it might, but it might not
#suggestions-discussion
dapper coral
dapper coral
i feel like it would
tawny garden
it's actually forbidden
novel belfry
it's honestly more than just nostalgia, it's really just simply the theming of the fight would work with leviathan
also i did check, yes it is forbidden.
hollow shell
I don't think Gama would be too happy to see the Siren name returning
novel belfry
also what was gama's issue that led to siren becoming anahita?
radiant meadow
Dev drama and that it was his creative content pretty much afaik
hollow shell
Gama effectively owns the Siren as a character
and then Gama left the team
novel belfry
ah yes
Dev drama
novel belfry
gotcha
cobalt pewter
Even the lore is Gama's
hollow shell
Which is why it's so weirdly specific and OC-ish
mossy badge
but the siren name in general?
novel belfry
it was really just about the name and not the lore really
Siren made sense in that she served as a bait of sorts so that the Leviathan could find food.
now that I think about it though, since there's no lore for anahita currently, I don't understand why anahita still does the siren thing
limber ocean
she has lore tho
novel belfry
what
hollow shell
Got added to the wiki recently
(which iirc now results in a discrepancy between the wiki and the forum.
We're moving away from the forum.)
novel belfry
ok
the lore is still relevent, that's good to know
Oh no, I am already formulating another name change: Anahita, the Water Elemental Anahita of the Tides
cobalt pewter
Also looking at the summon debuff sugg
Which is cool, but it has the trade off of making summons substantially less useful for players who used them as support when playing other classes.
This is the thing they never want with summons in Calamity
Like
They don't want other classes to abuse summons
novel belfry
There are those classless items
cobalt pewter
Oh no, I am already formulating another name change: Anahita, the Water Elemental
That kinda sugg has been made iirc
gusty scarab
Maybe giving summoners a way to deal direct damage could be a good idea
Since dual class is now completely worthless
cobalt pewter
Borealis Bomber is one
gusty scarab
That’s endgame
dapper coral
definitely not
gusty scarab
Ok, so it’s after Aureus
Still, early game summoner has no method of dealing direct damage
Besides arguably the blossom staffs and the sun spirit staff, but they take up a minion slot
I like the 1.4 whips, but tmodloader 1.4 is coming “””””””””” soon “”””””””””
heady storm
Still, early game summoner has no method of dealing direct damage
Besides arguably the blossom staffs and the sun spirit staff, but they take up a minion slot
Isn't that the point though?
gusty scarab
You have effectively no influence on what your summons do and its kinda annoying
I love summoner but I only ever play it dual class, pure summoner is unbearable for me
And calamity, which introduces so many cool summons, ruins dual class summoner
unreal viper
Le 50% damage penalty go brrr.
gusty scarab
Like I think that’s too much
ashen warren
the penalty is designed to seperate summoner away from other classes, making it more than just support
dapper coral
this sounds overly specific with regards to the actual backgrounds @twilit tendon
better to leave it up to the devs as to what kind of design they wanna go for
but your reasoning at the bottom seems fine
twilit tendon
Yeah it was what I kinda brainstorm on how the actual atmosphere of the boss fights would feel like, but i guess i was a bit too into it
hollow shell
Yeah you should cut down on a lot of that specific stuff @twilit tendon
dapper coral
as in, this stuff can all go
Here are some of my ideas:
- Slime God: the sky become red and purple, alternating between eachother, and slimes start falling from the sky (aesthetically of course). It suggests how all the slimy thing in this world is starting to join the body, and summon the catastrophic gelatine core as it consumes the world in its sludge.
- Ravager: Landscape turn fiery red (a darker one to differentiate from Calamitas) , sky filles with red smoke and lingering embers as a sign of aimless rampage of the catastrophic creation.
- Astrum Bosses: Astral shooting stars and constellation forming on the sky, signaling the descending of the stars.
- Anahita (just anahita): the sea trembles, with clouds starting to form and the air gets foggy, showing the overwhelming dominance of the water elemental.
That's all I have in mind right now.
twilit tendon
awww
hollow shell
Ye, now your suggestion is good
dapper coral
coolio
crude geode
...I never realized true melee was that inferior that a very iconic lore should be changed to make it more accessible.
heady storm
The damage isn't really needed because not only there are a couple accessories already boosting true melee damage
That's one of the main benefits of lore items @cobalt pewter, they don't take acc slots to use, but rather inventory slots.
And also the sugg leans more towards buffing the Lore item instead of changing it.
cobalt pewter
That's one of the main benefits of lore items, they don't take acc slots to use, but rather inventory slots.
I noticed, but I feel like true melee isn't something you'd jump in, deal massive damage in a short notice, then get out. It's more of a constant, close-range barrage of sword slashes.
And I used "accessibility" in the broadest of terms
It could be anything, really
Like what the mod did to scal when holding true melee weapons, or DR, so on and so forth
heady storm
The idea behind true melee is more damage against enemies for risking more damage upon yourself.
What I'm trying to say primarily, is that the acc arguement isn't the most supporting.
cobalt pewter
Hmm
I guess I can omit that and really focus on the "accessibility" part
But I'm eating rn, so gon be a while before I do that
heady storm
Alright then, I'll have to exclaim the sugg until then; however, ping me when you get to it.
heady storm
Aighty, looks fine to me.
cobalt pewter
crude geode
(Every time true melee gets closer and closer to becoming a real class it kind of hurts my soul.)
I don’t see why DoG’s lore needs to be the thing to increase true melee accessibility, especially with DoG being one of the last three bosses in the mod.
You could put it on a pre-hm accessory instead, or anywhere besides post-ml Bc that is so late in the game that people who might have wanted to do true melee likely would have just switched to normal melee.
It’s like increasing sentry accessibility by giving Betsy a drop to help with it. It just doesn’t make sense to put it that late in the game.
(Also I’m pretty sure the whole point of the lore is that you’re more powerful, but reckless, like DoG.)
But maybe I’m just spewing nonsense.
Also @heady storm since my suggestion is like twenty minutes from being deleted, is there anything wrong with it?
heady storm
Rover went over it with you, right?
crude geode
Yeah
heady storm
It's not exclamated, therefore he didn't think anything in particular was bad.
It won't be deleted unless it's exclamated is what I'm trying to say; suggs are auto-approved now.
crude geode
Ahhh gotcha, didn’t realize
Not sure if this has been posted recently/at all
But here we go
heady storm
Fan of this one for sure.
serene fox
agreed
crude geode
I didn’t even mention the boss fight meant to be in the middle of the hype train for moon lord
There’s just...so much there.
cobalt pewter
I'd honestly retier Rav and nerf it to fuck
As for the wall o text above, it actually could still signify the recklessness, since you'd still have increased damage taken, while still encouraging true melee gameplay
serene fox
I don't really see how this can encourage or even improve true melee at that stage of the game
cobalt pewter
Hhh, I guess
serene fox
consider that there is not a single true melee option pre-yharon
and as for murasama
idk how it would work with that
crude geode
(You mentioned the thing I put in parenthesis over the fact that putting something to make a class more accessible in the third to last boss is kinda absurd)
@cobalt pewter Why not encourage true melee gameplay the way you want by adding something early on when the player can still experiment with their class more, instead of changing the third to last boss’ lore to be a accessibility tool?
cobalt pewter
Hmm, that's a fair point, I just feel kinda iffy with dog lore somewhat
Idk will probably make a separate suggestion about it later
serene fox
it does thematically yeah
crude geode
Yeah ^
serene fox
it's just completely worthless because true melee is almost never worth it
serene fox
cobalt pewter
Honestly I'd always push on "Moonwalking"
But it never garnered enough attention to be delivered
This is like, the 2nd time I reposted it? This time only 102 votes so far
#suggestions-voting message
cobalt pewter
The older ones only reached up to 130
And yes, this wasn't the first sugg
The previous 2 were posted at August 22nd and 31st respectively
crude geode
Ok
earnest cape
I'd honestly retier Rav
and nerf it to fuck
Ah yes, thank you fabsol for removing his contact damage except when he's stomping
serene fox
isn't ssv getting overhauled next update?
might want to wait and see
seems like it's going to become a standalone weapon instead of a sentry mage weapon
golden narwhal
Ye (note that iirc it'll still only have 4 vortexes at a time because of its low use time)
ashen warren
two days late but
Make heart crystal and life fruit have lower ore value after beating WoF and Plantera or Moon Lord respectively, or alternatively make (maybe perrenial), scoria, astral, and exodium ore have a higher ore value
why not just make them show separately
golden narwhal
@robust shuttle above stuff (above the quote)
sleek hornet
Btw subsuming vortex is changed on the next update, it will not have any vortex cap anymore
copper turret
Oh god imagine the lag
sleek hornet
I don't think the projectile still the same as current one
But if it does, well prepare for 10 fps party
serene fox
the use time is being tripled so your pc won't explode
frail mantle
yea
cobalt pewter
Before you'd ask, yes, I'm usually too good to not take damage for a whopping 10 seconds of Rover Drive's field
before getting a lot of damage shortly after the field is down
frail mantle
cooldown
tawny garden
Ah
It's too vague imo, people might not understand the abbreviations
I'd not use em in suggs
tawny garden
Aight cool
cobalt pewter
Is it alright to suggest smth based off its sprite?
The Sponge has Rover Drive's shield effect on its sprite, yet not in the item itself
sinful steeple
The shield is coincidental since rover drive was added after the sponge was resprited, but the rover drive is used in the absorber and by extension the sponge so it'd make sense to have the effect anyway
cobalt pewter
Actually Absorber doesn't have Rover Drive's field effect despite using the item for its crafting
sinful steeple
Yeah
cobalt pewter
@scarlet hill already done for next patch
scarlet hill
ok
cobalt pewter
All dashes will be toggled with "Ball and Chain" item instead of visibility
scarlet hill
Cool good to know
cobalt pewter
@crystal iron "basically, as stated before,..." could be omitted
Not only it'd count as chaining suggs, which is a bad practice
crystal iron
Oh
cobalt pewter
But the sugg in question is also separated by a couple more suggs
Make sure your sugg stands on its own
crystal iron
Also would it be hard to make an option to disable melee projectiles so that there are .ore options for true melee
More*
Like a config maybe
sleek hornet
Btw in rev+, immunity frames are capped at 2 sec
crystal iron
I'm pretty sure it's possible to make certain weapons ignore that cap
True melee in this case
tawny garden
That would make true melee a more viable option
you could elaborate
unless True Melee is specifically made to be unviable
dapper coral
@wintry wharf that is incredibly specific
also you don't have any reasoning
honestly the sugg should just be something like "give the TFB staff some unique projectiles," what you've got going right now is much too specific
sand umbra
meanwhile I'm just like "okay but why is TFB exponentially more complicated than either of its predecessors"
dapper coral
that would be fine, yes
going into detail about the nature of the projectiles is the issue, so if you just say that some more unique projectiles would be good/constant attacking is bad and then add your reasoning, that would be fine
craggy stratus
this is a very, specific rework
hollow shell
@wintry wharf Your suggestion still isn't fixed
Too specific and you have no reasoning
You gotta explain why you want these changes, what is your goal? And cut out your specific changes so the devs have more freedom in accomplishing that goal.
dapper coral
now you have to say why you want that
hollow shell
You still have no reason...
You need to say why
okay
Aight well, it exists now
Thank you
dapper coral
I would like to know specifically how constant fire messes things up, but this is better
dapper coral
i still wanna hear it
m
that's not quite the strongest reasoning
for most players
gaunt quest
If you got rid of the plantoids the space lab would go poof lol but I guess plantoids are in the way of something but by the time you get to space battles you literally can speed destroy the plantoids lol
That would make sensr
I wasn't here when it originally was posted lol so I commented late
dapper coral
it's kind of useless to have it fire constantly
why? is the noise annoying? is it a waste of projectiles?
so then add that
radiant meadow
If you're hitting the projectile cap, you have other problems.
dapper coral
cool, that's better
robust shuttle
I feel like Vivid Clarity should be buffed.
Compared to other weapons around it's tier.
sleek hornet
#suggestions-voting message
did he/she mean mana polarizer? and of course eldritch tome can be powerful with mana polarixer because it shoots multiple projectile + can hit 2 or 3 part of WoF at once
sleek hornet
Compared to other weapons around it's tier.
@robust shuttle idk seems fine to me, because its currently used in conjuntion with subsuming vortex, but sure you can run dps test first, compare it with exoblade, celestus, cosm immat, photoviscerator etc
robust shuttle
I always that the damage would be decreased when used with the Subsuming Vortex.
Also
A day ago I ran a DPS test
it's "terrible"
even with multiple targets
In comparison to Hadopelagic Echo.
sleek hornet
i know you can die with mana polarizer, but i think its not that much an issue if youin a combat situation becaus, well it kept spawning healing orb
sturdy geyser
well, it should be compared to darksun tier weapons, not auric tier
sleek hornet
sure make a suggestion then
sleek hornet
well, it should be compared to darksun tier weapons, not auric tier
@sturdy geyser but vivid clarity is a exo tier weps
robust shuttle
that's sad
sleek hornet
robust shuttle
:byeah:
I'll just go make a suggestion
Just to get it off my chest
if you will
sturdy geyser
Oh yeah, I agree vivid clarity is super underwhelming compared to other exo weapons
Honestly, could use a rework imo
robust shuttle
thank you.
robust shuttle
vv?
serene fox
vivid clarity acronym
robust shuttle
oh
sleek hornet
ViVid?
serene fox
eyeah it's super inconsistent and difficult to use
robust shuttle
I'll make a suggestion.
serene fox
I don't think it needs a buff
serene fox
just needs to be made into a more consistent weapon
robust shuttle
Yeah
serene fox
it's just
hollow shell
You talking about current VivClarity?
robust shuttle
yes
serene fox
yes
hollow shell
I wouldn't think of current VC as an inconsistent weapon, with all the direct hitscan beams
but, then again I haven't rigorously tested it
robust shuttle
In comparison to the Hadopelagic Echo.
robust shuttle
But then again.
I don't want to "pressure" the developers by making a suggestion.
robust shuttle
yeah
I know that.
But you guys could be working on something.
So I don't want to give a suggestion while you guys are.
hollow shell
👍
unreal viper
I don;t see why core of the blood god needs a buff. It's good for both phases of yharon, it's only not helpful in scal.
hearty yew
idk who made the ssv suggestion but we already reworked ssv to be a direct use weapon
It does not fire multiple things at once but it's viable alone and isn't a support item
craggy stratus
astral snow looks fine for me
exotic stag
For me its just the same texture as snow
It should have some astral looks instead of just. chunkier snow.
cobalt pewter
I'm pretty sure there's no evil snow, only ice
cobalt pewter
But ig a bit of a purple shade on astral snow is ight
exotic stag
yeah
hollow shell
For comparison, by the way:
exotic stag
Its kinda hard to tell the difference
hollow shell
exotic stag
For me i can barely tell the difference
cobalt pewter
Maybe just make the purple a bit darker
exotic stag
Not like astral monolith dark but atleast a deeper purple
hollow shell
Also you say to resprite Astral Ice in your suggestion but only at the end of your reason
Do you want Astral Ice resprited or no
exotic stag
Ice can maybe get the snow texture
hollow shell
Why
exotic stag
I feel like the snow texture fits the ice more
exotic stag
hold up am i just blind or stupid...
Because i swear the ice doesnt look like that...
hollow shell
It definitely does
exotic stag
then im stupid..
hollow shell
If you're unsure, maybe screenshot in-game?
exotic stag
But yeah the snow could use a resprite to look more purple
violet dagger
It has to be narrowed down to make crystyl break walls
Since post scal things are a no
ashen warren
we kind of need a crystyl crusher kind of tools for walls ngl
even in endgame im still using The Axe
craggy stratus
isnt grax, the best hammer
ashen warren
huh never heard
fringe cloak
Yeah its the best Hammer/axe
You need uelibloom for it
and some other previous axes
tawny garden
[[Grax]]
red stormBOT
craggy stratus
i dont think, you can add change to dev weapon
tawny garden
you can, if that dev agrees
ashen warren
whats the point of this
craggy stratus
true melee
hollow shell
Combat tool yeah
tawny garden
using a mining tool for combat 
radiant meadow
You should be able to plant acorns in astral snow, no?
and then the trees drop astral monoliths when chopped down
hollow shell
@exotic stag
radiant meadow
Are you sure it's astral snow? Sounds more like a bug
exotic stag
Yeah. i made sure to spread astral solution all over my snow biome
radiant meadow
Astral Monolith trees should drop Astral Monolith.
exotic stag
and zero astral monolith trees
hollow shell
(You do indeed have trouble differentiating Astral Snow from regular Snow so it's possible) :P
radiant meadow
Is it multiplayer?
radiant meadow
but it works with normal trees?
exotic stag
Yeah all i have to do to get astral monoliths are spray my trees
anything else planted becomes boreal trees.
frail mantle
needs a reason
dapper coral
also the title doesn't really say what the sugg is about @robust shuttle
robust shuttle
🙂
robust shuttle
not yet
cobalt pewter
As much as I'd like the clump to be toggled on visibility
The clump is what makes Amalgam semi usable in general now
robust shuttle
ah
hollow shell
Do you have any more reasoning besides a self-imposed challenge?
cobalt pewter
And standing in the clump's seawater allows for the water boosts
robust shuttle
sorry!
cobalt pewter
Make sure things you're suggesting changes for are updated to the most recent patches
robust shuttle
oh okay
cobalt pewter
Don't base it off solely from memory
cobalt pewter
No worries
hollow shell
(tbf his suggestion didn't say that it was cuz Clump was useless)
frail mantle
This is especially useful when doing a strict playthrough such as Ranger, Warrior, Mage, and etc.
isn't this kinda iffy in the same way suggs aimed strictly at pleasing subclass runs is
in that they're self-imposed challenges
frail mantle
o right i'm blind
hollow shell
I guess he's given up on it?
dapper coral
i think so
i'm just gonna get rid of it and if they want it back they can ping me ig
cobalt pewter
God honestly idk what to do to Amalgam's Clump tbh
Kinda wanted to suggest smth to make the seawater a bit easier to follow on, but now I'm not so sure
hollow shell
I mean, I could come up with a reason for it
like, that it could be distracting, especially if you randomly receive buffs from seawater you didn't see, could throw you off slightly a lot, due to the significant movement speed boost
and/or that the clump could attack enemies you didn't want attacked or maybe eviscerate some critter by grazing over it
and/or for consistency with Heart of the Elements
dapper coral
perhaps? but with the critter thing doesn't the clump hang around the player's head anyways
cobalt pewter
But the suggestion can have one of the reasons rover mentioned yes
dapper coral
so it's unlikely to yeet any critters unless they're at head level
hollow shell
Yeah but if like a Blue Slime wanders in and the Clump does a death-sweep across the yard
dapper coral
oh, perhaps
like, that it could be distracting, especially if you randomly receive buffs from seawater you didn't see, could throw you off slightly
do you get a buff icon for this? or a visual effect or anything?
hollow shell
No
But, that's only a notable argument if the water buffs affect speed
which I will now check
cobalt pewter
+75% movespeed
hollow shell
YEP
cobalt pewter
Off the top of my head
hollow shell
Very very significant movement speed boost
dapper coral
oh lord
cobalt pewter
hollow shell
that can definitely throw you off if you don't expect
dapper coral
fair enough then
hollow shell
So yeah I think the sugg can work if the reasoning is changed
dapper coral
@robust shuttle do any of these reasons appeal to you? they would be quite a bit stronger than the class thing https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/465195069406707722/761275425867431998
robust shuttle
it's whatever, tbh.
cobalt pewter
that can definitely throw you off if you don't expect
I'd partially blame the player for not reading the tooltips throughout, but
robust shuttle
I don't really have a valid reason.
cobalt pewter
Rover mentioned some good ones
robust shuttle
but it's cool.
dapper coral
those would be your reasons
hollow shell
Well I mean, I gave you some reasons that you could edit in
robust shuttle
thanks!
dapper coral
and those would be perfectly valid
robust shuttle
But are they "minor".
cobalt pewter
For example, the seawater bonus can distract unaware players with the massive movespeed bonus
dapper coral
perhaps? but it's a minor suggestion after all, so it's fine
robust shuttle
Even though their good.
hollow shell
They're somewhat minor but there are several of them
robust shuttle
yeah
hollow shell
It's just to lay out that the player could use the option of disabling the clump
cobalt pewter
The movespeed bonus and the hote consistency seem like the strongest reasons out of the 3 rover gave
cobalt pewter
Not sure if there are any other minion summoning accs
robust shuttle
There's Godly Soul Artifact.
hollow shell
Cuz I'm thinkin like
Godly Soul Artifact has no visibility toggle cuz that'd ruin the point, the entire accessory is minions
Heart of the Elements does have a visibility toggle because it has numerous non-minion benefits, a whole lotta stats
The Amalgam falls into the HotE's category
robust shuttle
it does seem valid tho.
cobalt pewter
Yeah the waifus and the clump act as bonuses rather than primary focus
robust shuttle
But it's up to you.
hollow shell
Not a bluecheck tho, your sugg failed
craggy stratus
atleast it didnt get deleted like last time, brav shot it down to the ground
man, 85 stars off
craggy stratus
not really deleted by brav
it is about cheat item to manipulate proficiency
well, i guess cheat engine works
hollow shell
I suppose it does but that's quite silly
craggy stratus
i mean, if it get implemented, only a small fraction of community will use it
civic pond
hollow shell
huh
civic pond
its time.
craggy stratus
i dont think, it is sadder than :cri: tho
cobalt pewter
Ah yes
hollow shell
That is quite close to Hage
civic pond
and chungus isn't even in the server
sleek turret
hmm yes, the chungus emote.
gray nebula
as someone that assisted to feelschunguses creation i have the high ground to decide wether or not it is irght to be added her
e
cosmic jungle
sleek turret
No.
craggy stratus
not allowed
cosmic jungle
it's still a good emote and should be here tbh
sleek turret
Read the pins.
dapper coral
@ashen warren that's a don't, it's not allowed to bring back removed content
especially astralgeldon
gray nebula
wouldnt even call feelschungus that good of an emote
sleek turret
plus, abandoned slime staff exists now.
cosmic jungle
it is good tho
cosmic jungle
well, I tried
craggy stratus
still funny edit
cosmic jungle
elder mist
feelsmeow sucks
sleek turret
I have one from TES server called :TESaverNOOO:
gray nebula
meow hate user
sleek turret
yes
cosmic jungle
objectively false
elder mist
🙄
gray nebula
not really based opinion
cosmic jungle
unbased opinion
elder mist
but iban
cosmic jungle
gray nebula
im not someone that would make a feelschungus pat
elder mist
but still
gray nebula
i mean yeah sure but still no im allowed to use the pepe edits because im from the server where they're all being made and in my humble opinion i think im not overusing them everywhere
tldr : argument won
probably shouldnt keep debating smth this dumb 
dapper coral
yes, let's move on pls
dapper coral
it's an emote, as long as it has semi-decent reasoning just star it or don't when it goes to voting
exotic stag
exotic stag
peepo fighter emoji
frail mantle
lemon no
dapper coral
sugg it yourself
exotic stag
wtf is ballfart
subtle oracle
If we get :feelschungus: in this server im loosing it
exotic stag
im boostin it
cosmic jungle
no.
sturdy geyser
sorry
exotic stag
why,,
sturdy geyser
😔
exotic stag
why....
ashen warren
ballfart
plush locust
feels chungus
exotic stag
dapper coral
mmkay we can stop talking about it unless it's an actual suggestion
hollow shell
This is a good point Katherine
exotic stag
flushed ball
dapper coral
wait there's no cooldown? that's peculiar
hollow shell
gotta press it every 10 seconds
cosmic jungle
toggle would be actually pretty nice
brittle nexus
I'm pretty sure it just places the debuff on the enemies every time you press the ability button though. A toggle would have to constantly place the debuff, or change the way the "enrage" works
Though I do like the idea
dapper coral
then maybe it would become an aura instead
and every enemy within the aura gets the debuff
craggy stratus
considering that demonshade is for BR, the aura would be pretty big
hollow shell
@solar kayak Your reason is all about survivability over damage, so why are you also suggesting a damage buff?
dapper coral
In a lot of cases, raw damage isn’t really that important.
solar kayak
Cause I also dislike the idea of nerfing Auric Tesla
So I think that buffing Demonshade in general is less contentious
craggy stratus
demonshade is for BR tho, so scal isnt the only boss here
solar kayak
Ok, but it doesn’t really affect my argument all that much though. I still mention the failings of its use case.
craggy stratus
projectile damage cap, so maybe it is a nerf to auric
violet dagger
Nerfing auric tesla tbh shouldn't be done without compensation
solar kayak
People often swap to Auric Tesla in Tier 4
hollow shell
Well yeah and that's fine
This always gets brought up when there's a Demonshade vs Auric suggestion
craggy stratus
no one banning armor swapping
hollow shell
Auric Tesla is highly defensive and survivable, Demonshade is the glass cannon
craggy stratus
^
solar kayak
Yeah, and that’s the problem. Glass Canon is objectively inferior
craggy stratus
dapper coral
mmmmno?
hollow shell
Except when you're skilled enough to not take many/any hits
solar kayak
Is your intention to make Demonshade a more viable and used wear, or just make it pander to Leviathan?
dapper coral
if you can live, you do crazy damage
if you aren't able to dodge stuff so good, then auric tesla is better
elder mist
leviathan is not the only person who can use demonshade you know
hollow shell
It's not supposed to be as survivable as Auric Tesla, I can tell you that much
robust shuttle
as is evident
elder mist
i thought the entire point of demonshade, from the very start, was to be the glass cannon build
robust shuttle
it is?
solar kayak
I’m just suggesting compensation for a lack of revive
elder mist
pretty sure that's always been the case, even before demonshade enrage
hollow shell
Pretty sure it is, ever since the Enrage mechanic got added
solar kayak
Hence shadow dodge and increase DR
dapper coral
that is exactly the point
elder mist
that goes against the fact it's glass cannon doe
its not meant to be a survivability armor
robust shuttle
damn bruh
elder mist
if you use it, be prepared to die in 1 or 2 hits
robust shuttle
read his/her's suggestion.
solar kayak
I’m saying remove the glass canon mantra entirely, cause it’s not useful in certain, important use cases.
hollow shell
uhhh yeah no that's not going to happen
hollow shell
You have Auric, you can use it if you want more survivability
hollow shell
The people who don't take many hits during fights can use the more DPS-heavy options at the cost of the survivability they don't need
solar kayak
Ok, so you're going to further the Auric Tesla preference in the community?
robust shuttle
me?
hollow shell
No we're gonna keep it the same
robust shuttle
tbh.
solar kayak
So no buffs or nerfs?
terse sundial
auric tesla got a nerf already
robust shuttle
really?
terse sundial
it will be in the .003 patch
robust shuttle
lemme go check the changelogs
solar kayak
😡
hollow shell
Just line 55?
terse sundial
I summarized them into one line for #changelogs
robust shuttle
damn, it's like that.
terse sundial
it's more than that though
robust shuttle
?
hollow shell
(hey Kami you still need to edit your suggestion)
robust shuttle
yeah ik
terse sundial
lemme get out the wiki changelog thing
robust shuttle
🙂
solar kayak
Wait, who here actually makes changes to the game?
violet dagger
why does it have to be like this
robust shuttle
Fabsol?
hollow shell
There are a few programmers
solar kayak
Just put your hand up
hollow shell
Fabsol, Ben/Termi, Dominic, Ozzatron
terse sundial
there are like 8 programmers
robust shuttle
damn
violet dagger
Scal is hard enough pre auric nerfs
hollow shell
Me, technically, but not much
robust shuttle
I can't code for shit.
sleek turret
im confused.
solar kayak
DOOM GUY
robust shuttle
sadly.
sleek turret
which one to discuss first.
robust shuttle
As much as I want to code, I'm not that patient.
solar kayak
I guess Demonshade's gonna remain perpetually shitty. Sigh. 😔
robust shuttle
it's whatever though
ashen warren
demonshade bad
radiant meadow
But it's not shitty
hollow shell
Well, for people who get hit a lot ye
radiant meadow
It's like super strong dps wise.
robust shuttle
I mean
like Rover said
from the start it was intended to be glass cannon.
well not sure if said that
solar kayak
@hollow shell which is like the entire population of Uganda 😂
radiant meadow
....
robust shuttle
damn, it's like that?
terse sundial
*Removed several Auric Tesla armor inherited set bonus amplifications, this includes the following:
**Auric Tesla Hooded Facemask additional 10% fire rate increase for ranged weapons, increased bloodflare soul damage, and increased shrapnel round damage.
**Auric Tesla Wire-Hemmed Visage increased silva explosion damage, increased ghastly bolt damage, and increased god slayer explosion damage.
**Auric Tesla Space Helmet increased bloodflare mine damage.
as well as soft damage caps to a lot of the Bloodflare and God Slayer armor sets that Auric Tesla inherits
sleek turret
Demonshade is supposed to be a glass-cannon armor, since it doesn't has the revives, this is the first point. Second point, demonshade is only good if you are confident about not getting hit a lot of times.
tawny garden
Oh ye
Increase the damage of a glass cannon armor
terse sundial
so a big nerf overall
radiant meadow
We don't need to throw around insensitive jokes around here.
tawny garden
hollow shell
Do a majority of people get hit a lot? Yes
They can all use Auric Tesla
Are there people who are good at not getting hit a lot? Yes
Demonshade exists as a high DPS option for them
solar kayak
We need to make a poll. Remove Glass Cannon Mantra from Demonshade to make it an overall better upgrade, or not?
violet dagger
Does scal really need to be a lot harder because auric nerfs
sleek turret
That was what I said @hollow shell
cosmic jungle
no
violet dagger
:feelsmeow:
radiant meadow
If you know what you're doing, Demonshade literally halves the time it takes to clear boss rush.
hollow shell
This suggestion can act as that poll
cosmic jungle
why would you make demonshade non glasscannon
robust shuttle
like literally
hollow shell
You should reword your suggestion to be more general and acknowledge that Demonshade is an intentional DPS option for skilled players
robust shuttle
the whole point of the Demonshade armor is that it's a glass cannon.
cosmic jungle
haha imagine non linnear armor choice
craggy stratus
like merk said, tanking for scal is a good idea
so the nerf is essentially a buff
sleek turret
So, about the shadow dodge.
hollow shell
Don't give specific ideas like a dodge or higher DR cuz then your sugg becomes more concerned with balancing your exact ideas than the concept you're proposing
tawny garden
If you know what you're doing
Most people don't
And that's really sad
zenith hazel
if you can provide a solid comparison between auric/demonshade proving auric is better than demonshade in terms of offense then maybe
even though that is not true
solar kayak
Well, the concept I’m proposing is to make Demonshade more appealing to the public
hollow shell
Yeah
cosmic jungle
auric is supposed to just be a defensive sidegrade to demonshade yeah
ashen warren
speaking of demonshade, i never really get the enraged set bonus for some reason dog can hit you when that buff is active even though its supposed to be invulnerable after teleporting
robust shuttle
damn bruh
zenith hazel
it is appealing
hollow shell
So, you should just make your suggestion topic be that
robust shuttle
you sound like you're making a speech.
ashen warren
is that an oversight
hollow shell
instead of listing specific ideas
sleek turret
It wouldn't make sense, since the armor is designed to be a glass-cannon armor, meaning that it wouldn't need revives/second chances.
zenith hazel
it's just that people tend to pile on the armor because auric has so many defensive benefits to it
robust shuttle
i agree.
zenith hazel
2 revives are enticing
cosmic jungle
you being good enough to not get hit, get rewarded with fat damage
sleek turret
Yeah
solar kayak
So just flat out increases, with compensations for the lack of revival—were things I integrated into the suggestion. @hollow shell
robust shuttle
p h a t d a m a g e
zenith hazel
so people easily pile on demonshade even though it's far superior in terms of raw damage
sleek turret
Choose between good DPS and Survivality.
hollow shell
wdym?
robust shuttle
Survivability.
craggy stratus
if you spam the set bonus, yeah demonshade is way better than auric in term of damage
robust shuttle
Unless you can no-hit.
robust shuttle
Then by all means go for the Demonshade armor.
solar kayak
In any case, the suggestion above should definitely be considered.
sleek turret
Use Auric if you want to survive.
Use Demonshade if you want to kill fast.
robust shuttle
I need to edit my suggestion.
craggy stratus
yeah, the enrage should be a toggle, agree
robust shuttle
wait.
solar kayak
Change Enrage buff for Demonshade so that it can be toggled on and off, like Elysian Guard
Considering there's no Cooldown, why even bother make the buff temporary? Just give the choice to the player for when they should turn on or off the buff.
hollow shell
I'm saying to make your suggestion topic be "Make Demonshade more survival-focused and reduce the DPS elements" (don't say damage increase, don't say DR increase, don't say add a dodge) with the reason being that a majority of the public isn't skilled enough to utilize the high-DPS option
I'll disagree with it (many people would) but it'll be a valid suggestion
sleek turret
yeah
robust shuttle
solar kayak
I don’t see how that improves my suggestion
sleek turret
like, Iron Bomber from TF2
hollow shell
To quote myself from earlier:
"Don't give specific ideas like a dodge or higher DR cuz then your sugg becomes more concerned with balancing your exact ideas than the concept you're proposing"
robust shuttle
So I don't understand that reference.
cosmic jungle
tf2 is different because everything in that game is supposed to be a sidegrade
hollow shell
Many people will laugh at the fact that you want to add Shadow Dodge
solar kayak
Being more blatant with my demands regarding what can compensate for Demonshade’s lack thereof, is far more important in my eyes
sleek turret
its supposed to be an side-grade but its basically a little bit more powerful.
hollow shell
No, it isn't
zenith hazel
adding those things onto demonshade, what's supposed to be glass cannon set, is basically asking for it to break balancing
hollow shell
It's the reason behind those changes that is more important
robust shuttle
that's true
craggy stratus
a shadow dodge from void sash is enough
robust shuttle
I agree with Brav, he's got a point.
zenith hazel
demands don't always mean they're justified
hollow shell
Your exact methods of changing it are not as important as the reason why you want those changes to occur
sleek turret
@zenith hazel You are right.
solar kayak
Idgaf if people laugh at shadow dodge—it at least makes Demonshade viable in comparison to Auric's revive
solar kayak
It adheres to my point of removing the mantra of glass canon too
hollow shell
But Katherine, people don't need to laugh at it
You can just say to make it more survival-heavy and the devs can balance it themselves
solar kayak
Sure, y’all ultimately make the changes, but I wanted to at least set a baseline
zenith hazel
why would you want to remove the glass cannon mantra?
hollow shell
Because, again
Your suggestion will become more concerned with balancing your changes instead of accomplishing your overall goal
solar kayak
Well, I didn’t know y’all were sensitive over the idea of non-devs doing your jobs for you
craggy stratus
...
hollow shell
It's been this way since we banned SIS's about 2 years ago
solar kayak
?
hollow shell
(also you're not "doing the jobs for them" because they still need to balance your ideas)
robust shuttle
changed it, lul
cosmic jungle
you're making a concept, coding the shit in is actually doing their job for them
solar kayak
I don’t get the "balance your changes instead of your overall goal" shtick. The changes I proposed adhere to my overall goal.
zenith hazel
it's not about whether we're sensitive about this concept
sleek turret
Third part of the suggestion.
Its a glass-cannon armor, how many times I said this, a glass-cannon armor is supposed to reward you with DPS in exchange with something that affects your survivality, like Omega Blue Armor, it eliminates the positive HP regen, but it rewards you with more offensive stats than Bloodflare Armor.
For this reason normal armor which balance between ofensive and defensive stats, having a stable relation with them, and these armors can have DR because they don't exchange something from both ofensive and defensive sides.
zenith hazel
it's about what we think is more balanced for the mod
hollow shell
Katherine please
zenith hazel
the ends don't justify the means
hollow shell
also c'mon Kami I had two other reasons you could add, not just the HotE one
robust shuttle
lul
hollow shell
Also Kath your changes do not, in fact, adhere to your overall goal
Your suggestion is asking for a damage buff
when your overall goal is to make Demonshade less damage-oriented
craggy stratus
my sugg is the same as yours Kami, and it died
crystal iron
I do kind of agree with demonshade Sugg
Demonshade armor is a bit underwhelming comparing to auric Tesla
craggy stratus
underwhelming as in defense
sleek turret
Me too, I wrote some reason why I don't like the suggestion.
sand umbra
here's my thing with Demonshade
even if you do buff its survivability, Auric Tesla will outclass it in all possible respects in that regard anyway
people ask for survivability buffs to Demonshade to make it better but
solar kayak
I’ll reiterate once more; if your intent is to make Demonshade the more used or viable set in comparison to Auric Tesla—you need to consider what is demonstrably more valuable as a perk, and what is more valued by the community. That would mean compensating for what Demonshade lacks in comparison to Auric Tesla. Namely, survivability.
Auric for some reason has higher base damage increases. So, make Demonshade better in that regard.
Auric has Revive. So, give Demonshade a shadow dodge and higher DR, or some other comparable fallback.
These changes basically compensate for Auric's benefits, while also bettering the appeal for Demonshade in general.
robust shuttle
Auric Tesla will be changed in the next update.
sand umbra
what they don't realize is that Auric Tesla buffs your survivability to such an insane element that it literally won't matter unless you have Demonshade one-up Auric Tesla, at which point it's a straight upgrade
sleek turret
Yeah
robust shuttle
I feel like it's more about "adapting"
sand umbra
it has not been nerfed in any meaningful way and certainly not any way that's meaningful to this discussion
sleek turret
The difference between Auric and Demonshade are their playstyles.
hollow shell
Well our intent isn't to make Demonshade more widely used
It's supposed to be the high-skill DPS option
solar kayak
But no one cares about that
hollow shell
except for the people who do
solar kayak
Clearly people don’t find that useful
robust shuttle
damn bruh
solar kayak
I’m talking about the majority
hollow shell
"Clearly"
You have faced like, overwhelming opposition when you posted this sugg
solar kayak
Literally look at the people in the calamity mod talk
sleek turret
Demonshade is more for a risky playstyle, but rewards with damage, and Auric is more for a "I suck at dodging, so this is my bet" armor.
robust shuttle
damn it's like that.
solar kayak
They despise the idea of glass canons
robust shuttle
tbh.
craggy stratus
you also failed to mention enrage buff in damage factor
hollow shell
Then they don't need to wear it
sand umbra
I'm pretty sure the people against widely-usable Demonshade are people that are actually good at the game
hollow shell
If they dislike Glass Cannon then they can wear Auric Tesla
solar kayak
They're saying shit like, if they nerf Auric Tesla, they better nerf SCal
robust shuttle
How much damage increase does 125% translate to?
hollow shell
That's why there are two armors
craggy stratus
#calamity-mod-talk 10 people active =/= 80k people in this server
sand umbra
I hate to say it like this, but the average person is not that good at the game
hollow shell
+125% = 2.25x
sand umbra
love me or hate me for it, that's the truth of it
and that's why Demonshade won't be used outside of the more skilled circles
sleek turret
duplicates the damage, but makes you get 25 damage more.
hollow shell
And that's the point
solar kayak
But, isn’t the sole reason why you're nerfing Auric Tesla (which is a bad decision imo) because you want more people using Demonshade?
sand umbra
which, conveniently enough, basically all manifested out of thin air to protest this concept
solar kayak
What is your intention?
robust shuttle
wait katherine what?
hollow shell
No it's because Auric too stronk
sand umbra
wh
robust shuttle
that sentence just
frail mantle
AT is being nerfed because AT is meme tier strong
hollow shell
(I actually don't know for sure, I am not among the testers)
solar kayak
That's why I prefaced, if your intent is to make Demonshade more widely used or viable, then make these changes
If that isn’t your intent with the changes
robust shuttle
question about my suggestion tho
craggy stratus
merk said even auric is a defensive armor, its damage is too high
solar kayak
Then you can do whatever you want
robust shuttle
Is it still terrible?
sand umbra
except
solar kayak
My comments don’t apply
crystal iron
But then again it'd be weird I'd demonshade was better than auric Tesla since u need like 5 other armor pieces to make auric Tesla
robust shuttle
So Auric is good then.
sand umbra
I re-iterate: Auric Tesla has not been nerfed in any meaningful way and certainly has not been nerfed in the ways that would be relevant to this discussion
sand umbra
correct
the fact that it buffs your survivability to an asinine element is still there
hollow shell
Aight so
Kath if you ain't gonna change your main line to be less specific then I'm just gonna ❗ it and wait and also leave, this has been a moderately frustrating conversation
solar kayak
Do you guys want Demonshade do be more widely used, or preferred over Auric Tesla ain terms of performance?
robust shuttle
hey Rover.
solar kayak
Just answer this question, and then I’ll be able to gauge your intentions
sand umbra
you still get Tarragon's increased heart chances, Bloodflare's...healing I think? I know Bloodflare gets something, God Slayer's revive, and Silva's 10sec invulnerability and bonus thereafter
solar kayak
Yes or No
robust shuttle
n o
craggy stratus
balanced usage
sand umbra
Auric Tesla also has much higher defense than its component armors
frail mantle
AT is supposed to be better for general use, and DS is supposed to be better for more skilled use
hollow shell
(regardless of our answer to your question that you just proposed, you still need to change your top line. It's too specific. It being too specific will not change.)
robust shuttle
me?
hollow shell
No, Kath
robust shuttle
oh
robust shuttle
damn bruh
hollow shell
Dude you can keep it
dry latch
In a lot of cases, raw damage isn’t really that important.
don't need survivability if you don't get hit
robust shuttle
Tyranny's End
hollow shell
Your sugg is controversial but it'll be valid if you just make your top line more generally worded
craggy stratus
tyranny end is balanced on scal
hollow shell
to directly state your goal
craggy stratus
except heart phase
hollow shell
instead of trying to propose exact changes
robust shuttle
Chad, wdym?
hollow shell
But do it in your top line please
solar kayak
Hence the discrepancy
hollow shell
I don't care if I disagree with it
That doesn't matter
I'm just trying to make your sugg be valid according to the rules
craggy stratus
@robust shuttle not too much damage to activate reactive DR
sleek turret
@solar kayak let me tell you a thing,
if the player wants to choose between defensive and offensive stats, its the problem from the player, an intelectual player who knows what is doing and knows its skill level, meaning that the player knows that it gets hit a lot of times or hardly-ever, will choose the armor which is the most confortable for it.
solar kayak
It would be valid if we were on the same wave length.
dry latch
bruh
hollow shell
Because it's too specific
dry latch
read the pins lol
solar kayak
I already explained why it would.
hollow shell
This is the first Don't in the Suggestion Don'ts doc
dry latch
did you read the pins?
robust shuttle
man I'm too lazy to read the pins
solar kayak
**"I’ll reiterate once more; if your intent is to make Demonshade the more used or viable set in comparison to Auric Tesla—you need to consider what is demonstrably more valuable as a perk, and what is more valued by the community. That would mean compensating for what Demonshade lacks in comparison to Auric Tesla. Namely, survivability.
Auric for some reason has higher base damage increases. So, make Demonshade better in that regard.
Auric has Revive. So, give Demonshade a shadow dodge and higher DR, or some other comparable fallback.
These changes basically compensate for Auric's benefits, while also bettering the appeal for Demonshade in general."**
Did you not read this?
frail mantle
We did.
dry latch
bruh listen to what we're trying to say
hollow shell
Even if I agreed with your suggestion wholeheartedly, Kath, your top line proposes specific changes and is therefore invalid
It doesn't matter if it aligns with your goal
hollow shell
solar kayak
I thought you were criticising my method of writing
hollow shell
No
solar kayak
In that case, I’m sorry
edgy sundial
if anything, i would criticize your method of reading...
solar kayak
Misunderstanding
hollow shell
Jesus Christ
solar kayak
Ig
robust shuttle
damn bruh
solar kayak
Regardless, it wouldn’t have worked anyway cause we aren’t on the same wavelength in the first place
craggy stratus
rover isnt the only one voting for your sugg you know
hollow shell
It doesn't matter if I agree
(well it kinda does but generally, it doesn't)
That's why there's a voting system
craggy stratus
^
robust shuttle
democracy
robust lava
Rover is as impartial as can be regarding suggs
solar kayak
Oh, is that right
hollow shell
Not really but I try to be
sand umbra
he tries harder than most people
robust shuttle
Is my suggestion fit the criteria?
sand umbra
myself included
solar kayak
So what do I do to make it valid again
craggy stratus
@robust shuttle i still dont feel it
hollow shell
Lemme go get the message
robust shuttle
there is the Summoner penalty.
sand umbra
edit your top line to be less specific about the kind of buff/change that would need to be made
robust shuttle
I could go with the summoner penalty.
sand umbra
yeah, what Rover mentioned
robust shuttle
Just so that my weapons "prioritize" over the Fungal Clump.
craggy stratus
that works too kami
hollow shell
Also Kami your suggestion is better now
craggy stratus
idk the movement boost has anything to do with your sugg tho
robust shuttle
that's true.
hollow shell
Though, you should specify in the last line that it's the Clump's seawater that could cause an unexpected increase
craggy stratus
does clump leaves lingering seawater
hollow shell
Yeah
robust shuttle
hollow shell
And it causes you to get underwater boosts
Amalgam has a massive movement speed boost when underwater / in seawater
which can throw you off
craggy stratus
brb beating boss rush with deep diver
robust shuttle
lul
sleek turret
victide armor + deep diver moment.
robust shuttle
yes
craggy stratus
does fungal clump kill critters in general
robust shuttle
it could.
hollow shell
(I would also not say Truffle Worm in specific, cuz that's way earlier in the game. Just keep it at any critter, cuz it could be a Bloodworm or a golden critter or just normal bait for fishing)
robust shuttle
Bloodworm can be catched?
solar kayak
@hollow shell check
hollow shell
yea
craggy stratus
yes
robust shuttle
I haven't played Calamity up to that stage.
sleek turret
@robust shuttle yes, it can be catched.
craggy stratus
solar kayak
Aight
robust shuttle
thanks for the clarification
craggy stratus
man
robust shuttle
I'ma go to the Calamity Mod talk
hollow shell
Now, I bet you won't get many stars on this suggestion, Kath
but you can now get stars on this suggestion
craggy stratus
my enchanted axe kill critter sugg and havent reached the limit
hollow shell
also thanks for the edits Kami