what's this for
#suggestions-discussion
distant gyro
hollow shell
Prolly would be a good idea to make these docs more public
distant gyro
i don't see any point to nor anywhere to place them to
onyx river
As a member of the public i can say that i found the doc useful
hollow shell
You could have Fabsol add them to #changelogs
or get em pinned in #calamity-mod-talk
(or even get perms to post em in #changelogs yourself, but that's less likely)
tawny gyro
also tundra flame blossoms staff sounds nice
i honestly had a problem with the fact that out of every single pre-hm summoner weapon only one (sun spirit staff) gets upgraded, at all
but now it's better
ancient crow
i like tundra staff as a concept but the name could be changed
"Tundra Flame Blossoms Staff" just doesn't sound right
stone yarrow
posted thing
i feel like it's probably been suggested before since it's a popular vanilla set but I didn't think of checking
civic pond
I think it has been suggested before but I see no issues with it
faint needle
I feel like vampiric talisman is literally useless in pml
It barely gives you any heal and when it does its not much
exotic ibex
just take weapon that shoots many projectiles
faint needle
That doesn't really help
exotic ibex
idk it restores my health really fast
faint needle
Eradicstor hits extremely often yet I don't think I get more than 1 hp per sec
Brb gonna test
wooden wedge
Whats the 6 deaths part? I thought auric only revived you twice
exotic ibex
on SCal if you don't made any so real attempts to avoid projectiles on whole battle
it took me 6 deaths
on melee
exotic ibex
death mode
faint needle
Bruh
radiant meadow
can't you like disable statis belt and asgard's valor dashes?
and if you're using counter scarf post moon lord, you may want to re-assess what accessories you should have equipped.
stone yarrow
@radiant meadow true melee build
and that's what i mean
if you don't disable them they take priority
but if you disable them then after your charges are depleted you literally can't dash at all
radiant meadow
and also, not sure if weird dash interactions can be fixed
stone yarrow
i don't think this was a thing in vanilla though
i might be very wrong but if you had tabi or shield of cthulhu equipped with solar flare they would work as i described
radiant meadow
vanilla and modded dashes use different bools
so naturally, they interact weirdly
sand umbra
cool bug fact's:
vanilla dashes don't even use bools, it's a single centralized int that changes based on what dashes you have equipped
player.dash
so e.g. if you want Solar Flare dash you set player.dash to 3
it's...a bit annoying to override vanilla dashes without IL editing
that's all I'll say
radiant meadow
I know they don't use bools, I just thought that would be easier to understand
to exemplify that they're different
sand umbra
ah, I see
I just wanted to clarify a bit, although the point still stands that yeah, they're handled differently and it's really annoying to mess with vanilla dash priorities without IL
stiff jay
Would it be possible to add ingame config options such as locking the Rage and Adrenaline bar in place or removing the built in boss bar as opposed to leaving the game, going into config options and toggling it?
tepid root
thats...already an option?
wooden wedge
update your mod
void kelp
If you don’t have it, update your game
stiff jay
dont you have to click that gear thingy in the mod menu
wooden wedge
you can do it ingame
crude geode
What
hallow kraken
two word epic sug
gray nebula
wooden wedge
@fierce tendon care to like
say anything more
if you wont we can just call spider over
fierce tendon
i didn't see that it was slomode
wooden wedge
you can edit messages
versed mica
fierce tendon
oh ok yeah
fierce tendon
ok fixed
void kelp
don’t bosses when they drop the hearts just drop more?
wooden wedge
probably specify that you mean the 20 hp healing hearts
fierce tendon
ok
wooden wedge
because there's a lot of heart things in this game
radiant meadow
did you drink a photosynthesis potion?
radiant meadow
it does
because buffing it more might border too strong if you abuse the mechanic
wooden wedge
the only time I think it's strong is when you farm several hundred worlds for heart statues
other than that the hearts are pretty meh
indigo fog
You can also summon a very weak boss and just kill it fast, depending on how far you are in the game. Don't bosses drop like a ton of hearts?
fierce tendon
spider, i just checked with yharon and no, bigger bosses don't drop more hearts
void kelp
have you used photosynthesis pots?
fierce tendon
yes, but they don't make too big a diff
i was thinking like the health could scale up as you beat bosses
onyx river
But that mould make the bloodstone armor prolly too good
wooden wedge
they'd make a big difference if anything during a boss fight dropped a reliable amount of hearts
onyx river
Yes
void kelp
idk a 25% boost to all heart gains is pretty substantial
wooden wedge
20 -> 25
eh
it's only 5 hp which you can regen in like
less amount of time than it takes to get another heart
onyx river
Well again if you have bloodstone armor, you'll get the 5 more hp many times over the course of the fight
wooden wedge
oh wait does bloodstone drop hearts
onyx river
When you hit ennemies under 50%yeah iirc
fierce tendon
yes every 3 seconds from enemies under 50%
also on that note maybe i should add mana stars because those don't scale up either
onyx river
yes and honestly hearts are fine too
fierce tendon
maybe it's just me, but I guess i always felt that it was weird that hearts that heal for 20 at the beginning of the game are exactly the same at the end of the game 🤷
onyx river
from what know certain ennemies spawned by statues can drop hearts, which allows you to setup heart farms way more easily than with heart statue
void kelp
and photosynthesis potions do exist, which provide a later game scaling
onyx river
And every aspect of the game doesn't have to scale
void kelp
which is... exactly what you’re asking for
onyx river
Also yes
ashen warren
heart drops are already good enough
even the halved healing during scal saved my ass many times
unkempt bolt
main use of hearts later game is getting health back before DoG p2 imo
which is already pretty strong with 20 hp hearts
toxic kettle
20 HP is fine tbh
if you have like 2 or 3 heart statues standing around, you can regenerate 100+ HP within seconds
the fact that some mods introduce crafting recipes for heart statues makes them even better
Personally I now refrain from using heart statues because they may make a boss too easy for me
I know it's not representative of everyone but my battles against the Twins made that pretty evident:
With heart statues: 3 attempts, not so big of an arena
Without heart statues: 18 attempts, had to extend my arena and upgrade my gear to survive
same weapon, same difficulty
latent agate
Imagine dying to twins, this post was made by don’t getting hit gang
It was also made by mecha mayhem is easy as hell with mage gang
Also if you’re gonna compare stuff at least compare it with the best gear at the time
Saying you had to upgrade your gear just shows you were underprepared, not how hard the boss is
Or rather, how good the thing helping you is
unkempt bolt
i mean he isn't the author of the sugg, so they don't really need to provide any evidence
toxic kettle
I'm fairly confident my gear in both situations was equally strong (before I realized I had to upgrade in one of them because I wasn't getting anywhere) and even though it probably wasn't the best gear I could have had, the difference in attempts still says a lot. I'm not saying this is concrete evidence or whatever since that third attempt could've easily been a fluke, but I think my point still stands.
There is no downside to using Heart Statues and the Photosynthesis Potion exists, so the amount of health they heal now seems fine to me
as in, there's no need to buff them
dapper coral
the author is correct in that it would be weird that hearts still healed for 20hp, if there weren't any extra ways to get health in lategame
but there are, so it kinda solves itself
wooden wedge
bloodstone armor gives you those heart drops
and it's worked into auric tesla
so yeah
and it's worked into auric tesla (put the "so yeah" under this message because discord ,,.,,.)
wooden wedge
auric tesla bars are made with a lot more than just 3 materials yeah
toxic kettle
that combination of souls only needs 3
wooden wedge
and have a lot more useage than just a pickaxe
raven shoal
angel treads and Moab also uses the souls
wooden wedge
so 3 things
that's not really enough to justify needing a combo of the souls for those
zealous ridge
but then there's galactica
toxic kettle
Crafting recipes also don't exactly get easier if you put another step in between
wooden wedge
galactic singulatities or is it something else you're talking about
raven shoal
items using the 3 souls have no reason to use them besides locking them behind progression
zealous ridge
there is precedent
toxic kettle
they're used for a lot of things
wooden wedge
mhm but those things are different since they have quite a lot of uses yeah ^
toxic kettle
not all three at the same time
wooden wedge
all 3 souls don't have a lot of uses
zealous ridge
eh
wooden wedge
I'm going to check how many have uses for all 3
toxic kettle
using an item that is a combination of the three souls doesn't make more sense in the crafting recipe than the souls themselves
zealous ridge
ye
regardless, i dont think it's needed
just like i dont think cores of cal are really... needed
or galactica
its just that it makes the recipes less cluttered
and like, that's it
raven shoal
Fair enough
toxic kettle
introducing Auric Tesla bars was helpful because else a lot of crafting recipes were way too big
zealous ridge
functionally it worked the same, though
toxic kettle
I don't think this quite applies to items made from all three souls
zealous ridge
well okay
wooden wedge
all 3 souls have like 14 ish recipes if you count variants like drax and pickaxe axe
zealous ridge
14 is a decent amount
but i digress
it really doesnt matter that much
because like... a 3souls combo isn't that needed anyways
nor were galactica or coc
but those are already in the mod so whatever
wooden wedge
galactic have 33
zealous ridge
okay
zealous ridge
okay
wooden wedge
but all of these have more reasons to exist than just because of recipe numbers
zealous ridge
now, did you just say that for completion's sake or is there a point
hm
functionally there isnt really a difference
wooden wedge
funtionally no
zealous ridge
for tidiness's sake yeah its different
wooden wedge
but they're used in later recipes in which they have a lot of ingredients
and terraria has an ingredient cap iirc
zealous ridge
yes
wooden wedge
and all of those like life alloy and coc are used in the same recipes
zealous ridge
?
wooden wedge
maybe not all but a lot
core of calamity, life alloy, and galactic singularities are all usually shared in a single recipe in some way or another
zealous ridge
3souls aren't used for much outside of post mech, is thje point
wooden wedge
mhm
zealous ridge
while coc, lifealloy, gs, they all have prevalance throughout the game
okay so that's done
wooden wedge
if all 3 souls had more recipes besides around 14 which are in the range of post mech bosses to golem(ish?) then I'd say that the sugg would be ok
dapper coral
souls basically get replaced by lunar frags after a while, in the form of galactica singularities
except galactica is used much longer than souls are
so eh not really necessary
wooden wedge
@raven shoal probably wanna read through all of this
dapper coral
something i am wondering though, is it worth suggesting adding meld thingies to the galactica recipe? considering it's obtained through the lunar events, and turns into a lunar-ish armor, same as everything else
zealous ridge
theyve probably been reading lmao
just like... eh ig wait for time to be up or for a mod to look at it
dapper coral
Add meld blobs/bars to the crafting recipe for Galactica Singularities.
Galactica Singularities are made of all the lunar fragments, so since meld/xeroc gear is like the rogue equivalent of lunar stuff, meld blobs or bars should also be in the crafting recipe. Currently, it's fantastic that galactica singularities make the lunar event more replayable to get the frags, but meld blobs, the new drop for the lunar event, are left out in this since there's really no reason to get them past moonlord, unless you're a rogue or arbitrarily need more blobs to craft some other xeroc weapons. Therefore, it makes sense that meld should also be included in the singularity recipe, since they are from the same event and act as the rogue counterpart.
This is a bit messy, what should i fix
toxic kettle
This suggestion will inevitably lead to people suggesting Aureus and Deus to drop Meld Blobs/Bars
dapper coral
it's been suggested before
toxic kettle
makes sense to me tho
dapper coral
IMO there's a lot that could be different about meld blobs, like having aureus and deus drop them
indigo fog
it was suggested before and was denied
dapper coral
that is also true
one step at a time though i guess, since iirc there may be other plans for meld?
i have no idea if that's actually true tho
i may have just made it up and thought someone said it
toxic kettle
if that was denied, I don't see much of a chance of Demik's sugg getting through
indigo fog
Unlike lunar fragments, meld can be obtained through astral crates
toxic kettle
I wonder why tho
toxic kettle
post-Cultist or post-Aureus?
dapper coral
that is one of the reasons that i feel meld is kinda disconnected from all the lunar frags
onyx river
The problem with meld is that it's an equivalent to lunar fragment but isn't at the same time
indigo fog
Meld blobs have several differences from lunar fragments
dapper coral
like, is it a lunar item or not? if it is, make it like all the others, and if it's not, then don't
indigo fog
pretty much the only connection is xeroc being a rogue armor
dapper coral
but don't combine some aspects and not combine others
and being dropped in the lunar event
onyx river
Ye but i feel like the main reason Xeroc is rogue could be just to fill the gap of pre provi for rogue armors
dapper coral
but at the same time, it's not
its weapons are all over the place, not sticking to rogue
i mean, the real issue is that meld drops in the lunar event, and therefore gives the impression that it's an alternate frag
maybe if it was made like, an astral-only thing, then it would make sense that it was dropped by deus or something
or found in crates
i have no idea
onyx river
Imo the dev team didn't want to make it feel like a full on frag without a pillar, but at the same time making another pillar is kinda 
crude geode
Making another pillar is incredibly
dapper coral
i'm not saying make another pillar
but meld needs to change to either fully embrace the lunar frag category, or fully reject it
actually i made a sugg about meld in general a few weeks ago which got to 120 but then got rejected
radiant meadow
meld stuff has plans to change
when it's done with some spritework, animation, I don't know what is needed still...
crude geode
Chill
onyx river
Oh i though you were gonna wait for Xeroc to come out befor diong the rework on that
dapper coral
then i shall stow my remarks about meld until a later date
crude geode
(also Meld Blobs being more related to astral biome was an approved sugg Demik)
crude geode
From what I saw, it was like 5 messages from him.
crude geode
I mean, I don’t see rogue as all that tanky tbh
crude geode
I don’t see how Rogue can lifesteal that much, unless you have Red Devil.
And that’s a post-SCal weapon.
Like
Vampiric Talisman is good, but if you’re using it post-ml...what are you doing?
crude geode
Yeah.
civic pond
Personally I think the cooldowns are fine as they are
crude geode
@exotic ibex Can you please make your suggestion more clear on how Rogue and Melee and specifically tanky?
Same rly
The 45 second cooldown on god slayer is honestly almost as much as adrenaline, and that’s the main one you can utilize
exotic ibex
I do not really understand what you want to correct in my submission
I can, but just retype please
crude geode
Why do you think Rogue and Melee are tanky, and have so much lifesteal? Providing specific examples would help others understand.
exotic ibex
well, okay
can you give me 12 hours for thinking please?
I'm just gonna sleep
for now
crude geode
Ok
faint needle
Idk about melee but rogue certainly doesn't have enough tankiness and life steal to sustain getting hit on later bosses
From post ravager vampiric talisman can help but barely
And its mainly used for damage after that
exotic ibex
vampiric talisman + supernova/celestus = easy SCal
faint needle
The Crits don't heal that often
And when they do its not much
When was your last rogue playtrough
unkempt bolt
you were on 1.4.4.3?
exotic ibex
is it was already week ago?
um
no
of course it was 1.4.4 with some numbers in the end
oh
maybe yes?
yes
plain mango
I feel like you haven't really thoroughly investigated the subject before making a suggestion on it. If you provided some detailed examples / gameplay to demonstrate your point, it might be further looked into. As it stands, it just look like x is broken because of specific briefly mentioned y example with little further explanation.
exotic ibex
um
I were playing on rogue and melee
boss rush was smth really easy
only for rogue that scarlet devil makes it soo casual
for melee that's illustrious knives
roughly for both, but for rogue sd is better anyway
at this moment
on yharon
the same point
empyrean knives
for both
not only empyrean, on rogue + vampiric talisman
it's just insane
sleek wadi
My issue with the suggestion is that nothing is stopping other classes from using the lifesteal weapons.
exotic ibex
not this the problem
sleek wadi
Empyrean Knives already isn't that much of a DPS weapon even for melee and that's not what the weapon does anyway. So this would just nerf melee/rogue while ranger gets to slap knives into their build and become the new survival class.
exotic ibex
idk it's were giving me a nice amount of hp
gusty delta
How much?
exotic ibex
death
gusty delta
Ye
unkempt bolt
though it might just be calamity in general
sleek wadi
Scarlet Devil is top of the line stuff, so good it actually puts you at risk of being DQ'd from a boss rush no-hit IIRC. Could be that weapon in particular.
crude geode
Using BR isn’t the best example to provide reasoning for nerfs
sleek wadi
As for the knives, that heal would be about the same with any other class because the weapon isn't spectacular. If anything needs nerfs, it'd be the weapon and not the class. Especially because it'd be wack to nerf people who aren't using the lifesteal because of the person who is.
crude geode
^
crude geode
I swear, whenever I used Illustrious Knives, it gave me like 500 health every once in a blue moon. It felt very inconsistent, and I would rather just use Earth.
exotic ibex
I said
I think about it
just because late night are not the best time for discussion
crude geode
Prolly not
civic pond
i would prefer consistent smaller lifesteal than large slow chunks
crude geode
Same
gusty delta
Ye
rose ermine
Terra/terrarium says hello
indigo fog
For Endothermic Energy and Nightmare Fuel you can just use a Ceaseless Hunger Potion
void kelp
- do other floating items, such as souls show?
I'd understand lore bc they're more unique
vague laurel
I forgot people still play normal mode 
void kelp
but do general drops deserve that treatment?
vague laurel
no, only the boss drops where it could be anywhere
essences and souls of light,flight,night, ect dont need it
void kelp
but can't you encounter problems w a soul of flight disappearing bc the wyvern dies offscreen?
- same goes w essences
should those also show on the map, because they float?
crude geode
Can't you just use the basis of "these drops are on the ground, so the floating item has to be somewhere above it"
void kelp
like the only one i'd agree w is lore items because they're unique and special, similarly to treasure bags
subtle oracle
Wait, this already exists??
crude geode
The only part of this suggestion that's relevant then is Endothermic and Nightmare Fuel, and that's not neccessary due to the fact that Ceaseless Hunger Pot exists
@vague laurel
And yes it does exist Krastyan
subtle oracle
ik, im surprised that its getting sugged again. I thought it got removed or smth
void kelp
@ashen lark the reason why this isnt the case is because of how thorium's aquatic depths spawns on the jungle side of the world
radiant meadow
the abyss isn't moving
ashen lark
Better preparing to move sides and replace aquatic depths than remove possibly key features
void kelp
also, future content is a don't
wooden wedge
wait why'd the abyss replace the aquatic depths
I don't get it
anyways ben said that the abyss isn't moving so kill sugg iirc @void kelp
dapper coral
he was saying to let the abyss replace aquatic depths instead of replacing 1.4 ocean things
but yeah it's irrelevant so yeet
ancient crow
even if 1.4 expands the dungeon-side ocean, it wont get expanded all the way down to the underworld lmao
i'm not particularly worried about the abyss
the sulfur sea, though...
hollow idol
I would have said combine sulfur and aquatic depths but it would feel weird having both calamity ocean biomes not on the same side
ancient crow
that would be a lil janky
but i honestly could see sulfur on top of aqua depths
it even makes a bit of sense lore wise, the sea life escaped the corruption of the water by descending into the caverns below
radiant meadow
abyss and sulph sea should be on the same side ye
abyss doesn't need no normal beach above it
dapper coral
does aquatic depths not have a normal sea above it? because if it does then it really shouldnt interfere with vanilla changes
sand umbra
Aquatic Depths always gen on the Jungle-side Ocean
Abyss and Sulf Sea always gen on the Dungeon-side Ocean
and I have a feeling the gen of the Aquatic Depths will be changed to some degree to account for 1.4 shenanigans
dapper coral
but i mean like, is the ocean there? or is it replaced by the aquatic depths like sulphurous sea replaces regular ocean
radiant meadow
aquatic depths is under the ocean
sulphurous sea and the abyss are tied together
there's no moving only one of them over
dapper coral
yeah that's fine, i was just thinking that if aquatic depths doesn't change anything about the actual ocean surface, then there's literally no issue
radiant meadow
the issue is thematics
dapper coral
but anyways that sugg was deleted like an hour ago 
eh, like thomas said im sure that thorium will change their gen if necessary
hollow idol
- already happening
- read the don'ts doc
ancient crow
thats a dont
lilac ruin
got it
hollow idol
@lilac ruin
ancient crow
and yeah, its already being done
hollow idol
oof
civic pond
heck
hollow idol
ancient crow
oh, that looks a bit more done than the last time i saw it
nice
magma tail looks a lil funky tho
wooden wedge
1 frame gif ./,.,.,
ancient crow
gifn't
lilac ruin
damn that's sick
ancient crow
can't wait to not be able to see any of the details when it's flying towards me at 600 mph
lilac ruin
honestly
kinda like with the song in phase two,
super cool, but can't hear it over me screaming
@hollow idol is that official art? if so, where did you find it?
hollow idol
art server
lilac ruin
got it
hollow idol
its official
warped pollen
Can I suggest something about adding an item that prevents sandstorms?
distant gyro
there's already an item that cancels ss
warped pollen
Oh, you're the first to say that
can I suggest a desert lore item dropped from DS that prevents sandstorms
warped pollen
I don't think it has a lore item
hoary birch
What would the possibility be of another level of the dungeon unlocks after beating SC for the next update
void kelp
future content is a no
radiant meadow
desert scourge immediately whips up a sandstorm after being killed for the first time
wouldn't a lore immediately preventing that be counter intuitive?
radiant meadow
to signify that sandstorms now can occur
dapper coral
maybe it could be signified with a chat message instead?
but i guess that could be confusing, idk
warped pollen
I mean, sandstorms just make farming him harder
dapper coral
but then, why not just make it so that it's just the chat message, and then the player can decide whether they want a chance of it happening by using the lore?
i feel like it's a good idea, but maybe there's another way to implement it that doesn't involve DS
that i am missing
warped pollen
idk it would feel add to personally ask the player something because of lore and all that stuff
but idk, guess the devs will decide
civic pond
pogfish
hollow idol
smh put one of the 500 calamity related pogs instead
death
death
hollow idol
or I can repurpose the cursed earth ele emote into a pog 
hollow idol
fear
civic pond
is it really tho
foggy plover
cal pog is fear
radiant meadow
I think art added prov pog
dapper coral
fear indeed
fossil torrent
oh god
tepid root
powerful
crude geode
I mean.
You are specific.
I did ask for this, but it’s probably better to keep it more vague as to the specific numbers of what the buffs should be.
hollow shell
Sure wish the bot didn't keep dying
Makes for some weird unwanted situations
hollow shell
Not talking about your suggestion, don't worry
exotic ibex
well ok
hollow shell
Actually, about your suggestion
You're kinda cramming a lot of changes into one suggestion
People could only agree with some aspects and not others,
which makes it difficult for them to decide if they want to Star your suggestion or not
exotic ibex
split into several?
hollow shell
You could, yes.
I'd prefer you only send the ones you think are the most important, so that we aren't flooded with them
hollow shell
Yeah, seems fine.
You could mention in the suggestion itself that it's exactly 1 HP per stealth strike
(I wasn't convinced at first until I checked the wiki)
@faint needle Wrong channel
faint needle
I'm a fucking idiot
exotic ibex
it's done
hollow shell
It's okay, lol
faint needle
Yeah sorry
onyx river
Hmm you don't equip yound siren and levi in the same slot so i wonder how that would work
hollow shell
That is indeed a bit weird
Presumably it'd be in the light pet slot, this combo item
so you don't have light functionality in the pet slot
onyx river
Ye but that means you could have two levis
hollow shell
More likely, whatever item you put on next will have no effect in terms of summoning mini-Levi
cuz it triggers a bool
onyx river
Oh ok
hollow shell
m.
onyx river
Didn't know terraria code worked that way
hollow shell
yeah
crude geode
(also isn’t Levi a dedicated item for Leviathan)
hollow shell
You gonna keep your sugg up or no?
hollow shell
okay
onyx river
Yeah but Primerose keepsake is a combination of 2 dedicated sooo
charred sparrow
and yes cursed, the levi item is dedicated
hollow shell
(also memespower, still gotta add the "1HP per stealth strike" thing
Unless you decided against it)
exotic ibex
done
hollow shell
Thanks 👍
exotic ibex
hollow shell
(The English quality is questionable but I'll give that a pass, ik you can't help that. It's still readable)
subtle oracle
So many suggs in sugg posting
hollow shell
Yeah, the bot's borked again
hollow shell
@ashen warren'll take care of it
subtle oracle
Noice
hollow shell
(I'm conflicted on whether or not to consider joemama's sugg valid
but I'm going to say yes, because even though it's (very) disagreeable, it's still fine and has a reason)
(Wilton and Wingdings' suggs are valid for the same reason, tho to lesser extents)
aight now I'm not so sure
crude geode
Yeah
exotic ibex
i heard that maximum of hearts, being in a world is 5
onyx river
I don't think so
hollow shell
I don't think that's true, but I can't confirm nor deny that
crude geode
Also all blood flare armors/upgrades would have to be rebalanced around the new hearts.
onyx river
but max near a statue is 3
exotic ibex
Also all blood flare armors/upgrades would have to be rebalanced around the new hearts.
weapon too
mutilator
hollow shell
Yeah
Bloodflare equipment does Heart-spawning stuff, and Photosynthesis Potion does boost the effectiveness of hearts
so
buffing em would be quite difficult to balance
.... and most likely not needed at all
crude geode
Agreed
exotic ibex
i didn't really know that photosynthesis potion buffs hearts
crude geode
Also then you have the argument of mana stars
hollow shell
I didn't know that either, to be honest.
onyx river
Mana stars already are good enough
exotic ibex
mana stars are good, 100 mana per star
exotic ibex
is really nice for mage
onyx river
Yeah photosynthesis is kinda but not every pot has to be a game changer
crude geode
(My calcium memes 
)
It’s not meant to be relied upon like lifesteal or anything
It’s meant to just be nice when it happens
exotic ibex
you're right
onyx river
Well except maybe during the moon events but you alredy get enough hearts so it's not a problem
crude geode
kills one boss
Damn that didn’t get me back to fu-
another boss instantly dies
Full Health
exotic ibex
hm
it's a good strategy
just spawn king slimes when killing someone
always full hearth
onyx river
Better, use fargos to make swarm crowns so you don't have to spawn the bosses yourself
crude geode
@void marsh Already an approved suggestion
void marsh
oh. didn't notice
exotic ibex
lol
crude geode
It’s chill
void marsh
wait, has giving crabulon a summon weapon been approved?
onyx river
Crabulon has fungal clump
exotic ibex
but accessory already do this
crude geode
Yeah
exotic ibex
by the way really useful for summoner
onyx river
Eh not really but it is summoner
void marsh
fair enough, but for new commers to the mod who don't want to get straight into expert mode, fungal clump isn't available
onyx river
Just because a thing does summon damage doesn't mean it's usefull
onyx river
Yes it's also really short
hollow shell
It's fine that it's an already approved sugg, btw
Bluechecks exist
exotic ibex
for summon it's not an issue
void marsh
the rifesteal is only useful post DoG as before then, it heals 1-3 health, but at a short range
lifesteal*
onyx river
It' is, just beacause summoners have less trouble dodging doesn't mean they can hug ennemies, they still have very low defence
exotic ibex
buffs?
crude geode
Nah, it’s useful where it is
void marsh
for melee, maybe, but for summoners, you have to stay as far away from enemies as possible, not hug them
exotic ibex
well, okay, at some point you're right
crude geode
Have you heard about igneous exaltation, or any of the aura minions that float above your heard, Kristaps?
exotic ibex
but it does nice damage
onyx river
The aura that floats around you are ranged and igneous is not at all the same tier as fungal clump
crude geode
I’m more referring to the basis of “summoner needs to be far away from enemies”
onyx river
And also is at the limit of true summon wep if you ask me
void marsh
yeah. i have. but the minions that float above your head are mostly set bonuses from calamity armour with the summoner helmet. they don't take up a minion slot and they also don't take up an accessory slot
onyx river
Igneous is the expetion rather than the example
exotic ibex
yeah. i have. but the minions that float above your head are mostly set bonuses from calamity armour with the summoner helmet. they don't take up a minion slot and they also don't take up an accessory slot
not true
there are many such summons, that float above your head
crude geode
Sirius, Blossom Staves, Sun Spirit, etc. Krist.
onyx river
As stated befor the ones that float abobe your head don't force you to stay near your ennemy
void marsh
well, the ones i know are the sun spirit staff and is upgrades and the calamity armour set bonuses
crude geode
There’s still examples and weapons that allow summoner to not just be a class simplified to “summon and run”, which is an incredibly boring play style.
exotic ibex
that's shows that you were not playing summoner for full playthrough
onyx river
You find it boring
onyx river
Doesn't mean that other people don't enjoy taht
exotic ibex
they does nice damage
void marsh
i only have used the upgrade to the frost blosson staff, which summons 3 blossoms that rotate around the player and i have never used cold divinity
onyx river
And also yes you don't just run
onyx river
You have to be able to guide your minions
crude geode
But cold divinity and igneous exaltation show the ability of calamity summons to branch out and do more than that.
onyx river
They restrict your playstyle more than they expand it
subtle oracle
@patent moon use ** in-between sentences in order to make your words bolded
void marsh
the best example of it not being just a "just run" thing is the summon from brimstone elemental. if youthe minion slots are full, you can cast out a damaging aura that doesn't last for too long
patent moon
K thx
void marsh
not to mention that you technically have access to lunic eye as it does true damage
onyx river
Yeah but imo it's a bad example, this wep is just a magic wep with a summon tag once you have full slots
void marsh
or basically any weapon that does true damage
crude geode
Like I said. I’m not dissing the current summoner or pre-acid rain summoner.
I enjoy it, but that doesn’t mean I can’t want more from it.
void marsh
but lunic eye is the best because of the defense drop
onyx river
Yeah but what i'm saying is that i find theese weps are the less enjoyable part of summoner for me
exotic ibex
yeah
crude geode
Opinions are opinions, they’re gonna differ noye.
onyx river
Yeah but i don't want them to become required in a certain part of a playtrough because it's just the only wep that works
and if more are added and the existing ones are rebalanced that might happen
Btw fishron is ass for summoners
crude geode
If only one weapon works well and is viable for summoners, that’s a balance problem. It can always be suggested to be buffed.
onyx river
True
crude geode
Limiting design space is usually a bad idea as well. Stifles creativity, and prevents things such as classes from evolving.
fossil torrent
fungal clump does not need a buff lole
i could see making an upgrade for it with shroomite tho
void marsh
fungal clump already has an amazing upgrade named the amalgam
patent moon
I don't even know what fungal clump is xD
fossil torrent
then why are you in the convo
onyx river
[[Fungal clump]]
red storm
exotic ibex
onyx river
Ha
patent moon
K thx
Also Im here to wait for people to discuss my suggestion because I don't wanna SIS xD
onyx river
You just forgot to mention lore items
crude geode
I think it’s a fine suggestion, though the timing of it is a bit off, since lore is going through like a redesign in the background iirc
patent moon
Oh I thought I did
onyx river
or is it what you meant when you wrote lore weps
void marsh
the amalgam makes the damage the fungal clump do significantly better, gives it insane lifesteal and makes it travel for either an unlimited amount of time until it reaches the player, or just increases its range, whilst keeping it limited
fossil torrent
it's balanced as is
onyx river
Wasn't they just rewriting the lore, not changing the way it's implemented in game
fossil torrent
remember it's a drop from a fucking post EoC boss
patent moon
I just want the lore IN the game ._.
crude geode
That’s valid, ik
void marsh
as i said in my suggestion, either increase the range, or remove the lifesteal and increase the damage of the fungal clump
fossil torrent
but why
crude geode
Removing the lifesteal kind of. detracts from the whole point of it.
void marsh
admit it, nobody uses fungal clump post hive mind/perforators
fossil torrent
and taking risks
fossil torrent
do you use the crown jewel post those bosses?
patent moon
Lifesteal is highly useful
exotic ibex
if you remove lifesteal it ceases to be an accessory
onyx river
Because obviously staying far is not actual gameplay
patent moon
In vanilla terraria I used vampire knives all the time because they kept me alive
fossil torrent
an accessory doesn't have to be usable for the entire game to be balanced
crude geode
^
void marsh
yeah, but it doesn't heal up all of the damage you would take from queen be onwards
onyx river
Vampires is the antithesis of providing challenge
crude geode
It doesn’t need to.
onyx river
in vanilla at least
fossil torrent
^
i could see if it had an upgrade before amalgam
being made with shroomite or something
exotic ibex
true
fossil torrent
but that's a specific item suggestion
onyx river
not that specific
crude geode
^
fossil torrent
it's pretty specific
void marsh
post hivemind/perforators, you should have regular healing potions, or even honeyfin, which basically make fungal clump useless from then on, until post DoG
crude geode
hm yes
frail mantle
Consider: potion sickness
crude geode
^^^^
Or literally any point when you want more healing. Just slap it on in a invasion and let it heal you up more
frail mantle
Clump provides healing when your health potions are still on cool down
crude geode
It’s the same reason why Crown Jewel is nice
onyx river
Fungal clump just allows you to stay closer to bosses it isn't necessarily good for everyone but some people might wanna use it
crude geode
Yes.
fossil torrent
if you would buff the range of the fungal clump healing, it would be overpowered
see: vampire knives in vanilla
void marsh
yeah, true, but still. i'd rather have potion sickness when using a healing item that heals 100 or 120 health, rather than have no sickness with an accessory that heals 1-3 health at a short range
onyx river
Spectre hood too
exotic ibex
because of DR
fossil torrent
vampire knives are insanely overpowered in vanilla
onyx river
^
patent moon
Ye
exotic ibex
spectre hood is overpowered
patent moon
Its why I love them xD
exotic ibex
idk i don't think so
onyx river
Theye even have a specific machanic against them during ml
void marsh
and if you're playing all classes, post slime god deffinetally makes the clump useless (if the expert mode accessory still has healing when mana is low)
fossil torrent
any free healing at any range that's greater than like 2 per second, will be overpowered and used for the entire game
it would be used by every class in every situation
literally every item like that in vanilla is overpowered, aswell as the thorium post-ragnarok bow
onyx river
2life/sec maybe not nut fungal clump is more than that
fossil torrent
wasn't very exact
lament cobalt
vampire knives are insanely overpowered in vanilla
@fossil torrent I don't think so
fossil torrent
no, they are.
onyx river
They are
crude geode
Uhhh no they are.
exotic ibex
any free healing at any range that's greater than like 2 per second, will be overpowered and used for the entire game
not true
patent moon
Depends
fossil torrent
ask anyone with a lot of experience with this game
crude geode
Want your health bar back? Just run away and throw knifes
lament cobalt
I was barely able yo heal up like 50hp while SPAMMING them on an invasion
patent moon
They are usually overpowered in boss fights, however with normal mobs not really
onyx river
People who say vampire are not op didn't use them
exotic ibex
because of damage it does to enemy
fossil torrent
there's a reason that potions heal for 200 in post moon lord and have a 60 second cooldown
consider that
patent moon
Vampire knives are only op with boss's.
fossil torrent
60 seconds
lament cobalt
ask anyone with a lot of experience with this game
@fossil torrent 900h if you count mobile version into playtime
bro
onyx river
Basically full heals you in 2 sec
exotic ibex
People who say vampire are not op didn't use them
i used it in period of golem and cultist
on ml it's very useless
insanely useless
fossil torrent
there's no point in discussing this anymore, they don't get it
frail mantle
Yes
patent moon
I think we're going off topic
onyx river
because it has a specific mechanic to prevent their use
frail mantle
Because ML fucks life steal
exotic ibex
yes
void marsh
i agree that vampire knives are useless during ML
exotic ibex
not only lifesteal
fossil torrent
also yeah you cant lifesteal on ML thats a part of the fucking fight
exotic ibex
any lifehealing effects
frail mantle
What
lament cobalt
Moon Bite
patent moon
The lifesteal mechanics in games are usually Op
void marsh
the only boss that has a debuff that prevents lifesteal
exotic ibex
i'm not about potions
onyx river
Saying it's bad because one boss nerfs them just shows how good they are otherwise
patent moon
Yeah
crude geode
Moon Bite was probably implemented bc of Vampire Knives and Spectre Hood tbh
void marsh
but technically, it is possible to regain life if i'm not mistaken
onyx river
it was
fossil torrent
it was
frail mantle
It was
crude geode
Yes ty
patent moon
Thats why they are both so good
They're TOO op, so for the final boss they HAD to be nerfed
lament cobalt
Moon Bite was probably implemented bc of Vampire Knives and Spectre Hood tbh
@crude geode that's why I almost always focus on not getting caught by ml's tongue
void marsh
i believe that spectre set with the hood can still heal you as it technically doesn't count as life steal
frail mantle
Moon Bite fucks life steal but not life regen ye
lament cobalt
just for spectre hood
onyx river
I remember the time where it wasn't there and ml was basically a cakewalk even in expert and when it got implemented, everyone was like OMG when pedguin beat him for the first time
lament cobalt
i believe that spectre set with the hood can still heal you as it technically doesn't count as life steal
@void marsh it counts as lifesteal
frail mantle
So technically you can use Life Drain to “life steal” ML
onyx river
Yes
patent moon
Life drain and life steal are almost the same concept
void marsh
oh, it does?
lament cobalt
(...)Moon Bite debuff which prevents lifesteal such as the Spectre Armor and the Vampire Knives(...)
onyx river
Life drain is a wep that boosts life regen
dry latch
now go back to fungal clump
lament cobalt
Life Drain just drastically boosts life regen
void marsh
oh, didn't know that
fossil torrent
this is far off topic
onyx river
Drop from crimson mimic
patent moon
Ye we're gettin pretty of course guys ._.
lament cobalt
or maybe check new suggestions
void marsh
also, who agrees that demonshade needs a buff?
patent moon
Perhaps
crude geode
Please no.
onyx river
No
lament cobalt
no
fossil torrent
it doesn't
crude geode
Dear god not this road
patent moon
GUYS
onyx river
It was already discussed here before many time
fossil torrent
it's more aggressive than the auric tesla armor
patent moon
WE'RE GOING OFF TRACK XD
dry latch
demonshade will be moved. no point in rebalancing it now
fossil torrent
if you dont get hit, demonshade is much better
void marsh
for some classes, auric tesla is better than demonshade
lament cobalt
still, I never made demonshade because it doesn't have the god slayer and silva effects
and the melee auric tesla has 146 def
demonshade full set has 150
crude geode
This has been discussed to death.
patent moon
Ah yes, the debate between which is better: Demonshade or Auric tsela
void marsh
exactly. and demonshade is POST SCal, whilst auric tesla is PRE SCal
fossil torrent
defense isn't the only thing defensive about auric tesla
frail mantle
DS is good but gets outshadowed by AT’s two revives
lament cobalt
I only said that I don't use due to lack of auric tesla bonuses
crude geode
Demo shade is glass cannon armor.
Auric is survivability.
Get over it.
fossil torrent
^
patent moon
We need to stop guys xD
patent moon
We're so off topic xD
onyx river
Hmm about the sandstorm preventing lore, wouldn't making it drop by desert scourge invalidate the sandstorm that happens when you kill it
frail mantle
patent moon
True
dry latch
that's what ben said lol
crude geode
^
onyx river
well then i'm slow
patent moon
I guess having a way to prevent sandstorms would be all right
crude geode
@lament cobalt Have you seen Red Devil? It’s got even more lifesteal, and without even needing to tank a hit.
onyx river
SHUT
lament cobalt
@lament cobalt Have you seen Red Devil? It’s got even more lifesteal, and without even needing to tank a hit.
@crude geode really?
crude geode
Literally the most recent sugg.
onyx river
END THE DEBATE
patent moon
WE'RE NOT GOING OFF TOPIC AGAIN XD
frail mantle
Insulting people for no reason is 
crude geode
^
lament cobalt
@lament cobalt Have you seen Red Devil? It’s got even more lifesteal, and without even needing to tank a hit.
what do you mean
shit
onyx river
Sorry
crude geode
Don’t ping me twice.
lament cobalt
forgot to remove the ping
crude geode
It’s enough even to have it the first time.
Yes. It does on a stealth strike. Practically back to full hp after standing still for a second.
lament cobalt
suggest it...
frail mantle
You mean Scarlet Devil, not Red Devil
crude geode
shit
onyx river
OOF
patent moon
Aight
frail mantle
my life
onyx river
crude geode
It’s the (currently) only unique rogue weapon from SCal.
lament cobalt
Nanoblack reaper is OP
crude geode
^
onyx river
Have fun outhealing DoG head fuckery
crude geode
Earth is feasible on around two bosses in there. Astrum Deus and Hive Mind iirc
zenith hazel
summoner already has 3, rogue has like 4
crude geode
Aureus
lament cobalt
shadowspec stuff are always dev items
exotic ibex
summoner and rogue should have more weapons from shadowspec bars
scarlet devil is super OP
just ultra
frail mantle
Does PSA count as one of those weapons
zenith hazel
PSC is practically shadowspec
lament cobalt
and if I remember correctly in donts there was something about not suggesting developer items
onyx river
Simple way to get more rogue shadowspec weps:
1- become a dev
2- ask for a rogue wep
crude geode
exotic ibex
frail mantle
fossil torrent
1: become fabsol
crude geode
Yes.
frail mantle
It does
fossil torrent
suggesting weapons breaks the rules
suggesting shadowspec breaks the rules
lament cobalt
it sucks tho
fossil torrent
double negative makes a positive, right? :)
frail mantle
3 if you count PSA
zenith hazel
not really a problem tbh, some devs just prefer certain weapon types
frail mantle
Yea
crude geode
Ye
fossil torrent
rogue didnt even exist when most those devs requested their items lol
lament cobalt
cause the other ones are rogue variants of melee weapon... or maybe the melees are just melee variants of rogue weaps
shit I dunno
zenith hazel
again, not really a problem
frail mantle
Fab likes melee, so there are a bunch of melee dev tier weapons
crude geode
Yes
lament cobalt
Animus is fun
crude geode
(Though melee variant of rogue weapon yeeting is going to be interesting when it gets to there)
lament cobalt
shit worng channel
crude geode
Oof
tawny gyro
quick question to a programmer:
how difficult is it to rebalance one weapon?
(related to a sugg i might or might not post)
distant gyro
why is this directed towards a programmer
distant gyro
maybe
tawny gyro
but, just to get to my sugg:
tawny gyro
nerf every sentry, but add sentry slots to summoner armors
given there's like, what, 9 sentries?
it doesn't seem like much
distant gyro
i think there's a bit more than 9
tawny gyro
9 calamity
distant gyro
oh 9 cal yeah
tawny gyro
i didn't count vanilla
distant gyro
i was gonna bring up the 12 relevantn't sentries from ooa
tawny gyro
but if balancing like 2 or 3 weapons is already hell, that'd be a rather obvious "no."
tawny gyro
okay, i guess it's time to use my remaining 7 brain cells to come up with sufficient reasoning
distant gyro
but also when you get an awfully god kill time you don't know who to point at
the armor, the accessories, the minions, or the sentries
who to blame
normally minions have suffered the most