La Resistance - Hit-and-Run Spy

[green blaze]

my idea for an animation for this would just be the revolver animation, with a folded stock SMG

[grand kestrel]

the revolver animation has a lot of recoil, so with the smg's fire rate it would probably look off

[green blaze]

probably.

[green blaze]

y'got any criticisms of the weapon's design?

[grand kestrel]

i guess it's alright
it feels like there's maybe too many stats? i get what you're going for, but it feels overcomplicated

for instance, the cloak move speed buff feels out of place on an smg - it should be exclusive to watches imo

[green blaze]

I mean the initial idea was just the damage to buildings in exchange for damage against players

the movement speed thing was just because i felt like it fit the whole "hit and run" aethstetic

or "schtick" might be the better word

I guess it isn't really necessary since it's supposed to work hand-in-hand with L'escampette

something more like this without the movement speed bonus

[grand kestrel]

i personally don't like the focus on destroying engie's buildings
the revolver has a damage penalty against buildings to prevent the spy from quickly destroying the building he just sapped, so designing a weapon specifically to ignore that penalty doesn't sound like a great idea
it also falls into the danger shield / razorback trap of only being effective against a single class, which is generally not fun for either the user or victim

[green blaze]

I mean, the main reason for it is I've noticed that the interaction between Engineer and Spy is like, overtly biased towards Engineer (and Spy is supposed to be something of a hard counter to Engineer) so I feel like giving you the option to sacrifice some level of PVP capacity to help keep Engineer in line would be nice.

like there are just those stupid spots on maps (especially where Engineer can now just jump around with the jump pad) that Spy is kind of screwed against Engineer (and if the engineer has teammates actively protecting him spy can't do much, and neither can a lot of other classes) so having the anti-Nest camping weapon for Spy I feel would be nice

[grand kestrel]

it's not even that much better at destroying buildings
you might as well play demoman or soldier if your goal is to pump as much damage into a nest as possible

[green blaze]

I mean the stats I added were kind of arbitary but the same concept of "do damage to engineer at range so he can't just camp with a pyro who can block the two other classes good at clearing out nests" applies even if you have to tweak them

[grand kestrel]

spy's main job is to disable buildings to let his team finish them off, and to kill the engineer if he's unaware of the spy
he does sometimes have a good opportunity to destroy them himself, but he's generally not the guy who destroys entire nests - especially if there's multiple engies or a pyro in the nest

[green blaze]

well yeah but when there are multiple engies or pyros in the next it becomes increasingly difficult for the Spy to do anything which is why I feel like he need some kind of ranged means to deal with Engineer so he can still be somewhat useful against nesting

[grand kestrel]

again, it's only slightly better than the revolver at destroying buildings, so it's still not good against nests

you'd be infinitely better off just switching off spy to play as an explosive class

[green blaze]

well yeah and that's why I mean to tweak the numbers to make it good at destroying nests in exchange for the ability to take on players

being able to spam an engineers building at mid range to the point where he cant just sit back and let a pyro deal with you while smacking away at it would be nice

[grand kestrel]

i already established that giving spy a weapon that's specifically designed to destroy buildings isn't a great idea from a balance standpoint

[green blaze]

and I don't think the jump pad is good at a balance standpoint with no cool down and the ability to let engineer get in spots that are annoying to clear out

[grand kestrel]

why are you on about the jump pad now? we're discussing this weapon, not engie

stay on topic

[green blaze]

well you're talking about balance and the whole point of the weapon is to stop engineer from doing stupids hit like that with the jump pad and a pyro

the amount of times i've found engineers out camping in front of spawn in elevated areas with like 5 other teammates holding off anyone from actually focusing on them is ridiculous

christ i am having way too many brain farts

[fossil stone]

A weapon specifically for messing with an engineer wouldn't be very strong nor fun to play against