That thing
#suggestions-discussion
radiant meadow
they don't want a buff I think
west prairie
Then there we go, helium flash is probably pretty good as is
queen sail
Like
cloud surge
There's no point
queen sail
Did you skip past my “SDMG vs Celebration” comparison earlier 
hearty yew
helium flash was best for mage vs. yharon p2 when it released
contingent on you knowing how to aim it
since I rewrote defense/DR to use correct math instead of broken math since then (making DR weaker) and yharon's defense was reduced, both of the rapid fire options (voltaic + alpha ray) are now stronger vs him, so they are probably better now
radiant meadow
alpha ray and voltaic have limited range in my experience
queen sail
Wouldn’t another example be Helium Flash vs its upgrade
radiant meadow
helium flash is nice for not having limited range
hearty yew
helium flash doesn't have an upgrade
queen sail
Vivid Clarimeme
hearty yew
vivid clarity uses it by force of including every single staff
radiant meadow
vivid is not an upgrade
radiant meadow
it just uses helium flash
hearty yew
it's the one weapon which is famous for being useless
hearty yew
in any case yeah i acknowledge helium flash may have fallen behind alpha ray and voltaic due to defense/DR changes, but that's okay because it is still definitely viable
queen sail
...somehow ignoring the other 20 staffs built into it 
tired haven
fab flips out rn I can feel it
hearty yew
so, what's the problem with helium flash?
is it not complex or flashy enough for a weapon at its tier?
radiant meadow
not like other exo weapons are any less to blame of not taking all their components into account
except photo because well, it's very simple
queen sail
If a weapon doesn’t suit your fancy because it doesn’t make you look like a shonen protag then that’s a moment
mint mantle
Can Someone fix the Wiki About Daedalus Armor?
It currently says that it requires Crystal shard and essence of eleum in addition to cryonic bars to build armor, which isnt true
It only requires cryonic bars
tired haven
Update your mod
mint mantle
I last updated it like 2 weeks ago
radiant meadow
a new update came out like 3 days ago
hearty yew
@proven tide oh by the way never speak for the devs again thanks (now that i'm reading the chat history)
we have taken the alt. luminite suggestions seriously we just haven't acted on any of them because they haven't met priority list and take non-zero effort
queen sail
Oh no wait you’re outdated
hollow shell
Yeah iunno where you got the impression that the devs weren't going to do that, Vetus
It's not in the Don'ts, and we have indeed discussed it in the dev server
hearty yew
alright
i read the whole discussion on helium flash, turns out I only missed a few things
tired haven
Well, the fact that about a dozen of ways were sent but none were considered, I suppose
Which is imho a fair assumption even if a tad rushed and absolutized
hearty yew
Imo the Helium Flash should have an attack that has something to do with Helium
Please read https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helium_flash
Helium Flash sounds like the name of a balloon bomb thing from the Party Girl
See above answer. This article is also linked on the Calamity Wiki page for the weapon. It's just a cool name that's space themed.
Helium Flash needs a lil
buffrework
I'm all ears, but as said earlier, it's strong versus Yharon P2 though it can require some tricky aiming.
If something needs to be reworked about it, be specific in the suggestion.
tl;dr on the wikipedia:
"This produces a flash of very intense helium fusion that lasts only a few minutes, but briefly emits energy at a rate comparable to the entire Milky Way galaxy."
radiant meadow
it doesn't need a dps buff at all
hollow shell
Yeah its DPS is not the concern
Its the function
The function being a bigger Inferno Fork that deals more damage..
hearty yew
Ok, what does Helium Flash need to do that it doesn't do currently?
hollow shell
Nox does provide a few ideas in his suggestion
hearty yew
let me look at those 1 by 1
hollow shell
Such as: Homing, more useful debuffs, more projectiles (possibly black holes with gravitational properties)
radiant meadow
making it inflict ichor would require it be nerfed
since unlike melee and rogue, mage has to use another weapon to apply ichor to yharon
I don't think homing is really necessary though
hollow shell
(This is why suggesting specific ideas is not recommended in a suggestion)
(They can get in the way of the suggestion's concept.)
hearty yew
The bolt had slight homing
I could do this, but I actually like it being a magic sniper rifle that you have to aim manually. Maybe I could give it sniper zoom out!
The bolt inflicted ichor
Why ichor? What does that have to do with an unstable miniature sun? And yeah, Irradiated and Daybroken do nothing versus bosses at the tier, but you gotta recognize every single debuff that isn't Ichor/CI is thematic flavor versus all post-ML content. Helium Flash just follows the trend.
Every 3rd shot fires a black hole
Black holes are cool, but editing boss movement is explicitly illegal, so we can't implement that.
hollow shell
See?
hollow shell
Hello
hearty yew
Hi nox I'm here to talk about helium flash because I want to know what about the weapon feels unsatisfying or insufficient
ashen warren
My current problem with the Helium Flash is simply that it's difficult to hit Yharon effectively with it because he moves so fast. That is all. Other than that I have no quandaries with it.
hearty yew
Gotcha. I do acknowledge the weapon is kind of like a sniper rifle and requires precise aiming
I take it you want to give it more utility to offset its difficult aiming trouble?
ashen warren
Thing is most of the damage is from the explosion but Yharon barely ever stops moving to be hit by it.
Yes.
hearty yew
and/or address the aiming problem directly by giving it slight homing
ashen warren
Mhm
hollow shell
mm, a lingering explosion isn't very effective on a target that's always moving
ashen warren
I love the Venusian Trident and I really want to use the Helium Flash in it's place in progression but it's just difficult to hit Yharon with.
hearty yew
well, I can assure you that helium fhash's damage is vastly overtuned at the moment to make it viable vs. yharon p2 and enemies that sit still in it take absolutely stupid damage, higher than exo weapons and even some of the weaker dev weapons
try sitting still and blasting ravager or crabulon with multiple stacked helium blasts in BR
radiant meadow
I never had issue aiming
hollow shell
How about this:
The bolt doesn't home, but the explosion does.
hearty yew
( honestly the fact that yharon p2 is constantly yeeting about at 180 mph severely reduces the viable weapon space versus him )
i was thinking that rover
what if the explosion stuck to enemies
hollow shell
That would help it keep its difficulty while making it more worthwhile to use
ashen warren
I guess it's probably about circumstance, I'm playing with a friend and Yharon is targetting them so I'm trying to stay away and help them but I can't get Yharon with the Helium Flash so I've been using the face melter.
hearty yew
oh yeah, multiplayer? definitely, HF will be ugly in MP
because you can't even predict yharon's movement cause he isn't moving relative to you
radiant meadow
multiplayer yharon is kinda ugly ngl
ashen warren
(you probably don't care but we beat it 10 minutes ago for the first time together)
hearty yew
I do care
Helium Flash's capabilities or lack thereof negatively impacted your game experience
You were let down by an item
now that being said you were using it in quite possibly the situation in which it is least effective
a single shot, slow weapon versus an extremely fast and unpredictable target
ashen warren
Despite what people say, I've enjoyed Calamity much more with a friend than solo.
hollow shell
^
hearty yew
i guess you're really happy right around now that i fixed the yharon enrage bug lmao
otherwise you wouldn't be beating him at all
vocal grotto
Laughs in coldheart icicle
hollow shell
It's a shame multiplayer is such a bitch to balance/bugfix for that we often ignore or disregard it
(even though the last several playthroughs of Calamity I've done were in multiplayer because it's simply more fun...)
ashen warren
I didn't know there was one, yesterday we got close (15% on p2) but then both died.
My friend has never played Calamity before and we're doing revengeance and their skills are very impressive for a beginner.
hollow shell
oh good lord I am very thankful the enrage bug is fixed
ashen warren
I was more waiting for the thing he does at 1% where he just spams all his attacks at once to end you
quick ice
Multiplayer calam is fun
hollow shell
I did a normal mode playthrough with a friend a few months back because he wasn't the most well-versed in Terraria
and the difficulty spike from DoG to Yharon was absolutely ridiculous, because he always 1-shot us
and then it plummeted back down for SCal
ashen warren
The most issues we had with Yharon wasn't Yharon himself, it was the fact we were using weak weapons from the tier because our computers couldn't handle the good weapons.
hollow shell
Sad exo hours
ashen warren
So it was a long fight.
hollow shell
(actually wait exo is a tier above)
ashen warren
I asked about a low particle option here a couple days back but somebody said vanilla already has that but I checked and it doesn't.
hollow shell
Quality setting
has some effect on particle count.
And we are currently working on reducing particle a bit
or at least making most/all weapons and projectiles no longer exclusively particles, if they are.
ashen warren
That would be fantastic, thank you. Alluvion and phangasm are literally off limits for lower end PCs right now
especially with vanquisher arrows
hollow shell
Vanquisher Arrows are the big PC kill.
hearty yew
to be fair
we did that global -90% lag thing
which helps a lot
the only thing we can do better than that is to reduce total dust and reduce dust which gives light
basically reducing total light sources in computation
ashen warren
Is there anyway to have stuff offscreen not rendered but still functionally there?
hollow shell
I've gotta assume that's already the case
or else you'd be rendering every single block and light source in the world at once, which would tank your FPS all the time
zealous ridge
if im honest, my least favorite part of all of my full calamity playthroughs were the yharon fights
its usually hours or days that im grinding him and the fight just feels so tedious
zealous ridge
zealous ridge
long isnt even the problem for me
its just so... samey
and the longness contributes to it
queen sail
Yharon rework when
queen sail
||Bc atm he still gets memed on for being Fishron’s/Betsy’s Revenge EX||
zealous ridge
his AI is similar to that guy, yes
but honestly, i see a lot of wasted potential
like this awesome dragon phoenix's most threatening aspects are ramming into you with a sort of counting minigame incorperated in, some long gyrating fire pillars and really slow fireballs
queen sail
Honestly
For being a fire dragon i kinda expected him to have more
Than, yknow
Fireball and flarenado spam
hollow shell
Do y'all just want him to have Betsy-esque fire breath?
zealous ridge
what do you mean by that? like her fire breath attack?
placid girder
Idk how you would make him distinct from other fishron type bosses
hollow shell
Yay, reprogramming and redesigning the whole boss
zealous ridge
im not asking that it be done immediately, or in the way i describe
but i think the amalgamated fishron ai contributes to the fight being somewhat samey
quick ice
Betsy fire breath would be cool for Yharon
hollow shell
I'm sure the fact that you fight the same phase twice is the main contributor to that feeling
zealous ridge
i also feel like i dont see the boss enough
like im focusing on a little map icon and counting 90% of the time rather than focusing on the boss's would-be interesting attacks
hes quite disjointed besides his charge
hollow shell
(I haven't fought Yharon in a while. What're you "counting"?)
zealous ridge
dash cycles
first subphase short short short, short short long. as an example, dont have it off of the top of my head
hollow shell
I see
zealous ridge
something that might help that is teleporting and not always doing the dash attack
hollow shell
Because he's impossible to approach while he's doing a series of dashes, right?
zealous ridge
because of his IMMENSE contact damage
the best way to dodge and keep him on screen is to fly upward and dash perpendicular to him every time he charges you
you dont get hit and he just flies off to the side of you
its a cool maneuver, but you're not always in the best spot to do it
hollow shell
This seems like something you could suggest.
Making him dash less often, so that you can spend more time getting closer to him and so the fight feels less samey and less of a count-fest
(rather than suggest the whole fight be reworked)
zealous ridge
whole fight being "reworked", at the very least over a longer period, would still be something i support
but i would be fine with suggesting something like that to help it in it's current state
lemme cook something up and see what how it works out
hollow shell
👍
zealous ridge
Jungle Dragon, Yharon & Movement Dynamics
Yharon's fight is one that I and many other people dread. I think this is for a myriad of reasons, but for today I will be suggesting a change that could potentially fix one of these problems.
As we know, Yharon is a fast boss. He kind of has to be, in order to catch up to players with the running boots and wings available to them. However, such a focus has been placed on the dash-attack-dash-tornado formula that the fight feels tediously simple, while at the same time being annoyingly difficult due to his massive contact damage. Additionally, the fight focuses less on the actual boss, and more on the counting of dash cycles and general positioning of the boss relative to you regardless of where he is on the screen, resulting in a focus on the silly map icon that keeps track of the boss across the arena.
My suggestion is that Yharon's non-dash phases be extended and more unique in order to break up the monotonous pacing of the fight as it stands currently. Additionally, teleportation should be introduced earlier in the fight, at the very beginning, even, in order to encourage interesting movement patterns on the player's end.
Why would this help? Well, it retains the aspect of counting dash cycles and keeping track of Yharon's positioning, but now the boss and its... beautiful sprite get far more screen time. Additionally, the boss would be granted new opportunities for interesting attacks in the non-dash phases. Examples would be Yharon spinning around you and spawning some fireballs, forcing you to move in between the gaps, or straight up flying above you and spraying Betsy flame breath, forcing you to fall down to avoid the attack. it would break up the fight immensely, and offer up more interesting dodging situations that would make the fight worthy of it's current "final boss" title.
alrighty
hollow shell
I'm not sure I agree with teleportation coming in earlier, but overall the suggestion's good
zealous ridge
what about the teleportation is iffy to you?
hollow shell
Teleportation is an aspect of difficulty, increasing his unpradictability and mobility
It makes sense that it comes in later to progress the fight
getting harder as it goes on
radiant meadow
teleportation definitely shouldn't be in sub 1 and 2
sand umbra
teleports at the very end of his chain in sub3 might be good for higher difficulties (Expert+ mayhaps?)
zealous ridge
oh yes that is a good idea
radiant meadow
split sub 3 into two more subphases 
zealous ridge
teleportation has to be balanced in an interesting way, regardless
sand umbra
tbf I'd be cool with higher difficulties giving more substantial changes to bosses in general but that's a whole different beast
I'll get into it eventually, but not right now
zealous ridge
you must not make it unfair, but rather give him the extra mobility where he needs it
queen delta
Yeah i fully agree with this suggestion besides earlier teleportation
zealous ridge
I want yharon to be on screen more , is my deal
queen delta
Yharon is just very boring until sub7+
zealous ridge
perhaps the more unique non dash phases already help enough
queen delta
Yharon definitely needs more than just dashing
sand umbra
more unique non-dash phases would definitely benefit the fight overall
queen delta
P1 is pretty much only dashing
sand umbra
his main attacks are...dashing and spawning fatass tornadoes that take up half your screen
zealous ridge
i hate the tornadeoes
sand umbra
sounds kinda like another boss we know, doesn't it--
zealous ridge
they add very little to the fight
queen delta
The tornadoes are lame
queen delta
Theyre just oversized things that think they make the fight more intense but really dont
sand umbra
also Fishron's 'nadoes don't devour half your arena
zealous ridge
but no these things are literally just walls
sand umbra
that's the big thing, Yharon's 'nadoes are enormous
I seriously think the fight could benefit from the size of those things being toned down overall
zealous ridge
im more rip the band aid off than anything
queen delta
These tornadoes are just way oversized and should really be made more smaller but have something new
Like shooting stuff
Like sharknadoes do
zealous ridge
remove them and re- incorperate them in a more interesting way
sand umbra
fun idea I came up with just now: Yharon's 'nadoes are smaller, but occasionally shoot fireballs towards the player similar to LC's (NOT identical! just similar)
queen delta
Difference: they move at supersonic speed and home in as strongly as chloro bullets
sand umbra
or just emit fireballs/fire projectiles in general so it's not just a fatass wall removing your arena space and ruining your strategy
queen delta
People will wish for old infernadoes then
sand umbra
that alone would probably make the fight way better because then they'd be
manageable
as they are they're way too big and ruin basically every strategy and the only way anyone knows how to mitigate that issue is to lead them into the corners of your arena
except if you're losing such a large amount of much-needed space of your arena from a common attack in the first place, there is something seriously wrong
because that's never accounted for with Yharon's attacks
zealous ridge
imo they add little to the fight and take away too much
your mobility is neutered bc of them
and they arent fun to dodge at all
fly up
winning strategy
sand umbra
this is why Drew's Wings were busted for Yharon's second phase
because flying upwards is the only correct fucking way to dodge them
and Drew's Wings had, by far, the best flight height of anything obtainable at that tier
zealous ridge
they even look ugly to be honest
the big one just splits into segments and its gross
sand umbra
that too
zealous ridge
but yeah, what would be a good way of fixing it, then? no point in complaining if there isnt a good solution
sand umbra
I was gettin' to that
zealous ridge
fireballs are okay, but the tornadoes still kind of walls. and the fireballs add more unpredictability and frankly might even limit your movement in the same way
sand umbra
some ideas:
- Infernadoes throughout the fight are much smaller but no longer have gaps at all
- Infernadoes emit fireballs on occasion in Rev+
- Yharon doesn't spawn Infernadoes as often, opting for other unique non-dash attacks to vary his moveset
sleek hamlet
Suggestion, Half the rate of Flamenados and have them inflict the Sandstorm wind effect towards it
zealous ridge
- Yharon summons a tall, non damaging tornado at the center of the arena, and Yharon hides in it for a little while, activating some bullet-hell esque attack for a short while (phase two, late phase attack)
zealous ridge
not sure what those abbreviations mean but im assuming its late phase 2
zealous ridge
okay
sand umbra
it's basically from...I think about 65% until 15% or so
zealous ridge
well, ill leave the tornadoes to you, Thomas, if you're so inclined
or would you be okay with me adding them to my sugg?
sand umbra
oh I'm perfectly cool with you mentioning these things in your sugg
zealous ridge
i worry it might make the whole thing too bloated
perhaps ill ask for a tornado rework later lol
i think ill stick with make his movement more interesting and less samey
the tornadoes are a different beast, so to speak
sand umbra
boss sugg 
for once, I didn't miss it
but I don't really like it
there's no flavor, no taste, no real passion poured into it
the baseline is there, it's just...very blank
I give it a 3/10, because a 3 seems generous enough.
@ some mod I guess lole
zealous ridge
thomas's "generous" boss rating system (tm)
sand umbra
I want more Snow biome content as much as the next guy but like
br
I really oughta come up with Snow stuff eventually
sand umbra
I totally support more fun and actually optional post-ML fights though and seriously think they need to exist at some point
more on that eventually™️
teal ibex
tbf most post-ml stuff is optional under the context of yharon being final boss
but that context is not really a heavily revered one so
ashen warren
@tawny wind Boss suggestions aren't allowed, read the suggestion don'ts in the pins for info on what is/isn't allowed
placid girder
polter kinda optional
sand umbra
I mean, most major post-ML fights are basically necessary either way to keep up
Calamity's post-ML power curve is steep, especially so post-DoG
placid girder
p sure you can do dog with pre polter gear as summoner
sand umbra
well yes
teal ibex
i think the lowest you could do is moonlord > one of the first three > polter > yharon
sand umbra
because lamps exist
teal ibex
or maybe a sentinel that's true
sand umbra
lamps just eat everything I'm pretty sure
zealous ridge
the power gaps are large enough that the average player kind of does need to fight most if not all post-ml bosses in order to succ eed (unless you're summoner, as it seems lole)
teal ibex
just do a surface signus fight, lamp polter, then banshee hook yharon into the stratosphere
zealous ridge
fair
placid girder
also ngl like
sand umbra
banshee hook
placid girder
on an unrelated tangent why arent sentinels death mode spawns
sand umbra
the literal chaddest weapon in the game
zealous ridge
love that thing
sand umbra
capable of actually retarded DPS spikes on literally everything
zealous ridge
although imo its sprite is not as nice 
sand umbra
quick ice
Underground Ceaseless void would be nice
teal ibex
well not so much on DoG
which is what it's intended for
so it's hyper viable
but banshee hook's core weakness is actually just irrelevant to the yharon fight
thank you discord very cool message ordering
quick ice
sand umbra
ahh
teal ibex
it doesn't really go anywhere
luckily, yharon comes to you
DoG on the other hand does move quite a bit, so banshee can't deal super duper lasting damage
which keeps it in line with the rest of stuff for the fight
sand umbra
and then I wager Yharon just flies right into everything
sand umbra
that is amazing
teal ibex
it's still not better than other things at tier but for a low% run it's the absolute king imo
quick ice
Alternatively, use the drill with an auto-clicker to dig your hell-avator and use the 100 stone to make some bricks to make it look good
You won’t remove the fall damage but it’ll get the same result without adding in a cheap item
sand umbra
ebonstone brick is better imo
paper plaza
im putting that in suggestions because HELL(avator), THAT HAS SOME PVP USE, DROP THAT BITCH AND ANYTHING WITHIN 10 BLOCKS FOREWARDS OF WHERE YOU CLICKED IS FALLING!
quick ice
Terraria is not a pvp game
paper plaza
but it can be!
sleek hamlet
I’m just feeling sorry for the little dwarf, he gets no love in any mods I’ve seen, lil guy needs content
zenith hazel
isn’t mining like a big part of the game anyway
vocal grotto
^
zenith hazel
trivializing something too much isn’t Fabsol’s cup of tea
hallow kraken
Isn’t this game’s moto “Dig, Build, Explore”
tawny wind
There ist luiafk for Things Like this
sleek hamlet
Why not just buy 999 dynamite and make a ton of explosives blocks to make your hellevator
zenith hazel
calamity trivializes things, sure, but not to the point where it requires no effort or patience whatsoever
simple hamlet
You would need to dig the helevator to put those explosive blocks down, right?
zenith hazel
an instant hellevator is just lazy
tawny wind
You can use an crystyl crusher for quick hellevator
hallow kraken
post scal
tawny wind
Yes but i only say its the one only quick hellevator possibillity
sleek hamlet
It’s simple nez, Dig, plant, dig, plant until it’s all wired, push the Angler in it and Bobs your uncle it’s a Boom
hollow saffron
imagine needing hellavators post-scal after you have probs made and wired up teleporters and have the astral arcanum
use luiafk ok.
hollow shell
I would appreciate if you didn't react exclam every suggestion that gets posted, Xult
@tawny wind That suggestion could be worded way better
It's a bit of a mess as is, even if short.
hollow saffron
tbh rover i only do it with suggestions that i dont like
if i like a sugg i will star it ofc
and in this specific case the suggestoin was hyper confusing
"Ive got a Suggestion about some Post ML or even Post yharon enemies for the old ones Army and maybe even new items or items at the barkeeper" sounds like theyre asking for permission to post a suggestion
not like an actual suggestion
not to mention that there is absolutely no reason given, but why should there be when it doesnt even appear to be a sugg imo in the first place
hollow shell
Yeah but you put it on the prior two suggestions as well
The exclam is not a dislike button.
If anything it's a "I don't think this is a valid suggestion" button
There are plenty of suggestions that are valid but one may not like
in which case you just don't star it
@paper plaza That's a specific item suggestion. Specific item suggestions are not allowed.
It shouldn't have a name, it shouldn't have an exact recipe, and you shouldn't specify exactly how thick the walls shold be or what material they're made out of
Luiafk already adds a hellevator item (and a few other mods)
but if you want one in Calamity then make the suggestion more general then that, and also you have to provide a reason
paper plaza
oH
hollow shell
Something like "Add an item which instantly creates a hellevator when used, because..." is valid
but "Hellevator Drill: An item crafted with 100 Dynamite that creates a hellevator with 3-block thick Grey Brick walls." is not valid
runic heath
also Fargo's and I assume luiafk have similar items
hollow shell
indeed
runic heath
the biggest difference really would just be the 3 block thick stone walls which I assume are just there to prevent world evil/pure spread
which seems to be the general purpose of the suggestion anyways.
but yeah there is no reason for calamity to add one since it doesn't strictly add anything to the game that couldn't reasonably be achieved manually. Which while arguably you could get some of craftable accessories, those can actually just not spawn if rng is really bad, or in the case of sandstorm in a bottle/shiny red balloon they could not exist or there could not be enough of them.
brittle lagoon
ah yes
hearty yew
@hollow shell oh fuck do you want me to stop reacting exclamation on suggestions that don't make sense, aren't well formed or that I don't think follow the rules?
I don't react ! on just anything I dislike, it's like an error message to me
hollow shell
It's okay to put it on suggestions which are invalid or bad in terms of suggestion quality, like as a mesasge of "This needs moderative attention"
but it shouldn't be put on whatever you or anyone else disagrees with in terms of what the suggestion is for, what its concept is
That's how I use it anyhow, and it makes more sense considering it's what the grey exclamation signifies
cuz some people just use it as a "disagree" button
which it shouldn't be.
@paper plaza @tawny wind So uhh, are you gonna edit your suggestions?
Cuz if not they can get deleted.
hollow shell
Alright
shadow's needs some rewording to be clearer & more understandable
and also it needs a reason added to it
void kelp
oh, i do the same, I ❕ suggestions if they're not valid
cobalt rose
we should just add a reaction to suggestions if we think they're invalid or need more work
ebon mortar
! Is For ?
hollow shell
You're technically not even supposed to react to it at all
civic pond
h
hollow shell
but people do it because it looks like the opposite of a star
when it ain't
its just an automatic thing
hollow shell
(indeed)
cobalt rose
we could just resolve the situation with a new reaction i guess
hollow shell
(although very confusing to anybody not versed in programming)
hollow shell
There will not be a dislike reaction
civic pond
wasn't it concluded that it would be abused in some way
void kelp
imo a dislike reaction promotes toxicity
ashen warren
actually thomas you said the exclam mark is not equal to not a star, which would mean it is a star 
civic pond
that too
cobalt rose
what about a "needs clarifying" reaction
civic pond
well thats why we just ping them here
sand umbra
hollow shell
Yeah just ping em
civic pond
@ person please clean up ur sugg
sand umbra
either way, you get the point
civic pond
done
sand umbra
to put it simply, ❕ is not the opposite of ⭐
can we please stop treating it as such
thanks
void kelp
yeah, i dont think we need an additional reaction when we can ping people
cobalt rose
well i guess what i said here was fucking stupid, im gonna leave now before i fart out more braincells
civic pond
and thomas's comment is in vain, for people are going to do it anyways lets be honest
void kelp
maybe the legend should be updated to emphasize that ❕ is not star
civic pond
its ok xvader
sand umbra
legend?
civic pond
i thought the same 
hollow shell
Reaction Legend
civic pond
LEGENDS IN THE PINS
hollow shell
pin
civic pond
what are pins?
sand umbra
^
civic pond
terse sundial
hollow shell
There, edited the legend
sleek vector
add here ?
wooden wedge
to the actual suggestion
zenith hazel
no biome suggestions please
plush locust
Did we have an influx of new people recently or something
hollow shell
Biome suggestions are not allowed
plush locust
I bet pewdiepie did this
zenith hazel
read the “suggestion don’ts” doc in pins
hollow shell
^
wooden wedge
yes, because of pewds
sleek vector
Ok
hollow shell
Biomes are huge content commitments and we've already got enough content planned for Calamity
civic pond
wooden wedge
b
hollow shell
oh boy
zenith hazel
that sounds incredibly tedious
especially when you’re trying to make it to the ocean early-game
sand umbra
gotta make it to the Ocean for my good pal Sequence Break Shark
hollow shell
He didn't use the word "biome"
so it could be considered a structure
sand umbra
...oh and Urchin Stingers ig
spiral arch
maybe it could have like a mine going throught the bottom where it was at ground level
zenith hazel
but is it necessary?
zenith hazel
like what purpose would it serve?
civic pond
perhaps you could discuss your idea in this channel beforehand
hollow shell
Well its bein discussed now
spiral arch
ill just remove it sorry
hollow shell
Alright
spiral arch
Im going to make a concept build of what I mean it will take a long time
hollow shell
Ok
sleek hamlet
Honestly I’m surprised that my small suggestion got as much support considering I’ve not really thought of what he’d sell
zealous ridge
small things like that are easy to understand and star, methinks
and it seems logical, so why not?
simple hamlet
The world can always use more things that go boom
sleek hamlet
Perhaps hellfire arrows and explosives blocks after WoF, and Mining Charges after Moonlord that just breaks Ores?
It pains my heart that the only reason I need to talk with Gimli is to buy 999 Gunpowder
zealous ridge
he sells hellfire arrows already after WoF
but like after wof why use hellfire when there's holy
sleek hamlet
I mean, holy Bullets are GLORIOUS with Infinity- But those are the only reason I go to demo- they use explosive bullets which need gunpowder
sand umbra
in the end, we all want more shit that blows up
there is no such thing as too many bombs
calm onyx
A bomb with a radius greater than dynamite sounds like yes.
sleek vector
Will it be a good idea to have an item like "Custom Lore pack" ? :p It will be like flying piggy bank but it will provide all the bonuses of the lore items that are placed inside it. Since in late game keeping all the lore items in the inventory takes a lot of space. Also it will be customizable so we will be able to add/remove different lore item buffs as necessary.
hollow shell
That falls under a Suggestion Don't
The balance of the lore items is that they take up a lot of space.
It's like accessory slots
How much do you value your inventory space versus the bonuses of the lore items
That's the think
sleek vector
Oh. I see. Ok then.
spiral arch
Here is the mountain idea I had I didn't spend to much time on it because I doubt it interests anyone else.
zealous ridge
certainly interesting
but doesn't fit in calamity, per se
like, the basis of the idea is solid, if a little underdeveloped
but i feel like it would be too much of a time sink, plus the surface is really not open real estate atm
hollow idol
its Calamitas' old home
zealous ridge
yeah but
hollow idol
yeah no more surface structures
zealous ridge
its big enough that it could be considered its own biome, imo
hollow idol
especially a giant one like this
zealous ridge
i mean, the dungeon is technically a structure
spiral arch
I was thinking it would be more tall than wide really so it wouldn't take up that much space on the ground more of the sky
zealous ridge
which doesnt have much real estate either, in all honesty
like, there's the planetoids, which might be hell to code around
and the floating islands
spiral arch
zealous ridge
what about conflicts with other mods?
spiral arch
I dunno about other mods I pretty much only play calamity
quick ice
Calamity isn’t meant to be played with other mods
spiral arch
Thats what I was thinking its already a huge mod it doens't really belong with other massive content mods imo
zealous ridge
doesnt really change the fact that people still do it
and plus, it doesnt even need to be a major content mod
quick ice
If people do it than they deal with the consequences of having multiple content mods that affect world-generation
zealous ridge
alright, it seems im in the minority
quick ice
Except Thorium since there’s Rev-mode support and one of the new fish can drop Thorium gems
zealous ridge
where's the why to the suggestion, though?
zealous ridge
...because it would be cool?
hollow shell
Do not post all those images in #suggestions-voting @spiral arch
fierce mulch
No stop
zealous ridge
yeah it messes with the star system
spiral arch
oh okay sorry
hollow shell
That's not the reason
It's just because it's spam and pushes every other suggestion about 4 miles upward
hollow shell
Linking to #suggestions-discussion in your suggestion doesn't work either
because an image of your sugg is delivered if it reaches 90 stars, and the devs won't have that context
A doc would be best
but
this is incredibly specific
and we don't really need this at all
quick ice
Problem with docs is that people don’t like reading them
hollow shell
It's better than the other options he's tried so far
quick ice
Also yeah, as cool as it is it’s an unnecessary idea and the devs won’t implement it if it manages to get 90 stars
zealous ridge
the way i see it
why implement new structures when we can do so much with what we have now?
spiral arch
I mean I was just trying to give some idea's though that was kinda what the suggestion chat was for guess I was mistaken
quick ice
New structures would be cool if they’re small
zealous ridge
suggestions is the more formal realm for actually getting stuff in the game
space is important there
feel free to bring your ideas here, if you wish, as space isn't really required here
spiral arch
Im confused on what you mean why is space important in that spot?
zealous ridge
might bury suggestions that should get stars
hollow shell
Only so many suggestions can be fit on the screen at once in #suggestions-voting
If you post 8 images in a row, all other suggestions require a whole lot of scrolling up to get to
spiral arch
I thought you wwas talking about space on terraria
zealous ridge
oh no lol sorry for not being more specific
spiral arch
Not text space on discord
quick ice
Ruined houses in the Sunken Sea since it used to be a kingdom, ruins from Daedalus’ old city and new shrine variants are all ideas for potential new structures that could be implemented and not be too invasive on the world like a mountain
hollow shell
I don't think that's the SS lore
I thought the Desert and Underground Desert was Amidias's old kingdom
and the Sunken Sea was just some deep aquatic caves that were too far from the surface to get evaporated
quick ice
It might have been the Underground Desert that was the kingdom, I just figured it was SS and the Underground desert because Amidias was in the sunken sea and the Scourge guards the sunken sea, implying that he’s defending the old kingdom
void kelp
the whole guards part isnt really confirmed, just a dokuro music title
hollow shell
mm, I see
void kelp
iirc the sea itself is supposed to be literally, part of the old ocean that sank too deep underground to be razed
but everything in the sea isn't exactly the same ocean since there's no new air in it, meaning everything there is slowly dying
quick ice
Yeah I just checked DS lore, I was wrong the underground desert was Amidias old kingdom
void kelp
hence, eutrophic
hollow shell
I don't think everything is slowly dying, I think everything is adapting to the reduced air environment
Sunken Sea isn't exactly desolate.
void kelp
tbh, i see it as things won't last as long as they would on the surface, but that's why most of the mobs there are passive to conserve oxygen
hollow shell
@tall furnace Already planned, and boss suggestions aren't allowed
tall furnace
Oh
hollow shell
Also he was never in the game
distant gyro
@spiral arch maybe it's better to link to the message directly, instead of pointing to a channel that will eventually get filled up.
Here's the link
https://discordapp.com/channels/225030931008847874/465195069406707722/649822779603943455
queen sail
cobalt rose
implying the LORDE was yharim
heady comet
what the hell
hollow shell
A doc would be preferable, Altix
tall furnace
He technically was in the form of THE LORDE
hollow shell
nah
heady comet
that suggestion is legendary
cobalt rose
the lorde was a meme
queen sail
The lorde was an ai fab programmed in two seconds
hollow shell
But it was a fun 2 seconds
spiral arch
Legendary suggestion kappa
queen sail
...that somehow ended up being taken seriously that it became the next “where’s scal” for dokuro
tall furnace
THE AMALGAMATIONE
queen sail
No
simple hamlet
@tall furnace Are... Are you talking about the lorde
tall furnace
Yes
hollow shell
I'll deleto the suggestion considering,
yeah
hollow idol
something something, apotheosis readds him
tall furnace
Yea
simple hamlet
Yeah, Grab apotheosis
hollow shell
Mutant Boss is basically Yharim tbh
tall furnace
Plot twist: Yharim is Cthulhu
heady comet
imagine deleting a historical artifact
hollow shell
Noxus or Xeroc would be Cthulhu before Yharim's that candidate
tall furnace
I guess so
cobalt rose
cthulhu exists in the calamity lore but he dieded
tall furnace
Isn’t moonlord Cthulhu though?
tall furnace
Id make sense because Cthulhu also has something to do with the moon
hollow idol
tldr
moon lord isnt cthulhu in calamity lore
he is in normal lore
tall furnace
Ok
hollow shell
Nobody likes normal lore.
tall furnace
Except p e w d i e p i e
spiral arch
i like normal lore
bitter topaz
normal lore is the kid sitting in the corner of the playground playing with sticks because he's stupid
hollow shell
ah
tall furnace
Normal lore is good but it sucks compared to calamity
simple hamlet
Calam lore is that Cthulhu was yeeted so hard into terraria, that he went splat, and became the crimson
tall furnace
What about corruption
hollow idol
calam lore says some old people made it
simple hamlet
A Microbial Entity
hollow shell
Corruption's a virus, a siikness
tall furnace
With age comes wisdom
hollow shell
much like the Astral I guess
two viruses on the world
anyway this is #lore-discussion
tall furnace
Let’s go to #lore-discussion
hollow saffron
@spiral arch just put it in your suggestion so i dont have to go hunting aaaaa
hollow shell
@sterile moon I have come with knowledge
in relation to your Flamethrower suggestion
Obtaining a Slurper Pole and then fishing in the Crags allows you to catch this
https://calamitymod.gamepedia.com/Dragoon_Drizzlefish
which takes a while
but it exists
hollow saffron
also rover i saw your reply earlier, fair point
spiral arch
I will i forgot @hollow saffron
hollow saffron
also shouldnt suggs actually say everything they are suggesting instead of requiring you to link to some other places?and shouldnt they not be omega vague? we need to define what a suggestion is, maybe even in the don'ts because invredibly vague suggs are about as useful as specific item suggs
ish im right here
hollow shell
Well the thing is
ish had like 8 images of what he was describing
and attempted to post em in #suggestions-voting
distant gyro
8 images big
calm temple
Would it be possible to lower the maximum height at which a meteor can spawn to stop them from spawning in planetoids?
distant gyro
That's interference with redcode ig
zenith hazel
keep in mind that brimstone crags are pretty dangerous in pre-hm, combined with the odds of getting a slurper pole, combined with the odds of actually catching a dragoon drizzlefish in the lava
so uh, g’luck
distant gyro
you can block cheese in crag btw
wouldn't call it cheese actually
building blocks is a valid game mechanic to fend off enemies
quick ice
Brimstone Crags aren’t nearly as dangerous as the underworld come Hardmode though
zenith hazel
don’t scryllars faze through blocks?
distant gyro
knockback is god
worldly saffron
Knockback has both saved and killed me
quick ice
Scryllars May faze through blocks, but they have very little HP when fought in Hardmode so they die way too easily
I made a suggestion about this a while back, but every Brimstone Crag enemy needs a buff in Hardmode to prevent them from dying so fast (This includes the Assassin, since the Scryllars are faster and can fly, not to mention have greater health or damage depending on the variant) and they should get additional HP after Providence so they’re a little harder to kill
tawny wind
Really good Idea
With the new mimics im totally for it
karmic stone
Adding cut content from Vanilla is banned
quick ice
It’s already been suggested many times before
karmic stone
But Zapinator and Lazinator exist so lole
tepid root
adding cut content from vanilla has been allowed for ages now
tepid root
if it wasnt, masomode wouldve had some problems
ashen warren
that's true
quick ice
The suggestions for adding in Astral & Crag mimics arent new, so either the dev team doesn’t want to add them or they’re working on implementing them later
ashen warren
i'll leave it in there anyways
radiant meadow
there's already an ice mimic
tepid root
ice mimics already have special items
distant gyro
Ice mimic itself has special items
ashen warren
it does? i completely forgot
tepid root
they exist, but not really
radiant meadow
clam buffs them iirc
tepid root
👀
sand umbra
I mean, just because they're buffed doesn't mean they're relevant
ashen warren
yeah by giving them upgrades
ashen warren
can't wait for celebration 2.0
sand umbra
Celebration's damage is legit doubled and it is still completely irrelevant to ranger play
quick ice
Alright folks, here’s a controversial suggestion
Make Despair stones drop Charred Ore post-Plantera, remove charred slimes:
Doing this gives the Despair stones a purpose other than bring a reskinned Angry Tumbler with a few drops that aren’t unique and gets rid of a boring enemy.
sand umbra
I see a Gungnir buff except Gungnir still has no actual reason to be used over the 12 other spears that do anything Gungnir can do and more
radiant meadow
brb buffing Gungnir to have the same base dmg as scarlet devil
ashen warren
you should put that in the suggestions channel bud
quick ice
No I’m putting it here for thoughts
sand umbra
a shame Starnight Lance will still beat it anyway because yes
ashen warren
i mean charred ore isn't all too useful
quick ice
I’ll put it in there if it doesn’t get destroyed
radiant meadow
unholy cores are very useful though?
ashen warren
anarchy blade?
radiant meadow
the weapons are quite good pretty sure
ashen warren
they're decent
quick ice
It has an ore slime so it clearly has some uses
sand umbra
Unholy Cores get you the sword of a billion pre-patch AEW deaths
radiant meadow
like brimblade, brimrose staff, and burning sea
sand umbra
...oh and also the Blood Moon summon and the Ruin Medallion for whatever those mean to you
radiant meadow
ruin medallion is most definitely useful for rogue. the stealth consumption reduction is good iirc
ashen warren
oh yeah
ashen warren
man i can't keep up with all these updates even though i try
you're given a fair share of charred ore to begin with imo
sand umbra
also Unholy Cores are used for one of the best furniture sets in the game
ashen warren
unless you're playing in multiplayer
sand umbra
so there's that
ashen warren
true true
sand umbra
(namely, the crafting station and lighting pieces of said set)
zealous ridge
the boring enemy in question is the charred slime, right?
quick ice
yes
ashen warren
slimes are boring though
zealous ridge
fair enough i suppose
ashen warren
it's kind of the point
quick ice
if we can get rid of ore Slimes and have a new, fitting enemy drop the ore instead we should
ashen warren
indeed
zealous ridge
despair stone isn't really new, per se
in fact, i believe it's older than the charred slime, no?
and yes, it is fitting, but adding a new drop to it doesn't necessarily make it less of a reskinned angry tumbler. I feel like that point detracts from the suggestion for being somewhat unrelated.
otherwise, I see the logic behind it, so good suggestion
quick ice
changed that, you're right mentioning that it's a reskinned Angry Tumbler wasn't relevant to the suggestion
ashen warren
a new sprite for the despair stone would be neat too
it's pretty outdated
oh wait
i just checked
nvm
quick ice
it would, but that's for the Art Server or the Development team to deal with
quick ice
alright, here's another ore-slime suggestion
Give Steller Culex the Astral Ore drop, remove Astral Slime
This would help to incentivize exploration of the Astral Underground to get additional Astral Ore, as well as provide a use for the Stellar Culex which as of now has no unique drops.
ashen warren
you should compile these suggestions into one imo
it's pretty similar
also very good
radiant meadow
stellar culex is the bat thing, right?
quick ice
yeah
radiant meadow
it drops from novas
since novas go boom
thematically, (like AI and stuff) novas make more sense to drop stellar cannon
distant gyro
Stellar Culex exists
sand umbra
where does Stellar Knife belong then
radiant meadow
aeries iirc
quick ice
Arieses
radiant meadow
the astral derplings
sand umbra
I know it drops from the bootleg derplings but like
the correspondence between these two things is very vague
quick ice
alternatively I could suggest removing the Astral Slime entirely, I just decided to change the drop for it since the Infection would infect slimes and it's a super old enemy if i recall correctly
sand umbra
Arieses bounce a lot, Stellar Knife is just ZA WARUDO
I love Stellar Knife though so eh, what the hell
radiant meadow
astral meteor heads died
distant gyro
I thought astral slimes were removed and unremoved
sand umbra
rip in pepperoni pizza
distant gyro
That may be another ore slime though
radiant meadow
chaotic slimes were removed
quick ice
yeah, they had their drops redistributed to the Devil Fish and Chaotic Puffer
by the way, having the Devil Fish spawn in Layer 3 would be a nice QoL change so people could get Chaotic Ore and Hellborn in the appropriate layer based on progression
distant gyro
worldly saffron
@ashen warren I think new mimics would be interesting, but it would also be extremely redundant. We already have Wood, Gold, Shadow, Ice, Corrupt, Crimson, and Hallowed mimics.
ashen warren
I suppose they could just be another rare enemy, they don't need to have any drops
they're a good mini-boss and i think it's wasted potential not to have more variants
hollow saffron
honestly i feel like atellar culex's could get a unique drop instead
maybe a pet or a summon
because if you remove astral ore from astral slimes then it ruins the consistency
like how cryo/perennial/bloom/chaos slimes drop cryonic/perennial/uielbloom/charred ore after a boss is defeated
sand umbra
We already have Wood, Gold, Shadow, Ice, Corrupt, Crimson, and Hallowed mimics.
I want to agree with you except
quick ice
I guess so, my logic for moving it from the Astral Slime is that it gives the Underground Astral a bit more value since it has less weapons than the surface
sand umbra
half of these mimics are literally the same fucking entity
and 3 of them share the exact same drops
(Wood, Gold, Shadow, and Ice are all the same internal NPC --- and of these, only Ice have unique drops)
quick ice
all 3 of the biome mimics use the same AI, so if there was a new biome mimic it would help to give it a unique effect
such as an Astral Mimic having an attack where it can rain stars from the sky or a crag mimic being able to summon Brimstone Fireballs
ashen warren
i'd suggest just giving the stellar culex it's own unique drop tbh
Also i added another reason to why there should be more mimics
zealous ridge
Already existing slimes? You mean mimics right?
ashen warren
sorry im retarded
zealous ridge
In any case, new mimics for the biomes would be interesting, certainly
zealous ridge
Although, quite frankly, I don’t think there need to be ones for vanilla biomes for the purposes of this mod
It feels beyond the scope, I guess. Calamity biome mimics would be better
signal prairie
quick ice
Jungle has enough content
runic heath
give the mimic fighter ai to make it more unique
quick ice
ah yes, truly a brilliant idea
anyhow, I just had an idea for a suggestion that'll never reach 90 ⭐ s since people don't read documents, but I'll make it anyways
quick ice
yes
runic heath
I mean yeah grapple hook progression stops, but at the same time late game grappling hooks really aren't used that much
quick ice
Patience Dr. Fetus, they only just did their first Grappling Hook a week ago
ashen warren
i like hooks
runic heath
then again I use dual hook 90% of the game despite it being super slow
ashen warren
i use diamond hook until i get illuminant/crimson counterpart
runic heath
but I also don't build a ton so there's that
ashen warren
then lunar hook
runic heath
but after a certain point I don't see like a huge point
since lunar hook is pretty fast and has 4 hooks, anti-grav I would imagine is great for building and maneuvering
but also wings exist unless you're doing defiled
ashen warren
hooks are good for other things than building
runic heath
early game is when hooks see the most use really because you don't have a lot of mobility
ashen warren
then lunar hook
it's great for that part when your wings just quite don't reach that platform you built too high
runic heath
I mean seraph tracers/drew's wings have really good flight time, but that is also end game
ashen warren
yeah
runic heath
and I do make use of hooks, but I guess I'm just not sure about how necessary more hooks are
ashen warren
post moonlord hooks would be greatly appreciated
runic heath
idk maybe I sleep on hooks since I am out here using dual hook
ashen warren
probably
runic heath
that's not a document that's a paragraph
quick ice
yeah I decided to cut some ideas
runic heath
I thought you were going to link a google doc or some shit
ashen warren
there was a suggestion sometime mentioning how the abyss generation should be improved overall
quick ice
there was, yes
runic heath
Yeah someone did some pretty cool builds with that
quick ice
yeah I remember that, shame that it's too difficult for the Terraria world-gen to generate a unique variant of that
ashen warren
not entierly
runic heath
as it stands it would be neat to have a bigger difference between layer 2 and 3 because as it stands they aren't that different?
ashen warren
i don't know about a lot of coding
foggy plover
Cant you fish up the abyss items?
quick ice
you can, but only the accessories
ashen warren
but i know it's possible to improve it at the very least
runic heath
save different enemies and increased breath loss/reduced light
quick ice
people have complained about the weapons not being in layer 2, if my suggestion was implemented it would guarantee they're in Layer 2 rather than in the bottoms of Layer 3
ashen warren
needless to say the abyss should be improved
runic heath
Yeah there could be some design improvements for sure
as it stands the atmosphere of the biome especially with the music is really good though
ashen warren
truly
runic heath
ngl I get pretty freaked out going down there cause spooky dark place
you'll never get me to play subnautica sorry
ashen warren
those reaper sharks ain't fun to accidentally stumble upon early on
quick ice
Layer 1 is negligible without anything but empty space, and layer 4 you usually just chill at the very bottom of it since there's no islands down there
runic heath
I remember playing like a year and a half ago and the bottom layer didn't seem to work right or there was an issue with spawning minibosses. Either way I just chilled down there with a zerg potion and a bunch of eidolists lining the floor
and the way light worked was different. Either way there have been improvements since then. Still the bottom should not be just a weird geometric dip
quick ice
I've considered making a suggestion to add multiple small islands scattered throughout the 4th layer, with one holding the Abyss shrine rather than it always floating at the bottom
gusty geode
Tbh I think a 5th layer at underworld level would be neat
runic heath
that could be a little whacky but sounds interesting
idk how functional that could be if it's actually in the underworld though because it might have trouble trying to override the underworld water evaporation
zealous ridge
This discussion brings up problems with the current abyss generation in general
gusty geode
You don't need to
From my experience if there's too much water the underworld can't seem to evaporate it
zealous ridge
I don’t know if it’s apparent but I don’t like the abyss for its subpar generation shenanigans
runic heath
eh the underworld will usually be able to evaporate it over time
it's generally janky to say the least
quick ice
It does, I drained the whole abyss and flooded half of the underworld, and it took 4-5 in game days to evaporate
gusty geode
Also
Keep in mind there's blocks generating water covering the walls there
Could just have the walls make water faster than hell can drain it
radiant meadow
how would you prevent someone from going to layer 3 early and snagging hm weapons?
runic heath
the weapons in the abyss are pre hm?
zealous ridge
Referring to the suggestion, roofon
gusty geode
You don't
If they survive among ML tier enemies long enough to get things worthwhile they deserve them
quick ice
Nah, he has a point
runic heath
ah I skimmed over that part my bad
zealous ridge
I counter
Layer 3 does not have many threats
Sure there’s some hm enemies and maybe a boss spawn
quick ice
Layer 3 is survivable if Colossal Squid doesn’t screw you
runic heath
with enough determination you could probably get it
probably not even that much determination
zealous ridge
but it’s all avoidable, is the point
radiant meadow
you could even go full meme and bring along something like eoc for boss zen 
zealous ridge
runic heath
king slime just vibing in the abyss
quick ice
Hm, would it be fine if I suggested a locked Void chest replace the shadow chests in Layer 3 and the Abyss Shrine?
radiant meadow
modded locked chests are kinda ech iirc
runic heath
no more pre hardmode terminus
zealous ridge
New keys and locks are kind of risky, remember when astral chest got cucked by a chest code thing in tmod?
vocal grotto
Not like you're gonna get anywhere in preHM BR
radiant meadow
is that a challenge?
runic heath
it was a meme but yes
quick ice
In that case, best option that I see is spawning a Colossal Squid or an AEW if you enter Layer 3 for more than 5 seconds
runic heath
yeah where is my no hit pre hm terminus smh
vocal grotto
Ben, no-
runic heath
idk about that cause like you'd just tip your little toe in there and then bam
quick ice
Gives you time to get out and kills anyone trying to get Hardmode loot
runic heath
although to be fair the light level change is an indicator I guess
queen delta
BR prime vs phm kid
vocal grotto
BR Prime?
zealous ridge
Imo that’s a shitty way to lock you out of an area
vocal grotto
4 armed dentist
quick ice
Hence the 5 second warning, because any more time than that may give you the necessary time to grab the items
runic heath
I mean the dungeon does that
but yeah it feels kind of ech
You could create a barrier that you have to use the RoD to get around
quick ice
I edited the suggestion to just have the items be unusable until Hardmode
runic heath
@ashen warren the astral infection doesn't spread
hollow shell
Krant, it might be a good idea to use the word "weapon" at least once in your suggestion, because I was confused on what exactly you were saying should be changed and what should stay
runic heath
let's ignore that halibut meme exists :p
ashen warren
okay im sorry im being big brain rn
radiant meadow
ye, it doesn't spread
runic heath
you're good
ashen warren
back to getting yoyos
runic heath
yoyo time
plantera gatekeeps yet again. Just after siren was removed from this gate keep smh
quick ice
Changed it, thx for the feedback Rover
hollow shell
That's better
runic heath
although to be fair one is supposed to go to the abyss post plantera anyways
sand umbra
or post-Clonamitas
runic heath
just make all of the chests locked biome chests
sand umbra
you know, the literal only advantage to fighting Clonamitas in the first place aside from like 3 drops from Clone herself, a couple flamethrowers from Cataclysm, and Crushsaw Cratashtrophe
ashen warren
bro i just want a good yoyo
quick ice
And you get a reskinned Blighted eye to spawn, don’t forget that
hollow shell
Calamity Eyes are post-Plant only, funnily enough
quick ice
I’ve never understood Calamity eyes, they just seem pointless when you have the blighted eyes
sand umbra
logically speaking, given their theme and the boss intended to be fought right before Plantera
shouldn't they be post-Clonamitas and act as a way of getting more Ashes of Calamity without going through the mildly-tolerable-at-best shitfest that is Clone's fight more than once
runic heath
meanwhile plantera unlocks abyss drops, ectoplasm, a new ore that is needed for bars of life, dungeon stuff, jungle temple
hollow shell
Calamitas and Plant are still kinda meant to be alts
Neither fought before the other
sand umbra
that's a good joke.
Plantera unlocks everything on the fucking planet and is easier than Clone by a wide margin
runic heath
just don't fight either and get ecto from aew lmao
hollow shell
Of course it's not direct
Much like the Calamity mech alts
Killing Cryo doesn't spawn Red Devils
runic heath
I just don't like how you can't kill mech alts and get mothron to spawn
hollow shell
(but it should)
sand umbra
Cryo unlocks Cryonic Bars and Permafrost
runic heath
ideally you should have to kill either mech alts or regular mechs or a combo of them to get mothron
ashen warren
cryo unlocks kevin
quick ice
Calamitas could just be swapped in progression with Brim, spreading the underworld bosses apart a little more
runic heath
or mothron could also start spawning after killing yharon phase 1
quartz hare
wh
hollow shell
Yeah Roofon that's been suggested before and should be a thing
runic heath
if killing alt mechs worked you wouldn't have to kill aew for low boss anymore but that's beside the point
hollow shell
Feel free to suggest it again so it can get ManyHaveSuggested'd
sand umbra
Brimmy is arguably better than Prime for unlocking Clonamitas (although if you want my honest opinion it should be a unique material rather than Soul Of Fright Meme)
and AS...
...I actually don't have much of an argument for AS
runic heath
Imagine having two worm bosses on the same tier
sand umbra
because both it and Twins are enjoyable, albeit to different degrees and for different reasons
sand umbra
^
runic heath
I am guessing the reason the mothron change hasn't happened is 1. it doesn't really matter that much or 2. redcode
sand umbra
it is possible to mess with spawn rates based on certain conditions
Mothron shit is NOT set in stone if you're willing to put in the effort to change it
hollow shell
I feel like it does matter and just hasn't been noticed/gotten to yet
but Redcode is a possibility that I haven't thought of
runic heath
I mean I imagine the first one is more likely
sand umbra
inb4 "b-but true night's bruh and that stuff for mechs is unbalanced!"
runic heath
since in the grand scheme of things it isn't a huge deal
you would still have to kill alt mechs or ideally be able to kill any combo of mechs/alt mechs to get mothron
hollow shell
True Night's Bruh is the new Apoth item
runic heath
or if it's a yharon case then it just prevents a mild annoyance if you happened to skip a mech
but if you could have a combo, and since most people get all 3 souls for pickaxe axe then that likely wouldn't be an issue
hollow shell
Helps speedruns
Low-boss-% yo
ashen warren
better rebalance mechs around being fought with terra blade
and since theyre stronger, buff all the hm bosses that come after too
hollow shell
Terra Blade is Post-Plantera you lummox
ashen warren
and since mechs could be beat then alts, buff the alts more
runic heath
well if you could do cryo then you could kill plantera instead of ravager and then AEW wouldn't be required
just buff the mechs and mech alts until the game is unwinnable obviously
sand umbra
and this is exactly why Living Shards are needed for Terra Blade
runic heath
I still don't really see the issue here though since killing the mech alts is also a challenge
sand umbra
something something Mechs are supposed to be harder blah blah blah
runic heath
you'd also have to kill at least one mech for excalibur to get terra blade
the alt bosses in general exist to be optional but also give the player boons for beating them
is terra blade really that op against mechs anyways? I haven't actually tested dps at all
sand umbra
yet there's almost no benefit to fighting anybody that isn't Cryogen before Mechs
you get exactly one set of weapons from AS --- plus outdated mats and an acc you probably already have --- and one very awkwardly set up drop pool from Brimmy
teal ibex
helps speedruns? 👀
runic heath
it would help low boss specifically because if you can kill cryogen + plantera you would have a way of getting ecto that doesn't involve kill AEW
sand umbra
they give you souls, yes...except a good chunk of the items that take souls of fright, sight, and might?
also take hallowed bars
quick ice
That’s because you should still kill at least 1 mech boss
runic heath
the ideal outcome for low boss would being able to freely swap out mechs and alt mechs to get mothron to spawn so you could 1. get pickaxe axe 2. be able to get life fruit.
teal ibex
just make the alt bosses drop an alt hallowed bar that turns into an actually useful armor set
ezpz donezo
runic heath
cryogen already does that
sand umbra
sand umbra
yes it does
it's the universally best™️ armor set for mech-tier Hardmode
and literally the only one for rogue
runic heath
daedelus has more defense than hallowed armor too
teal ibex
okay lemme rephrase
quick ice
They could just buff rework hallowed armor and make a Rogue/Summoner headgear
teal ibex
daedelus shouldnt count 
runic heath
the ranged daedelus armor only has 1% less crit chance and 20% reduced ammo consumption vs 25% reduced ammo consumption compared to hallowed
sand umbra
that's exactly how we ended up with the same four actually fucking relevant armor sets for late-game after lunar sets for EVERY SINGLE CLASS
runic heath
meanwhile it has 4 more defense, 3% more damage, and the crystal set bonus
teal ibex
i mean, some alternatives postml would be cool but also makes me fearful of something on the thorium side of things
it pains me how many random class specific materials fill my inventory when playing through it
runic heath
and actually I would like more unique armor sets in general. Summoner is really the only class that has unique armor for the most part