Tech Lab forum - General Discussions!

[mossy gull]

Still, try to find a CPU cooler that can cool 350w+.

[jade scaffold]

was an amazing win of the silicone lottery unfortunately had a crappy VRM

[jade scaffold]

loads exsist

[mossy gull]

Which the 3090 is known for blowing up PSUs🙃

[sonic meadow]

you dont need to, since cpu coolers tend to work more efficiently on gpus.

[jade scaffold]

theoretically on a standard width rad every 120mm rad should be able to dissipate 200W of heat however due inefficiency especially on modern CPUs they cant cool as efficiently as they'd like

[jade scaffold]

vastly so

300W 1080ti 45C
same AIO on a 5800x
70C

[sonic meadow]

admittedly the 5800x runs hot 😦

[jade scaffold]

one of these pulls nearly 3x the power of the other

yea the 5800x is spicy though cant fault the performance

anyway back to the topic

[sonic meadow]

mines "idling" at 56c on air. (my idle involves haaving chrome with too many tabs open, and youtube playing music 😆 )

[sonic meadow]

about 40w load

[jade scaffold]

do any 480MM AIOs Exsist or am i gonna have to just build a custom loop cos i cooled my 1080ti for a grand total of £75 and i wouldnt mind spending more but dont want to spend £500 just to cool a GPU i'd rather sell the thing and use said extra money otherwise spent on cooling on a 4090

[sonic meadow]

I had a quick look earlier, and didnt see signs of any. even 420 seems to be rare

[jade scaffold]

yea

Right what the fuck its a machine piece of metal the profit they make on these things must be mental

[sonic meadow]

low volume part with multiple fixtures

[jade scaffold]

i almost wonder if i could buy my self a tiny CNC Machine and just bloody make my own

[mossy gull]

That's why I go Alphacool

[jade scaffold]

i would go alpha cool but it just looks mega cheap like i like alpha cool they make some good stuff but their block for the 3090FE is VILE

[sonic meadow]

yeah. multiple parts, each with front and back machining. multiple feature sizes. I could feasibly see this costing them a substantial portion of the sale price just on the machining, let alone any other parts of the production

[jade scaffold]

awww they have an equally ugly water-cooled backplate

[mossy gull]

Or others make it look overly complex which makes it looks more expensive that while Alphacool cares more about cooling performance over aesthetics 🙃

[sonic meadow]

though I do agree it is stupidly expensive

[jade scaffold]

like i said they make good stuff their CPU blocks like im getting for my Server look pretty good but they make a GPU block and its just really ugly looking if they make a solid one with no acrylic or lighting on it i'd get that but i cant see one

and EK Blatantly overprice everything they make

They do solid ones for Reference Cards why are you like this why make super ugly ones for the FE ones and nice ones for the Reference

[mossy gull]

https://www.alphacool.com/shop/gpu-water-cooler/nvidia-fullsize/?p=2

Found a few of each

Yes ish in Deutsch, you have to put the website probably in English

[jade scaffold]

literally not seeing any non acrylic 3090FE blocks

this is all they offer for the 3090FE

[jade scaffold]

thats not FE

thats reference

[mossy gull]

They aren't the same?

[jade scaffold]

no

[sonic meadow]

nope

[jade scaffold]

Reference is Board Partners

FE is NVidia

[sonic meadow]

for one, the reference board is rectangular, while the FE has the triangular cutout

component layout is different too

[jade scaffold]

Reference

[mossy gull]

Seriously, NVidia does my head in sometimes

[jade scaffold]

FE

FE Used to use reference

[mossy gull]

Which is still is for both Intel and AMD🙃

[jade scaffold]

but then NVidia wanted to make their GPUs still relativly compact and really well cooled and made T H A T for the flow through

WHAT THE FUCK

that just poped up

[sonic meadow]

hahahahaha

[mossy gull]

So a reference cooler won't fit on a Founder Edition?

[sonic meadow]

unlikely

[jade scaffold]

no

[mossy gull]

That's dumb

[jade scaffold]

WHYYYYYYY

[mossy gull]

MCA

[jade scaffold]

even more anoying not all Board partner boards are Reference

only a few of them are

[sonic meadow]

used to be even less of them were reference

[jade scaffold]

which means if you buy a gpu you have to do so with the foresight that you might wanna water cool it

[mossy gull]

Nvidia likes to give people headaches I see

[jade scaffold]

that not on NVidia

thats the fault of board partners

AMD have the same isue there

the board partners just do what ever they want

[mossy gull]

Nvidia can say "Everyone Reference board"

[jade scaffold]

no they cant

[sonic meadow]

the reference boards arent always good designs

[jade scaffold]

because then their partners drop them and go to AMD

[sonic meadow]

yes, they can. pretty sure its happened a few times.

[jade scaffold]

they can get away with you need to have some reference boards

[mossy gull]

I thought all 4090s were reference cards🧐

[jade scaffold]

but most partners wont stand for here strap a cooler onto this board

for all the products you sell

the issue is reference boards kill any OC version of a product pretty much

you couldnt have you for example 3090 Kingpin if they were limited to reference

[sonic meadow]

heh, kingpin would have just stuck an external vrm on anyway 😆

[jade scaffold]

and voltage control

[mossy gull]

I mean, there was a time, if you wanted your GPU to be the right side up you needed a BTX motherboard 😃

[jade scaffold]

and a comically high power allowance which is the advantage of the Kingpin

wish i coulda desodered my 1080ti Chip and put it on one of the kingpin boards cos that cards VRMs were not happy with what i did to them

[mossy gull]

You know, just use a Vega FE cooler on an NVidia card and you surely will kill your VRAM 😃

[mossy gull]

K!ngpin cards were meant to go balls to the walls

[jade scaffold]

yea they were overclockers cards

[mossy gull]

Sad that NVidia pushed EVGA away

[jade scaffold]

yea

[mossy gull]

And NVidia doesn't seem to care🤣

Idiots

I would be devastated losing EVGA

[jade scaffold]

NVidia arent though they would sell the same number of GPUs regardeless

[mossy gull]

To note that, last time I heard Lenovo wants to become an NVidia partner.

[sonic meadow]

lenovo... of all companies. wow

[mossy gull]

Yes, it's what I heard.
I have nothing against Lenovo though, they make good systems, but a GPU manufacturer, that's something new.

[sonic meadow]

precisely

though I am a tad prejudiced against them. I helped out with IT at a school during the mid '00s. aka in the middle of the capacitor plague. so many motherboard/pc swaps...

I know that they couldnt have known

oh, also a weirdly large number of pcs that nuked their boot tables somehow

all lenovos

[mossy gull]

I never had a Lenovo break on me 😅

[sonic meadow]

The mid aughts were a bad time to be dealing with oem systems

The capacitor plague cost dell(?) millions

[mossy gull]

I skipped tha capacitor plague

[dull garnet]

How many fan should go with my build and I go with CPU air cooler

[mossy gull]

Depends, what's the specs and the case

[mossy gull]

Medium specs wouldn't be so bad with 2 to 4 case fans, but are you going top of the line then be aware of getting serious cooling

[balmy flicker]

Would it be possible to mount a laptop hard drive into a new case without some sort of adapter setup

It should be a standard Sata cable hhd Drive

But I think it's two and a half inch not 3 in Drive

[sonic meadow]

if you have 2.5" ssd mounts, then sure

[sacred seal]

Electrically you should be fine, physically mounting it can be interesting

[sonic meadow]

modern cases with 3.5" drive sleds usually also take 2.5" ssd/hdd as well

[balmy flicker]

I've got a case with dedicated two and a half inch Drive Bays on it but they're designed for ssds not for hdds

[sacred seal]

Most modern cases should have 2.5" bays

[sonic meadow]

connector wise its exactly the same as a 3.5" hdd or 2.5" ssd

[balmy flicker]

Yeah try to save myself a couple hundred bucks in the storage space by cannibalizing my laptop

[sacred seal]

There is no difference between a 2.5" ssd and a 2.5" hard drive other then the internals

[balmy flicker]

one just has the potential of vibrating itself to death

[sacred seal]

Thats something that can happen, yes

[balmy flicker]

Granted I'm half tempted to figure out a way to clone that drive onto an SSD via a Linux boot flash drive

That's for half of my current laptops information is stored though

[sonic meadow]

clonezilla. does exactly that

[sacred seal]

Gparted ships with umbuntu, works well enough and is fairly painless to use

[balmy flicker]

But to do that I need to go get myself an SSD that's either SATA or m.2

[sonic meadow]

well yeah, to clone on to something you need to have said something

[balmy flicker]

Last time I tried to use Ubuntu I lost a hard drive

How hard would a hard drive be to add after the fact to a already built up system

[sacred seal]

Probably not going to save much by using a old drive given how cheap mech storage is, but money is money

Depends on the size of the SSD

[sonic meadow]

trivial, as long as you have a sata+power free

[sacred seal]

If its bigger then your hard drive you are golden

[balmy flicker]

It was about 50 bucks closer to $100 for the SSD

[sacred seal]

If its smaller, its going to be fun if you want to keep your OS intact

[balmy flicker]

OS is on the SSD so everything boots just fine it's just that I'm missing about half of my programs

In theory I have enough spare capacity on my current SSD to hold everything on the HDD but that's only in theory I think I've just got slightly half a terabyte on both drives and they're both 1 TB drives

[sacred seal]

Oh, so you have a OS ssd, and you want extra storage with the option to upgrade that extra storage in the future

Or more accurately replace that storage with faster storage

That should be fine

[balmy flicker]

Yeah well kind of I want to keep the laptop because components-wise it's still pretty good it just needs an OS reset because Microsoft. At the same time I have a little bit of extra spending money with the holidays to buy myself a new SSD equivalent to what I currently have or a new SATA SSD that way I can keep the hard spinner Drive in the laptop and use that as an auxiliary or backup machine

Bigger issue is unless I want to factory reset my current Drive I might run into weird issues due to about half of my stuff having been installed only to my D drive which is the hard drive and having to do an OS refresh after I started installing everything only to the D drive

[mossy gull]

https://www.microsoft.com/software-download/windows10

🙃

[balmy flicker]

Well when I get home from work I'll be figuring out how to mount my hard drive into my case and get it all hooked up. After that all I need to do is sadly download Windows 11 so I can make use of my Intel CPU

[mossy gull]

You have an 12th or 13th gen🧐?

[balmy flicker]

12th got a combo deal that saved my a nice bit of change on an i5 12600k and my mother board

[balmy flicker]

new computer works

[balmy flicker]

now to test it with a very intense game factory Minecraft
signs are good it took less than a decade to load

[balmy flicker]

test went well and the game ran smoothly

[mossy gull]

Oh nice, some combo deals are really nice money savers.

[west mirage]

PC's complete

[mossy gull]

I thought "Why's the CPU Cooler blowing downwards", but then I saw the picture is sideways, nicely done though.
I hope it'll run nicely

[west mirage]

it does

[mossy gull]

Nice Q-code though 😅

[mossy gull]

https://youtu.be/QwETOlLroEE

Worst RGB software awards🤣

[west mirage]

whats that Q code mean

my PC has some start up issues - always has

[mossy gull]

Somewhere in the line of Driver incompatible with BIOS

[west mirage]

but theres a work around to get into it

how tf do I fix that

[mossy gull]

I don't know, you can try updating both the BIOS and the driver.

[west mirage]

which driver tho >_<

[mossy gull]

AMD drivers, I don't know if you have any installed?

[cerulean helm]

Well, bit the bullet and have started a new pc build.
Case is the Phanteks Enthoo Lux 2. I purchased the case in 2019 before it was renamed to the 719. Cpu is 13700k, and I am reusing my 3080. Motherboard is an Asus Z790 ROG Strix E. CPU and GPU cooled by Alphacools Esibaer expandable and servicable aios. Currently the gpu is waterblocked. Will be using 2x 360mm HPE rads from alphacool.
Hopefully the build will be done by the end of the month.

[sonic meadow]

Oooh

[dull garnet]

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/Ckw9Zw

Am buy the part. get the motherboard and the Case.so far

Mind you I'm trying to be a budget Warrior here

I'm trying for best bang for your buck without going oh my God my wallet

[sacred seal]

Personally I would go AMD with a 5800x3d on a tuf instead of the intel CPU.
Disregarding that the CPU cooler is underpowered, would get something beefier.
Ram is about 2x more then it needs to be
Hard drive way overpriced

[dull garnet]

Actually it's like 70 bucks but they see part Pickers doesn't update all the time

And what more beef or should I go for air cold cuz I'm not getting an aio want this last a while

Plus it's my first build

And the one I am buying is a two-stick set

I want to go with 32 but I couldn't find the compatible set

[sacred seal]

Ram is ram, with few exceptions any kit will work. https://pcpartpicker.com/product/vPLwrH/patriot-viper-steel-64-gb-2-x-32-gb-ddr4-3200-cl16-memory-pvs464g320c6k

[dull garnet]

And I'm not overclocking

[sacred seal]

I would only get 64 GBs of ram if you main SC

[sonic meadow]

especially now that we are out of the zen1/2 chips... dark times

[dull garnet]

I want to go RPG Galore

Must be rainbow puke

But performance over all else

[sacred seal]

Well with a difference of 100$s I think sacraficing on the ram is worth it

[dull garnet]

G.Skill Trident Z RGB Series 64GB (2 x 32GB) 288-Pin SDRAM (PC4-28800) DDR4 3600 CL18-22-22-42 1.35V Dual Channel Desktop Memory Model F4-3600C18D-64GTZR https://a.co/d/0M2Fkug

[sacred seal]

If you want RGB and are willing to do 32gbs https://pcpartpicker.com/product/FPYLrH/gskill-trident-z-rgb-32gb-2-x-16gb-ddr4-3200-memory-f4-3200c16d-32gtzr

Got to love PCer, never gives the right prices...

[dull garnet]

So what about my air cooler the thing's Rated up to 200

[sacred seal]

My go to would be a dark rock pro 4, but that is on the pricer side

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/CJQcCJ/scythe-mugen-5-revc-6762-cfm-cpu-cooler-scmg-5200

[dull garnet]

Should I go with 2 fans or just one

For the CPU cooler

Cause I'm run of 5 fan configuration in the case

[sacred seal]

Its less the number of fans that matter and more how you use them

More fans does not always equal better

[dull garnet]

I was thinking about running intakes 3 out takes 2

from what i read that's the best configuration

[sacred seal]

With the case you chose you are probably better off running 4 intakes one exaust, but you can try shoving your 5th fan way back on the top

[dull garnet]

I was going to put one in top in the very back and 1 in the rear exhaust

[sacred seal]

Honestly you will probably get best performance with 2 140s in the front instead of 3 120s

[dull garnet]

Well we can talk about the fans all night so be the be quit best get without Breaking the bank

Cooler

Funny thing is I was just using part pickers to make sure I didn't have compatibility issues

[sacred seal]

There is a big difference between a computer that works, and a computer that is optimal

[mossy gull]

32GB is already enough for SC😅

[sacred seal]

There is supposedly some small advantage to 64gbs of ram in SC

[mossy gull]

Small advantage on medium tier is next to nothing though.
You better can get faster RAM and have the same results.

[cerulean helm]

I sacrificed an old Corsair Lighting Node and was able to connect my 3 pin Alphacool waterblock rgb header to it and have ICUE control the waterblock rgb.

[dull garnet]

i do stream little and play star citizen so go the i5 or i7

with i should i go for

[mossy gull]

If you want to stream go i7 or Ryzen 7.

If you stream you want something with extra cores

[dull garnet]

I've already bought the motherboard

[mossy gull]

I just put 2 CPUs of identical performance on the table😅
I can't remember what everything has sadly enough 😅

[dull garnet]

This is the board am get

I could get i9 but that's like almost a 100 more

[mossy gull]

The question is, will it really benefit over the i7

I would currently stick with the i7 and then get 32GB RAM

[dull garnet]

real sad I cannot find a 32 stick kit that's 3600

That was compatible

So I'm going to 64 kit

Which I know is complete Overkill

[mossy gull]

Why isn't it compatible?
Any DDR4 RAM will fit in a DDR4 slot

[dull garnet]

Oh I thought you have to make sure it was compatible with the board

[mossy gull]

Nope,

[dull garnet]

Good to know I probably just saved myself 50 bucks then

So far I've only gotten the board and case

[mossy gull]

@dull garnet
Some manufacturers have a list with "validated tested" RAM, but they can't test all millions of RAM sticks out there, so the list usually is pretty small.

[dull garnet]

K

Go with 3060ti I do not see the point go 4k for games

[mossy gull]

My laptop was tested till 32GB RAM, I texted with Asus about it because I wanted 64GB, and they said 32GB is just what they validated, it'll probably support more.

[dull garnet]

Good to now

Is the 3060 TI the best option for 1080p gaming at basically high-endish

I really don't want to spend more than I want to say $700 on the graphics card

[mossy gull]

It's enough for 1080p higher settings, but at 1440p it may lack a bit because of its 8GB VRAM

[dull garnet]

So don't go with the ti variant then

Cuz I do play Star Citizen

[mossy gull]

All I can say with more modern titles 1440p can use around 10GB VRAM

[dull garnet]

I only have 1080p monitors anyways I don't see the point going past 1080 right now considering most games just upscale technology the resolution

[mossy gull]

Get the 3060Ti, and if you upgrade the monitors get the next gen with more VRAM is I would do

[dull garnet]

Maybe by tax return the 3080 will go down but that's probably overkill for what I'm doing

This has been very helpful thank you I've been getting different information from different people with different opinions what should go in a computer

[mossy gull]

Nothing is overkill with GPUs only if you use less than 20% of the GPU😅

[dull garnet]

True that

I'm planning on running a five fan configuration with a air cooler is that good or is that complete Overkill

I'm trying to make this computer last 10 years

Hopefully by then I have a better job

[mossy gull]

Better too much cooling than not enough

[dull garnet]

Three intakes to exhaust is what I've read is the best. in dimension return

[mossy gull]

As long you have intake and exhaust its good

[dull garnet]

K

Get the 4000d airflow case

[mossy gull]

Nice case

[dull garnet]

Much better than the computer I currently have with is xps 8930

Dell makes pieces of crap

No intakes one exhaust fan

[mossy gull]

I am so sad the XPS only became uglier

[dull garnet]

Plus it really doesn't lend itself concern it's a compressed case to upgrades

When I finish this build I'm just going to give it to my sister

But she just has an HP Notebook that's on its last legs and she's an artist

[mossy gull]

Poor sis

I know how that feels

[dull garnet]

And a real Tech question which 3080 is good cuz I don't plan on overclocking

[mossy gull]

The founder edition🧐

[dull garnet]

With is most expensive

[mossy gull]

I don't know, I am not really following prices currently

In the Netherlands the 3080 costs the same as the 7900XTX

[dull garnet]

For ram 3200mhz or 3600mhz

[mossy gull]

I personally would go with 3600MT/s

[dull garnet]

K with cl should From what read low the better

[mossy gull]

Indeed, lower is better

[dull garnet]

So the 1st number and the rest doesn't matter

[mossy gull]

Well, the question is, will you notice

Keep in mind you have to turn on XMP or whatever it's called these days in the BIOS to get the RAM to 3600MT/s

Sometimes it's like 1 fps difference

[dull garnet]

Probably not going to do that

Want go g skill

[mossy gull]

I have everything Corsair because it just works easy for me with the RGB shinanigans 😅

[dull garnet]

G.Skill Trident Z Neo Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) 288-Pin SDRAM PC4-28800 DDR4 3600 CL16-19-19-39 1.35V Dual Channel Desktop Memory Model F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC https://a.co/d/hDAE7Wp

everything but my CPU cooler is corsair

And my bored

Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 SE CPU Air Cooler, Dual Tower 6 Heat Pipe, Dual 120mm TL-C12C PWM CPU Fan, for AMD AM4/AM5/Intel LGA 1700/1150/1151/1200, AGHP Technology, Aluminium Heatsink Cover https://a.co/d/dJCAItj

That the cooler go with

Should get hub or use splitter

[mossy gull]

I don't know, some cases come with 1, others don't

[cinder lagoon]

Splitter for any fan amount per header below 4 - should be OK

[dull garnet]

Get rgb one and 4pin

[ripe pike]

https://pcpartpicker.com/user/rossaaron460/saved/DFJYdC

is my pc good enough for star citizen

im about to pull trig on it

[mossy gull]

Those SSDs are way way overpriced

I also would go for a cheaper motherboard

You don't need a Crosshair motherboard unless you go serious overclocking

You'll be fine with a Strix B550

And get an Crucial P3 as SSD, they're like 100.- per terabyte

Or a 970 Evo is also good enough

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/KKmPTn

[mossy gull]

Around the same price and at least twice the performance.

Unless you mean that's your current PC then it should be decent enough, but I wouldn't build it with the specs you showed us.

[ripe pike]

oh i forgot this is built

already

and it cost like 1200

some of these parts i took out of corporate rendering rigs that were being thrown out

[mossy gull]

Ah, fair enough, it is enough for SC, but I recommend you install SC on 1 of your SSDs

[ripe pike]

gotcha i JUST got a samsung evo 512 gb JUST for star citizen and arma

hopefully that will be enough

[mossy gull]

Which Evo?

[cerulean helm]

I have an 850 and 860 Samsung SSDs. My first 850 died at 4 months old. That was fun. New build I'm going with NVME. Can get a 1TB 980 for $90. I want to get a 2TB version for my spare drive but those are still $200.

[ripe pike]

i think 850 pro

[mossy gull]

Ah, fair enough

[ripe pike]

i also have a 2 gb barracuda hdd that i need to slap in there

[mossy gull]

I would go with the 970 Evo Plus, this SSD has a DRAM cache while the 980 doesn't

[ripe pike]

the m.2 slot?

one

[mossy gull]

Yes

[cerulean helm]

Wait even the 980 pro doesn't have DRAM cache? I wasn't aware of that.

[ripe pike]

Do I have fast enough ram

Wasn’t sure if I was stupid getting the vengeance

[mossy gull]

I mean the 980 doesn't have it, the 980 Pro does, but it isn't worth the extra price unless you are a very heavy user.

[ripe pike]

If I didn’t get a MacBook I would have had a better budget

[mossy gull]

DRAM is a chip with volatile storage on the SSD to increase the durability of the SSD.

[ripe pike]

Gotchu I was talking about ordinary random access memory

Like the big ol sticks

I haven’t been into building for years. My last gpu was a gtx 460

And @mossy gull my ssd has some dram

Both of them do

[mossy gull]

Back in the day all branded SSDs had them, currently not anymore

[ripe pike]

So I gotta check when mine were made?

[ripe pike]

Can I check in the bois menu or in my pc?

[cerulean helm]

I should have all my pc parts by the end of next week. Now I just need to research what case to use as a media server for my 8700k that I am replacing,

[mossy gull]

You have to look the specs up online if they have it listed at all.

[mossy gull]

ITX or ATX board

[cerulean helm]

ATX

Was looking at Silverstone GD09B HTPC

[mossy gull]

I was looking at the SilverStone SST-GD10B 🤣

[ripe pike]

I have a sun microsystems atx workstation

If anyone knows what that is

[mossy gull]

Do those still exist

I have an old Dell laptop rebuild into a media machine in self build case

[cerulean helm]

Ohh, I can fit my old 1080 thats been sitting in that Silverstone HTPC case. The 2080 ti won't fit. But I kinda figured that, lol.
But that build is for way later.

[ripe pike]

It’s a relic

You guys have to see my retro setup

[mossy gull]

I want to build my room to make it look like the 400i

[ripe pike]

Cut out some systems

[mossy gull]

That's a lot of old junk🙃

[ripe pike]

History

Lol

Also I don’t think anyone here is into amateur radio

So I won’t bother showing it

[mossy gull]

Don't worry, I think it's awesome if someone has those old consoles.
And no, I am not into amateur radio, but I like the looks of it at times.

[cerulean helm]

I only have my N64 left, my Sega Genesis was sold when I left for college many years ago. That irritated me to no end.

[ripe pike]

not the genesis

[cerulean helm]

Still have my OG Game Boy and Game Boy Color. And somehow all the games still work and the batteries in the cartridges haven't died.

[ripe pike]

damn

[ripe pike]

my first game was blue sapphire

[mossy gull]

My oldest "game" console is a defunct satellite prototype 🙃

Just joking, my X360s is my oldest.

[cerulean helm]

I haven't used a console since the PS3 days. I think the last time I turned that on was to pull off images and music from it 10 years ago, lol.

[mossy gull]

I want to rebuild my X1 into a small PC

[sacred seal]

I would agree with Littles recomendations, but I would also suggest dropping the AIO, way to expensive and you will get better value by putting it towards a better CPU

[cerulean helm]

Honestly the LCD versions of Corsairs AIO have a bad rap. Ive seen dozens of reprts of the LCD screen just dying or causing the pump to heat up raising the cpu temp.

I have an older H115i Pro and thats worked fine for years. But I am switching to Alphacools Eisbear Aurora 360. And somehow that is less money than the H100i .

[ripe pike]

oof i already have the aio and the 5600x is super hot

so it makes sense for me until i upgrade to the next generation

i like the lcd one because i can see the temps at all times and i only have a single monitor

[sacred seal]

5600x is one of the cooler parts on the market. Can easily cool it for less

[ripe pike]

really?

i notice higher temps than my old i7 lol

and i was running a shit cooler

[sacred seal]

Parts in general have gotten a lot hotter, but if you are seeing abnormally high temps with it something is probably off

[ripe pike]

Def not this issue

i only have a single monitor for now

[sacred seal]

My brothers rig has a 5900x which is basically two 5600xs glued together and it stays under 90 when fully loaded

[ripe pike]

mine never went higher than 75

bottom one is cpu surface temp

[sacred seal]

As I said, parts in general have gotten a lot hotter

They are rated for operation over 100 degrees, so if you are keeping them under 90 stuff should be fine

[ripe pike]

okay great

[sacred seal]

For the price of the AIO you could get a pretty cooler and a cheap monitor, not that that is a partuclarly good option

Given that that is a 240, there is actually a decent chance it will even be a better cooler

[ripe pike]

Yeah but I already bought this 😭

I might just keep this and save for the monitor

I have better thermal paste I haven’t added yet

[cinder lagoon]

Anybody got any experience with debugging C (The basic basic one) in VSCode on windows?

Can't seem to be getting it to work...

[sacred seal]

Why are you using VS code for C?

[cinder lagoon]

I like VSCode and Uni forcibly advises me to use C

[sacred seal]

I would personally look at VS studio for C, I don't believe code has full intergration which could be why you are having some issues with debugging

What are you doing that your uni is requiring you to use C? C++ I can get because of pointers and memory management, but C?

[cinder lagoon]

Nah we have a C course and I procrastinated long enough that I have 2.5h left before it's overdue sooo...
I will try VS Studio

[jade scaffold]

Got wired hand pass through for VR Chat
for standard avatars with no setup I can emulate index controllers but for custom avatars i have full on quest finger tracking
still need to wait till a reasonable time of day for my friend to get on so she can sort what needs to be sorted for the avatar for full on finger tracking

[mossy gull]

https://www.thessdreview.com/our-reviews/nvme/phison-ps5026-e26-reference-design-pcie-5-0-2tb-nvme-m-2-ssd-preview-things-just-got-a-whole-lot-faster/3/

10GB/s

SSD

PCIe 5.0

There was a time 150MB/s was revolutionary on an SSD🧐

[jade scaffold]

yep SSD Tech has been some of the fastest progressing tech in the industry

i mean people though SSDs wouldn't be replacing HDDs in data centres anytime soon

but they are just that much more power efficient and storeage dense that they pretty much have done in all the super large companys

[surreal moss]

Tbf the ssd san my employer installed a few years ago wasn’t cheap. The rest of our physical stuff is still using the cheaper hdds

[jade scaffold]

dater centre SSDs arent cheap

but to big companys it literally does not matter if that upfront cost is 5x what a hardrive would be
the extra density saves money in the space needed for your servers as well as the efficiency of the servers reducing power costs long term

[surreal moss]

In my experience a big company will take reliability and performance over saving space

[jade scaffold]

its a balance

Saving space saves lots and lots of money especially if a company is renting space in a data centre Being more data dense regardless saves you shit tonnes of money because you need less computers for the same amount of storage which means savings in electricity
not to mention the absurd reliability of data centre SSDs makes them far more reliable than a hardrive and being NVME SSD in some form of Raid Array much much faster

[cinder lagoon]

I just fried the fan controller on my rPi CM4 IOBoard ;-;

Shorted the PWM tach pin with 12V 90W while trying to get the fan off...

I hope it didnt affect the CM4 itself, even the IO board now costs 44€... I bought it for 35€ ;-;

The i2c bus the rtc and fan controller were on is fried ;_;

Do you think I should ask for RMA?
This is the second board with these symptoms but I know that I actually caused this one...
I've even seen the fan controller emit a yellow glow, where now is a little black dot... even if I buy a new board, the problem might have gotten to the rPi itself tho it seems to be working fine...

[mossy gull]

I guess I need some advice, how do you make a powerful PC component energy efficient 🧐

[jade scaffold]

Depends on the component and who it's made by

If you got a gpu that allows you to change voltage turn voltage down slightly stress test if it's stable repete till you can't go any lower CPUs are the same

Can actually reduce thermals without loosing performance this way or if you are good at tuning you can get a tiny bit more performance due to the increased efficiency gained by lower temperatures

[mossy gull]

Ah okay, I will try, I have a R7-5800X and 6700XT, sadly my 6700XT is sadly voltage locked

[jade scaffold]

Yea you can reduce power usage by turning the power limit down but your unlikely to maintain performance

Cpu you can undervolt though

[mossy gull]

I will try soon.
Last time I couldn't make it work other than limiting the wattage.

[jade scaffold]

Some cpus don't undervolt as well as others scilicone lottery still applies

[mossy gull]

I know, which sucks ass😅

[cinder lagoon]

cap the framerate

Really helps much

[mossy gull]

I do at 100fps because my monitor is 100fps

[cinder lagoon]

Also just try some things and graph it with afterburners OSD
turning down Game settings like shaders and mesh quality will also help you but textures and post processing wont

[cinder lagoon]

Try 85, feels pretty much the same

Orient yourself at this graph from the 4090

Powerdraw goes up exponentially above 100% but FPS rises logarithmically until 80% soooo...

I'd say try to graph your GPU kinda the same and then go for (here) 60%, because there, FPS gains are reminiscing returns compared to power draw

[mossy gull]

I will try that, I hope it feels good enough though 😅

[cinder lagoon]

If you go for the power target test you can probably keep it at 100

[mossy gull]

I just hope I can stay under my power target😅

[jade scaffold]

Why you trying to keep power down?

[mossy gull]

Well, in my country they raised electricity prices from last year 0.21 per KW to 0.96 per KW to now 1.11 per KW.

So now I pay a lot for electricity alone

[jade scaffold]

Ahh

Make sure you have Widows set to prioritise power draw over performance too otherwise you gpu will idel at 30%power

[mossy gull]

I didn't know it did that much so I left it on balanced😅

[jade scaffold]

Yea my 3090 I found was running hot at idle thought my cooling was dying turns out it was pulling 120w

Literally at idle for like no reason

Tbh I don't think setting it to power efficiency actually effects performance there's days just stops silly idle power draw

I might test that actually

[sonic meadow]

there are several situations that can prevent an nvidia gpu from going into their lower power modes. (or at least was, havent really looked in to it lately). the big one that I noticed ages ago was having more than two monitors, wouldnt surprise me if there was other stuff that could do it too

[jade scaffold]

Yea

[mossy gull]

Well shit, I have AMD 😅

[sonic meadow]

no clue about amd, havent seriously run an amd card in... i dunno, sixty years? 😆

okay. scratch that, my last laptop had amd discrete graphics

but it was a weird system. this was before they had figured out switchable graphics properly

[mossy gull]

Only amazing thing is if you rock a hybrid GPU set-up then even if it runs on the lower GPU it uses the dGPU as a graphics booster

[sonic meadow]

needed a custom driver release, honestly a massive pita

HP didnt release updated drivers for very long, and neither intel or amd did the weird driver pack. I eventually found some people that were doing the magic to merge the two with the switching software/etc

[mossy gull]

I rarely use drivers from manufacturers like Dell and HP, I prefer to download drivers directly from the CPU, GPU and motherboard manufacturer.

[sonic meadow]

as I said, they werent available

the AMD drivers would fail to find the card, and I cant remember what the intel ones did... probably just stopped the switching from working

[mossy gull]

I also rarely use auto detect feature, seems to always break on me

[sonic meadow]

when I gave it to my mum years ago, I told her to never try to update the graphics drivers, it would likely result in a much less functional laptop. though at this point its running an 11 year old laptop cpu

[mossy gull]

I wish I could say the same.
I once had a Fujisu Amilo SA3650 I think it's called.
It ran Vista like a charm.
It had an ePCI eGPU like people have now through Thunderbolt.
But as soon I upgraded to W7 I wish I never did because the eGPU stopped working.
Now it's just in a display stand.

[jade scaffold]

I fucking hate Nvidia

Why use a screw type nearly no one has then why make it so tiny then why make them so weak the right sized screw driver destroys them

[mossy gull]

Cost savings measures.
NVidia clearly wants to be the best while also having the most profit.

[jade scaffold]

Using a tiny Philips would have saved them money as they are more common

Nvidia are just cunts

[mossy gull]

How much I want the best performance in my rigs.
I am tired of logging in to make a driver work, tired of old looking drivers with options that barely make any sense in this day and age.

[jade scaffold]

On another note how to get out tiny toques screw without out literal magic

[mossy gull]

But the Phillips head is under John P. Thompson patent.

[jade scaffold]

Yea and its still so widely available and produced that is Costa nothing

Ya know why it's so produced because its the 2nd hardest to strip the head off

And nvidia went for the shitty toques made out of what I can only assume is aluminium

[mossy gull]

I would like companies use a Security Torx screws, they're 9/10 times more sturdy and you can't use the wrong screwdriver 😃
Too small an the pin in the middle won't fit and too big and it won't fit in the screw.

[mossy gull]

Aluminium is cheap, it actually happens way too much.

So far on every machine I have worked on I have replaced the screws with good quality Security Torx.
And if people want I give them a Security Torx screwdriver that properly fits.

[jade scaffold]

Aha ultra tiny carbon steel flathead to the rescue

[mossy gull]

Anything is better than a Pentalobe screw😃

@jade scaffold every 3090 I can find has a Phillips head screw, not a Torx.

[jade scaffold]

Founders edition 3090

Every screw on it is a torx

And there's like 3 different sizes

There's literally no reason to use them on a gpu as literally everyone else has shown

[cinder lagoon]

Torx is great tho, never strips...

[jade scaffold]

Oh yea sure it doesn't I just watched a perfectly fitting torx bit obliterate one

Use fucking Philips or flat heads. Don't use torx on a screw the size of an m.2 screw then certainly don't make the screw out if aluminium

[mossy gull]

@jade scaffold I just watched GMs vid, and there's Torx and Phillips, just why🤣

[jade scaffold]

Nvidia are fucking cunts that's why

[mossy gull]

I still prefer security torx, gives a lower chance of people destroying the screw

[jade scaffold]

It's a nightmare enough to get the god forbidden magnets off them

Yea bigger torx are fine

Like they are really good

[mossy gull]

Security Torx are Torx with a security pin in the middle

[jade scaffold]

But m.2 sized ones are the pinicle of bad fucking design

I've only sofar got one of them out and that was the obliterated one

[mossy gull]

This is a security torx

[jade scaffold]

Yea

[mossy gull]

I love them as nobody I know destroyed 1

[jade scaffold]

That's the one on the 3090 tiny flathead and pcie for comparison

I can't get any of the other 3 screws out ffs

Don't wanna use my torx bit as it may have well have melted the other screw

Nvidia your cooler looks cool and performs well but can you fuck off with the anti repair shit you massive cunts

[mossy gull]

They're also Anti-MakesOurGPUsCompatibleWithOlderPSUs

[balmy flicker]

I mean they are in cahoots with big power supply and energy look at how much power their cards pull

[mossy gull]

But your old 2KW PSU is obsolete just because NVidia wants people to have a new connector🧐

[amber fable]

It isn't that simple.

[cinder lagoon]

Well, you can adapt ,improvise, overcome

[mossy gull]

Nothing is simple, yet everything is.
It's just the matter how you look at it.

We can send Internet data over just 2 copper wires.
Yet we can't seem to figure out how to do the same with an 8-pin cable on a GPU?

[amber fable]

The cable isn't for data. It is for low voltage power.

[mossy gull]

All I see is an 12-pin with extra pins on to for data🧐

[amber fable]

And only three pins in an 8 pin pcie connector carry 12 volt power.

[mossy gull]

So why not just keep using the 8-pin😃
It works and doesn't melt😃

[amber fable]

Because the 12 pin carries a lot more power.

[mossy gull]

But you can make an 8-pin do the exact same🧐

You only need an extra cable

🙃

[amber fable]

Except, once again, it isn't that simple.

[mossy gull]

To me more logical would be more like in the Mac Pro, where the GPU power goes through the mainboard and uses pogo pins to connect to the GPU

[amber fable]

The 12 pin connector can carry 500 watts. The 8 pin can carry 150.

So at what point do you want to stop "just adding more 8 pins"?

The same reason why you won't find 6 pin pcie power connectors is the reason why the 12 pin is a thing.

The 6 pin carried 75 watts BTW.

[mossy gull]

If 12-pins can send 500w, why can't 8-pin send 350w🧐.
Unless my logic is just weird......

[amber fable]

Because each pin is speced to a higher limit.

[mossy gull]

I still prefer Mac Pro's approach, GPU power goes through the painboard and then to the GPU, it removes cables all together

[amber fable]

That only works if you control both sides of the equation and know the limits of your power needs from the start.

There is no upgrade path with that solution.

[sonic meadow]

Because the ATX spec says that the 6 pin is 75w and the 8pin is 150w. That's why.
Their actual theoretical current load is the same (I want to say around 400w) since they are actually the same thing.

[mossy gull]

People just don't want change, that's why PCs still look the same as in 1990.

[sonic meadow]

A twelve pin has twice the power pairs of an eight pin, and each pair has been rated to a higher current

[amber fable]

Ok, so you spec your new slot to 500 watts. Along comes a 600 watt add-in card. Oops.

And I, for one, do not want to return to the days of boards having PCI, PCIe 1.0, and AGP slots.

[sonic meadow]

The nice thing about those days was that you didn't need to worry about lane availability, if the slot was there it would work

[amber fable]

:/

[mossy gull]

Not what I mean, I mean that there's just traces in the mainboard carrying power from the PSU to the GPU, so you connect your fancy dandy 12-pin in the back of the motherboard, and near the PCIe slot there's another connector just for power for your GPU.
So basically the PCIe connector and the "12-pin" would be on the same side of the card.

You know the Mac Pro actually has like 3 8-pin connectors for people who wanted to connect a normal GPU into the Mac Pro?

[sonic meadow]

That's a thought/idea ive had a few times now

[mossy gull]

If it was up to me I would make every component into a module so it's easy to slide in and out, kinda like Razer Project Christine.

[amber fable]

It is a terrible idea though. For starters: Small mother boards won't be able to fit the slot, and then what do you do to support cards that use it?

[sonic meadow]

You have a cable that can also connect to it

[amber fable]

Yeahhhh. How about no.

[sonic meadow]

I'd it's placed such that it's overhanging on a miniitx board but not a micro ATX, then you could have a cable that slots/plugs in to it

[amber fable]

Motherboard surface area is at a premium though.

[mossy gull]

Take the Mac Pro approach.
Mac Pro. Specific component get power through pogo pins near the PCIe ports.
While if you want to use a general GPU you can have cables that go from 8-pin connectors on the mainboard to the GPU.

We have 2k costing motherboards, more expensive than the Mac Pro mainboard and they're still in the same style as made in 1990.

[amber fable]

And for damn good reason.

That layout is supported by everything, it works really well, and it has pretty much every issue long exterminated.

[mossy gull]

Even car engines evolve faster than PC designs.

[sacred seal]

In what way has the car engine evolved in the last 30 years exactly?

[mossy gull]

In complexity for sure🤣

[amber fable]

Yeah, complexity has gone down a lot from early mechanical fuel injection.

But that is all peripherals and control systems.

[mossy gull]

All I am trying to say is a Mac Pro is a very modular system, just very closed source.

The average joe can replace a component like its replacing a battery in the Nokia 3310.

A normal PC it's too easy to fuck things up for inexperienced users.

[cinder lagoon]

Internal combustion engines have been getting way more complex tho. Just in terms of fuel efficiency. Almost all vehicles nowadays ship with some form of forced induction system and those are really complex

Variable cam shafts; micromanaging, improved exhaust systems; the list goes on

[mossy gull]

For me the PC design just walks behind the facts, yes it works, for experienced people, not for the average joe.

[amber fable]

Yes, it is very hard to plug in a cable.

[sacred seal]

Simplicity limits expandability.

[amber fable]

Also, before you say that people plug in cables wrong, allow me to point out that somehow people plug RAM in wrong all the damn time.

[cinder lagoon]

I also must admit the PC design hasn't changed much, for the better (cross compatibility) or the worse (size, complexity).
But I also do not see any ways it could actually be improved upon

Many ways come with significant downsides that must not be overlooked

[mossy gull]

This is the Mac Pro design, CPU on top and a bunch of expansion slots, the slot that looks like a double PCIe slot is actually meant for the GPU and does have a pogo pin style power in the middle.

[cinder lagoon]

Higher res image

You mean these?

[amber fable]

Ok, now build a mini-ITX system with a card designed for that system. Oh, wait.

[mossy gull]

Thanks 😅

[mossy gull]

You know in a mITX the biggest problem are the cables?
If you let the motherboard carry power traces then you need less cables

[sacred seal]

If you want to evolve that system you have to do everything at once

[amber fable]

A mini ITX board doesn't have room for that.

[cinder lagoon]

That sounds realistic - there is no versioning/step by step approach

[sacred seal]

Need cables capable of delivering more power? New slot standard which means new motherboard

[mossy gull]

All I am saying is to move the power of the GPU to the other side beside the PCIe, which in turn can make the cooler wider because you don't have to account for cables coming out of the side😅

[cinder lagoon]

There are many layers in modern PCBs, where there is place for a connector this size there is place for traces below the surface at least. Just the Power conversion would not fit

[mossy gull]

The motherboard only has to carry the power traces though, like a bypass for the PSU to the GPU.

[sacred seal]

I'm fairly sure 8 and 12 pins were not part of the original atx spec

[cinder lagoon]

I didn't know about the power pins in the pci connector lock. It seems sensible and really do-able tbh. Even if you would plug the GPU power into the motherboard and this just relays it.

[mossy gull]

Also, give the options for both, like the Mac Pro

Fun fact: the Mac Pro has a 12-pin bypass for normal GPUs😃

[sacred seal]

They were added after the fact when gpus started to take more power than molex could provide

[mossy gull]

On the Mac Pro, the power between the PCIe slots is a 12-pin pogo pin style connector, on top there's another ATX 12-pin if needed in case you want to connect a 4090.

Just as a temporary in-between step have both.
Kinda like Plug-In Hybrid cars.
A nice in between EV and ICE.

[sacred seal]

In that case you have redundant system that drive up the cost

[mossy gull]

We have motherboards that cost 1500.- and people still buy them.

[sacred seal]

Yes, but we also have a motherboards that cost 50ish

[mossy gull]

A Mac Pro motherboard is in the neighbourhood of like 450.-, cheaper than a 1500.- motherboard.

Everything has to start somewhere, usually it starts expensive and as soon as it becomes mainstream it becomes cheaper.

[sacred seal]

Creating a standard that drives up the price floor is not a good idea

How many people buy 1500 motherboards?

[mossy gull]

Enough that they still exist.

[sacred seal]

Actually not necessarily

[mossy gull]

If nobody bought them then manufacturers would stop building them.

[sacred seal]

There are a number of boards that have lost money on development

[mossy gull]

Like why do people buy 2500.- iPhones, the group is small but enough that they keep continue building and selling them.

[sacred seal]

They don't exist to be profitable

[mossy gull]

Same goes if you have something new, it starts with a small group, eventually it'll grow to be a new standard or option.

[sacred seal]

They exist to drive up the presived value of a brand

[mossy gull]

I remember the time people thought a navigation device was just a gimmick and were only on very luxery cars, now we find it on 20K costing cars.

If you don't give it as an option, you will never know if it'll work

[cinder lagoon]

You both are right

[sacred seal]

You are conflating new tech with new standards

[cinder lagoon]

Just think about type c/thunderbolt connectors on Motherboards

[mossy gull]

In Dutch we have a saying.
If you don't shoot you always miss.
And computer manufacturers don't shoot so they always miss.

I had a laptop in 2013 with an external GPU, people told me that will never happen, these days, people connect GPUs to their laptops.

[cinder lagoon]

They all were exclusive to >$200 MoBos and certainly >$800 Laptops. Now nearly everything has them, even if just for charging.

[sacred seal]

The current pc bears little resemblance to the early atx based systems. With the exception of the form factor everything has been replaced. But it was done so gradually as tech evolved

We need more bandwidth we went from agp to pci to pcie

[cinder lagoon]

So if GPU & MOBO Manufacturers (like Asus/Gigabyte) would come to the idea to try implement such a Connector, with the fallback option of a regular 2x8 plug that gets a well-designed Plug-cover if unused....
Even if they did it for really top-end Motherboards that would be game changing

[sonic meadow]

Theres what, two parts of the original spec still in use? The form factor, and part of the main motherboard power connector

[mossy gull]

So we also can move GPU power beside the PCIe port as a bypass from the PSU, which would help small form factor PCs.

[sonic meadow]

The issue with feeding power through the mainboard isn't getting into the card, it's the fact that you also need to get it into the motherboard

[cinder lagoon]

I kinda wish, there was a way to ask for such a thing

[cinder lagoon]

Plug at the bottom, near the PSU

[mossy gull]

That's why it's called a bypass, you plug it in for example near the 24?-pin and let it bypass to beside the PCIe so a GPU can feed from it.

Apple does it, so why can't Asus for example

[sonic meadow]

Well of course it needs a plug, that's issue. Especially on the already space constrained mini itx boards mentioned above

[cinder lagoon]

I really do think this thing would have potential but off the top of my head I don't see many other improvements...

I do however also think that passing 400W through a PCB is difficult... tho it does happen on the GPU already, why not on the MoBo aswell?

[sacred seal]

To have the motherboard provide power you need gpus that can get power that way, and psus that can plug into the new motherboards. 3 new parts, each that require redundant systems so they can work with legacy hardware

[mossy gull]

You also can do it behind the board at a 90° angle.
Wouldn't take much more space than tied cables.

[cinder lagoon]

It provides an entry point for such tech tho. Not meant for all cases but as said, on some of the Formula XII or whatever boards I could really see this, but it must come with like 4 GPU models to choose from

[mossy gull]

Rome wasn't build in a day.

[cinder lagoon]

NONO, 2 parts and many manufactureres do actually make both

Or it may be specified as a standart first, like the 12VHPwr connector

[sacred seal]

And in the case of the motherboard, how much power can this new standard handle? The more power the more expensive the board is to engineer, but as soon as you have something that takes more power you are back to square one

[mossy gull]

That's why you start at the premium segment, then when it becomes more developed go to the cheaper segment.

[sonic meadow]

If a board can handle CPU power, it can handle GPU power

[mossy gull]

OLED TVs also use to start at 20K, now we get them sometimes below 1K.

[sacred seal]

You would need custom psu hardware as well unless you want to put expensive power balancing components on the mobo itself

[cinder lagoon]

No balancing, just replace cables with traces!

[mossy gull]

PSU can be a standard PSU, the motherboard only needs a bypass.

[sacred seal]

To which slot? Two gpus on one board is not a 1 to one mapping

Or any other card for that matter

[cinder lagoon]

Only provide it for the top slot! Nobody uses the bottom for a GPU anyways

[mossy gull]

Hey😕

[cinder lagoon]

Well, SLI/Crossfire I mean

[mossy gull]

Or 2 virtual machines😃

[cinder lagoon]

It's like only the top slot is "reinforced" on earlier MoBos

[sacred seal]

But you can plug a gpu into other slots and have it work

[cinder lagoon]

Yes but you can also still have the covered fallback connector on the side on adoption generations

[sacred seal]

Without extra hardware on the mobo you are electrically limited to one card

[mossy gull]

Then make sure the motherboard has more than 1 GPU Power connector😃
If we go 12-pin and put each GPU connecter at the height of the corresponding slot😃

[sonic meadow]

Being limited to only one GPU on consumer boards is not an issue

[cinder lagoon]

The "replacement" part would come in the long term only. During feature adoption it's always an added feature, not a replacement!

[sacred seal]

One add in card that takes external power

[cinder lagoon]

Who needs those damn SATA ports anyways xD

[mossy gull]

I literally haven't used them in years, just got a PCIe to M.2 for extra M.2 SSDs😃

[sacred seal]

And every card is now more expensive because it needs power delivery traces from two different sides of the card for power delivery

[cinder lagoon]

Exactly - 60% of new builds probably don't use SATA, or 1-2 at max

[cinder lagoon]

GPU PCBs literally have a giant empty spot where the power would come from and it's actually not really complex to lay some traces beneath the surface.

[mossy gull]

We have GPUs that cost extra just because they have a watercooler, so instead of a watercooler have an extra connector😃

[sonic meadow]

Pretty sure slot power delivery is already on both sides of the board

[cinder lagoon]

<45W through pcie

[sonic meadow]

And even then, it just gets dumped into internal ground/power planes

[sonic meadow]

75 I think

[mossy gull]

PCIe 3.0 carries 75w

[sacred seal]

There is a big difference in cost delivering 75 watts vs 500 watts

[sonic meadow]

If you were trying to do it over one pin, sure

[sacred seal]

Do it over traces

[cinder lagoon]

Not exactly, the GPU does need high performance voltage regulators and those usually go to power and ground planes. (But I might be wrong, there could be huge interference and fluctuations!)

[mossy gull]

We have CPUs that draw 375w😃, actually 4 of them on 1 board😃

[cinder lagoon]

Traces are not just exclusively limited to the PCB surface!

[mossy gull]

If Apple can do it so can Asus

[sacred seal]

Yes, we do. I'm not saying that it can't be done, I'm saying that it's cost prohibitive for main stream

[cinder lagoon]

...which is why we all say to start with high-end boards

[mossy gull]

And Teslas are only for rich people right?

[sacred seal]

Apple can do it because there is a enclosed system

[sonic meadow]

Asus could do it for their OEM systems like apple does, sure. But doing it for the general non-oem market would require more than just Asus

[cinder lagoon]

There are even watercooled VRMs soo that is not an excuse

[sonic meadow]

It's not like OEMs haven't done stupid non standard shit before

[mossy gull]

Asus has 2 displays on 1 laptop, Acer did it in the past as well.
Why can't a destop PC change?

[cinder lagoon]

They could port the technology over to the high end. Could save costs in RMAs and stuff like that before hand

[mossy gull]

What were you saying?

[sonic meadow]

It's not about the high/low end, it's about standards. Apple sets their own standards, but anything diy-able follows external standards

[sacred seal]

It's a question of natural evelution vs forced

[sonic meadow]

OEM system builders have been known to do non-standard stuff before though, apple is a great example of that 😆

[cinder lagoon]

Theoretically speaking, someone in their design department must've alreaddy thought about something like that... 🤔

[sacred seal]

There is no technical or cost reason to do it that way, therefore adding cost when existing systems still work makes no sense

[sonic meadow]

Non standard power connectors, non standard motherboard layouts, non standard cooler mounts. I could go on, and I'm not talking historical either, but current

[sacred seal]

Apple does it so that there systems can't be as easily upgraded

[cinder lagoon]

RGB VRM Waterblocks

[mossy gull]

I think it's time desktops change a little, not with flashy disco lights(thank you Alienware for that idea), but with brand new connectors that make a PC with less visible cables possible.

[sonic meadow]

Cool, get the enthusiast/DIY space to adopt atx12v then

[mossy gull]

Yet Apple includes a standard ATX 12-pin

[cinder lagoon]

The trend has started already - this would just be an addition actually

[mossy gull]

The Mac Pro has both the 12-pin pogo and a ATX 12-pin for consumer cards.
Apple knows people keep their systems for a long time, so they prepared it so you can use a normal GPU.

[cinder lagoon]

Except they literally software-lock the hardware to itself

[mossy gull]

People made the 3090 work in a Mac Pro🙃

[sacred seal]

But the psu is non standard so as soon as you need more then 600 watts you are screwed

[cinder lagoon]

By bypassing said software-locks tho xD people always did and always will do that

[cinder lagoon]

Rising power consumption is not the future tho

[mossy gull]

Mac Pro has more than 600w, I think it's a 1500w PSU

[cinder lagoon]

Gotta tell you that

[sacred seal]

Yes but the 12 pin can only do 500

[mossy gull]

Rising power consumption is just a stop gap because people want faster PCs in short notice.

[mossy gull]

Yet, you have 2 of them, so 1KW GPU is possible in a Mac Pro.

[sacred seal]

I wouldn't say 2 years is short notice

We used to have annual launches

[cinder lagoon]

Things like semi-conductors are in planning and development for well over 2 years!

[mossy gull]

2 years is short, very short even.
If we had new products each 4 to 5 years then we would probably have a 4090 that only needed 200w.

Not to mention back in the day the 980 used I think 250w?
A 1660 Super which is around the same power uses 150w.

[sonic meadow]

The 4090 needs as much power as it does because Nvidia set it up so that it would use that much. Aka they pre over overclocked it

They wanted to "win", so made sure they did

[sacred seal]

So how do you explain the launch window for the 5000 series through to the 900 series?

[mossy gull]

900 series were like together with Vega no?

[sacred seal]

No, before

[cinder lagoon]

Tadaaa, your 200W 4090

[mossy gull]

If I could I would buy a 4090 and limit it on 200w max🤣

[sacred seal]

Multi year development of gpus is a new phenomenon which loosely corisponds to higher power requirements

[cinder lagoon]

2013Q3

[mossy gull]

I have been too long with AMD🧐

[cinder lagoon]

Actually, you started too early xD
Polaris was kinda sucky the whole way through and up until 6000 series I don't think I would've touched AMD again xD
Don't wanna imagine what came before Polaris...

[mossy gull]

But in the end, I am willing to pay for a GPU with a power connector near the PCIe that bypasses through the motherboard to the PSU.
Then I can finally build small again.

[cinder lagoon]

I would too, just not in the Ultra-High-End

[mossy gull]

I had 2 Vega FE WC, in Crossfire with studio drivers so I could stack the VRAM.
And NVidia only had that option on the Quadros, at 15 times the price.

[mossy gull]

I already would be happy if it's the 7900XTX or 4080.
I don't need to go 4090Tie specs.

I have to build on efficiency as long electricity prices keep rising.

[cinder lagoon]

Kinda same. Don't know 4090@70% power performance tho

[mossy gull]

I am staying with AMD or Intel if they get better for now till NVidia modernises their software.
The NVidia software is what pushes me away the most currently.

[cinder lagoon]

Agreed

[mossy gull]

Like we're in 2023, and NVidia still has software from Windows 3.1

[cinder lagoon]

Radeon settings actually is a great program

As long as it DOESNT KEEP GETTING OVERRIDEN BY WINDOWS' DRIVER GODDAMNIT NOT AGAIN

[mossy gull]

LONG LIVE THE K..........I mean manual updates.

Nvidia laptop with Maya.
Lets run it on the iGPU😃
AMD laptop with Maya.
You need power, you get power.

[sacred seal]

Only problem I have had with the AMD drivers lately is vendors keep installing there own custom version which never gets updated and is often horribly broken. On my brothers laptop he had to disable the IGPU any time he wanted to play a VR game, and another friend had an issue where the netflix website would cause the monitors to disconnect

[mossy gull]

I always uninstall the manufacturer's GPU driver and just download 1 from AMD.
Works like a charm.

I always had problems with manufacter's drivers not working properly, even on NVidia.
That's why I always DDU them and install the GPU manufacturer's version

[mossy gull]

https://youtu.be/cDRIzS3sGIU

Review of the 4080 12GB

[jade scaffold]

Yea the 4070ti is dogshit

[mossy gull]

I love how good the 4080 12GB is🤣

[jade scaffold]

It costs more than what my 3090 cost me and is slower 90% of the time and is only faster when dlss3 is used

[mossy gull]

For me it costs as much as the 7900XTX.

And you know the rest of the story 😅

[jade scaffold]

Though 3D v-cache versions of ryzen 7000 have been announced which is exciting as well as much cheaper none x versions putting the new ryzen 5 at a rather reasonable 230 usd

[mossy gull]

I found the perfect PC for Australians

[frozen igloo]

I found a 12 pack of arctic p12 pwn pst for $60 though the seller says they have some rub in certain orientation though that is typical of the product, would that be a good deal if I am in the market for computer fans?

[sacred seal]

If you are in the market for 12 fans, then its decent

Concidering that you can only mount a few fans in a case though, and that those are likely not the highest quality, 3 higher quality fans at aroudn 45$s is likely a better value

[frozen igloo]

Might hold off awhile then, i’ve heard good things about those fans (good price to performance without being terribly loud) especially if you use them for a radiator as they are designed for static pressure

[sacred seal]

Given how cheap fans are (for PC components) buying less then the best does not make a whole lot of sense in my opinion. With rare exception a system is going to ship with enough fans that you don't need to buy any, so if you are you likely are doing so to improve performance (cooling or noise)

And concidering you are limited to how many you can put in, you are looking at a price difference of like 60$s at most between a cheap and top of the line part

[frozen igloo]

Yeah, I was looking at a open box o11d evo near me though will likely hold off and get a entire system at the same time, as to why so many fans I would have likely made a laptop cooling pad with the left over fans

[sacred seal]

Even then how many fans are you using? 7 total?

[frozen igloo]

Max of 10

[sacred seal]

If you can make use of 10 fans thats a better value then

[frozen igloo]

There are a few cases I’ve been looking at and if I go with a alternative cheaper case it would likely be 5 fans 3 intake 2 exhaust

[sonic meadow]

some cases can use (but in no way need) a prodigious amount of fans

[frozen igloo]

Like the one I have mentioned above……

[sonic meadow]

the o11d is a silly case (not in a bad way or anything) 😆

[frozen igloo]

What are options on the purebase 500dx that would be a case I would be potentially interested in getting and grabbing a few more purewings to fill it

[frozen igloo]

I’m tempted only because I can reverse the layout and have the pc on the other side of my desk and see inside

[sacred seal]

I would buy fans for a case only after building a PC in it. Often times adding fans ends up doing little to nothing

[frozen igloo]

Still similar aesthetically with fewer fans?

Don’t put a ton on it though still care a little

[sacred seal]

If your fans are not RGB odds are you won't even notice them visually

Expecially with something like the 500dx

[frozen igloo]

Due to light sensitivity it would almost certainly be static or off

[ionic tusk]

Well this free graphics card bracket I finally got since asus shipping took awhile isn’t gonna work

To tall lol

[mossy gull]

How can they be too tall if they're usually adjustable 🧐

[ionic tusk]

Even the smallest adjustment

At its smallest compared to the included one

lol a free paperweight now

Not gonna be held by anything lol so no point of using this

[ionic tusk]

It’s a good thing I didn’t purchase the anti sag bracket cost 79 dollars where I live

[mossy gull]

I wouldn't know, I always vertical mount the GPU since BTX moards went out of fashion

[inland dove]

It finally arrived

The components are a lot smaller than I thought they'd be.

All of this was 120 dollars.

[jade scaffold]

Nvidias screws have eaten my torx bit

So I'm not risking using that on the retention mechanism

Fuck you nvidia for using the most easily damaged screw type for small screws

I wouldn't mind if they were bigger torx screws like t8s

But they aren't they are 5s and 6s with not even a mm of depth so one slip fucks the screw up

T8 screws they do use on the io plate and they have like 3mm of depth to them they are really solid but the back plate and the retention mechanism are certainly sub mm in depth and super easy to fuck moral of the story don't buy nvidia FE cards ever because they make them as hard as is legally possible to take appart

[cinder lagoon]

I already had a doubt your torx bit might be a great one xD
If your torx bit slips and gets damaged by the screws while the screws are also being damaged - that's just a really soft bit and probably the wrong material :P

[frozen igloo]

I use torx for robots in my high school club and we have no issues with any of them stripping out, wonder if it is because we use slightly larger sizes than you have there

[inland dove]

hahahaha

I did it!

Everything went perfectly

And it all works

[sonic meadow]

Nice

[jade scaffold]

Yea Ive never had issues with larger bits but mechanically speaking torx bits that are smaller do slip much easier and are much more fragile than Philips

But again on Nvidias part there isn't a reason for them to have used torx than to screw with the consumer

Nvidias thermal pads are also crumbly af

[inland dove]

I'm very happy with my upgrade.

My 4 gigs of ram was reallllly bottlenecking my CPU and now my laptop runs much better.

[jade scaffold]

nice yea its always nice to have more ram

[sonic meadow]

Yeah. My tablet runs like ass with 4gig ram... And an atom, but the ram sure doesn't help

[jade scaffold]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/593040008928296979/1061315529547190332/IMG_20230107_155322.jpg

ignore how dirty the CPU RAD is

that things like 10 years old and has been passed through like 3 people that dust is just baked into it

looking like at my current settings temps are setteling at 60C when under load

and the computer is silent

The goal is to keep under 65c when having a maxed out powerlimit so that I get the most clock speed out if the gpu Nvidia Gpus begin to slowly drop clock after 65C

[mossy gull]

Nvidia and their dumb heat levels

[jade scaffold]

not really an NVidia thing

all CPUs and GPUs do it the difference is most GPUs cant be forced to run at a clock speed
where as most CPUs can be forced to run at a clock speed

makes GPU overclocking very different to CPU Overclocking

[mossy gull]

But AMD thermal target is 100c😃

[jade scaffold]

Yea for Junction Temps

Core temps are the same as NVidia 85

well actually sub 85

because physics is a bitch and going over that tempurature will lessen the life span of a GPU or CPU core

[frozen igloo]

Anyone know of a good way to reduce laptop thermals? Mine currently idles at 63 with turbo off, the fans are clean though it may not hurt for a repaste, are then any other methods I can use, I already have it undervolted slightly though not to the maximum potential as I was having it crash and didn't spend a long time tuning it

[jade scaffold]

a repaste using high quality thermal past like thermal grizzly cryonought could really help with thermals

[frozen igloo]

I already own MX-4 which is what I would be using

[jade scaffold]

MSI Afterburner can be used to turn down the power limit of the GPU if its a NVidia one

[frozen igloo]

It is

[jade scaffold]

yea that'd work fine too

Unfortunatly CPUs in laptops tend to have their overclocking settings locked down making undervolting them very hard

[frozen igloo]

I had to use throttlestop, my laptop also has a really annoying method of tuning fan curves where it is just a colored bar and not actual temperatures

[jade scaffold]

yea

check the bios of your laptop just incase maybe youll find some voltage controls for the CPU and you can learn to undervolt

which would help with thermals too

but i doubt there will be options to do so

[frozen igloo]

I don't remember anything with voltage in there

I don't think I can access BIOS on my laptop as my LVDS connector is fried

Unless there is a hotkey to switch to external monitor

[jade scaffold]

dont need a connector

you should be able to just load the bios some laptops are a bit weird about it and you have to disconnect the drive to do so but there shouldnt be any need for a connector to enter bios

[frozen igloo]

The issue that I have had is that it boots onto the laptop screen which has no display out

I can enter BIOS just not see it

[jade scaffold]

ahhh

might wanna see if you can get that fixed

[frozen igloo]

Quoted at $600

Fried on mainboard and requies new board or microsoldering to fix

[jade scaffold]

FUCKING Hell

[frozen igloo]

Yeah.....

[jade scaffold]

the Soldering for it is high level if its like Trace Repairs or Bypass's

but i wouldnt charge $600 for it

thats like $120 an hour

[frozen igloo]

The store that quoted can't do that soldering and would replace the mainboard

I don't have a microscope otherwise I would potentially attempt to fix it since I can solder

[jade scaffold]

yea the soldering is really high level but its possible by someone whos skilled

whats actually broken

is it like the traces in the main board

or just the connector for the display

[frozen igloo]

The actual cable socket I believe

[jade scaffold]

that'll just be a ribbon cable socket

[frozen igloo]

The cable wasn't seated in there properly and one day the cable shifted and shorted a few pins

[jade scaffold]

that really shouldnt be THAT hard

i would be more worried about pin shorting damaging the display itself as well

[frozen igloo]

After I repasted and the cable shifted shortly the screen turned on then died, the shop figured that the LVDS connector (ribbon cable socket) itself fried and is the issue

We tried with a new cable because that was busted as well

[jade scaffold]

i guess it depends on the size of the connector too as to how hard it would be to solder but if its bigger than the one for my 3090s Fan ribbon cables really there should be a repair shop that can do that for you

[frozen igloo]

Not my mainboard though same laptop so you can see the size of the connector

[jade scaffold]

yea thats massive

the pins are fairly small like

but ive seen waaaay smaller

[jade scaffold]

yea there should definatly be a repair shop you could take that to to get that sorted

[frozen igloo]

I don't think there are any local that could do it, as it is the nearest shop is a 30 minute drive next closest is about a hour and a half

[mossy gull]

@frozen igloo laptop at 63°C is actually pretty cool for a laptop.
You may not be able to lower it

[frozen igloo]

That's with turbo disabled it's 90 with it on

Locked at 2.6 ghz

[jade scaffold]

yea thats less good

[mossy gull]

I would not lock CPU speed

[jade scaffold]

especially if like its used for gaming

what CPU is it

like which brand

[frozen igloo]

i7 9750h

Intel

[jade scaffold]

Because Intel do have a Desktop overclocking tool that might actually let you undervolt it

i just cant remember what its called

[frozen igloo]

XTU?

[jade scaffold]

maybe yea

[mossy gull]

Locking CPU speed on a laptop is something I don't recommend at all.
If it gets too hot or it is in a less CPU intensive environment it won't be able to cool down.

[jade scaffold]

it will

you cant lock CPUs to a clock so much that Thermal Throtteling wont take effect

[frozen igloo]

It's still adaptative speed, just with turbo disabled, I have turbo on right now, I just disabled it to see if the extra voltage was the issue

[mossy gull]

Thermal throttling is there to save your CPU if it does get too hot.

[jade scaffold]

yes

and its also adapting

theres teirs to thermal throttling not just oop hit 90C time to drop 3GHZ worth of clock speed

[mossy gull]

My CPU on my laptop is like 90°C
4.2GHz in SC, sometimes dropping to 3.2GHz if it gets 100°C

[frozen igloo]

I know, my problem is the fan’s ramp up to incredibly high rpm and the temperature doesn’t drop

90c at idle seems excessive

[mossy gull]

What manufacturer is your laptop?

[frozen igloo]

MSI

[jade scaffold]

this is why i dont recomend gaming laptops except in very very specific circumstances

bad thermals bad upgradability poor portability

[frozen igloo]

I got it a few years ago because I was traveling several hundred miles a week to stay with family because I was a minor

[jade scaffold]

yea

thats a circumstance i can see it being needed

[mossy gull]

I personally never put a laptop on Turbo

[frozen igloo]

On XTU my turbo max power is 200w could that be the issue

[jade scaffold]

but my usual recommendation is buy a desktop and a shitty laptop run pascal to remote onto your desktop and as long as you have internet you have ultra low latency connection to a computer and about 2x the performance you otherwise normally would have

[jade scaffold]

yea try turning that down to 45

dpending on the laptop 30 might be a better bet

[frozen igloo]

MSI GF65 Thin 9sd-004

[jade scaffold]

but for big thicc high end laptops they usually have a CPU power draw of 45W max

then try 30 or 25 if its a thin one

[frozen igloo]

I’ll let it run for a while and see if anything changes

[mossy gull]

My CPU is locked at 45w.
I have better performance than having it unlocked.

[jade scaffold]

yea because attempting to go beyond that will overheat the CPU and it'll throttle

[frozen igloo]

Should I fully disable throttle stop and dragon center and just run xtu and after burner, the only reason I have dragon center is for fan control, speed fan doesn’t work, I don’t see anything in bios and can’t find silent option to control the fans

[jade scaffold]

i thinkso yea

do some tests with different power limits on the CPU see what gets you a reasonable tempurature

[frozen igloo]

Alright, I’ll rebuild my undervolt on xtu as well I think, I used to hit 109c before I undervolted

Dropping the power drop reduced the temperature by 20, I’m moving to the tdp to see if it doesn’t cause overheating, if so I think we have a winner

It is power limited throttling though only about 100mhz slower and it’s not thermal throttling at idle

Would removing my ribbon cable force bios to my external screen, I think the shop that inspected the computer may have left it plugged in, if so I may tear the laptop apart, repaste and unplug that cable

[copper pond]

Anyone know how to do a Cold Reset in a Lenovo?

[mossy gull]

Cold reset?
What do you mean

Also there are like 2000+ different Lenovo machines, without knowing the model it's hard to say

[copper pond]

I figured, i really don't know the model and i currently can't use it, it's going to the workshop soon.
Sorry for bothering

[surreal moss]

Possibly? To me it sounds more like something is up with your graphics

[surreal moss]

You’re good. Are there any like numbers on it?

[mossy gull]

That's okay, usually holding down the power button works, on tablet like devices it's usually like hold Volume down + power.

[frozen igloo]

I haven't had much issue with them, I haven't had any driver issues however I am not able to adjust many of the setting for my dGPU or any for my iGPU on afterburner

[surreal moss]

Model numbers, that kind of thing

[mossy gull]

Depending on the laptop, laptops without a Mux switch you cannot have full dGPU settings

[frozen igloo]

I don't think I have a mux switch

So that would potentially explain that

[mossy gull]

Yes

@frozen igloo 1 thing that can help is connecting another display.
On most laptops it bypasses the iGPU using the dGPU

[frozen igloo]

I only have my external display connected as my internal one is broken

The ribbon cable inside may be plugged in from the shop though I have not opened my laptop since I got it back from them

[balmy flicker]

is this still one of the better three axis stick options
https://vkbcontrollers.com/?product=gladiator-evo-space-combat-edition

[mossy gull]

Yes

[balmy flicker]

finally going to bite the bullet and get a new stick

[frozen igloo]

Came back to the pc a few hours after the adjustments no stability issues and seems to have significantly improved thermals at what seems to be no loss in perfromance

For some reason it was trying to draw 200w

[cinder lagoon]

Yeah, thats toast... sucks...
repairing contacts on ribbon cables is nearly impossible but since the front seems to be intact and a bit in the mid is missing, it might be.

Disconnecting it probably won't help to boot to an external display, the "connection logic" is probably on the board.
Shit like this happens easily because manufacturers (like apple aswell) for some reason tend to put display data lines directly next to 50V high current display backlight power.
You're lucky if it didn't fry your GPU...

Source: Louis Rossman

[mossy gull]

He's not entirely correct, more modern laptop these days just have the display on an "Internal HDMI/Display Port" with some cables to power the backlights and stuff.
But if the cable is broken I wouldn't replug it unless you get a new cable for your display if that's even possible.

[cinder lagoon]

Yeah there's like these devices that can like switch your internal and external Video output between the iGPU and eGPU, without going through the iGPU but I have no clue how they work physically ^^'

[mossy gull]

You mean a Mux?

I mean with most laptops if you disconnect the internal display connector the device won't use it.

[frozen igloo]

The repair shop replaced the cable in a attempt to fix it, that cable isn’t the one inside the laptop

[cinder lagoon]

Yuh I think

[dull garnet]

Should do 1440p with 3060 ti

[surreal moss]

Uh yes?

[dull garnet]

K

[mossy gull]

You can do, just don't expect every game to run as fine though

With some newer titles you can be VRAM limited and you may have to play on 1080p

[surreal moss]

Pfff

I’m reliably running 4k with my 3060 ti

It’ll keep up no problem at 2k

[sonic meadow]

oh, a 3060ti will do 2k easy, it will also do 1440p fine

[mossy gull]

Jimm, I said newer titles.
You can run 4K even on an 980Ti, but when it comes to newer games with much more complex textures you need more than 12GB.

[dull garnet]

think get tuf 2k monitor

have 2 1080p monitor

build a pc

it with i7 12700kf with 3060ti and 3600mz cl 16 ram

[surreal moss]

That should be a pretty decent build

[dull garnet]

i would do 3080 but that out my reach

Still some parts and have the money get cpu and gpu

What a good 3060ti go for

Is there any reason to get a curve monitor

ASUS TUF Gaming 27" 2K HDR Gaming Monitor (VG27AQ) - QHD (2560 x 1440), 165Hz (Supports 144Hz), 1ms, Extreme Low Motion Blur, Speaker, G-SYNC Compatible, VESA Mountable, DisplayPort, HDMI https://a.co/d/90EJXHj

This one think get for 2k and keep one of 1080p

[sacred seal]

My brother runs two of those, pretty nice displays

Note that when dual screening you likely will want to keep both your monitors the same resolution, or if you go with a lower res also get a smaller display

The way windows handles dual screening means that the mouse position across screens is based on the number of pixels

[surreal moss]

Could probably upscale the 1080ps just fine

[dull garnet]

Indeed

[sacred seal]

You mean send a 1440p signal to the 1080p display?

[surreal moss]

My EU rig I upscaled the curved 1080p and downscaled the 4K to 2k

[dull garnet]

I'm getting my sister one of my old pc cause she's getting my old PC

And I have the same brand monitors 2 them 1080p

Same size too

[surreal moss]

I’m not sure exactly how Nvidia does it. All I know is I had the same sized desktop on two different resolution displays

[dull garnet]

I'm not going bigger mainly because I don't have the room

27" almost pushing a limit

[mossy gull]

On AMD we have something called Super Resolution, maybe NVidia has the same?

[sonic meadow]

27" is a good size for 1440p

[sacred seal]

When I tried it with my gtx1080 and a 1080p display and a 4k display I could never get it to work properly

[mossy gull]

Get a monitor with thinner bezels, then you can go bigger display 🙃

[surreal moss]

I was running 2080

[sacred seal]

I could get it to work, but full screen content was always effing itself up

[dull garnet]

I don't have the space to go bigger as you can see

[surreal moss]

I see you too partake in the nectar of the good Doctor

[dull garnet]

Indeed. Should see the rest of my room

[mossy gull]

Vesa stands is how you do it😃

[dull garnet]

My table won't do it they both have to be on single mounds

And it was all bending that

[mossy gull]

Who says you need 1😏

[sonic meadow]

im staring at a double vesa mount in a box by my desk 😆

[mossy gull]

You have Vesa stands for 1 monitors that only have 1 desk foot

[dull garnet]

I know. prefer having this table pushed all the way back because my room is almost a hallway

That's how what I mean when I say my room small

[sonic meadow]

there are also stands (like the one in my box) that clamp to the edge of the desk, and thereforce take up essentially no table space

[mossy gull]

I was talking about these Vesa stands

[dull garnet]

I got one of those it bend my table

[mossy gull]

Wait how😐

[sacred seal]

How? Just the weight bieng too much at one point?

[sonic meadow]

I would be guessing too much weight in the center of the tabletop

[dull garnet]

It was not even an inch stack

[mossy gull]

That's a different mount you used there it looks like

[sonic meadow]

probably a hollow chipboard kinda thing

[mossy gull]

That looks like a clamp type, not a stand type

[dull garnet]

It was a clamp type

[mossy gull]

The 1 I shower is a stand type

Basically a normal monitor foot only meant for 2

[dull garnet]

One problem was that I have no room to under my table