#Tech Lab forum - General Discussions!

1 messages · Page 18 of 1

jade scaffold
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Preferably ones that won't require me to sell a kidney for them

cinder lagoon
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all torque screwdrivers I know need a kidney ^^

pearl moon
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technically you could use a torque wrench as a very bad torque screwdriver.

jade scaffold
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I guess

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I could also just eyeball it lmao

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Who needs memory channel 11 anyway no one likes that guy

mossy gull
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AMD crushes Intel.
Where Intel has 288 e-cores in total, and AMD has their 128 core with 256 hyper threads e-cores Epyc.

sonic meadow
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Any idea what the difference was in power consumption/use?

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The AMD also had twice the ram

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It's possible they were running the same amount per channel, I'm not familiar with Intel server stuff

mossy gull
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I wouldn't be surprised if AMD was also more efficient because it was only 1 CPU again 2 from Intel

amber fable
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I would like to have one for printer nozzles, but I just can't justify it.

mossy gull
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I believe iFixit has 1 or is gonna release 1

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Same with Linus Tech Tips

amber fable
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If the LTT stubby took normal bits I would buy one instantly.

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I carry a small driver with me everywhere I go, and a ratcheting stubby would be a nice upgrade.

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But not with their shitty proprietary bits.

mossy gull
amber fable
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And you can't fit normal bits into the storage for the stubby model.

cinder lagoon
amber fable
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That is for the full size model.

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The stubby has half the bit storage that the normal model has.

cinder lagoon
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ahhhh oops

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did not hear anything about a torque driver yet but there are probable cheaper sets of fixed-torque ones.

mossy gull
cinder lagoon
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I guess they do if they are variable torque but dont see why they would without

amber fable
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Fixed torque just means that when it needs calibration you can't.

cinder lagoon
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hmmm I see

amber fable
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So you better hope it was well made and won't start to wander out of spec. But hey, guess what cheap torque drivers do?

jade scaffold
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i mean i eyballed the Xeon and all its memory channels work

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atleast all the ones my mobo has

cinder lagoon
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Threadripper came with ones the last generations

jade scaffold
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yea

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Epyc doesnt

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and even if they did if they were the same design as TR you wouldnt be able to use them

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EPYCs aren torqued on the socket they are held down by the cooler itselkf

sonic meadow
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Epyc can be generally assumed to be being installed by system integrators/etc rather than end users, so not coming with it makes some sense

jade scaffold
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yea the CPU new is also a 4000 USD part

sonic meadow
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Doesn't make it any less of a pain for people like yourself though

jade scaffold
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so like who the fuck at spending 4000 usd per cpu multiple times cant afford a 500 usd torque driver

sonic meadow
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What cooling solution are you going with?

jade scaffold
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meanwhile i only spent as much as a launch 7950x 3D on this thing

jade scaffold
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there are only 2 liquid coolers for it
one costs £400 the other is an EK waterblock which i dint even bother to check the price off because its EK

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and i checked alpha cool they dont have anything for SP5 sadly

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£150 for just the block itself
i spend that much on the little tower cooler and noctua fan

sonic meadow
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Cute

jade scaffold
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its legit not even wider than the socket
but its aparently rated for 400w so you know

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im not going to be hitting it all core hardly ever anyway
might upgrade the cooler when SP5 hits EOL and i buy the highest clocking low core count CPU i can

sonic meadow
jade scaffold
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also also EPYC is less power dense chip wise

sonic meadow
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Giant socket and chiplet design helps with that

jade scaffold
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like a 7950x will pull 200w under full load and is unironically a quarter of the size with a less efficient IHS Design

jade scaffold
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looking at torque drivers just saw one for £5,500

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i am in fear

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im looking for ones that have preset torque but cant find any that are in the specific range my CPU wants

rotund siren
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Any of you smart people/audiophiles have any half-decent suggestions for a pair of headphones?
Necessary features:

  • Price range $50-$180, variable
  • Over ear style (Earbuds and on-ears are plain uncomfortable)
  • decent adjustable fit
    Cool but not required:
  • Microphone (I already got a decent desk-mounted one)
  • Wireless/Bluetooth
  • High quality audio
sacred seal
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M40x is a really good option, but the hinges have durability issues

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My current daily drivers are a pair of k553 MKIIs which are currently on sale for 150usd

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I have had these for 3 years now and while there is a crack in the hinge, its mild enough to be self repairable (I just have a zap strap wrapped around it

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A good budget option would be the k240

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Though that is semi open back

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@rotund siren

rotund siren
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Much obliged

cinder lagoon
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I mean you cant break it by not having it in the exact specs, it might just take several tries until everything works :P

jade scaffold
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I'm just gonna eyeball it tightening it too tight can damage the socket so I gotta be carefull

jade scaffold
jade scaffold
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Also any 1500+ PSU recommendations

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My new CPU will be capable of pulling over 3x and very nearly 4x the power of my current one

cinder lagoon
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Silverstone 💯

jade scaffold
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Yea or seasonic

cinder lagoon
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oops meant seasonic 🤦🏽

jade scaffold
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As long as it won't burn my house down all is good

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Shoulda really bought it on black Friday or whatever

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I'm not convinced my current PSU would survive having this epyc xD

sonic meadow
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whats your current brick?

jade scaffold
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1000w phanteks revolt x

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Gonna give that to my server alone when I switch

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And I'm able in some games to trip that things OCP

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Like the revolt x is a ballin PSU very reliable it is actually just a seasonic PSU but there is no way it can handle a 350w GPU a 320-400w CPU and a second 255w CPU while powering 1 pump and 10 fans and 8 drives

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Would be nice too if Nvidia could fix their memory clocks too

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I need to work on the idle efficiency of my pc

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You guys think second hand psus are a safe buy?

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
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Yee

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If I can get some real time control over my CPU when doing my shenanigans with it might write a program that says if I'm not playing a game to streight up turn off 10 of my cores and drop the power profile
Honestly I might turn off 8 cores and just have 1 core per ccd

cinder lagoon
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look into bitsum Process lasso - it can do things like that

jade scaffold
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Thanks for that recommendation

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Do you think I can shut my GPU down when not gaming or atleast put it in very low power?

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The mobo has a GPU built in thatll work for basic shit

cinder lagoon
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desktop mode already is very low power.
you can also disable more of the windows beautification but if you really want deep control you'll need linux

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also remember to disable all background windows bs

jade scaffold
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Yea I'm going to be running a fresh Install of windows

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Specifically one of the modified stripped down versions

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My GPU idles at 120w because Nvidia keep breaking what ever is responsible for downclocking memory it idle

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Bearing in mind the things meant to pull like 35w at idle not 120

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
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I'm only getting one that nukes bloat

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Not a total stripped down one

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I don't need to be able to fit it in the cache of my cpu

cinder lagoon
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still -

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send me the link i wanna have a look at it

jade scaffold
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Not decided on who's I wanna use yet still looking at options

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Actually will W11 server even have much bloat

cinder lagoon
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no, actually its bare except of edge

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and it has everything installable as components

jade scaffold
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That'll work then

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I hope the w11 core scheduler doesn't get confused tho

cinder lagoon
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?

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same kernel / scheduler as regular windows apart from being the stable branch

jade scaffold
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Just worrying especially with my CPU having 8 CCDs

cinder lagoon
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never heard of any of that in recent times. there were problems at the beginning with the core favorization

jade scaffold
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Yea might be better now

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Mobo should be here today or tomorrow

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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According to amd on their website the issues have been fixed now so I'm allgood

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Epyc Genoa apparently either never suffered from the issues or came out after the issues were resolved

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
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Wonder how Genoa will behave with it's cache it handles cache differently to Ryzen 7000

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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Amd have literally said all is fixed

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The issue with w11 not using the best core TM was an AMD issue as well not windows itself windows was having a stroke over cache causing a large latency increase which was also fixed

mossy gull
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I just don't like how W11 does everything.
The interface is also shite

jade scaffold
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In like 2021 apparently

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I don't mind the interface better than having everything yeeted at the edge of my screen

mossy gull
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I have full screen start and task bar on the left

jade scaffold
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How we feelin about this PSU

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Alternatively

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
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There's also the PX variant which is a whole 2% less efficient

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For that 2% you pay £1000 extra

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Seasonics PSU calculator seems to think I could get away with a 1300w PSU though ima doubt that especially when I upgrade my GPU late next year

cinder lagoon
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well at 1600W 2% is 32W thats a whole other computer in idle

jade scaffold
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That is true

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But I don't think I'll hit 1600w consistent ever

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In theory I can hit 1300w with everything maxed with the new cpu

cinder lagoon
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beQuiet lists a 1700W peak wattage, cant find anything bout the Seasonic one 🤔

jade scaffold
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If a 5090 is 550w then I'll be hitting 1500 under full load sustained

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
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Which I again never will be

jade scaffold
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I just have silly amounts of stuff in my pc

cinder lagoon
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yea I mean fans and hard drives and stuff

jade scaffold
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I have 10 fans 1 lonely hardrive and I'll have 7 SSDs

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Also 1 pump

cinder lagoon
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what kind of SSD? M.2 or SATA?

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nvm shouldnt make a diff

jade scaffold
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2xm.2, 1xsata, 4xu.2

cinder lagoon
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you should look into beQuiets "Overclocking key" feature

jade scaffold
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Yes I know my system is an abomination

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What does that do

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Just increase fan speed and power output in the PSU

cinder lagoon
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the beQuiet also as an extra 25W over the Seasonic regarding non-12V

cinder lagoon
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so it disables the multi-rail conversion

jade scaffold
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Oh so just a big 12v rail in effect then

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Bequiets PSU is also really expensive £400

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Can't get over how nice it looks though not that it can be seen in my case

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And saying that even if you could see it my motherboard is fucking bright green

sonic meadow
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black rattle can time

cinder lagoon
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3D print some nice cover plates like what is installed on most shit nowadays

jade scaffold
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Get some one to make a huge fuck off monno block for the entire board

amber fable
# rotund siren Any of you smart people/audiophiles have any half-decent suggestions for a pair ...

People already suggested the m40x and the DT990, I have used both and liked both.

(Do note, I do not use stock pads! Pads make a big difference to the sound, because different pads will absorb frequencies differently, so my experience is not stock!)

The m40x is a very nice pair of headphones. Get ZMF oval cowhide pads and you will have a very flat sounding and wonderfully comfy pair of headphones. HOWEVER the hinges are horrible and will break. I wish audio technica would get their shit together on hinges. The ZMF pads are expensive, but they make a immense difference to how good these headphones feel and sound.

The DT990 is much more robust. I put some dekoni "earpadz" jersey knit pads on mine and they are quite comfortable, although they needed some minor EQ to be properly flat. Sound is still great though.

Both are pretty cheap for how good they are.

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I use the 990s while streaming, and the sound leakage from their open backs is not enough to interfere with my mic.

jade scaffold
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I'm using dekoni valour pads on my lcd2s love them to bits

pearl moon
# rotund siren Any of you smart people/audiophiles have any half-decent suggestions for a pair ...

Sennheiser PC38x is my suggestion if you're open to open back headphones. literally the most comfortable thing i've ever worn, i've been side sleeping wheile wearing them for the past 3 years and i love them. Not wireless, but the audio quality is very high (use the velour pads if you want a little more full sound, but both sound great), and the mic quality is pretty good imo. if you really want good bluetooth headphones, the only ones i've seen that i would consider buying are the Audeze Maxwells, but they are well past your budget.

jade scaffold
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Just now realising that I shoulda bought faster ram

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Epyc officially supports 4800mhz

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This mobo supports 5600mhz

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That is a goofy ammount of extra bandwidth probably not gonna make a huge difference but ya never know faster ram wasn't that much more expensive anyway

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I can also disable half the CCDs and get much higher interconnect speeds between the remaining 4 CCDs however I am then loosing 128mb of cache

spiral hedge
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Not a massive upgrade but i merged my spare pc build into this

STLpHhr.png
jade scaffold
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It's a nice little CPU upgrade

spiral hedge
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i can see the difference on star ciitzen went up by a good 10fps and its stable fps which is better than the former (running through area18)

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and i finally dedicated to going full SSD build

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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Kill the hardrives

mossy gull
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How much HDDs are good for long term storage, I hate how slow they are

jade scaffold
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Yea if you are just throwing stuff on them for long term storage like jotos or videos they are fine

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But loading stuff off them is hell

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And SSDs are cheap now old gen 3 drives are as cheap as hardrives used to be 5 or 6 years ago

sacred seal
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Depends what you are loading. I keep a suprising amount of stuff on spinning rust (mainly because I have an absurd amount of files on my PC)

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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I have an absurd amount of files loading the thumb pics for all my videos and pics takes nearly 2 minutes

sonic meadow
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12TB is probably shingled, which doesnt do single file reads all that well

jade scaffold
sacred seal
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I have 19TBs total, 5 in SSDs and 14 in mech. Use the mech for media and large project files, and while it is slower, its not that much slower

mossy gull
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I have 22TB just in SSD storage

jade scaffold
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I have 13tb 12 in SSD 1 in hardrive just can't use 8tb if it yet cos no pcie lanes

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Soon tm

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Might ditch 2 tb though run the ssds in a raid array and use 1 drive as parity

sacred seal
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And I thought my 4TB SSD was luxury. Granted SSDs are a lot cheaper then they used to be, but that seems like an expensive way to store that much data.

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That's what, a minimum of like 800$s in drives alone?

jade scaffold
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I spent £20 per tb on my 8tb of u.2 nvme

sacred seal
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Ah, yes, I recall now. Got a absolute steal on used server hardware

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That makes more sense then

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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Second hand intel server drives let's fucking goooooooo

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I have a 256gb SSD I've had since I was like 10 that's still working

sacred seal
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What on earth are you doing to your harddrives? I can count the number of dead hard drives I have had to deal with in my life on my fingers

sonic meadow
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all of my dead hard drives have been doa 🤔

sacred seal
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And concidering just how many PCs I have been inside, that is not a lot

sonic meadow
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heck my three 4TB spinning rusts are at 30k hours each (3.5 years continuous)

jade scaffold
sacred seal
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I think the oldest chunk of spinning rust I still have in service is going on 6 years of active deployment. I have always just upgraded before they have died

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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Mines a crucial sata SSD

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Good ol' reliable micron

mossy gull
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My old 96GB I once bought for 150.-.
And people now complain that 100.- is too much for 1TB

sacred seal
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Actually, no my dad has a drive from my first laptop that he is using for storage. That thing must be like 12 years old by now...

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And its a 2.5" mech drive

sonic meadow
sacred seal
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Well I would expect nas drives to be a bit more durable then your consumer fare, but yea, hard drives are more resiliant then most people give them credit for

sonic meadow
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oh, they are disks in a NAS, not NAS disks

sacred seal
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Ah, I stand corrected

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Computers in general don't really die. I suspect the vast, vast majority of them are retired well before they break

sonic meadow
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okay maybe they were NAS drives 😆 smartctl says they are seagate ironwolf drives

jade scaffold
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they propper drop test thoes Nas and enterprise drives

sacred seal
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Still, at 4 years are they even out of warrenty yet?

sonic meadow
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oops, the power on hours was only 38k hours not 40k. 40k was the boot ssd I got second hand 😆

jade scaffold
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My intel drives still aren't out of warranty didn't even buy them new

sonic meadow
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local provider says 3 year warranty. so probably not 🤔

sacred seal
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Ah, I thought those had 5

jade scaffold
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I still really want one of Intel's gen 4 optane drives but ima need to wait for some data centre to go bankrupt to get one of thoes

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Make great boot drives borderline unkillable

sonic meadow
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though the store website also says this 🤷

image.png
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and so does seagates website (the 3 years I mean)

jade scaffold
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Iron wolf's are their like enthusiast and pro aimed line

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Their enterprise drives might have a 5 year warranty

sonic meadow
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the ironwolf pro are 5 years

jade scaffold
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New mobo comes tomorrow according to DHL

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I hate DHL with a passion

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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Of 3 big mail carriers in the UK they are the worst

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DPD is the best by a land slide royal mail are good DHL dont give precise delivery times no kinda active tracking very hard to access options for having them put mail elsewhere other than handing It to someone at your door

mossy gull
sacred seal
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Last thing I ordered from DHL ended up lost for 2 months, and they only bothered to start looking for it once I asked them to. Then it took them another month to find it, and they did not give me any rebates

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Anyways, got my dell r720. Added 16gbs more ram and it boots fine (I can get into the config menu), but if I add in my GPU (p40) the power supplies start flashing orange (both of them), and the system refuses to turn on at all (Power button does nothing). People are running p40s in these things successfully with comprable configurations, so it should work.

Anyone have any idea's?

cerulean helm
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I am very tempted.

cinder lagoon
sacred seal
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Thier is an 8 pin power connector on the riser card which provides the power. To get the power to the GPU you need a special cable that adapts the 8 pin to a 8pin+ 6pin pcie

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I plugged the 8 pin PCIe power into the card

cinder lagoon
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do you have a multi-meter on hand?

sacred seal
cinder lagoon
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and did you check with just the cables connected plugged into the mobo but not the GPU?

sacred seal
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It boots fine in the above configuration

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And unfortunately I don't have a multi meter on hand

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Wait a second...

cinder lagoon
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can you confirm the cable colors with the shapes?

image.png
sacred seal
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Wtf kind of pinout is this?

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Better question, who the fuck put a EPS connector on a graphics card?

sonic meadow
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looks like eps12v to me

pcie-eps-pinout.png
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just remember that they have complementary keying in one direction 🤦, but the voltages are swapped. more importantly two of the pins that are 12v/gnd on eps are gnd/sense (aka both ground) on the pcie one

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luckily most psus just go in to OCP and shut down immediately with no damage to anything

sacred seal
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Bleh, time to see if you can adapt PCIE power to EPS. That is not something I ever thought I would need to do

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Again, why would nvidia put a EPS connector on a graphics card?

sonic meadow
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whats the card?

sacred seal
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Tesla p40

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So server grade

sonic meadow
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that might be why. the EPS connector has a higher power limit (350w or something, compared to 150w for 8pin pcie).

cinder lagoon
sonic meadow
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I said that just below my image, though in different words

sacred seal
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Ah, that makes some sense, but this is like a 250 watt gpu.

Well thanks for the advice, I probably would not have noticed the different pinnings otherwise

sonic meadow
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yeah you would probably want a 2x 8pin to eps adaptor

sacred seal
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Still though, do servers just regularly have an excess of EPS cables?

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Or is everyone just using adapters

sonic meadow
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dunno, not a space I am really familiar with. iirc EPS came more from that space in the first place, with the PCIe connector being a more consumer space thing

sacred seal
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I have never seen EPS on anything but CPU

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And its fairly rare to see a PSU with more then one of those

sonic meadow
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there were all kinds of peripheral plugs on things before the pcie came about

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get above about 700w and you start to see two eps plugs

sacred seal
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Well now I have to wait several more days to get my server set up. So annoying

sonic meadow
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the corsair RMx850 for example has two EPS connectors (and 6 pcie connectors, doesnt say what size)

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probably will in the manual, but im just looking at hte product page

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the rm1000x has 3 EPS, and 6 PCIe again

sacred seal
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Yea, with some of the r9s and i9s I have seen a handful of consumer boards that take 2 eps. But that is a very recent edition, p40s what, like 7 years old now

sonic meadow
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while the AX1600i has 2 EPS, but 10 PCIe

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oh a lot of boards have two EPS, or one EPS and one P4, even though you only need one EPS for every consumer cpu

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the P40 even says EPS connector on the TPU listing

image.png
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still a massive pain if you werent expecting it.

sacred seal
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Well its not something I have ever encountered before, that's for sure

sonic meadow
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"oh, it has an 8 pin on it. I need to make sure I have a spare 8pin pcie"

jade scaffold
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Oh already awnserd

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Yea Tesla's use CPU EPS because it can provide more power

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Good thing dells psus are good otherwise that could have quite literally caught fire on you

sacred seal
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Yea, real glad that the PSUs seem to be quite intelligent. The fact that you can just stick a standard 8pin GPU cable into it though is scary

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Other then the clip not bieng in quite the right location I had no issues plugging it in

jade scaffold
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Yea it's really dumb that you can plug a 8 pin pcie into a eps connector

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Personally I don't much see the point in pcie when EPS exsists there's probably some form of good reason for it but all I'm saying is that a 4090 would only need 2 8 pin EPS which solve the whole not enough room for connectors shit they were going on about

sonic meadow
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it is one of those things I have wondered about myself

jade scaffold
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New mobo arrives today too 🥳

sonic meadow
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heck, apparently the old p4 atx connector good for 140W, aka basically an 8pin pcie...

jade scaffold
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Eps can do 250w I think on one cable

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On the 8 pin I mean

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So if you had a GPU with 2 of them you have 575w of power available

sonic meadow
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EPS is the 8 pin 😛

sacred seal
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I'm thinking it may have just been poor planning for a future standard. We started out with p4 and upgraded it to EPS. When GPUs started to take more power then molex could handle, they wanted a connector that would be very distinct from the 4 and 8 pin, so they went with a 6pin pci. But then that was not enough, so as a stop gap they upgraded it to a 8pin pcie and made a mess out of everything

cinder lagoon
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sounds about right since all of them use the same plastic housing

jade scaffold
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But the Tesla's already used EPS

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They have done since at least Kepler

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You start going much further back and you end up with stuff just pulling power from the slot

sacred seal
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kepler was like 700 series, right?

jade scaffold
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Yea

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The k80 was a dual 150w GPU

sonic meadow
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before then you tended to either have a 6pin pcie, or a molex on cards that needed more than whatever the slot provided

sacred seal
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I'm fairly sure the 9800gt had a 6 pin pcie

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That was what, at least 4 years before kepler?

sonic meadow
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my 9800GT (actually I had two of them) had no power connector

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or am I thinking of a different card?

sacred seal
sonic meadow
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lets see if I still have one stowed away

jade scaffold
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9800gt was 125w

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Had to look that up I'm not that old

sonic meadow
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I see that, but as I said im pretty sure mine didnt take any external power

sacred seal
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I have one kicking around somewhere but I would be darned if I know where it is

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Got it well after it was relevant

jade scaffold
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It must have had external power of some form I don't think the pcie slot has ever done more than 75w

sonic meadow
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it hasnt. except for weird ones like in the... mac pros? that had an extra connector next to the slot

jade scaffold
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It has pretty high memory bandwidth if you compare it to ddr atleast

sacred seal
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Well there were motherboards that had GPU power connectors on them for awhile. Don't know if that allowed the slot to carry more power

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Or if it was just real wierd PCIE design

jade scaffold
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Surprised we only caught upto gddr3 CPU wise so recently

sonic meadow
jade scaffold
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I miss multi GPU

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It was so cool

sacred seal
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I present to you this cursed page out of the 2016 edition of the A+ textbook

image.png
jade scaffold
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Dual 3090 fe is the epitomy of style

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Too bad no games support it

sacred seal
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So yea, multi gpu

sonic meadow
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ive got some old boards that have that. not ones I ever used (bought a job lot of dead boards for.. some bad reason im sure)

jade scaffold
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XD

sacred seal
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I have only ever seen molex on a board once.

sonic meadow
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doesnt look like either of my old 9800gt cards are here. probably in "storage" at my dads

jade scaffold
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You guys talking about 9800gts my first GPU was a 1050

sacred seal
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My first proper gpu was a refurbed 380x. Prior to that I was just running games on the IGPU

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Still have the old dell tower I stuck it in in service. Its my dads PC now, a q9400 with 8gbs of ddr2

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Not the most sensible of pairings, but it worked

sonic meadow
#

so I think the solution for an 8pin pcie being able to fit in to an EPS12v connector was this notch. both the PCIE 6+2 cables I have feature a sticky-out bit on the +2. plus the top bit is a square rather than round, both of which would stop it from going in to an EPS12v (and I tested it on the rando motherboard I have in a box). it doesnt stop the 6pin from going in mind you

image.png
jade scaffold
#

First pc was a gtx 1050 8gb of ram and a 7600k

sonic meadow
#

my first gpu was a... i dunno, riva tnt2 or geforce 2 or something. was in the family pc

#

might have had something older in one of the older pcs we had. dunno what though

#

but that was the first I eventually ran in something "mine"

sacred seal
#

AGP, dont see a lot of that

sonic meadow
#

ran a motley assortment of second hand crap for quite a while after that. until I eventually got the pair of 9800gt I mentioned above

jade scaffold
#

Then I went to a 1080ti and 2700 and 32gb if ram

I got the 2700 originally as part of a little games server which then just became my gaming pc

Upgraded the GPU to what I have now the 2700 wasn't fast enough for that so upgraded to the 5800x

sonic meadow
#

new, but they werent quite current. I think the gtx 200 stuff had been out for a bit at that point

sacred seal
#

I used to be able to go to the recycling station and take thier old PCs. Would strip them for parts and build out the best systems I could

#

Which were not very good

sonic meadow
#

I got a copy of World At War out of a machine like that 😆
was a... lian li(?) media pc case, and had a q6600 and a I want to say 560ti in it.

sacred seal
#

Q6600 with a 560? Man that is an odd pairing

sonic meadow
#

its been a while. I remember it having a q6600, but cant remember much else

#

cant think of where else I might have got the 560ti from though

sacred seal
#

Fair, we are talking like 10 years back at least probably

sonic meadow
#

I got this PC from an ewaste facility (my uncle worked at one, so I acuired a few pc bits from there)

#

he mostly seemed to try building up old dos pcs from that stuff 😆

sacred seal
#

Nice. I really wish we were still able to get old PCs from the dump, so much waste. But there are issues with people leaving data on thier old drives

#

I have accrued quite the music library

sonic meadow
#

I (currently) care mostly about old PCs for their cases. I want to make a sleeper in an old case. preferably something like an old IBM PC-AT, but you work with what you can get

mossy gull
#

People simply think a quick format removes Data, but you have to do a full format at least 3 times to destroy all data

sonic meadow
#

DBAN

sacred seal
#

Heck, they did not even bother doing it once

jade scaffold
#

Just vaporise the drive idiot

#

Toss it into a jet engine

sacred seal
#

I have almost 10k files in my music folder

jade scaffold
#

Jeez

sacred seal
#

I have never bought a song

#

35GBs

jade scaffold
#

There are like no high quality cases in exsistance

sonic meadow
#

just build in an O11 /s

jade scaffold
#

No

#

Also not particularly quality
Too much steel

sacred seal
#

I think doing one up in one of those old dell clamshells would be hilarious.

jade scaffold
#

I'm fed up of steel on pcs it doesn't look good and doesn't feel good I want aluminium

sonic meadow
#

I also want to do a silly watercooled build in a lenovo sff desktop

jade scaffold
sacred seal
#

New enough that someone could feasably still be using one, but old enough that you would get double takes

ltRpLpSXiYnFIrdB.png
#

And the way they opened

hqdefault.png
jade scaffold
#

I beg you

sonic meadow
#

oh yeah, would love to do a luggable too

sacred seal
#

As beautiful as that thing is, no one is going to believe you are still using it

jade scaffold
#

They dint have to believe

#

They just have to look at you like your insane

sonic meadow
#

put a few hundred Wh of batteries in, and use it on the train/bus/etc as a laptop

jade scaffold
#

I will do a luggable sleeper next year if it's not too much of a nightmare to get one

sonic meadow
#

I imagine luggables with the case in decent condition arent going to be cheap to get a hold of

sacred seal
#

Upgrade the screen to an oled

#

Then run a GUIless linux

jade scaffold
sonic meadow
#

better to go with a 40 series card. more efficient

jade scaffold
#

I can get a dead luggable for £400

sacred seal
#

I wounder how difficult it would be to put a flash chip inside a floppy

jade scaffold
#

Case looks in good condition

sonic meadow
jade scaffold
#

Yea it's not cheap

#

I'm getting a 5090 next year or when ever it comes out

sonic meadow
# sacred seal I wounder how difficult it would be to put a flash chip inside a floppy

yes https://hackaday.com/2016/02/28/floppy-drive-hides-sd-card-reader/
(about 2/3 down says hackaday): https://imgur.com/gallery/A9Ekr

Hackaday
Bob Baddeley
Floppy Drive Hides SD Card Reader

[gilmour509] posted a thorough gallery of a new custom-built computer and case made to look like a 1995 IBM Aptiva. While the whole build is impressive, the most clever part involves a 3 1/2″…

Imgur
1995 IBM Aptiva build, 66mhz 486DX2, to i7 6700k!
jade scaffold
#

Luggable with a 5090 and 16 core epyc anyone?

#

But seriously though I do want to design and have made a custom case

#

Make it mostly out of aluminium

#

Get some uber chonky and quiet fans for it design it with the sole urpose of being really quiet and good looking

sacred seal
#

What I would like to see someone do is just make a super thin (2") water-cooled PC where the rad is external from the case

image.png
jade scaffold
#

I mean you could also do a super flat pack one where the radiator and fans are flat down same as the mobo and GPU

#

Use noctua thin fans and a thin rad

#

Do you think you could use the mac pro fans on a normal desktop mobo?

#

Because these are balling fans

#

Genuinely some noctua level shit

sacred seal
#

Yea, that is what I am thinking with this one. But given how thick a mobo+wb+ pipes is, I don't know if thin rads and fans would be nessasarry

jade scaffold
#

Probs not

sacred seal
#

Are those ducted fans, or are they just real tight clearance

jade scaffold
#

5cm is how thick a normal fan and rad would be combined

jade scaffold
#

From apples last intel mac pro apparently produce insane static pressure and airflow while being practically inaudable

#

Look at the back of them they got stator blades lmao

image0.jpg
sacred seal
#

I may think apples generally kinda shit, but man do they know how to make stuff look good

#

Well thier internals look good

#

Not a fan of the cheese grater

jade scaffold
#

Look at how big they are though the reason they are so quiet I'd probably because they are like 7cm thick

image0.jpg
#

I do like how apples stuff looks I hate them as a company

#

That's why I took such a shining to the nothing phone

It's like an iPhone but cooler and android

#

Do you recon anyone else makes ducted fans like that for pcs? Would be really nice to have if they perform as well as apples

sacred seal
#

I know there is a youtube channel that is dedicated to testing 3d printed fans

sonic meadow
#

I would suggest looked at who made those fans, and seeing what their off the shelf offerings are

sacred seal
#

https://www.youtube.com/@MajorHardware

YouTube
Major Hardware

Well what is up, my name is James and this is my channel Major Hardware. By day I'm a Mechanical Engineer, by night I'm a PC/Tech enthusiast. I love checking out new or interesting products doing my best to make them look as good as possible on camera. I also love thinking outside the box, trying to come up with new or interesting ideas on how t...

jade scaffold
#

Yea I've seen that channel it's really cool

#

All the testings done on the a12x25

#

Which will struggle to spin a 7cm tall fan probably the reason the fan hub on aples fans is so massive that and it helping with noise of the motor

#

On a scale of 1-10 how hard using a resin 3D printer and some basic micro controllers do you think it would be to make my own pwm fan

Would I be able to use a off the shelf motor

sacred seal
#

I would emagine it would be fairly straight forward

#

Like people build drones, I cant emagine a case fan bieng more difficult

#

Or more demanding

sonic meadow
#

essentially trivial?

jade scaffold
#

In the end it's 2 prices if plastic a controller and a motor

#

So yea it's worth a try

sonic meadow
#

might just be able to get a 1w dc speed controller for cheaper

jade scaffold
#

Maybe but I would like it to be pwm compatible

sacred seal
#

Something like this may work if you want something beefier then what a mobo will provide

jade scaffold
#

A mobo will provide enough power for 1 fan on 1 header I think

sacred seal
#

A more modern incarnation

s-l1200.png
jade scaffold
#

A single 4 pin pwm can do 12v 1A I think

sonic meadow
#

depends on the motherboard

jade scaffold
#

Yea

#

My server board should be fine probably their whole thing is running silly fans

#

I can double check that

#

Noctuas a 12x25 is 1.7w ish

sonic meadow
#

which is what, 150ma?

jade scaffold
#

And I have like 4 of them on one header on my gigabyte board

#

Yea

#

0.14a according to noctua

sonic meadow
#

1A is a lot of fan.

jade scaffold
#

Yea

sonic meadow
#

I have a pair of full thickness 120mm fans that are like.. 10w or something. and they are insane

jade scaffold
#

It's not recommended to run more than 4 normal fans off 1 pwm header

#

So if I stay under 3 a12x25s worth of power that should be well within pwms spec

#

Just looking at motors and realised how powerful a 3w motor would be

jade scaffold
#

Looking around the internet realising that fan motors are clearly highly specialised motors and most motors are either for moving really heavy shit or drones

sonic meadow
#

Most fan motors will be bldc, driven by an internal brushless driver

jade scaffold
#

Yep

#

If you find anything that looks like it could work

#

Please do let me know

sonic meadow
#

For what specifically sorry?

jade scaffold
#

Fan like as in pc fan

#

Just wanna do it as a fun little project

sonic meadow
#

Oh, your "add pwm to fan with no pwm" thing?

jade scaffold
#

No just like make a pwm fan

sonic meadow
jade scaffold
#

This is a really nice little motor though worried about if it'd be able to spin a fan as heavy as what I plan to use cos like it's only 20mm wide

image0.jpg
#

God damn it's an expensive little goober

#

84 euro nah

#

Macon apparently have some 3w and below internal motors. Their website has 0 functionality on phones tho so will have to wait till home

#

From the maxon data sheet which does actually work on phones this motor can do 12v but Its 0.34A continuous going full tilt at 10k rpm at 3.28mNm of torque

#

So honestly that could work not sure if that's enough torque that needs some math doing

sonic meadow
#

4w or so. Not a bad little donk

jade scaffold
#

Yea and I'm limiting it to 2000rpm 2500 max

#

So should pull under that I think

jade scaffold
#

So I'm gonna have to model my fan calculate it's volume and thus get a weight prediction to see if that little motor could spin it

jade scaffold
#

R7 2700 For scale LMAO

#

this things crazy

#

got 8 sata ports too so i can throw cheap ass sata SSDs in there if i ever some how manage to use up 11 NVME Slots worth of PCIE Gen 5, if i down it to gen 3 and get decent Adaptors i could have 44 drives at Gen 3 speed so to say i think im set for storeage for like forever

#

wait no im stoopid

#

thoes 3 NVME SLots on the side are x8

#

or atleast they say their designed to support 2 lots of gen 5 ssd

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
#

Holy shit that was scary

cinder lagoon
#

Haha glad it's in.. already running?

jade scaffold
# cinder lagoon Haha glad it's in.. already running?

not yet no
not gonna put it in till tomorrow having a friend round to basically help me totally rearrange the internals of my PC

Hes getting my old CPU and Mobo and the CPU AIO i have
though my CPU AIO isnt staying on the CPU we are putting it on his GPU to keep that nice and cool

#

Also been looking at the bios settings super micro provides

#

this bios has Core Performance Boost, Which incase you dont know what it is: It tells the CPU to keep boosting higher and higher untill it either runs out of Power or thermal Headroom and i Assure you Power will not be my limiting factor

#

all Cache between CCDs is shared too Though i can speed up the communication rate by disabling 4 of the CCDs and giving the remaining 4 more bandwidth essentially removing any memory bottleknecks between CCDs i will loose 128mb of cache doing that but that still gives me more cache than a 7800x 3D with quadroople the TDP and a much more spread out heat load

cinder lagoon
#

Ohh remember to also cool the VRMs of the AIO GPU!

I would recommend against entirely disabling the CCDs, just allocating specific tasks to each CCD. It will also cut down on interconnect-traffic.

jade scaffold
jade scaffold
#

theres going to be a fan directly blasting them last time i did this on a 1080ti which is a much more powerfull GPU one i had overclocked to pull 300W my VRAM and VRM Temps went down because theres no real path for heat to transfer from the GPU Core to the VRMs and VRAM

jade scaffold
#

I got a question about server boards both this one and my other one from asrock have these Weird looking VRMs

#

why are these VRMs build different to typical PC ones

#

like they look totally different

#

like what are these

image.png
cinder lagoon
#

goood question... is the outside plastic or metal?

sonic meadow
#

those just look like chokes to me. unpotted (ie not a black cube like on most enthusiast motherboards)

jade scaffold
#

Because these seem beefier than thoes in terms of their size

sonic meadow
#

ones on enthusiast boards tend to just look like a grey or black box

cinder lagoon
#

yea but metal - like for better heat conductivity

cinder lagoon
#

...since when is DDU considered unwanted?? 😒

image.png
jade scaffold
#

Standard windows fuckery

jade scaffold
#

Booted it with my OG drive

#

This installation of windows is exceedingly unhappy

#

or maybe its my instalation of the CPU

#

Like my GPU displays Duh

#

but the Sound card doesnt play audio

#

infact the sound card isnt detected by its own software

#

but Windows can See it and so can the MB so maybe bad CPU Install or driver fuckery

#

Usb card works fine

#

Only the sound card werird gonna reinstall drivers and restart

#

Causes yt vids to freeze when they try use it

jade scaffold
#

What evs will be doing a fresh install of W Server 2022 tomorrow

#

im not toooo fussed about this thing being broke af ATM

#

Sound service doesnt run by defualt when the PC Starts
the task bar is buggy af
Typical W10 is certainly not built for this kinda CPU

#

also Super Micro have 0 In bios Fan control settings because who the fuck needs thoes

#

just use ipmi dummy

hasty rose
surreal moss
#

huh... that might actually only be about a $500 markup from building it yourself

hasty rose
#

Elaborate...

surreal moss
#

There are issues it so don't run with that list

#

For example you can definitely get a better m.2

#

and the mobo should be swapped out

mossy gull
mossy gull
# hasty rose Elaborate...

Boutique pre-builds like these have a mark-up, they always do.
If you really want to save money buy a pre-build from example Lenovo Legion or build 1 yourself

surreal moss
mossy gull
jade scaffold
#

Super micro mobos are a pain

#

They have next to no Bios options

#

Everything has to be done through ipmi

#

They have this anti stall fan feature which can only be configured through ipmi which unless you have 3000rpm fans will think your fans are stalling so ram fan speed to max

This can't just be turned off you have to configure the lowest none recoverable rpm per fan through ipmi which is pain ontop of that there is no configurable fan curve atleast not one that wouldn't make your average person suicidal

I get it's a server board but asrock and gigabyte let you do all this through ipmi and the bios why doesn't super micro

sonic meadow
#

does fancontrol work on the board?

jade scaffold
#

How do you mean

sonic meadow
#

though how well that plays with the IPMI monitored stuff I have no idea

jade scaffold
#

I can try it but the entire fan control system is apparently a part of the BMC ipmi system

#

Which is also known to fight for control of the fans too

#

So easy solution

#

Corsair fan controller

#

Using usb to control the fans

sonic meadow
#

hmm, I believe I may be powering the switch/wireless in my room using one of my Vive psus 🤔

#

I wonder if it (the switch) takes the same plug as one of my old random laptop psus 😆

#

since I appear to be irritatingly short on 12v bricks

#

hmmm, the psu I use for my sim wheel matches, but I dont want to take that out of usage /pulls hair

#

ah hah!, random 12V3A brick found

jade scaffold
#

uhhh i have to set fan rpm above this stupid things stall speed

jade scaffold
#

This mobo Is killing me

#

Trying to install a fresh coppy of windows
All goes as you would expect in the beginning coppys files installs them
System needs to restart as usual for a windows install
Boots back into the installation media what the fuck. No drive with windows on in sight in bios

jade scaffold
#

My Sound card is super angy and causing all sorts of fun audio issues so that comes out tomorrow when i get the fan controler hub

#

have gotten into CS2 and this thing is goofy fast

jade scaffold
#

my GPU Block has randomly and rapidly corroded

#

still in warentee tho so should be able to get my money back

sacred seal
#

This is why I don't deal with water cooling. Any chance of mixed metals?

jade scaffold
#

yes there are mixed metals which is usually fine with the right solution
and this was fine untill the past month and a half or so where it has gone from very shiny to green and brown not sure what would cause that to happen as rapidly as it did

sacred seal
#

Ah, probably the mixed metals then if it was that fast. Anything possibly contaminated the solution you were using such that it would no longer be effective?

jade scaffold
#

air?

#

theres definatly some air in it now

#

when there wasnt when i got it

#

i havent opened the thing up though so thats not on me

sacred seal
#

Just as clarification, you didn't do the loop yourself?

jade scaffold
#

nope it was an alpha cool aio which ive previously had very good experiences with

sacred seal
#

Ah. You would have thought they would have known better then to risk mixed metals

jade scaffold
#

you would think

#

ive got my GPU in "sports mode" vertically mounted so that it doesnt obstuct all my lovely new PCIE Slots

#

so i dont really wanna go back to my air cooler

sacred seal
#

Do a full custom loop?

jade scaffold
#

how cheap you think i can get away with a full custom loop for

#

if i get refunded for this alpha cool one ill get like £250 or somthing along thoes lines

sacred seal
#

Well you will need GPU and CPU block, those are like 100-150 each, then 2 360 rads, so another 200?

jade scaffold
#

i dont NEED a cpu block GPU only would be fine

#

besides the only CPU block for my CPU is EKs

#

and that alone is like 150

sacred seal
#

Well if you are going through the effort to do a loop, you may as well do your CPU as well

jade scaffold
#

would you belive nearly no one makes SP5 Water blocks

sacred seal
#

But if you don't need it, then the price drops a fair bit

jade scaffold
#

this is the only one

#

fuck it going with the air cooler im going to be replacing the 3090 anyway in a years time or so

cerulean helm
#

What alphacool gpu block? The expandable "aio"? Its not mixed metal. The rad is one of their Nex full copper rads, and the block is their standard gpu block just with the pump attached to the side. And thats chrome/nickel plated copper.

#

I should add thats if its one of the newer ones like I am using. The Eiswolf 2.

jade scaffold
#

in that case theres no reason it should have rapidly corroded to the point of being dangerous to use under load

#

Because like THATS BAD thats real bad

#

it did have some air in it so maybe its worth filling back up

#

cant tell from this pic but the fins do look pretty clogged up

sacred seal
#

That's knarly

cerulean helm
#

Yeah, thats really bad. Ive had mine for over a year and its perfectly fine. I'd definately contact Alphacool.

jade scaffold
#

ive had mine for just under a year

mossy gull
#

Who likes some dumb Nvidia "rumours".
From what I have heard Nvidia wants to release:

  • 4060 Super
  • 4060 Ti Super
  • 4070 Super
  • 4070 Ti Super
  • 4080 Super.
#

The 4070 Ti Super is also rumoured to be $850.-

cinder lagoon
#

And as all Ti super models completely superflous

#

I hate apple for making their products pro max ultra hyper. Everone follows their example and its stupid

mossy gull
cinder lagoon
#

checks out

jade scaffold
#

I don't mind the use of pro or Max

#

But it gets stupid at some point

mossy gull
jade scaffold
#

forgot how cool this thing looks

jade scaffold
#

Now that im all up and gaming again im noticing something

#

even though im now on a much higher res monitor making games harder to run and my avrg fps is down its only down by a very little bit
whats more is games are clearly benifiting from this CPUs absurd 256mb of L3 Cache im getting 1% lows within 10fps of my avrg

cinder lagoon
#

Geeee

spice arrow
#

I should get to put together my new rig tomorrow night. it's complete overkill but I figure it'll last me enough to justify in the long run

jade scaffold
#

Awesome what specs you got

spice arrow
#

14700K and a 3080 i bought some time last year. going for an icue link fan and cpu cooling setup just to try it out

jade scaffold
#

sounds like its gonna be a very nice build

spice arrow
#

hope so. think I might be getting several amazon shipments tomorrow

mossy gull
cerulean helm
#

The 14700k has the same or near same power draw as the 13700k though. A simple 360mm aio or large air cooler will work fine. Especially if not overclocking.

#

Can't say much about the 3080 FE, but it can't run hotter than my MSI 3080 when that was still on its air cooler. Never went over 65* while gaming.

mossy gull
sacred seal
#

Bleh, just found out that my clean install of windows somehow put the bcd on my old SSD...

sonic meadow
#

did the other disk have a copy of windows on it?
and yeah, windows sometimes likes putting the bootloader on a different disk to the windows install. not entirely sure why, but a pain in the butt

sacred seal
#

Yea, it did, it has the backup of my old OS

#

Meaning I cant just clone it over

sonic meadow
#

your new install probably killed that one

#

windows doesnt like coexisting with itself

sacred seal
#

Actually I can still use both installs fine. I get a prompt asking which windows I want to use when I boot. Probably should have tipped me off that something was screwy

#

But I wanted to use the SSD for my server, so now I need to wait until I can get my laptop back from my parents so I can rebuild the bcd so I can take the SSD out of my computer and wipe it

sonic meadow
#

its definitely doable, ive had to do it myself before... because windows put it on the wrong disk 😆

sacred seal
#

I have done it a few times, but there is no way that I am doing it without having a second computer avaliable

sonic meadow
#

that was not a fun few days.
I did several different generational upgrades at once:
gen4 intel to ryzen
sata ssd to nvme ssd
win7 to win10
I tried to leave the windows upgrade until after, but win7 doesnt have nvme support, and win7 support for ryzen was... iffy.
I think I reflashed my SSD from my backup 5 or 6 times

sonic meadow
sacred seal
#

That sounds like it would be a lot of fun

sonic meadow
#

It was the reason I didnt bother trying to keep peoples win7 installs when doing upgrades. I couldnt be arsed trying to go through that again

spice arrow
cerulean helm
#

Interesting, my Asus boards "ai" overclocking has decided that 3 cores can run up to 6Ghz while the other 5 P cores run at 5.8ghz.

mossy gull
sonic meadow
surreal moss
#

Well I’m screwed

jade scaffold
mossy gull
mossy gull
#

Also I must be alien for being able to multi-focus and speaking telepathically with my family.

cerulean helm
#

Okay totally expected this to be a Corsair product and not Lian Li. But screens on fans? Just why?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgW2v4qMiF8

YouTube
JayzTwoCents
Those crazy SOBs did it... they put SCREENS in the FANS!

Those crazy SOBs at Lian-Li put LCD screens in their fans!

Learn more and see pricing for the Phanteks NV9 at https://amzn.to/4axsIRe
Get your JayzTwoCents Merch Here! - https://www.jayztwocents.com

○○○○○○ Items featured in this video available at Amazon ○○○○○○

► Amazon US - http://bit.ly/1meybOF
► Amazon UK - http://amzn.to/Zx813L
► Amazon C...

▶ Play video
amber fable
#

Take one look at that and tell me it doesn't look cool as hell.

#

that's why.

#

Useless? Oh yes.

#

Looks awesome? Hell yes

cerulean helm
#

I do not think it looks awesome, I think it looks pointless.

surreal moss
#

It doesn’t have to be your thing. I’ll take two though

sonic meadow
#

I think it's cute.
Do I want it? Nah, I use a solid side panel.
Does it have use/utility? Sure, the thumbnail is even showing it showing temperature+something.
Is it frivolous? Or course
Does that matter? No

spice arrow
#

the rig is built. now I must sleep, for tomorrow I fly... hopefully... after some desk arrangement.

#

And some dishwashing, and packing for a road trip on Friday. I’m almost tempted to take the rig on the road trip to my parents’.

sonic meadow
#

I know that feeling, kinda want to use my mum's lounge for VR stuff

cinder lagoon
#

hmmm ideas that dont involve reinstalling windows?
already DDU'd the graphics driver and there is a known loose connection between GPU and motherboard but it doesnt affect anything until you push the GPU a certain direction.

image.png
#

the black appears by selecting stuff

jade scaffold
#

i know reinstalling windows isnt the most fun thing in the world but honest to god its like the best sollution when drivers turn fucky

cinder lagoon
#

yea true tho...

jade scaffold
#

sometimes just updating windows can fix it

#

perhaps roll back a version and update again

#

also Watercooling UK are refusing to Refund my water block but they'll replace it

#

so does any one want a Brand new Alphacool eiswolf 2 aio for the 3090 Founders Edition?

cinder lagoon
#

hmmm thats stupid...

cerulean helm
#

Okay, this is more my thing for performance monitoring than an lcd screen on a fan.
https://www.gskill.com/product/412/415/1702982997/WigiDash

G.SKILL International Enterprise Co., Ltd.
WigiDash - Overview - G.SKILL International Enterprise Co., Ltd.

Experience improved productivity and multitasking with WigiDash, the ultimate PC command panel for gamers, content creators, and power users alike. The 7” touch panel display allows a multitude of actions, display monitor system performance, and customize your workflow to suit your needs.

cinder lagoon
#

looks great if you actually want to keep an eye on everything, the GPU fan LCDs are more or less just for a quick summary but I like both!

jade scaffold
#

I wonder if that would work with my mobo

#

My msi after burner can't pic up some things about my CPU maybe it just needs an update or smthn

surreal moss
cerulean helm
jade scaffold
#

Why is my Tctl So high

#

but nothing else on the CPU is high atall

#

the offset cant be 50 degrees

jade scaffold
#

nvm EPYC is just offset by 50C

mossy gull
jade scaffold
#

Been Running some benchmarks here and there and noticed somthing interesting about this chip
despite having a 400W TDP the most ive seen it pull is 195w

tender plank
#

So, I just had a... moment. I needed to change a cable in my computer, I grabbed my headlamp and was using it as a flashlight to see something on the back panel, then I went to work on the other side and tried for about 10 seconds to balance it just right to get good lighting into the case before realizing that it's a headlamp and I can just put it on.

tender plank
#

On a related note, I'm really curious how bad the impact on CableMod is going to be now that they are putting out a recall for their V1.1 of the 12 volt adapters that were supposed to have been fixed but are now melting just like the V1.0.

mossy gull
cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
#

Something something cooling

#

Threadrippers have a 30c offset

#

Maybe it's something to do with how big they are physically

mossy gull
jade scaffold
#

All the CCDs are under 60 degree so I'm happy enough ipmi isn't using the Tctl to control fans

#

The fact epyc can share it's cache really helps CPU performance none of that 7900/7950x3D shittery

mossy gull
jade scaffold
#

yea its a very interesting looking PSU ive been considering it for my Crazy setup

jade scaffold
#

confirmed that VR is working through the USB Card i have

cerulean helm
#

damn windows defender keeps false flagging a file in firefox cache folder and a trojan and my backup keeps failing.

jade scaffold
mossy gull
cerulean helm
#

Deleted the file and still caused a flag resulting in my backup failing. Ended up just deleting the entire cache folder and that worked.

jade scaffold
#

been looking round the internets not alot of these Genoa CPUs are floating arround at good prices yet not enough for the Overclocking community to go wild

balmy flicker
#

I need to fix my PFP so that insted of an HO229 I have a YB 35 and 49 traing my B2

#

what would be the best free tool to do that

cinder lagoon
#

so you want to image edit other planes in there?
gimp. not the easiest but certainly the best free tool!

jade scaffold
#

I do really like this case

#

But A Spensive and B no vertical mount for my GPU which i kinda need

#

also now realising im gonna need a case that can mount a 4 slot GPU Vertically

#

because i expect Next gen GPUs to be hella beefy

jade scaffold
#

My brother got a quest 3 for Christmas and from me briefly using it I have 3 observations

A pass through on it is insanity
B the image clarity as a result of the lenses and display is crazy
C the controllers tracked way better than I expected they would

surreal moss
#

I’ve bumped into several Quest users in VTOL VR. Seems like a solid set up

jade scaffold
#

Addition observation valve charging as much as a quest 3 costs for the headset bit of the index alone is daft because it doesn't hold a candle to the headset part of the quest 3

surreal moss
#

Counterpoint though: Meta

#

Really that’s the only thing that kept me away from it

jade scaffold
#

I like the index for the most part but the entire index set shouldn't be priced at £900. £650 should at this point where the index should be priced at 900 at launch was fine because when the index launched it was genuinely new and impressive. Where as now it's decidedly last gen and still priced as if it was new

#

It also has had substantial reliability issues and the stupid proprietary cable it uses is expensive and the most common part to break

surreal moss
#

I’ve owned two and haven’t had reliability issues with either one. And I don’t exactly have it resting on a felt pillow

#

Would be nice if the pricing came down though

jade scaffold
#

The controllers are known to just die valve are typically pretty good for replacing them though which is nice

The cable breaking is not a reliability issue more of a matter of time as with any headset but £120 for a wire? Fuck you valve coulda just used a usb c cable

And on a headset as low Res as the index it was not for visual clarity reasons

#

I hope with their additional experience gained in designing the steam deck their next gen headset is both more repairable and uses a wire that's not proprietary or stupid spensive

surreal moss
#

Just don’t be stupid with stuff and it tends to last

jade scaffold
#

With cables on vr headsets it's unavoidable for the most part. That poor wire is gonna get wiggled around and eventually die

#

This can be mitigated somewhat with the cable hangy things

#

But the least valve could have done is make the wire easy to replace

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
#

It's easy to swap

#

You just pop the foam off and pull the wire out

#

It's a pricey little bastard is the issue

cinder lagoon
#

ahhh hmm to be fair its a combo DisplayPort 120Hz 4k and USB cable

jade scaffold
#

Or they coulda used usb c

#

The resolution of the index is also nowhere near 4k

#

It's actually less than a 21:9 screen 1440p

cinder lagoon
#

wasnt sure about it tbh havent used in a long time

jade scaffold
#

1440x1440 per screen I believe the index was

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
#

1800×1920 per screen at 90hz on my quest pro

2064 × 2208 per screen at 120hz for the quest 3

jade scaffold
#

I've never had my quest pros link cable unplug on me

#

And I've pulled on that accidentally many a time

sacred seal
#

My brother has owned 2 index's he has had so many issues with them

#

The headset itself has never died, but he has had to replace the cables 3 times, both the controlers at least 5 times each, and one of the base stations once

#

When his first one ran out of warranty he sold it and bought another because it would be cheaper then having to replace everything out of warranty

jade scaffold
sacred seal
#

The tech is still pretty good. My brother has a quest 3 but he still prefers the index

jade scaffold
#

The tracking and controllers are sick

#

But the lenses are very meh and the resolution is surprisingly low I feel like the headset part of the Q3 with index like controllers would make a fantastic vr setup

#

Honestly a headset for just pc vr with similar specs to the q3 should be really reasonably priced

#

The reason the pro is so expensive is because it has 3 whole ass SOCs

cinder lagoon
#

my biggest problem with the index was the screen temperature and non-true blacks

jade scaffold
#

My biggest issue with the q pro is refresh rate

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
#

the Indexes screens IIRC are hard to replace

#

its not uber repairable/modular like the steam deck

cinder lagoon
#

apparently some company claimed to be developing a kit but nothing came from it seemingly

sonic meadow
# jade scaffold The controllers are known to just die valve are typically pretty good for replac...

The index/vive cable is much longer than the maximum spec for unpowered usbc cables, and getting close to the limit for powered ones.
Considering the issues Quest users have with incompatible cables I am glad valve didn't go with USB-C.
That not even considering the sturdiness requirements (people are going to be stepping on it, having it twist around, yanked at both ends).
Plus of course it's not just picture, but sound and USB as well. That would (as I understand the USB c spec) require a second cable, I don't think you can do both USB and alt-mode video at the same time. Though if you just use it as a bunch of differential pairs then stuff like that is less of an issue. But then you possibly get extra latency at each end, which is no bueno

sacred seal
#

The index cable costs something like 100usd. You can get a lot of replacement cables for that price

sonic meadow
#

I wouldnt know 😢

image.png
sacred seal
sonic meadow
#

the price is apparently comparable to the cables for other tethered headsets (htc, pimax)

mossy gull
sacred seal
#

I don't think thunderbolt would work. Least of the issue is actually getting a thunderbolt port on a device

mossy gull
#

I don't think it'll be an issue, if they can put it on a phone they can put it on a headset.

sacred seal
#

Given the quests run quite happily on usb 3, and they also have to handle controller tracking, I don't see why you would need a more robust standard

#

As far as I am aware, no phones have thunderbolt.

mossy gull
mossy gull
sacred seal
#

But more to the point, not a lot of devices have thunderbolt, meaning you would need to buy a new PC to get it to work

#

Thunderbolt 3 has a shorter max length to my knowedge

#

Unless you do fiber optic, which does not work for vr

mossy gull
#

Still, I seen very long USB-C cables that work without problems as long the devices that are connected support it.

sacred seal
#

Looked it up, thunderbolt 3 and 4 max length is 2m per the spec

sonic meadow
#

Cable length should not exceed 2 metres (6 ft 7 in) for Gen 1, and 1 metre (3 ft 3 in) for Gen 2.
the index having a usb3 connection along with power and dp1.2
it looks like DP alt mode would allow for all the everything needed... up to 2m at most

#

so still well short of the 6m that the offical cable is (1m pigtail, then 5m for the cable itself)

mossy gull
#

The thing I don't understand, how can 1 cable have much more range than the other while they're fundamentally the same except different connector.

sacred seal
#

USB 3 active cables have a max range of 18m

sonic meadow
#

shielding

sacred seal
#

Fairly sure thunderbolt uses far more of the pins then type c

sonic meadow
#

plus maximum latencies

mossy gull
sacred seal
#

Hence more wires inside the cable and therefore more interference

sonic meadow
#

USB 3.2 uses all four differential pairs in a type-c connector/cable

mossy gull
#

Still, you can make very long USB-C cables, the longest I personally own are 5m and they work without a problem.

sonic meadow
#

DP alt mode allows the DP connection to use 1,2 or 4 of those pairs, leaving enough for a usb 3.0 (or maybe 3.1) signal over 2 pairs, and the usb2 lines/etc can be used for PD and the DP sideband stuff

#

but you still have the cable length issues. just because yours "work without a problem" doesnt mean that is going to be the case for everyone. Quest users using theirs tethered already have enough issues with cables, and thats without even considering the absolute fucking mess that is type-c cabling

mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

and the solution is to not use type-c

#

its the wrong thing to use for this application

mossy gull
sacred seal
#

You can buy PCIe 4x to hdmi adapters

#

Fairly sure that is not what hdmi is intended for

mossy gull
sonic meadow
mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

USB type-c is a horrific lack of standardised standard

sacred seal
#

I would rather deal with the mess then have to spend 160cad on a wear item

mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

huh?

#

no you cant really

sacred seal
#

The solution is fairly simple, release a branded cable, and offer no guarantee that other cables will work

sonic meadow
mossy gull
#

@sacred seal HDMI 2.0 also doesn't support 4K120 I believe, I believe that's 2.1 but I seen them passing by when searching for cables.

sacred seal
#

They sell an entirely propritary cable that costs a mint

#

And as far as I am aware thier are no third party options

sonic meadow
#

so does pimax (though there 5m one is 60 bucks)

sacred seal
#

That is a fiber optic cable, that at least justifies the price

sonic meadow
#

the vive one is around 70usd, so still expensive. not as much. but within ballpark

image.png
#

oh, and none of these tethered headsets use type-c cables

mossy gull
#

The problem with proprietary cables is when you need a longer 1 it's much harder to do so, and sometimes impossible.
If you just give minimum specs of what a cable needs to support then in the end it's the user's own fault for not following them.
As long everything is so vague people keep on being dumb and buy 100m long HDMI cables that aren't up to spec.

sonic meadow
#

oh, and the vive pro 2 is even more expensive

image.png
sonic meadow
mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

that doesnt suddenly or magically make it in-spec

mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

because the spec says it cant

#

cables arent just wire

mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

you dont need to fucking ping for every reply, especially not when it was the last thing said

mossy gull
#

Just make sure you have a few cables that'll work, and certify them.
Instead of making everything proprietary and annoying when you need a longer length.

#

Or do people forget that people use USB hubs or docking stations to extend their cable length?

sonic meadow
#

the specs for max cable length are determined by a collection of factors:

  • round trip time. USB has a maximum round trip time in the specification, this varies based on the exact version of the standard
  • signal integrity. This one has multiple aspects to it: shielding, twist, secondary shielding, crosstalk, interference. These are based on the physical construction and design of the cable and the values are based on a combination of mathematics and simulation (for stuff like the different twist rates, crosstalk, etc), and real world testing (for all the previous, as well as external interference and shielding)

The higher your bandwidth (per pair), or more signals you are sending (all pairs), the more important all of the above becomes.

Power has nothing to do with any of the above, those are all about signal strength/integrity/noise ratio.
Power is almost purely about cable length, conductor diameter, and allowable voltage drop (which ties back in to length).
POE for example has a voltage drop allowed of 15-20v, and under 1A per pair used. with POE++ using all four data pairs for power.
Type-c has to do all of that over... one power line, with much lower drop at the consuming device end

mossy gull
#

That's because of how they build it in their vision on how things should work.
Which is all theory based.
If we look at real world applications my USB-C to DP(yes, using 1 of those because my laptop doesn't have a DP) shouldn't reach past 2m I believe.
Yet I have a 5m 1 that works without problems.
As long you have a good cable you should be able to reach it.

Just because the spec says this, doesn't mean it's final, signals don't instantly drop unless they're made that way.

sonic meadow
#

while correct, it is all that the spec guarantees (for cables that meet the spec, which is a massive issue for type-c in general. )

mossy gull
#

Specs more often than not are because that's what a company tested, or what they think is what people want/need.

sonic meadow
#

a spec will be designed around the intended use case, and then the engineering done to meet that

mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

and USB (and thus type-c) is a peripheral interface connection

sonic meadow
mossy gull
#

A good solution would be to give the VR headsets a hub, a list of supported and certified USB-C cables, or more if needed, and if people don't use certified cables it's their own responsibility.
Just like people using Chinese chargers while being warned a million times.

#

The reason I absolutely hate proprietary cables is because when said company stops producing them you're fucked.
While if you have said company having said other companies making certified cables, it's up to the 3rd party when to stop.
USB-C can easily reach 10m I think, but only if companies make them that way.
How else do we have lovely HDMI cables that go past their spec just to feed a projector and still work fine.

sonic meadow
#

needs to be a "powered" cable for USB/Type-c, but iirc they introduce latency.
HDMI has no maximum length defined in the spec, just a bunch of requirements around shielding/twist and signal integrity. Requirements which make it harder to make a cable longer than around 10-15m iirc

mossy gull
# sonic meadow needs to be a "powered" cable for USB/Type-c, but iirc they introduce latency. ...

Like I said, certify a few, or tell a 3rd party to make a cable with at least certain specs.
There's always a 3rd party that will go above and beyond the minimum required specs.
Besides, the longer tha cable, the higher the latency, doesn't matter if they're proprietary or USB-C.
Just because it's proprietary doesn't instantly make the latency go away.

It's an explanation I give at least once a half year why I prefer to use my WiFi6 over the 100m long ethernet cable my brother bought me.

sonic meadow
#

active/powered cables have repeaters. this adds latency.
latency is bad in a VR context, these devices do all kinds of things that arent necessary or even found outside of VR to reduce latency. iirc even a single millisecond of extra latency is noticeable. Many of the earlier VR devices simply wouldn't work unless connected directly to a computer (ie not through a hub or via power cables).
The latency in this context is not a function of cable length, but of the repeater.

mossy gull
#

Then make a better repeater

sonic meadow
mossy gull
#

The 100m long cable is a 1Gbps cable

sonic meadow
#

cat5e is rated for 1-2.5Gb/s, and cat6 is rated for 5Gb/s. though networking hardware support for 2.5/5 is still iffy

mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

tbh if you would need to run 100m of cable to connect up your device, then wireless is likely a better solution for that

#

consumer ethernet hasnt really got any faster in the last 10-15 years. 10gig never hit the consumer space, and 2.5/5 is niche.

mossy gull
mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

ethernet, not internet

#

even 2.5gig switches are silly expensive compared to 1gig switches

mossy gull
#

Yes the company aka Ubiquiti gives a max throughput instead of what each port is able to do.

sonic meadow
#

its not uncommon with more business focused devices.
switches have a maximum switching capacity

mossy gull
#

Yeah, and I was tired with the cheap switches that keep breaking, had 3 of the cheap ones break in less than 2 years.
So I decided to go more expensive.

sonic meadow
#

heh. my small mikrotik board was the first time I actually saw file transfers saturating a gigabit link

#

which was great when I was moving something like 3TB off my PC and on to my newly commisioned NAS

surreal moss
mossy gull
mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

yeah the mikrotiks configuration is very... unfriendly

#

and I can never remeber what the application to connect to it is called 😆

mossy gull
#

UniFi is easy to remember, and not like RouterOS or RouterBOARD

sonic meadow
#

The issue is that the software name is completely unrelated to the product name

mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

As far as I know, only one for connecting to and configuring their products

sacred seal
#

Been ages since I set up my routerboard, I thought you just went to it's IP?

sonic meadow
#

You probably can, but there is a much more in depth tool you can use. I also have no idea what mines IP address is

sacred seal
#

Fair. I use mine as the backbone of my wisp, it's been crazy reliable. I don't think its been restarted once in the 4 years its been deployed

mossy gull
#

This is why I like Ubiquiti, you access 1, you access them all.

sacred seal
#

Its web ui is fairly rich, it even has a terminal

sonic meadow
#

I think thats basically the same interface actually

sacred seal
sonic meadow
#

I finally found out what it was called: winbox
I could remember "box", but windows wasnt giving me the rest of it when I searched for that

mossy gull
sonic meadow
mossy gull
#

Those looks so 2001

sacred seal
#

I like ubiquiti's stuff, I have a like 6 dishes on my network, but it costs so much more

sonic meadow
mossy gull
sacred seal
#

And given that I needed to set this up once and never touch it again i'm very happy with the microtek

#

Expecially since I don't own the property where its installed

sonic meadow
#

I needed something that would let me bridge to a commodity wireless router and then let me connect multiple devices to it. with a bit of finagling I got it to work. likely could have done the same with a ubiquiti baord

sacred seal
#

Almost certainly, but thier routers start at like what, 250?

sonic meadow
#

couldnt feasibly run a cable, and my devices were getting shit reception in my room

sonic meadow
mossy gull
sonic meadow
#

I think mine supports PoE, but I never had any upstream switches that did so it was an unimportant feature for me

sacred seal
#

Given how cheap a dedicated POE switch (or just individual POE injectors like I currently run) its not that useful of a feature

#

Unless you have a butt tone of security camera's I cant think of a place where POE is actually useful

#

POE on a switch*

#

Or you need to run a really really long cable for some reason

#

But then it's only a single device

sonic meadow
#

POE is provided by infrastructure, and used by downstream devices. having a small switch able to be located in a space that has no available power is handy. but not a dealbreaker

sacred seal
#

I have two poe injectors for my relay point on my wisp (one to power the receiver and one to power the transmitter) so a POE switch would be nice to clean up cables some of the excess cables, but i cant justify the 122cad it would cost

sonic meadow
#

I would love to be able to free up a power outlet in my room 😆. the board by my PC is full, has seven devices on a six outlet board

#

HTC for whatever lunatic reason thought it would be a good idea for the Vive PSUs (it needs three in total) would stick out sideways... in to the next two outlets

sacred seal
#

Did I mention my house is too old to have ground wires?

sonic meadow
#

wrong outlet type 😛
tbh its not usually a problem. I have one dangling figure 8 plug for when I bring my xbox in to my room. but otherwise it is all stuff in use. I dont strictly need the extra plug for the vive there (its for one of the lighthouses).. but I have two monitors, speakers, a computer. thats four of the six oll on its own. then two for the vive (the other lighthouse is powered elsewhere), and the one dangling cable. wouldnt mind having a cloverleaf there too for my laptop. but eh

sacred seal
#

Ah, yes your running 240

mossy gull
#

I have 1 PoE switch(soon to be replaced) getting power from the server.

#

If needed each switch can be hooked up to USB-C power

sacred seal
#

POE doorbell is not super useful, odds are you will already have power run to that general area. Don't know what a door access panel is supposed to be.

mossy gull
sacred seal
#

Ah, nfc keys

mossy gull
#

Yes

#

The doorbell also has an NFC key, so it can unlock the door

sacred seal
#

Ah, that would explain why it needs networking

mossy gull
#

Yep

sacred seal
#

Personally I don't bother with any of that, locks are laughably insecure

mossy gull
#

It's just I have them so I can unlock them during the day, at night the doors are locked with deadbolts.

jade scaffold
#

Valves use of a proprietary cable is nothing but predatory knowing that cables that are stept on and twisted will fail and that they don't honour warranty on the cable of the index

#

That cable does not cost them that much to produce the least they could do is make it cost like 30 or something instead of 120

jade scaffold
#

Either companies should use Type C For their VR headsets or they should just make a actual standard cable thats a unlicenced standard everyone can use

#

the Cable of a VR headset is the most common failure point by a land slide
having a unlicensed Common cable for VR is a must if VR is to advance at any reasonable rate
and still the fact that VR headsets arent really getting cheaper for no apparent reason isn't helping the VR Space either
it is possible for these companies to build basic VR Headsets that are sub £200 easily which would help massivly advance the space

cinder lagoon
jade scaffold
#

yea theres Open XR which is a good step in the right direction

cinder lagoon
#

ohh oops wrong name ^^

jade scaffold
#

issue at the moment is nothing supports it fully just using it half hazardly to get random feautres in

#

if Open XR was fully supported in Say Pavlov you could use Quest Hand tracking to track hand gestures which can now actually be done at the same time as holding your controller

#

but Pavlov only partially supports Open XR and does so in a way that is extreemly buggy

glacial canyon
#

Hm, my yeti mic is no longer being recognised, for some reason...

#

No, the computer recognises it, but I don't get the dingaling when I plug it in.

sacred seal
#

Windows is wierd sometimes. Does the mic work?

glacial canyon
#

Just a sec, gonna try it on audacity...

#

"Error opening recording device. Error code: -9996 Invalid device."

sacred seal
#

go into device manager

#

Well actually first restart the computer

glacial canyon
#

Done

#

Best drivers already installed, apparently.

#

They didn't stop working for W10, did they?

#

{
"timestamp": 1703888080,
"event_id": "17310e87b8c48d48837bdff997b4cb11",
"platform": "native",
"release": "[email protected]",
"contexts": {
"os": {
"type": "os",
"name": "Windows",
"version": "10.0.19045"
}
},
"exception": {
"values": [
{
"type": "Error",
"value": "Error opening recording device.\nError code: -9996 Invalid device.",
"mechanism": {
"type": "runtime_error",
"handled": false
}
}
]
}
}

sacred seal
#

Most likely not. In device manager is it showing up correctly? (as in not a yellow triangle)

glacial canyon
#

Nope.

sacred seal
#

Go into the device properites and the events tab

#

Should look something like this

image.png
glacial canyon
#

Configured and started...

#

Device SWD\MMDEVAPI{0.0.1.00000000}.{fb797646-aef4-4f39-ad2a-03e922c2bdf6} was configured.

Driver Name: audioendpoint.inf
Class Guid: {c166523c-fe0c-4a94-a586-f1a80cfbbf3e}
Driver Date: 12/06/2019
Driver Version: 10.0.19041.1
Driver Provider: Microsoft
Driver Section: NO_DRV
Driver Rank: 0xFF0000
Matching Device Id: MMDEVAPI\AudioEndpoints
Outranked Drivers: c_swdevice.inf:SWD\GenericRaw:00FF3001
Device Updated: false
Parent Device: USB\VID_B58E&PID_9E84&MI_00\7&32488f49&7&0000

sacred seal
#

Not sure what it is supposed to look like, but that seems wrong

glacial canyon
#

I have no idea what changed, either.

#

Maybe it's time to pull a w4sted and get something that doesn't work via usb.

sacred seal
#

Well everything works via USB

#

I would try uninstalling the device via device manager

#

I'm trying to find the driver page for it, but I cant seem to

glacial canyon
#

Looks like a spider was hanging around on the mic. Took an aircan to the socket and that end of the cable, plugged it back in at both ends, got the dingaling... and windows said it didn't recognise it.

#

Unplugged, replugged, no dingaling again.

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I'll get a new cable, see what happens.

glacial canyon
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The local shop only had micro usb, not mini, heh. Scan has it dirt cheap, I'll order it after new year.

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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yep watching it now

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We really need a new connector standard

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like actually a good one

mossy gull
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This connector, is the entire reason for me to avoid Nvidia all together this generation.
It's been nothing but problems.

jade scaffold
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the HPWR connector is trash and so is the PCIE Cable

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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It might be worth for future ATX Revisions replacing CPU EPS and PCIE with a unified 12V cable

jade scaffold
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CPU EPS Is really quite high power and with 2 of them you can get 500w or so and thats 16 pins

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8 power 8 ground

mossy gull
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Or let the card deal with different power voltages.
I mean the cards are humongous anyways, so why not put the regulators on the card itself

jade scaffold
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they do

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they take 12V in as primary power then step that down to 0.5-1.5 depentand on load and gpu design and whats not

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theres not really a reason why there isnt 1 cable to rule them all at this point

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some mobos are moving over to 12 VO
GPUs already take 12V anthing that needs anything else can be done on the board

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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cant do power over mobo

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not easilly anyway

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the issue with power over mobo is it makes alot of "noise" which can fuck with pcie signaling as is nevermind Gen 5 or Gen 6 signaling aditionally mobos are already expensive enough as is with how thick they are

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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thats just complex

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you have a mobo with like 5-15 layers you want to put a giant holes though

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yea lemme just rout 20 odd PCIE lanes that have to be of similar length around that

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also then that mobo side connector has to be future proofed af

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because we dont know how much power GPUs are going to end up consuming having the connectors on the gpu you can just plug a cable into prevents that issue by giving you the ability to just add another connector onto your card

mossy gull
jade scaffold
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and next gen will be 500-550w

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the gen after maybe 600

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Some data centre GPUs can Pull 700w at current but they have their own special connector

mossy gull
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The problem is in some US states it's near impossible to run a PC above 1000w.
Which means it'll be harder and harder to make power hungry GPUs

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Not that it won't happen ofcoarse, but eventually they can't go any higher without sacrificing how big GPUs can get.

balmy flicker
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I mean at this point the GPU might as well come with its own PSU at least for the top of the line ones

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how many watts does a 4090 drink?