the dragon egg used to require cosmolight
#suggestions-discussion
inner dirge
sand umbra
then it got changed
inner dirge
cosmilite
dapper coral
...but like, is it even remotely possible with only lunar gear?
sand umbra
it can be done, almost certainly
inner dirge
probably
sand umbra
you're not going to have fun doing it because post-DoG is arguably the biggest power spike in the mod rivalled only by post-Yharon
but it can be done
inner dirge
you just have to be good at dodging. easier said than done tho
dapper coral
that is very yikes imo
but okay, that path is for the gods among us
i, a mere mortal, will be sticking to the suggested path
inner dirge
i kinda wanna try it now...
distant gyro
it wasn't too tough until pre-prov got nerfed a bit
dapper coral
"And Kirby8 was never heard from again..."
crude geode
You can also fight lunatic cultist at the start of hardmode, siren pre-hm, and golem pre-hm? Hazard on hardmode only tho for golem.
dapper coral
cant do golem pre-hm tho
inner dirge
Lmao 🤣
distant gyro
uh, well, the last time i tried it being initial release of cocktail which was insane though
dapper coral
wof and plantera need to be dead for it to work
distant gyro
Golem is Pre-Cryo at max with Old Power Cell
crude geode
That’s right, old power cell
So yeah beginning of hardmode for golem
Non-linearity is fun 
distant gyro
and yea also pre-boss AS
dapper coral
that is what we call wack af
cinder spade
siren and levi are also pre-boss
crude geode
brought that up too
You can technically fight ml before even fighting a single boss in hm
dapper coral
zealous ridge
We already talked bout yharons teleports?
wooden wedge
yeah
ancient crow
you need to kill cultist before ml dont you?
ancient crow
eidolon tablet 
wooden wedge
so 1 boss
crude geode
True.
nova crown
My suggestion is reaching the Discord character limit pls help
frail mantle
doc time iirc
wooden wedge
use a doc
crude geode
^
zealous ridge
Well I’m reading back and it seems people are more interested in giving advice than talking about the advantage and disadvantage of having teleports
zealous ridge
Perhaps I didn’t read back far enough
nova crown
...Overly long reasoning about why it should happen :P
crude geode
It’s because of the fact that someone wanted “boss nerf Bc I can’t beat it”
nova crown
Both are heavily tied together + have pretty much the same reasoning behind them
wooden wedge
@zealous ridge we told them that it was fair, they didn't really listen iirc and that a better sugg would be to have yharon telegraph more
instead of killing a whole attack
wooden wedge
like without outside knowledge the dashes and stuff are basically random
when they have a pattern
crude geode
I think suggs about Yharon should hold off until Chozo’s jank rework comes through in a update
That’s the real problem with it. I feel like, most of the time, most post-providence bosses need to be looked at on the wiki to actually understand them and what they do.
zealous ridge
Mhm
Hive mind’s a good example of a well-telegraphed boss
I’d say polterghast has some elements of a badly telegraphed one
crude geode
Ehh I like polterghast but there’s also the problem of a lot of stuff going on at once. Providence is a example of a pretty well telegraphed boss post ml.
zealous ridge
Provs at its worst when she’s using her basic attacks
Cocoons are better, and the holy ray is great
she’s okay overall
What I’d like is better movement sync with attacks
crude geode
I feel mostly the same way. I feel like cocoon is definitely fine, but that may just be me. Having providence trying to stay above you while you’re trying to dodge the homing flames, before she hits you with a large fireball almost immediately feels unfair in some ways.
zealous ridge
mhm
the only improvement id make to cocoon is telegraphing her going into it better
because sometimes i just get sniped by holy inferno before i even realize she's in cocoon
crude geode
That’s fair.
crude geode
Mmm calamity and other mods
zealous ridge
seems okay, but mod compat is ech last time ive heard
its just a vanity thing, in any case
nova crown
My wall of text is ready
atomic badger
oh no
nova crown
Mod compatibility doesn't seem like something that would get added, especially if purely cosmetic
true blade
I would kill for a cryogen inaction figure
zealous ridge
is that the chad of chad furniture
true blade
Quite literally
crude geode
It’s possible to add more reasoning to that sugg boomical.
zealous ridge
"more vanity good", perhaps
crude geode
Such as it allowing us a glimpse of the actual human characters, like Calamitas.
nova crown
👀
zealous ridge
nova crown
Maybe
crude geode
I don’t think removing trophies would happen, but adding in more vanity is always nice.
nova crown
^
crude geode
“Add” was the key word in there, apologies for not noticing
true blade
I would love for calamity to add inaction figures even if it would be unlikely
nova crown
Okay I think I found a pic of them
They do look really cool tbh, I'm just not sure what would be the right approach for Calamity to implement them
Like, would they be crafted? Boss drops, just like trophies?
crude geode
leave that to the devs
true blade
They’re drops
Drop from the first time you defeat a boss
You can also craft them using the trophy
That’s how chad’s furniture mod did it
nova crown
Sounds fair tbh
crude geode
Ye
cinder spade
why does the cultist have 6 foot long arms
true blade
What
dapper violet
tentacle
nova crown
Who cares about proportions anyways smh
crude geode
I wouldn’t specify that in the suggestion, as it narrows the range down for what the devs can do with it, but I would add in the picture as an example of what inaction figures look like
nova crown
^ That
nova crown
Ok that means I have time to post my wall of text and make everyone suffer muahahaha
crude geode
You should be able to edit and add the picture Boomical. Unless I’m drunk as fuck and don’t know how it works.
true blade
Nope can’t
nova crown
It's up, have fun
nova crown
Yes 
dapper coral
what the crap
true blade
Let me just
crude geode
Hm.
nova crown
Also @true blade you can copy the link of the figurines image and paste it onto the edited message, that should work
nova crown
No because slow mode would make it 8 minutes (+ Mods check all suggestions anyways, my wall of text doesn't mean yours won't be seen and approved lol)
crude geode
Your suggestion is kind of odd, Albertalberto. Mainly with the second paragraph.
nova crown
I didn't want to just make it "Make these invasions better pls you figure out how"
dapper coral
okay question for yall: im glad they added upgrades for the harpoon to make an otherwise-useless weapon better, but does anyone actually use triploon?
crude geode
Read the last sentence of that paragraph, that’s kind of the problem.
zealous ridge
dualpoon idk about
dapper coral
oh really? i didn't like it that much bc it felt pretty low range + not piercing
crude geode
Narrowing down what you want the dev team to do makes them less likely to do it, as they hate restrictive things.
true blade
Big brain
zealous ridge
triploon is nice for plant though
true blade
Circumnavigated your wall of text
dapper coral
unless im wrong about that
nova crown
It was just ideas as to how they could do it, but I guess I can delete that last part if needed
dapper coral
that's pretty interesting, i suppose its not useful past that tho?
zealous ridge
eh
its single target dps is great
but plant is like the only single target enemy that it's good against
crude geode
I’d let it sit and simmer amongst others first, and not just my opinion against specific suggestions.
zealous ridge
levi is too dangerous up close, aureus is a longer range fight, golem has multiple parts which makes piercing better
dapper coral
that's what i thought
bc i was gonna suggest making a wep that combines the triploon and septic skewer considering theyre both harpoon-like weapons, and seeing as triploon is not a fantastic weapon to use for more than one boss
but its not entirely necessary
i just wanted to see what you guys think
zealous ridge
septic is already fine imo
doesnt really need an upgrade
because around dog is when the range of foes to beat up becomes much more restricted
crude geode
I wouldn’t post a sugg rn, seeing as a text-wall sugg was just posted
I think the third paragraph might need to be removed? The whole suggestion is just very long and can be squished if you tried.
dapper coral
fair enough, thanks for letting me know
crude geode
Or not nvm.
dapper coral
is septic good against dog? i would assume the piercing is good but also piercing is nerfed or something so idk
dapper violet
it will be very fun and cool to fight a bloated flying dutchman
dapper coral
also i have a massive bias against harpoon weapons because harpoon bad
zealous ridge
septic has good enough range, and extra homing projectiles make it pretty good for damage
dapper coral
huh thats pretty epic
nova crown
And the thing got deleted 🦀
crude geode
Moved to voting*
nova crown
That was fast
crude geode
I was the only one who commented on it
Barely had any focus
But hey if Afzofa wanted it to be up, who am I to judge
nova crown
Still thanks for the feedback though! I'll try to shorten any future suggestions I do a bit more
crude geode
That’s fair. I think it’s always good to hazard on more support and reasoning for your suggestion, but there is a limit.
granite grail
Not speaking for everybody but for me yes
crude geode
Eh I think we mentioned something about nerfing Clock Gatligun?
lost agate
That sounds like a separate deal so idk
But like does the spectre rifle one need any edits?
crude geode
Don’t believe so. Seems well supported and valid.
lost agate
Aight
Dammit theres no instructions anywhere
Iiiiiim just gonna guess its a check reaction
yup
crude geode
Sweet
cinder spade
spectre rifle also has that godawful firing sound
crude geode
Poorly supported, never responded to a ping to change the suggestion.
lost agate
So lacks edits
Next one then
Karthus sugg next
Any problems with it?
One i see myself is that i think its katharsis not karthus but eh
hollow idol
catharsis
loud parcel
i think he means infernal catharsis
hollow idol
Rebirth is a remaster
lost agate
Doesnt catharsis rebirth play once you can do p2
hollow idol
no
it got switched
so that you could hear the full epic theme in p1 and blaze through the old one in p1 before p2
hollow idol
Rebirth is first
lost agate
Oh so its just a swap
hollow idol
The phase 1 pre-darksun fight is longer so the remaster was used for it
Phase 1 post-darksun is shorter because new stronk weapons, so the old one is used
swift wadi
I can confirm after listening to the two that the original plays when Dark Sun is over
frail mantle
wait didn't we come to the conclusion that it was more Gatlignum and Aeries needing a nerf than Spectre Rifle needing a buff
swift wadi
League of Legends lookin ass
cinder spade
k a r t h u s
lost agate
Oh well then
cinder spade
how do you spell catharsis as karthus
radiant meadow
oh ye
lost agate
Dun ask me
lost agate
So what do i do with the rifle sugg 
radiant meadow
just leave it
frail mantle
cause like
a 1:16 kill time vs plontoro is more reasonable than a 30 second kill iirc
cinder spade
people talking about gatlignum while pearl god exists
granted it is a RiV
lost agate
Anyway imma just uh
swift wadi
I've forgotten, can I suggest boss reworks? I've seen them here before
I really think Ravager needs a lot of work
frail mantle
yea i suppose it can stay, though a Rifle buff probably won't be the result if it's accepted
crude geode
Major scale no, which might be the problem.
lost agate
@red stratus Mind editting your first suggestion so it says catharsis rather than karthus?
Ok so next one is deus dropping meld
Yay or nay
dapper violet
yay
crude geode
Reasoning seems a bit short but tbh it doesn’t need to be long to establish the point. I’d go for it.
dapper violet
really just any alternate source of meld
swift wadi
I agree
crude geode
And the Yharon subphase 4 bad.
swift wadi
Why would those be removed
They aren't even random, he goes behind you and either above or below
crude geode
This one was requested to be changed to “give the teleport phase more of a telegraph” but was never changed.
lost agate
The reasoning isnt quite good so yeah imma skip that one
cinder spade
fishron exists
lost agate
Yeah and that too
cinder spade
a lot of yharon's attacks are based on fishron's
radiant meadow
meld blobs aren't fragments
earnest harness
feels like something that could be made as a chad's addon instead of something integrated into the main mod
lost agate
Dont see any issues with the reasoning and such
swift wadi
"We should have ones for calamity bosses too."
That "too" makes it sound like "as well", but it wouldn't really be an "as well" unless this was a sugg for the mod that adds the originals
swift wadi
I'd prefer if it was worded more like it was using those as an example tbh
lost agate
That sounds a lil too nitpicky
lost agate
So that one goes to voting too
Uuuuh
Now that i think about it, maybe we need a reaction for "pending changes" so someone else doesnt do the revision with them again
Or actually that may be inconvenient
Yeah nvm that
crude geode
I mean the ping should work, and if it’s a ding dong ditcher then...they won’t change the suggestion anyways.
lost agate
Yeah but i mean like for other mods and such
crude geode
Yeah that is kinda odd.
mighty knot
I thought you couldn't do suggestions based on other mods
frail mantle
iirc someone mentioned that we could get the ❕ react again but there'd be no point, cause if a mod has reviewed a sugg in #suggestions-posting and it's buenos dias it'd just be slapped into #suggestions-voting
lost agate
The other mod is only used as an example of what he wants, at least thats what i see
swift wadi
Rover was going to suggest that once
lost agate
Oh yeah
swift wadi
But he decided against it as he found it went against the core concept of the suggestions rework
lost agate
Yeah tru
radiant meadow
Rover did like the idea of a ❗ reaction to note that this suggestor has been pinged about possible issues to make it easier who got pinged about fixes already
lost agate
Yeah but my problem with that is, unless the reaction goes away once its edited, it aint really gonna do much
So cant really do much about it
Just hope someone doesnt check the same sugg twice
distant gyro
but the ding dong ditchers
lost agate
They can keep ding donging
frail mantle
ding dong ditchers are thanos'd by the auto deletion after 24 hours when it works
distant gyro
lost agate
Yeah im aware of autodeletion
crude geode
Could the suggestor then ping an online mod whenever they edit their suggestion, so they can have it checked over?
radiant meadow
that wouldn't be a good idea
crude geode
Yeah true.
radiant meadow
not when a good amount of mods don't check suggestions
crude geode
So I guess the plan is to keep going with the current layout?
lost agate
Pretty much
Unless people just like post a message there saying "Suggs reviewed at this time"
But that also wouldnt work cuz edits are uninformative af
SO yeah cant du nuthing
crude geode
Rip
lost agate
Anyways, thanks for your cooperation fellas
crude geode
No problem. Thanks for reviewing.
sand umbra
Rover did like the idea of a ❗ reaction to note that this suggestor has been pinged about possible issues to make it easier who got pinged about fixes already
he was going to post a sugg on this
and then pointed out that this is the exact issue the suggestions rework was designed to fix in the first place
distant gyro
yea like
sand umbra
in essence, the whole point of #suggestions-posting being present is so that people realize "hey, wait a minute, my sugg hasn't been buenos dias'd into the voting phase yet, do I need to fix a thing"
which then prompts those folks to look here and see if their presence was requested to tidy up their sugg
along with DESTROYING ping-pong ditchers with FACTS and LOGIC
distant gyro
if you ding dong ditch then it just gets yeeted off the universe
wooden wedge
how do you destroy them with facts and logic if they don't read it
frail mantle
the facts and logic is so factual and logical that it destroys them without them needing to read it
sand umbra
"this sign isn't going to stop me because I can't read!"
moment
but yes. they are destroyed by the facts and logic without needing to read them
without even needing to see them
they are inevitable
dapper coral
essentially, become literate or become dead to the world
wooden wedge
if you're illiterate you shouldn't even be here
dapper coral
this is true
wooden wedge
press random buttons
lost agate
I was more so saying it for the cases of mod not asking twice about the same sugg
then realize all options i could think of kind of die after first stage
ashen warren
ding dong ditchers are thanos'd by the auto deletion after 24 hours
when it works
@frail mantle which it does now that the straggling issues with it have been resolvedprobably
frail mantle
sand umbra
inb4 a new problem arises within the next like week
ashen warren
Probably, but it’ll be fixed fairly quick provided i get notified about it 
sand umbra
warped pollen
rapid pivot
@bitter drift The summon's viable, just not in that specific situation.
I'd argue that it is required as a summoner for fishron.
bitter drift
that's a post brim and post mech summon
rapid pivot
It is.
bitter drift
why do you use it for fishron then?
rapid pivot
Because when Fishron hits his 3rd phase, minions refuse to target him.
bitter drift
oh
ya i see
but really this summon is good everywhere
just it's too bad you can't see it underground
rapid pivot
By the time you get to golem, though, you have sand sharknados.
rapid pivot
And before plant, entropy's vigil.
bitter drift
what's that? i forgot
rapid pivot
The calamitas summon.
bitter drift
oh
ok so should this be in
the only thing it adds is light
also am i the only one who REALLY like the blades
digital saddle
i really hope my stealth suggestion gets starred enough for delivery, though most stealth suggestions i or others have posted didnt get super enthusiastic responses
its just so disappointing to have all this gear to support it and even fully decked out its barely usable
ashen warren
i would think that most devs dont agree
digital saddle
ashen warren
uh ok
swift wadi
Looks good to me, any objections?
sand umbra
no objections here
sinful yarrow
I dunno, the Za Warudo thing with the stellar knife is pretty awesome
small talon
mages are already really damn powerful, the mana sickness helps level them out with other classes actually
sinful yarrow
I dunno
digital saddle
yharims crystal
sinful yarrow
Summoner gets really strong
swift wadi
@digital saddle add a space between the header and body of your sugg so I can send it
digital saddle
is balanced around mana sickness
sinful yarrow
But yeah, honestly I would like an easier way to gain stealth
swift wadi
Wait what that wasnt the issue?
zenith hazel
no wait lemme check something
sinful yarrow
Maybe instead of removing mana sickness make it a little less severe
zenith hazel
ok bot isn't working it seems like, hold on a sec
cobalt rose
no
swift wadi
I can ping amber
sinful yarrow
cause mage is a pretty powerful class
zenith hazel
I already dm'd her
swift wadi
Alright
small talon
I never has a problem with mages being underpowered, mages are imo the most powerful outside summoner
equal to range i think
swift wadi
Mana Sickness does not nerf mage, it balances it
Removing it wont happen, Mage is balanced around it
sinful yarrow
I can agree
zenith hazel
alright it's working again
swift wadi
Changing the balance of the entire class and every weapon because of removing a vanilla mechanic that some might call "annoying" is NOT what devs want to spend time doing
That would be worthless
slender plank
I mean if you call mana sickness balancing out mage classes, shouldnt other classes have something like that as well. I'm pretty sure while you wait and or while you take you're 50% dmg penality other classes can consistently put out more than you
sinful yarrow
Well, other classes have their own drawbacks
slender plank
What other drawback is = to or more than mana sickness
while they do, I can't think of one so strong in nerfing dps
swift wadi
It's not hard to understand, Mage is EXTREMELY overpowered with some weapons, the reason it doesn't show? Because they're only that strong for a few seconds after being used constantly
sinful yarrow
rangers need to supply ammo
Summoner has to deal with crappy AI
And melee needs close range a lot of the time
swift wadi
See: Yharim's Crystal
slender plank
Well yes I do agree with items like Yharim Crystal and Last Prism needing some kinda drawback, those items supply too much damage
but what about the other items
They shouldn't be affect so hard by some items able to dish out broken dps which should net a nerf on the item itself
sinful yarrow
At least those weapons are locked behind major bosses though
swift wadi
Normally other weapons use little enough mana that it's only a minor drawback if you have decent mana pots
slender plank
Ammo and Ai aren't really nerfs, imo those are very minor considering ammo increases dps or give you homing and Ai can be managed by you
melee is, well melee hence why I didn't compare mage to melee
sand umbra
AI aren't really nerfs
cobalt rose
AI can be managed by you
no it cannot
slender plank
they follow you
sand umbra
you can tell when someone hasn't played summoner
sand umbra
when you're playing summoner, you yourself are not the focus
swift wadi
Shoutout to the fact that when SCal dashes, summons do not do any damage to her
slender plank
Most can clip through walls
swift wadi
Because she goes too fast
sand umbra
you are entirely at the mercy of your summons and you better pray they're competent enough to deal with enemies
also, summons that ignore tiles for targeting do not become common until around the post-ML segment of the game
sinful yarrow
I saw someone talking about minions not being to target DF because he is such a fast boi
zenith hazel
that's because AI is wack most of the time
slender plank
Yea, I am also talking Mid game on for Mage as well so I thought I'd compare em to those summons
zenith hazel
summons at that point do not have enough capability to multitask between dealing with sharkrons and duke teleports
zenith hazel
spoiler alert: it doesn't
sand umbra
anywho, you're missing the point of Mana Sickness
it's
- a vanilla feature which would be ass to counterplay without some funnymemes
- the main balancing point of Mana Flower which is stupid strong otherwise
- something which the devs are not going to add a config for
slender plank
As for the items that require little mana, it makes sense that someone can manage those. However fights aren't always so short you wouldn't need a potion
sinful yarrow
There is absolutely no point in removing mana sickness
plucky matrix
I hate mana sickness but removing it is just... A horrible idea.
sinful yarrow
that's like saying they should have unlimited mana
sand umbra
please, humor me
express to me what benefit comes from removing mana sickness
cobalt rose
there are more points as to why it shouldnt be removed rather than should
slender plank
What items come to mind when thinking it's a horrible idea
plucky matrix
Well, all weapons
sand umbra
[[tgc:Mana Flower]]
red stormBOT
sand umbra
plucky matrix
If you remove it you'd need to balance all weapons around that too, because otherwise it'd be way too good
sinful yarrow
Because as long as they have money they can just fill their inventory with potions
zenith hazel
so is flat out removing mana sickness because a fuckton of weps will be affected
sand umbra
suddenly either every magic weapon in the game needs to be rebalanced
or Mana Flower has to die
slender plank
tbh i'd be fine with mana flower dying
swift wadi
zenith hazel
that'd require us to rebalance at least 90% of the mage weps because people can spam shit without consequences
slender plank
but that's probably not an option
sand umbra
never mind the fact it procs when drinking potions manually too
zenith hazel
that's not mage
swift wadi
Last Prism weapons would need full reworks
cobalt rose
thats melee
zenith hazel
that's magen't
slender plank
Pretty sure mana sickness was meant to nerf items like Last Prism
plucky matrix
I'm against it just for the fact that it makes mage unique, because you actually need to manage your mana effectively, if you remove it it'd be like any class except summoner, brainless point and click
slender plank
but with the plentiful items Calamity adds mana sickness just hurts them out of spite of it's existence
zealous ridge
no it doesn't?
i don't see why the other magic weapons cal adds are negatively balanced by this
ancient crow
calamity weapons are balanced around mana sickness the same way vanilla ones are
sinful yarrow
But overloader gets useless because you can never activate spectre healing at low mana
zenith hazel
we balance stuff around how mage is usually played you know
sinful yarrow
because you never have low mana
zenith hazel
so playing clam mage is practically the same as vanilla mage in terms of mana management
ancient crow
~~clam mage 🐚 ~~
sinful yarrow
exactly
small talon
Mana regen potion + overloader is another reason mage is fucking op as hell
dapper coral
mana sickness reduces magic damage by 25% for 5 seconds, with each second decreasing by 5%. this basically means you're not losing that much damage since 3-4 seconds is negligible. The point of mage is that you are more fragile but you get more powerful weapons, which mana sickness accomplishes pretty damn well imo
small talon
you may not be able to fire fast but you heal and do full damage
cobalt rose
you read it wrong
queen sail
Shit
sinful yarrow
oof
queen sail
:whenlifegetsatyou:
slender plank
I think my biggest downfall with it is that other classes can supply constant dps (maybe not so much melee), but mages have to wait
zealous ridge
changing the fundamentals of mage in that way would require much more than simple number changes, we'd have to rethink how the entire class works. Mage is no longer balanced around being strong, but easily punishable via mana overusage, we have to basically start anew. It doesn't seem like it's worth the time.
zenith hazel
but it balances out by having big boy dps
slender plank
However I do see the points you all are bringing out
sinful yarrow
That's why you have to manage mana properly
sand umbra
(and being able to use Quick Mana and Mana Flower at the cost of reduced DPS)
zenith hazel
lots of mage stuff is powerful, but people tend to overlook 'em due to the inconsistency
sinful yarrow
so you don't screw yourself over
zealous ridge
you're not playing mage right if you have to wait so long
you manage it well, it's hardly a problem
zenith hazel
hence why people shit on mage easily but that's not the point
zealous ridge
its hard to manage, but it can be made to work
cobalt rose
pvp
sinful yarrow
Precisley
small talon
summon can be powerful in pvp, at least in vanilla they can
slender plank
Well, I see that perhaps removing Mana Sickness isn't the answer that I'm looking for
small talon
really powerful actually
sinful yarrow
Really? whenever I play summoner the summons dissapate when they hit someone
sinful yarrow
And at least in vanilla you can use other weapons on top of that
swift wadi
Do we have anything to say about Adir's suggestion?
plucky matrix
Looks good probably, sure I guess
sinful yarrow
Give the ingeus exaltation stuff a glow
sure, though I didn't use it so I have no idea what you guys are talking about
zenith hazel
who uses exaltation for golem is my question
sinful yarrow
Don't you use the plantation staff or something?
zenith hazel
at least use something on-tier or cold divinity byeah
sinful yarrow
Whats a good weapon for plantera while it's on my mind. for summoner
Currently I have brimseekrs
zenith hazel
not exactly the right channel but entropy's vigil
sinful yarrow
ok cool
ashen warren
boop balancing sugg, any feedback
subtle oracle
What? Balancing sugg... Oh god
swift wadi
EASTER OF WORLDS
subtle oracle
EASTER
swift wadi
I think that's a great sugg, does anyone have anything against it?
subtle oracle
Turkor the ungrateful
ashen warren
holdon, double checking one thing
civic pond
I agree with it
ashen warren
yep, we all good 
dapper coral
fair enough, crimson is a pain
swift wadi
I'm gonna ya yeet it in tbh
ashen warren
aight
sand umbra
honestly that is a great sugg which sums up every evil biome sugg that ever was, currently is, and ever will be at once
sand umbra
what gear are you using again
sand umbra
note how I didn't ask what your max mana was
I asked what gear you're using
okay so Permafrost's Concoction and Butterfly Wings w/ Daedalus armor
good on you for finding a Moth, seems legit so far
what else are you using
okay maybe I should rephrase
are you using anything that grants infinite mana
cinder spade
removing mana sickness would make the mana flower completely busted
sand umbra
I ask because Ion Blaster's damage is based on how much mana you have in reserve
yeah, the more mana you have remaining, the more damage it does
...I just realized Ion Blaster is like
dummy fucking cheap
6 mana cost before any mana efficiency modifiers 
brimmy doesn't drop souls of fright anymore
although close to 3k DPS after Skeletron Prime is
uh
yeah
ah
you should test DPS against enemies and bosses and the like, not on a dummy
dummies don't really provide an accurate measure of DPS due to enemy behavior, defense calculations, DR in Rev+, etc.
void kelp
bloodworm on lifeform analyzer is a bluecheck btw
indigo fog
How are Yharon's teleport dashes random?
also if we remove mana sickness mana potions would be completely busted
zenith hazel
it's a bluecheck?
wait fuck it was already completed
@civic merlin it'll be a thing next update
dapper violet
what mod is it that adds the improved target dummy? uses a random boss's sprite, dr, resistances for more accurate DPS?
foggy plover
luiafk
dapper violet
nearly
but ichor's still better
civic pond
cursed flames DoT hardly makes up
dapper violet
cursed flames is a flame debuff but it does shit damage to anything important, if they're not immune to it
meanwhile the only thing immune to ichor is.... destroyer?
foggy plover
tbf I think the only problem with cursed flames isnt the debuff itself, its with applying it
with ichor you get golden gun and golden shower straight out
toxic kettle
Yharon's teleports do follow a set pattern, the only thing that's random is whether he appears above or below you iirc
yes
alt-mechs are dead
dapper violet
The "alt bosses" are no longer alt bosses. They only drop biome essence
sand umbra
who dares disturb me 
..o
yeah, the "mech alts" are no longer mech alts
all of them have unique unlocks to compensate. Cryogen grants Permafrost + Frigid Bars + Verstaltite, AS unlocks the second tier of the Acid Rain and lets some new Sulf Sea enemies spawn, and Brimbo grants the ability to mine Charred Ore, allowing the player to create Unholy Cores
toxic kettle
Verstaltite 
indigo fog
Yes the only random aspect is where Yharon teleports, and you do have time to react and dodge them
sand umbra
yeah, there have been a couple updates since the Acid Rain update
latest version is 1.4.4.003
civic merlin
that aint it
toxic kettle
Recently people have wanted to toggle like everything
"Toggle taking damage from bosses huehuehue"
void kelp
anyways, im gonna go toss in a suggestion inspired by someone who posted it but didnt fix it but i do want it to go through
unkempt bolt
last-prism type weapons would be busted without mana sickness
and relying solely on mana regen pots is not that difficult
zenith hazel
the config option shouldn't be a get out of jail free card for an unreasonable suggestion
void kelp
- theres no proof that mana sickness makes mage significantly weaker
zenith hazel
just because it's optional doesn't mean it's a good option
foggy plover
I mean its not like you are going to be able to shoot a boss 100% of the time, there is always some point where you can regen mana
zenith hazel
we may as well throw that onto suggs don'ts due to how people tend to use it as a scapegoat
toxic kettle
Doesn't seem like a consistency issue to me but it makes sense
void kelp
to me it seems inconsistent if the EoW drops BoC lore 
toxic kettle
That's probably an oversight if anything
void kelp
its possible, because you dont expect people to go out of their way to fight a different evil boss
foggy plover
theres also fargos both evils mod
void kelp
ye
actually, is it in the docs or implied that suggestions should refer to calamity only, not calamity + other mods
bc i know crossmod content is a don't
but i dont believe suggestions about intermod relationships are?
void kelp
yeee
unkempt bolt
strange that it would work like to start with
i don’t claim to know how it works, but idk why the drop would be based on the evil instead of the boss
lost agate
If i were to guess, the downed bools for evil bosses probably are weird
sand umbra
the evil bosses share a downed bool
lost agate
Dont get me started on whatever ooa does for downed 
void kelp
does bosschecklist differentiate?
sand umbra
OOA is fuck
lost agate
Checklist doesnt
void kelp
ooa is literally "any tier = yeah internally betsy is dead i guess"
lost agate
Theyre both in the same tick box
void kelp
oof ono is it hardcoded
sand umbra
lore drops are never hardcoded as they are added by Calamity
and all it takes is 2 new bools in Calamity's ModWorld class to account for the different evil bosses
sand umbra
ye
determines which lore pair to drop using what the chosen evil was at worldgen, not which evil boss you're fighting
although as I mentioned, that is easily changed
lost agate
Iirc world bools are a tad harder to manage but yes its doable
tribal oyster
@slender plank the mana sickness debuff is a core part of the magic class and should defo not be changed, its balanced by the fact that magic should do more damage than every other class
if you take out manasickness there is no point to being magic based, it completely ruins the theme of magic by giving infinite mana
ashen warren
magic shouldnt do more damage than every other class
and also uh mana sickness is kinda negligble postml lol
tribal oyster
because it is based on playing around a resource it very much should
also mana sickness is percantage based so i doubt that but i never use potions anyways cause mana regen potion is op af
ashen warren
mana regen requires you to pause a few secs tho
tribal oyster
looking up, someone stated this earlier, but its not like you are always going to be damaging a boss
and alot of weapons have low enough mana cost that it doesn't matter
taking a breather every few moments is essentially required with or without mana
so pausing for mana happens anyways
either way, if people want infinite mana go add a mod that adds intentionally broken shit to give you infinite mana
calamity is about the challenge not being completely broken
earnest harness
^ calamity changes enough vanilla stuff as is, screwing with vanilla balance even further is generally going to be a terrible idea, and there are almost always going to be mods that can carry out these terrible ideas for you
neat citrus
If you don't want mana sickness for a few second, get conservative magic weapons and don't use mana potions. It's pretty much equal DPS to using mana potions with celestial cuffs. Just get hit by a weak projectile. The mana is what balances magic class dude.
Alternatively: melee
real steppe
I have a suggestion. Make Draedon's Heart craftable in a Draedon's Forge and not in the Ancient Manipulator...
Just a very minor thing
earnest harness
you should put it in #suggestions-posting
preferably with the purpose and reasoning behind such a suggestion
real steppe
Ok
indigo fog
Asgardian Aegis and Elysian Tracers both use Ancient Manipulator instead of Draedon's Forge
radiant meadow
That is intentional so you can use those accs vs the buffed moons
indigo fog
that makes sense
ashen warren
yea so since its intentional should that sugg be approved
hallow kraken
frequently suggested
hallow hatch
Aren’t calam achievements on the don’t suggest list
hallow kraken
yes
indigo fog
yes they are
hallow kraken
in frequent
void kelp
@hallow fjord
wooden wedge
on the don'ts? then just kill it
hallow fjord
i want to see the dont suggest list
earnest harness
check the pins
indigo fog
pins
dapper coral
wait, but you can't craft asgardian aegis/elysian tracers until you get cosmilite anyways, which are required for draedons forge
so whats the point
indigo fog
Draedon's Forge still requires frost moon and pumpkin moon
dapper coral
oh wait yeah im dumb
real steppe
Hmm, ok... I deleted my suggestion regarding Draedon's heart
I agree with the microwave one
But I absolutely don't agree about removing Yharon's tp ability.
Git gud man
wooden wedge
nobody agrees with that one
and they didn't edit their sugg
to be better
since adding telegraphs would help solve this issue
at least more that removing a whole attack for basically no reason
that'd make p2 more p1
real steppe
Even if the suggestion was edited to "make it slower" or something, people still would not agree..
cinder spade
aren't custom achievements not even possible?
wooden wedge
they're a don't so
tepid root
theyre possible, achievmentlib exists, not sure if that still doesnt work in mp or what
hallow fjord
is it mean the frequently suggestion will not be added?
wooden wedge
yes
indigo fog
It can be added, but you just can't suggest it
Bobbit Hook was added while post-ML hooks were under frequently suggested
wooden wedge
you can kill your sugg now ,.,.
placid moth
This also holds true for the actually-healing green flames, which are difficult to differentiate between the orange ones in the heat of battle
dapper coral
if you guys have any suggestions for my sugg, just ping me and i'll get to them tomorrow
placid moth
what this means
dapper coral
what i mean is, the orange and green flames look pretty similar in the fight
imo
when theyre coming at you it can be difficult to tell what they are, which is made so difficult by the fact that everything is tinted orange
dapper coral
i addressed this in the sugg, yes it would be better but i truly want to fight the fight like it was meant to be fought, which is with the tint. i just think that it makes these flames much harder to see, which maybe is supposed to be the difficult part but idk, if you can change the difficulty of a fight by changing lighting then i think that needs to change
onyx river
Well to be fair i can tell them apart pretty quickly i think(don't take my word for it tho i mostly play DM nowadays so no healing flames) but don't the damage flames make an explosion sound when they ht you?
rapid pivot
They do.
(seriously, those things are probably the most dangerous part of the fight)
onyx river
nah not really, they're one of the easiest to avoid
plus they don't even deal holy flames
rapid pivot
They are easy to avoid, but if you get hit by a few in a row..
onyx river
well the same could be said about every attack, true they don't have i frames but they also don't take away adrenaline for example, imo the holy blasts(i hope this is the right name) are the hardest part of the fight
earnest harness
The green ones are pretty hard to see with the custom hazy background shit that happens on some color settings
The explosions they make are also kinda hard to hear i feel
onyx river
Well maybe, i'll go see that when i can, it really isn't that bad from what i remember though
I can very clearly hear the explosions though
earnest harness
Maybe i had my sound config weird, this was also like a month since i fought prov at this point so
onyx river
and to be fair about the flames i don't see why it's a problem that you can't tell them apart easily, the fact is you still can, if it means you have to focus more then i don't see the problem
dapper coral
Wait fr they make noise? I legit do not hear anything, that’s wild. Got my game sounds turned up as well so idk
Maybe I’ll just ask that the noise is more prominent considering the epic soundtrack in the background
They are not awful to avoid, the problem is if you’re close to her and then she does it you’re screwed
Not to mention they move faster when you are farther away from her, I think
onyx river
They are slower at first so you have time to move away
dapper coral
True, but it’s easy to get unlucky when getting away and get hit by one and instantly losing 150hp
And then, at least from personal experience, it’s much harder to notice when you get hit by those than if you get hit by a real attack
indigo fog
@vast zinc boss suggestions aren't allowed
vast zinc
oh
swift wadi
Especially without any reason at all
vast zinc
k i deleted it
indigo fog
Make sure you read the Don'ts document in the pins before suggesting things
neat citrus
New suggestion: add ender dragon boss
bitter drift
lol
junior cliff
Can you add a cheat item that generates the abyss. Mine didn’t spawn
ashen warren
item that generates the abyss 
junior cliff
I mean they did have an item that spawned new content for when there was a big update
Like the brimstone area
So why not
junior cliff
Well tbh I don’t wanna make a new world just for the abyss since I have a beautiful base and using that world just for farming is gonna suck since I have to kill some bosses again
And I have several mods that make my terraria experience a pain
Like merciless mod and such so
Yeah... tldr can’t make new world cuz I made my game super duper hard
onyx river
Well if you don't mind using cheats y not just butcher the bosses you need to get back to the same level of progression
junior cliff
Didn’t calamity have butcher protection
onyx river
Well ony for bosses post DoG i belive(maybe some others but not that much)
onyx river
plus for some reason the greater tome of manipulation(from luiafk i belive but not sure) can bypass that
junior cliff
Oh yeah that thing
onyx river
Next time make sure you generate the world without any other content mods
junior cliff
Btw what’s an op weapon that has insanely high dps I’m playing with +900% hp and I can’t defeat Mech bosses before it turns day
Ok will do
onyx river
it is prolly why you don't have abyss
junior cliff
It’s been working fine? Maybe a bug or just unlucky
Wait I should probably ask elsewhere
Not here
rapid pivot
on that last sugg in posting
but y tho
consider the implications that would have on weapons like the Prism
indigo fog
I really don't want to see automatic piggy targeting. What if summons attack the piggy while there are actual enemies around?
unless you're talking about when you hit the piggy
safe sail
i mean if the summons could at least hit the damn thing that would be way better than what we have now
rapid pivot
Mandible claws.
You wanna kill the piggy? That's all you need.
(or just like, net it)
onyx river
Tbh summonners have other targeting problems that are way more troublesome(for example summons don't target AS half the time, and they don't even target trashers before you hit them for some reason)
granite grail
Ya going summoner in calamity is weird
onyx river
Well i am going to in the near future since i'm doing a DM summoner playtrough and currently at mech bosses
granite grail
Like seabound staff does like 11dmg
rapid pivot
Yeah, here's a tip; you're gonna need the igneous exaltation for that fight.
As insane as it sounds.
Ideally with Tesla pots and the brimmy lore, and inferno.
granite grail
While the magical conuh (whatever) does 21
rapid pivot
erm
granite grail
To me the doesn’t make sense
onyx river
the thing is i really don't like the idea of an active summon wep, i don't mind using it's left click though
ashen warren
base damage i see
granite grail
Still though
onyx river
Well i mean i could skip it also
rapid pivot
Because here's a fun fact for ya; when fishy boi hits his 'invisible teleporting dashes' phase, minions will not attack him!
onyx river
i wonder about DoG tho, since AS has pretty shitty targetting
onyx river
nice
granite grail
How can a boss item which has like 1.5 or something like that health drop something that can replace it in under a minute
The sunken sea should be post-EoC
rapid pivot
Because the conch minions can't fly.
onyx river
Nah trust me seabond staff is way better against most bosses
granite grail
So that doesn’t change dps
frail mantle
conch is good against Crabbo and maybe Perfs and that's it
rapid pivot
Exactly.
ashen warren
perfs lol
onyx river
EoW too if you can manipulate it well enough
rapid pivot
... wat
frail mantle
consistently dealing decent damage>dealing a fuckton of damage one tick every minute
granite grail
Yes I agree
rapid pivot
very very consistent theme among the summoner class
the best minions are the ones that can actually reliably hit stuff
granite grail
So why have the conch post desert scourge
onyx river
Hence why shellfish staff is a good summon for some bosses
frail mantle
cause it's themed around amidias' inventory, which is post-DS
onyx river
because you don't have to deal with ass AI
granite grail
Ok ya, I’m not going to post a suggestion about a whole rework, but just to me why have dps>dmg on a boss that is constantly moving
rapid pivot
... wat
granite grail
And it can’t even keep up have the time
frail mantle
i don't think Conch needs a rework tbh
frail mantle
it can absolutely meme on Crab sometimes and does aight against Perf worms and occasionally EoW, so at least it's not like it has no use (even if its only use isn't against EoC)
rapid pivot
......
granite grail
Yes I have first hand to the but the timing for the weapon is wrong
granite grail
Hehe lol
lost agate
If you get thorium you can also do it mounted on a crab 
shell lynx
Is there any way to differentiate Provi’s healing flames from the harming ones aside from colour?
frail mantle
aside from one of them healing and the other negatively healing? no
shell lynx
Ouch. Yeah one of my friends is colourblind in the way that green and yellow look basically the same
I don’t think it would be reasonable to suggest that the harming flames be slightly bigger and the healing ones be slightly smaller, would it?
indigo fog
healing ones are already slightly smaller iirc
wooden wedge
@paper torrent what does this even mean? You say add a summon weapon then bring up 2 other weapons that aren't related
paper torrent
No. I mean an item to summon Betsy.
zenith hazel
@steel peak no.
indigo fog
@steel peak A meme server won't happen
steel peak
on the discord
indigo fog
a meme channel existed before, and it turned to shit so it got deleted
zenith hazel
yea
indigo fog
we're not adding it back again
zenith hazel
please read the suggestion don'ts doc in the pins before you suggest anything next time
gray nebula
it's not because you only used 3 summons that you can ignore all the others
indigo fog
why is the entire suggestion bold
gray nebula
apart from eye and KS, you get at least one summon after every boss
crab drops the fungal symbiote so it counts smh
@pastel terrace
zenith hazel
time to nerf vile feeders again if they're carrying you to skeletron tbh
at this point, I'd rather nerf feeders just so people can stop gushing about them
gray nebula
actually theres a post eye summon
two even
caustic croaker and rusty beacon
all of those are pre HM
:///
golden shoal
i think pre hm has enough summoner content
also suggestions that just say "add more content!!!" don't really help
gray nebula
reducing it to only 3 weapons is kinda wack
wooden wedge
I don't get the herrings part
wooden wedge
It's viable for 2 bossrs
golden shoal
maybe cryogen
if you push it
but other than that yeah it's sg and wof
then you put it down for claspers
digital saddle
conch is strong but requires specific arena building
sand umbra
conch requires specific arena building and a lot of patience
because if you want to use it, you are entirely at the mercy of its AI
pastel terrace
Yeah but you only REALLY need those 3
golden shoal
yeah
pastel terrace
Why would I bother with any other summons when those 3 serve me great until cryo?
golden shoal
i mean that's your choice
sand umbra
because the other summons work just as well in their own right...?
sand umbra
amusingly, I personally never get any of these aside from Herring Staff
which I only went for because post-Skeletron content is a meme
golden shoal
i used a ton of pre hm summon items in my summoner run
tho granted i was trying to check out as many as possilbe
pssible
possible
how did i do that?
XD
sand umbra
you say that but you mention pre-HM needing more summon items and choose to mention a grand total of three (3) of the nineteen (19) summon weps in pre-Hardmode
golden shoal
who me?
sand umbra
wait
toxic aurora
is there a reason why calamity sentries cant be summoned on platforms
golden shoal
yeah XD
sand umbra
I'm tired, didn't sleep too well 
sand umbra
platform collision is a fuck
golden shoal
spikecrag took a bit to farm
toxic aurora
if so there there is really no reason to use valhalla for ml
golden shoal
and i was disapointed ngl
toxic aurora
in any way
sand umbra
if you're disappointed by Spikecrag you're using it wrong
golden shoal
idk i mean it just didn't seem much better than dreadmine
i used it for martians
dps was decent
digital saddle
valhalla knight armor is strong
toxic aurora
for spikecrag
golden shoal
huh
golden shoal
but ooa gear is take time fer farm ;-;
idk ooa isn't my fav
also then you don't have minion slots
toxic aurora
if hive pod can be summoned on a platform i would have used valhalla
sand umbra
you don't need minion slots
golden shoal
i had 14 xenos and they just melted literally everything
sand umbra
step 1: many spikecrags
golden shoal
but xenos go zab
toxic aurora
math
golden shoal
for deus how do you spikecrag it withought dyeing?
your hair
and also your lifeforce
sand umbra
uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
golden shoal
Xd
sand umbra
you make Stardust Dumbfuck your stand and hope it does something
golden shoal
i just used xenos
even tho no peirce
they still went sab
zab
and deus went OH GOOOOOOD WHYYYYY
and then blew up
:]
it was a good day
toxic aurora
stardust dragon for deus is extremely good
golden shoal
tru
but then you have to do a pillllerrrrr
and xenos still have great dps
i like having a ton of minion slots tbh
i don't really like the sentry thing
i prefer just having minions i guess
BECAUSE THEY MELLLLTTTTTT
tho old ones with dreamine sounds cool ngl
dreamines are like the best event sentry
for the teir
realizes everyone left
welp
toxic aurora
how do you use Caustic Croaker Staff properly when you cant put it on a platform