NatDex OU Rates

[wooden drum]

Scarf?

[hollow fern]

Specs

You have some really strong answers into steels like exca zama

And rn theres not much breaking

[wooden drum]

Wouldn't speed be an issue?

Koko is weak

[hollow fern]

You have zama no?

[wooden drum]

So zap having a bit of speed investment would work?

[hollow fern]

I thought it was koko being replaced

[hollow fern]

Imo not worth giving up the bulk

[wooden drum]

Koko is being replaced for Lele of we go your route

[hollow fern]

Yeah

[wooden drum]

Hold up

[weak adder]

guys i need help

i need to make quick fixes

https://pokepast.es/69ce5d835619dbd7

[celest merlin]

Hey @weak adder, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9nationaldexubers team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1060037469472555028 instead.

[brittle galleon]

Tried to make a team around Ferrothorn and Tapu Lele. I'm pretty new to team building so I'm not too sure if it's any good. https://pokepast.es/8600fca6771caf9b

[signal dust]

https://pokepast.es/b280ffa769648688

hey this is my mega Manectric set it lowkey missing something could anyone help me out

[white condor]

https://pokepast.es/4e9cd7de9bffbd37

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[celest merlin]

Hey @white condor, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9ou team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1297721195604611163 instead.

[hollow fern]

Unfortunately triple ghost is way too weak defensively and this team lacks a lot of fundamentals like speed control, a ground type, hazards, and removal

I would recommend checking out samples to get a look at what teams are like in this format

[white condor]

Yeah I feel like I over did it with the four ghost types

[hollow fern]

Yeah this team is really all over the place

And loses very hard to a lot of strong mons

Hazards also farm this to an absurd degree

Double sash with zero removal

[meager badger]

Could you evaluate my team? I put together this team for a game mode where shed tail moves are allowed and only mega evolution is possible. Is there anything you think is missing? I'm aware my team is weak against Rain teams and those spamming Wide Guard. I plan to eliminate Water Spout users primarily with Talonflame's Brave Bird, and to break through Wide Guard by using Oranguru's Instruct move to land two consecutive single-hit moves (e.g., Moonblast/Earth Power).

https://pokepast.es/5b853da86f0a7ae3

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[blazing moth]

!arbitraryformats

[celest merlin]

Please take a moment to review the rules of the competitive section: #1373406929317269624 message

Do not ask for assistance with arbitrary rulesets or restrictions placed on teambuilding, we will not help with them in this server. The competitive section is only for Smogon and Nintendo formats.

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/539a6e08b3a446e2 this feels bad

[empty olive]

really bad pon mu

alot of others too basically just a mid selection of mons

corv mola is fine but you need a sturdier ground than offensive tusk

and ur speed is kinda middling for being somewhat of an offensive team

[nocturne summit]

hmm...

is something like scarf meow instead of lele and bullet punch med salvages it?

[brittle galleon]

First time making a natdexs team. I'm pretty new to team building so I'm not too sure if it's any good. https://pokepast.es/8600fca6771caf9b

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/a3258e2081d6717d anyway to make this less threatened by woger?

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[fickle harbor]

https://pokepast.es/3f0a0496817fa9b8
Currently doing quite well at 1500-1600 using this team. Anything I could improve?
Some weaknesses: Lost to every electric terrain team I played against, rain was somewhat annoying

[empty olive]

adding extra speed and more priority helps a little ig

but way too much of this is still too slow

the easiest way would just to replace medi for za and ur prolly good already

and if you want more breaking power you can use z ghold (z zama is also an option but less effective)

[empty olive]

kinda ass

double scarf is redundant

and as offense this is outclassed by regular ho

worse breaking and it's not like u have anything resembling staying power with just a mixed cele

[fickle harbor]

ok

[summer turtle]

https://pokepast.es/573c00d4ee87b93f

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[nocturne summit]

problem the team was meant to be built on m-medi 😭

[empty olive]

the rest of the team doesn't support it enough

try medi weavile

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/bc76560b37681c9c the cheesest team you'll ever see

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[hollow fern]

Isnt this literally just the lyra team

Same sets and everything

Cause if so you cant post other people's teams

[nocturne summit]

who?, to be fair made this with a friend who give me the ideas

[hollow fern]

Thread '“Cool to lose to Random Shit” V2 | Peaked #1, 1998 ELO' https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/“cool-to-lose-to-random-shit”-v2-peaked-1-1998-elo.3776467/

Yeah I checked

Its the same lol

Did you post the wrong team?

Cause even the paste title is the same as the thread title

[nocturne summit]

tf 😭 my friend definitely saw this and give me the idea, sry about that 🙏

[hollow fern]

Lmao all good

[nocturne summit]

the maranga berry thing weirded me out since it seemed too specfic ;-;

[hollow fern]

Lol yeah I recognized it immediately cause its such a unique team

Lotta weird stuff

[nocturne summit]

btw is m-latios + cb zama possible to make?

[hollow fern]

Yeah that defo sounds possible

Both solid mons

[nocturne summit]

quick question is clef usable?

https://pokepast.es/52e9f225c2172e22 this is what I went with

torn between unaware or mg on clef

[hollow fern]

I think on here you wanna go zap>clef

Lati as the ground immune is shaky imo

[nocturne summit]

why?

[hollow fern]

A lot of the grounds can hit it hard

Like uturn on lando, spinner on tusk, lu just 1v1ing

Uturn is a big reason in particular

[nocturne summit]

yeah to be fair I can see it, what set for zap tho?

[hollow fern]

Just defensive

Boots, roost, physdef, three attack

Imo the lele matchup is also rather shaky

Ive used treads as the sole lele check before, and it gets worn down really fast

Or just hit with fblast/z fight

Especially since mlati and zama locked into cc let it in

[nocturne summit]

😭

[nocturne summit]

is the team at least decent?

[hollow fern]

Im a fan

I think its cool

[hollow fern]

https://pokepast.es/0c0c3bf732d0e6da
Reminds me of this team by toxic ariados

Took me a while to find it lol

Imo alo>pex is defo smth to consider, the momentum works very nicely on ur team

[nocturne summit]

zama crowned ;-;

[hollow fern]

Yeah it was used for the suspect

[nocturne summit]

to be fair wanted pex as water type with knock off and can punish contact but with zap now can I go av mola?

[hollow fern]

Hm yeah prolly and now you have zap to punish contact

If you do id make treads offensive

With like z maybe

[nocturne summit]

would still need rocks

[hollow fern]

Yeah

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/6db0c4d17ce8be95

[hollow fern]

https://pokepast.es/41d8a9cf9526445d
Theres a sample of this same 6 lmao

[nocturne summit]

damn ;-;... is it strictly better? 🤔

Idk how to feel about taunt sd

[hollow fern]

I mean theyre very similar lol

So theyre probably both good if I had to guess

[nocturne summit]

kk

[shy whale]

Can someone tell me what to change
https://pokepast.es/dfc5a1b0f19355a2

[paper notch]

Taunt is ran over coverage on this team to break stall, you can punish ferro by doubling to ceru or zama and sometimes kgb. Although the team is HO by structure, its real purpose is anti offense with id zama + ceru, woger is here so you dont auto lose to stall + is a good offense mon in general. Without taunt, your MU vs stall becomes extremely dubious if not nigh impossible since the team relies almost soley on woger to win as non of the other mons do much vs stall. Diancie gets handled by clod, ceru + kgb can never break dozo bc of knock + poltergeist anti synergy, and rocks from lando are never staying up vs magic bounce + corv. What taunt does for woger is it denies roost + idef from corv/skarm and lets u set up safely on status users that might want to trade into u such as pex, mola, glisc, or blissey/chansey.

This last part is very important, without taunt, stall can literally hard into something with status that lives a +2 hit (something all effective stall team is going to have, e.g. pex, chansey, gweez) on ur sd and cripple you. And from there, even if we ignore the fact that most stall have some way of forcing out a +2 oger once, you are still very likely to lose. If wisp'd, u lose to dozo on the spot, if toxic'd, It takes 6 turns to kill from full, 2 of which is spent killing whats in front of you, protect users (glisc, msable) gurantee another 2, and curse dozo gurantees the last two with curse into rest. In this MU stall can afford to trade msable/glisc + pex/chansey for your woger since after woger dies you lose to dozo clicking waterfall, and this is assuming that the stall doesnt have hardcounters like tangrowth or shedninja or hydra. Granted, you dont have to stay in on the 6 turns of toxic, but switching out just means you have to find another oppurtunity to set up with the poisoned oger except now they might have hazards up vs you, and keep in mind that in addition to all this you also have to connect multiple whips even if you get every play right so the odds are not exactly great.

[paper notch]

also prevents set up from dnite and whatnot

[blazing moth]

js replace brute bonnet w venu and maybe give hatt av instead but that's up to you

u could also try rocky helm

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/15ea15a0d741870b this feels slow

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[shy whale]

Thanks ima try that out

[empty solar]

https://teams.pokemonshowdown.com/view/1677425-dymlyyi6pmg3hakdmxyw

[empty solar]

ouu

https://pokepast.es/f1b5d1f6345e2bb2

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[empty solar]

i need like a good offensive core

hera to wallbreak someone else to sweep

idk about my defensive core

generally i just want the team to be fat and bulky

but also not passive

[hollow fern]

This is weak to woger and overall pretty slow/passive imo-ur really relying on hera for any sort of progress making

Imo the bottom three are the ones holding it back

Like meow as the dark resist mainly

I think making alo the av mon and gking physdef for woger would help, but that would make the team more offensively oriented

[empty solar]

im fine with that, any other changes?

[hollow fern]

Hm could maybe go like torn>molt now that you have av alo

To help make the team have more speed/less passivity

[empty solar]

ty

what about iron treads, its one of the bottom three

[hollow fern]

Treads is prolly fine but id go spinner>knock and make it ice z

[empty solar]

gotcha

[hollow fern]

Either that or make it balloon with torn the z user

I think smth that can help revenge like zama+yard instead of meow might be nice here

[empty solar]

what would you recommend for that

[hollow fern]

Scarf lele maybe?

I just think itd be more valuable to have the extra insurance here

You have several other mons who you can slot knock off on anyways

[empty solar]

true

[shy whale]

What set on the venu?

[empty solar]

should torn be nasty plot or pivot

[hollow fern]

https://pokepast.es/50f3c2a65259507e
Uhm I just realized I accidently recreated a slightly older team by a good player😭

So sorry about that I was like "this 6 mons look familiar"

[empty solar]

oh shit LOL

nah its chill

[hollow fern]

Inspo if you want it but thats mb

[empty solar]

perfectly fine

[blazing moth]

https://www.smogon.com/dex/sv/pokemon/venusaur/national-dex/

it's the second one

[quasi moth]

what coverage move on kyurem?
https://pokepast.es/e3cd4df2e4b3e725
(natdex ou so no tera types)

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[low bay]

https://pokepast.es/3a003a3993f17ee3 I don't know how to build a balance team without Gliscor and Alomomola, I think Nat Dex meta don't have enough pokemon to fit on a balance team

[celest merlin]

Hey @gentle lintel, it looks like you're trying to share a gen4ou team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1060339824537641152 instead.

[gaunt stirrup]

Why is Kyurem iron head

Lacks speed control

[quasi moth]

thats what im asking

what should it be

i got dclaw

[gaunt stirrup]

Just scale shot

[quasi moth]

yeah booster energy only one time but i got 3 priority moves

[gaunt stirrup]

Vacuum wave is wasted on Valiant

Especially booster speed

[quasi moth]

i know except i only had 2 sucker punches as priority

[gaunt stirrup]

You don’t have any way of instantaneous pressure and speed control is still a problem when 4 attacks Zama clicks vs your team

[quasi moth]

so lika a boosted speed dark type or whatever would sweep me

[gaunt stirrup]

esp ice fang over stone edge

[quasi moth]

i copied team from pinkacross tho

it was ou tho

i play natdex

[gaunt stirrup]

Dont use teams from OU to nat dex, metas differ a lot

and ppl rate teams you built

Not others

[quasi moth]

ik

not many ppl build natdex tho

so i dont have another choice

i wanted a sub kyurem team

only ou ones were there

[gaunt stirrup]

You do though

!samples

[celest merlin]

Whether you're new to a format or competitive Pokémon as a whole, sample teams provide a quick way to pick up a team and play. Sample teams are contributed by community members and have a proven track record of success on ladder or in tours. You can find sample teams for any given format using the /tier command.

If a user has recommended you use a sample team this is not meant as a slight. Creating a successful team can be incredibly difficult without metagame knowledge and experience playing; sample teams reduce the barrier to entry by letting you jump in and start gaining that knowledge.

[quasi moth]

is there one with kyurem

[celest merlin]

National Dex (Gen 9)

• Sample teams
• Viability rankings
• Tournament schedule
• C&C reservation index
• Role compendium
• Speed tiers
• Metagame discussion thread
• Discord
• Pokemon Showdown! room

Overview

For more info, see this format's Dex page.

[gaunt stirrup]

yeah

[quasi moth]

i see

its pretty similar

[quasi moth]

oh and yeah i just went to the wrong channel

i also asked in comp channel

[empty olive]

https://pokepast.es/598283bf6f8897a2

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[empty olive]

how does this hold up

[shy whale]

Can someone rate my team and give it feedback on changes
https://pokepast.es/84dc157ce112b221

[quasi moth]

no real speed Control outside rain

sd rillaboom is mid

like nasty plot gholdengo and band rillaboom would prob be better

[shy whale]

Alr

[quasi moth]

for rillaboom go wood hammer grassy glide u turn knock off

and gholdengo go np shadow ball make it rain focus blast/recover

[shy whale]

Other than that the team is good?

[quasi moth]

probably yeah im not the best at building

its just rain offense

i always used this one https://pokepast.es/8814e59ffe7cfc72

[celest merlin]

Hey @quasi moth, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9ubers team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1059901370477576272 instead.

[tame galleon]

archa is banned, why not raging bolt ?

[hollow fern]

Archaludon is not banned lol

[tame galleon]

wdym

you cant use archa in ou

can you ?

[hollow fern]

This is natdex

[tame galleon]

yeah

[hollow fern]

It was banned in regular ou

[tame galleon]

i'm just straight up insane atp

[hollow fern]

This is a different format

[tame galleon]

mb ignore what i said i mixed it up

[quasi moth]

not in natdex

[tame galleon]

i got it twin

[topaz pawn]

Hey everyone, I’m fairly new to Nat Dex OU building and I tried brewing a ETerrain Screens HO (sorta?)
https://pokepast.es/6ba321769fe4ded1
I have a few doubts: I chose a Hex/Twave set for ghold cause I felt like needing speed control but I’m not sure if a Nasty Plot set would be better?
I dunno if life orb is the better choice for Iron Crown?
Do I lack coverage?
Thx in advance for your thoughts 🤗

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[tame galleon]

rocks, taunt and fblast are awkward

• i believe taunt would be better replaced with bolt or something so that koko's less passive ; it's more something you'd find on fini, IMHO
• having chomp being a sword dancer with rocks and two attacks with immunities is...he can't break skarm or corv for example
• ghold having to use focus blast for reliable damage when make it rain's right there

idk how but try to switch it up. maybe make a bulkier chomp ? cause as is i don't think you can afford the two turns of sitting. and you have no way to hit water/flying outside of iron crown's volt switch. yeah.

ah yeah also for ghold my set is personally modest/252hp with recover, make it rain, twave and hex, which allows it (in my team comp) to switch in safely, eat an attack and retaliate with either twave to prepare for other attacks or double with hex, or make it rain to finish off threats, but that's me

also iron crown has two sets on smogon and they're booster energy and av

[topaz pawn]

Makes sense, thx!

[empty olive]

these r completely fine

taunt is great on screens koko bc u can stop annoying shit like setup/hazards and basically cripple the support that were meant to cripple ur breakers coming in after koko

you don't need reliable damage on koko the set is basically a sample

rocks on sd chomp is literally standard, you don't really need more than dual stab or eq + rock z for enough coverage to break most things, the only thing that can take dual stabs well is corv/skarm and you beat them if they don't carry id too

and fblast on hex sets are also standard, mir is another option you can use but there's different reasons for both

it's never one or the other, mir covers faries while blast takes care of gambits/can actually kill tar compared to no invest mir only chipping it

however, the team does have some flaws

lorb crown doesn't make too much sense, I know ur trying to take advantage of koko, but without extender you can't keep ur speed boost for long, since this is screens you need cm so with av out the window the only 2 options r either booster energy or maybe like a weakness policy/lefties, lorb doesn't really help crown past it's usual checks like gholdengo enough to justify it

and this is more personal but I find that screens/veil likes to use less glue like bulky gholds/4a pagos in order to fit more threats to maximize on being as offensive as you can behind screens

and so I'd rather see dengo running np, loon is fine but a simple modest 252 252 does everything you want, and pagos should carry a boosting move be it cm, meteor beam, or both

oh and setwise setup crown shouldn't carry volt

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/466c93f5a7825348 this feels like it sucks

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[nocturne summit]

yeah grounds maul this

[tame galleon]

replace tusk by a flying type with defog (like corv ?) and cinderace by a potent ice type (like weavile ?)

actually skarm > corv cause hazards i think

[hollow fern]

Lele is an insanely rough matchup

Same with mlati

Zero psychic resist

[dapper crypt]

need feedback on this https://pokepast.es/5c17283fa5a1bdde

[topaz pawn]

Thx a lot!

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/189a31fd495d0f80
https://pokepast.es/5b7c0f6d475be663 which one is better?

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[topaz pawn]

Then maybe weakness policy + stored power in place of volt switch makes sense for crown?
I initially thought of more sweeper variations of pagos/ghold but was not sure if that was « too much » or not

[empty olive]

demon crown isn't too bad of an option

id cm stored focus

you also don't technically need stored with weakness policy, and can run w just cm weakness 3 atks or 2 atks + sub considering ur behind veil

[nocturne summit]

anyone 😭

[blazing moth]

probably the first

it's rly up to which ur more comfy with in tests i think

[nocturne summit]

can I make tusk have helemt?

[tame galleon]

i don't see why not

(dont mention tspikes)

[blazing moth]

sure?

like it's probably gna be much of the same so ig

u could try defensive tho, set's kinda ass but worth a try

[tame galleon]

defensive would go harder with bulk up imo

[tame galleon]

https://pokepast.es/10e822a43f0110dd

id like some feedback, i have mixed 6 teams with gardevoir and aegislash and this is the best one yet

[hollow fern]

This team is all over the place, using really weird mon choices and sets and missing requirements like a ground type and rocks user

Zero mons in ou is generally not the best sign

[tame galleon]

isn't gardevoir ou ?

[hollow fern]

No

[tame galleon]

and volcanion (even tho i messed him up) ?

wait

no way volcanion's OU

[hollow fern]

No volcan is also not

[tame galleon]

okay okay this one's on me

[hollow fern]

Theres just no clear vision imo

[tame galleon]

what if i switched volcanion with volcarona and gardevoir with whatever other mega you'd suggest

[hollow fern]

Its just very all over the place

[tame galleon]

it's just foggy trust (i actually do not have a plan or an archetype)

[hollow fern]

Imo there really is no one mon switch that can save this

[tame galleon]

okay give me a second

https://pokepast.es/1b9224cff751036a

i know the next logical choice would be to sack wo-chien for ting-lu or smth but he has the niche of protect + ruination + leech seed

and that worked

so surely it can work again right ?

[hollow fern]

I mean if its works for you ig

This still needs a ground and rocks tho

And removal

I would highly not recommend keeping scarf xurk and band zap

The issue is that these are like all niche mons that require a lot of support to work and so stacking them on a team doesnt really create a good team imo

[tame galleon]

yeah so basically ting lu actually solves half of my issues right

[tame galleon]

does it ? i feel like i have enough breaking power to prevent hazard stack if i don't throw, and the only mon that really doesn't wants to hit rocks is volc - and he has hdb

[hollow fern]

Hazard control is essential for basically every team

Otherwise they just wear you down so fast

Even if everything on ur team is only taking neutral damage, the damage adds up a lott

Spikes and rocks going up just wreck this without removal

[tame galleon]

maybe i did rely too much on low ladder never clicking spikes

[hollow fern]

Even just rocks are really important to be able to get off the field

[hard creek]

https://pokepast.es/588587e68774adc5

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[blazing moth]

looks p passive and kgb weak

probably go zama here

and np pech instead of tea and make bolt pivot to free up the z

also this has no hazard control

[hard creek]

the point of the team was sinistcha but ty

but what hazard control would I put

[empty olive]

lop corv enough kgb answers

just add fog to corv and maybe make lop taxel for the gliscor mu and u have basically everything covered

yard might be a little rough, but it's managable, maybe you can snipe a few too w rslide > payback on lu

[lethal flicker]

https://pokepast.es/615e6579559973fa

idk what to do with this team, smth feels so off

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[tame galleon]

no physical breaker

besides hoopa-u

who's unreliable IMO

[lethal flicker]

they recommended me swapping hoopa u with zama

but I feel the team is still not good at all

they recommended it in natdex discord

[tame galleon]

ok let me take another look

the zard/Bolt/tusk synergy is good

keep it

mola on a sun team isn't bad but it makes it more passive than it already is

so maybe switch that with zama actually

[lethal flicker]

Is the glowking good?

Or should I change for more offense? Also, is it better for me to change tusk to offensive support?

[neon kite]

https://pokepast.es/6015375fa0bc301c hows this looking

[tame galleon]

well since you'll proc protosynthesis it can't hurt

[tame galleon]

it's double regen slow pivot, it can't be that bad ? just adds a ground weakness that's mitigated by zard.

maybe that's what you need a strong ice/grass type like weavile or waterpon

[tame galleon]

gliscor, pex AND ferrothorn ?

lowkey add dengo instead of tornadus and make it hazard stack lmao

[void thorn]

https://pokepast.es/bb0729cc7392b822 how can this team work i kinda wanna keep the dozo scizor valiant core

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[blazing moth]

i dont see how you can dozo here while being like, actively useful

it really just doesn't work on anything other than stall

the rest is fine outside of moveset

I'd prolly go for another ground though

team is a bit too offensive for gliscor and it's already using lando moves so

[void thorn]

What would u run rather than dozo?

[tame galleon]

samurott

or keldeo ?

yeah keldeo you need the special

[timid crescent]

https://pokepast.es/789d2bde66661afb Opinions? I'm new to team building so I'm not too sure

[tame galleon]

i have trouble believing zam and blissey will be useful here

[vapid flax]

https://pokepast.es/5517d9489c84cc53 Hovering around 1500-1600, looking for any tips since this is one of my first teams. I have been struggling a lot vs kyerum (literally sweeps my team lol) and teams with slowking galar/charizard y

[empty olive]

https://pokepast.es/332e7df3d867462b @limber crypt

wondering if specs koko is a bit much bc otherwise I feel like I'm way too hazard dependant to break but idek if that's a bad thing

or maybe theres just a better way to go about this

[dapper crypt]

https://pokepast.es/1abf412881df17b2 not sure what i should change about this team

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[woeful hearth]

https://pokepast.es/6ae420942038c9df
Peak 1330 (really bad but im not good at battling or teambuilding lmao)

Currently testing balloon most likely going back to hdb tho

[tame galleon]

https://pokepast.es/a8a02ea4db58ce7a
so i make a team exclusively of offensive threats and it still can't wallbreak properly unless i pivot every two turns (which i can't because i pack NO utility) how do i fix this without wrecking the semblance of structure i finally reached

[tame galleon]

glowking's built to take hits get him the hdb back it'll be more useful

also try power trip corviknight cause rn ghost types force a switch (you don't HAVE to it's just funnier that way)

other sets are fine enough although maybe change ting-lu's investments since his SpDef is already boosted by vessel of ruin (so you could invest in regular def or maybe atk for earthquake ?)

[tame galleon]

punching glove iron hands trust (he has the hp to rely on drain punch believe me)
also i'm not too sure of u-turn gliscor
and maybe swap court change for sucker punch ?

[woeful hearth]

idk lowk i have specificially idef because i have nothing else for physical attackers, idk i guess i could defog or kill the ghosts before using corv but ill try power trip, i just like spdef ting lu bc it feels really good for me

[hollow fern]

This team is missing rocks, removal, a ground type, and is just generally really all over the place. These mons choices are extremely weird and dont seem to have any purpose

[tame galleon]

okay so it's just the consequences of me ignoring almost every basics of teambuilding

thank you

[tame galleon]

keep idef/bp with power trip it works better that way

[fathom lion]

https://pokepast.es/418b3cff43ca5338
I'm kinda new to teambuilding but can anyone help judge this team 🥺
I think I found a really good core, its pretty balanced and has worked wonders so far
BUT I can't help but feel really uneasy how half my team is setup sweepers 💀
And its hard to really know if I'm heading in the right direction since I'm still low elo

[tame galleon]

if you want a bulky volc, go for the HP evs. It's generally always a better idea to go for HP evs first, unless you have, like, blissey.

as for having 3 setups sweepers. It's fine. HO works with 5.

i'm unsure if you need both clangorous soul and clanging scale. Besides, you can get kommo-o's z move in natdex.

i think meowscarada is fast enough to work with band

pex might like toxic over toxic spikes

might

again with the u-turn gliscor which i never see, honestly just check smogon for this one

nvm i'll do it

[fathom lion]

I tried toxic over scald but then I have like
no water moves

[fathom lion]

also they do have hp ev's?????

[tame galleon]

it's an option

[tame galleon]

oh my bad i focused on the 200 def sorry

well

i personally go for 128hp/128spA/252 Spe with Modest, which allows it to outspeed comfortably at +1 or even +2 without sacrificing too much breaking power

roost and giga drain feels overkill tbh

[fathom lion]

I have toxapex as my spikes setter and the gliscor as the utility monkey here, thats why gliscor is like that here

[tame galleon]

and mawile's good ig

[tame galleon]

yeah i meant that it works according to the pros

[fathom lion]

also sure, I'll try it out
I did focus on volca being more tanky though

[fathom lion]

ahhhh ok

[tame galleon]

let me run some calcs

you have 248/200/60

[fathom lion]

indeed

the 248/200/60 is kinda nice since it is usually enough to get away with a quiver dance

[tame galleon]

also i noticed you put tera types

tera is banned in natdex

[fathom lion]

I just put that for flavor

just in case I ever port half the team into another mode or something

although considering its built around mawile that probably wont happen lol

anyway if kommo-o's issue is that clangarous soul is a little overkill, would something like this set work

because this leans more into wallbreaking with some utility
and has the z-move as you recommended

[tame galleon]

252 Atk Great Tusk Headlong Rush vs. 248 HP / 200 Def Volcarona: 216-255 (57.9 - 68.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Great Tusk Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 200 Def Volcarona: 480-568 (128.6 - 152.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 SpA Charizard-Mega-Y Scorching Sands vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 85-101 (22.7 - 27%) -- 40.7% chance to 4HKO

252 SpA Charizard-Mega-Y Ancient Power vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 292-348 (78.2 - 93.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

28 Atk Diancie-Mega Diamond Storm vs. 248 HP / 200 Def Volcarona: 724-856 (194.1 - 229.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

228 SpA Diancie-Mega Earth Power vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Volcarona: 108-128 (28.9 - 34.3%) -- 3.5% chance to 3HKO

252 Atk Landorus-Therian Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 200 Def Volcarona: 520-612 (139.4 - 164%) -- guaranteed OHKO

it doesn't change the supereffective matchups

you always die to stone edge

[tame galleon]

let me check what the moves do again

[celest merlin]

Clangorous Soul (Gen 9)

Raises the user's Attack, Defense, Special Attack, Special Defense, and Speed by 1 stage in exchange for the user losing 33% of its maximum HP, rounded down. Fails if the user would faint or if its Attack, Defense, Special Attack, Special Defense, and Speed stat stages would not change.

Type

Dragon

Category

Non-Damaging

Power

0

Accuracy

100

PP

5 (8)

Priority

0

Target

Self

Flags

• Can be stolen from the original user and instead used by another Pokemon using Snatch.
• Has no effect on Pokemon with the Soundproof Ability.
• When used by a Pokemon, other Pokemon with the Dancer Ability can attempt to execute the same move.

Clangorous Soulblaze (Gen 9)

Raises the user's Attack, Defense, Special Attack, Special Defense, and Speed by 1 stage.

Type

Dragon

Category

Special

Power

185

Accuracy

0

PP

1 (1.6)

Priority

0

Target

AllAdjacentFoes

Flags

• Has no effect on Pokemon with the Soundproof Ability.
• Ignores a target's substitute.

[tame galleon]

ok so omniboost

[celest merlin]

Clanging Scales (Gen 9)

Lowers the user's Defense by 1 stage.

Type

Dragon

Category

Special

Power

110

Accuracy

100

PP

5 (8)

Priority

0

Target

AllAdjacentFoes

Flags

• Has no effect on Pokemon with the Soundproof Ability.
• Ignores a target's substitute.
• Can be selected by Metronome.
• Can be copied by Mirror Move.
• Blocked by protection moves.

[fathom lion]

damn
even with a bunch of quiver dance stacks??
alright well 128/128/252 it is

[tame galleon]

and this one is just scale shot but different

[tame galleon]

you won't get the chance to stack quiver dance

another option would be to go all out with a simple 252/252 if you trust your positioning skills

[fathom lion]

so I just make volcarona an all-or-nothing glass cannon

do I even bother putting quiver dance on that then?

[tame galleon]

actually pick exactly that

with the rocks

[tame galleon]

of course, it doesn't work without it

well

there ARE z-moves volcaronas out there

i think it's less reliable

[fathom lion]

ah okay
actually that might help with spikes since toxapex sis the only one with it as is

[fathom lion]

ohhh so you just mean that "in disadvantageous matchups (i.e. supereffective) it dies 100% of the time"

[tame galleon]

i'd recommend drain over close combat but that's personal preference almost

[tame galleon]

yes. you won't survive rock attacks.

and volcarona just needs the quiver dance to become an actual threat it's just that good of a move on that good of a mon

smogon seems to prefer morning sun over roost for recovery

btw

[fathom lion]

I just did roost since that was the recommended setup on smogon

[tame galleon]

for natdex ?

[fathom lion]

yeah

this one

[tame galleon]

ah yeah

morning sun comes back more often

but it's influenced by weather so

[fathom lion]

I just put in giga drain instead since any healing is nice but
might as well bug buzz for stab

[fathom lion]

ohhhhhh ok
this probably matters only on a sun team but meh, easy change

[tame galleon]

giga drain is useful for the water/ground matchup

i personally never use bug buzz and having two coverage options is (imo) extremely effective
but then bug buzz swarm substitute is a thing so

[fathom lion]

I could try substitute

probably helps for survivability

so considering mawile is my big win con
do I try going for a offensive quiver dance set, or try substitute/swarm gimmicks?

[tame galleon]

you will keep QD in both cases

honestly i'd say keep it simple at first

swarm works but then you rely on bug stab, which is walled by a lot

[fathom lion]

I mean something more along the lines of
substitute has the possibility of letting my volcarona live longer, but should I lean into the survivability or not

considering their biggest use case is taking the time to power up

[tame galleon]

oh
well my opinion is no

[fathom lion]

because otherwise I can just do the standard

[tame galleon]

you really only need to live the setup turn
because if it all goes well you should be fast and strong enough to - yeah that one

[tame galleon]

only issue is that you really can't miss

boots knocked off by an opponent that can force a switch ? it's over
water ? it's over
physical attack ? it's over

so if you trust yourself do it

my set is simply a compromise

[tame galleon]

but if you position it well it's the most straightforward answer

(i'd switch bug buzz for something else because again bug stab, but maybe that's why i'm not in the smogon council)

[fathom lion]

would giga drain be fine then?

seemed to work before

[fathom lion]

nvm you already answered that question

anyway so as long as I change up kommo-o and voclarona, that seems to be the biggest issues out of the way
I guess I just test choice band meowscarada and toxic on toxapex?

mawile and gliscor seem fine for now

[tame galleon]

i use it

[tame galleon]

yeah, that's what i would do

[fathom lion]

okay cool
thank you very very much!!
I'll go test this and see how I do
thanks for helping and leading me to the right sources

[tame galleon]

yw !

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[indigo vigil]

https://pokepast.es/598efcab9d74f991 nidoking webs team

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[hidden osprey]

nidoking is garbage and would probably fit better on a much more bulkier structure than ho
kart is barely better and band is pointless, if you want to keep it on the webs its better to do grass z/normal z giga impact
technically the rib set is slightly not optimal but its fine
tusk set should be cc/stone edge with booster attack>knock w boots
and last thing is boots zama can tear this apart pretty easily if you use tusk slightly sloppy, so be absolutely careful of that. could make ghold fat twave to help?

main points are:replace kart and nidoking for better, more consistent breakers, and replace them with better sweepers that can at minimum handle zama better

[indigo vigil]

Aight ty

Made this in under a minute either way i just needed sm1s input

[summer mist]

https://pokepast.es/591f770d53618ec5

[tame galleon]

i'm not sure the gen 7 set still works for xurk.
esicue is a gimmick mon
heatran should get magma storm instead of overheat
maybe zen headbutt somewhere on medicham
i don't know what cornerstone brings besides accurate physical rock move
corv is basic and that's alright

also your only reliable special attacker is xurkitree

that's terrible

but yeah really idk why esicue and ogerpon are here

[summer mist]

i like using my favourites but igwym

[tame galleon]

oh
well then it's likely fine you could make em work
you probably already know that there are better options out there

but they're not THAT bad like Esicue will be hard to setup and cornerstone is the weakest Ogerpon variant but they still got something

[lapis sleet]

https://pokepast.es/ee5a444e9bb50d08

Need some help with this team
I think the core is quite solid, but it the team severly lacks defensive options against HO
Feel free to change the team if needed, but keep Kyurem and Rilla

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[tame galleon]

switch heatran for mola

[hollow fern]

That gets rid of the steel type

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/10b3110e22e6b9eb does this suck?

[tame galleon]

but it creates a double-regen core and i think mola is a better special wall ?

[tame galleon]

i was about to say that it was alright until i saw endeavor substitute mega diancie

what were you cooking

[nocturne summit]

what's wrong with it? that's the typical lead set

[tame galleon]

is it ?

that's what i find

[nocturne summit]

that's the wallbreaker, scroll down

[tame galleon]

and like does this thing need endure like no one runs iron head but

[tame galleon]

okay give me a second

[tame galleon]

holy

that's real ?

okay let me read the analysis

[gaunt stirrup]

Wth

I was spectating the convo

[tame galleon]

oh my god it's a thing

[gaunt stirrup]

Did not expect that to be a real set

[tame galleon]

yeah like why would you run that

[gaunt stirrup]

Wth is wrong with people who play this meta?

[tame galleon]

endure

i don't know man 😭

[gaunt stirrup]

Man I used calm mind M Diancie

And it was fun

Not ta

ts

[tame galleon]

i can see the reasoning here at least

like even the analysis says the whole point is stealth rock

[nocturne summit]

tf you mean endure, endevear is another thing

[tame galleon]

stealth rock magic bounce that's it

okay i can't read but still substitute endeavor

what are you going to do ? kill yourself the opponent's pokemon to death ?

[tame galleon]

just run sableye or smth atp
wait sableye doesn't get rocks
yeah you get the idea

[nocturne summit]

it's a lead, obviously situations that where you just have to suicide it

[tame galleon]

it has 100/100 offenses and 150/150 defenses and that's what you'd do with it

not criticizing you personally of course but

it just seems like such a waste

it's a mega too

[nocturne summit]

those stats are of the base form, you're going to have to mega to use the magic bounce

[tame galleon]

even worse with mega

160/160 offense and you use it as a suicide lead

that's

[nocturne summit]

I DID doubt the mon when I was starting to play the format way when I was a beginner but after some time it recognized that it does a really good job at what it does, especially for the fact that it's a setter that isn't afraid of taunt

[tame galleon]

yeah but it does just rocks

like not even rocks and toxic or rocks and spikes

[nocturne summit]

difference is things like deoxys and glim usually die fast and are taunt victims, this thing can actually last, deny other hazards, taunt immune and actually do good damage

[gaunt stirrup]

I’ve fought a lot of lead Diancies but usually they run rocks 3a

And that’s the most threatening set half the time

[nocturne summit]

what you're talking about is probably the wallbreaker set

[tame galleon]

what about ferro, ting-lu, or even lando/chomp ?

wait you said good damage so forget ferro ig

[tame galleon]

wallbreakers is diamond storm, ep, moonblast and mystical fire

[nocturne summit]

they can use rocks as a slot instead of diamond storm

[tame galleon]

...and that would actually allow for better ev distribution

why don't you do that ?

it seems smart
not that i tried it

[gaunt stirrup]

Just use mega Tar guys he’s goated

[nocturne summit]

what about them? chomp and ting both hate moonblat and neither can throw hazards on it

[gaunt stirrup]

(I’m a Tar glazer)

[nocturne summit]

best thing I can say to you is try the set out befoe judging it

[tame galleon]

not a setter

but very good nontheless

[gaunt stirrup]

He sets up rocks tho

🗣️

🔥

[tame galleon]

yeah and that's it

[gaunt stirrup]

He got that knock off

[nocturne summit]

I had my doubts on it but after testing it was great to me

[gaunt stirrup]

And that strong ass stone edge

[tame galleon]

like imagine you run DD/Rocks, you're then stuck with knock and stone edge when you'd also like idk pursuit and earthquake

[nocturne summit]

slow af

[tame galleon]

the devious 20%

[tame galleon]

bulky enough

[gaunt stirrup]

Never run dd w tar

It’s a dumb set

[tame galleon]

look if it works it works

let me look the rest of the team

[gaunt stirrup]

Low kick stone edge knock off

rocks

[tame galleon]

the stuck at 1400 experience (i keep running bad teams as soon as i start making progress)

[gaunt stirrup]

Usually run enough speed to outpace gambit

rest in bulk

and atk ofc

[nocturne summit]

never tried dd ttar out

[tame galleon]

dragonite ice spinner ???

[gaunt stirrup]

I ddi

Did

[tame galleon]

well according to Y it's bad

[tame galleon]

better options out there

[gaunt stirrup]

It was solid sometimes but it’s inconsistent

[nocturne summit]

thing's place was always dnite

[gaunt stirrup]

You dd in front of corvi switch stone edge

and die to body press

[nocturne summit]

feel like it suffers from 4th slot syndrome

[gaunt stirrup]

or get uturned on and cc’d by Za

Or shit on by scarf Lando or even lando itself

Pretty much has a LOT of answers

3a gives a lot more bang for your buck with rocks

[tame galleon]

my answer is +4 return mega altaria 😭

[gaunt stirrup]

P sure rocks then 2 stone edges is enough to kill corvi

[gaunt stirrup]

Say wallahi bro

[tame galleon]

with what investment

[tame galleon]

istg

[gaunt stirrup]

Max atk adamant
All you need speed for is Gambit anyways

[tame galleon]

either that or aegislash and pray i time the king's shield right

[gaunt stirrup]

Outpace base 50’s jolly/timid

[tame galleon]

no i meant in the corv lmao

[gaunt stirrup]

Oh

Max phys def

[tame galleon]

WHAT

you fr ?

[gaunt stirrup]

Lemme get the calcs

[celest merlin]

Tyranitar-Mega (Gen 10)

Typing

Rock / Dark

Abilities

0: Sand Stream

Base Stats (BST: 700)

100 / 164 / 150 / 95 / 120 / 71

Weight

255 kg (120 BP)

Gender Rate

50% Female

[tame galleon]

164 on a neutral hit cannot hit that hard

...

i mean it's corv

[gaunt stirrup]

252+ Atk Tyranitar-Mega Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Corviknight: 150-177 (37.5 - 44.3%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Ah mb

It’s close but it needs to be like

a little more chipped

[tame galleon]

and that's 248 hp

[nocturne summit]

252+ Atk Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 184+ Def Corviknight: 135-160 (33.7 - 40%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

[tame galleon]

is 184 a real thing

[gaunt stirrup]

That’s base

Tar

[nocturne summit]

252+ Atk Tyranitar-Mega Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 184+ Def Corviknight: 157-186 (39.2 - 46.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery mb

[tame galleon]

ah yeah true

oh my god 😭

[gaunt stirrup]

252+ Atk Tyranitar-Mega Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 204+ Def Corviknight: 154-183 (38.5 - 45.8%) -- 15.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

What calcs are you running brother

OH lefties

Makes sense

I think I got my calcs w mega tar mixed with band tar

Bc band tar just raw 2hkoes no rocks I think

252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 204+ Def Corviknight: 199-235 (49.8 - 58.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

49.8% min lmao

[tame galleon]

i mean you make calcs say whatever you want them to truly

like

+6 252+ Atk Bastiodon Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0+ Def Corviknight: 355-418 (105.3 - 124%) -- guaranteed OHKO

does that make any sense to you

[gaunt stirrup]

It’s bastiodon

[tame galleon]

i know

[gaunt stirrup]

What’s your team even

[tame galleon]

don't laugh

[nocturne summit]

guys aboma is scaring me

252 Atk Koraidon Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Abomasnow in Snow: 312-368 (81.4 - 96%) -- guaranteed 2HKO it's without the sun boost but still wtf

[tame galleon]

right now i'm running this. https://pokepast.es/a8a02ea4db58ce7a

[tame galleon]

hold on hold on hold on

[gaunt stirrup]

That’s quite the team

[tame galleon]

8 SpA Abomasnow-Mega Blizzard vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Koraidon: 306-360 (89.7 - 105.5%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO

THERE IS A WORLD

IN WHICH ABOMASNOW-M WINS THE DUEL

[gaunt stirrup]

There’s a lot of things that can be fixed w this but overall it’s kinda unviable

However

[tame galleon]

yeah, i know 😔

[gaunt stirrup]

I see a lot of these mons

working with screens

[tame galleon]

that's not my actual team dw

the real one is

[gaunt stirrup]

Screens/Veil

[nocturne summit]

scarf toxic xurk 🥀

[tame galleon]

we all make mistakes okay ?

i updated it for energy ball 😭

[gaunt stirrup]

All I got is my OU team rn if you guys wanna see
But I think we should take this to another chat

[tame galleon]

anyways why is this what catches your eyes instead of charge beam iron jugulis 😭

[gaunt stirrup]

Maybe add each other for a quick gc?

[tame galleon]

nah it's chill

[tame galleon]

as you wish tbh

[gaunt stirrup]

Alr

My team did just get rated in #1297721195604611163

if you wanna see it

[tame galleon]

https://pokepast.es/76f2fc682d5fc41b

basically this with hurrican instead of air cutter

[nocturne summit]

fun fact: do you know that flamethrower is run over fiery dance a lot on volc?

[tame galleon]

and 128/128/252 for volc

[gaunt stirrup]

Yeah

[tame galleon]

yeah but i like fiery dance cause signature + 50% chance to boost

since I run HP investments I can afford to wait a bit

a bit

[nocturne summit]

all for the purpose to have a chance to ohko scarf lando, at least that's the one Ik

[gaunt stirrup]

I like the defensive core but there needs to be a few edits

[nocturne summit]

at 1+

[tame galleon]

that explains why i'm always at 91

[tame galleon]

i'm all ears, cause I actually have trouble improving on that one

[gaunt stirrup]

Scarf Gholdengo is good over Aegislash and Zapdos can be max phys def

You prolly want a more offensive Volcarona

[tame galleon]

never tried it except in my very early days when everything was 252/252+

[gaunt stirrup]

Tusk is a lot better over Zygaurde

[tame galleon]

also why scarf ghold ? it's got a way different role than aegislash no ?

plus it would remove me a physical breaker

[gaunt stirrup]

Heatran is a giga threat

[tame galleon]

again different roles no ? genuinely asking

[gaunt stirrup]

You need hazard removal

[tame galleon]

can't I handle it with fini/zygarde

[gaunt stirrup]

And Tusk can be a breaker

[tame galleon]

zap ?

[gaunt stirrup]

depends on the item

[tame galleon]

i'll see if I find a set for this ig

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/b0f0fb38c3f18de6 guys is this a good defensive core?

[gaunt stirrup]

Oh right this is Natdex OU

[tame galleon]

yeah lol

[tame galleon]

payback > ruination since it relies on speed and not damage

[nocturne summit]

actually defog instead of body press

[gaunt stirrup]

Don’t you want volt switch over tbolt

[tame galleon]

no defog corv

[tame galleon]

okay forget it

[tame galleon]

that's already patched in the - yknow what give me a second

[nocturne summit]

ruination gives a safe button to click on any switch in

[gaunt stirrup]

Yeah

[tame galleon]

https://pokepast.es/b2fb692776ec48a2

[gaunt stirrup]

Try out Skarm though if you want

[tame galleon]

if you want reliability sure better idea

[gaunt stirrup]

Hazard stack with spikes

And you can just do boots spam

with the last two mons being speed control and a wincon

[tame galleon]

i don't have much to say cause it's not bad

[nocturne summit]

if I was going defog-less corv then yeah skarm is better

[gaunt stirrup]

You won’t need defog

Bc 1 it’s unreliable into Ghold

[tame galleon]

av mola loses to tspikes no

[gaunt stirrup]

and 2 if you change to bootspam

ur fine

[tame galleon]

bootspam + ghold makes the team a knock off victim no ?

[tame galleon]

anyways that's the actual team if anyone's got suggestions

[gaunt stirrup]

Skarmory and I didn’t say add Ghold

[tame galleon]

well you spoke of hazard stack and then of ghold so i assumed but my bad

[gaunt stirrup]

Pecharunt is fine by itself

Skarm Pech Lu is a very common core

[nocturne summit]

not if you have an absorber

[gaunt stirrup]

Zama loves abusing hazards

[tame galleon]

forgot about that

[gaunt stirrup]

Kinda getting overstimulated rn
Too many things to think abt

But yeah

Just build w that

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/115f7bc1b46b1a52 maybe something like this

but ahhh no removal

[tame galleon]

ironically volcarona victim

[gaunt stirrup]

Don’t like the set

for Lati

You might need heavy slam

over ice fang

You need a knocker

[nocturne summit]

mola

[tame galleon]

with attack investments i think

[nocturne summit]

I despise glis and lando

[gaunt stirrup]

Weavile

[nocturne summit]

bro

75 atk 😭

[gaunt stirrup]

Try boots weavile

[nocturne summit]

sd weavile + wallbreaker m-lati?

[tame galleon]

exactly tf you killing with that 😭

[gaunt stirrup]

I’m not sure abt mlati

Is deo s still banned

[tame galleon]

i think

[nocturne summit]

the point is to knock items not do damage

[nocturne summit]

yes

[tame galleon]

yup

[tame galleon]

idk man i like my knock mons to benefit from the power boost

take every damage you can get

[nocturne summit]

having damage dealers is fine

clef sometimes uses knock off

[gaunt stirrup]

I guess then
I feel like you lack speed control but

Your bulk should handle it

Since the main fast guy in the tier is Za

and well you have

LITERALLY THE best check to it

[nocturne summit]

zama or weavile are good enough speed control

[gaunt stirrup]

I think you just go with Weavile M lati

Weavile is slower than Za and guys like those but I think they’re fine

Booster Val mu is eh

[nocturne summit]

speed control is neccesery outspeeding the fastest thing in the tier just having a good speed tier is fine,

[nocturne summit]

yeah fairies are scaring me here

especially special ones

physically skarm and pech walls but special ehh

pech is an unreal mon, a ghost mon that is bulky enough to eat up most knock offs hell be a decent absorber is creepy

[tame galleon]

skarm got this dw

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/faa5d977b9bc8c0c got back to og form, this is what I got

[hard marten]

Hey yall, posting this team for advice, but keep in mind when replying I do have a few restrictions on what changes I can make. They may seem a little silly but just know that these restrictions cannot be bypassed when improving the team.

https://pokepast.es/7bb68b6850c481ef

1. No Legendaries, Mythicals, UBs, or Paradox mons
2. Mega Manectric must remain on the team

[hollow fern]

!arbitraryformats

[celest merlin]

Please take a moment to review the rules of the competitive section: #1373406929317269624 message

Do not ask for assistance with arbitrary rulesets or restrictions placed on teambuilding, we will not help with them in this server. The competitive section is only for Smogon and Nintendo formats.

[hollow fern]

If this is for cobblemons those arent rated here sry

[hard marten]

I see

[lapis sleet]

https://pokepast.es/82c5c923c7ab8621

The team looks solid in the first glance, BUT I still believe it lacks breaking power, especially if Blissey + Dozo + Gliscor are together on the enemy team
I know this team has a lot of potential, but I think I am still missing something
Does anyone know?

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[low bay]

https://pokepast.es/a751fb92535e374f I tried to build a team for AVmarina but I think things getting a little change in the process

[tame galleon]

replace tusk with boltbeam special attacker and give moltres defog instead of roar to compensate

[tame galleon]

why torrent and not liquid voice ? anyways i don't really know what to change besides maybe switching ghold to nasty plot/make it rain

[nocturne summit]

to not effect psychic noise

[nocturne summit]

would probably go cm on tera, flamethrower + tera strom covers everything you want and cm makes you an actual threat

also static on zap

[tame galleon]

alright, then it works thanks to AV i guess

[tame galleon]

oh wait didn't even notice it was lacking cm and static
yeah seconded of course

wait we're talking about different teams

the one with tera doesn't have tusk in the first place

[nocturne summit]

wait..

my bad

[tame galleon]

happens dw

[lapis sleet]

what should i replace tusk with again?

[tame galleon]

anything with good special atk and boltbeam coverage

lowkey im thinking valiant

[burnt remnant]

hows my team? https://pokepast.es/b18464b4de90913a

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[gaunt stirrup]

https://pokepast.es/569843f3dfe93b8a
This any good? Wanted to pair up my top 2 fav mons

[nocturne summit]

cm on pagos instead of ice beam

is that me or glis feels a bit annoying here

[dry rain]

https://pokepast.es/e8c53f7dbc2901ed

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[dry rain]

Help me improve this team pls

[tame galleon]

i don't think ursaluna is really him in natdex tbh

especially with no TR

anyways

yeah it's RUBL

it COULD work but I wouldn't count on it.

scald over toxic on mola

[dry rain]

Well I did try to make him work and thts my core so I wouldn't wanna change tht

[dry rain]

Alr

Tysm

[tame galleon]

Okay better idea then

make a tr team.

like actually.

get hatterene or smth

[tame galleon]

yw

your team isn't bad btw i just don't want to risk breaking everything

[dry rain]

Well, I also didn't want to do tht ;-;

I alr hv used ursa in troom

Ive plenty of troom teams

Although they r basically the same

;-;

[tame galleon]

oh

okay let me think for a second

ursa's main issues are flying types, ice types and ghost types.

so you need

boltbeam
speed control
and something against ice (though the type's defensive profile makes it so that you'll probably get it's counters even without actively trying)

you could build your team entirely around ursa with teammates to support his weaknesses so you can bring him in safely

i also forgot he likely doesn't appreciate toxic.

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/769f50017cf09a30 @tame galleon wdyt of this

[dry rain]

Can u give me some ideas of how I shud go about it?

[burnt remnant]

could someone rate this

[tame galleon]

IMO balloon gambit isn't worth it, you're likely bringing him in as 5th or 6th and not as something that can switch in and start setting up so you're better with dark glasses or leftovers
as for the team in itself zapdos seems to be kinda sitting there since it doesn't have removal. I'd suggest switching him with a second special attacker to reach some kind of balance
band zama is fine (even though it's not on smogon) but then you can easily be forced out by ghost types and you'll have a harder time dealing with stuff that would require ice fang
the other three seem fine enough

[tame galleon]

i can give you my opinion if it helps

[burnt remnant]

yes please

[nocturne summit]

I mean to be fair I can make zap have defog instead of twave (although I love the cheese of it) but is it just sitting there? it does fine-ish damage while providing pivoting and a way to punish contact

[tame galleon]

get something with defog (torn can work, or corv if you want something simpler)
get a fast special attacker (i like to recommend valiant cause it's easy to use)
get a bulky pivot (that could be tornadus, you can pair it with mola for easy double regencore)
get a physical attacker of a different type (many choices, i'd keep weavile and lookup a smogon set cause it's typing completes ursa really well)
add uhh...Hazards (i personally use ferrothorn)
add ursaluna
you should have something that can answer to most structures and use ursa

[tame galleon]

i mean it works but then your only real special attacker is latios
and dozo exists

[tame galleon]

alright let me try

[nocturne summit]

so? what if dozo exist? 😭 I'll just switch the zap on it

[tame galleon]

i'm not sure what you'll be hitting with thunder punch mega-mawile ; i'm often told knock is better over it
mola is fine
without hdb, rocks will break multiscale and steal your setup turn
i think calm mind would work better over tera starstorm, but smogon recommends both.
landorus is alright, maybe defog over taunt
you could switch knock with u turn if you need fast momentum, but with the current structure i wouldn't advise it

[tame galleon]

zap with hurricane 😭 let's run calcs maybe you're right

[burnt remnant]

taunt kind of does the same thing as defog tho

[tame galleon]

0 SpA Zapdos Volt Switch vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Dondozo: 258-306 (51.1 - 60.7%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Hurricane does less

it CAN work

[tame galleon]

you need to anticipate taunt while you can wait for defog. it's easier. but if you believe in your ability to time it then sure.

[nocturne summit]

realistically who's keeping dozo infront of zap?

you're just risking para and waterful and body press don't do anything

[burnt remnant]

so should i keep it?

[tame galleon]

well if it's a zap out of rain I know it's likely defensive and I believe in my ability to beat him

but it doesn't matter since the calc is for volt switch. if dozo hits rest you're cooked

[tame galleon]

you got rapid spin and all your mons can afford some chip (except dnite) so yeah

[nocturne summit]

hurrcaine it to chip it or damage whatever ground typing coming, it's not resting when it's volt switch food

[burnt remnant]

okay so just put boots on dnite and change thunder punch and my team is good?

thanks for the help

[tame galleon]

if you put boots on dnite go uturn on waterpon imo
it'll make switching easier

[tame galleon]

well volt switch "only" does half uninvested

so either run some investment or yeah pray you don't miss

[nocturne summit]

still realistically what can dozo do against me for me to not take the risk? like cursing up won't help it to overpower zap, unless I'm really unlucky I'm at an advanatage

[dry rain]

https://pokepast.es/735e57630db7cefd

So smth like this? For the last slot I need smth that walls diancie mega but also gets rocks

Or I could go spd corv > torn so tht I can wall diancie and for the last slot js smth with rocks

[tame galleon]

just get treads then

anyways the team looks fine enough tbh

[dry rain]

Won't I just get swept by a diancie?

[tame galleon]

let me run calcs and check stats again

[dry rain]

Okie

[tame galleon]

228 SpA Diancie-Mega Earth Power vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Iron Treads: 302-356 (78.6 - 92.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

0 Atk Iron Treads Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Diancie-Mega: 242-288 (100.4 - 119.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

there's a world in which it works

[celest merlin]

No data found for that Pokemon!

No data found for that Pokemon!

[tame galleon]

are you kidding me

okay

[celest merlin]

No data found for that Pokemon!

[tame galleon]

diancie outspeeds

[blazing moth]

huh

[tame galleon]

so yeah

[dry rain]

Well every time diancie comes in it pressures me too much

[tame galleon]

sup

[tame galleon]

don't forget it's guaranteed OHKO

[blazing moth]

p sure js alo+luna works

and a fairy resist if u rly need it

mdia can be ur rocker too

[dry rain]

Why wud they not swap out diancie?

[tame galleon]

well if they do then diancie is off the field and it's not an issue right ?

[dry rain]

Yea I was considering tht too

[dry rain]

I mean it's eventually gonna be pivoted back in

[tame galleon]

252+ Atk Guts Ursaluna Headlong Rush vs. 0 HP / 0- Def Diancie-Mega: 698-824 (289.6 - 341.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
228 SpA Diancie-Mega Moonblast vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Ursaluna: 216-255 (46.6 - 55%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after burn damage

but eventually you'll have options

[dry rain]

Oh well maybe then luna with some spd invest could help

https://pokepast.es/fcc1829dc2e5e3c2

Tysm for ur help

[tame galleon]

this should hold

[tame galleon]

the calc gives a 2HK0 without spd or full hp

[tame galleon]

yw !

[dry rain]

Oh yea didn't notice no hp

[empty olive]

@gray lake https://pokepast.es/f2407d64bed37644 thoughts

ik it would be way better w eq over dwb for dnite but zama is completely balanced and 1v1s both non gleam specs koko and defensive ghold

ig just adding gleam to koko seems obvious but it's kinda strapped for slots with dual pivot and honestly having both has been really useful to control momentum and pressure

and the other 2 slots are kinda a given

[nocturne summit]

that dnite is walled by literally any steel, at that point just give it dragon tail to be a bulky fazer

[empty olive]

Dd is likely worth more here

Being walled by something isnt the end all for dnite, it compresses a few roles here, being a wellspring answer, strong prio, yard answer, but dd also allows it to become a lategame sweeper if the opp isnt careful

Tail is nice but it doesnt justify itself because the utility you gain doesnt match the threat of dd, most stuff ur gonna want to tail on doesn't want to stay in on dd dnite anyway

[gray lake]

generally if you wanna run roost dnite your best bet for moves is earthquake and ice spinner

although this Dnite set doesnt sweep on its own very often tbh

[empty olive]

Ye I just mainly want to have the option though

[gray lake]

other than that i think the main thing is like

[empty olive]

Eq ice is fair best coverage but Ive been finding myself liking espeed on it its just such a good revenge option

[gray lake]

tspike pex balance looks incredibly hard to deal with

since those teams generally have a koko wall

so it just gets a tspike down and outlasts tusk since u arent boots

[empty olive]

So boots tusk

Sure icium was just nice to snipe unsuspecting zap and not take helm + skin from chomp

[gray lake]

i would be curious what you built this around tbh

because a lot of these sets arent exactly consistent performers, you just have a lot of pokemon that have hard matchups into really common stuff

so i would guess this would just have issues with consistency

[empty olive]

Koko sciz mainly just for voltturn

Then av hamu helps w break stuff down, ghold + dnite glue and tusk for hazard compression

[gray lake]

i think this could be better if you make ghold a plot+z set with tusk as boots

because it gives u another pokemon that can force generalized progress

and takes advantage of ferro rly well

[empty olive]

Ig

I mainly liked balloon just so it acts like proper glue once even against mons like tusk or dnite

You think its a little weak to those if u make the ghold offensive and no balloon?

[gray lake]

its kinda a give and take because i think your too passive overall as it stands rn

theres also nasty plot sets with balloon if u wanna do that

[sleek scroll]

https://pokepast.es/b16837de1b09635c Need a sp.atk wall breaker im sick of stall

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[sleek scroll]

Also another hazard remover would be nice

[tame galleon]

why tf is pidgeot here 😭

what is bro's purpose

anyways as a special breaker lowkey kyurem, volc, moth or xurk

[tame galleon]

you have tusk no ?

[blazing moth]

make pidgeot a tornadus-therian

and use another move instead of slack off on gking

probably also replace koko with something that actually benefits from alomomola wish like a steel type like melm or ghold

or js dont use wish mola and go av or something for a physical sponge

[blazing moth]

as for this idk what to say tbh tusk is enough for hazard control but you need to also use rocks on it

and headling rush+ice spinner+max speed max atk jolly

bulky tusk is undesirable most of the time

[sleek scroll]

I can't do that to my bird not pidgeot

[sleek scroll]

Wut would u suggest

[nocturne summit]

toxic or twave

[blazing moth]

^

[blazing moth]

well tornadus is a pretty good spatker that breaks stall but ok

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/394b9a0888d4891a people is this good?

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[nocturne summit]

@blazing moth wdyt of this?

[blazing moth]

yeah that's good I'd use headlong tusk though

[nocturne summit]

to be fair I didn't want to deal with defenses stat drops while yeah it makes me weaker in grassy terrain with enough boosts I doubt rilla can do much

[blazing moth]

it's rly js free dmg not much reason not to go for it here

[nocturne summit]

do you think I should give torn taunt for more stall resurance?

[blazing moth]

nah you have a hatt and xard ur fine

[vapid flax]

https://pokepast.es/5517d9489c84cc53 Hovering around 1500-1600, looking for any tips since this is one of my first teams. I have been struggling a lot vs kyerum (literally sweeps my team lol) and teams with slowking galar/charizard y

[blazing moth]

zapdos should be max speed here

or at least 252 modest

although i prefer tornadus-therian more

kingdra is also like just bad

and hp fire is anti sinergetic on a rain team (fire moves do less damage on rain)

[vapid flax]

I have it for ferrothorn tbh

If he’s chipped and rain ends I can send kingdra to finish

[vapid flax]

Who would u recommend instead?

[vapid flax]

I had him max speed but I’ve been using him a lot to tank phys attacks and get para so I switched it but I think ur right abt 252 modest

[blazing moth]

I figured but weather ball does just as much
252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Weather Ball (100 BP Water) vs. 252 HP / 176 SpD Ferrothorn in Rain: 123-144 (34.9 - 40.9%) -- 60.9% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Kingdra Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 176 SpD Ferrothorn in Rain: 132-156 (37.5 - 44.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

urs is not modest but u get the point

[blazing moth]

probably bolt or overqwuil

u can also try bolt over archal

[blazing moth]

as for slowking it's just a bad matchup u gotta play aggressive but u can never trully 100% fix it
yard teams should be lightwork if u keep pelipper and swampert alive and play around raging bolt well

opposing weather is sum you can never truly fix though it's more about how you into them

[summer turtle]

https://pokepast.es/7b1040e08f8b312e

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[summer turtle]

Could someone help me pls

[gentle trench]

uh base latios as a general rule of thumb isnt very good

also think your fini set is a bit dubious, cm fog prolly isnt it

[summer turtle]

It is quite helpful tho

[gentle trench]

i would recommend dropping tios for a sturdier ground immune (preferrably a fogger) and then making fini taunt

[blazing moth]

mega is just straight up better here

[summer turtle]

I kinda can't thinl of a better defoger for my team

[gentle trench]

u could maybe make mlop zama and then go mtios but i assume the whole idea of the team is mlop

[gentle trench]

cm fog on fini js feels rly clunky

[blazing moth]

js a normal bird works like zapdos or torn

[gentle trench]

u could torn

yeah my initial thought was torn

[summer turtle]

But this is a Lopunny team tho

[gentle trench]

yeah i thought so

torn would also give u a pivot on this which is nice

caus ur no turn punny and no other momentum

[summer turtle]

Also, isn't a water type useful tho

[gentle trench]

also i think triple setup is greeding

[gentle trench]

u would still have a fini

js not fog on it

[summer turtle]

So who do I drop, Latios?

[gentle trench]

https://pokepast.es/17d3fec758024266 mayb this type of route?

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[gentle trench]

depends how strongly you want to keep latios

/ bolt

[summer turtle]

Ty for the suggestion but I reallh don't like playing a defensive Chomp (also Latios is like my 2nd biggest source of dmg)

Immediate dmg

[gentle trench]

u can go sd z chomp

sd drag / rock z

[bitter wagon]

https://pokepast.es/9e3ec35401fddb1a

need hyelp

[blazing moth]

hi! u should give ferro spikes instead of sr and tusk rocks instead of body press

[bitter wagon]

i need the body press to hit gambit and ting lu

since im no attack investment

[blazing moth]

headlong already hits kingambit

as for the rest of the team lu is just not a horrible matchup

but go max attack and speed (jolly nature) on tusk yea

oh yah i js noticed this is the def tusk set

yeah that sets lowk ass

offensive is better on most teams teams this is no exception

[gentle trench]

this has no speed control I fear

mayb drop tusk for scarf fog lando

also with Ttar yard I like having a mbouncer like hat but that's js personal preference and would prolly require a bigger rework with the last 3 mons

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/ad5acb5f0670861f correct me if I posted this already

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[gentle trench]

uh u have no removal

js make corv fog

but it looks solid enough

[nocturne summit]

huh? wait 😭 corv should be defog instead of bp

[nocturne summit]

is stall managable?

[gentle trench]

yeah u have a cm lele