just tenfold because PBG's dashes can go in like 5 different directions
#suggestions-discussion
sand umbra
terse sundial
byeah at this point it's pretty off topic
hollow shell
uh ohh it's one of those convos again
dim palm
Honestly they should replace the ravager with the ravager from terraria
terse sundial
The convo has turned into complaining about bosses instead of discussing suggestions
dim palm
*minecraft
swift wadi
Yeah you're right
terse sundial
so let's shift gears here
opal silo
When you realize the pillars are just large phantasmal eyes
swift wadi
Yeah I agree
distant gyro
I think I've fought S&L along with Aureus so much that I found them to be easier than rev plantera
It's all a matter of opinions
queen sail
So uhhhh
gusty geode
If we're talking about the wiki can we update class setups to provide alternatives for lower difficulties
distant gyro
Yes that is uncommon thought
dim palm
I mean it could just be I'm not used to calamity
terse sundial
I can look into that @gusty geode
queen sail
How’s those bloodstone brimmy/doppelcal/ravager weapon upgrades goin
dim palm
I've only started playing it this last month, vs terraria where I've been playing it for about a year
opal silo
I need more healing
sand umbra
is this the part where I mention that I'd make a sugg about something related to this tier if I wasn't 102% certain it'd never actually get accepted
because I so badly want to, if nothing else, sugg that Levi's dashes and PBG's dashes be changed so that there's a minimum distance the respective bosses can be away from the player before starting their dashes
swift wadi
Aureus is in a way more difficult than Golem in my eyes because he's a Calamity boss, He's a lot of fighting, dying and learning, but when you have his mechanics in mind I find him much easier
queen sail
I agree with levi
dim palm
That's a good idea
swift wadi
@sand umbra I will star that instantly
hollow shell
So basically
@dim palm Edit your suggestion to word it like "intended progression" or mention Boss Checklist
considering it's not the wiki's doing
sand umbra
except I know, you know, and everybody else who's anybody knows that boss-related suggs never actually happen ever
queen sail
Levi’s charge is done so close that I have no idea if it’s even possible to dodge normally
dim palm
I mean we're not really supposed to edit our suggestions
hollow shell
Yes you are
dim palm
Plus it already got rejected
terse sundial
Yes, you are
dim palm
Oh
hollow shell
You are absolutely encouraged to edit suggestions
terse sundial
^
dim palm
I thought in one of the pins it said to discuss rather then edit
swift wadi
Of course it's allowed
queen sail
Who says you can’t edit your own sugmas :idontgetit:
hollow shell
Not quite
dim palm
Oh
void kelp
you do both
dim palm
Sorry
hollow shell
It says that discussing here before you post it in the first place
is better
than posting a flawed suggestion and then discussing it here, then editing it
distant gyro
Unless you edit a 89 star sug to a completely different unapproved sug and self star to get to 90
sand umbra
(except nobody does that thing with discussing here first)
distant gyro
sand umbra
queen sail
Brb gonna edit my Giant Squid sugma into Add Supreme Yharim LORDE with 9999999 stats and 500 exo weapons to kill him with so i can feel like a god
swift wadi
Calamity GOD
hollow shell
<><><>
queen sail
Rover you are on the verge of losing dev privileges
hollow shell
You're on the verge of losing life privileges
hollow shell
distant gyro
bad
void kelp
oh my god rover did the <><><>
sand umbra
truly a moment for the history books
swift wadi
what is the <><><>
hollow shell
(I'm the only guy who references that)
void kelp
I screenshot it
hollow shell
(dunno why this is news)
cobalt rose
SDOMG
void kelp
we reference it all the time in skrib when we shitpost about sugmas
hollow shell
dunno what skrib is
ashen warren
👀
gusty geode
Meanwhile there's me
I discuss suggestions here and then never actually post them
void kelp
oh mood
ashen warren
hey discussion suggestions still gets somewhere
cobalt rose
skrib is a knockoff calamity-related server for skribblio games
void kelp
also, @swift wadi epsilon, it’s making fun of this guy who made an incredibly large wall of text for a suggestion
he used <><><><><> as line breaks
swift wadi
Oh amazing
void kelp
gave specific item stats, a crafting recipe, a detailed description of its appearance, a tooltip
tepid root
god
gusty geode
Which reminds me
Asked about lore suggestions and never got an answer
Last I checked it's not outlawed in the rules or don'ts
And with the lore as unstable as it is, devs could potentially use help in improving it
hollow shell
You can suggest lore changes
void kelp
it was objectively bad and a great push to prohibiting specific item suggestions
hollow shell
It's just that... almost nobody does
hollow shell
void kelp
godly
umbral mulch
Jesus christ that man tried way too hard
void kelp
tbh for lore stuff I’m willing to wait
sand umbra
On today's episode of "everything post-Plantera is horrible difficulty-wise and I want more replayability":
Make the dashes of sub-50% Leviathan and the Plaguebringer Goliath have a minimum distance they can be from the player.
<><><> ❔ <><><>
These two entities are both enormous, they are both extremely fast for their size, and they both have way too easy of a time ramming into the player for huge damage. Giving these two some sort of limitation on otherwise infuriating opponents can seriously help to level the post-Plantera playing field, which is currently very heavily skewed in the game's favor and not yours, and would arguably make these two opponents a bit more fair.
(note: unsure if QB needs this change, but if it is found necessary then she can gain it too)
swift wadi
HOly fuck'
swift wadi
Post it
devout seal
I'd love that change.
sand umbra
swift wadi
Plz
hollow shell
I'm pretty sure they do have some minimum distance?
void kelp
it’s practical and useful an has <><><><><>
hollow shell
Levi at least tries to position herself to some point away
void kelp
suggestion bot is the first fan epsilon
sand umbra
if they do, it's way too fucking close
you have to remember that these are like two of the biggest bosses in the game
placid moth
Make it like < 30% or something
swift wadi
Shhh
hollow shell
Yeah I hate Levi dashes a lot
swift wadi
Levi is biggest iirc
placid moth
Levi 50% dashes are as horrifying as Fishron 50% P3
swift wadi
Well, ML
void kelp
Levi dashes are literally impossible to dodge
devout seal
they're possible to dodge, just gotta fall.
swift wadi
In my no-hit I literally just flew in a way that made it where she never dashed
void kelp
especially on small resolution screens and you basically have to use a minimap icon to position yourself
swift wadi
Because fuck that
hollow shell
She should start the dash by moving backward and then accelerating forward, not immediately 0-to-60 straight forward linear movement
void kelp
all big dashes should Telegraph like that ngl
hollow shell
Yes
umbral mulch
I always move towards levi before the dash and then dash away
Works most of the time
swift wadi
--------
--------
<<<<< --------
>>>>>>>>>>
hollow shell
yes
sand umbra
and here comes the wave of people telling me that these dashes are supposedly easy to dodge
just in time for me to post the sugg
void kelp
perfect visualization epsilon
umbral mulch
I'm not saying they're easy
void kelp
please add that to the suggestion as an illustration
umbral mulch
I'm just saying it's possible
hollow shell
Thomas I'd reword your suggestion a bit to say "greater minimum distance" just in case they do have some distance and the devs dismiss your sugg immediately
ashen warren
Golem in Rev+ is way harder than Astrum Aureus tbh
umbral mulch
Alright I'm gonna have to stop you right there
Golem is literally walk slowly across a platform
void kelp
difficulty is subjective
sand umbra
aaaand we're live
umbral mulch
I have video evidence that's all you have to do
distant gyro
low salmon
swift wadi
sand umbra
low salmon
No don't,
sand umbra
well, that's enough of that
low salmon
I was checking if i had the emote omg no
void kelp
fastest stars in the west
sand umbra
how to get stars fast:
suggest making arguably the most unfair boss in the game actually something closer to fair
distant gyro
how to get stars fast: <><><>
sand umbra
that too
queen sail
@sand umbra very impressive visuals
swift wadi
Helpfully provided by me
sand umbra
the best visuals on the planet
queen sail
Also no qb doesn’t need the nerf
queen sail
She’s a good distance when she does it
sand umbra
she's not really that much of a threat by comparison
she's much smaller than these two and has a decent min distance
queen sail
Unlike levi where’s it’s an ML sized sprite right in front of your face and the only help the game gives you is “Dodge 🤷”
sand umbra
and is slow enough to where running in the same direction will grant you enough time to jump up or drop down and outta the way
void kelp
tbh remove QB part from sugma and nothing changes
queen sail
Even the fall speed of the slime mount isn’t enough to get out of levi’s charge
I can’t recall how many times she hit me with it and I said “There is literally no way to dodge this.”
cobalt rose
i'll be honest, i ddon't remember the charge being obnoxiously hard to dodge last time i fought levi.
sand umbra
even the Rod of Discord, an item I despise balancing against because it's an instantaneous teleport with no real penalties for using it
cannot guarantee safety in the face of that dash
hollow shell
(well there are penalties for using it in Rev)
queen sail
hollow shell
(pretty big damage taken increase)
devout seal
25% more damage taken
sand umbra
(I mean, fair)
(although personally I really do think Chaos State should've done that in the first place)
(and given a bigger penalty for getting spammy)
(but this is a whole different can of worms I'll open some other time)
cobalt rose
can of worm bosses
queen sail
Tl;dr make levi less fat and charge more bearable
cobalt rose
well the former ain't gonna happen, probably
low salmon
Leviathans dont needa be thicc.
queen sail
But then they might just sprite scale that one 
lost agate
Tbf i never had problems with pbg and its size when dashing
hollow shell
we had like 3 suggestions in very close proximity saying PBG dashes need to be fairer
lost agate
What gets me its how fast they are near the end and my luck getting me combo'd
void kelp
PBG dashes aren’t as unfair as Levi honestly
tepid root
what
swift wadi
Who even notices that
dim palm
I did :>
lost agate
One of the problem is that if levi is on your face when it gets in height, she wont drop back to give you space, the moment you end in the same height as levi the dashing happens
queen sail
What
void kelp
Levi doesn’t give you dodging clearance
hollow shell
(you gonna edit your previous suggestion, Mochi?)
queen sail
Dodging levi’s charge is luck based final verdict
No idea how hec manages to dodge it
dim palm
I did
lost agate
Flight speed
hollow shell
You shouldn't have, because the wiki doesn't decide the boss order
The devs do, and they use Boss Checklist to define it.
hollow shell
who mentioned LC?
tepid root
btw
dim palm
tepid root
dont golem lasers pierce through blocks
sand umbra
Shucks and only Shucks
dim palm
I don't think so
sand umbra
also no iirc
dim palm
Actually nvm
hollow shell
I think they do but I wasn't really paying attention to that
sand umbra
neither do his fireballs, they just boing
lost agate
Im just saying since the argument was that bosses are harder than others and thats what the progression should be
hollow shell
I was mostly trying to not die
sand umbra
e
hollow shell
Well the thing is LC is standardly progression-locked behind Golem, and has vanilla Boss Checklist values that we can't change
but Levi is in no way concrete in her position after Plantera
dim palm
The lasers aren't nearly as much of a hassle as aa's fireballs
And the golem fireballs are basically a non-issue
hollow shell
Levi has never not been a post-Plant pre-Golem boss
(and Anahita's just sprite changes, no?)
dim palm
But the progression says it is
hollow shell
Well, new sprites tend to bring about new behaviors
lost agate
I mean, that they werent before doesnt mean they cant fit in the progression in the future
hollow shell
Too easy to summon ngl
dim palm
And really annoying to summon at the same time
quick ice
I’d like if they had a summon item after they’re defeated
sand umbra
they're intended as post-Plantera, pre-Golem according to the team
their weapons iirc match up with stuff you'd get a bit earlier on (blame post-Plantera power spike)
their general difficulty and statistics imply they're closer to LC and ML, relatively speaking
sand umbra
I'm gonna have to disagree with you there
hollow shell
Seekers + Catastrophe ate my ass
sand umbra
Seekers + Catastrophe is the worst thing
hollow shell
Had to save Cal till later
lost agate
Well
dim palm
Huh
void kelp
it’s.. catastrophic
lost agate
Guess what
dim palm
;D
sand umbra
guessing what
dim palm
You guessed wrong
hollow shell
It's good imo
dim palm
Just fly around and she's basically not an issue
lost agate
Also catastrophe is pre seekers
hollow shell
you playin on Normal Mode?
dim palm
Yeah :|
sand umbra
Seekers are pre-Catastrophe
hollow shell
that explains it.
lost agate
Wat
hollow shell
and yeah Shucks is that an upcoming change or something?
dim palm
Shouldn't a game be balanced around the lowest difficulty?
lost agate
Yes
dim palm
:T
sand umbra
Seekers come at 50-45% or so, Catastrophuck at 40%
quick ice
No, it’s balanced around Revengeance
lost agate
Im telling you
dim palm
That's kinda weird imo
lost agate
Thats gonna change
dim palm
I hope
lost agate
Catas is gonna be pre seekers
hollow shell
You said "Catastrophe is pre-Seekers" and then said "wat" when we said otherwise
so
you can see why we'd be confused
lost agate
Yeah ik
sand umbra
you had me confused for a good minute there
but all is well now
Seekers + Catastrophe will no longer occur 
void kelp
calamity mod has this whole thing about being more difficult, which is why balance is around rev ig
lost agate
Ir can still occur
dim palm
I mean it's fine if it's more difficult
hollow shell
It can still occur in Normal :P
lost agate
If you somehow yeet more than 5% hp in one shot lmao
dim palm
I just feel like it should be balanced around the easiest difficulty, and the rest falls into place automatically
sand umbra
dim palm
You can keep the hard parts hard just as long as there aren't difficulty spikes
Make it all hard or all easy
hollow shell
Rev is the one Calamtiy is balanced around because it's the mode we have the most control over
lost agate
Btw im sorry to tell you this but everything in normal is made to be easy
dim palm
I know lol
hollow shell
and it's the difficulty level the lead dev Fabsol enjoys playing the most
dim palm
That's fair, but I still feel like that doesn't give an excuse to not balance the easier difficulties
dim palm
Yeah
hollow shell
Well yeah of course they're balanced to some extent lol
ashen warren
wow fab doesn't play DAD hardcore 1hp? casual
lost agate
We do balance easier difficulties
hollow shell
We have health and damage values for all of them
sand umbra
I didn't want to tread into this subject because I was certain it'd get my ass muted but here we are
hollow shell
(Armageddon and 1HP is slightly redundant)
dim palm
I feel like it isn't really balanced enough though
lost agate
We also made aegis and elysian wings non mode restricted
ashen warren
(you don't die to random stuffs with armageddon)
lost agate
And drew wings
dim palm
I honestly feel like you should buff the vanilla bosses to make them tough as the new ones
ashen warren
And celestial onion
lost agate
Yeah
hollow shell
Drew's was never a Phase 1 drop iirc?
void kelp
they do have buffs in revengance
dim palm
But not in normal
sand umbra
Drew's was a phase 1 drop for the longest time
dim palm
Where they need them the most
void kelp
it was a drop from the bag
sand umbra
(remember: Yharon drops his bag/normal loot in phase 1 save for a few things)
dim palm
But the calamity bosses are hard compared to the vanilla bosses
Which means the difficulty isn't even
void kelp
like. I can’t really say you’re not supposed to have an easy time
quick ice
If you go into Rev mode, the vanilla bosses are for the most part better
hollow shell
Surely the Calamity bosses should be nerfed, then?
dim palm
I mean I guess
void kelp
the difficulty is even when you play on a harder difficulty because vanilla scales up to it
dim palm
That would have the same effect
lost agate
Crabulon is very easy even for vanilla bosses
dim palm
That's true
sand umbra
Crabulon is just the perfect Calamity boss
dim palm
Poor crabby boi
sand umbra
ashen warren
i mean balancing normal isn't really important because like 1% of the playerbase plays clam on normal
dim palm
I play on normal :<
quick ice
Crabulon is to much work to actually summon it at the stage it’s fought for me
sand umbra
lost agate
Also kinda hard to make calam bosses not harder when skelly is just
Shoot at the moving skull
dim palm
Yeah
void kelp
ngl calamity literally advertises itself as being harder than expert
dim palm
That's why I said buff the vanilla bosses
So that it could keep it's reputation as being difficult
void kelp
so even though balancing for all difficulties is honestly a good idea, there’s no impetus for it
lost agate
I dont see why we should
random flume
its difficult on the difficult mode kappa
hollow shell
I do feel like we should keep the vanilla boss changes to our own difficulty modes
lost agate
Yeah
void kelp
bc if you want harder, you just. turn on a harder difficulty
dim palm
I guess
quick ice
I mean, the vanilla balance changes aren’t kept to the difficulty modes
void kelp
I think thomas has something insightful to say tho, let’s wait for him to speak
dim palm
I don't want harder, I want a balanced difficulty curve
lost agate
I mean
hollow shell
He does have something insightful to say.
" txvsn "
void kelp
which currently only exists in the harder difficulties,
sand umbra
I so badly
want to say something here
dim palm
So add it to normal mode
sand umbra
but anything I could say at all would cause me to quickly spiral off into a tangent
lost agate
Vanilla itself has a spike of LC then ML
void kelp
I think if you say it diplomatically we’ll listen
lost agate
Which is a very big spike if you ask me
dim palm
I guess, but that doesn't really mean calamity has to be the same way
sand umbra
because this is a subject I've intentionally kept my mouth shut on so I don't die from voicing my thoughts
so I'm going to stay as quiet as humanly possible here
random flume
thats because moonlord sucks 
dim palm
F
hollow shell
basically:
PLANTERA
ᵍᵒˡᵉᵐ
ˡᵘⁿᵃᵗᶦᶜ ᶜᵘˡᵗᶦˢᵗ
MOON LORD
sand umbra
vanilla progression moments
ashen warren
moon man is actually easier in rev
hollow shell
difficulty moments
void kelp
ngl rev locking the changes to bosses to itself is like. a soft compatibility thing because rev makes other mods piss Easy
lost agate
You know if people are just gonna not talk because im here i would rather leave
random flume
no bs floating eye lasers
ashen warren
make moon lord bald
sand umbra
I don't not talk because you're here
dim palm
We are talking tho :<
hollow shell
I don't have personal experience with new Rev ML
but I know people have had trouble with it
so I dunno if I'd say it's easier
sand umbra
I don't talk because it's a subject which I have a fucking wealth of thoughts on, all of which can be see as varying levels of controversial to just about anyone in the main playerbase
ashen warren
i found it to actually be fun
sand umbra
there is a reason I've kept quiet about this for as long as I have
random flume
i mean on a skybridge its real easy imo
ashen warren
now i want to know the controversy
dim palm
I mean it's good to talk about it
void kelp
I feel like you have something important to say abt difficulty and balancing tho bc I’ve seen you rant a bit about it and I honestly agree with much of it, even if I dont really have a use for it
hollow shell
(I understand Thomas's hesitation)
dim palm
Lol
hollow shell
(Especially if it's grand sweeping changes and would involve a long rant
which is something we discourage talking about in this channel)
void kelp
eg. what you’ve said before about difficulty and how it relates to calamity; no pressure in you
frank stratus
Expert and Rev ml difficulty is debatable from what I've heard, I did Rev ml recently but not expert
dim palm
I mean I shared my opinion even though I have no basis to speak on
It can't be that bad
hollow shell
Thomas
has a doc
void kelp
Thomas could probably write a 10 page essay
random flume
i remember hardcore struggling with pre change ml
dim palm
Lmao
hollow shell
Thomas has written a 200 page essay
sand umbra
multiple times over at this point
ashen warren
on what
hollow shell
Calamity.
quick ice
sounds like me when it comes to enemies
ashen warren
boi
sand umbra
I do not want to get going on this
because once I do
I can guarantee you I will not stop
void kelp
if you need to step back feel free to!
dim palm
Thomas we should discuss this in dms :>
sand umbra
not because I want to keep going but because I feel extremely strongly about this
in short, I'm quiet about this for a reason
random flume
keeps on talking about why he isnt talking as opposed to either talking about it or not talking
sand umbra
and especially in light of recent events that have resulted in long ramblings like mine being discouraged, I've--
dim palm
void kelp
tbh tom you can probably made an abridged doc
sand umbra
ehhhh
hollow shell
Just shrink it down to 40 pages, like mine 
distant gyro
frank stratus
yeah if you don't want to talk about it you probably shouldn't talk about why you don't want to talk about it for 5 minutes because it's...yeah
sand umbra
hollow shell
(tbf other people were insisting he continue)
void kelp
(yeah)
lost agate
Tbh i have heard several people saying they have docs about calamity, but if i were to worry about every nitpick i would probably go crazy in the process 
sand umbra
people wanted to know why I've been intentionally staying quiet about this
so I explained myself
void kelp
do you need to take a break or smth
lost agate
I said this on dev chat, we do what we can basically
sand umbra
anywho, that's my story, basically
you can ask in DMs or whatever for more information if you're really curious but don't expect a short story
I'm gonna try and do somethin' else now ig
back to suggs discussion or smth, y'all
void kelp
take care!!
sand umbra
🛫
sand umbra
🛫
queen sail
You can’t shoot what’s inevitable, ThomasThePencil The Tank Engine
distant gyro
Pencil the Tank Engine
lost agate
Anywho, i dont have much problems dealing with aureus
Since i learned that slow circles dodges a lot of what he shots
potent veldt
I mean
It's moreso an issue of I kinda feel both of them are about as strong as one another
Especially considering they're both actually kinda similar in fightstyle
teal ibex
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/660577948402974790 👍 @potent veldt
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/660579264047087616 👍 @potent veldt
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/660554026072408068 No opinion @radiant meadow
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/655747506063409163 🏁 @quartz hare
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/656697292635766784 🏁 @scenic aspen
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/655823493761466371 🏁 @quick ice
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/656013760041058316 🏁 @cobalt rose
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/263382359397761025/652931017182674977 🏁 @quartz hare
sand umbra
WEW
teal ibex
fun fact: there is currently a set of six consecutive suggestions that received a ✅ reaction. wowza!
sand umbra
big bunch of suggs
quartz hare
cute
sand umbra
there is currently a set of six consecutive suggestions that received a ✅ reaction
yowza
that's a lot
void kelp
sexy 🏁
radiant meadow
@tidal bough specific items like that aren't allowed
I recommend you read the Suggestion Don'ts document in the pins
tidal bough
Time to yeet the suggestion to the shadow realm.
rapid pivot
Tweak Crabulon's abilities in Boss Rush to add a teleportation ability similar to that of the King Slime.
❔ Currently, it's entirely possible to just stand on your skybridge, have Crabulon fall to the ground, and just fire straight down in Boss Rush. Crabulon will never pose any threat to you whatsoever if you do this. Given that this is boss rush, cheese like that really shouldn't be possible.
Thoughts?
rapid pivot
think my suggestion's decent enough to throw in there?
terse sundial
I don't really see a point to it
teal ibex
there's a mod that allows more buff slots actually, used it for a masomode run
somber island
what pins? sorry I dont know much about discord anymore
versed mica
Mobile or pc?
rapid pivot
Like, it just feels weird that a boss rush boss can be skipped like that.
versed mica
A lot of them can be skippped
terse sundial
the pinned messages in this channel
teal ibex
but the existence of that mod itself makes adding such a feature needless imo
versed mica
With one good attack
terse sundial
rapid pivot
True, but those bosses can't usually be skipped in a way that lets you stand still, and heal.
terse sundial
that is the pins
lost agate
Tping crabulon make almost no sense
hollow shell
There is indeed a mod which lifts the buff slot restriction
terse sundial
interesting
somber island
ohhh thanks @terse sundial will read right now
tepid root
i think that mod causes some bugs byeah
royal cedar
Many boss rush bosses are normally quite insignificant anyway, plus giving a boss an ability just for boss rush is kinda pointless. Most enemies adjusted for it simply take on death mode mechanics so you would have to put that mechanic into death mode, which makes little sense
rapid pivot
Fair enough.
void kelp
One of the mods that increase buff slot count relies on having a new character made + said characters can only be used with the mod enabled
lost agate
Crabulon becomes usain bolt
royal cedar
I can't remember which, but I got a mod for increased buff slots for my summoner playthrough and it had no issues at all. I'm gonna load up the game to find out which so give me a second
somber island
really? which one?
royal cedar
Lan's unlimited buff slots
Also has config so you can set how many buff slots it gives
jovial venture
antisocial also makes social slots accessory slots
keen geyser
that mod makes calamity too easy
hollow shell
That's a different thing entirely, Carbn
(Also I thought Dradon made an unlimited buff slots mod?)
somber island
thanks
jovial venture
sorry, i jumped in to the conversation on how to get more buff slots without reading the conversation fully just got here.
hazy glacier
I apologize if this has been asked 10,000 times before, but is the suggestion bot a custom bot?
hollow shell
Ye
rapid pivot
Is it just me, or is it kinda weird that Ranger is the only class that gets a skill level bonus for something that isn't just ranger-specific?
(aka; movement speed?)
hollow shell
A bit odd.
Projectile velocity for rogue isn't that rogue-specific either
There are some rogue accessories which modify the velocity but it ain't exclusive
rapid pivot
Well, yeah, but that's not quite as universally useful as movement speed.
hollow shell
Movement speed for ranger is definitely the oddest
Could be changed to ammo consumption
maybe
rapid pivot
I'll suggest that.
keen geyser
wholeheartedly agree
hollow shell
(This has been suggested before as part of a larger scale proficiency suggestion, but it's too old now)
ashen warren
what's proficiencies as a whole ? like honestly I feel like they don't make much of a impact and kinda gimmicky
rapid pivot
They're pretty useful, but you don't really notice them often.
hollow shell
They're pretty subtle but grant decent bonuses for free by the end of the game
and also they're very powerful for Summoner
rapid pivot
+12% damage of your class's type, +6% crit chance, and a number of class-specific benefits.
ashen warren
oh huh, that does sounds alright, guess it's just really unnoticeable
rapid pivot
Goblin tinkerer sells things that track it.
rapid pivot
It takes a long time to level it up. :P
ashen warren
afk farm
hollow shell
Afk farm stinky iirc
ashen warren
summoner is like the only class that can gain proficiency from afk farm
hollow shell
I see you haven't heard of the Mouse Rock technique
ashen warren
i don't feel like ammo consumption is that important because it's not hard to get enough ammo
except if you use star cannons
rapid pivot
Yeah, but it also fits better compared to movement speed.
The issue isn't that ammo consumption isn't important; it's that movement speed is a weird, universal thing to buff for only one class.
ashen warren
projectile velocity maybe?
rapid pivot
¯_(ツ)_/¯
night cradle
it's kinda more important than the movement speed since you still want to keep some of your ammo
and some of the ammo isn't that easy to recollect tbf
civic pond
I mean late game isn't what your using basically holy fire
radiant meadow
@rapid pivot implementing ammo reduction for ranged items isn't as easy as you would think
radiant meadow
Stuff that already does it like Daedalus Emblem just steals a vanilla bool
hollow shell
Oh, is vanilla stupid?
Modifies ammo consumption directly instead of setting a stat that does it?
rapid pivot
eeeeeeeh, i'd disagree, Aloe
Movement speed is one of the most important stats in the game
but eh
either way; fair enough; can't help but think it's kind of silly that Vanilla does that though
@hollow shell should I just change my suggestion to projectile velocity, then, or should I delete the old one?
hollow shell
Nah it shouldn't mooch off another class
I think it's fine as is, it'd just require some programming fuckery
I don't think there's any other ranger-relevant stats...
keen geyser
since there are other mods that give ammo conservation, I would only think that it indeed IS possible
rapid pivot
wouldn't wanna annoy the devs too much tbh
radiant meadow
You can keep it I guess
Don't have anything better to do
No, I'm not programming a complicated summon
ashen warren
what about shooting speed and charge up speed bonuses? kind of specific but there r weapons later on that need to be charged up
rapid pivot
i mean, not really
keen geyser
ooh a small spoiler?
radiant meadow
Charge up speed would definitely be annoying
And I doubt we'd be able to modify vanilla ones
Like Phantasm or Phantom Phoenix
teal ibex
how about a stat that gradually decreases the volume of the weapons you're firing
because ranger could REALLY use something like that
ashen warren
agreed
how about a stat that gradually reduce the amount of lag cause by ranger weapons
keen geyser
that'd be too op for halibut cannon 
ashen warren
ranger armor increases drop rate for halibut
up to 1% from juveniles
at god slayer armor
civic pond
Make bullets invisible
jovial venture
make it easier to fire projectiles
make it so the guns are always active while holding them
hollow shell
Make bullets have no travel time, they're always hitscan-
wait that's just projectile velocity
lost agate
projectile extra update moments
hallow hatch
Or remove shredder
quartz hare
♾️
radiant meadow
make moon lord drop gravity globe in normal mode 
quartz hare
why not
bitter topaz
yea making the globe drop in normal is probably the better idea
it shouldn't have even been an expert exclusive item in the first place
night cradle
and it'd be not really harmful for balance
it was supposed to be a "fun" item anyway
more than being used for bossfights, in vanilla at least
tired haven
It's pretty funny that the globe has rainbow rarity and tentacle doesn't yet they both are expert exclusive
hot solstice
could we get a new summon minion from the eye of Cthulhu like the twins, but just the melee/biter one with lower dmg?
terse sundial
specific item suggestions are a no-go right now
quick ice
Tentacle is also more useful than the globe cause Light
wild yoke
actually, make the grav potion work with the ML lore, since even with said lore, NOBODY will use the gravity globe
left crest
just swap the effects of grav pot and gobe
raven moth
TL;DR: giving the buff from ML's lore item to grav pots will decrease usage of grav globe even more
Full Text: well, that's not really going to help the gravity globe, I think the point of that specific lore item's buff is to increase usage of the gravity globe, but allowing the buff for grav potions will result in LITERALLY NOBODY to use the globe... I actually am not sure the point of the lore item buff, maybe it was supposed to be related to the drop from the moon lord, and also, who still uses grav pots at that stage of the game anyway?
sand umbra
ML lore buffing Grav Globe was an attempt to make Grav Globe, the EXPERT DROP FROM THE MOON LORD, relevant in any capacity
raven moth
okay, thanks for confirming what I was saying
sand umbra
you said you weren't sure so I clarified
raven moth
yeah, and I am thanking you for that
sand umbra
ah
raven moth
I wasn't being sarcastic
sand umbra
it's always hard to tell in text
raven moth
yeah
umbral mulch
Petition to make grav globe obtainable prehardmode before any bosses
raven moth
it sucks
umbral mulch
As a very very very bad alternative to grav potions
raven moth
that's gonna straight up fail
sand umbra
petition to make Grav Globe the one able to flip in mid-air
umbral mulch
That's the only real time you even use gravitation
There's a few bosses that you can use it on
But even then you don't want to
Esp for the sacrifice of an accessory slot
So
Just make it obtainable prehardmode for the people really struggling to find grav pots
Only time I can see it having some practical use
sand umbra
uh-huh
no way to make being upside down with Grav Globe give you some neat additional stats or some other effect
no sir, that's stupid and the only solution is moving a thing that should be late in the game to pre-Hardmode just because something else that is found a billion times easier is better
umbral mulch
Well what do you think it should do
Even if it gives you 20% more damage people still aren't gonna do it
Because upside down platforms don't exist
Can't flip gravity in mid air with the globe
sand umbra
MAKE IT FLIP IN MID-AIR LIKE I SAID TEN MINUTES AGO THEN
what is getting lost in translation here
umbral mulch
And you can't make gravitation potions the one that you can't reverse because if you don't find a double jump accessory you're fucked and have to find a sky island somehow and then rope up
umbral mulch
The only reason I can think of why the grav globe can't flip gravity again is because it was impossible to code
umbral mulch
If you could've done it
lost agate
they could very well just copy the effects of grav potion i would imagine
umbral mulch
He probably would've
sand umbra
fun fact: Gravitation Potions were introduced eons before ML was even a thing
hollow shell
I assume the Gravity Globe being unable to flip in mid-air was some weird balancing decision
and yeah
sand umbra
or Expert Mode, for that matter
civic pond
i guess the tradeoff is that its "infinite"
lost agate
accesories and potions kinda behave similarly
sand umbra
so if it was impossible to code then why, pray fucking tell, can Gravitation Potions do it
civic pond
infinitely useless
sand umbra
hollow shell
Very similarly
lost agate
both activate a bool to do stuff
umbral mulch
I can't imagine a single rational human being that exists that would purposefully make the moon lord expert mode drop a worse gravitation potion
hollow shell
Well cuz when it was first introduced, it wasn't a Moon Lord Expert drop
It was unobtainable
and they just
plopped it into his loot table without changing anything
sand umbra
I mean, this is Red and company we're talking about
Terraria's design logic is...questionable at best, more often than not
lost agate
sdmg was in fact also an unobtainable before
the difference was that the thing isnt expert locked and its a clear upgrade to megashark
some unobtainables just got axed
i think there was one that was like a reference to frostmourne
hollow shell
mhm
Unimplemented Lunar tools and Red Potion are still stickin around
The latter I assume because of a joke and the former will prolly go away in 1.4
lost agate
yeah maybe
raven moth
actually, I think the "unimplemented lunar tools" have been implemented, are you referring to the hamaxes?
devout seal
he's talking about the drills, probably
raven moth
oh, there were drills?
hollow shell
Drill, Chainsaw, Axe, and Hammer
Assumedly unimplemented just cuz it'd be redundant with the existing tools
You only need a pickaxe and hamaxe
raven moth
yeah
jade escarp
astralgeddon slime added back as a miniboss
swift wadi
Astrageldon was a mistake, he's staying gone
grizzled stone
Not gonna happen
swift wadi
He's been officially replaced by Astrum Aureus, and he's not gonne be in the mod again
umbral mulch
F for Astrageldon
ashen warren
dude stop babbling about astrageldon
grizzled stone
It's in the Don'ts anyway, so it wouldn't be accepted
ashen warren
i mean it's annoying ig he has been babbling about it since yesterday
grizzled stone
If you want to see astrageldon slime, then watch some old calamity playthrough. That's all
raven moth
probably for the Exxo Avalon throwback
ashen warren
his reason for wanting it back cuz he never got the chance to fight it
grizzled stone
It's a slime...
sand umbra
mfw the only reason anyone ever wants anything back is to fight it 90% of the time
this makes me pensive
swift wadi
@ terry add astrageldon to Apoth and Friends so we can just tell these people to get that
lost agate
Even terry doesnt want astrageldon
green pumice
burnt thanos marshmellow deserves to die and be forgotten
ashen warren
isn't astrageldon in apoth and friends already iirc
sand umbra
no
swift wadi
I couldn't find it in the mod when I was fuckin with it, but you could be right
sand umbra
Burnt Thanos Marshmallow is not in Apoth iirc
which should say something considering the exact same mod revives He Who Shan't Be Named
seriously just fight Aureus he's way better 
sand umbra
||yes||
gusty geode
Just gonna point out
None of the requests to bring it back say anything about removing Areus
Considering Astral Slimes exist
All it really needs is a simple resprite to fit in with the modern AI
And then you could have it, as was suggested, as a mini-boss
sand umbra
I mean yeah
gusty geode
Remind me again what the problem is?
Rn it looks like
"Hey, this scrapped boss has a following even after its removal, still fits thematically, and while it's too simple to be a boss, maybe it could be re-added as a mini-boss?"
"No fuck off"
sand umbra
because there are already 500 slimes in this game
because the entity itself was entirely too simple, most likely
although I wouldn't be against having a much larger Astral-themed slime as a miniboss as a general concept why do you think one is planned for EE
queen sail
Probably because the new concept for the fight didn’t fit with the boss itself
Or smth
Which is weird considering that part of it is just astrageldon but less jumpy and spammy
Also probably for lore reasons even though entities like Siren and Levi exist
lost agate
The problem is that we scrapped the boss for a reason
You dont just bring it back
And by the way respriting just means more time, for just a simple what if we bring it back
And not to mention we may need to do the ai all over or change it a lot
To the point its not even the same boss anymore
And astrageldon is humongous for a miniboss
And the fact theres an astral slime doesnt mean there needs to be a bigger one
Nobody gave a shit about the boss when it existed
I could go on but i would rather not
grizzled stone
It's pretty self-explanatory anyway, it was removed for a reason. So there is no reason to bring it back. That's all there is to it.
lost agate
TL;DR astrageldon wouldnt even work as a miniboss
So if youre saying its just nonsensical "fuck off" when someone wants astra back, its not
I can give a list of reasons if youre still in the impression it is
hollow shell
@outer tusk It'd be a good idea to mention you mean Providence's guardians
(you don't mention her)
hallow kraken
No
tepid root
thats kinda weird
outer tusk
ik
i just reached her on my 3 playthough and its kida anyyoing that i cant focus down the healer
hallow kraken
Because of the way guardians charge makes dodging them during some attacks (cough cough antiheal flames) dumb
frank stratus
Oh, I had a small problem with the guardians today because I couldn't see where they were
ashen warren
First, srry for bad english
Idk why is a lot of people suggesting for nerf post-plantea bosses
And nobody talking about moonlord
Do you think ML is harder than ravager goliath, etc?
Someone*
hollow shell
Moon Lord is hard, yeah
He's supposed to be hard, though. Final boss of Hardmode, big milestone boss.
sand umbra
ML is supposed to be hard
that doesn't make the bullshit pulled in the base fight any more acceptable mind you but like he's the final boss of the base game
tepid root
i think ml is currently pretty good in rev
especially with the changes that happened a while ago
sand umbra
yeah the Rev+ fight makes it way more bearable
and arguably makes it infinitely easier
hollow shell
(I'm currently getting my ass kicked...)
potent veldt
He's more legitimate than before
He's not as difficult, but before it was more difficult out of annoyance
queen sail
ML’s difficulty came out of the fact that his attacks had no sync
queen sail
I think infernium and maso make the eyes sync iirc
ashen warren
uh whats maso again
tiny rose
A seperate game mode like revengeance from fargo's
opal barn
Uhh, people scroll back and send the suggestions that reached above 90 to the dev server @copper flame
radiant meadow
and the dev server is exactly where we keep those suggestions
copper flame
Oh
opal barn
It just takes time because people have stuff to do
copper flame
Ok
void kelp
@upbeat tapir that’s already planned
potent veldt
bamboozled
terse sundial
I don't even know what that suggestion is asking
upbeat tapir
read it
upbeat tapir
well sorry
void kelp
It’s basically saying “make clam a stand-alone game”
void kelp
“make a game that isn’t calamity”
terse sundial
I'm deleting since things like that are planned, kinda
upbeat tapir
"Calamity is good practice, use it make something similar but unique"
ok fair enough
since they are already planning that
i wasted my time talkin about that, huh
upbeat tapir
nothing in info... .__.
void kelp
Oh no I meant to read info to know what suggestions are for
upbeat tapir
oh sorry youtuber crabbar
civic pond
i mean to be fair
bobbit worms are stationary for the most part
a buff couldn't hurt..?
void kelp
maybe not drag the player but attack faster tbh
tired haven
Well, bobbit worms in calamity are also likely a tad bigger than RL counterpart
potent veldt
Size in terraria is already screwed up everywhere, that part is unfixable
civic pond
For the most part they're extremely easy to avoid
potent veldt
Well its mainly the speed thing that's odd
Since, that's almost the entire point of a Bobbit Worm
void kelp
tbh the speed thing is the only thing that I would think is an important change since rn it really is just weird slow worm
basically a clinger without the cursed fireballs
what if it got an attack pattern where it springs at you from a fixed point
queen sail
Wait do they not launch themselves at the player before retracting
void kelp
I don’t think they do it quickly if at all
sly gale
is a stealth meter a good concept?
void kelp
I would think so! are there accessories that display your current stealth level?
sly gale
no
green pumice
it's been suggested already
sly gale
i see
green pumice
but its been quite a while so you can try ig
sly gale
alright
hollow shell
Something on-screen would be better than a tooltip like our current stat meters
So you can know what stealth you're at without needing to rely on visibility (such as when you're near NPCs)
If it was an accessory/item tooltip it'd be quite useless in combat
void kelp
👍
I think UIs are hard to program but I know thomas has been able to get one working, and thorium has got one working for hard stuff
**bard
night cradle
yea
It'd be pretty useful if it was informational accessory kind of thingy
void kelp
I feel like a visible stealth gauge will also help make rogue more differentiated from throwing
but I’m unsure on how difficult that would be
hollow shell
Honestly I'd like if there was a config for you to have visibility, a meter, or both
because I would like to... see my character
Granted, you don't go fully invisible
but, I like vanity
sly gale
rover, can i take one of your phrases to add it to the suggestion?
hollow shell
Sure thing
void kelp
weaponout (lite) making it so that you’re just a floating weapon
sly gale
any counter argument defending the stealth meter would be the meters of adrenaline and rage
both of them can be tracked by their respective noises
so technically, you dont need them.
lost agate
cough
void kelp
if you play muted you have no way of knowing aside from a visual
sly gale
same thing with rogue
void kelp
hi shucks! how possible is it to make a visual meter on the screen similarly to how thorium’s bard has those gauges
sly gale
the very same way how rage and adrenaline have their own meters
lost agate
UIs are definitely possible, we have two lmao
void kelp
oh, is it possible + easy enough to do?
void kelp
tbh I think adding a visual would help a lot especially because some people play muted like I do so I rely entirely on visuals
oh! I was talking about your experience w UI earlier thomas
sand umbra
granted custom UI is entirely doable
but it's beyond stupid and so am I
that said, given enough time one could absolutely allow a rogue stealth meter of sorts to exist as a UI
(and it'd help greatly with the expression of how much stealth one possesses, which is a plus)
void kelp
it would be pretty cool albeit probably a bigger PITA than summons
lost agate
I mean
sand umbra
UI is on a whole different level
lost agate
I though i would never make a summon
void kelp
since you’re a dev shucks I assume you got some idea of how it could be done !
lost agate
But now i just made whats probably the most complex summon alongside mechworm
queen sail
Honestly, visual stealth meter would be qol more than anything
void kelp
scal
lost agate
Its a matter of learning
void kelp
is it by any chance the summon you mentioned that did three separate things at once
lost agate
Also that was termi who said it
void kelp
right, more like independently of one another ? sounds really freaking cool
queen delta
Ooh i like the idea of bobbit worms doing something unique
lost agate
You call those trappers
hollow shell
They're Golem Fists.
queen sail
Yeah that’s what i thought
wooden wedge
sly gale
its not the lack of materials that he has
its the "retrive the once-was-jungle in no time at all" business
ashen warren
Because you need the jungle for a lot of stuff
I could build an artificial jungle but I shouldn’t have to do that, especially if it’s just to fight Yharon or smth
sly gale
you just need a small patch of jungle to fight yharon
sand umbra
mfw people failing to remember that Calamity makes Jungle even more necessary than vanilla does
gusty geode
Obscure fact: Chlorophyte does this
sand umbra
sly gale
you dont need to build an entire jungle to fight him
because when you summon him on the jungle, he creates an arena automtically
so, he doesnt get enraged if you leave the jungle
as long as you are within the arena, you are good
gusty geode
I shit you not
Chlorophyte ore converts all nearby dirt into mud
It's really cool and nobody seems aware of it
ashen warren
My point being it’s a whole biome that can be converted and is extremely difficult to reverse. Also does the chlorophyte thing on the surface too
insert asking where reasoning is
gusty geode
Probably ye
terse sundial
@spiral niche Literally over 80 new rogue weapons have been added to the game over the past 6 months
with more on the way
spiral niche
Good
hallow kraken
Meme suggestions are banned
sand umbra
isn't the next update/patch bringing in a bunch of them
terse sundial
mhm
sand umbra
also it's. not really a meme
terse sundial
it's not a meme
sand umbra
rogue was lacking weapons for the longest time
spiral niche
It wasn't suppose to be a meme suggestion
terse sundial
but it is redundant
hallow kraken
very little detail
sand umbra
it's fair for some peeps to not know of the recent major work to expand on rogue
terse sundial
it doesn't need to exist because that's that plan to being with
gusty geode
There's another equally big issue here
I imagine I don't need to say it
But nobody seems to care about it besides me and a couple others
spiral niche
Yea I didn't know that we are getting a expansion on rogue class
sand umbra
summoner expansion will come in due time, squid
everyclass has gotta wait their turn
gusty geode
Ik ik
sly gale
The rogue class is something that requires more technique. Normaly with other classes, damage is very optimal. But with rogue, its not that BAD, but its not THAT good. So, you're kinda underwhelmed by the bosses, forcing you to adapt/make techniques to avoid them and deal damage with what you have.
But thats my opinion. The weapon we have been given are nice and they work. What needs to be good is our skill.
spiral niche
Actually no
green pumice
i would say false
spiral niche
For now
green pumice
there's a lot of weapons that do fine without stealth
spiral niche
Everything before moon lord
green pumice
also stealth requires you to stand still which is ech
spiral niche
On just revengce
sly gale
well i didnt mention stealth
sly gale
Yes
sand umbra
sly gale
Stealth is kinda useless
without extra damage and rogue stats by it, technique is more required.
lost agate
Summoner is already getting stuff
spiral niche
Like for example the upgraded paladin hammer destroyed the sea version of desert scourge (forgot both names)
ashen warren
I dislike that stealth replaces many unique Rogue set bonuses because it’s so neesh
hollow shell
Stealth before Dark God's Sheath is useless.
Now that I have DGS I can actually use stealth and I'm actually having fun
sand umbra
my man Rover out here spittin' straight fax
sly gale
damn rover