In extreme cases driller will lose because it's physically impossible to reach the pod at the end
#deep-dive-discussion
inner void
full saddle
depending on layout driller can do extremely well but it felt pretty awful this week to the point that i didnt rerun it after beating it once as driller, mostly the first stage is miserable
but driller benefits a lot from repeated attempts because you can basically just beeline to objectives and skip enemies lol
manic pivotBOT
_ _
ATTENTION MINERS!
New 
Deep Dives will be available in one hour!
_ _
thick steeple
manic pivotBOT
_ _
ATTENTION MINERS!
New Deep Dives are now available!
_ _
eternal whale
EDD, Magma Core: Mythic Foot
stage 1 - low oxygen, PE/morkite
stage 2 - mactera plague, morkite/black box
stage 3 - lethal enemies, PE/2 eggs
manic hedge
I had a very strange experience. Started sandblasted elite deep dive, got magma core, finished it, but didnt get a reward
Terminal still shows sandblasted
eternal whale
DD, Radioactive Zone: Madmen's Derail
stage 1 - cave leech cluster/volatile guts, 2 dreads/black box
stage 2 - exploder infestation, morkite/2 mini mules
stage 3 - 4 eggs/2 mules
steady magnet
so, I just lost the EDD
we got to the last stage, the platform was fecking glitched. When you stepped on it you would go straight through, 3 of us had that and were unable to deposit. 2 of us got stuck in the drill platform entirely and got killed off by a wave cause they couldn't shoot or move
what the absolute fuck
somber quest
another s3 loss agh
steady magnet
beards?
somber quest
forge fodder
real wolf
fair enough
unique spoke
EGGQUARQ HERE 
thorny geyser
Two point extractions huh
covert heath
bleah, another magmacore. eff that (I've got 5 blanks, so I don't need to worry much for a while)
that one looks particularly ugly... another low o2 pe... nah, the last one was utter garbage
eternal whale
@feral atlas what loadout did you run?
feral atlas
direct damage flamer w/ range OC and +mag, sticky slow
full auto subata
axes
tbh, that's just because that's my default loadout
didn't exactly aim for anything
eternal whale
mods?
cobalt pasture
i think i had no less than 20 mactera spawn onscreen during stage 2, what on earth
feral atlas
11231 flamer w/ diffuser
21211 subata w/ full auto
and yes, I beat it
only iffy stage was stage 1, and that's because I nearly quit out of boredom since O2 is so tedious
stage 2, I fell into a magma crack at a bad time
and drilled into a lava maggot
stage 3 is easy; just keep bosco working
meager topaz
hollow pawn
people cant seem to understand the implication of 'lethal enemies'
raw path
tfw resupplying multiple times on Stage 3 literally just for pheromones
thorny geyser
this magma core EDD had nothing on that other one
distant steppe
Have to say, this EDD feels like a big "F*** you" from the developers
not at all fun
eternal whale
@feral atlas I feel like with that particular build, switching to T1 range mod and the mag capacity OC is more ideal since you gain back the fire rate, keep the +25 mag, and lose 2 range
i do recall you saying the fire rate reduction helps and I felt the opposite as enemies died a beat too slow but I think a pretty good reason you like it especially with the mag mod is it makes your heat radiance uptime last longer as you burn through a tank slower
feral atlas
Meh, it still kills fast enough for me
I personally just think it conserves ammo because I tend to pre-fire
a habit from siege
inner void
@distant steppe Yeah, bit too hard to be fun this week
The first two stages are okay, but the third...
Lethal haz 5.5 enemies on their own are not insurmountable, but you MUST keep moving.
Feels like whenever an earthquake pops everyone instantly dies
stable karma
thorny geyser
you have to build yourself some kiting space in this EDD
or have a no bug zone, enforced by good gunner
feral atlas
Just mine quickly enough that you don't need to kill too many waves, kill waves fast enough that you can go back to mining.
Kiting is only a micro strat. For PE a macro strategy is more important.
low jetty
what's the difference between DD and EDD?
feral atlas
One is harder than the other
thorny geyser
one of these is not like the other
wraith shard
One makes you die
elfin stone
Driller just goes AFK without saying anything as soon as we hit the escape button on stage 2 of the EDD
Everyone then proceeds to get grabbed by the 50 grabbers on the way back
Feels bad man
wraith shard
fallen light
Just did my first DD, is it wise to hop into an EDD right away after the fact?
stark slate
DD is haz 3, EDD is haz 5. If you can handle haz 5 well then you can do EDD
fallen light
ok, thank you
burnt oasis
This week's DD was a lot of really shitty, unfun modifiers
O2 on PE, then Mactera, then fucking lethal as final stage
All on magma core, aka the least fun biome in the game
Both PE have a fire geyser spawn directly underneath them forcing you to deal or pop into iron will to clear it
The last stage was literally me having Bosco move everything while I desperately pumped DPS into CC'd enemies
Nitra is plentiful but you ain't got shit time to collect it on the final stage, and the first stage is so fucking vertical it's painful
wraith shard
Umm
If you didn't go solo maybe someone would be able to collect nitra for you
Wait if you are solo why dont you make bosco mine it
distant steppe
Point extractions scale waves to mission time, which doesn't reset per stage in dives.
So it's a balance of "do I want the Nitra I see" vs "do I want even more insane difficulty in the third stage", unfortunately.
I'll also throw in, eggs in either objective on the final stage add a quite frustrating amount of RNG
especially on point extraction
burnt oasis
I had sufficient nitra to make it through, though, like someone else, I was basically resupply solely for additional pheromones
last veldt
this week's EDD was fun, i enjoyed it
thorny geyser
It was not that hard, but you really had to keep killing bugs all the time. There was barely any time to breath.
last veldt
yeah that first step off the drop pod on stage 3 was a doozy
if you're not in the mindset of "lethal enemies"
right away
thorny geyser
There is one pretty wide open space near the minehead, so you can manouver there.
pure crystal
Could someone post up the EDD mods/hazards?
unique spoke
O2, Macteras, Lethal in that order.
last veldt
pure crystal
Thanks
tender axle
damn dude, all the gunners i'm doing this EDD with are ass
literally only throw shield down when they're about to die
valid river
how much harder is EDD vs DD? I've done 2 DD now but I'm not sure if I should join EDDs yet or not
full saddle
it really really depends on the specific EDD as well
some EDDs are extremely easy due to different factors and are probably fine if you can do haz 4 consistently, but some are much harder and give haz5 players trouble as well
eternal whale
@tender axle wanna do edd? i didn't have too much problems with it as drller
i can do engi too
tender axle
nah i'm good, probably just try again tomorrow
plain dew
What are the new normal deep dive mutators?
eternal whale
EDD, Magma Core: Mythic Foot
stage 2 - mactera plague, morkite/black box
stage 3 - lethal enemies, PE/2 eggs```
DD, Radioactive Zone: Madmen's Derail
```stage 1 - cave leech cluster/volatile guts, 2 dreads/black box
stage 2 - exploder infestation, morkite/2 mini mules
stage 3 - 4 eggs/2 mules```Thanks
sullen elm
maybe mod can pin this up here https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cvRHDfmBKK8Ggmoga6A3PrlyBaunZpbQhZuy987gGKk/edit#gid=0
shoutout to whoever update this weekly, rock n stone!
indigo leaf
fringe kettle
@valid river if you can successfully complete haz 5 with a lethal mutator consistently, you will almost never have issues with the EDD since that’s arguably more difficult.
tired pawn
this weeks lethal enemies
was pretty chill for the edd
was on the easiest game modes so no doubt there
wraith shard
imagine not running into deep dives blind with randos and a meme build
tired pawn
sounds like me with ice storm
wraith shard
lmao
wraith shard
Lethal ennemies at part 3 on elite deep dive.. EVERY GODAMN TIME
thorny geyser
just dont get touched lmao
subtle cove
low oxygen on stage one?
goddamnit can we just get rid of that nofun modifier ...
thorny geyser
I like low O2 on PE.
distant steppe
I like O2 on PE when it's not part of a deep dive
cold lark
I like it because it adds challenge
heavy torrent
Low O2 isn’t even that tedious, it just means you need to keep track of where Molly and your teammates are.
Mactera plague and exploder infestations are by far the most annoying modifiers, in my opinion
sweet skiff
ziplines are godlike in low o2
heavy torrent
Do they give oxygen?
final obsidian
hi fellow space dwarfs, I am in need of Guidance for discord, how does the LFG commands work or join people
rose karma
do we have an official ratio for how often machine events spawn?
thin lake
hello fellow miners. quick question. fast way to earn Credits on solo ?
inner void
this week's EDD3 is pretty brutal
the lethal mutator on it's own isn't so bad, but it's the magma biome and any earthquake is almost an insta-death if you're fighting at the time.
took me three tries and we made a point of cleaning out the first two levels of nitra so we could spam everything we had on the third
slow frost
when do deep dives change?
tired pawn
in 5 days
candid blaze
change how
tired pawn
as in reset and change to new biomes and mutators raging
candid blaze
Oh I see
tired pawn
;)
slow frost
thank you
tired pawn
all good, have you done this weeks deep dives then strife?
slow frost
i only just promoted my first class and just did this weeks regular deep dive
havent tried elite yet
tired pawn
ah well elite deep dive is a bit harder
no shit but attempt it later in the week once you've tried some haz 4 or 5 games to practice
slow frost
gotcha ty
heavy lichen
swarm + earthquake is near the top of the list of things that can eat my ass
tired pawn
heh
heavy lichen
anyone solo'd this one yet
first stage is severely tilting me
lol
nevermind
I think I'm just done
graduate into the roving mactera death squads
wraith shard
I think Solo would've made it easier...
My team's gunner didn't like using ziplines properly to get the aquarks moving, now that one egg out of the pit on the last stage.
Bosco could've just flown it over to the Minehead for me and it'd be a no-brainer.
Meanwhile the driller left on the start of the second stage for some unknown reason, and the engineer was just dead 90% of the time.
So it was just back to the 'ole game of being the KiteMaster5000™ Scout once again.
signal wagon
Considering there's no Dreadnought objectives yeah this EDD should be an easy solo in theory
"easy" of course being in comparison to group
odd comet
@heavy lichen the swarm will eat your ass, thank you very much :p
astral portal
just me or what happened to all the dwarves in this game?
i play EDD and we failed with one having nearly 30 downs..
and i had to take the drillers role ..
idk, i feel like i wont be able to get this EDD due to me and my partner having to do all the work
burnt oasis
Scout, pheromone to victory, ignore gold and have Bosco, with msxed mine speed, constantly busy
feral atlas
scout probably has the easiest solo since stage 1 is probably the most annoying stage
lament robin
Hi, can I start the tutorial again?
brave dune
yes, it's located between the dwarve's rooms and abyss bar
lament robin
Thanks
bitter garnet
I've gone missing for a week, how's the EDD? Is it easy to solo with Scout?
elfin stone
There is a nasty black box + nactera swarm on stage 2, probably biggest hurdle for a scout. Stock up on nitra and abuse pheromone
bitter garnet
Thanks, I will be giving it a try later
bitter garnet
This EDD just gave me cancer, I went in blind and did it first try but god damn
twin spire
i got gangbanged on second stage when i tried the black box
hollow iris
There were 3 oppressors and 2 bulks both times I've tried so far
Lets see if its a threepeat
white sandal
This EDD was my first EDD and boy did it leave an impression
tender axle
instead of getting bulks i got like 4 goo bombers and 2 menaces every wave
and it wasn't even on mactera plague
all i could do was spam ping the menaces as driller
wraith shard
This is probably the worst EDD since the 2nd EDD
vocal moss
anyone want to carry me through edd? 1st mission down I play all classes
uneven fulcrum
I'd like some help myself
Just got a scout who stole all the nitra left and hide it
uneven fulcrum
yeah, if i knew where it is
white sandal
Pick up his bag?
uneven fulcrum
yeah, if i knew where it is
twin spire
oh fucking hell fuck magma core
what the hell is that biome ? who saw all the fire everywhere and thought : yeah, thats pretty much balanced with the others
next one, lets make it permanent exploder invasion, modifier or not
twin spire
i have no idea, but fron the last few weeks, it definitely feels harder
distant steppe
This week has a rather difficult EDD, yes.
It does have quite a bit of RNG to it that can tick it over from difficult to impossible.
turbid badger
this week's EDD wasn't the smoothest of rides
however, the host decided to kick me when we were basically done both objectives on stage 3
hollow flower
rip, host your games and you dont have to worry about that
turbid badger
did it again anyways
marble sandal
Me and a team of 3 others just got to the drop pod in the third stage. So we would've won, except at that exact moment we de-synced and weren't able to stand in the pod.
So we technically won but didn't because of f#%king de-sync.
I'm so done with this game.
p2p fucking sucks.
shut sierra
It's mactera and earthquakes again
Virtually impossible to counter
And fuckin' hell, I tried to do it multiple times, and keep getting people who play as if it is their first EDD.
(Some even said it was)
Hell, I had to explain to the scout what pheramones were
Gunner insisted on using the autocannon despite the constant mactera swarms
distant steppe
On lower difficulties the autocannon is pretty decent against mactera swarms. Understandable if you were with new-ish players.
shut sierra
Still, this is the EDD
It might be good with big bertha
would it one-shot them?
because that'd be good
distant steppe
haha, on EDD there really isn't anything in the primaries that would one-shot Mactera
shut sierra
yeah, and the m1k takes too long to charge up
Though.. the 'no slowdown' during charged shot OC might be worth it
distant steppe
and the Mactera targeting update also unfortunately gave them a slight buff against pheromones
distant steppe
To some degree, yes. The hitboxes seemed a bit wonky in several of my attempts this week.
shut sierra
that's for sure
I tried soloing it earlier today
But not much you can do when you're doing the black box
tried it as scout, gunner might be better
But I'd rather just have a competent team
distant steppe
Best bet for countering the quake & Mactera situation is probably the Gunner's shield, followed by pheromones and/or Driller digging out a shelter in the wall
Engi can also set up some cover if another class can get the group past that initial round of damage.
Aside from pheromones, I think Scout is probably the least necessary class this time around.
First and third stages really need a competent Driller, first and second a decent Engi. Gunner just all around this week.
shut sierra
yeah, def need a good gunner for the point extractions
That might have been it, all the gunners I had, I had to tell them how to use the zipline gun
distant steppe
Might be worth losing the Scout for a second Gunner.
The only things you'd really suffer are the loss of the pheromones and not having someone to make a mad solo beeline to the pod once it arrives.
shut sierra
Hell, that itself makes it worth it
most of the times the scout was the only one alive to make it to the pod in the first one
distant steppe
There's the Morkite on the first stage, but there's enough time even with an over-achieving Driller to get there and get it done.
(I say that from a lot of experience this week...)
Scout definitely makes it to the pod quickly in the first stage. The rest need either good ziplines from the Gunner or a Driller with good map awareness.
eternal whale
duod this week's edd with driller and gunner, had a pretty easy time of it
I think I prefer duoing in general for deep dives
It's easier to hunt for 1 competent person versus 3
eternal whale
yes, soloing is always an option
manic hedge
I feel like for a co-op game this actively discourages playing with more people. Like solo and duo are far easier than a 4 man team
The damage given and taken didnt need to scale with people, just the number of enemies
The jump from 2 to 3 people is stupid, and 4 is a continuation
hollow pawn
Heresy
tribal ridge
man that first stage was some oof
noble sable
wooden fiber
im somewhat new to the game, and when im in an egg run and go after the eggs people get mad anyone know why?
unique spoke
Freeing an egg summons a wave of baddies and sometimes an entire swarm. If you grab eggs too quickly you're probably flooding the team before they're ready.
wooden fiber
So after i get an egg I should wait before getting another?
unique spoke
Yeah. For good measure, if you aren't already with the rest of the team you should announce that you're going to grab an egg first (ping it or use voice or w/e) so that you don't accidentally grab one at the same time someone else does.
wooden fiber
ahhhh ok makes sense thanks 🙂
uneven fulcrum
How do i realistically finish the last stage from the EDD
There wasn't a single moment when a swarm of something wasn't going on
unique spoke
it helps to do the first two stages as quickly as possible.
Time spent in any part of the DD counts toward every stage of the DD, so if you spent 15 minutes in stage 1 and 15 minutes in stage 2, then you're starting stage 3 at 30 minutes. Which means Stage 3 Point Extraction gets Very Busy.
uneven fulcrum
It does?
wtf
pale pilot
Damn, didn't know that
frail zodiac
that PE thing is not true
uneven fulcrum
I can't do it
The last stage, it's cancer
I can't do it
just did the 15th try
We land down, go get aquarqs, SWARM die
twin spire
you gatte bunker inside the pod for a bit and kill some stuff
wraith shard
imagine ever considering bunkers
tender axle
I had my team pop both eggs at the same time, that was fun
Thankfully they helped me out with the brood nexus, that things needs to die like, immediately
dark lark
LoyalToday at 15:34
it helps to do the first two stages as quickly as possible.
Time spent in any part of the DD counts toward every stage of the DD, so if you spent 15 minutes in stage 1 and 15 minutes in stage 2, then you're starting stage 3 at 30 minutes. Which means Stage 3 Point Extraction gets Very Busy.
Look, I'm gonna need actual evidience for this before I buy it.
I still don't think PE get's expentially more difficult, there's just a grace peroid that's slightly longer at the start
@uneven fulcrum I can offer help if your still trying, I've already done the edd so I'm familar with it
bitter garnet
@dark lark That's something that our blue wiki diggers have said and we have kinda tested that.
PE has a higher spawn rate the longer that you take. Deep Dives is considered "one" mission, ergo the time spent in the previous stages get added on the spawn rate of the Stage with a PE.
That's why PE on third stage its ALWAYS cancer unless you speedrun
dark lark
I would like to see the actual source. Right now I haven't seen any hard evidience that it gets harder.
Give me 2 mins tf4
uneven fulcrum
Sure
bitter garnet
I remember the first EDD with PE stage 3, because my team took 1hour before reaching this stage, not even 800 Nitra helped us to finish the stage.
Then, we speed run it and it was really easy
dark lark
Alright, but that's not concrete evidience.
bitter garnet
Because there was near to no spawn. Everytime a Stage 3 PE appeared, it was the same. I got my info from Cyrob.
And from personal experience.
dark lark
I mean the way I understand spawns is this:
You have a slightly longer time between the first swarm appearing and starting a mission than you do between swarms..
bitter garnet
This weeks EDD is by no means one of the hardest, but PE is always cancer so...
dark lark
But past that inital change, swarms don't come any faster.
bitter garnet
Mate, you can get on Stage 3 PE a horde within a horde.
And not because of eggs or anything like that
dark lark
You can do that regardless if you take to long to kill the first one.
I'll ask CyRob about it now. But in my limited testing, when going to an hour swarms didn't come in quicker as time went along.
The only change was after the start, where you usually have slightly longer.
dark lark
PE undoubtly has fast times between swarms, but it doesn't get faster is what I am saying
bitter garnet
If you have never seen this, is because you are actually doing the objective at a "proper pace"
dark lark
I've just checked in with CyRob and he hasn't checked it. There's still no evidience that the time between swarms decreases as the mission length increases.
uneven fulcrum
It does sure feel like it
We would be fighting a swarm while another swarm rolls in
dark lark
Anyway, @uneven fulcrum how do you want me to join your match
buoyant token
I think that swarm times (bar the initial spawn are randomized between 2 values)
next pebble
#steam-profile-sharing @uneven fulcrum
uneven fulcrum
21 revives
I noticed that you run so fast with scout
does scout have a natural sprint boost or smt?
frail zodiac
no
spring stratus
LF a gunner for Elite deep dive. Have three ready to go.
dark lark
@uneven fulcrum
I run weekend athlete on all classes, I have grapple mod which boosts your speed after grappling, the zhukovs mod that boosts you after emptying a mag, and then Ill run speed boost on kill for the GK2 if I'm not running bullets of mercy.
Basically, I am speed
Becuase of all those speed upgrades, the bugs literally can't catch me.
uneven fulcrum
Gotta try that out
dark lark
If you sprint jump, fire the grapple (so you're moving while firing out the grapple), land keep on sprinting, just as the speed boost ends grapple again you'll basically never stop being fast.
Sometimes Ill just fire the grapple for the speed boost, since the grapple speed boost lasts for 3s, and recharges in 4s. So the jump covers the 1s.
The zhukovs mod is just overkill, mostly for circle stafing dreads.
uneven fulcrum
How much is the speed boost that they give?
dark lark
I don't know the exact number. It's fast enough to outrun everything though,.
vague oar
Can someone tell me what these strange platforms are that look like launch pads. And what im supposed to be doing with them 0.0-
odd comet
Lick them
vague oar
Wasn't the answer i was expecting
crimson arch
you have any screenshots of 'em? sounds like machine events
dark lark
@vague oar You're probably looking at a machine event, they require a promoted dwarf to activate
vague oar
Ahh, thanks fellahs. I was getting mad for not doing them.
uneven fulcrum
Took me 17 tries
bitter garnet
holy shit why that much
cold lark
Whenever I find a hard one I nail it in no more than 5 tries
If you take more than that you just aren't learning from you previous attempts
bitter garnet
Pretty much
cold lark
the definition of insanity is trying the same thing again and expecting different results
bitter garnet
With so many tries you know the location of everything
cold lark
Exactly
hollow iris
You can SOMEtimes
Aaand hey 20 more mactera spawned literally all around us and fired at once
uneven fulcrum
It wasn't really about me
I would always join a new lobby full of people who haven't even tried deep dives
They would all die immediately and take ages to do anything
I'd have to do all the objectives with 4 times the enemies
bitter garnet
If you fail 17 times chances are, that it's because of you
tepid flower
will there be random generated deep dives ?
bitter garnet
DD are already randomly generated, just once a week :^)
If you cannot carry in a 4 player team, which is understandable, lower the bar with less players.
tepid flower
but i mean like reg. missions.
uneven fulcrum
Was i only pulling my weight really tho?
I did almost more kills than the other 3 combined
dark lark
I was one of those 😛 rude
dark lark
I take half credit for the pheromone shots I lined up
uneven fulcrum
understandable
dark lark
But no, you should just solo at that point to be honest.
uneven fulcrum
I was planning to do it if i didn't get it today
By that point i could walk all mineral deposits, morkites and aquarqs with my eyes closed
it was like that movie for me
dark lark
I think the issue with EDD
Is that there was way too many people trying them that simply aren't ready.
uneven fulcrum
You know that movie where the guy dies and always wakes up on dday till he closes the loop
Live. Die. Repeat that's it
dark lark
Basically every pub I've played with someone isn't good enough for haz4/5
uneven fulcrum
That's how i felt the entire time
dark lark
And that's fine, but why are you playing an EDD lobby then? I think the reward structure
Incentivises too many people to try it who aren't ready.
uneven fulcrum
Because then i can blame others when we all go to shit 😄
uneven fulcrum
What was he even doing
dark lark
He was just not ready for the difficulty
And that's the problem. Too many pubs have people like that desperately trying the EDD despite it being way above what they are ready for.
dark lark
Rank means bugger all if you don't learn.
uneven fulcrum
Spaztic speed scout is gonna become my new favourite thing btw
dark lark
It's pretty strong. There's a reason I choose scout / gunner whenever I'm trying to help a team out.
Pheromones and shield it pretty much sums up to.
With carpet bomber / magic bullets gunner has massive AoE potential, so he can kill the swarms to.
Scout just moves at the speed of light and can stay alive for years.
Both can revive during a swarm with relative ease and have some serious crowd control.
uneven fulcrum
Where tho, i wouldn't pick the Heavy autocannon for Haz 5
Should i just use cluster nades
dark lark
Autocannon is eh unless taking carpet bomber
uneven fulcrum
Well i'm happy to say i have it
dark lark
I like cluster grenades myself, the AoE potential is nice.
But minigun + magic bullet explosive build on the bulldog is normally what I run.
Minigun mostly becuase you'll often need to kill dreadnoughts, and mactera. Which the minigun does better than the autocannon.
uneven fulcrum
magic bullets?
dark lark
It has a 100% chance to ricochet
uneven fulcrum
what
dark lark
It's a massive drop in direct damage, but it doesn't affect explsoive damage. It also gives you extra ammo.
So you build for ammo, explosive damage only, neurotoxin.
And you spam fire that weapon, and everything takes 30 damage + might get posioned.
But, if you just miss an enemy, the AoE can still hit the enemy, and then the bullet will still bounce.
warm gate
Just finished this week's EDD solo as scout. Last level I barely bothered killing anything.
uneven fulcrum
Wait what is the magic bullets for?
dark lark
Killing swamers / grunts.
warm gate
First time finishing an EDD solo
uneven fulcrum
no what weapon
dark lark
Bulldog
dark lark
Oh no lol, bullet hell is cool, it's a decent sidegrade but I prefer stock for tryharding
uneven fulcrum
i use exhaust vectoring, it feels nice
dark lark
I like it / dislike it. Tad too inaccurate for my tastes and I would probably stick with a little more oomph.
I've heard leadstrom is super good and yeah, I can bhop and whatnot.
uneven fulcrum
idek what the minigun can have
dark lark
But I'm so used to the way the minigun handles without leadstorm it throws me off
I use the minor movement to adjust my aim, and stuff like that
wraith shard
everyone i have a problem. me and my friend played thorugh 2 deep dives, finished them , but didnt get the matrix cores. is that a bug?
uneven fulcrum
No
you can only have them once
Then either play the elite deep dive or wait for a week for the next dive
nimble gazelle
So I just unlocked deep dives, how rough are they to do?
warm gate
Regular DD is ez. The elite ones can be a real challenge
uneven fulcrum
Haha, well this one is a exception i heard
it's especially hard so don't feel bad if you don't get it right away nor after 17 tries
warm gate
Yeah this week's Elite dive is rouugh. Last level is point extraction 10 aquarq and 2 eggs, and a pretty unpleasant terrain.
nimble gazelle
Righto, maybe I should just give haz 4 a few goes too. first mainly been bouncing between 2 -3
warm gate
I failed 5 times with a team, got it first try solo
uneven fulcrum
The whole dive is on fire, random earthquakes, flying bugs that shoot lasers
dark lark
Bullet hell if you take the accuracy mod
It reduces it down massively.
The accuracy mod is a multiplier, not a fixed reduction in spread.
manic pivotBOT
_ _
ATTENTION MINERS!
We are hearing rumors that some dwarves are still not done with this weeks Deep Dives!
We want to remind you that there's only half a week left until our scanners pick up new missions!
_ _
dark lark
Which means it has a far greater impact on bullet hell, since the intial spread is so large.
warm gate
@nimble gazelle I'd definitely recommend getting used to haz4 at least first, if not haz5 for elite dives. No harm in giving it a shot though!
dark lark
DD is up to hazard 3.5
EDD is up to hazard level 5.5
Also, most missions have negative modifiers, this weeks EDD has lethal enemies so all melee attacks do x2 damage
So it's pretty tricky. If you're not me ofc 😛
uneven fulcrum
uhyyahuhyauhya
nimble gazelle
Righto, been mainly going at it solo on engie been working out pretty well do far so I should be good to go for haz 4
bitter garnet
ITs like almost all EDDs have Lethal and Mactera
Dunno why these warnings are almost every week
uneven fulcrum
What other ones could be meaningful enough
uneven fulcrum
How many negative ones are there even
bitter garnet
I dont complain, Mactera Plague is really really easy when you go with a specific loadout
It's still random, it may not even get a negative anomaly
dark lark
There's only a handful of negative modifiers. And every deep dive has two of them.
Chances are you will go through them all.
warm gate
I like PE. The maps are pretty easy. Extra complexity and length are just free XP for PEs
bitter garnet
Have we ever gotten leech cluster in EDD?
dark lark
Aas why it feels like specifically lethal enemies and mactera plague prolly becusae those are the hardest ones.
Cave leech cluster is a meme, so is exploder infestation for the most part.
bitter garnet
Still
I dont find Mactera plagues hard - Granted, if you bring a specific loadout for them.
Goind blind without such loadout can be a pain
dark lark
Personally I despise low 02, reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
Promotes teamwork, becuase teamwork is huddling all together around a slow mule is what teamwork is apparently
bitter garnet
It doesnt promote teamwork
"Dude I need oxygen, let me waste 80 nitra"
TH-thanks
uneven fulcrum
dark lark
I mean teamwork for me is a a set of individuals I can trust to get the task done.
It's not about proximity, how close you huddle.
bitter garnet
Agreed
dark lark
Low 02 sorta reduces teamwork IMO. At least my standards of it.
uneven fulcrum
Can you compare low o2 with teamwork even
it's more like managing your own existence
warm gate
I think it's a fine challenge, I don't think its intent is to promote teamwork.. if anything just more planning
dark lark
We split across the cave, we each go in different directions to maxismise our effectiveness.
The scout doesn't need to be next to the engineer, as long as the engineer has already placed down the platforms.
I think as a device to promote planning it fails rather spectaculary.
bitter garnet
Anomalies need some rework in general
dark lark
Like, it only forces you to think on point extract.
And usually that boils down to, place it away from the minehead
Planning done, scout go grab everything becuase you're the only one who can grapple back and get anything done with the timer
bitter garnet
Leech cluster is a meme. Exploder infestation is nice. Haunted makes one player not play the game. Low O2 is boring and just makes the game slow. Lethal is boring. Mactera is alright.
Shield disruption is alright
dark lark
I dislike shield disruption personally.
The game has too many enemies, too many vectors of attack.
It shouldn't be about avoiding all damage, it's completely unreasonable to do so. That's why the shield exists,.
dark lark
It's just a cheap way of ticking down your health, that's really what no shield is.
bitter garnet
Practically, yes.
warm gate
Vamprism + berserker is a must for shield disruption
bitter garnet
It isnt
warm gate
Well.. it's a lot more fun imo
dark lark
I would disagree with that assessment.
If anything, most people lose health trying to vampire on no shield.
bitter garnet
^
warm gate
Yeah you shouldn't try to take a horde on for sure lol
bitter garnet
You're making the perk useless for when it matters then
Its only usable with Driller and Iron Will
Basically, 3 perk slots to do one thing
Quite expensive
warm gate
But if it's a trickle of grunts, you can easily get from 0 to half HP with it
dark lark
I mean I run vamp / zerk on all classes.
It's fairly decent at scooping up health when low, esp. when you jump to cancel slow.
Also, I'm a digusting iron will user, so it comes in handy from time to time
Sorry wait let me take that back
I never use iron will I'm going to pretend Im flawless at the game*
dark lark
I did, I went down once. Gasp.
uneven fulcrum
The only use of Iron will honestly
frail zodiac
wait you went down? ignored
dark lark
One of my favourite stunts
Is to revive someone while in ironwill.
Use the fear from field medic to kill an enemy for vampire, so then I recover from vampire, and fookin' book it
dark lark
No, the vampire heals from ironwill.
dark lark
Yeah, it's tricky as fuck to pull off but I've spent quite a while doing it so I can give a few tips.
uneven fulcrum
it doesn't say that anywhere
dark lark
You get revived with 5 health, aka oneshot range of literally anything.
When you melee an enemy, you want to jump, then swing the pick to ignore the slowdown from the melee.
You usually combine it with chucking a grenade like pheromones, using the fear from a revive, a shield etcc.
uneven fulcrum
imo, if your feet touch the ground for longer than a second while you move
You're doing something wrong
It doesn't cost anything to press space and you're that much harder to hit
dark lark
I must emit, the jump being able to cancel slowdowns is a god tier ability.
uneven fulcrum
One question, does it revive you immediately or are you in god mode still for 9 seconds
Immediately gets sniped
how expected
dark lark
No, you are completely vulnerable.
People say that iron will is a crutch and chain reviving is defo a bit suss
But reviving yourself with vampire can take quite a bit of skill to pull off. But once you get good at it?
That's how you look like you've only gone down once or twice XD
dark lark
I mean, if you have shield or pheromones you drop that.
And there's the stunt I mentioned earlier
About using the fear of the revive to give you a window to self revive.
dark lark
Mhm, you can really cheat death, but it does take quite a bit of practice to pull off though.
Or you have to use up some limited tool like the shield.
dark lark
Eh, it's more for the it's a crutch crowd.
I mean they aren't wrong, it's powerful as hell. But it's not a clear case of being a crutch when it comes to self revving
uneven fulcrum
Of course you don't wanna get into a state where you HAVE to do it
dark lark
I mean yeah, prevention is always better.
but
- Everybody is human, and they make mistakes.
like adding acid spitters
- The game puts you in situations where you will take damage through no fault of your own.
dark lark
1400 hours.
It's always fun explaining to someone hey no, sometimes the game makes you take damage and there's noting you can do about it.
insert someone with a fraction of your experience telling you how to play the game
frail zodiac
dude, like, dont get hit at all mate, hp is a crutch
uneven fulcrum
takes a hit*
might as well uninstall
I have a problem
and i noticed it a lot in our dive
i go into a spot, decide that nothing can go wrong if i keep my back to this corner, and then it all goes wrong
For some reason i can't convince myself to move and not die
"that's the role of the scout so meh, he'll get me after i nuke these guys"
and when i sometimes DO move, i see all my teammates die and i wonder if it was because i wasn't there to kill them all or because they suck and they should be doing what i do
celest oasis
How are people doing lethal modifier on this weeks EDD on PE?
Failed the last mision several times now :(
Is it just easier to solo?
bitter garnet
ITs easier to solo and duo
tender axle
From what i heard this EDD is super easy duo and solo
feral atlas
EDD isn't necessarily easier on solo
what it is, is more consistent
if you are capable of solo'ing Haz5, you will nearly always be able to solo EDD on 1st or 2nd try going in blind
if you aren't, you'll fail nearly every time
doing solo eliminates the element of uncertainty from teammates
so if you're already a solid player, it's better to solo because the result will be predictable
if you're not, you'll probably be better off taking your chances with a team
bitter garnet
Bosco is better than the average player, fight me
feral atlas
Bosco isn't necessarily better.
But the important thing is that he is more predictable.
odd comet
Well, I've yet to see anyone else fly
feral atlas
He can't watch your back, but at the very least he won't do anything retarded unless you've told him to.
odd comet
I mean, he can mine stuff off the roof without needing mobility tools
feral atlas
So can a driller with the EPC
Plus, you need to take time out of doing your own thing to manage him properly.
odd comet
And he's quite good at clearing rooms of leeches before you even get close to them
feral atlas
Good teammates area always better than Bosco. But Bosco is a known variable, while teammates aren't.
odd comet
Also he never runs out of ammo
feral atlas
If you are good enough that you know that you + Bosco can beat EDD, you will consistently beat EDD.
Ammo doesn't matter shit for EDD
you get a ton of nitra
distant steppe
Maybe I need to swap Boscos with someone else. Mine is too incompetent... and forgetful... and trolly.
feral atlas
if you run out of ammo, you and your team are defective
Bosco management is a skill
Not one you learn normally.
distant steppe
Bosco management - telling Bosco to do something three times over a minute and a half so it actually gets completed.
feral atlas
bosco management is just having him on a little down time as possible, and make him mine the risky parts of the cave
distant steppe
'cept earlier today, when Bosco just decided to stare at an Aquarq on the ground rather than do anything with it. Three times. Until I took it back to the minehead myself.
Also, regarding this week's EDD - I found it a bit too frustrating to solo with the second stage, too much randomness with grabbers and insta-kills.
heavy torrent
When you think your mediocre engie skills are enough to carry two greenbeards and another average player through the EDD:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EuiWd1LWX1I
feral atlas
How many times have you tried to solo it?
I've played it two times, beaten it two times.
Solo'd blind with driller, then once with gunner.
feral atlas
Currently visiting family, so I'm not gonna try multi as being on wifi makes for being a shitty host, as well as a bad teammate.
bitter garnet
Yup, its shitty for everyone
I went in solo because I needed to do 3 exams soon after so I wanted to secure the EDD 😂
I ain't gonna repeat it, it was cancer tbh
heavy torrent
Playing video games before exams? 🤔
bitter garnet
Yeah its an open schedule
bitter garnet
Hey, I had to start on the middle of summer
and its still running
I have no vacations nor holidays
anyways thats another matter
Either way Feelz, you havent changed my mind about the previous statement
Bosco is a better "player" than the "average" player that you can find in game
bitter garnet
Kinda sad honestly
feral atlas
Arguing that the "easiness" of solo'ing EDD is mainly apparent when you're already good.
What Bosco provides isn't really competence, because that's dependant on how you use him.
bitter garnet
It's easier to carry your ass than yours + extra 😛
feral atlas
What he provides is reliability.
Consistent performance without any unpredictable variables.
Bosco isn't a genius, but he's only as bad as you are.
bitter garnet
Honestly, it's quite OP how you can just tell Bosco to get one aquarq meanwhile you kite or pick another one
Aquarq fell down a cliff? He can still carry it
More so as a Scout, you can hook, tell him to mine something from one corner of the map and go back to the other
It will not die and will certainly fullfill its mission, even if it may take a while
A reliable machine
distant steppe
Except for the reliable bit, at least for me, these days.
My Bosco has a horrible tendency to forget tasks in the middle of doing them, or just wander off and stare at a wall for a while. Or forget how to carry things.
Also, per an earlier question, tried soloing this EDD (as Scout) maybe half a dozen times.
distant steppe
The problem I kept having was that grabbers would take a random amount of shots to scare off, and if I got grabbed I was dead.
bitter garnet
Pinging / pressing X is a command
distant steppe
So every wave of Mactera was a bit of a dice roll, and I wasn't able to finish the stage before those dice ate through Bosco's stock of rezzes.
Indeed, I'm aware. I've been trying to figure out what's been causing the problems, but I haven't found a pattern yet.
bitter garnet
If you struggle against macteras, bring anti macteras loadouts
What class are you playing
distant steppe
Thought it was distance, proven wrong. Thought it was the presence of enemies, proven wrong. Took to watching Bosco work for a bit, and still couldn't figure it out.
bitter garnet
Bosco has an icon to tell you what's doing. When its moving / carrying an object it wont tell though.
distant steppe
Scout. Deepcore, Zhukov, pheromones.
bitter garnet
Fist is attacking stuff, the pickaxe is mining or digging, the light is obvious
Switch that zhukovs out
No reason to run zhukovs with a GK2
distant steppe
Indeed, well aware of the lights and colors.
bitter garnet
run boomstick with fire
and blowthrough rounds
If there's a bunch of mactera, the shotgun will clear it
They're weak to fire
distant steppe
I find the Zhukovs more reliable than the Boomstick at effectively clearing groups of enemies that make it close to me.
Interesting, didn't know about the fire weakness.
bitter garnet
That shouldnt be the case, even less with a hook and GK2
distant steppe
Which is comical, since I'm often up against them as a Driller.
bitter garnet
Driller also has subata which is good for macteras
Can either go for +20% mactera damage or +50% when something is on fire
distant steppe
Yep, as Driller I run CRSPR and Subata with axes.
Though I switch over to Cryo if I know I'll be up against lots of Dreads or Bulks.
The thing that chases me off Driller when solo is the lack of mobility compared to other classes.
bitter garnet
Not really worth it tbh
dreads 1-2 players can be killed by Driller rather easy wtih flamethrower
A C4 full damage obliterates all the armor plus a tiny bit of health
distant steppe
Each of the other classes gives me some way to evade or distance myself from enemies, Driller can just dig himself a tomb
don't Dreads and Bulks have resistance to both fire and explosive damage?
bitter garnet
taking into account that he will at minimum, has his armor up 3 times per fight (unless critical weakness which can go beyond the thresold)
Yes, when the armor is down
You can instantly eliminate the armor with C4 as 1-2 players
The C4 needs to be full damage
So you should have 2 C4s
The last armor can be taken out with the flamethrower and axes
unique spoke
The nice thing about driller is that, resistance or no, you don't have to worry about being behind the Dread to hurt it with the CRSPR or Cryo.
bitter garnet
Or axes
You'll only care for your subata
If he shows his weakpoint, hey, Subata away.
So yeah, Driller only sucks against Dread on 3-4 players
But he's still better than Engi at killing the Dread regardless of players
Engi's the worst class to take the Dread out, unless you have managed to stack thirty proximity mines in one place to blow the dread up instantly.
which I have done
distant steppe
heh, wasn't the discussion originally CRSPR vs Cryo, not whether Driller was good/bad against bulk?
er, Dread, rather
bitter garnet
Yeah and Im telling you that its better to bring flamethrower at the moment
Because it's good against everything, cryo is only good against dread
distant steppe
and bulk, situationally
distant steppe
Well, I personally enjoy watching a bulk shatter instead of explode.
bitter garnet
They do blow up now
distant steppe
I guess I don't enjoy it enough to choose it over the flamethrower anymore, per this conversation, but still. 🙂
distant steppe
... well then, why bother with Cryo anymore?
unique spoke
it's not the usual detonation
it's just a big ol shockwave that does knockback
I do agree it's a weird choice tho considering how they've otherwise buffed the CRSPR to the moon.
bitter garnet
"- Glyphid Bulk Detonators unfreeze faster and when if they die while frozen they now explode with a nonlethal shockwave."
Yeah, there's not much of a reason to bring cryo
The only reason being Elimination with 4 players
And even then, you're better off with flame and let the Gunner+Scout deal with the Dread
Meanwhile the Driller with Engi deal with any uninvited guests
unique pivot
So is it just me or is the elite deep dive impossible this week.
hollow iris
It's pretty BS TBH
unique pivot
Sorry if I'm late to the discussion. Has anyone had any strategies that have worked? Me and my two buddies haven't been able to even beat the first mission.
Do you need a full four to pull it off?
distant steppe
You don't need a full four, but it does make things a bit easier (in the first stage)
The biggest thing is map knowledge - knowing where everything is and how to get there quickly makes the first stage a lot easier.
A good Driller also helps immensely on the first and third stages.
feral atlas
Map knowledge honestly is only relevant if you're struggling in the first place.
Just play Haz5, and get good enough to treat it as your regular difficulty.
If you can't do that, playing EDD will only be an exercise in frustration.
distant steppe
On an O2 point extraction that you're trying to get out of as quickly as possible? I'd say map knowledge is relevant.
feral atlas
Relevant but only if you're already close to the skill level where you're likely to fail.
It's relevant in borderline cases.
Your goal should be not to be on the borderline all the time.
distant steppe
Agreed, but if you're not running solo that's not entirely on you.
Besides, less time spent on the stage to gather everything generally means more comfort in subsequent stages regarding resource management.
Less incentive to push things and more to ensure survival in the current situation.
unique pivot
Good to know. We still struggle with haz4 so maybe we just need to get better.
distant steppe
out of curiosity, what three classes do you have in the team?
hollow iris
Tried soloing the EDD, just spammed malices and mactera at me
wraith shard
can someone explain me how Hardened round work and if it is worth on the M1000 Classics scout rifle
somber quest
you absolutely want a good driller for stage 1, tbh i found it harder than s3
memorize the morkite spots
dont try to defend waves on the minehead
its doable as 2man, nearly beat the edd first try as 2man
hollow pawn
The key is zip lines. If you or your gunner isnt deploying enough zip lines then you have a problem. To explain in simpler terms: stay off the fucking ground
wraith shard
unfortunately the minehead is almost always a terrible place to be aganst swarms
not the least problem being awful pathong around it by bugs
but also that is usually open on all sides and the turrets don’t do enough themselves
real wolf
never stand on a platform during waves. bugs will bite you from below
wraith shard
not even just the platform, the whole place is just naturally void of decent terrain usually
unique spoke
The ideal place to fight is someplace open and flat, regardless of circumstance. If you have such a place near the mine head you should use that to take advantage of the gun turrets. Otherwise yeah, get away from there.
somber quest
put a resupply on the fight zone to tell everyone else "hey fight over here and not on the minehead dammit"
real wolf
they will look at you with a question 'Are you fucking stupid?' on their faces
'Let's fight on a high ground under cover of turrets!'
civic quarry
Anyone experienced up for EDD? We failed on last mission because of drop pod clipping and would like to get this done asap haha
lethal dock
Stage 1: Zipline and focus spitters, scout focuses mor and gets nitra on the side
Stage 2: rush blackbox and mine all the stuff in the area; make sure to make driller bunkers making use of gunner shield and drilling further away if needed
Stage 3: scout rushes one egg while rest of group drills down to second egg and makes bunker, holding off both waves in case the scout dies in getting his egg. Bunker every wave and rush aqua
bitter garnet
A dirty digger alright
wraith shard
mfw we drop into EDD blind and the plan is “okay lads, kill anything with more legs than two, have fun, and be excellent to each other”
distant steppe
Alternate suggestions for EDD:
Stage 1: Driller rushes Aquarq, Scout and Engi focus on Morkite and Nitra, Gunner sets up zipline access to all the major areas (the pod can land in a lot of inconvenient locations).
Stage 2: Don't forget the Morkite and Nitra in the first room. Rush to the dirt, immediately turn around and rush downward to deal with the breeder and nexus (x2), mine out the immediate area, then rush back to the black box and mine out that cave too. Black box into escape, bunker black box if you need to.
Stage 3: Gunner sets up access to the egg on the same-ish level, Driller sets up access to the egg below (and in the opposite direction). Rush Aquarq. Bunker if needed to weather swarms, preferably in the wall behind the platform (take advantage of the platform turrets). Pop one egg after the first non-egg swarm, second egg after the second non-egg swarm. Good luck.
celest oasis
after 5 failed managed to finish stage3 of EDD wew... last mission is a doozy
really liking sticky flame to deal with so many swarmers
sweet igloo
random tidbit, if 2 stages in a row use morkite, if you keep morkite in your bag between stages, it'll still be there, it'll only disapear if you go to a 'no morkite' stage
celest oasis
How do you do the bunker method?
I feel like you get overwhelmed so quickly if you all bunch up on one spot
celest oasis
Feel like kiting everything in a circle is better lol
This is pubs mind you 
PE mission 3 is a nightmare oof
feral atlas
EDD?
I felt like it was the easiest. All objectives except one are basically within LoS of the minehead
white sandal
Bunker method is a leaf lovers strat 
celest oasis
Lethal modifier and static objective is ughhh
Standing on the PE point is death lol
heavy torrent
I’m gonna have to prestige scout before I try this EDD
So far everyone I’ve dived with doesn’t understand how to run a PE and not take a year
Also, where are the nitra deposits you guys are talking about? I’ve only noticed a few on the horizontal columns that span across the initial cave.
celest oasis
Does it get progressively harder the longer you keep a PE?
I heard varying accounts that it does... But also doesn't
Is it bugged?
distant steppe
Answering a few questions as best I'm able...
The idea behind bunkering is having a decently long Driller-sized tunnel that works as a lengthy chokepoint where the team can just lay down DPS in the hope of holding off a swarm.
Not always a good idea, and in some situations it's just suicidal.
It's also directly countered in most circumstances by Dreadnoughts, Bulk Detonators, and Oppressors.
Situationally useful when done properly, but also tends to get negative reactions from some players, sometimes to an extreme.
...
bitter garnet
Because it's boring and you are separating the team if someone doesnt want to, ending in a wipe.
You are forcing someone to join on a lame ass tactic that does nothing
distant steppe
The Nitra in the first stage EDD is a bit spread out - there are a few I remember on ledges if you circle up and right in the stage, and a few more if you dig upwards and left instead.
Heh, case in point.
feral atlas
Bunker tends to be the last resort of the overmatched.
Doing it normal tends to be faster, and if you're competent, safer in the longer run.
distant steppe
Personally, I'm indifferent to bunkering. It's a valid tool in the Dwarves' arsenal the way the game works now, does have its uses, and I find it more abhorrent to purposefully play otherwise if the team wants to use it and ends up wiping due to lacking specific firepower. (Lacking firepower in general, that's the team's problem.)
@feral atlas Agree on both counts. It's still a valid strategy, and in specific circumstances it can make life much easier.
feral atlas
My personal issue is that it's generally an all in or nothing strat.
distant steppe
Very, very true.
feral atlas
A person that chooses to do it essentially forces his team to either do it, or play with a man down.
distant steppe
Whereas a person who chooses not to do it when the rest of the team does risks causing a full wipe anyway.
feral atlas
If the team all decide they want to do it, sure, I don't care.
distant steppe
The problem doesn't appear to be so much the bunker as the team cohesion, to me.
feral atlas
It's bad game design to introduce an element that coerces cooperation in this fashion.
In game, it feels like blackmail.
Do this boring strate I hate, or play with a handicap.
It's like fire panic in KF2 before the change.
But no matter. This is why I host.
bitter garnet
^
feral atlas
At the end of the day, host makes the rules.
Including the decision to bunker or not to.
distant steppe
Agreed, though I'm not going to assume it was intended gameplay at this point. Certainly valid per the current mechanics, but players have an odd way of recombining available tactics in ways devs don't always think of.
bitter garnet
You dont want to join the boring bunker? You are in horrible place and they have one less player.
It's lame
feral atlas
Meh. On those occasions where people decide to bunker, I just leave.
bitter garnet
At least zipline cheesing can be stopped with spitters and the like
distant steppe
Meh, it can always go the other way too. Driller tries to bunker and ends up all alone entombed in a wall and dead. Kinda comical sometimes.
distant steppe
I was debating on whether or not to mention I've seen Dwarves go anti-party over bunkers and cost the stage. Guess I don't have to worry so much now.
feral atlas
As long as people respect the hosts, and hosts are transparent with their bunker/no-bunker status on their server names, players can self assort
distant steppe
"As long as people respect the hosts..." - oh ho ho, that's a separate rant that I really don't want to get into. There's a reason I stick to either solo or groups I'm familiar with these days.
feral atlas
As host, you have the stick.
Use it.
Gotta get past the point of feeling bad for kicking people for being bad or souring the lobby.
distant steppe
@celest oasis Regarding the difficulty escalation on Point Extraction stages - it's been debated recently, but is currently not conclusive either way. Some claim the waves get faster or larger, others that there's no significant difference as mission time increases. From personal, anecdotal experience, when I was experimenting with it I did see significantly larger waves as time went on (Haz 4/5, solo), but the goal regardless should be to finish the stage before it matters too much.
celest oasis
Interesting
distant steppe
As host you do have some limitations at present. The current sore spot for me is having others call the drop pod before the secondary objective is completed; as Scout, I've taken to ignoring the primary objective until the team (or, worst case, me solo) completes the secondary.
The other problem I remember, and I haven't checked recently if this is still the case as I no longer care to host these days, is that some stages will remove your ability to kick Dwarves after a certain point. The worst offender for me was Salvage stages, where several times I had Dwarves that contributed until they couldn't be kicked anymore, then immediately went AFK.
feral atlas
Well, given than I have nearly everything and don't really care aout mission rewards, I just go nuclear.
And turn off the modem.
distant steppe
Indeed. Were I still up for hosting, at this point I think my policy would be to just instantly abort the mission of someone called the pod early. Another motivating factor for me not to host.
dark lark
Oh
I just tested difficulty on point extract.
Basically, the time between swarm does not change, it remains the same,.
The size of the swarm I'm unsure about, my testing didn't show a massive increase.
The real change is in the size of the ambient swarms. Every 1 to 2 minutes a wave of enemies spawns on PE.
The size of that wave increases with time, and is probably the main notable difficulty increase over time
distant steppe
Hmm, very interesting.
That would mesh with my results.
by the time I'd have both objectives done, I really wouldn't be able to distinguish much between the swarms and ambient waves.
The primary thing I noticed was that even with my full DPS pretty much constantly I'd always eventually get to the point where I couldn't clear everything from the previous swarm before the next one hit, and eventually I'd just have a massive population of stuff chasing me around the level constantly.
Getting worse with each subsequent swarm afterward.
Actually, that reminds me, did the end-of-swarm messages get removed from Point Extraction missions at some point?
hollow iris
It seems to ramp up way faster/too fast on PE this patch, though I dunno if it's been like that for a while
On higher haz*
sand pilot
If you're talking about elite deep dives, I find the insane amount of swarms and group spawns to be so incredibly high on some elite deep dives that there's just no breathing room between spawns. But I had always assumed that was part of the difficulty, and I just had to get better I guess.
shut sierra
Whole point of EDDs becomes time management.
Work fast, and communicate and coordinate.
Go for nitra and objectives
later just objectives
And remember you have control over swarms spawning with egg hunts and eliminations
and they'll overlap with timed swarms from mining ops and point extractions
So make sure to do them ASAP after a timed swarm
or you'll get a double-swarm, and you.. don't want that.
inner void
PE is extra brutal in EDDs because a lot of players don't seem to recognize the time pressure you are under
it's the only mode with constant spawns and they only grow over time, so if you try to get the egg last it doesn't go well
@shut sierra One rookie mistake I see in a lot of EDD parties is that they leave nitra behind.
shut sierra
I'd ditch gold, but nitra?
inner void
Even the rank 200+ triple golds sometimes.
shut sierra
There's only so much speedrunning you can do
I mean, sure on the third stage, and later second stage, you can ditch it if you got enoguh
but other than that
inner void
Yeah, it's always worth getting every scrap of nitra you can. If nothing else it means you can ignore nitra completetly on the second/third map and just breeze through it, but a lot of the time having ALL the ammo can pull your ass out of the fire.
Especially if the first or second stage is a PE map because there is always tons of nitra everywhere.
shut sierra
Yeah, the timed swarm missions are pretty nasty
I'd say egg hunts are the easiest
because (as far as I can tell) there's no special swarms with them
and you choose when they happen
inner void
I think you still get them if you have too long a delay between eggs. But I think digging out an egg does something to the swarm timer.
celest oasis
Say if a swarm is coming and then we activate black box on stage two
Can swarms combine into a mega swarm?
harsh iron
Afaik pretty much any swarm will combine into double swarms
harsh iron
Isn't that only the first mission on the regular Dive
harsh iron
I'd like to see how it is in 4p. I did it solo first go
Solo is super ez
Just kite while bosco does literally all the work because it's PE
harsh iron
Probably scout
Just because you can traverse, and abuse the hell out of iron will
Iron will? Pheremones and vampire. No pheremones? Zip to a sugar. Out of sugar? Zip to your resupply. Out of that? Vampire while falling and zip away so you can't get 1hko
celest oasis
Gk2 or sniper iyo?
harsh iron
I don't know all the builds people use because I just started after having not played for over a year
It doesnt matter as long as you can solo clear
On PE you don't even have to clear
You can indefinitely kite while Bosco does literally everything
celest oasis
Hmm
harsh iron
If you're feeling good about yourself youn can manually clear the easy aquarqs* while bosco does other ones
celest oasis
What is your bosco build for solo dd?
harsh iron
It doesnt matter, you just want mining and revives, rockets don't do shit. Electric can make bosco slow a single target if you want
Sometimes I use the rockets to clear trash
Save ammo
My favorite is when you accidentally right click on something with bosco then tell him to mine something he has to pick up, like aquarq. He will fire the rocket after he drops the item, like even minutes later. It's hilarious
inner void
the mining upgrade is the best, if you want direct damage for bosco get the electric upgrade instead of the bullet damage. It dramatically increases his dps and adds a useful debuff too
building for rockets with fast recharge and radius is okayish, but bosco's AI isn't that great and it's hard to get the rockets to land where you want them to
cryo rockets are very awesome but situational
harsh iron
I love trying to mark a swarm of trash for him to clear and I click between them on the rocks, which is NBD but he has to fly over like point blank to fire the rocket so all the bugs have moved
Just fire the damn thing from across the room lol
celest oasis
Is lumen any good lol
wraith shard
GK2 for the scout, much better all around then the M1K which is built more around teamplay most of the time
if you get shafted and the spawntable has an unholy amount of swarmers you wont regret taking the gk2
rockets with bosco are okay, I use cryo rockets but I frequently forget to use them and they just clash with me if im playing driller
you need two cryo rockets to freeze all airborne targets which is a supreme pain and the accuracy is not the best
def go for recharge speed though, its abysmal without it
wraith shard
electric bullets are free extra damage plus stun
any rocket upgrades still require you aiming the rockets
yeah ill probably go back to electric bullets
they can seriously gimp a single large target
glossy wolf
Just did my first stage of Deep Dive. Was a dreadnought elimination and black box combo. Leech infestation and explosive guts.
wraith shard
did u rike it
glossy wolf
First stage went smoothly aside from the last dreadnought fight, which I almost died in. Granted, that dreadnought's egg was in a rather small, confined tunnel so there wasn't much space to safely kite it around in.
Second stage was mining expedition and salvaging the small mule bots, with exploder invation. That one was an annoying drag, not just because of all the swarms, but also because the mule bots ended up getting bugged in one of the rooms and it took a satchel charge to fix them for whatever reason.
Now on to the third stage, egg hunt.
Gotta repair two mini mules again, as well.
glossy wolf
Finished the deep dive.
Third stage wasn't bad either. My guess is that this was a relatively tame deep dive roll, aye?
wraith shard
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sswNp6CBx64
Watch my youtube video 🙂
wraith shard
ive been running into a bug where when im solo on that EDD first stage ill randomly die for no reason. no enemies around, maybe even just turning in what i have on the first stage, and the game will at random just kill the character even from full health.
thorny geyser
reghular dds are pretty easy
celest oasis
@glossy wolf try EDD its hilarious with pubs
distant steppe
we may want to work on your definition of hilarious there...
celest oasis
Reee 
minor saffron
i did the edd with randoms and it worked for some reason
celest oasis
Did you do the bunker strat on stage3 lol
minor saffron
no
celest oasis
Aww
minor saffron
we did the 2 eggs on stage 3 all spread across the map
it was so weird that this worked
celest oasis
I surprised that worked lol
What was the team comp
Usually get overwhelmed too fast if you solo in a 4man pt rofl
minor saffron
aoe gunner , sticky flame driller , me as a scout and a stubby gl engie
and i really suck as a scout xD
celest oasis
Good stuff
minor saffron
i really wonder is constant kiting with 4 tagets is more effective than actually trying to rally and fight from that 1 spot