ot1-perplexing-regexing

[vale raven]

I have questions

[weak peak]

nice books

[vale raven]

tyty

I recently bought a couple more to reread and Brotherman gave me his old ones
So the collection is growing again

[ebon shell]

i've genuinely never heard of these books

[vale raven]

You need better taste

[ebon shell]

well im sorry my taste is (now) nearly exclusively fantasy

[vale raven]

(the entire right half is fantasy)

[ebon shell]

(lol)

i genuinely can barely remember what books i've read like ever

[vale raven]

Everything from Eragon forward is all fantasy

And depending on who you ask the first two books are fantasy too

But lets not start that argument tonight

[ebon shell]

anyway top 5 books or something

1. earthsea (books 1 & 3)
2. the silmarillion (didnt really like lotr that much, well great book but silmarillion >)
3. all of narnia (nostalgia speaking but very cool)
4. dune book 4

[vale raven]

I got handed a book and told "this is Narnia"
At the time I didn't realize that it was a series
I thought The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe was THE book
I was super confused

[ebon shell]

lol

the first one was

i mean it was a good book

just not as good as 2 onwards

(the lion, the witch and the wardrobe is book 2)

[ebon shell]

if you could not tell i'm a sucker for worldbuilding

[vale raven]

Hey me too

[ebon shell]

god why do i have to do this much algebra CASs exist

[vale raven]

When I'm doing menial labor I ask Gippity to write a fantasy story.
I'll give it a prompt while I wait for the computer to load something, then continue the work while the response generates, then read the responses the next time the computer freezes while loading

[grave cove]

hello

[vale raven]

The story has exactly 0 action because the characters just keep hanging out

hi

[ebon shell]

honest opinion on hoods

[vale raven]

How many books do you have anime profile picture?

[grave cove]

they're fire

[grave cove]

im more of an audiobook person

[vale raven]

TRAITOR

[vale raven]

What kind?

[ebon shell]

wow i cannot breathe properly

[weak peak]

original post: #cybersecurity message
what is an exacutor? @versed niche

[ebon shell]

the joke was robin hood

[vale raven]

o

[ebon shell]

https://github.com/ogham/exa genuinely first thing i thought of when you said exacutor

[weak peak]

I think the OP might be referring to an "executor"

iirc executors are used for cheating in games like GTA and Roblox 🥴

[grave cove]

this is fire

i use it instead of ls

[versed niche]

chilllllll

[weak peak]

uh huh

[bleak lintel]

isn't exa deprecated

[vale raven]

exa is unmaintained, use the fork eza instead.

huh

https://github.com/eza-community/eza

[weak peak]

To answer your question (#cybersecurity message): You can try and detonate whatever is in the zip file in an interactive online sandbox like ANYRUN (https://app.any.run) or Triage (https://tria.ge) to see what it might do

[versed niche]

the only one it failed was Phishing Database when i put it through does that one matter that much?

[weak peak]

just send me the url in DMs

[ebon shell]

https://github.com/eza-community/eza use eza, exa is dead even the maintainer of exa tells you to use it

[thick ore]

in what scenario would you need to rewrite ls in rust 😭

[thick osprey]

When you want to.

[thick ore]

the thing is even sponsored by warp

[ebon shell]

warp sponsors everyone

might as well be the federal government now that trump's shut down federal grants and they've just been doling out money /j

[ebon shell]

never really liked red rising

hunger games in space ts

[tropic ore]

the modern modern alternative

[grave cove]

yeah i dont like the last 3 books that much

first 3 were pretty good

[ebon shell]

there's 6????????????????????????

i thouhgt it was a trliogy

[grave cove]

its like 2 trilogies

its 6 books in total

the 2nd trilogy is basically game of thrones but in space

[ebon shell]

idk about th esecond one

first trilogy was mid

[vocal oyster]

every damn modern tool has been abandoned and forked I swear

[graceful basin]

what maintanance does ls even need?

bsd changed the ls command 2 years ago

and before that, in 2020, and in 2018

seems like it's half bumping versions of deps

[vocal oyster]

thats the thing, most stuff just doesn't need maintaining in a system where stuff doesn't exactly break all the time like shell commands

if you find some sort of vuln then maybe

like every time I show neofetch everyone spouts out like 5 forks, but it was only archived not even a year ago

[tardy rain]

Rewrite in rust every 2 years

[lament cairn]

two owl OTs

[open cliff]

what is up with all the owls? like
#ot1-perplexing-regexing
#ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

what's next?!

“The Owl Galactic Federation is invading angrily marching ”
this or is it something even more hectic?

just say it ain't so (#ot0)

[frozen coral]

Owl Corp. The reason you haven't noticed anything.

[thick ore]

does #ot1-perplexing-regexing mean that Owl Corp does NOT use the Go programming language

[lament cairn]

pydis rebrand to owldis when??

[solemn tulip]

say it ain't so
owl will not go
has a nice flow

[narrow coral]

say it ain't so
owl will not go
has a nice flow

Umm

No double quote?

[strange blade]

It seems not?

[harsh tundra]

Just discord being discord I guess. Tried to do >> instead of > > you did and didn't work :c

[strange blade]

Also little matcha girl has gotten so emotional 😭

what happened to cute little adventures with little matilda cha

[harsh tundra]

It was always about necromancers, in a world where they are killed if discovered... just with comedic bits. Mostly because Mats was raised sheltered and didn't have to deal with those dark parts, now they're catching up to her

[strange blade]

aahhh well everyone's dying left and right and I can't take it

It's still a great read tho thanks for the rec 😄

[grave cove]

https://tenor.com/view/blackbeard-blackbeard-writing-taking-notes-writing-gif-17583038544116987898

[plush sun]

turn the lights off
carry me home

[bleak lintel]

yeag

[vale raven]

Careful
They’ll make us all use Poetry

[uneven pine]

poetry is garbage

ever since they made it a standalone tool instead of something just to add into a venv I stopped using it

uv does 1000x better at being a standalone tool

uv is the only way I handle my python right now

[cobalt remnant]

uv, poetry, pdm, hatch, and most other build tools can be installed with pipx/uvx

[vocal oyster]

I've been thrown off by their v2 being so picky

like please leave me alone

same with readthedocs changing their config and deprecating things slowly so I've followed docs to fix things, only to find it then breaks the next week

[uneven pine]

sure, but the point is I didn't want poetry to be installed like that. I used it by installing it directly to my venv as a dev dependancy. Then they made it suck to do that/warn you not to do it every time you tried.

and there's no reason to use poetry when you have uv because uv does everything poetry does just better

[cobalt remnant]

Imagine having to install a dependency to manage your dependencies

[uneven pine]

and far more because it properly manages python versions too

[cobalt remnant]

(not trying to defend poetry)

[lament cairn]

i have been doing fine with just pip and setuptools

[uneven pine]

my thing was I just wanted a tool that managed projects without having something extra besides python installed on my system

[lament cairn]

might use uv for its speed

what's the point of anything more

[uneven pine]

the philosophy of uv being the tool instead of python being the tool works really well with that

unrelated: yet another Linux Is Not Ready For Daily Desktop Use™️ moment

installed Nobara on my laptop since it doesn't support W11 and W10 is EOL, everything worked great out of the box

Now, I've rebooted it a single time and the touchpad doesn't work

[left jewel]

maybe try rebooting again

[uneven pine]

yeah I've done that

the touchpad works iin the login screen but not at all once K Desktop Environment loads

I wonder if this is a KDE issue

[uneven pine]

ah crap I left my USB drive at work

I wonder if I can use my other PC as a PXE with an eternet cable to the laptop

[glossy niche]

can't u just install it with pip

I just have a separate requirements file for installing poetry

but yeah it's annoying to install it in its own venv

[uneven pine]

The answer is no

I cannot seem to get my laptop to network boot from the desktop

[low chasm]

yeah idk if I'd ever use Linux on a laptop

[vale raven]

Why are you network booting at home?

[uneven pine]

I do not have a USB availabe

I left mine at work

[uneven pine]

Actually I explicitly stated that already lol

[vale raven]

Excuse me

Am on mobile around machinery

[uneven pine]

:p

[fringe rain]

i only have a laptop 😔

i dual boot though

[uneven pine]

I found an old USB while looking for something unrelated

let's go

unfortunately the ethernet port on my motherboard is dying too -.-

I gotta find where my NIC is

Edge trying to tell me that bing is better than the search engine I pay for

REALLY

I told it not to and it changed it to bing anyway

[willow narwhal]

Ah, I remember now!
I couldn't get it to enable HTTP mode at all. It insisted on being handed a certificate.

[timid latch]

"surely not using bing was a mistake, let us fix that"

... Wtf

[tardy rain]

you pay for a search engine?

[uneven pine]

Yes

And it's very much worth it

Qwant is fine if you don't search very often

[timid latch]

What search engine are you paying for?

[uneven pine]

But I got tired of having to refresh 3-5 times when my Qwant search failed basically every time

Kagi.

[timid latch]

I am mostly happy with ddg, but maybe I'll look at alternatives

[uneven pine]

I have never once had a search on ddg ever give me a result I'm looking for

[timid latch]

Must be looking for some very obscure stuff

[uneven pine]

Google enshittified their results so much that bing has actually been a better search engine the past couple of years

But bings results are still garbage

Same with yahoo

[bleak maple]

If you add a swear word to the end of your Google search it turns off the AI crap at least 🙂

[timid latch]

Yhe Google is unusable

[uneven pine]

Startpage was working good for me but then they started jamming their own ads/sponsored links

So they're no better than Google now

Qwant was great for a while, their results tend to be pretty good

But the searches got slower and slower and then it got to the point where almost every search said "your search failed click here to retry"

And I'd have to retry 2-3x to get it to go. And that pissed me off more than YouTube ads

So I gave Kagi a try. Their free 100 search trial. Great results. Fast. Good options and features. I paid for the 300 search package and used that in like... A week

So now I'm on unlimited

[bleak maple]

So you're 'just' using it like a better Google? Or are you also automating it etc?

[uneven pine]

I've been trying out their chatgpt too but yeah pretty much just a better google

It saves me genuinely hours every month

[tardy rain]

what do you search for that takes you hours over a month using chrome

[low chasm]

google's ai summary lets us get past the llm ban on school computers lmao

[timid latch]

Honestly schools banning LLMs and so many sites adding them is annoying.

The only site allowed for our web dev exam was w3s, and when I looked into why mdn wasn't allowed? Because it had AI features.

I ended up downloading the MDN content from GitHub before the exam

[vale raven]

You can do that?

[vocal oyster]

it is on github yes https://github.com/mdn/content

[vale raven]

Oooh nice

[uneven pine]

Chrome has nothing to do with it???

[lament cairn]

they probably meant google

[uneven pine]

If that's the case then

Searching for 10 pages to get past the ai slop, sponsored listings, and find a relevant result

Google has been so enshittified that it's useless

[tardy rain]

Oops yea i meant google

Bro its so late my brain is at like 1% production

[lament cairn]

what does 100% look like

[rough sapphire]

for sql where do i learn it from?

pls someone help

[solid elbow]

https://selectstarsql.com/

[muted pebble]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boltzmann_brain it's kinda sad and crazy that some concepts seem utterly incomprehensible without being versed in high-level maths

[grave cove]

i dont think this thought experiment in particular is very math heavy

[muted pebble]

but these names mentioned that are postulating on it are mathematicians and/or physicists

[grave cove]

a lot of historical mathematicians and physicists were also philosophers on the side

[muted pebble]

these dudes go into another realm of thought when they fall down the rabbit-hole lol

[grave cove]

i mean they were kinda no lifes back then

[muted pebble]

lol! true

[grave cove]

but math and philosophy arent completely orthogonal

[muted pebble]

I remember one time I was obsessed with some 3d gfx equation (something to do with getting a point on the exterior of a 3d sphere) and I was trying to understand it. for a brief moment I had a true understanding of it and could see it in my head and then it was gone and I felt like an idiot again lol

[grave cove]

bro had a fleeting moment of enlightenment

[muted pebble]

rabbit-holes are like black-holes. once you get caught in the gravitation field there's no going back.
I believe it's the event horizon lolol

[bleak maple]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satori I wish those moments were easier to arrange.

[glossy niche]

true, in fact, they intersect a LOT

[bleak maple]

I agree; this is probably my favorite programming book also https://www.amazon.com/Unfettered-Mind-Writings-Master-Swordsman/dp/1590309863

Although it does not mindfully keep guard, in the small mountain fields the scarecrow does not stand in vain.

[steep sluice]

Hi guys,
I'm looking for a web developer to help me with WordPress.

[noble hound]

I can help you

[unkempt python]

Is this a rule 9 ??

[narrow coral]

!rule 9

[royal lake]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[narrow coral]

No

[unkempt python]

saw the wording wrong

i need to change this font bruh

[narrow coral]

Hahaha

[reef goblet]

I reached complete enlightenment once with this piece of code and then completely snapped out of it

[muted pebble]

what did this piece of code concern?

[glossy niche]

ppl who drive atvs in residential areas should be ejected from the gene pool

[cold aspen]

god i hate windows

[thick ore]

how else are you gonna let the sunlight in

[strange blade]

by being one with the grass

[cold aspen]

tf is sunlight

[thick ore]

tf is grass

[thick ore]

light emitted from the only star in the solar system

[cold aspen]

tf is a solar system only light i know is the light from my computer screen

[strange blade]

https://tenor.com/view/touching-grass-touch-gif-21219969

[cold aspen]

whats that green stuff

[thick ore]

is that nuclear waste

[strange blade]

you're confusing that with yourself maybe

[thick ore]

excuse me

are you saying I am toxic and emit unsafe levels of radiation

[strange blade]

you described yourself better than I ever could

and you're excused

[tropic ore]

don't be negative... it means you're unique and radiate energy ^_^

-# ||/s||

[fringe rain]

/s is crazy work

[thick ore]

all of you are horrible people

😢

[fringe rain]

what did i do 😭

[thick ore]

ummm

yea

[tropic ore]

i can't speak for people i don't know =`=

[thick ore]

actually you know what you're right

i'm just so positive that it outshines your negativeness

https://tenor.com/view/dog-nose-butterfly-dog-puppy-peaceful-gif-14700589898488542320

[strange blade]

so you do know what grass is

you lied

[thick ore]

that green stuff is just a green screen

[strange blade]

now I'll go dig a deep hole and cry while curling myself up in a ball

[strange blade]

cap

[gusty galleon]

tf microwave spin means

[tropic ore]

waltzen

[uneven pine]

When you the food the microwave spins

MMMMRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

BEEP BEEP BEEEP BEEP BEEP

[cobalt remnant]

https://tenor.com/view/microwave-amazed-stunned-cooking-dumbfounded-gif-3913284309338949793

[harsh tundra]

At prev work we had microwave with no spinning plate, that was actually weird. You had to manually rotate or mix cold and hot parts when heating lunch...

[uneven pine]

I have to mix cold and hot parts anyway

Funnily enough, the one microwave we had that didn't spin was the most evenly heating microwave we ever had

I miss that thing

[cobalt remnant]

Can't wait to eat a pizza that's hot to the touch but ice cold when I take a bite.

[tardy rain]

Ours is just a box 😔

You just put stuff in there and it sits in there

[vocal oyster]

cut to everyone's first frozen pizza here at uni being different forms of ruined

I 'cooked' mine without heat because fan and convection symbols differ by a faint circle around the fan

gave up and had it raw 😭

on the other hand one guy cooked it with the grill on and yes it went black on top

[harsh tundra]

Remind me tomorrow to post homemade pizza

[drowsy storm]

how does github know who's using a project

on this repo

https://github.com/nvbn/thefuck

[bleak maple]

https://docs.github.com/en/code-security/supply-chain-security/understanding-your-software-supply-chain/exploring-the-dependencies-of-a-repository

Basically it supports a ton of package-manager formats

I say "ton", it's actually a slightly shorter list than I expected, but it's the major stuff.

(but, like, no Bazel?)

[green pelican]

mine are all ilke that too but what trips me up is the knob to set the time

just give me the keypad

[harsh tundra]

Knob is nice i can easily adjust to more/less just before setting. And less buttons. My childhood home had microwave early and it was pretty straightforward to use.

[narrow coral]

Whenever you read this, get started on the pizza

Tf u r idle

Go sleep dude

I hope the idle is actually idle

[glossy niche]

https://www.pcworld.com/article/2651749/office-is-too-slow-so-microsoft-is-making-it-load-at-windows-startup.html

we heard you like diarrhoea, so we are removing your bowel control completely

idk how to spell diarhea

[rough sapphire]

helloo ! , i have a C# file that i want to convert into APK , any one know how to?

[uneven pine]

That's a very roundabout way to ask how to make an Android app with яC#

[scarlet peak]

wait you couldnt just like

cook it again

[vocal oyster]

it was too long at that point

[uneven pine]

How do you fail to cook frozen pizza

I've been doing that since i was like 11 lmao

[vocal oyster]

literally explained but ok

[tropic ore]

TIL the UK isn't a single country?

[stark prawn]

nope

[glossy niche]

wait fr?

[tardy rain]

🤨

Its a union of 4 countries

[glossy niche]

ik it has Scotland and Wales and shit but r they countries or just "states" kinda like the us

is texas a country

[acoustic moss]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNu8XDBSn10

[tardy rain]

They are countries

Idk about northern ireland

🤷‍♀️

[glossy niche]

huh

[glossy niche]

idk I don't trust cgp grey that much anymore , he got too much shit wrong for my liking

[acoustic moss]

damn

im too illiterate to know when someones wrong so i like everyone

[glossy niche]

should I forgive him or has he rly fallen off

[acoustic moss]

video is 14 years old tho

[glossy niche]

he got some bad takes on the royal family and self driving cars

I did love his content as a kid

[tardy rain]

Ohno

Is he a royalist

[glossy niche]

"the family pays for itself via Tourism" iirc

I hope I am not misremembering

[tardy rain]

Thats absolutely bs

Goddamn

[acoustic moss]

lol

[glossy niche]

and cancelling someone based on an anecdote I have from like

a decade ago

yeah let's cancel him

[tardy rain]

Absolutely no one in the history of visiting the UK ever did so to come stand outside buckie palace

[glossy niche]

fr? lmfao

[tardy rain]

Theres no way

You'd have to be fully sold on this idea, like have the entire pair of royal boots in your mouth

[glossy niche]

if I ever go there I'll probably just tour the castles

I wanna know the history of king fuck field bottomhead

and the lore of his manor

[tardy rain]

Who even visits the UK for tourism

Must be an american thing

[glossy niche]

not sure, I had relatives study there and go "I am not going back to that shit hole"

they come from war torn third world countries

[tardy rain]

Studying yea, business yea, flying over to look at some royals? Hell no

We got royals back home

[glossy niche]

https://youtu.be/yiE2DLqJB8U?si=

oh I found it

2 brits beefing

[tardy rain]

Not the corgi in the sea 😭😭

[glossy niche]

btw is the queen rly dead or they fkn with us

[tardy rain]

Who knows at this point

All i know is king charlie fired cadbury chocolate

[harsh tundra]

Lol, it's may long weekend (1st May Labour Day), we partied long :3 bbq yesterday, today pizza in wood-fired oven. We're firing it now, heating the stone

[thick ore]

redis is open source again https://redis.io/blog/agplv3/

wonder what happens to valkey

[bleak lintel]

probably stays around

i would say there are a non-zero amount of people pissed off by the rugpull of the century here

sorry, second best rugpull of the century, first was trump saying his voters actually did sign up for tarriffs

[thick ore]

😭

[glossy niche]

probably the same as opensearch: (not much I think)

[vocal oyster]

maybe it's like the situation under paris syndrome

[narrow coral]

What was in the glass?

Also, u owe me 2 slices

For making u the vice-president of the cult of nikita

😤

[harsh tundra]

Sure, come here and get yours.

[glossy niche]

that looks so messy I love it

the messier the pizzer the better

[harsh tundra]

You mean the glass visible in the bg? Idk, whatever K was drinking at that moment

[harsh tundra]

I forgot to take a photo earlier when it was whole. This was actually second pizza. I didn't remember about a photo when first was in

[glossy niche]

can relate

even when I tell pppl to not eat before I take a picture they just eat

[harsh tundra]

This is not even Italian, my partner's sib does more of Italian style pizza. We usually throw a lot of stuff on.

[plush sun]

New wojak perspective unlocked: behind

[harsh tundra]

What we have left for now, everyone is full.
Dough from 2kg of flour, 8 people.

[narrow coral]

Funny enough, i also had pizza for dinner haha

[glossy niche]

oh I just noticed that one

[cobalt remnant]

I'm trying to design a build/deploy stack I can self-host. I'm thinking jenkins to run ci/cd. After that passes, it pushes an image and updates a git repo containing kubernetes manifests. An AWX server will then see the changes and run kubectl apply automatically.

possibly using templates defined in the repo.

[bleak maple]

Have you considered ArgoCD? It's pretty decent.

Used it recently to wrangle our insane multi-phase deploy process at work

It's even easier if you use Helm but you don't have to.

[cobalt remnant]

I'm looking at Jenkins and AWX because those are services being offered to be hosted for me by another team at work.

[bleak maple]

Gotcha

Jenkins is what we used before ArgoCD; my advice is to just be incredibly sparing about the surface area you 'touch' in Jenkins.. try to keep your stuff isolated to its own little area etc.

[cobalt remnant]

plus, there's an air gap between our current build server and the kubernetes cluster, and AWX will be able to access both the git repo and k8s cluster

[bleak maple]

AWX is the Ansible thing right?

[cobalt remnant]

yes.

[bleak maple]

What you propose sounds sane then yeah; I would still consider using Helm as the 'template' format, but you may or may not love its design.

[cobalt remnant]

I'm familiar with helm

[bleak maple]

The nice thing about Helm is that you can add validations and avoid ever generating anything weird/unexpected.

You can build that with 'bare' k8s templates, there are some other utilities, but I like the under-one-roof Helm approach so far.

[cobalt remnant]

I'll probably just write a single helm template, then fill in values with ansible variables.

[glossy niche]

Jenkins is ass to self host

[bleak maple]

and to keep updated, oof

[glossy niche]

it's a nightmare to update

[bleak maple]

Yeah, I never want to have to do that again

[cobalt remnant]

I'm not self-hosting it. 🙂

[glossy niche]

you have to make sure all the fucking plugins are the correct versions

[cobalt remnant]

It's being done by the DaaS team

well, it will be

[glossy niche]

you condemn someone to a fate that should only meet those who commit crimes against humanity

[cobalt remnant]

They want to do this.

[glossy niche]

Dickhead as a service?

personally I'd recommend whatever CI ships with ur version control

[cobalt remnant]

They want to take on the task of managing everyone's existing jenkins server.

[glossy niche]

and self.host argo or smn idk

[glossy niche]

huh

[cobalt remnant]

We have bitbucket server

[glossy niche]

do they have Jenkins experience?

[cobalt remnant]

It doesn't include Bitbucket pipelines

I'd assume so.

[glossy niche]

yeah OK shit bucket sucks

Jenkins needs like 5 years of development to get on par with actual cloud native CI

[cobalt remnant]

woe is me, the internal corporate code monkey

[bleak maple]

(I think my favorite CI so far that I've used is BuildKite)

There's probably something cooler now but BK is good

[glossy niche]

hmmm, I've not used it before

[bleak maple]

It's 'hybrid' so it lets you describe pretty interesting workflows
https://buildkite.com/docs/pipelines/architecture

[glossy niche]

Jenkins isn't bad tbh but it needs a lot of fixing and development isn't super fast

if you get a managed Jenkins then I'd say it's good

[cobalt remnant]

effectively managed

by someone else at the company

It's almost as good as managed postgresql

[glossy niche]

huh

[cobalt remnant]

the only thing better than managed postgresql is self-serve managed postgresql

[glossy niche]

so it's half saas half not

[bleak maple]

Yeah; and you can pay more to run the SaaS part yourself if you need/want to.

[glossy niche]

mmmhmmmmm I'd rather not get something rugpullable

[bleak maple]

That's fair. I wouldn't have chosen it probably myself, but I ended up at a job that was using it, and I was pleasantly surprised.

"Wait, why isn't this awful?"

[vale raven]

https://tenor.com/view/david-meece-youre-not-ok-stop-it-get-some-help-get-help-youre-crazy-gif-25860529

Anyone that says Jenkins is good needs to get themselves checked out

[surreal sparrow]

I remember using Hudson and also CruiseControl back in the day!

[vale raven]

I don’t even know those names

[surreal sparrow]

I'm an old F

[vale raven]

Am I too young?

[surreal sparrow]

I'm 49 so ...

[vale raven]

icic

Dam

25 this month

[green pelican]

DAMN

[vocal oyster]

don't worry I'm here to replace

ripe 18

[grave cove]

Bro might be unc fr

[vocal oyster]

it's coming

[bleak maple]

Huh I don't actually remember disliking Hudson.. do you remember why we all stopped using it?

[surreal sparrow]

IIRC Jenkins superceded it

[bleak maple]

Oh right ugh.. they got us there

There turned about to be a correct amount of logic to permit your CI system to have, and not more

[jaunty wraith]

Then there's Dagger, which tries to be all CI as logic

[bleak maple]

Next time I should just build my own CI in https://cylc.github.io/ I guess

[jaunty wraith]

Huh. That looks cool

[bleak maple]

It's pretty interesting to be able to refer back to previous outcomes in a first-class way.

Instead of having to store things in a db and look them up later

And it's fun to be like "everybody can handle ACYCLIC graphs..."

[glossy niche]

I checked myself out in the mirror and I look great, I don't know what you are talking about

[warped sentinel]

hudson was the original project.
when Oracle acquired sun, they tried to mess with the community and the community just forked it into jenkins

[thick ore]

the jenkins guy is a butler

[glossy niche]

there are a lot of parts of Jenkins still named hudson

In those java packages and shit

[vale raven]

Woah
You’re still alive

[thick ore]

https://github.com/BurntSushi
this guy is the goat

[tropic ore]

i do wonder why i have come to be in favor of types and typed languages

its exactness and attached connotation of speed is simply a bit too enticing, perhaps...?

[bleak maple]

I think it's natural once you get experienced enough to encounter large codebases and fully understand them.

I used to be all-in on dynamic typing, but now I've seen some things where I don't feel that's the right tool etc.

[tropic ore]

i mean, i think it's very much a pain to have such a system, but to be so precise holds my dear interest well, i guess

[round pendant]

i cant imagine writing code without knowing what types it operates on

[bleak maple]

I'm not even 100% sure how I feel about fancy type inference anymore.. because if you never spell out the type, I have to calculate it in some editor plugin etc..

[round pendant]

annotating parameters is good even though systems like HM can infer them, but annotating locals everywhere is too much clutter

[bleak maple]

Yeah, I'm torn.. but if you can just do:
auto x = 5 somewhere, and never have to say what kind of int it is.. I dunno if I love that anymore.

[round pendant]

its whatever int it should be used as
which is much better than having to sprinkle the size everywhere and have to change it everywhere if you do need to change

[bleak maple]

Yeah which I now have to go find, instead of being able to use this as a program invariant in my head

I guess, yeah. It just makes me lean on my editor's tooling harder than I prefer.

[round pendant]

i guess you could define an alias and use that
like Int
the size would be an implementation detail that can change without the name needing to change everywhere

[bleak maple]

That's my current preference, but you're right all-in inference has some nice advantages re: refactoring etc.

[round pendant]

its also just.. less typing
though ig the editor could write the annotation for you instead of showing an inlay hint

[bleak maple]

I'm slowly designing a dataflow-ish programming language and I'm leaning toward all-in fancy inference there, so I guess I'm converting

[torpid hare]

everything that is not libc is bad

[vale raven]

https://tenor.com/view/stop-it-get-some-help-gif-15058124

[bleak maple]

I take it you're not a musl fan

[torpid hare]

well, can you help me?

[bleak maple]

wolf-rainbow is an ally of justice, surely they can

[torpid hare]

problem solved then

[vale raven]

I can introduce you to Python

[torpid hare]

what's the difference between instanced variables and "normal" variables

[bleak maple]

(IMO everything is really an instance variable of something, but I guess that isn't usually how Python talks about it)

(I guess the 'toplevel namespace' isn't as formal in Python as it is some other places)

(in Ruby for example ruby -e "puts(self.object_id)" the toplevel binding is itself an object)

[harsh tundra]

Technically "global variables" in python are module-level variables... But without the module itself being loaded as an object.
But your file can import itself and it will be accessible as an object

[bleak maple]

Are those really the two classes then in Python under the hood? Instance variables of some kind of type(), or module vars?

[harsh tundra]

What?

[graceful basin]

modules are instances of the module type

and the module type is an instance of type

[bleak maple]

OK, then yeah I guess I'm still OK with my 'everything's an instance variable' take

[graceful basin]

local variables aren't instance variables

[bleak maple]

Is there not a Binding type in Python exposed to the user? I guess not?

[harsh tundra]

Everything in python is an object. Modules, functions, all numbers... There's no "primitive type" vs class in python like in e.g. Java (where you have primitives like int but then class of "similar" type Integer because not everything can be done on primitives there)

[bleak maple]

(I'm used to Ruby and locals are instance variables of Bindings)

[graceful basin]

Ah no, Python doesn't work like that

Python is statically scoped specifically for local variables

[bleak maple]

(bindings are an optional argument to eval() to use that scope etc)

Aha, that's good to know. So they are meaningfully distinct.

[strange blade]

@acoustic moss hopefully i'm remembering correctly and you're chompkin (otherwise I'm stupid) but here

[acoustic moss]

damn

[strange blade]

satisfying

perfect 1k

[crystal spruce]

nice

[scarlet peak]

when you travelled all the way to europe for the pizza and it ends up being a pizza, not a biosafety hazard

[glossy niche]

slapping topping onto flatbread is a Mediterranean classic

[cobalt remnant]

Don't make fun of people who eat pizza with a fork and knife. They're probably just european

[robust zephyr]

Eating pizza with a fork and knife is slower, which is better for digestion

[bleak maple]

Man, do we really need this? https://github.com/jj-vcs/jj

I guess borrowing "conflicts-are-first-class objects" from Darcs is cool.

and I guess working on 'weird' filesystems like Dropbox/Drive is cool.

[young shoal]

yes

it's quite nice

[solemn tulip]

it's nice, very ergonomic

[solemn tulip]

(out of curiosity, is this coming from the devops toolbox video, or just randomly bumping into it?)

[bleak maple]

Oh I think I did hear about this on YouTube? Lemme look at my history to see where I saw it

[solemn tulip]

there was a recent video (pretty clickbaity title)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZqFaMlufDY

[alpine kiln]

Why do they use " when they print hello world but not when they do this age = 20
Print(age)

[solemn tulip]

the title struck some nerves in the jj discord 😛

[carmine apex]

ah yes, a popular google product
countdown to when they kill it?

[bleak maple]

Oh yeah that’s the one; I didn’t actually watch the video but it made me Google for it

[alpine kiln]

Answe yall I need to know

[solemn tulip]

and that's the exact response that you get with such a title

[solemn tulip]

the video itself is actually a pretty good look at jj and some nice features

[carmine apex]

hecking miracle they haven't killed chrome yet

[solemn tulip]

they might be forced to sell chrome

[thick osprey]

They do get to either fight for it, sell it, or kill it. So, early polls are early.

[solemn tulip]

though the "killed by google" stuff ends up being killed services most of the time

[carmine apex]

the idea of openai buying chrome is

[solemn tulip]

services can be killed easily, projects living and being contributed to externally less so

jj in particular started as a free-time project of a google engineer who worked on their internal vcs stuff for a long time

and it was only later was picked up as a replacement for the internal vcs frontend

[rough sapphire]

Day 1 of asking you to become a helper

[harsh tundra]

Because you can either print literals or variables. And string literals require quotes, "hello" is a string literal, hello is a variable

[jaunty wraith]

That's the first time I've read about its adoption

[jaunty wraith]

Perhaps they could "enhance" it to be like Deta Surf

[thick ore]

@surreal sparrow not sure what you mean but here's a screenshot

[surreal sparrow]

Thanks - that's good but did you run it from the UI desktop or from the cmd line?

[thick ore]

from the search

[surreal sparrow]

NICE!!!!

In which case, are you interested in a demo license, perhaps?

[thick ore]

sure why not

[surreal sparrow]

chuck me your email in a DM

[harsh tundra]

@nova pine
Continuing from #python-discussion message because this is no longer python

I'm under 18...

In some countries, parents can make a bank account for a child 13+, linked to their bank account. 😉 I'm almost 30 and I had one of those.
So such account + linked debit card would work.

Or just a prepaid card - similar to debit, but for a separate small deposit account you can load. (It's actually advertised in my bank as great way to give children allowance, lol.)

You can do some research for your country (especially prices for each, e.g. in Poland accounts are usually free, but cards are free only if you use a card several times a month, otherwise you have to pay a monthly fee for it).

Prepaid card is safest as it won't get over what's deposited (a lot of people actually use those for Internet shopping and deposit money there just before making a purchase - even if site is suspicious, it just can't charge beyond what's on the card).
For debit card, it's whole account it can use, so you'd need to keep only a bit of money there to have similar safety.

Some free services may do a lock for like $1 to see if it's a real card and whether it's empty or not (because completely empty cards are suspicious). Service will release the lock without charging the card, it's just a check. So just keep a small amount on your card, just enough to pass those checks.

[nova pine]

i know this, and i am pretty sure i have such account like this, (actually im sure i have), but i dont want to pay because it is not so important to me... my main site is deployed without ws

but thank you for the help

[bleak maple]

I should move my Steam library to some crazy NVMe over RoCE volume I guess.

I can't believe how cheap it is to do NVMeOF / RoCE stuff now; all my gear already supports it WTF etc.

(If you're wondering what those acronyms are here's a primer https://www.purestorage.com/content/dam/pdf/en/ebooks/protected/eb-nvme-of-for-noobs.pdf )

(ignore the marketing for their product, though the Cassandra benchmarks are relevant)

[open cliff]

legal loopholes found

[harsh tundra]

As I said, it's just for the times you need a card for free account for verification (that's why I explained the lock and release, as it sometimes scares people if they notice it). :3

[green pelican]

if they need a "card" for verification they are betting on you forgetting to cancel

hot take

(idk if its hot)

oh god thuri is here

[carmine apex]

that's neither hot nor a take

[green pelican]

oh

i just assume im going to be cooked with every opinion so i say it

[harsh tundra]

That's only for free/discounted trials tho

[green pelican]

which is fair my opinions are

interesting

[carmine apex]

takes are viewpoints

[green pelican]

man you guys see the party in ot0

[harsh tundra]

The talk back in pygen was about free plans that still require a card to verify that's a real person and not a mass account to use up resources 🙂

[green pelican]

ic ic

thats fair

until they find out about bins

[harsh tundra]

Plus the shady practices is why I mention prepaid or to keep only small amount on your teen account 😉 just to pass the card verification (lock of small amount)

[green pelican]

i always kept a empty prepaid gift card in my wallet

[bleak maple]

OK this is an idea I don't see every day https://github.com/obi1kenobi/trustfall

[carmine apex]

wiki's example of a fen string, rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/RNBQKBNR w KQkq - 0 1, is 56 ascii characters, which is 448 bits, but this is obviously unoptimized.

with FEN:
let's assume that the separators of / and can be ignored somehow. in an implementation, this is likely true.
PNBRQK with 2 cases is a single base 12 number (equivalently, base6 (piece) * base2 (side)). the absolute worst-case FEN board state would have the 32 pieces distributed in a checkerboard pattern. whether this can be legally achieved, ¯_(ツ)_/¯. spaces are denoted by the number of adjacent spaces, 1-8. naturally, an base-8 number. There are thus 32 base-12 numbers and 32 base-8 numbers. The raw board state would take log2(12**32 * 8**32), or 211 bits

But FEN stores more than the raw board state. We must also add the current player (b2), castling availibility (4 binary states, so b16), En passent position (b16 - 8 each for both opening rows), half-move clock (up to 75* full moves, so b150), and turn number (b8849, rip). These bring us to log2(12**32 * 8**32 * 2 * 16 * 150 * 8849), or 237 bits

*half-move at 75: while FEN normally stores this for enacting the 50-move rule against repetition, claiming this is voluntary, meaning that (again, for the worst case) it essentially doesn't exist. The 75-move rule is recent, dating back to 2014, but is enacted by the arbiter, thus a hard limit. Reducing this to b100 for the 50-move (also reducing max turn length to 5899) only cuts the total bit size to 235.

[graceful basin]

Nice, I technically beat FEN in the worst case.

[carmine apex]

assuming the past hour () of me mathing wasn't filled with a zillion errors

[open cliff]

[carmine apex]

license question
if a person A contributes code under a license that requires attribution, and that code is later completely replaced (whether as a whole, or piecewise via multiple contributions), are there situations where A can be removed the list of contributors?

in other words, are there licenses where attribution is required only for contributors to the current state of the code, not its entire history

[thick osprey]

Don't all licenses only apply to the current state of the code?

[carmine apex]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

afaik, the list of contributors is an add-only object. whether this is legally required, or simply common practice, idk

[thick osprey]

Oh, you mean the list of contributors on a site like GitHub?

Not a file in the repo.

[graceful basin]

If you no longer distribute code by A, you are be able to ignore the license under which they provided their code. The challenge is in proving this.

[carmine apex]

no, the actual file. gh's tracking data is external to the code organization's practices

[carmine apex]

so you could, but most places wouldn't consider it even close to worth the hassle unless a contributor becomes infamous, and perhaps not even then

[thick osprey]

Hmm. Outside of an organization I would say that if I've removed all code that A, then the license no longer applies. However (and a big one at that), if this is being distributed externally in an org I'd be dialing up the legal team or general council for review.

in other words: If it's my code, I'd pull the trigger. If it's a company's code, I'll let them decide and just keep even stale references.

[graceful basin]

contributors usually do not conveniently only work on one clearly demarked bit of code

tho I've come across such things

where there are like 8 licenses for various pieces as they were contributed

[carmine apex]

yeah i think the biggest problem is getting a court to buy the idea that the original contributor's code has been completely removed instead of slowly modified

[rough sapphire]

.8ball should I play chess today?

[median dome]

Outlook not so good

[vocal oyster]

speaking of code contribution, Ubuntu is adopting sudo-rs and it seems like a gimmick with the hidden idea of changing licenses

like there is practically no benefit to a rust sudo, especially audited by so few people initially

[bleak maple]

I also think it's comical that sudo-rs doesn't target UNIX portability

[green pelican]

every day im happier to be on gentoo

[lament cairn]

port everything to rust

[green pelican]

i would rather die standing than live on my knees (to rust)

rust users when unsafe

https://tenor.com/view/what-the-gif-15375505645985080248

[thick ore]

thats why go is better

[uneven pine]

Rust has become such an awful language

[thick ore]

at least the tooling is still nice

i love colored output

[uneven pine]

Great tooling can't fix a language that tedious and ugly

[thick ore]

yeah lol

i read any rust code and it's too noisy

[uneven pine]

I mean it's fine if you just use like... The language features that existed on initial release only

And ignore all the crap they added

But rust has suffered from ruby syndrome

"there's now 3 different syntaxes to do the exact same thing, they are entirely interchangeable and the community will never agree on one way to do it"

Thanks I hate having to mentally interpret code as I read it

Not to mention some of the "new" ways of doing things look so so so much worse. Tacked on as an afterthought

[tulip palm]

i'm still interested in learning rust because i somewhat prefer the way it feels over C/C++

though i've not really worked a substantial amount with either side, i've had the most fun when working with rust

[uneven pine]

I used to. I really did

I would rather write C++ now any day

[tulip palm]

that's interesting

[uneven pine]

I have been looking into Zig as a replacement

And it seems promising

It has some quirks but overall looks a lot better to use and read

[tulip palm]

hmmmm

noted

[unkempt python]

Yeah im looking into zig too

Rust feels rlly good as a language but i cant keep going with it anymore

[lament cairn]

rust devs moving from c just need to write better code smh , \j

I've learned a little bit of Rust through Rustlings for a project that I've now abandoned, and I had fun
but reading any "real" rust code, I can't tell wtf is going on most of the time. can't blame the language, I'm barely a beginner, just something I noticed

[uneven pine]

I have used a considerable amount of rust but most of it was written a long while ago

[bleak maple]

If you are bummed with Rust but want memory-safety in a systems language, what else are you pondering?

I've been tempted to write a thing that transpiles to Rust, but has fewer features, just because Rust seems like the go-to back-end for compiling such programs these days

[low chasm]

does zig even promise memory safety?

[bleak maple]

No

[low chasm]

I've heard pleasant things about it, at least

I imagine it's a vastly different language than rust, though

[bleak maple]

Zig is super badass

but this is also a valid Zig program:

const std = @import("std");

pub fn main() !void {
    var a: *i32 = undefined;
    {
        var b: i32 = 10;
        a = &b;
        std.debug.print("address of b is: {s}\n", .{&b});
    }
    std.debug.print("a is pointing to: {s}\n", .{a});
    const c: i32 = a.*;
    std.debug.print("{d}\n", .{c});
    a.* = 11;
    std.debug.print("{d}\n", .{a.*});
}

Now, what a Zig person would say is, don't write it that way, and yes that's how not to do it.

They would tell you to make an 'allocator' object and have it track the lifetimes for you and yell if you did this etc

My main must-have Rust-like feature is:

fn main() {
    let a:i32;
    let a_ptr = &a;
}
``` this needs to not work.

https://medium.com/@shyamsundarb/memory-safety-in-c-vs-rust-vs-zig-f78fa903f41e a little slow-paced but semi-useful I guess

I dunno, I continue to aim higher than what Rust has shown us is possible.

Waaaaaaait, one of the VPRI nerds has an active project on GitHub, with commits last week? https://github.com/ohmjs/ohm

God why is this JavaScript 😦

[low chasm]

the r/programminglanguages discord has a lot of cool people doing cool stuff

https://discord.gg/programming-language-development-530598289813536771

oh, we're already mutuals there lmao

[bleak maple]

Nah we weren't, I just joined instantly

Thanks for the suggestion!

[grave cove]

mods, ban him for advertisement

[uneven pine]

Memory safety is a great thing. I don't want to discount that

But

If memory safety is the only thing your language has going for it as a selling point... Maybe your language isn't that great.

And that's where I'm at with modern rust.

[bleak maple]

Yeah, "necessary but not sufficient"

[timid latch]

I mean rust a lot more going for it as well. Maybe not exactly unique features persay, but I wouldn't use rust if all I got for it was memory safety.
Like I really like the trait and macro systems, not to mention enums and the ecosystem

I also love how you can basically work at whatever abstraction level you want in rust

Like you can go from raw pointers and memory manipulation, to high level generics and traits without it feeling jarring

[grave cove]

i like the idea of marking functions as unsafe but being able to build safe abstractions on top. so it's not like async where one async function pollutes your entire call tree all the way to the top

[wicked haven]

Just make every function that isn't inlined async /j

[warped sentinel]

Are you saying that eliminating whole classes of bugs from your code by definition is not valuable?

[uneven pine]

Please read the messages literally directly above the one you replied to.

[warped sentinel]

I did. So you are saying it would be great but not that great?

[graceful basin]

I mean, the rust selling point is parallelism and robust APIs

[uneven pine]

I'm saying if it's the only selling point of the language then it is not a great language.

[warped sentinel]

Why would you not consider correctness as a strong point for a great language?

[uneven pine]

It IS a strong point for a great language

but that alone does not make a great language

[warped sentinel]

where do you put the bar then?

[timid latch]

I mean I do agree, correctness is useless if it's a hell to use/satisfy

[warped sentinel]

Are you saying it's binary and either you have correctness and it's hell to use/satisfy? Or it's easy to use/satisfy but you have no correctness?

Or that no correctness can be provided without being hell to use/satisfy?

[timid latch]

I simply meant correctness isn't useful if it's hard to use.
I made no point about whether correctness is fundamentally hard or easy.

I think rust strikes a good balance where it can prevent many bugs at compile time, without spending hours proving stuff to the compiler

I would use a language with less correctness guarantees that was easy to use, over one with correctness guarantees that is hard to use

But I would use a language that has correctness and was relatively simple over both of those

[warped sentinel]

I see. That's an odd ranking from where I stand. But sure.

[timid latch]

(and I do consider rust in the "relatively simple" camp)

relatively being a important keyword there

[manic canyon]

lightmode user

[thick ore]

what the heckles man

[tropic ore]

people are scared of how big this guy's vision scale number is

20/n where n is huge

[graceful basin]

what does this mean?

[stark prawn]

smh, forgot about the time dimension

[vocal oyster]

maybe the centre

what an interesting interpretation though

[graceful basin]

Yeah

[acoustic moss]

huh how is it 3

[thick ore]

3 meters

how hard is it to understand

smh

[brazen ingot]

3 dimensions

[wooden silo]

The distance from the Earth to the center of the Milky Way is indeed about 26k ly

[graceful basin]

Good to know

[wooden silo]

The only reasonable interpretation I can imagine is that it's number of spatial dimensions

[loud raft]

Hello man

Anyone here

[brazen ingot]

null

[loud raft]

hey bud

[simple matrix]

Hi

Can anyone teach me python?

[scarlet peak]

!res - teach yourself

[royal lake]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[vocal oyster]

nobody ever

[scarlet peak]

absolutely not

[lament cairn]

goood morning

[muted pebble]

https://tenor.com/view/sleepy-cat-gif-9756806555839107811

[loud raft]

O ye

Any one to play valo type game with me

[simple matrix]

.me

[loud raft]

Hey man

@simple matrix

[green pelican]

without spending hours proving stuff to the compiler
we must have very very different perspectives on rust

[graceful basin]

oh it can get so much worse than rust

[timid latch]

Exactly, hence "relatively simple"

[vocal oyster]

seeing that would require reading down

but anyway relative all depends on what group of languages you're considering but whatever

[graceful basin]

I don't think it's worthwhile discussing how safe rust is if rust is the safest language you know.

[tropic torrent]

i need to optimize my library asap💔💔

[solemn tulip]

is this a lean moment?

[graceful basin]

ATS, Lean, some Haskell patterns, Ponylang and such.

Technically mercury

Oh, and PlusCal/TLA++

And all the many related languages

[nova wyvern]

...cube spins?
cube spins!

now add 'raytracing'

[tropic torrent]

this is running in the terminal btw

[nova wyvern]

yeah, since there are so few 'pixels', you can easily do that in Python without performance becoming too much of an issue

[wicked haven]

I would assume it's trying to say the milky way is 3 * (the distance from the earth to the center of the milky way) wide

errr wait no it converted it into meters

whar

[vale raven]

I wanna know the story behind this OTN

[vale raven]

I don't like this
Can you make a better story?

[carmine apex]

can you click the link and read it yourself?

boring context, really. person was concerned about whether a discord bot would be harmful to their read-by-interviewers gh portfolio

[vale raven]

Yea I can
(I did, I'm saying the context was lame)

[carmine apex]

🇮🇨

[vale raven]

This is what GPT is actually good for

Creative stuffs

[carmine apex]

https://tenor.com/view/ogli-gif-17468683305861986751

be professional discord bot developer
overseeing deployment and maintenance of bot for big-time client
job and future literally depends on it working
it breaks
fired & unemployable

a discord bot broke my career
mfw

spent nearly minimal time or effort on that, so there ya go @vale raven

[vale raven]

https://tenor.com/view/americas-got-talent-agt-happy-smile-excited-gif-13083860

https://tenor.com/view/funny-animals-say-cheese-smile-creepy-excited-gif-6564757416229948468

[bleak maple]

Is there some cool-kid 2025+ shell I should be using instead of my beloved zsh?

[grave cove]

fish maybe

[bleak maple]

I tried it way back and didn't really feel like I needed what it had to give me

Great errors though

[tropic ore]

the M107 shell is pretty cool, widely used even in 2025

[bleak maple]

155mm is good stuff

[low chasm]

what are you looking for?

is posix compatibility something you want?

[bleak maple]

I guess that’s the real question. I do value that feature of zsh a lot, but equally maybe I should try something wildly different?

I usually use /bin/sh directly for scripting anyway

[low chasm]

I don't really script with it, but I use fish for interactive use, which is nice since it comes with pretty much whatever I need out of the box (e.g autocompletion, coloring, and pretty nice history), and is widely used enough that it's generally supported by a lot of things. And abbreviations are cool.

https://www.nushell.sh is apparently popular these days

[bleak maple]

Nice, this is the sort of “take” I was picturing. Maybe I will try this for real.

Kinda “jq but for everything”

[open cliff]

^.^

... A fine addition to my collection.

[scarlet peak]

what discord bot broke what career

[open cliff]

[open cliff]

#career-advice message

[loud raft]

Hey man

You kinda gamer?

[open cliff]

?

[loud raft]

valo types?

[open cliff]

Nope. I don't play valorant >.<

[loud raft]

Any?

[tardy rain]

Sir this is a python server

[loud raft]

Isnt it off topic

[tardy rain]

It is but if youre looking for gamers you'll have better luck in gaming related servers

[glossy niche]

it always weirds me out when ppl do this, I remember opening a page for covid info during the pandemic and it was full of people trying to get others to play pubg mobile with them

[green pelican]

nah thats hype

💀

[plucky ridge]

Got a weird question. I'm trying to download a file from a site. The file download fails, and I'm trying to watch the network traffic to see why it fails. When I click the link to download the file, it opens a new tab, starts the download, then closes the tab. This is keeping me from seeing the traffic as the download is happening. Is there a way to keep that automatically opened tab from closing after it starts that download?

Or actually, maybe an open-source option that works like fiddler?

....he says forgetting the wireshark exists

[green pelican]

i was gonna say

lol

[jaunty wraith]

If it's an <a download target="_blank">, you could try to modify the target

[grave cove]

try curling the file instead

[plucky ridge]

How would I do that if it's a file I have to log in to access?

I'm still a rookie when dealing with web stuff in general

[grave cove]

token probably

[plucky ridge]

And now to learn how to wrangle wireshark

Trying to figure out which thing I actually need to be tracing

[green pelican]

u could pass ur browser cookie

session cookie

mayhaps

[plucky ridge]

This is on Windows so....

Oh wait I did install curl for windows

Ignore me

[green pelican]

ok blocked

[plucky ridge]

I'm IT, I have to use Windows

I'm working with what I got

[green pelican]

nah im kidding lol you said ignore me

[plucky ridge]

HA

Right

Jesus, shows where my head is right now

[green pelican]

💀

[plucky ridge]

Hmmm.... It'd be doing a redirect before it starts the download, right?

So the link I haven't isn't technically the direct download link

[green pelican]

uhhhhhhhhh whats wireshark say

[plucky ridge]

It's.... very complicated and I don't understand....

[green pelican]

ah networking

[green pelican]

i think in theory the redirect would have a file extension like https[:]//whatever.com/file.exe

or

maybe curl allows for redirects

[lament cairn]

-L makes curl follow redirects

[plucky ridge]

Gotcha

The session id would be called something like "JSESSIONID", right?

I feel dumb for asking this kind of stuff

[green pelican]

yes that is the cookie

When a user creates a session request.getSession() will be called; this is what creates the JSESSIONID object, which stores the session cookie. This is how websites identify and remember you

source: my blog 😎

[cloud oxide]

you guys know vue?

[green pelican]

i also made a cookie extractor lol

[native kindle]

is it called cookie cutter?

[green pelican]

cookiemonSter

haha

cookie cutter is fire too though

[willow narwhal]

cookiecutter is already a thing

!pypi cookiecutter

[royal lake]

cookiecutter v2.6.0

A command-line utility that creates projects from project templates, e.g. creating a Python package project from a Python package project template.

Released on <t:1708538561:D>.

[green pelican]

well mine is C not python

so im good

[cloud oxide]

🙃

[green pelican]

!pypi cookiemonster

[royal lake]

cookiemonster v0.0.1

Format, lint and test only the files that have changed on the current branch.

Released on <t:1653037960:D>.

[green pelican]

thats hard wtf

[green pelican]

i know its a js framework

[cloud oxide]

eslint gave 4 warnings so deleted it but wanna reinstall it so it hopefully doesn t give warnings but sure how to do it with npm

[spare oriole]

use httptoolkit

thank me later

[plucky ridge]

Oooo

This does look neat

[tulip palm]

i've been learning vue recently! made a reactive website for a private game server, https://osu.skrungly.com/

[cloud oxide]

cool need to learn it for uni 🙂 have done angular before

[spare oriole]

[tulip palm]

good luck! this is my first attempt at a reactive website and it has been really fun (which helps a lot)

[open cliff]

"Jsession Jesse, we need to cook"

[rough sapphire]

Hi

[green pelican]

yoooo

[weak peak]

welcome back

[unkempt python]

HELLO

[spare oriole]

🪀

[spare oriole]

[spare oriole]

[unkempt python]

Has it actually already been a year

[spare oriole]

wdym?

[unkempt python]

Like a year since u left or whatever

[green pelican]

nope

[narrow coral]

It has been 4 months at most

Yep, 3 just checked

[uneven pine]

Man

I remember when Doritos cool ranch were good

Ever since they started putting sugar in them they just don't taste good.

[spare oriole]

wait what?

[uneven pine]

Yeah. They're ever so slightly sweet now. It's pretty bad.

[spare oriole]

i haven't noticed that myself

[uneven pine]

On top of just being way more bland than they used to be

[spare oriole]

the bland stuff i do get, but not the sweet

they feel more stale

[uneven pine]

We were out of the normal chips I usually get from the vending machine so I got a bag today

[weak peak]

https://tenor.com/view/thinking-agreed-hmm-gif-27306034

[vivid pulsar]

wassup guys

[glossy niche]

homeless man begged me for insulin money today so I told him money doesn't buy happiness 😌

[tropic ore]

it sure does buy healthiness though >^>

[scarlet peak]

happiness comes from within

[quasi blaze]

Put in the best effort in everything that you are getting paid for because you don’t want your customers or your employer to think that they’re wasting their money paying you.

[glossy niche]

don't feed my anxiety dude

[tardy rain]

Have you increased shareholder value today?

[glossy niche]

actually yes I saved them from a 10k usd per month aws bill

just yesterday

they got rug pulled lol

fix was to just cache a thing bec there was this expensive aws api they kept bombarding

[quasi blaze]

Anxiety for what?

[glossy niche]

me and a lot of ppl ik have paranoia about being fired for having poor job performance

It's a common fear it seems, makes sense because getting fired means getting fucked for some

[tardy rain]

😭😭

[quasi blaze]

Are you in 🇺🇸?

[thick osprey]

How about:

Put forward your best effort into what you do.

[quasi blaze]

Makes sense because I think most states have a “fire-at-will” policy

In Canada, you need to be on a probation first before getting fired

[tardy rain]

Put forward effort relative to value exchanged for it you said?

[wooden silo]

But don't overwork yourself and let yourself get taken advantage of.

[glossy niche]

no

[tropic ridge]

Me neither💀

[uncut hull]

guys, do you believe that the universe is a simulation?

[wooden silo]

I believe there's no way to know whether it is or not.

[uncut hull]

scary

[wooden silo]

It also kinda doesn't matter.

[low chasm]

not worrying enough to have an existential crisis over, at least.

[wooden silo]

Like, if you did find out it was, it wouldn't really change anything about your life.

Other than if you let the mere thought of it bother you.

[uncut hull]

it is good to not know everything

[wooden silo]

I think it's generally better to know more true things, as a rule of thumb.

[carmine apex]

there was linked elsewhere a bit ago an article relevant here: https://notashelf.dev/posts/curse-of-knowing

[wooden silo]

I feel like the issue here isn't technical fluency but rather a kind of personality disorder unique to certain individuals.

Like, some flavor of OCD or need for control.

[carmine apex]

my point was that in that case of notashelf and other fields, as rb said, sometimes

it is good to not know everything

[wooden silo]

I mean, yeah, seen through the lens of a personality disorder, in the short term, that may be true. But perhaps a better approach would be going to therapy and dealing with whatever's causing you to need to use problem-solving as an emotional coping mechanism.

[quasi blaze]

You know not it’s a simulation by experiencing pain

[low chasm]

what if the simulation simulates pain

[solemn tulip]

[quasi blaze]

Pain is far from a simulation

[solemn tulip]

how so?

[low chasm]

how do you know the pain you feel isn't also simulated

[wooden silo]

Why can't simulated beings feel pain?

[solemn tulip]

keezy.cause_pain()

[quasi blaze]

Because pain is not an illusion

Otherwise you wouldn’t have experienced it

[uncut hull]

is the opposite of npc (non playable character) a pc?

[lament cairn]

character

[solemn tulip]

but if you are simulated you can be simulated to feel pain

[wooden silo]

I think the argument Keezy is making here is that consciousness can't arise from a simulated system.

[graceful basin]

Yes, tho I haven't seen the abbreviation much.

[quasi blaze]

I disagree

[solemn tulip]

how?

[scarlet peak]

why is neovim mostly vimscript

[solemn tulip]

by what logic?

[wooden silo]

And given that we don't, and basically can't, know what the conditions for the emergence of consciousness is, the debate is pretty much dead in the water.

[thick osprey]

How does this statement apply to phantom pain?

[scarlet peak]

like wtf is this lang distribution??
i heard it was written in lua but clearly not

[graceful basin]

If you just slap together atoms in a human-like way, is the result a human? Can we check?

[scarlet peak]

unless it inherits all of vim's source code and acts as a superset of vim

[graceful basin]

It started as a fork of vim

[scarlet peak]

an entire language for an editor is pretty wild ngl

[scarlet peak]

ah ok thats why

[quasi blaze]

The best way to question if you are experiencing reality is the feeling of pain

[thick osprey]

Almost as if it's a fork of vim. Isn't it?

[wooden silo]

We can't check if it's conscious.

[uncut hull]

everything you see is built on atoms

[scarlet peak]

didnt know

[carmine apex]

as an aside, calling "this is broken, and i have the ability to fix it, therefore i should fix it" a personality disorder is an interesting take

[quasi blaze]

What is phantom pain?

[scarlet peak]

imaginary pain, usually from amputated limbs

[graceful basin]

All configuration is a custom language

[solemn tulip]

this isn't like a dream where you are in reality and trying to tell if you are in a dream

[wooden silo]

I don't think it's a stretch when the article itself describes it as an emotional regulation method.

[lament cairn]

the way i interpreted it, i think the "disorder" part isn't fixing things, it's trying to fix everything immediately

like what the article says, yeah

[thick osprey]

Phantom limb pain, attributed to the sensation of limbs amputated from the body.

[scarlet peak]

no like a physical scripting language, not a bunch of toggles and inputs

[quasi blaze]

“Imaginary pain” is an oxymoron

[solemn tulip]

the premise is that you are just part of the simulation

[graceful basin]

Is it? There may be more to reality than that.

[scarlet peak]

irrational pain? then?

[quasi blaze]

What does that even mean?

[low chasm]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phantom_pain

[graceful basin]

People do occasionally feel pain even without any physical stimulus for it.

[quasi blaze]

If you get pinched in the arm, how does one determine that being “rational pain” or “irrational pain”?

[low chasm]

I think you're getting caught up on the terminology, "phantom pain" is a thing.

[solemn tulip]

irrational pain was a math joke, I'm pretty sure

[low chasm]

lmao

[solemn tulip]

following imaginary pain

[uncut hull]

atoms - molecules - cells - organs - organism - ................

[wooden silo]

I think the argument Keezy is making is that pain is a subjective sensation, so it doesn't really matter whether it's caused by any actual physical trauma or not. If you feel it, it exists, in the same sense.

[carmine apex]

i dislike the wording of imaginary or irrational, but if your right arm hurts from being pinched, and you don't have a right arm any more, then you're experiencing phantom pain

[quasi blaze]

Right. It’s still pain regardless?

[solemn tulip]

yes?

[carmine apex]

certainly perceived as such

[thick osprey]

It is the sensation of pain, yes. Your body is simulating where that pain is coming from.

[quasi blaze]

Perceived? It’s objectively happening

[graceful basin]

There's no hard evidence that all of reality emerges from arrangements of atoms AFAIK. Tho it is obviously a pretty strong model.

[low chasm]

maybe we're talking past each other, then.

[solemn tulip]

body does chemical stuff that causes (the sensation of) pain, for no good reason

[quasi blaze]

No. I am arguing that it’s objective

[uncut hull]

do you guys support abortion or you against it and why?

[quasi blaze]

And you use pain as a metric to determine that you are not in a simulation

[wooden silo]

Do you mean that pain exists as an objective property of physical reality? As in, it's an objectively measurable property of physics?

[solemn tulip]

why can't a simulated being feel the sensation of pain?

[uncut hull]

yeah true, learned at school

[carmine apex]

the neurochemical process of pain perception and its consequences to the body and mind are assuredly there, yes, but the correct mapping and cause are not. the sensation is caused by perception failures in the brain

[quasi blaze]

Do you mean that pain exists as an objective property of physical reality?

Yes. To negate the argument that we are all in a simulation

[graceful basin]

Why is pain special?

[thick osprey]

My friend's left left hurts. They have a cramp in their lower calf. Objectively, they do not have a left leg. The pain is real. The experience is real. The limb is false. How is this a property of physical reality?

[wooden silo]

What tool can you use to measure pain as a physical property?

[muted pebble]

it's crazy that pain is a construct of the mind

[quasi blaze]

If you think your feeling of pain is also a simulation then you must question if your existence is a simulation

[solemn tulip]

why?

[muted pebble]

are you referring to right before becoming 'lucid' in such a dream?

[thick osprey]

My existence might be a simulation. Why should I have to question that? It doesn't matter either way.

[muted pebble]

and what are dreams then lol?

a micro simulation of a simulation 😄

[solemn tulip]

again why couldn't a simulated being be simulated to feel pain?

[graceful basin]

Oh, is the argument that you, a real person, can't be in a simulation from birth, because of pain.

[wooden silo]

I'm pretty sure what this comes down to is whether you believe consciousness can arise from any substrate arranged in the right way, or if there has to be some special stuff (like, y'know, real stuff and not virtual stuff) to cause consciousness to come about.

[carmine apex]

existence being a simulation might provide help with understanding qualia, tbf.
ah, pain is actually considered a qualia. idk why i didn't see that coming

[graceful basin]

Because that's nonsense, people in VRChat do feel pain arising from the virtual actions sometimes.

[quasi blaze]

I can’t give you a proper scientific answer because I haven’t studied phantom pain deeply but I think their brain is triggering a molecule to signal pain for them to get out of harm’s way