New bags?
#suggestions-discussion
hollow shell
sand umbra
new bags would be ideal as they'd kill both inconsistencies
radiant meadow
new bags isn't happening
sand umbra
but that'd require a greater degree of upkeep on the devs' end in its own right
radiant meadow
I refuse to do it
lost agate
New bags is gonna kill mod compat
radiant meadow
oh ye, that would also be an issue
sand umbra
mhm
radiant meadow
like if EE wanted to throw something in Clone's bag or something
sand umbra
byeah
I'd have to account for both variants of the same bag
which, while not particularly annoying for me, wouldn't exactly be optimal
lost agate
Or any boss since rev exists and people would want rev bags as a solution for that also
sand umbra
having to edit 5 different drop tables just to add the fucking Optic Staff to Twins is where I'd draw the line for keeping "consistency"
well, disregarding the fact that I have to override bags anyway
lost agate
Dont forget hardcore dog bag
radiant meadow
exactly why I mentioned the plushie
sand umbra
Cosmic Plushie moments
sand umbra
dropping directly will ultimately provide the fewest issues in the long run, from what I can tell
radiant meadow
yharim's crystal isn't a bag drop
sand umbra
Yharim's Crystal is wack
radiant meadow
p2 only items aren't bag drops
sand umbra
make it affected by Defiled iirc
hollow shell
For Legendaries consistency I assume
radiant meadow
crystal isn't a leggie
hollow shell
because they can't be affected by defiled at the moment
Crystal's a pseudo-leggie
as stated by Ozz a few times
radiant meadow
Ozz keeps getting them confused. Blame him 
I'm wondering how good of an idea making P2 items like drew's wings and ysf a bag drop would be
just add the condition if Yharon is defeated so the game knows you're post P2
hollow shell
hrm
As long as Yharim's Crystal remains out of the bag in order to be affected by Defiled I guess that'd be fine
versed tundra
"A puke green bar of rotten petrified wood and shit"
lost agate
They arent mode exclusive so byeah
sand umbra
Yharim's Crystal confuses me
radiant meadow
yharim's crystal isn't going to be affected by defiled
hollow shell
Why not.
sand umbra
because it's not mode-exclusive probably
hollow shell
Is beating Yharon without wings too easy
radiant meadow
I mean, with the amount of times I see Pinkie do it
lost agate
Rover please
radiant meadow
hollow shell
I'm sorry
radiant meadow
I'm sorry
sand umbra
gusty geode
I didn't realize it was possible with how fast dragon boi is
sand umbra
here's a better prompt that I'll probably come back to later, why are two of mage's only four post-Yharon options locked behind being on RNJesus' good side
radiant meadow
I mean, iirc you can facetank rev yharon without using healing potions up until sub8
not sure how much of a difference defiled crits would make
so you could potentially create some mega cheesy strat
hollow shell
How on earth
sand umbra
Yharon and facetanking in the same sentence
sand umbra
prior experience, and tons of it, leads me to believe you're pulling my leg
lost agate
So luigi
radiant meadow
ye, along those lines
it was awhile ago since I last tried it and it was a complete waste of my time
but it was post yharon rework
lost agate
Well then
radiant meadow
cuz he was teleporting and shit
lost agate
Maybe YC isnt a leggie cuz alt fires dun fucking work with channel weapons for whatever reason
hollow shell
Cosmic Discharge
sand umbra
that fact still aggravates me to high hell
let me have a channeled right-click smh
lost agate
Right, CD needs an alt attack
radiant meadow
brb adding an alt fire to cosmic discharge
hollow shell
cuul.
radiant meadow
time to add those tactical nukes I always wanted
but actually, what would be a good alt fire attack
that doesn't require asking for sproots
hollow shell
Whirl the CD around you in a circle?
radiant meadow
I'm not sure how to code that
hollow shell
dang
zealous ridge
well, the secondary fires of most legendaries put a different, but similarly themed twist on the primary fire
sand umbra
(to clarify: when I say punch flail, I mean shit like Golem Fist, Chain Knife/Gullotines, and Dragon Pow)
radiant meadow
I guess I would need to ask for a new sprite regardless of what it is 
unless maybe I cut up the whip flail sprite?
hollow shell
Do biggest balls and have the alt-fire be a normal flail
radiant meadow
can I do that and have it not look like shit?
sand umbra
what even
civic pond
radiant meadow
ah yes
if (counter >= 10)
projectile.Kill();```so it just wildly stabs rather than sweeps over a large area?
civic pond
sand umbra
that could work, honestly
though I still think having it function as different types of flails could be a neat approach
hollow shell
middle click fire to complete the trio
lost agate
this basically cosmic golem fist smh
tired haven
Bol discharge
Fist discharge
Whip discharge
3 stones of a flail experience
carmine stream
zealous ridge
well, most secondary fires are like a higher base damage, but lower fire rate attack compared to primary
maybe it does something like the Maw from thorium? does anyone even have an idea what that would feel like?
lost agate
Tf is dat
sand umbra
SHPC would like a word with you
also I have actually never used The Maw so I have no idea what it is
zealous ridge
it might not be the best idea, considering it's thoriums thing
sand umbra
or rather, what it does
zealous ridge
basically it shoots out a little hungry
(i imagine it being similar to the pirannha gun)
it attaches to enemies and deals constant damage, but there's like a chain that connects the player to the target
again, its a concept kind of only explored by thorium, so it might not be a good idea to "borrow?" that idea
zealous ridge
i think the best precursor to what im talking about in calamity is the barracuda gun
because it's really the only item that cal adds that acts similarly
tired haven
And it's simply piranha upgrade so ye
zealous ridge
mhm
radiant meadow
is it even possible to attack with the middle button?
radiant meadow
idk, it'd be a good meme if it was possible
lost agate
Taking from thorium is gonna make a bazillion people screech at us
zealous ridge
Yeah. Hence why it’s really just a suggestion
Not saying that’s how it needs to be done
lost agate
A lot of the thorium community seems to have a grudge against calam so better not risk it
cobalt rose
considering thorium is heavily based on vanilla while calamity pretty much goes against it, not suprised
hallow kraken
this is
hollow shell
(you don't turn transparent if you're near town NPCs, so that could be a source of confusion
but the sound should be obvious)
tired haven
I wonder if that suggestion was done "blindly" or the sound somehow was ignored all the time
hallow kraken
It might be just a bad meme sug
tired haven
Doesn't seem like it
Technically it should be removed as irrelevant but I'm interested if they will come back any soon to acknowledge the trouble
hollow shell
If they don't come back soon they're gettin added to the list...
tired haven
It's almost an axiom at this point
If one does a suggestion, they go offline for a good hour
hollow shell
@quick cipher Re-ping. There are indicators for stealth already.
distant gyro
another one in the counter
teal ibex
oh goodness he described the exact existing indicators yeah
hollow shell
I'll delete for now. Maybe they'll get back to us ever.
quick cipher
haha just memeing bois
teal ibex
i think you forgot to make the meme funny
hollow shell
Ah, well you're already warned
hallow kraken
This was so funny can we cite pinned sug rule #6
hollow saffron
^
queen delta
@quick cipher Please don’t meme in suggestions channel next time
hollow shell
It is indeed against the rules
hallow kraken
gottem
tepid root
which suggestion are you talking about
hallow kraken
hell burst
tired haven
radiant meadow
:stonks:
swift wadi
It keeps losing stars lmao
tepid root
hallow kraken
You’re living in the past
lost agate
i can implement it even if you do 
distant gyro
split narwhal
tired haven
vocal grotto
queen delta
Replace Statis' Ninja Belt rogue stat boosts with summoner stat boosts and remove rogue boosts from Statis' Belt of Curses.
Rogue now has Nanotech, Eclipse Mirror, and Statis' Belt of Curses, THREE lines of accessories for late game, while Summoner just has the Statis' Belt of Curses line, sharing it with Rogue. Remove the rogue stat boosts so summoners can have their own accessory to use. It also makes sense for summoners to have their own agility set since their main focus is dodging.
Thoughts?
tired haven
Post-plant summoner already has tons of gear in post-plant and giving belt here too would be also worrying
Well, other than that I'm for it mostly
lost agate
I thought rogue was the one focused on agility and dodging
radiant meadow
but the idea is to remove both summoner and rogue boosts from both belts
statis' belt of curses would obviously get a redo in design, recipe, and name
lost agate
Thematic wise at least
radiant meadow
summoner would get a new post dog acc
foggy plover
im guessing new summoner accessory would be the upgrade to spirit glyph?
sand umbra
I still personally feel Statis' Ninja Belt and its upgrade would be best suited as a rogue acc series
sand umbra
Statis' Blessing and Curse confuse me though
lost agate
Wat
queen delta
and would probably also be the successor for statis' curse
foggy plover
tbh the added dodge chance from belt and eclipse mirror is really good, especially with healing from vampiric talisman
lost agate
Well then
foggy plover
it adds an incredible amount of tanking ability rather than dodging/movement etc if that was the intention
radiant meadow
the belt accs are planned to just be mobility accs
tired haven
Statis was originally summoner/rogue hybrid in the lore, iirc
queen delta
oh yeah, speaking of black belt, has there been any plan to remove black belt from abyssal mirror recipe?
tired haven
Not sure if that was changed
radiant meadow
ah yes, the infamous Tabi collection we had 
queen delta
radiant meadow
what would it better off be instead though?
tired haven
The agonizing joy of finally getting 2nd black belt, hahaues
Also hmm
queen delta
does there really need to be an item in the recipe that resembles dodging?
Like, what's wrong with removing black belt and still just keeping the dodge effect
It's not explicitly the black belt dodge, but something else
foggy plover
I mean, it already has ink bomb in it so it doesnt really need the black belt
tired haven
Putrid scent except then we would need special biome mimic summons and flesh knuckles included in another recipe so nvm
Btw abyssal mirror already takes 3 accessories with a few other materials. Wouldn't it be fine with just 2?
radiant meadow
perhaps
I will consider (meaning probably do it) after I finish working on this summon weapon
queen delta
What do you mean by bed upgrade?
gusty geode
How does one upgrade a bed
rough basin
well, in some games, you can upgrade your bed for health buffs
in this case, you could make a special bed or bed related item (furniture placed near bed, or tiles its on) that would grant you full health on spawn
in this case you would probably make a bed with souls of light or dark, and any previous bed, and it would make a special new one
umbral mulch
Not quite sure how you'd make a bed heal you when you respawn at it but if you could that'd be neat
hollow shell
Honestly not a bad idea
tired haven
I believe that's actually quite simple to code that
Just a crutch solution is to make it an aura uber-regen buff for 1 second after the respawn, and there certainly are more elegant methods
And ye it sounds really promising
radiant meadow
I think I have an idea that could possibly make it work
lost agate
Mrrp would have to approve
hollow shell
Mrrp disapproved of making Third Sage into a light pet considering it doesn't emit light
But he might be okay with removing the health effect and keeping it as a normal pet?
queen delta
It would help to explain it more so it makes more sense in your suggestion
hollow shell
I guess we should probably wait for the suggestion to get more support first..
gusty geode
Why would a light pet not emit light
That's why it's called a light pet
Wait
Shit
I'm tired
queen delta
Ngl, at first, I thought a light pet just meant a not-heavy pet
hollow shell
The logic was that Third Sage was the only normal pet in the game that has any effect beyond aesthetics
and light pets were "effect" pets
so we could move it to be one of them instead
queen delta
Took me a while to notice that light pets emit light
hollow shell
big brain yata
lost agate
Only thorium made light pets be function pets
hollow shell
Yeah Thorium has a ton of functional light pets
lost agate
Which... Dont emit light
lost agate
I still disagree with the idea but yeah
The entire biome is flesh
The water is likely just filled with blood
tepid root
piss water 2
gusty geode
Would support but idk if that's doable
lost agate
Also yellow water would look weird
hollow shell
Would be kind of a weird thing for us to do
ashen warren
new piss ocean
gusty geode
On the other hand
What if it was it's normal color at first
But turned Ichor-colored in Hardmode
Same could be done with Corruption to get Cursed Flames water
Cursed water
lost agate
And why or for what reason?
gusty geode
Effect
lost agate
Its water nothing else
cobalt rose
i like bloody water better
queen delta
Yeah
cobalt rose
besides, its not like there was already water in the crimson that got tainted with cthulhu blood
lost agate
Imagine having an entirely purple biome and then you just see pools of green
Besides cursed flames dont even belong in water
sand umbra
I agree with you
or rather, I would if the tooltip of Cursed Flames didn't outright state that not even water can put them out
void kelp
tbh ive always felt like ichor stuck out a bit since we get the ichor stickers but nothing else
lost agate
That doesnt mean the flames blend with water
carmine island
I can only see it working with the texture pack, and I dunno how many people actually use it
lost agate
Like it was kool aid or smth
gusty geode
Might work if it was like
Vile Spit green instead of Cursed Flames green
lost agate
I still dont think it makes much sense
cobalt rose
ah yes
puke water
hollow shell
I do think puke green water would fit well in the corruption
considering all of their goop is green
carmine island
I play with the texture pack and all of the enemies of some green stuff on em. So do the walls I think
sand umbra
purple and green are basically the team colors of the Corruption
although the green is definitely a much darker one
void kelp
make funky colored water yes
sand umbra
and then you have Crimson which just has Ichor yellow slapped in there yet is mostly red
radiant meadow
maybe change the lava instead
and then when you go in it, you get ichor
green and cursed inferno for corruption
cobalt rose
colored lava??????
lost agate
Green lava wew
radiant meadow
if there's colored water, I don't see why there can't be colored lava
gusty geode
Fair point
radiant meadow
I remember seeing something like this
void kelp
ben i like that
sand umbra
how do you intend to pull it off, though? pretty sure there ain't a system for it in vanilla, although I could always go dumpster-diving with Main.cs memes to check
sand umbra
not a huge fan of a lava change for Hallow, but for Corruption and Crimson I can definitely see it
carmine island
It's less of different biome lava and more of dangerous substance to avoid
fervent citrus
Lava changing colors?
placid moth
Ichor water sounds neat ngl
wide flicker
Really Really hot ichor would be interesting to say the least
placid moth
just inflict ichor debuff on player if said player steps into the water
teal ibex
i noticed you dipped your left pinkie toe in water. 
opal silo
No
tepid root
masomode water 
opal silo
Hallowed snow biome
wide flicker
"I am the ichor man, my ambiguous liquid is delicious. Special delivery today"
ashen warren
Why this still hasn't happened is beyond me, but I'll star these suggestions to the end.
hollow idol
at this point it should be a frequently suggested tbh
sinful flax
My main reason is because I've gotten killed after spending a while prepping for a boss only to realize I had armageddon turned on
Quite unfortunate
potent veldt
Make Armageddon be off by default upon each world loading
Why?: I get that it's a "mode change" sort of thing, so it runs off of the same coding that makes Death work between play sessions, but oh my god if I can't count how many times I've taken even just a few hours of a break from Calamity and would come back to forget the thing's on, and would die to some hard, important boss. This is also extremely tedious to deal with since it's not even fully solvable with just "Check if it's on before summoning them, dummy", because sometimes bosses summon themselves. And it's also just entirely too easy to forget that Armageddon is something you'd even need to watch out for, despite being such a drastic change in how boss fights go.
Death makes perfect sense to keep between world loads, given that it's a difficulty setting. Armageddon is MEANT to be temporary, only for a specific boss fight or boss grinding session, not to keep between play sessions. So it being a static setting that doesn't automatically turn off upon exiting a world is far more of a hinderance than it is helpful and logical.
fierce hedge
@potent veldt Nice place to suggest
swift wadi
Sounds like you should turn it off before logging out
fierce hedge
potent veldt
You can post suggestions here for discussion before officially posting them, dummy
fierce hedge
Can you
swift wadi
@fierce hedge Nice not reading the pins and seeing that pasting suggestions here before the actual channel for discussion is recommended
potent veldt
Bamboozled
potent veldt
Might just make it an official sugg anyway, because damn I can't stand prepping hard for a boss fight that I took a break to mentally stable myself for, to only get shanked to death instantly because some small, harmless seeming projectile said "Hurdur you forgot Arm was on"
And no, this isn't a "I'm pissed because of this one instance" sugg either. For as long as I've played Calamity, this has gotten in my way consistently.
keen geyser
I agree
sand umbra
how in the hell do people constantly get the idea that posting a sugg in here beforehand is bad or somehow a mistake
and then they wonder why suggs that nobody talked about in here, which actually should've been, don't get discussed because of that very misconception 
potent veldt
Because they see it says "discussion" and get confused
It's an easy mistake, but it's also just weird to be like "Hehe wrong channel"
sand umbra
either way I wholeheartedly agree with this sugg
fervent citrus
Is it a good suggestion if there would be some sort of sign that armaggedon is active?
tepid root
that was literally just suggested
fervent citrus
Wait wat
radiant meadow
@teal ibex gdi why did you have to make that vid
quiet abyss
@junior wasp Please read the suggestion rules and the suggestions don't document in the pins before you suggest anything.
tepid root
holy shit
hollow saffron
making arma toggle off when you leave the world would be a pain in DAD mode
frosty dagger
It is a state of game when you have it on, like death or defiled, it shouldn't be turned off when you leave, just put it on your hotbar when it's on so you can't forget
hard crescent
Can i just uh
(This is the same guy, i change my name/pfp like every other week but whatever)
frail mantle
why do we need more hooks post-ML though
opal barn
because they don't exist obviously
frail mantle
apologies for my blindness
byeah Celestial and Bat Hook are already viable throughout all of post-ML
still cliff
Isnt Celestial hook pre-moonlord?
still cliff
I know
still cliff
We could make a hook like
green pumice
besides make hooks plz
still cliff
Idk
thorny cradle
Because pretty l o n g hooks please
green pumice
but bat hook is better than every hook anyway
frail mantle
^
tired haven
Static hook is l o n g either way so 
thorny cradle
fair enough
still cliff
Just
Why
keen geyser
"More post moon lord hooks"
"The variety of hooks in the game is quite lackluster when it comes to late game, and I feel like they could add in some more cool hooks."
green pumice
static hook is terror
keen geyser
that's a small reason
despite not being very great, it's still reasoning
"They don't exist" is just no
still cliff
Hmm
Then what should i say?
keen geyser
also this has been suggested half a dozen times already
still cliff
Ik
tired haven
Well, why would those hooks need to be implemented
You are the one who suggests that, you should know better
keen geyser
^
keen geyser
Definitely better
a little confusing
"because it seems to me that it somewhat not" is uh
quite confusing
tired haven
Certainly an improvement from previous one, but it feels like it goes in circles with "add hooks" and "they are better than hm hooks"
Now, if you said for example that tracers speed is so much higher that most existing hooks cannot grapple reliably and/or give you enough speed (which might or might not be the case, since I never really used them in postML, so be careful with that potentially false reasoning), then it would sound more-less solid imho
keen geyser
I'm pretty sure tracers are indeed faster if you just dash with them
still cliff
Fighting dog
And then you fall from your arena
wooden wedge
You don't have wings for DoG?
If you fall in a DoG arena you're most likely going to have more than enough wingtime to just fly back up
hollow shell
Well
Extreme Gravity
wooden wedge
Oh yeah that exists
hollow shell
(also Nick you didn't correct that one weird sentence)
wooden wedge
what does it do again?
hollow shell
ah wait no he did
keen geyser
reduces flight time by 50% and disabled infinite flight
did he?
"seems to me that it somewhat not"
still cliff
I I erased it
hollow shell
(This is somewhat futile anyhow considering it's a bluecheck but quality is quality)
alright
still cliff
I was a bit ashamed but ok
Oh and btw
What does this check ✓ in red and White means?
•-•
(I didn't know)
hollow shell
Red and White check?
Not sure, must be something exclusive to your device
still cliff
Ok hold on
hollow shell
We've only got green and blue checks
keen geyser
different emoji type
hollow shell
Ah, that's supposed to be blue
hollow shell
It means that "Post-ML hooks" has been suggested and delivered in the past six months.
hollow shell
So if your suggestion gets to 90 stars, it won't be delivered, but the original suggestion will get marked as being suggested a lot
still cliff
Ohh.
Ok
still cliff
It won't
An other good idea is that the message
Steampunker has awoken
Isnt a way to spawn a NPC
:/
still cliff
I won't
coz im trash
keen geyser
steampunker is spawned like a boss enemy in calamity, that's why it appears that way
still cliff
But why
hollow shell
It's a technical thing
tired haven
Forced spawn method
still cliff
Why not like a natural npc?
hollow shell
We force-spawn her once Hardmode begins and that message appears as default
We can't change her move-in conditions.
keen geyser
she normally doesn't spawn until after mechs
but calamity makes it so she spawns right after you kill wall of flesh
tired haven
Well, actually that makes me wonder, what purpose she has pre-mech that she was moved?
The only thing I can recall is clentaminator access
keen geyser
jetpack maybe?
keen geyser
static hook
tired haven
distant gyro
steampunker can probably be moved without the meme message
but interference with vanilla code sounds like death
opal barn
@keen forum never
tired haven
^
hollow idol
if you want one, time travel back to december 2017 iirc
keen forum
oh there used to be one?
opal barn
for about 5 minutes
hollow idol
for less than a day yes
tired haven
Or just go to main terraria server ig
queen delta
Main terraria doesnt have a meme channel anymore
queen delta
They decided to just be more flexible in other channels about memes
hollow idol
Epilepsy, racist and nsfw memes
queen delta
So they got rid of the channel
tired haven
Well their #multimedia is basically memes, let's be honest
keen forum
oh
hollow shell
It was the channel that all devs and all moderators here hated the most
tired haven
It's just that other channels permit some of them too
lost agate
i didnt experience it but the stories sound scary
tepid root
bruh?
lost agate
hollow idol
the fact that a channel which existed for less than a day has stories
lost agate
Yikes
hollow idol
all i remember was intense image spam
hollow idol
december 2017
hollow idol
December 15 2017 ye
hollow shell
It didn't exist for less than a day, it had a few months at least
unless you're just insistent on that one hyperbole
fervent citrus
^
tired haven
Well, depends on whether it was dedicated channel or just # offtopic
Latter certainly lasted a few months
hollow shell
Yeah I'm talking about #offtopic
I wasn't aware we ever had a dedicated meme channel
fervent citrus
i wonder how many people would want a meme chat
versed tundra
I don't consider this server my "main" server, so a meme channel wouldn't affect me
terse sundial
a meme channel will never return
fervent citrus
oof
bitter topaz
yeah no we're never having anything like that again
versed tundra
why was it cut?
hollow shell
Shitshow
fervent citrus
nsfw content i guess
hollow shell
Absolute hell content
versed tundra
wow
ashen warren
when theres more than 2 opinions on this green earth someones gonna want someone gone
versed tundra
Why would people do that in a "meme" channel...
frail mantle
cause muh place to post shitty memes :////
fervent citrus
^
terse sundial
because people think that rules don't apply in those channels
frail mantle
anyway imma go somewhere else before the mods slap me for offtopic moment
ashen warren
whats the stupidest way someones been banned here
terse sundial
there are quite a few, but that convo doesn't belong here
ashen warren
move to gen?
terse sundial
yea
fervent citrus
lets travel to general talk
pallid brook
Heart attack mode, during combat a bar (heart attack progression bar) increases based on the health of the things you are fighting, as the bar rises your damage and resistance increases but once it hits 100% you suffer a negative buff (heart attack) that drops your resistance to 0 and your health to 1 until death, nurse can cure it for a fee. As you fight more tougher beasts you will have a harder time surviving without suffering its effects. Rumor is, if you challenge strong foes while weilding a cursed blade found in the dungeon, you can consume their strength to improve your heart. But all powers come with consequences...
queen sail
...why do we need this
fervent citrus
hmm...
queen sail
fervent citrus
no i mean, thats kinda useful...
keen geyser
6000 dps is not a lot, hate to break it to you
ashen warren
didnt getting heart attack already deal 400 damage at some point
terse sundial
@sacred imp Can you please provide boss killtimes without using Adrenaline or Rage on those bosses
sacred imp
I didn’t know I’m new
terse sundial
Killtimes and DPS are both used to balance weapons
your suggestion is fine
just needs a little work
keen geyser
can I test, or do you want them to do it
pallid brook
How does it sound?
sacred imp
I didn’t even have menacing on my accessories
terse sundial
I deal with balancing the mod, so I'm familiar with the Lashes of Chaos being on the strong side of magic weapons available at this tier
again, Boss Killtimes would be appreciated
sacred imp
I will have to test it
terse sundial
Siren/Levi on average is about a 2:50 kill, and Golem is around 1:45 on revengeance mdoe
queen sail
Are you using any other content mods besides calamity?
terse sundial
Aureus is about 2:30
sacred imp
Spirit and Thorium
fervent citrus
ahhh well
terse sundial
and what accessories are you using
pallid brook
;-; I wish to be judged
terse sundial
please wait your turn
pallid brook
🕐
umbral mulch
It's fine P90 acid needs the same treatment
sand umbra
queen sail
Don’t nerf Acid Rounds
sand umbra
actually
sand umbra
are Acid Rounds good with literally anything else
queen sail
/s
sand umbra
or just P90
queen sail
Acid Rounds are this mod’s Poison Bullets right
umbral mulch
Because why the hell would you do anything else
terse sundial
Acid Rounds used to be broken before they gave enemies DR
sand umbra
because Chloro gets nerfed in Calamity smh
queen sail
Chloro is a meta
sand umbra
not in the way that matters but I digress
umbral mulch
Didn't notice
queen sail
Hmmmm yes today I will not aim and hit anyways
sacred imp
Mana Overloader, Asguard’s Valor, Aurate Booster and I cant remember the rest
terse sundial
alright
terse sundial
if you could get killtimes for those bosses that would be nice, I'll put Lashes of Chaos on my todo list to look at
I'll also look into acid rounds
now for that other suggestion
sacred imp
Ok. Thanks
umbral mulch
5k dps on moon lord btw
sand umbra
if Acid Rounds are only good for P90 just make them deal less damage with P90 specifically
pallid brook
:)
umbral mulch
Yeah honestly
terse sundial
@pallid brook I don't understand the point of your suggestion, are you asking for another difficulty mode, or are you asking for something else
hollow shell
Remember that the reason is the most important part of a suggestion
Why would that mode be a good idea?
pallid brook
Another difficulty mode with new mechanics
terse sundial
but why
pallid brook
I must suffer
hollow shell
Play DAD
terse sundial
try Iron Heart
Death mode is getting reworked next update, you could play that when it releases to the public
umbral mulch
DAD Iron Heart
pallid brook
challenge not suicide
terse sundial
Try using the Defiled rune yea
terse sundial
Or try another mod, such as fargos maso mode if you want a challenge
pallid brook
I haz that too
And fun mode from afk pets
And leveled 3 hearts and it's crit mode
hollow shell
(And you're saying that DAD is suicide?)
keen geyser
if I may, the siren fight using lashes with gear obtainable at that stage without rippers takes roughly from 12:50pm to around 3pm
terse sundial
If you could fine more purpose for your suggestion that isn't just "I want more of a challenge" that would be nice
sand umbra
have you actually played through DAD
pallid brook
Yes
sand umbra
have you finished it
pallid brook
Yes
terse sundial
should've recorded it and sent it here for the nohit roles 
pallid brook
I find the nurse useless in most cases, giving her a new use is part of the idea
You can only fight for so long before you have to go back to the nurse
fervent citrus
i remember that one time some stubborn guy wanted the iron heart removed
quite a fiasco
pallid brook
why?
hollow shell
He's not pro enough iirc
fervent citrus
queen sail
Tbf Iron Heart is very niche
hollow shell
Also the problem with your Heart Attack Mode or w/e is specificity
fervent citrus
ive just noticed i never used the iron heart
hollow shell
You've got too much exact specifications going on
pallid brook
Kek, he doesn't have to use it so why does he care
hollow shell
It's generally a rule to keep your suggestions general and malleable so that they needn't be implemented to your precise vision, and to have a good reason for each element you propose (preferably, you won't have many elements)
fervent citrus
^
queen sail
Also this would require testing
When they’re already busy figuring out how to make the existing difficulties better
Pretty sure we’re fine with what we have
fervent citrus
tru
pallid brook
I'm thinking of an equation but the main effect is this, a new meter that increases when in combat with ANYTHING, it does not decay, only resets upon death or nurse curing, 100% on it sets your current max health to 1 and defense to 0, every 10 or so % gives you a little buff ( like some extra damage or extra speed)
pallid brook
Nurse Chan gets to be useful
hollow shell
Why would it give you small buffs periodically?
night cradle
eh
setting your health to 1 in a bossfight would make them not so much fun
and making the debuff only renevable via nurse curing, especially during a bossfight, doesn't sound like a good concept, at least to me
pallid brook
Kill the boss before he makes you reach 100%
night cradle
having a timer in bossfights isn't better either
hollow shell
(Would this not essentially be an easier Armageddon?)
night cradle
a specific timer that sets the time you need to kill the boss before it ends, that is
(yeah, pretty much)
pallid brook
nah, bosses are not the only thing that inflicts it
hollow shell
Easier version of SCal Lore item
keen geyser
is it fine if I post the time and setup that I got of the levi kill with lashes of chaos here or shouldn't I post it since I wasn't the one who made the sugg
tired haven
Mmm it won't be hesitated much I'd say
Boss kill times are pretty vital when balancing things
keen geyser
alright
pallid brook
What does that one do again?
keen geyser
I had 4 menacing 3 lucky with wingslot, same armour and wings, Angel treads, mana overloader, Asgard's, Celestial Emblem, Sorcerer Emblem and Void of Extinction, with mythical on Lashes of Chaos and using all available magic boosting buffs and the fight took me 2:09 without attempting to dodge.
Since I don't know the exact setup I'm just assuming the best case scenario.
Realistically, dodging Leviathan's attacks could result in a 20-30 second increase, and since he stated he didn't have menacing on his accessories it would take longer
hollow shell
Scal lore item is essentially Armageddon except it's always active
night cradle
^
pallid brook
O
sacred imp
I didn’t have any mage damage accessories. For each class I play, I just swap out one accessory
keen geyser
Do you remember the accessories so I can test again
(since I assume you can't do so)
green pumice
lashes of chaos are good tbh
green pumice
but there's still other alternatives which are also strong
lashes are pretty strong against the fat levi
also aureus
lolem is a bit more 
sacred imp
Angel Treads
keen geyser
Angel treads, mana overloader, aureate booster
keen geyser
I have all the mage buffs available in vanilla/calamity
terse sundial
^
keen geyser
also isn't using another mod's buffs/accessories kinda bad when trying to judge item strength
terse sundial
yes
teal ibex
@radiant meadow dont kill the messenger ok
also just make the summon already, problem solved 
sacred imp
I will take everything out of my inventory that is not calamity (except my RoD) and will use vanilla buffs
keen geyser
there's a reason warding was buffed later on
still cliff
But why not menacing
keen geyser
warding is absolute garbage in its vanilla state
keen geyser
menacing is broken as shit
terse sundial
warding becomes much less useless in calamity as the game progresses
hollow shell
Because Menacing and etc are percent-based
Warding was originally just defense, which is not percent-based
terse sundial
^
still cliff
alright
hollow shell
so it needs to get buffed as you progress
tired haven
Unlike menacing, warding scales additively, and thus is less effective later in the game when large amounts of defense are common
still cliff
So do i delete it?
hollow shell
You could
terse sundial
your choice
hollow shell
It's not invalid it's just a bad idea :P
still cliff
Im gonna leave it here
keen geyser
and I doubt even if it reaches 90 that it would be approved
tired haven
It's the one dev team disagrees with, not exactly bad 
still cliff
Just in case
green pumice
menacing gets a buff by the fact that you can add another 4% damage after hm and pml
keen geyser
make menacing an emblem post provi
karmic stone
Mfw 56% more damage just from reforging
lost agate
You dont compare a flat 8 defense with 4***%*** damage
Thats not how numbers work
8 defense is always 8 defense, 4% dmg can mean 2 extra dmg up to 2000
So no its not unfair cuz menacing is a percentage
keen geyser
4% of 500 is 20, add together 7 menacing and you've got 140 extra damage
or something like that
lost agate
Also, defense and dmg are basically opposites
karmic stone
4%
add another 7
That would mean post ML in which case it would be 8% per menacing (in an hypothetical universe where this sugg gets greenlighted)
Which is alot kinda
lost agate
That would mean an absurd power spike if well reforged
keen geyser
7 wardings at max scaling gives 56 defense, which sounds epic. However that's only reducing 42 damage
tired haven
Lucky reforge be like 
lost agate
Cuz again 56 flat defense doesnt compare to 56 percent more damage
keen geyser
and when stuff is doing 300 damage a hit, what is 42 flat damage reduction gonna do for you
lost agate
Only yharon and scal hit that hard iirc
keen geyser
fair
tired haven
300 more like 600, for those two
karmic stone
56 defense means like 40~ less damage received in expert+
keen geyser
600 at scal yeah
lost agate
40 less dmg can sometimes save you
keen geyser
i guess
lost agate
Get hit again, thats 80 less, then 120
If we were talking smth like provi
Which has....
tired haven
flames
lost agate
(brb checking wiki)
tired haven
karmic stone
I tried full Warding melee pt after the true melee pot rework, Yharon got me to like 30 hp
keen geyser
taking 238 instead of 280 damage from profaned guardians on rev tho isn't really much of a decrease tbh
lost agate
Dmg from provi is around 200
keen geyser
(the attack one)
lost agate
40 less dmg means a reduce of 20% of the dmg
Ofc you dont go trying to use holy ray as an excuse
tired haven
It's more like 15% btw
lost agate
Regardless is still a decent percentage
keen geyser
but it doesn't compare to menacing in terms of effectiveness
tired haven
It is good % (though stacking dr still better )
lost agate
Ofc its not gonna compare to percentage
keen geyser
if you do indeed do that, you lose out on damage though
lost agate
It all adds up
keen geyser
I guess it's a personal pref
keen geyser
fair
tired haven
Summoner would have argued but it was fixed
keen geyser
doesn't really validate buffing menacing but that's not what you were trying to do
lost agate
I never said i wanted menacing buffed lol
keen geyser
yeah ik, that's just kinda where this started
lost agate
I was just trying to point out how different warding and menacing behave
keen geyser
and did so superbly
lost agate
But anyway TL;DR: Menacing isnt gonna be buffed because its a percentage boost, warding needed it cuz it was a flat boost
night cradle
warding was buffed bc it was pretty weak in calamity
and warding and menacing aren't the same thing
keen geyser
yuh
night cradle
menacing is already strong enough on its own with well reforged equipment
jaunty jackal
Defence would be a whole lot more valuable if there was less massive damage every so often and a lot more chip damage
night cradle
+20% > +24% > +28% damage boost isn't weak at all
lost agate
I mean, if you want low dmg you shouldnt be doing the 3rd difficulty all things considered
Defense's value basically scales inversely with difficulty
night cradle
^
keen geyser
yeah I was taking my damage numbers from rev
jaunty jackal
I'm just saying that against an enemy that has a lot of projectiles that don't deal much on their own, but hit you a lot, defence is all of a sudden a much more important stat
jaunty jackal
true
umbral mulch
And makes getting adrenaline and nohitting far harder than it needs to be
jaunty jackal
Maybe if defence had an effect on debuffs? I'm not trying to make a suggestion here, just spitballing
night cradle
accessories are use for that kind of thing
keen geyser
that would be an interesting concept to try, but I doubt it'd do much tbh
night cradle
warding doesn't need any more buffs imo
keen geyser
It's not "garbage" it's just outclassed since it's not a percentage stat
night cradle
especially in that kind of direction (as in, more abilities to it)
sand umbra
the Warding buffs actually make it a fairly powerful reforge as it is, although
I think part of the issue is rooted in everything late-game dealing exorbitant damage on the only difficulties anyone here wants to balance around
tired haven
That addition will require lots of duration times adjustments, but also sounds pretty neat
Tbh a few accs instead of defense effect would do this better imho
keen geyser
yeah
lost agate
Reminder expert was the one to said fuck it and double all stats like dmg and shit
So theres part of why the dmg is so high
tired haven
(one thing to remember about defense affecting debuff times is that since it's plain value and not % the effect would be either inflated in late game to the point where nothing affects you or the formula will have so much diminishing return that prehm shines again)
jaunty jackal
Isn't it the case with most bosses that have a 'signature debuff' that you can only get the accessory that grants immunity to it after the boss is defeated though?
keen geyser
not pbg
lost agate
Abaddon is also there
keen geyser
but i think she's the only one?
lost agate
So clone too
tired haven
Asgard's valor vs providence
jaunty jackal
the hint's in the name
karmic stone
Arcanum+ used to provide immunity to GSInferno, now it's just AI
tired haven
Ursa sergeant vs astrum deus/aureus
sand umbra
I mean, Shucks, I was simply pointing out/was about to point out that damage in late-game is high enough to where the defense from Warding will not make much of a difference at all, especially in the face of the i-frame fuckery that post-ML opponents start putting in place (local i-frame counters are fun, aren't they)
on its own merit, Warding is great --- it's just that post-ML in particular, it starts to lose any favor it has because it just cannot keep up with the damage dealt by normal enemies and high-ranking opponents alike
lost agate
As i mentioned earlier, it does make a difference
Just dont go trying to use high dmg shit as a base to define it
jaunty jackal
I guess it'd be more of an alternative more than anything (I know I don't like going into the astrums with a 35% speed decrease)
lost agate
If you try to use provi holy ray or scal shots or the like to say how worth defense is well...
keen geyser
you can have 400 defense and still take a chunk from those
sand umbra
tbf, my point moreso refers to shit like the buffed seasonal moons
tired haven
Using Abaddon alone instead of in-built with valor will be somewhat questionable too, but that's the point of niche
You sacrifice one of slots to prevent nasty DoT
sand umbra
attacks from normal enemies that late in the game are very highly damaging + local i-frames for the player start coming into play
lost agate
How are you gonna say smth so generalized when you focus on one thing?
sand umbra
.
wut
I wasn't
my point was
...okay, time to go work on something else before I get a headache, I don't have the mental fortitude for these kinds of arguments at the moment
jaunty jackal
I guess then you'd also have to consider the effect of DoT debuffs on high defence enemies
And it'd sorta be an indirect buff to debuffs that do DoT and lower defence
gusty geode
May I ask why Warding scales
If we're still on that topic
tired haven
Mmm, seeing how enemies don't even get affected by expert defense scaling, I doubt they will by debuff durations
Also a sec
jaunty jackal
Warding scales because defence doesn't
keen geyser
and 4 defense scales really poorly post ml
tired haven
Unlike menacing, warding scales additively, and thus is less effective later in the game when large amounts of defense are common
sand umbra
(also Warding gives 6 defense in Hardmode and 8 post-ML)
lost agate
(and a lil bit of dr always)
jaunty jackal
Considering that by having all accessories reforged to warding only gives a little over 50 defence (Ignoring the DR) is honestly pitiful for that stage of the game
umbral mulch
The warding buff still isn't enough
opal barn
it is though
tired haven
that's better than hella overbuffed
foggy grove
Did someone say old fabled tortoise shell? 
sand umbra
56 defense and 7% DR isn't too bad for just from reforges
potent veldt
@still cliff Warding is additive, making it less useful later in the game by default, which is why it was buffed. Every other accessory modifier is percent based, making it so no matter what part of the game you are in, they will be giving you adequate increases in stats.
Except for Arcane.
Arcane is useless.
tired haven
hollow shell
yeah we told him
potent veldt
No one pinged him and I didnt see him pop up in discussion
So just figured Id wrap it up anyway
Sugg is gone anyway
elder mist
i see a sugma deleted and immediately come to watch what happened 
elder mist
never
lost agate
Fixed?
potent veldt
Because it's useless, as of right now
sand umbra
oh yeah, when is Arcane becoming a more general-purpose mage modifier
potent veldt
Except for like, an extremely niche, small part of pre-hm, where you can just get more mana from stars still anyway
I dont mean it's a bug, dummy
potent veldt
I mean it's a problem
potent veldt
Just make Arcane lower mana usage by an extremely small amount
radiant meadow
it's harder to work with than warding because it doesn't have like 4 tiers
sand umbra
yeah, I can see that
potent veldt
Make it lower mana usage by like 2%
sand umbra
it's just that it is currently large amounts of ungood because of mana hardcap shenanigans
potent veldt
It'd indirectly buff Mage as a whole, since it'd give more dps given they're using Mana Flower, and would save money through not chugging so many potions at once
While still being a cost
elder mist
specific mage prefix while ranger and summoner and rogue don't have any specific prefixes
elder mist
melee's is kinda useless for the most part so it should also count
tired haven
Ranger doesn't need one
Summoner slots can't be balanced
Rogue is ranger
potent veldt
If we're going by Ranger's proficiency standards, Ranger's specific prefix is movement speed
elder mist
no because MS is general purpose
potent veldt
I know, I was just joking
elder mist
and it doesn't even work unless you're walking on asphalt bridge, either
because hermes boots and it's upgrades cap the max move speed you have
sand umbra
oh yeah, boot running speeds are a big meme
potent veldt
Make ranger have less ammo consumption as a prefix, and have rogue have more velocity as a prefix
Summoner doesn't need one, given Menacing is the only one that matters
radiant meadow
because clearly you don't know how annoying it is to implement custom ammo reservation
but like not just once
sand umbra
I mean
radiant meadow
but 15 times
sand umbra
it seems pretty easy when I do it
elder mist
by the same logic menacing / lucky are the only ones that any class needs
for damage output
including mage
lost agate
Max hp reforge when
potent veldt
I guess, but I still think it's for Summoner even more so, since it kicks in right away with Minions that you don't control, that have their own dps
elder mist
max hp reforge would be dope tbh
potent veldt
An hp reforge would actually be neat, but also wouldn't make sense
lost agate
Thats just a heart yeah
elder mist
ye
sand umbra
max HP reforge would be yes
elder mist
+100 per reforge when 
lost agate
Hueh
elder mist
ez +700 hp
sand umbra
percentage health bass-boost hours?
potent veldt
"I'm wearing these boots on my feet that a goblin dude touched, so I have more health"
sand umbra
radiant meadow
why +700 when +7000 
tired haven
Imagine applying RL logic in terraria
potent veldt
Also, handsobble
twilit swan
maybe Post-Moon Lord reforges that add either +50 HP or +40 Mana
potent veldt
I'm aware me bringing up ammo conversation is annoying, but Ranger has barely any specific class stats, so
potent veldt
I apologize, but I dont have any other ideas for that generic class
radiant meadow
I did add ammo conservation to the stat meter
potent veldt
For the most part, yeah
elder mist
just like how mage doesn't need a specific reforge
arcane is there just to be useless
radiant meadow
but adding ammo conservation to proficiency would make the stat meter calcs even more annoying
sand umbra
melee didn't need one either yet it got four
potent veldt
Not even sure why Mage had a prefix in Vanilla
elder mist
melee kinda did
radiant meadow
since you now have to also check for the prof config
lost agate
Does arcane ignore the mana cap?
radiant meadow
when it already checks for the adren config
lost agate
Jeebus
potent veldt
That's why it's useless
elder mist
because before terra blade and 1.2, melee at best had like
twilit swan
Oh I Got it, +100,000 HP, but 100% chance of crit that deals 100x damage
lost agate
Best sword was excalibur so like
sand umbra
Excalibur being good in vanilla ever sounds beyond wack
elder mist
good days
lost agate
Thats 1.1 to you
potent veldt
All of Vanilla is wack
tired haven
Before 1.2 starfury wasn't even melee smh
lost agate
What was it again?
radiant meadow
magic iirc
tired haven
Stars were magic
lost agate
Yike
lost agate
Wot
tired haven
Spellsword discussion
lost agate
Ah oke
void kelp
re: lashes nerf— wouldn’t it be better to use kill time?
wooden wedge
@proud isle what reason?
proud isle
i didnt mean to post without explanation mb
void kelp
ah
hallow hatch
Bruh
sacred imp
I remember one more accessory of mine: Defific Amulet