is reposting a thing I can do?
#suggestions-discussion
mighty knot
hollow shell
Only if it's been over a week since you posted the original, and if the original was not delivered.
mighty knot
not delivered as in...?
tepid root
didnt hit 90 stars/now 120 stars
mighty knot
but rover said previous suggestions would only require 90...
hollow shell
Yeah
If you're thinking of reposting something now, original would need to be sub-90
mighty knot
oh I see
hollow shell
cuz 1 week ago was before the raise
mighty knot
oh I see what you were trying to say potato
I thought you meant "if it hit 90 stars before the 120 change"
tepid root
m
indigo fog
While an armor set for rogue at that point would be nice, I don't think rogue is "incredibly difficult" in early hardmode because of a lack of a better armor set. Although Statigel is definitely not as good as Titanium or other options different classes get, I don't think Statigel armor is that bad to where Cryogen is that much more difficult, but I may be wrong. Also Mollusk Armor isn't hard to get at all since Mollusk Husk is easily fishable through Sunken Crates. Still a good suggestion though, Rogue players shouldn't have to stick with Statigel at that point while the other classes can get Titanium or Frost/Forbidden armor.
empty geyser
@mighty knot don't feel like minimodding, but if no mod has mentioned it: If it has been at least a week and a suggestion has not been not reached the star requirements to be delivered, then you may repost it.
And your suggestion... well, I've seen something of the sort a few times.
It's a good suggestion honestly.
empty geyser
Good, good
frail mantle
re: automatic Armageddon: i've thought about this before, maybe you could get one extra bag for nohitting a boss without Armageddon on, so you get a reward for nohitting a boss, and Armageddon still has some use?
barren hound
Add an alternative version to summoner armors for sentries
Currently the only sentry armors and accessories are the old ones army ones and i think thats a shame.
Calamity already adds more sentries in the later stages of the game like Energy staff or Guidelight of Oblivion so its not out of the question for a sentry playstyle to exist.
One way this could work is that summoner armors has two different variants like how melee and rogue have weapons.
is this a good suggestion?
tepid root
i mean
eh
not the biggest fan of this but i guess its ok
although maybe change them having completely different armors to just different helmets?
barren hound
i was thinking that but was unsure if only the helmet gave max minions.
hexed lagoon
I mean some new summon weapons would be nice. Calamity adds like hundreds of melee weapons and ranged, even rogue. But summoner has like 20~ weapons
versed mica
Summon weapons take the most time and effort to code
hexed lagoon
I've been using seabound staff for ever in my playthrough
versed mica
The devs can’t make them very fast
hexed lagoon
Yeah thats understandable
frail mantle
the problem with adding more sentry armors is that Calam sentries are already broken as shit
tepid root
yeah thats true
barren hound
well sentries kinda have to be super strong because of how power creeped movement is in late game and the fact they have no armors/accessories to support them.
tepid root
it would require a bunch of balancing if they were to add more sentry slots
bitter drift
20 more start and my suggestion is getting viewed (cuz i posted it at the time of the 90 stars to view it)
@mighty knot i found a problem you keep saying crabs and not clams
also how about make the frost armor add buffs for rogue
it's pre boss and has both melee and ranger buffs and considering rogue is just ranger but instead of shooting bullets arrows or rockets you are throwing melee weapons it's not much of a stretch
frail mantle
i'd prefer to not have more one-size-fits-all armor sets tbh
bitter drift
maybe that's true but i was going in with a bit more of a logical idea in mide
also @frail mantle i don't think a big buff for frost set will be good
i think a small one will be amazing as this armor already have large about of defense
tired haven
Frost set 
Forbidden set 
ashen warren
Wait, people use the forbidden set?
tired haven
Yes I do
distant gyro
circlet
tired haven
not in just yet
bitter drift
but really pls fix this
frail mantle
fix what
keen geyser
distant gyro
frost armor is already indirectly buffed
ashen warren
Saying ''rogues'' are incredibly difficult in early hardmode is an overstatement. @mighty knot
Sure, they might be on the weaker side, but by no means are they unviable.
distant gyro
rogue is compensated by op weapons yes
ashen warren
And as soon as you defeat Cryogen, you can start buying new weapons and ultimately craft the Kelvin Catalyst, which is obscenely strong.
It's almost insane how good Kelvin Catalyst is.
distant gyro
(this is talking about pre-cryogen though)
distant gyro
funny reference up there
ashen warren
Yeah I get it, but even pre-Cryogen Rogue isn't that bad.
distant gyro
red stormBOT
ashen warren
Easy to craft, really strong.
ashen warren
Oh, it is? I thought you could get Charred Ore earlier.
ashen warren
In that case, you can farm for Spear of Destiny.
radiant meadow
I prefer just snagging prismalline
distant gyro
spear of destiny is exempted for being rare
ashen warren
Or Ichor Spear.
radiant meadow
a lot faster and still very effective
ashen warren
Spear of Destiny is rare? How rare?
radiant meadow
when do we buff ichor spear and cursed dagger
ashen warren
I have two of them.
distant gyro
0.5%
distant gyro
that's your destiny for getting 2 of them
ashen warren
Then you can farm Sand Elementals and get yourself a Spear of Paleolith.
distant gyro
not sorry for that joke
distant gyro
™️
ashen warren
By the way, Ben.
frail mantle
Eventually©️
ashen warren
One of my suggestions got to 90+ stars (before it got changed to 120).
And sent to devs. When will I know what they voted on the suggestion?
radiant meadow
you wait
ashen warren
Do I just scroll up from time to time and manually see what the consensus is?
radiant meadow
yes
distant gyro
in like 1 hour
wary canyon
one of my Suggs about the walls in the Abyss got like 160 some stars
ashen warren
My suggestion is about Floating Islands and Space getting more content and not being such a barren wasteland that only serves as an alternate source to get stuff pre-Hardmode.
radiant meadow
it has one upvote
distant gyro
yes I have your suggestion in reserve
ashen warren
The only thing you can do with Floating Islands and Space is to summon a boss Post-Moon Lord, which means that it's an ultimately useless place to be in pre-Moon Lord except getting a few Souls of Flight.
distant gyro
be patient, it's not time yet 
radiant meadow
there were some concepts for planetoid crap
but it's low priority and for a future update
I think
ashen warren
Also, don't say upvote.
Ben, I love you, but if you make Reddit references..
It's over for you.
radiant meadow
okay, it has one voteup
but an easier suggestion that I did do was changing silva armor recipe
silva shit no longer requires cosmilite
instead, it uses gold bars
or platinum
gold bars are now officially a component of auric armor
ashen warren
I see one of mine is in that reserve too
Also I wanna know how much gold I’ll be needing
One bar of Reddit Gold.
Looks like I’m fighting SCal with Cosmilite armor then
copper onyx
Tweak the death mode boss changes to readd missing mechanics
Some of the death mode boss changes completely remove phases or mechanics. This means that people who are new to the mod or replaying it after a long time won't experience bosses in their entirety. My assumption is that death mode was designed for experienced players, but that doesn't change the fact that some skilled players might want to play the hardest difficulty right away. This would mean
EoC has a short phase 1
Twins have short first phases
Siren would keep her intro phase and music, but it would be a lot shorter
Duke fishron would keep phase 1
Posting this here for thoughts
ashen warren
I’m not sure what’s with death mode bosses skipping their first phases entirely, so I’m down for this
hollow shell
So they're always at their hardest
ashen warren
If there is concern that these phases aren’t Death enough, make them harder and more unique, such as something to do with EoC’s gaze before he turns into MoC
hollow shell
Half Diamond's argument is that it's too hard
which defeats the point
it's Death Mode
copper onyx
Not saying it's too hard at all lol
Just saying that some parts of the fight are completely skipped
i.e. intro phases and the such
A harder difficulty shouldn't throw parts of the bosses' design out the window
But to keep it challenging, make the first phases only last 5-10% of the health
ashen warren
Or perhaps give those phases something new
hollow shell
Alright, I see
A matter of missing out
copper onyx
^
ashen warren
It’s kind of like, the Eye of Chrulhu is missing the craziness factor of it turning into a mouth if it does that from the get go
hollow shell
You can suggest it I guess, though Fab will directly disagree with you
toxic kettle
isn't that like suggesting to add Duke Fishron Phase 3 to the fight in Normal Mode because you're "missing out" on Phase 3 there
distant gyro
you could also make phase 1/2/3 way harder but I don't think fab is supportive of that idea for some reason
tired haven
Maybe
Except while adding phase 3 to normal will directly screw with players, one could argue that adding easier phase back for death is flavor
distant gyro
yes rev+ eoc has 4 phases and death eoc skips to phase 4 right away
tired haven
(and honestly I see that kind of flavor as slog so that's really controversial)
ashen warren
The thing about it is, can we make the phases unique while also not varying in difficulty?
copper onyx
The phases would be really short is my point
tired haven
Then a reasonable question: why add them in first place?
copper onyx
Barely even noticeable, but still there so people get to know all of each bosses' mechanics
tired haven
As soon as the phase has impact on the flow of the fight (so people are inspired to learn it), it also becomes major enough to want to skip
radiant meadow
hard to know a bosses' mechanics if the phase ends in 5 seconds
elfin swan
If I may, if you wanted to see all the boss had to offer, you could simply play revengeance
radiant meadow
reminds me of dragon god, yharon
it started sub 3 at 98%, so the first two subs literally were just a waste of time
ashen warren
Well, if Death mode involves adapting to changing attack patterns of equal difficulty, it would be a bit more interesting than “summon a boss in its final form”
tired haven
It is somewhat lazy move, i agree, but doing 3 fleshed out, fair but difficult phases is much more effortful than focusing on last one
So here is that
teal ibex
disagree with the siren phase in particular. only serves to remove the unique mechanic of choice from that fight by forcing you to reduce siren's hp first, which i've always disliked personally (even tho i kill siren anyway)
otherwise i see where youre coming from for the rest
hallow kraken
Reason?
teal ibex
powerful suggestion
hallow kraken
Can’t even ping since name is in weird characters
copper onyx
It lasting a few seconds would be a matter of balance. It would ideally last long enough to be noticeable but short enough to not drag out the fight
teal ibex
time to copy id mode
hallow kraken
@vast remnant your sug lacks a stated reason
teal ibex
its already dead lol
radiant meadow
I killed it
toxic kettle
did you mean to send that suggestion twice in one message
hallow kraken
ouch
ashen warren
Well, I can see why devs would wanna focus on their upcoming content, so I guess this could wait. But at the same time, having bosses start in their final phase basically means the pattern remains the same for the whole fight (and in the case of the EoC fight, it got kind of boring just because I moved in a loop and won)
Granted EoC is an early game boss, but I figure it could use some spice.
radiant meadow
you'll have to repost it with some actual reasoning
teal ibex
yeah i can see the perspective of reintroducing at least the more engaging phases 100%
but like some peeps mentioned some phases really just aren't relevant to a deathmode player to begin with
copper onyx
Well that's assuming deathmode players are people who just finished playing calamity
toxic kettle
and in the case of the EoC fight, it got kind of boring just because I moved in a loop and won
It's almost like EoC is an early-game boss and is supposed to be easy
ashen warren
I already acknowledged that
teal ibex
actually, did rev levi ever start spawning with siren or does it still have the siren only bait?
copper onyx
Siren only
teal ibex
lame
distant gyro
@ashen warren pretty sure that every death/rev AI changes that exists are in huge files titled CalamityGlobalAI and CalamityAI
If Death changes were to be flat out different from Rev ones while retaining many phases then it's basically
- Basically twice the size
- Hard to balance gameplay-wise
- Takes disproportionately longer time and effort because it takes the programming of every single boss and their moveset
ashen warren
Are resuggestions fine?
distant gyro
also why infernum takes forever
radiant meadow
if it's been at least a week and the suggestion wasn't sent originally
if it's already been sent, don't bother
ashen warren
It already was, but I wanna resuggest it because I think it's a genuinely good one that would fix Cryogen and make him more fair.
Please remove the forced snowstorm during Cryogen fights, or make him and his minions light up more. Fighting them in a forced snowstorm in his current state makes it a whole pain to fight him, because he and (especially) his minions blends in with the particles, meaning you can't see them. This has caused me to get perma-frozen so many times, because I am never able to actually see his little goons.
That makes sense to me. I’ll let off then. It’s kind of a bummer that these fights are static though is all I’m saying
ashen warren
It doesn’t show projectiles. Omniscience does tho
It's not reliable, Hunter Potion isn't a very good potion. Also, the fact that you need to use a potion to make the fight actually fair is..
distant gyro
bonus points with omniscience to be able to see projectiles yes
I think level 1 snow is fine
ashen warren
You know, not fair.
I mean yeah. High difficulties work with the assumption that you’re using potions
distant gyro
level 2 snow can be reserved later in the fight
ashen warren
@ashen warren Here's the thing though.
distant gyro
level 3 snow can cease
copper onyx
Well I've never had a problem with seeing in cryogen's fight
ashen warren
Potions are optional when you face other bosses. You can beat them without potions, but it's obviously easier with them.
Cryogen however requires that you use Hunter Potion and Omniscience.
rancid flame
Well a warmth potion for cyrogen is pretty much necessary so having another one isn't too much of a big deal.
ashen warren
I didn't use a Warmth Potion vs Cryogen.
rancid flame
I cannot live without warmth for cryogen. My personal experience, though.
radiant meadow
I'm pretty sure cryogen is getting some changes next patch
to some of his attacks
ashen warren
But what about the snowstorm?
Not really. Seeing Cryo and his projectiles were seldom a concern as much as having Warmth because chilled
radiant meadow
the snowstorm is getting no forseeable changes
ashen warren
But the snowstorm is the only issue.
copper onyx
I still don't see how the snowstorm is an issue
radiant meadow
do you turn off storm effects?
ashen warren
They don't light up or anything, they completely blend in with the snowstorm which makes them a pain to see.
radiant meadow
I can make the minions emit some blue light if that'll help
ashen warren
And no, I don't. I actually like the snowstorm otherwise because it fits in thematically. But yeah, that would help.
radiant meadow
but I don't want to make any drastic change like removing the snowstorm entirely
ashen warren
It's really poor design having the minions not emit any form of light and completely blend in with the snow.
copper onyx
Personally I've never had that problem. What's your zoom like?
ashen warren
You're talking about 2-3 completely invisible minions being able to freeze you.
Cryogen also blends in with the snow, but he's a lesser issue because of his sheer size.
Also, normal zoom.
Making boss stuff emit light is typically the solution
Perforators intensify
teal ibex
it's not poor design, it's clearly seated in the intentional decision to mask the visual aspect of gameplay
that being said, i do generally prefer visibility in bossfights
copper onyx
I still don't see the problem, but I guess giving them a glowmask wouldn't do any harm
teal ibex
this one just happens to have a reason to it, but i do think its better w/o the snow
old green on green on green pbg was a painful nightmare, however
ashen warren
It's poor design because the snowstorm serves to create a situation that you can't do anything about.
Make no mistake by misunderstanding me; the snowstorm itself isn't the issue per se.
The fact that it completely masks the minions is the issue.
teal ibex
it definitely doesn't completely mask the minions. they're quite large chunks of white relative to the visual flurry.
ashen warren
Well you say can’t do anything about, but previously you said requires omniscience potions. Which one is your argument?
teal ibex
it obscures them. that's totally okay from the perspective of design, whether you disagree with the choice or not. i disagree with the choice but acknowledge its merit, even if it isnt appealing to me
ashen warren
@ashen warren The fact that you need two separate potions to even make them visible should be an argument why they're poorly designed.
teal ibex
also their point is that you have to use omniscience, which is effectively not a choice
its a restriction
copper onyx
The thing is it obviously isn't completely impossible to see them. If it's a bit straining then something could be done
ashen warren
A restriction which makes the boss fight extremely difficult due to the smaller minions blending in with the snowstorm.
teal ibex
i think it's a bit overzealous to say, but visual problems are not created equally and i've nagged fab about like half a dozen of them LOL
ashen warren
Which is... the point of the snowstorm.
copper onyx
And no one said omnisense is a necessity
It just helps if you're having trouble seeing them
ashen warren
@ashen warren Which is poor design. Having to fight against invisible enemies isn't fun.
teal ibex
also i will say, you know the exact point of origin of each minion. as long as you know how they travel, you can move around that
you should stop saying that they're invisible, it doesnt support your point at all
copper onyx
But they aren't invisible???
teal ibex
theyre hard to see
ashen warren
You're already handling a big boss, and then it spawns very difficult to see mobs that are near invisible due to the snowstorm. Just because it's intended doesn't mean they're well designed. Having them at least have a blue light to make them stand out would help a lot.
Because you can actually see them coming.
copper onyx
Here's how I see it; if you have trouble surviving a boss, get regen/defense potions
if you're having trouble killing a boss, get damage potions
if you're having trouble seeing a boss, get hunter/omnisense
ashen warren
They blend in. If you’re looking for them, you can find then. If you want a potion to find them for you, do that. If not, you accept an extra challenge, just like every other potion you choose not to use.
If I'm looking for them, then I'll lose focus on Cryogen and his projectiles.
tepid root
its not really an extra challenge, more of an annoyance
ashen warren
There's a reason why no one ever plays against Cryogen with snowstorm effects on.
copper onyx
Some people are better a finding things, others are better at dodging, and some are better at aiming. Whichever you struggle with, you can use the potions
ashen warren
The minions are quite linear in how they work. Once you glance at them, you know where they are, and can attack them while keeping an eye on Cryogen himself
radiant meadow
cryogen's minions already give light
ashen warren
Once you glance them.
radiant meadow
but I'll double the brightness
teal ibex
also just gonna say that using omniscience as a counterpoint is not conducive to quality imo. new player won't know about omniscience necessarily and some people just don't like grinding potions. it can be a benefit, but the baseline should consider the lowest common denominator as well imo
copper onyx
Almost everyone I've seen fight cryogen has snowstorm effects on
ashen warren
Can’t see is a repeated exaggeration. The apparitions have a purple tail. They’re not that hard to see.
Almost everyone I've seen fight Cryogen without snowstorm effects on.
tired haven
It's just that there are no other heavily limiting visuals other than blizzard that people feel uncomfortable with those
ashen warren
I tried to find videos online so I could give an example.
Gungnir, Chippy and several how-to guides fight the boss without snowstorm effects.
radiant meadow
can't really say since I usually keep snowstorm effects off
since it wants to kill my laptop
ashen warren
It's not even the snow storm itself I have the issue with. It's annoying, but serves to fit the theme of the fight and you can actually see Cryogen himself.
teal ibex
snowstorm is horrible for bitrate, yeah
ashen warren
His minions, however.
tired haven
Tbh as youtuber I disabled snowstorm mostly for nohit anyway (but can confirm, bitrate dies)
But in regular play couldn't care less last few times
ashen warren
It's like his minions were made specifically to blend in with the snowstorm, making it so you need Hunter Potion, Omniscience and Warmth just to fight him.
My thing is, if the sky is clear when you spawn him, the snow never really turned into the blizzard effect by the time I kill him.
rancid flame
Using potions is a key part of terraria's bossfight preparation. Using a potion to negate a advantage the boss has, whether it be well-designed or not, is what potions are used for. To give advantages and make it easier to fight the boss.
ashen warren
- The fact that you need 3 potions to even fight him should serve as an argument that Cryogen isn't completely well designed. Buff potions should never have to be a requirement against bosses.
teal ibex
you dont
copper onyx
imo you're struggling to see them way more than most other people, so you should use potions
teal ibex
please stop exaggerating
tired haven
wondering how to incorporate "aava, king's pet" from ds2 into the dialogue about visibility 
teal ibex
you are killing your own argument
ashen warren
@teal ibex I'm not the one who said Warmth Potion is necessary.
teal ibex
that would be one potion, not three
copper onyx
No one said that, just that it helps a lot
ashen warren
Different potions are necessary for different people in different bossfights
teal ibex
and the person who said that is also incorrect, so its unwise to parrot them
copper onyx
Just like potions help with DoG, but you can still beat him without them
ashen warren
I mean for me when I’m playing mage, mana regen is a must for all bossfights
Doesn’t mean I want devs to overhaul how mana works
teal ibex
this whole discussion would make far more progress if we stopped calling it bad design and started calling it what it is: a visibility issue. if you as a player genuinely can't visually keep up, then that's that. it's worth changing for that reason alone.
radiant meadow
I mean
ashen warren
Three.
Omniscience to see the projectiles, that otherwise blend in.
Hunter Potion to see the mobs, that otherwise blend in.
Warmth Potion to ignore Chilled, although I don't feel like Warmth is that much of a requirement.
distant gyro
mana is planned to be overhauled
radiant meadow
omniscience highlights mobs
ashen warren
Also, keep in mind that not everyone has perfect 20/20 sight.
teal ibex
im not gonna keep this up lol
radiant meadow
omniscience is hunter + spelunker + dangersense + projectile highlights
ashen warren
I don’t blame you
teal ibex
please post the suggestion. i agree it should be changed. please also realize that you can disagree with a decision without it being poorly designed.
rancid flame
That is a good point actually. My friend has trouble finding chlorophyte because of his eyesight.
ashen warren
I already posted the suggestion.
teal ibex
sick, i'll star it and move on with my life 
tired haven
No player is the same
Can bet there are some who can't run in a line for a minute for whatever reason
Doesn't mean that games should just cease to exist
game journalists phenomenon
radiant meadow
it was from almost a week ago and stagnated around 80 stars
teal ibex
oh wait this was for a repost lol
radiant meadow
but not yet a week so repost isn't allowed
ashen warren
Yeah, I asked if I could resuggest it because it's a change I really want to see.
rancid flame
In the meantime, there are efforts you can do against it, but I agree it should be changed.
ashen warren
Yeah that’s how resuggs work
Never once have I felt like having a certain buff potion is a requirement in order to fight something. The only reason I won against Cryogen is because I just went into my vanilla Hardmode character who had much stronger weapons so I could effectively just shred Cryogen.
And I've never once had to do that before.
copper onyx
I think the change would be nice, I just see it as more of a boss nerf where it's good but not necessary
teal ibex
well, if you do repost it, i'd make sure to specifically mention those with visual impairment
it will go over far better than diving into the design, which is extremely subjective, clearly
ashen warren
The Cryogen fight, for me, is the single hardest fight I've ever been though.
Not because of the damage or his speed, but simply because of the snowstorm that makes projectiles and enemies just blend in so perfectly.
And I'm one of the few people who actually enjoyed fighting Ocram.
Ocram.
tired haven
Creative way to go about that, i suppose, would be to reduce blizzard power near cryogen but increase it at high distance
Eye of the storm, p much
Not sure how hard it would be to implement though, with crutches or not
rancid flame
yeah that would be pretty cool. It would force you to stay near in a more natural way.
ashen warren
And if Cryogen ends up being on the weaker side because of blizzard getting nerfed, I wouldn't be opposed to seeing the actual boss being buffed to compensate.
copper onyx
For the record I struggle seeing pbg's stingers with his black background, so I can definitely see what you're talking about
tired haven
To clarify, it will stay constant on the screen, just based on player's distance from cryo
Otherwise it's like impossible to code
ashen warren
That's not a bad change, honestly.
copper onyx
I don't think the blizzard itself should be changed, but the stuff should glow
ashen warren
I think pbg stingers are WAY more of a sight issue
radiant meadow
pretty sure that'd be extremely annoying to code
rancid flame
@copper onyx Yeah definitely. I think that is a large issue, you just have to keep moving and hope.
ashen warren
Who is PBG..?
copper onyx
Plaguebringer goliath
rancid flame
Late-hardmode
copper onyx
The mines are also hard to see at high speeds
rancid flame
Especially since the rest of her projectiles are bright green
copper onyx
Well the only bright green projectiles are the missles but ok
rancid flame
wait what
really
It's all I can ever identify in that fight besides herself and her little bees
distant gyro
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8 👍 (@ashen warren) https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/677209140245823498
9 👍 (@swift bison) https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/677203396213604383
10 👍 https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/676989052779495444
11 🚫 (@sand umbra) https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/676958411740545034
12 (@quick ice) https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/676941775126134804
13 👍 (@swift bison) https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/676569843297943564
14 🏁 (@supple lodge) https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/676538271731417100
ashen warren
distant gyro
I realized that one suggestion was placed on the list but not sent to dev
so I took it down and move everything back by 1
ashen warren
Why do some of the suggestions have a thumbs up?
And one has a flag?
It’s in the pins
radiant meadow
flag menas its happening next update
distant gyro
read pins
distant gyro
in case you don't get it yet, blank is not listed but it means no real consensus
tepid root
yey second approval
distant gyro
aka either split or no opinion at all
ashen warren
radiant meadow
approved != gonna be implemented
radiant meadow
a lot of stuff gets approved
ashen warren
It got approved and that's nice enough.
distant gyro
it was rather obvious that is subject to change
radiant meadow
I did try and do a suggestion earlier today
with the community
but then Terraria shit itself and only showed 0% boosts to all my stats
distant gyro
I think I should enlist some as L/M/H
ashen warren
I honestly feel like Hallowed Armor should be buffed.
distant gyro
not sure since that's more or less kept into the dev system
radiant meadow
hallowed armor does not need a buff
ashen warren
Because Hallowed Armor is so..
radiant meadow
I've said it before and I'll say it again
ashen warren
Not bad, but there's little reason to use it over other armor sets that you can get.
distant gyro
hallowed is the go-to armor for mage rn
radiant meadow
it's better than Daedalus armor and not quite as good as Chlorophyte, just as it should be
distant gyro
and is between daedalus and chloro for melee/ranger
rancid flame
I swear hallowed was better than chlorophyte. Maybe I was just doing shit calculations.
distant gyro
hallowed mage is better than chloro fsr
ashen warren
Why is Hallowed better for mage than Daedalus?
radiant meadow
because it gives better stats
tired haven
It is better by stats but chloro crystal is underrated usually
ashen warren
It doesn't.
radiant meadow
then I'll nerf daedalus
ashen warren
Hallowed set for mages gives 35 defense and the set bonus is 20% reduces mana usage.
tired haven
Hallowed is adamantite+ so here you go
ashen warren
39 defense for mages with Daedalus and the set bonus is +5% magic damage. You have a 10% chance absorb physical attacks and projectiles when hit. If you absorb an attack you are healed for 1/2 of that attack's damage.
radiant meadow
and you're ignoring the raw stats of the armor
ashen warren
I was just getting to it.
rancid flame
I found that the Daedalus set bonus never did anything
tired haven
And also you just copycat wiki instead of counting total efficiency
ashen warren
Hallowed: Increases maximum mana by 100
12% increased magic damage and critical strike chance
Daedalus: 13% increased magic damage and 7% increased mage critical strike chance
10% decreased mana usage and +60 max mana
hollow shell
@copper onyx Your suggestion got a lil messed up
radiant meadow
hallowed is more mana efficient and has better crit
ashen warren
The thing about the ''max mana'' is that it's not hard to get full mana bar by the time you get to Hardmode.
hollow shell
It's doubled
ashen warren
So that 100 maximum mana becomes unusable, because you can't get 100 more.
radiant meadow
and in calamity, hallowed mage has 40 defnese
radiant meadow
I hate numbers
rancid flame
So hallowed is slightly better then
ashen warren
And between the two hoods:
distant gyro
hallowed mage vs daedalus mage
40 defense vs 35 defense
19% damage vs 21% damage
19% crit vs 13% crit
100 mana vs 60 mana
-20% mana usage vs -10% mana usage
Daedalus has the weird absorption effect
ashen warren
@distant gyro The max mana is almost not even worth bringing up.
distant gyro
By pure stats, Hallowed wins for all but 2 situations
ashen warren
It's very easy to hit the max cap.
tired haven
Sigh
Daedalus mage: 35 defense, 16% dmg, 10% crit, 10% mana usage, 60 mana, 5% hp recovered from attacks
Hallowed mage: 40 (?)/35 defense, 19% dmg, 19% crit, 20% mana usage, 100 mana
radiant meadow
it's 35
ashen warren
radiant meadow
not 39
tired haven
39 is ranger
radiant meadow
39 is ranger defense
tired haven
Additional 10% to save on mana is no joke
Same goes for 9% crit
radiant meadow
hallowed doesn't need a buff beyond the existing defense buff
distant gyro
13+3+5=21 btw
toxic kettle
as for the mana cap, you can get up to 450 at that point
ashen warren
That 2 defense does a lot in Rev+ you know
distant gyro
(yes you can get up to 200 mana from gear att to reach the cap)
radiant meadow
ashen warren
I've already hit max mana pre-Hardmode without using gear.
distant gyro
the bug pushes it to 150 but bugs don't count because temporary
toxic kettle
wait why is Gladiator armor so strong
ashen warren
How do you manage to have 400 mana prehardmode? You had to have been shooting for that.
Because it was trash in vanilla.
toxic kettle
21 defense for a pre-boss set?
distant gyro
Vanilla Glad armor is made for vanity tbh
nerfed soon
also who farm hoplites 24/7
ashen warren
@ashen warren Easier than you think.
When you run around picking up stars.
Also might have had my friend also pick up stars and craft crystals for me.
Max mana from mana crystals is 200
Is it not?
tired haven
It is
ashen warren
Yeah. I meant 200, not 400.
I forgot what the cap was and thought it was 400.
Well 400 is the weird vanilla mana bonus cap
distant gyro
jungle grants more max mana than daedalus btw
rancid flame
Wait what is the overall mana cap?
distant gyro
400/450/500/550/600
ashen warren
It does, I have 280 mana with jungle armor rn
distant gyro
vanilla/1-2-3 consumables+star beam rye
tired haven
Jungle gives 80, so does diamond robe iirc
ashen warren
Jungle armor is unviable though. I don't see jungle armor being viable and usable when it's made solely from spores and stingers.
toxic kettle
distant gyro
jungle is early game
tired haven
??
ashen warren
It’s low defense but the magic bonuses are S T R O N K
If you're smart, at least make wooden armor.
toxic kettle
since when does the power of an armor set depend directly on its ingredients
ashen warren
Wood is tougher than spores.
rancid flame
I used Jungle it was pretty good against Slime God.
ashen warren
D A W G
tired haven
Ok now that's just trolling
ashen warren
@toxic kettle Iron > Wood.
tired haven
Quit it lad
distant gyro
ashen warren
Certified bruh moment
Am I wrong though?
This is a video game. It disobeys logix
Therefore yea, you are wrong.
tired haven
Real-life logics that is, at least
distant gyro
an iron bucket has 1 defense, wood helmet also has 1, pumpkin helmet has 2
welcome to re-logic
rancid flame
I guess it makes sense since it's like the magic power of the jungle is in the armour.
radiant meadow
yet all jungle themed craftable weapons are melee
ashen warren
Does it say ''Magical Stinger''?
ashen warren
Well the melee armor is Molten
tired haven
Magical pumpkin armor
toxic kettle
tfw wearing metal armor makes your sword stronger
tired haven
Because the fact it's the game isn't enough, gotta explain everything
radiant meadow
and I think this idea of armors being made of flimsy materials is derailing off the topic of any suggestions
tired haven
Indeed
rancid flame
Oh yeah
ashen warren
Suggestion: make Jungle Armor grant no defense and sting you constantly, dealing 1 damage per second due to Stingers being imbedded in you.
Did anyone ever talk about DiamondWalker's suggestion?
left crest
funny meme sugg haha
ashen warren
Let's talk about you Ben.
ashen warren
We concluded that it will inevitably get denied
sand umbra
yet all jungle themed craftable weapons are melee
but the armor is mage
thank you for giving me my latest and greatest prompt of creativity
tired haven
Oh no, sis incoming
ashen warren
Jungle magic weapons!?
Oh no wait Mana Rose exists
distant gyro
Oh no, EE idea yoink incoming
toxic kettle
spill the sugg, sis
sand umbra
alt gets it
left crest
make thorn chakram magic because yes
sand umbra
explode
left crest
but in all seriousness that makes no sense
distant gyro
eviscerate
sand umbra
(under my hands)
ashen warren
Wait. Terraria made sense?
radiant meadow
nah
left crest
cat sword cat sword
sand umbra
Terraria inherently makes no sense
distant gyro
*video games made sense?
rancid flame
If terraria made sense solar armour would burn you
sand umbra
forget Solar Flare
ashen warren
Terraria is a game that exists to make references. Change my mind.
sand umbra
Molten would burn you
radiant meadow
I mean, there are a lot of references
left crest
If terraria made sense Titanium wouldn’t give you a dodge like seriously what
radiant meadow
not much to change your mind on
sand umbra
Titanium armor 
left crest
sand umbra
I despise Titanium armor from a balancing standpoint, I really do
that is all
rancid flame
I'm not complaining though that set bonus is crazy
ashen warren
Of all the damaging aura things in Calamity, why none of them are Uranium baffles me
radiant meadow
we don't have any uranium themed items
past cape
or with all the sulfur stuff, we don't have pyrite/fool's gold
or cinnabar for that matter
wary canyon
fools gold armor sounds like a cool rogue set
radiant meadow
I'm sorry but cinnabar only makes me think of pokemon
sand umbra
like, in practice I doubt anyone cares because it's one of the two highest-tier HM ore armors pre-boss and the set bonus is cool as hell
but as someone who's going to have to rebalance bosses at that tier eventually for his own purposes I literally despise the concept of an armor set granting you a free dodge
(if you're curious, and just to make this clear, I have similar feelings towards the Counter Scarf)
radiant meadow
clearly, Thomas enjoyed pre nerf scarf
rancid flame
The counter scarf is better though because you actually have to react to the danger. titanium is just free dodge
tired haven
Counter scarf is worse because it's an accessory
The only thing that makes me tolerate it is the fact that dodge is so unreliable that the players kill themselves trying to dodge into projectiles 
sand umbra
tired haven
(same goes for eclipse mirror bug)
frank stratus
that's why i stopped using counter scarf
ashen warren
I don’t use it as a dodge. I use it as a dash.
rancid flame
Is the fact that it's unreliable a bug or I am just doing something wrong
tired haven
More a bug than not
radiant meadow
it used to have twice the dash length
left crest
And that is why cryolore is the best dash
radiant meadow
and half the cooldown time
sand umbra
frank stratus
lole
radiant meadow
so yes
ashen warren
Well Counter Scarf existed before Rev did
tired haven
Because cryo doesn't even take slot, yes
rancid flame
who thought that was a good idea
left crest
fab prob
radiant meadow
Fab also nerfed it realizing how strong it was
it also used to not have chaos state interactions of course
sand umbra
left crest
at least it’s not counter matter
ashen warren
Aight so Calamity history for a moment, if I may
sand umbra
personally I don't like the concept behind Counter Scarf too terribly much, but I can appreciate the state it's in right now
it's in a state where I actually feel semi-comfortable balancing against it and it's a Rev+ item anyway so it's not like I have much room to balance against it
Titanium armor is just "have a free dash from an equally free armor set" because the condition is something you fill on a regular basis anyway
I hate it
left crest
exactly
ashen warren
Counter Scarf existed before Revengeance mode did, and you had to kill Prepare to Die EoC to get it, which had stats I can’t remember off the top of my head, but you basically had to Post Moon Lord to get it. So it used to be super good because you had to go so far out of your way to get it.
left crest
so much worse than the other two hm ore armors with special set bonuses
elder mist
prepare to die was post wof
prepare to cry was post ml
you had to kill wof to get counter scarf
you history a bit wonky
ashen warren
Yeh somethin like that. Yea cuz that’s what Celestial Onion and the other item did
wary canyon
prepare to what now
left crest
demon trophy
ashen warren
Yea that’s it
wary canyon
I think I’m in over my head on this one
radiant meadow
wof dropped vehemence iirc
rancid flame
Sorry what's this prepare to die/cry stuff?
radiant meadow
not scarf
left crest
now a meme spawnrate booster
wary canyon
^
elder mist
wasnt vehemence in cry
radiant meadow
it was
ashen warren
WoF dropped Vehemence. EoC dropped Counter Scarf. Yharon dropped Drew’s Wings.
radiant meadow
but pretty sure scarf was a ptd eoc drop
left crest
wof dropped vehemence, eoc dropped cscarf in die
ashen warren
You can read up about this on the wiki
elder mist
thats what made the most sense
wary canyon
are these prepare to die/cry things what used to exist before Rev and Death modes?
ashen warren
Yes
elder mist
yes
frank stratus
yes
radiant meadow
well you said kill wof to get scarf
ashen warren
It was basically, everything had way more health and damage that’s it
elder mist
because wof drops the item to get prepare to die
which is what was required for cscarf
left crest
so Master Mode?
radiant meadow
oh I see
ashen warren
We don’t talk about Master Mode here.
radiant meadow
but I digress, since I don't think this is suggestion related anymore
left crest
ahh yeah this is sugg discussion channel
rancid flame
At this point we're just saying stuff
left crest
yeeting outta here bye
ashen warren
True. But there is currently not a new sugg to discuss so, unsure what the rules are here
rancid flame
Someone might be trying but dont feel like it because of the current convo
ashen warren
Fair enough
elder mist
thats just an excuse used, pro tip
ashen warren
?
rotund hatch
so i dunno if this has already been susgested yet but
something in changelogs made me think
specifically the recent change to rogue stealth being generatable while moving, specifically an amount that's "decent"
it made me think about rage and true melee, specifically how rage is generated while using true melee. is it kinda pointless to increase the amount of rage gained from true melee to an amount akin to the rogue stealth changes, or has that already been considered and declined
tired haven
Le shrug
True melee doesn't synergize with rage mainly due to losing the active boost when getting hit
void kelp
which is odd considering how rage is built w true melee strikes
karmic stone
losing the active boost when getting hit
Wasn't this changed or next update/I'm tripping
distant gyro
it was changed in 1.4.3 iirc smh crabboomer
karmic stone
potent veldt
@copper onyx Interesting suggestion, but please condense the fuck out of it
You do not need that many line skips
rotund hatch
idk, i just think it (the true rage+melee thing) is either kinda pointless, or should be buffed to be pretty useful because imo rage is like, basically useless unless you specifically use heart of darkness or draedon's heart which is like 10% of the game if you use those items during their main times lmao
potent veldt
It literally takes up almost all of my monitor in one suggestion
tired haven
True melee is hard subject
On the one hand, you have 1.5 hours scal fight done by one of the best players solely
On the other hand, plant dies in 8 seconds to budget build even mouse clicker can reproduce 100% of the time
potent veldt
To be fair, a massive chunk of the Scal true melee fight is just the brothers being antisocial
rotund hatch
mostly refering to specifically the rage and true melee interaction, namely because i played true melee for a decent amount of time and i got rage all of probably 3 times
tired haven
It is literally the whole fight except for hearts being antisocial to something with less than 20-35 blocks range
And there are quite a few less extreme but not less annoying examples like retinazer
unique vector
i see zero reason to do this suggestion
the point of deathmode is to be a more unique, harder mode
whatever people experience by playing deathmode first, they wouldnt care what stuff rev has because they wouldnt know what it even is. and even if they do care that much they can just turn off deathmode
this is another case of suggestions that try to accommodate for every option/situation for the playerbase. which is typically bad game design.
distant gyro
also it's doubled
potent veldt
It's doubled for whatever reason, and it has more line skips then there are paragraphs
quartz hare
it'sn't
potent veldt
What
Also, yeah, while I enjoy trying to give everyone a healthy experience of everything possible, if you're going death mode, you've given up your right to "aesthetic boss fights"
distant gyro
and ye that line skip is pretty excessive
tepid root
isnt the main catch of the new death mode bosses is that they have their action from right at the start of the fight?
potent veldt
Yeah
There's legitimate reason as to why this isn't a thing, btw
Such as lessening breathing room, making more of the fight it's difficult phases, and disallowing you chances to build adrenaline
tepid root
also yeah this amount of line skips is h
rotund hatch
h
potent veldt
There's more gray then there is suggestion lol
Wait, that's a thing?
That's.... Really fuckin stupid
indigo fog
I'd just use Purification Powder/Clentaminator for that issue
potent veldt
Thank you redigit
stoic crag
gray nebula
death is already a toggle
indigo fog
/\
ashen warren
Personally I find most of the new Death stuff is
But me brain say I'm a 🅱️ uss for not using it
tiny rose
@elder estuary put a proper description of the problem, and a proper explanation so that people will empathise why this might be a big problem. You not seeing anything is one thing, "putting config for people with eye problems" is another. Be descriptive or it will be deleted.
"Bad delet" won't cut it.
indigo fog
That image can't be real.
indigo fog
That has to be a bug then
elder estuary
bug or not the whole 'feature' is dumb and should never have been implemented
gray nebula
disable death if you dont like it 
indigo fog
It's only meant to be slightly darker. This was never supposed to happen
elder estuary
er discord pls, sec
image taken from suggestion and enhanced in photoshop
literally a screenshot of ingame
zero reason for this to be a thing
zzz
hollow shell
You know there are ways to boost the light level, right?
elder estuary
do tell
ashen warren
Yea a lot of the game's intended environmental difficulty has turned out to be just silly. It could use tweaks
hollow shell
That it's an obstacle to overcome?
elder estuary
because i haven't found it prehardmode
i have night vision on via nighttime EoC lore btw
and shine potion
literally worthless
gray nebula
breaking dark orbs/crimson hearts to get a light pet helps
hollow shell
Gimme a sec
elder estuary
i have the dark orb light pet equipped
gray nebula
well that's a bug then
elder estuary
bug or not the feature is anti-accessability and overall just dumb; needs a toggle in mod config to outright disable at the very least
elder estuary
why would I want to play calamity on non death mode...
what is the point? it's too easy
gray nebula
actually calamity is balanced around revengeance
elder estuary
yes... rev is too easy after many hours invested; but if i wanted to play blind, i would use a blindfold
gray nebula
and you would want to play calamity on non death mode because you dislike the underground darkness???
it's a toggleable mode
just disable it while mining
elder estuary
so option 1: a mode with zero challenge, option 2: a mode with the challenge I want but also i'm blind
great
gray nebula
oh yes revengeance my favorite 0 challenge mode
hollow shell
Iban plz
gray nebula
but the latest update removed the boss buffs on death 
elder estuary
people literally nohit death mode but you're having issues considering people thinking rev is not challenging.. ok
gray nebula
It's pretty much the same as rev but with some small ai boosts on the bosses, and mostly environmental changes
hollow shell
Ohh, okay
I see the issue
The darkness is unintended, Xeta
It's getting fixed in the next patch
gray nebula
I'm not saying it's not challenging I'm just saying death isn't like super hard compared to rev
ashen warren
Honestly I must be the only who is glad to see the boss buffs and extreme rippers gone. I was one for the trickier boss AI but I'm too scrub for required extended nohits
elder estuary
@hollow shell this still doesn't fix my complaint... i don't want it just nerfed I need it gone; the contrast in my eyes is shot after 20 years of staring at a monitor
hollow shell
(also I'd prefer if this didn't devolve into an argument about difficulty preference)
elder estuary
normal terraria is already pretty dark to me
hollow shell
Well I'm saying the darkness won't occur if you have proper lighting equipment, which you do have
sand umbra
except it still does
hollow shell
That's comin in the next patch
It doesn't work in this update so we're fixin it
wooden wedge
the darkness is still there because it's a shader iirc
sand umbra
the lowered light level in the underground is a shader, Rover
it doesn't work like normal light level adjustments or the Abyss
hollow shell
That doesn't mean you can't turn it off
sand umbra
ashen warren
Even when using Night Owl, it is unaffected because shader
hollow shell
if you have certain things equipped
wooden wedge
it doesn't change no matter your gear
sand umbra
...I was told that wasn't happening when I asked Ozz about it before
hollow shell
@hearty yew Clarify
sand umbra
now I'm confused
sand umbra
when I'd asked about making certain equipment null/lessen the underground darkness effect (specifically those from mods outside Calamity e.g. EE, context is spoilers for the moment) I was met with a no and now I'm being greeted with a yes so understandably I don't know what's happening anymore
gray nebula
I'm on the latest test version
here's very deep undeground without any light acessories or anything
here's with suspicious tentacle + shine
so yes, it's fixed
tired haven
(tentacle is overkill ngl)
elder estuary
great now do it prehardmode
gray nebula
brub
ashen warren
Retro/Trippy tend to be brighter, but either way this looks functional aside from considering that you have to get to the underworld with nothing but an orb
sand umbra
so you're a cat
hearty yew
anyway what am I here for
tired haven
gray nebula
hey I didn't do anything
tired haven
what's happening, actually?
hearty yew
wooden wedge
ozz look in the top right corner and click the @ button
elder estuary
i didn't ping u ❤️
wooden wedge
it shows you your pings
sand umbra
x 3
ashen warren
Are we all guilty?
hearty yew
no
gray nebula
talkiing about underground darkness stuff
gray nebula
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/457851493672812549/679036145929158656/unknown.png actually shine only works well too
hearty yew
Ah okay
elder estuary
yeah,... no
hearty yew
Rover has asked me to explain what's happening to underground darkness in the upcoming update
elder estuary
that is way too dark for me
i just need a toggle in mod config to turn off the shader completely... i can barely see vanilla
wooden wedge
turn off death when you're undergroudn then
hearty yew
Answer: It's being fixed in multiplayer.
Nothing about the brightness is being changed, or the fact that it depends entirely on post Skeletron items yet makes 1/3 of the underground unplayable.
night cradle
that's pretty good for shine potion standards actually
hearty yew
It's copy pasted Abyss light mechanics, so it's built to be balanced post Skeletron and later. There is no meaningful way to boost your light level early game.
gray nebula
well that's weird because apparently xeta is seeing only pitch black even with light pets and shine
elder estuary
so basically calamity is dead to me if this doesn't get a toggle off, i don't play non-death mode and i can't play with the darkness added
oh well
night cradle
and you shouldn't be able to invalidate the difficulty which the darkness brings up at pre-boss either, so imo it's good
hearty yew
Quit being a drama queen
elder estuary
i'm not? quit being ableist
hearty yew
Calamity stops being dead to you the second you disable death
elder estuary
i literally cannot see shit
I don't have any interest in playing rev... haven't in like 2 years
wooden wedge
if you can't see then turn it off when you're underground
hearty yew
Calamity is not a for profit organization and doesn't need to make its visual effects compliant with any sort of disability protocol
wooden wedge
then turn it on when you're above ground
hearty yew
I think adding darkness underground was a fucking stupid idea
elder estuary
didn't say it does?
hearty yew
Let me make that clear
gray nebula
Isn't the shine + darkness orb combo screenshot visible enough?
hollow shell
Should that be fixed
ashen warren
I could be wrong, but this seems very much to me like, no one likes this change, but Fab likes it, so it stays.
hearty yew
You are exactly correct
distant gyro
I'm pretty sure the underground darkness effect is barely noticable
elder estuary
this one you posted of shine and dark orb
sand umbra
it's extremely noticeable
elder estuary
is too dark for me
distant gyro
the only reason it gets pitch black is because dumb bug
hearty yew
It's too dark for me too
elder estuary
my eyes are fucked and it wasn't an issue i couldn't work around before this change
tired haven
wooden wedge
then turn off death
hearty yew
I'd disable death mode too if I had to fucking equip my abyss gear just to go mine obsidian
wooden wedge
if you can't see with it on then turn it off
tired haven
Time to see for myself in a playthrough I suppose
Brb rushing hellevator
distant gyro
like: This was accounted for in the test version
The Underground gets darker the deeper it gets without any light (only starts to get noticable in the Mid Caverns) [135]
elder estuary
no! i'm not sure what part of I have no interest in playing rev isn't understood
distant gyro
Mid Caverns
wooden wedge
god.
wooden wedge
turn it off when you need to see
hearty yew
this is clearly ruining some people's enjoyment of the game
elder estuary
i haven't asked to be catered to specifically.. the WHOLE CONCEPT is DUMB and at MINIMUM should have a toggle off for ACCESSABILITY
if not outright removed for... being dumb!
artificial difficulty at its finest
it's not like abyss where at least it's thematically appropriate
hearty yew
Then make a suggestion to that effect and watch as nothing happens
hearty yew
I recommend you do
tired haven
sigh
hearty yew
Once you have shown that certain things are beyond the control of the community start pulling teeth
gray nebula
I'm having trouble seeing how some ennemies being slightly easier to kill while underground can ruin you whole experience
elder estuary
only reason im still typing in here is i got pinged ¯_(ツ)_/¯
distant gyro
if something is relatable to everyone, makes sense, and has a good reason then 120 is not a big deal
ashen warren
Honestly, this, the lightning, and the lava geysers are the only part of new Death Mode that I don't like.
distant gyro
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/678093805160759325 this suggestion got to 120 in like 1.5 days
hearty yew
Randomly dying with no warning, it's vanilla traps 2.0, flashier this time.
If you don't like dying don't play death mode
tepid root
unique vector
its not artificial difficulty, its realism mechanics. its either a keep, remove, or change. asking to toggle mechanics is basically trying to get a compromise of both keeping and removing something while getting the worse ends of both. additionally to that, “just disable death underground” is a fucking stupid excuse. thats like saying “just lower your difficulty level when you get to a certain starcraft mission”, it SHOULD be a proper playthrough throughout and not require constant flip flopping between different modes
hearty yew
ok so what do you suggest we do pixl
fervent zealot
when someone has a disability of any kind, a proper playthrough isn't guarenteed
tired haven
I found the issue with that, seemingly
unique vector
i cant personally comment on the actual severity of the mechanic itself because i havent touched the mod in months, which i plan to fix this week since im on break. ill see for myself how bad it is since i play on dm all the time anyway, and then go from there
hearty yew
yeah but we shouldn't say "disable death mode lule" to a disabled person and walk away
unique vector
i dont want to suggest a fix that doesnt necessarily do the fixing
fervent zealot
we shouldn't, no
ashen warren
I suppose it is called Death isn't it, although I figured that when the world wanted to kill me it meant it would be hard to survive rather than annoying to play
fervent zealot
but it's more reasonable than a demand for the mechanic to be removed on a selfish whim
hearty yew
no it's not
unique vector
if its an issue with disabilities then that would require disabled toggled that cater towards said disabilities, which depends on the amount of audience that needs said toggle
tired haven
It reduces ALL the brightness, making it less contrasting, as opposed to reducing radius of lighting things
Not sure why abyss feels fine, but last layer is clearly uncomfortable when at low light level gear, even when everything around is lit
hearty yew
it's disrespectful to people who literally can't help themselves instead of disrespectful to the wishes of an entire community
fervent zealot
last layer of abyss just uses the vanilla brain suckler effect
unique vector
i didnt realize this was a subject of catering to someone that physically cannot deal with the dark mechanic my bad
hearty yew
yeah it is
That's what started this discussion
"I literally cannot see due to death mode darkness effect in caves"
even with appropriate gear
unique vector
that kinda goes back to the idea of a disability enhancement toggle for those that struggle with said things
another option is to just implement a game brightness slider, but this is terraria we’re talking about
ashen warren
If a mechanic is unfun and worsens the experience of a game, why is it in the game?
hollow shell
Monitor gamma is a thing but I assume that's something Xeta already tried
tired haven
So, that's how it looks without light gear
unique vector
fun is subjective
ashen warren
i legit squinted
tired haven
Note how things that should be bright aren't
ashen warren
such as Lava
tired haven
And UI stands out
hollow shell
Yeah it's not an extreme Darkness/Blackout effect
it's a full screen dim
unique vector
...why does the dark mechanic completely overrule light sources
that makes no sense to me
tiny rose
^
sand umbra
because it's a shader
distant gyro
isn't it a blackfadein
hollow shell
A strong light reduction would make more sense for realism
unique vector
thats basically just saying “yo we’re gonna make game brightness 20% less”
hollow shell
Light is still light but it doesn't penetrate the dark as much
tired haven
I suppose it's because you can't directly change light level of items without tons of work, but it doesn't justify the filter
unique vector
i thought it was a “darker areas are darker, light sources matter more”
and not an entire blanket darkness effect
fervent zealot
see, that would be bearable
tired haven
Same
unique vector
when was this added??
hearty yew
Main.blackLevel or something I think and yes it literally is a shader which just darkens everything arbitrarily
tired haven
Last update
unique vector
did noone say anything during testing..?
is that
is that fucking hell
where darkness makes zero sense whatsoever
fervent zealot
. . why the fuck is the darkness applied in hell
hearty yew
Of course nobody said anything during testing!
tired haven
(weird, for me hell stays at normal light)
elder estuary
i think im in hell, minimap says im in hell
hearty yew
Nobody can speak up
fervent zealot
this isn't 1.1 or 1.2 where hell had an actual fucking background
elder estuary
standing in/on lava
sand umbra
public override void ModifyLightingBrightness(ref float scale)
{
Player player = Main.LocalPlayer;
if (condition)
{
scale -= 0.05f; // or something close to it
}
}```buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut
sand umbra
context: Mod class
hearty yew
Hell is supposed to stay at normal light btw
lost agate
Oh good this is happening
hearty yew
okay thank you Thomas I'll report that
elder estuary
daytime with no EoC buff
sand umbra
this is a thing you can do and should accomplish the same effect without making light-granting items useless
hearty yew
something seems really fucked up about your computer
unique vector
?? why is daytime dark too
hearty yew
that's way darker than day is supposed to be
unique vector
that makes no sense
elder estuary
not my pc
lost agate
Thats not even underground
vocal grotto
Yeah, the darkness effect doesn't come up for me when I'm in hell or above the ground, so that's really weird.
elder estuary
other person has same issue
exact same issue
on a literally brand new pc
built like 3 days ago
ashen warren
That's multiplayer right?
distant gyro
@unique vector I did. test the Death Mode darkness effect The result was that; after turning death mode on and off excessively, the fade in begins at 750' Caverns in a large world. The max fade in is not a lot considering you get to the lava layers by that time and lava is insanely bright.
ashen warren
Where is the other person?
hollow shell
It looks like you're using other mods than Calamity
Is something affecting that?
elder estuary
no
unique vector
i need to start a dm playthrough again, this looks pretty stupid
elder estuary
absolutely none of my other mods affect this in any way
distant gyro
Of course the public version turns out to be different because ???
lost agate
Pixl calm down
unique vector
i am calm?
lost agate
This may just even be a mod incompat
distant gyro
Same for Primrose Keepsake, idk how people made it vanish
wooden wedge
it shouldn't be dark in hell whatsoever
lost agate
Well youre saying its stupid and shit
distant gyro
Too many things went wrong and idek why
wooden wedge
so something else is being fucky
unique vector
...which is why i said i need to see this for myself shucks
lost agate
Aight imma go then
ashen warren
this entire discussion is incredibly heated and escalated way more than it needed to
unique vector
im not stating it is. im stating it seems from what people are saying
vocal grotto
I'll go see if this happens in MP for me as well.
fervent zealot
this entire discussion seems to stem from what is at a guess either mp shenanigans or stupid obscure bugs that make no sense
tiny rose
@elder estuary since this is mp, did you try sp and see if its affected by it?
fervent zealot
or, possibly, both
tiny rose
Is it sp bug or mp got a role in it
elder estuary
sp doesn't do the daytime darkness but underground is still WAY too dark
unique vector
which means it needs people looking at it to see if there is a legitimate issue or if theres just something else being fucky
vocal grotto
Then MP is affecting it at least to some degree then
unique vector
which is what ill be doing, just to see the new changes in general
elder estuary
downloaded off mod browser btw
fervent zealot
the surface darkness is probably mp then at a guess
unique vector
does mp accidentally cumulate the darkness effect? or is it something else
ashen warren
I have a paper to write, but I'll say: I don't understand how things like this even get into the game.
@unique vector iirc ye, it's fixed in test
ashen warren
it was yes, the testers had a lot on their plates with such a large update, it's inevitable things would be missed
unique vector
anywho, if people have complaints about mechanics its best to try and have a discussion about them before actually making suggestions bc ik sometimes people like to outright suggest mechanics to be a config or removed without conferring to other people or the actual dev team beforehand
makes sense
placid girder
@ashen warren as someone who's done beta shit, people are only human and some really dumb stuff gets missed
elder estuary
pretty ironic they were blind to the whole being blind part tho
unique vector
i apologize for not being up to date with everything
ashen warren
true, but this doesn't look like one of those things.