Smogon Doubles Rates | Smogon | Page 4

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 5:46 PM

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😦

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What pokemon should I use instead that fufill similar roles?

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:46 PM

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Gothitelle is bad, copperajah is bad, there’s no reason to use hatterene instead of necrozma, etc

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 5:46 PM

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Wait I thought Necrozma was banend

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:46 PM

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It isnt

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Its not even like

peak crypt Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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DOU has a different banlist than singles OU

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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That good

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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Also what should I use instead of Copperajah

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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peak crypt DOU has a different banlist than singles OU

Wow I should stick to OU..

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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There’s no 1 to 1 replacement for copperajah

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The best option is like

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Stakataka

peak crypt Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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no singles is definitely worse than doubles

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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K

peak crypt Apr 6, 2023, 5:47 PM

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a bad doubles meta is still a better experience than a good singles meta :)

queen willow Apr 6, 2023, 5:48 PM

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least biased arctic take

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:48 PM

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He isnt wrong

peak crypt Apr 6, 2023, 5:48 PM

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(I am probably objectively wrong)

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back on topic though

queen willow Apr 6, 2023, 5:48 PM

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earnest junco He isnt wrong

~~not saying hes wrong~~

peak crypt Apr 6, 2023, 5:49 PM

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sometimes there's not really a strict 1:1 improvement over a bad Pokemon

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 5:50 PM

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What is a good trickroom moveset for Stakataka

peak crypt Apr 6, 2023, 5:50 PM

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Stakataka can definitely slide in over Copperajah, but there's not really a strictly better Dusclops for example, just Pokemon that have better strengths

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:50 PM

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Stone edge gyro ball trick room protect/body press/heat crash

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 5:50 PM

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Ok

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And should I scrap conkeldor?

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:51 PM

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Staka without protect kinda sucks imo but its worth it on some teams

earnest junco Apr 6, 2023, 5:51 PM

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lofty compass And should I scrap conkeldor?

Yes

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Volcanion/torkoal

slender oasis Apr 6, 2023, 5:52 PM

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peak crypt Stakataka can definitely slide in over Copperajah, but there's not really a stri...

probably the closest 1:1 replacement to dusclops would be porygon2 as it's also super bulky but also not extremely passive

lofty compass Apr 6, 2023, 6:02 PM

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https://pokepast.es/f0c40304472d7b00 Is the updated team good?

slender oasis Apr 6, 2023, 6:06 PM

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I'd change future sight to expanding force but other than that it looks good

torpid moat Apr 6, 2023, 6:07 PM

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yeah use eforce

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the staka evs seem like they might be inefficient?

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why so little hp invest?

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I think even if you only care about special bulk running hp is still better

lyric tangle Apr 7, 2023, 5:45 AM

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https://pokepast.es/575eaeac4ae1c74e

halcyon pantherBOT Apr 7, 2023, 5:45 AM

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New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

torpid moat Apr 7, 2023, 11:16 AM

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lyric tangle https://pokepast.es/575eaeac4ae1c74e

a little too much support here, not enough reliable offense

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farig is mostly dead weight on this team, I'd probably cut it for like dragonite or something

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or sd iron hands

lyric tangle Apr 7, 2023, 12:19 PM

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Ok which dnite set ?

lyric tangle Apr 7, 2023, 1:55 PM

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Also recommend me a sp attacker and who to replace it with pao

torpid moat Apr 7, 2023, 6:10 PM

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prob just cb dnite

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tera normal espeed is the important move

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I suggested it because of the chien pao here buffing palafin and dnite's priority

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you don't need to cut it

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though since there's a lot of support here, SD iron hands is definitely an option too

fervent ice Apr 7, 2023, 10:27 PM

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Hey all, I’ll be facing off against some specific threats in an upcoming tournament that I know of — (1) Greninja and Garganacl, (2) Flapple, Sandy Shocks, Iron Moth & Altaria, and (3) Iron Treads & Dusk Lycanroc.
Does anyone have any suggestions for this team to better adapt to these threats?

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I’m thinking Iron Treads, Iron Moth, Garganacl, and Lycanroc are the scariest. My hard hitters don’t do any super effective damage to them and if I’m prevented from getting my speed control off, I’ll be stumped.

lyric tangle Apr 7, 2023, 11:26 PM

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Ok thanks mr paint

weary dirge Apr 8, 2023, 12:18 PM

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USUM DOU anyone?

torpid moat Apr 8, 2023, 2:10 PM

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weary dirge USUM DOU anyone?

seems like a very reasonable sm team, is there anything you're having trouble with?

peak crypt Apr 8, 2023, 2:59 PM

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Use shiny Genesect if you’re already Hasty, so you can bluff having Extreme Speed

weary dirge Apr 10, 2023, 12:00 PM

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https://pokepast.es/2b3551cd8eeef6f4 Gen 5 DOU anyone?

torpid moat Apr 10, 2023, 6:14 PM

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weary dirge https://pokepast.es/2b3551cd8eeef6f4 Gen 5 DOU anyone?

far too many tr setters here, and you're not doing anything particularly powerful

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try eruption heatran over chand at least

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and probably get gothitelle involved

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maybe aboma or ttar as well

rough ice Apr 13, 2023, 4:50 PM

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Gen 7 (the cresselia's safeguard is to protect against sleep which otherwise kills the team)
https://pokepast.es/b3f0fd463a7fd887

torpid moat Apr 13, 2023, 5:52 PM

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rough ice Gen 7 (the cresselia's safeguard is to protect against sleep which otherwise kil...

gastro could easily be a fini if you're having trouble with amoong

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it could also be goggles incin or something

rough ice Apr 13, 2023, 5:54 PM

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Thanks, I'll try those out!

torpid moat Apr 13, 2023, 5:55 PM

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that kinda cress is just extremely passive, there's lots of other options like fake out users or hoopa or bronzong or whatever

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and gastro yeah is kinda mediocre in general

rough ice Apr 13, 2023, 7:34 PM

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torpid moat that kinda cress is just extremely passive, there's lots of other options like f...

I assume you mean normal hoopa instead of unbound?
I didn't really want to use bronzong because it's about as offensively strong as cresselia, but less bulk and adds a 3rd fire weakness to the team

torpid moat Apr 13, 2023, 9:44 PM

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rough ice I assume you mean normal hoopa instead of unbound? I didn't really want to use b...

no I meant hoopa u, it's quite offensively threatening

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also bronzong does heatproof with z trick room (raises accuracy and taunt immune) + hypnosis

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which makes it way harder to ignore than cress

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it's still slightly less bulky than cress but the steel gives good resists

fervent ice Apr 20, 2023, 4:05 PM

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https://pokepast.es/fe1da30194a9e861
SwSh Doubles team ^^
Anyone have any thoughts on this? Very casual match with my friend, not really for online play. Just used some of my favorites, any glaring flaws in it?

torpid moat Apr 20, 2023, 4:44 PM

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fervent ice https://pokepast.es/fe1da30194a9e861 SwSh Doubles team ^^ Anyone have any thoug...

flash cannon hydrei doesn't really hit much, could be protect or earth power

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aegi should be quiet

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your ttar is missing evs

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moonblast is better than dazzle garde

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do life orb sandslash prob over ebelt

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the mon choice is really weak but I'm assuming you know that already, not much else to do

fervent ice Apr 20, 2023, 5:12 PM

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Cool, thank you as usual @torpid moat . Yeah, I don't expect any Fairy types on my friends' team anyway, so Flash Cannon can go to Earth Power. Or hell, maybe even Nasty Plot -- although it's spending way too much time setting up with Tailwind already there to actually get down to business.

Aegislash needs to sit down and stfu, true.

Thanks for noticing the EV's missing, and point taken on Moonblast. Gardevoir doesn't seem strong enough to warrant Dazzling Gleam without specs.

Expert Belt was chosen to prevent duplicate items, perhaps I'll switch it out with Hydreigon for a Chople Berry?

torpid moat Apr 20, 2023, 5:13 PM

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nvm then do like av slash then

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sandslash*

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or cb

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or soft sand

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anything but ebelt

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if sandslash gets swords dance I could buy that too

fervent ice Apr 20, 2023, 5:15 PM

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Assault Vest? Oooh wow that's a fun idea

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Swords Dance and Soft Sand?

torpid moat Apr 20, 2023, 5:16 PM

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sure that's fine

fervent ice Apr 20, 2023, 5:17 PM

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Cool, thanks!

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I expect to see some things like Oranguru, Arcanine, Slowbro, Venusaur, Chesnaught, and some other favorites of my friend's.

torpid moat Apr 20, 2023, 6:56 PM

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if there's no rillaboom present you can probably pull off earthquake sandslash then

weary dirge Apr 22, 2023, 4:46 PM

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How's my team? G7 DOU

torpid moat Apr 22, 2023, 10:55 PM

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weary dirge How's my team? G7 DOU

try koko instead of lele

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also thunder gene

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or tbolt

sour topaz Apr 23, 2023, 5:26 PM

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can someone give me tips for doubles teambuilding

torpid moat Apr 23, 2023, 8:54 PM

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sour topaz can someone give me tips for doubles teambuilding

learn the format and what's strong, then start with some kind of strong starting 1-3 mons

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for your first 4 mons only worry about matchups that you straight up lose to, just pick good complementary options, either expanding your offense, offering more utility, or shoring up weaknesses

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by utility I mean some combination of speed control (tailwind, trick room, icy wind) disruption (fake out, follow me, taunt, spore), damage mitigation(intimidate, snarl, wisp, screens)

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that's not a comprehensive utility list btw and they're usually just good to have, none are strictly mandatory

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by your last 2 mons you just think about what you're weak to or greatly missing and add mons to fix that

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don't worry about specific movesets or evs etc until you have your 6, just knowing what role you want each mon to play is enough, you can figure out sets and tech options once your 6 is done

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this type of building requires decent meta knowledge and the ability to judge/determine matchups decently easily, which are things I recommend you learn regardless

marsh lagoon Apr 24, 2023, 11:47 PM

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https://pokepast.es/7941cd3284c520f5 The team has been performing decently well, with nice matchups into chi yu teams and sun but protect stalling and other teams that drag battles out have been wearing it down and winning

halcyon pantherBOT Apr 24, 2023, 11:48 PM

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New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

brittle spade Apr 24, 2023, 11:51 PM

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well you're running a fullroom team and you're describing the ways to beat fullroom teams

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:51 PM

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marsh lagoon https://pokepast.es/7941cd3284c520f5 The team has been performing decently well,...

you should use armarouge over indeedee and replace chien pao with like... literally anything else lol

brittle spade Apr 24, 2023, 11:51 PM

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you're not gonna like that but either you fully commit to the archetype and get rid of garg chien pao

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or you need to replace indeedee+hatterene

marsh lagoon Apr 24, 2023, 11:52 PM

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earnest junco you should use armarouge over indeedee and replace chien pao with like... litera...

chien's been in for ruin with rockslide spam and cleanign up games once the roomers are gone, I have no idea who to replace it with though but I've definitely felt it could be removed

brittle spade Apr 24, 2023, 11:53 PM

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fullroom right now is running kingambit armarouge over garg chien pao

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:54 PM

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yeah kingambit > chien pao seems

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pretty much just better

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Kingambit @ Lum Berry
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature

Kowtow Cleave
Sucker Punch
Swords Dance
Protect

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ive been using this

marsh lagoon Apr 24, 2023, 11:54 PM

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I'll give gambit a shot then. reluctant to remove garg yet since that was the reason I crafted the team in the first place and he's actualyl been a great mon versus sun and chi yu bundle leads

brittle spade Apr 24, 2023, 11:55 PM

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if you really want to keep garg you can try a ghost tr setter instead

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:55 PM

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on this team maybe run iron head > sd

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if you want to keep garg use mimikyu

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over hatterene

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and drop chien pao for amra

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arma

brittle spade Apr 24, 2023, 11:55 PM

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i was gonna suggest spiritomb

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but yeah mimi is fine too

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:56 PM

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Mimikyu @ Mental Herb
Ability: Disguise
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Spe

Taunt
Trick Room
Will-O-Wisp
Play Rough

marsh lagoon Apr 24, 2023, 11:56 PM

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I'll keep that one in mind. I gravitated towards hatt for eating fighting moves but mimi could work

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:56 PM

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in sv you can actually run curse

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instead of play rough

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(tera dark)

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:57 PM

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marsh lagoon I'll keep that one in mind. I gravitated towards hatt for eating fighting moves ...

mimikyu is immune to fighting

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they both eat fighting moves

brittle spade Apr 24, 2023, 11:58 PM

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Nah not mental herb what

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Nothing runs taunt right now

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:58 PM

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something generic like sitrus is also fine

brittle spade Apr 24, 2023, 11:58 PM

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Ok ting lu and roaring moon do

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But you always have a redirector in that case

marsh lagoon Apr 24, 2023, 11:59 PM

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Imprison Farigiraf has been popping up

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and that's been extremely annoying

earnest junco Apr 24, 2023, 11:59 PM

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imprison fari shouldnt be that bad

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you can just curse it and force a switch

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and/or explode

marsh lagoon Apr 25, 2023, 12:00 AM

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farig requires a tera commit with explosion

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the original reason I put protect pao on the team was to boost some of the explosion calcs I did

brittle spade Apr 25, 2023, 12:01 AM

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I'd run this

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https://pokepast.es/ed1f4a8e2f0869fe

marsh lagoon Apr 25, 2023, 12:02 AM

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I've been back and forth on heavy slam with the garg

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Hammer arm OHKOs bundle where hevay doesn't

earnest junco Apr 25, 2023, 12:02 AM

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is it supposed to be shadow ball mimikyu?

brittle spade Apr 25, 2023, 12:02 AM

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Shadow claw oops

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With tera grass

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Corrected

marsh lagoon Apr 25, 2023, 12:03 AM

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what's that hands evs optimized for

brittle spade Apr 25, 2023, 12:05 AM

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Living headlong rush max atk adamant

marsh lagoon Apr 25, 2023, 12:06 AM

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I'll remember that. Tusk has been really rare lately though

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@brittle spade @earnest junco Kingambit immediately soloed a game he feels great thx

brittle spade Apr 25, 2023, 12:19 AM

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Yeah it's really good if you already have tusk hands answers

sour topaz Apr 25, 2023, 5:02 AM

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torpid moat learn the format and what's strong, then start with some kind of strong starting...

ight

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tysm

grizzled walrus Apr 26, 2023, 11:51 AM

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My sand team with outdated EV spreads and idk what to put on Ting-Lu https://pastebin.com/1mwRNQKD

Pastebin

Bacon Maker (Garganacl) (M) @ Covert Cloak Ability: Purifying Salt...

Pastebin.com is the number one paste tool since 2002. Pastebin is a website where you can store text online for a set period of time.

earnest junco Apr 26, 2023, 1:54 PM

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grizzled walrus My sand team with outdated EV spreads and idk what to put on Ting-Lu https://pas...

Please use pokepaste

torpid moat Apr 26, 2023, 2:05 PM

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pastebin is perfectly fine

torpid moat Apr 26, 2023, 2:06 PM

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grizzled walrus My sand team with outdated EV spreads and idk what to put on Ting-Lu https://pas...

houndstone kinda sucks, especially so when you're not even using last respects

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psychic seed drifblim or even most pranksters or booster scream tail offer far more utility than houndstone can

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and also don't rely on sand

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the ttar set also doesn't really make much sense either, 1 attack sash twave dd is just not succeeding in offense or utility

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sand teams should not actually be running many sand immunes

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you can just use inherently strong and complementary mons like chien pao, which kills amoonguss and ting lu and buffs other physical attackers

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or your own amoonguss as a solid water resist and iron hands check

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here's a sand team by ratpacker that's relatively recent: https://pokepast.es/8e0b528caafbc5ff

earnest junco Apr 26, 2023, 2:13 PM

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You can probably keep houndstone, but the rest of the team just autoloses if your opponent has a grass type. The movesets are also just not good

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https://pokepast.es/fde0bcb1ae87adb8 another sand team

torpid moat Apr 26, 2023, 2:13 PM

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imo there are some questionable sets on ratpacker's as well but at least it's functional

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yeah that one looks cleaner

rain mantle Apr 26, 2023, 2:47 PM

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https://pokepast.es/3acc5ed6bda61c8e

halcyon pantherBOT Apr 26, 2023, 2:47 PM

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New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

rain mantle Apr 26, 2023, 2:47 PM

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rain mantle https://pokepast.es/3acc5ed6bda61c8e

Been climbing up with this recently and I want to shore up any holes before I get into the higher end of later

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Also I replaced terablast on the farigraf with shadow ball. I wasn't clicking it enough to justify the moveslot

brittle spade Apr 26, 2023, 3:56 PM

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rain mantle https://pokepast.es/3acc5ed6bda61c8e

I'd run this :
https://pokepast.es/b43157dcdee062a8

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Makes farigiraf bulkier, hands lives headlong rush with those evs

rain mantle Apr 26, 2023, 4:00 PM

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Okay thanks mTe

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Mate

brittle spade Apr 26, 2023, 4:09 PM

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Hf

real zealot Apr 29, 2023, 2:58 PM

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completely wrong channel bud, and wrong person to tag.

scarlet chasm Apr 29, 2023, 2:59 PM

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Someone told me that you rate OU teams

peak crypt Apr 29, 2023, 3:00 PM

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sure but this is for DOU teams

novel grove Apr 29, 2023, 7:31 PM

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Hi, is this a good team for gen6 doubles? Any suggestions? https://pokepast.es/45e4fd3e7c3743c7

peak crypt Apr 29, 2023, 11:04 PM

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You don’t really have good answers to Volcanion or Mega Gardevoir, and you have exactly one answer to an opposing Lando-T (and Bisharp can’t switch in)

earnest junco Apr 29, 2023, 11:29 PM

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Im not the most well versed in xy but

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This is most likely a “check samples” moment

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Xy teambuilding is very particular in the way you have to approach it, and off meta stuff can work, but this is, for lack of a better term, not it

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https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/xy-doubles-ou-vr-post-2-samples-post-3.3606255/

Smogon Forums

Metagame - XY Doubles OU (VR Post #2, Samples Post #3)

Art by the amazing GenOne!

This thread is dedicated to information and discussion about the Generation 6 Doubles Metagame, XY Doubles OU

Play Restrictions

Endless Battle Clause: Players cannot use any moveset on any Pokémon capable of intentionally causing an endless battle. Thus:
A Pokémon...

novel grove Apr 30, 2023, 6:31 AM

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earnest junco This is most likely a “check samples” moment

It is my first team I made myself used to use the samples team without reading the wisdom around it. I already thought it was shit but thanks for telling me where to read how to do it. Have a nice day : )

peak crypt Apr 30, 2023, 2:49 PM

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I think that’s being a little harsh @novel grove

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The team isn’t bad

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It’s not like you’re running special Terrakion or anything

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I think it just has bad matchups into the “typical” XY team these days, so you’ll struggle at higher levels of play

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Honestly I think swapping Rhydon for a Rotom-W will help smooth out those matchups a lot

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It’s not perfect—a Zard X team can only be so good, unfortunately—but it has stronger matchups into the big three overall

ivory acorn Apr 30, 2023, 5:55 PM

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Hatterene @ Focus Sash
Ability: Magic Bounce
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Atk / 148 SpA
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe

Trick Room
Psychic
Shadow Ball
Play Rough

Armarouge (F) @ Iron Ball
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe

Armor Cannon
Energy Ball
Trick Room
Expanding Force

Indeedee-F @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Psychic Surge
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

Follow Me
Helping Hand
Shadow Ball
Trick Room

Torkoal @ Focus Sash
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 164 HP / 252 SpA / 92 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe

Eruption
Earth Power
Solar Beam
Sludge Bomb

Iron Hands @ Iron Ball
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe

Ice Punch
Fake Out
Drain Punch
Rock Slide

Kingambit @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe

Kowtow Cleave
Iron Head
Brick Break
Sucker Punch

novel grove Apr 30, 2023, 9:02 PM

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peak crypt It’s not like you’re running special Terrakion or anything

Yeah tru just used the advices sets on smogon

novel grove Apr 30, 2023, 9:02 PM

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peak crypt Honestly I think swapping Rhydon for a Rotom-W will help smooth out those matchu...

Thanks for the advice switch in I would not know what to pick.

novel grove Apr 30, 2023, 9:02 PM

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peak crypt It’s not perfect—a Zard X team can only be so good, unfortunately—but it has str...

Yeah but it can be fun

remote edge Apr 30, 2023, 11:38 PM

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@IdkAndIdc#3285 use pokepastss

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nevermind they left

twin nova May 2, 2023, 1:52 AM

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https://pokepast.es/e97f7b90f0fc978c made this doubles team pretty recently, wanted some feedback on it

halcyon pantherBOT May 2, 2023, 1:53 AM

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New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

earnest junco May 2, 2023, 1:54 AM

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yeahhhh this is a samples moment

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you have: one competitively viable pokemon

twin nova May 2, 2023, 1:54 AM

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which one

earnest junco May 2, 2023, 1:54 AM

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https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/doubles-ou-sample-teams.3710876/

Smogon Forums

Resource - Doubles OU Sample Teams

Art by GenOne

Welcome to the Sample Teams thread! This thread is meant to highlight the best of the best teams in the Doubles OU tier. Sample Teams are exemplary teams that have proven themselves to be good and are basic enough for beginners to use, allowing them to pick up the fundamentals of...

earnest junco May 2, 2023, 1:54 AM

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twin nova which one

water tauros

twin nova May 2, 2023, 1:54 AM

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hmm ok

earnest junco May 2, 2023, 1:55 AM

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and even then the moveset is pretty bad

twin nova May 2, 2023, 1:55 AM

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aw man

earnest junco May 2, 2023, 1:55 AM

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meredith (Tauros-Paldea-Aqua) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 116 Atk / 140 SpD
Adamant Nature

Raging Bull
Close Combat
Aqua Jet
Bulldoze

twin nova May 2, 2023, 1:55 AM

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i had a good strat with cryogonal + tauros

earnest junco May 2, 2023, 1:55 AM

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bulldoze can also be wave crash

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or like

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tera blast if you're using tera grass or something

twin nova May 2, 2023, 1:56 AM

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hmm

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ok

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 2:09 AM

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the anger point gimmick isn't worth using

peak crypt May 2, 2023, 3:09 AM

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@twin nova when you're building a team, you really want to make sure you know what Pokemon are the best, and especially how you plan on beating them

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but you also need to make sure you know what you want your team to do, and ensure that you can execute

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on the team you posted, your Tauros is actually faster than your Cryogonal, so you can't even do the Frost Breath thing correctly (sorry, made a typo there)

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along with the weird choice of Choice Specs Oinkologne - the pig has an incredibly low special attack stat, so Choice Specs isn't really that much of a boost

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after the Choice Specs boost, it only hits 357 Special Attack; a number of Pokemon can get close and even surpass it without even holding an item

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:23 PM

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https://pokepast.es/081880002826e5b7 i reworked the team, removed everyone except tauros and cryogonal, and overall i think i made the team better.

halcyon pantherBOT May 2, 2023, 10:23 PM

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New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:24 PM

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twin nova https://pokepast.es/081880002826e5b7 i reworked the team, removed everyone excep...

have you used it yet? I think you're overfocused on the gimmick

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:25 PM

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i havent tested the team yet

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:25 PM

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and there are various flaws

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like cryogonal aurora veil with no snow

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froslass is also pretty much just better cryo

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:25 PM

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hmm

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i realized aurora veil's problem

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:26 PM

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the frost breath combo itself has a lot of problems, it's not something you can build around assuming it'll work

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:26 PM

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hmm

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ok

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originally i had wanted to build a team that had a tauros somewhere on it

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:27 PM

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for example any team that wants to run as bad a mon as flamigo is probably doing something wrong

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:28 PM

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i could rebuild the tauros and replace cryogonal with something else

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:28 PM

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that's actually the better way to build it

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you can have a team that has froslass + tauros or mewoscarada + fire tauros on it

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:28 PM

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i added the flamigo to focus more on the anger point gimmick

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:28 PM

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don't focus more on it

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:29 PM

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im now realizing that anger point is just too gimmicky and bad

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:29 PM

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oh I thought you specifically wanted to build that

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:30 PM

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so rebuild the tauros, and replace cryogonal and flamigo?

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:30 PM

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uh wait are you still going for anger point?

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:30 PM

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no

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its too gimmicky

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im gonna replace the cryogonal and flamigo with better mons, and rebuild the tauros to not be focused on anger point

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:32 PM

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so intimidate tauros?

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:32 PM

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would cud chew + sitrus/salac berry be good or should i just stick with intimidate

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:32 PM

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because that has a small but reasonable niche

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intimidate + typing is the reason people actually use tauros

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:33 PM

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There's a Tauros team on the bazaar that is used in tournaments

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:33 PM

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also screenbreaking

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:33 PM

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Why not try it out

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It'll help you get a better understanding on how to build with it

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:34 PM

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im gonna use intimidate tauros

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:35 PM

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so just so you're aware

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tauros is more of a "glue" mon than a buildaround

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you add it to a team to fix problems

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:35 PM

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ok then

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:35 PM

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and you'd only add it to certain teams that have those problems

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:35 PM

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ok

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i feel like i shouldn't use tauros in that case

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:36 PM

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there are sample teams available

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:37 PM

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ok i deleted tauros from the team and im gonna add 3 different mons to replace cryogonal, flamigo, and tauros

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:38 PM

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that wasn't really the point either, and try not to delete all your work so quickly

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you can keep the old team, just make a new one

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:39 PM

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well i have some ideas for different mons i can use

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:39 PM

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twin nova well i have some ideas for different mons i can use

https://pokepast.es/1c2ef44344ca2655

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:40 PM

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brittle spade https://pokepast.es/1c2ef44344ca2655

hmm ok

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:40 PM

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that team has water tauros at the end as a chi yu resist

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and as a general intimidate

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:40 PM

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ok ok

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@torpid moat what mons would go well with the espathra, murkrow, and amoonguss i added?

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:42 PM

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espathra isn't good

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and murkrow and amoong are support mons as well

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murkrow works well with chi yu and iron bundle and great tusk

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basically any offensive mons

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:43 PM

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ok

torpid moat May 2, 2023, 10:43 PM

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gholdengo as well

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:43 PM

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If you're running murkrow you want a fat pokemon that can click earthquake

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Ting lu, garchomp, iron hands, great tusk

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:44 PM

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ok ive started a new team

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so far i have the murkrow i built and a not-yet-built great tusk

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:46 PM

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Assault vest or focus sash stealth rocks are your options

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:46 PM

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hmm ok

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:47 PM

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If assault vest you'll want close combat earthquake ice spinner rapid spin

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:47 PM

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im thinking another good pokemon for this team could be walking wake

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:47 PM

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If you're running walking wake and tusk you can put sunny day on murkry

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Murkrow

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:48 PM

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oh yea that's smart

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should i put sunny day over taunt

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:48 PM

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I'd get rid of protect

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:48 PM

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ok

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:49 PM

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Then you'll want a fire type and maybe a steel type

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:50 PM

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would headlong rush be good instead of rapid spin

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:50 PM

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Fire types can be Arcanine, chiyu or even iron moth

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Rapid spin is good against hazards

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:51 PM

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ill probably use arcanine or chiyu

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:51 PM

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Glimmora is rather popular

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:51 PM

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true true

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:51 PM

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But headlong rush is good too

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:51 PM

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ok ok

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:52 PM

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For steel types you have kingambit or gholdengo

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And then you can finish with something like rotom wash iron bundle glimmora brute bonnet or amoonguss

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Just use sample sets if you're unsure of the EV spread or the attacks

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:53 PM

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ok then

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for great tusk, what should his tera type be

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:54 PM

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Water ground or dragon

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:54 PM

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ok

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 10:58 PM

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Hf

twin nova May 2, 2023, 10:59 PM

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https://pokepast.es/9991571bb9098520 this is the team

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 11:03 PM

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yeah looks ok

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they haven't updated the samples in a while

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so glimmora should run power gem over sludge bomb

twin nova May 2, 2023, 11:03 PM

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ok

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i wasn't sure if safety goggles on kingambit was a good choice

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 11:04 PM

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having an amoonguss switchin is always nice

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you can otherwise put goggles on arcanine

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and run whatever you want on kingambit

twin nova May 2, 2023, 11:05 PM

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so give goggles to arcanine

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 11:05 PM

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either is fine

twin nova May 2, 2023, 11:06 PM

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how about leftovers on kingambit

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or heavy-duty boots

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 11:06 PM

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that's a no though

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life orb or sitrus

twin nova May 2, 2023, 11:07 PM

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ok

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i gave it sitrus

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and i put goggles on arcanine

brittle spade May 2, 2023, 11:08 PM

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you can always change it later

twin nova May 2, 2023, 11:09 PM

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ok

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 1:29 AM

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https://pokepast.es/2db1d962cd38b9b8 Is this good?

halcyon pantherBOT May 6, 2023, 1:29 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 2:00 AM

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pulsar vigil https://pokepast.es/2db1d962cd38b9b8 Is this good?

this seems pretty bad, all the "combos" you're going for are kinda just too slow/unreliable compared to just running regular sun offense

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for example torkoal/lilligant/walking wake/roaring moon can do everything that scovillain/sableye/amoong/dragapult did

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except they do it without requiring specific partners on the field together, or even spending precious moves setting up

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 2:05 AM

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I wanted to spicy extract things and ko or make stronger

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 2:05 AM

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yeah ik

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if you don't wanna abandon that part

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try starting with torkoal/scovillain/clear amulet roaring moon

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and probably a great tusk on there

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the sableye amoong part is definitely dead weight

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if you do ignore that advice, at the minimum please don't use iron ball amoong

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it's basically wasting your item slot

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 2:15 AM

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Thank you for the advice, I'll try to rebuild my team

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 7:55 AM

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@torpid moat https://pokepast.es/eeb52f77dbfb803d Is this better now?

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Definitely seems to perform better

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 11:01 AM

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pulsar vigil <@168532715296129024> https://pokepast.es/eeb52f77dbfb803d Is this better now?

yes, it's a lot better, that's the power of straightforward efficiency

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the sets can still use work

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torkoal for example should use heat wave over lava plume, burning allies is the worst

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and maybe protect or helping hand over rapid spin

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scovillain probably doesn't want sub sash

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the fire move should be overheat, and it has options like rage powder, will o wisp, helping hand, sunny day, or grass move instead of sub

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use protect over u turn moon

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and potentially something over earthquake, it's hitting allies

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for tusk do the assault vest doubles analysis set

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I think you're using a singles one rn, try navigating to the doubles tab

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you can also get sets by clicking on the mons in here https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sv-doubles-ou-viability-rankings.3710905/

Smogon Forums

Resource - SV Doubles OU Viability Rankings

Art by Fangame10

Welcome to the Doubles OU Viability Ranking project, where we rank the viability of Pokemon in DOU. The floor will always be open to discussion, and after a period of time (roughly every month), the viability rankings council will vote on any of the Pokemon being discussed and...

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make sure your wake boosts speed with proto as well

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try chien pao instead of scizor, it's another way of buffing your physical attackers

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 11:22 AM

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Thank you for the input, I'll start making changes

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 11:37 AM

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torpid moat the fire move should be overheat, and it has options like rage powder, will o wi...

Solar beam?

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https://pokepast.es/4236512ddd32c3aa

halcyon pantherBOT May 6, 2023, 11:44 AM

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New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 11:59 AM

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pulsar vigil Solar beam?

Rage powder instead of solar beam

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 12:02 PM

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yeah rage powder's good

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do hydro steam wake, not hydro pump

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 12:22 PM

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also make sure your moon is slower than your scovillain at +1

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and make sure you lower attack as well to keep it speed proto

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 12:32 PM

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torpid moat also make sure your moon is slower than your scovillain at +1

Yep checking in game now

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 12:33 PM

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torpid moat and make sure you lower attack as well to keep it speed proto

kk

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 12:33 PM

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you need 363 or less speed

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 12:34 PM

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Moon has 370 speed

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 12:34 PM

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you can potentially go for 334 speed if you wanna creep garchomp or something and be greedy with evs

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but you'd need to lower attack as well

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yeah you have to lower the speed to 363 or less, then lower attack to 1 less than that

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 12:35 PM

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torpid moat yeah you have to lower the speed to 363 or less, then lower attack to 1 less tha...

kk

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Scovillain is 273 and moon is 363

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Do I keep like that?

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 12:41 PM

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yes

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273*2 is 546

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263 * 1.5 is 544

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and make sure moon's attack is 262

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 12:42 PM

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263?

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 12:42 PM

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ah sorry 363

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and 362

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 12:42 PM

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ah

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Wait so moon Will outspeed

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oop nvm

pulsar vigil May 6, 2023, 12:44 PM

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torpid moat and make sure moon's attack is 262

Tysm

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For the help\

torpid moat May 6, 2023, 12:44 PM

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yw

pulsar vigil May 7, 2023, 4:19 AM

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Team is working very well

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Just not against trick room

torpid moat May 7, 2023, 11:16 AM

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well, not exactly an unexpected result

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try using kingambit or iron hands over the pao slot

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and making the torkoal eruption/heat wave/yawn/protect

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quiet

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you can also run bulkier specs wake

pulsar vigil May 8, 2023, 10:12 AM

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torpid moat try using kingambit or iron hands over the pao slot

Should I use booster energy iron hands or like assault vest and just not worry about the boosts?

peak crypt May 10, 2023, 3:15 PM

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pulsar vigil Should I use booster energy iron hands or like assault vest and just not worry a...

Definitely Assault Vest on this team; Iron Hands doesn’t need an ability to be threatening and the extra bulk is a game changer

ivory acorn May 10, 2023, 9:32 PM

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https://pokepast.es/2abc28b68409c61b i think i should replace torcoal but idk for what

halcyon pantherBOT May 10, 2023, 9:32 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

earnest junco May 10, 2023, 9:33 PM

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the actual six is fine, but the movesets are bad

ivory acorn May 10, 2023, 9:33 PM

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It works well tbh

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Usual lead is haterene and iron hands

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Then if they die arm and indeedee

earnest junco May 10, 2023, 9:34 PM

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ok but you also have

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objectively inefficient evs (iron hands has lower effective hp with max hp than max spdef) and anti synergy (fake out and sucker punch + psychic terrain)

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:35 PM

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we don't like balls here in DOU

ivory acorn May 10, 2023, 9:36 PM

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Fake out is mainly used at the start and basically nowhere else

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Sucker punch i usually use against farigaraf

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:36 PM

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seriously no sets aren't viable

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the samples have a team like yours with sets more suited for doubles

earnest junco May 10, 2023, 9:37 PM

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https://pokepast.es/81fb0c13cc518ce2

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dex spreads with slight edits (swords dance hands could probably work too)

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:38 PM

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although fake out is a must on fullroom

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you really want fake out

ivory acorn May 10, 2023, 9:38 PM

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earnest junco https://pokepast.es/81fb0c13cc518ce2

Haterene needs shadow ball for goldengo

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:38 PM

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there's zero fullroom biulds without fake out hands

torpid moat May 10, 2023, 9:38 PM

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yeah fake out hands on indeedee team is fine

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:38 PM

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it's crucial in certain matchups

earnest junco May 10, 2023, 9:38 PM

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ivory acorn Haterene needs shadow ball for goldengo

you have kingambit for the express purpose of beating gholdengo

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:39 PM

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you also don't lead hatterene if you're expecting gholdengo

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unless you're ready to tera turn 1

torpid moat May 10, 2023, 9:39 PM

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hatt shadow ball also does not kill ghold at all

ivory acorn May 10, 2023, 9:39 PM

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earnest junco you have kingambit for the express purpose of beating gholdengo

Thats fair but if i send out haterene with kingambit trick room isnt always gona go up

earnest junco May 10, 2023, 9:39 PM

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yeah especially not the bulky gholdengo

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and also not if it teras

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:39 PM

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it can, you protect hatt and use kowtow on the ghold

torpid moat May 10, 2023, 9:39 PM

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how will slow shadow ball help you against gholdengo when it just kills your hatt

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:40 PM

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then you click sucker trick room

torpid moat May 10, 2023, 9:40 PM

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either you already have tr up and ghold isn't a problem, or one of your other mons is answering it

brittle spade May 10, 2023, 9:41 PM

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earnest junco dex spreads with slight edits (swords dance hands could probably work too)

like, jrl akaru run fullroom with swords dance hands, but its fake out swords dance 2 atks

torpid moat May 10, 2023, 9:41 PM

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yeah having fake out hands enables hatt + hands or hands + armor leads

earnest junco May 10, 2023, 9:41 PM

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https://pokepast.es/8073d5f1c8a475ac

peak crypt May 11, 2023, 4:21 AM

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keep in mind that you don't need to set up Trick Room turn 1

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sometimes you can't afford to lead a setter into your opponent's roster, so you need to just bring in two threats and try to position yourself better

pulsar vigil May 12, 2023, 2:37 PM

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https://pokepast.es/39653b1f38f32de9 took out scovillain because i just don't like it without a foul play user and added king gambit for trick room

halcyon pantherBOT May 12, 2023, 2:37 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

tardy ember May 12, 2023, 2:43 PM

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Moon / kinbambit don't benefit/can't use protect with cb/av
You could also benefit from a form of speed control as there isn't any rn

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Kinbambit here is a bit ehh as it doesn't really create or benefit from any synergy nor does it patch any of the team's weaknessess

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Then one of wake/moon may not be specs so you can run protect and have better positioning tools (if, for ex, moon is not cb it can run tailwind)
If you don't want to change the choice items then they would benefit from a priority control (deedee) so they are not harassed by fake out and you gain a form of speed control

pulsar vigil May 12, 2023, 2:58 PM

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tardy ember Moon / kinbambit don't benefit/can't use protect with cb/av You could also bene...

oop yeah I changed cb to life orb earlier

pulsar vigil May 12, 2023, 2:59 PM

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tardy ember Kinbambit here is a bit ehh as it doesn't really create or benefit from any syne...

I put specifically for the trick room teams as if torkoal and iron hands died my team kinda died

tardy ember May 12, 2023, 4:25 PM

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If you make tera water tusk you have already a good option

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There are better ways to deal with tr

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Kingambig also doesn't help with pokemon that want to abuse tr

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Such as torkoal, rogue, hands, ...

ripe flume May 13, 2023, 6:15 PM

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rose notch May 17, 2023, 2:14 PM

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ripe flume

uh what???

pulsar vigil May 21, 2023, 8:54 AM

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https://pokepast.es/f207764c9f22680b Is this good? I'm having fun with it

halcyon pantherBOT May 21, 2023, 8:54 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

torpid moat May 21, 2023, 12:24 PM

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pulsar vigil https://pokepast.es/f207764c9f22680b Is this good? I'm having fun with it

Room service is basically never worthwhile on anything. It's actually completely fine to just have a fast mon on your trick room team so you're not completely helpless if you fail to set TR

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also the only water I'd ever use on a sun team is Walking Wake, clawitzer gets worse in sun, not buffed like wake

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try using a fast specs wake and iron hands instead of clawitzer and moon

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psychic seed iron hands with swords dance is just s really threatening setup that is still bulky enough to function outside of tr

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it also enables fake out + hatt or armor leads

pulsar vigil May 21, 2023, 12:59 PM

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Oooh okay will do

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I'll use the same wake as my other team

torpid moat May 21, 2023, 1:00 PM

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I also recommend eject button or charcoal instead of heat rock

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your team's not very dependent on sun

pulsar vigil May 21, 2023, 1:01 PM

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torpid moat I also recommend eject button or charcoal instead of heat rock

yep changed a bit later

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also, I did like clawitzer for the 75% health back

torpid moat May 21, 2023, 1:04 PM

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if you want a support mon amoonguss is more flexible

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it can heal, but spore/rage powder is more proactive

pulsar vigil May 21, 2023, 1:13 PM

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Does fake out work in psychic terrain?

peak crypt May 21, 2023, 1:43 PM

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You can still Fake Out a flying or Levitate mon, but it’s not worth it

torpid moat May 21, 2023, 2:50 PM

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you can't fake out grounded targets no

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but psy terrain won't be up 100% of the time

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like when you lead hands with armor or hatt

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also you should prob give indeedee psychic

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instead of dazzle

pulsar vigil May 22, 2023, 10:39 AM

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I also gave flamethrower to torkoal for flash fire on armarouge

torpid moat May 22, 2023, 12:23 PM

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that's not really worth it tbh

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well, having a single target fire move like overheat can be

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but side-flash fire is usually a bad play

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it gets lava plume if you wanna try that

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but be sure to have another fire move

potent shuttle May 22, 2023, 4:24 PM

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Yea, torkoal learns helping hand too, which isn't a lasting boost like flash fire, but is more flexible in support since it could help anyone on the team. That's more common on sun teams without a tr component though, with tr it's usually better for tork to focus on its own damage output

pulsar vigil May 23, 2023, 7:46 AM

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I chose helping hand

pulsar vigil May 24, 2023, 8:50 AM

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https://pokepast.es/70bcc5298b74acf2 I made a new team

halcyon pantherBOT May 24, 2023, 8:50 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

brittle spade May 24, 2023, 8:53 AM

#

You're very weak to fire types and a lot of these sets aren't optimal

#

You want a better target and better support for baton pass too

#

And a better set on grimmsnarl with more spdef and defense

#

At the very least you want a different set on Scizor and something else instead of breloom

#

Any special attacker

pulsar vigil May 24, 2023, 9:06 AM

#

I'll change some of my sets and switch breloom for something, but I kinda like fury cutter even though its kidna bad

brittle spade May 24, 2023, 9:13 AM

#

Playing for fun is always respectable

#

Keep in mind that fury cutter isn't just bad, it's extra bad

#

You want a different item than metronome then

#

Clear amulet, choice band, Lum berry

#

And tera water

pulsar vigil May 24, 2023, 9:15 AM

#

brittle spade Keep in mind that fury cutter isn't just bad, it's extra bad

lol

#

Question, was baton pass banned in doubles? I thought it was until I saw it today

brittle spade May 24, 2023, 9:19 AM

#

No it's not banned

#

It's not as good

#

As in singles

peak crypt May 24, 2023, 6:39 PM

#

Not just “it’s not as good”

#

It’s straight up bad

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:00 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/a84de3f3acdd82d3

halcyon pantherBOT May 25, 2023, 11:00 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:00 AM

#

very bad dou team

#

rate >:)

#

Main strat is big special offense with scarf chi yu lowering spdef for wake or nplot dengo

#

Hands act as mostly a way to easily pivot and beat waters, thanks to fake out and tera water

#

Dnite is offensive support with tantrum to beat dengos

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:04 AM

#

You want enough spdef on torkoal to live power gem glimmora

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:04 AM

#

Oh yeah, probably

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:05 AM

#

Protect isn't necessary on support torkoal

#

Earth power has more use

#

Leftovers is bad on ghold

#

You want sitrus, colbur, life orb metal coat

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:06 AM

#

Idt I want colbur, It tanks dark fine

#

I think sitrus

#

Since I dont run recover

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:06 AM

#

What's the speed on gholdengo for

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:07 AM

#

Imma be honest I dont remember

#

Lemme think

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:07 AM

#

247 is the benchmark for scarf chiyu

#

Maybe check the one to outspeed wake

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:08 AM

#

brittle spade Maybe check the one to outspeed wake

?

#

I think Im changing the wake set to lorb too

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:08 AM

#

Make sure you outspeed protosynthesis walking wake if you have tailwind for example

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:08 AM

#

brittle spade Make sure you outspeed protosynthesis walking wake if you have tailwind for exam...

Ah

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:08 AM

#

I agree

#

You want protect and flexibility

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:09 AM

#

Specs can be so restrictive, having to switch when I can claim an easy kill

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:10 AM

#

Otherwise looks ok

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:10 AM

#

So, spdef on koal, swap for ep, Item on dengo, lower speed on Chi yu

#

Anything else

#

Wake too

#

It did well, I was like 20th on ladder as peak. Not amazing but not awful

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:12 AM

#

brittle spade Otherwise looks ok

Out of 10? glape

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:16 AM

#

N/10

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:18 AM

#

pain

brittle spade May 25, 2023, 11:19 AM

#

that's like a 7/H

#

it's pretty good

#

this thread ain't for the faint of heart

#

its to prepare you to the horrors of competitive pokemon

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:23 AM

#

I just

#

dont get

#

the letter

#

💀

#

7 out of 100?

zealous vessel May 25, 2023, 11:27 AM

#

brittle spade N/10

thats just .1 newtons 💀

tall helm May 26, 2023, 10:54 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/c3f3048d27532185

#

bop

remote edge May 27, 2023, 12:19 AM

#

no way, surprised azumarill in dou

tall helm May 27, 2023, 12:54 AM

#

surprised azumarill in dou!!!

torpid moat May 27, 2023, 2:05 AM

#

tall helm https://pokepast.es/c3f3048d27532185

it's too slow for having no speed control

#

a tusk or something is gonna run through a lot of this

#

there's also very little counterplay to opposing hands, not having wisp arc will do this

#

you'd prob be a lot better off with amoong or indeedee over maus, and then leaning towards trick room with indeedee or picking like scarf tusk instead of ting lu

tall helm May 27, 2023, 2:09 AM

#

oh i see

torpid moat May 27, 2023, 2:10 AM

#

definitely the kind of team that can run indeedee + sd hands

tall helm May 27, 2023, 2:12 AM

#

if i have sitrus sd hands what item should i have on gholdengo?

torpid moat May 27, 2023, 2:12 AM

#

no item clause

#

psychic seed sd hands goes with indeedee

tall helm May 27, 2023, 2:13 AM

#

oh right

#

im used to vgc lol

torpid moat May 27, 2023, 2:13 AM

#

ghold is another mon that can be specs or scarf instead of np too

tall helm May 27, 2023, 2:15 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/f92a77bc29791326

#

reworked

#

should be minus speed hands

torpid moat May 27, 2023, 2:16 AM

#

try normal tera arc

#

rest seems very reasonable

tall helm May 27, 2023, 2:17 AM

#

alright

#

thanks for the help

pulsar vigil May 27, 2023, 6:36 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/dce6f9e400f9bec3

halcyon pantherBOT May 27, 2023, 6:36 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 7:17 AM

#

This breloom set is really bad in doubles

#

Put focus sash instead

#

Also you're running screens without any setup pokemon

#

You can get rid of grimmsnarl

#

There's no speed control, no fake out no protect

#

So you'll instantly lose if the opponent gets a tailwind or a trick room up

pulsar vigil May 27, 2023, 7:23 AM

#

brittle spade You can get rid of grimmsnarl

Happy Rabbit (Cinderace) (M) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Libero
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature

Pyro Ball
Gunk Shot
U-turn
Court Change

#

I changed for this

pulsar vigil May 27, 2023, 7:24 AM

#

brittle spade This breloom set is really bad in doubles

Ah okay ill change my set

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 8:08 AM

#

the only good breloom set is focus sash

#

but it's still very underwhelming in doubles

#

you need to pair it with a fast tailwind option

#

like moon or murkrow

#

otherwise its not gonna do anything

sterile pine May 27, 2023, 10:30 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/e622ccc3a2f9a044

halcyon pantherBOT May 27, 2023, 10:30 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

sterile pine May 27, 2023, 10:30 PM

#

This is my team for a gym leader

#

Well as a ghost type gym leader

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 10:40 PM

#

sterile pine Well as a ghost type gym leader

Are you allowed to use other ghost types ?

sterile pine May 27, 2023, 10:42 PM

#

Well it's gen 7 doubles ou

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 10:42 PM

#

Within gen7dou

sterile pine May 27, 2023, 10:42 PM

#

Yea

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 10:43 PM

#

ok give me a minute

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 11:01 PM

#

sterile pine This is my team for a gym leader

i'd run this instead :
https://pokepast.es/69eaa3d269689e59
https://pokepast.es/017a0e3350360763

#

you have more type variety and you use strong doubles pokemon

sterile pine May 27, 2023, 11:04 PM

#

No offense but these seem like kinda basic

#

I'd didn't wanna be a hard gym leader but a funny one

#

That gengar set with sub is a must tho imma totally use that

#

Also going to use jellicent

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 11:08 PM

#

sterile pine I'd didn't wanna be a hard gym leader but a funny one

do you consider this fun : https://pokepast.es/3b82483ccd8fb44e

sterile pine May 27, 2023, 11:09 PM

#

That's lowkey hilarious but it's a gym leader team I gotta have more than 2 pokemon

#

Also I dunno If dusclops is allowed in that format

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 11:10 PM

#

you can fill in the rest of the team with sets from the other team i passed

sterile pine May 27, 2023, 11:10 PM

#

Ohh

#

Alr

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 11:11 PM

#

there's stuff like this too : https://pokepast.es/2173f69bc5688d34

brittle spade May 27, 2023, 11:15 PM

#

sterile pine Alr

smth like that : https://pokepast.es/292d2e733380de89

#

would be competitive

tawny salmon May 30, 2023, 10:15 PM

#

Rates for this metagame will be on halt as the metagame adapts to the new Home additions. It will be reopened when comp staff and specific raters feel its appropriate to so stay tuned!

tawny salmon Jun 8, 2023, 5:49 PM

#

DOU rates are now open for business again!

earnest junco Jun 8, 2023, 8:44 PM

#

:D

peak crypt Jun 8, 2023, 9:55 PM

#

time to put the most vile and heinous things onto Pokepaste and FORCE the poor innocent raters to look at it

rose notch Jun 8, 2023, 11:44 PM

#

peak crypt time to put the most vile and heinous things onto Pokepaste and FORCE the poor i...

:Worrywhirl:

abstract forge Jun 9, 2023, 1:47 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/249987d79f2734fc

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 9, 2023, 1:47 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

abstract forge Jun 9, 2023, 1:48 AM

#

I find it weak to sylveon and torkoal

#

They both wreck damage

#

And for sylveon not even resists can answer it.

earnest junco Jun 9, 2023, 2:34 AM

#

i would make volcanion tera grass heatran

#

if you're struggling with sylv and torky

#

this looks pretty solid other than that though

#

i don't love drain punch ursa, especially since you have cress to heal it anyway

#

but its probably fine enough

#

if you're gonna run eq instead of headlong rush i would run enamorus-t instead of flutter though

#

https://pokepast.es/7588cc4c2fb478fc

#

this looks fine

abstract forge Jun 9, 2023, 3:25 PM

#

earnest junco this looks fine

The main issue with the previous team I had was passivity. And if Cresselia goes down then it's game over.

#

Meow had helped me build the team I am using now.

urban summit Jun 9, 2023, 4:27 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/74b3c165757ca796
@remote edge
full trick room team with min speed anger point primape

#

set up +6 on ape with terra water (don‘t have to terra tho) (rage fist is 100bp now)

#

kill frostlass with eq

#

bring in cresselia

#

set trick room and protect ape

#

kill stuff with ape

#

when ape dead get out any other trick room abuser

#

when luna comes out you can sd and ally switch

#

for flame orb

#

Max phys def cresselia is surprisingly really good because most dark type attackers are physical and you can ally switch with luna to cover gohst type attacks

#

but in general the luna cresselia combo is just broken

#

(most people see +6 ape when you bring cresselia out and will attack it with 1 mon but then trick room goes up and well thats not good for them)

#

Weaknesses:

#

Wide guard

#

Redirection

#

Can be counters by the rest of the team tho

torpid moat Jun 9, 2023, 5:00 PM

#

you know primeape can still hold eviolite right

#

but yeah this seems too gimmicky to be worthwhile

#

you can still try maushold + ape, that at least has more utility than froslass

urban summit Jun 9, 2023, 5:12 PM

#

torpid moat you know primeape can still hold eviolite right

Thought I did that

abstract forge Jun 9, 2023, 11:03 PM

#

earnest junco https://pokepast.es/7588cc4c2fb478fc

There's a major flaw I see here when you rated my team. And that's the over reliance of trick room from Cresselia. Which is tricky to set up and difficult to maintain when both pokemon on the opposing side are targeting the cres to avoid trick room.

earnest junco Jun 9, 2023, 11:03 PM

#

Thats just how fullroom works

#

You use amoonguss and iron hands and cress’ naturally absurd bulk to create space to get trick room up and win with ursaluna/enamorus

#

If you want you could try a semiroom build with more immediate speed options

#

You could also look into using a second tr setter

#

If you find cress is dying too quickly

abstract forge Jun 9, 2023, 11:06 PM

#

Meow thought otherwise.

#

Passivity would be an issue

torpid moat Jun 9, 2023, 11:40 PM

#

I think your original team was pretty fine tundra

#

maybe life orb flutter instead

#

also do dark tera cress

#

also yeah pick a different coverage on ursaluna

#

and run leaf storm on amoong over clear smog

abstract forge Jun 10, 2023, 12:14 AM

#

torpid moat and run leaf storm on amoong over clear smog

Right, forgot to do that. Had to do so before the ape ban.

abstract forge Jun 10, 2023, 6:28 PM

#

Torn or Murk, they both have their qualities.

torpid moat Jun 10, 2023, 7:44 PM

#

tornadus always it's just the best option

knotty ember Jun 11, 2023, 12:37 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/39a58171deabece5

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 11, 2023, 12:37 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

knotty ember Jun 11, 2023, 12:37 PM

#

@remote edge

remote edge Jun 11, 2023, 12:47 PM

#

ada on pala and ice punch over cc
eject button on peli and tailwind (or smth else but tailwind is just way better as speed control) over icy wind
gyara is bad, you most likely want torn-i over it for taunt+reliable way to hit grass types etc
basc is fine ig
tsar over eleki since you already have thundy-t and fake out (also eleki is v eh due to the transistor nerf)
wildbolt storm over tbolt and change scarf to smth else since you're gonna have a lot of speed as is

can also look into urshifu-r over pala (in fact its almost certanly better here lol) but idk its too early

dire flint Jun 11, 2023, 2:26 PM

#

Having both thund and eleki seems redundant here

#

If you really want eleki drop Thunder cage for volt switch or protect

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 5:42 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/071fcdb28ef4e23a funny team i made i'm not sure if it's legal because ladder is broken and validate button isn't working

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 12, 2023, 5:42 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 5:42 PM

#

skill swap intimidate stantler uses trick room then skill swaps intimidate onto enemy which activates defiant for kimgabit / zapdos-g

#

that's the main gimmick

#

ursaluna is level 99 to underspeed other ursalunas

tardy ember Jun 12, 2023, 5:44 PM

#

Wyrdeer is missing evs, all offensive pokemon should run 252hp/252 att or spa

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 5:44 PM

#

oops guess evs didnt save

#

ursaluna too

#

oopsies

tardy ember Jun 12, 2023, 5:45 PM

#

There are prob better tr setters over toeds (such as cress for ex), but that is up to you

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 5:45 PM

#

i'm thinking 2 psychic TR setters is too much maybe

tardy ember Jun 12, 2023, 5:45 PM

#

You should also be running 0 speed ivs on all pokemon and -nature to fully take advantage of tr

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 5:45 PM

#

i also forgot to do that probably

tardy ember Jun 12, 2023, 5:45 PM

#

unique lantern i'm thinking 2 psychic TR setters is too much maybe

Fullroom normally runs 2/3

#

You can always make one of them tera dark

#

So you also become immune to prankster

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 5:46 PM

#

o, true

#

or just use covert cloak

tardy ember Jun 12, 2023, 5:46 PM

#

Support such as fake out, follow me/rage powder also helps set tr

#

Covert cloak doesn't block things like taunt for ex

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 5:46 PM

#

ye toedcruel has rage powder

#

brute bonnet too

#

would oranguru with instruct work as a TR setter

#

instruct is really funny

#

https://pokepast.es/ee14d6334fd526cd

#

something like this

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:28 PM

#

final version of the team

#

perfectly fine tuned the speeds

#

https://pokepast.es/9fdde20b82738a7f

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:35 PM

#

unique lantern https://pokepast.es/9fdde20b82738a7f

I really recommend not trying the skill swap defiant gimmick, it's just jumping through a lot of hoops for +1 while using suboptimal mons

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:36 PM

#

only suboptimal mon i'd say is wyrdeer though

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:36 PM

#

so is attempting to use room service gapdos

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:37 PM

#

i mean room service isn't necessary it's just so that oranguru can instruct it

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:37 PM

#

also inner focus goggles orang is better in every way

#

but orang itself is also pretty suboptimal

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:38 PM

#

yeah thats true

#

instruct is just so good

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:38 PM

#

it's really not

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:38 PM

#

how come

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:38 PM

#

it's worse than having two good attackers out

#

it's much easier to disrupt or switch into/wall/protect a single instructed mon

#

than two attackers with complementary offenses

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:39 PM

#

but i can do that too?

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:40 PM

#

it's why you shouldn't use oranguru really, because instruct isn't as good as you think it is

#

same with defiant skill swap

#

it's a way less flexible version of coaching

#

I know coaching isn't in the game rn but

#

I have a feeling you're misvaluing it

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:41 PM

#

i get what youre saying

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:41 PM

#

equivalent to howl

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:41 PM

#

but defiant skill swap is staying, oranguru i do realize how it might be better to just get another good tr setter

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:42 PM

#

you just have to remember the cost of a mon spending a move

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:42 PM

#

i built this team just cause defiant skill swap is fun not cause its the most insane strat ive seen

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:42 PM

#

gotcha, so long as you're aware

#

I wouldn't bother with air balloon gambit then

#

either give it av or a boosting item

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

but yeah i get that using swords dance is pretty much the same thing lol

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

with flying tera

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

fairy resists fire and theres a lot of fire stuff though

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

you kinda intim + defiant is only +1 right

#

and not +2

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

yeah

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

fairy doesn't resist fire

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

why did i think fairy resisted fire

#

yeah you're right it doesn't lol

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:43 PM

#

fire resists fairy?

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:44 PM

#

yeah that's it

#

AV might work but i'd have to give brute bonnet protect if i go for it

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:45 PM

#

ah speaking of that

#

are you aware the evs are really inefficient?

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:46 PM

#

i love brute bonnet do not speak ill of it

#

on brute bonnet probably yes

#

they should be good on everything else tho, no?

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:46 PM

#

on wyrdeer too

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:46 PM

#

not really worth speccing into special attack, right?

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:46 PM

#

but yeah bonnet and probably wyrdeer should be running 252 hp

#

as a rule of thumb you should invest in hp before touching defenses

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:47 PM

#

Wyrdeer @ Safety Goggles
Ability: Intimidate
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe

Psychic
Earth Power
Skill Swap
Trick Room

#

this good?

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:47 PM

#

much better yeah

#

potentially no earth power either

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:48 PM

#

helping hand?

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:49 PM

#

yeah hh is good

#

hypnosis isn't bad either

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:49 PM

#

no

#

i am not using a 60% accurate move

#

every move on my team is 100% accurate and i like it that way

#

would expert belt be good on kingambit?

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:50 PM

#

it's a proactivity thing

#

forces opp to respect your mon more than it doing like 20% chip

#

I'd sooner do life orb or blackglasses

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:51 PM

#

i feel like if i wanna sleep stuff i just swap to brute bonnet

#

life orb it is

#

i could replace zapdos-g's room service with a boosting item but i'd have to make oranguru significantly faster

#

so it can instruct zapdos-g

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:52 PM

#

oh I thought you were cutting orang

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:52 PM

#

i mean i feel like when the kingambit's attack is boosted it's better than having 2 offensive mons at the same time

#

or when it's ursaluna cause ursaluna is just insane

#

412 and 405 attack is huge

#

and also tbh it's just fun lol

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:54 PM

#

the problem comes when your opp does things like protect vs stuff, but on again not stopping ya

#

the team would likely be better with like flutter + fast gapdos last two slots

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:55 PM

#

torpid moat the problem comes when your opp does things like protect vs stuff, but on again ...

isn't that a problem generally because usually i much rather double attack something than attack both mons and risk not killing either

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:56 PM

#

you can risk doing 0 damage too hitting a protect no?

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:56 PM

#

yeah but then that only risks one opponent mon doing something instead of both

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:56 PM

#

it depends on the mons

#

oftentimes a hard tr team is built to be able to ohko many things

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:57 PM

#

torpid moat the team would likely be better with like flutter + fast gapdos last two slots

that makes leading less versatile because defiant ss would only work with wyrdeer and kingambit while rn i have the option of gapdos

#

i could just find another defiant pokemon to use

#

but the only others are thundurus and tornadus

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 6:58 PM

#

it's because the gimmick itself is inherently weak and inflexible

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 6:58 PM

#

which are both faster than gapdos so it's still more annoying

#

that is true

#

competitive exists though

#

i could run articuno-galar lol

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might be nice to have a special attacker

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 7:00 PM

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competitive is certainly the stronger version

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 7:00 PM

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3 psychic types on one team tho

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 7:00 PM

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but yeah even weaker mons

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 7:01 PM

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articuno-galar is great though

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 7:01 PM

#

it's really not

unique lantern Jun 12, 2023, 7:01 PM

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it's kinda just a psychic special zapdos-g tho

#

what makes it worse?

torpid moat Jun 12, 2023, 7:01 PM

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worse coverage, lower bp moves

#

worse typing in general

#

also slow gapdos itself isn't very good

#

I'd unironically rather have like an amulet sd hands or something

#

fast gapdos is also just okay in current format

#

very bad into tornadus and flutter and bundle

unique lantern Jun 13, 2023, 1:20 PM

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ok i have remade the team somewhat and i think it is good because ive reached the highest ive ever been on DOU with it https://pokepast.es/ac10865f6dbed17d

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 13, 2023, 1:20 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

unique lantern Jun 13, 2023, 1:20 PM

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please tell me if something is bad i want to make this team good

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skill swap defiant is staying

earnest junco Jun 13, 2023, 1:27 PM

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Yeah oranguru and wyrdeer are just

#

Not good

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Cress > oranguru and diancie > wyrdeer makes this team like

#

Almost immediately better

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I would also drop gambit for heatran probably

unique lantern Jun 13, 2023, 1:31 PM

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skill swap defiant is staying cause thats the main gimmick and is staying but i will go cress over oranguru

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i am aware its not the best strat but it's fun and the main gimmick

earnest junco Jun 13, 2023, 1:32 PM

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Also why is the flutter mane tera normal

unique lantern Jun 13, 2023, 1:32 PM

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uhh i think i misclicked the tera type lol

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i wanted to make it steel

unique lantern Jun 13, 2023, 10:16 PM

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not a specific RMT (although feel free to the team is above) but i wanted to know if this flutter mane set would work against most dragapult

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Misdreavus (Flutter Mane) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protosynthesis
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

Shadow Ball
Thunderbolt
Moonblast
Mystical Fire

#

i know booster energy timid makes it outspeed pult but im not sure if most people run jolly/timid pult, cause if the pult is not timid/jolly i outspeed without booster energy

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previously it was modest but i feel like specs might do better

torpid moat Jun 13, 2023, 11:42 PM

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pult will basically always be +spe, that's the reason to use it

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speed booster flutter can try to be greedy in the other direction, cutting speed and spa for bulk

terse kindle Jun 14, 2023, 5:03 AM

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i am on the search for a third go to team with the odst coming up
i built this after qsns tore me apart and just so happened to have samurott-h
https://pokepast.es/0e833a8482b022f1

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 14, 2023, 5:03 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

torpid moat Jun 14, 2023, 5:17 AM

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terse kindle i am on the search for a third go to team with the odst coming up i built this a...

I really doubt qsns won bc of hisui samurott. The format is way too HO for that degree of hazard stack to be worthwhile

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try using kleavor and only kleavor, plus pao, plus espeed from dnite

terse kindle Jun 14, 2023, 5:18 AM

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I’ll try it

torpid moat Jun 14, 2023, 5:18 AM

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also ghold kinda sucks rn

terse kindle Jun 14, 2023, 5:18 AM

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torpid moat I really doubt qsns won bc of hisui samurott. The format is way too HO for that ...

Definitely it was my second time using a pretty bad sun team

torpid moat Jun 14, 2023, 5:18 AM

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you can just use flutter or heatran or something

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or like lando t or rilla if it's the pivoting aspect you're interested in

terse kindle Jun 14, 2023, 5:19 AM

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I think I like heatran

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I’ll be back

urban summit Jun 14, 2023, 7:39 AM

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https://pokepast.es/479c503f9c152541
its not as gimmicky as it looks i adjusted the team synergy and rn it is actually really good

unique lantern Jun 14, 2023, 11:38 AM

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i have given up on skill swap defiant its just kinda sucky in higher ladder so yeah i dunno what to go instead of wyrdeer so i went for indeedee, i wanted a pokemon that can redirect and i figured i'd need trick room too because only cresselia to trick room probably isn't great https://pokepast.es/0e7f0aabb594c329

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 14, 2023, 11:39 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

earnest junco Jun 14, 2023, 2:47 PM

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I would do diancie > kingambit

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But this looks fine

halcyon flume Jun 18, 2023, 6:45 AM

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https://pokepast.es/f94c85a16701567f
My attempt at gen 9 sand

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 18, 2023, 6:45 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

rose notch Jun 18, 2023, 9:23 AM

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halcyon flume https://pokepast.es/f94c85a16701567f My attempt at gen 9 sand

wheres the houndstone also use tyranitar over hippopotas why body slam landorus run sandstream or ep

earnest junco Jun 18, 2023, 1:38 PM

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A team being a sand team doesnt mean the whole team has to be sand immume

torpid moat Jun 18, 2023, 1:47 PM

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yup

torpid moat Jun 18, 2023, 1:53 PM

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halcyon flume https://pokepast.es/f94c85a16701567f My attempt at gen 9 sand

sand is rather bad in current format due to how common ursaluna and rillaboom and rain are, the best you'll get is more like a "team that happens to have tyranitar on it" to beat chi yu and torn and a few others

#

only rock types receive the sand 1.5x spdef buff if you weren't aware

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ttar + diancie is like the only "combo" that's worthwhile

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houndstone isn't even worth using because adaptability basculegion is just better

peak crypt Jun 18, 2023, 3:13 PM

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rose notch wheres the houndstone also use tyranitar over hippopotas why body slam landorus ...

Houndstone is hot garbage

jovial root Jun 18, 2023, 9:22 PM

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https://pokepast.es/455425aee6249b27

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 18, 2023, 9:22 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

jovial root Jun 18, 2023, 9:22 PM

#

o

earnest junco Jun 18, 2023, 10:51 PM

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https://pokepast.es/862cc1b08f95db9f quick edit

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I forgot to change the rilla spread

#

https://pokepast.es/a7bdb62940fd731a

jovial root Jun 19, 2023, 2:08 AM

#

@earnest junco

#

i’d rather run Hyperspace/DP/tect/TR on

#

hoopa

#

other than that

#

looks cool

#

WhiscashGrin

peak crypt Jun 19, 2023, 4:13 PM

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There’s like two moves that could possibly be DP here

#

Which one do you mean

torpid moat Jun 19, 2023, 4:35 PM

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I'm assuming it's drain punch? tbh never even knew it got that

peak crypt Jun 19, 2023, 5:10 PM

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Drain Punch Hoopa sounds like it does 3 damage

torpid moat Jun 19, 2023, 10:51 PM

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yeah just use poison gunk

noble heron Jun 20, 2023, 8:57 PM

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Hello, I tried to make a team for gen 9 DOU utalizing Hisuian Avalugg, as an offensive TR attacker, does anyone have any suggestions?

rose notch Jun 20, 2023, 9:00 PM

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Tbh use diancie over spritomb as a trick room setter and use cess over wyrdeer as a trick room setter and maybe use eq luna over play rough since eq pairs well with cess and change tera to ground/normal

noble heron Jun 20, 2023, 9:02 PM

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rose notch Tbh use diancie over spritomb as a trick room setter and use cess over wyrdeer a...

well with wyrdeer I need it to use bulldoze to set up avalugg's weakness policy, and i don't think cresselia gets access to bulldoze

rose notch Jun 20, 2023, 9:06 PM

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fair but atleast remove spiritomb for one of the two trick room setters i mentioned

peak crypt Jun 20, 2023, 9:07 PM

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Why do people keep trying to use Avalugg? It doesn’t even look cool

#

I agree on Cress over Spiritomb (that Pokémon’s just bad honestly), Iron Hands wants a different item too - Life Orb Fake Out occasionally does more damage to you than the thing you want to click Fake Out on

#

With Amoonguss on the team I actually think you want Swords Dance over Play Rough on Ursaluna so you can punch through physically bulky stuff and get around Intimidate

#

I also think the Avalugg set is lousy (Sturdy but you’re Bulldozing it? No HP investment? No Ice move???)

peak crypt Jun 20, 2023, 9:49 PM

#

@noble heron I'd probably make changes as seen here: https://pokepast.es/936bc8e11f561c23

Avalugg really doesn't need any points in Defense since it's already so high, and Body Press isn't really hitting anything particularly important that your other attackers can't hit, so I swapped it to Mountain Gale with Sturdy. (Ice Fang with Strong Jaw will do a little less damage but is more accurate.) Just swapping to max SpD makes a huge difference, as you can see here:
252 SpA Choice Specs Flutter Mane Shadow Ball vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Avalugg-Hisui: 441-519 (132.8 - 156.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Flutter Mane Shadow Ball vs. 8 HP / 252 SpD Avalugg-Hisui: 279-328 (83.7 - 98.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
The 8 HP just hits an odd number for Stealth Rock.
Wyrdeer is pretty much the same with a different Tera type. The EVs have been adjusted so that Wyrdeer will always live an Ursaluna's Facade after Intimidate.
Iron Hands has been switched to Assault Vest. Heavy Slam murders Flutter Mane, which you had some issues beating before. Play Rough doesn't really hit anything that your STAB attacks don't, and the few things it would hit are covered by other Pokemon anyway.
Ursaluna should be Tera Normal, whoops! I also switched it to Swords Dance as mentioned above. The listed EVs allow you to always survive a Volcanion's Steam Eruption: 252+ SpA Volcanion Steam Eruption vs. 104 HP / 252 SpD Ursaluna: 360-426 (84.3 - 99.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after burn damage
Spiritomb has been swapped out for Cresselia. Cress is incredible at setting Trick Room and at keeping things alive within Trick Room. Spiritomb stinks. Cress's Helping Hand can be swapped to Ally Switch if you desire
I just copy pasted my own Amoonguss in the last slot, but your moves and EV spread look fine. I wouldn't use Leftovers though; consider Sitrus Berry or Covert Cloak.

#

sorry for the giant fucking wall of text, but I did want to make sure everything gets explained

#

I think if you wanted to go for a more aggressive route, you could swap out Amoonguss for Rillaboom and then switch Iron Hands to a third Trick Room setter. Hoopa-Unbound might be cool there, or you could try Slowbro or Slowking for a Fire resist

peak crypt Jun 20, 2023, 10:23 PM

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oh yeah, I'll also note here that if Avalugg isn't working out, swapping it out for Glastrier will be a massive improvement (and then you can also swap out Wyrdeer for another TR setter like Diancie)

noble heron Jun 20, 2023, 11:52 PM

#

peak crypt <@820343872445874207> I'd probably make changes as seen here: https://pokepast.e...

thank you so much! all of these suggestions seem very good, and I will implement, however my only question is why I should use covert cloak, since it seems pretty situational

peak crypt Jun 20, 2023, 11:53 PM

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Amoonguss is a really common Fake Out target, and Covert Cloak will let you use Rage Powder or Spore unbothered by flinches

#

it is situational though, Sitrus Berry is still totally fine

#

and you could even use a resist berry if you want, like Occa

#

Amoonguss has a lot of freedom in its item slot

noble heron Jun 20, 2023, 11:54 PM

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kk thanks, I think ill go with sitrus its generally more reliable

peak crypt Jun 20, 2023, 11:54 PM

#

👍

terse kindle Jun 21, 2023, 12:01 AM

#

https://pokepast.es/b6fe5c47fdfc1c07 why is this team bad pls

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 21, 2023, 12:01 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

terse kindle Jun 21, 2023, 12:01 AM

#

ty btw

torpid moat Jun 21, 2023, 12:05 AM

#

terse kindle https://pokepast.es/b6fe5c47fdfc1c07 why is this team bad pls

item choices seem all mixed up

terse kindle Jun 21, 2023, 12:05 AM

#

yeah i just slapped it together

torpid moat Jun 21, 2023, 12:05 AM

#

do sr lando + booster bundle instead

terse kindle Jun 21, 2023, 12:05 AM

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ooh

torpid moat Jun 21, 2023, 12:05 AM

#

no clue what that flutter is supposed to be doing

#

wood hammer rilla > drum

#

you're also potentially just better off with torn over bundle

#

but yeah flutter set is weird

terse kindle Jun 21, 2023, 12:07 AM

#

what if i used torn over flutter

torpid moat Jun 21, 2023, 12:07 AM

#

ig that'd be fine too

terse kindle Jun 21, 2023, 12:08 AM

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and what item should i use on the lando?

torpid moat Jun 21, 2023, 12:08 AM

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bundle and torn play a similar role though of speed control

#

well, bundle is supposed to at least with icy wind

#

lando could be sitrus ofc

#

other options maybe covert cloak

#

you can also try kleavor instead of lando

#

kleavor offense is getting pretty popular now

abstract forge Jun 22, 2023, 1:37 AM

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https://pokepast.es/ba787f0592d89131 anything better I can do? (I desire to keep garchomp and palafin.) @remote edge

#

I just slapped this team together.

peak crypt Jun 22, 2023, 2:18 AM

#

the Garchomp is for sure the worst thing on the team

#

max/max Calm Tornadus with Heat Wave is a pretty awkward set; I'd go for either a fully offensive spread or one of the bulky Modest ones floating around

#

Palafin probably wants Wave Crash more than either coverage move; I'd stick with CC (maybe swap for Choice Band too)

#

but outside of the Tornadus spread being weird, this team looks pretty fine as is; if I were you I'd spend some time laddering so you can see what you might struggle with

abstract forge Jun 22, 2023, 4:06 AM

#

peak crypt the Garchomp is for sure the worst thing on the team

https://pokepast.es/81de810d7f1108cb Better? (I'm trying to find a good ev spread for torn as I'm new to doubles and is the few times I'm using it. And I don't know what to do with garchomp.

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 22, 2023, 4:06 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

peak crypt Jun 22, 2023, 4:07 AM

#

definitely better

#

I still think Heat Wave Tornadus isn't great, just because non-STAB Heat Wave does really low damage

#

I think you'd get more value out of Protect in that slot

#

I also think Garchomp wants to be Tera Steel to improve the Flutter Mane matchup

#

but like I said, this team looks good enough to hit the ladder with and actually test out

#

no need to micro-adjust until you have some more objectives

jovial root Jun 23, 2023, 11:13 AM

#

I want these 3 to work on a team somehow

#

Mainly Harcanine and Volc

abstract forge Jun 23, 2023, 3:17 PM

#

jovial root

Unfortunately Volc and arc overlap in typing and arcs typing really holds it back. Common mons like garchomp, Lando I and T, and Ursaluna (at the moment) crush this thing into pebbles.

#

Plus waters like fin, volc itself, bundle, and finally dozens and bascu, turn is thiing into smoke.

#

Not even volc as a teammate can save it from being turned into the Rendonut.

torpid moat Jun 23, 2023, 5:24 PM

#

arc + volc isn't ideal but it's probably playable

#

do like pao arc rilla volc

#

arc being espeed tera normal

#

can probably comfortably cb

#

basically just a dnite pao team but trading dnite for an intim mon

glad flower Jun 25, 2023, 7:21 AM

#

yo so i'm doing a pixelmon server, and this is like the first team i've ever built. we're doung doubles 6v6, and i don't have much experience with comp except watching vgc. if someone could review my team that'd be great. (keep note, allowed pokemon are gen 7 and below, and above that only regional and starters are allowed. you can only mega evolve, no tera, dynamax, Z-move. you can also have one legendary/mythical from this list here: https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1117975357224665189/1118728583792300106/Untitasdasdasled_1.png?width=751&height=676)

here is first draft of team: https://pokepast.es/ae2d4f7d883b4bf9

things i'm considering rn:
exchange m-gallade for m-scizor
exchange celesteela for tapu lele
exchange whimsicott for amoongus

for this tournament, the people playing have little to no experience with competitive. so i'm assuming 2 things

lots of spread moves, which is why i'm considering wide guard on gallade on top of celesteela
decent amount of pseudo legendaries, which is reasoning behind exchanging celesteela for lele (maybe fini?)

ty for help!

#

ik this isn't really DOU, but it's what I've been using on smogon for team building reference alongside VGC

unique lantern Jun 25, 2023, 11:10 AM

#

glad flower yo so i'm doing a pixelmon server, and this is like the first team i've ever bui...

are you using gen 9 abilities?

#

also, does zoroark-h need to be modest to ohko anything it couldn't if it was timid?

torpid moat Jun 25, 2023, 2:07 PM

#

glad flower yo so i'm doing a pixelmon server, and this is like the first team i've ever bui...

melmetal and jirachi are by far the strongest on this list

#

jirachi as a follow me user with excellent support options

#

melmetal as just a really strong really tanky attacker

#

mega gallade and mega sciz both kinda suck compared to mega metagross

#

also mega kang and mega gengar

#

actually kang and gar are by far the top 2 strongest megas

#

gross and mence distant next

#

zard y and garde as other options

#

if your opponents aren't great, which they likely are since they're playing pixelmon, an easy win squad would be like

#

kang/azu/jirachi/incin/amoong/filler

#

oh jk rilla is legal

#

mgengar/incin/rillaboom/melmetal/something to kill incin/maybe a trick room setter like slowking

#

also would be quite strong

#

pick a comp you're interested in and I can mock something up

glad flower Jun 25, 2023, 4:34 PM

#

unique lantern are you using gen 9 abilities?

yea gen 9 abilities and movesets

glad flower Jun 25, 2023, 4:45 PM

#

torpid moat pick a comp you're interested in and I can mock something up

tbh, I'd like to prioritize coolness over meta to a certain extent. my friends are most definitely not going to put as much time into team building as i am. (i'm actually not participating, i'm going against winner of tournament at end)

#

but I'm helping them at least have a general idea for teambuilding, and they've been watching vids for this tournament

#

but for my team, my original idea for a team was having at least one snowball hypercarry (swords dance gallade sort of filled that role)

#

tbh tho I got no clue how to build that

#

like I was going to use decorate alcremie, but I thought it was gen 6 mon until I found out it was 8

#

but if you could whip up a comp with mega metagross and horoark (horoark is required bc I spent 3 days getting it and zorua is favorite mon)
if you have another idea for snowball comp tho I'd love to do it

torpid moat Jun 25, 2023, 5:06 PM

#

there's dd mega mence

#

there's also nasty plot tailwind moltres galar if you want a "weaker" version

#

horoark should be using nasty plot though

#

it seems really lame as a specs mon

#

also use bitter malice on it over shadow ball

#

if you want a more defensive setup wincon, there's stuff like iron defense body press

#

goodra hisui is probably the best user of this

#

also cosmic power body press metagross

#

and I guess skeledirge? dirge will prob just get killed though without support

#

azumarill on the first kang comp does belly drum

#

paired with jirachi to redirect it with follow me, it's a strong setup wincon too

#

apparently grassy glide rillaboom is legal under your rules though, which is a big azu check

unique lantern Jun 25, 2023, 8:32 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/12a27adace32e77e modified version of a team i stole from here, i struggle with torkoal / typhlosion-h eruption spam, my only real answer is diancie and iron hands fake out and that doesn't really work out too well and torkoal is slower than my entire team in trick room and typhlosion-h is faster

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 25, 2023, 8:32 PM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

peak crypt Jun 25, 2023, 8:54 PM

#

you'll have a much stronger matchup against those if you run Diamond Storm on Diancie

torpid moat Jun 25, 2023, 9:38 PM

#

try fixing your teras as well

#

you can do water or fire hands, water or ground + horsepower glast

#

water amoong (though this doesn't help vs goggs sets)

glad flower Jun 25, 2023, 9:41 PM

#

torpid moat also use bitter malice on it over shadow ball

bitter malice isn't updated in pixelmon, so it's 60 bp with double damage to status and frostbite.

#

but i'll make a m-salamence team

#

so far i'm thinking rillaboom, horoark, m-salamence, jirachi, incineroar, and last i'm unsure

#

i'll post here when finished

torpid moat Jun 25, 2023, 9:45 PM

#

try belly drum azu last

#

or sub calm mind sylveon

glad flower Jun 25, 2023, 9:48 PM

#

aight

abstract forge Jun 25, 2023, 11:37 PM

#

https://pokepast.es/5b18b012a848db08 OK, turns out garchomp is the MVP of the team and palafin justs.. sits there. I need something for the whole team to function well with because most members except palafin perform fantastically.

#

I never really use it and when I finally do it does very little.

#

Or nothing.

torpid moat Jun 26, 2023, 2:24 AM

#

abstract forge https://pokepast.es/5b18b012a848db08 OK, turns out garchomp is the MVP of the te...

cb palafin has fallen out of favor, bulk up or mystic water taunt sets are a lot more common now

#

if you want more immediate power, try basculegion instead of palafin

abstract forge Jun 26, 2023, 2:25 AM

#

torpid moat cb palafin has fallen out of favor, bulk up or mystic water taunt sets are a lot...

Maybe I should try those suggestions.

#

https://pokepast.es/8e9708f206d212c5 OK, changed palafin in investing in mostly its bulk while also its speed. I places the remaining EV's in Attack to hit hard even after a boost.

halcyon pantherBOT Jun 26, 2023, 2:40 AM

#

New DOU RMT @torpid moat, @remote edge, @strange sable, @night edge, @light ridge, @earnest junco, @brittle spade, @dire flint, @tardy ember. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

earnest junco Jun 26, 2023, 2:40 AM

#

make garchomp like av landorus therian

#

other than that this team feels solid

#

another thing is

#

i would run some bulk on flutter mane

#

Flutter Mane @ Booster Energy
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 48 Def / 16 SpA / 192 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

Dazzling Gleam
Moonblast
Shadow Ball
Protect

#

this but pixie plate

#

i actually like booster speed more

#

but pixie plate is fine

#Smogon Doubles Rates