NatDex OU Rates

[gaunt stirrup]

yeah noticed

either way

[blazing moth]

and ferro better w bpress

[gaunt stirrup]

for what?

[blazing moth]

more pp

still hits kyu and stuff

i mean ig u can keep gyro if u wann hit lele

[gaunt stirrup]

over gyro I’m assuming?

[blazing moth]

yea

[gaunt stirrup]

Kinda wanna but then again power whip hits it well enough right?

[blazing moth]

but like u have spdef guys and u can js seed the lele

[blazing moth]

yea

[gaunt stirrup]

alright

[blazing moth]

can also rock knock here

u dont want spikes anyways so

[gaunt stirrup]

alright, anything else

you’ve helped a lot btw so ty

[blazing moth]

nah no prob im js free rn

[gaunt stirrup]

alr

Ty

[blazing moth]

maybe u could experiment w mixed chomp but that's prolly it

[gaunt stirrup]

alr

appreciate it

[nocturne summit]

btw @blazing moth wdyt?

[blazing moth]

meow doesn't need scarf and rotom can be like any other water w a pivot and be better ngl

mainly mola but maybe even heat synth pon could be cool

or hamu

tusk should offensive too def tusk is pretty asscheeks

[inner elm]

def tusk is fine
prolly not on here tho

[blazing moth]

ts like only decent on sun

[inner elm]

i mean there's a separate ghold punisher
u only really run defensive tusk to cram on bo or sun imo

[inner elm]

anyway this really needs a volc answer n stuff
do we make metagame based recs or do we just make sure it's a mildly cohesive structure around here

[blazing moth]

i mean

rly js add a mola

shit solving anything

here's no exception

[inner elm]

yeah av mola over tom fixes this
except ur koko mu that's just curl into a corner and cry

[blazing moth]

although ts bit hazard weak

[inner elm]

well there's a gking and lop

[blazing moth]

whole gking

[inner elm]

my goat physical z koko would never fall for this bait

[blazing moth]

and mola legit 1v1's no electrium bc fish js built like that

[inner elm]

meow's just here ig

[blazing moth]

sets spikes so hey

thats cool

[inner elm]

needs more power
z ghold n shit

[blazing moth]

yeah true ig

u have fsight tho so idk

[inner elm]

fsight lop highkey breaking through nothing

kyu is also bad
lele > meow?
no knock then

lemme find the messages from that other guy hover sent screenshots of

lmao

[blazing moth]

js scroll up a bit

[inner elm]

i did it's really funny

[blazing moth]

how come tho

worst case js make meow a pon anw

[inner elm]

cuz lefties corv just ate both ccs and the fsight
needed some immediate power
pivotpon could be good yeah

power trip corv to answer ghold
⚰️

[blazing moth]

whatever keeps the rent payed ig

[orchid latch]

It has scald as well as nature’s madness😄

[blazing moth]

u don't lose knock tho, mola over tom

unless u using hbd but like eh

dy need it

icl koko probs better than lop here, ion like double fight

[orchid latch]

Yeah it does and ferro is ofc also good, but no alternate weather just feels difficult as they die quite easily

[inner elm]

i mean if you really wanna enable a specs volcanion you need a lot of stuff
he's also kinda guessing if you wanna break balance and that issue (along with the hazards issue) could be avoided by going boots taunt earth power steam eruption flame
u-turn mzor's prolly a particularly good partner because he can bait pex corv molt zap etc. in for volcanion

[nocturne summit]

why no scarf on meow? also I added rotom since it's a water type AND a ground immunity and I have some mons that are weak to ground so it never hurts

[inner elm]

@blazing moth i'm gonna enable that other guy you'd better not

i'll tell him all his ideas are good

[blazing moth]

[blazing moth]

u have lop alr u dont need 2 speed control

oh yeah u have no ground immune lmao

erm js get big torn or sm over meow

heatios

[inner elm]

washtom just kinda bad these days too
very exploitable and fears strong hits from basically the entire tier
even against mola ur free momentum

cuz that volt highkey did 30

maybe 40

[nocturne summit]

one fast mon in a team generally on the slower side feels a bit risky

[inner elm]

just not how it works
look at speed tiers and look for smth particularly fast ur weak to
zama? ghold/gking handle it
scarf lele? ghold
scarf shifu? the to-be mola
etc.

[tame galleon]

then my apologies i must be blind

[nocturne summit]

scarf lele has in it's main set hp fire but ig you're right

[inner elm]

that's an issue for ferrothorn, mzor, and nobody else
252 SpA Tapu Lele Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 84 SpD Gholdengo: 130-154 (34.3 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

[nocturne summit]

damn...crazy calcs, anyways is this better? https://pokepast.es/bb9af4d7dd91a703

[inner elm]

https://pokepast.es/8209caff302738b0
would rather you did smth like this
but yeah looks better

[nocturne summit]

steelium z?

[inner elm]

https://pokepast.es/c8be61c9e9c1fe58
bulky ghold's aight too
ur not in much need of his defensive profile tho thanks to alo gking
if you want you can run the gking physdef

[inner elm]

+2 252+ SpA Gholdengo Corkscrew Crash (190 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Vessel of Ruin Ting-Lu: 432-508 (84 - 98.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ SpA Gholdengo Corkscrew Crash (190 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Kingambit: 396-467 (116.1 - 136.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
just a good breaker

u don't need the defensive profile as much as you need the ability to remove stuff from the game

[nocturne summit]

what's the use of liquidation on mola?

[inner elm]

alo gking zap is enough to cover pretty much anything u'd bring ghold in on

[inner elm]

more reliable answer to subswarm volcarona
as if you're clicking flip turn then you have nothing you'd wanna bring in to actually kill it and you'd end up losing a mon

you can go aqua jet too

liq is nice tho

have mlop for decent priority anyway

[nocturne summit]

so bascially breaking subs for the most part?

[inner elm]

no it's just so you don't die to volcarona
subswarm is strong, flip turn doesn't OHKO it, so if you're clicking flip turn into it it's taking a kill on one of your other mons
as opposed to liquidation, which lets you stay in and 1v1

[nocturne summit]

oh ok ig thx for the help

[tame galleon]

what if the volc has gigadrain tho

[inner elm]

+1 252 SpA Volcarona Giga Drain vs. 0 HP / 252+ SpD Assault Vest Alomomola: 192-228 (40.7 - 48.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
oh no

flip to gking twave then chilly to lop and hit it
not an issue

drain volc is bad fish anyway
you can just mirror coat asw

[blazing moth]

not rly bc u have meow is also fast without scarf

not speed control but fast

[blazing moth]

mirror coat

[inner elm]

scarf lele clicks kinda free (no spdef on ferro either to eat two focus blasts), u have double speed control, lop's kinda random given the problems you've mentioned, no whip ferro so your best piece into rain is kind of a bum
volcanion is a massive entry point for a ton of stuff so it necessitates a very solid defensive backbone to get it in and out safely
can solve most of your issues revamping team a bit
it's a lot more dire since you're specs too, as you need very good removal asw
so i'd advise boots, but if you wanted to continue on the specs route, here
https://pokepast.es/215f348262c222e7
pretty solid structure that solves most of your issues
ferro can actually threaten rain now, mtios helps answer yard, wellspring
lando can come in on zap n pivot or whatever
sun struggles to switch into zama
can go knock > press on ferro if you wanna put something that offensively pressures kyurem in slot 6
pagos is a pretty chill tag-on but honestly anything can fit here based on which mu you wanna sharpen up

[inner elm]

ngl i always forget mola is running ts cuz opp is always playing around it
so it just never gets clicked

[blazing moth]

what opp

[inner elm]

u right i don't play this tier
mb

[blazing moth]

bro what 😭😭

oh

💔

took me a sec

slow trufs

[tame galleon]

yeah but who's gonna run AV mola tho
you close yourself off wish and protect

anyways

i wasn't seriously asking

[tame galleon]

oh yeah didn't think about that one

[inner elm]

to explicitly check volc, mdia, tapu lele, etc.

in fact that's the entire point of the set
feel free to read the set article on smogon

[blazing moth]

av fish is top 2 waters in nd btw

only shit that's rly as good and splashable as av mola is pon

[inner elm]

fish moment

[blazing moth]

• be me
• tank everything in the tier
• pivot slowy
• regen
• one shot trade if u think you can take me down w a special attack
• random knock off
• have the swag of fitting literally any archetype

[inner elm]

[orchid latch]

I get that boots would be probably more consistent but I like clicking buttons, thanks for the paste and tips. Lopunny really hasnt been that incredible so definitely open to changing that.

[orchid latch]

Thanks for the m-sciz shoutout, might try that out

[inner elm]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[hard creek]

https://pokepast.es/2de55b533a689bc2

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[next forge]

no zardy answer

[tame galleon]

so i checked and roost kyurem always has hdb
cinderace is okay-ish
lando is good
corv is okay
pecha is good
zama seems okay
but yeah sami's right i don't see how you reliably handle yard, even if zama outspeeds it's a gamble with stone edge, so

[nocturne summit]

feel like you have nothing that can comfortable switch on shadow ball, or special attackers in general, like most of your team is getting chipped badly for a decent special attacker

[hard creek]

wait yeah forgot the gholdengo answer

do I go dnite > pecha and maybe lando spdef or smthn

[inner elm]

kyu threatens (imo load ground z but ice is fine ig)
ace threatens
corv u-turns on switch
pech threatens
lando threatens
zama is gambling

tho team would probably be better with molt > corv and then u just go some steel over ace cuz you have no yard or volc answer besides ace softcheck
can make that steel the rocker and then make lando fog or u can use fog molt and compress a bit with bb fog ig

[hard creek]

which steel ftr

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/786d6a46108a4f7e

[inner elm]

tier's rocking steels are ferro treads tran
non rocks is ghold gambit melm mzor etc
test em out
ur really just picking them up for psychic ice drag resist
so ghold or mzor is ur best bet ig

[hard creek]

https://pokepast.es/1f6200455f662079

wait yeah no ice resist

[inner elm]

booster val on eterrain?
also this kinda just gets 6-0'd by a ton of shit
volc, ceru, those kinds of guys
prolly not salvagable, i'd say pick a lane or go like koko + bolt max alongside semisun, ur already stretching to cover bases with those 2 alone

[inner elm]

would just go mzor so the mdia mu looks a bit better

[hard creek]

then no rocks

[inner elm]

lando can rock

[hard creek]

unless I go bb fog molt

https://pokepast.es/398c6d4594694ac9

[inner elm]

u-turn blitz molt is also fun if u wanna try it and care about the pivot
but that's just a personal opinion and bb flame is fine too

[hard creek]

ill do bb fog flame

ill stick with this team if nothing else is wrong

[nocturne summit]

had the idea of eterrain not being always active since there is other common terrain changers

[inner elm]

then u just sack a guy or try switching around
more of a play thing then stretch yourself in the builder to cover the scenario

team just looks mad fishy and inconsistent

[hard creek]

earth is my team ok

[inner elm]

looks aight
no glaring holes at least?

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/74dc823f785d2626 is this better?

[inner elm]

https://pokepast.es/1d7a823816d53a65
might be able to get away with this

[nocturne summit]

actually looks good, it takes more of defensive way then mine

[inner elm]

gotta handle the massive gaping hole that is the mdia and lele mu

[nocturne summit]

shouldn't something like av mola handle lele?

[inner elm]

wants boots

i did mola set wrong
make it sassy with 0 speed iv

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/772f9e285653068d

[empty solar]

https://teams.pokemonshowdown.com/view/1538422-ho72hiv5q0xpekhqyan9

i wanted to build around mega heracross, what y'all think?

[tame galleon]

mega hera and only move to benefit from skill link is rock blast

im not sure bro

besides, one spinner while you're building your team around the mega that loses 12.5 of it's health when switching on rocks, and more if other hazards are up ?

mola is okay

maybe grass knot over hp ice for more BP

treads being your spinner and having icium Z feels weird to me

i'd personally give it leftovers or boots

slowking could work even though no chilly reception probably sets it back a bit

probably

moltres looks like what i see most zapdos doing but as a fire type

zapdos works relatively well so maybe it'll work too

i'd give it defog somewhere though

[hard creek]

https://pokepast.es/d8fea9ec2c26e218

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[empty solar]

@tame galleon ty for the advice

[tame galleon]

yw i tried my best

[tame galleon]

im not sure why the boots on zama since you made it 252atk/spe

other than that your sets are good

your main issue would be the only pokemons to truly benefit from sand stream are tyranitar and excadrill

the other's don't especially suffer from it but maybe there's more synergy to be found

[nocturne summit]

@tame galleon can you help with this?

[empty solar]

https://teams.pokemonshowdown.com/view/1538807-92mfteqc0by1rbhcrwv6

[worldly bronze]

https://pokepast.es/35441914ab5a1b82 first time making a team (started like 3 days ago) and i was wondering if i could get some help with it

not sure at all abt the rotom, and honestly the rest of it too, but i know i want to keep mawile in there

[tame galleon]

i can try at least

[tame galleon]

for the sets all i could suggest is replacing headlong rush with EQ it seems more reliable
i ran some calcs and it really seems pretty efficient already
you have a specific issue with it ?

[nocturne summit]

aren't EQ good on bulky sets like full hp?

[tame galleon]

it's not bad but i just realized you lack ways to shutdown flying type
which are a big threat to your mega

[tame galleon]

yeah but i personally prefer to be able to tank more hits reliably
smogon sets follow your reasoning though

[nocturne summit]

ig but still I'll stick with HR for the extra damage, tusk especially it's offensive utility set is staying long in the field for it be scared about it's health, defensive and bulk up set however I do prefer EQ

[tame galleon]

you only have one TR sweeper dude
you should give corvi the helmet and give rotom leftovers especially since you run protect
i'm mixed about AVchomp

[tame galleon]

as I said smogon says it works so i dont see many issues with it

[nocturne summit]

neither way what about the team overall? is there is any holes I'm not seeing?

[tame galleon]

not really
with good positioning you can handle most of the threats i could think of
but maybe we just have trouble anticipating threats

[indigo trench]

does iron treads and mega char y work together on the same team?

[hard creek]

aoa zama runs boots

also all out sand is dookie

[blazing moth]

apple probs not needed w a corv and zama here

[blazing moth]

sure why not

not the first thing you'd say when u think of good cores but it's alr i guess

[indigo trench]

whats a core

i just use it for setup

[blazing moth]

group of 2-4 mons that sinergize

[indigo trench]

and to remove

[indigo trench]

what synergy does charizard and iron treads have

[blazing moth]

not a lot specifically i think but they should work w each other

[indigo trench]

does it have to be in the synergy cant i just use another pokemon for that

[blazing moth]

sure man they

work fine together

[hard creek]

perhaps, wdyt would work better there altho like

zama as a solo check to pon doesnt work no?

[indigo trench]

i was thinking of adding a pokemon with nuzzle to help charizard what do u think i should use?

[blazing moth]

it's zama+corv tho

[blazing moth]

Hatterene

[hard creek]

ig its zama and corv so pons fine

is there anything else i forgot to answer here, it may give me an idea on what to put in that slot

[blazing moth]

maybe Slowbro/mola or a water liker ur own pon, u could try pech or koko too ngl

a pivot basically

[hard creek]

yea

[blazing moth]

uhh volc can fry actually

[hard creek]

which pivot tho? I forget what im weak to without apple here

oh volc

av mola with liquidation?

[blazing moth]

yea sure

even non liquid should be able to somewhat alleviate the mu enough

[hard creek]

nah volc can bullshit past

if ur not liq

[blazing moth]

yeah but u have sand exca so

[hard creek]

u cant be too safe with volc

at least imo

[blazing moth]

u can outspeed it at +1

[hard creek]

mons a terrorist

[blazing moth]

anyways anything works last slot rly

[hard creek]

ill go mola

[blazing moth]

oh btw lele should have hp fire/shadow ball

over one of the psy moves

[hard creek]

ill do hp fire

[blazing moth]

kk

other than that looks aight

[hard creek]

ill replace psyshock

ty trufs

ill make another team since the mod ping shld be off cooldown

[hard creek]

https://pokepast.es/afe4dc9598f6e1ec ik veil is bad but im wondering how this is

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[potent furnace]

sash ceru is bad

id run balloon

also drop zama for bulk up speed booster great tusk

besides that this looks good

[hard creek]

ok ty

[viral temple]

https://pokepast.es/0741184643cfe2db
hehehe

[tame galleon]

dude
ballon ceru just isn't a thing

sash allows it to freely setup on most supereffective hits and activate weak armor

[tame galleon]

stop horsing around fr 😔

[potent furnace]

you have no hazard control or denial

[tame galleon]

i didn't check the team

[potent furnace]

.

[tame galleon]

yeah in that case then why not
since you have to open with ninetails

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/c5dce2796a6b625a can I switch ghold to a cm set of one of the tapus

[vale hearth]

you dont really need focus blast on dengo

i would just use recover over it

but thats just me

[cloud solstice]

This is very woger weak

I think zapdos is better than molt here

Otherwise ogerpon just 6-0s

[nocturne summit]

to be fair if you scroll you will find the exact team but with zap, I was building a whole different but unconscious went the same route of building, the all team had ferro and lando

[cloud solstice]

This version looks ok you just need zap instead of molt and maybe put z for ghold

No reason for ballon here really

It will help breaking better

[nocturne summit]

prefer another ground immunity that isn't too obvious, I did have another same team but with steelium ghold

[cloud solstice]

Why do you need 2 ground immunities

1 is enough on almost every team

Zapdos should deal with grounds well other than lu

And treads

[nocturne summit]

gliscor is annoying like I despise this mon, my only toxic immunity folds to earthquake

[nocturne summit]

the problem zap really can't do much against them ye it walls them but what more can it do?

[cloud solstice]

Hurricane

[cloud solstice]

You know gliscor runs knock off

[nocturne summit]

rng and me were never friends

[cloud solstice]

That's not gonna help with gliscor maybe just for one time

Z would destroy gliscor though so

I think that would help better

But your call

[nocturne summit]

yes but against it, ghold can switch on EQ and toxic and threaten it or set up on it if it doesn't have knock off

[inner elm]

no
make gking physdef and molt spdef
go offensive tusk too, physically defensive checks nothing essential for u
make ghold steel or ghost Z and drop focus or mir for recover

go taxel lop if you don't like gliscor

then just hard gking on it, chilly to lop, threaten it out

not a perfect solution but decent enough
tusk and lop can threaten
still go liquidation on mola
u can also switch molt out for zap and that'd be fine, av mola answers yard and gholdengo fine

[light shadow]

Achalodon isn’t checking ferrothorn tho

[inner elm]

click aura sphere

ferro doesn't really do anything back
rain's too offensive and doesn't care much about the leech seed if they get enough chip on ferro to break through with a boosted water move later

[light shadow]

What do I even put in instead of Goodra

Like I just want my gooey critter to work

[inner elm]

he's usable in UU

[light shadow]

Goodra Should Useable anywhere ;w;

[tame galleon]

regular or hisuian ?

[light shadow]

Both

[tame galleon]

cause one works significantly better than the other in, like, all situations

[light shadow]

Just give Goodra what typing

[tame galleon]

well then I have no clue what your team is or what you are trying to do but I can confidently say switch to hoodra and give it AV

[tame galleon]

what

[light shadow]

Water

It would be a lot better

[tame galleon]

"just make goodra a dragon/water with poison heal trust"

[light shadow]

Posion heal is interesting

[tame galleon]

idk man im quoting

[light shadow]

I’m more or it being water type over posion tho personally

Very synergetic with dragon

It would only have a fairy weakness I think

[tame galleon]

let me think

it gets a lot of neutralities

fairy, dragon and x4 to freeze dry yeah

otherwise it's better

but pure dragon already has like the same with a lot more resistances

[blazing moth]

fighting move

[coral ridge]

https://pokepast.es/d6ae243199ae71ce

what type of team is this?

bulky offense stall or offensive stall or what

theres only like two mons with reliable recovery but im not sure

[inner elm]

balance
has zero power whatsoever tho

[coral ridge]

it works fine for me

how is it balance though lol

[inner elm]

hstack with zero breakers and a lot of knock with a few guys that have passable longevity

not a stall cuz ur removal has no longevity so you can’t afford a real endless game of attrition against an opposing balance

not an offense because… well there’s nothing offensive about this

not semistall cuz there’s no wincon with good longevity
etc.

[coral ridge]

what wincon mean

oh yeah i guess

i mean it doesnt really need one i dont think

tapu fini wins 1 million turns in once stuff is weak enough to die to it or stuff just dies anyway

[coral ridge]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9nationaldex-2540435475

chesnaught is a wincon

[hollow fern]

Issue is just how passive it is, it has no way to make any immediate, large progress in a tier infested with breakers who are able to do that very well

Especially since fini and terap have no longevity and zong relies purely on lefties

So you dont have the longevity to just act like stall and halt all form of progress

[coral ridge]

i make immediate, large progress all the time. idk what you mean

[hollow fern]

Hazards arent immediate

They chip away over a long time

What i mean is you dont have a pokemon capable of doing large damage immediately

Like a mega diancie or tapu lele

Etc

[coral ridge]

i dont really need anything like that here. i kill the stuff before it kills me. the stall matchup might be bad, i haven't seen a stall team on the ladder yet. but both tapu lele and mega diancie and the like check stuff im already checking

[hollow fern]

Ok

[worldly bronze]

https://pokepast.es/2a6931576cd3676e so technically this team cant be used in ou, but thats my problem. i want to replace both landorus-t and magearna (mainly the latter) with something that can do the same thing she can but can also be used in ou. any advice for the rest of my team would also be appreciated :)

[inner elm]

landorus-t is legal in OU
absolutely nothing can replace magearna in this specific composition
klefki is devoid of any offensive potential, bronzong is the same, jirachi is too fast, and stakataka isn’t neutral to fighting

[worldly bronze]

yea ik landorus is legal, its a stupid reason but i copied this team and i feel like if i only replace magearna then i didnt really make it (which i didn't either way) if that makes sense

would I have to change around the entire team? if so could i keep some things i like about it (ex. mimikyu, mawile & cresselia)? or would i need to change around the entire team at that point

[light shadow]

Gotta consider stab also and how it would effect Goodras movepool

But yeah freeze dry would be a pretty funny interaction

Also another reason water is good

Is because the a natrual resist to grass is balance out by sap sipper

Makes it pretty good check for ogerpon being 4x resistant to water ivy cudgel

Also urshifu rapid strikes

Like 4x res to fire 4x res to water 2x res to steel to water grass immune and only being weak to fairy

And dragon

[light shadow]

And like just cover those weaknesses with a steel type

[proven night]

Any improvement I should do?

I wanted to make a lopunny mega team

[blazing moth]

looks fine enough outside of the mola moveset (it's av with status moves) and pagos (you need kce beam over cm here)
maybe make ferro bpress>whip for kyurem and kgb (ig?) and u could also try electrium Koko instead of specs, it's also a bittt ogerpon weak but eh it's revengable so ur allg

[proven night]

I don’t know mola proper build that why but what should I go for her

Plus thanks for the advice

[coral ridge]

assault vest means you can only run attacks.

[blazing moth]

u can js click inport/export in mola and click assault vest

[blazing moth]

also this

[proven night]

Yeah I forgot to change that one thanks tho

[proven night]

Okayyy thanksss

[blazing moth]

happy to help ^^

[proven night]

You mean ice beam right?

[blazing moth]

yeayea mb

[proven night]

All right :3

[proven night]

I’m sorry but Wdym mean by electrium koko im kinda new so sorry for the lack of info

[blazing moth]

you know what z moves are? it's like the item that lets you use them

[proven night]

Ooooo ok thanks

[proven night]

So it should be something like that

[blazing moth]

yeah but u turn on koko instead of volt switch and lando should run max hp not max attack, you also take some speed away, just make sure you hit 301 speed on it

[proven night]

So u turn and max hp doesn’t lando need speed or he’s just fine without any speed

[blazing moth]

nono make ur lando hit 301 speed with the evs

some teams use little to no speed lando but yours should def use speed

[proven night]

Alright I will try that

He already have enough speed

He got 309

[blazing moth]

yeah u dont need 309 u can take some speed off, enough to hit 301

[proven night]

What should I invest 8 in?

Like attack

[blazing moth]

defense

[proven night]

Alright

Okay thanks for the team improvement

[blazing moth]

npnp hf w it

[blissful ingot]

https://pokepast.es/eb2a50a24d8053b1 RMT

[vale hearth]

https://pokepast.es/8292878ce0e1d34f tried making a heracross team any gaps I missed?

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[zinc sparrow]

https://pokepast.es/281596ffe92244d7 How can I make this team any better? The main focus is M. Charizard Y, so he has to stay.

@potent furnace

@gray lake

@limber crypt

@vague hemlock

[coral ridge]

rillaboom sucks ima start playin tapu bulu

[potent furnace]

yea

rock z bulu is the truth

[hard creek]

https://pokepast.es/e7b43c123e7b5ac9

[blazing moth]

.

[blazing moth]

pattern recognition

[blissful ingot]

https://pokepast.es/eb2a50a24d8053b1 RMT

[cobalt skiff]

I would genuinely recommend replacing gholdengo here for a more offensive threat and steelium z on excadrill just the first few seconds analyzing the team

you genuinely don't rly have a good reason to have ghold I think

also, skeledirge over Moltres so uh

probably make your final offensive threat be able to handle what your team needs is my recommendations

just test, I genuinely don't know what is best for final slot, just make it offensive though.

I recommend an offensive dragon type though

https://pokepast.es/a7e930bd5ad27e26

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[cobalt skiff]

here is a version with kyurem

I think it's okay, just needs testing myself honestly.

[cobalt skiff]

wait add high horsepower @blissful ingot 😭

I FORGOT

grassy terrain on excadrill kinda stinks

with eq at least

5 BP hopefully shouldn't matter 💀

[inner elm]

wellspring kinda just wins no

[coral ridge]

@novelvc3000

weird af

[blazing moth]

p sure you've already posted this exact team before so like idk to tell u atp

kinda dies in these weeks w free zama-c u should probs get something more solid for it, probs instead of primarina

slowbro shpuld solve that ig, or slowking if you want a better dia mu

besides that team's like aight enough rly

also dont see the point of suit ttar in a team where gking/ghold doesn't sit on much, low kick should be like just better here

[tall shale]

https://pokepast.es/0d46721590d640d2

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[tall shale]

What do you think

[slender sentinel]

I would also like my team to be judged https://pokepast.es/7a393f9a14af350d

[limber crypt]

no proper steel on this seems rather annoying, id drop torn for offensive np gholdengo, would also mske tini boots vrrste/bolt/uturn/toxic as well, band just isnt good atm, koko can prob hp ice > dgleam and as ghold is getting the z, koko can hold hdb

[limber crypt]

this is just cynthias team which is unfortunately unviable in this mets, id tske a look at thr samples to get a good idea of whats good in this tier

[native spruce]

💀

bro thinks hes the main character

bro is not cynthia

[tall shale]

Ok 👍

[slow surge]

https://pokepast.es/50b87e57dd95f148

RMT

[slow surge]

put av on bulu & replaced sd with horn leech to be better into mixed valiant and ting lu & gain more longevity. bulu still hits really hard and doesnt really need to SD to act as a check to anything.

[weak shadow]

https://pokepast.es/37574e113a4ee768 Gen 8

[celest merlin]

Hey @weak shadow, there are presently no raters signed up to rate teams for gen8nationaldex. A rater in this channel may still step in and provide advice, but you can check out the resources for this format.

[weak shadow]

oh well

[low bay]

https://pokepast.es/051478e0811ca99b Double Trap
https://pokepast.es/6288e05e25cf1b7b no Double Trap

[limber crypt]

This looks pretty solid but personally id drop thundyt for dnite, serp > rilla, and have a diff mega over gyara (zardx is the usual choice but i think it overlaps a lot here so i think justbkeeping gyara is fine)

[limber crypt]

These feel very gen 8 but for gen 9 (at least in a non zama c context) they feel quite passive, i think making fini calm mind, smth less passive thwn tang as ur pon check (serp or rbolt maybe) making the tran offensive z and zapdos defensive is the play, hdb or av zama > lop would also be quite

[hardy frigate]

https://pokepast.es/0fc2a9d311f8aa61
Msciz+alo balanced

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[hardy frigate]

I need help

please

[tame galleon]

im not sure about much but make terapagos 252HP/252SpA instead of fast attacker spread IMO

also what's the point of 20 atk for bolt ?

[rose granite]

it's because it's mandatory the 20iv in bolt or showdown says the team isn't valid to play

[sick herald]

Gen 8: https://pokepast.es/39fa92b85d231968

[celest merlin]

Hey @sick herald, there are presently no raters signed up to rate teams for gen8nationaldex. A rater in this channel may still step in and provide advice, but you can check out the resources for this format.

[blazing moth]

autoloses to volcarona as of rn and unaware clef seems very redundant here especially with a wishmola

heal belling your mon that statuses itself is also not a good idea

[timber surge]

https://pokepast.es/9a784d7d97726bba

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[empty olive]

https://pokepast.es/4dd526c06b125e6f

[celest merlin]

Hey @empty olive, there are presently no raters signed up to rate teams for gen9nddplou. A rater in this channel may still step in and provide advice, but you can check out the resources for this format.

[empty olive]

oh I misput tier its ndou

thinking of infestation on pex bc I don't trust charx to break stall/fats

although honestly thats not enough help anyway

would trick scarf val > encore do the trick?

https://pokepast.es/0e5776927f920d79

also posting this bc I want to learn stallbreaking

[hardy frigate]

Yeah I'm thinking abt volcarona

too

clef can't take at all

I also thought go bulk with raging,but lose to hp ground

[spring plume]

yo try firium z with blaziken, that can genuinley catch most people off guard

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/abc76445b9b86386

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[blazing moth]

bolt isnt doing shit to volcarona

u need something like a fire type like moltres or yard or a bulky water like av mola or pex

or dnite ig

[tame galleon]

oh alright then

[timber surge]

https://pokepast.es/84a3640a3b769926 any advice

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[pseudo stirrup]

https://pokepast.es/c4c2f9b9585a4834 chat is this peak

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[hardy frigate]

I'm interested to use molt or dnite,which mon shld I replace?

[hardy frigate]

Then I have to move smarter than before against stall,but ok

what move shld I use instead?

[rose granite]

kowtow cleave > knock off

[blazing moth]

not like it makes a difference bc stall still slams your team

[blazing moth]

definitely not knock off does straight up more damage and has utility

[blazing moth]

over pagos probably if molt, if dnite put it over bolt

[spark marlin]

https://pokepast.es/acda9d292994d7a2

what should i do to improve my team ?

[blazing moth]

yo sup, you dont have soeed control here and clef set is pretty bad

[spark marlin]

Oki so what do you suggest i could give dregion scarf

[blazing moth]

honestly just sack hydreigon

it's like

bad

that pon should be wellspring mask

[spark marlin]

WHy its not that bad its really good on a balance team

[blazing moth]

your team's not rly balance

and

yeah nah it's still bad on balance icl

especially if choice locked

nasty plot is cool tho

pecharunt should also be boots or else you die to hazards quickly

[spark marlin]

Okii thank youuu :>

[spark marlin]

well how do i make it balanced

[blazing moth]

in this case I'd say just a more solid defensive backbone

https://pokepast.es/baa1e69646251310 example

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[blazing moth]

the defensive core is glisc tran slowbro tornadus
3/4 walls that provide some offensive Utility should be the standard

[spark marlin]

pokiii but where would i sneak hydreigon

[blazing moth]

i mean u can just

keep it

I'd just make it nasty plaot atp bc specs is a predict bot and scarf is dogshit

https://pokepast.es/bfc8062cb0b5289f I'd use something more like this

[nocturne summit]

that pfp is so unhinged I love it

[blazing moth]

yea i got gifted 2 weeks nitro click the pfp it's a gif

i love kid buu

unhinged ahh mf

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/76617eb7c7b0c323 this feels bad

@blazing moth need your help

[blazing moth]

lots overlap here i think

esp with both clef and tran trying to both have rocks

[nocturne summit]

how?

[nocturne summit]

heat is supposedly for special set up sweepers and breaking stall

clef is my rock setter

[blazing moth]

tran doesn't really do that, at least not when kinda everything else is a bit hopeless into gliscor+pex

tran is better at compressing rocks while helping a bit vs bulky guys with the trapping shit

[nocturne summit]

so I guess I should switch the clef's set?

[blazing moth]

yeah ig

also make latias a latios

cm latias is like really really bad and if you wanna use it should be on screens teams

[nocturne summit]

is this better? https://pokepast.es/a70d2f691a8c9fdb

[blazing moth]

yeah it looks better, id make that kart a Zamazenta tho

[nocturne summit]

wouldn't I need some speed?

[blazing moth]

Zamazenta

is the speed

[nocturne summit]

idk if one decently fast mon is good enough for a team that is generally slow-middling

also quick question how is c-zama exactly?

[blazing moth]

that's perfectly fine especially because ur fat asl

also zama is not decently fast it's likethe fastest ou mon not scarfed

[nocturne summit]

ig I'll test it, still is kart fine?

[blazing moth]

yeah nah idk abt scarf kart in the big 26

think only real kart set atp should be sd

but here especially you need a kgb check so

[nocturne summit]

ok ig, what set for zama btw

[blazing moth]

boots

[nocturne summit]

jolly or adam?

[blazing moth]

jolly

[wooden gale]

Hi could someone rate my team do some changes i am struggling with mostly tapu bulu, sun team with charizard y and trick rooms i would be very grateful thanks ahead https://pokepast.es/48d85a4121c2cbf3

[gaunt stirrup]

how tf are you struggling with tapu bulu when Rillaboom is just Bulu if it was better

and Tar should be more than enough for Zard Y

Just pursuit trap it

and drill should not be your rocker

js run lefties on Tar

[wooden gale]

Oki idk both of them are good I have the movesets on Bulu

Thanks for advice I putted mostly mega Scizor becouse he counters a lot of things

[empty olive]

who art thou cosmic power sweepers

that can work

[hidden osprey]

clef mew

wouldnt recommend using them demon mons arent that good except for like zamah

[lost wagon]

who should i distribute EVs on him

[hollow fern]

just max max offensive prolly

max speed and max attack with speed boosting nature

since ur sash no real reason to ev defensively

just wanna get damage off and outspeed stuff

[blazing moth]

p much just clef but that's just bad cm, u can use demon iron crown tho that's funny on some screenslop

[low bay]

https://pokepast.es/701b9ba943bff629 4 Attacks Mega Gallade + SD Garchomp Bulky Offense team (I think 165 base attack stat is enough to a pokemon for breaking walls)

[blazing moth]

band ttar kinda outta place here and loses to just abt any ghold above 221 speed really badly

u can also use spikes by just giving the chomp rocks

the whole point of drag z chomp is that you already kill birds not named corv with it and u dont need rock coverage

stone edge doesn't really give you anything

[low bay]

https://pokepast.es/d64781c6921a56e6 Dragonium Z Dragonite ZeraKantoking Voltturn Offense (or Bulky Offense ıdk)

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[nocturne summit]

raters rate full teams, your situation is better discussed at #comp-general , you will get help there

[viscid vector]

thanks

[lost wagon]

https://pokepast.es/6d8c9c16c7bdd914 is this good

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[lost wagon]

anyone tell fast

[tame galleon]

seems a bit fragile

[nocturne summit]

you're mixing archetypes, screens with what looks like anything but HO is weird

[lost wagon]

https://pokepast.es/a6256b44d0f2f20b

wb this

[lost wagon]

HO?

hyper offense?

[nocturne summit]

ye

[nocturne summit]

I would leave that to an expert but your team pretty much gets sweep or broken by any strong special attacker, bc you have no special tank or even a mon relatively special bulk

[lost wagon]

Oh

[tame galleon]

seconded

[gritty schooner]

https://pokepast.es/bb4e7bde2f4f7bfe

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[gritty schooner]

lmk what i need to fix

[low bay]

https://pokepast.es/51c3fcc52411c828 This team is for guys who love Kaiju archetype of pokemon

[celest merlin]

Hey @minor onyx, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9ou team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1297721195604611163 instead.

[gaunt stirrup]

wtf

why spdef Zap and phys def alo

I did not expect to see this

anyways

Wogerpon omega destroys this team

[cursive bison]

Guys, i know ur not supposed to make a competetive team with ur favorites, but assuming this is my top 30, what sort of team can i make if i wanted to use as much of these mon as possible? preferably with goodra in it

is bulky offense possible? hyper offense?

https://pokepast.es/ee3872e0b59be2da

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[cursive bison]

This is what i came up with so far

im ok with switching mons, but i prefer if goodra is one of the mon used

[gaunt stirrup]

the first 2 mons were fine, then it pivoted into eh

Scarfed Mimikyu is not it Im sorry

but it isnt it

also we’re not like ppl who teambuild for you, we just rate the team

Imo you could do smth with sand tho fosho

Tar Volc Oger Mega Scizor even

Something across those lines

No Excadrill but you wanna use ur favs so yeah

[cursive bison]

wait, if i included exca, who should i replace from among this

[gaunt stirrup]

M scizor and use M Tar

[cursive bison]

sorry if i sounded demanding

and thx, i'll try it ^^

[gaunt stirrup]

You’re good dw

[cursive bison]

why would volc work with sand btw?

[gaunt stirrup]

Volc works with anything

lmao

But also you could pursuit trap some checks/soft checks like Zard and Tran, chipping it or getting off damage with knock for Volc to sweep

and Drill can also be a sweeper/breaker, same as Volc

or you could use a bulkier moth and get some flame body procs vs threats like Za

Lopunny too

[cursive bison]

I see

Thx for rhe advice ^^

[gaunt stirrup]

Np np

[hollow fern]

Could go webs cheese since you have ribombee, ghold, volc, scizor, azu, mimikyu, kommo-o, etc

Ribombee+ghold and then 4 more setup guys

[blazing moth]

tusk should be ice spinner over cc and you could use a z move somewhere in here, other than that looks pretty good

ah wait the whole tusk actually kinda wrong

def tusk kinda ass

[gritty schooner]

😭 ✌️

[blazing moth]

u should prob sack chomp imo since tusk and tankchomp overlap a bit and u dont ahve speed control so ghold should proba be scarf

u also get a bittt fried by volcarona

https://pokepast.es/f68a82ec52b1cdb2 try this @gritty schooner

also gave gking flamethrower for ferro and zama-c

[little delta]

https://psim.us/t/1565475-yttpiajgh1inqgo4cl19

Can someone give advice on how I can turn this team into a good doubles team?

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/0c357f7d41105e27

[gritty schooner]

👍

thank yo u

[blazing moth]

we rate singles ndou here, doubles ou and nd doubles ou are in https://discord.com/channels/192713314399289344/1059655497587888158 and https://discord.com/channels/192713314399289344/1060037469472555028 respectively

[little delta]

Oh I’m sorry, thanks

[blazing moth]

no problem!

[tame galleon]

what is corv here for

[nocturne summit]

my hazard control and ground immunity

[gaunt stirrup]

lowkey just use a Zapdos

[nocturne summit]

actully you're kinda right while yeah I have mola 3 steel mons feels unnecesery, keep forgeting that defog is a lot more common in mons here

[gaunt stirrup]

should ghold not be nasty plot here

you have no setup sweeper or wincon

besides Gambit

[tame galleon]

seeing as it's rather passive and you're the one who wants to set rocks and spikes without any mons that really need hazards immunity i think you'd be better off with something else

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/27cbe226aee265ea is this better?

[celest merlin]

Hey @vast fable, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9nationaldexdoubles team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1060037469472555028 instead.

[tame galleon]

big reliance on loppuny to manage ice types but yeah

wrong channel im sorry

[vast fable]

Is this just national dex cause I can’t find NatDex OU on the game

[nocturne summit]

could give tusk cc

[hollow fern]

Yeah in showdown, national dex ou is just "gen9nationaldex"

[gaunt stirrup]

yes

[tame galleon]

i didn't even notice
of course you give him cc he's atk/spe invested

i'd say put rocks on chomp instead of spikes
more value faster

that way you can keep a measure of hazards

tornadus could really use u-turn

i'd remove focus miss since you have heatwave already and they both hit steel/fire
that leaves the issue of rock but you have chomp,tusk and loppuny to handle it

gambit without iron head or kowtow cleave is a choice
i'm not sure what value you get out of knock off since he'll probably come in as last pokemon or maybe last two but it's your choice

i heard av mirror coat was good on mola

and loppuny seems good

[hollow fern]

Gambit with knock is way more solid

Higher base power btw

And it has utility

[cursive bison]

what mons usually act as the setup guys?

and how do u deal with smth like alomomola?

cuz i find those particularly annoying

[hollow fern]

Webs isnt really standard atm

For ho

Generally screens/standard lead rocks

But for the guys ur using you have options

[hollow fern]

Just setup and hit hard lol

Can't absorb everything

[cursive bison]

is it bad? :0

[hollow fern]

Honestly not sure i haven't seen it talked about much

I think its prolly just screens is so good atm

Lotta really scary stuff that abuse screens

[cursive bison]

i remember soemone mentioning webs is like... matchup fish

but wb screens? what mons do u usually use with those?

[hollow fern]

Volc, dnite, chomp, ceru, ogerpon, hatt, terap, ghold

[cursive bison]

actually i might do that too

so just

screen setter/aurora veil + 5 sweepers?

or 2 screen setter + 4?

[hollow fern]

Nah only one

You can also toss in a rocks lead like mdia

[cursive bison]

i see, preferably ones that can also do plenty of damage right? like chomp?

[hollow fern]

Yeah can prolly do rocks chomp

Could also just go lead chomp with like helm and dual hazards and drop screens

[cursive bison]

right right

[nocturne summit]

tusk has rocks?

[tame galleon]

even after knockin the item away ?

[tame galleon]

well unless i'm crazy you put rocks on tusk

[nocturne summit]

the message isn't edited

[blazing moth]

which is exactly why you shouldn't double down on them

[tame galleon]

wdym

[tame galleon]

i said replace rocks with cc on tusk and replace spikes with rocks on chomp

[nocturne summit]

you mean that I edited the message of the team and made it the same version but with tusk having rocks?

[tame galleon]

what ?

[tame galleon]

i just suggested this ?

[nocturne summit]

don't understand what you mean here exactly

[tame galleon]

you asked if tusk had rocks

it had

and then i checked and sent a screen ?

that's all

[nocturne summit]

I meant that tusk already has rocks so why make chomp rocks too?

[tame galleon]

because you remove rocks on tusk to give him close combat instead and remove spikes on chomp to give him rocks instead

[nocturne summit]

oooh ok, sry for the misunderstand, although is toxic switchable with spikes?

[tame galleon]

it's alright
i'd say it can work but it's very different
spikes does at best 25% once and is negated by hdb
toxic can build up to 25% multiple times but is negated by steel-types (but chomp is ground so still threatening)
i'd personally keep toxic tbh

[blazing moth]

why

that's just pointless

[hollow fern]

No but knock is just a way better move 90% of the time

Removing item+high bp

Its not like every pokemon is gonna be knocked

[tame galleon]

so you can have cc on tusk
it's an offensive tusk

[tame galleon]

yeah but removing item doesn't matter that much when it's the only remaining mon no ?

[blazing moth]

why would you do that instead of having more hazards

literally cc barely hits shit

[tame galleon]

because offensive tusk without fighting stab just isn't

and this team doesn't like ice

[blazing moth]

?

[hollow fern]

Gambit can also just act as an early game breaker since its using a 100 bp stab move

[tame galleon]

or rock types

[tame galleon]

i didn't think about that

[blazing moth]

genuinely what are you on abt first of all offtusk 9 times outta 10 doesn't use cc second's tusk with cc still loses to every ice type ever

genuinely what ice types is tusk beating

there's like 2 and they're both faster and dont like taking headlong anyways

[tame galleon]

listen

120 bp STAB Move is just good okay

that's what I know

[hollow fern]

😭

[blazing moth]

and sr is the singular best move in singles

[tame galleon]

that's why it should be used over spikes

[blazing moth]

you can

use both

??

[tame galleon]

yeah but here we gotta have cc as well

[blazing moth]

for WHAT

fuck the cc u only hitting basically only ferro w that and u have another cc user if that's rly the problem

just pack rocks and give spikes to the hazard setter who can sit for more turns

[tame galleon]

being reliant on a frail mon like loppuny for coverage such as fighting isn't so good

[gaunt stirrup]

???

CC is a great move to spam lmfao

Also Tusk with cc is very common

like

also lwk why are you being disrespectful to the raters you asked to rate your team

[blazing moth]

literally what does cc hit that headlong doesn't

[tame galleon]

let's see

[blazing moth]

I didn't ask my team to get rated this guy's js making the dude's team worse

[tame galleon]

ground is SE on steel, rock, fire, electric and is walled by flying
cc is SE on normal, steel, rock, ice, dark, and is walled by ghost

i don't know seems useful to just have both

[tame galleon]

👍

[tame galleon]

in fact if it was me i'd use cc and eq not to have double def drop but that's a loss of 20 BP i can hear that it would be unoptimal

but really having STAB is just basic

[blazing moth]

stop looking at the types and look at what mons it actually hits in the meta, which is basically just ferro ting lu, and stealth rocks is still infinitely more useful when cc basically doesn't hit shit and you're passing on spikes for a coverage move your team literally already has

[tame galleon]

did you...look at the team

spikes are on chomp

chomp doesn't learn cc

then

types are useful

if you tunnel on two mons just because they're OU you'll never be truly ready

[blazing moth]

yeah tankchomp is a trillion times better WITH spikes

[tame galleon]

i can hear that. But we were talking about tusk ?

[blazing moth]

dude

you mentioned chomp

[tame galleon]

because you mentioned spikes

[blazing moth]

because it's infinitely better to pack spikes and rocks than just rocks and cc on two mons for no fucking reason

mons that you dont have problems with

which is ting lu and ferrothorn

[tame galleon]

it's an offensive tusk though

besides there are way more pokemons weak to CC

it's just that good for neutral damage

if the tusk was HP/Speed i would have advised rocks for sure

but here it's ATK/Speed

[blazing moth]

also no it isn't it isn't standard on smogdex it's barely used on tours at best and even on ladder u barely see ts

only tusk that should be packing cc is scarf

[blazing moth]

literally offensive tusk uses rocks basically always it doesn't matter

[tame galleon]

you know what

there

both are valid

have a great day

[vast fable]

what build should I use for potential mon

[nocturne summit]

I feel bad this turned sour real fast 😭

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/9fe24be3438ac5b2 I've been using this team for a long while, it is decent but is there any problems with it?

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[hard creek]

https://pokepast.es/f0237b611bcce070

nvm I have medi weav mola treads dnite +1 now

I cant fit gambit check + speed control

[vast fable]

https://pokepast.es/9c9f976d068c76fe

[hollow fern]

What does toxic orb on gweez do?

[vast fable]

Idk I was just putting stuff cause my last two periods I was busy with schoolwork so I couldn’t look the preferred item for it

Look up*

[hollow fern]

Id recommend using sample teams/sets to learn the tier honestly, the bottom 4 pokemon sets are pretty weird and there are better alternatives

And incin in general is just not a thing

[vast fable]

alr thanks

[crystal pivot]

hello could you rate my team please https://pokepast.es/901b8600a0cd247c

[nocturne summit]

feel like you have nothing that can switch on a strong ice beam without getting chipped too much especially with two 4x weak mon, what archetype you're going for here since from what I see your team is painfully fragile

with just one (or two if you count dnite as tempory bulk) bulky mon

[crystal pivot]

oh, what could i replace then ?

[nocturne summit]

again tell me what are you trying to reach for with this team?

[crystal pivot]

An hyper offence

[nocturne summit]

well firstly a HO team follows some kind of playstyle like using screens or hazards..Etc, if you want to go for it your whole team must be all set up sweeper that abuse those playstyles, your team looks absolutely nothing like a normal HO, defensive mons on HO like glis are straight not good so switch it with another set up sweeper, also never put any choiced mon on unless you NEED it and it has pivoting, I generally recommend checking out the HO samples to see better exemples that you can make a team out of

[crystal pivot]

Does like for exemple gliscors with the entry hazard and add a 2nd sweeper instead of samurott would be good ?

(Sorry i m kinda new in strat so i don t know really good how all things work)

[nocturne summit]

glis isn't really good at setting up fast enough, an HO hazard setter should do it fast enough so it can switch in to the sweepers, If you want one you can use either m-diancie, lead landorus-t...etc
for an example you can make it like this https://pokepast.es/94f8902b6f929395 the team has it's flaws but you can know it's an HO team from the first look

or the sample with lead lando-t https://pokepast.es/41d8a9cf9526445d

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[nocturne summit]

sry for the ping

[crystal pivot]

ok i see thanks for explanations

[crystal pivot]

would you be down to teach me more about strat if you have time ?

[nocturne summit]

to be fair I'm not really an expert on natdex but you can ask others in #comp-general

[crystal pivot]

ok thx

[crystal pivot]

hello i made a team for gen 9 nat ou but i would like to replace clefable, by something else cause in gen 9 he can't learn toxic and teleport https://pokepast.es/04bcf39b626c9684

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[crystal pivot]

sorry for ping

[blazing moth]

? yes it can

[crystal pivot]

on real game for exemple in can't

[blazing moth]

i mean it's not really a great set but you dont have another mon like that rly

[crystal pivot]

and what could i put instead of him in that team ?

[blazing moth]

imo I'd just use a normal rocks sets or wishport

[blazing moth]

clef's fine u dont rly need to replace it imo

[crystal pivot]

ok

[blazing moth]

last 3 are a bigger issue if anything

[crystal pivot]

do you have exemple of the build i need please ? (i m not really good in strats)

[crystal pivot]

?

[blazing moth]

just use the sets on the smogon pokedex if you're not great at making your own

you can also go the builder and click import/export on the mon

and you'll have the sets there

[crystal pivot]

ok thx

[crystal pivot]

can you check dm also please

[blazing moth]

sure

it was in requests mb

[nocturne summit]

https://pokepast.es/bb91d166268d213e

[celest merlin]

Hey @lost wagon, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9nationaldexmonotype team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1060037469472555028 instead.

[lost wagon]

Can anyone give me tips for this water monotype team.Iam in a showdown server and with gyms so iam water gym leader

https://pokepast.es/80f29e608e6adf0f

[celest merlin]

Hey @lost wagon, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9nationaldexmonotype team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1060037469472555028 instead.

[blazing moth]

nd monotype is not rated here

[blazing moth]

no hazard control and this is mixing archetypes a bit

especially the last 2 feel off in that

I'm looking at that as a fat team so idk tho

[nocturne summit]

my mistake corv should have defog instead of bp

[blazing moth]

either way ion js corv as ur only removal tbh makes u way to passive into ghold

[nocturne summit]

lele is a breaker while scarf blace gives me some speed control with the chance to sweep with boosts

[blazing moth]

you have speed control already with zama

lele overlaps with clef a bit too

both cm fairies that thud into ghold and other steels

[nocturne summit]

feel just one fast mon isn't enough with scarfers and priority everywhere

[nocturne summit]

I mean is something like np ghold a good replacement?

[hollow fern]

Mdia kinda fries this

[empty olive]

lowkirkenuienly just replace clef w av mola, make lele cm (prob fight z > psych), and also corv fog and ur good

its not terrible for scarf blace even if u have a zama

I'd argue it's actually good since u can't reasonably slot priority there as more antioffense with the lele

just another cleaner either way

[pulsar harness]

who wanna 1v1 pls

[nocturne summit]

the hell is lowkirkenuienly

[empty olive]

search it up

[gaunt stirrup]

lowkey but charlie kirk remix

[nocturne summit]

humanity's language is doomed

[nocturne summit]

anyways like the person before said is priority necessary?

also is psyshock better then psychic on lele?

[empty olive]

you never need prio its more just nice to have on any team for antioffense sheblang

however on lele teams rule of thumb is to just never use it

[empty olive]

either or

I like psychic more

but it just mildly changes some interactions

lele still does the same thing basically as a wallbreaker

[nocturne summit]

softens stall mu a bit (that archetype is the most thing I automatically want to be able to beat no matter if it's bad or good in said format... too much trauma)

[empty olive]

psychic is still threatening to stall w cm

mainly just hit blissey better if u like that

[nocturne summit]

yea that blob is the main thing that scares me

[celest merlin]

Hey @native orchid, it looks like you're trying to share a gen9nationaldexdoubles team, but I didn't find any raters for that format in this channel. Try posting in #1060037469472555028 instead.

[native orchid]

Oh

[dreamy steppe]

https://pokepast.es/4a7f1dc976000393
Here's my team, it's doing alright and I just got to 1400 but hatterene and ogerpon w are rlly problematic

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[tame galleon]

what about brave bird iron head roost defog or something

agreed i didn't give it much thought but you get the idea

[gray lake]

main thing here is blissey's set isn't super optimal and mola is a bit out of place imo

you dont need sball blissey since clod beats ghold, i think you would be better served with wish blissey to support sableye, which would also let you replace mola with something else

if ur concerned about Pon you could try amoonguss, some stalls in NDCL used him

hatt i could see being hard still tbf so maybe try like poison jab clod or smth

also theres some hatt sets that turbobone stall without much recourse so like

like ive yet to see a hard stall that doesnt lose to helmet+pain split hatt

[celest merlin]

Hatterene (Gen 9)

Typing

Psychic / Fairy

Abilities

0: Healer | 1: Anticipation | H: Magic Bounce

Base Stats (BST: 510)

57 / 90 / 95 / 136 / 103 / 29

Weight

5.1 kg (20 BP)

Gender Rate

Female Only

[tame galleon]

136 spA stab psychic on the psychic weak pokemon might not work out well

[mystic swift]

https://pokepast.es/d6d8c953ff5f6449

[gaunt stirrup]

it’s usually uninvested

compared to the extremely invested spdef clod

sure it’ll chunk Clod but also you chunk Hat

esp catching it switch in

[tame galleon]

so like trading ?

[dreamy steppe]

So I should replace soft boiled and s ball on bliss with wish and protect
And alo for moonguss

[dreamy steppe]

But is losing toxic on clod a big problem or not rlly

[finite solstice]

https://pokepast.es/3f9cf58972987eb8
hey i was wondering if i should have defog on gliscor instead of one of the moves it currently has, or some other way to get rid of hazards for one of the other mons

[celest merlin]

New [Gen 9] National Dex RMT @potent furnace, @gray lake, @limber crypt, @vague hemlock. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[dreamy steppe]

Ty for the suggestion, I tried it out and iron head is good to OHKO mega diancie

Im now 1500 (practically 1500, 1496)

[blazing moth]

it really is, esp if you pair it w another 110+

[tame galleon]

glad to hear it worked

[tame galleon]

so i tried something and it didn't really work
i'm interested in your opinions
https://pokepast.es/bda45ddfcdcc5aa6

maybe it's the lack of special breaker ?

[hollow fern]

The issue is just these mons/sets are really suboptimal

No switchin to common mons like ghold, way too slow, missing requirements like a ground type and stealth rock user and removal

And the mons themselves have really weird sets that limit them greatly

[tame galleon]

damn 😔

ok i'll be back eventually with better cooking

[cloud solstice]

Bro what

Is this a ZU team ?

[tame galleon]

nah it's OU

melmetal is OU

slowking is UU

Iron Hands is UUBL

[cloud solstice]

Those are some... Interesting sets

What's haze altaria for ?

And why dynamic punch melmetal

It's 50% accuracy

And why wide lens on hands

Just run wild charge if you don't wanna miss so bad..?

And where is your flying type or ground immunity

And the removal

[tame galleon]

yeaaah this one was a choice for sure

[tame galleon]

i'll admit i was straight up being goofy here.

[tame galleon]

This one was actually thought through ! I never miss Supercell Slam !

[tame galleon]

yeah but then I get recoil

[tame galleon]

none

[tame galleon]

at low ladder i can do without tbh

[cloud solstice]

Yes you can protect exists

[nocturne summit]

biggest hot mess I've seen a while

[cloud solstice]

And ground types

[cloud solstice]

Who cares you have drain punch

And fake out is useless in singles

This is for doubles

[cloud solstice]

That's a big problem you get 6-0ed by ground types

[tame galleon]

okay I never miss UNLESS the opponent has protect, but this is singles

[tame galleon]

thought it could be useful for revenge killing

plus it's fun

[tame galleon]

"experimental" might be the word you're looking for ?

[hollow fern]

alo uses tect

so even with wide lens you cant safely click it into smth like an alo

also if you use it as a ground type comes in you take the recoil

so wide lens is basically useless

since you still cant click it safely

[hollow fern]

takes up a valuable moveset that could be used for more important stuff

[tame galleon]

[tame galleon]

okay i'll put SD

[hollow fern]

low ladder is the key phrase here lol

[tame galleon]

...true

[hollow fern]

is there a particular mon you were trying to build around?

[tame galleon]

altaria maybe ?

[hollow fern]

rn this team seems really random without much thought behind it icl

[tame galleon]

i just remember i took whatever looked bulky

originally this was a klutz skill swap lagging tail trick team

but it SUCKED

so i remade it into "whatever has high enough hp/def" + dusclops and grafaiai

[hollow fern]

id recommend using resources like sample teams and smogon sets in order to learn the tier-theyre really helpful and can give you an idea of what 'bulky teams' look like

cause in terms of what a bulky team is you could go bulky offense or smth like stall

but rn this team doesnt really have a direction/intent

[tame galleon]

i know 😭

[hollow fern]

but yeah id recommend using samples to learn the tier theyre pretty varied and fun, and give great examples of standard teams

knowing the meta makes it way easier to experiment with wackier stuff

/knowing teambuilding in general

[tame galleon]

let me check my threats rq

...

okay

guess i'll keep this one to my alt

[hollow fern]

even more than just understanding the threats its really helpful to see synergies/strong offense and defensive cores

along with what are good general requirements teams need

like a ground type, rocks user, removal, resistance to types, speed control etc etc

[tame galleon]

i'm never posting my "experimental" teams again 😔

[hollow fern]

lol naw its good to experiment but inherintely yknow posting it here means you want feedback

you can defo build some really cool stuff with mons people think are bad

[tame galleon]

alright, then do you think there's anything salvageable in this ?

[hollow fern]

id say picking a mon you want to build around is a good start-iron hands is a decently niche mon but has seen success and defo has some traits with exploring

mega altaria is very niche and hasnt seen much success but on paper it has a lot of good tools ive seen people mention

if you wanna use grafaiai you could probably do some funny unburden stuff on a terrain team similar to hawlucha

[tame galleon]

hold on i got an idea

[tame galleon]

https://pokepast.es/38f1910a55ad1c79

wait i got stupid

i gotta switch clops for a flying type

[hollow fern]

This is looking much better already but id personally push this into a more hyper offense direction by doing stuff like making koko dual screens set, making Mega altaria dragon dance, and replace dusclops/treads

Since grafaiai is inherintely a one time sweeper pokemon, hyper offense can help open holes for him to clean late game

[tame galleon]

treads as well ?

on it for the screens btw thanks

[hollow fern]

If you want to keep treads you could make him a lead set with booster and stealth rocks

I just think it might be worth looking into replacing him with another setup sweeper to fully play into screens

[tame galleon]

https://pokepast.es/c05479028843f18d

so like that ?

[hollow fern]

I think it would be better to replace hawlucha with a special attacker here tbh

[tame galleon]

hmm
makes sense

so like thundurus-T ?