I've tried at least
#suggestions-discussion
gloomy hazel
severe burrow
true melee would be impossible too
hollow shell
(Vetus carroting everybody)
severe burrow
good luck doing true melee if you can only hit the head dude
gloomy hazel
ngl?
proven tide
Not gonna lie*
gloomy hazel
Mmh
ashen warren
you can still hitting the tail
hollow shell
Yeah, I usually target the tail cuz it's safer
severe burrow
the DoG fight is not easy, he fast, he hurt you big, he got lots of hp
proven tide
guess who never considered that
The DoG fight is tragironically harder in Normal/Expert
proven tide
Do you know how long it took me to discover DoG had two phases
hollow shell
What changes in Rev to make it easier?
proven tide
hmm
hollow shell
oh right Adren lol
proven tide
kek
hollow shell
I'm an idiot, I was thinking of items
proven tide
Nah nah, it's really just the massive damage boosts
severe burrow
okay but the punishment for getting hit is reduced in the easier modes
proven tide
with items less goode
hollow shell
Actually
severe burrow
then how the fuck is the p-
hollow shell
I may be missing something drastic
but
proven tide
correct me if I'm wrong, because I only know the experience, not the stats
hollow shell
No rev changes in damage
radiant meadow
doesn't rev have a dmg multiplier though?
severe burrow
wait wait wait how is death mode easier than normal
hollow shell
Not anymore I don't think
severe burrow
his head fuckin instakills
proven tide
adrenaline vore
alright what if the devourer of gods's presence was too overwhelmingly chilling to let you unleash your adrenaline's full power
hollow shell
Yeah uh wow
I think DoG is easier in Revengeance than Expert
ashen warren
only head
severe burrow
no
proven tide
like, yes, it's a boost, but not a nuke-a-third-of-the-health-bar kinda shit
ashen warren
No rippers in expert
hollow shell
DoG needs more Revengeance changes pronto
proven tide
hollow shell
Thots Cosmic Guardians aren't enough
proven tide
ashen warren
It takes a bigger brain to fight him in normal than in revengeance
severe burrow
uh
proven tide
hollow shell
Purple is Death Mode, Kitty
severe burrow
instant kill
proven tide
600+ tries, everybody
hollow shell
Red is Revengeance
severe burrow
i know the color coding
i've
inhaled that wiki with my eyes
long ago
a whole 2 weeks
hollow shell
Ok
proven tide
450K -> 720K (60% increase) when there's no bonus to the player
severe burrow
head instantly kills you
hollow shell
We're talking about Revengeance
proven tide
we're more concerned about rev atm
severe burrow
hm
proven tide
Get slapped by the head a couple times in normal and you're fucked regardless
severe burrow
then nerf DoG normal and expert
radiant meadow
normal is always easier than death
severe burrow
because i find the fight to still be a challenge even with the bullshit that is the anti-social mod
hollow shell
Dang, son
radiant meadow
then perhaps you have not learned the fight very well yet
proven tide
Well, it's 50/50 debatable regardin DoG but I'll take that up in the #suggestions-voting and see who agrees (after we break it down a bit here, of course)
hollow shell
You gotta get training in the hyperbolic time chamber
radiant meadow
or had a bad arena for the fight
proven tide
thank you rover
hollow shell
wew
severe burrow
because he actually forced me to make one
proven tide
severe burrow
so, imo, he's fine for where he's at in the game
yharons harder, provi is easier
polter is optional
proven tide
Again: 60% increase for Expert, 13% increase for Rev
proven tide
The huge leaps for Death are alright imo but rev is a real shitbag for the Devourer
hollow shell
Hm
severe burrow
i mean why is he hard in normal anyway
proven tide
Less than double its normal health when you can deal half a dozen times as much damage several times during the fight
radiant meadow
just letting you know that when testing weapons, it's done in rev without rippers
severe burrow
it's basically baby mode
radiant meadow
just because it's normal mode, that doesn't mean that later end bosses are going to be a joke
severe burrow
don't have to be a joke but
if rev DoG gets buffed death DoG would have to scale accordingly, no?
proven tide
Ya ya
dusty stirrup
Depends on the changes
proven tide
All damage inflicted on the head and tail of The Devourer of Gods is multiplied by 1.25.
How about we don't for rev
severe burrow
so just
radiant meadow
that's only in phase 1 pretty sure
proven tide
even so, it helps the fight
hollow shell
Lemme check
severe burrow
it also makes death harder
dusty stirrup
If it's health/dmg, we can make it so death doesn't get upgraded, if it's a new attack, it'll usually be in death too
hollow shell
Nope, it applies for Final Phase as well
severe burrow
just give him ripper resistance
radiant meadow
does final phase like have dr or something? 
DPS drops by a good 5-6k between 1st and final phases
hollow shell
That's the last ditch option
severe burrow
it is?
hollow shell
specific resistances and weaknesses
radiant meadow
resistance is something that is undesired
hollow shell
as far as I know about game design, you wanna avoid that
severe burrow
i mean i'd rather not be forced to not get hit at all
radiant meadow
afaik, only scal and brimstone hearts have resistance
hollow shell
to Celestus, right?
radiant meadow
hearts - celestus
scal - apoth and sons of yharon
radiant meadow
and enraged
severe burrow
imagine fighting DoG without godslayer immunity
proven tide
enraged is a buff in debuff's clothing, no?
radiant meadow
it's a debuff
hollow shell
Shellfish Claps surpass the devourer of gods
severe burrow
we could never have a weapon that deals more damage to targets based on their damage resistance
higher = more damage, in this case
proven tide
defeats the purpose of DR
severe burrow
it defeats the purpose of not having a billion hp
proven tide
100% dr can just be ignored
hollow shell
I don't think anything has 100% DR because it'd just be set to take no damage
severe burrow
yes
proven tide
fair
hollow shell
we've got 99.99% DR though
proven tide
> Up to a max of 5 shellfish can cling to an enemy, causing 2500 damage over time.
slate crown
hollow shell
Adult Eidolon and rev Dungeon Guardian
severe burrow
that's not a lot considering his DR
proven tide
that's more than soma m9
severe burrow
does each segment count as a different enemy to grasp
proven tide
it's on equal footing with demonshade and apotheosis
hollow shell
except Soma also has
gun
proven tide
clam then gun
It's a DoT effect not summon damage
No multiclass nerf
hehehe I shall abuse this 
radiant meadow
shellfish gets nerfed next update anyways 
proven tide
damnit
severe burrow
sad
proven tide
DoG page: see also: [page of removed content]
hollow shell
I'm really trying to fact check this shit because it does not seem like it should be the way it is
but it do
severe burrow
so do we balance it around ripper mode
hollow shell
I was referring to the shellfish
severe burrow
because my consensus from you guys is
proven tide
DoT, rather than a set speed, are given 150% accel
proven tide
150% accel and 70% DR on head and body
proven tide
this cannot go wrong
severe burrow
if you don't spam ripper (and by extension don't ever get hit) you lose
proven tide
not at all
proven tide
This is the DoTs not the DoG
severe burrow
he speeds up like a train
severe burrow
uh
hollow shell
They're called Cosmic Guardians now
severe burrow
guess i'll just kill them like i did before
hollow shell
because DoT means "Damage over Time"
which is especially confusing because we were just talking about Shellfish Claps
severe burrow
clap fish
proven tide
oh fuck yeah I have highest IQ idea
spawn DoU when normal mode dog reaches 99% health
radiant meadow
can you not?
proven tide
fair
proven tide
shitposting aside, Rev DoG needs a bit more of a jump from expert to compensate for rippers
severe burrow
actually..
radiant meadow
well, rippers are supposed to be an optional mechanic
severe burrow
mutilator
hollow shell
Rippers are on by default and they're the key feature of Rev
Can't balance bosses acting like they don't exist
severe burrow
it would make any challenge or preference against them a hell
don't like ripper mode? fuck you the bosses are balanced around it
radiant meadow
well, I don't really feel like arguing with Fab, so you can go tell him, Rover
https://gyazo.com/df47e459576cd8ed40ac40e89c9daba6
severe burrow
^^^^^^^^
hollow shell
Aren't rippers only optional for people who want a greater challenge?
severe burrow
considering that adrenalin is both much more potent and requires taking far less damage
hollow shell
You know what you're getting into by disabling them
proven tide
the mode is designed to flex about how the mode is so hard you need damage boosts so why the fuck are the bosses then made easy enough that the mechanic itself becomes a cheese
aa
radiant meadow
I don't know, but that's how I found out you're not supposed to use rippers when testing weapons
severe burrow
I think it's more to allow skilled and unskilled players to do better
if you're excellent at dodging you get adrenalin,
proven tide
inb4 why play revdeath when you're a noob
hollow shell
You see I would argue with Fab about it if it didn't mean I'd be arguing with Fab
severe burrow
if you can't dodge very well you get rage
proven tide
answer: trial by fire
severe burrow
you don't need to be a noob to struggle with dodging
i mean the point of rev is to make dodging harder
because the bosses are stronger
proven tide
Here's a way to fix this: right click with the rev item to disable/enable rippers
radiant meadow
I think the config is fine for that
proven tide
Nowhere near enough players touch the config
Making it a direct mechanic makes it seem more optional rather than default
proven tide
(weakening/strengthening the bosses to compensate could be optional)
severe burrow
if you don't care then don't bind them to anything
hollow shell
I'm beginning to question why the rippers are optional at all if they'd lead to such obvious balancing issues
proven tide
^
severe burrow
because it lets skill extremes thrive more
hollow shell
But just
don't use them
if you want a challenge
severe burrow
yes
hollow shell
Doesn't need to be a config
severe burrow
if you're able to avoid damage for a long time
proven tide
If I'm good enough to avoid damage for twenty seconds I deserve to skip a phase of this boss
what
severe burrow
uh
i've never deleted a phase with rage adrenilin
unless i was already deleting the boss
sleek wadi
I would love a mode that has the Rev AI with nerfed stats but no ripper.
proven tide
^
hollow shell
That's a bit specific
severe burrow
it is
proven tide
I'd just like an option to rev without ripper or buffed!Rev with ripper
severe burrow
"death mode ai on normal pls"
hollow shell
You can already get halfway there by disabling rippers
or, ideally
just not using them
proven tide
same for death
severe burrow
you can choose not to use ripper
so it's not a problem unless you're already struggling and want to progress
proven tide
Making no difference, because that's how it's assumed you play already
Choosing not to should be the choice
sleek wadi
I still think that despite what Fab says that the ripper has some influence over boss health mainly
severe burrow
uh
severe burrow
defining feature huh
hollow shell
Yeah pretty much
proven tide
yes
severe burrow
i guess deaths defining feature is being more harderer
hollow shell
Somebody make a suggestion to remove the Rage/Adrenaline config in order to fix Revengeance balancing
severe burrow
no pls
sleek wadi
Like, the boss health still needs to be larger than it normally would because otherwise someone dodges for 45 seconds and obliterates 50% of the health bar while skipping a phase.
proven tide
tadah
severe burrow
i mean if that person feels like the fights too easy and they want a challenge
they can just
not ripper
proven tide
fixed
hollow shell
I'd rather not have myself associated with that because I fear for my safety
proven tide
No that's shit
severe burrow
if they want to progress instead, just let them.
they won't win against SCal with ripper spam b
hollow shell
Thank you
sleek wadi
I bet if there was no ripper, rev and death would have smaller health bars
severe burrow
nah
proven tide
No
proven tide
That's part of the problem
proven tide
alright kitty can you please stop looping the same three points
we seem to be talking past each other a bit
hollow shell
You could bring up that Expert is harder than Rev because of Adrenaline
That's a pretty strong argument
ashen warren
So you want to remove the Rage/adrenaline?
hollow shell
No, removing the config to disable them
proven tide
I want to make them NON-toggleable
ashen warren
Oh that's even better
hollow shell
No I mean add it to the suggestion, Vetus
severe burrow
i mean the config has no reason to exist other than so you can prove you did something without ripper
in that way it's a good verification tool
but otherwise it has no purpose because the choice to disable them or not is in the controls
hollow shell
I don't see a situation where the config would be useful for proving whether something was done without them
in any useful capacity
A real man would have video proof, and using Rage/Adrenaline is very obvious with the sound, particles, and DPS
severe burrow
true
proven tide
tadah point is elaborated
severe burrow
tbh all removing it does is remove heart attack from play-
huh
now that i think about it
hollow shell
Thanks
severe burrow
you can't really remove the heart attack debuff unless you disable the rage mechanic
proven tide
tadah yet more yet more elaboration
severe burrow
tbh at best heart attack lets you survive one more hit
just one
but only sometimes
radiant meadow
balancing was still done without rippers before the config was added 
hollow shell
Why?
severe burrow
why not?
radiant meadow
I don't know
severe burrow
tell me, was yharon 1 easy for you?
hollow shell
Because balance is screwed now
severe burrow
im assuming you used rippers
hollow shell
The bosses in Revengeance were designed around the player having much less DPS
radiant meadow
tbf, rippers cause kill times to fluctuate and stuff
ashen warren
The whole purpose of removing r/a config is to balance everything in rev.
radiant meadow
like if I dodge good this time and then fail badly the next
hollow shell
That's why you do it multiple times
like a true science
proven tide
It should be assumed that your base level of skill isn't on the lower half of the bell curve if you're trying this.
This isn't balance.
It's pandering to the incompetent.
ashen warren
Thats.... the point. Skill is required to use adrenaline
hollow shell
But that skill is only rewarded in Revengeance
ashen warren
Correct
hollow shell
which is supposed to be harder than Normal/Expert
hollow shell
balance gotta be fixed
ashen warren
Yes
proven tide
but that reward is never addressed.
It's treated like it's not the FLASHY MAIN ATTRACTION OF THE MOD
hollow shell
Not getting hit in the harder mode already rewards you with not dying
proven tide
Some degree of that skill should be assumed as present when balancing this, goddamnit
hollow shell
not really
ashen warren
No
proven tide
not at all, because rage isn't accounted for either
hollow shell
I think the suggestion Vetus has is enough
It would involve rebalancing a lot of stuff in Rev
which will no doubt frustrate the devs
but
I feel like it's gotta be done if this mode is supposed to be the proper intended difficulty
severe burrow
but should press F to do damage really be the main attraction?
ashen warren
He has a point
sleek wadi
It is the main attraction because of how damn flashy and in-your-face it is
DR? Spicy defense
hollow shell
that's
thas not how that works
severe burrow
yeah but if you can't deal any damage without rage adrenalin you're gonna feel weak as fuck
hollow shell
DR isn't just defense with a different name
sleek wadi
New AI? Could've been done by just adding a harder clone if each boss, not enough to justify a new mode.
smoky wagon
dumpster fire
hollow shell
wait Spark I can't tell which side you're arguing on
severe burrow
yes having a new boss on a higher tier is no different than making the lower tier boss harder
hollow shell
I cannot discern if this is sarcasm or not
ashen warren
This is going nowhere
smoky wagon
same
novel pebble
Confusion
ashen warren
Is this even about a suggestion anymore? I left about an hour ago
hollow shell
It is
hollow shell
Because Dark Souls
ashen warren
Because people want a challenge. And dark souls
hollow shell
indeed
smoky wagon
darkeater midir wants to know your location
sleek wadi
Okay those points went nowhere. The DR point was because DR does the same thing as defense except percentage based and isn't enough to justify a new mode. But the rippers are easily the most noticeable thing and will serve as the main attraction even if other things are more important
severe burrow
I don't like the idea of relying on taking damage to deal damage
hollow shell
Yeah that's not the best argument
proven tide
yah yah yet more expanding to my suggestion
severe burrow
Rage is literally take damage to do damage if you think about it
proven tide
#suggestions-voting look at my highest IQ
hollow shell
DR is added on top of defense, not replacing it
Its addition makes the game harder, hence belonging in a higher difficulty mode
also I don't know if that's the best tl;dr Vetus because it doesn't actually include the suggestion in it
smoky wagon
idt players should be forced to use adrenaline in death or rev all the time in order to win
hollow shell
It should be "TL;DR remove the Rage/Adrenaline config in order to fix Revengeance balancing"
severe burrow
Regardless of mode you are forced to dodge dodge dodge on all modes
smoky wagon
i play death and im doing fine
novel pebble
Or go play dark souls 
severe burrow
You think SCal cares if you are on normal?
smoky wagon
its just dont think bosses need more hp to compensate for the mechanics
hollow shell
Better yeah
severe burrow
Vuln hex
proven tide
literally has in-universe replies to you being in normal mode
she refuses to reward a weakling
severe burrow
Oh wow
proven tide
it does make a difference
ashen warren
I feel like rage isnt all that great. It's easily overshadowed by Adrenaline. I mean, why do you have to get hit multiple times to deal extra damage? Where as having skill and experience rewards you with a damage boost.
severe burrow
So the game actually encourages you to play on expert
proven tide
Anyway. I'm out. My point's been made.
severe burrow
Laugh
proven tide
Y'all can loop around this a dozen times but I'm headed
hollow shell
cya Vetus
proven tide
Cheers on this, Rover
ashen warren
Alright vetus
severe burrow
I'm really against ripper balancing
proven tide
I know we clashed over 170 bees but I'm glad we're at least on the same wavelength lmao
We noticed.
Anyway cyas
ashen warren
Cya
radiant meadow
now for the suggestion to be sent and then most likely be ignored like 90% of sent suggestions
severe burrow
Quad boss health for press f to deal damage doesn't sound fun
hollow shell
it wasn't 170 until I stepped in 
severe burrow
170 bees???
hollow shell
And yeah it probably won't even get to 90
sleek wadi
It doesn't need to be quad health, but this amount of damage spike simply can't be ignored. Especially with how its presented
ashen warren
hollow shell
It might require the context of our convo to make sense
novel pebble
It's actually a very well thought out suggestion tbh
severe burrow
Tbh if you feel like ripper makes the bosses too easy just play death mode
radiant meadow
<insert death ripper melt meme>
hollow shell
If you feel like making ripper required would make the bosses too hard, play Expert
radiant meadow
hollow shell
also yeah rippers are super boosted in Death, too.
severe burrow
I want the rev items
ashen warren
Death is a meme tbh
smoky wagon
rippers shouldnt be the main focus of balancing
hollow shell
They should if they exist
severe burrow
I play rev because I want rev boss drops
hollow shell
They're a significant DPS boost
You can't ignore them.
smoky wagon
im not saying completely ignore them
severe burrow
Counter scarf is good and cool
sleek wadi
If you had to toggle Ripper on, then it'd make sense why the bosses aren't balanced around it. It would be an optional mechanic that very clearly screams optional. You'd NEED to opt in if the experience is too much without it.
hollow shell
(currently, we ignore them)
smoky wagon
yeah and it works fine
hollow shell
Well
not really
smoky wagon
isnt there a config to increase boss hp next update if you feel they die to fast?
severe burrow
I mean isn't the idea that you use ripper like in mgrr
hollow shell
because Expert DoG is harder than Rev DoG as Vetus has stated
even though Rev is supposed to be a higher difficulty mode
smoky wagon
then nerf expert bosses
sleek wadi
That feels like the wrong approach to this
worthy raptor
(Or buff rev ones)
smoky wagon
that works also
severe burrow
But we all play on rev
hollow shell
Well yeah that's what we're suggesting, lol
severe burrow
So that means
sleek wadi
Rev DoG is easier because it ignores ripper's existence despite the incredible spike
hollow shell
Again
Rev is a choice too
smoky wagon
the hp jump from rev to death is pretty steep
hollow shell
just because you want to play Rev
you don't need to, if it's too hard
severe burrow
But you miss out on cool items if you don't play rev
hollow shell
You git gud, you git rewarded
severe burrow
Play rev from the beginning
hollow shell
Normal mode Terraria players miss out on cool Expert drops too
severe burrow
Which is why most people played expert once it came out
hollow shell
(I still eat shit)
severe burrow
Like, i'd imagine everybody would pick expert if it said "exclusive boss drops" somewhere in the description
hollow shell
It kinda does
severe burrow
Guts and glory kid doesn't say anything specific
hollow shell
*Fortune
ashen warren
Normal mode is for building tbh, Rev+ is for casual Calamity play
hollow shell
I wouldn't call Rev casual
Late game bosses are still intense
severe burrow
I don't want the game to be harder than it already is because I feel challenged enough
Okay here's the solution
Rev mode does not turn on ripper by default
smoky wagon
maybe its just me but i dont really play the new modes for the meters which is why im hesitant to balance around them
severe burrow
Ripper is it's own mode toggle item
severe burrow
The description tells you to use it as a last resort
hollow shell
I would imagine all bosses have some degree of imbalance, if all bosses are balanced around rippers not existing
radiant meadow
because if it's only doggo, it's probably better to just target doggo
like I'm pretty sure scal is fine
sleek wadi
DoG has been a consistent problem child for a lot of things
ashen warren
^
severe burrow
He acts like a middle child
sleek wadi
Off the top of my head, Holy Collider is worse than Stellar Striker just because of him
severe burrow
His problems all stem from the fact that he's a wormy worm
sleek wadi
I'd imagine other worms have issues with ripper considering the amount of hurtboxes they have
severe burrow
Destroyer has pierce cap
hollow shell
Well
DoG only has 2 that matter
smoky wagon
dont most worms bosses have alot of health
radiant meadow
yes
sleek wadi
Pre-HM worms get obliterated by grenades regardless, so HM is the proper place to look
severe burrow
Destroyer is scarier than the other mechs now tbh
At least in rev
No healing, homing lasers and more lasers
Tanks like a mf
hollow shell
iirc all the mech bosses are scary in Rev now
and near-impossible in Death
Not sure if they got nerfed already or if thats in the upcoming update
zenith hazel
destroyer is a legitimate threat now, surprisingly enough
sleek wadi
I've had an easier time with PBG in rev than in expert, though I'm not sure if that's due to the Flame Scythe buff that happened in between playthroughs
severe burrow
Could also be because of your experience
PBG was hard first time around for me on rev
sleek wadi
It was first time on that mode for both playthroughs, I'm not sure if experience is the answer
severe burrow
I mean knowing how to fight a boss on expert helps for rev
Is fishron easier on Rev? ๐
sleek wadi
Wouldn't know, I always skipped the thing.
sleek wadi
Though if balance around rippers becomes a thing, great care should be taken in avoiding another BoC situation
Remember when rev BoC respawned creepers so damn much that adrenaline was practically required?
severe burrow
Balance around rippers would not be fun
Dealing no significant damage at all until you get adrenalin or rage sounds crappy
Forces that BoC situation tbh
Since you won't be able to progress unless you can get lots of rippers before you die
sleek wadi
It doesn't need to be THAT extreme. In fact, what could happen is that we could roll out a patch where balance around rippers is applied to one boss for testing/community reaction purposes. Say, DoG where expert ends up being more difficult than rev because of easy rippers
severe burrow
I mean why not first find other bosses that get easier in rev
Nobody has given a major example
sleek wadi
DoG jumps to mind immediately due to his problem child status and him being the main example in the most recent suggestion
severe burrow
Other than DoG, who else is easier in rev because of ripper?
sleek wadi
I'd imagine bosses that don't have particularly big changes
severe burrow
Yes you can use DoG as a scapegoat but if there's only 2 or 3 problem bosses then a system wide change is not needed
sleek wadi
Plantera and Golem don't change much in the way that you approach them, compared to say Destroyer who goes from worm to light show and changes the fight dynamic
severe burrow
Okay but is that rippers fault?
Destroyer got a big rework, that's why he's so different
sleek wadi
The fact that the don't change much means ripper could make the fights much easier due to sudden damage spiking
severe burrow
But does it?
lost agate
Uh not really
sleek wadi
From personal experience yes
lost agate
And most of the times theres always something added
Like tell me who doesnt get new extra stuff on rev/death?
radiant meadow
some are quite small changes
sleek wadi
Does new extra stuff include debuffs?
lost agate
Perhaps
sleek wadi
Because Calamitas literally just gets faster otherwise
severe burrow
Fishron is a nightmare
lost agate
Calamitas on death gets more bros
radiant meadow
calamitas also gets life seekers
lost agate
And that yeah
sleek wadi
Really? That isn't listed on the wiki page for rev changes
radiant meadow
ack, I'll go check it out 
lost agate
Didnt you say you knew from experience? >_>
severe burrow
Again I'd like to see another boss that's harder on normal than on rev
radiant meadow
wait, it's on there
lost agate
And i dont think any boss is easier on rev compared to normal
radiant meadow
lost agate
That would be stupid
sleek wadi
Oh. Its not on the main revengeance changes page
radiant meadow
added
pliant bone
Imagine laudanum at hardmode post-mechs
gusty geode
A boss might be harder on normal than on rev because you lose access to a ton of meta-defining items like the asgardian aegis
radiant meadow
except the bosses are much less punihsing
ocean moss
I want a rogue cheese weapon that's only redeeming feature is that it one-shots adult eidolon worms but makes them drop nothing
wide patrol
What would you associate exodium with? Like would you say it's related to aggression, or peace, or what?
hollow shell
It's definitely otherworldly, and of course has space themes considering it spawns on planetoids and crafts Starmada
Its original intention was that it came from the future or had some time-distorting property, hence why it was able to craft the Future Boss summons (now accessories), but that theme isn't really shown anymore
wide patrol
Sounds perfectly fine still
hollow shell
Alright
Why do you ask?
wide patrol
Exodium slime
quiet abyss
As another source for exodium clusters?
dusty stirrup
Exodium doesn't really need an infinite source as of rn, tbh
dusty stirrup
Many others did
wide patrol
Just thought it'd be interesting for a slime with post-ml looking power
How about an astral ore slime? What would astral ore relate to and what should the slime itself be called?
quiet abyss
"temporary ability alike to DoG's passive laser phase"
Might wanna phrase this a bit better imo
if ya meant the invulnerability period: "Can temporarily turn invulnerable" would be better
Cause with the way this is phrased, it makes it sound like this slime has a laser wall spam phase
dusty stirrup
Don't need an astral ore slime either
dusty stirrup
besides astral slime already exists
wide patrol
But it doesn't drop ore but ok
quiet abyss
Well, a suggestion along the lines of "make astral slime drops astral ores after astrum deus is defeated" wouldn't be too out of place
dusty stirrup
^
wide patrol
Just because I'm feeling like dumping my ideas into the pit of forgotten worthlessness
queen sail
Thats just on expert+ tho
Then again playing normal mode is for memes only so
Expert+ is the only canon difficulty
wide patrol
Remove normal mode?
queen sail
Remove normal mode to own the vanilla weebs
dusty stirrup
Oh right, you should also put the reason why you want exodium slime added, trashbox
ocean moss
Normal mode is just death mode now
dusty stirrup
wAIT
distant gyro
queen sail
:hmmm:
dusty stirrup
I got their pfps confused
wide patrol
I'll just keep drafting here
ocean moss
wide patrol
Exodium Slime
Spawn conditions: Post-ML, space
Abilities: Flight, temporary invulnerability
Drops: Money, Exodium
Why? ...
distant gyro
I mean, Exodium is already craftable
ocean moss
Absolutely necessary
wide patrol
Oh
distant gyro
Yeah, hence the no need for exodium slimes
wide patrol
Pillar slimes?
dusty stirrup
Astrum aureus
distant gyro
Aureus
wide patrol
Ugh
queen sail
You can just download soa if you want celestial slimes
wide patrol
IDK
queen sail
The new update added them
dusty stirrup
Did you get hired by slimes for propaganda?
distant gyro
Slimes, KS, and Slime rain suggestions are top suggs lately idk why
wide patrol
o
queen sail
For some reason
distant gyro
There's vanilla ore crawlers suggested iirc
queen sail
But crates and silt exist
wide patrol
Astral crawler?
queen sail
At most astral
wide patrol
Also rip my silt suggestion
queen sail
Since astral ore only comes from the meteors afair
dusty stirrup
I mean you can spawn multiple meteors anyway
distant gyro
^
dusty stirrup
One meteor is usually enough
queen sail
True
But if i want multiple iโm too lazy to go get my ass to check the map and find it
bitter drift
@ashen warren you should type here wot you are suggesting for criticism
zenith hazel
sounds like a fun idea for guardians to finally get some attention
marsh gust
hm.. generally youd avoid suggesting 2 items in one post and avoid giving stats but that seems fine to me
bitter drift
it OK you don't have to just a suggestion on your suggestions 
zenith hazel
i see guardians as some sort of mirror to bumblebirb, dropping some pretty minor stuff but act as preludes to much bigger boss fights so it's cool that the guardians are also dropping weapons
so yeah, the guardians deserve the birb treatment ngl
bitter drift
me like Prothaind guardian suggestion
i just talked like an idiot
quiet abyss
Kinda wanna ask:
Combining a scarf and a shield turns it into...another scarf? The shield is just gone?
Granted, this is Terraria where some crafting recipes don't really make too much sense, but I'm rather curious
frail mantle
Wh
bitter topaz
can we not spam emotes please?
sinful violet
Adir that's enough
bitter drift
i typed a comment with these emotes
elder kestrel
@bitter drift you just recently got unbanned from suggestions, please don't mess around in here and put more quality into your suggestions; don't push your luck
bitter drift
ah sorry
elder kestrel
Aye it's fine, just something to keep in mind
bitter drift
still any criticism on the suggestion
frail mantle
tbh the main thing iโd want from a Post-Golem summon weapon is something that can actually be decent against Fuckron
warm tinsel
I actually liked adir's suggestion, we do need some balance.
I wanna fight the chicken balls for power, not to get a goddess immediately
Also yes, a decent summon post-golem Vs.Fuckron sounds good
bitter drift
yay :D
arctic wren
Yes, it does sound good
zenith hazel
reason: WHO WANT A GOOD SUMMON WEAPON FOR DICKFISHROM
wat
marsh gust
a viable summon weapon to fight fishron with ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ when worded a bit better i guess
zenith hazel
ok then...? pretty good idea
ashen warren
hornet ai being good against fishron? 
marsh gust
probably not 
zenith hazel
minion ai being good against fishron? definitely not
bitter drift
exploding bug will be good at fishron? better then anything alse
marsh gust
xenostaff, its hitscan
bitter drift
you like Marsan invasion?
marsh gust
im just stating the existence of xenostaff
zenith hazel
or you can just skip fishron entirely and fight cultist with entropy's vigil, which still works
bitter drift
@marsh gust try to kill it with the xenostaff it's a pain in expert let alone death mode
marsh gust
im in my attempt of killing it wingless balloonless ripperless armageddon death
zenith hazel
killing fishron with a summoner weapon is a pain in any difficulty tbh
ashen warren
time to do 11x fishron
marsh gust
sure then i'll switch my gear to summoner, wont affect me much anyways. gonna continue my attempts after i find out what is eating my laptop's ram
fossil torrent
@ashen warren Thatโs not very specific at all, doesnโt say very much or any details, and thereโs also no reasoning. if you could elaborate a bit more, thatโd be fantastic nice name btw
ashen warren
A quest system similar to the fisherman's quests where you need to kill X anount of a certain monster, cut down X amount of trees, or get X item from mining or random drops and then turn in the item for rewards like potions or rare materials.
earnest raptor
@marsh gust
Bruh im in my attempt of killing it wingless balloonless ripperless armageddon death
Just unequip all armor, accessories and pets.
And don't use any buffs.
๐
marsh gust
well if you can proof that its possible then i will
earnest raptor
When adir will make a good suggestion?
Also, Plague summon weapon is frequently suggested thing.
hollow shell
Quite frequently
tired haven
Technically, Dreadmine is good against Fishron ai but like, lol
hollow shell
actually hang on did I put it in the Donts?
yes I did.
@bitter drift Plague summon weapon is in the Donts due to the fact it is so often suggested
zenith hazel
but srsly, minions can be effective in the fishron fight when they don't dick around with the sharks
hollow shell
especially one for a plagued hornet/charger
fossil torrent
@ashen warren You should elaborate in the actual suggestion, and not in here
bitter drift
i looked and didn't see a plague summon suggstion
ashen warren
Means ya overlooked it
zenith hazel
bitter drift
oof
tired haven
It was cannon btw
arctic tapir
So like why no plague summon weapon
tired haven
Canon*
arctic tapir
I get that itโs recommended a lot but like is there another reason
void kelp
mostly redundant Iโm p sure
bitter drift
the reason that everybody ask for it but never star a plague summon suggestion
void kelp
no. itโs because itโs asked so often itโs basically spam
bitter drift
well maximum if we want a good summon that isn't plagued theme we can do a prototype ravager
FOR DICKFISHRON
fossil torrent
lore cannon: shoots uncomprehensible amounts of text at your enemies
clear basin
lore cannon lmao
marsh gust
i guess great knowledge comes with heavy responsibility.. its heavy hitting too
bitter drift
XD OOF to much text
arctic wren
lmao
Lemon Juice, make a list of specific mirrors with specific recipes if you want any hope of actually getting in
cyan lagoon
@normal thorn Astral Arcanum partially is that
arctic wren
And astral arcanum exists yeah
cyan lagoon
It has a Hell, Dungeon, Jungle, and random teleport
bitter drift
ok so i posted a suggestion about a plague summon and i didn't know that it wasn't allowed.
should i replace it with another idea?
smoky wagon
Its isnt not allowed just has already been suggested alot of times
void kelp
Iโd just remove it if you want to remove it
bitter drift
but should i replace it with another idea i have
teal ibex
arctic wren
bitter drift
my brain have a big imagination insert spongbob meme
zenith hazel
n = 1;
if(n != 0)
return adir(n+1);
}```wot? what is this?
zenith hazel
recursion loop
bitter drift
XD
zenith hazel
it doesn't have an end
bitter drift
YES๐๐ป
zenith hazel
ok back on topic
normal thorn
Man why modders have to call their teleport mirror a freaking astral arcanum i had to rush to the dungeon every 5 minutes to farm phantoplasm... how should i guess
void kelp
idunno, read through item descriptions?
bitter drift
lol
normal thorn
Well theres alot of items in calamity
void kelp
then ask here, w people who also play the game ig ๐โโ๏ธ
normal thorn
Yea thats what i figured out
bitter drift
normal thorn
You guys really play the game
bitter drift
i think i know how to fix summons
just tell them to go after the hittable enemy with the highest max health
normal thorn
And they will switch between enemies every second when the hp is equal?
marsh gust
good luck killing enemies that bosses spawns then
bitter drift
welp that didn't work ๐๐ป
what they are coded to hit and how anyway
marsh gust
probably the ones closest to them, and the right clicking is supposed to override them.. probably
zenith hazel
clonemitas is impossible then
marsh gust
dont even have to go that far, perforators
bitter drift
shouldn't you need to tell them what to kill after all they are your minions
marsh gust
hence why right click somewhat exists
bitter drift
what make it glitch?
marsh gust
idk, it just doesnt work sometimes
zenith hazel
minions ai will stay dumb
marsh gust
we arent even talking bout suggestions anymore why are we continuing 
bitter drift
yup
at least melee is still doable and rogue some what works
zenith hazel
summoners donโt work sometimes, but when they do work, oh boy
bitter drift
but i agree let's continue
did anyone thought of summon from ravager as a mini version of him (not really a prototype cuz he is one him self but more of a little version of what should have been his real form)
zenith hazel
ravagerโs drops are gonna change so weโll see how that turns out
bitter drift
it can be craftable
devout gazelle
I just came up with an idea for a pet/minion.
Imagine something like a lantern spirit, but, it attacks by using a beam to rip a single foes soul out a la Life Drain, and then uses that soul to fire a handful of beam attacks.
bitter drift
signus
zenith hazel
ravager doesnโt drop new materials to craft a mini ravager tho
bitter drift
enoth said
no i mean it can be from mats he already drop and doesn't drop
like: Bars of life, lizard bricks, chaotic cores and bars ace. ace.
but then what is the point of it being a revenger summon
the
zenith hazel
why does it need to be a thing
ashen warren
^
bitter drift
the same reason i typed in the plague one can be
zenith hazel
a mini ravager sounds useless considering it canโt fly and would be better off as a sentry
ashen warren
But duke gets destroyed by hive pod
zenith hazel
even then, itโs ludicrously slow
bitter drift
think of ravager does now
shoot lasers exploding fists fire balls
zenith hazel
have fun hitting fishron lol
ashen warren
but why a summon
zenith hazel
besides, vigil works fine
bitter drift
you can make it fly if you want by adding rockets to his legs (i mean they are already on his arms
ashen warren
Or xeno if ya commited
bitter drift
isn't ravager a prototype
zenith hazel
then why would a mini version of it be a complete one?
bitter drift
yes
ashen warren
Tf
zenith hazel
thatโs not a valid answer fam
ashen warren
complete nonsense
bitter drift
it can be like the thing calamitas's first try or something like this as you know everything have it's mini version to show how it works
zenith hazel
besides prototype ravager is basically โkill everythingโ, sth without a brain
thatโs what made it so powerful
bitter drift
and ravager isn't?
zenith hazel
i just said ravager doesnโt have a brain tf
bitter drift
so you know wot NVM my idea always get destroyed by you
zenith hazel
if mini ravager were to have a brain, itโd underutilize its arsenals, making it weak compared to the prototype
i donโt mean to, just carefully plan out your suggestions then
frail mantle
iirc one of Ravager's new drops is gonna be a summon weapon
ashen warren
Means its even more irrelevant
bitter drift
can i get a reminder of what IIRC is
zenith hazel
you can google it
normal thorn
bitter drift
i think i got a new weapon suggestion.
psychosaw (pure melee)
crafted by: the butcher's weapons (idr how it called), A Psycho knight(from psychopaths), 10 Dark sun fragment, 10 Cosmolight bars, 5 Endothermic energy and 20 Brimstone slag.
What it does: If you can stand completely still with it for 20 seconds without attacking you will get an upgraded version of the psycho knife's damage boost. That upgraded version will give +500% Damage to the weapon, A 100% crit chance on top of the 500% damage boost, +65% Contact damage reduction And you will only run as fast as a person with the angel treads.
How does the stealth works: You can attack with the stealth for only one time before it resets but you will need to stop attacking to return to normal damage, speed and crit chance. (see why in More)
More: This weapon is hold able meaning you can continue your click and the weapon will continue to attack, This weapon have a very fast melee speed like the Archahilis (or how ever you type it), This weapon will inflict the enemy it hits with God slayer inferno, Holy flames and Brimstone fire And this weapon have a short melee range so it's won't reach long.
ashen warren
I'm assuming by pure melee you mean true melee, no projectiles on swing?
bitter drift
yes
ashen warren
If so, then this thing being post darksun yharon is gonna be pretty much a useless addition, true melee on post yharon bosses wheeze
It sounds good but I'd move it down in progression tbh
ashen warren
To what? A screens worth of range just to make it useful? 
bitter drift
XD lol no a bit longer then a katana
ashen warren
The 65% contact dr also seems a bit broken even for a true melee wep tbh
bitter drift
to the good or bad
bitter drift
but remember the melee range and invincibility frame time
you will most likely get hit 2 for 1
bitter drift
uummm?? XD lol slime mount
queen sail
Donโt we already have crystalline and radiant star for knife-esque rogue weapons already tho
bitter drift
i play now rogue at hard mode now and THERE IS A PROBLEM skelly is a good fight if you have a good enough weapon so does cryogen
but there isn't in rogue there is not enough weapons
bitter drift
well it needed
severe burrow
Huh I thought rogue was solid enough
Well anyway that sticky boots idea sounds cool except for the fact that it's completely busted
All you would need to have unparalleled vertical mobility is a pair of wings, a gravity potion, and those boots.
bitter drift
i have an seafoam bomb upgrade (post plant or post ML)
gusty geode
I thought the mana rose was an accessory
bitter topaz
the mana flower is, the rose is a weapon
royal turtle
what do y'all think of a hardmode Arkhalis upgrade?
oblique geyser
Sounds good!
lost agate
sounds awfully dangerous
severe burrow
Asgards valor can dash because its a shield..
oblique geyser
Ankh shield can't dash.
Nor can Obsidian or Cobalt.
lost agate
i mean, you dont need to add a dashing accesory into something to be able to just boost yourself forward
lost agate
and if it included tabi in it, that would be one hell of a dash lenght gap between the two
severe burrow
Plus tabi isn't for offensive dashes
lost agate
yeah
severe burrow
Asgard does shield bashes, which is an attack
lost agate
if anything it acts like the solar armor dash
rare ingot
I prefer the Statis dash above asgard
lost agate
yeah cuz its longer
rare ingot
yeah
severe burrow
Plus why just a tabi
rare ingot
It turns Duke kinda In a Joke fight
severe burrow
The point of the tabi is the ninja gear
cosmic cove
Great suggestion right?
oblique geyser
Rogue has a legendary weapon. Summoner needs a legendary weapon.
cosmic cove
Hmmmmm..... Yeeeeaahh
rare ingot
What could be a good legendary ?
oblique geyser
Maybe Legendary Summon from Cryogen?
cosmic cove
I mean im technivally gonna beat scal in rogue death so i obviously want it rogue but yeah why not make it mage ๐ ๐
severe burrow
Do shortswords just do melee damage or do they do rogue?
oblique geyser
Melee
royal turtle
Pixy Stick
Melee (possibly rogue) weapon
Early Hardmode Arkhalis upgrade
Recipe:
Arkhalis
Pixie Dust
Light Shards
Crystal Shards
Souls of Light
Other?
Why: Unlike the other spreading biomes, which have full sets of weapons and armor, the Hallow only has five weapons in total, and no summoner or rogue weapon. This would give it some serious variety, as well as adding utility to a very early-game weapon that drops off significantly after Hardmode starts. It could theoretically be made a rogue weapon by making it shoot its slash projectile a short distance instead of staying by the player, and in that case it could supplement the very limited Rogue selection in early Hardmode.
sound good?
cosmic cove
Rogue class depends on some distance...
severe burrow
But it's also considered to be an assassin/thief
cosmic cove
And also a ninja
severe burrow
So, why not give shortswords rogue damage and powerful crits to make up for their bad range?