suggestions-discussion

[distant gyro]

we already have defiled soul for those who do it legit

[frosty dagger]

I did it before I knew about the discord, and so I felt no need to record it, big sad

I do plan on doing it again once Yharim comes out

[gusty grail]

see you in 3 years

[frosty dagger]

It will probably only be two

[gusty grail]

which honestly is the time i would expect for something so major

[frosty dagger]

They have been working on it for a while now, but still have far to come before it is finished

[radiant meadow]

it's also unrelated to suggestions

[zenith hazel]

mfw excluding rev defiled

[plush karma]

Hardcore dad reward when

[frosty dagger]

And when DB is equipped at all times

[zenith hazel]

wrong channel?

[fathom iris]

wait golem enrages

[queen delta]

Yeah he enrages

[fleet igloo]

Quite curious if anyone is working on a Boss Rush theme?

[radiant meadow]

@still condor not happening

due to copyright issues and such

it's been brought up in the past

[still condor]

oh aight

just curious 🤷‍♂️

[mighty knot]

then you could have asked here

putting suggestions here to get feedback first is generally a good idea

[still condor]

oh mb im new to this

[mighty knot]

I KNOW I'M IN SUGGESTIONS DISCUSSION. READ THE PINS.

Update the Textures of the Brimstone Monsters
The fact that most people think these are moons until they get killed by them is kind of a tip-off. I don't know whether the fact that they're projectiles is limiting (and in that case, you can probably just make them an invulnerable entity), but they are out of place in the SCal fight for this reason. As it stands, most of them is just pure red circle. I think this could be easily resolved by adding some shading and extra detail, to the otherwise empty part of the texture.

thoughts?

if nobody has any issues, I'll post it in suggestions soon

[fleet igloo]

No issues with me

[radiant meadow]

tfw disclaimer is necessary

[mighty knot]

for most people

but I'm tired of various people saying 'wrong channel?' or 'this is suggestions discussion'

drives me absolutely up the wall

[sly lily]

? People who come here know it should be discussed before posting

So you should answer back "no, YOU read the pins" xD

[karmic stone]

Sprite suggestion
h

You can ask someone in the art server to put it in the sprites needed doc and someone will eventually do it

hi baba

[radiant meadow]

I think Nin plans to redo the doc

since neither Jace or Vai are devs anymore (people who managed that doc)

[karmic stone]

Syhea

@mighty knot 🏓

[mighty knot]

uhhhhhhhhhh

I'll do it later

[spiral olive]

i am in fact working on the resprite doc, it's just been taking longer than expected

i wasn't thinking of adding moons to the list but given their new ai change it may be something to consider

[hollow shell]

(I don't think they act that different but they could indeed use a resprite)

(Still Images of Doom floating towards you doesn't make for good visuals)

[spiral olive]

well with their new movement and how they bounce off each other, i'd say a design to have them work around that, be it having a different shape or size, may be something to consider

because with current moon's sizes it can sometimes leave you in an extremely tight situation if you're not careful

[uneven spoke]

im sorry

[spiral olive]

it's oke jace

[uneven spoke]

i never managed the doc even when i was a dev lol

[spiral olive]

[sinful violet]

having them bounce around just looks weird too yeah lmao

[spiral olive]

well it's not exactly a bounce

more of just repelling off of each other

[sinful violet]

its like

mini bounces

[brittle nexus]

They don't really bounce, it's more like pushing

[sinful violet]

you know what i mean

[brittle nexus]

Now if they were bouncing all over the arena, well I don't even want to imagine that

[sinful violet]

minecraft mob collision

[brittle nexus]

[queen sail]

I’m pretty sure they were supposed to be animated but they weren’t for the same reason it took almost a year for someone to bother animating levi

[gusty geode]

Also unless they got a resprite I'm not aware of
They're perfectly spherical
No pixels or nothing
And that feels vaguely wrong

[hollow shell]

They're still Terraria sprites
They are not in 1x1

[sinful violet]

just the scale makes it a bit weird to tell yeah

[hollow shell]

still made of 2x2 pixels

[unkempt bolt]

are they not supposed to be moons lol

[hollow shell]

Internal name is just "Brimstone Monster"

Not sure what led to the "moon" name
fsr the go-to for a large spherical object

[unkempt bolt]

resembles the moon in the pumpkin/frost moons

[hollow shell]

I spose so

[sand umbra]

Obsidian is a wacky block

also, even if you make it immune to bombing runs

you forget that our good friend Sequence Break Shark exists

[distant gyro]

we nerfed obsidian outlaw armor but didn't want it to be overnerfed

[sly crater]

shark pickaxe for weak

[distant gyro]

any worse would make it about as good as wulfrum

[sly crater]

copper pick->gold->crimtane/nightmare->molten is for dudes

[pulsar jay]

honestly if you manage to walk over to the ocean without dying and fish up a reaver shark pre boss you deserve the outlaw set

[gusty geode]

Laughs in Meteor Armor

[pulsar jay]

if you manage to bomb rush a chasm pre boss without getting eaten by fucking spiders you also deserve meteor set

[unkempt bolt]

calamity doesnt seem to be a fan of the reaver shark

[distant gyro]

This is some statistics (Gleaming Dagger, tested on Desert Scourge)
Wulfrum Rogue: 1:28
Gladiator: 1:19
Obsidian: 1:19
Victide Rogue: 1:09

[unkempt bolt]

why is victide rogue as fast as it is?

[pulsar jay]

probably that boomerang

[split narwhal]

The seashells increases dps

[unkempt bolt]

from my limited rogue knowledge, isn't gladiator intended to be later?

ah

right

[pulsar jay]

also the seashells pierce i think

[distant gyro]

I believe full victide armor is rarely obtained before defeating DS

unless you really overprepare yourself

[pulsar jay]

ds is a worm

[unkempt bolt]

cnidrion farming

[split narwhal]

Also, what about pumpkin armor?easy to obtain and good set bonus

[pulsar jay]

of course the seashells ate him

[distant gyro]

ok fine here's king slime
Wulfrum Rogue: 1:26
Gladiator: 1:07
Obsidian: 1:04
Victide Rogue: 0:54

[pulsar jay]

what

how

[distant gyro]

I never tested pumpkin armor because pumpkin pre-boss is a fuck / aka event-exclusive memes

[unkempt bolt]

shows the same as before

wulfrum ass, gladiator/obsidian about the same, victide best

[pulsar jay]

victide is best in terms of raw dps maybe but I'm pretty sure obsidian outlaw is stronger on the defensive side

also better for exploring the caverns and hell becsuse of the lava immunties

[distant gyro]

victide has 12 defense + 5% DR + 8% movement speed + extra stats in water

raw obsidian has 15 defense and some typical rogue stats

[split narwhal]

Gladiator technically has more defense than outlaw(21 defense)

[sand umbra]

Gladiator also requires killing some pretty bringeworthy enemies so like

[unkempt bolt]

bringe

[quiet abyss]

@thick arch Actually, it's not random intervals.
Both of WoF's eyes have a set interval that dictates the delay between each laser firing, so msot of the time they should always be firing at the same rate.
It's just that the attack requires a line of sight, so when one eye have their line of sight blocked by solid blocks while the other doesn't, they start to desync.

Though, apart from that your suggestion is valid.

[thick arch]

oh, didnt know that. the way the eyes move up and down through blocks makes it seems very inconsistent, my bad

[clever salmon]

Buff Reven Brain of Cthulu legit free

[ashen warren]

crystal crusher's normal pickaxe swing should be left click and the destructo beam should be right click

[gentle plinth]

The wall of flesh i think is supposed to be chaotic

Light and darkness is within it

[bitter drift]

@thick arch actually i find that he shoots consistently as long as you are not behind cover
if you are then get ready for lasers right after he can see you again

[ashen warren]

iirc wof only starts his chain laser shooting after he lets out a loud growl

[agile cloud]

Lasers have no cue iirc, but it's not random

I believe it's a consistent pattern, although it gets different as it's hp goes down

[agile cloud]

edit: it has multiple consistent patterns, but the pattern it uses changes based on HP

[ashen warren]

People say you can run on a flat platform and never get hit, but I’ve never found this to be true. I thought WoF would aim ahead of you with the lasers

[agile cloud]

It does aim slightly ahead

build floating walls to avoid lasers

jump up, it shoots, lasers hit wall, repeat till the thing is dead

[tired haven]

Never noticed thar it aims ahead ngl

The issue is, to be actually able to just run, you need huge arena so the eyes are spread out

[agile cloud]

Yeah

[tired haven]

Usually you should wave up-down with jumps/wings/boots fly time

[agile cloud]

^

[unkempt bolt]

it's incredibly possible to just get a rhythm of jumping and falling going and never be hit

[agile cloud]

i still cant stress the importance of a few floating walls though

[unkempt bolt]

until he changes pattern because HP or cover

[agile cloud]

Yeah

And patterns dont change much

just gets faster

[tepid root]

iirc the just keep running without doing anything strat only works if the eyes dont move at all, aka the floor and roof of your hell is completely flat, which never happens unless you use smth like TEdit

[agile cloud]

i mean, it CAN happen, but people are too lazy

But yeah, indicators are unnecessary

[toxic kettle]

the latest sug is just wrong lul

pretty sure WoF always shoots three lasers at a time from each eye and the intervals aren't random, they just get shorter as WoF loses health

[agile cloud]

It can be more or less than 3

depending on health

at like 1k on expert it shoots around 10

[tepid root]

god

[tired haven]

imagine spending 10 hours just for flawless wof arena

[agile cloud]

sounds like something you would do 🤔

[tired haven]

Haha, that's exactly opposite of what i do

I try to fluke out waffle fight so i never have to spend those 10 hours

[toxic kettle]

and WoF's eyes and mouth moving through blocks and shifting up/down isn't WoF's fault

[tired haven]

It kinda is, but the only factor that affects wof doing so is block placement. So theoretically, it always goes in the same pattern if you keep arena intact

[toxic kettle]

also can something be straightforward and inconsistent at the same time

[agile cloud]

Straightforward in that it's predetermined patterns, but inconsistent because of block placement/worldgen i guess

[tired haven]

(although damaging wof faster or slower will also affect how quickly wof goes through and thus which points you get shot at)

[agile cloud]

True

[toxic kettle]

imo adding a visible cue for when WoF is about to shoot takes out any difficulty WoF still poses

[agile cloud]

wait it has difficulty?

[tired haven]

If people die to it, it does

[toxic kettle]

you're already pretty much untouchable with the right arena

[agile cloud]

i forget where i saw this, but someone said the difficulty comes out of the arena

or how bad or good it is

[tired haven]

That's a common one, which I also agree with

You basically fight worldgen and your laziness

[agile cloud]

i love losing to myself!

[toxic kettle]

killing yourself with extra steps

[tired haven]

and innocent eyes

[quiet abyss]

imo WoF's difficulty depends mainly on 2 factors
1.) How good/bad your arena is.
2.) How well you can dodge his lasers.
You can get away with only a decent arena if you can dodge the lasers well, but you can also somewhat get away with poor dodging skill if you have a very (over)prepared arena.

[agile cloud]

or a tedit arena

[tired haven]

The catch with that is that you can get away with no skill whatsoever with properly designed arena, but no matter how high your skill is, some worldgen will always screw you until the deliberate fix
Pure imho there tho

[quiet abyss]

True, true.

[agile cloud]

i always underprepare my arenas, then expand it after i stop being stubborn

but the lasers arent a problem

[quiet abyss]

Though arguably it's the fault of the players for not atleast clearing out a portion of the area that they'll be fighting WoF in.

[tired haven]

And there isn't any real fix to that either
Closest we can get is add an attack with cue that will punish mindless movement (maybe preemptive bolt/laser a-la moon lord, but only single)

Yeah, although even if you make a bridge and clean up some tunnels, you may still end up in a situation where eye is on the same line as you and you have nowhere to dodge the stream

[agile cloud]

Its how the boss is designed

[tired haven]

That is, if you don't spend said few hours to fully polish out the battlefield (which gets obnoxiously longer with difficulty mode)

[agile cloud]

I personally dont think changing it to make it more skillful instead of based off of your arena is a good idea

Relogic wanted it this way, why should it be changed

[tired haven]

Because relogic also wanted stormbow to exist

[agile cloud]

Uh

ok fair point.

[fervent citrus]

I have this one suggestion that would be a cool concept for the yharon fight but...

[tired haven]

It sure is arbitrary to fix vanilla just because "it obviously did bad there", but assuming that original solutions are perfect is just as naive

[fervent citrus]

...im not sure whether it will be accepted ;-;

[tired haven]

If you don't try it won't be accepted for sure, so go for it

[agile cloud]

yharon suggestions are welcome to me

[frail mantle]

imo spending hours to make an arena should be rewarded

[ashen warren]

Of course there’s also the fact that higher difficulties makes those hours the norm rather than a rewardable action

[fervent citrus]

Well, we all know the part where yharon heals right? So umm, it would be cool if yharon stayed in one place during healing, and to keep the fight there could be some sort of bullet hell as he is doing so, and i spose the bullets would disappear after the healing so the player can r u n

[tired haven]

It is rewarded, and it will stay rewarded for sure
But the trouble is, you may as well skip fight if the arena makes it "hold a/d and m1"

Also mhm, curious

[indigo fog]

So make yharon's phase 2 transition a bullet hell

[fervent citrus]

My sugg in my head vs my sugg in reality

[agile cloud]

What sort of bullet hell though

akin to Scal? or something more like DoG laser walls

[indigo fog]

What's wrong with his current phase 2 transition?

[fervent citrus]

I guess you could phrase it like that

Well, uhh, one would like the healing to be more... uhh...

...dramatic? :l

[indigo fog]

There's no bullet hell in any other part of the fight

[fervent citrus]

Very poor choice of words

[indigo fog]

why would we need one for this specific part

[tired haven]

p2 is a slight bullet hell but i digress, heh

[agile cloud]

I like the idea of a bullet hell, but it would have to be unique/inspired

and i agree, p2 is crap flying all over the place

veryfun

[fervent citrus]

I know, it doesnt have to be similar to other ones

Maybe splitting bullets, moving diagonally or smth

Maybe fireballs instead of bullets

[indigo fog]

It just seems kinda out of place knowing that it's in no other part of the fight

[fervent citrus]

I mean, yharon needs to rest during healing, right?

[agile cloud]

in theory

[tired haven]

The anecdote of mod design btw:
If it's similar to something else, it is uninspired and not added
If it's a totally new concept, then too much effort spent coding it and thus not added

(not sure what i tried to bring in the convo with that but yknow)

[ashen warren]

/\

[agile cloud]

lazy or unimplemented

[fervent citrus]

Well, i guess that wont happen

[ashen warren]

I think it’s a better idea than the current way he heals

[agile cloud]

it would be nice if it happened

[ashen warren]

I mean, he just fuckin does it

[agile cloud]

current healing is boring

While charging head first into you

[fervent citrus]

Oh, i spose theres some sense then :P

Cant tell myself

[tired haven]

Special healing animation could have been hot, but hard to design the attack pattern for it ngl

[ashen warren]

Perhaps making it more general would help

[agile cloud]

we could reuse sprites from other fireballs in the fight

[ashen warren]

Suggesting a unique phase for Yharon healing, and using a bullet hell as an example of what it could look like, is more likely to work

[agile cloud]

from what i've seen, spriting holds back stuff the most

[fervent citrus]

Well, maybe there doesnt have to be an animation, he could just flap his wings in one spot

[agile cloud]

but thats an animation

[fervent citrus]

...for the whole fight, so another one isnt required :P

Modify yharon's healing phase
Reason: Right now the healing phase feels a bit... funky, changing up yharon's healing would add more depth and immersion to the fight. There are a few ways to do it but one idea i can suggest is have yharon stay in one place, healing up (perhaps add a beam of light towards the sky, for spicynees :P) and some sort of bullet hell for the fight to continue without the player just waiting. The bullet hell doesn't have to look like other ones (DoG laser wall, SCal bullet hell, etc.) But then, it's only an example of what can happen during yharon's healing, the opportunities are endless.

Critics, please :P

[agile cloud]

⭐

[fervent citrus]

[hexed ore]

Could be a smooth, quick, 1 by 1 hp healing (Kinda like how masochist bosses heal when you die)

That but really fast

[fervent citrus]

Hmm, wouldnt that be a bit laggy? Not an expert tho so i cant tell

[hexed ore]

It doesn't have to show every single "1" every time he heals, but it might make some lag if there's also a bunch of other stuff going on

[fervent citrus]

Well, thats for the devs to decide :P

I only wanted a more dramatic healing phase

[hexed ore]

Yeah, the current one is a bit... anticlimactic

[fervent citrus]

Yes :P

[gray nebula]

"because it'd be cool"

Epic reasoning

[hallow kraken]

Would this count as a SIS or am I dumb

[gray nebula]

Not really a sis

It's an item suggestion but not specific

[hallow kraken]

sick

[worthy fiber]

Thorium has a crab mount anyways

[indigo fog]

It's still in the don'ts to have a reason as weak as that though

"it would be cool" isn't good enough

[tired haven]

Something like "expanding on mounts in prehardmode, the time when your movement is the most restricted and lacking" could already give a more reasonable picture

although that implies that crabulon mount would have some outstanding mobility and by the looks of the dude it doesn't seem to be the case, hehe. maybe the young version of crabulon would be more agile though

[hollow shell]

@fervent citrus You could elaborate more on why his healing phase is flawed
You just kinda say that it's "funky" and then go right into suggesting changes

[fervent citrus]

hmm, how do i change it?

finally good reasoning :D

[hollow shell]

What about his healing phase makes it "funky"?

[fervent citrus]

im not sure, i dont know what word would fit because fuck my english, so i just went for funky

[hollow shell]

I mean
why do you want it to be changed

What's wrong with it

[fervent citrus]

well, what was it someone said, uhh

lemme check just a sec

im a fucking idiot yea

well, it adds more of a...

...dramatic effect?

i dunno

my sugg prolly wont reach 120 votes tbh

[frosty dagger]

I'm going to sug the second part of my attempt at an OOA reform

[fervent citrus]

gl :P

[hollow shell]

Those are better words than 'funky', yes

Do you not know the reasoning behind your own sugg?

You doin it on behalf of another person?

[frosty dagger]

I think I'm done editing it for now until you guys come up with new ideas

I'm doing it because nobody does OOA, and I think that's an issue

There is nobody this is for

[rancid urchin]

i have a question, because I want to make a suggestion about this. what other mounts are accessible early prehardmode besides Slime?

[frosty dagger]

I'm trying to come up with solutions, though someone brought this up when I posted the other one

[worthy fiber]

Rabbit, Turtle, Bee

Drill

[frosty dagger]

Slime is the only viable mount for all of pre hm and quite a lot of hm

[tired haven]

Bee isn't early doe

[rancid urchin]

^

[worthy fiber]

oh, earlypre-hm

There's also the Angry Dog, though it's pretty weak for a shrine item

[rancid urchin]

i see..

[tired haven]

Basilisk prehm bad?
Not wrong tbh

[worthy fiber]

Expecting players to tank when it does summon damage

[tired haven]

ikr

[worthy fiber]

Having it puke snow or something would be neat

[rancid urchin]

Something like "expanding on mounts in prehardmode, the time when your movement is the most restricted and lacking" could already give a more reasonable picture

Crab, if i expanded on what you said, would that be a legal suggestion?

[tired haven]

Of course, it's not copyrighted or smth, just an example
Just make sure it makes sense at the end

[rancid urchin]

alright, thanks

is that good wording?

[hollow shell]

Seems like a good suggestion

[proud isle]

Trashers killed me while afk with 17 minions post plantera in hardcore

[hollow shell]

Don't afk in hardcore

[frosty dagger]

[gusty geode]

Isn't pre-hardmode supposed to be limited

[frosty dagger]

Yes

[hollow shell]

Mounts are already kinda limiting
what with how they make you chonky, gotta activate em, can't do certain things while mounted, (and are often slower than Hermes)

but they're better than walkin

[frosty dagger]

If there was a slower brimrose with much less flight time there would still be absolutely broken things you can do with it pre skeleton

[hollow shell]

What, you mean the bee mount?

[frosty dagger]

Ok pre evil bosses

I'm a bit of an idiot

Still though, bee mount would be really for DS, eow, hives, and crab

[tired haven]

[frosty dagger]

Ok never mind I'm not just a bit of an idiot

[tired haven]

The gripe with bee mount is it's too slow even compared to what you usually have
So yeah, it is just as limiting

[frosty dagger]

Imagine actually haveing at least one brain cell at all times

I don't have the brain cell required to do that rn

[tired haven]

Eh, i prefer random (2) tbh

But w/e

[frosty dagger]

If this one doesn't go through on Wednesday, I'm gonna post another one about buffing OOA items

I am determined to find a solution people like

[indigo fog]

or we can just make it despawn

unless im missing something

[thorny cradle]

That would work too, but for whatever reason that hasn't been done.

[fervent citrus]

@ rover i was doing it on behalf a few people :P

[indigo fog]

Why won't you just suggest for it to despawn instead then?

you shouldn't be able to refight it at all

[thorny cradle]

Because thats the smart thing to do

And I am an idiot at times.

[hollow shell]

tbh I like being able to continue the WoF fight cuz it's already a bitch getting back to him

It's definitely not a free cheese

[thorny cradle]

Laughs in alchemistnpclite

[hollow shell]

Nobody should ever balance around Alchemist NPC...

[indigo fog]

If WoF despawns earlier then I don't have to wait to fight it again

i have to wait until it passes through the world

[thorny cradle]

You can also use the zen debuff it inflicts to do stuff as well.

[cyan glen]

Talking about WoF, He is cheeseable only running in the mouth plataform, why not make him blast something from his mouth?

[indigo fog]

Stuff like what?

[zealous ridge]

i mean

leeches

but

[cyan glen]

leeches are

easy to kill

[zealous ridge]

maybe he shoots something alongside the leech?

[cyan glen]

maybe do that they can't be killed in a time? or that

[thorny cradle]

Have him shoot dynamite

[cyan glen]

uh, no

[thorny cradle]

[zealous ridge]

[cyan glen]

maybe like the brimmy laser

but bigger

and cannot move

[thorny cradle]

So like a ML laser?

[zealous ridge]

no

masomode already does phantasmal deathray

[thorny cradle]

Yeah

[zealous ridge]

for like every boss, including Wof

[cyan glen]

Yeh, but from his eyes

not his mouth

[zealous ridge]

but

why?

[thorny cradle]

Yes because we need another lazer when we go DeathMaso.

[cyan glen]

but yeah, maybe a bloody laser, id

idk

or meat balls?

like, lauching at high speed meat balls from hismouth?

[thorny cradle]

I could see it

[zealous ridge]

maybe something to do with demon scythes

perhaps he summons a ring of demon scythes when he finishes his leech vomit attack

[cyan glen]

Well, that is very used in maso

[thorny cradle]

Like a smaller, redder version of the leviathan projectiles.

[cyan glen]

^^^^^

A meatball

lul

[zealous ridge]

wait wut

demon scythes in maso?

you mean like

[cyan glen]

yuuup

[zealous ridge]

eoc?

[cyan glen]

and masoboss

[zealous ridge]

[cyan glen]

also, i see more like he vomit something instead of launching demon scythes

Or, do the eyes try to predict your movents like ML

[thorny cradle]

Oh god

[cyan glen]

GOnna be hell, but

[thorny cradle]

That would be terrible

[cyan glen]

No cheese in calamity

[zealous ridge]

no

[thorny cradle]

Laughs in W A L L

[zealous ridge]

no eye prediction

ml lasers are annoying enough, and note that ml doesnt spam phantasmal bolt

unlike wof

on rev, at least

[cyan glen]

Ml proyectiles are very easy to dodge lel, minus the eyes

[zealous ridge]

but

nvm im not gonna do this rn

[cyan glen]

[zealous ridge]

[wary canyon]

works for me

[indigo fog]

Aren't there like 3 sound based weapons

[wary canyon]

my friend insists on playing bard

[glossy marten]

even if there are only 4, it still helps nontheless

and it's not like those sound based weapons are weak

cough cough face melter

[hollow shell]

Heck
"Thorium crossover content (such as Healer/Bard items)" is a Don't

but this is a greyer area cuz it's not new items (and also the Don't is from SIS era)

[glossy marten]

why so?

[hollow shell]

It's a Frequently Suggested one
People asked for them a lot in the past

[glossy marten]

it's not like this is downright crossover content

[wary canyon]

yeh

[glossy marten]

it's just changing item's damage type

[hollow shell]

Indeed, that's why it's greyer area

[glossy marten]

like melee and rogue weapons that are the same

[wary canyon]

I feel like this is more mod compatibility than crossover

[glossy marten]

yeah

crossover content is like adding an auric tesla bard helmet

[hollow shell]

m
I'll allow this one, but I've gotta think more about the Don't

[radiant meadow]

personally not a fan of the idea

also, I don't know how to do it, but that's a different story

[wary canyon]

I mean are you really gonna farm for eidolic wail as a mage

[glossy marten]

it's def possible, mods like g realm have done stuff like that before

[radiant meadow]

that doesn't mean I know how to do it

it probably involves mod calls

and I don't know what Thorium's mod calls are

[hollow shell]

Gotta ask Diver

[digital saddle]

"make wof even more of a pain"

[glossy marten]

bosses are a pain depending on your class/weapon/equipment, wof is easy to cheese due to it not regenerating(as the suggestion stated), so if you have, say, a way to teleport to the underworld quickly you can beat wof very easily and cheesily, so I think that suggestion is reasonable

[digital saddle]

It's a literal brick wall to progression, requires a ridiculous amount of arena prep relative to current level of mobility, and puts you on a hard time limit

It really doesn't need to be a super difficult boss imo

[glossy marten]

I wouldn't call the time limit hard, although it heavily depends on the size of your world

I, for one, always play in large worlds so it's not a problem to me

wof is one of those bosses difficulty of which depends on a lot of stuff

[digital saddle]

Hard time limit as in: set in stone

[glossy marten]

like, A LOT of stuff

[digital saddle]

In general my opinion on cheese is if you don't like it don't do it

Unless it's so pathetically easy to cheese that there's no point

Like vanilla king slime

Or so difficult cheesing is almost mandatory

See: ufo

[frosty dagger]

Together, we can make OOA great again

[late cypress]

Here's a suggestion I made when I realized sawtooth shark shoots projectiles with Luxor's Gift.

Blacklist drills, saws, and everything relating to those tools from the Luxor's Gift effect
❔: Currently, all drills have no usetime and can be spammed very fast. They appear as a melee projectile to Luxor's Gift, so the projectile may be spammed very fast as well. Tools should not be usable as weapons, let alone weapons that have the potential to shoot 30 (60fps/2) projectiles in one second dealing 17 (510+ dps) damage each.

Note, this is pre-boss with a sawtooth shark.

[hallow kraken]

Should probably mention that in the sug

[glossy marten]

I think this is a good idea that is rather pointless: why would anyone use a tool to attack? and even if someone figured it out, it's not like it makes the bosses easy, just easier

[indigo fog]

This has been suggested before but idk if that reached 120 stars

[hallow kraken]

If a tool can be exploited to attack, then people will use it to attack

[glossy marten]

but if allows you to exploit like 4 fights at max, is it realy that much of an issue

[hallow kraken]

that sounds like a lot of fights for a tool

[glossy marten]

plus, as @digital saddle said

In general my opinion on cheese is if you don't like it don't do it

[late cypress]

Yeah, makes sense. I just tested it and I does really pitiful damage. Its a good suggestion with no real repercussions if it stays in the game.

[glossy marten]

exactly

[hallow kraken]

Alright

But I’ve gotta say, that’s a pretty bad thought process you brought up there

[glossy marten]

why so?

[hallow kraken]

If cheese is present in something, then it’s an unintended easier way of doing something. Even if someone doesn’t want to use it, there’s always other people who will use it and take away the challenging part of whatever they’re playing, depending on how big the cheese is.

[glossy marten]

ok but why is that a bad thing

[hallow kraken]

Because cheese if an unintended easier way to do something, keyword unintended

[glossy marten]

some people don't play for the challenge

some play for the items

some play for the building

[late cypress]

Well, Halibut Cannon is still in the game for those who don't like playing for challenge 😛

[glossy marten]

plus halibut is actually hard to get

[hallow kraken]

I’m fine with people not wanting to play for challenge, but using an unintended way to cheat something removes other points of the game regardless of what they are trying to play for

Actually can we define what cheese in terraria is

[glossy marten]

star cannon in vanilla

that's cheese

it's very op

at the time you can get it(pre boss post orb smash)

[late cypress]

meteor armor + space gun in vanilla normal

is also cheese

[glossy marten]

meteor is cheese

let's say that

in vanilla of course

[hallow kraken]

meteor is intended to be obtainable pre boss, so I wouldn’t call that cheese

[glossy marten]

I wouldn't say it was intended to be that powerful

[hallow kraken]

but it was intended to be at its tier

[glossy marten]

maybe

vanilla actually has a lot of cheese

[late cypress]

carries to all of pre-hardmode

[glossy marten]

cough cough daedalus+holy arrows

cough cough meteor staff

[hallow kraken]

alright something to say here

meteor staff

[glossy marten]

it's op

trust me

[hallow kraken]

no

[glossy marten]

it's early hardmode and it rains doom

[hallow kraken]

anyways

[glossy marten]

huge dps

[hallow kraken]

To define what cheese is in general, it’s an unintended way to make something easier

[glossy marten]

true

[indigo fog]

Ice bombs are easy to dodge if you have a large arena with RoD available. You need to just stay away from them.

also ice bombs not exploding doesn't even make sense

they're bombs

Ice bomb explosions can't cover your entire arena if it's large enough

[bitter vessel]

Like i said you just have to go to another part of your arena to avoid them, they dont add anything to the fight except frustrations if you accidentially run into the edge of the area covered by them

[indigo fog]

How do you accidentally run into a part of the arena that is covered by them?

you can RoD out of the way

The best way to dodge them is to teleport away before they explode

imo they really aren't that bad

[bitter vessel]

they arent that bad but they arent any good. they are annoying at best. i think they could be more interesting

and usually i dont farm a RoD before cryogen but that would be my problem then

[indigo fog]

RoD is pretty easy to farm for if you fish

also does making the bombs do nothing like SG mines really make them more interesting?

[bitter vessel]

i know i stull didnt consider cryogen a boss where i should need it

and i dont know, i havent seen it yet, but i figure it would

[tired haven]

RoD being mandatory for any attack is bad design

[indigo fog]

I never said RoD was mandatory. I just said it's the easiest way to dodge them

[tired haven]

Well, it isn't exactly mandatory in that part: just that if there really isn't more reliable ways to go, then it's rather sad

[bitter vessel]

do you think they make the fight more interesting or funy in any way?

[indigo fog]

I just don't think having them sit still and do nothing is the way to nerf it.

but i'm not exactly sure how you would nerf it though

[bitter vessel]

it doesnt even have to be a nerf just make them less annoying. There is no fun in dodging them like the rest of his attacks are

[bitter vessel]

I just tried around a bit agian and especially in his last phase there sometimes is no other way than the RoD to get out of the bombs area since he is charging really fast without there being much room to leave the area exept teleporting

[frosty dagger]

This is gonna be really acward because for some reason I have to remove my discord tab and reload it for things to update

Nerf baurinadical

Rangers have access to the Daedelus Stormbow, and that makes Aquatic Scourge kinda easy so you can get the baurinadical for basically free. This isn't that big of an issue, but this weapon has a much higher dps that all ranger weapons obtainable after Calamitas (not Plantera), and has the hightest DPS of all these weapons (not including halibut canon). This weapon is by far the best ranger weapon at everything until plant, so rangers have almost no options at this point because of a weapon you get for free. It makes the gameplay much more boring in all aspects of the game for rangers, and this point in proggression lasts a exceptionally long time.

If either y'all are not saying anything or you are and my discord is breaking, either way, I'm gonna post it

[void kelp]

uh, its *Barinautical

[gray nebula]

br

[void kelp]

and it'd help to provide kill times for comparison w other weapons at the tier

[gray nebula]

also AS is an alternative to the mech bosses and the mechs don't really have any set order, so yes it's normal that it's strong for stuff before plantera because that's the tier you get it at

[frosty dagger]

How bout 1200 DPS abridge vs a third other rangers weps at 600 DPS, half at 850 DPS, and the rest at 1000, I tested all of the weps, but I guess I should add that in

[ashen warren]

what if the barinautical becomes the version of it when you have too much fire rate

aka it fires 2 arrows

in a fast rate

[frosty dagger]

I think it already does that

[ashen warren]

barinautical*

:))

[hollow shell]

funny

@iron stirrup 👍 🏁 https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/685731692530761752
@proper otter 👍 https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/684485522483052544
@woeful ginkgo 🚫 https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/685610394722631743
@ashen warren 👍 https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/682275013176590388

[woeful ginkgo]

What a terrible day

on top of that too?

geez man

[hollow shell]

oof, sorry to hear that

[woeful ginkgo]

no need to be sorry man

it was entirely my fault

[frosty dagger]

Sometimes devs just don't want something

[hollow shell]

I hope you feel better soon

[woeful ginkgo]

man I have talked to like

already multiple people now

[hexed ore]

Or you could, like, not get it

[woeful ginkgo]

All I have now is an unbearable sadness

[frosty dagger]

I diagnose you with the big sad

F

[hollow saffron]

@frosty dagger remember, baranautical doesnt home

that can contribute to lower dps because you miss

[terse sundial]

Could you provide boss killtimes as well? ^

[wary canyon]

my sugg got to way over 120

is there a way to know if the devs have seen it?

sorry if this has been asked 10 trillion times before

[wooden wedge]

green checkmark

[vital marlin]

green checkbox means its delivered

[wary canyon]

ah ok

thank you

[frosty dagger]

I would do kill times against cloneamitas later, but it doesn't matter, the sug is not even gonna get close

I am aware barinaudical doesn't home, but despite that it still has much higher dps

[wooden wedge]

I won't get any stars if you put no effort into it

[hollow shell]

Terra?

[frosty dagger]

I did put effort but I see not point in adding more

[wooden wedge]

I think it might be a borderlands reference

hide of terramorphus

[hollow shell]

Oh, right

yeah

[frosty dagger]

If it was above 15 I would, but it stands no chance, even with a kill time

[wooden wedge]

like, 15 stars?

[frosty dagger]

Yes, then I would assume it has the slightest chance in making it and would put in the extra effort to do EVERY ranger weps post mechs against Clonamitas, but I don't want to waste my time

[wooden wedge]

your sug is like

super new

[frosty dagger]

Every time I got a new wep I got excited, only to see it fall far short of barinaudicals damage

[wooden wedge]

less than 2 hours old

I don't see why getting 15 stars in 2 hours has anything to do with putting effort into it

you just seem lazy

[frosty dagger]

I also know how many stars a sug roughly has to have to stand a chance at different timestamps. If I had thought of kill times and that apparently DPS checks isn't sufficient I would have done it when I first made the sug, but it's to late now, enough people have already seen it and decided no.

[wooden wedge]

do you think everyone who looks at suggs all look at it when a sug gets posted

because that's not what happens

[frosty dagger]

If you think me not wasting my time is lazy, then I guess you think I'm lazy, but I'm not going to do it. Also I forgot to mention it, but the people who have seen it now work as a sample for the general population, and I don't think kill times over DPS would make it do a complete 180.

[fervent zealot]

it would help though

[wooden wedge]

you're right

it wouldn't make a complete 180

[frosty dagger]

I don't care if it would make it help if it won't make it anyway

[fervent zealot]

and also your suggestion was posted 2 hours ago give it some time jeez

[frosty dagger]

Ok, but when it caps off below 60 I'm gonna have to say I told you so

[wooden wedge]

bruh

[frosty dagger]

I used this against brimmy, twins, sprime, cloneamitas, and plant. I would have used it against cryo by doing AS first, but I didn't know how strong this wep was then so I didn't. If I had it it would have halved the time of my cryo fight. I didn't use it against destroyer because Daedelus Stormbow. For all of the farming in this time the only wep I used was Barinadical. It got real boring real fast, but I guess the sug is to specific.

[digital saddle]

out of curiosity... is there a reason vanilla hardmode armors dont have bonus rogue/summoner variants w/ this mod?

i would suggest to add them

but it seems like something that would have been suggested so often that there's a reason they havent done it

[frosty dagger]

Blue check, but you can do it anyway

I very well agree with you on this one

[distant gyro]

oremors kinda bad and bloaty

especially the trio of cobalt, mythril, and adamantite

[tired haven]

Mage tends to disagree but no one plays mage so eh

[digital saddle]

titanium at least

is good

[gusty geode]

I like to think that there are so many early HM ores because it was trying to replicate pre-boss pre-hardmode to a degree
With how much there is to do after WoF I could see the devs thinking the tier is bigger than it statistically is

[digital saddle]

the cobalt mythril adamantite progression is a relic of the past

from when mechanical bosses were endgame

[hollow shell]

@vital marlin You might wanna elaborate further in your suggestion as to what the buff is and why it should be in the display

(I say this because I noticed the sugg wasn't immediately getting a bunch of stars
even though this is a relatively noticeable oversight that we've fixed in other areas)

[ashen warren]

adding a buff would clutter up buff slots even more tbh

if temporary buffs from accs and armour worked like the enhancements from thorium or smth I'd be more on board with this buff icon trend

[umbral mulch]

Yeah the flesh totem icon already made me get rid of a potion and I don't think adding more is really a good idea

[gusty geode]

Isn't Amadias kinda like that
A Calamity Guide

[toxic kettle]

pretty much

[mighty knot]

@strong jacinth you mean like ❕?

[strong jacinth]

❕ just means it hasn't been reviewed yet

[toxic kettle]

❕ isn't a dislike button

[mighty knot]

well, I guess

[gray nebula]

bruh alert

bruh (bruh)

someone already suggested that

and I already bruh'd at this previous one

chances are, if the suggestion is stupid, the devs will deny it

[gusty grail]

i feel like we should have a it breaks rules on

[ashen warren]

You know that the sugg reaction legend specifically states that ❕is not the opposite of ⭐️

[gusty grail]

not one opposite

[gray nebula]

but like

no

[wooden wedge]

aren't sugs for

[gray nebula]

the moderators are already here, we don't need public reactions to know if something breaks the rules or not

[wooden wedge]

just the mod?

and if there was an auto delete people could abuse it

[ashen warren]

Suggs for the server are allowed

[wooden wedge]

uh huh

[gray nebula]

they are

[wooden wedge]

then why are they in the don't doc wh

[gray nebula]

by your logic you shouldn't suggest... mod suggestions?

[toxic kettle]

those are just categories

[gray nebula]

^

[toxic kettle]

but Server suggestions only has one entry anyway

forgot what it was

[gray nebula]

yeah, no true offtopic/meme channel

because its moderation hell iirc

[vocal grotto]

Just because the explanation point doesn't mean a reverse star officially doesn't mean people won't use it as such

Nothing's stopping them

[gray nebula]

Well the bot stops them now

[vocal grotto]

Ah, it does?

[gray nebula]

it auto removes the !

[toxic kettle]

smart

[vocal grotto]

I see

[gray nebula]

it also auto removes any other reaction

rip funny meme emotes

[tired haven]

well you can always break a bot

but shh

[gray nebula]

also that suggestion above sounds a lot like a npc from another mod

[tired haven]

The Tracker?

[gusty grail]

deviant

[gray nebula]

joost mod iirc

[wooden wedge]

deviantt doesn't tell you to look out for monsters though?

she just gives out tips

[strong jacinth]

deviantt summons rare enemies you walnut

[gusty grail]

na i was talking about the help button

aka guide being useless on maso

[strong jacinth]

ohk

[gusty grail]

it really annoys me

that the terraria devs

didnt add new text to guide

[gray nebula]

amidias guides you too

and you get him after killing DS (and giant clam) who's usually your first calamity boss

so like epic

[tired haven]

At this point I just wonder how many people actually used guide unironically throughout the game history

[radiant meadow]

people who don't know about recipe browser

[tired haven]

For the progression part that is

[radiant meadow]

the other function is useless

[gray nebula]

wacky and uncharacteristic vague indication

you
possibly kill something?

[hollow shell]

@vague valve Add a reason

@strong jacinth Add a reason

I'm gonna add that to the Don'ts doc, actually
Not actually as a don't, but put it at the top

[sand umbra]

a sugg that literally asks for an anti-star

okay so

1. people already used❕for this in the past even though that's not the purpose of the emote

b) very important thing here:

if you don't like a sugg, don't fuakn star it

[ashen warren]

1)
b)

[hallow kraken]

Here’s a better idea: tell us why you don’t like the sug here

[sand umbra]

that can also work

byeah
if you don't like a sugg, either talk about it here or simply don't star it
there has never been and likely never will be any sort of downvote system, the number of stars a sugg possesses is already a fairly good measure of its popularity amongst the common playerbase

@strong jacinth this is directly correlated to your sugg, please read the above

[lost agate]

sounds appropiate for the task

[ashen warren]

if a dislike or downvote system was added then no controversial but important suggestion could exist

even if my suggestion to ban sprites wasn't accepted, what did happen is it introduced the idea to the public and now it's almost an unspoken rule of sorts. barring specific item ban of course lmoa
if dislikes existed my suggestion would've died before anybody saw it

as an example

[sand umbra]

I feel like I probably have an example I could use here but I don't know if I do nor am I in a mood to dig one up

wait a minute yes I do have an example

the lack of a dislike/downvote system is more than likely the only reason my sugg about making HM Abyss shit only post-Clonamitas ever came to pass

[tired haven]

Ah yes
Every nerf ever: 🙃 👎

[lost agate]

does the bot auto delete reactions?

yyyup seems like it

[hollow saffron]

honestly a downvote system could be abused

like, to brigade posts with tons of dislikes

look at reddit when someone has an opinion for example

[pulsar jay]

item nerfs wouldn't be able to exist

and again

[tired haven]

Don't forget about "WHO THE HELL DISLIKED REEE"

[pulsar jay]

nothing worse than giving people the option to just be like "BAD" without any valid reason

[tired haven]

(and thus accidental downvote chains)

[pulsar jay]

that's the thing about not having dislikes

if you want someone to know you don't like their idea you gotta tell them why

this generally prompts a conversation

that may ultimately allow the OP to improve the suggestion

[lost agate]

or it ends in an argument

[tired haven]

Yeah. Stars can get away with no opinion because they essentially mean you like the most of the suggestion already and see no issues

Also lel

[pulsar jay]

well if you like it what is there to say

[queen sail]

Thats just how life be

[pulsar jay]

compliments don't mean anything in the grand scheme of things to be frank

anyone can compliment you even if it isn't deserved

take earth lord for example

[tired haven]

Let's not take that one

[pulsar jay]

it's obviously whoever made it was either young, drunk, or high or all of the above

but look at the comments

a bunch of other drunk, young, or high people are praising the thing

[queen sail]

Considering this community the latter two are out of the question

[tired haven]

Or rather the former (first former) being a dominant option. But shh

[fervent citrus]

I like how someone's reasoning behind cryo's ice bombs is just

[tired haven]

Tbh judging people by opinions on that single idea is rather rude, anyway

[fervent citrus]

"Annoying as hell"

[lost agate]

taking fan ideas wiki seriously is probably a bad idea to begin with

cuz who knows how many people there are legit and how many just go for the memes

but what do i know

[fervent citrus]

More than me

[tired haven]

You know that the fan ideas wiki is questionable location

[tepid root]

"crazy gamer" moment

[sleek wadi]

It'd be kinda neat if the ice bombs were an enemy but summoner suffers with Cryogen enough so I'm not gonna bother making my own take on that suggestion.

[lost agate]

cryogen becomes cold hive mind

[sleek wadi]

Hive Mind suffers a brain-freeze, the suggestion

[hollow saffron]

what to do when someone uses the ice key:
say "Alexa, play Antarctic reinforcement"
Set weather to snow
Spam ice bomb

tbh for a ruined magical castle cryo has some swanky security systems though

[ashen warren]

Well it’s also chaotic and DERPING OUT, so I wouldn’t expect it to make sense

[smoky wagon]

Have they still kept the “derping out” text in after all this time

Feels like an antiquated meme

[hollow shell]

yep

There was a conversation about changing it to a more serious message with a small chance for it to be derping out, so it's more of an easter egg than an official fight thing

but we haven't acted on it (yet)

[hallow hatch]

I like that hahah

Easter eggs are fun

[fervent citrus]

My yharon sugg is halfway to 120 votes

If it doesnt reach 120, ill prolly rephrase it so it sounds better and send it

[last star]

Any opinions on my suggestion that needs answering?

[open brook]

Idk,nerf of the bad debuffs?

[last star]

Basicly yes either nerf or removing of the negative sideeffects

[distant gyro]

removing is definitely a no

[open brook]

This ^

[frail mantle]

problem with old lore items was that they were a free boost

[open brook]

This too^

[frail mantle]

now there's actually a penalty outside of inventory clutter

[last star]

They werent free tho, it costs inventory

Ah

[zenith hazel]

they were still very much free

if you can't loosen up your inventory for like 3 slots or so, then you might need to reevaluate your inventory management

[open brook]

Ehh

Nice (?

[last star]

What if we just revamp the punnishments? Like the eye giving improved vision underground always (since lack of daylight) but lowered on surface during day?

Cause like underground doesnt really have a day night cycle anyway

[distant gyro]

mfw lowered vision doesn't even affect the surface during day

[last star]

But it makes no sence for it to have a cycle underground tho

Like at all

[distant gyro]

no we're probably not going to revisit blackfadein again

[last star]

Like the dessert scourge one i can see is fine in terms of punnishments but the eye and clam just feels weird

I have an idea

What about changing the crab one to make you slower on surface/dessert since its dryer than the damp dark areas underground and have the regen affect you underground because the mushrooms collect moisture and grow in the dark areas underground and empower your regen while on the surface they dont give you kt because they dry upp?

Opinions?

[distant gyro]

the clam one?

uhhh

oh, crab

[last star]

Crabulon sorry

What do u think?

[distant gyro]

that sounds as weird as the current one

[last star]

More logical tho and feels less bad

[distant gyro]

also harder to explain in 2 short sentences

[last star]

Provides regen underground and slows during day on surface and dessert

(I could make it sound more narrator like and lore stuffs if u want)

Opinion? Yey or nay?

[ashen warren]

is abyssal elemental a trashed concept?

[worthy fiber]

Talking about the one in the art server contest from a while back?

Don't think it was ever intended to be in the mod itself

[ashen warren]

ye that

[hollow galleon]

I think some negatives could be removed

like I think increased night vision isn't that much of an advantage

[indigo fog]

Slightly reduced vision during the day isn't that much of a disadvantage either.

especially since you can just take it off

[distant gyro]

the advantage is as easy to notice as the disadvantage

but half the disadvantage is nullified for reduced day vision only being a concern underground

[indigo fog]

farming his summon is pretty boring and sometimes hard

[[Fish of Eleum]]

[red storm]

https://calamitymod.gamepedia.com/Fish_of_Eleum

[indigo fog]

what are you talking about

[glossy marten]

But I doubt that a lot of people go fishing for items they need, although I also think that making boss minions drop anything is a bad idea

[indigo fog]

It's extremely helpful to fish in calamity, and is very easy in early-hardmode

[glossy marten]

Cataclysm and catastrophe don't count, they could as well be seperate bosses

I know, I enjoy fihing, in fact

But just cause its helpful doesn't mean a lot of people are going to do it

It can take a long time

[indigo fog]

I'm just saying farming the materials for cryo key isnt hard at all

and fishing is by far the easiest way to do it

[glossy marten]

The easiest way is just using zerg and going to the correct biomes

[indigo fog]

You can die pretty easily at the beginning of hardmode though

[glossy marten]

I thought calamity nerfs pre-mech hardmode

[indigo fog]

does it?

there are also a lot of really good fishing gear you get right after hardmode

[glossy marten]

I definitely saw something like that on the list of changes

On the wiki

[indigo fog]

can you show it here?

what got changed

also if pre-mech hardmode is nerfed in calamity that just makes farming the cryo key even easier

this isn't necessary at all

[distant gyro]

I think you take 20% less damage from all sources in hardmode until you defeat a hm boss

same as pre-boss revengeance

[amber escarp]

Farming for cryogen materials is not that hard, but it's still really boring. Honestly, i didn't knew about fish of eleum, that kinda helps things, but i don't really see a reason to not implement another way like the one i suggested to get eleum. I mean, i had to farm for like 10 of those keys, without zerg potion or chaos key because i didn't know about that god forsaken fish.

[distant gyro]

https://calamitymod.gamepedia.com/Vanilla_changes#Enemies_.26_Bosses

[indigo fog]

Boss minions shouldn't drop things

that's why

[glossy marten]

Exactly

They're supposed to be like projectiles that can die and have an ai

Aka without anything unique being dropped

[indigo fog]

Actually i might suggest for BoC creepers and EoW segments to not drop things at all because that's stupid

[glossy marten]

I disagree on this specific instance

[indigo fog]

You can get hellstone without killing those bosses first though

[glossy marten]

But it requires fishing

[amber escarp]

lol

[indigo fog]

Fishing?

[glossy marten]

Yeah

The reaver shark

Explosives don't work before wof

[amber escarp]

No, i don't think that's what izzy is talking about

[indigo fog]

I'm talking about creepers dropping tissue samples and EoW segments dropping shadow scales

[amber escarp]

yea

[glossy marten]

And that's a good thing

[indigo fog]

you can't just get hellstone before those bosses

[glossy marten]

It allows sequence breaking

[indigo fog]

I don't see how that's a good thing though

[glossy marten]

And I don't see how that is a bad thing

[indigo fog]

Those items are meant to be locked behind those bosses

[amber escarp]

Yeah, even in "please do not suggest" list, there's a part where it says "do not suggest things that make game less non-linear" or smth like that

I mean

You can kill plantera

before mechs

[glossy marten]

If you're willing to go to the underworld before skeltron youdl deserve it

You deserve the stuff you get there

[amber escarp]

i actually done that in my recent walkthrough

although i only got myself a pickaxe

[glossy marten]

I got myself a pick and got to mining hellstone in some playthrough

[indigo fog]

But do you deserve Crimson Armor for just killing the Creepers and not defeating BoC?

[glossy marten]

Yes

It's the earliest actually decent not class specific armour

[amber escarp]

me: first armor is gladiators

I just love killing all first bosses without armor at all

[glossy marten]

Wof can be your first boss if you're brave enough

[amber escarp]

The reason for all of these things, like an ability to kill plant before mechs, is to make a game more non-linear, and same goes for brain and worm drop their ingredients

[glossy marten]

Non linearity is agood thing

[indigo fog]

Yes, but that's actually challenging and you're being rewarded. For Creepers you're taking the easier way out by not even finishing the fight.

That's like prime's arms dropping mechanical bars. it's the exact same thing.

[glossy marten]

Not exactly

[tepid root]

yeah creepers and segements dropping stuff is pretty ech imo, you arent really doing that much effort, you can just, summon the boss, kill a few, die, and repeat

[glossy marten]

Creepers are a seperate thing from boc

And skeltron's arms are still him

Just disjointed

[tepid root]

ok so eow segements

[indigo fog]

They're both parts of their fights is what i'm saying

but it's not finishing the fight if you just kill them

[glossy marten]

Yes

[amber escarp]

wait

let's just

see

You CAN kill wof without killing worm or boc

[glossy marten]

Yes

[amber escarp]

and it won't be much harder than it would've been

At all

[glossy marten]

That's what speedrunners do

[amber escarp]

Those two are actually like optional bosses

[glossy marten]

Tend to do, at least

[tepid root]

except killing wof requires some effort, unlike killing some creepers/eow segements

[indigo fog]

^^^^^

[glossy marten]

All pre-hardmode bosses sans wof are optional

[amber escarp]

Do you gain anything by doing it?

[indigo fog]

Yes you gain something

[tepid root]

you gain scales and tissue samples

[amber escarp]

And? You can get a better armor and weapon without them

[tepid root]

pre boss? i dont think so

[glossy marten]

Like jungle armour

It's preboss

[amber escarp]

gladiators armor

[glossy marten]

If you're brave enough

[amber escarp]

you can farm for ancient armor

if you really want to

[glossy marten]

Obsidian armour

[indigo fog]

If you're brave enough? it's not hard at all.

[glossy marten]

Yeah

[amber escarp]

here's the thing

[glossy marten]

It's not

[amber escarp]

it's not hard

[tepid root]

ancient armor

[amber escarp]

and killing those bosses is purely optional, so optional that you don't even gain anything by doing it

because you'll still have to farm for better armor and weapon

even if you kill them

and you can farm for it without them

[glossy marten]

With calamity you can go wof=>lunatic

[amber escarp]

pretty much, although, in hardmode it will be a lot harder to do, than in pre hardmode

[glossy marten]

True

[amber escarp]

you don't really have a lot of options with armor and weapons

in hardmode

[glossy marten]

Because hardmode scales much more differently than prehardmode

[amber escarp]

if you don't kill bosses i mean

[glossy marten]

Hardmode can be divided into 3 sections

Pre mech

Pre golem

Pre moon lord

[amber escarp]

going wof-lunatic
STONKS

[glossy marten]

All are very different

Especially pre mech

It's just prehardmode with hardmode mobs and ores

[amber escarp]

pretty much

imagine killing lunatic with crystalline

or platinum dagger

[glossy marten]

Imagine not

[amber escarp]

i can imagine that

[glossy marten]

Freaking casual using post golem loot smhmh my head

Although

It is possible to go wof o lunatic and not die

Halibut

[amber escarp]

last time i killed lunar with... How was it called... Xeroc's armor?

The one from meld

[glossy marten]

Yeah

It's supposed to be rogue fragment armour

Hence why xeroc pickaxe counts as a lunar pickaxe

[amber escarp]

rogue for life

[glossy marten]

I think this convo has branched off the discussion of suggestions just a tiny bit

[amber escarp]

yeah, excuse me

[glossy marten]

I'm not a mod tho

So idc

[amber escarp]

nah, it really did, so let's not play with fire.

[hardy depot]

For the lore items, I don't mind the downsides, but I do dislike the ones that happen under different circumstances than the buff, since those become a bit of an inventory juggling exercise.
Sure, the same is true for Skeletron and Aquatic Scourge, where you only take them out of wherever you're keeping them when you actually plan to go into the underground desert or dungeon, but unlike the Eye of Cthulhu, you only have to do that once. The Eye kinda encourages you to swap back and forth every sunrise and sunset, which gets tedious after a while.
And then I just end up not using them at all. And not because the debuff is so bad, or because the inventory slot is so valuable, but because the effort to use it well is too much to bother.

[karmic stone]

now that they have to use Seraph Tracers
Do they

[tepid root]

i dont use seraph tracers/upgrades recently

theyre not essential at all

[distant gyro]

as a defiled player, moab is a far-from-essential

sure it's useful for bosses such as astrum deus where mobility is basically all you need

but it's just garbage for precision on bosses that do need precision in dodging like cultist and ml

[scenic crypt]

true

[distant gyro]

additionally applies to most post-ml bosses

balloon jumps are so fast it cucks the player more than helping

[scenic crypt]

but i still use bundle of balloons with bounding potions for yharon

[distant gyro]

I ended up using steampunk wings on defiled for stat buffs and auto-rocket boots

[scenic crypt]

since im not comfortable with mount

[civic pond]

@toxic socket gonna add a reason for that suggestion..?

[toxic socket]

I mean, it would make sense for a scythe like that to be a recipe for the molten amputator because currently with how op the nanoblack reaper is, I think it would be appropriate for the Molten Amputator to be an ingredient

[karmic stone]

How does Nano being op relate to Amputator being needed in it's recipe

You mean like, Amp gives a sense of

Power?

[toxic socket]

yes

[potent veldt]

You still need to add a reason to the suggestion

Saying it here doesn't do anything.

[karmic stone]

Yea, edit it in

[void kelp]

is amputator a part of any other item?

[karmic stone]

Nop

[green pumice]

celestus?

not sure

[karmic stone]

Just checked

[green pumice]

o

[void kelp]

oh so those are some nifty reasons then

• it’s not part of any other recipe, and could do with additional uses
• it’s a powerful weapon that fades into obscurity after a short period of relevance

also - makes nanoblack harder to craft which helps balance it out

[karmic stone]

@toxic socket 🏓

[ashen warren]

Nanoblack reaper is a dev weapon though...

[karmic stone]

Oh wait

[ashen warren]

I think the dev it’s dedicated to has to decide

[karmic stone]

[ashen warren]

[civic pond]

my favorite reason

they are both scythe looking thingies and therefore must relate

[void kelp]

ah, shit you’re right, it’s ozz’s weap

[sand umbra]

homing attacks on a boss that already sucks to fight

no thank you

I'd prefer the Mechs getting nerfed again

[tepid root]

make every laser the mechs shoot a green laser when

[tired haven]

Green laser walls in DoG fight

[tepid root]

do not

[tired haven]

did

[tepid root]

[keen geyser]

green freeze rays

[sand umbra]

homing freezeflame rays

enjoy

[tepid root]

will do

[frosty dagger]

I don't know if I'm just unlucky or something, but I was farming in the abyss post cloneamitas for a little over 30 min and got four lumenyl. Also, I couldn't find any growing on voidstone. Is this normal?

I remember getting lumenyl in bunches before, and the wiki says it's a 100% drop chance

Strangely enough, I use recipe browser and It said it only dropped from eidolon worms and eidologists, I think this is a glithc because the wiki says it drops from most enimies but I also got four so I'm not sure.

I'm bringing this up here because if this isn't a glitch then I'm gonna make a sug about it

[tired haven]

Must be a glitch. Lumenyl is far more common than something like crystal shards even

[frosty dagger]

Ok thanks, I bring it up in bugs read pins

[fervent citrus]

i have an idea for a change in the wall of flesh fight, i noticed that if one runs on a platform in one direction away from WoF, the lasers wont hit the player at all, meaning one doesnt have to bother to dodge them. Maybe make the lasers have a slight angle in their trajectory, randomly generated? it would completely annihilate the cheesey strat :P

(same for dmode, btw)

[frosty dagger]

No, then you would get hit for no good reason