

[short fulcrum]

They have too. For the merch

[wind adder]

Krypto will be in it for sure

https://x.com/axeltalksfilm/status/1947012396314505273?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

Axel 🦇 (punkrocker era) (@AxelTalksFilm)

so when Flag said there wasn't any kryptonite left on the planet, what we thinking?

Clark himself get rid of it?

X · Jul 20, 2025, 7:15 PM

[timber obsidian]

Probably a top 5 frame in the film for me

This is how you know the people in charge actually give a shit about Superman and the themes that are paramount to his character.

[golden frost]

I am so excited for the memes that will result from the Lex 1A moment

[tame tangle]

Batman does this stuff too. He isnt just a mere ass kicker.

at least Conroy batman did

[craggy pawn]

Movie is a different medium than comics and it is an adaptation.. You don't need to do 100% of what was in comics .. Marvel never did that too

[craggy pawn]

No but I have watched the animated movie based on the comics and it was really good

[unreal widget]

DC animation roster is strong, and a great reference for live action adaptations.

[echo kraken]

It doesn’t have to be

[unreal widget]

Kinda shocked this scene didn't trigger the Indians

[sharp hearth]

?

[rugged pier]

I agree with this take to be honest.

[wind adder]

That person wasn’t an Indian lol. Why do you think he was?

[craggy pawn]

What are you even saying?? Guy Gardner is a human with a Lantern ring.. Superman is a alien from another planet and he's saying I am like everyone else as well.. totally different thing

Guy doesn't have to prove to anyone he's a human.. Superman does

It was also to counter Luthor because he hated Superman due to his alien heritage

[wind adder]

Luthor hated Superman because he was better than him in every way and he was jealous, not just because of his alien heritage.

He stole his thunder and his ego couldn’t handle that.

[unreal widget]

I liked it cause of what Lex did with him. It was a full circle moment.

It made sense. Luthor giving his profound speech, and krypto jumping in as a victim of his hypocrisy.

[craggy pawn]

How was Superman better than Luthor?? It was because of Superman being kryptonian and the most powerful metahuman. If Superman was just Clark Kent with no powers.. Luthor wouldn't care about him.

[wind adder]

Take away Luthor’s intelligence, and he would be irrelevant. Your logic is pretty silly.

[craggy pawn]

I don't even get what you are saying. Luthor literally says Superman is a It because of his alien heritage alright..

[wind adder]

Luthor doesn’t specifically hate Superman because he’s an alien. It has more to do with the fact Superman stole his thunder. His xenophobia is a secondary aspect.

[craggy pawn]

Luthor has said he hates all metahumans.. that's in the movie btw and for Luthor, Superman is better than him and beloved by many because he's a alien who has fantastical powers.

[wind adder]

Luthor just hates everybody who he sees as a threat.

You don’t get the character

[craggy pawn]

Luthor is already a multi billionaire in the movie, he already thinks he's the greatest human on Earth.. Superman threatens his ego.

[wind adder]

The alien thing is his excuse. Do you actually think Lex cares about humanity?

[craggy pawn]

Ya but he isn't going after Justice gang.. is he ?

[wind adder]

Because he can beat the Justice Gang lol. Superman is vastly superior to them and also Lex.

[craggy pawn]

That's his main thing.. Luthor hates Superman even more than other metahumans because he's alien.

Don't know how many times you have watched the movie.. I've watched it 2 times and that's my takeaway.. you disagree, that's fine.

[wind adder]

If you think Lex Luthor is the equivalent of a Nazi or KKK, then you don’t get the character. He mainly hates Superman because he’s better loved and also the more powerful man. The alien thing is more of an excuse.

He portrays himself as a saviour of humanity, which is all an act.

Watch the movie again. If Lex hated Kryptonians so much, then he wouldn’t create a clone of Superman.

[craggy pawn]

Agree to disagree then, imo.. Luthor hates Superman even more and one big reason for that is because he's an alien.

[wind adder]

No that’s not really the main reason. It has more to do with the fact he’s jealous of Superman’s abilities and the admiration he got.

[craggy pawn]

What ?? Lex created that clone to defeat and kill Superman..

[craggy pawn]

Justice gang have also gotten admiration quite a bit.. Lex isn't focused on them.

I'm sure there are other metahumans as well in DCU but Lex is laser focused on Superman.. when Flag says to Lex, so you want to imprison all metahumans.. Lex says no, Superman is different

[craggy pawn]

Where did Superman's abilities come from??

[wind adder]

Precisely. If Lex actually hated aliens, he wouldn’t dare do something like that. Again let me reiterate, Lex hates Superman because he’s jealous. It’s not specifically that he hates his race, which is more of an excuse to portray himself as a saviour of humanity and he wanted to convince the public that Superman should not be trusted because he’s from another world.

That was all an act

[craggy pawn]

That clone isn't alien.. it was created by Lex in a lab.. same with Kaiju and Mr. Handsome

[wind adder]

That clone was created by taking Superman’s DNA

[craggy pawn]

So?? It is just a mindless clone, one of his experiments and he hates Superman so much he created that clone.. not because he has no problems with aliens

[wind adder]

If he hated Kryptonians so much, Lex wouldn’t do that. In fact, Lex himself in the comics have gained Kryptonian abilities.

You don’t get the character. You’re just spewing nonsense without realising why he hates

[craggy pawn]

Lex hates Superman alright, and one main reason is because Superman is alien and because of that he has gained abilities that are superior to that of Lex

[craggy pawn]

Even you said, Lex hates Superman abilities.. well, tell where did those abilities come from?

[wind adder]

Lex just hate people who pose as a threat to him. He barely gives a shit about humanity or even aliens.

The entire “I’m a saviour of humanity and aliens pose as a threat” stuff is an act

[craggy pawn]

Well, agree to disagree then

[wind adder]

He doesn’t mainly hate Superman due to his Kryptonian heritage. He’s just mad that Superman is naturally more powerful than him and Lex had to work hard to become successful. It doesn’t have to do with Superman coming from Krypton, which was more of an act by Lex to convince the public he’s a threat who is up to no good.

[craggy pawn]

So, Lex doesn't resent the fact that Superman got his powers and abilities because he was born in Krypton?? Like that doesn't concern him at all?

[short fulcrum]

Yeah… Lex hates anyone that’s an obstacle to him. Even other evil people. And funny enough he likes Clark Kent more.

[wind adder]

Maybe try reading some comics to better understand the character. I used to think the same way, until I actually read the books.

[craggy pawn]

Movies and comics are different mediums alright.. I don't need to read comics to form my own interpretation of the character and btw Gunn has already deviated hugely from comics regarding Jor el

[wind adder]

I used to think Lex hated Superman due to his alien heritage, but if you actually read the comics, then you’ll realise that’s just an act. Lex has gained powers from aliens before and it didn’t bother him at all.

[short fulcrum]

He literally falsified a war just to have the opportunity to justify of killing Superman.

[wind adder]

Even in the movie, Lex doesn’t exactly specifically hate Superman due to his alien heritage. You’re just being ignorant IMO.

[craggy pawn]

Of course but he's hyper focused on Superman though.. and not other meta humans.

[craggy pawn]

He shows his disdain for Superman by calling him It in the movie.. now what does that tell you??

[short fulcrum]

Well yeah that’s what I’m saying. Even having the parents message just guarantees city hatred to Superman

[craggy pawn]

No no.. why is Lex hyper focused on Superman, so much so that he falsified a war, he spent 3 years making a clone, learning 2500 fight moves?? There are other meta humans too.

[wind adder]

Calling him “It” just to belittle him doesn’t mean Lex is obsessed with Superman’s alien race. This is the same guy who used Superman’s kryptonian DNA to create a clone. He wouldn’t do that if he hated aliens that much. Like I said, he just hates everybody who is a threat to him.

[short fulcrum]

He literally says he made a war just to have the opportunity to kill Superman

[craggy pawn]

Yes but why focus on just Superman ?? He's just one hero out of many.. there's Justice gang and probably others

[wind adder]

Because Superman specifically stole his thunder and is the saviour of Metropolis and the world in general. Other metahumans aren’t stopping Lex.

[short fulcrum]

Cause at least for the justice gang they play by the rules but Superman doesn’t because all he sees is about saving people

[wind adder]

Other metahumans also do not pose a threat to Lex like Superman does.

[craggy pawn]

How did Superman stole Lex's thunder?? By saving people ?? Justice gang are saving people too.

[wind adder]

It’s literally in the movie. Superman is described as the most powerful metahuman, and it’s not surprising Lex hates somebody who is more powerful than him. That’s his characteristic.

[craggy pawn]

What did Superman do to steal Lex's thunder?? Like, we are never told Superman did this or that to stop Lex before.

[wind adder]

Justice gang isn’t more powerful than Lex. This guy created people like Engineer and also a Superman clone.

[short fulcrum]

Superman gets power from the sun and a super being. Lantern gets power from the ring. Hawk girl just flies and Mr terrific is just good with tech. Within the movies eyes and even our irl eyes, Superman is godlike. Of course he is the main threat

[craggy pawn]

So, Lex believes Superman is more powerful than him and that is stealing Lex's thunder ?

[wind adder]

Superman is the guy who he’s truly afraid of. Lex knows that he’s more powerful than him and whatever he can do.

[short fulcrum]

Yes. Superman stopped a war that Lex was profiting off of because he created the war to win half of the land so he can rule

[craggy pawn]

OK but then Lex should also know why is Superman so powerful than him while he can take of other metahumans right?

[wind adder]

Because Superman is more powerful than other metahumans lol and Lex couldn’t stop him. Whereas, clearly Lex can stop the others.

[craggy pawn]

No .. that war was engineered by Lex to bait Superman into acting so that he can say to US govt.. Superman is a threat and needs to be taken care of.

[craggy pawn]

Yes.. Superman is more powerful than others because he's from Krypton. Lex knows that.

[short fulcrum]

He literally said he was guaranteed half of the land for Lex to rule

[wind adder]

Lex created Ultraman and Engineer to take care of Superman, and even that didn’t work out. It just shows that Superman is the guy he can’t beat. Why is this so difficult for you to understand?

[craggy pawn]

That was all a ruse and Lex says it later..

[short fulcrum]

It was all a profit gain because he sold weapons to them during the war

[craggy pawn]

I agree that Lex believes Superman is more powerful than him and hence he's a threat.. but I also believe that Lex knows Superman is that way because he's an alien and that's another main factor behind his hatred towards Superman imo.

[short fulcrum]

I swear we watched a different movie and you just focused on the woosh woosh

[wind adder]

Again, it has barely to do with his race and has much more to do with jealousy . Lex just doesn’t like that Superman is better than him. If Justice Gang had members that could pose a threat, then Lex would’ve treated them similarly.

[craggy pawn]

You need to watch the movie again.. Lex later clarifies that the war was started so that Superman will take the bait and help these people creating a international crisis.. and sure if at the end, he also gets half of Jahranpur that's fine but that's not the main reason.

[wind adder]

Lex is way too smart to actually be like Hitler. He’s the smartest man in the world. Do you actually think he’s obsessed with race?

You have fundamentally misunderstood the character

[craggy pawn]

Let's disagree then. Lex knows Superman is powerful than him because of the fact that he is alien and that is one source of hatred towards Superman.

[wind adder]

This has more to do with jealousy than some race obsession.

He’s literally a genius level scientist.

[craggy pawn]

I never said that Lex is obsessed with Kryptonians .. I am only saying part of the reason why Lex hates Superman and him being more powerful is because Superman is an alien.. that's all.

[short fulcrum]

Would you think if Superman wasn’t an alien but was still powerful, would he still hate him?

[craggy pawn]

Yes but the hatred wouldn't be as huge as in this movie where Lex says Superman is a It..

[wind adder]

You literally said he only hates Superman because he’s an alien. You’re implying that he’s some hardcore racist like Hitler who’s fanatically obsessed with the concept of race. I told you he hates Superman because he’s a jealous prick.

[craggy pawn]

I said a big reason that Lex hates Superman is because he's an alien and due to that Superman gained huge powers and he's jealous of that.

[short fulcrum]

You know Lex literally gives Superman cancer in all star Superman because he knew he would save people from danger in a sun mission

[craggy pawn]

Jealousy and envy is absolutely a huge motivation for Lex and he says in the movie himself.

[wind adder]

If Lex actually hated Superman for being an alien, then he wouldn’t even create a clone taking the Kryptonian DNA from Superman. He clearly doesn’t give a shit about race. It’s all about power and money for the dude. Then someone like Superman popped up in Metropolis saving people and Lex couldn’t stand the fact he was more admired than himself.

I bet if Guy Gardner was a powerful threat like Superman, Lex would’ve made sure that dude is dead.

[craggy pawn]

Again, part of the reason I said.. and it's a clone of Superman that Lex created to defeat Superman. I doubt Lex even considers that clone a alien.

[short fulcrum]

He created that other chick too that’ have more alien like powers but considers her as a tool

[craggy pawn]

Yes, to defeat Superman because he hates Superman that much

[wind adder]

Dude took alien DNA to create a clone. Why would some who hates aliens do that? Lex is way too smart to be obsessed with something like race. He’s a genius level scientist.

[craggy pawn]

Lex hates Superman who's also a alien and considers him threat to the humanity itself..

[short fulcrum]

The only reason “alien” has been thrown around is probably cause current political views are thinking that.

[wind adder]

Lex doesn’t give two shit about humanity. This is the same guy who casually killed an innocent man for nothing.

[short fulcrum]

So alien means stranger from the world in our eyes

[tame tangle]

send a kryptonian to kill a kryptonian.

[wind adder]

Lex only used that as a propaganda. That Superman is an alien conqueror who’s a threat to humanity, even though that’s not true.

[craggy pawn]

Well that message is true though.. Gunn confirmed it

[wind adder]

If anything there is more evidence that Lex is a threat to humanity and he doesn’t give two shit about other people.

[tame tangle]

Lex do be egotistical

[wind adder]

The message is true, but clearly Superman isn’t a conqueror, is he? He cares more about humanity than Lex. In fact, he’s more human than Lex.

[craggy pawn]

I agree with that

[tame tangle]

Does Jor-El know that Krypton gonna blow up?

in this continuity

[short fulcrum]

Dude grew up in a family farm.

That’s more human than anything

The unfortunate part is that due to the message, mass opinion goes against Superman, so now super has to show the people he’s not his parents or his tradition

[craggy pawn]

Yes he does.. that's why he sends Kal el to Earth

And also says to Superman to basically expand genetic pool of Kryptonians

[tame tangle]

so in all fairness, why wouldnt he encourage his son to repopulate?

he the last one

[wind adder]

Jor-El in DCU is like Zod.

[short fulcrum]

This is true but to rule and be a literal god over the humans. It’s very different from its long lasting origins of Superman

[wind adder]

Yeah, it’s such a dumb decision.

[craggy pawn]

I mean, fair question I will say. Of course in comics that's not the case and Gunn has said that not every Kryptonian shares the world view of Jor el too.

[wind adder]

Such an unoriginal change.

[craggy pawn]

I think it works well for this movie

[short fulcrum]

It’s a manipulation change if anything

To set the tone of the movie

[tame tangle]

Jor-el was kind of a douche in smallville too.

[wind adder]

It fits the “aliens are conqueror” sci fi cliche. This change is one of the main reason, it isn’t a good movie IMO.

[craggy pawn]

I think it absolutely makes sense for a advanced alien civilization to try to conquer smaller civilisations like Earth..

[wind adder]

That was AI Jor-El. Not the real one

[short fulcrum]

Yall should read absolute Superman. That shit is amazing and Superman is still considered young

[craggy pawn]

I think this change with Jor el was absolutely the right decision for this movie and I will be interested in what happens next like did Supergirl parents have the same opinion as well??

[tame tangle]

better believe that's what the US would do if they found a planet of inferior civilization level.

[wind adder]

Yes, but Kryptonians aren’t exactly conquerors or violent bunch of people aside like Zod and his cronies. The change is silly and very cliche.

[short fulcrum]

Of course because that’s how use real people think of what real aliens might do if they have try to do the same to us

That’s our definition of alien

[craggy pawn]

It has happened throughout human history..

[wind adder]

Gunn lied that he read comics and then end up doing shit like this. Probably skimmed some pages.

[craggy pawn]

Well, maybe the Kryptonians are different in DCU

[tame tangle]

Yup...

[short fulcrum]

Dude that’s what I thought about after I read all star Superman. I’m like where the hell is this Superman in the movie lol.

[wind adder]

He’s no different from Zack Snyder tbh. Both don’t give a crap about source material.

[short fulcrum]

If anything he’s trying to build another universe than making an awesome singular hero film

[tame tangle]

Just because you dont like something doesent mean everyone shouldnt. Thats the point of an opinion.

[craggy pawn]

I like this change by Gunn, it fits the story and also it makes sure that Superman is good despite his Kryptonian heritage and at the end he kinda renounces his biological parents in favor of human parents

[wind adder]

And I’m giving an opinion. I don’t think Gunn read any comics and he has stated previously they’re garbage.

[craggy pawn]

We will know more about Kryptonians in general in supergirl

[short fulcrum]

That’s unfortunately true but with years of source material, making a tweak in storylines especially in film is a tough act to start on.

[tame tangle]

well, the guys who wanted to do the Kevin smith superman movie read even less.

[craggy pawn]

Gunn has read more comics than you alright.. and apart from that one change, the rest of the movie is very comic book accurate

[wind adder]

I really don’t care about that. The point is Gunn portrayed himself as some comic book guru, and then made this change, which is baffling.

[tame tangle]

covers alot of ground too.

[craggy pawn]

I don't know why people don't get that movies and comics are totally different mediums and sometimes for a good story, you need to change stuff from the comics.

[short fulcrum]

He just setup characters, didn’t setup the world

[wind adder]

Yeah, sure lol. I’m not arguing who read more comics.

[craggy pawn]

I'm absolutely fine with that.. vast majority of people who watch superhero movies never read the comics anyway

[short fulcrum]

Batman and robin will probably be a more setup to the world than this film

[tame tangle]

Jor-el is like a minor character that you can mold however you want. Its superman that needs to be the good guy, not Jor el

[wind adder]

If he actually cared about the source material, which he pretend to do so publicly, then yeah maybe people can criticise about comic book accuracy. His fanboys defend him for the change.

[craggy pawn]

What are you talking about?? There was a lot of worldbuilding in this movie.. from metahumans appearing 300 years ago, to Justice society mural.. among others

[craggy pawn]

Absolutely.. Jor el is just not a huge character

[wind adder]

Jor-El isn’t a minor character. In fact, his hologram provides guidance to Superman whenever things get difficult.

[tame tangle]

and he did. just not the guidance you want him to have

[wind adder]

Superman’s Kryptonian heritage is equally as important to his humanity. You clearly know nothing about the character because you just watched one movie.

[craggy pawn]

Not in DCU

[tame tangle]

besides, clark looks to his earth dad just as much.

[wind adder]

Which is why I said read the comics or even watch the previous movies. In both Donner’s Superman and Snyder’s MOS, Jor-El provided guidance to Clark and what’s his purpose.

[tame tangle]

Pretty sure jor el didnt say a damn thing in Red Son

[wind adder]

https://youtu.be/tZZGq8-SZAY?si=IWacLa5VjOVfkRlB

[wind adder]

Superman isn’t even an alien in Red Son and that’s more of an Elseworld story.

[tame tangle]

yes he is, he landed in soviet russia

[craggy pawn]

This is a different take on Superman, which focuses more on his humanity than his alien heritage and I'm okay with that.

[wind adder]

James Gunn said Superman(1978) was his main inspiration, yet the change he made was the complete opposite of what was stated in the film. He’s a liar.

[craggy pawn]

What ?? Superman didn't land in Soviet Russia from krypton in Red son??

[tame tangle]

you can be inspired by something and make a different take of it.

[craggy pawn]

Absolutely

[tame tangle]

yes he did.

[craggy pawn]

Inspiration isn't the same as copying everything

[craggy pawn]

So what is Don saying about Superman not being an alien in Red son?

[wind adder]

You clearly didn’t read Red Son or watched the movie. Superman is an evolved human from future civilisation who was sent back in time.

He’s not a Kryptonian

[tame tangle]

i think he confusing with something else.

[wind adder]

He’s an evolved human

[somber bane]

Yeah like wtf why didn’t Pa Kent die in this film if 1978 Superman was his main inspiration

[wind adder]

That’s literally the twist in Red Son. Superman was an evolved human from a far future civilisation on a doomed Earth, who was sent back in time.

[tame tangle]

See? Russia

[craggy pawn]

I've watched the Red son animated movie alright..

The premise literally is what if Superman ship crash lands in communist Russia instead of Kansas..

[craggy pawn]

You are confusing with something else

[tame tangle]

yup

you even have a russian version of batman and wonder woman present

[craggy pawn]

Yes

[somber bane]

Yoooooooo that’s cool

I keep procrastinating the film version

[craggy pawn]

Watch Red son animated movie.. it is good

[somber bane]

I shall try

[tame tangle]

better believe its real too.

[wind adder]

Read the freakin book lol. Superman is an evolved human from a future civilisation on a doomed Earth. Dude was sent back in time. Earth is just ancient Krypton in the Red Son universe. Superman’s parents in Red Son are Lex’s descendants.

I’m not confusing with anything. You clearly didn’t read or even watch the animated movie.

[craggy pawn]

No you are wrong and confusing it with some other comic and I've watched the animated movie as well.

Nothing like that happens .

[tame tangle]

https://villains.fandom.com/wiki/Superman_(Red_Son)

then what the heck am i looking at?

[craggy pawn]

Read the premise

[wind adder]

Read the freakin book lol. I believe the animated movie changed that aspect.

Ok, wait I’ll post the panel.

[tame tangle]

wow, dude really holding on to this

[wind adder]

Ask anybody who read the comic, they’ll you the same thing. It was a twist

[tame tangle]

pretty sure if i ask about red son they go "oh, russian superman"

[craggy pawn]

I have only watched the animated movie and that wasn't in that..

[wind adder]

Ask anybody who read the comic and they’ll tell you he was an evolved human sent back in time by Jor-L. The last issue shows that it creates a paradox, where it makes Superman a descendant of Luthor and Lois.

[tame tangle]

What you're describing is from this.

[wind adder]

Basically, billions of years in the future in Red Son universe, Earth is doomed due to the sun becoming a red giant. Jor-L sends Kal-L back in time, which creates a predestination paradox.

[craggy pawn]

Maybe thats in the comics and I haven't read it, I can only say that it wasn't in the animated movie.

[wind adder]

I’ll post the panel. Wait

[tame tangle]

and i'll research that panel.

[wind adder]

This is the twist. Red Son Superman basically came from the future. Dude comes from future Earth, which is doomed.

I need to rewatch the movie. I guess they didn’t include this twist.

[short fulcrum]

I gotta read red son

Cool concept

Sometimes animated changes the visuals from comic

[tame tangle]

it shows the pod landing in ukraine in 1938

[wind adder]

Holy shit, you clearly can’t read.

[tame tangle]

same page as you

[wind adder]

No you clearly can’t read.

[tame tangle]

https://imgur.com/gallery/superman-red-son-epilogue-y137PWt

[wind adder]

Red Son Superman comes from future Earth and he’s sent back in time. Like, read.

“I gave them firm substantiated evidence that the Earth is on the brink of collapsing into our own sun”

[craggy pawn]

No they didn't.. that's why I was confused

[tame tangle]

Ok, i was wrong

earth becomes like krypton some eons later

luthor lineage

[craggy pawn]

I only watched the Red son animated movie and that scene wasn't in the movie.. didn't know comics had a different ending later

[tame tangle]

they do send an infant back in time, it at least its implied

[wind adder]

It’s not implied. That’s directly stated in the panel.

[craggy pawn]

That ending is a bit confusing though.. Good thing they didn't have it in the movie

[wind adder]

“Do we have to send him really so far back”

[tame tangle]

So what came first, skynet or John connor, type of deal

[craggy pawn]

It's basically a paradox.. Don is right here, this is in the comics

[tame tangle]

Agreed.

Sorry.

[craggy pawn]

Sure, just shows many of us don't read comics.. I had watched the animated movie and it wasn't there

[tame tangle]

avoid animated killing joke. it is the cringe.

[craggy pawn]

I've watched it too and it wasn't good I agree

[tame tangle]

i mean the killing joke half was fine, but...

just...not the beginning

[craggy pawn]

Ya

[tame tangle]

hate the beginning

since when do these two get together.

[craggy pawn]

I have forgotten about the movie tbh

[tame tangle]

anywho, back to the Gunn

[craggy pawn]

Agree with this..

This is a good start for Superman and DCU.. mainly due to audience and critics reception

[tame tangle]

i just hope they stick with this for awhile rather than reboot in 5 years.

[craggy pawn]

I think they will.. 2 more years is guaranteed like Supergirl next year and the Clayface in 2027 maybe.. you would need a string of flops to change direction

[tame tangle]

i also wanna see some proper Reign of the supermen stuff.

live action

[craggy pawn]

That's long way off I think

[tame tangle]

pff they killed cavil on his second movie.

[craggy pawn]

I don't think they will even think about killing and then reviving Superman for a very long time

We need to get a Justice league movie before that

[tame tangle]

I hope the next batman is good.

and isnt pattinson.

[craggy pawn]

Same.. DCU Batman is gonna be interesting and how it contrasts with Reeves Batman as well

[tame tangle]

i hope we get dafoe joker.

i would kill for it

[craggy pawn]

A little late for that due to age

I also don't think we will get DCU Joker for some time..

[tame tangle]

how old was he when he redid goblin?

[craggy pawn]

He was around 66.. he's 69 now

[tame tangle]

how old was nicholson?

51

joker doesent have to be young

[craggy pawn]

But he can't be early 70s

[tame tangle]

right, i suppose.

who would you want as joker if you could chose?

Bill Skarsgard maybe. He played a killer clown before.

or maybe the terrifier dude

[short fulcrum]

https://tenor.com/view/smiling-smile-2-grinning-creepy-smile-world-smile-day-gif-16896567371234583638

[somber bane]

Clayface rn is slated for late 2026

[gritty tundra]

Something about secret invasion

[unreal widget]

https://tenor.com/view/hang-first-time-smiles-gif-14991372

[glass meteor]

What's with the Snyder hate?

[civic marten]

So that was 9 days ago

[golden frost]

https://tenor.com/view/hang-first-time-smiles-gif-14991372

[craggy pawn]

Honestly I don't have anyone in mind at the moment.. we have had so many jokers, 3 at least including Heath Ledger Joker. And DCU Batman has to be very distinctive as well.

[echo kraken]

Quitely’s art is so distinctive

[wind adder]

I think people are tired of the Joker. Besides, we might get a solo Joker TV show set in Reevesverse.

They should start with fantastical villains in Brave and Bold. Joker can be introduced much later.

If The Brave and the Bold ever gets made, they should include villains like Poison Ivy. She’s an interesting character and a powerful opponent.

[echo kraken]

Nobody is tired of anything, including Joker and “superhero fatigue”… people are tired of shit story and stupid characterizations. You can push things through with amazing production scale and action only so far before the audience become aware of the tricks. Gunn works within the comic book logic intersect now well established in the normal movie goers, which is why it’s like “no longer a trick” and felt “authentic and sincere”.

[thick arch]

https://youtube.com/shorts/UOALSBSIzOE?si=zlKJTZhKZmA5prjH

https://youtube.com/shorts/UOALSBSIzOE?si=zlKJTZhKZmA5prjH

I think he did one for guy as well.

These are so tough

[thick arch]

Artwork done by Manabu Yashiro

[craggy pawn]

I do agree that as Gunn said recently there's no superhero movie fatigue, there's just mediocre movie fatigue but we have had just too many Joker iterations already and DCU Batman needs to start with a different, more fantastical rogues gallery like Poison ivy maybe or others.

[echo kraken]

https://youtube.com/shorts/EbfPkXlCchw?si=JQi1YDR0XAwaPVbU

[wind adder]

https://fxtwitter.com/discussingfilm/status/1947285324234641714?s=46&t=_AWFhpIAIwbUeGd6RdGh0A

DiscussingFilm (@DiscussingFilm)

James Gunn says ‘SUPERGIRL’ is an edgier & rougher movie than ‘SUPERMAN’
︀︀
︀︀“Supergirl is a way more rock & roll film. It’s a little bit rougher, in certain ways. She’s a tougher character. She’s not Superman at all”
︀︀
︀︀(Source: www.rollingstone.com/tv-movies/tv-movie-features/superman-ending-explained-james-gunn-spoiler-interview-1235389024/))

**💬 164 🔁 341 ❤️ 5.1K 👁️ 176.2K **

FxTwitter · Jul 21, 2025, 1:19 PM

[echo kraken]

Old news, if it’s based on Woman Of Tomorrow, she’d be crazy with survivor guilt.

[craggy pawn]

It is based on woman of tomorrow comics

[echo kraken]

Where she goes around drunk across the universe seeking revenge for someone ELSE hehe

[echo kraken]

God her boots rocks

[craggy pawn]

Yup.. Superman mentions that in the movie itself

[echo kraken]

He just say that she likes to get drunk (due to survivor's guilt), but not the near murderous rampage because ||she felt sorry about someone else's planet got blown up|| lol

[craggy pawn]

That will be explored in the movie for sure

[echo kraken]

Milly Alcock is such a great casting for a young, JUST LEGAL DRINKING AGE (according to USA, anyways) Supergirl...
She can do cute AND crazy so well.

Very much "Looks like a cinnamon roll, will kill you" vibe

[craggy pawn]

She looks great in the role

[echo kraken]

Supergirl is already in the can, wrapped in May. The first internal assembly cut should've already been done... they would be going into pickup and reshoots in the next couple of months I think, since they have to picture lock the whole film down for sound, music and image post (VFX) probably no later than October if they want to make the Late June release date.

Gunn definitely runs a tight ship.

[echo kraken]

Totally agree... and the Krypto sequence was hilarious

[craggy pawn]

Yes it was

[echo kraken]

Pounce, pounce, pounce pounce...

[Supergirl giggling while the floor of the Fortress of Solitude gets destroyed]

[echo kraken]

I don't think I've seen any of the 3 Kryptonian characters (well one of them is a Kryptonian dog) being done with so much humanity (and flaws, in a good way) before... Gunn knows how to do flaws

[craggy pawn]

Totally agree with this

[golden frost]

Is 54% a big drop for a second weekend

[echo kraken]

Not really, kinda normal.

[echo kraken]

It's kinda pretty much as expected, maybe slightly stronger.
A TRUELY bad movie willl have a crazy drop.

[echo kraken]

For a recent example of a WoM destroying a film, here's Snow White

[golden frost]

What was the % drop

[echo kraken]

77% from opening Friday to 2nd Friday heh

[golden frost]

77% damn 😭

[echo kraken]

Saturday and Sunday did slightly better than Friday, but it's still slightly over 60% and 57% drops.

Drop % only make sense when you have MASSIVE numbers to check it against though... notice that yes the 57% drop doesn't look TOO bad, but the fluctuations is WILD, because the BASE of the opening weekend are in 16, 15, and 10 millions... with opening cume of only 42mil.

And third weekend is in the single digit millions.
So the AMOUNT also provide half of the picture here.

If you look at what we have for Superman (Snow White is in a wrap-up/debriefing state, while Superman is in active tracking)
The numbers are comparatively MASSIVE, so a 53% drop STILL allowed it to be the number 1 film on every single day.
I suspect it'll remain there until FF comes out... the BIG question is, once FF comes out, would Superman get a second leg or not.

Not impossible, but improbably, unless everyone HATED FF.
@golden frost

[golden frost]

What was MoS second weekend drop

[echo kraken]

I think MoS was a massive hit, iirc... and it was a TOTALLY different time

[echo kraken]

actually, not great lol... 65% drop weekend 1 to 2 lol

And in a time when there wasn't massive streaming and vod following up, and everyone had to wait for bluray/dvd if you want to wait... which is like 90-180 days....
Yeah... suffice to say that it's super bad lol

[golden frost]

65? I thought it was just 62

Also didn’t Spider-Man Homecoming have a 62% second weekend drop

[echo kraken]

There's a summer push for the Aug 9th weekend it seems, for MoS, that's about it... when you can't even stay number 1 for 2 weeks....

[golden frost]

I do know the film had very strong reactions

[echo kraken]

It still made about 3.0x the production budget, so it's still a relative success

[golden frost]

I’m not sure 65% is that big of a drop tho but anyway

Plus the movie also did get cooked by some competition

A fun family movie like Despicable Me 2 was going to get more attention

[echo kraken]

It isn't THESE days.. because if you've missed the opening, the though for a lot of people is like "it'll be 2-3 weeks before VOD anyways, I'll be nice and buy it then... 1 ticket vs one for each of my family member"... but back in 2013, that's a CRAZY drop

[golden frost]

Was it a big drop in 2017

[echo kraken]

It would be in 2017, though slightly less. After the Pandemic, anything below 70% isn't super bad... it's bad, but not "OMFG!!!!"

[golden frost]

So what can we say about Spider-Man Homecoming facing a 62% drop

[echo kraken]

Both MoS and Black Adam are in the same range in matrices, that's scary

[golden frost]

Wdym?

[echo kraken]

2.50 "Legs", meaning a relatively short run with low takes

[golden frost]

Low takes?

[echo kraken]

It's just 2nd weekend, and Superman is already 1.89 "legs"

[echo kraken]

Per screening tickets sold.

[golden frost]

Are second weekend drops always an indicator of reception

[echo kraken]

Not always, it's a quick matrix, but not the only.

Think of it as a gauge

[golden frost]

Gauge?

[golden frost]

What does the higher number mean

[echo kraken]

Like a quick look... for instance, the 62% drop for Homecoming LOOKS bad, until you realized that the Per Theater (pre screen) take remained at above a $1000 per screen for nearly 3 months.

[golden frost]

What about for 2014 Godzilla which had a 66% second weekend drop

[echo kraken]

Higher the "legs" the longer the run, the slower the drop vs biggest weekend... it's another composite number.
Anything above 2.6 is considered "well received", while anything below are not. And it's somewhat exponential, so the lower you go from 2.6, each 0.01 is a lot more loss than each 0.01 is gained after 2.6.

[echo kraken]

Donno, I'll need to look at other matrices... gimme a sec

[golden frost]

What’s the case with Superman having 1.89

[golden frost]

Any chance this can be translated for my primitive mind

[echo kraken]

See from this, as it's now a FULL status (meaning done with initial release)... you can quickly see that it had a REALLY short run, with a MASSIVE take on opening weekend, with a quick dropoff, but still made money because the movie costs so little.

[echo kraken]

Summary, for a film that had completed the Box Office run, is quite accurate

[golden frost]

Wait what did you say about Spider-Man Homecoming

[echo kraken]

Nothing, it's not done it's run... that matrix is only really valuable (unless you get into the other matrices) once the run is done...

[echo kraken]

Big opening, long run, a the theater made money, the movie also made money.... a LOT of money.

But healthy, since the domestic share is below 50%.

It's a really healthy film, but a bit on the low side

[golden frost]

What about X Men Dofp facing a big drop in 2014 in second weekend with 64%

[echo kraken]

See for Spiderman the range is still fine, but a bit low

[thick arch]

https://youtu.be/B-wEkHVHtQY?si=2nFKTaeQ4uBytrbt

oh man birdman Superman grift review dropped 👀

[echo kraken]

Stop pulling films out, we've got MORE than enough examples, and we should frame it only in relations to Superman

[golden frost]

So what can we conclude about MoS

I’m not sure it can be placed in the super bad category

[echo kraken]

Minor success... way below expectations for 2013.
Not enough to start a cinematic universe, and therefore the pressures are on BvS...

[golden frost]

Is it even possible to conclude if reception was more on the positive or negative side

[golden frost]

Why did they start one anyway 😭

[echo kraken]

That's really hard without doing some mathing that I'm way too lazy to do right now... but let's just say that on quick gut-instict, the MIDDLE "That's an ok film, but I won't be rewatching it in theaters" crowd is going to be VERY high... so something like 15:70:15 love -> like -> hate ratio.

[golden frost]

Which is weird cos it has a fine score on lb, an A- cinemascore, a 7.1 on IMDb

Anyway

[echo kraken]

Reviews arn't really well represented on the box office matrices... the domestic curves will tell a main overperform/underperform picture and the effect of WoM... not the quality of the film or whether people like it or not. Like (sorry to draw another film into the discussion) The Beekeeper VASTLY overperformed... and while not like for like with it being a 1999 film... The Matrix thrived on WoM.

The Beekeeper

The Matrix

The issue is that the matrices and box office analysis doesn't really account for marketing pushes and crazy strategies they used to do (less now, but still there) of pushing a shit film super hard, and making all the money back on opening weekend, then cut the film's run short as the WoM hits... for instance.

[echo kraken]

Basically, the easiest way to think the box office not as quite the quality of a film, unless it over-performs or under-performs on expectations, but more a combined result of marketing, cast, director, other draws. The likeability of a film and the WoM are usually tied, but that's also not always related to the quality.
Most films REAL scores won't really be considered "realiable" to the audience appreciations for at least 2-3 years after the film had come out. That's when the film can be judged on "cultural longevity" and therefore "quality".

[golden frost]

I think that box office quality argument can be forever killed when Michael Bay’s Transformers Age Of Extinction makes a billion dollars

Despite extremely low scores

[echo kraken]

Yeah, and when was the LAST time you hear people re-streaming THAT film outside of being part of a series or marathon, here?
Nearly none.

Big box office can be an indicator on the brand's viability and how good a ride (specifically for summer blockbusters) it is... that film fits the bill on delivering a mindless fun ride that is made to sell popcorn... nothing more, nothing less.

[golden frost]

I can never trust audiences sometimes ugh

[echo kraken]

I never trust anyone other than myself on how much a movie can be liked .... I TRY to think of how others will receive it, but my enjoyment is my own... My wife often sleeps on films even slightly boring in theaters (reclining chairs in cinemas are great), so that's pretty reliable for me on what the NORMAL audience would think...
Like... Blade Runner 2049, I don't think she's ever finished that film... at least 45min of the runtime she's asleep lol

[golden frost]

Like MoS underperforms yet Michael Bay slop makes a billion? Get the fuck out of here

[echo kraken]

Snyderbros knows exactly what kind of films they want from him, and he delivers to that... Baybros are the same.
There's just way more Baybros than Snyderbros, that's all.

[golden frost]

At least Michael Bay is self aware about it

[echo kraken]

There's also the Nolanbros, and the DelToroBros etc etc

[golden frost]

Snyderbros apparently have grown through the years…..

It’s frightening

[echo kraken]

I honestly appreciate that sometimes there are more fans of the directors than of the films lol

[echo kraken]

A LOT of people jumped on the bandwagon on "Release the Snyder Cut!" movement... and the fact that it was a successful campaign, bolstered their resolve AND gained them some numbers too.
It's interesting, I just wished they aren't so toxic towards everyone else.

[golden frost]

Not all of them are toxic

[echo kraken]

No, but due to the fact that the smallest and the most toxic will be the most vocal, it'll feel like they ALL are, obviously.