#ot1-perplexing-regexing

1 messages · Page 379 of 1

shell raptor
#

ADTs are stuff like:

type class User = AuthenticatedUser | AnonymousUser

type class Maybe a = Just a | Nothing

type class Book = {title : String, author : String, releaseYear : Int}
lime gazelle
#

chemistry is to biology what programming is to maths (spelled wrong, probably)

#

@shell raptor hm..I only understand the object thingy

shell raptor
#

Well, Haskell and many other languages, especially other functional languages, borrow from category theory. I tried watching Category Theory for Programmers by Bartosz Milewski, and I got confused at the 10th video or so

# 
divide_numbers x y = 
    case (x, y) of
      (_, 0) ->
          Nothing
      (x, y) ->
          {- division logic -}
          Just divisionResult
#

Basically, the first two are 'union types'.

lime gazelle
#

what's with that Just?

shell raptor
#

In pure functional languages, there are no exceptions. But you have to report errors somehow.
So the division function can't just return an integer. It should either communicate a successful result or communicate a failure.

#

It's roughly equivalent to this:

#

!e

def divide(x, y):
    if y == 0:
        return (False, None)
    else:
        return (True, x / y)

print(divide(35, 7))
print(divide(1, 0))
royal lakeBOT
#

@shell raptor :white_check_mark: Your eval job has completed with return code 0.

001 | (True, 5.0)
002 | (False, None)
lime gazelle
#

Okie, that sounds correct

#

so how do you do stuff like error handling without exceptions?

shell raptor
#

Well, like this.

#

^

#

You can have a more complicated error than Nothing

lime gazelle
#

Return True or False?

#

Oh ok

shell raptor
#

!e

def divide(x, y):
    if y == 0:
        return {"status": "error", "cause": f"Division by zero: {x}/{y}"}
    else:
        return {"status": "ok",    "result": x / y}

print(divide(35, 7))
print(divide(1, 0))
royal lakeBOT
#

@shell raptor :white_check_mark: Your eval job has completed with return code 0.

001 | {'status': 'ok', 'result': 5.0}
002 | {'status': 'error', 'cause': 'Division by zero: 1/0'}
shell raptor
#

This approach is also useful in C because it doesn't have a built-in exception system.

#

You can return a struct with two fields.

lime gazelle
#

GWgoaThinken wdym it doesn't?

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Boo!

shell raptor
#

Does it?

lime gazelle
#

I don't know

#

I don't know C, I'm asking you GWpinkuSadOtato

shell raptor
#

I'm pretty sure it doesn't.

lime gazelle
#

it was more like a "really?"

#

like, baffled

shell raptor
#

You can create your own exception system/framework, of course.

lime gazelle
#

C is not as fun as I thought it was.

#

Not even exceptions?

shell raptor
#

Personally, I don't like exceptions.

lime gazelle
#

Why?

rough sapphire
#

I'm not too fond of them either

shell raptor
#

It kinda breaks the control flow.

def f():
    try:
        data = fetch_from_db()
    except DatabaseError:
        something
        return None

def g():
    data = fetch_from_db()
    if data.is_error():
        return None
    something
    # or
    fetch_from_db().on_success(fn1).on_error(fn2)
rough sapphire
#

I quite enjoy how Go solves this issue

undone berry
#

Yeah, I prefer the Go way to normal exceptions as well

lime gazelle
#

I never really got annoyed at exceptions

#

maybe because C# uses them and I'm used to just try/catch everything

shell raptor
#

I hate exceptions so much I built my own pipeline system in Python that borrows Result from FP languages.

#

So that I can return a normal value or a special Error value if something goes wrong.

#

Then I can use a wrapper that wraps around a repository or something like that, and when the repository raises an Exception, it gets transformed into Error automatically.

lime gazelle
#

I understood very little GWpinkuSadOtato

#

I don't know enough

#

I need to learn C

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to know more

#

Is it wrong to call C the "fuck you, build it yourself" language?

shell raptor
#

Let's say I have some repository (a component that provides an interface to a database):

class Repo:
    ...
    def get_user_by_uid(self, user_id): ...
    def get_users_by_city(self, city): ...

(or it could be a dict with endpoints as keys and functions as values)

Then you connect a wrapper:

@SomeWrapper
class WrappedRepo:
    ...

And if this call would result in a DatabaseError:

plain_repo.get_user_by_uid(-3)
# DatabaseError: No user for this uid

Then a WrappedRepo would return an error value:

wrapped_repo.get_user_by_uid(-3)
>>> Error("Invalid UID: -3")
#

@lime gazelle I think it's pretty accurate.

#

You can create so much stuff with C.

lime gazelle
#

Same with Rust though

shell raptor
#

I wish it had better metaprogramming support.

lime gazelle
#

Rust just seems like C/C++ but better

#

and less hard to write

#

Anything that C/C++ can do, Rust in theory should be able to do too?

#

Also, if C++ can go embedded why do people still use C for embedded?

shell raptor
#

I guess it generates less code even if you include some of the stdlib. But I can be wrong.

#

Also, C can compile on more devices.

#

And, well

#

Python is written in C, not C++

lime gazelle
#

I just look at C code and I'm like "so much, for so little"

#

But GWhurpyShrug I'm no expert. Maybe there's a reason for it?

#

I mean yeah, I know the language is smaller

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so most of the things are up to you

#

but wouldn't that make for some ugly and inefficient code?

shell raptor
#

Well, assembly is most of the things are up to you.

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C even has types.

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except void*

lime gazelle
#

yeah but does anyone write assembly anymore?

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No, that'd be pointless

shell raptor
#

Well, if the device you're writing code for doesn't have a C compiler yet.

lime gazelle
#

I mean

#

yes

shell raptor
#

Or if it's like... 512 bytes of ROM

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Or less

lime gazelle
#

I hope I'll never have to do it

rough sapphire
#

this dude has half a kilobyte of ram? look at mr rich here

shell raptor
#

Not RAM, ROM

#

sorry

#

32 B of RAM is enough.

#

Some people also write assembly for fun

rough sapphire
#

there's entire games around that concept

shell raptor
lime gazelle
#

I mean

#

Tis is very fun

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and frustrating

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I never completed it

rough sapphire
#

TIS-100 is a fun one

shell raptor
#

I bought TIS-100, but I haven't really played it that much

rough sapphire
#

recommend looking into it

lime gazelle
#

yupz, super fun

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I don't remember where I got stuck

shell raptor
#

(to be honest, I like opus magnum more)

lime gazelle
#

early levels though

#

what's magnum opus?

rough sapphire
#

have yet to play that

shell raptor
#

wrong word order...

lime gazelle
#

doesn't look like asm

#

Shenzen I/O looks fun

shell raptor
#

(it uses flash which is kinda deprecated nowadays)

lime gazelle
#

Shit it's midnight and I haven't watched eithee videos GWpinkuSadOtato

#

But now I feel hyped about C so I'll watch the roguelike

shell raptor
#

Building a CPU out of logic gates is fun as well.

#

There is an entire series about that made by Ben Eater.

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You can even build it virtually, using logisim. Sadly, it hasn't been updated since 2011.

#

I've wanted to make something like logisim that would actually be not dead.

lime gazelle
#

ben eater is a god

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But I like ferris more. He's a streamer

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He did this shit

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which is..just...how the fuck

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I haven't watched it cause I don't want to feel dumber

pine vector
#

FPGAs are pretty sweet. but...Verilog/VHDL. 😬

rough sapphire
lime gazelle
#

GWpinkuSadOtato I think I might watch that instead if the C roguelike

#

and be like "why am I so stupid"

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cause that's how it makes me feel lol. He be so good it makes me feel dumber than a rock.

shell raptor
#

Building something yourself sometimes can reverse that.

hazy marlin
#

Yeah, Itsn't probably the best place for asking, but does anybody know a good java script course?

#

free

quaint rivet
#

w3schools?

sand goblet
#

Mozilla developer network has tutorials as well

#

They're usually referred to as a better w3schools when you talk about learners

undone berry
#

Personally I think w3schools is better structured for people who are coming in from scratch

rough sapphire
#

@hazy marlin Codecademy

hazy marlin
#

Omg, Codecademu, w3schools, Mozilla developer netwok, I'll take a look at all of them, thank you

quaint rivet
#

i had a really bad experience with codeacademy haha

#

i mean maybe they re-structured it, but they would cover one concept and then do almost no reinforcement exercises before moving onto the next thing

#

this was years ago though, i imagine its much better these days

rough sapphire
#

It's considerably better, and they've got Pro

hazy marlin
opal timber
#

I like freecodecamp more than codecademy but I've only done a couple of the courses

#

freecodecamp lets you jump around so you can learn only what you need to. When I tried codecademy (quite a few years ago) it held your hand and the speed was incredibly slow

rough sapphire
#

Codecademy has paths you can take

#

So if you want to do web development for example, it'll have you do HTML/CSS/JavaScript.

drowsy rose
#

aaaaaaaaaa

rough sapphire
#

what

#

?_?

#

xD oki

#

e

royal lakeBOT
#

:x: According to my records, this user already has a mute infraction. See infraction #6489.

#

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied mute to @drowsy rose until 2020-04-08 04:57 (9 minutes and 59 seconds) (reason: burst rule: sent 8 messages in 10s).

rough sapphire
#

oop

karmic lintel
#

ouch

karmic lintel
#

ok back

#

sry was eating lunch

bright swallow
#

wb

deep saffron
#

bit late to the party, but yeah zachtronic games are cool, own tis-100, exapunks and shenzen-io and like all of em

quaint rivet
#

forget the name but i have one, chem-something, didnt play much of it though

tardy haven
#

How do u create a triggered gif using python

#

like there's a selectable image

#

and then u create a triggered gif

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using python

rough sapphire
#

like, on a webpage?

lime gazelle
#

@shell raptor agreed, and I will learn stuff. I just have to hunker down and actually learn. That's a big oof, cause there are so many cool things to do!

lime gazelle
#

I can't decide on which one to focus, there are too many. Game engines, emulator, there's a standford class for making an operating system (with labs and explanations so that's super duper nice)

#

I can't decide GWpinkuSadOtato

glass gorge
lime gazelle
#

I tried that, but I keep finding cool stuff to watch and learn

glass gorge
#

I can't decide if or when i should sell out of the stock market today lemon_grumpy

#

I'm not super comfortable sitting on $1300 in stocks throughout easter when the markets are closed

lime gazelle
#

GWgoaThinken sell

glass gorge
#

But they're not my desired $ :(

lime gazelle
#

I mean, that's what everyone's gonna do

#

Better sell now rather than later when they'll be worth shit

glass gorge
#

Fair point, but at least 2 or 3 of these will end in a loss then

#

cause of the fees

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4 actually

lime gazelle
#

I don't know economics or stock market tactics

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But I do know one thing: people sell things, things are not worth much

rough sapphire
#

not true, if people are selling, it might be worth buying

lime gazelle
#

also, you could sit on them until this crisis stops, and ride the high

glass gorge
#

I was thinking about buying later today / tomorrow

rough sapphire
#

:stonks:

glass gorge
#

I am riding the stonks atm

rough sapphire
#

currently sitting on around 1400 eur of stonks

glass gorge
#

This is roughly what all my stonks look like atm on the 6 months graph

📎 unknown.png
rough sapphire
#

we'll see how the tides rise or fall

#

I only bought a few weeks ago

glass gorge
#

Same

lime gazelle
#

Booo stock markets are like casinos

glass gorge
#

For a lot they are

lime gazelle
#

That's how I always viewed them

glass gorge
#

but at least you can attempt to predict them, compared to a slots machine

rough sapphire
#

I'd say stocks can be a fair bit fairer

#

casinos tend to be rigged

#

the house always wins, etc

glass gorge
#

Like, the airshuttles firm I just sold out of for a 20% gain could have been a 500% gain when covid19 pandemic ended.. but there are rumors of them going bankrupt

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If they go bankrupt that $200 gone

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so ill take my 20% instead then

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Can always buy in later if there are good news again

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Time for a r/wallstreetbets

lime gazelle
#

ah yes, the best stock market players

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GUH

rough sapphire
#

they closed down Germanwings

glass gorge
#

Many airlines doing bad

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Just natural

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Except maybe american ones, based on that live airplane tweet i saw recently :')

deep saffron
#

well i think we can be pretty sure about where american business intrests are ... profit or people? (hint: it's not the people)

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but, god help us and save us from the commie threat of worker unions ...

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if you want rights you should have paid the people who make the laws more, than what business pay them ... thats how the free market regulates everything

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i feel like the commie version of dr. strangelove failing to supress his outbursts :D sry for the rant

rough sapphire
#

I dont know about that

#

the US just highjacked shipments to Italy, France and Germany..

#

they also secured drug supplies by threatening india

plucky ridge
rough sapphire
#

seems like they're taking pretty good care of their people, at least to a certain extent.. and won't leave any stone unturned

plucky ridge
#

The tweet wasn't actually accurate or correct

glass gorge
plucky ridge
#

Sure, but it still showed Europe's airspace as being damn near empty, which is clearly false

#

Both Europe and China are still very active

glass gorge
#

Might've been from before? They recently started airing planes again

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atleast in norway

rough sapphire
#

flights sometimes have to continue flying empty, they need to keep their slots

plucky ridge
#

I looked the same day the tweet was made, so I don't know

glass gorge
#

¯_(ツ)_/¯

deep saffron
#

depends on the time, america could still be active, when over here everyone is sleeping

rough sapphire
#

there's also cargo traffic and military

glass gorge
#

Guess im a sheeple for believing a tweet

plucky ridge
#

Well one of the first replies to that tweet was a link to flight tracker.

#

Soooooo

glass gorge
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I never clickedi n

rough sapphire
#

I just found out today.. that Mark Cuban is President

plucky ridge
#

🐑

glass gorge
#

just watched it in discord with the embed

rough sapphire
#

in Sharknado3

plucky ridge
#

Baad boy

rough sapphire
#

is a Ram a sheep

plucky ridge
#

I mean typed :sheep:, so if it came out as a ram that's on Discord or whatever font is being used

rough sapphire
#

I thought it was a mountain goat.. sorta thing

#

ahh

#

so a ram is a kind of male sheep.. huh.. more you know

plucky ridge
#

Neat

rough sapphire
#

lol

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🐐

plucky ridge
#

Yeah I think rams are typically curlier

#

Like Tim the Enchanter from Monty Python and the Holy Grail

rough sapphire
#

I haven't seen the movie since I was a kid

plucky ridge
#

Oh my god, they're still there

rough sapphire
#

whats that

plucky ridge
#

Hot air balloons

#

Flight tracker will even track those

rough sapphire
#

wow.. never knew that before

lime gazelle
#

Hello! Does anyone know a good DosBox technical writeup?

#

Like how does it work etc etc

#

Idk what to google "How does dosbox works" just shows me tutorials on how to run games on dosbox.

glass gorge
#

Wikipedia?

#

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOSBox

DOSBox

DOSBox is an emulator program which emulates an IBM PC compatible computer running a DOS operating system. Many IBM PC compatible graphics and sound cards are also emulated. This means that original DOS programs (including PC games) are provided with an environment in which th...

lime gazelle
#

GWeniSadNeko sorry

opal timber
#

It's also open source if you wanted to torture yourself and look through all the code

quaint rivet
#

anyone who's into fighting games able to recommend one? i own blazblue CF but have never played it outside of a few tutorials, injustice 2 is on sale which i think i could get into.

thorn snow
#

but also not very easy

quaint rivet
#

i guess im looking for babys first beat em up

#

i really have almost no experience with them aside from some turbo street fighter on the sega genesis decades ago haha

thorn snow
#

I mean, Batman could be considered a fighting game too, but it isn't the conventional left <-> right fight

#

it's a rythm based brawler/fighter

#

but I guess injustice is as good as any, didn't play it though

#

I am inherently bad at games like Streetfighter 😄

quaint rivet
#

same, i have to do something about my cabin fever though haha

#

might as well try to get good at a new genre

frosty berry
#

smash bros!

#

(it's more technical than it looks, but it's fun to get started with anyway)

quaint rivet
#

it would have to be obtainable through steam haha

frosty berry
#

fight games on pc? do these exist?

quaint rivet
#

why would they not exist

sand goblet
#

There is a game like that for PC

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I'm trying to remember what it's called

quaint rivet
#

brawlhalla

sand goblet
#

Oh yeah

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Slap City

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It's a pretty wacky smash bros clone

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Of course dunkey did a video

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Haha

quaint rivet
#

funny video, looks awful to play though lol

#

i grabbed the definitive injustice 1&2 editions dunno
was like $20 for 2 games and about $160 in dlc, seemed like a steal

hazy marlin
#

Well guys, yesterday I asked you some JS course tips, I started one but, omg it sucks, it's almost the same as python, there is any way of see how X thing in python may be done using JS?

rough sapphire
#

@hazy marlin Which one did you start?

hazy marlin
rough sapphire
#

So, I'm going repose my question here since there isnt an active conversation. And my topic is JS...

#

I need a JavaScript book that understands that I want to use as little JavaScript in my application as possible.

I'm looking at these books and I'm seeing a mix of extremely outdated, skipping over basics to talk about new features, and "Modern Architecture from the ground Up Your Entire Application Front to Back in JS"

I dont want that. I want a book that has a sensible approach to JavaScript as a front end language. Any recs?

#

I'm thinking I have two options: Purposely learn JavaScript from an old book from before people were using it to do everything, so that I can use it to extend my Flask application in various ways

#

Or... I can learn it from a new book that is going to assume I need JavaScript a lot more than I do.

#

I should point out that I already familiar with basic syntax. I just need practice.

opal timber
#

I know an online resource that has python in mind for web app development but goes over JavaScript, AJAX, jQuery, etc. It uses Bottle which is very similar to Flask afaik

rough sapphire
#

Thanks. There was a great Flask By Example thing I was doing on realpython until it randomly jumped into Angular. And I dont know JS well enough to use Angular. It was sort of just like, "Hey, use this angular"

#

I'll skip the parts about Python and just look at ths JS parts. I already know Python well enough to not need books anymore. But thanks.

opal timber
#

of course. I hope you find it helpful

#

if you have any issues with making it into a pdf just dm me

rough sapphire
#

I might just read it off the web, if it has all the content this is good for me.

opal timber
#

cool cool

rough sapphire
#

Was bottle a precursor to Flask?

#

Bottle doesn't have nearly as many of additional third-party packages for it

#

Actually, this might be helpful to me because it is talking about JavaScript from the perspective of someone who uses Python.

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And that might be exactly what I need

rough sapphire
#

JavaScript makes me less angry when I understand the reasons for things. For example, always seeing this

(function() {
  //code
})()

has always made me go wtf

#

But reading why they have that makes me feel less wtf

undone berry
#

if you're writing modern code - you probably shouldn't really be seeing that

rough sapphire
#

I'm not.

undone berry
#

(() => {code})()

rough sapphire
#

ahh right.

#

So, why is that better?

sand goblet
#

Closures like that aren't necessarily needed these days

#

But yeah, they're a thing

rough sapphire
#

I see it all the time

undone berry
#

At least in part its prettier syntax

rough sapphire
#

To be honest, I dont really see a way to concern myself with "modern JS" without being forced into what I call "Modern Architecture from the ground Up Your Entire Application Front to Back in JS"

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I will eventually get to it because obviously its also in use everywhere

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That is really one of hardest parts of JS is that there is so much variation of it in use everywhere

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I just need to learn the basics of it.

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The fundamental things about it

undone berry
#

When you're writing python - I assume you try and write idiomatic python, its easier to maintain and after a while easier to write. I don't see why you'd approach JS differently unless you were only ever using it for hacky copy paste jobs

rough sapphire
#

Right.

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I am interested in idiomatic code.

sand goblet
#

Basically, there have been lots of new things added relatively recently and some of those things are syntactical

#

That's why you're seeing differences

rough sapphire
#

Yeah Ive seen a lot of that.

sand goblet
#

The other approaches are just, well, old

rough sapphire
#

And theyre also everywhere.

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So.. I dont really understand the mentality of not learning them

sand goblet
#

You'd expect that, yeah, but you don't need to learn them

#

Focus on writing your own code first

rough sapphire
#

Right

sand goblet
#

Once you have that down, you can use the older styles to learn to read other people's code

rough sapphire
#

Im used to using other peoples JS more than writing it. I write Python but thats why my JS is lacking

sand goblet
#

Also eslint helps a lot

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But if you thought linters in python were strict

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Well sonny Jim, you ain't seen shit yet

#

Because holy balls is eslint on your ass all the time

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It's worth it though

rough sapphire
#

I wouldnt mind that. I'll check it out. So, let's say I jump right into ES6. Is there a way to do that without being taught to write backend in node? Without frameworks that will be dead tomorrow?

sand goblet
#

I mean, yeah?

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Browsers support it too

rough sapphire
#

I know that its possible. Its just hard to find someone who uses JS who doesn't use JS for everything.

sand goblet
#

You mean people like me?

rough sapphire
#

I'm not judging. You can do what you want. I dont want to.

undone berry
#

Do you mean using JS for everything on the frontend?

sand goblet
#

I don't do backend js

rough sapphire
#

No, I mean using it for everything.

sand goblet
#

Fuck that noise

undone berry
#

Then IMO thats most people

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That includes me

sand goblet
#

Don't get me wrong

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JS is useful

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Es6 has tons of great stuff in it

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And I write a lot of JS

undone berry
#

Tutorials and stuff are mostly all JS because the market for JS/Python is much smaller than pure JS

sand goblet
#

But I don't like JS

rough sapphire
#

I dont enjoy the ecosystem at all. I agree. I hate every moment of it.

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But at the same time like you said its useful

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and I need to know it to do certain things

sand goblet
#

I don't hate it

rough sapphire
#

But I dont want to rely on it.

sand goblet
#

But there are a lot of weird quirks

undone berry
#

What do you hate about it?

sand goblet
#

Although I agree the ecosystem sucks

rough sapphire
#

I hate it now because I have a tendecy to resist new things when Im attached to what I like. I have meta-thought around this enough to know that and that's how I am.

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I hate the ecosystem and I hate over reliance on it to do things that dont need it.

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As a user.

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Not as a programmer

sand goblet
#

This here is a package.json I wrote

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It has around 31 dependencies in it

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If you actually install this package.json you will be downloading and installing around 700 individual dependencies

rough sapphire
#

Dude, I installed a boilerplate from node that was like create-react-app or something

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I was blown away

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It was like it downloaded the entire package manager

sand goblet
#

Haha

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Yeah, it's.. Something, alright

rough sapphire
#

Yeah that was what made me not want to play with it anymore.

sand goblet
#

My complaints about the ecosystem largely stem from this problem and the people that perpetuate it on purpose

rough sapphire
#

I decided that Id rather just learn vanilla/es6

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no framework.

#

At least not yet

sand goblet
#

And don't get me wrong

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People are doing this on purpose

rough sapphire
#

Why would they do that? Im not denying im curious to know whyu

sand goblet
#

Because they've realised that "Maintains 50 NPM packages with millions of downloads a month" looks good on a CV

rough sapphire
#

Assholes.

#

I hate npm

sand goblet
#

And employers don't drill down and see that this guy wrote is-even and is-odd

undone berry
#

I think its very few assholes

sand goblet
#

It's very few assholes

undone berry
#

like, the is-even/odd guy is responsible for half of my NPM hate

sand goblet
#

But it is a lot of packages

#

Yeah, pretty much

rough sapphire
#

Wow

#

I had no idea about that

sand goblet
#

If you inspect your dependency tree then you probably have at least a few of his in there

#

Regardless of what you're actually doing

undone berry
#

If you're using webpack, you're using is-odd. Which itself relies on the excellent package is-number. Its depressing

sand goblet
#

Yep, and if you're doing frontend, you probably need webpack

#

Webpack itself is fantastic by the way

#

I wish IDE support for its paradigms was a little better

rough sapphire
#

Wow.

sand goblet
#

But jetbrains will get to that eventually I expect

rough sapphire
#

so those are real packages

sand goblet
#

Yes they are

rough sapphire
#

One of the things I wanted to use from npm was constructed with webpack and I couldnt figure it out easily. I finnagled it into working somehow that I dont understand. That's what JS is like for me and its probably largely responsible for my feelings about it. I need to just take the time to understand it and it will probably irritate me a lot less.

sand goblet
#

Are you making use of NPM?

rough sapphire
#

I just dont enjoy it as much so the obsessive part of me that has read everything I can find to read about Python for example doesnt extend to it.

undone berry
#

Christ - Google lead me to a guy on hackernews defending is-odd https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16901188

suprfnk

I am absolutely flabbergasted that the is-odd package on NPM [1] was downloaded 3 million times last week. In any project, a check for an odd number would half the time not even have its own function.Even an aggressive build server that redownloads and builds 50 times a da...

Hacker News ·
rough sapphire
#

I used npm to try a couple packages.

#

I dont make use of it.

#

Ive played with it

sand goblet
#

I use NPM too

#

So that makes us both idiots because supposedly we should be using yarn

undone berry
#

NPM is easy to use. IMO easier than pip

rough sapphire
#

I was wondering if that was a better ecosystem but i was told it was no better

undone berry
#

but the ecosystem is definitely a bit borked

rough sapphire
#

Its not that npm is bad as software. Its the ecosysem.

sand goblet
#

Yarn is just another package manager

#

It still uses the npm package registry

opal timber
#

lol at the guy explaining what a package manager is for no reason

sand goblet
#

It could well be the guy that wrote the package

#

There's no good reason to actually use it

opal timber
#

imagine releasing a python module just to check if a number is odd

sand goblet
#

Well, there are some differences

#

Python is strongly typed

#

You can try the modulo in JS and it'll always try to return some value

#

It won't error if you have eg a string

#

So the checks are necessary to a point, but you should always know what it is you're working with regardless

opal timber
#

sounds like such a mess

undone berry
sand goblet
#

I mean you can tell from the blurb that it's bullshit haha

#

Probably not worth the click

undone berry
#

yeah - I did laugh at the "Don't let the trolls get you down" - and that seems to be the predominant tone

sand goblet
#

Well see that's the thing isn't it

#

We don't like how this guy exploits the ecosystem so that makes us trolls, you see

#

It's true that a lot of these packages should have been part of the standard library

opal timber
#

is-even
I created this in 2014, when I was learning how to program.

sand goblet
#

The solution to that problem is a large package, maybe call it

#

I dunno

#

Kitchen

#

Which is literally what happened with python 2

undone berry
#

Yeah, if this guy was acting in good faith, he'd condense a bunch of these tiny libraries down into one big thing and suggest that as the package others should use as their dependency; not 837 random shit libraries

sand goblet
#

Yeah.

#

Wonder if anyone has done that yet

opal timber
#

the funniest part is that is-even depends on is-odd

#

just why

undone berry
#

this is the package that tilted me off the earth - his array flatten package that talks about being as fast as possible is literally the most basic implementation you could think of https://github.com/jonschlinkert/arr-flatten

#

51m downloads

pine vector
opal timber
sand goblet
#

That one is yeah

opal timber
# 
const _isTenThousand = function(val) {
  return (
    !isOdd(val) &&
    val !== five &&
    val !== two &&
    val !== five.negative &&
    !isTen(val) &&
    !isThirteen(val).thirteen() &&
    isNotThirteen(val) &&
    !isZero.isZero(val) &&
    !isMultipleOfThreeAndFive(val) &&
    !isArray(val) &&
    isNumber(val) &&
    !isString(val) &&
    isString(val.toString()) &&
    !isObj(val) &&
    isObj({ val: val }) &&
    !isPlainObj(val) &&
    isPlainObj({ val: val }) &&
    !isObject(val) &&
    isObject({ val: val }) &&
    !isPlainObject(val) &&
    isPlainObject({ val: val }) &&
    isNumberLike(val) &&
    !isNegative(val) &&
    isNotNegative(val) &&
    isPositive(val) &&
    !isNotPositive(val) &&
    jQuery.equals(val, 10000) &&
    val === 10000
  );
};

this is art

rough sapphire
#

That's not the word I'd use to describe that

opal timber
#

im switching to js guys

rough sapphire
#

What's js guys?

undone berry
#

I would 100% put that on my wall

opal timber
#

im switching to js, guys*

quaint rivet
#

wheres ur semi?;

sand goblet
#

They're optional

#

I actually don't use them at all

#

Eslint recommends against it

rough sapphire
#

@sand goblet Surprised you're still up

sand goblet
#

That makes two of us

opal timber
#

its not mine, thats from is-ten-thousand

sand goblet
#

Semicolons are officially cruft

#

What do you think about that @rough sapphire

undone berry
#

How can they be cruft? Mr is-odd includes them in his cruft free arr-flatten package

sand goblet
#

Haha

#

I feel like some JS people would have me shot for being so against semicolons but whatever

undone berry
#

standard, one of the most popular style guides, is anti-semicolon

sand goblet
#

I forgot to use eslint for the linked project

#

But I think my setup is a modified standard

rough sapphire
gentle moss
#

good man

#

always tap enter a few times to make sure you're in the shell

#

can't have that header cluttering shit up

rough sapphire
#

why r u pythoning on a mobile

#

that seems immoral and wrong

quaint rivet
#

why, i wish i could install python on my iphone

#

and all he did was some math lol

rough sapphire
#

hmm.

#

python? this is the calculator app on my phone

#

dunno what you're talking about mate

quaint rivet
gentle moss
#

ᶦ ᵃᶜᵗᵘᵃˡˡʸ ᵘˢᵉ ᵖʸᵗʰᵒⁿ ᵒⁿ ˡᶦⁿᵘˣ ᵃˢ ᶜᵃˡᶜ

rough sapphire
#

curl google as your calculator

#

@rough sapphire i want that too! which app did you install

#

that's android right

quaint rivet
#

clearly a microsoft phone

rough sapphire
#

interface is Android X for sure

#

@rough sapphire termux for android

#

then just pkg install python

#

can you ssh into your phone

solid pollen
#

Sure you can

rough sapphire
#

yes

#

yuss

#

why haven't i ever done that

#

I use a magisk module for that though

#

dunno if termux supports it

#

but it should be possible regardless

solid pollen
#

Hun, my ssh app allows me to do a local terminal session, but I get a pkg: not found

rough sapphire
#

sooooo whatever I can install with pkg, I can run

#

does this thing run normal elf binaries

#

@rough sapphire yes

solid pollen
#

If they are ARM binaries, yes

rough sapphire
#

pkg is just a wrapper for apt

#

okay so i can theoretically make this run postgresql... ?

gentle moss
#

sure

#

but maybe don't

rough sapphire
#

if you hate yourself, sure

#

:brain-blown:

#

my phone. is. a. computer.

gentle moss
#

err

#

yep

rough sapphire
#

whoda thunk it

gentle moss
#

did you miss the memo?

solid pollen
#

I mean, android is Linux based

gentle moss
#

everything is computers now

#

EVERYTHING

rough sapphire
#

I mean sure I knew it but that was so well-hidden beneath the swirly graphics!

solid pollen
#

It is just a specific distro

rough sapphire
#

i are computers?

solid pollen
#

Sure

rough sapphire
#

this truly is the future

#

hmm

gentle moss
#

see this?

#

these are computers

rough sapphire
#

okay so the next logical step is to make my phone and computer share disk

#

is that an IoT toothbrush though?

#

my light bulbs are computers

gentle moss
#

no neonshadow

rough sapphire
#

unfortunately

gentle moss
#

it's a computer

#

duh.

rough sapphire
#

iot is just another word for computers

#

but i need an app on my computer to monitor my daily brushing habits

#

get an update when i need to change the head

#

etc

#

you know, pointless stuff

gentle moss
#

this?

#

computer.

rough sapphire
#

that stuff isn't completely pointless when everything does that. the benefits accumulate.

#

they're trying to make toilet bowls computers that analyse your poop

gentle moss
#

these?

#

computers.

rough sapphire
#

@rough sapphire juicero

#

@rough sapphire very expensive example yes

#

you know how python has zen? IoT needs that

#

@gentle moss so these are those flip-flop gates I keep hearing so much about

gentle moss
#

hah

#

IoT needs more than a python zen

#

it needs a fucking common sense zen

rough sapphire
#

who needs common sense when you can get investors

#

@rough sapphire even something as simple as nickname auto-completion was considered a big "feature" back in the day... it's not so much that you get one feature from one place that you get a shit load of improvements from many places that things get actually better.

gentle moss
#

"we can put a computer in your house bricks so you can se-"

rough sapphire
#

@rough sapphire the first editor that came up with "code highlighting" was the marvel of the world

#

what's that got to do with most IoT being useless shit?

#

that they are considered very much default things by now and there are so many of them we don't even realize how many things we take for granted.

gentle moss
#

yeah sure but they're practical features

rough sapphire
#

that IoT might seem like "useless shit" when looking at any given one example

gentle moss
#

well... most of IoT is useless shit

#

or dangerous shit

#

or both

rough sapphire
#

code highlighting was never considered useless shit... by most people

#

@rough sapphire it wasn't. in that sense it's a bad example.

#

there are zealots but those are very much an exception

gentle moss
#

IoT very much appears Web 2.0 type shite

#

loads of fluff not much content

rough sapphire
#

it's a money grab

gentle moss
#

buzzwords for a new generation of thick VC's

rough sapphire
#

so we need to take examples that came in as "not useful" but because there were a billion of them

#

it isn't even growing pains

#

but we can get 5x the profit if we make a smart [common thing]

gentle moss
#

^

rough sapphire
#

exactly

#

and guess what lads, 5G is just around the corner

gentle moss
#

it's not that IoT is inherently shit

#

there are practical applications

#

it's just the majority of the applications aren't practically useful

#

like if we used all the helium in the world to make our voices go funny rather than to do science

rough sapphire
#

haha that would be pretty funny though

gentle moss
#

replace the nitrogen in call centres with helium

rough sapphire
#

if half the world breathed in helium, and the other half breathed in sulphur hexafluoride, then everyone yelled at the same time, would it sound the same as if nobody wasted the gas?

gentle moss
#

no.

#

even in fun imaginary land i don't think that's how that would work

rough sapphire
#

so you're saying it's worth at least testing it?

gentle moss
#

i'd almost be more concerned by the total energy output from 7bn people screaming at once

rough sapphire
#

yeah, that's gotta have some serious green energy potential

gentle moss
#

if we could all hit the same harmonics we could shatter the globe

rough sapphire
#

sounds like an xkcd what-if scenario

gentle moss
#

i think we'd just need to lube everyone up and pack them tightly together

#

so we can maximize transmission of soundwaves from the throat to the ground

rough sapphire
#

mm.

#

I don't think 7 billion people can do anything with their voices

gentle moss
#

a cluster of people covered in ultrasound jelly would surely sonically act like a solid mass

#

or very close to one

rough sapphire
#

unless sound has some weird properties that I'm missing

sand goblet
#

It'll just sound like that guy with the basket full of rubber chickens

#

But louder

gentle moss
#

hah

#

adam savage made a crazy one of them

rough sapphire
#

hmm I guess hitting a resonant frequency would be possible but that might be more likely by jumping up and down

gentle moss
rough sapphire
#

but even then the total mass of humans vs. the total mass of even the oceans (which are just on the surface of the earth) is tiny

gentle moss
#

give me a lever long enough and a fulcrum on which to place it and i'll blow up the planet

#

or something

rough sapphire
#

that makes sense

gentle moss
# 
Regards,

Fail2Ban```
#

awww, thank you fail2ban

solid pollen
#

So I have some news about the baloo file thing, accroding to htop, it asked for 260Gib of memory

#

And they call that low footprint

gentle moss
#

i asked you something a little while ago

stark prawn
#

That's kde's indexing thing is it?

gentle moss
#

it is

#

akarys, do you have any big files? like multiple gb files

#

a significant amount of them could cause the indexer to hang

#

or consume too much

solid pollen
#

Hmm maybe

#

I have the unreal engine source code

#

I thing there is some big files in here, but nothing really big

gentle moss
#

hmm, probably not that then i guess

#

you could try manually telling it to rebuild the index

#

at least then you'd know what it was doing because you told it to

solid pollen
#

Yeah, I'll prob do that later

rough sapphire
#

I've had locatedb deadlock and spin at 100% usage before

#

suspect it's got something to do with the bind mounts inside themselves thing I was doing

gentle moss
#

no one is immune from the indexer stalls

#

except he who regularly gets to make coffee while searching for file

plucky ridge
#

Today I learned you can fairly easily remote into a windows machine on a linux machine

#

Like I didn't realize that the remote desktop protocol was fairly standard, I thought the microsoft one was proprietary for some reason

rough sapphire
#

it is.

#

but developers don't really care

plucky ridge
#

Fair enough

#

Just means I'll be able to (or should be able to) remote into work if need be

#

Using my Manjaro laptop as opposed to booting up my beast

#

Well, former beast

rough sapphire
#

I've found remmina to be the best solution on Linux for RDP

plucky ridge
#

Yeah that's what the article I was reading mentioned

#

Does make me wonder if it's on Manjaro as well and not just Debian based systems

gusty oar
#

since i don't know many things about that things. is booting hackintosh illegal?

#

or grey area or like that?

undone berry
#

According to Wikipedia, its a legal grey area. But it breaks Apple's ToS, so I doubt this server can provide help with problems related to it

rough sapphire
#

Personally, I'm more concerned with laws than terms of service. Of course I dont bring any discussion of breaking terms of service here, as I understand why its not prudent, and this is not the kind of place for it.

#

Most of the laws in my country I consider to be good laws. I have no interest in breaking laws.

#

But terms of service are often wack af

#

Just saying

undone berry
#

I mean, I agree, when I'm doing stuff I don't pay much attention to ToS. But its the server's rules, just pointing out that answers to "how do I install hackintosh" would break rule 5

velvet rapids
#

Hey

#

I'm trying to use rooms in flask_socketio

#

I got something like this from the docs -

@socketio.on('join')
def on_join(data):
    print('Hi')
    print(data)
    username = data['username']
    room = data['room']
    join_room(room)
    socketio.send(username + ' has entered the room.', room=room)
#

I don't know what I need to do in the client side though

rough sapphire
#

@undone berry and I think its a good rule to have here, because this is a community on a platform with ridiculous TOS and we happen to represent an entire programming language here. So, if I ran this community, I would have the same rule. Time and a place for everything

echo grail
#

Hey guys, so, whenever I want to use my Corsair Virtuoso wireless, I plug in the dongle in and make sure it's charged, but in the iCUE software it always shows as unavailable and I can't listen to anything wirelessly with it. How do I fix this?

gusty oar
#

According to Wikipedia, its a legal grey area. But it breaks Apple's ToS, so I doubt this server can provide help with problems related to it
@undone berry hmm okay then 😄

plucky ridge
#

@rough sapphire I'm very glad you seem to understand our reasons

#

A lot of people just think we're jackbooted thugs or something

#

We're just trying to make sure we can continue running our server without any huge scandals or frustrations.

rough sapphire
#

Does make me wonder if it's on Manjaro as well and not just Debian based systems
@plucky ridge on Arch, Remmina is in the community repo

#

don't even need to dip into AUR for it

plucky ridge
#

Oh kick ass

sand goblet
#

What's a jackboot?

undone berry
#

Military boot is the actual item. But in this context used as a symbol of cruel or authoritarian behaviour or rule.

honest cloak
#

one of first messages in this server - sure did age well

sand goblet
#

Ah okay

rough sapphire
#

who is this John guy and where can I get his time machine?

honest cloak
#

click search bar, select before, click any date

#

and then click "oldest"

undone berry
#

Nereus#9479 is the John guy

plucky ridge
#

I think xx was more making a joke about the fact that John was indeed right

undone berry
#

still in the server - you can @ him

rough sapphire
#

@main herald please, tell me your time travel secrets

undone berry
#

from a ctrl+f, this John guy is a bit of a legend

sand goblet
#

Nereus is the original founder of this place

#

I wonder how he's doing

undone berry
#

He has no roles, so did he leave before @developers was a thing, or if he left rejoined and didn't verify

plucky ridge
#

What?

undone berry
#

oh what

#

I swear that wasn't there

#

when I looked a second ago

rough sapphire
#

it was

undone berry
#

I'm just crazy

rough sapphire
#

looked him up before you posted his username

sand goblet
#

Caches man

#

Caches

plucky ridge
#

Yeah this isn't a glitch in the Matrix moment, you just overlooked it

gentle moss
#

the mystery of john is lifted

#

everyone go back about your business

plucky ridge
#

Go about your biskness

gentle moss
#

disperse. this off topic area needs to be decontaminated.

#

but it's not bugs.

#

just too many features.

#

ahhh.

#

@undone berry

#

the daily clapping has begun

#

lets all clap

#

clap clap clap

undone berry
#

some bastard* is beeping his car horn

#

can fuck off

#

drives me insane

gentle moss
#

are you clapping?

#

did you at least clap twice?

plucky ridge
#

Thank you for the ping

gentle moss
#

once is considered sarcastic

undone berry
#

I'm not clapping - I'm being salty about this clapping

#

I always forget that pings - sorry

plucky ridge
#

It's fine it's just funny

#

I feel like that watchword was made for bisk but now that he's cleaned up....

gentle moss
#

if the length of clapping correlated with death toll that'd be quite foreboding

plucky ridge
#

Oh wait wait

#

There was an old movie....

#

I think it was called Merlin

quaint rivet
plucky ridge
#

There was this little windup cymbal monkey that when he banged his cymbals together, it meant you were going to die

undone berry
#

I want to go to Lidl right now - but I can't leave til the 2 minutes of clap is up

gentle moss
#

because everyone's out getting the clap

#

great idea btw

plucky ridge
#

What, getting the clap?

#

It really is not a good idea

gentle moss
#

in the middle of a pandemic, everyone leave your house at 8pm to celebrate the people working to stop the spread of the pandemic, potentially helping spread said pandemic

plucky ridge
#

Either that or they're all listening to the Cha Cha Slide

quaint rivet
#

eyyy macarena

sand goblet
#

Cooough to the left, cooough to the right

#

Get sicky with it

undone berry
#

when I'm king of the world, as well as mandating unix time for everything - I'm gonna ban clapping for any reason

quaint rivet
#

CRISS-CROSS

plucky ridge
#

🎶 Everybody fall down dead! 🎶 -thump-

undone berry
#

You try and catch a ball and miss - straight to the gulag

sand goblet
#

You catch a ball like a toddler?

undone berry
#

well

#

no

plucky ridge
#

I like to imagine that gulag is the sound a drain makes after you pour in drain cleaner and it starts to push through

undone berry
#

but that was the only accidental clap I could think of

sand goblet
#

Lol, hem

undone berry
#

there are things that I try and catch like that tho

#

scissors

gentle moss
#

i have really poor depth perception

#

can i live

#

sir

#

please sir

plucky ridge
#

"Hey I've been turned into a cow, can I go home?"

sand goblet
#

If you have to catch scissors, you need better people around you

gentle moss
#

or you have the best people around you

plucky ridge
#

What if it was Edward Lizard-hands?

#

These are the kinds of questions that my brain asks and the kinds of things my wife has to deal with

gentle moss
#

for no reason i just imagined the Lizard-hands being Queen Elizabeth-hands

#

queen elizardbreath

#

oooh

plucky ridge
#

"I was made into what I am today by a mad doctor." -from his hands you hear- "What do you do?"

gentle moss
#

now in stereo

#

corgi's for legs

plucky ridge
#

Band name

gentle moss
#

just two. attached at each hip.

quaint rivet
#

capybara head

plucky ridge
#

Also a good band name

gentle moss
#

we're one bad dub away from a 1950's Sandy Frank japanese import film

quaint rivet
#

if we could put this creature in the "had to do it to em" pose that would be great

plucky ridge
#

Not familiar with that pose

quaint rivet
gentle moss
#

but...

plucky ridge
#

Gotcha

gentle moss
#

but the two queen fists would be kissing

plucky ridge
#

Or one is swallowing the other

#

Just jaw unhinged and then oOOOOOOMmmmmm

quaint rivet
#

oroborous hands

gentle moss
#

like some kind of queen arm ouroboros

#

that one is a bitch to spell, i don't blame you

#

i had to see you spell it wrong to remember

quaint rivet
#

yeah i just winged that

plucky ridge
#

The only reason I kind of remember how to spell it is Red Dwarf

gentle moss
#

same

#

same reason i know how to spell "R E D D W A R F G A R B A G E P O D"

#

gimmie an R

#

gimmie an E

#

gimme a D

#

gimmie a red dwarf garbage pod.

quaint rivet
#

how has a site like vimms lair lasted as long as it has?

sand goblet
#

No idea what that is

quaint rivet
#

roms/iso’s

sand goblet
#

The same way most community run sites survive, I suppose

rough sapphire
#

Can't talk about that, sir/ma'am

gentle moss
#

^

#

loose lips sink ships

sand goblet
#

donations or someone with a very good job

quaint rivet
#

its ma’am if you’re asking mlady

rough sapphire
#

never can be too sure

#

haha

rough sapphire
#

So, is it accurate to say that prototype in JS is just the equivalent of adding a method to a class?

function Car(make, model, year) {
  this.make = make
  this.model = model
  this.year = year
}

Car.prototype.display = function() {
  return 'Car: ' + this.make  + ', ' + this.model + ', ' + this.year
}

let myCar = new Car("Holden", "Astra", 2009)
undone berry
#

Yeah, prototypes and classes are pretty similar

#

worth noting, that JS has a normal class syntax which syntactic sugar for that way of making a prototype

rough sapphire
#

JS has too much syntax haha

undone berry
#

the problem is - it had this shit way of doing things for like 15 years til 2015 or something - then it started to realise it was a shit language, and things have slowly been getting "fixed"

#

where fixed means introducing pretty syntax

rough sapphire
#

The only thing in Python where there are so many varied ways to do a thing is string formatting.

undone berry
#

I've learned like 3 new string methods just today from helping people in help channels

#

there's so many damn string methods

#

But yeah, JS definitely doesn't have this bit of zen:

#

!zen preferably only

royal lakeBOT
#
The Zen of Python (line 12):

There should be one-- and preferably only one --obvious way to do it.

rough sapphire
#

definitely not

quaint rivet
#

helping people is a killer way to learn, basically how i got into my last language

#

ironic how it works

rough sapphire
#

yeah you end up looking up answers to problems you didnt think of or care about.

#

Or you'll see an error and be like, "I didnt know that would happen if you did that"

#

There are so many tools in programming, a lot of times the ability to use them is just knowing that they exist.

undone berry
#

The best way to learn is by helping people with something thats right on the edge of your knowledge - something that you can do, but that you haven't done a million times

rough sapphire
#

Either you know they exist or you dont yet

#

yeah

undone berry
#

Thats kinda why I like #web-dev so much - I'm pretty comfortable with flask, but helping people teaches me new things all the time there

quaint rivet
#

basically spent yesterday fiddling with web api’s after someone asked about one, baby steps haha

#

way easier than scraping ill tell you whut

undone berry
#

I've only ever had call to scrape once (and I didn't even need to do it then, at the time I was being a right prick and didn't realise) - its so hard to find places where its worth it

rough sapphire
#

Scraping is not difficult if you know CSS and HTML. imo.

#

Its a matter of making sure the server gets the right User-Agent from your request and then just picking out the selectors you need.

#

Its tedious maybe at times

#

But not difficult

#

now...

#

What can become difficult is when you start getting ratelimitted. But at that point... it's difficult to a degree that its not worth doing.

undone berry
#

I just want to find a place where I can practice it and put it on my github

rough sapphire
#

Depending on the aggressiveness of the ratelimitting. And its also implies that someone doesnt want you to do it.

undone berry
#

but I don't know of any legal scraping that can be done

#

and I don't want to put illegal code on my gitub

rough sapphire
#

the problem with spending effort to make a scraper is that it will become obsolete as soon as they change their page.

undone berry
#

The one time I did do it, it was scraping aircraft info from some tiny hobbyist site, so I was effectively dossing them

rough sapphire
#

And if they dont like you doing it... lets say you are illegally, against their wishes putting a lot of effort into getting around ratelimits

#

They will stop you

#

And they will stop you again

#

Its a pain in the ass.

#

Well let me put it this way

#

Facebook does not want to be scraped.

#

In fact they dont want it so hard that that tool is effectively impossible to use

#

But look at all the names of who has contributed to thjat

#

Its rather ironic

#

The biggest data whore & invasion of privacy (Facebook) doesn't want others doing exactly what it does

quaint rivet
#

to be fair, you willingly have to give them your data

#

they arent holding anyone at gun point for their hometown

sand goblet
#

Public data is given willingly yeah

rough sapphire
#

Where do ghost profiles fall into this?

swift tusk
#

interesting channel name 🙂

rough sapphire
#

It's a reference to last years April Fool's day

#

Everyone was lemon

swift tusk
#

haha nice

deep saffron
#

@quaint rivet i'd say they are nicely asking for you to willingly share your hometown with others
they themself have probably figured it out already, including your address, with the location data from your phone :D

rough sapphire
#

They do invade privacy. And the mentality that you choose to give it away is bullshit. I'm forced to have a facebook in order to keep in contact with people locally. Yes, I could choose to not have one, but in so doing, I choose to be cut off from the world around me that relies on it because they are ignorant and oblivious or unconcerned.

#

To that end, I don't use it the same way every user uses it, but using technology is not a choice.

#

These people effectively own a huge aspect of our social lives.

#

And we cant opt out of it. We can. But we're choosing to opt out of a social life by doing that.

#

And we cant opt out of it. We can. But we're choosing to opt out of a social life by doing that.

#

as faar as OSINT is concerned,

#

the hometown is not nearly as useful as the people you know.

#

I haven't had a Facebook for a few years now. Don't think I'm particularly missing out on anything, but I was never particularly the FOMO type anyways

#

I haven't had a Facebook for a few years now. Don't think I'm particularly missing out on anything, but I was never particularly the FOMO type anyways

#

<@&267629731250176001>

#

<@&267629731250176001>

#

auto repost bot

#

auto repost bot

quaint rivet
#

And we cant opt out of it. We can. But we're choosing to opt out of a social life by doing that.

i have absolutely no idea what this means

solid pollen
#

Eeeh, I disagree

#

You can have a social life without facebook

rough sapphire
#

Yeah, I'm not sure I particularly agree with that. How much of your social life really relies on Facebook being there?

#

Think that's a bit silly

#

It depends on the people. There are people you can't get to respond back to SMS but if you message on facebook they will be right there.

#

It depends on who you know.

#

Some people are addicted stuck there.

#

Its unfortunate.

agile quail
#

I think people relying on having facebook or some other social media stuck in there face all time tends to lead to a social life but a bad one

rough sapphire
#

I have made the decision to leave and come back bcause I miss people multiple times

#

I think you are right about htat

quaint rivet
#

i feel like you’re straw manning

agile quail
#

my inner boomer came out my bad lol continue using social media fellow kids

rough sapphire
#

I got whoever I cared about moved over to Telegram. If they're not willing to download 1 extra app to keep contact with you (if they don't respond to SMSs), they're not worth keeping around anyways.

quaint rivet
#

facebook isnt invading anyones privacy, i dont have one but you agree to whatever is in their ToS

rough sapphire
#

And I have had that mentality at least two times... haha. And I end up opening my account back up down the line. I even backed up all my data to make sure I had no reason to go back to it.

#

But all it takes is, "I wonder how so and so is doing."

quaint rivet
#

i.e whatever you put on that site they can use

rough sapphire
#

@quaint rivet you're really naïve if you believe that.

quaint rivet
#

then im naive dunno

#

either way facebook doesn’t affect me

rough sapphire
#

Facebook will create a profile of you (look up shadow profiles) even if you've never used it. You don't even have to have ever gone to facebook.com for them to start gathering data about you.

#

And they will continue to do so after you delete your account. But the distinction here is whether you willingly give them your data or not.

solid pollen
#

What on earth is that thing.

quaint rivet
#

lets assume i have a "shadow profile" what kind of legitimate info are they going to gather?

#

that isn’t already available in a public registry

rough sapphire
#

Friends & contacts, family, interests, location, industry you work in, etc

#

Anything they can realistically get their tentacles into. The more the better.

solid pollen
#

But.. there are no legal issue with that?

quaint rivet
#

anyone with a background check app can get most of that info anyways

solid pollen
#

I mean, they collect data on you without your permission

quaint rivet
#

and i dont really care if someone is making up my interests lol

#

what does that even mean

rough sapphire
#

"It's only illegal if you get caught" is basically Facebook's motto, @solid pollen.

quaint rivet
#

how does this affect me at all

rough sapphire
#

@quaint rivet Not sure why you're so comfortable with being made into a commodity.

quaint rivet
#

how am i being made a commodity?

#

again how does this affect me negatively, because they did a background check and found some already public information?

rough sapphire
#

You're no longer a person, you're a target for ads (both for products/services and political campaigns like we've seen in the past)

quaint rivet
#

im gonna withdraw from this conversation

rough sapphire
#

Not sure how "targeted brainwashing" is not a negative thing

#

Instead of making decisions, you have companies make them for you

solid pollen
#

I’m personally more or less okay with targetted ads, as long as a computer is processing my informations, not a human

quaint rivet
#

i dont know what that means haha, take it easy

rough sapphire
#

I'm taking it easy dog

#

But it's not exactly hard to connect the dots if you've followed the controversies and their background contexts

pseudo crystal
#

By the way, the bot situation was addressed. They were spamming multiple channels, so we didn't respond individually in each. Thanks for mentioning the moderators role though @rough sapphire.

rough sapphire
#

Sure, cheers

#

@solid pollen idunno, I think I'd rather have humans process that information

#

computers can be scary accurate

#

seeing as Facebook and Google are heavily implementing ML in all of this as well, it's easy to see why this might get out of control real fast

#

Which is why I'm really iffy about the whole AI situation as well. Sure, AI is cool and can be useful, but it's almost certain a big private company will achieve AI first. I dunno about you, but I can't see that company using AI for anything else but serving their own interests. It'd be cool if the company that does it first does not touch user data at all and is instead something technology related, such as IBM or so, but I find that happening really really hard to believe.

#

🤷

#

yeah, unfortunately I agree. My main concern with tech isn't the tech, its the people who own it.

#

Particularly in my country, people see private enterprise as being capable of no wrong.

#

Frankly I fear them more than any government bodies we have.

#

I don't even use smart phones anymore.

#

I used to entertain the idea that I could manage my use of them in a way that I was okay with, but as time come along the direction of the software is just.... "Take away control, streamline everything into ensuring all data to us... and anyone else who wants it"

#

And I just dont like using them anymore.

#

I literally have a drug dealer burner phone haha.

#

from a computer, sure, plenty of data is still being generated and given to plenty of people.

#

But Im more in control of who it is.

#

I'm waiting for my PinePhone to arrive, I'll probably start using that instead

#

Not necessarily a "dumb" phone, but also not, like

#

I cant wait for that one!

#

Yeah its a much better option. Unfortunately it has battery charge issues. But... I believe in the future of what it means for mobile device users having non corporate options

#

And I want to support it

#

Same

coarse hearth
#

I'm waiting until new iPhone SE 2020 release

#

I'll get this

solid pollen
#

whyyy

coarse hearth
#

Because this will be best

#

And I want MacBook Air 2020 13" and AirPods Pro too

rough sapphire
#

to each their own, I guess

#

the apple stuff makes me just. angry.

#

the last time i saw an apple phone was when a friend of mine was trying to buy a used one.

#

the guy brought the phone and showed it to him. he wanted to test it out but turns out you can't just "turn it on and start using it"

#

then all these stories about apple being horrible about not being able to repair your own phone or something

#

the only people who "think it's ok" are the people who have stockholm syndrome

sand goblet
#

Apple deliberately makes their devices hard to repair, yeah

#

And then if you figure out how to fix phones and start doing so, they sue you for it

gentle moss
#

they also limit supply chains of repair parts

#

and have also previously asked iFixIt to remove tear downs
actually i think that was Samsung

#

i can't remember for what specific reason

#

might've been "too early"

sand goblet
#

There's also a lot of anti competitive stuff on their app store

rough sapphire
gentle moss
#

o_o

sand goblet
#

How about a long stringy stingy thingy to complete your morning

oak tangle
#

I read stringy as stingy and got a bit concerned

#

oh

#

I can't read

#

stringy stingy, you say

gentle moss
#

stringy stringy

#

strings on strings

#

or stings on stings

oak tangle
#

So, it's a thingy made of smaller thingies

sand goblet
#

47m long thingy made of smaller thingies

oak tangle
#

neat

#

I want one

sand goblet
#

Do you though

#

It's pretty deadly

oak tangle
#

I'll get better

sand goblet
#

Haha

rough sapphire
#

"fail2ban" is not a very good name for that service

#

I mean you REMEMBER it but it's not very descriptive...

gentle moss
#

sure it is

#

if things fail to meet criteria

#

it fails to ban

rough sapphire
#

i see

gentle moss
#

like how stuff can "fail safe"

rough sapphire
#

now that does make sense

#

maybe call it, hmm.. BANNER?

#

i jest.

#

that would be a horrible name too.

#

but maybe "ban4fail"

#

fail -> ban. ok.

#

clever.

#

i've always just read it as "failing to login leads 2 getting banned"

#

for me the only logical reading was "i am failing 2 ban you"

solid pollen
#

I've always just read it as "ok Google, what is fail2ban ?"

bright swallow
#

I am helping this dude install arch linux. he says he is from ethiopia