#Old Gens OU

1 messages · Page 25 of 1

upper plume
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Alright I'm assuming you two had it covered

inner mist
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Yeah pretty much

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If you have your thoughts you can go ahead

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But I doubt it’s anything that hasn’t been said already

upper plume
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What gen is this?

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Also

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!nolegends

karmic geyserBOT
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See rule 6 of #1030567099703242903 message

long ginkgo
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This is not an oldgen ou team

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Also we dont w arbitary restrictions like this

unreal spire
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @cobalt vigil. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

cobalt vigil
# unreal spire https://pokepast.es/e9766ecf7b391ef8 gen 4 rain team

Rain Dance Azelf prefers to have more bulk to compensate for a) its lack of a defensive item and b) be able to survive the 2 turns needed to pull off SR + Rain Dance. You can find a spread on the analysis.
Kingdra is more potent as a Choice Specs users so it does not get worn down as quickly by residual damage. Specs also holds a better ability to threaten steel types such as defensive Jirachi.
Kabutops is better with a life orb than with a choice item. This is due to its typing making it unable to come multiple times on the field and Water/Rock takes good advantage of the lack of lock.
As a whole Qwilfish > Kabutops because it has access to Explosion.
Toxic on such a fast paced playstyle doesn't fit. You probably want some SpeA and Shadow Ball to weaken Ttar and friends.
You ask Bronzong too much; a simple damp rock set with Rain Dance / Gyro ball / Eartquake-Hypnosis / Explosion will work better

tight sonnet
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Any suggestions for Gen 7 ou

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I’ve switched my mega slot so many times

vale lagoon
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Gen7OU balanced offense

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I think the Kartana+Bulu+M-Ttar is good, but the other 3 I’m kinda iffy on

fickle tulip
topaz needle
solid cradle
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yeah you definitely hdb here

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and rilla and pult fuck you upp rn

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eh pult maybe is ifne

fickle tulip
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I won vs rilla 3 times in a row with that version, it's manageable

tropic schooner
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i feel like torn might wanna be some sorta ddance dnite

hasty ingot
gritty scaffold
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Keldeo take choice band boosted rain barra surely u stay alive

tropic schooner
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my issue is this

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252 Atk Choice Band Urshifu-Rapid-Strike Close Combat vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Keldeo: 322-379 (99.6 - 117.3%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO

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or rather

gritty scaffold
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Idt is just a good switch

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Also what ur doing to shifu back bc idk if ur killing it

tropic schooner
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just run dnite over torn

gritty scaffold
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They kinda serve diff roles but ig that works either way im not a ss rmt

topaz needle
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Definitely out playable lol

vale lagoon
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

drifting estuary
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https://pokepast.es/f4d9ab2206d87625
I'm new to showdown and made a team just to play against my mate with some of his input just wanted to see if I did any good would appreciate feedback (Gen 8)

gritty scaffold
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Would be better if u specify the gen while posting the team so u ping the raters (u specify the gen on same post of the team)

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And editing doesnt matter

upper plume
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Uh

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Bot didn't ping

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Wack

gusty jungle
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Maybe without the reply?

karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

orchid tiger
gusty jungle
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srry

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@drifting estuary hey just so you know you gotta put the gen in the same message as your team

upper plume
orchid tiger
hasty ingot
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It looks like you took a team with torn and made it a mew I won't lie

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Double band on two mons that don't really want band is also questionable

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Rillaboom without knock off is quite sad

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No boots removal for anyone

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I agree with making melm 3 attack lefties

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The new slot should tornadus

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And probably SD boom

drifting estuary
hasty ingot
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looks good, tho probably volt over discharge on zap sadly cause you do be in need of some pivoting for melm

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also give garchomp 16 speed i believe that is what is needed to outspeed ttar

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maybe put toxic on pex over knock

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up to you on that

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also could be down for sub > sucker on pult

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or just fire blast

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sucker is kinda bad

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looks fun i may run some games with this

peak canyon
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yes I do insist on using pikachu, but I am welcome to replacing it as well as making some other changes to my team.

upper plume
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what tier is this

peak canyon
long ginkgo
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uhh

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@leaden fiber

leaden fiber
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when i wake up tomorrow

calm spade
long ginkgo
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it doesnt

calm spade
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ik it has a micro niche in gsc

peak canyon
upper plume
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heracross doesn't work w/ spikes to my knowledge

peak canyon
calm spade
fickle tulip
calm spade
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yea i looked at the hercross strategy thing on the smogon website

vale lagoon
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

peak canyon
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btw you can rate the 1st one I sent with Pikachu

hasty ingot
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just so you know

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no extenuating requirements either, just serious teams please! if you want to talk about Pikachu, do so elsewhere

leaden fiber
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Yea like dex said pika is unviable but if ur going to use it

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I'd just steal one of the players teams from this

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pika isnt complete dogshit but the team is bad regardless

leaden fiber
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W. hera u really have to consider what u are going to do with it

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sub 3a with focus is also meh not amazing

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hera checks usually intimidaters and skarmory

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mence, gyara, skarm

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So U should think about how u are beating them down

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Of coures U can use hera to break skarm, in which case you build around a team that trades into skarm with hera and other guys (curse boom lax, cb gross, claydol, stuff like that)

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and then abuse that breaking of skarm

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Against mence/gyara you can slowly slide it down over the course of the game

peak canyon
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so uh, what can I do with my team?
What should I replace and fix?

leaden fiber
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depends on what u want to do

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Like

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many directions u can go with just hera

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with this team specifically idk really, i dont think its super salvegable

peak canyon
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I wanna go balanced

leaden fiber
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Hmm

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probably some sort of skarm beatdown team

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with spikes its kind of weird

peak canyon
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so no Skarmory?

leaden fiber
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sure

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hera lax dol crocune maybe

peak canyon
peak canyon
leaden fiber
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Hmm

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elec and mence i think

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Idk if that even counts as balance

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crocune is surf cm rest talk

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leadzap, aoa lax, dol, sd lefties hera, mixmence, crocune feels weird - no steel? maybe meta > mence, mixmeta?

peak canyon
karmic geyserBOT
agile saffron
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have i been certified to be rater successfully?

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here is my post

upper plume
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Idt it's been discussed yet

peak canyon
upper plume
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Medi is the same thing with heracross

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typically checked by spiks immune pokes

peak canyon
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!smsample

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!samples

upper plume
karmic geyserBOT
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SM Sample Teams
Ubers: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7ubers
OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3695427/
UU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7uu
RU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7ru
NU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7nu
PU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7pu
LC: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7lc
1v1: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen71v1
Monotype: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen7monotype
Let's Go OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3667865/post-8552756
Doubles OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3661293/

peak canyon
leaden fiber
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U can prob run bolt grass twave pass

peak canyon
broken jungle
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Who better in gen 5 chansey or blissey

gritty scaffold
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we only rate teams here but both are for different weathers. blissey you only see in sand stall due to it being able to run lefties, chansey on sun stall

upper plume
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Sand and spikes are too strong

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Chansey is more of a staple on sun stall vs Blissey on any other team archetype

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But sun stall isn't as consistent of style of team

jaunty crater
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I'm still new to this, but how good is this sample team I am using for gen 4 ou? https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/gen-4-ou-dragmag-team.3728529/

Smogon Forums
Gen 4 - Gen 4 OU DragMag Team

DragMag is a playstyle typically employed in Gen 5 OU. However, many of the Pokémon used in these DragMag teams, such as Dragonite, Latias, and Magnezone, are also highly viable in Gen 4 and pose significant threats to the metagame, playing a substantial role in shaping it to its current state...

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It does seem to struggle with dd gyarados tho

fickle tulip
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You're supposed to only send teams you built here

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or teams you built w someone else

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stuff like this is a compgen/compgen 2 question

gusty jungle
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You need to put the format in the same message as the pokepaste

calm spade
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what

topaz sentinel
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @cobalt vigil. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

minor plume
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @azure torrent, @astral thistle, @surreal crypt, @upper plume, @gritty scaffold, @inner mist, @long ginkgo. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

upper plume
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!nolegends

karmic geyserBOT
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See rule 6 of #1030567099703242903 message

upper plume
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you don't need both skarmory and ferrothorn

minor plume
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ima delete ferrothorn

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but i dont know who to use

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on last slot

upper plume
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keldeo improves ur mu into volc

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as it is it can smack your entire team hard

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next, magnezone doesn't actually do anything here

gritty scaffold
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I think scizor wants speed here

upper plume
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and scarf tyranitar doesn't really work here either

gritty scaffold
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Glisc hp ice is also not good

upper plume
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you can keep tyranitar but I'd make it the bulky pursuit trapper

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oh wait it's a hp ice gliscor lmao

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his ass is not lando-t

gritty scaffold
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And u need to.fix those evs

minor plume
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🫡

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ima search

upper plume
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yeah even when you remove the ferrothorn

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you don't have a check to keldeo

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it clicks 6 hydro pumps in rain and you lose

minor plume
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which spA user can i use?

upper plume
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for a keldeo check?

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latios is a great one

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also a great spikes abuser

gritty scaffold
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Scarf lati could work here just make sure u can pressure spinners

upper plume
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Jellicent also works here if you want to maintain Spikes

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If you go Jellicent then you'll need a different form of speed control

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You may also consider a different Ground type in order to pressure Reuniclus in conjunction with Tyranitar

minor plume
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should i go reuniclus or alakazam?

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rn have tyranitar, scizor, jellicent and skarmory

cobalt vigil
# topaz sentinel https://pokepast.es/16753ce1638d3e22 gen 4 ou

You don't have a proper lead; Gyarados does not fit in teams like these especially berry Gyarados because you cannot prevent/get rid of Stealth Rock. Also I can't recommand Scarf Jirachi too much. You may try Gyarados > Swords Dance Gliscor and put Swampert as a lead, but the current Breloom weakness may be too much. Azelf Lead + Gyarados is another issue because you can't OHKO it with Jirachi.
As a side note in order to improve readability, I can recommend you using the following format of Lead - Lead backup - Midgame utility mons 1 and 2 - Scarfer - Late game threat when sharing teams like these.

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Such things helps identifying pre-made gameplans when building / looking at your team

minor plume
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forgot to change excadrill ability xd

gritty scaffold
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Dont use life orb sciz on non ho teams

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Latios here prob better

minor plume
gritty scaffold
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I still think sciz isnt good here

minor plume
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k, ima keep searching

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ty every1

upper plume
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skarm leftovers > rocky helmet

upper plume
minor plume
upper plume
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does breloom help here?

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hmm

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go sash > lorb on zam

minor plume
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but sand storm?

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a

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magic guard ri

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mb

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im thinking about

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if i keep breloom i dont really need focus blast

upper plume
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I mean breloom can work

minor plume
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on ala

upper plume
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nah you still want blast

minor plume
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k

upper plume
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you can change it out for grass knot if you want

minor plume
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i think i suffer against fire type mostly

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or water

upper plume
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latios could help with that

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also helps against thundy and puts pressure on opposing tyrantar

minor plume
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🫡

upper plume
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your alternative is a second volc check

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although you still have tar + jelli

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on tar go rock slide > stone edge and superpower > fire blast

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you also want pursuit somewhere there so that you actually can pursuit trap latios

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in which case you'll want a different stealth rock setter

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you may consider a mixed garchomp for that

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or some of the other options here

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I don't recommend making tar, drill, or skarm your rocker

minor plume
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rocker?

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a

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i see

inner mist
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You may as well use Gliscor over Drill and Latios over Loom

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Latios is pretty customizable here, so you can change it up to be whatever you like

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Alternatively you can go the HO route with Custap Skarm with Tran > Gliscor

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Peng recently updated his Skarm HO team in the invitational

minor plume
gusty jungle
gritty scaffold
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you have fine fire mon checks

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fire mons arent common on bw

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ttar checks volca fine

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and jelly can check heatran

drifting estuary
karmic geyserBOT
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New OU RMT @orchid tiger, @hasty ingot. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

orchid tiger
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@vast oracle for u chatotbot got us mixed up

drifting estuary
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@orchid tiger nah that's my b I put gen 8 on accident pre edit

orchid tiger
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Ahh

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All good

inner mist
gritty scaffold
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Fire moves often suck ig ttar can run on 4th , volca just likes nuking steels. But yea as gamer said fire moves is the least of problems

inner mist
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My issue is that Drill and Loom don't fit on a team like this

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Like I said Gliscor > Drill and Latios > Loom

upper plume
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I agree that Breloom is an odd choice on a Spikes team

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Considering that its checks are not vulnerable to Spikes

upper plume
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(Checks being Latios, Thundurus, Lando)

inner mist
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Exactly

prime juniper
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Hello, I've always wanted to get better at understanding cores. I'm trying to build a Gen 5 OU team around specs Chandelure, and Umbreon has always been one of my favorite pokemon. Latias and Gliscor are my tailwind setters right now but I just feel like I'm always scared of a stray ice beam losing me the game. What other pokemon could I put around these 2 to play a more stally, matchup oriented game where I tailwind at the right time and sweep with Chandelure? Thanks all

upper plume
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Um

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So

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First of all we only rate teams of 6

prime juniper
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it was a magnezone

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sorry

upper plume
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Second of all I think this team is trying to combine several ideas that just don't work, either on their own or together

prime juniper
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What direction should I be going in

upper plume
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So both Chandelure and Umbreon are not good Pokemon in BW OU

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For one

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Second, Tailwind isn't really that good in singles because it's difficult to position an attacker to take advantage of the Tailwind

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Let's consider the order of operations for Tailwind

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Gliscor uses Tailwind

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You have 3 turns of TW left

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Gliscor uses U turn to go to Chandelure

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Chandelure now has to take a hit, because you already have a max Speed Gliscor

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You have 2 turns of TW left

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They switch into a Chandelure counter (Tyranitar, a Water type, etc.)

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You have 1 turn of TW left

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Chandelure is forced out and you don't have TW anymore

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Like

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It's a lot of effort for a Pokémon whose upside is limited

prime juniper
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Okay, I see what you're saying about Tailwind, is it any good if I can run Scarf on it?

upper plume
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Choice Scarf Chendelure can work, but you will need to give it better support than what you are giving it now

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Although there are just better options for Scarfers in the metagame that aren't as flawed as Chandelure

prime juniper
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I figured that would be the case, but I don't need to be pushing top ladder with it, just that its the best team that could be built around these 2 mons

upper plume
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I think Umbreon is completely unworkable

prime juniper
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As a special wall entirely?

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too many superpowers flying around?

upper plume
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You're playing in the tier with Ferrothorn and Tyranitar

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It will get worn down too easily by a well played Spikes team

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And Rain will just brute force through with Hydro Pumps and Thundurus

prime juniper
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what if i ran it in a sun team then

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with moonlight

upper plume
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Umbreon is just a passive wall in an environment filled with Fighting types, sandstorm and spikes

upper plume
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Which is better in every way

prime juniper
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wishsad

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What are most people switching in to ubreon?

upper plume
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If I had a Steel type, I'd switch into that and start clicking Whirlwind

prime juniper
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it sounds like i need a defoger or spinner

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should i use a lati or one of the ground/flyers?

upper plume
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Defog doesn't work in BW

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Clears the hazards you've set, not the ones your opponent has sent

prime juniper
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did not know that

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is my only option spin?

upper plume
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Yes

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Which basically means we're using a Sand team

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Which also means we're not using Umbreon

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Don't get me wrong I like Umbreon as well

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But I can also recognize when a Pokémon just will not work at all

prime juniper
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thats why its in uu, i see

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will Chandelure work in sand? or is it better suited for sun

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You brought up Cresselia, what is it usually doing on a sun team

upper plume
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Well the thing is

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Chandelure isn't really used

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If you want to use a Ghost type for spinblocking, it's easier to use one that isn't weak to Stealth Rock

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Which is why Jellicent (and occasionally Gengar or Rotom) are used

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And Fire types are not super common in BW because of their defensive shortcomings into Rain and Sand teams

prime juniper
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what better scarfers are there?

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so you want non-fire types with fire type moves

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how would a team like this perform if i swapped the alakazam with the choice Chandelure?

upper plume
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I don't think it would work

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Because Alakazam is immune to hazards

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So knowing this the team can afford to not have a Rapid Spin Pokemon

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But if you have Chandelure, you definitely want to start with a base of Chandelure + Excadrill + Tyranitar

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And ultimately I do believe if you choose to build around Chandelure, it'll be the limiter on the team's success

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But it probably isn't impossible to do

prime juniper
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I think I will check in with nat dex RU, to see if i can find a home there. if not, what else could i look into adding to this excadrill tyranitar core

upper plume
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Let's see

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If you have drill chandy tar, you're gonna want to start with a Keldeo check

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That leaves you with one of Latios, Jellicent, Gastrodon, or Celebi

prime juniper
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i like the latis, never tried jelly

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celebi was never a huge favorite

upper plume
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Latios is just the best Pokemon in the tier and lets you check a few other boxes as well (like Thundurus T)

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It also gives Chandelure a partner to weaken opposing Tyranitar

prime juniper
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latios scarf and excadrill what

upper plume
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Jellicent is best fit alongside Spikes but you're running a second Ghost that does Chandelure's job of protecting Spikes

upper plume
prime juniper
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i like that idea too

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av?

upper plume
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Doesn't exist in BW

prime juniper
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ripp

karmic geyserBOT
upper plume
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You just put a bunch of SpDef investment

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Gastrodon is an underrated option as a Keldeo check that also can take on non-NP Thundy T well

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It also gives the team a soft check to physical attackers like Mamo and Cloy

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Celebi can pass Substitutes which is very handy for setup Pokemon or Pokemon that are simply just very bulky

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It also deals with Thundy well and matches up better into the Psychics (namely Alakazam)

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Celebi is an interesting option since it can draw in Steels and Fires for Chandelure to take advantage of

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Alas, Chandelure doesn't have Grass Knot

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It must settle for Energy Ball

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Or Will o Wisp actually

prime juniper
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i guess i figured "Strong Scarfer" would fit on more teams, but i see it takes more than that to fight with the best of them

upper plume
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I might run a Chandelure with Leftovers so it doesn't take chip damage from your own Sandstorm

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Anyway, after picking a Keldeo check, I would fill out the rest of the team from there (Stealth Rock setter, Ice resist, etc.)

prime juniper
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played a dozen or so games with this, it feels good but i only really had one game where i got to use ferothorn

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is latios a good lead usually?

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i can also imagine i dont need both celebi and latios

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gonna try and swap celebi for jellicent

upper plume
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I know you have a Chandelure

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But this looks extremely weak to Volcarona

prime juniper
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even post jelli?

upper plume
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Maybe Jelli fixes that

prime juniper
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what if i put a rock move on ttar

upper plume
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That can work

prime juniper
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over crunch?

upper plume
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Rock Slide > Twave

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Also your Tar needs more Spdef

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Also, if your Ferro has Rocks you don't need Drill to run it

prime juniper
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is ctunch more valuable than twave

upper plume
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Give it Iron Head

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Yes

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Lets you pressure Reuniclus with Tar

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Reuniclus can literally set up on Crunch less Tar

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(This would've won me a set in tour but I got crit)

prime juniper
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rain teams have been no problem so far

upper plume
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Go Trick > Dark Pulse on Chandelure

prime juniper
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giving away the scarf defeats the purpose of using the chand no?

upper plume
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There's surely a better move than Dark Pulse tho

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Maybe HP Ice?

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Yeah I'd do that

prime juniper
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i like that, i was thinking to use it for latis but hp ice works just as well and hits more

upper plume
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Lets you weaken Dragonite

prime juniper
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what should i run on jelli

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i have taunt recover tox wow

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lefties water absorb

upper plume
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Night Shade > Tox

karmic geyserBOT
prime juniper
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eject button looks cool

upper plume
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It's mainly for use on HO teams

prime juniper
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mold breaker is right for excadrill right?

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ho?

upper plume
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You can go either Mold Breaker or Sand Force

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HO = hyper offense

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Basically teams that forgo playing a weather war and just stack attackers

prime juniper
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i dont know if i should be running a choice item on excadrill or not, so far ive liked the ability to remain flexable but running sand force and choice scarf or sand rush and choice band seem tempting

upper plume
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Sand Rush is banned

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And no, a choiced Drill isn't really that good here

prime juniper
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latios is super fun to use

upper plume
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Oh yeah Latios is busted

prime juniper
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come in and click

upper plume
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Time to plug my Latios meme

prime juniper
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truly a gifted mon, one worth staying in the meta

upper plume
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Not broken whatsoever clueless

prime juniper
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thats what i feel ive been doing, just looking for the right meta to use some of my fav mons. gen 5 is easily my favorite OU, but as you can probably tell the mons i like using are UU at best, and no one plays any of the smaller formats theyre never on showdown

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do you have any other favorite formats?

upper plume
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I have a soft spot for BW OU and BDSP OU

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And I also like their UU tiers as well

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I also like ADV OU and GSC OU

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Anyway I have to catch a flight

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Good luck with the team

upper plume
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One is to ask in the Ruins of Alph room on Pokemon Showdown

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Two is to ask in the respective tier's rooms on Pokemon Showdown (so if you wanted to build a team in BW UU to feature Umbreon, you could ask in the UU room on PS)

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Third is to check various Smogon-affiliated Discord servers

karmic geyserBOT
upper plume
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In this case, to play BW UU, you can ask in either the BW Discord server or the UU Discord server

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Last is to wait for the tier's ladder to appear, which will get you games with other people more easily

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However, the tiers that appear will rotate each month so you aren't guaranteed to see the tier that you'd like to play

calm spade
inner mist
#

There were a couple of stall teams with Umbreon that I saw years ago, I think Dark Eeveon used it? Or Dice? From what I last heard Dark Eeveon attempted to use it in Sun.

#

It's a really weird team though, so I would not recommend it if you are a newcomer to the tier

#

(Just remember to change the Latios set since Gems are banned now)

calm spade
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @weak mirage, @red delta, @night bridge. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

calm spade
#

i think id want gengar for this team

night bridge
# calm spade https://pokepast.es/2c2b81ffe28691b7 Gen 1 OU i wanted to god for a more HO buil...

chanseyless is certainly fine but "HO" isn't really a term that applies to RBY at all. Few notes:

  1. Persian should always run Body Slam over Hyper Beam. Body Slam lets you break Snorlax Rest loops by going for Slash - Slash - Body Slam; on a noncrit they have to Rest again or die to Slash, and on a crit you KO.
  2. Rhydon has zero reason to run Hyper Beam. IMO drop HBeam + Rock Slide for Substitute + Leer to give your team more Lax answers, freeing up Persian to take out a Starmie or something.
  3. Your Egg needs Stun Spore over Mega Drain here probably; you don't have nearly enough paralysis spreading on this team.
  4. Icelax is absolutely not it on a team like this. If you ask me greed a bit and go Hyper Beam.
  5. Optional but I think Tbolt on Tauros might be nice here, you already have a lot of ways to answer Rhydon and not nearly as many for Cloyster
#

If you're newer I really can't recommend dropping Chansey at all though

calm spade
night bridge
#

i would switch ice beam on lax for hyper beam

#

persian is a lax check

#

rhydon is a lax check

#

let your lax provide some offense into chansey and starmie instead

#

basically what you do is

#

you make lax rest and right as it rests you go to cat and start slashing away at it

#

or you can send rhydon in to leer it so you can break it despite reflect

#

any reflax can force enemy lax rest

#

which is your in for the other stuff to force their lax out and get progress

#

persians nice for this cause starmie and chansey don’t want to switch into slash even if not paralyzed

#

too risky

#

basically your goal is force their lax out in an uncomfy spot and trade for something on top of that with one of them

#

then you can likely use the other to break past lax for real the second time

calm spade
#

alr tysm

night bridge
#

np

sacred flume
gritty scaffold
#

you need to mention the name of the format alongside pokepaste

#

so you tag the rmts

upper plume
#

Do you need two Mega Pokemon?

#

I feel like if you mega either Mawile or Venusaur the other will be completely useless

sacred flume
#

I forgot that I have two megas

upper plume
#

Yeah

#

You may want to fix that

sacred flume
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

flint ridge
#

U don’t need 3 fog brah

topaz sentinel
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @cobalt vigil. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

calm spade
#

idk much abt dpp but doesnt this team get mowed by cm clef

topaz sentinel
#

I thought gyara and meta could deal w it

calm spade
#

ig

#

but metagross is prolly not gonna be alive when the opponent reveals clef

topaz sentinel
#

Weirdly enough even despite being top 5 in the meta it’s like not super common for me at least

calm spade
#

prolly ladder weirdness

calm spade
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @half jungle, @silver reef, @fresh thistle, @red delta. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

olive stag
#

Been running this team for a while in Gen 8 OU and I'm pretty happy with it. I used to have toxic on Heatran and rocks instead of spikes on Ferro. Lately I've been thinking of having Ferro be spdef and lando be physdef but I'm unsure. I'd also love to have a second regenerator Mon but don't think that's possible

https://pokepast.es/6392f2e4f942565a

olive stag
#

Ye it's better when melm is more popular. What do you mean by unmove on it?

olive stag
#

I appreciate your help and I dont want to sound rude but no melm beats this zone set because of the mag rise as long as you don't blind switch into a super power

#

Also it beats excadril if you get a safe switch in and don't get filched on the iron head

flint ridge
#

I think this team lacks a breaker

fresh thistle
#

For this reason I recommend replacing Exeggutor with Cloyster

#

While this makes it more difficult for Machamp to get past Zapdos, Cloyster and Golem can target Zapdos with Explosion fairly often

#

You may also want to replace double edge with body slam on Snorlax to help Machamp break through Skarmory

#

Roar on Houndoom is a decent option to try to force Pursuit targets in, but Houndoom rarely has turns to click it

#

Sleep Talk is an option to consider to make Houndoom a better answer to Sleep Powder Eggy, Lovely Kiss Jynx, and Hypnosis Gengar

#

Houndoom still checks these mons without Sleep Talk, but ST makes Houndoom a little less exploitable

#

Replacing HP Bug with Earthquake or Fire Blast on Machamp can also be worthwhile since you have Houndoom to remove Exeggutor

olive stag
#

Heatran to trap bliss, pex, and clef, zone for any steel type

calm spade
fresh thistle
#

Leads in gsc arent all that important as long as you stick to one of lax/spiker/electric/sleep user

#

Just don’t lead something like Machamp or Golem

calm spade
fresh thistle
#

Looks good 👍

calm spade
#

alr thx

glad tusk
#

so im kinda new to pvp and i wanted to make a gen 5 ou team and this is what i have so far

gritty scaffold
#

just redo tbh

#

3 of your mons are unviable

#

and magnezone doesnt fit here at all

#

id recommend reading analysis when making a team

upper plume
#

@agile saffron u wanna do this one? nvm ur probably asleep sry

upper plume
#

Your Skarmory shouldn't have Defog because before gen 6, it only clears hazards from your opponent's side of the field, instead of all hazards on the field

#

And your Tyranitar and Magnezone don't work well together because they are both Pokemon that support attackers, but you don't have Pokemon that take advantage of their trapping capabilities, and Tyranitar and Magnezone don't really support each other well

#

If you're new to competitive singles as you say you are, I would take a sample team and use that to get a feel for both Pokemon battling as well as the BW OU metagame, and then when you feel that you have a solid understanding of the metagame, then you can start building teams

#

!gen5samples

karmic geyserBOT
#

BW Sample Teams
Ubers: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5ubers
OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3686880/
UU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5uu
RU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5ru
NU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5nu
PU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5pu
ZU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5zu
LC: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5lc
1v1: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen51v1
Doubles OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3606719/post-7393081

glad tusk
glad tusk
inner mist
glad tusk
#

Alr thanks imma try use one of the sample teams

cobalt vigil
# topaz sentinel https://pokepast.es/789361743b02641b gen 4 ou would like to try to keep pert, ra...

You mix two playstyles here:
Bulky offense with physical pert - meta lead (Those two don't work too well together as they give a lot of free turns to skarmory early on. Both also hate spikes) - Jirachi - Gengar.
Offense with Gyarados (which requires a Taunt lead or spin) - Berry Tyranitar
You need to make a choice between the two.
You are also very Gyarados weak.
You can try something like this: Gyarados -> Latias and put pert as the lead. Use Tyranitar as your Dragon Dance user and switch Metagross to an iron ball set with spedef investment. This way you keep your 2 win conditions in DDer + Jirachi.

main scarab
#

https://pokepast.es/ecb71f2089c91b44

Gen 1 OU team, Gengar and Zapdos can be swapped if recommended but I'd like to keep Slowbro (also do let me know which is the better Pokémon to have as a lead if possible)

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @weak mirage, @red delta, @night bridge. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

night bridge
# main scarab https://pokepast.es/ecb71f2089c91b44 Gen 1 OU team, Gengar and Zapdos can be sw...
  1. Do not lead tauros, lead Gengar
  2. Counter on Gengar is a meme and you don't even have a way to exploit it
  3. Gar Zap Bro isn't gonna work, they all lose to Rhydon (yes, even your Slowbro, it's 3HKOed by EQ so if Rhydon comes in on Rest it straight up beats Slowbro) - Gar Mie Zap is a much more real team that does this better. If you want Slowbro drop the Zapdos for like an Egg or something
  4. Icelax is fine I guess but every new player seems to use it on teams it doesn't synergize with, on this team I'd much rather have EQ so you can cover Rhydon and Gengar better
main scarab
#

Got'cha, I guess that Big Yellow video influenced me into running counter gengar lol

#

Many thanks for the advice!

night bridge
#

np

sacred flume
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vale lagoon
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vale lagoon
#

Is it worth it to use defog Kartana here?

#

Gives Rotom the slot to use pain split

#

or should I just run the SD variation

leaden gate
leaden gate
vale lagoon
leaden gate
#

ur running bulu

#

why not

vale lagoon
#

Oh I know

#

but what's solar blade Kartana?

leaden gate
#

solar blade is a 130 bp grass physical attack that takes 2 turns to charge but no charge in grassy terrain

vale lagoon
#

ahh okay

upper plume
#

it's no charge in sun

leaden gate
#

bp might be off this is just from memory

upper plume
#

not in g terrain

leaden gate
#

wait

upper plume
#

solar beam

#

solar blade

vale lagoon
#

Kartana doesn't learn solar blade in gen7ou

upper plume
#

gottem

#

gen 7 stabmons

vale lagoon
#

Leafblade might as well be solar blade when used on Kartana in grassy terrain

#

That thing hits like a truck

vale lagoon
#

Fini is the only special attacker

#

Physically defensive Pokemon could be a problem

leaden gate
#

blue flare focus blast trick filler

#

something like that

tribal smelt
#

RBY OU, Victreebell. https://pokepast.es/eb6305cffe040074

Its' always been hard to fit victreebell to me outside of Chanseyless all in style teams since its' a tempo sink that aims to abuse situations like 'mons resting and healing to come in and heal so I tried to build with it as something that is going to come in and force dicy situations after 4a Lax inevitably leaves a smoldering hole in the opposing teams lineup.

Zam is the fastest para lead possible it still ensures that something happens the moment the Chansey comes in to absorb the paralysis. Twave was chosen on 3 members to ensure that as many paras as possible are going off. Sleep on Victreebell while something you're (realistically) are only ever getting off on Chansey and Lax if a psychic on their side dies is still necessary since Sleep in RBY is mandatory outside of like. A single team I've seen.

A big part in why I chose reflect Toss chansey over a utility one is because Lax is going to try and explode so Chansey has to carry a lot of mid game physical fighting and mie + Chansey feels okay in a lax war should it happen.

karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @weak mirage, @red delta, @night bridge. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

calm spade
#

idk much abt rby ou but how does this team break through reflax

tribal smelt
#

Twave + Bell + exploding on it in the mirror

calm spade
#

Thats alotta wraps u gotta hit consistently

#

Unless u throw out a razor leaf

gritty scaffold
#

i mean zam can deal with lax if lax is sleep , mie isnt that bad vs lax

valid aspen
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @polar nacelle, @surreal crypt, @old iris, @leaden fiber. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

leaden gate
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

polar nacelle
valid aspen
polar nacelle
#

Dont use ttar there. Fighters will completely smash you

ivory siren
#

Within 5 attempts I got a shiny impish swarm scyther from the game corner in frlg and intend to transfer her to gen 5. What would be a proper build for them? On the smogon strategy guide it does not have any builds listed for impish unlike other gens.

20240114_184022.jpg
polar nacelle
#

Not the right place buddy. You should try your luck in the orange islands server

ivory siren
#

Oh ok thank you

young island
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

young island
#

No hazard removal is triggering me but idk if there's any viable hazard removal in rain lmao

#

Maybe something slipped through me

#

(Also gonna be on main soon so ping stallsunguy if i don't respond lmao!)

granite skiff
outer crescent
#

my timing is nuts

image.png
vast oracle
# leaden gate gen7ou https://pokepast.es/f396163a0438089a how do i fix this team's weakness to...

you dont cause it doesnt exist xd
you should be more concerned about more viable/common threats like KB, lele, and SD kartana (which is just the nature of stall in this tier). biggest change is defo the fact that you dont need 2 unawares, so prob remove quag for defog glisc, so you can fit smth like ww on skarm instead.

  • heal bell over toxic on clef & stoss on chansey over heal bell
  • if you want an attacking move on skarm run impish
vast oracle
outer crescent
#

as i said

#

could've forgotten about something

#

who do i replace ig

vast oracle
#

which of koko or keldeo do u want to keep?

outer crescent
#

prob koko

#

though i'm kinda scared about the stall matchup

#

not sure

vast oracle
# granite skiff https://pokepast.es/c94c229731eb8513

looks good, just minor changes:

  • since you dont have a mega then i'd also go mega slowbro since it gives you another knock absorber + sturdier physdef wall which you currently lack
  • heart swap over ice beam/flash cannon on mage to check setup CM-ers that can otherwise beat chansey like reuni, clef, & cmsplit mage
vast oracle
outer crescent
#

no lmao

gritty scaffold
#

Ig is faster but yea idk mana is immeadtly threatening

outer crescent
#

Manaphy @ Waterium Z
Ability: Hydration
EVs: 248 HP / 240 SpA / 20 Spe
Modest Nature

  • Tail Glow
  • Rest
  • Surf
  • Ice Beam
#

this set?

vast oracle
#

last move is customizeable but looks fine yea

#

so you're removing koko for torn-t?

#

team will look like the standard rain 6 so not sure if that's what you want

#

are you scared of the mantine, shedinja, and bulky zardY that you run stone edge mpert btw? i think they're pretty rare that you'd rather run another move like superpower, PUP, or sub

#

gets more mileage in general

outer crescent
#

it was mostly for zardy yea

#

superpower against some stuff looks juicy tho

vast oracle
#

ferro mostly, and lets you rk kart, hits rotomw hardest

outer crescent
#

yeah

#

and with that i just realized this is close to standard rain

#

but it's fine

vast oracle
outer crescent
#

i haven't played much rain so that'll help give me some understanding as well ig

outer crescent
#

nothing new here

vast oracle
#

rain usually wants double hazard as well

outer crescent
#

fair

#

so spikes on agren or smtg?

vast oracle
#

or both on ferro

outer crescent
#

whaat would ferro drop

#

whip or gyro

vast oracle
#

double hazards + stabs

#

you dont need leech on rain offense

gritty scaffold
#

This feels like gen 5 ferro rain lmao double hazards , double stabs

outer crescent
vast oracle
outer crescent
#

assuming lefties over helmet on ferro then?

#

cause without leech seed it's easy to wear down

vast oracle
#

chople/iapapa

gritty scaffold
#

tatsuthink iapapa?

vast oracle
#

lefties is too slow

gritty scaffold
#

Oo

outer crescent
#

oh ferro runs healing berries?

vast oracle
#

but not the end of the world if you want lefties

outer crescent
#

i've never ran across one lol

vast oracle
#

in offense yea

gritty scaffold
#

Its funny how more often berries are used in sm

#

Idt any other gen is that common to run berries

outer crescent
#

i'm relatively new to sm stuff that isn't ho

#

lol

outer crescent
#

except some specific stuff

vast oracle
#

rain tends to run chople, you deal with stuff like mzam better, also lets you take on bulu in a pinch if you run a steel stab, or kart if you run twave

outer crescent
#

well ig i'm running a steel stab

#

chople is interesting i might try that out

vast oracle
#

if you dont want double hazard on ferro then you can make one of agren or mpert be the other hazard setter, your call

outer crescent
#

i'll test both

vast oracle
#

if you still want to keep lefties or leech is fine too (or run other stuff like twave knock), was just my personal preference

outer crescent
#

i might go spikes on agren if i turn out to not use much ibeam

vast oracle
#

as long as it's the same 6 it wont be a problem lol

#

they're pretty flexible

outer crescent
#

ig lol

#

thanks

vast oracle
#

👍

weak glade
vivid kraken
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
# weak glade https://pokepast.es/19ac502fa25cb16a

lele rain brings me back to like 2018 SM but not the worst if you still want it.

  • Dont really need rotom-w and scarf lando-t in rain; you just wanna stack better rain abusers and you already have mpert, respectively. Biggest change is to replace them with Agren and bulky torn-t; former is a strong threat in rain & also gives you spikes so you can run rocks on ferro, while latter gives you a pivot + defogger + check to grasses like bulu, kart, and tang (can run the zmove too if you want)
  • with tornt as defogger you can drop the move on peli to run roost, which is very necessary anyways (unless you run like specs) to keep yourself healthy for more rain. change jolly to bold.
  • fix the evs to spdef on ferro. lefties + leech + tect is definitely too passive for rain, you'd rather run chople/iapapa and other moves like twave/knock off/gyro(iron head if you go twave)
  • make sure to go through your sets again (missing nature on lele & 4 extra evs on most mons)
vast oracle
# vivid kraken https://pokepast.es/d7e62773e386577b sm ou

6 looks okay, just minor fixes:

  • Dont really need pivot moves on zapdos & glisc on these type of structures, so discharge & toxic respectively are prob better alternatives. pressure on defog zapdos might even be an option here too to pp stall rocks, esp since the team is bulky in nature & also you have discharge as a means to still spread them anyways
  • psyshock reuni over psychic for opposing CM-ers like clef (z psyshock gives you your special psychic move anyways)
  • tspikes pex over toxic fits better on reuni structures, especially cause you lack a way to hit dark types like mttar and agren (toxic glisc can help punish tspikes immune switchins like zap, tornt, rotomw, and mlati)
vivid kraken
#

and lefites > helm zap?

vast oracle
#

is an option sure. it's better in the hazard removal dynamic but being able to chip exca, msciz, and choice-locked kartana w helmet a bit helps relieve the pressure of celest & keep it healthy, especially since celest doesnt want to take a knock. either or is fine

vivid kraken
#

ic ok

#

thx

weak glade
vivid kraken
#

also is energy ball better on reun

vast oracle
#

mpert + ferro should cover the electrics

vivid kraken
#

pert is a threat to this so eball seems good

weak glade
#

Ohhk and what item for aggron?

weak glade
vast oracle
vast oracle
#

if so then chople berry or the 50% berry (iapapa, wiki, etc) are fine

weak glade
#

U said change tornadous with agren

vast oracle
#

change rotomw & landot for agren & tornadust

weak glade
#

Can't find the Pokemon agren

vast oracle
#

ash greninja

#

sorry

weak glade
#

Ohh sry sry i m little dumb

vivid kraken
weak glade
#

Thank you imma change it

weak glade
vast oracle
#

yeah

weak glade
#

Hmm isn't Thundourus therian better cuz he can volt absorb

vast oracle
#

thundy-t rain is a thing yea but standard structure runs tornadus-t for the defensive utility; faster than the offensive grasses of kartana and serperior, has regen so you're a better pivot and sturdier defogger

#

almost forgot but also stab perfectly-accurate hurricane in rain, lets you deal with the aforementioned grasses on top of stuff like tangrowth and bulky tapu bulu, all of which can otherwise be problematic for your offensive rain core

vivid kraken
gritty scaffold
weak glade
#

I did some more changes

#

How about this?

small bridge
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vast oracle
small bridge
vast oracle
# vivid kraken https://pokepast.es/13abe154a98c992b sm ou

bulky defog landot over torn-t, better switchin & (soft) check into physical attackers + gives a ground. rachi over av mage means the team's agren matchup is even more awful, especially cause you run zardx when the mega is often mmedi (like the image attached), which means the team warrants a defogger. jirachi + zardx is better on BO with fini anyways

image.png
vivid kraken
#

so basically xtrashine

#

but gren > kyub

vast oracle
gritty scaffold
#

Oo true

#

Hm i could prob fit here lando ig or exca

#

Glisc could work too but idk replacing pex feels rough

vast oracle
# vivid kraken but gren > kyub

pretty much. or if you still want kokolucha + zardx still then either go HO or with like scarf defog kart as removal while still having mage + landot

#

sd glisc is fine ye cause you have pursuit

#

sd bulu + sd glisc + pursuit (m)ttar is a classic anyways

vivid kraken
#

ok

#

thx

gritty scaffold
#

cheempao neat

vast oracle
#

i thought about gastro as well over pex, still covers the stuff pex covers while switching into rotomw better

gritty scaffold
#

Hm yea

#

I think ill try both gastro and glisc both seem to work

vast oracle
#

there's also the sd glisc + spdef heatran variant for a better volc matchup

gritty scaffold
#

Oo true

#

I mean ttar should do fine ig but yea hp ground is rough for heatran , even just psychic z

vast oracle
# weak glade https://pokepast.es/1a0ae8b54fe01901

2017 sm rain with kokolucha i see

  • I refer ferro over kart for the defensive utility into stuff like mega alakazam, lele, koko, and opposing rain
  • with kokolucha + mpert you have enough anti-offense tools that i'd rather run manaphy over kingdra to improve the fat matchup
  • dont need scarf koko either, specs or LO is fine
vast oracle
vivid kraken
gritty scaffold
vast oracle
#

can you send the paste again? i thought it was mbro and av ttar

gritty scaffold
#

both are working alright on ladder

#

i noticed kartana can give some trouble in both teams but shoudlnt be impossible to handle

vast oracle
#

both are fine; the av ttar team really needs to hit heatran so either eq or superpower (if you want it to be stronger under terrain)

gritty scaffold
#

oh yea true i forgot i prob should change to super power. just incase of heatran

vast oracle
#

the mttar can go crunch over fire punch too to more easily pressure mlatias, since neither heatran nor pex can force toxic on it, but between sand + scald burn chip it's no big deal and still playable

vast oracle
gritty scaffold
#

Yee

untold oak
#

thoughts? (gen 5 OU)

#

ik its pretty bad

gritty scaffold
#

send pokepaste next time

#

!pokepaste

karmic geyserBOT
#

PokePaste is the easiest way to share competitive teams with other people online. Simply upload your team to the site and you can share your team by sharing the link in your browser!

To upload a team to PokePaste directly from Pokemon Showdown, scroll to the bottom of the team and press the button that says Upload to PokePaste.
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/459043501984972801/1158775180735291453/pokepaste1.png?ex=651d78fc&is=651c277c&hm=5d0b952a78e50b944a63f5e16a9006dffbf6f8fe900cede444f1c65b965a064a&

You can then take the link of the PokePaste and share that link to share the team with other people.
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gritty scaffold
# untold oak

soo id recommend rebuild this team because like nothing has synergy at all

#

3 of ur mons in the team are straight up unviable

#

rotom without will o isnt good

#

and that dnite needs outrage

#

tbh just read the analysis and rebuild ur team because it looks a mess

untold oak
#

what should i replace with outrage? dragon claw?

untold oak
gritty scaffold
#

replace roost with outrage and dclaw with earthquake or something

#

look you need to rebuild this

gritty scaffold
untold oak
#

oh this stuff

#

is there like

#

a formula for building a team?

#

i just put together strong looking pokemon and then one or two cripplers

gritty scaffold
#

not really is all about synergy between those mons

#

and depends on the team style ur doing

untold oak
#

what styles are there?

gritty scaffold
#

theres ho ( hyper offense ) , rain , sand , hail . well theres sun stall but i dont consider rly viable atleast not for now it has alot of problems

untold oak
#

hyper offense seems fun

#

it also seems like what my team is closest to

gritty scaffold
#

no

untold oak
#

rly? but dnite nidoking volc

gritty scaffold
#

only dnite and volc are ho mons there

#

nidoking isnt viable , rotom isnt for ho builds , metagross isnt viable , eel isnt viable

long ginkgo
#

And nido too

untold oak
#

nido slaps

long ginkgo
#

Imo just run a sample atp theres not much we can do to save that doesnt make this team a complete redo

long ginkgo
untold oak
gritty scaffold
#

its not that strong

untold oak
#

it one shots like everything

gritty scaffold
#

no it does not

untold oak
#

what holds it back?

gritty scaffold
#

look you can see viability ranking and rebuild ur team to think more about it

long ginkgo
#

Like any spd wall lol

gritty scaffold
long ginkgo
#

Also Choice Scarf means you cant have LO

untold oak
gritty scaffold
#

life orb

untold oak
#

oh life orb

#

forgot that works with sheer force

long ginkgo
#

Check the VR

#

And check samples too

untold oak
#

wow they forgot to put nidoking in any of the tiers

gritty scaffold
#

no its because is unviable

untold oak
#

oh so its like

#

f-?

gritty scaffold
#

unranked

untold oak
#

it should at least be c

gritty scaffold
#

wtf no. C mons are niches but they arent straight up unviable (except of hydregion)

untold oak
#

but like nido pulls his weight

fickle tulip
#

Or using optimal teams

long ginkgo
#

@untold oak look if your not gonna take our advice dont send your teams here

untold oak
#

i am trying to take advice

#

im just also trying to keep nidoking on the team if i can

gritty scaffold
#

we dont rate teams when u wanna keep unviable mons

untold oak
#

damn is metagross also not on the viability list?

#

is this good?

image.png
#

like just as a base setup

#

i dont think im using any unviable mons here

long ginkgo
untold oak
#

so i kicked him out

gritty scaffold
#

also send pokepaste so we can see the sets

untold oak
#

ohi havent made sets yet

#

btw just curious whats wrong with gengar?

gritty scaffold
#

its too frail , easily pursuited

untold oak
#

and also if i put exca then wont there be ground overlap

gritty scaffold
#

not really

#

garchomp and exca are diff in their roles

untold oak
#

oh someone told me that you shouldnt have type overlap in a team

gritty scaffold
#

actually prob change volca for latios here

fickle tulip
#

Type overlap is fine and can even be desired

#

Same type offensive pokemon generally have similar checks that they can both wear down for each other

untold oak
#

any good sheer force pokes?

gritty scaffold
#

none

untold oak
#

aww

#

im wondering

#

if i put latios

#

should i get rid of alakazam

#

bc they seem to accomplish the same thing. both special attacking psychic types

fickle tulip
#

There are latios + alakazam teams because they can both wear down tyranitar

#

it can pursuit one but then it might be too weakened to pursuit the other

upper plume
#

and gengar isn't great in bw

#

!gen5samples

karmic geyserBOT
#

BW Sample Teams
Ubers: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3714123/post-9462708
OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3686880/
UU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5uu
RU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3733239/
NU: https://www.smogon.com/roa/?format=gen5nu
PU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3730796/
ZU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3646944/post-8034681
LC: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3676193/
Monotype: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3685272/
1v1: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3646875/post-8031460
Doubles OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3606719/post-7393081
Last Updated <t:1705345762:f>

upper plume
#

^ for sample teams

upper plume
# untold oak a formula for building a team?

top player phosphor actually wrote a solid guide to building a bw ou team, but if ur new to the tier I would just take a sample and play with that before you try and build something on your own

upper plume
untold oak
#

And nido

#

And d nite after dance

gritty scaffold
#

how are you setting up with volca

upper plume
#

scarf keld in rain is a common sight

gritty scaffold
#

an scarf keld exists

upper plume
#

and beats all 3 of those

vale lagoon
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

vale lagoon
#

Not too sure which way to go though

vast oracle
#

do really need the koko?

#

i'd say keep the last two to scarf lando + rotomw and you're fine

#

prob want tect over synth on bulu cause you have sand too

vale lagoon
#

Alrighty

vale lagoon
vast oracle
#

you have rotomw + mttar

vale lagoon
#

Actually nvm I jave Ttar

#

I was gonna use Koko to deal with Skarm and Steela, but Heatran and Ttar eat them up

vast oracle
#

rotomw helps switch into stuff like skarm celest tornt when they switch into your grasses and uses it as an opportunity to pivot/spread status/pain split/defog or whatnot, mttar pursuits tornt zapdos & overwhelms skarm celest, and yea heatran in terrain should have the longevity to pressure them somewhat more repeatedly

vale lagoon
#

Alrighty

inner mist
untold oak
inner mist
#

Ok I am going to be real with you

#

What are you even building around?

untold oak
#

nothing rly

inner mist
#

Well then just use the samples

untold oak
#

i just put together some good pokemon with good movesets

inner mist
#

Ok then use the samples

#

That’s probably your best bet for now

untold oak
#

but i dont want to copy others

#

i want to be original

inner mist
#

Well if you aren’t experience the metagame you have to use something pre-existing to get a feel for it

#

Cobbling a bunch of mons together without understanding why they work isn’t good teambuilding philosophy

#

That’s what are samples are for

untold oak
#

on the topic of non viable pokemon and viable pokemon

gritty scaffold
#

Again id recommend reading analysis if u wanna make a team because they suggest usually on what you need

upper plume
#

both in battle and in the teambuilder

gritty scaffold
upper plume
#

like you're gonna lose to keldeo

#

also

#

when ur in showdown

#

type /dt5 knock off

untold oak
#

What does that do?

upper plume
#

it tells you what the move does

#

I think you'll reconsider Scizor's last move once you see the results

#

(though honestly I'd reconsider many of the other sets on your Pokemon, as well as the mons on your team)

inner mist
untold oak
inner mist
#

And besides, winning a low ladder game with unviable pokemon doesn’t really prove much when most of the tutors here have reached Top 1

upper plume
untold oak
#

60 BP but 90 when they have an item

#

Right?

inner mist
#

Knock off in Gen 5 is weaker but takes off items

untold oak
#

Ohhhh

#

I see

#

So sucker punch would be better

upper plume
#

(scizor doesn't learn sucker punch)

inner mist
#

Why are you comparing the two

untold oak
#

Je suis stupido

inner mist
#

They are very different moves

upper plume
#

look

#

you have access to good teams

#

you put your team in here because on some level

#

you want to improve in the game

#

we're telling you that the teams you posted won't help you improve because they are heavily flawed and will hamper you against common Pokemon

#

and you have access to teams that give you the tools to compete against any team

untold oak
#

I think I should stick to chess

#

Thx for the help tho

upper plume
#

I'd imagine a chess player would tell you the same thing if you asked for improvement and your response to 1. e4 was the Stafford Gambit

untold oak
#

Okok but the Stafford gambit is like

#

Proven by a computer to be a shitty opening

#

About computers, is there a pokemon engine?

#

Stockfisk?

inner mist
#

Competitive pokemon doesn’t work like that

untold oak
#

Stunfish?

#

Oh

#

Is it because of the luck based parts?

upper plume
#

but chess engines have been developed for over 30 years

inner mist
#

Designing an AI for Pokemon is practically impossible without a fuckton of money

upper plume
#

and chess is a far less complicated game (in terms of state space) in comparison to Pokemon

untold oak
#

True true

fickle tulip
#

There was an AI but it always lost to people who planned ahead

#

Because pokemon has so much rng and hidden info that it's impossible to really calculate

upper plume
#

oh yeah, Pokemon isn't fully observable

#

forgot about that

fickle tulip
#

Some endgames might be possible to completely calculate but there's still mindgames

weak glade
#

Isn't manaphy too weak

upper plume
#

too weak for what

weak glade
upper plume
#

tail glow

vast oracle
#

+3 252+ SpA Manaphy Hydro Vortex (175 BP) vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Eviolite Chansey in Rain: 622-733 (88.4 - 104.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+3 252+ SpA Manaphy Hydro Vortex (175 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Toxapex in Rain: 275-324 (90.4 - 106.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

weak glade
#

Hmm so u sure I should swap it with Kingdra I was looking for one to counter grass type pokes

vast oracle
#

with rest + hydration you're also resilient against the passive walls

#

hawlucha kinda feasts on the grasses

#

since you're going for the more offensive variant than the standard tornadust

weak glade
#

Hmm Still any other option than manaphy? @vast oracle

vast oracle
#

better than manaphy? not that i can think of

weak glade
#

Item for manaphy (already using a z)

vast oracle
#

manaphy in rain 100% wants the z

#

yeah i recommended changing kart to ferro

weak glade
vale lagoon
ivory yarrow
calm spade
#

What gen😭

long ginkgo
#

Looks like adv

#

@leaden fiber

leaden fiber
#

i gave him this team

#

LOL

#

the team is fine btw

#

i peaked like 1650 with it on ladder couple days ago

#

when i had way too much free time

long ginkgo
calm spade
#

oml

#

im an idiot

#

i thought jirachi was introduced in gen 4

#

..

leaden fiber
#

no yeah LOL

weak glade
long ginkgo
#

Im not an SM player by any means but this team looks p bad

#

why are youu using specs zard when mega zard y exists?

#

a sun team witrh torn and kartana?

#

plus in general idt sun is that good but ill let @vast oracle rate from here on

vast oracle
#

is that team even tested or being played yet

#

why is there a boots blissey in sm

#

either way most of the mons and sets in general are unviable, i'd recommend the standard sun sample with zardy + weav + kart + lando + fini + heatran

#

fwiw venu isn't the most standard on sun but not unviable by any means, but this team really needs major fixing

weak glade
#

Hmm

weak glade
vivid kraken
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @vast oracle. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

ivory yarrow
ivory yarrow
#

im hovering at the 1300s

#

but i think im learning

#

it covers a lot of bases

cedar lily
vale lagoon
cedar lily
vale lagoon
leaden fiber
#

u probably appreciate a scarfer

#

id say some of these teams not amazing defensively enough to warrant going slow

#

mage > fini or smt

vale lagoon
#

Alrighty

#

Mage is Alakazam right?

cedar lily
#

Magearna

vale lagoon
#

Ahh ok

cedar lily
#

Altho idk how much I agree with that, Mage and Mawile on the same time seems weird

#

I’d say even something like koko over magnezone and then z-fly lando could be better

#

Or Torn-t over Magne maybe

calm spade
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @cobalt vigil. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

tawdry wraith
karmic geyserBOT
#

New OU RMT @azure torrent, @astral thistle, @surreal crypt, @upper plume, @gritty scaffold, @inner mist, @long ginkgo. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

gritty scaffold
#

Id recommend rebuild tbh these mons dont fit in rain at all there isnt amy synergy with them.

#

You dont even have a rocks setter

#

Id recommend you reading analysis before building a team in bw so you can know better what to use in rain

tawdry wraith
#

Where is that analysis

gritty scaffold
tawdry wraith
#

Ok thanks

gritty scaffold
#

Theres also rain samples if u wanna know a bit more of structures
https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/bw-ou-samples-thread.3686880/

Smogon Forums
OU - BW OU Samples Thread

Maintained by the BW community.

Hello! This thread is here to archive teams from the Black and White Overused metagame and showcase popular playstyles and archetypes of the current metagame. Its aim is to help beginners and intermediate level players to get acclimated to the tier, or simply to...

tawdry wraith
#

Wanted to build a rain team since politoed and scizor are one of my favorite

gritty scaffold
#

Scizor in rain only works with scarf sets

cobalt vigil
# calm spade https://pokepast.es/0019574287392f9a Gen 4 OU

Magnezone isn't a very natural pairing with lead Machamp. Clef and Nidoqueen don't fit the pace of the rest of the team (and you really need a specific reason to play nidoqueen). All the members combined fail to make a coherent 6. I'll suggest you to look at the sample teams. https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/dpp-ou-sample-teams.3687351/#post-9828313
and at the VR: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/dpp-ou-viability-ranking-mk-v.3683332/
You will notice that Latias, Jirachi and Tyranitar are all at the top; notably because they help you pivot during a game. With each of them having ~50% usage in tournaments, I'd recommend using those three a lot.

Smogon Forums
OU - DPP OU Viability Ranking: mk. V

DPP OU Viability Ranking

Welcome to the DPP OU Viability Rankings topic. In this thread, we as a community will rank every single usable Pokemon into "tiers." In this thread, you're encouraged to post your thoughts and opinions on the various Pokemon that are usable in DPP OU and what tier...

Smogon Forums
OU - DPP OU Sample Teams

(banner by Bandkrook)

Hello! This thread is here to archive teams from the DPP metagame and showcase popular playstyles and archetypes. Its aim is to help beginners and intermediate level players become acclimated to the tier, or simply to help anyone in need of a solid team to play.

Please...

calm spade
#

I got a other team ive made and laddering with

#

I think i already got it rated here tho