suggestions-discussion

[fossil finch]

They're just swords that are winged and have a normal double edged sword blade for different reasons

stop theorizing with cringe melee weapons and use that energy on cool future content iirc

[glossy marten]

why not lol it's funny

[fossil finch]

Funny part is that seraphim's a big dagger and not actually a sword

[glossy marten]

oh damn

[fossil finch]

Because it's cringe

[glossy marten]

I disagree

[fossil finch]

Everything related to melee is

[glossy marten]

you're just boring

[fossil finch]

you're the boring one

Melee is largely boring

[glossy marten]

ark??

biome blade???

yoyos??

flails???

murasama??

[fossil finch]

Cosmos line is an exception

And we're talking about a sword anyways

[glossy marten]

with a unique effect

[fossil finch]

A broadboringsword

[glossy marten]

!

[fossil finch]

Mmyes very unique
It shoots x projectile or does x thing sometimes

(Or has a comedical amount of y stat)

[glossy marten]

majestic guards lowers defense on hit and heals if no deffense

name a ranged weapon that does that

or a rogue weapon

or a mage weapon

or a summoner weapon

[fossil finch]

That's irrelevant

It's still boring

[glossy marten]

how is it irrelevant

we're talking about melee

[fossil finch]

It's just a boring x on hit effect

[glossy marten]

how is it boring

it's more unique than most guns

[fossil finch]

Which, by the way, is done by all classes

[glossy marten]

yeah all classes swing swords that lower defense and heal on hit

[fossil finch]

There is atleast not more guns than summoner weapons in the game

yeah ur kinda annoying and using flawed arguments

Why are we discussing this is stupid anyways

[glossy marten]

which ones exactly were flawed

[fossil finch]

All classes have on hit effects, whether they're exactly that is irrelevant on whether it's interesting or not

[glossy marten]

I mean it absolutely is because a debuff on hit is also an on hit effect lol

[fossil finch]

that doesn't help your point

[neat linden]

cool on hit effect, any weapon, just one example?

anti materiel rifle

[glossy marten]

what's it do I dofgor

[fossil finch]

This was about Seraphim looking like a random sword right?
Yeah no it's just a coincidence hope that helps your doubt

[neat linden]

when the bullet critically hits, it summons a swarm of extra projectiles at the enemy

[glossy marten]

it's an interesting coincidence nevertheless

love stuff like that

it makes me think of covergent evolution in animals

like how hyenas are similar to dogs but biologically are closer to cats

[neat linden]

and considering its high crit chance and the fact you usually have close to 100% crit at that stage, means most projectiles will summon the swarm

[glossy marten]

that's cool

but I meant that as in

that exact effect

lol

[fossil finch]

Again, that is irrelevant and does not make the sword more interesting

[glossy marten]

it makes it more unique

which helps in being interesting

[neat linden]

it's just one of 16384 true melee weapons

[fossil finch]

By 0.01 uniquely points yes it's slightly more unique

[neat linden]

Which due to how they work are overall fairly interesting but some aren't particularly noteworthy

[glossy marten]

by that logic anti materiel is jsut one of 198769 guns because functionally it just shoots

[fossil finch]

(Out of the trillion true melee with onhit effects sword

[neat linden]

maj guard being an example

is it awesome ultra flashy? no

[fossil finch]

It is

[neat linden]

is it good? yes

[fossil finch]

That's the point

[glossy marten]

well I disagree

anti materiel is cool too

[neat linden]

Because it's a sniper weapon and that's cool objectively-

[glossy marten]

does tyranny's end do that too?

[neat linden]

Wait but like

[glossy marten]

I haven't used it

[neat linden]

is this related to some sugg or

[fossil finch]

No

[glossy marten]

it was initially but not anymore

lol

[neat linden]

so we're kinda offtopic

[fossil finch]

Never was actually

[neat linden]

whatever

[fossil finch]

Yes

[glossy marten]

yeah let's stop

anyway gss is in such a sad place

like genuinely right after plant is the worst place to put anything

like does anyone outside summoner even care about its loot?

wait apparently the scale droprate is lower in expert?

the fuck?

100% in normal 33% in expert

@drowsy plank would that be worth adding to the sugg

the weirdchamp droprate I mean

[fossil finch]

Pretty sure that's wrong

[glossy marten]

the wiki said so lemme recheck

[neat linden]

i don't think mentioning other suggs isn't a great idea

[fossil finch]

Pretty sure the 33 droprate is for the extra?

[neat linden]

wiki means the +1 extra being 33%

[small timber]

it means the +1 extra is 33% rate?

[glossy marten]

ah

weird

[fossil finch]

Like yes it needs to be clearer

[glossy marten]

ty anyway

[crude geode]

see above @drowsy plank

[neat linden]

other than this, i don't see any significant issues

[glossy marten]

if devs are actually planning on making it post ml that works too

[neat linden]

never heard of GSS being planned post ml

the only retier of a boss i heard was ravager

[glossy marten]

fr?

where is he going

[neat linden]

post provi

and being the only source of bloodstone

[glossy marten]

makes sense

[eternal escarp]

nitpick, GSS aint a boss

[neat linden]

[glossy marten]

hope he's still dropping the bars and cores tho

[neat linden]

Stop ruining my argument-

[glossy marten]

does slime god make sense as a name?

[neat linden]

#suggestions-voting message

[neat linden]

...yes?

[glossy marten]

because it's kinda weird that slime queen comes after her god

in 1.4

[neat linden]

what else would you call it, slime gods

[glossy marten]

idk like slime primordial

[glossy marten]

it's jsut this kinda bothers me

[neat linden]

devs will figure out how to deal with that mess

[crude geode]

there's already plans to deal with that iirc

[glossy marten]

moving sg to post plant

[crude geode]

I don't think either are getting swapped tho

in terms of progression movement

[neat linden]

moving sg to post ml

[glossy marten]

I think slime god is perfect where he is the name jsut kinda is weird

inb4 slime queen renamed to slime godess

[small timber]

I think the tester do say that slime god is completely intended to be the "final boss" of preHM (WoF is count as transition boss to HM)

and that will not change no matter Queen Slime's existence

[neat linden]

slime god fits really well

[glossy marten]

actually I think it's a little more logical if you think about qs as just a slime that accumulated more slimes than the god

you know

[glossy marten]

I agree

[bright crag]

Slime God will remain where he is

[glossy marten]

it's not the boss it's the name of queen slime really

[bright crag]

And Queen Slime being stronger will be explained

[glossy marten]

oh wait lore items are a thing

right

[bright crag]

She'll remain as she is too

[bright crag]

Yes

[glossy marten]

don't normally care about the lore but genuinely curious how they explain this ngl

[small timber]

something something god of slimes died (since the lore item mentioned how "slimes gods will eventually be unbelievably powerful if it merg all slimes in the world"), will slimes finally be stopped? turns out no, slimes just consume everything, even just a new slime consuming on the newly borned hallow can become more powerful than what previous was known as the most powerful form of slimes ever exist

[crude geode]

wow speculation is awesome

[small timber]

eventually we will just need a supreme slime god boss for the lore to finally finish

[bright crag]

Not really

It's just that being old =/= being powerful

Slime God gained powerful by combining with slimes over time and its associations with the world evils

Queen Slime, while being younger, gained power from a much stronger source - the Hallow

Which I assume wasn't available to Slime God

[glossy marten]

hmmm

[glossy marten]

yharon is already right there

[drowsy plank]

lmao love how i was pinged for this twice and got 0 notifications for it

thank you discord very cool

[glossy marten]

Rip

[crude geode]

I’d argue that with the moving of Light and Dark shards into GSS’s drop pool
this hasn't been implemented nor does the original sugg discussing this have more than 👍. it seems unnecessary to the sugg

[celest sonnet]

i like the latest suggestion

a lot

[drowsy plank]

[hollow shell]

hm indeed @drowsy plank, a strange inclusion to the suggestion

[drowsy plank]

oh i just noticed that

i was going off of uh

here; #suggestions-voting message

oh wait

lmfao i just misread the guide it was only deliever and ignored

lemme fix that

ok there

[hollow shell]

aight coolio

[drowsy plank]

gss dropping shards would be cool tho cause like that sugg pointed out getting shards is weird rn but that's a problem for another day

[sinful steeple]

would this also be the place to ask about a suggestion i'm thinking of making?

[drowsy plank]

yes

this is suggestion discussion

[sinful steeple]

okay good, i've been hanging in the abyss for a bit and i've noticed that the two worm enemies in the abyss, when hovering under you often go close enough to yo that you're in their aggression radius

like you can be entirely stationary when they spawn and then proceed to do nothing, but they'll just aggro on you anyway

[hollow shell]

(Funny you should mention cuz people in the dev server were talking about problems with Abyss enemy aggro earlier today)

[sinful steeple]

every other abyss enemy can be avoided much more reliably than the oarfish and gulper eel, and especially with the eel it really forces you to stop what you're doing and get rid of the eel or move far away super quickly

i feel like if the oarfish and gulper eel were changed to work like aquatic scourge they'd feel better to encounter- like if they spawn they are passive until damaged

is there any problem with them working like that which i don't realise or is that alright

[hollow shell]

You could make a suggestion of that variety yeah

It's possible your problem is going to be fixed anyway cuz of the aforementioned dev server convo
But, that prolly won't be an issue

[sinful steeple]

alright, i'll make the suggestion then

[fossil finch]

Better solution i think would be making the background pitch black/orange, etc etc but still having eye of xeroc be there

Though iirc eye of xeroc shines red sometimes(?) That'd be annoying

I just want a middle ground that gets to keep eye of xeroc

[frozen hornet]

Just fight scal in space

(I don't actually know if this works)

[hollow shell]

I think it would work actually

(Gotta chug a Normalizer)

[gaunt frost]

fix multiplayer

[muted osprey]

(impossible

[frosty trellis]

Probably. White gemstone walls and white torches also works wonders

[unborn oriole]

How to make an ez Scal arena

• Go to underground
• Use Drill mount to clear space
• Summon scal
• Fill space
• Fill space with diamond gemstone walls
• Shadow paint
• Enjoy

[frosty trellis]

See

I don't always find the drill mount

[silent pawn]

can we have more bumbledoge content

aka bumblefuck stuff

[grave zinc]

@night jolt - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Properly Decrypt the schematics after putting them into the Codebreaker]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

@drowsy plank - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Add Calamity Ores to Fishing Crates and Standardize Crate Drops]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

@slim lion - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[An accessory or material to craft an accessory to give full immunity to the Abyss should be a drop from the Adult Eildon Wyrm.]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

@crystal stone - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[Add a custom background to Brimstone Crag.]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

@ashen warren - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[The Devourer of Gods should have animated background effects]

It has received enough votes to be passed on to the dev server for voting! You'll be notified again when a verdict is reached.
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

[small timber]

(that will completely break the flow of the fight), I will really prefer dialogue to just be, say, either before boss fight start or after boss fight end

[drowsy plank]

finally, here's hoping it passes 🙏

[small timber]

it probably will? I dont see much reason it dont

[drowsy plank]

ik, but still, there's always a possibility

also doesnt DoG... already have text appear above you when hit by his head???

[hollow shell]

@crystal stone Doesn't DoG's eat text already appear in the world near him and the player?

[drowsy plank]

ok yeah it wasnt just me

ig you could have it appear above draedon's hologram in the fight, and scal's in her's respectively but... eh

[small timber]

ye, just regardless of that I dont think having a short pause in the fight for purely dialogue reason is really a good idea

[small timber]

^

[crystal stone]

A lot of the time you move away from the text to fast to read it

[hollow shell]

Boss Rush is actually a good example of dialogue in this instance, cuz they're always during breaks

[crystal stone]

It should appear above you so you can read it easier

[small timber]

but boss rush is different in that each boss is a single instance of fight, in a normal full boss fight it is basically breaking the fight itself into parts

[hollow shell]

Your sugg words it confusingly
You mention text appearing on the side of the screen, then immediately follow up with DoG as an "example"

[crystal stone]

Wait I do

[hollow shell]

Yeah

[crystal stone]

I reworded it a little

[small timber]

does scal have text float above the player for her dialogue? I dont remember her doing that

[crystal stone]

She doesn't

Im saying she has text that's on the side of the screen

[small timber]

(then probably reword slightly, since this reads like "scal has text float above the player instead of beside the screen")

[hollow shell]

Yeah that does look like SCal is the "good example"

[ashen warren]

Ayo i got ping

[grave zinc]

@ashen warren - Your suggestion has received an updated status!

[The Devourer of Gods should have animated background effects]

It has been add to the devs' to-do list and planned for implementation!
You can check out your suggestion again here: #suggestions-voting message

[ashen warren]

Thx

[frozen hornet]

Pogg

[small timber]

ya the progression guide is a "guide" for a reason, not a "rulebook"

if you think it is too easy you can even kill queen bee before king slime, or kill slime god straight away

[kindred canyon]

Yes, but guide information should be true at least to some degree

[small timber]

the guide information IS true, post-skeletron gear is stronger than perforator, which is what the guide is based on

[kindred canyon]

For example, nobody doubts in vanilla progression. Yes, you can kill Skeletron before evil bosses, but he is actually harder

[frail mantle]

This seems more like an issue of skeletron being too easy than the progression being wrong tbh

Although I’d say moving the evil2 bosses so they’re not literally right after the vanilla evil bosses wouldn’t necessarily be a bad idea

That is true

There’s not really anywhere else in pre Hardmode they’d fit

And Hardmode has enough bosses as is

[small timber]

the thing is just because skeletron unlock dungeon which provides a lot of decent accessory, weapons and shadow key it must be relatively far in the progression

ideally evil 2 will be after QB before skeletron in power I think, basically if you dont kill QB (which is optional) evil2 will be a very decent challenge and then afterwards skeletron which unlocks lots of gear to prepare for Slime God

currently it is before QB and Skeletron, and another thing that make skeletron so weak is probably because hellstone is balanced for post-skeletron (I think?), but is accessible post-evil 1

[eternal escarp]

whatever reason can come from this sugg

the reason they give is entirely subjective

which is just

not a good sugg

[small timber]

ya (and suggesting to change something that in the context of gear, do make complete sense)

[eternal escarp]

and changing the wiki as a whole doesnt need sugg, though objectively the sugg is just wrong anyways so the wiki wont change

[small timber]

I do think the biggest thing require rebalancing is hellstone, currently hellstone gears completely nuke evil 2 bosses, QB and of course skeletron itself

[fossil finch]

I like the implication "wiki owners" choose progression order instead of devs

[small timber]

turns out there is dev that are also assisting in building the wiki, and idea of "progression order" itself had always been community defined not developer defined

calamity never just say "yo kill this boss exactly after this one, then do this then kill that boss", in fact calamity deliberately want to make the game less linear

[fossil finch]

No progression order is developer defined

Bosschecklist is based on values given by devs based on intended boss orders

There was always and had always been an intended order to fight bosses in this is how design works

[small timber]

because if they want to put a value the most appropriate approach will be follow the wiki? and calamity still didnt force the player to follow boss checklist order exactly

otherwise boss checklist will be a jumble mess where you have scal as first boss because it is the boss you are required to kill

[fossil finch]

that doesn't mean there's not an intended boss kill order?

What do you think the wiki's order is based on?
Wiki has always had dev involvement since its conception iirc

[small timber]

there is an intended boss kill order? sure (since there is always gear balancing/progression), but the devs (except post-Yharon) didnt really force you to kill one boss exactly after another

[fossil finch]

that doesn't have anything to do with this though

The point is thay progression order is indeed a thing devs made even if it's not forced

Devs in this case may reduce to fabsol deciding when are his bosses supposed to be fought relative to vanilla bosses or to other bosses of his i think but it still is a thing

the point being that "wiki owners" don't exactly decide this

[small timber]

ok since I thought you are referring to the suggestion (which confused me a bit), then this is my opinion:

• community defined = what the community think best to progress the game, including "intended boss kill order" (since even devs is involved with it)
• developer defined = the developer/game force you to only progress in said exact way, eg: you can only desert scourge after king slime, and EoC after DS (by hardlocking them)

[fossil finch]

This is stupid semantics iirc

Or whatever

Also it's pretty confusing i think most people can assume developer defined is what's intended by the developers

[cobalt heath]

sorry if im late but like skele might be easier, but dungeon opens abyss which is even later on

and it would not make sence to have abyss progression before evil 2 cause abyss gear is literally the end game of prehm

plus there is no official progression

[fossil finch]

Boss check li

[cobalt heath]

techically

its not official do, calamity is non linear

until post ml

[fossil finch]

That doesn't matter?

It's still official

Just because non linearity exists doesn't mean it's not official

I'm :sadcat: rn since when official=100% forced to follow

[golden tulip]

i mean it is kinda official

calamity devs support the mod and place the bosses in whatever point of progress they want

[fossil finch]

Yeah that's the point indeed

[tardy smelt]

*post-DoG

actually not even

crappily drawn, but like

Post-Moonlord is way less linear than you'd think it would be

there's lots of ways to do different post-moonlord bosses out of order

in fact, every post-Moonlord boss except for Old Duke, Providence, Draedon and SCal is available as soon as you beat said

[small timber]

ye old duke is like AEW now

it is only linear if your end goal is to beat both exo and scal, if your "final boss" is yharon it is super non linear (you can skip almost all post-ML bosses)

[tardy smelt]

oh right

yep

most of Post-ML's progression is just forced by a power curve

much like Hardmode and Pre-Hardmode actually

[small timber]

the forced one is mainly just auric ore tbh: it require tarragon for blossom pickaxe (providence), then auric cooling cell hardlock by post-DoG frost moon (DoG), then Yharon is essential (auric bar)

[warped tide]

me when you can just fight Dragonfolly without touching Moon Lord

aw

:(

2.0 stinks

!!!!

[small timber]

isnt 2.0 one forced dragonfolly before yharon not force moon lord before dragonfolly?

[warped tide]

ooohhhh

right yeah

draconic swarmers are now only a infight thing

I can still Sequence Break Dragonfolly

WOOO

[tardy smelt]

i wonder if they still despawn instantly if Folly does the summon attack offscreen

[warped tide]

please

(they are indeed a pest)

[tardy smelt]

if they ever do appear

they can say hi to my adrenaline'd clockwork bow

[warped tide]

requires luninite

which means moon lord

[tardy smelt]

fair enough

i'm too used to nohit progression

which is 5x as linear as casual progression

[warped tide]

yeah sounds about right

you cant nohit folly pre ML

fight takes too long

[tardy smelt]

oh you can

[warped tide]

(unless your a mage and using the Swarmer)

[tardy smelt]

time length isn't a constraint

its just that like, well

why would you

you can't do him later on either, though

progression skips are banned

[warped tide]

aw

bbbut Blunder Booster

and Mad Alchemist Cocktail Glove

[tardy smelt]

boss progression skips are banned

non-boss ones are fine

in fact, both are pre-Folly for nohits

i used Blunder Booster for my Folly nohit, really fun and useful accessory

[tardy smelt]

so you can fight DFolly with pre-Moonlord gear but you still wouldn't be able to fight Moonlord with Folly gear

[warped tide]

pain

[tardy smelt]

fair 'nough

[warped tide]

cant use the Golden Eagle to shred ml

(hate ml)

[tardy smelt]

fair enough

if you really wanted to tear Moonlord to pieces without progression skips you can use True Biome Blade without attunements

which, theoretically, could get maybe like, a 30-40 second killtime on him?

its nuts

[warped tide]

https://calamitymod.wiki.gg/wiki/Blunder_Booster

Only needs

the feathers

[crude geode]

Classic #suggestions-discussion getting off topic

[tardy smelt]

yeah, i know

[warped tide]

pain

[tardy smelt]

fair enough

[night jolt]

Difficulty is subjective, you need some actual stats to say Skeletron is easier than Perf/Hive

[tardy smelt]

poll a few dozen/hundred people on it

even then that should only give a really vague idea of it

[drowsy plank]

i was just gonna say get kill times

but i guess you could do that too if it's more that the patterns are way easier regardless of the bulk of the boss

[tardy smelt]

kill times are meaningless in terms of difficulty

just ask just about everyone who's nohitted the profaned guardians

the bog standard is to melt them in under a minute, and there barely are any nohits that pass beyond the 60 secs on them anyway

and yet

[crude geode]

meaningless is a bit of an overstatement

considering you're using no-hitting as a standard of difficulty

[tardy smelt]

hey, let me finish

[tardy smelt]

almost all of them complain about them being overtuned

yes, its just their opinions, but i've seen the same people complain significantly less about some bosses that take much longer to kill (which is almost all of them, people on the lounge love complaining about guardians)

just killtimes aren't a good meter of any two given bosses's overall difficulty

[grim tusk]

And guardian’s intended kill time is ~2 mins

[tardy smelt]

yeah

its sad to see

[tardy smelt]

especially since you can get vastly different killtimes with different weapons on the same bosses...which reduces or increases the difficulty of said specific bosses. Difficulty's context-dependent after all

for me, there's two ways in which you can measure and compare any two given bosses' difficulty in a remotely objective way

one's to ask many, many people about it, then compile that data and compare the stats

preferrably select a more narrow niche to poll from

[crude geode]

that's really not a good way to poll

[grim tusk]

Wouldnt a broader audience be better?

[tardy smelt]

yeah fair

[grim tusk]

Since you get people from all skill levels

[tardy smelt]

fair

brain fart

[crude geode]

arguably that method runs into the problem of the boss changing before you get your poll data done

[tardy smelt]

also true

[tardy smelt]

the second way is to meticulously chart out the exact ways in which a player can/should move to avoid each boss's attacks, which differs anyway since different people avoid said in different ways, and just try to get an idea of how each intended way of dealing with each attack from each boss compares to the other, purely in what a player has to do to avoid it

which has its whole other range of flaws, but at least you can somewhat start seeing difficulty from the designer's perspective

[slim lion]

oooh, rad

[tardy smelt]

considering a thing such as "intended difficulty" exists and looking at how a player can and should deal with challenges in any given way is important a s a game designer, that method still carries some value

both methods are extremely high effort

neither is ever used in #suggestions-posting, seemingly

[crude geode]

it shouldn't be that surprising

the common suggestor barely manages to get formatting correct, let alone doing actual research/experimentation

we are long past the days of frequent google doc posting

[tardy smelt]

truetrue

sadly.

[drowsy plank]

i still have a google doc i just dont post links to it

easier to copy paste stuff out of it

[tardy smelt]

on the note of suggestions

i had kind of an idea to suggest something about adding more content/rewards to the sulphurous sea caves

they're genuinely quite cool to explore, but considering how dangerous the underwater part of said caves is, you're likely to not explore it until later on in pre-hardmode

and the only actually usable gear down there is also craftable post-Eye of Chtulu, using Acid Rain drops

[small timber]

ye probably like draedon's old abandoned lab (actual)

[tardy smelt]

that'd be one cool thing

it'd also be quite high-effort, but it'd definitely add something super interesting and worth checking out to the lower Sulph Sea

[tardy smelt]

...so its kind of sad to me that there's never any incentives to actually explore that place, despite how cool it is

[tardy smelt]

in fact, there's already little run down arsenal lab monitor structures down there

which are quite cute and cool foreshadowing-wise, but they don't do much

[tardy smelt]

byeah, does this point seem valid?

otherwise there's not really any reason for me to sugg about it :p

[small timber]

the two main one (besides those planned such as brimstone crag and sunken sea, subworld...) is sulphurous sea and normal ocean

both are generally lacking, sulphurous sea (below sea) now is pretty much just to see if you can get effigies of decay or rusty medallion, thats about it

[tardy smelt]

yeah

if you get effigy of decay from the Acid Rain

you can literally get every other underwater drop from that event's mats

and its significantly lower effort to check the Sulph Sea out post-EoC rather than to explore it earlier on, dive into the extremely dangerous underwater part for getting that few items just a few tiers earlier

with, likely, little to no equipment at your disposal that will help you explore the underwater Sulph Sea more effectively (which includes Victide Armor, Sulphurskin Potions (which are crafted from Acid Rain drops if im not mistaken so that makes the situation even more silly), vanilla underwater accs and potions and Sulphurous Armor which speaks for itself)

[drowsy plank]

if sulph sea just inflicted normal poison at least you could get a bezoar from the jungle to mitigate it at least

[small timber]

I think sulphurous sea being difficult (early) to explore is intentional, since they nerfed sulphurskin potion duration

[drowsy plank]

not to mention that jungle drops are also just better than literally anything you could get from sulph sea anyway

maybe the itmes could be buffed to make it more worth but idk why you'd even bother atm

[small timber]

but ya, currently sulphurous sea exploration just have a lot of effort required but no reward

I dont think those items need to be buff, they just need to add more to sulphurous sea exploration; say having an epic super powerful drop just in a random crate (as in, literal crate, not fishing crate) do not feel impactful

[tardy smelt]

^

though honestly, even just some rare items down there could help

say, the loot pool from the draedon labs that spawn in the caverns

lifeforce potions are a rare and valuable resource in prehardmode

[small timber]

I think a draedon lab (ruined one) fit perfectly as stated above, just because I will imagine the abyss is one of the thing draedon desperately want to get in but cant because the physical condition is too harsh

[tardy smelt]

and the other loot in them is nothing to scoff at either

[tardy smelt]

yeaaaa

but like

how would you format that into the suggestion

is this even worth suggesting about in the first place

[small timber]

~~Add more sulphurous sea exploration content

it has crates and nothing else, add more please. Done~~

maybe, since sulphurous sea is probably not on the plans for change for a long time, since things like sunken sea and brimstone crag take a lot of priority

[drowsy plank]

tbh why wouldnt you suggest a buff to sulph sea chests

arguably they're harder to access than sky islands and hell items atm, and yet are easily worse than both

[tardy smelt]

well

that's subjective

[small timber]

it is just, sulphurous sea items are unironically pretty decent

[tardy smelt]

but i'd say its easy to pin down that they're harder to access than the average biome

...and all of its unique loot is accessible after the Eye of Chtulu

the chances of you reaching the biome before beating EoC are... not too large

[drowsy plank]

hardest boss in the game babieeeeeeee

[tardy smelt]

you're much less likely to explore the area beyond your spawnpoint early on

exploring downwards though? much more plausible

[drowsy plank]

yeah idk, ill need to look at what spawns in sulph sea chests cause

i know rusty medallion is one of them i think and uh

yeah

[tardy smelt]

which already leads you to one of the ways to summon the Eye, being Sus eyes in chests

making houses? The Eye spawns naturally after just four npc's have moved in

fighting things on the surface at night, once you have a decent weapon? You'll soon get enough lenses for a summon

if you just play casually, you're actually really likely to run into the Eye by accident at some point or another

and once you have,

"an acidic downpour falls over the wasteland seas"
if you know about the sulphurous sea in the first place, you'll go there

otherwise, you'll run into it by accident later on, maybe after Skeletron or so since that already puts you pretty close to the Sulph Sea

if you somehow get into and survive in the Sulphurous Sea before beating the Eye of Chtulu

honestly

[drowsy plank]

why is broken water filter in sulph sea chests

[tardy smelt]

what are the odds of you seriously spending any time in the water, let alone exploring it?

[fossil finch]

This is assuming of a new player though

[tardy smelt]

yep

[fossil finch]

Balance applies to both types of players

Or all of them really

[tardy smelt]

mmhm

[drowsy plank]

ok but i think it's true for both that. who the fuck would bother with sulph sea chests rn

[fossil finch]

Wiki also exists, but it's hard to factor the game outside of the game when balancing

[tardy smelt]

for more seasoned players, there's little incentive for exploring the sulphur caves

the loot can be acquired more easily by simply beating the Eye, which they'll do in no time, and doing Acid Rain and crafting the items from the caves from that event's materials

[fossil finch]

I think chests should get unique loot and scale crafts keep being what is now both chest loot and scale crafts

[small timber]

I think generally have a big "point of interest" is good for both new and seasoned player, seasoned player know where to get the items that need but for new player it is "hey that is a gigantic building, there must be good loot in there!"

instead of having random sunken crates yielding super good items

[tardy smelt]

yeah

[fossil finch]

Acid rain actually does kinda require you underwatering a bit though
New skyfin ai fixed this a lot but still

[tardy smelt]

mmhm

but Acid Rain is a combat thing, not an exploration thing

[small timber]

acid rain still serve its niche, it is not exactly perfect but many of its loots are very viable

[tardy smelt]

other than that loot and some cool worldgen, there isn't much to do down there

[small timber]

^

[drowsy plank]

ive literally never needed to go in the water for acid rain lmao

[tardy smelt]

landmarks are a staple of exploration-focused games

metroidvanias use it a lot to lure players to backtracking to areas of interest

[fossil finch]

Yes but if we go by the metric that underwatering sea being hardly accesible early is the reason exploration there doesn't work I'm still making a point lgl

Anyways this also has to do again with how players play in general
Remember the first assumption you made of players not exploring sideways but under? I usually do both and reach both beaches preboss

and i did my first pt

Pointbeing uhhh cool loot for sea yeah

[tardy smelt]

fair enough.... its generally hard to predict what a player will do

the thing is overall, going down gives, alright loot. Going sideways does that too, but leads into more challenging biomes. Dying gets you back to spawn either way

[drowsy plank]

i still think it's funny that the vanilla water exploration items in rusty chests are worth more than the actual weapons and items in there minus effigy

[tardy smelt]

the Crimson/Corruption, Jungle and to a lesser extent the Desert and Snow are somewhat likely to "gatekeep" the far sides of the world

in a soft fashion

[drowsy plank]

and even then effigy is just useful for getting more items from the chests effigy would be in

[tardy smelt]

not to mention that the crimson and corruption chasms are among the very points of interests that xpcqe was talking about

luring the player into them

[tardy smelt]

yeah

you generally don't need one to explore the abyss

even when just entering it

[drowsy plank]

it just an "oh cool i guess i dont need to worry about that mildly annoying debuff when going to the abyss. anyway..."

[tardy smelt]

at the point at which you enter the abyss, the debuff isn't nearly as threatening anymore

[small timber]

there are people who never explore sky or never reach ocean (or never find a draedon lab), but I dont think it really invalidate the need of landmark

even if it is hard to access as long as there is an incentive people will actually try, otherwise they will simply never

[tardy smelt]

there are people who will never actually progress the game past pre-hardmode

chads

[tardy smelt]

yeah

[drowsy plank]

is an entire ocean not a landmark enough
regardless i think the idea of a decaying lab is more than enough to a solution to this but it still doesnt solve the problem of the items sucking wind

[tardy smelt]

biomes can be explored in multiple chunks

like sure, the sulphurous sea being different will make players curious, even if they'll get bodied by it early on

the abyss works in a similar way

but going off the beaten path, e.g. the surface and the way to the abyss, is something that few ever have an incentive to do

[drowsy plank]

tbqh i feel like we're all basically saying the same thing in slightly different ways so uh

how do we actually fix it

[small timber]

ya the current sulphur (under sea) is a bit barren

[tardy smelt]

its not like they can't, but there isn't much to check out there that you don't already have by the time you have the gear to do so

yep

its sad, because their world gen is actually quite nifty

[tardy smelt]

its kind of simple

[small timber]

actually, if even something like this get pass I think there is no problem in suggesting to add more to sulphur sea

[tardy smelt]

truetrue

just describe the problem, give arguments as for why it needs fixing, and as a bonus toss in some ideas

the last thing is not recommended, specific suggestions are dangerous territory

[small timber]

ye, just referring to the fact that I do get passed into voting

[drowsy plank]

well unless someone else wants to type it up i still got a suggestion slot left for this week

[small timber]

I think just type it, I am not good at explaining thematic stuff like these

you seems way better at english than me seeing from the suggestions you made

[drowsy plank]

aight

[tardy smelt]

Can i do it @drowsy plank 🥺

[drowsy plank]

oh sure lmao

gl

[tardy smelt]

thanks

i'll post a draft here first

Make the lower Sulphurous Sea more worthwhile to check out

Below the Sulphurous Sea lies a complex network of caves, containing Rusty Chests with their respective loot and small structures remniscent of the Arsenal Labs. While they're interesting to explore and contain decent gear, said gear can already be crafted after defeating the Eye of Chtulhu. The chances of any player reaching and fully exploring the Sulphurous Sea are quite small, due to how dangerous and intimidating the biome can be early on.

Thus, there's little reason for most to check out these caves, which make up the bulk of the Sulphurous Sea's explorable space. Even when the player dives into the abyss, the dangerous debuff will likely drive any players to pass the Sulphurous Sea as quickly as possible rather than to take the time to explore it. In fact, most of the Sulphurous Sea often remains unexplored because of this and the obsoleted gear issue, which is quite unfortunate.

Adding any landmark that is somewhat visible and worth checking out, be it more chests containing better/more lasting gear that is not available during Acid Rain, a unique worldgen structure (such as a run-down arsenal lab for example), or anything else that works better could contribute a lot to making the Sulphurous Sea more interesting and attractive to explore overall.

...thoughts?

[warped tide]

Eyyy there could be some upper abyss themed items there like

uh

Abyssal Amulet which is abyss fishing exclusive

[drowsy plank]

eye of cthulhu, not chtulu
this looks pretty good but id mention how sulphskin potions are post-Acid Rain, and how there are only 2 items in the sulph chests that aren't directly related to sulph sea exploration (like how the rusty water filter is there despite the fact the chests are pre-Boss so you literally couldnt even get Acid Rain to spawn anyway like what???)

[warped tide]

Most acid rain enemies are

absurdly tanky

for some reason

for Post EoC/Pre Boss

[tardy smelt]

eye of cthulhu, not chtulu
dammit

[drowsy plank]

dw i forgot the second "h" in cthulhu for a while too

so it's just a hard name to remember lmao

[warped tide]

cthuhluhluhlhulvhyuhlvuh

[drowsy plank]

true!

[warped tide]

(eye)

[fossil finch]

Ar enemies being tanky is fine

They don't spawn in absurd amounts

[tardy smelt]

its not too big, its too empty

[fossil finch]

Ar does an excellent job at being an engaging event

[warped tide]

you know

[fossil finch]

Enemies being somewhat tanky helps

[tardy smelt]

yeah, Acid Rain is actually really cool

[warped tide]

there could be a generator structure or something

or a broken vile

[tardy smelt]

dunno

[warped tide]

to like help explain more why the fucking

sea is acidic

[tardy smelt]

its actually corpses

[drowsy plank]

i mean there are already remnants of a decayed draedon lab so just taking the next step and making an actual structure would be fine

[tardy smelt]

unless that lore got changed

[drowsy plank]

dont think it's been touched yet

[tardy smelt]

what that would be would be up to the devs, if it actually passes

byeah uh

[drowsy plank]

fair enough

[fossil finch]

It's not corpses lol

It's dreadon

Or, was

Corpses did not much

[warped tide]

…

[tardy smelt]

this okay?

[fossil finch]

(Corpses do not make seas acidic like that

They're also not radioactive

[warped tide]

Yeah that

place is a fucking wasteland

[fossil finch]

There probably was never a construction there though

It's just waste

[warped tide]

dragon corpse would be a fun idea

[fossil finch]

Dumpsters don't exactly have generators of trash on them

[warped tide]

hmm

[fossil finch]

Yes

[warped tide]

Maybe like actual

trash piles

[tardy smelt]

cough i'll go ahead and tentatively post

[fossil finch]

I don't know if there's any other place for dragon lore than the aerie

That's very far away though

[warped tide]

the Aerie is going to be fun

[drowsy plank]

@tardy smelt not to nitpick again but it c-t-h-ulhu not c-h-t-ulhu

[tardy smelt]

damn

bloody impossible to spell

[drowsy plank]

yeah

think that was kinda the point

it's the sky biome

that's all i know about it

[tardy smelt]

yuppers

[fossil finch]

Possible

[tardy smelt]

sky biome?

[fossil finch]

Dragon Aerie specifically

[drowsy plank]

if you search aerie people were mentioning that there was one sky biome and all the other new biomes were confirmed not to be sky related so

¯_(ツ)_/¯

it was very vague

[fossil finch]

Long ago in this very channel someone sugged for a sky biome to be added relating maybe to that sky temple idea
Rover said that there is a sky biome planned and that it wasn't related to that

Dist is confirmed to not be sky biome and profaned is probably going to be some cave biome or something
So it is most sensical aerie is the biome rover was referring to

[tardy smelt]

i see i see

[fossil finch]

Fab also mentioned that there would be 3 post ml biomes so i don't think it's an unrevealed one

[tardy smelt]

yeah

a good bit, that

[warped tide]

look

game theory time

[fossil finch]

Also i say long ago but it was 2020

[warped tide]

I have a feeling the Aerie is going to be more of a dragon graveyard in the shadow of the sun or something

pulling back to Yharon’s Dark Sun connection

[tardy smelt]

i feel like it'll be a subworld

Brimcrags are already in hell

there's the Arsenal Lab

[fossil finch]

Yharon's dark sun connection is probably getting axed

[tardy smelt]

hell's gonna be getting crowded

[tardy smelt]

its getting subbed by provi

[warped tide]

Hell is getting a fucking rework

its turning half Crag

[tardy smelt]

i know

[warped tide]

bbut

background planet over sun

😳

[tardy smelt]

Darksun will be related to provi, and will have a bunch of minibosses in it

it might be becoming a standalone event

[warped tide]

oooohhhhhh

[tardy smelt]

when it'll be, hell if i knew

[fossil finch]

Darksun will be tied to an event with minibosses apparently

At least ozz said so

If it wasn't ozz it was a dev

[tardy smelt]

thats what i said

it was ozz yeah

[warped tide]

hm

[tardy smelt]

its all ozz

[fossil finch]

Ozz is most probable because ozz is the one who wants to make darksun provi related

[sand ermine]

@kindred canyon isn't that something you're supposed to suggest in #wiki-discussion? or

[warped tide]

Then whats happening to Nightmare Fuel and the frost moon Equivalent

[tardy smelt]

moved to the Distortion in some way or another, methinks

[drowsy plank]

why not look at #wiki-discussion first lmao

[warped tide]

maybe its a Distortion sub-biome?

like a wastes area?

[sand ermine]

i dont even check that anymore since its not anything im interested in
also dont reply ping me

[night jolt]

There is actually a very significant thing in the Lower Sulph Sea

Bloodworms

[drowsy plank]

that's like post moonlord tier stuff

which only makes the sulph sea chests even more trash

[fossil finch]

Oh my fucking god please do not

[small timber]

@kindred creek cannot suggest things for 1.4 port (since it havent come out), wait for the port to fully come out first

[fossil finch]

Specially the latter we don't need another post ml statboost that's pointless

[kindred creek]

Got it. Removed the suggestion.

[kindred canyon]

I did but wiki adminiatrador said I should post it in suggestions

[sand ermine]

alr

[drowsy plank]

was about to ask about what the attack was but ayo someone finally added vanilla bosses to the calamity wiki

took long enough

ok so according to the wiki the released spores while moving (NOT spore clouds) are malice exclusive and like

i went and watched like 5 malice runs of plantera and i literally didnt even see them

i think on one i could hear the spores insta-dying cause you'd heard random death sounds during the fight but this is such a nothing attack lmao

[fossil finch]

They're an expert attack

At least originally

[dim osprey]

Looks like 2 suggestions got accepted

And then implemented in the change logs

[night jolt]

@cobalt heath No suggestions that are purely references

[cobalt heath]

oh

[drowsy plank]

dont we already have unique death messages?

i know having bosschecklist installed adds unique despawn messages

[sand ermine]

@serene field boss checklist

[serene field]

how do i see that?

[sand ermine]

its a setting iirc

in its mod config

[serene field]

1 of 2

1- i don't find it

2- i'm stupid

oh

i didn't installed that mod

[grim tusk]

@serene field could be a decent idea but no joke comments

No “skill issue” nor “player sucks”

[serene field]

but it wasn't a joke tho

anyway

[grim tusk]

Make your sugg more serious

[serene field]

aight

[gray nebula]

separate mod

it'd work nicely as a funny separate mod

[grim tusk]

Something like: “in a close battle the guardian commander managed to defeat [player]” would be something more serious

But if you want stuff to say “Skill issue” get other mods

[fossil finch]

Also shittalking the player is not exactly humor

[acoustic mortar]

Maybe it could be a special dialogue message for different bosses

[hollow shell]

@kindred canyon I think you misunderstood Temp here

Boss order is not defined by the wiki

It is defined in the mod
In particular, it's defined by our Boss Checklist compatibility

The #suggestions-posting channel is only used to ask for changes to the mod and not to the wiki

Also you really should have fought Hive Mind before you made the suggestion

[fossil finch]

No

[gray nebula]

oh my godddd I'm moisturisinggggg

it'd be funny tho

if it did like a happy roar

[fossil finch]

Do those exist

[gray nebula]

custom sounds exist.. lol

[fossil finch]

Can you record happydsroar.ogg

[hollow shell]

rawr XD

[fossil finch]

Oh my god

Would the player know it's a happy roar

[night jolt]

A bit of a problem

[fossil finch]

Legitimate questions with the implementation

[gray nebula]

I mean just by the tone I think ppl could infer

like if the pitch rises

[winged fiber]

I want you to know that I am completely serious about this suggestion despite it sounding extremely stupid

[night jolt]

If you moisten the Desert Scourge, its just gonna dry up again cause its in the desert

[winged fiber]

You have to moisten it enough

Or take it down to the sunken sea I guess

[fossil finch]

Anywya calamity devs hate fun or something

(You have to reqson your suggestion

[raven turret]

hey guys my tmod crashes every time i beat WoF and my world doesnt set to hardmode any1 got suggestions

[rapid pendant]

how do i do the bold in the suggestion posting

[hollow shell]

#bugs-read-pins or #help-advice-read-pins

[hollow shell]

You put two asterisks on either side of the portion of text you wanna bold

**like this**
like this

[rapid pendant]

like this

k

[hollow shell]

[rapid pendant]

ok now how do enter down you know

[hollow shell]

Hold Shift

While pressing Enter

To do this

[rapid pendant]

k

[hollow shell]

Wow nice, you included killtimes without needing to be asked

Nice

[rapid pendant]

thanks we tested it early in here if you want to see exact statistics

[warped tide]

i am 100% on board with giving ds some water :)

he just needed some lotion

[rapid pendant]

gulper eels in real life are so tiny

[warped tide]

what if i

gulp the eel

[rapid pendant]

i think a frilled shark would be more fitting as its an eel like deep sea shark

[warped tide]

oop

[rapid pendant]

what do you guys think of the scal npc showing up to your town disguised to scout you out once after you kill the dopleganger calamities like a traveling merchant. this more importantly gives you a chance to get scal enchantments on your weapons so you can actually use them like more then just the last 5 % of the game

[warped tide]

hmmm

sounds janky but

would honestly be pretty fun

[hollow shell]

Two slight problems

• Enchantments are all currently balanced around endgame and would need some significant code n stat changes to work throughout the game
• Why would she offer you enchantments if she's supposed to be spying on you

[warped tide]

idk to blend in

[rapid pendant]

well you wouldnt know its a evil witch would you

[warped tide]

the fucking drunk lady sells her wine

[warped tide]

hey

hey idea

[rapid pendant]

you just killed calamities in your characters mind

[warped tide]

Old Calamatis costume!

With the Fedora!

[rapid pendant]

would an enchantment on a like plantra tier weopon make it that broken?

[warped tide]

https://youtu.be/MT6HTpY_OyE

this look

[rapid pendant]

i dont really get to use enchantments because the game is already done by the time i get to them

[warped tide]

😳

Maybe she can say some stuff if you talk to her but

enchantment is not something i think she would do

[night jolt]

If you wanna use enchantments

Play Fargo's lol

[warped tide]

though her Selling ashes of calamity to save from farming her clone could be an idea

[hollow shell]

No I mean
A lot of the numerical stats are balanced around endgame, the things that aren't just percentages
Like the HP of entities like the demon portals and the lecherous orb, and the damage some of the projectiles deal

And there isn't really an elegant way to make them scale throughout the game and be balanced without manually setting a lot more values

[night jolt]

Also, Enchantment pre Moon Lord means Shattered Community pre Moon Lord

[rapid pendant]

that just wouldnt be enchantable

just the base enchantment and only 1 weopon

[warped tide]

thats Exhulmed

[rapid pendant]

maybe if you do the upgraded scal after its buffed

[warped tide]

not Enchanted

[rapid pendant]

and she comes

which would make more sense as you just killed a GOD! so a really powerful scout would be something logical to do by the tyrant also you get to use the new mechanic more

[night jolt]

Kinda weird that the Archmage doesn't know how to enchant things tbh

[rapid pendant]

maybe she would only enchant specific weapons

[warped tide]

Maybe she can only give Enflame???

like specifically Enflame

[drowsy plank]

bringing up the archmage thing actually, if you wanted to introduce earlier enchants (ones specifically balanced to an earlier point in the game) why not just use him lmao

[rapid pendant]

i guess

yah that would work

he could have his own exumed stuff too

[night jolt]

Like, just keep the crazy shit locked until Endgame, and let us actually use this mechanic instead of probably never letting it be used

Wizard exhumes when?

[warped tide]

tha

that makes way more sense

yeah give Permafrost the Enchant Mechanic with ice themed ones instead of like

BLOOD and DEATH

so no upgrading too

[night jolt]

So like, make weaker versions of the enchants for Permafrost/Wizard, keep Exhumes to SCal, and I think that'd work

[rapid pendant]

@hollow shell what do you think about permafrost having the enchantment mechanic so you can more easily scale it down?

[night jolt]

Calamitas spy idea is kinda dumb, this makes way more sense imo

[rapid pendant]

it gives more scal lore and actually makes them fell like a part of a bigger story

[night jolt]

Except you learn the instant that you kill it that its just a clone

Pretty weird that the Clone of Calamitas is a fucking big ass eyeball

[rapid pendant]

i always thought of it as like a flying mech

like a tie fighter without wings

[night jolt]

Also, I can't believe I didn't notice this before, but I can't unsee it now

This mod is named after a boss that has the same name

as this guy

[crude geode]

@hollow shell shitpost

[hollow shell]

Don't know if shitpost but it could very well be one

[rocky ferry]

wats a shitpost

board game would be very beneficial to calamity

[rapid pendant]

i do not even think its programable

[steady delta]

i think he means like one of those collectors addition

[rocky ferry]

shut up ethan

[steady delta]

kinda like this?

[rocky ferry]

exactly like that

[steady delta]

but with calamity characters

[rapid pendant]

if you fund it they will probably accept it

[rocky ferry]

gotchu 👍

[steady delta]

gotchu 👍

[rapid pendant]

just pay for the pations the licensing fee pick the manufacturing do distribution

[rocky ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/real-estate-impatient-gif-20983622

[steady delta]

what are pations

[hollow shell]

Can you both stop

[steady delta]

https://tenor.com/view/crying-emoji-dies-gif-21956120

[rocky ferry]

dey should make a biome

in da sky

[fossil finch]

Legit questions:
How does this give any scal lore
Enchantments are by nature hurtful and dark-toned which is very much literally the contrary permafrost seems to like in terms of magic
How would this work when it comes to scal npc's usefulness, are this enchantments different? Worse stat wise?

[rapid pendant]

scals encantments are more powerful and harm ful

the permafrosts enchantments would be less powerful and less damaging to you

and they would be scaled for hardmode note post moonlord

[fossil finch]

I'm not sure this would fix any of the problems enchantments have when it comes to being too late in the game

It's just enchantments 2: earlier because yes

It's not like enchantments are a mechanic that requires introduction earlier on

U don't need to know any bases to use them

[rapid pendant]

yes but the problem is you never really get to use the mechanic in the game as it is

[fossil finch]

Yeah but this doesn't fix that

[rapid pendant]

it does

[fossil finch]

It just adds new enchantments you can use while you still won't use scal's

[rapid pendant]

because you get to use the mechanic eariler

[fossil finch]

You don't

[rapid pendant]

how?

you figure

[fossil finch]

if it's different enchantments or toned down one you're not really making scal's enchantments available earlier

Ur just making new ones that are available earlier

[rapid pendant]

you cant make scal encantments earlier

[fossil finch]

Yes it makes thematic sense and i definitely support the idea in that sense but scal's enchantments would still remain unused

The fix to the problem is just adding post scal content, which is already happening eventually

Earlier enchantments doesn't fix anything really and just adds more bloat to the testing process

[rapid pendant]

even with the post scal content its 1 boss

yharium

then just the super boss throw ins

[fossil finch]

You choose to neglect that it won't be just yharim

There's gonna be content between MagiTech duo and him

How much i can't say but at least yharmy is assured

[rapid pendant]

from what i understand yharium is directly after scal

[fossil finch]

Even then considering how hard enchantments are to balance while keeping interesting it's not a bad thing they don't get use for a ton of content

[hollow shell]

There will indeed be an invasion event between SCal & Draedon
and Yharim

[rapid pendant]

oowh

HOT LEAK HOT LEAK

[rocky ferry]

how do u know rover

fake news

[fossil finch]

Do you think anything else could be between them or between yharim and superbosses

[rocky ferry]

🤦‍♂️

[hollow shell]

(this has been in the plans for several years)

[fossil finch]

Also it's not a hotleak

We've known since 2018

[rapid pendant]

its a leak for me

[fossil finch]

(2017*

[hollow shell]

It is possible that there will be a bit more pre-Yharim content, but the plans are not set in stone

[fossil finch]

That's fair yeah

[hollow shell]

Post-Yharim, beyond BR and the two cosmic bosses, is too far off to say

[rapid pendant]

elder elidon wyrm

[fossil finch]

Esp because it's a very long time away yes

[rapid pendant]

as for enchantments as of now

they really dont serve a purpuse? you know

its just the mechanic is introduce so late

[fossil finch]

They do they're amazing at boosting your dps against exos and help with br 👍

Anyways as i said already adding new hot flaming ones earlier doesn't really help the issue

because it's not like they're a whole mechanic

[rapid pendant]

and giving dps up for bosses like brimestone elemental and esspesially destroyer

[fossil finch]

They're reforges that make your weapon do something extra

[night jolt]

Dude, the point is that Enchantment in general should be accessible before the literal postgame, it doesn't really matter if it's SCal's enchants specifically

[fossil finch]

Then what's the point?
Enchantments are just applying fancy functions to your weapon
They are not exactly a deep mechanic
You can add more for the sake of having more of the same thing earlier yes but if the point is fixing Enchantments not being used then it accomplishes not that goal

If that is not the goal then go off

I'm also against the idea in general being repeated anywhere because it downplays the uniqueness of scal's npc a lot

[night jolt]

You're acting like Permafrost enchants would not be enchants at all

[fossil finch]

No I'm acting like enchanting is clicking a button to add a fancy function to your weapon

[night jolt]

The reason Enchants aren't used is because of how they are completely inaccessible in a standard playthrough

[fossil finch]

They aren't?
They're just at the (current) end of it

[night jolt]

Standard playthrough doesn't include AEW or Boss Rush

At most, Enchantment is available for one boss (2 once Yharim comes) in your entire playthrough

[fossil finch]

By what metric exactly?

[rocky ferry]

my metric

[hollow shell]

I mean

[fossil finch]

And as said again there's still gonna be content between scal and yharim

[hollow shell]

I can see why it feels like a missed opportunity to have Enchantments available so late

but also

Just because something is at the end of a playthrough doesn't mean it needs to be available earlier, in and of itself

There are plenty of endgame weapons and equipment that serve the purpose of existing in endgame

[rapid pendant]

i mean but enchantments are differnt then things like weapons

they are key gameplay features

[fossil finch]

i know the point of wanting them earlier but like:
Downplaying scal's uniqueness
Balancing problems
These are 2 considerable big points to think about when suggesting this

[night jolt]

The problem is that Enchantment is used exclusively for those endgame weapons

[rapid pendant]

just like crafting moving attacking

[fossil finch]

No?

[ruby plover]

They are no where near as fundamental as those ones you mentioned

[night jolt]

Enchant is definitely not on the level of those 3

[rocky ferry]

should make a weapon that does more damage the more you kill with it

[fossil finch]

Yeah exactly

Enchantments are not at the level of like
The game being playable type of mechanics

[rapid pendant]

they are a gameplay mechanic

[fossil finch]

That doesn't mean they're at that level

[night jolt]

A gameplay mechanic that is anything but essential to actually playing the game

[hollow shell]

You can compare them to reforges and you can compare them to weapons

I don't think it's fair to compare them to movement and crafting

[night jolt]

You can't compare enchantment to attacking

[rapid pendant]

they are above weopons and acsessorys

[night jolt]

Attacking is objectively required to finish the game

[night jolt]

No

How can something that gets applied to weapons and accesories be above them?

[fossil finch]

Technically dh's rework of adrenaline is also a new gameplay mechanic so like,
Same with shat community's changes to rage
(Draedon's Heart will be reworked to make adren free healing bar

[rapid pendant]

its like on buffs tier

right?

[night jolt]

I guess? Why not compare them to reforging?

[fossil finch]

A thing with reforges is that uh

[night jolt]

And even then

[fossil finch]

They're kinda weird from all sides

They're just statboosts that lock you out of 30% of your dps arbitrarily

[night jolt]

The only buffs you can really compare enchantment to are the vodkas cause they aren't a strict buff

[rapid pendant]

man i and alot of the community just want to use this new feature

[fossil finch]

Enchantments were designed to not be exactly this

[hollow shell]

And you can

[night jolt]

I agree, but thats not a point

[fossil finch]

You can!
Pop out some cheats and kill scal and just use them while doing bossrush

[night jolt]

There will be content after SCal, so at bare minimum we'll be able to use it for 3 unique bosses by the end

[hollow shell]

(you don't even need to bust out cheats if you wanna use them during BR, that's just natural progression)

[night jolt]

smh just do Boss Rush in PHM, you can get the Terminus by stacking enough breathing buffs

[fossil finch]

Yeah I'm just saying to skip the pt if desired

[rapid pendant]

is it possable to have exumed to be scal npcs feature not enchantments?

[night jolt]

Dude, you haven't given a reason yet why Enchantment HAS to be available earlier

[fossil finch]

Please consider balancing exists too

(You have to rebalance everything after enchantments existing

Though ig that's workload and not a point if just going by design

[dull pewter]

Hm

What about new whips?

[night jolt]

Future content

[rapid pendant]

y are people so obsessed with whips

[calm steppe]

Whoever created Profaned Guardians buff needs death sentence.

Lmao

[night jolt]

And they're obviously gonna make new whips, come on

[ruby plover]

they are getting nerfed

[rocky ferry]

whips should just add debuffs

[ruby plover]

wait until you see their nerfed state before making a sugg about it

[night jolt]

They were piss easy pre buff

[rocky ferry]

so peple aint mad bout melee doing summoner damage

[fossil finch]

Guardians are still piss easy they're just enjoyable now

[dull pewter]

Well, somebody needs to say it. Because the current state of whips is trash honestly, makes you get into melee range just to have you one shotted because of low armor

[fossil finch]

You circle them now and do wacky horizontals sometines when the third one is alone

[rapid pendant]

i mean im not made at magic doing melee

in litterally all the ranged projectile swords

[night jolt]

Summoner was overtuned way too much in 1.4

[hollow shell]

See the document pinned in #calamity-update-talk

[night jolt]

They made a set thats PHM viable against Moon Lord

[small timber]

Since you are here I will not ping you

Ideally for your suggestion attached the tested stats in a txt file, because the gear used and average dps/max dps is equally as relevant as kill time

[dull pewter]

Nice, thank youu

[small timber]

(that is why all test have all of the mentioned shown), and ya I will be honest, if a beta tester already say they are gonna look into it chances are that will be much faster than through suggestion

[hollow shell]

Did a tester say they will look into it

[small timber]

Ya, I will see if I can find the message

^

2 actually since Blast was also there

[hollow shell]

I see I see

[fossil basin]

That’s the whole point, if you want to do extra damage with your whip you have to take a risk

[small timber]

I feel it is more with the problem of summoner having low armor for no reason, but whips is actually relatively long range since early HM summons cant really hit out of screen anyway (and later whips are longer)

[fossil basin]

If summoner had high defence they would just replace melee at their most effective range

[small timber]

The current state of class range (except ark line since it is new) is that summoner have shorter range than melee, even without whips, so that already happen

Because turns out 90% of melee weapon already shoot projectile as otherwise it is unviable for bosses, and all the other are true melee weapon that need to deal 5x dps of other on tier weapon to be viable

[fossil finch]

Yharon can't speak

Xd

Aside that i think you dying about 3 seconds after going out sets the mood properly

Don't really think the reasoning holds up

[small timber]

scal maybe (since her enrage is unironically super weak, because you invalidate all her attack if you dont have arena), but yharon's out of bound requirement is so unreasonable that you have to deliberately do it to come close

the height enrage have higher range than the distance from surface to space level, even if you dig into underground somewhat you still need to dig super deep to come close
if you mean the other out of bound then there is 2 giant flame pillars so it is obvious enough (and ya yharon just smack you at light speed in that case)

[lyric depot]

It can be something like describing the sudden atmosphere change. It doesn’t have to be him talking

[small timber]

(then ya probably have to be more specific in the suggestion, since the way you worded it is "yharon text in dialogue if you go out of bound")

although I do think for Scal it make complete sense

for yharon I think the only thing is maybe change the shader (to like brighter/closer to sun colour) if you try to go out of bound, indicating yharon is really angry right now, maybe follow with a roar

[sudden knot]

some sort of visual or sound queue to know you f'd up

I think sound would be faster to react to, rather than getting distracted by text

[hollow shell]

Note that you do kinda have to exit those boss arenas intentionally

SCal's borders are solid blocks and Yharon's borders are insta-kill

[sudden knot]

I found myself dying to providence while playing mage a LOT, because I didn't know about the fire

[hollow shell]

That is indeed a complaint we've gotten

[small timber]

I think yharon's border is just heavy burn damage now, but ya the player need to intentionally do it, because those 2 giant flame pillars are super good indicator of arena border

[sudden knot]

yeah, I like yharon a lot

[hollow shell]

A fire visual appears on the player when you get too far from Prov.

In the past, your whole screen would darken as the indication instead. This was obvious, but also had the downside of blinding you and making it very easy to run into projectiles

[small timber]

the one that I think is a bit not obvious is the height enrage (since I think it is actually not dependent on flame pillar height?) as people can start the fight at top and the height enrage will still works downwards

[hollow shell]

I think we have to make the Prov fire visual more intense

[sudden knot]

I'd appreciate it, i'm oblivious as hell

i'm the type of person to not see the fire i'm standing in when i'

*i'm in a raid

[small timber]

ya the fire is abit not obvious, the previous (darken one) was good just it lead to lose more situation (you are already near border, darken makes it harder to see)

[sudden knot]

I get so focused on where the projectiles are that I don't bother looking at my character

[small timber]

though both have the same problem, providence can transition to cocoon very suddenly and the entire screen just blackened (or in the new case, the burn being not obvious enough for player to realise being out of range)

[hollow shell]

We do have a plan on making it so the border is always visible

so you know where your limits are before you run into them

And we have a few ideas on how we wanna execute that

But, not happening quite yet

[sudden knot]

i appreciate you takin' the time to look at these!

[ashen warren]

Ares is the example of a enrage made clear well, it plays a sfx and the boss is visually different if you leave the blender

[echo furnace]

"How foolish. You cannot escape."

[fossil finch]

too generic

[hollow shell]

It's fine

[drowsy plank]

pretty sure it's mostly just there until they actually finish balancing the mode

[small timber]

I can repost my old malice tooltip suggestion if people do want it

[fossil finch]

Remove mali

[hot zephyr]

we have removed a country in west africa

[sand ermine]