corites while using the phantasm be like
#suggestions-discussion
toxic aurora
gusty geode
What do people have against the Nebula Pillar
Just in general
Brain Sucklers are hated
Nebula Floaters are hated
People don't like how the pillar itself doesn't attack like all the others
fervent zealot
people hate brain sucklers?? news to me
they're actually the least annoying enemy there afaik because they spawn with such frequency you can use them to skip 90% of dealing with nebula stuff
glossy falcon
There's the death laser thing as well as the dog that shoots those balls that I cant see for some reason
gusty geode
K, the debuff they inflict is hated
Tho tbf
What else do you think would happen if you had an alien wrapped around your head
Of course seeing would be hard
teal ibex
i mean the nebula pillar just
isn't that interesting
brain sucklers are basically fodder, i don't even know the name of the ground based enemies because they don't ever become relevant, and nebula floaters are P A I N
so there's not much to love
wide flicker
Or we can all agree the celestial events in general are just kinda meh, and some just stand out more than others (Like the solar pillar and nebula floaters)
teal ibex
i honestly like stardust. i don't think there's anything wrong with it.
but the others are extremely jank for one reason or another
stardust is a bit too ez tho
wide flicker
Vortex having the nasty tendency to snowball really quickly
teal ibex
vortex, aka: dps test and stupid horrible gravity debuff
tired haven
Stardust may have been decent if not for cells being so abused
teal ibex
tru. vortex can also be cheesed so big shrug there
tired haven
Vortex is just. Why
But also the easiest even naturally so ig I'd take the slog over clump and brain torture
wide flicker
Vortex is really easy as long as you don't act stupid and somehow manage to get swarmed and then consumed by the hive of bugs you failed to destroy
ashen warren
fuck nebula bro
ashen warren
@loud steeple which came first doesn't even matter at this point and time
queen delta
Wow I really am the only one who finds nebula floaters easy to deal with
ashen warren
floats do kinda sock doe....
zealous ridge
floats are easy to dodge for me, relatively speaking
its just that if you let them land shots by not focusing on them, they punish you really hard
i think, at least
they basically monopolize attention because they always keep up with you and deal crazy damage if you don't strafe the lasers
queen delta
its just you that sock @ashen warren
quartz hare
:magic_finger:
lost agate
For me pillars are like this
Stardust: Ya should be fine as long as you dont stop moving
Solar: WHERE TF DO I GO or i somehow have a platform in there so i only need to worry about corites
Vortex: I kill a lot of the stuff before it even gets to shoot me sometimes so kinda ez
Nebula: To this day i still dunno what kills me in there sometimes
I always struggle the most on solar but nebula is a close second
tepid root
i usually have a skybridge already so solar is easy byeah
hollow saffron
stardust: easy
vortex: alien queens suck
nebula: was that a brain suckler or an evolution beast
solar: RANGERS BEWARE
ashen warren
solar: hide on an elevated platform and farm corites
vortex: irrelevant
nebula: evolution beast + predictors whose shots instantly fire when you hit them + nebula floaters = guess i'll die
stardust: there are enemies besides the flow invaders that 3shot you?
hollow saffron
imagine getting killed by a flow invader
imean literally the pillar difficulty is so unbalanced i swear
tepid root
lol vortex
foggy kindle
Nebula is a pain in the ass to clear... Especially when you get swarmed by those sucklers and the floaters start sniping you
ashen warren
imagine dying to anything besides a flow invader at stardust
fringe vessel
nebula is the worst pillar imo
safe sail
for me nebula is the easiest
tepid root
i think i died to a stargazer before
ashen warren
how many flow invader deaths tho
hollow saffron
nebula is honestly the worst
safe sail
i just pop a battle potion and go to town on the scramblers then its done
hollow saffron
the rest can be cheesed
tepid root
most of the stardust deaths were flow invaders
tepid root
dont they deal like 200 damage
distant gyro
the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse imo
solar: corites
vortex: alien queens
stardust: flow invaders
nebula: nebula floaters
ashen warren
240
safe sail
yeah fuck flow invaders
tepid root
ok
safe sail
and theyre so tanky
hollow saffron
wait until you fight selenians
or whatever the solar enemy is that reflects projectiles
ashen warren
selenians are baby because cant deflect rockets
hollow saffron
ew who uses rockets
safe sail
never had a problem with solar except being chased by a crawltipede
lost agate
I think i died to flow invaders a couple of times cuz i killed them when i had to turn around
Also yes scorpio
ashen warren
yeah invaders live just long enough to build up at least one orbital jelly to shoot at you when you kill them
lost agate
Theres also those guys who shoot lasers but they never shoot it or dont hit me soo
tepid root
yes stargazers
they killed me before because i was fully unaware of them shooting laser
queen delta
Solar: get cucked in all directions for existing
Nebula: most cheese-able, and the only threat is from ground, so stay up in air
Vortex and Stardust: medium difficulty, easy to die
lost agate
Byeah they can caught you off guard but after that they dont do much
tepid root
also twinkle poppers, what the fuck do these guys even do
lost agate
The worms or which?
tepid root
this
lost agate
Oh
queen delta
Im pretty much always in the air for all pillars except solar
lost agate
Tf are those even lmao
queen delta
Using shrimpy truffle or ufo mount
distant gyro
they spawn twinklers
tepid root
they make twinkles
distant gyro
and become ground pests
lost agate
Ah oke
tepid root
twinkles are killed from like one hit
lost agate
You do the obi wan strat
hallow kraken
You guys know how selenians were created with nothing but a pure hatred for range
gusty geode
What'd you expect from a pillar that's all about melee
Imo it's important to keep in mind that all these mechanics are as annoying as they are because they're meant to be the end of the game
They're going all-out with the bullshit because there isn't supposed to be anything harder and you're probably not gonna be doing this more than a few times
But with Calamity, it's more like the 2/3s mark
And you'll probably be doing it tons of times for all the materials you need
When an end-game event is no longer the end-game
Of course it's gonna seem overkill
frail mantle
bullshit=/=hard
the Pillars could have been designed in a way that made them challenging but still fair, but they ended up being shit like projectile reflection meme
queen sail
The pillars are also boring
They’re built to look imposing and dangerous (as if the apocalypse was happening) but you could just let them be and nothing would change
It’s not like the other events of the game where enemies are constantly after you (e.g frost moon, goblins, etc.)
If anything it’s just a chore (and sometimes a very exasperating one)
wooden wedge
if you leave them alone they slowly sink into the floor
very very slowly, but they do
potent veldt
The lunar events, despite how cool it is aesthetically, is the worst event in the game next to Frost Legion
And Frost Legion was basically farted out
Its an impressive contrast too, because Frost Legion had next to no work put into it, where Lunar Events has the most work put into it
But both are equally as fun
runic heath
Frost legion is strange since it’s a relic of old terraria that’s still in the game and still sucks
placid moth
I think pillars are fine rn
it offers you the freedom to choose the pillar of your own class and more time to prepare stuff
i cant imagine lunar events being an invasion event
and yes, frost legion exists for ZERO reason
placid moth
no
runic heath
Also the enemies are weirdly tanky, do a dumb amount of damage, and as mentioned, still cause structural damage which hasn’t been a thing for any other enemy since 1.2
Pillars are not too bad, solar is mostly annoying because it just punishes range so hard, while no other pillar I think does it to that degree
Mostly I find the pillars to be just mildly tedious
But at least calamity reduces expert kill count to 100 from 150
gusty geode
They do structural damage?
hollow shell
Their snowballs create Snow blocks where they land
gusty geode
Ah
Thought it was something else
Antlions still shoot Sand blocks, so they're not the only ones
But aside from that ye
Pretty sure Frost Legion was made as a christmas event before the idea of the moons came out
And imo that update did it better
Had no value in progression like the Frost Moon
But it added a ton of cool food, placeables, a tool set, etc
And it was accessible at any point in the game
But this is getting off-topic
Undecorated christmas trees are the best decorative item in the game tho fight me
runic heath
Yeah frost legion was added a long with the seasonal Christmas way back in 1.1.1 It also added presents, among some other things. I forgot about antlions, but they're at least confined to the desert so generally won't be too much of an issue (although definitely somewhat of a nuisance at times)
versed tundra
Make the chaos and tranquility candles more like the water and calming candles
Their visual effect (flame) looks much weaker in comparison to the vanilla ones, which are weaker.
Also you can't pick them up with a right click, for some reason.
safe sail
hollow shell
The right-click thing was already sent before
The code was attempted but couldn't be figured out
so
hollow shell
just change your suggestion to making them look more powerful or summin'
safe sail
wrong channel
hollow shell
whar
runic heath
just delete the message
safe sail
no did that guy post in the wrong channel
hollow shell
(I can't tell if Grimm was referring to himself or if he doesn't know that you're supposed to post suggs here first)
runic heath
People post suggestions before putting them in #suggestions-voting so people can give their thoughts on the idea
You can put suggestions directly to #suggestions-voting , but it might just end up deleted, or just be a big DON'T
versed tundra
Make it so you can't right click the water and calming candles for consistency 
hollow shell
versed tundra
add stardust torches that can go behind furniture
would be cool tbh
alright, I'll stop now
Make the chaos and tranquility candles look more like the water and calming candles
Their visual effect (flame) looks much weaker in comparison to the vanilla ones, which are weaker.
Maybe the tranquility's flame tint shouldn't be so close to the calming one, to avoid confusion.
ashen warren
hollow shell
"Make the two candles look more similar to their ingredients.
Except Tranquility, make that one more different."
It seems like you just want the stronger candles to look much stronger
or at least, doing that will accomplish what you say in your reasoning
Main line should be reworded
@versed tundra
versed tundra
yeah, thanks
Make the chaos and tranquility candle's flames look stronger, more akin to the water and calming ones
They don't stand out nearly as much as the vanilla candles, despite having a stronger effect.
Maybe the tranquility's flame tint would have to change a little to avoid confusion with the the calming one.
Since essence of chaos is used in the making of chaos candles and they are red too, the tranquility candles could be blue/white to reflect how they are made with some essence of eleum.
hollow shell
Better.
Lil thing, should say "look stronger"
Just so people don't think you mean the functional effect, at a glance
Good, though
versed tundra
thanks, as always, having an external POV helps a lot
ashen warren
I forgot the Grand Dad had knockback resistance removal
terse sundial
that's more of an oversight if anything
ashen warren
still should be fixed
terse sundial
right
radiant meadow
time to not fix
frosty dagger
Sugg idea: give each lore item a unique Sprite
Currently they get all mixed up in you storage because a lot of them look the same. Also it would make the items much more interesting and just improve the lore aspect of the mod
dawn heron
Or have the lore items be something related to the boss or biome itself. Like for EoC, a retina or something, for EoW, a jaw mandible or something. That would be better than just a swirly bit of magic.
indigo fog
they're probably gonna get their own sprites at some point
i don't think it needs to be suggested
they are probably using placeholder sprites
frosty dagger
@dawn heron, that is the very literal interpretation, and was exactly what I was saying yes
lost agate
Thats done already
lost agate
Lore items have palettes corresponding to the boss you got them from next update
frosty dagger
Oh ok, guess I'll see them today or tomorrow
dawn heron
Where are they? Is the file accessible?
teal ibex
whoever worked on the lore item recolors is actually a master of working with colors and i have the utmost respect for them
no, the public generally doesn't get to yoink testing files
dawn heron
Like Is it pinned on a channel?
teal ibex
not sure if they got leaked at any point, i'd assume not but shucks would probably know if they did
dawn heron
K
lost agate
Or probably not because im not that involved in the mod anymore
gusty geode
Wait what
When did that happen
gusty geode
I meant when did Shucks stop being a dev
They were last I checked and I don't remember any announcement
gray nebula
less than a week ago
ashen warren
Actually, with Duststorm in a Bottle can farm too much Meld Blobs
ashen warren
Wow those lore items look awesome
hollow saffron
^
hollow shell
Discord compression doesn't do em any favors there
This is better
hollow saffron
any sort of order bwhing the shapes?
hollow shell
Nope
I just recolored what they already had
It'd be nice if they were based on the type of function
but they had their sprites before they got functions, so
hollow saffron
imean i was thinking the shapes would be dependent on the type
like a certain one for a prehm/hm/pml boss
or ones for biomes
etc
hollow shell
yeah, or that.
gusty grail
lost agate
either discord is being dumb or youre blocked 
hearty plaza
yeah you were blocked. idr why i did that tbh
gusty geode
See what you mean about multiple choices being bad when one is the obvious correct answer
But when there's actual benefits to both choices I'd have to disagree
It means the choice actually has weight, so you have to choose what you value most and work harder for the one you didn't pick
If you can get the other option at all
hollow shell
except the fact that Sweetheart is a complete dead-end
gusty geode
Again
In this particular instance I get it
But I mean in general
Imo the better option would be to add upgrades to the Sweetheart so that the choice between the two matters more
Then again Calamity seems to have a phobia of choices that matter considering they've gotten rid of every other notable instance of it
So
hollow shell
I beg your pardon
gusty geode
World evils is an obvious example
In vanilla you picked one and lost out on what the other offered
Both had their benefits and pitfalls
hearty plaza
yeah that may be right in some cases that the choice is an actual problem
not this one though
you can either make some accessory that isn't even that good for the time that you can get it
ot you can make one of the best defensive accessories in the game
gusty geode
I've said twice now that in this case I get it
hollow shell
I do kinda like the concept of missing out during some playthroughs
Same kind of reasoning as removing the armor helmet quintet fuckfest
sand umbra
class-specific armor sets gang rise up
hearty plaza
most mods that arent calamity gang rise up, more like
sand umbra
Calamity is like the only mod that makes most of its armor sets forcibly work with every class
gusty geode
Why was evil island added again
sand umbra
and it's a shame too because it seriously negatively impacts the amount of variety you experience in playthroughs
hollow shell
People don't like missing out during playthroughs
hearty plaza
also i might suggest to add something like bars of life to the deific amulet later- i'm against an immediate direct upgrade to one of the best (imo) early hm accessories (that being charm of myths)
star veil is also quite good
hollow shell
Imagine not having ichor
Therefore, imagine playing Corruption ever
hearty plaza
for the cross necklace, not star cloak
sand umbra
it is far and away my biggest issue with post-ML especially, where these types of armor sets are the only ones you have
hearty plaza
star cloak is meme
sand umbra
also, re: Ichor
do you have a minute to talk about our lord and savior
Cursed Inferno stacking
hearty plaza
tbh that would make it good only for the start of hm
because the damage of stacking cursed inferno doesnt scale with how much hp the enemies has
sand umbra
even if that's the case, it's better than it not being good at all
sand umbra
oh yeah
gusty geode
In vanilla at least
You had Scourge of the Corruptor, easier time getting Band of Starpower, Vilethorn, the biome itself being easier to work with
Iirc Crimson was designed as the harder one with the better rewards but idk
Also ye
hollow shell
(I always found the environment of Crimson to be easier to deal with
Corruption chasms are a bitch, and Crimson provides a natural arena for BoC)
sand umbra
you can't ignore the big fat entrance of a Crimson chasm the way you can the simple hole drops of the Corruption
hollow shell
I disagree
You have no choice but to notice the Corruption chasms
sand umbra
platforms
sand umbra
ye
so as I was totally saying about Deific Amulet and how Sweetheart Necklace is a meme
gusty geode
Crimson has a Spider AI enemy
Which can be scary if you get cornered in the tunnels
Also
Like I said, another option would be adding upgrades to Sweetheart so the choice between that and Deific matters more
hollow shell
Prolly
The only thing you'd need to reobtain is Panic
(which is funnily enough easier to obtain in Corruption worlds with Calamity)
(No RNG, right within town)
sand umbra
hearty plaza
calamity moment
sand umbra
the biggest reason Corruption is easier with Calamity: you can literally get the Panic Necklace for
what the fuck is it
like 3 gold
hollow shell
You do get it later, though
sand umbra
after EoW dies
hollow shell
5 gold but yeah
In Crimson worlds it's pre-boss
so it could be considered balanced out?
sand umbra
in Crimson worlds it requires luck
hollow shell
It does
sand umbra
am I the only one who never really uses Panic Necklace on its own
I don't see much of a purpose to it
hollow shell
I used it in vanilla playthroughs
hearty plaza
panic necklace not that good on its own
hollow shell
I dunno if I used it in a Calamity playthrough
hearty plaza
but good when combined with, say
small talon
The speed boost is really nice early game
hearty plaza
cross necklace
sand umbra
like. it gives you a great movement speed boost!...which only procs on hit and does not stack with boot accs
small talon
Good when you get hit by low damage things like thorns
sand umbra
which you probably have if you're getting Panic Necklace in the first place
hollow shell
(in Calamity yes, but in vanilla getting boots is also a matter of RNG)
sand umbra
(speaking in Calamity's context here, really)
small talon
I agree it ain't great but when you can barely reach 5 accessories it's good at the time 
hollow shell
s'better than Shackle
hollow shell
... hm
There are counterarguments but they're all situational
hollow shell
yeah, 'course
sand umbra
at the point where you're still rocking wood armors or low-tier ore armors and don't have a lot of accs to work with
hollow shell
Band of Starpower kinda blows on its own actually.
hollow shell
Panic's the better alt.
sand umbra
literally a boost you can get from Mana Crystals
hollow shell
anyway what the frick were we talking about
sand umbra
Deific Amulet and stuff related to it
I like how we keep getting sidetracked because almost none of the stuff in Deific Amulet is stuff you really use on its own
lmao
hearty plaza
the only one worth using on its own there is charm of myths
purely for the philosopher's stone effect
honestly philosopher's stone carries rampart of deities, along with frozen turtle shell
hollow shell
Philosopher's Stone is indeed crazy valuable
Mage had a big advantage back when it was a part of Sigil of Calamitas / Ethereal Talisman
hearty plaza
it was WHAT
hollow shell
Celestial Cuffs and Charm of Myths were inexplicably in each other's places in recipes
for a while
in the past
then someone suggested to flip em and Fab was like "yeah that makes sense" so he did
glossy falcon
For the point of losing out on the world evils that you didn;t pick, The only thing you don;t lose out on is the Chest weapon. You need to make another world in order to get the other items. I'm also pretty sure the only reason he made it that way was because it made it easier to get the Scoruge of the Devourer when you wanted to make Scourge of the cosmos.
hollow shell
"the other items"?
hearty plaza
nah, you get access to everything corruption
because you get access to corruption blocks
hollow shell
and also a ton of em are sold
hearty plaza
which can be used to spread curroption
glossy falcon
I guess I never really thought of that
But since you cam make more worlds
It still doesn;t really matter
hollow shell
Everything kinda operates under the assumption that creating new worlds isn't a thing
glossy falcon
Yeah, but its doesn;t stop you from doing it, and since characters aren;t world locked, then they can't really ever miss out on anything
He made it all available in one world for convenience.
hollow shell
Java and C# are pissed at you, by the way
Yeah creating a new world is seen as a big hassle
Having everything important be accessible without having to do that is a plus
ashen warren
the chances of this getting in are 0.001%
hearty plaza
just use better multiplayer
green pumice
there are mods for this
green pumice
byeah
hearty plaza
ye
ashen warren
does it work correctly or is it buggy?
ashen warren
hehehe
hearty plaza
it works correctly
hearty plaza
well yes but actually no
tired haven
Mfw lego bricc didn't see celestial shell and daedalus emblem yet 
distant gyro
daddy emblem doesn't even fully inherit celestial stone though
tired haven
that doesn't mean crafting 2 of them is less annoying in that case
Not like celestial shell is in ranger's meta anyway but eeh
distant gyro
distant gyro
I love belts in my mirrors tbh
distant gyro
it's actually celestial stone but yes the question still remains
hearty plaza
mfw crab says the wrong item name
tired haven
Mfw i said upgrade that would be used naturally and everyone interpreted it as material
hearty plaza
mfw the english language is a fuck and in conversation people can be misinterpreted
also mfw we're offtopic
tired haven
Yeah
Anyway, some more common items like cross necklace are passable for multiple usages, I suppose
fervent citrus
I usually have sky bridges in my world preHM, and the astral infection seems to spawn fine for me
wooden wedge
Imagine not being able to react to a sugg
runic heath
Way late, but the band of starpower made some sense in really early terraria back when mana stars took 10 fallen stars to get, and I think fallen stars didn't spawn as frequently, but I don't really have any evidence to support that. At least I don't think they fell more frequently on full moons. Early game it made a decent difference, although it's not like there were a lot of magic items early game. It paired well with vilethorn I guess since that was pretty much the only magic weapon at that point in the game.
Actually looking at the wiki fallen stars don't actually effect fallen stars at all, and as far as I can tell there have been no changes to drop frequency
sand umbra
Fallen Stars are fairly easy to obtain if you know how to get them
hell, you can get them even by just walking along the surface of the world at night
doing this can quite easily garner at least 2 or 3 Mana Crystals' worth of stars
runic heath
For sure, but when it took 10 fallen stars for one mana crystal it took a while to get your mana up
runic heath
¯_(ツ)_/¯
It used to take that many, and in that context it made some sense for the band of starpower to exist, and you got said band right around when you got your first magic item, since there weren't really any early game magic items unless you cheesed a water bolt
sand umbra
meme
see, nowadays there are actual early-game magic items
and Mana Crystals by comparison are a dime a dozen
so Band of Starpower kinda loses the niche it once had
runic heath
Yeah, it is most definitely not a good item given the changes to the game overtime
sand umbra
it may have been good back in the early days, but nowadays it's made obsolete by Mana Crystal recipe changes, new magic items, and the Arcane modifier
(literally the one purpose Arcane even has lmao)
runic heath
The alternative being the panic necklace, which isn't bad, but due to the way boots work if they aren't on concrete it makes 0 difference
sand umbra
byeah
runic heath
it is a great meme for maximizing ground speed though
runic heath
Oh yeah I forgot about that, rocket boots used to cost mana too, but that wasn't terrible for the position in the game they were in. Though you could chug mana potions for infinite flight
ashen warren
I think there are a lot of suggs that can be made about vanilla items that are now useless
Might should have an update just for that
runic heath
You also didn't start with mana, so yeah you'd need 200 fallen stars to get max mana
hollow shell
Someone suggest to buff Starpower
+40 or +60 mana or something instead of +20
lost agate
needing stars to use your magic mirror
runic heath
Old terraria was jank
keen geyser
Buff Band of Starpower
Band of Starpower was used in Terraria because you needed 10 fallen stars to make a mana crystal, and you didn't start with any mana. Now that you start with mana, and mana crystals are easy to make, this item is really lackluster and only serves as a component item. Maybe buffing it to 40 or even 60 mana to make it worth it
hollow shell
That's good
runic heath
yeah sounds good
tired haven
not bonus mana regen smh ye p sweet
runic heath
not reduced mana consumption smh
hollow shell
smh that's that its upgrade is for
runic heath
jungle armour best armour
tired haven
smh that's that its upgrade is for
??
hollow shell
Mana Regen Band
tired haven
Oh
Right, I messed those two up
Wait, wouldn't then mana regen band be a sidegrade?
(just like the rest of that crafting tree hue)
hollow shell
¯_(ツ)_/¯
hollow shell
I like the concept.
Life Regen + Max Mana = Mana Regen
imo its more creative than just granting Life Regen and Max Mana
keen geyser
that is true, but I honestly would think it should be life regen and mana regen
hollow shell
... like literally every Calamity accessory upgrade
distant gyro
this just gave me a reflection
tired haven
Imagine if it was "Life Regen + Max Mana = Max Life + Mana Regen" 
distant gyro
mana jelly exists
keen geyser
epic
distant gyro
it's literally just mana regen band but the regen part only happens when you stand
tired haven
It's also the one that is fair bit earlier in progress but ye
hollow shell
and mana regen gets boosted when standing anyhow 🤔
sand umbra
honestly Mana Regeneration Band's justification for doing what it does is really creative
more creative than some other accs I know, anyway
sand umbra
really highkey
hollow shell
We've had this convo before though
sand umbra
lowkey you should show me that doc sometime
I'd love to know more about how you feel on all this
hollow shell
I don't want you stealin the ideas for EE
sand umbra
you know me too well 
sand umbra
implying Obsidian Swordfish is balanced properly for Hardmode at all
hollow shell
Ask a tester
lost agate
because its not even good for SG
indigo fog
If it's not good for even SG, why is it lime rarity
lost agate
because vanilla balancing
keen geyser
redcode and vanilla balance
sand umbra
if it were actually powerful enough to justify it being in Hardmode it wouldn't be obtainable pre-Hardmode, I'll tell you that much
cobalt rose
but isnt the hotline rod HM
sand umbra
yes
keen geyser
slurper pole aint
distant gyro
calamity has a thing
tired haven
It is
But that's vanilla doing a dumdum
distant gyro
called slurper pole yes
sand umbra
however, Slurper Pole can be obtained at any time from Soul Slurpers
distant gyro
although it would be interesting to see how it performs on hive mind and stuff
sand umbra
needs a buff either way if you ask me--
keen geyser
on hive mind it seems to perform above average
indigo fog
What's the purpose of the heart rapier existing
hollow shell
I need healing
keen geyser
it's for the genji onetricks
indigo fog
should its range be buffed
hollow shell
I mean
5 HP per hit ain't bad
distant gyro
buffing a spear's range generally goes wrong or awkward
hollow shell
right at the beginning of HM
distant gyro
its recipe is literally 10 life crystals though
indigo fog
but who uses it
distant gyro
what about making the recipe more complex by adding palladium/cobalt
hollow shell
You already need a Mythril Anvil for it so that won't really do anything
distant gyro
am aware
sinful violet
heart rapier is just kinda there yeah
has a decent sprite though
so it has that going for it
indigo fog
what if its range was increased, but its healing was slightly reduced
that'll make me want to actually use it
hollow shell
@sinful violet Bone Sword?
Skeletons do drop those normally.
fuck wait I'm a dickhead
s'
yeah
Armored Skeletons and Skeleton Archers do not
and Hoplites
hollow shell
Specifically those three are not very necessary
but the Amarok and Hel-Fire make more sense
because those can drop from all enemies in their respective biomes
which could be annoying if we made them all affected and you got a bajillion of them if you happened to be farming there, or if we made em not affected at all and it's annoying due to still being hard to obtain
sinful violet
Still pretty pointless however
Neither are very difficult to obtain
Also uhh, could you confirm this bit? In particular the “or more” part.
hollow shell
Yeah sure
sinful violet
Yeah, sorry. I don’t have access to source at the moment
Not that I’d be able to read it
cyan lagoon
(This primarily focuses on weapons that have multiple classes)
sinful violet
Alright
arctic wren
tbh in regards to the band of starpower thing
I'd like for it to get a more unique effect instead
not really sure what, though
runic heath
Reduced mana consumption would be cool
arctic wren
something like that might work
sand umbra
Band of Starpower for slightly increased magic damage or crit chance though
something unique to the Band itself
or just. something that isn't already covered by another very early-game mage acc le cough
sinful violet
imagine using natures gift
sand umbra
implying I was talking about Nature's Gift
although I suppose that counts for that too
I was moreso talking about the direct upgrade that requires very little to actually get, the Mana Flower
which is much more widely used, albeit for the auto mana potion rather than the inherited mana costs reduction
sinful violet
Nature's gift is a more apt comparison anyway smh
sand umbra
the point is there are already two very early-game accs that reduce mana costs, one of which is a direct upgrade from the other
runic heath
I forgot about the mana flower tbh
mainly because I haven't done a mage playthrough in ages
and also because I am capable of pressing a button to use a mana potion
sinful violet
@whole delta Sorry, could you clarify?
hollow idol
Monado what
elfin swan
I think this counts as a specific item suggestion
versed tundra
Yeah, I'd really like a ref to Xenoblade but that sugg is a big 
moment
swift wadi
Monados are a mechanic in Xenoblade
sinful violet
I see
elfin swan
Monado is shulks sword
swift wadi
Which sounds weird to be in calamity lol
whole delta
Sorry my bad >///< its merely a suggestion ofc
elfin swan
It'd work better as a patron item
hollow idol
versed tundra
Monado was the title of Xenoblade before they rebranded it so fans of xenogears and xenosaga could go "another xeno gaem? wow thanks monolith soft!"
sinful violet
Yeah, sorry, specific item suggestions aren’t allowed
versed tundra
Besides that sounds like a very complex item/series of items
Maybe you can make your own Xenoblade mod though ;)
sinful violet
No problem
radiant meadow
@sinful violet removing bone sword from those 3 enemies would either require making a new list subtracting just those 3 enemies (unnecessary file size increase) or make dropping ancient bone dust more tedious in code
sinful violet
radiant meadow
it uses a list
sinful violet
There’s a separate reason they drop bone swords while defiled is active?
radiant meadow
because there's like 20 different kinds of skeletons
sinful violet
Oh right, that
radiant meadow
because lol variation
sinful violet
Jesus, right right
radiant meadow
the bone swords is just an accidental side effect
one that is to be documented on the wiki
sand umbra
wouldn't it be possible to just check for NPC type when going through the list
sinful violet
Then would it be a lot of extra work to just make them drop bones sword normally.
The point is to start cleaning up defiled
radiant meadow
I don't see why that needs to be cleaned up though
sinful violet
Because it’s an unnecessary detail/basically a bug turned feature in their case which isn’t even listed on the item.
lost agate
oh look its from when i still was testing
sand umbra
alternative: csharp if (npc.type == thing1 || npc.type == thing2 || npc.type == thing3) do not; else { stuff; }
sinful violet
Solution’d still be to add it to their normal drop list. It’s extra work of course but again, it’s worth it.
sand umbra
radiant meadow
is it worth it
sinful violet
For the sake of polishing the mod? Yeah
radiant meadow
also, if you remove the yoyos, then the yoyos just won't be affected by defiled
sinful violet
Or do we want to add to defiled rune the fact that it makes certain enemies drop items they usually don’t and list them out.
Also what’s the case for stuff like yelets?
sand umbra
Yelets drops from turtles
radiant meadow
yelets is actually the same as amarok and hel-fire
regarding defiled
since all 3 are tied to biomes, not specific enemies
editing the wiki rn to reflect that
sinful violet
That’s what I’m saying yeah
Wait so all the post golem plague enemies only drop yelets with defiled now? 
radiant meadow
no?
sand umbra
p. sure Yelets just drops from anything killed in the Jungle or Underground Jungle
normally
sand umbra
after a Mech, ye
radiant meadow
same with amarok and helfire but different conditions
sinful violet
That’s why I’m asking what the case is for them
radiant meadow
(and slightly different drop rates)
the case for them is that they normally drop with a < 5% chance but aren't tied to a specific enemy
rather, they drop from any enemy killed under certain conditions (amarok being in hardmode snow/ice biome for example)
By making them affected by defiled, they are tied to an enemy and then will drop it even if not meeting the biome conditions
sand umbra
can I at least request that the Hel-Fire drop be moved to something more connected to Hell
Sun Bats are only very loosely connected to the item in that they are...both hot, probably
wouldn't a more fitting candidate be Demons or Hellbats/Lava Bats
sinful violet
So the drop rates for the rest of the enemies concerning those yoyos is just unaffected
keen geyser
doesn't it drop from any enemies in hell?
sinful violet
No it drops from lower caverns too
sand umbra
the condition for Hel-Fire is the bottom half of the Caverns and the entirety of Hell
most people generally associate it with Hell specifically
sinful violet
I wonder why
sand umbra
heh
sinful violet
This is why we probably really need to just clean up defiled . So many edge cases and some weird exceptions normal players aren't aware of. Like if they didn't get their biome key drop from the respective boss and wanted to farm it they'd probably use defiled, but nope.
Biome specific drop
sand umbra
but like
you have a yo-yo that is primarily assigned to and associated with things that spawn in Hell
...and then you have an enemy that is completely unrelated, being more akin to the likes of the Sunskater, and which can spawn basically anywhere underground
my question really becomes "how are these two things connected?"
radiant meadow
biome key drops from bosses are 20%
sand umbra
and, as a follow-up: "is there not a more suitable candidate for Hel-Fire specifically given its normal association?"
sinful violet
I know that 
radiant meadow
then why'd you use them as an example
sand umbra
because there are most definitely people that have no idea bosses are changed to drop biome keys
sinful violet
Because the example I gave was of a casual or newer player who just wants to experiment and play with the mod
Use the stuff they have given too them.
A lot of the stuff defiled rune boosts which people actually want is basically circumvented by farming with zerg or crafting, which is a lot easier than the effects it gives the player.
For those effects I'd honestly say it might make sense to have it boost something like only legendaries or rare item variants.
sinful violet
What was the bone sword oversight exactly
Also yeah yoyos are an entirely different issue
radiant meadow
the fact that armored skeletons, archers, and hoplites drop it in defiled
and only defiled
sinful violet
Ah
ashen warren
So do they not drop it at all anymore or do they drop it outside of defiled?
Oh wait no one uses it anyway
radiant meadow
they do not drop it at all anymore
ashen warren
Good call
radiant meadow
Made SCal drop it at 100% chance
sand umbra
still probably gonna push for Defiled's Hel-Fire drop being moved to Demons or Hellbats soontm
radiant meadow
perhaps
sand umbra
hollow shell
or Heat Spirit, if we want it to be Calamity for some reason
radiant meadow
it shoots vanilla projectiles as of now
not to say that it can't shoot modded projectiles
cyan lagoon
It would be up to the spriter(s) whether they take your word to consideration
quasi oasis
Sorry about not being the most versed in how calamity works, It was just something that came to mind earlier today.
zealous ridge
ye, interesting idea
but i dont see it working with the... current design?
if it were designed around that alien hornet theme, i think it would look really nice
but yeah, its not really up to devs, moreso spriters
radiant meadow
go bug bee about it
zealous ridge
haha yes
swift bison
can you do clonedefaults with a projectile btw?
radiant meadow
probably?
quasi oasis
Does the damage of the bees depend on the gun's damage currently? If so, then maybe the modded projectiles could be buffed in place of the gun to allow for the change in appearance?
swift bison
because if so programming the new projectiles would be pretty easy in the event this sugg ever got accepted
radiant meadow
the issue is more of spriting them
swift bison
^
radiant meadow
oh ye, yes you can clonedefaults on a projectile
it's on the basic projectile guide on the tmodloader wiki
swift bison
kek
zealous ridge
also, on the note of bees
i didnt notice until recently, but plague keeper uses 2 seperate bee projectiles
is that a coding thing to make it work properly?
also, despite the fact that its themed as such it doesnt use plague bees
which exist
quasi oasis
where can you view calamity's projectiles? Terraria wiki has its own page for them if I remember correctly but I don't see anything for calamity.
hollow idol
because its “””unnecessary”””
radiant meadow
the plague keeper only uses one bee projectile, doesn't it?
I think it only has one bee projectile
unless you have hive pack or plague hive equipped
then it'll spawn buffed bees instead occasionally
zealous ridge
well, heres what happens
normal bees are spawned from the cloud, so no suprises there
but when you land true melee strikes, a new bee that stays stationary when no targets are nearby is spawned
i noticed this primarily because normal bees dont show the particle effects associated with fire gauntlet or cursed flames
but these new bee projectiles do
radiant meadow
true melee strikes spawn 3 bees
wait
that means the bees spawned by plague keeper don't do melee dmg (the ones spawned by the cloud)
fixing that now
zealous ridge
interesting
radiant meadow
they're the same bee projectile
the ones spawned on true melee swings do melee dmg
the other ones don't
zealous ridge
huh. interesting
radiant meadow
I did that a few hours ago
hexed ore
Nice, thanks!
ashen warren
Should abyss had Echo sounds as ambient?
hollow shell
The Abyss does have some ambient sounds through the soundtrack and, deeper down, the roars of idle minibosses
but, there could be more, I suppose
ashen warren
because Abyss is a very dark ocean
sand umbra
see, Terraria's sound engine is
not good.
it has like 5 slots for sounds happening at any given time and that's that
hollow shell
It is possible for us to do our own XNA things
(which Ozza did recently for an item)
so, maybe
ashen warren
mmm ok
gusty geode
Imagine if you could hear the roars of the bosses echoing in the distance in the upper layers
And it got louder the deeper you went
ashen warren
welp
i'll wait until the Update releases
to suggest things
what means these emotes?
radiant meadow
microwave
ashen warren
both emotes means microwave?
sand umbra
m is for microwave
hollow shell
m
sand umbra
m
swift wadi
m
plucky matrix
woeful ginkgo
ashen warren
hollow shell
No idea if there's a defined system for this yet
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/673180560340025345 👍 @potent veldt
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/673259609213108255 👍 🏁 @hexed ore
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/668979495939866654 👍 @craggy hedge
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/668923748182917134 👍 @indigo fog
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/671178516196360192 🚫 @warm tinsel
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/671805260251004969 🚫 @fossil fern
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/672307815649378309 🚫 @swift wadi
hollow shell
RIP
These're just the ones I've delivered, btw
I don't wanna intrude on others' (and have that recent Brav/Altix situation)
swift wadi
Good idea
What did you think of my sugg Rover? Not like it matters, just wondering
Also, you basically run this channel, you could make the system :p
hollow shell
I could indeed make the system
(It'd be much easier to systematize once the bot gets done, if it ever gets done)
I'm spose I'm okay with a Tiger Skin recipe considering how rare it normally is, and it's used in a Calamity item
Not sure what the other devs' exact reasons were, but I guess cuz it's just one item that uses it
You could live with missing out on one item
It's a post-Providence item as well, so the chances that you've seen Tiger Skin sold at least once by the time it becomes available are decently high.
swift wadi
Fair
hexed ore
What're the conditions for Tiger Skin?
ashen warren
I want to suggest an isopod critter for the abyss, however I have been told that specific npc suggestions are also banned
If they really are, I did not find them on the donts doc so that should be added if it is the case
radiant meadow
I wasn't aware they were disallowed, but they might be frowned upon
for being specific
hollow shell
You could suggest something like that in a general manner
sand umbra
wasn't GSS a specific NPC suggestion, or am I beyond retarded
radiant meadow
that was long before the star system tbf
hollow shell
and sure I'll add a note about it on the Don'ts
("Not disallowed, but frowned upon" is the current policy. It may become flat-out disallowed eventually)
And yeah it was indeed a specific NPC suggestion prior to the star system
made by That Guy with the garchomp pfp
or That Dude
can't remember
ashen warren
anyways
hollow shell
Ah, they changed their name to Bellossom and have since left the server
sand umbra
pensive
hollow shell
(thank you Discord notes. If only they didn't put a fucking limit on you)
anyway yeah
you could suggest that an isopod or isopod-like enemy be added
as long as that's pretty much the extent of your specification
and you provide a good reason for it
ashen warren
yeah
I don't really have a good reason however so I'll just leave it here and in the back of my head
void kelp
another good reason is maybe ambience
hollow shell
Could be a good critter.
sand umbra
the world could always use more critters
void kelp
@drifting sail but why
hollow idol
that would overwork the mods
cobalt rose
"i want a role"
sand umbra
meme
sand umbra
also this reminds me that I need to prepare for Wand of Sparking v. KS: Round 2
zenith hazel
who would want to go for actual nohit roles when you can go for the easier ones instead?
drifting sail
to increase the variety, many people do not have the ability or cannot make all the bosses without taking damage, in my opinion this would increase the number of people challenging themselves mainly in the boss rush that many ignore and in the defiled rune too @void kelp
hollow idol
you give the nohit roles a privilege like SaA access duh
void kelp
see that’s an actual reasoning you can edit in
hollow shell
Well
yeah the point of the exclusive roles is that they're really hard to get
Most people are indeed not able to do it
drifting sail
but the roles of completing without taking damage would still be superior, only for the best
zenith hazel
yeah, but that'd still remove the point of going for harder roles since everyone can just get the easier roles
hollow shell
But it's kind of a simple role for just
beating Calamity on its intended difficulty
void kelp
when everyone’s special, who is, I suppose
hollow shell
(Hopefully) a ton of people would have that :P
zenith hazel
yeah, what spider said
hollow idol
tell that to the fact most people use a decent amount of qol mods that affect gameplay
void kelp
especially because rev is literally calamity’s intended difficulty
drifting sail
I think not, because there would be progressions in your level on the server, as if it were a qualification, many would start with the easiest positions and try to take them without taking damage
void kelp
but if you’re already trying for a role you may as well just go for defiled soul
sand umbra
this feels like that one line from The Incredibles which I totally didn't have to look up to see if I was remembering it right
"when everyone's super...no one will be"
void kelp
which is exactly what I was referencing
sand umbra
drifting sail
I don't say a big role, just something like you managed to do a complete run of calamity, congratulations haushaus
sand umbra
it's the truth, really
zenith hazel
why should there be progression in the server?
void kelp
if you want a special role you can always go for a mute or warn, or even wiki contributor
hollow shell
(There already is)
(Defiled > Death > Rev nohits)
(that is, "greater than", not arrows)
Oh yeah I didn't even think about the implementation
drifting sail
yes, it makes sense, I thought it would be nice to increase progressions to make people more active, but just like you said, it is better to have very difficult rolesonly
void kelp
I mean if you’re active people will know your name even if you’re not a nohitter
drifting sail
yeah
hollow shell
Hollow is what you get for Rev no-hitting the Boss Rush
drifting sail
i will try to get the untouchable and the dead inside, i stopped in moon lord, today i will finish and make the videos
ty guys
hollow shell
Good luck, Turttle
drifting sail
thanks hsuahsa
drifting sail
wooow
hollow shell
(Derpy Lord never existed I guess)
swift wadi
Was he also one boss away?
hollow idol
what about if you no hit defiled BR
swift wadi
I was making a joke about myself
hollow shell
(No he deleted all his messages in this convo)
hollow idol
lost agate
(hollowed doesnt have to be rev specifically)
hollow shell
(Is anyone gonna do it in Death when they can do it in Rev?)
lost agate
(with the rippers, yes)
hollow shell
(Not anymore)
swift wadi
(I've never actually seen someone do rev-defiled)
lost agate
(update isnt out yet,.,.,.,..,)
radiant meadow
reminder that some people with nohit roles are still nobodies as well
radiant meadow
sm644me is like god, but he doesn't talk much here
frosty dagger
What are these other roles? Where would I be able to find info about them because I've only seen the ones mention on the info page
frosty dagger
Oh, what was the hollow and dead inside things then
frosty dagger
I'm going to pretend I'm not and idiot and only didn't skim it so I hadn't seen that
drifting sail
if you do the boss rush dad mode you are a calamity master basically
fervent zealot
i already have an idea but i don't remember if DM environmental hazards are enabled during bossfights or not
lost agate
Go try the mode first
sick saffron
ashen warren
versed mica
ashen warren
6 arm
void kelp
Unless the math works by a multiplicative factor so now you have 8 arm
((HP your lack of a profile pic radiates a powerful energy that I cannot easily describe))
ashen warren
tepid root
maso doesnt even add any arms to normal skeletron tho?
ashen warren
why are there people that play on Death Maso
ashen warren
Me no hav patience
lost agate
:wot:
ashen warren
And?
queen sail
Are they not already called that
hollow saffron
i thought it was always "calamini" what
keen geyser
nah they're calamitamini
frail mantle
Calamitamini, Catastromini and Cataclymini
cobalt rose
i guess calling all three "calaminis" makes more sense then calling them all by just one of them
queen sail
Bacon
ashen warren
oh so the catch able piggy is a donor item
uneven wing
What are the mini twins called anyway
green pumice
catastrophe and cataclysm
placid moth
the optic staff ?
sand umbra
the catchable Piggy is a dedicated item for the reason that the Piggy itself is a dedicated NPC
toxic kettle
ashen warren
oh alright, thanks for clarifying Thomas
sand umbra
ashen warren
poi 
hollow shell
@worthy fiber Using wiki images is not a good argument, because the wiki flips all NPCs to the left even if they're facing to the right in source
The bit about vanilla critter items is mostly correct
worthy fiber
elder kiln
also makes the piggy more cursed
low salmon
You have awoken an ancient evil.
terse sundial
that might even be an oversight
karmic stone
If ||Deathmode's Enviromental Hazard's|| were a thing for all modes the config would be best toggled off by default, which is not neat
So I think it's fine as-is
hollow idol
your config option is the death mode item itself
terse sundial
Death mode is no longer meant for casual players
distant gyro
terse sundial
yes and no
death used to just be revengeance stat boosts and a few minor AI changes
swift bison
i personally wish a less severe form of the environmental hazards were a thing in rev
terse sundial
and yes, the "config" toggle for death is literally the death mode item
low salmon
hollow idol
Generally when I see toggle my mind automatically goes to toggle off, heck
low salmon
Oof, Yeah I was wondering why everyone was thinking it's to turn it off.
Death MOde is death mode, just being able to turn them on outside of it sounds like immersion
void kelp
I imagine it’d be like the lethal lava burn toggle
ashen warren
I mean for people who want a bit more difficulty but dont wanna go all in. Ya know? Not everything obviously because otherwise death mode wouldn't be that special if you could just turn it all on in the base mode.
queen sail
death wouldn’t be that special if you could just turn it all on in the base mode
...how
The changes are the only thing that make death unique at this point
Making all of them toggles for people to experience would just rob it of that
vestal comet
Environmental Mode Toggle item when
keen geyser
calm temple
I thought the idea was to never really lock content behind death mode, hence why we can’t suggest death mode exclusive items and such.
Similar to the upcoming vanilla master mode
keen geyser
here we go
ashen warren
Locking items behind death mode and locking game mechanics behind death mode are different
radiant meadow
Night's Gaze doesn't have sticking
and iirc for some reason Poss didn't want the weapon used in Eclipse's Fall to not use sticking
(this was brought up when I suggested Profaned Partisan use Daybreak in its recipe)
hollow shell
This brings up a point.
Should Death Mode item suggs be allowed now?
The rule was originally intended for Specific Item Suggestions anyhow
and now Death Mode is much more of its own mode
ashen warren
Criticizes me for saying death wouldn't be special if the features could be enabled in normal mode...then proceeds to tell me why by saying exactly what I said. 🤔
hollow shell
Today is just full of miscommunication, and assuming worse of people...
ashen warren
Indeed
radiant meadow
wdym death mode item suggestions?
terse sundial
suggestions for death mode exclusive items
queen sail
All rev mostly has is legendaries and some rage accs ig
gusty geode
Death mode could potentially add items to combat the environmental changes
shell lynx
I was about to say that, but I don’t know how many exist already
gusty geode
Like, say
A heat shield to make you immune to damage from flame jets
Or a visor to make it so you can see in the AI again
shell lynx
I’m assuming all the scarf accessories count, so counter scarf might work against cold
queen sail
That would probably start making us too similar to maso
sand umbra
Masochist Mode from Fargo's Soul Mod
night cradle
Masochist mode
queen sail
Harder difficulty mode created by Terry