interesting...
#suggestions-discussion
zealous ridge
indigo fog
On statigel and reaver there's melee speed buffs
but otherwise there's only demonshade
hard crescent
So you take the fastest vanilla speed increase (~175%), add an extra violent accessory, two calamity accessories (badge and something else) so add 15+15+4, then add yharim stims
i did the math some other time
versed tundra
how is vanilla 175%???
tired haven
55% armor, 24% reforges, about 66% from accs and a few buffs to finish off
hard crescent
Sounds about right thanks
versed tundra
accs?
hard crescent
Accessories
hard crescent
If calamity truly thinks true melee is that busted (keep in mind that projectiles that spawn every hit wouldnt actually spawn every hit bc cooldown) then it is what it is, but it certainly isnt the greatest way to handle it by placing an overal nerf to the entire concept
And my suggestions to change that have been denied, so now im asking just for an option as to not have to deal with it
versed tundra
for that you need a mismatched armor set and the tipsy (de)buff...
hard crescent
Yes
versed tundra
you also rely on hook for movement
void kelp
too high melee speed actually breaks yoyos btw
hard crescent
Max melee speed wouldnt even be viable even without a cap, but i was just saying that thats the theoretical best you could do
Thats fixed apperently
versed tundra
Wasn't the yoyo bug fixed?
hard crescent
It was
void kelp
aah
hard crescent
In al fairness, a viable max melee speed would not include the armor you would probably want boots and wings, and most likely a dash and or a shield
void kelp
melee speed does only bring you so far
versed tundra
yeah, you'd get less boost to your attack
hard crescent
so it would be more around ~170% or ~160%, so x2.6 decrease in speed
versed tundra
and against armor you lose some more attack
and then you have the added risk because of the range
hard crescent
yes
Thats why i dont get why theres such a heavy nerf for that
Its high risk high reward
versed tundra
maybe because it works in MP?
hard crescent
You can do massive damage but you have to be very close to the boss which is risky
radiant meadow
a cooldown is most certainly possible for some on hit effects
versed tundra
you can have a tank and a min-maxed DPS
radiant meadow
galileo gladius uses a cooldown
hard crescent
I assumed most have a cooldown
Vanilla does that for sure, so idk why calamity wouldnt
distant gyro
I think melee speed could be a diminishing graph instead of flat out more speed
hard crescent
Either way this suggestion is more out of desperation than anything, maxing out melee speed is fun
Someone said they would look into soft capping it
distant gyro
nope; they will certainly get to a still frame with cap gone
look at crab's pre-capped true melee series where something like omniblade is straight up held upwards
not to mention things like samurai badge and stuff got added since
hard crescent
Will do
Rough calculations show that anything with a use time of 7 or below can be a 1 frame
queen sail
Iirc some melee weapons just straight up disappear if the speed is too fast
hard crescent
*11 because autoswing
So if omniblade is 10 frames or lower then it can be one framed because of rounding and autoswing
It has a use time of 9, so yeah
btw calculation is:
[Base UT]*(1-([wpn modifier]/100))*(1/(1+[total mods]/100))-1
(rounded down)
and maybe another -1 because autoswing
void kelp
@timber thicket better to keep your suggestions separate from other suggestions
cyan lagoon
@timber thicket Chaining suggestions is frowned upon
void kelp
oop, double ping snipe 
indigo fog
"Make exo gladius' projectiles a bit faster"
hard crescent
i will literally delete mine and he can reword it
cyan lagoon
and explain why for the second, please
indigo fog
^
versed tundra
@timber thicket 
indigo fog
the suggestions are still chained
timber thicket
in here?
timber thicket
ohhhh
potent veldt
Make the Red Devil from the Demonshade Armor benefit from summoner bonuses instead of magic bonuses.
Why?: This is the only minion in the entire game that benefits from another class entirely, and has no real reason for it. It also doesn't help that this is a dev-tier armor, but also has this weirdly summoner-limiting behavior.
Eh, screw it
timber thicket
wrong place, bud
potent veldt
Read pins.
indigo fog
why does it even give mage bonuses
versed tundra
frail mantle
Afaik the reason it happens is because it uses the Unholy Trident projectile
versed tundra
/s
potent veldt
I think it's because it uses a magic projectile
But it's still a minion
And I think it was largely forgotten, because Demonshade isn't that good anyway
frail mantle
Yea the Unholy Trident projectile is magic because it’s fired by a magic weapon in vanilla
potent veldt
Worth suggesting then
Also, this is the third time I've been "hurdur wrong channel bud"'d by someone who didn't read pins
radiant meadow
you can change the dmg type when something shoots
but it defaults to magic if you don't touch it
radiant meadow
I think part of the reason it isn't summon is to avoid the summoner dmg nerf
and so it can crit
potent veldt
Maybe?
But then just make it so it doesn't even get touched by it
And why does it need to crit when it's base damage is 9000
frail mantle
tbh just give minions the ability to crit because why the shit is Summon the only class that can’t crit anyway
potent veldt
Because vanilla memes
low salmon
cause 20 angery minions critting angrily is very weird.
potent veldt
And, lowkey, I'm fine with minions not critting
It makes a sometimes-inconsistent class far more consistent
I'd be far more worried about my minions snorting dirt off of a ceiling they got stuck on instead of if they could crit
hallow kraken
What’s even weirder is that lightning aura is able to crit but only with shinobi
potent veldt
Again, vanilla memes
Alright, you know
Minions shouldn't crit by default
But I wouldn't mind if there was an accessory at some point in time that would grant them the ability to crit
hollow shell
That'd be cool
potent veldt
Is that even something that can be sugg'd
That's kinda specific, and I don't believe it'd be really easy to code
frail mantle
would probably be SIS meme
hollow shell
I don't think it'd be hard to program, but I don't think it could make the text show up as red
radiant meadow
balancing nightmare impending
potent veldt
Yeah, it would definitely be a wild balancing thing
hollow shell
just like
if rand.next(critChance) == 0 {
damage *= 2;
}
radiant meadow
imagine endogenesis and immat all of a sudden getting crit abilities
hollow shell
not exactly that but yeah
potent veldt
To be fair, you are losing an entire accessory slot for it
Especially if it were a later accessory
sand umbra
you're losing an acc slot for the ability for minions to crit
honestly, what is the issue with minions critically striking? why is that such a not-good thing for balancing purposes
you could always make it not craft into something later
potent veldt
Minions shouldn't crit by default
hollow shell
Because they've been balanced all the way up to this point with no crits in mind
potent veldt
Because right now I'm already doing a playthrough with ranged that has almost all my weapons at 100% crit chance, and summoner is as strong as that already
Giving them potentially double damage on top of that could be risky
sand umbra
I suppose I'm just annoyed that summons just universally can't crit while everything else can
hollow shell
I do think it actually wouldn't be too bad (and may actually be underpowered) considering no summoner gear grants critical strike chance increase
potent veldt
Yeah
sand umbra
that too
frail mantle
tbh an accessory that reduces minion damage but grants you minion crits would be cool
potent veldt
The accessory could just be like, a static chance that you can't influence
sand umbra
there isn't a single piece of summoner gear that inherently grants crit chance
radiant meadow
they don't grant a critical strike chance increase because they can't crit?
hollow shell
Yeah I know
sand umbra
well yes
hollow shell
I'm just sayin
sand umbra
that's the point
giving them a small ability to crit wouldn't be too bad when you consider that critical strike chance is effectively fixed
radiant meadow
they also got big dmg boosts to combat no crit
hollow shell
It's not like, a problem that it doesn't
It totally makes sense
sand umbra
nothing can decrease or increase it
radiant meadow
if crit chance is fixed, it might not be too bad
sand umbra
a fixed crit chance would be best imo
radiant meadow
I think there is a mod like that that gives minion crit abilities actually
frail mantle
there are several
potent veldt
And if you're really scared of balancing issues, make certain endgame bosses lower the chance
sand umbra
I know Fargo's Soul has the Spider Enchantment
which grants summons a fixed 20% crit rate
or something like that
frail mantle
afaik most of them just give minions a flat 10% crit chance and leave it at that
potent veldt
100% crit minions when
Should I make that idea a sugg, or would it be too specific?
hollow shell
I mean...
Giving minions the crit feature that all other weapon types have is a pretty general and understandable suggestion
but tying it to one accessory and having it be a fixed rate for ideal balancing may be too specific
lost agate
minion crit accesory
ya know, fargos has the spider enchant which does just that, it gives your minions a 20% crit chance, but its balanced by the fact its legit the only accesory that does this afaik
so ya gotta use a acc slot for some minion crit and you cant go any further
sand umbra
I was thinking of Spider Enchantment, yeah
except it doesn't craft into anything, let alone grant a slightly weaker variant of its effect when doing so
zealous ridge
is the spoiler period over yet
frail mantle
yes
vapid plaza
Hey since minion accessories are being discussed rn I'd like to ask thoughts on making a suggestion about an accessory/potion that could increase minion aggression range? Going through a summoner run I've felt frustrated a few times trying to get minions to attack something and it'd be nice to use an accessory or a potion that could affect that.
zealous ridge
idk hard to say really
i feel like... that should just be remedied with the weapons themselves
where are you in your playthrough rn?
sand umbra
an increase or decrease to summon aggression range would likely require overriding their AI
vapid plaza
Yeah but the caveat is that then they fuck off and never come back to help you in cases of moon events
I've beaten rev mode a couple of times now
frail mantle
minions in general have a thing for being dumb as fuck and not really having that great range
vapid plaza
Deus was the one to make me think to suggest it though lmao
zealous ridge
deus is a nightmare for summoners id imagine
all those worms just going everywhere
and the probes too
vapid plaza
It was definitely trying to balance out dodging probes and staying close to the final worm yeah
empty geyser
I just realized that some bricks added in Calamity are called "Bricks" and some only "Brick". Is this intentional?
zealous ridge
depends i would think
like a single brick as opposed to a tile of several bricks together
zealous ridge
isnt that post ml
keen geyser
nah I just forgot deus was pre
zealous ridge
i see
well in any case
if im honest part of the problem with deus being horrid for summoners is that deus is horrid as a boss in general
i don't like how he's designed, at least
keen geyser
zealous ridge
idk how most people feel about deus so that's just my opinion
radiant meadow
@empty geyser what is called "Bricks"?
empty geyser
Stratus Bricks
zealous ridge
nice
empty geyser
Oki, cool
vapid plaza
i thought he was fine until the screenful of mines phase really
But at least for me using the dragon the dragon didn't wanna attack unless I stayed really close to the worm itself, which is why I wanted to ask about making an accessory or something to extend the aggression range
sand umbra
are you sure you're not mistaking Larvae breaks for just
QB being QB and inviting herself to the party at random
because she does that quite a lot
potent veldt
I can't tell if you're meming or if she just has some random spawning thing
radiant meadow
oh, there's a party?
I hope you don't mind if I invite myself
I believe random spawns are a byproduct of larva being fragile
potent veldt
^^^ That's what I'm referring to
I'm playing in rev, btw, so it's definitely not Death's meme-spawning if that's even still a thing
radiant meadow
sometimes they break for absolutely no reason
bronze abyss
^
radiant meadow
then she makes her guest appearance
potent veldt
I'm almost positive it's possible that your computer lagging for a split second is enough to make them break
At least it certainly feels like it
It literally feels like if I sneezed on the other end of the world they'd get pissed because that's just how fragile they are
hollow shell
(one of my QoL mods in my recent playthrough made em as fragile/durable as Plantera Bulbs, but I couldn't tell you which one it was)
It'd be welcome in Calamity
s'not a major change and a lot of Calamity projectiles have the range to break em all the time
potent veldt
Well in Calamity it's even more of a problem because Yharon, and the array of weapons you'd have at that stage of progression
cough cough Burning Sky cough cough
zealous ridge
fair suggestion
ill give it a star
anyways
since the spoiler period is over i can talk about this
galileo gladius is like... really good
ive been thinking about calling for a nerf on it
because it's like... good up to pre yharon p2
sacred imp
i wonder if this would be a good suggestion: nerf Verdant v polterghast. i got a 33 sec kill on him with it
radiant meadow
ye, gear is very important
sacred imp
tarragon melee set, community, HotE, seraph tracers, elysian ageis, fire gauntlet, super yoyo bag (i will try with normal), celestial shell, yharims insignia. all menancing
radiant meadow
super yoyo bag is almost certainly the issue
frail mantle
it is indeed
distant gyro
Don't use buffed yoyo bag shit
swift wadi
Yeah no-way that's killing in under a minute with Calamity gear alone
distant gyro
it's just shit and it breaks every law
sacred imp
i will try normal
distant gyro
Just yeet the calamity yoyo bag buffed mod away because it's bad 
swift wadi
Yeah fr get rid of that mod before your entire world crashes and it vibe checks you through the monitor, irl
keen geyser
causes lots of issues too
sacred imp
you were right. i got 1:41 with normal yoyo bag
small talon
@flat furnace I suggest wording it in a more serious manner
indigo fog
there could be a reason for the suggestion but ok
just dont build your arena that close
if all of those npcs die from that it's kinda your fault
sand umbra
Calamity Yoyo Bag Buffed is a bad mo--
oh wait I'm late
byeah, if your NPCs commit liven't from you building your arenas close to your base, that's your fault
now, if your NPCs commit liven't from a fucking Mourning Wood spawncamping your ass, that's another story entirely
sand umbra
pretty sure it is
or was
the problem becomes especially huges post-DoG
where everything 1-shots everybody that isn't you
save for a select few NPCs which laughably enough are all from Calamity
hollow shell
1-shots everybody including you
sand umbra
shit, u rite
small talon
^ if its post DoG moons yeah they do one shot you too
sand umbra
Mourning Woods just one-shot nearly everybody
indigo fog
yeah that has been suggested before
sand umbra
and then stick around to shit on Permafrost, Cirrus, and Amidias too
you can't get rid of them either because guess who else also gets one-shot
you, pretty much the second you spawn
royal yoke
you know what you should vote for? piggy cage! c'mon it'd be epic
hollow shell
Are you trying to make that suggestion become taboo?
You tryin to make it a warnable offense?
indigo fog
It's just unecessary
sand umbra
piggy cage is gonna go the way of my signature flavor text real quick if you keep tryin' to push it like that
just let the sugg gather stars as it may
void kelp
add it to frequently suggested preeemptively?
radiant meadow
I don't think people know how much work it is to animate terrariums
indigo fog
they probably don't
sand umbra
while I can appreciate the concept of more cute little critters to put in Terrariums, I do understand the work that goes into animating these things
or at least to some degree
versed tundra
Why would you put a piggy in a cage when you can get 15gold and a meal?
radiant meadow
I would do it
versed tundra
smh
queen delta
Maybe if town npcs werent made of fine chinas, I'd bother to make a decent house for them
but no they get 5x12 prisons cuz they deserve it
versed tundra
Now I make a super safe underground bunker in the cave layer to lodge them all whenever I hit the bosses and invasions that could kill them easily
indigo fog
What's with the suggestion asking for larva to be less fragile? I couldn't break it with any weapons or projectiles
radiant meadow
must be another mod protecting it
indigo fog
I don't see any changes to larva on the wiki page for vanilla changes
hollow shell
I don't see anything touching the Larva tile in the source
Only thing that comes up is the mud planetoid generating it
indigo fog
I'll test it in the jungle and see what happens
hollow shell
May as well.
It shouldn't be any different.
indigo fog
Throwed Supernova at it and it did nothing
hollow shell
How weird
@potent veldt When was the last time you accidentally broke a larva in-game, with a projectile?
indigo fog
I guess if it's bugged then the suggestion was already in the game
potent veldt
Twice in one Yharon fight 20 minutes ago.
hollow shell
Current version?
potent veldt
Yup.
hollow shell
er
1.4.3
indigo fog
I'm using the current version
hollow shell
That's very odd
indigo fog
are you using any other mods?
hollow shell
What the hell...
There's only one thing I can possibly think of and it doesn't make any sense at all
potent veldt
For me it breaks like normal vanilla, AKA by breathing on it
hollow shell
Seberian, are you using the Calamity texture pack?
potent veldt
Yes, but that makes absolutely no sense
indigo fog
are you using any other mods Seberian?
hollow shell
I'm glad it wasn't the texture pack cuz that would be pure nonsense ...
potent veldt
Yes, but I also remember having issues with those larvae in Vanilla as well.
So this grudge has persisted from before I knew of Calamity.
hollow shell
Yeah, it's definitely the normal behavior to break if a frickin fly lands on it
There's something making them more durable
hollow shell
What's your mod list?
indigo fog
I can't see any of those mods doing it
hollow shell
hmm
potent veldt
None of them should.
indigo fog
I never broke larva with those mods
hollow shell
I don't have AlchemistNPC Lite, Lan's Unlimited Buff Slots, nor Begone Evil!
So one of them could be adding the fragility back in somehow
keen geyser
lan's definitely doesnt
hollow shell
You'd be surprised
indigo fog
I never used lan's or begone evil
hollow shell
And your larvae are durable?
potent veldt
Alchnpc is wonky
keen geyser
they haven't done anything thus far
indigo fog
they're durable
potent veldt
Because it keeps some weird behaviors from the full version to the lite version
keen geyser
aye aye
indigo fog
are you talking to seberian or me
potent veldt
I might try
hollow shell
Voidborn
Begone Evil does seem like the mod that would cause larvae changes
considering it pertains to tile behavior
I'll do it too
indigo fog
I just enabled begone evil and it did nothing to it
The only thing i can possibly think of is Tmodloader itself affecting it
I'm using the latest version of it
keen geyser
hollow shell
What mods do you got, Voidborn?
keen geyser
Lan's, Alchnpc lite, HERO's, calamity and both music mods, veinminer, wingslot, and infinity
hollow shell
Alright
keen geyser
oh and luiafk
hollow shell
(btw Maxwell that's a good suggestion.)
indigo fog
^
keen geyser
very much so
ashen warren
First time I used last prism, I was incredibly underwhelmed. Not by the damage, but by the incredibly boring and almost monotonous sounds it made, especially on the initial charge up. It sounds like a water gun when you first start casting. I got excited when I learned about Yharim's crystal. I thought it was gonna sound unique and satisfying to use but...ya
I have yet to test dark spark and its a dev weapon which is why I didnt focus too much on it in the suggestion. Those are how they are for reasons
potent veldt
Then in that case, for the larvae thing, that'd mean that Calamity disables their fragile thing.
hollow shell
Using no mods. Clean slate tModLoader
https://gyazo.com/7e345b343665a6c5a9df02cf2c56750b
(I am using the texture pack but yeah)
This seems like it was a tMod change, then
hollow shell
That's the only possible explanation
potent veldt
Because I'm positive I've smacked some and they still explode
hollow shell
Everybody involved, state your tMod versions
ashen warren
I saw that suggestion. Why not just make all other non-boss npcs invulnerable during boss fights?
indigo fog
most recent
keen geyser
0.11.6.2
hollow shell
I got 0.11.6.1
potent veldt
v0.11.6.2
hollow shell
"most recent" doesn't mean shit, say the number
indigo fog
0.11.6.2
potent veldt
Weird then
loud steeple
wrong channel for this stuff,might wana take this to bugs
hollow shell
Perhaps
potent veldt
I'll just leave the sugg there just in case
hollow shell
It does indirectly pertain to the suggestion
potent veldt
Until it's officially sorted out
Because even if they are still durable, like everything its pointing towards, I've still had about 3 queen bees in the last 2 hours
hollow shell
Could you go get a gif of you slapping a larva directly, for reassurance?
ashen warren
But yeah. Hopefully Yharim's crystal and Dark Spark get some better sounds
hollow shell
Yeah that'd be cool
"prisms" don't really have defined sounds
they're a bit silent in real life
but
something a bit more bombastic sounding would be good
ashen warren
Well. Yeah. We don't have magical laser prisms irl
radiant meadow
sound man, get to work 
keen geyser
that only applies if you're lame maxwell
potent veldt
I would go find a larvae, but I'm not joking when I say all of the beehives I found just didn't have larvae
And, for some reason, were scarce to begin with, but I'll just say that's me being unlucky
ashen warren
Just...an awesomely powerful laser beam sounding like a watergun, and then a quiet, underwhelming, low hum is kinda...ehhh
indigo fog
make a new world
potent veldt
Aight
sand umbra
thought:
potent veldt
What
sand umbra
Last Prism sound starts out at its current speed but then ramps up as you channel the weapon more
potent veldt
It's still odd
ashen warren
I know this. The sound itself is trash
potent veldt
Even when using it, I expect more than brown noise
potent veldt
Yeye
ashen warren
I was actually disappointed in RE when I heard it for the first time
sand umbra
current Last Prism is very underwhelming in the sound department
and I feel like a change like that could really bring out some more potential just with what it has
(also it needs a better startup sound, Jesus)
ashen warren
Don't get me wrong. Love the thing. Just doesn't feel like a lifeform disintegration ray
radiant meadow
make it use the wail sound
ashen warren
Specifically yharim's crystal needs a sound change.
radiant meadow
ashen warren
Last prism is vanilla anyway. With calamity, you wouldnt be holding onto it long anyway
potent veldt
Okay, yup
sand umbra
hahaaaaaaa
that's a good meme
Last Prism is legitimately good enough to be one of the few vanilla items to be nerfed in Calamity
potent veldt
Only used Photoviscerator
ashen warren
"That's a pretty meme. Exquisite"
sand umbra
it's seriously absurd for what it is
ashen warren
True
sand umbra
and it puts nearly every other drop ML has to shame
ashen warren
coughs in lunar flare
sand umbra
Lunar Flare is pitiful by comparison
indigo fog
@potent veldt did you disable all non-calamity mods?
sand umbra
it's very situational
ashen warren
True
potent veldt
Nope
sand umbra
Last Prism can be used anywhere for any reason
indigo fog
do that
potent veldt
Lemme try again without them
ashen warren
Oh also. I'm gonna edit the sugg
radiant meadow
outdated texture pack 
albeit irrelevant
ashen warren
Maybe different beam colors. The crystal itself is blue but the only two colors that come from it are red and a greenish yellow
ashen warren
Are you getting jungle music when it spawns?
potent veldt
Yup
indigo fog
So far you're the only person to have this issue
potent veldt
Is the larvae immune to only certain types of hitboxes??
ashen warren
Okay so its not a biome issue.
indigo fog
probably not but let me try
potent veldt
Because Im using flamethrowers and explosives
Whereas others have used normal projectiles and bullets
indigo fog
nothing
near rover
I really, really want to make a suggestion to expand the lore in the game itself to make the stories and lore bits more engaging and accessible rather than the majority of the lore being on a wiki page, but im worried about it being too big of an idea for them to reasonably accept
indigo fog
photoviscerator doesn't break it
near rover
I’d use pinky mod as a fantastic example for how such things would work but they go so far as to not only have new biomes but teleport you to entire worlds and dimensions which is DEFINITELY too big of an ask to make of the devs
ashen warren
Can't wait for my sugg to hopefully get 90 stars so the prism series of weapons can get a nice boost in spicy, satisfying sound effects ✨✨✨
Edited to be easier to read
near rover
to what extent would it be reasonable to suggest for in game lore additions? I really like the lore and feel has a lot of untapped potential to make the mod just that more amazing
ashen warren
I think they plan on touching a lot of that up in future
Also theres a whole lore doc in the pins if you want
near rover
of course, im not gonna suggest new stories or anything, im not their writer and they have no reason to listen to my ideas on the lore itself, im just hoping for more ways the lore can be seen and experienced by a regular player and maybe even have a fully fledged in game story if they want to get ambitious
ashen warren
An in game lore browser perhaps?
near rover
Im aware a lot of suggestions would take a lot of time, thats why im asking for more reasonable ideas, a lore browser seems like a rather simple idea or maybe extra dialogue bits from npcs even tho there are already a couple of those
ashen warren
Other than music and maybe some boss sounds, are there any original sound effects even in the mod?
potent veldt
I'd say hold off on lore+ suggestions until they're actually finished with the mod, for the most part
And, yes, there are tons of sound effects
indigo fog
what would a lore browser even do
potent veldt
Ever spawned AEW
ashen warren
An in game lore browser for one would be more convenient and immersive to use. It would be like a lore journal. As you defeat bosses and gather their lore items, the expanded/full entries like on the wiki could appear within the pages.
Obviously to use the lore items, they would still need to have them on them. This would just be another qol change I guess
indigo fog
that kinda sounds like a lot of work to implement
sand umbra
honestly I could see it being like Gungeon's Ammonomicon
where the more you collect items and defeat enemies overall, the more information you get about the world and the items you're using from a lore perspective
it'd be an egregious amount of work though and something that'd probably fall to someone more willing to put in such a timesink
such as myself
ashen warren
I mean. Its not too different than a bestiary.
indigo fog
doesn't mean it'll be easy to implement into the mod
sand umbra
it'd be easy from a programming standpoint once the initial UI was set up
it'd just be really
really
r e a l l y
tedious.
ashen warren
Elaborate
Typing out all the lore again? Lol
Or getting it to add entries upon boss defeat
sand umbra
it'd mean coming up with an entry each for tons of items in the game along with importing existing lore entries
some of the latter especially would no doubt specifically require many items of a set associated with them to even learn of
ashen warren
Items?
sand umbra
...yes, items
near rover
jeez, that does sound like an exhausting amount of tedious work
sand umbra
did I stutter
sand umbra
I am aware, but even then, I've been discounting the fact that UI is literally beyond retarded to work with
I say this as someone who has worked with it to a notable degree
custom UI in Terraria is painful to program and nobody likes doing it
ashen warren
To that end, I understand.
radiant meadow
ripper bar UI is already hella complicated
ashen warren
Because the terraria UI isn't the greatest imo to begin with.
near rover
I didnt mention it, but smth like a lore browser or book is exactly the sort of idea id see from pinky mod, but that does sound exhausting ui wise, especially as they made the browser look like it was written on journal paper which would be even more difficult i think, they have the browser as an item in your inventory that you access with whatever key you bind it to, I'm not sure how useful that information is because I've never worked with this sort of thing tho
honestly the amount of work put into mods for a silly game like this amazes me, love it
versed tundra
Maybe I'm wrong, but don't the life steal effects of post Moon-Lord ranger need a buff?
You can recover much more health from the Pearl God / Aeries than from the bloodstone weapons
near rover
I've never used ranger post moonlord so i wouldn't know
versed tundra
well, there are those arrows that heal one miserable HP a third of the time
and a gun that does the same half of the time
near rover
lmao, that's literally useless sounding, especially if you have that item that doubles your hp
versed tundra
Whereas Aeries and pearl god heal for 10% of their damage, 100% of the time
The only downsides are that you don't do as much damage, are limited by the lifesteal cooldown and you aren't healed on hit but rather when the homing projectile it spawns reaches you.
But even with the lifesteal cooldown you heal much more than with the bloodstone gun and arrows
near rover
meanwhile here's the viscera healing you to full health in seconds for mages
hallow hatch
Lmao facts
near rover
hell even non mages ive seen use it
hallow hatch
I used viscera for polterghast
near rover
yeah, it's nuts, i dont think it even has a cooldown
near rover
i get the feeling it was intended to be used by all classes as even with reduced damage it still heals a ton
but if it was why would it be magic instead of non class damage?
either way, insanely good weapon for just about anyone
as long as you have decent mana and didnt ignore the max mana increases throughout the mod
I couldnt imagine beating expert, let alone revengeance without it, tho i could just suck at the game
near rover
I figured as much if the healing is still great even if you’re not a mage
I just didn’t know what else it could be based off of
versed tundra
it heals for each time it deals damage, augmented by the number of pierces / bounces it did before that
so basically, if you use it in a closed space or on a crowd, it's incredibly strong
indigo fog
Those accessories are intentional
i think it would be too much to have those bonuses outside of water
keen geyser
but having an ultimate accessory be a glorified emblem is okay? 
indigo fog
are you talking to me or
keen geyser
yes
indigo fog
what do you mean by that?
gusty geode
Maybe have them give the effects when it's raining too? Maybe to a lesser degree?
keen geyser
this ^
indigo fog
Imagine victicide bonuses during the rain
that's gonna be too strong
it has to at least be nerfed
gusty geode
Imo it's kinda balanced out by the fact that you can't control the rain at that point
So whether or not it's buffed depends on the day
keen geyser
it'd also make seeing rain less of an "Again? Really?"
indigo fog
still free defense damage and speed
what about turning on the rain and getting amalgam's massive speed bonus and 40 defense
near rover
You CAN control the rain because of the torrential tear
indigo fog
instantly better than a ton of accessories
near rover
Wait nvm you said at that point
keen geyser
then nerf the submerged stats
indigo fog
it's still a free bonus, buffing something that doesn't need to be
keen geyser
it's basically a useless accessory unless your world is completely filled with water
gusty geode
Another alternative would be to nerf torrential tear
indigo fog
what is i have acid rain and im fighting AS
zealous ridge
you uh... dont have the amalgam at AS tier
indigo fog
im talking about a torrential tear nerf
keen geyser
acid rain is honestly a buff
indigo fog
what
keen geyser
crit, damage and movespeed
indigo fog
some people don't want the defense reduction
gusty geode
There any preventive measure you can take to work around that without the tear?
If not then
You lose the one time
And you can come back later
You've got plenty of stuff you could be doing at that point anyway, so it's not like you'd be forced to sit there and wait
craggy hedge
I supose people have already suggested a summoning item for Syren&Levi
What's the devs posture regarding that?
zealous ridge
i dont know the dev input
indigo fog
It's in fargo's mutant mod
zealous ridge
maybe pair it with a massive decrease to ??? spawns post-ml
indigo fog
instead of post-ml maybe it could be post-levi
zealous ridge
yeah, the time doesnt matter really
ancient crow
I mean tbh, the spawn item right now is just a zerg potion
pop one and you get a ??? within 20 seconds
craggy hedge
For consistency, make the item available after killing the boss
ancient crow
but I agree, there should be a dedicated item
hollow idol
@violet palm Chain suggestion, its better to just ping the owner of the suggestion you are referring to so they can edit it
indigo fog
delete it and ask for the other suggestion to be edited
violet palm
ok
@hexed ore Maybe have the buffs be at their strongest and permanent underwater, but let the player keep a weaker version of the effects for a limited time after leaving the water, incentivizing players to go back from time to time to reactivate the buff like some already do with Honey.
indigo fog
good suggestion
potent veldt
Thank
indigo fog
i'm sick of looking at the wiki, going back in-game and repeating that
potent veldt
Also, is it meant to be like that, does the wiki just not state all the things that will save you from certain environments?
Or is it still probably being worked on in that department?
indigo fog
death mode page is probably already worked on
potent veldt
Because like, it always says "Cold gear includes:" and so on, which implies that there is more gear besides what is listed
Which, there HAS to be, because it then only lists three things
potent veldt
Thank
radiant meadow
like how most stuff signals abyss lightning
potent veldt
For the wiki part, I'm either guessing that it's still in progress,
Or that there literally is only 3 things in the entire game that will save you from a blizzard
Which I pray is not the case
radiant meadow
there's more than that
radiant meadow
idk
potent veldt
Welp
If any wikieditor knows, tell me, because I will actually make a sugg about it if that is meant to be the final product
radiant meadow
there might be a section that lists stuff that protects from both hot and cold
quite a bit of stuff protects from both
indigo fog
how is warmth not there
potent veldt
It does, but it also doesn't seem finished
indigo fog
and how would it protect from both
radiant meadow
warmth (and molten) only protects from cold I think
potent veldt
The wiki lists Molten Armor as the first thing that saves you from Space's climate
Which it also says is "hot and cold"
radiant meadow
anything in that hot and cold list saves you from both blizzards and underworld heat
it's just formatted kinda weirdly so I can see the confusion
potent veldt
The wiki doesn't make that obvious, yeah
Just list it out like how they do weapons
Where it's in sections
Also, I still refuse to believe all that the wiki lists is the full list of helpful things in this case
Because if it is, that means only 3 armors in the entire game provide any environmental immunity
*4, if you really count Eskimo armor
radiant meadow
several armors inherit lava charm effects
like tarragon, bloodflare, ataxia, auric
potent veldt
That's what I figured
Also, please tell me Statigel mimics Molten's environmental immunities
radiant meadow
i don't know, but I can try and make it a more conclusive list later
radiant meadow
busy working on coding a new weapon right now
indigo fog
Why does the siren lore give me 20 less defense and 10% less DR? Siren's Heart is rev+ only and I never use it and Spelunker Potions are really easy to get and soon I can just make the Chaos Amulet.
I just want my pet to move normally out of water
these downsides really outweigh the small buffs it gives
ashen warren
Aaaa. My latest sugg is at 50 already XD
zealous ridge
isnt chaos amulet like... as soon as you get into hm?
zealous ridge
no im pretty sure it uses essences of chaos now
zealous ridge
prime elbow
you can get it first day anyways
indigo fog
no you cant
prime elbow
its from goody bags
split narwhal
goodie bags
woeful ginkgo
I got an idea to balance it out guys
ashen warren
Dood. Just change the time on your computer
woeful ginkgo
make it drop from vampire if they are in their bat form
ashen warren
Ez pz
prime elbow
oh sorry. its first night not first day
indigo fog
Imagine getting the best hook in the game on your first night
ashen warren
Second best?
ashen warren
According to many, bat hook is best
split narwhal
1/150 chance from goodie bags and 1/80 for any mob to drop goodie bags
ashen warren
Still. Just set your time to halloween. Boom
prime elbow
its possible normally so
split narwhal
so that's extremely rare
ashen warren
True
woeful ginkgo
if it drops from vampire it could be fine considering it is locked behind solar eclipse
indigo fog
just move the hook to hardmode
split narwhal
1/12000 chance?
indigo fog
it's clearly too good
split narwhal
Or I am bad at maths
zealous ridge
nah, i feel vampire sounds good
idk, bat hook is weird because its a vanilla item and yet its like the best hook
split narwhal
That makes the suggestion basically invaild
ashen warren
make bat hook a legendary item
split narwhal
Since how often do you get a slime staff anyways
small talon
Id say 0.5% from vampires but could be increased with defiled
ashen warren
it doesnt say how fast it pulls the player
prime elbow
I did once
ashen warren
it pulls way faster than any other hook in game
zealous ridge
idk why people call it the best hook really
indigo fog
oh that makes sense
zealous ridge
i think they have similar pull times, but lunar has more range and bat has best pull
ashen warren
if u hook boost
zealous ridge
i think
split narwhal
Fish hook best hook
woeful ginkgo
nvm forget what I say about making it drop from vampire while they are in their batform
it will be too tedious to farm it
ashen warren
and the best pull is like much higher velo than any other hook
woeful ginkgo
but it could be a normal drop from them instead
split narwhal
Fish hook can launch a second hook if you miss your first
prime elbow
Its the reason why fargo rich mahoganny ench is good. you move at like 128mph.
indigo fog
I'd edit the suggestion to have it drop from giant bats instead of normal bats
just because of how good the hook is
split narwhal
Still tho, what will be the drop chance
prime elbow
when have you needed to use a hook in hardmode
small talon
Quite a lot
prime elbow
other than defiled
split narwhal
Static/anti gravity hooks exist
prime elbow
yeah I wont
woeful ginkgo
make it 5% from vampire during solar eclipse
prime elbow
static hook is for wings and thats it
split narwhal
Except for builders apparently
indigo fog
yeah make it drop from vampires
split narwhal
Anti grav is good for fishron
ashen warren
tf
split narwhal
radiant meadow
it can stay locked behind a time-based event and rng
ashen warren
then jut nerf it
indigo fog
make it drop from vampires instead
ashen warren
lol
split narwhal
Why tho
radiant meadow
it's not that easy to "just nerf it"
hooks aren't defined stats like base damage of a weapon
ashen warren
o
split narwhal
Bat hook should have a reliable way of being obtained
radiant meadow
how about boss rush reward
ashen warren
actually bat hooks arent good in boss fights, they're too hard to control
lost agate
a reliable way to get one of the best hooks :echthink:
split narwhal
But making it slime staff 2 is
split narwhal
Post moonlord
woeful ginkgo
or make it drop from vampire during buffed eclipse (pre-yharon p2)
indigo fog
I'd say it's better
woeful ginkgo
I think that could work even tho it is very late in the game
ashen warren
theres like no use for bat hook at all post yharon p1
indigo fog
^
ashen warren
it doesnt work against scal
indigo fog
you're faster than it
split narwhal
You just use wings
woeful ginkgo
yeah that's why I said it's too late in the game
split narwhal
Hooks are awkward
ashen warren
hi shucks
lost agate
hi
ashen warren
even more cute pfps
lost agate
btw hooks saved my ass quite a couple of times
fervent zealot
bat hook is busted as fuck
ashen warren
lunar hook or what
indigo fog
So yeah this suggestion seriously needs to be edited
split narwhal
AEW drop
ashen warren
whats aew
split narwhal
woeful ginkgo
adult eidolon wyrm
ashen warren
o
lost agate
kinda out of the scope but im playing maso and hooks saved my ass several times
KS, eoc, skeletron, wof, the list goes on
fervent zealot
but yes, a way of getting the bat hook reliably would actually be nice
. . . just not at the beginning of the fuckin' game
split narwhal
ye
ashen warren
post plantera is a good time
fervent zealot
pumpkin moon at bare minimum
woeful ginkgo
maybe it could be ok to make it drop post-plantera considering it unlocks the last tier of solar eclipse
ashen warren
actually imo its fine if its slightly busted since hook boosting require a ton of skill and prac anyways
indigo fog
pumpkin moon already has a hook
split narwhal
A drop from vampires
lost agate
having something to propel yourself or just regain flight can be a life saver
that is all
fervent zealot
though it is pretty strong so maybe even craft with nightmare fuel or something
indigo fog
it's not good post-DoG
split narwhal
Hooks have no use past then
ashen warren
what do u use it for then
fervent zealot
regular hook things
zealous ridge
what hooks have use for yharon
ashen warren
why do u even need to hook post dog
zealous ridge
at least, for me they do
ashen warren
none
indigo fog
You're faster then the bat hook at that point
split narwhal
Just use lunar hook for regular hook things
indigo fog
^
ashen warren
flight is superior over bat hook
fervent zealot
yeah but bat hook is literally the fastest reeling hook
ashen warren
now we arent rly talking about the speed
split narwhal
Still slower than wings
ashen warren
whats the point of being barely as fast as wings
but cant dodge
in boss battles
like who tf dodges with hook
split narwhal
Defiled memes
zealous ridge
i dont understand this rude bashing of hooks, like really they're generally very useful even in endgame
fervent zealot
byeah
split narwhal
For resetting flight, yes
fervent zealot
bat hook is miles better than every other hook as well so
lost agate
instant redirection maybe
ashen warren
dash
tired haven
Early game hooks are game changers
As soon as you get wings, however, they turn into flight refreshers
split narwhal
relocator
lost agate
dash upwards smh
zealous ridge
eh, its hard to use it for that, especially in platform sparse arenas that you'd use for yharon
lost agate
h
fervent zealot
or just use hooks
zealous ridge
its possible but hard to abuse
fervent zealot
i didn't come here to argue about why hooks are useful lategame
zealous ridge
you gotta be lined up really well
fervent zealot
i came here to argue why bat hook is strong enough to warrant being postml
tired haven
Another point with hooks that limits their use is that you have to build an arena for them if you want to use them beyond flight refreshers
split narwhal
bat hook is strong but not that strong to be post moonlord
fervent zealot
it's better than the lunar hook though????
tired haven
Given the stats, no, not really
ashen warren
overall lunar is better imo
split narwhal
Lunar hook is pre ml
ashen warren
lunar hook gives u more control over ur character than bat hook which is significant
fervent zealot
the power of the bat hook isn't in its stats, it's in its stupid acceleration
zealous ridge
but... that's a stat?
split narwhal
Solar wings + frog leg
ashen warren
try using bat hook in a post ml boss fight
fervent zealot
i have though
tired haven
The only part bat hook excels in compared to lunar is retraction speed and that is mildly excessive at some times (especially if you hook closely and cannot sling)
indigo fog
^
lost agate
well post plant seems fair to me
woeful ginkgo
I think it could be ok to make it drop post-golem from vampires with a 5% drop rate
lost agate
bat hook doesnt have multi hooking and such
fervent zealot
yeah post plant is kinda already hook bloated due to both moon events
lost agate
post plant is bloated period
tired haven
You say that like changing time on pc to october doesn't make all the hooks invalidated
split narwhal
same with post moonlord tbh
sand umbra
Bat Hook is pretty bruh
split narwhal
1/12000 drop chance for bat hook
lost agate
post ml is bloated? thats new
sand umbra
post-ML is bloated
lost agate
last i checked its even lacking in some department but w/e
indigo fog
how has that suggestion still not edited yet
sand umbra
yep, that one's going on my weekly comedy reel
split narwhal
oof
lost agate
anyway, i need to go now
tired haven
"bloated"
Interesting way to say "overloaded with bosses due to the lack of other content"
ashen warren
wdym bloated
tired haven
Like, quite peculiar
fervent zealot
there's literally only one thing to do postml
split narwhal
Having 30 weapons all crafted with luminite
fervent zealot
and that's MURDER THEM ALL
sand umbra
I think the problem with post-ML is hardly having too much content
it's moreso the fact that the majority of post-ML content focuses on that one thing Calamity seems to love above all else; boss fights
yet when all that's said and done, or if you'd rather not take even more time with a boss rush...there ain't really much else to do
split narwhal
Post moonlord:Kill boss, get mat, upgrade, kill boss
lost agate
well this is derailing to fuck
sand umbra
that's what post-ML suffers from, if you ask me. it doesn't suffer from too much content, or at least not in the sense that it's anywhere near bloated
what it suffers from is too much content put towards one facet of the game, to the point where the other pieces have trouble fittin' together as a result
anywho, that's about all I can say before somebody gets angry with me
split narwhal
Wasn't this a hook sugg?
radiant meadow
people are allowed to talk about other suggestions, y'know
sand umbra
so, back to the subject of "I'm pretty sure Bat Hook has extraUpdates set to 1 or something similar when hooking, which makes it better than basically every hook before Lunar in raw stats"
tired haven
I'd probably say make bat hook a post-3mechs vampire drop
radiant meadow
if it's literally just extraUpdates, Then I will be extremely tempted to force it to 0
indigo fog
post-calamitas/plantera is better imo
sand umbra
...huh
doesn't seem to be
which is strange, because in my testing the Bat Hook actually pulls in faster than the Spooky Hook
...despite the two having identical statistics in every facet, which should make Spooky Hook better by a mile by virtue of having extra hooks
radiant meadow
in example hook code, I remember
tired haven
confused crowd mumbling about how 1-2 hooks is better than more
radiant meadow
there was like a todo commented out about the bat hook's special speed boost thingy
sand umbra
...maybe that'll tell me somethin'
I can cross-reference that with vanilla code if at all possible, maybe get somethin' useful out of it
and the weird thing is, it's only Bat Hook
Candy Cane's got around the same rarity but it sucks in every possible way by comparison
radiant meadow
because mah batman reference
split narwhal
Candy cane is bit more common
radiant meadow
yes, but like the power difference is like extremely wide between just those 2
split narwhal
1/13 with presents and 1/159 with candy cane hook
compared to 1/80 with goodie bags and 1/150 with bat hook
sand umbra
still
the fact that a pre-boss hook, obtained in any fashion, outmatches nearly every other hook before LC says a hell of a lot
and it doesn't say anything good
split narwhal
It's like an extremely rare item that is overpowered kind of deal
You know what this reminds me of
split narwhal
Halibut cannon
radiant meadow
the whole point of this suggestion is to make bat hook more common
when it's an overpowered piece of crap
lost agate
well if bat hook is rare then idk why i got like 3 of them one time
sand umbra
...ech
radiant meadow
you got RNG's blessing
sand umbra
found the example hook code, but there ain't anything useful in it
split narwhal
1/12000 chance?
sand umbra
I'd need a lot more time to isolate where exactly the Bat Hook's faster reeling is handled, really
and while I'd love to help, it's not something I particularly have the patience or boredom to do
ashen warren
i love sound
split narwhal
I hope they fix up the code for vanilla
potent veldt
Man I sure do love brtrtrtrtrtrtrtrt
sand umbra
but I can tell you for a fact that the Bat Hook reels in faster than other hooks, for reasons I can't determine
and I hate it, because it basically makes every other hook irrelevant
lost agate
the sound is a reference
split narwhal
Vortex beater would like to know your location
potent veldt
Vortex Beater is ASMR compared to the Soma Prime.
split narwhal
Hoiks exist
fervent zealot
bad suggestion, 0/10 would not
split narwhal
And you can unactuate the blocks
prime elbow
actuators cant be placed on temple brick pre-golem
fervent zealot
you'd literally have to place acuated bricks around the entire temple to stop hoiking in
prime elbow
you can enter in a not enterence?
fervent zealot
i don't see ANY reason to try that hard to prevent people from entering the temple early
. . . do you not actually know how hoiks work my dude
actually i take that back acuated bricks would make it easier to enter due to a somewhat related bug
prime elbow
I do. Just not well.
fervent zealot
point being you can't stop people who want to do temple early from doing it early