📺 Doctor Who

[fallow pendant]

he also gives like, mega karen energy to me idk, i think i remember hearing a story of him yelling at cinema staff because he watched a film that was bad and they wouldn’t give him his money back for it or something

idk, i’m not a fan of the guy, i’m pretty sure he’s also blacklisted from the bbc too, which if that’s the case, it’s not like john could return as jack

so jonathan groffs character is probably gonna be a replacement jack

[uneven grail]

Yes, this was a Black Mirror-lite ep, but also remember that the target demographic is families, the kids of which are not yet old enough for actual Black Mirror

I thought it was a decent ep, surprisingly dark, but I liked that ending.

Just becasue the Doctor wants to save them doesn't mean they want to saved.

intense discussion going on at wikipedia

also some interesting dissections going on on Tumblr

I didn't even catch the racism angle (but I was only half watching)

[final wind]

oh it seemed really obvious to me

me and my gf watched it and were both laughing when they ended up being racist

[echo spoke]

what else could it be if not racism

[fallow pendant]

yeah same tbh

[charred wedge]

just watched. solid episode. not on the level of boom or 73 yards, but ok. And we finally got a Susan Twist acknowledgment from the Doc and Ruby

[charred wedge]

I knew Lindey was a bigot when i saw her massive friends list and everyone on it was lily white. It woulda been nice to see what happens to them. Show us how they die lol

[uneven grail]

Good old British classism. "I'm rich, you're not". It is that too, of course.

But I really like them using a genuinely terrible character as a 'lead' you know.

[uneven grail]

The story finally came to fruition with the Fifteenth Doctor and Ruby, with ideas contributed by Moffat himself, and promised to deliver "in a way you'd never expect".```

That kind of explains a few things

See, Disney Money pays for people in monster suits

[final wind]

oh shit i had no idea there were practical suits for the creatures

that's awesome

[uneven grail]

I think all the monsters have been some form of practical since the show came back with The Meep

[final wind]

that's so awesome

im a huge fan of practical effects

[uneven grail]

same

[molten sorrel]

They’re practical but probably enhanced with cgi

Although the Meep didn’t actually look like it even used cgi so that was very impressive

Neither did the Boogeyman

I think they would have to with how these creatures opened up thou

[echo spoke]

oh yeah that's probably another aspect of it definitely

[fallow pendant]

i think it’s better if they don’t show us tho

we know they’re gonna die, we know how they’re gonna die

you’ve gotta leave us with some interpretation

[uneven grail]

It was in the face.

They go into it in the behind the scenes shows

[molten sorrel]

Ngl

I think I’ve worked out the issue with this season

None of the villains/monsters are particularly memorable or menacing

Maestro had a lot of potential but they botched that final showdown

[uneven grail]

Hmm, yeah. That is true.

[fallow pendant]

idk, i liked maestro a LOT

i think the problem is more that there aren't a lot of monsters period

the only MONSTERS we've gotten have been the boogeyman and the slug things in the last episode

tbf we're getting more next episode too

but that's 3/6 proper monsters right?

and then the others were like

maestro, who's a villain but not really a proper monster, they're one of the pantheon of gods

and then 73 yards and boom didn't really have a villain

[fallow pendant]

rest in peace ian chesterton

[charred wedge]

Oh damn, RIP to the OG

made it to 99 tho, nice

Now Susan is the only one left alive from the 1st season

[charred wedge]

William Russel also got into the Guinness world record book for longest gap between playing aa character: "Guinness World Records confirmed the achievement, announcing: “The longest gap between TV appearances is 57 years 120 days, and was achieved by William Russell (UK) as the Doctor Who character Ian Chesterton in The Power of the Doctor episode, which aired on 23rd October 2022.”"

[charred wedge]

So theres a part in last weeks epi where the Dr describes the dot in Dot and Bubble to be an "anti grav device". shouldnt that have been an "anti mav device?"

i feel like they should either be consistent with mavity or just fix it

[uneven grail]

or becasue this was originally written for 12 and Amy, they just missed it on the rewrites?

[charred wedge]

I guess. Hopefully they catch those in the future or just fix it. it seems like a thing that'll be easy to forget the longer time goes by

[uneven grail]

I dunno. It's a fun little joke, but with them trying to rebrand this as 'series 1', it might be hard to explain how it originated with a whole other set of people.

and when there's so much else going on, slipping in 'anti mav device' might be confusing

[charred wedge]

i mean thats kinda why they shouldnt have altered the word gravity to begin with

[uneven grail]

oh I agree

[fallow pendant]

they couldn't have just ctrl+f'd tho?

[molten sorrel]

Lol I think the inconsistencies are intentional

Think of it as them being in our reality and other realities- most of this series is probably operating in an alternative reality (where smth has broken in)

There’s a wild theory I saw thou around Ruby

Saying she’s the child of The Rani and the Trickster

Wonder what Susan Twist is doing in Rogue

[torpid iron]

That would be wild

[fallow pendant]

no offence but i think this is a massive stretch lmao

i think they just forgot about mavity and accidentally said anti-grav

[torpid iron]

It's a stretch but it'd be pretty fucking cool

[molten sorrel]

Not a massive stretch considering The Rani has been name dropped and I believe they recently got the rights back for that character

[torpid iron]

That’s really interesting

[fallow pendant]

the fact that doctor who's tomorrow night is kind of crazy

this week went SO quickly

[final wind]

i know right??? it feels like only a few days between episodes

[torpid iron]

Fr and I'm glad

[final wind]

oh same

this season just keeps getting better

AND I NEED TO KNOW WHO THE OLD WOMAN IS AND WHO RUBY'S PARENTS ARE

[torpid iron]

FR

[runic seal]

https://youtu.be/wMpmt8zy0oU?si=kOUTK_YhWQ4bKF8H

[uneven grail]

I saw a little Insta video last night that really pointed out the problem with modern Who and I agree with it. The writers seem to have forgotten that Who isn't really about the Doctor. It's about their companion. We seem to be getting back to it with Ruby, but when I think about the most successful series, it's with Rose, Donna and Amy.

And it's all because they had really good character arcs.

[charred wedge]

definitely the problem with Jodies doc. Giving her 3 companions and not properly exploring any of them sucked

[uneven grail]

Rose had a nothing life and was swept away into adventure. Donna grew so much and became an incredible person. Amy found herself faced with a descision she didn't know if she wanted to make (getting married), and needed a change to realise how much she wanted it.

[final wind]

i was about to say, they're definitely focusing a lot more on the companion and her story this season, and i think the show is all the better for it

the mystery of ruby's parents and the old woman just keeps me wanting more episodes

[uneven grail]

yeah, but Ruby didn't have a situation that I felt needed her to go with the Doctor.

[final wind]

that's a good point, all the best companions are the ones who the doctor "saves" in a way

i still like ruby

[uneven grail]

Ruby seemed perfectly happy and contented where she was

[final wind]

but i think maybe making her home life worse to really show how being an orphan had negatively affected her might have made for a stronger story

like

why would she actually care about her birth parents? she seems super happy with her adoptive family

if she had like a shitty life it would make sense that she'a chasing the hopes of something better

[uneven grail]

exactly

[final wind]

but thats mostly a small nitpick for me, i still like her character

it just would have made for a stronger overall narrative

im glad theyre at least giving her a story and an arch at all

[uneven grail]

Rose had a dull life. Donna had a normal life until her wedding, then she went looking for the Doctor. Amy was probably feeling pressured into a normal life when she wanted something more extraordinary.

[final wind]

now that its been mentioned, yeah i completely agree that a big problem with 13 was just how forgettable her companions were

i feel like i still know nothing about any of them

[charred wedge]

i mean to be fair, literally everyones life is dull compared to what can happen with the Doc

[final wind]

thats true lol

[uneven grail]

well, there's dull and there's ordinary. Plently of people are content with ordinary.

[final wind]

but all the previous good companions were people who it makes sense would be searching for something more in their life

ruby, sure she wants to find her parents, but she seems to be happy and have a good life

she has like a whole friend group who i guess she's just abandoned now

[uneven grail]

exactly. That's why her first ep just didn't work for me

[charred wedge]

not knowing why your birth parents abandoned you could really mess with a person, even if they lead a good life

[uneven grail]

She had no reason to leave once the problem had been solved

[final wind]

literally if they had even just shown her going to the club alone to show how her being an orphan has caused her to feel isolated from the rest of the world, that would have worked better

because then if the doctor had talked to her then, it would be like "oh hey here's someone who actually seems to care about me and notice me"

[final wind]

this is true

it might not be so much who her parents are, but why they left her on the church steps

[uneven grail]

At least Ruby has been more of a character than Clara was. She was nothing more than a walking plot point

[final wind]

clara was good because she had amazing chemistry with the doctor

[uneven grail]

(and I stopped watching after her first series)

[final wind]

the two just played well off each other

[uneven grail]

I'll have to take your word on that

[final wind]

her and 12 i mean

[uneven grail]

I know I watched her first series but I couldn't tell you a single story

[charred wedge]

so you havent seen Capaldis last 3 episodes?

[uneven grail]

I saw Capaldi and Bill

[charred wedge]

they might be my fav out of classic and nuwho

[charred wedge]

ah ok

"I- waited - for youuuuuuuu"

[uneven grail]

look, I started losing interest in Who with the Ponds second series, then when Capaldi came along I stopped. I tried again with Bill, gave Jodie one series and a bit, and have only rejoined since the specials

[charred wedge]

Bill/Nardole shouldve gotten 3 full seasons

the doctor so rarely has companions that are his equals or close to like Nardole or Romana

[uneven grail]

I also don't like the whole 'living in modern times, sometimes going with the Doctor' situation. You either travel with him or you don't

[molten sorrel]

So now the theorists are pointing to Sutekh

Who hasn’t been in DW since the 4th Doctor

It’s weird honestly this season has divided opinions in my family

For me it’s good

For my parents they’re kinda less interested- they enjoyed the specials but their interest hasn’t really been there until Dot and Bubble

[uneven grail]

I think only having 8 eps has really hurt it

[molten sorrel]

It’s certainly hurt my interest levels I’d say

It’s not long enough to really have the dips it’s had

Also sorta wild how Tardis scenes have been pretty much absent

[uneven grail]

yeah, espcially considering how much they spent remaking it

8 eps of an episodic show is just not long enough to get to know the characters

though having a Doctor-lite ep was the best thing for Ruby

I kind of feel like all seasons of Who should ahve Doctor-lite eps. Really helps the companion to shine

[molten sorrel]

Tbf it certainly made Ruby less annoying

I mean she’s a good actress

It’s just strange casting slightly

She must be one of the youngest companions?

At least of NuWho

[charred wedge]

i think Matthew Waterhouse (Adric) was the youngest, but not by much. he was 18 and Millie Gibson was 19 i think when she started

[molten sorrel]

Ah interesting

Idk maybe it’s a me thing

But I do think it might just be a tad too young companion wise

Ig it’s intentional to make the season feel more like a breath of fresh air

There’s a lot imo riding on this two part finale

Whereas if the season had a few more episodes I wouldn’t probably have that feeling

[final wind]

wait, the christmas special was episode 1????

damn so we're only getting 7 new episodes huh 💀

thats too bad

i feel like it should be 12 episodes per season, even if it takes longer to make

[final wind]

HE FINALLY USED HIS PSYCHIC PAPER

i am now content with this new season

[charred wedge]

nah, space babies was epi 1

[final wind]

ok so theres still two more episodes after this one?

[charred wedge]

yep

Legend of Ruby Sunday and Empire of Death

[final wind]

SICK

tonight's episode was ok

not bad or anything, but felt rushed

i think it should have been two episodes

just so it could take more time on developing characters and relationships and stuff

because there were things happening at the end that were supposed to feel emotional but tbh i felt nothing

i like rogue though, he's cool

very much gives me captain jack vibes

but not as cool

no one compares to my beloved captain jack

[fallow pendant]

🥹🥹🥹

my heart

they better bring him back or i stg russell

[final wind]

IKR

he needs to be a returning character

[fallow pendant]

LET THE DOCTOR BE HAPPY FOR ONCE

[final wind]

i like that 15 is much more emotional and romantic

allowing himself to form true connections with people

i liked when he called ruby his best friend

I JUST WISH THIS HAD BEEN A TWO PARTER SO WE COULD HAVE MORE TIME FOR HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH ROGUE TO DEVELOP

i wish they had really taken the time to build it up so that it would hurt even more when he was gone

[fallow pendant]

u just know nerds are gonna be like “UM ACC THE DOCTOR SHOULDNT BE IN LOVE WITH ANYONE”

literally happens every time the doctor fancies someone

annoying people say it about rose, annoying people say it about river

[final wind]

it's definitely something new but im ok with it

i just wish they had taken more time with it 😔

[fallow pendant]

like he’s over a thousand years old, let him be in love

[final wind]

but i do like rogue's character quite a bit and i hope he isnt a one-off

[fallow pendant]

I FUCKING HOPE SO TOO MY HEART CANNOT TAKE THIS BEING HIM DEAD

i get that it’s jonathan groff and he might be kinda hard to book cause he’s a pretty famous actor but like

THEY WERE IN LOVE

this is ROMANCEEEE

i’m trying not to let recency bias get over me but i think this might be my favourite episode of the series

[final wind]

ohhhhh he was agent smith in the matrix 4, that's where i recognize him from

the whole time i was thinking he looks so familiar

[fallow pendant]

spoilers

he is like, token gay

[final wind]

i think 73 yards is still my favorite episode, this episode is probably lower in my ranking but not bad at all

[fallow pendant]

SPRING AWAKENING HELLOOO

[final wind]

none of the episodes have been bad in my opinion

space babies was probably the weakest though

[fallow pendant]

i thought space babies was kinda bad

[final wind]

the only thing i didnt like about space babies was the ending

the fucking giant fart

he couldnt have just transported the babies using the tardis?

[fallow pendant]

that’s what i thought

[final wind]

he just blasted them in a general direction using a literal fart and then dipped

they still have no thrusters, no steering

no way to land

[fallow pendant]

the fact that it’s the first episode lots of people would have seen is annoying too

[final wind]

just floating slowly in the general direction of a planet

but every episode other than that, i would consider to be at least good

[charred wedge]

solid epi. didnt love it as much as the previous 3, but decent. certainly better than the 1st 2

I think Susan Twist tonight was the duchesses aunt in the portrait

i imagine all the anti woke youtubbers are going to shit all over this episode as if the doctors never kissed a dude before

[torpid iron]

I hate queerbaiting

[torpid iron]

He reminds me so much of Jack

They're so similar

Love love love Jonathan Groff

[final wind]

yes, thats why ruby was paying attention to it and asking about it

[final wind]

agreed

its above the first two episodes, below the last three, still a good episode though

i would rank the episodes so far (best to worst):
73 yards
dot and bubble
boom
rogue
devils chord
space babies

[torpid iron]

73 yards was soo good

[final wind]

i loved it

definitely the highlight of the season for me so far

[torpid iron]

There were aspects of Devils Chord that I liked, but overall it was flat

[final wind]

same

haha

flat

little music joke

[torpid iron]

Lmao I didn't even realise

[final wind]

i would still consider it over all a good episode

[torpid iron]

Same, just not as good as the rest

[final wind]

the only one i wouldnt consider "good" was space babies, which i thought was just ok

it was really just the ending that i didnt like there

[torpid iron]

It felt like they were trying to tick boxes a lot in Devils Chord

Yeah it was confusing

Like why would he just leave them there

[final wind]

EXACTLY

and then in dot and bubble he actually does the sensible thing and is like "hey i can take you somewhere safe on the tardis"

WHY DIDNT HE OFFER THAT TO THE BABIES

[runic seal]

5/5 episode

[runic seal]

There was a nearby planst for them to go to

[fallow pendant]

wait r u saying this about the newest episode?

[final wind]

yeah but the ship didnt have a way to steer or land or anything, it was just slowly floating in the general direction of a planet that was like a million miles away and didnt know they were coming

[runic seal]

its space

[final wind]

and?

[runic seal]

and?

and?

[molten sorrel]

Intrigued about tonight’s episode

Just hoping the romance doesn’t feel too forced and shoehorned in

[fallow pendant]

i’m already seeing nerds be like “erm actually the doctor shouldn’t fall in love “ on twitter

just like, let my queer little alien be queer

it’s ok, u don’t have to rely on 60 years worth of story to enjoy something

[molten sorrel]

lol the Doctor always found love where others wouldn’t

Sorta part of that creature’s habit

I think ppl are like it bc they forget that the Doctor is an alien

Love is probably different on Galifrey

[molten sorrel]

I meannnn

You do

Just not in that way

Another series of Doctor Who trying to use none of the classic threats sorta shows that they are struggling with a villain problem slightly

Not as bad as Jodie’s season when they had blue sparkly teeth guy as the main threat

The main problem is the threat is too Disney-fied at points

[molten sorrel]

Great episode

I don’t feel the kiss was entirely necessary if I’m being completely honest

Would of just preferred for them just to keep the romantic tension for another episode so the romance is given time to grow a bit further

The creatures I don’t think are particularly that good

Although at least the reason to why the creatures do what they do is different

In all its at least a rather fun zany episode

[charred wedge]

if hes sacrificing himself so the doc doesnt have to kill his friend and the docs gonna go looking for him, i feel it made sense

[molten sorrel]

Sure it makes sense but I don’t think we needed it to be told that

It was better left to be suggestive rather than explicit

Though it was better than the attempt as a lesbian relationship in Jodie’s last season

That was rather underbaked

Could of been much better too

[charred wedge]

yeah i felt they were just ok. i liked the epi overall, just not as much as the previous 3. but better than the 1st 2 for sure

[molten sorrel]

Yeh I’d agree with you there

Strangely enough Dot and Bubble might be my favourite episode of the series thou

Or Boom

[charred wedge]

i dunno if i could pick between boom, 73 yards, and dot and bubble. all so different and good. tho i do know the beatles epi is probly my least fav. Space babies is somewhat ok, just that damn uncanny valley and fart propulsion at the end brought it down

[molten sorrel]

Well that is RTD writing for ya

Fingers crossed for Slithereen return

(Probably said no one)

[runic seal]

Best episode

If i criticised this, yall would jump in to hate

Lmao

I just realised

[charred wedge]

i admit, i fully anticipated you hating it based on your thoughts at the start of the season

[molten sorrel]

Tbh this season did take a few episodes to really get into the groove of things

I also just wonder whether it’s been too much RTD written episodes but he did the same thing on Eccleston’s run- guest writers became more frequent after the first season tbh

Am looking forward to see the announcements of guest writers on S2

We know Moffat is back (possibly for the last time) for the Christmas Special which will be interesting

[runic seal]

Seee i knew it

Prejudice ahh

No one can figure me

[charred wedge]

youre the one who basically said "why does the doctor have to be so flamboyantly gay". What was i supposed to think?

[runic seal]

I think moffat will always be a guest writer

[runic seal]

To not be prejudice and treat me like a human being

[charred wedge]

i made a logical assumption based on your previous words. literally nothing wrong or prejudiced with that

[runic seal]

It is prejudice

And assuming

[molten sorrel]

Where is your race or sexuality or gender being brought into this by Winston? There’s not really the basis of prejudice

[charred wedge]

assumption based on your words. not suree what youre not understanding here lol

[runic seal]

I win

[molten sorrel]

Lol you do you

Don’t chat with ppl who don’t want to chat with you lmao

[runic seal]

https://tenor.com/view/doctorwho-winner-iwon-davidtennant-ten-gif-7667994

[charred wedge]

ive always said, it must be nice to go through life being stupid. you can just live in a pretend world with no issues lol

[molten sorrel]

Kicking up old issues is a bit immature as well even if proven false

[runic seal]

You thought id hate todays episode

[charred wedge]

i logically thought that, yes

[runic seal]

You wanted to hate on me

But you wrong

[charred wedge]

i didnt want anything, all i did was try and guess your reaction based on youre previous words

[runic seal]

I even liked last week episode

And the episode before

[runic seal]

Massive L

[charred wedge]

agreed, someone is having a massiv L here

[runic seal]

You

[charred wedge]

🙂

[runic seal]

ive always said, it must be nice to go through life being stupid. you can just live in a pretend world with no issues lol

[charred wedge]

thank you for the homage

[runic seal]

Lets hate on the homophobes together

[molten sorrel]

https://tenor.com/view/doctor-who-doctor-davros-capaldi-rollstuhl-gif-17508475

[runic seal]

Oh wow do i hate homophobic ppl

I hope the doctor kisses more men to annoy them

[charred wedge]

i dont hate them so much as i pity them

[runic seal]

I am anti homophobia

Not caring is like being bystander

You have to be anti racist not just not racist

Did you guys know that next week they are going back to present day earth?

I know this because i saw teaser

[molten sorrel]

@charred wedge just a question since you watched all the seasons, could you tell me the general gist of what Sutekh is?

From what I can see online the theories are strongly going for either Sutekh or The Trickster

I’m gonna toss The Trickster theory back in

So when 13 regenerates in 14

The old face that returns is the one that met The Trickster

https://youtu.be/DhB3Bej3eTk?feature=shared

Also The Trickster had the ability to influence people in order to create chaos

[charred wedge]

from what i remember, Sutekh was the last of a god like race who fears that all life will challenge his rule over creation. I think the 4th Doc trapped him in a time tunnel

[molten sorrel]

Ahh interesting

Good to know

I believe it’s the Pyramids of Mars serial

If I get some time I’ll give it a watch this week

Only 4 episodes?!? That seems short to me

One of the Pertwee arcs was like 7 lol

With the Silurians

Whilst interesting it was sorta slow

[charred wedge]

i honestly feel like i need to rewatch all of classic who. I binged it all so fast i forgot so much

[molten sorrel]

Ahh lol

[charred wedge]

might be fun to revisit after seeing nuwho as well

just gotta power through those cartoon epis lol

[final wind]

i wish it was next friday already

seems like next episode is a big one

[charred wedge]

i just hope the end of the season doesnt cliffhang us too bad. such a long wait till christmas

[final wind]

yeah i'm curious to see how it all wraps up

[charred wedge]

i kinda wish theyd never tell us who was leaving the show. i like Ruby, and knowing that she leaves early to mid next season i feel will lessen the effect her leaving wouldve had had i not known

feel the same way about docs. itd be so much nicer to have it be a surprise regeneration every time

[molten sorrel]

Tbh I’m not a massive fan of Ruby

But the mystery around her knowing it’s getting wrapped pretty soon is slightly disappointing

[charred wedge]

Rubys a national treasure. I feel liker her exit is gonna be a gut punch

tho i wonder what the relevance of days of the week with these companions is

Ruby Sunday will be replaced by Munday

is there a Tuesday companion in the future?

[torpid iron]

Yeah, they baited us until the very end

[final wind]

what is queerbaiting

[torpid iron]

It’s basically teasing that someone is queer just to keep people watching

Like, they could be, just have to wait and watch the whole thing to find out

[final wind]

wait and when did they do that in the new episode?

[torpid iron]

The whole entire episode there was tension

Idk

There are people better equipped to explain it

[final wind]

i dont think romantic tension is the same thing as queerbaiting

if rogue had been a woman it would have played out the same way

it was just a brewing romance

it kinda sounds like you only have a problem with it because it was a gay romance

[torpid iron]

Touché

But I know queer-baiting is a real thing, I was glad at the end when they finally kissed

I might just have a totally incorrect knowledge of what queer baiting is tbh

[fallow pendant]

that’s not queerbaiting lol, that’s build up

queer baiting is teasing the idea of a character or a person being queer without the pay off of a queer moment

but like, the episode does that, so it’s not queer

[charred wedge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBaybCULmdY

Nice to see that Mel's back. wish more old companions would come back, specifically Nardole

or bring back Jamie while the actors still alive

2nd Doc and Jamie were an amazing team

[final wind]

i've mentioned this before, but i really want to see a companion not from present day earth. i want to see a companion from another time period or another planet, just someone who would have a vastly different perspective on things than anyone in our current society

[charred wedge]

thats one reason why I love Nardole and Romana. Both not human, both from other planets, both kind of on the Docs level

[final wind]

its cool to see a companion with a more complex understanding of the universe

it would also be cool to do the opposite and have a companion from 100 or 200 years ago

[torpid iron]

Thanks for clarifying, I wasn’t completely sure

[uneven grail]

the ep was ok, but have to say, I wasn't feeling the chemistry.

[final wind]

yeah same, i just wish they had taken more time to develop the relationship

[uneven grail]

I don't think time was the issue.

I will say, this is the first ep I feel like I really have a proper sense of this Doctor though.

but I also feel like they were really trying to make Rogue different from Jack, and I appreciate it. They've swapped the vivacious and reserved roles. Rogue is not good at making a scene, he can't really improvise under pressure.

and it would be nice to see him again. Its unlikely though, unless they've reversed the whole 'not being able to cross into other dimensions' thing

though I'm guessing Rogue would be trying to get back too.

[charred wedge]

i feel like Rogue saying, "find me" to the Doctor before he got banished means we'll get a few episodes where they go on a quest to get him during Ncutis run

[uneven grail]

not this series though

[charred wedge]

yeah probly not

[uneven grail]

I think, I felt the chemistry from the Doctor but not so much from Rogue.

but I do only half watch this show, so

[charred wedge]

Maybe theyll save it for Ncutis finale episodes

[uneven grail]

or it can just be a plot thread for season 2

[charred wedge]

could be. but whenever it is i bet its multiple episodes at least

[uneven grail]

assuming Groff is interested/available/affordable to come back

[uneven grail]

Bet those bird faces too ages to put on

[torpid iron]

They look so sick though

[void pasture]

Is Ruby actually confirmed to leave this season?

[vestal wagon]

no they said she’ll be in the next season aswell

Rogue was the best of the season so far by a wide margin

[fallow pendant]

idk if it’s by a wide margin but rogue is probably my favourite, yeah

[final wind]

73 yards still on top for me

[fallow pendant]

my ncuti ranking might be:

_ _- rogue
_ _- boom
_ _- 73 yards
_ _- dot and bubble
_ _- church on ruby road
_ _- the devil's chord
_ _- space babies

dot and bubble's been growing on me icl

honestly i don't think i've disliked any episode apart from space babies

[uneven grail]

Hmm, I don't think any ep has really edged over 3 stars for me. 73 Yards could have if it decided to explain anything, but it didn't.

I think I'd go:

• dot and bubble
• 73 yards
• rogue
• boom
• the devil's chord
• space babies
• church on ruby road

So Jackie and Ruby go to the same pub

[torpid iron]

That cannot possibly be a coincedence

[uneven grail]

I mean, same writer, so it could just be the usual placeholder/fake name

[final wind]

probably just an easter egg and nothing more

[torpid iron]

Probably, but where there's a will there's a way

[uneven grail]

Ah, apparently the ep was written by two women, Kate Herron and Briony Redman.

[torpid iron]

How has that got anything to do with the same pub

[uneven grail]

that's the point, it doesn't.

different writers referencing the same place (unless RTD just said to use it)

Also, I know it's silly to be impressed with make up, but I'm actually genuinely surprised they did all this for just that one joke/maybe two shots? I kind of figured it would just be CG or something

[torpid iron]

True, true

[torpid iron]

It is NOT SILLY to be impressed about Makeup, that shit is a true art form, it's really impressive

Costuming too

[uneven grail]

I just keep on thinking that Who is still this small budget show 🤣

[torpid iron]

The costumes in the latest epi were reeeeallly good

[torpid iron]

Those were the days 😔

[uneven grail]

very much so

but so far, I feel like this series has not been showy with it's budget.

like, it's done some fantastic practical effects, but hasn't gone mad on the CGI

[torpid iron]

HMU would actually be a torturous department to work in

[torpid iron]

True

I think the space ones are the most improved by far

Like that horizon in Boom

[uneven grail]

yes. I remember with the Jodie years everything looked great, but that's where the budget went, filming in south africa and such. Was utterly hollow

so far, this hasn't been too slick

[torpid iron]

It sucks that Jodie's writing was so bad, she's such a good actor

[uneven grail]

yeah, I still don't have anything against her, its just all her stories were utter shit

[torpid iron]

Chibnall 🤢🤢

[uneven grail]

its like I said the other day, there was zero focus on the companions.

Here's a police officer, a retired bus driver and his grandson with a physical limitation, and they never did anything with them

[void pasture]

Phew ok

I think the episodes so far have been really good(aside from space babies)but nothing special

Kinda like series 8 for me

Hopefully the final 2 episodes are even better

[fallow pendant]

prediction before tomorrow night

sutekh isn’t gonna be the bad guy

and neither is the trickster

idk who it’s gonna be but it’s gonna be neither of those

[final wind]

the real villain will be us, the audience

[fallow pendant]

also am i high or was nicola coughlan supposed to be in this season

[vestal wagon]

xmas special this year

i am hoping for Fenric as the villain of the finale

[charred wedge]

Game day!

prediction: Granddaughter Susan is back and shes pissed

[fallow pendant]

im sick and looking at screens hurt my eyes so i will be watching tonight’s episode as it was intended, wearing sunglasses in a dark room while snacking on some cheese and scranning some strepsils

is anyone seeing next weeks episode in the cinema btw

i was thinking about it but i’d have to avoid spoilers for all of that day which is just gonna be really difficult

[charred wedge]

no option to in my town :/

[final wind]

i am in america

[fallow pendant]

I HAVE TO WAIT AN ENTIRE ASS WEEK???

i forgot how PAINFUL two parters were

i will say idk if doctor who's vfx are good enough for a full cgi enemy even with the disney budget? it does look a bit scooby doo

and i'm fully embarassed to say that ||i heard the voice and thought they were bringing the devil back from the impossible planet cause it's the same voice actor and i'm not that well versed in classic who||

also LOVED the theresa may reference

https://tenor.com/view/dance-gif-20569392

cackled

[final wind]

i feel like i just got edged for 45 minutes straight

how tf am i supposed to wait a whole week

fuck this show

[fallow pendant]

that's a doctor who part 1 for u

I NEED TO KNOW WHO RUBY'S MUM IS

[final wind]

ISTG if they dont show us who her mom is next episode i am going to fucking break shit

imagine if they show her and its just a random woman with no purpose 💀

[charred wedge]

well at least we got one answer, ||Sutekh, but yeah i really wanted to know who Rubys mom was. And who the hell is Mrs Flood? Flood's gotta be somebody since she knows about the Tardis and knew a storm was coming. Another harbinger maybe?||

i just know they better not cliffhang us next week too. imagine waiting til christmas for answers

i dunno how ppl waited for Capaldi's last episode with the 1st doc appearing cliffhanger... summer til christmas for a resolution is brutal

[void pasture]

Absolute pain

Disney budget looking good

[void pasture]

Average Doctor Who resolution

[charred wedge]

i might rewatch Pyramids of Mars (4th Doc), Sutekh's only appearance

[final wind]

im fine if sutekh isnt defeated yet, but next weeks epiode NEEDS to tell us who ruby's mom is and who mrs flood is

[void pasture]

Yeah fr

But maybe mrs flood is just a random character tho

[charred wedge]

a random character that knows what the Tardis is and that Sutekh was coming?

[void pasture]

Ok yeah good point

[torpid iron]

Apart from some annoying ass writing in this episode I quite enjoyed it

[fallow pendant]

my assumption is that mrs flood is a disciple of sutekh or something

[uneven grail]

honestly, should have put on subtitles for some of this

[torpid iron]

Fr though

[molten sorrel]

Russell kept liking my Insta comments thou

About The Trickster

Haven’t seen the episode yet

But like would it be wild to say that just bc The Trickster wasn’t the antagonist of the first part

Doesn’t mean he won’t be teased in the second part

It’s a different pantheon after all

[fallow pendant]

i hate to tell u, i think he just liked ur theory

[molten sorrel]

I don’t think you hated that

You loved that

:/

[charred wedge]

damn, rewatching Pyramids of Mars, Sutekh made the 4th doc kneel before him. 4th doc also surmised that if ever freed, Sutekh could wipe out Gallifrey. wonder wtf theyre going to do against him. i fear another cliffhanger till Christmas :/

[charred wedge]

so Doc and Sarah Jane beat Stuekh by using the Tardis to trap him in a time vortex that shouldve trapped him forever. I guess using the Tardis allowed him to hide part of himself in it

so i guess this situation is where the whole Bi-generation thing is kinda silly. Tennant is on Earth just watching this happen and not helping? just odd

[final wind]

as long as we learn who rubys mom is next episode, im ok waiting until christmas to see how sutekh is defeated

[final wind]

i feel like he's gonna show up at some point, right?

i know rtd said he wouldnt

but like

cmon

[molten sorrel]

Easily the best episode

PROPER stakes

Amazing villain

And tbf The Trickster name drop made me happy

Can’t wait for the second half

Hasn’t been that dramatic in years

[molten sorrel]

Going to do this I think pretty soon

Sutekh should be resolved in the next episode

It’s not really a spoiler

But Ruby isn’t in the Christmas Special

It’s a different one off companion pretty sure

[fallow pendant]

https://x.com/bbcdoctorwho/status/1802057235817746924

Doctor Who (@bbcdoctorwho) on X

NEXT TIME: Dust to dust... ⌛️

#DoctorWho: EMPIRE OF DEATH premieres 22nd June on @BBCiPlayer and 21st June on @DisneyPlus where available.

Twitter · Jun 15, 2024, 7:15 PM

a part of me wonders if this is gonna pull a last of the time lords?

where like, sutekh wins and the next episode is a bit of a time jump

and then it's resolved by the end

[molten sorrel]

What if Mrs Flood is The Trickster

[charred wedge]

i imagine shes gotta be one of his underling gods. id be kinda shocked if she was granddaughter susan. Im losing hope that we'll ever see susan again 😦

[fallow pendant]

i think we will

[void pasture]

So christmas special with sutekh?

[torpid iron]

Hopefully it's done after this finale, otherwise it's not much of a finale

That'd be a 3-part finale

Which I wouldn't put above DW but it'd be super annoying

[molten sorrel]

Which tbf the only underling god we haven’t met is The Trickster

[molten sorrel]

I’m kinda wondering thou it goes against what RTD’s been saying

I reckon the 14th Doctor might make an appearance in the next episode

Especially if they need a Tardis to travel back again and reverse what happened

[thick rampart]

Cool last episode, even though this season pretty much sucks.
I just binge the whole season till episode 8 today.
I get that THE DOCTOR is a different person, but ‘how do you change a whole show’

So the Sutekh is the ‘god of death’ & ‘most powerful god of them all’. If we look at the Netflix series ‘The Sandman’ we know different lol.
(Yes, I’m comparing the too just cause 😂)

[thick rampart]

You think that’s why no preview. I was looking forward to it.

[molten sorrel]

Sutekh is cool

But like

Why bring this “god” being back now?!?

What’s his purpose

What he done to the timelines?!?

[molten sorrel]

Possibly

I mean if they are bringing back 14th Doc and Donna they wouldn’t want that getting out

Bc the 15th Doc can’t go back

So it would make sense if he needs the 14th to go back

Unless there’s another “cheat” way of reversing things

Maestro has to be the biggest disappointment of this season

Literally the climax was terrible of that episode

[thick rampart]

Probably ate some thing, to make itself powerful? Out of all the scfy crap I seem with gods, they mostly like playing games, and eating things.

‘The Magicians’ an example

https://tenor.com/view/going-to-be-fun-fun-fun-times-charles-mesure-the-beast-gif-11667140

[fallow pendant]

no no, as in sutekh won legend of ruby sunday, and then there’s a time jump in empire of death

[fallow pendant]

i really hope they don’t icl 😭

i think 14 is the only doctor where his ending should be a concrete ending

like i think it removes the emotional impact of him retiring if he just comes back

[torpid iron]

There is one on Youtube

[molten sorrel]

Probably wrong

It’s gonna be a direct continuation

Then I’m guessing Sutekh will win

Christmas Special probably will be when the Doctor’s in a time trap thing

Hence why Moffat keeps referring to it being Hitchcockian

And Sutekh will probably be resolved in the Season 2 premiere

Is my guess

I’m expecting a Trickster appearance too

Bc that’s the only God we haven’t seen which is honestly a bit odd

Is Ms Flood going to be that?!?

[fallow pendant]

there's a few we haven't seen right?

[molten sorrel]

Bc she’s technically tricked Ruby’s adopted family into thinking she’s nice

[molten sorrel]

Hmmm less sure about that

We’ve seen 3/4 now

The Toymaker

Maestro

Sutekh

[fallow pendant]

didn't they list like, 8 tho lol

[molten sorrel]

I thought it was like 6 ngl

[fallow pendant]

but sutekh's definitely gonna be resolved next episode

[molten sorrel]

Nah I disagree

The Christmas companion is a one off one

There’s gotta be a reason for that

[fallow pendant]

u think sutekh's gonna be villain for 4 episodes?

[fallow pendant]

maybe ruby just goes home for a bit lol

[molten sorrel]

Well no

[fallow pendant]

like amy and rory would

[molten sorrel]

He’s been the villain of whole season lmao

Where have you been

[fallow pendant]

but like, not every episode tho

[molten sorrel]

The way they’re positioning Sutekh is like the new Master role

[fallow pendant]

like there's been the bogeyman, the maestro

[molten sorrel]

So I expect he’ll be the 15th’s main nemesis

Also gives the Master a good rest

[fallow pendant]

but like, 4 straight episodes in a row?

doctor who doesn't really do that

like i'm not saying he won't back, but doctor who's very monster of the week-ey a lot of the time

that's just the format of the show

i doubt they'll wanna drag sutekh being this massive underlying villain past next episode

[molten sorrel]

Nah I’m expecting he won’t be main monster of the Christmas special

[fallow pendant]

altho i kinda find it funny that this season was supposed to be a place where new viewers could tune in and the first villain they've brought back was a niche villain from a fourth doctor story lmaooo

[molten sorrel]

But Season 2 episode 1 might be the resolution

Or aftermath

At the very least it’s the aftermath

[fallow pendant]

nah, no way lol

[molten sorrel]

:/

[fallow pendant]

aftermath maybe

[molten sorrel]

These convos are so reductive when we barely agree lol

[fallow pendant]

but like, there's no way they're gonna wait that long to resolve this lol

[fallow pendant]

i just don't agree, i'm sorry

[uneven grail]

it will be resolved next episode. It's rare for a Christmas ep to not be a stand alone

[fallow pendant]

yeah cause it's gotta be so the whole family could tune in, right?

i think the only exceptions are like, regeneration episodes

so like, end of time, time of the doctor, twice upon a time etc

[thick rampart]

This is true

[molten sorrel]

Nah I’m thinking more partial resolution

Enough to feel like an ending but also opening a new chapter in the Pantheon

Weirdly enough this concept of Gods in Doctor Who is a lot more explored in the non canonical Big Finish audio adventures

[molten sorrel]

Halfway through The Pyramids of Mars serial

It certainly explains a lot

[molten sorrel]

Nearly finished this serial

Tom Baker is such a good Doctor

SJ is honestly quite wooden, she’s better in her spinoff series

[molten sorrel]

Rewatching SJA Trickster’s debut

For those who haven’t sent the spin-off but want to see The Trickster (as he’s part of these Gods)

Whatever Happened to Sarah Jane?

The Temptation of Sarah Jane

The Wedding of Sarah Jane

There might be another two parter which is relevant tbh

But they’re the main three

Most of the Trickster’s origins are explained in the Wedding one

[uneven grail]

love this idea 😄

[molten sorrel]

lmao

ngl I’m hoping for a Trickster appearance in S2 if they ain’t gonna make Ms Flood the new Trickster

He’s always portrayed as this last of his kind type

And if they end up defeating Sutekh then it leaves the door open for other Gods ig to come thru

[uneven grail]

I mean, Mrs Flood could just be another god, hoping the Doc will sort out Sutekh for her

[molten sorrel]

Hmmm yeh

She matches The Queen of Time one better

She could be a version of Trickster thou bc she’s deceived Ruby’s adoptive mum in so that she’s looking after the man

There’s a lot of Gods thou

Pretty sure the DW wiki hasn’t actually got them all there

[uneven grail]

I should hope not. Keep it as a surprise.

Though, I must say, I'm not keen on the Doctor taking on gods. Because every time he's just going to out think or outwit them, which is fine, but you also know it's coming.

Yes, the Doctor is clever, but he'll end up always winning.

(with only an 8 ep run, he has to)

[molten sorrel]

Yeh the episode count is kinda hurting the narratives they can do tbh

[molten sorrel]

Hmm depends I don’t feel like it’s smth they should had a built a whole season around

I think Classic Who actually had a lot of Gods tbh

[uneven grail]

I've never seen Classic Who, tbh

"The Time Window chamber is a great device that UNIT has had secretly hidden away. 
"We've never seen UNIT traveling in time. It's funny, they've never invested in it, and we realized through a bit of dialogue that the Doctor's always forbidden them. 
"It's a means of looking into the past without traveling there by TARDIS. For the Doctor, it's kind of crude."
Davies himself had assumed that the scene would be filmed in front of a green screen, "but our effects guys, who are incredible, actually built it, and used this massive holographic projector! So, when the Doctor and Ruby are standing on it, Ncuti and Millie were actually there."```

that's cool

basically good old fashioned backscreen projection.

[molten sorrel]

Yup

Tbh I love Time Windows

But they are chronically under used until that episode really

I’m presuming it’s bc they can be deadly lol

[uneven grail]

well, could be a matter of (real world) technology.

but also, we don;t get to see much of modern UNIT

[molten sorrel]

Hmmm yeh true hard to portray

[molten sorrel]

Hmm it’s weird thou

Now with the Disney money

That’s where I sorta expect we’d see a spinoff tbh

But there’s been some reports that it’s actually a spinoff around the Sea Devils

Which would be ermmm

An unusual decision to make

[uneven grail]

while I like the idea of a UNIT spin-off, it also very limiting. Why are all these aliens/monsters/mythical beings on Earth (or just in London), you know?

did the SJA ever address that?

[molten sorrel]

A bit more yeh

You’d have to watch the full first series to really get into that

Tbh they essentially say they are an everyday occurrence or at least not that sporadic

[uneven grail]

I can't. It's just too 'family friendly' for me. Not the taget audience 😄

[molten sorrel]

These minor aliens/ time related issues are what SJA attends too

It’s lower stakes aside from The Trickster episodes

[molten sorrel]

Not even like one two parter

It has the 10th Doctor in a rather large role

The Wedding of Sarah Jane

That’s the only one I would suggest viewing

Especially if you ain’t in the demographic

[uneven grail]

I know. but I even tried watching it when it first came out, but it was just too young for me

[molten sorrel]

Tbh it’s aged like slightly off wine

[molten sorrel]

Haha that’s fair I would had been 5 when the first season of it came out

Kinda grew with me

[uneven grail]

yes, I am rather a bit older than you 🤣

[fallow pendant]

yeah i saw a vid on this

it's basically just entirely practical and they put a filter over it in post

it's super cool

it's like, unreal engine generated in real time or something, right?

[uneven grail]

same stuff as the Volume, I believe

[fallow pendant]

honestly the way doctor who has mainly been practical with vfx touch ups is so cool

[uneven grail]

Thats how you spend a budget, imo

[final wind]

i had assumed they had just filmed it in the volume, really cool to know they actually built it

[molten sorrel]

Yeh it’s pretty impressive tbh

Considering what Classic Who monsters are like

And New Who first gen

Thou I love New Who it’s starting to age a lil

[uneven grail]

well, it's never looked that great.

anything fully CGI was always 'off'. Bit on the cartoony side

[fallow pendant]

i think it's still kind of off

like sutekh looks a bit scooby doo

[uneven grail]

ehh, it's TV. I'm not that fussed

it's not like they can make it overly nasty. it's still a family show

[molten sorrel]

Lol disagree

Sutekh was brilliantly realised

[uneven grail]

Fairly certain now that Ruby's 'mother' is just herself putting her baby self in the church. Her mum's going to be someone else entirely

[fallow pendant]

i've heard that theory, yeah

honestly it makes sense to me

it's very doctor who

[runic seal]

Really liked last episode

Looking forward to the finally

Also i think ntuwi gatwa was at his best last week

Starting to warm up more to his version, i like him better than jodie wittika and peter capaldi so far

[uneven grail]

I find him a bit too energetic, tbh. like, there have been a few times where I'm just like 'tone it down a smidge, will ya?'

[final wind]

not a bad theory tbh, but they'd better still tell us who her parents are 😡😡

[fallow pendant]

i think, it makes sense but it'd be slightly underwhelming

like it's SO doctor who for them to do something like that that if it does happen i'd just be like "oh..."

i like the theory that she's river's daughter, but i doubt it's gonna be that because moffat refuses to let anyone else write for river

[final wind]

agreed

[fallow pendant]

i like the theory that she's susan's daughter too, which would make her the doctor's great granddaughter

[final wind]

it makes a lot of sense narratively but would definitely leave me feeling disappointed

[fallow pendant]

yeahhh

i've heard the theory that she's an android which doesn't make any sense

i think i remember hearing the theory that she's a child of sutekh which tbf, could work, but i think would be kind of underwhelming

[torpid iron]

I hope Ruby is River's daughter and Mrs Flood is Susan and also Ruby's daughter so that Ruby is the Doctor's daughter

[fallow pendant]

so i’m rewatching the star beast

towards the end the meep says “just wait til the boss hears about this”

is the boss sutekh?

or is this a different boss

[final wind]

that is the million dollar question

[void pasture]

I thought it was The Toymaker tbh

[molten sorrel]

It’s the same boss lol

[fallow pendant]

it's just like

the way the meep says it, it makes it sound like it's a mob boss

like an alien mob boss who's mafia is a bunch of alien bad guys

which doesn't really work for sutekh

because he's one of the pantheon and if he has a following it's gonna be harbingers, right?

[fallow pendant]

i assumed it was

i just wonder if bringing sutekh back was always russell's plan? or if the boss is a different thing? or if the boss was gonna be something different that fell through?

idk

like sutekh would not care about losing the meep i feel, and it's kind of set up as like "this is someone who would hate to lose an ally" y'know?

[molten sorrel]

The boss was always going to be Sutekh

Unless you believed in a theory that I did

Which it was going to be The Trickster

Bc he essentially used a lot of plot points from Sarah Jane Adventures’s incomplete final season

Which is why I’ve been theorising it would go back to this point

Sky and Ruby are both foundlings

Both have the Trickster theme in them for some reason

Both seasons for some reason have the Pantheon has the over arching theme

Pretty sure S5 of SJA was going to set up this Gods thing

That he’s now placed into the main show

It’s been around since the Pyramids of Mars serial

But mostly in the Big Finish productions

Which are often non canonical

But my viewing experience is drastically different to yours

I’m just glad that Sutekh actually looks menacing

And scary

[fallow pendant]

wait what's this in reference to, sorry you've lost me a bit

is this in reference to the trickster's theme

[molten sorrel]

In reference to this Pantheon of the Gods

[fallow pendant]

oh ok

[molten sorrel]

It’s been around I believe since the 90s

Or 2000s

[fallow pendant]

yeah doctor who's always kind of played around with the idea of gods i think

but i think they're only now making a big deal of it being this set thing

[molten sorrel]

Yes and no

It’s more due to the nature of the Time Lord

Being a God in some societies

That’s the like the ultra traditional lense

Just hoping they haven’t left too much riding on this finale

There’s still an awful lot of things left unresolved

[fallow pendant]

i think they'll probably reveal ruby's mum in the finale

i mean, ig it could be a river song thing and they wait a bit

idk if that'd be as satisfying tho

like u can only set up for so long until it gets tiring from a viewer lense, and if they drag out the snow and ruby mentioning that she doesn't have a mum and all this mystery for another season it might get kind of annoying

but in terms of big finish i am not a fan lmao

[molten sorrel]

I mean I think they have dragged a lot out this season

Like they haven’t really answered why it snows around Ruby

[uneven grail]

its been 8 episodes. that's not that long for a season arc

[molten sorrel]

How is that happening

It’s not a Foundling thing lol

[fallow pendant]

but like, i'm saying if they do this for another season

[molten sorrel]

Probably not

Bc the companion change

Ruby’s back for like 2-3 episodes

I believe

[final wind]

i think you're reading way too much into a single line of dialogue lol

[molten sorrel]

That’s all

[fallow pendant]

wait how do we know this

[fallow pendant]

fair enough

it just kind of confuses me more than anything and on a rewatch it kinda bugs me

[molten sorrel]

Ermmm… sources that I can’t publicly disclose

Since its leaks

[fallow pendant]

oh

[molten sorrel]

So slight spoiler

[fallow pendant]

isn't ruby leaving after a few episodes a spoiler then lol

[molten sorrel]

Idk

Depends how sensitive a person is to info lol

You wouldn’t know unless you’ve seen the set pics

That were circulating on Twitter a month or so ago lol

[fallow pendant]

i think if it's not released by the bbc it's a spoiler imo

[final wind]

let's go ahead and not discuss leaks here

[fallow pendant]

yeahhhh

but like, u mentioned big finish earlier, i wonder what u guys think about it

icl i'm really not a fan

[final wind]

what is big finish

[fallow pendant]

but like, some ppl love it

[fallow pendant]

they're those radio dramas

[final wind]

ohhh those

i haven't consumed any of them

[fallow pendant]

me neither

but some of the stories they've done just make no sense

[molten sorrel]

I wasn’t going to discuss it further lol

I don’t really see the point of audio dramas personally

I’d rather have a book

With the option to have audio on the side lol

[final wind]

give me more doctor who comics

i love comics

[fallow pendant]

i think it's just a fun thing that entertain some fans

[molten sorrel]

Emphasis on some

[fallow pendant]

but like, there's a big finish series called the diary of river song

and it makes no fucking sense lmao

like it's literally river meeting classic who doctors

but in silence in the library, river says 10 is the youngest she's seen the doctor and 10 doesn't know who river is

and then she dies

so like

how does this work

[final wind]

i dont think all the stories are canon

[molten sorrel]

What episode did she die in?

[final wind]

but it doesnt hurt to have some extra doctor who-related content to consume

[molten sorrel]

Capaldi one

I wanna say

But can’t remember lol

[final wind]

the very first time we meet her

[fallow pendant]

no she died at the end of silence in the library

[molten sorrel]

Ohhhh

[final wind]

the library one with 10

[molten sorrel]

Yeh

[final wind]

that episode was kinda creepy

[molten sorrel]

The one with astronaunt skeleton lad

[final wind]

yeeee

[fallow pendant]

yeah it's probs not canon

just kinda bugs me

[molten sorrel]

So did River Song travel back to 10 after seeing 13 or smth

[fallow pendant]

i get that it's just fan service for ppl who like that kinda stuff tho

[molten sorrel]

How comes we see her with Capaldi and Smith a lot lol

When’s she died

I think I’m having a brain fart lol

[fallow pendant]

capaldi was the last time the doctor saw river before she went back to see 10

cause capaldi gave river her sonic that she uses in silence in the library

and in silence in the library she mentions their last time together on darillium, which is where the end of husbands of river song's set

[final wind]

buddy

the whole show is about time travel

the point is that the doctor keeps meeting river in reverse chronological order

[fallow pendant]

wibbly wobbly 😎 ✌️

[molten sorrel]

OHHHHH

[final wind]

timey wimey

[molten sorrel]

True

I’m probably older than the both of you lol

[fallow pendant]

i'm 19

[molten sorrel]

I’m 21

[final wind]

im 20

[fallow pendant]

that's not too much older tbf

[molten sorrel]

Last time I watched Tenant’s arcs would of been like 7-8 years ago

[final wind]

more than that

[molten sorrel]

Maybe slightly less

[final wind]

15+ years ago

[molten sorrel]

I used to rewatch a lot more often lol

[fallow pendant]

honestly silence in the library is a top 5 episode for me of all time lol

[molten sorrel]

Clearly you missed my point lol

[fallow pendant]

like it's sooo good

[final wind]

tennant became the doctor in 2005 or 2006

[molten sorrel]

It would be if The Waters of Mars didn’t exist

[final wind]

wait im stupid

[molten sorrel]

When I was 3

[final wind]

i actually cant read

[fallow pendant]

i'm just saying my personal top 5

[molten sorrel]

And I rewatched his stuff when I was 6/7

[final wind]

i just watched all of nuwho a couple years ago

minus a lot of 13

[fallow pendant]

my top 5 is probs

1. girl in the fireplace
2. blink
3. heaven sent
4. silence in the library

and then maybe day of the doctor number 5?

oh no, utopia number 5

[molten sorrel]

I agree with your top 2

They would be my top 2 too

[final wind]

girl in the fireplace is great

[molten sorrel]

3rd is hard tbh

[final wind]

obviously blink is iconic

[molten sorrel]

1. girl in the fireplace
2. blink
3. doomsday

Probably

Doomsday is the one DW that I have tears I can’t stop

Might be one of the most perfect finales

[final wind]

im not great at remembering episode titles, which one is doomsday?

[fallow pendant]

that's the one where rose gets sucked to that parallel universe

the one where the cybermen fight the daleks and there's torchwood and stuff

i think it's a great episode, i personally wouldn't put in anywhere near my top 10 tho lol

i don't even think that's the best from that series

but

to each their own

[molten sorrel]

:/

Tbf you’d put a Jodie Whitaker episode in your top 10

[fallow pendant]

literally when lol, i don't even like any whittaker episode

[final wind]

oh that one, yeah doomsday is good

i like how later throughout the show, no one seems to remeber the daleks invading earth

[fallow pendant]

yeahhh

nerds get really pissy about that

[final wind]

like even the doctor comments on how weird it is lmao

[fallow pendant]

"erm actually they'd know what a dalek is cause of the torchwood invasion of 2006 " it's literally a 60 year old show, like

[final wind]

i am perfectly fine accepting that somehow nobody noticed the space aliens invading for a bit

[fallow pendant]

same honestly

like i don't really watch doctor who for it's continuity anyways

[final wind]

people get way too pissy about continuity

[fallow pendant]

yeahhhh

nerds suck

[final wind]

personally, i think that if a small retcon allows you to tell a better story, then go for it

its literally a show about time travel

its so easy to explain slight differences in continuity

[fallow pendant]

i mean, this entire thing ruins the continuity of the show

like the way these never come back proves that u shouldn't care too much about continuity in doccy who lol

[final wind]

if you're watching doctor who for continuity, you've already made a mistake lmao

[fallow pendant]

lol

[fallow pendant]

which i get comes off as hypocritical coming from me who just moaning about how this makes no sense

but

y'know

[molten sorrel]

Hmm not just them lol

The Shakespeare one with the Doctor and Martha

[fallow pendant]

ik yeah, was just an example

[molten sorrel]

I swear that villain was meant to have more effect on continuity

[fallow pendant]

oh yeah, the doctor saying "good ol jk"

bit concerning

[molten sorrel]

Tbh the show works better thru an anthological perspective

If you take each season singularly

Continuity and arcs generally stick

[fallow pendant]

i don't see it as each season, but i see it as each doctor being a soft reboot of the show

like if u start at series 2 or series 5 or series 8 or 11, honestly it shouldn't really matter too much?

cause, unless i'm having a real dumb moment rn, i don't think each doctor's continuity crosses over too much

like they're their own stories

[final wind]

i mean they are literally calling this "season 1"

this one especially is meant as a soft reboot

each doctor has their own arc

[molten sorrel]

Hmmm aside from the River Song stuff we were discussing earlier

Yeh there’s not too much

And The Master doesn’t usually cross between more than one Doctor

Another thing never explained is how on earth they regenerate perfectly at the same time

Lol

I mean one Tenant Master appearance in Capaldi’s arc

Outside of that yeh not much

[unique summit]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doctor_Who#Chronology_and_canonicity

The BBC takes no position on the canonicity of any of such stories, and producers of the show have expressed distaste for the idea of canonicity.

[final wind]

yeah i think worrying about canon and continuity within doctor who is a waste of time lol

[charred wedge]

Game day!

hopefully this season can stick the landing tonight

cliffhangers till christmas are not welcome tonight

[final wind]

i mean i dont see sutekh being defeated in one episode

but at least tell us who her mom is and i'll be happy

[charred wedge]

Sutekh doesnt have to be defeated, just no cliffhangers till christmas

[fallow pendant]

https://youtu.be/7Gr0NS291YQ?si=PpU3LFuWNy7tWBZH

YEARS old discussion at this point but i just found this great video talking about chibnall's regressive politics in doctor who, specifically talking about kerblam, and comparing it to it's 50 something year progressive politics. specifically in the second half comparing it to oxygen, the capaldi episode

honestly kind of perfectly illustrates what i really hated about chibnall's run on the show

[charred wedge]

Late crackpot theory... ||Ruby is the Eye of Horus (the large red gem that imprisoned Sutekh at the start of Pyramids of Mars) in human form... somehow ||

[fallow pendant]

||ok it is kind of funny that there were all of these crazy theories on rubys mum only for her to just be some woman||

probs gonna be an unpopular opinion but that second half was uhhhh

kind of underwhelming

and i'm not just saying that because a theory didn't come true or anything before someone says "ur just mad river's not the mum" or something

i just think a lot happened in legend of ruby sunday, and in comparison, not a lot really happened in empire of death

lmk when u guys see it what u think, cause i'm curious to know if anyone else was kind of underwhelmed

so like, what was the singing thing then

if she's just a normal human girl what was that song that she was singing when the maestro had her in the air and stuff

and they said that the doctor dealt with sutekh before by chucking him into the vortex and then sutekh clinged on

but like...

||that's how they got rid of him again, he got dumped in the vortex again. so how could the doctor be like "yeah, i've definitely killed him this time"||

[fallow pendant]

i feel like that's kind of a cinemasins point, but it just kinda doesn't make sense to me

[charred wedge]

disappointed we got no ||Mrs Flood revelation and no Susan. Carole Ann Ford is like fucking 84. Ae they going to wait till she's 100?||

[final wind]

i just had to say something, huh

[void pasture]

Bruh

Welp immense anticipation for Christmas now i guess