ah, that reminds me of what my next great OOA suggestion will be
#suggestions-discussion
sand umbra
still cliff
Ohhhh
hallow kraken
Can still be gotten easily with volcano trapping pirates
zenith hazel
if any recipe has a banner in it, 99% of the time it’s from Fargo’s
radiant meadow
on a side note, I added glittery dust to gilded/gleaming daggers
which does not fulfill the suggestion req, but it's an easy way for me to avoid getting yelled at by Rover
tepid root
still cliff
still cliff
Ok
lost agate
radiant meadow
star dust makes stars
still cliff
Yed
radiant meadow
are you asking for reverse compatibility?
still cliff
Yes
radiant meadow
5 stardust -> star
star -> 5 stardust?
still cliff
Maybe
green pumice
isnt that in thorium
rapid pivot
hm
would it be possible to give the Boss Rush EoW a single healthbar, rather than giving all of its segments the full amount of HP and just having it die when you kill one?
the way it is now, the game can absolutely chug because it doesn't like handling a boss with that much HP times that many segments
lost agate
EoW having multiple hp bars isnt even intended afaik
But it happens since EoW code is a meme
toxic kettle
Why specifically the Autohammer? 
lost agate
Post plant 
radiant meadow
the recipe to make stars from stardust uses a mythril anvil
so it'd only be natural if it was an anvil to change back
toxic kettle
yeah
I doubt there's a way to lock a crafting recipe behind a certain point in the progression through anything other than ingredients or the necessary crafting station
sand umbra
there are multiple, actually
it's just that none of them would be particularly intuitive in this scenario
radiant meadow
add a downed bool req to the recipe 
sand umbra
hollow shell
@spiral niche Boss suggestions aren't allowed. Joke suggestions aren't allowed.
spiral niche
It wasn't a joke but thanks for informing me
spiral niche
Boneface?
frosty dagger
Sugg idea, add more post ml sentries.
Currently, sentries have good progression till then, there is always a good sentries a summoner could run. In post ml however there is only energy staff, and it becomes useless post poltergast. Adding another would make the sentry progression much smoother
frosty dagger
Ok then, did it go through?
radiant meadow
@spiral niche ye, I'm sorry, I know I'm late, but meme suggestions like that really aren't acceptable
That's gonna have to be a warn
hollow shell
ouf
spiral niche
Oof
calm moat
a suggestion idea: add plague hives to the jungle since the lore states that even entire hives became plagued and i think it would make sense for them to be added
frail mantle
suggested before, i believe
calm moat
yeah i actually thought someone would've thought of that
calm moat
well it would screw with the progression if it spawned when generating the world
idk tho
distant gyro
no it could totally plague the jungle in the same way hardmode crash an astral infection
that's not the problem
calm moat
thats true
distant gyro
the problem being biome suggestion = no
hallow kraken
plague biome is frequently suggested iirc
hollow shell
It is
hallow kraken
“Also partly a shouldn’t”
hollow idol
Legendary drops only drop in rev to begin with
cobalt rose
they could be less forgotten if they
a) were better
b) had upgrades
hollow idol
Drat and Apoth:
cobalt rose
those don't count smh
ruby cobalt
neither are legendaries
pure dove
yeah, I think they should maybe have the buffed stats over time, but still, I don't think that they should be 100%. Especially some that are pretty powerful if you grind out for them at the stage they're obtained at
lost agate
Imagine forcing to farm for smth rare to upgrade it
small talon
I think it should be moved to 5% in rev, 25% in death or defiled, and 100% in death + defiled
sand umbra
they're cool, but painful dev-/tester-side
lost agate
If leggies are made a 100% the entire point of them existing goes away
lost agate
Also doesnt shit like cosmic discharge make yharon eat a whole bucket of shit?
small talon
yeah if they are 100% by default theres no reason to call em legendaries
lost agate
Malachite is also solid iirc and baron makes ravager cry
ruby cobalt
can't wait to undo all the changes to legendaries
and move them back to direct drops
and also make them scale
mhm
small talon
tbh i liked it that way
ruby cobalt
too bad
hexed ore
Or, you could make them 100% drops and Nerf them a bit
pure dove
nah
100% defeats the purpose of being "legendary"
also, not sure about the unlimited mana idea. Tho there's mods that add stuff like that. I mean, mana potions would work, right?
pure dove
lol
hexed ore
I never use them so that would make sense
ruby cobalt
isn't it 550
distant gyro
actually though, who finds mana restoration to be a problem anymore in post-dog
no, 3 mana upgrade + star beam rye + vanilla 400 cap
hollow shell
So, does Ethereal Talisman not exist I guess?
ruby cobalt
star beam rye, right
distant gyro
exactly
distant gyro
ethereal talisman already destroyed the need for other methods of mana restoration due to its built-in mana flower effect
sand umbra
vanilla caps on mana are super extra mega cringe
...actually, lemme rephrase that
vanilla caps in general are super extra mega cringe
distant gyro
and permafrost sell super pots for cheap, slapped in phantoplasm and you're good to go
sand umbra
I keep forgetting that Super Mana Potions aren't post-LC ngl
distant gyro
super mana potions, not to be confused with super healing potions, is... an immediate upgrade to greater mana potions
cobalt rose
okay can someone tell me why greater mana potions get an instant upgrade in early hardmode
ruby cobalt
yes
cobalt rose
because its kinda stupid
hexed ore
I see
hollow shell
Because the instant upgrades cost Crystal Shards and a Unicorn Horn, so it's a bitch to get
karmic stone
On another note, maybe Astral Injections could be buffed because in the 5 seconds the effect is active they barely affect the weapons that actually need it iirc
hollow shell
(3 seconds)
karmic stone
distant gyro
astral injections are worth when you first get it
that is, until <Player>'s blood vessels burst from drug overdose.
hollow shell
It's essentially a +540 Mana potion
karmic stone
So how much do they last stage-wise
distant gyro
I think astral injection's way of rebalance is to
hollow shell
and they fuck your adren and don't work with Mana Flower / Ethereal
distant gyro
increase the duration but nerf how much it gives per second
maybe +90m/s for 6 seconds
essentially still +540 mana but more evenly distributed
hollow shell
(I don't even know how you'd die to Astral Injections without doing it on purpose)
distant gyro
if you keep yanking injections you'll die eventually
55 injections = 165 seconds
aka just about a whole bossfight
keen geyser
not to mention health pots
distant gyro
imagine if you beat the boss just as you take the lethal injection
karmic stone
Injections aren't affected by Mana Flower+ right?
green pumice
re : legendaries, maybe just make them a higher drop rate, since they won't be legendaries then would they
lost agate
Some people said to make it a 100% and nerf them but thats just turning them into rev weapons
lost agate
Maybe, but there was thought on changing how you obtain them altogether
green pumice
versed tundra
Having rare drops is a nice incentive to farm for them
queen delta
What if we made them guaranteed to drop at x number of kills on the boss?
lost agate
So like banners but for bosses
queen delta
So if you kill aquatic scourge the 20th time, he directly drops the seas searing
versed tundra
A pitty system is good, but only if there's also a random chance
ruby cobalt
so basically make them craftable from 3 trophies
queen delta
Lets for once have items that dont use random chance
hollow shell
Trophies aren't guaranteed
versed tundra
impossible: Terraria damage is random
A way to craft bags into rare drops maybe?
that would "cost" you tons of money
since you don't get the content
queen delta
If legendary weapons/accessory was a guaranteed drop after x number of kills, they would be more legendary since you committed to killing the boss many times to get the item
lost agate
You kinda already do that, just that the game decides when to reward you basically lmao
hollow shell
because apparently devs don't want them affected by defiled even though-
versed tundra
but droping them by "accident" when not expecting them is great too: we need both
queen delta
Yeah, every item that drops from boss is random
Those legendary items being guaranteed would stand out more
green pumice
its probably cause you dont actually have to do the bosses in defiled to get them
queen delta
And nah, not everything needs to be random
They should just be guaranteed, no randomness
pure dove
nah
versed tundra
Defilled added chances should be applied on the boss kill, not the bag openning
It sound easy to fix: just add the weapon to the boss's loot table, along the bag
Maybe it's not fixed because of another reason I can't see
hollow shell
I've tried to argue this before, and failed for reasons I don't quite understand
hollow shell
I sure wasn't told "Yes"
queen delta
Make Legendary items a guaranteed drop from the boss when killing it an X amount of times.
Right now, Legendaries are a 1% chance, with Defiled Rune increasing it to a 5% chance. However, developers don’t want them being affected by Defiled Rune. So... instead of making them a random chance, mostly getting them ignored and forgotten, how about they become a guaranteed drop? If you kill a boss enough times, you should be rewarded. That would truly make the “Legendary” part of them true.
versed tundra
I think the "X number of kills" isn't easy to program
It would be much easier (and balanced, IMO) to implement a pitty system through a recipie made of X number of bags
queen delta
Also rare item variants exist if you really want a special low-chance item
hollow shell
'X number of kills' probably is easy to program
considering we already have it for SCal
fervent citrus
Tru
fervent citrus
Forgot? 
queen delta
Yeah it could probably use the same function as banners
Minus the dropping it directly at the player part
versed tundra
What about Guaranteed if killed in Armageddon?
Wouldn't that be better? Pushing the player further, forcing them to learn the fight perfectly...
fervent citrus
Maybe banners should have more of an effect, or at least one can combine them into 'tiers', and doesnt only have to mean lowering enemies defence and dmg, maybe make it have a higher drop rate
hollow shell
I dunno man, banners are actually kinda stronk
fervent citrus
Perhaps
ruby cobalt
double damage, half damage taken
versed tundra
Banners are dumb lore-wise
"Oh, I see you have killed 50 of my peers. Well, I guess I'll die then."
fervent citrus
But it doesnt make much of a difference when it comes to green slimes
hollow shell
God rewards you for your efforts.
ruby cobalt
lore
out of this discussion
night cradle
not everything needs to have lore connected to it
versed tundra
I know I was making a joke sorry
tired haven
Another idea would be to make something that gives you unlimited Mana, but at the cost of a percentage of magic damage.
Yeah. That's mana potions, I believe
versed tundra
But it's true managing banners in Vanilla is a hassle
fervent citrus
?
fervent citrus
Unlimited mana pots from luiafk?
ruby cobalt
actual mana pots
hollow shell
I'm sure E Bongos is gonna see that, Crab.
ruby cobalt
with mana flower
because overall you get 10% more DPS
if you compare it to mana regen pot
fervent citrus
They arent really infinite but k
ruby cobalt
they're very much infinite
fervent citrus
Perhaps
ruby cobalt
money shortages are non-existent
tired haven
i'm sure too
Ethereal talisman btw, so even better that no slot wasted
versed tundra
not using them feels sub-optimal, so you put them down, but it's never in a spot where you are going to spend much time, unless you bring them back with you, in which case they just take space...
ruby cobalt
hear me out on this one
permanent banners, but they come into full effectiveness at 10k kills
versed tundra
I don't hate them, but I hate having the feeling of missing-out on their potential
pure dove
nah, 10k kills is easy to get with zerg or UB
ruby cobalt
UB
you're out of this discussion
versed tundra
What's UB?
ruby cobalt
unlimited battler from luiafk
pure dove
ultimate battler
ruby cobalt
tl;dr - old zerg (massive spawnrates)
queen delta
Ultimate battler is epic
ruby cobalt
the fact that it's from another mod completely nukes your point
because balancing around other mods is fairly stupid unless you wanna collab with them
pure dove
well still, zerg is pretty much the same as UB
ruby cobalt
it isn't
night cradle
not quite
ruby cobalt
in fact, zerg is MUCH, MUCH weaker than UB
fervent zealot
zerg was nerfed very hard
night cradle
it was nerfed some updates ago
fervent zealot
it doesn't even compare to UB any more
pure dove
oh
pure dove
wait do the demon trophies affect zerg?
ruby cobalt
no
pure dove
ah ok
queen delta
Well looks like no objections so ill post the legendaries suggestion above
pure dove
hmm?
versed tundra
I have no objections, just slightly different ideas
pure dove
wdym
versed tundra
@pure dove just scroll up
pure dove
no I meant wdym by post it
versed tundra
pure dove
ah ok
tired haven
I don't really enjoy a weapon on x kills, but cannot replace that with any better trigger so ye
versed tundra
I proposed crafting bags into the drop
To have some sort of extra price
The content of multiple bags (includind the money) -> the leg drop
Kinda like the Kelvin Katalist if you think about it 🤔
radiant meadow
100% drop rate for leggies would require they all be nerfed
versed tundra
no
tired haven
Yes tho?
radiant meadow
since they're basically free now
ruby cobalt
actually free
radiant meadow
the fact that they would be guarantee drops
ruby cobalt
if you grind the same boss hard enough you'll get it eventually
versed tundra
You still need to kill the boss many times
distant gyro
100% legendary drop = if you beat the boss then you get it
radiant meadow
someone suggested that they be guarantee
distant gyro
of course
tired haven
They were balanced around being extremely rare, and then you are being shoved with them on first kill
its about previous suggestion
tired haven
ahem
versed tundra
We are not talking about first kill drops
ruby cobalt
no, we are, actually
radiant meadow
well, I was
versed tundra
You were the first I think
tired haven
It was suggested first, why not talk about it
radiant meadow
distant gyro
100% drop rate for leggies would require they all be nerfed
no
tired haven
distant gyro
ruby cobalt
oh wait I screened the wrong thing I'm a fucking dumbass
versed tundra
I interpreted that as 100% chance of getting them after a set number of times
ruby cobalt
oopsie
versed tundra
since it's the most recent sugg
versed tundra
Who's Termi?
distant gyro
Ben
versed tundra
thanks
radiant meadow
moreover though, there is some plan to eventually change how leggies are obtained
we just don't really know what to do with them atm
ruby cobalt
make them normal weapons tbh
mighty knot
Make a crafting recipe for Heart Statues and Star Statues
Right now, heart statues are still only obtainable by finding them underground. Some of the time, you won't find any, just because they're not in a place you would usually end up in. However, hearts are IMMENSELY helpful for bossfights, and make bosses that will always require full preparation (like Yharon or SCal) a lot easier. Almost every other substantial arena block is craftable or purchasable.
queen sail
The main issue with Legendaries as they are rn is that by the time you get them you probably don’t need them
versed tundra
some of them wouldn't make sense as normal drops
ruby cobalt
which ones, exactly?
versed tundra
like the leg for the desert scourge
ruby cobalt
there's none
distant gyro
people be talking about heart statues but not star statues
radiant meadow
desert scourge doesn't have a leggie
versed tundra
it's an upgrade of a normal drop
ruby cobalt
it isn't
radiant meadow
unless you meant Sea's Searing
versed tundra
Close enough
ruby cobalt
dune hopper isn't a legendary
versed tundra
I though it was
ruby cobalt
it isn't
mighty knot
imma go ahead and post that if nobody has any objections
radiant meadow
if it's a legendary, it has a custom rarity and it'll say "Legendary drop" in the tooltip
tired haven
Tbh if not for extreme sandbox behavior of terraria I would have proposed challenges that will lock legendary weapons
For example, rev+ mecha mayhem to get shpc. Plantera summoned and killed entirely on surface to drop blossom flux. And so on
But people will certainly develop ez strats for all these
radiant meadow
imagine out-dps-ing photosynthesis though
queen sail
What do you expect when ”SUPER EXTREME OMEGA MODPACK”
versed tundra
What's the problem with EZ strats?
ruby cobalt
or 300 defense
queen sail
distant gyro
just fight hardened plantera iirc
tired haven
Free leggie
versed tundra
It's not free
distant gyro
there will be people who develop cheese yes
versed tundra
you have to work on your strat
distant gyro
drag plantera to the surface at last second and land the final blow
versed tundra
It's just a different aproach
distant gyro
because whole fight meme
versed tundra
That's not what he proposed I think: he meant having enraged Plantera from beginning to end
distant gyro
yes
distant gyro
but also that defies calamity system of workaround
versed tundra
For Eg. you could modify it's AI so it can't un-rage if summoned through the portabulb in a rage-inducing area
distant gyro
after all, you can open the bag after you turn on rev and defiled just to turn it off back to expert later
and that mechanic was apparently intentional
versed tundra
It was?
distant gyro
if it was a direct drop then defiled cheese wouldn't exist, a simple change in code as well
it was ultimately decided that bag cheese is left there for reasons
lost agate
Who the hell said the cheese was intentional
radiant meadow
it was kind of intentional
hollow shell
5 suggestions in an hour 
radiant meadow
like a, we really don't want you to do that
queen sail
That’s just #suggestions-voting 
queen delta
Also im pretty sure main astrum deus not despawning as fast as other worms has been looked into
radiant meadow
but it's to get a different group of people to shut up about inconsistency
hollow shell
but
lost agate
Yes rover we get it
hollow shell
queen sail
@supple lodge wrong channel iirc
versed tundra
I think it's like a difficulty setting: you chose to use the strat or you don't.
You don't have to feel bad for doing either if it makes you happy.
radiant meadow
I made other stuff affected by defiled as compensation 
supple lodge
I just figured that would be more of a suggestion than a bug report
versed tundra
It's an oversight, that means it's a bug 
lost agate
I dont remember if that was fixed yet
ashen warren
@little geode dont
versed tundra
what the
little geode
Sorry
versed tundra
I saw that a fraction of a second and now I'm super curious to see what it is 🤔
little geode
I posted on the wrong discord
rapid pivot
here's a thought; something to do with rogue crit overflow?
because especially around lategame, rogue crit becomes downright laughably high
even without stealth it can go over a hundred
Maybe something to do with buffing damage?
sand umbra
I like how you say rogue crit specifically when every class' crit chance in late game might as well be 100%
...well, except Summoner, but that was a given
rapid pivot
I say rogue crit specifically because rogues really are the crit-focused class.
They've got Stealth, which dramatically boosts it, for instance.
(And there's all the bonuses associated with throwing something at max stealth, which naturally means max crit, which means, like, 140% sometimes.)
zealous ridge
do you mean like... giving a damage buff dependent on how much crit chance you have over 100%?
sand umbra
they've also got Stealth, which is useless in the one field where Calamity specializes for over half the game and then becomes broken
I'd say it balances out quite well already
ruby cobalt
over half the game
you mean until ML
ruby cobalt
because that's 66% of the game
rapid pivot
fair point tbh
rapid pivot
also; i ran through the boss rush and I noticed something odd
you get to SupCal, and the final two bosses past her are absolute jokes
ruby cobalt
the base point being that stealth is fucking useless until you get ways of getting it with 1 second of standing
yes
sand umbra
yeah pretty much
rapid pivot
why isn't suppy at the end?
sand umbra
rapid pivot
i get it was arranged by poll, but.
rapid pivot
..... wait- was the order determined before supcal got buffed
sand umbra
when did SCal ever get buffed wut
zealous ridge
it most likely wouldnt have affected the poll results
rapid pivot
think i heard she used to be a LOT easier
zealous ridge
that's all that affected the boss rush order
ruby cobalt
she used to be easier
because back then
(2.5 years ago)
you could've just flown across the world
sand umbra
oh bruh
rapid pivot
.. No box, then?
zealous ridge
no arena, less varied attacks, no bullet hell
sand umbra
yeah back then before she became a bootleg 2who boss
distant gyro
why is rise and fall and rise and fall and rise and fall and rise and fall of scal mentioned here
pure dove
also there was the time where she was hitcapped
sand umbra
the original point was "what if rogue had bonuses for crit overflow", I think
rapid pivot
ye
but then I remembered that it was strange that once you beat scal in the boss rush, the rest of it was basically irrelevant
sand umbra
except
- stealth, in the spots where Calamity makes things matter, is useless up until and including LC and then god for everything thereafter, so getting Dark God's Sheath would induce an even greater power spike
- this would just lead to more "calamity OP" memes because then the same mechanic would hafta apply to other classes for it to make sense or it'd have to be a specific accessory for rogues which makes rogue even more absurd
rapid pivot
right, fair enough
distant gyro
I would show a certain funny footage of stealth.exe but it has content for the next update ://
rapid pivot
(pity it'd be too much work on the devs to suggest a rebalance based around vanilla stats)
(then we might have true thorium compat :P)
distant gyro
for those in power, za warudo
sand umbra
Clam already gets memed on pretty hard for adhering to a different power scale than vanilla or any other mod
distant gyro
frail mantle
btw remember that SCal is actually nerfed in the Boss Rush
at least i'm pretty sure she is
rapid pivot
she is indeed
but, that doesn't exactly mean a lot
she's still far harder than either of the other two bosses of that tier in the rush
(and not in the 'lol if you're in the air and you don't hurry quick you might get insta-kill memed by doggy' sense)
ruby cobalt
she's nerfed in terms of stats
which means you skip most of her phases that you'd normally do
so you're left with 75s inescapable torture
rapid pivot
oh, and she also kills all your npcs
(dunno if that usually happens with normal scal too, just noticed it ESPECIALLY with the boss rush version)
actually, wait; is she nerfed in terms of stats?
think she's only nerfed in terms of health; all her other stats are bumped straight to death mode
either way; compared to the later two bosses, it's somewhat odd that she's at number 3, despite easily being number 1 in terms of difficulty
distant gyro
(BR scal health is nerfed from 10 mil to a mere 3.7 mil in death)
rapid pivot
(true, but again; doesn't really matter)
ruby cobalt
she doesn't kill any NPCs
distant gyro
that doesn't make the boolet hell any shorter
rapid pivot
ye
void kelp
I’m pretty sure if a boss kills your NPCs it means you summoned it too close to them
rapid pivot
probably just was too close to my house, then
gusty geode
Pretty sure they're ordered based on a survey that happened a long time ago
hollow shell
What was the third?
radiant meadow
best boss design iirc
hollow shell
Oh right
karmic stone
@ Haze suggested the same thing a couple suggestions above
radiant meadow
didn't someone suggest that like yesterday?
karmic stone
2 days ago
quick ice
I...don’t understand how slow mode will cause people to think about their suggestions
hollow shell
Is it possible to implement a slowmode for all users?
iirc Discord's default one is an individual cooldown per user
radiant meadow
2 days ago, close enough
bitter topaz
slowmode is role based
hollow shell
wdym
radiant meadow
it's still an individual cooldown per user
queen delta
yeah slowmode isnt gonna do anything
radiant meadow
but you can give slowmode to only certain roles
bitter topaz
oh yeah disregard what i said
i see what you mean now
and no that ain't possible, sadly
radiant meadow
slow mode for everyone would be kinda ass ngl
fervent zealot
slowmode would still slow down posting, and stop the people who try and post suggestions in multiple messages entirely
gusty geode
If I may
A server verification system would also help
Put the rules on suggestions with the actual rules
And preventing the rest of the server from being seen until the user's read through them
queen delta
Our system is fine
fervent zealot
it doesn't have to be long slowmode
quick ice
If it’s not long it wouldn’t do anything
fervent zealot
5 minutes or even less would do nicely, and help show what #suggestions-voting is supposed to be, even to people new to the channel
if you see that you have to wait to post again, wouldn't you think a little more about what you're posting?
hollow shell
I don't think anybody would ever post two separate suggestions within 5 minutes
radiant meadow
I don't think multi-message incomplete suggestions are common enough to demand slow mode
hollow shell
And if they do, it's hardly a big enough issue to implement that over
karmic stone
Very few people have done so
quick ice
If you post a dumb thing, you can just edit it
fervent zealot
either way it's less about the practical slowmode and more about the message it sends tbh
karmic stone
And I haven't actually seen people pointing it out here beyond "Oh ok"
radiant meadow
slowmode will basically change nothing
fervent zealot
it's something people are basically guarenteed to see before they post their message though, unlike pins
radiant meadow
in practice
bitter topaz
there's no reason for it, but also no reason against it either
queen delta
I think you're overestimating the ability of those people
radiant meadow
we will see in time if it reaches 90 stars and then we vote I guess
queen delta
Anyone who doesn't read pins/makes meme suggestions isn't gonna pick up on anything from slowmode
fervent zealot
well i'd post about a suggestions dependant warns/bans but i know that'd have an even lower shot of getting in
radiant meadow
suggestions ban is already a thing
void kelp
I’m pretty sure there’s already been specific user suggestion bans
radiant meadow
it's just extremely rare
fervent zealot
yes, but that's more so a case-by-case basis
radiant meadow
rare enough that only admins do it
void kelp
they’re not given any special roles iirc they have their specific user permissions restricted
radiant meadow
yes, that's what it is
gusty geode
That's why I suggested verification btw
Kinda forces people to at least skim over the rules
radiant meadow
yes we did
lost agate
This is some dejavu
karmic stone
Higher in the streets
fervent zealot
at least it's not a repost within hours of the original
gusty geode
Just cuz nothing came out of it last time doesn't mean nothing ever will
fervent zealot
as has already been noticed before
sand umbra
the conclusion was that it's too small and niche of an issue to try to "fix" by implementing a channel-wide thing that could have infuriatingly bad side effects later down the line
furthermore, slowmode wouldn't make anyone think harder about their suggs
they'll just go "oh, I gotta wait XYZ time" and then wait out that time before typing in their next bad sugg
most suggs that enter this channel are already resolved within minutes if they're bad or given the chance to grab some attention if they're good
fervent zealot
it still sends a message and i half only posted this to prove a point elsewhere
radiant meadow
bruh
sand umbra
fervent zealot
it's just a social experiment bro slowmode does kinda actually send a message, even if it does practically achieve nothing
sand umbra
in practice, it will accomplish almost nothing and will not justify the potential side effects it could have in the long run
this, I can just about guarantee you
fervent zealot
again, i raise my point of not unholy in length slowmode
sand umbra
if it's too short it literally won't matter and will not help anything
if it's too long reasonable suggestions that require more than one post due to being really fat will probably get cucked
you're damned either way
fervent zealot
yeah but when's the last suggestion that takes more than a post
hollow shell
and sometimes people who are new will split their post into multiple messages
which is discouraged, especially if it takes a while for them to write the latter messages
but the suggestions bot is designed around that
If you post messages in short succession, it'll only star and ! the most recent one
sand umbra
^
fervent zealot
oh the bot was changed to do that?
hollow shell
A while ago
radiant meadow
it always did that
hollow shell
like a year ago
fervent zealot
well excuse me i haven't kept up with suggestions since most of them are actually reasonable since the specific ban
radiant meadow
it's been like that since the bot's implementation 
fervent zealot
it hasn't though?
zealous ridge
fervent zealot
either way it's pointless to argue about something small like that
hollow shell
. _.
zealous ridge
well okay, so we're talking about slowmode in suggestions again?
fervent zealot
you seem to be reacting awful strongly for something that happened 2 days ago
void kelp
he’s probably annoyed because people are rehashing the same exact thing that was discussed already
fervent zealot
just because it was already discussed doesn't mean something new pertaining to it can't be brought to the table
sand umbra
which, for the record, is exactly what I often get yelled at for doing
radiant meadow
and what new stuff ahs been brought to the table?
zealous ridge
okay but has anything new been brought to the table?
hollow shell
are you bringing anything new to the table?
It seems like you just
forgot that it was already suggested
fervent zealot
not forgot, just didn't read back 2 days
radiant meadow
same diff
hollow shell
so, you never saw :P
zealous ridge
i mean, its kind of hard to bring anything new to the table regarding this idea
fervent zealot
either way i get the sense nobody's going to want to talk about slowmode for at least a week so i'll just try again later
hollow shell
I'm sure we'll be a lot more receptive to it later, yes
I'm sure that all of the reasons we currently expressed will be very different then
radiant meadow
imagine being receptive at all
zealous ridge
i just think it wont achieve anything if we discuss this topic again 2 days after we already did
fervent zealot
why bring new fresh suggestions when you can bring back old crusy suggestions
first, slowmode
then, abyss generation rework
radiant meadow
but on the bright side, I get to look for ways to implement a suggestion early without implementing them so Rover can't yell at me
world gen is actually ass
so abyss generation rework is extremely unlikely
zealous ridge
well that's unfortunate to hear
fervent zealot
doesn't stop me from trying, though
abyss is a very nice biome and i'd like to see it become less dull
radiant meadow
for one thing, you have to generate a new world every single time you change something and need to test it
which is very time consuming as you may imagine
and if you want it randomly generated, well, that adds a completely new layer to the equation
fervent zealot
i'd also go for a crags gen rework but i already know that's in the plans for some point
hollow shell
indeed
radiant meadow
world gen code is pretty much one of the most horrid things to work with
gusty geode
I brought a verification system to the table and it got dismissed immediately
fervent zealot
well yes, because verification systems are dumb
void kelp
it’s really easy to just skim through the requirements too
fervent zealot
there's really no cost effective way to make people read the rules or pins
void kelp
the best this server has is a 10 min wait time between your first message here and joining which theoretically means people read the info channels but people don’t
keen geyser
wait they really don't drop money?
zealous ridge
perhaps because the gods themselves drop money
hollow shell
Yeah, probably directly.
zealous ridge
okay, question then
is it really necessary for slime god to be "fixed" in this way?
radiant meadow
yes, they drop money directly
void kelp
smth smth consistency?
potent veldt
It makes farming them randomly not efficient
potent veldt
We've had smaller suggestions get through.
zealous ridge
yeah, fair enough
i guess i have no issue its just an odd suggestion to me, like it's such a minor detail that affects a very specific gameplay situation
i feel like a majority of the playerbase didnt even know that the bag didn't drop money
void kelp
tbh it would make sense for sake of consistency
potent veldt
It's on par with my suggestion before about how Abyss pots give sticky dynamite and nonsticky bombs
That, apparently, got a ton of stars
void kelp
add to your reasoning that even though the slimes drop the money it’d be more consistent if the money was dropped from the bags?
potent veldt
Yeah, I should
queen delta
i agree with this suggestion
potent veldt
Not that I know of
And I'm also not sure it'd include mod bags
Also it's just more prevalent in Calamity more than any other mod that I'd feel the need to sell the bags themselves, because it's the only mod where I can get 100+ bags in 5 minutes
void kelp
hey wouldnt it be neat if we could craft rare items with an item representing a grind.. like with banners or treasure bags
keen geyser
fargos
gilded pike
oh hey my suggestion for living trees to become monoliths when astral generates got in
nea
t
keen geyser
he basically started to work on it immediately
gilded pike
heh
radiant meadow
when and what I do varies greatly on my mood and how much actually non-suggestion stuff needs to be done (atm like none lol)
wooden wedge
sand umbra
it's another excuse for me to cry out for a non-consumable ML summon, that's what it is 
split narwhal
why is there so many of these recently?
keen geyser
but not all of them
sand umbra
in essence, they're asking for more summons that are consumable to be turned into non-consumable
amusingly, both of the two that are at the most appropriate tier yet do not have one are the two that are the most aneurysm-inducing to farm
sand umbra
who but Dr. Looney Tunes himself
sure you'll only farm him for like 2 things but that's not the point here
fervent zealot
doesn't deus also have a nonconsumable summon now
hollow shell
Deus does, yes
quiet abyss
They do, ye
sand umbra
I refer to the Lunatic Cultist
both he and ML are a headache to grind
both for their own respective reasons
LC requires yeeting Cultists, yeeting him, yeeting the Lunar Events all over, and then restarting the cycle
ML...is ML, I don't think I can really explain it much better than that
keen geyser
I think a non consumable ml one and lc one would be fine
you can also use the eidolon tablet from eidolists
sand umbra
that doesn't work once you've met the conditions for LC to spawn naturally
quiet abyss
? But, ain’t cultists spawn rate also drastically increased in cal?
So like, reset day to night to day for like 15-20 seconds and the cultists would respawn by then for you to refight LC again.
split narwhal
If we could get a variant of LC that doesn't actually spawn the pillars on death
fervent zealot
the problem with grinding cultist is pillars
keen geyser
this is true
fervent zealot
the problem with grinding ml is also pillars
sand umbra
killing LC, assuming you do not have other mods helping out, always triggers the Lunar Events
keen geyser
if only there was a way to make the lunar events into a consumable summoning item
sand umbra
without a way to manually despawn the Events --- be it Reduced Grinding, Fargo's, or what have you --- that's 10-20 minutes you're spending just getting rid of everything and then fighting and dying to because lol ML again
and this is why, on a base level, LC is by far the most time-consuming boss to farm
split narwhal
honestly it would easier to grind LC if he had a treasure bag of sorts bc armageddon will actually work
sand umbra
oh yeah, here's the other thing: LC does not normally drop a Treasure Bag as of right now, and mods that do add a bag for him don't work with Armageddon
keen geyser
and to think that a cultist bag actually exists in base terraria code
radiant meadow
armageddon only works with calamity bosses
keen geyser
what
radiant meadow
and vanilla bosses with vanilla bags
keen geyser
i was gonna say lol
radiant meadow
and betsy 
sand umbra
well yes but actually no
split narwhal
Betsy is bc of vanilla code
sand umbra
either way, I can say for certain that LC and ML are two of the most infuriating bosses to farm
woeful ginkgo
keep in mind that it doesn't even have an expert mode drop like all the other bosses
split narwhal
Thorn blossom
sand umbra
which is why it baffles me that a nonconsumable summon (that doesn't trigger the Lunar Events for 5 hours on defeat in LC's case) doesn't exist
LC literally has
two drops.
One is a meme and the other is Thorn Blossom.
woeful ginkgo
trophy
split narwhal
one of which is a rare item variant, taking a ton of time to farm for with 2.5% drop chance
radiant meadow
eidolon staff memes on the events pretty good
but you aren't really meant to farm for RIVs
they are intended to be cool if you happen to get it
legendaries should fall in a similar boat tbh
as for a non consumable summon that doesn't trigger the lunar events. I'm not sure how we can do that
quiet abyss
How many times has it been said again to focus more on actually discussing suggestions and making ideas, rather than throwing shades at something related to the suggestions we’re talking about and not actually coming up with anything for an idea/solution?
Because I’m tired of repeating it in this channel at this point.
sand umbra
Alright. Solutions, comin' right up.
Eidolon Tablet and some Galactica Singularities at an Ancient Manipulator could make a non-consumable LC summon. For post-ML, add a dash of Luminite.
To detect if the non-consumable summon was used, set a flag specific to LC using the power of GlobalNPC when using the summon, and then if/when he dies, check for that flag and if it's set, look through the NPC list and if any entities are pillars, yeet them.
hollow shell
Instantly despawn them when spawned?
sand umbra
As for the Man in the Moon himself, literally just a Celestial Sigil and some fragments and/or Galactica Singularities, with Astral Bars for good measure if you want people to really put in the work. Same as above for post-ML.
Yes.
sand umbra
Then what I can do is go experiment with it right now and iron out all the kinks so that when I go into details later, it doesn't cause issues.
hollow shell
alright then
split narwhal
You could check how the RG one works make it similar to that
sand umbra
If it ends up being important, anyway. At the end of the day, the prompt was to provide potential solutions to a problem that exists within the mod, and I gave 'em.
...then again I'll probably end up messing with it anyway because I have the plans already for a non-consumable ML summon, might as well work a few other things out while I'm at it.
It's somewhere on my to-do list now, probably.
split narwhal
gusty geode
I notice there's been a lot of repeat suggestions lately
sand umbra
Is this a bad thing? 
gusty geode
Depends on how you look at it tbh
sand umbra
Not saying it's good or bad personally, just wondering why you stated this fact.
gusty geode
hollow shell
It's a slightly bad thing but not much we can do about it nor do I think it's indicative of anything
s'just a lil weird
gusty geode
I mean
It's a bit pessimistic but I got that
A) There are issues that have existed for a bit and nothing's been done about them
B) All the limitations on what we can suggest are starting to show
K it's really pessimistic
sand umbra
Is this the part where I begin OOA Suggestion Ring: Episode 2
distant gyro
sure
sand umbra
alrighty.
distant gyro
Spoiler: Too many things are getting flagged now you just need to look for them some as far back as 2018
sand umbra
Time for more Betsy-related memery ig.
gusty geode
Could also try coming up with some new enemies
Even if plans are in place like I've been told, no harm in putting out our own ideas
radiant meadow
you talking about possessed hatchet upgrade lol?
sand umbra
Alright, this one's gonna be a bit of a doozy with the audience we've got, but I'll make it work...hopefully.
/throat clear
Step right up, ladies and gentlemen, it's time for everyone's favorite sugg show: "Let's Make OOA Great Again!"
Now, today's featured concept is Betsy's Curse being able to be inflicted by all of Betsy's weapon drops. Please couple with a nerf to Aerial Bane if necessary.
❔
A) To give the debuff a bit more relevancy for people that are not playing the Mage class, and due to thematical reasoning, it makes sense that the rest of Betsy's weapon drops should be able to inflict her exclusive debuff. It'll also make farming her out for class-specific weapons a bit more worthwhile for the playerbase as a whole, really.
B) Aerial Bane is stupid. Need I elaborate?
radiant meadow
how about just add it to the melee weapons
split narwhal
aerial bane is fine imo
fervent zealot
how about don't add it to aerial bane problem solved
hollow shell
She does only have four drops, doesn't she...
radiant meadow
aerial bane most certainly doesn't need the buff
sand umbra
fair enough
radiant meadow
vesuvius doesn't need betsy's curse either
sand umbra
Vesuvius is on another level lmao
radiant meadow
melee because mah reference
sand umbra
byeah, I can adjust it to just the melee weps
split narwhal
imo aerial bane falls behind compared to calamity weapons
sand umbra
wut
fervent zealot
it.. really doesn't though
radiant meadow
it fucking memed on deus before the resist
hollow shell
Huh, apparently we don't touch Aerial Bane balance-wise
radiant meadow
I think it was like 30%
karmic stone
How much is the %+ damage on flying enemies again
fervent zealot
doesn't aerial bane actually decimate everything at and above its tier
sand umbra
yeah Deuces WIld only takes 30% damage from Aerial Bruh Moment
radiant meadow
ye
split narwhal
guess I'm just stupid
sand umbra
that may give you a concept of how stupid this weapon is
hollow shell
1.5x damage to flying enemies
karmic stone
Hahaues
radiant meadow
what is balance
hollow shell
but the big thing is the 5 explosive arrows it spawns on every hit
fervent zealot
if it hits a flying enemy doesn't it split into 5 arrows
radiant meadow
and they explode
sand umbra
(consider: basically every boss you fight post-Golem flies and is fat enough to get hit more than once probably)
fervent zealot
it's like, something like tsunami except you only have to hit one arrow for all of them
sand umbra
(Ravager is the exception here, not the example)
radiant meadow
watch aerial bruh still meme on ravager
sand umbra
I would not be surprised in the least
fervent zealot
isn't "flying" calculated as "not currently on the ground"
sand umbra
Aerial Bane makes 90% of the other 
options on its tier entirely irrelevant
hollow shell
Yeah
split narwhal
So Aerial bane good, but rest of betsy weapon bad?
hollow shell
so, a jumping enemy is "flying"
fervent zealot
which means ravager's hands and head and body when it's jumping
hollow shell
actually nah the tooltip says "airborne"
radiant meadow
greatbow of turmoil has the ease of access bonus though
distant gyro
6 more flags added
sand umbra
Greatbruh of Bruhmoil is one of the few things that can compete with Aerial Bane
...er...was. Specifically, pre-nerf Greatbow
I haven't tested post-nerf Greatbow yet
split narwhal
didn't ballista used be OP as well?
distant gyro
yes
sand umbra
Ballista used to be able to compete as well
radiant meadow
ballista has also received several nerfs
sand umbra
then it got memed on with the nerf gun
distant gyro
it got slapped the slow hammer and the less damage hammer
queen delta
Make any additional mana after 400-550 75% less effective instead of hardcapping it.
(To further explain, for example, if your mana cap is 500, and your gear gives you 700 mana altogether, your max mana would end up being 550, with the additional 200 mana being cut in 3/4.)
The reason this should be a thing is because of how easy it is to reach the mana cap, and thus, gives you no reason to use mage builds that focus on increasing mana. This change should make max-mana-focused builds more useful while not being too OP.
Thoughts?
split narwhal
The hardcap is from vanilla
radiant meadow
it's possible to make everything bypass the hardcap I think
queen delta
Doesnt calamity increase the cap tho?
radiant meadow
but then we'll have to go through everything that boosts mana
no
but the permanent mana upgrades and star beam rye can bypass the hardcap
queen delta
Ah
split narwhal
Why don't you make it so that extra mana over the hard cap decreases mana cost instead?
tired haven
because that's not how mana works and with enough mana items it would be possible to achieve 0 mana cost on a few weps, unless mana to mana usage reduction ratio is garbage
split narwhal
oh well just an idea
karmic stone
Status Message for Solar Veil drops after Cal/Clone
Currently upon killing either one the message "The ocean depths are trembling" appears telling you to go check out the abyss, but there's no message for Solar Veil drops from Psychos/Reapers in the Solar Eclipse, which are unlocked at the same time
split narwhal
seems reasonable
karmic stone
Am I missing anything
split narwhal
display the message either after clone or plantera
sand umbra
because yes
sand umbra
I like this idea, would give the implication that hey, there's some new Solar Eclipse shit
one small personal gripe: if that's gonna happen I'm gonna need a way to keep it from proccing while EE is also installed
karmic stone
hollow shell
Actually, I don't think this really needs an indicating message
considering the Solar Eclipse already gets a big content boost post-Plant
You'd be there anyway
... vanilla is just really sparing with its usage of status messages
karmic stone
m, didn't think of that
radiant meadow
Yet another status message
karmic stone
Mostly because I always do Clone first
hollow shell
Reapers are in that weird middle area where it's post-All Mechs
but Psychos are post-Plant only
split narwhal
6 different status messages after you kill moon lord
hollow shell
I mean
fervent citrus
the more, the better
hollow shell
It's better than not communicating info to the player
fervent citrus
Tru
radiant meadow
I can just force it to post plant completely
fervent citrus
Oh hi ben 
radiant meadow
Then give it a generic eclipse monsters want to kill you message
To also signal vanilla
sand umbra
no please Clone's already been done dirty enough
fervent citrus
:CompleteFailure-1:
Wait, you guys see the failure emoji, right?
Cause i only got text
sand umbra
when EE finally exists maybe 
fervent citrus
:BirbThonk-1:
sand umbra
also no
tired haven
hollow shell
remove the -1s
fervent citrus
||which ones?||
sand umbra
either way I absolutely will need a way to keep such a message from proccing if a message does get added for Solar Veils/general post-Plantera Eclipse
hollow shell
:BirbThonk**-1**:
:BirbThonk: = 
distant gyro
karmic stone
To also signal vanilla
o I never noticed vanilla doesn't even tell you about new eclipse drops
hollow shell
If Calamitas ain't gettin post-Plant activation stuff then maybe she should be activating a bunch of her own stuff, eh?
distant gyro
vanilla has no status about eclipse exceept obligatory solar eclipse has awoken
karmic stone
tired haven
Little poll: who ever had read the status messages to get a benefit from that at least once?
Me didn't 
hollow shell
Right now all Cal has is some Calamity-exclusive post-Plant alt activations
karmic stone
That isn't the problem though
radiant meadow
Clone shouldn't be a complete plant alt
hollow shell
Yeah
Clone should pump up the world with cool shit of her own
to compete with Plant
radiant meadow
She needs unique shit
hollow shell
Expand the Crag or something
fervent citrus
' a Solar eclipse is starting!' Preplantera
'A solar eclipse ___________' postplantera
I dont have much imagination
:CompleteFailure-1:
sand umbra
Clone should pump up the world with cool shit of her own
hollow shell
also that wouldn't fix the problem much, Ore.
You'd already know there's new content once the eclipse starts
karmic stone
Isn't crag overhaul already a thing in the roadmap or something
From what I've heard
fervent citrus
Huh, true
karmic stone
Also :rainbowdance:
sand umbra
I've been trying to push the idea of Clone having unique unlocks for months
distant gyro
Ashes of clamtitties
karmic stone
This was a really nice derail lole
distant gyro
tbh also blighted eyes to a lesser extent 
sand umbra
nobody can seem to make up their mind on if Clone is or isn't a Plantera alt when trying to argue against the idea of Clone having unique unlocks
fervent citrus
Wait, one can skip calamitas clone? 
Ayy the emojis work
Not much of a difference
karmic stone
I mean, Plant unlocks the same things and more as of now
hollow shell
Yeah there's very little that Calamitas unlocks that Plantera does not also unlock plus more.
karmic stone
Clone has neat drops but they die a few tiers after
fervent citrus
Oh
karmic stone
Besides VoC > VoE ig
distant gyro
Plantera really unlocks a lot of things despit some things being overshadowed
fervent citrus
btw dafuq is happening in general talk?
sand umbra
me: "hey Clone shouldn't have all her unlocks taken by Plantera"
person: "but Clone's a Plantera alt, she doesn't need unique unlocks"
me: "so then why does Plantera unlock everything Clone can and much more"
person: "well actually Clone isn't really an alt she's just a boss you fight before Plantera"
me: "...what"
distant gyro
vials of venom and pulse bow
karmic stone
I've also seen a worrying amount of people do Plant before Clone even
Which is the opposite of nice considering the state she's in
sand umbra
hot take: HM Abyss should be a Clone unlock specifically
distant gyro
hot take: HM Abyss should be unlocked from neither but aquatic scourge thematically but he's thrown in the mech alt pit
what's the topic again
sand umbra
the topic was mayhaps giving Clone unique unlocks
which in turn spawned from the recent Eclipse-related sugg
hollow shell
... hmmm
Making Depth Cells / Lumenyl a post-Cal only thing would indeed give her a lot of content right off the bat
sand umbra
mhm
gusty geode
Isn't that the case because those enemies only start spawning at that point anyway
hollow shell
The change would require some rebalancing-
actually no it wouldn't, really
You can already get that stuff pre-Plant and fight her with em
All Abyss enemies can spawn always.
gusty geode
I mean the Eclipse ones
hollow shell
Perhaps
gusty geode
Also Eidolists
sand umbra
byeah
it wouldn't even really take any balancing because you can already get all the Abyss shit from Clone rn anyway
hollow shell
Yeah
sand umbra
it's just a matter of making it not post-Plantera as well, but specifically post-Clone
hollow shell
You can make that suggestion if you want
Sounds like a good one, wouldn't actually have that much headache associated
Considering the items are still staying in the same tier
fervent citrus
Gl 
sand umbra
On today's episode of working towards more unique boss unlocks and more diversity in playthroughs with the power of suggestions:
Make the HM Abyss materials unlock specifically after the Calamitas Clone is defeated --- in other words, disallow Plantera from also unlocking these materials.
❔
The Calamitas Clone is in sore need of unique unlocks to separate her from just being a boss you can skip entirely in favor of Plantera, who unlocks everything the Calamitas Clone can and much more. Moving these items to post-Clone specifically would not only be incredibly easy, as all of these items are already balanced as being between Clonamitas and Plantera anyway, but would help to give the Clone a bit more reason to be fought over other more rewarding bosses.
this lookin' good to go?
I'm really unsure on my wording here
hollow shell
I'd just reword it to "disallow Plantera from also unlocking these materials."
"by comparison" is kind of a weird term to use there
sand umbra
gacha
fervent citrus
Good suggestion :thonk-2:
sand umbra
anything else, or are we ready to take a shot for the stars?
gusty geode
Would it be a stretch to say it could work like an alt to Plant buffing the Dungeon
hollow shell
Reason looks good 👍
Yeah it could kinda be considered that
except
no new enemies
just new materials.
gusty geode
Guess since we're on the topic
What would the Calamity alts for other major bosses be
Thinking I could post some general ideas for things they could trigger in place of their vanilla counterparts
hollow shell
There aren't many direct alts aside from
Cryo Brim and AS, to the mechs
and Clone to Plant
tired haven
There aren't any aside from that at all so
hollow shell
I guess Slime God is Calamity's "final" pre-Hardmode boss, to vanilla's Wall of Flesh
radiant meadow
Mech alts are a headache
hollow shell
but you'd be hard pressed having that unlock anything on the scale of Hardmode
radiant meadow
I have plans for them
verbal forge
gusty geode
Was actually leaning in that direction
It'd definitely need a lot of work to reach the same scale as WoF
But maybe SG could trigger a pseudo-Hardmode on death
Causing the first AI to spawn and triggering most/all of Calamity's Hardmode spawns
lost agate
SG doesnt need to be a gateway boss
gusty geode
Tbf
It'd make sense for Calamity's final pre-hardmode boss to cause some significant changes
tired haven
I honestly would prefer the opposite: straying away from alt bosses with vanilla
Calamity pairs would be decent but calamity-vanilla is a no-no due to crutch interactions
sand umbra
more unique unlocks hours? +u+
hollow shell
I like the idea of the Calamity bosses in those tiers unlocking things that are comperable to the unlocks of vanilla bosses in those tiers
quartz hare
so much suggestions about clonelamitas
hollow shell
Having alt sources for the Souls n' stuff is neat, but I think it'd be neater to have those "alts" unlock
different content
which have a comparable scale to the vanilla ones
hollow shell
as we've discussed.
