[DO NOT USE][ARCHIVED] SV OU Rates

[weak vortex]

Indeed

[grave ginkgo]

https://pokepast.es/1a276a4ec43d2875

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[grave ginkgo]

tried pawmot

[weak vortex]

Hi pawmot isn’t really viable in ou let alone scarf on it.

Secondly, this isn’t stall about half of your team looks life you were going for a balanced team (more defensive team) though garg, alomomola and this variant of pult would be an ok start if you go that route. Other than that this feels pretty random and I would highly suggest going back to the drawing board with this one.

!gen9samples

[viral sable]

SV Sample Teams
Ubers: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3736089/
OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3712513/
UU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3720278/
RU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3733565/
NU: WIP
PU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3719989/
LC: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3712989/
1v1: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3713073/
Monotype: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3733750/
Doubles OU: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3710876/#post-9399767
Last Updated <t:1707235665:f>

[weak vortex]

Please take a look at the ou samples as well it will help you build a more comprehensive understanding of of what functions together.

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sv-ou-indigo-disk-viability-ranking-thread.3734134/ this is the viability rankings it shows what mons perform well in the sv ou metagame.

[fickle lagoon]

Where can i find good, tested OU teams? I made peace with the fact that im the worst team builder in the world since i cant win a single fucking game

[tender pecan]

!gen9ousamples

[viral sable]

Gen 9 OU Samples: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3712513/

[tender pecan]

these should help you out

[fickle lagoon]

Thank you verymuch

[tender pecan]

np

[night flax]

https://pokepast.es/036a0097db42d73f should i replace glowking with Iron crown? (or anything else that could help this team)

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[spiral fable]

why does everyone want to use volcanion all of sudden

[dusky kindle]

glowking seems to fit fine imo, im not sure gholdengo is the right fit tho

your'e really weak to garganacl

[night flax]

my team got bullied by prim and volcanian seems like a really good fit to it. i also just think the fact its in RU is a crime

[dusky kindle]

its not bad tbh tho i have to wonder what your ev spread is doing

better to just go with the standard wallbreaker set

Volcanion @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 116 HP / 252 SpA / 140 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
Tera Type: Ground
Modest Nature

• Steam Eruption
• Flamethrower
• Earth Power
• Taunt

[night flax]

my team wouldve had a bad time with ogerpon wellspring otherwise

[dusky kindle]

oh well it still handles ogerpon just fine

[night flax]

its not that ogerpon is terrible, its just when it sets up predicting a switch is when things could go wrong

if it has powerwhip

[dusky kindle]

yeah slap on tera fire then

but thats a hard prediction to make on a pokemon that doesnt often want to eat hits

[night flax]

yeah that is true. i also added the defense evs cuz of great tusk also being pretty bad to my team (if the gholdengos balloon is popped)

also speaking of gholdengo, what should i replace it with?

im thinking dragapult because my team had a lot of offense already

[dusky kindle]

pult would be fine yeah, its good on everything

you have solid special defense with tink and glowking but if you really want more survivability you could add alomomola with wish

you could also add removal with something like your own tusk, cinderace, or corviknight

or levitate weezing-galar

[night flax]

wouldnt those be bad for a hazard team? (except tusk, but replacing it with my spikes setter is a little iffy)

[dusky kindle]

nah can always get your hazards back up

[quaint canyon]

hey could i get some help building this team? i wanted to run it around kyurem tusk and g-slaking cause it looked like a fun core, but idk if the last 3 slots were good choices and im struggling a lot with tusk's moveset and especially the last slot

https://pokepast.es/271b790772065395

the dondozo used to be a gliscor, but i felt like i wasnt getting value with it. it had a spikes set

[wind gyro]

I feel like dondozo and armory don’t reallly belong on this

Maybe dozo but it used on more bulky teams

@quaint canyon

[quaint canyon]

what could i sub them for?

i feel like rn i kinda get blown up by sun teams

[wind gyro]

Slowking g should do ok

Do you want hyper offense or balanced

[quaint canyon]

i think balanced

[wind gyro]

Cause with a balanced team with bolt kinda runs through this team

Maybe landorus rocky helmet

Idk about double ground

Instead of skarmory

[quaint canyon]

that is a 3rd ice weakness

and the rest of the team is neutral

[wind gyro]

There isn’t a realistic kyurem check

Lemme look

[quaint canyon]

i mean i also see ice on opposing tusk and darkrais using ice beam

[wind gyro]

Some ok answers are av iron crown

[quaint canyon]

tachyon cutter psyshock volt switch and?

focus blast i think

or do i use psychic noise instead

[wind gyro]

Yeah psychic noise or future sight

Actually psychic noise because slowking

[quaint canyon]

252 spatk 252 speed timid nature?

[wind gyro]

Focus blast?

If you want to run av I would honestly run bulk

If it’s balanced

[quaint canyon]

why not focus blast

[wind gyro]

No focus blast is pretty good

Volt tachyon psychic noise focus blast

That way it’s a ice type check and is pretty nice with the team

[quaint canyon]

can i paste that set on its own here?

[wind gyro]

Sure

[quaint canyon]

Iron Crown @ Assault Vest
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Tachyon Cutter
• Psychic Noise
• Focus Blast
• Volt Switch

im not sure about the speed yet bc im trying to see if theres something i want to outspeed

[wind gyro]

Tera water I think

[spiral fable]

where spikes

you have hstack without spikes

[quaint canyon]

hstack?

[spiral fable]

hazard stack

actually this is eerily close to a sample team

[quaint canyon]

i had spikes on a gliscor but i got rid of it

oh

[spiral fable]

all you gotta do is swap tusk for ting lu, meow for weavile, and dozo for zamazenta

then you're just ice spam balance

o and change some sets

[quaint canyon]

ohh

[spiral fable]

https://pokepast.es/0676e886501cd993

this is the team im refereing to btw

[dapper imp]

isnt zam all out attacker set bad

[quaint canyon]

ive seen that team on the premade forum but i wasnt sure bc i didnt really know how to feel about ice spam?

[spiral fable]

it has its moments

not something you want to run on every team but its also not unviable

it has a niche and this team wants that niche

[quaint canyon]

ill give this a try though

[spiral fable]

type spam in general is fine as long as they each bring something valuable enough to the team and you have ways around their counters

[dapper imp]

what does all out attacker zam offer tho

i thought its weaker in general compared to other bulky wallbreakers

[spiral fable]

fast speed control with immediate power that can still defensive check some stuff

[dapper imp]

aye

[quaint canyon]

so stack hazards and blow up bulky mons /w kyurem/weavile?

[dapper imp]

weavile is the knocker

[quaint canyon]

oh

[dapper imp]

helps knock hdb/other items so they can be pressured by hazards

you pivot it in tho with something like gking slow u turn etc

[quaint canyon]

ok

safe switch then knock

ty all for the sample team suggestion

[tropic ice]

The thing with av crown though is that it’s kinda only a solution for offense, just cause it gets chipped down really fast, and, of course, gets cooked by ep, but there’s only so much you can do

[quaint canyon]

what's ep?

[dense glen]

earth power

[quaint canyon]

ahh

[buoyant prawn]

https://pokepast.es/ff43a70b37fde164 thoughts on this OU team and is it good for reqs?

@ruby crest i have a mon u want to ban lol

[ruby crest]

Imma bit out of the meta rn so I’m trying to familiarize myself before I rage again

[buoyant prawn]

@spiral fable hbu?

[spiral fable]

hi what

6-0 into waterpon

next

[buoyant prawn]

bruh

[spiral fable]

ok seriously though bad matchup into watepron no speed control poor physdef mons

[weak vortex]

No ground either

[buoyant prawn]

i wanna use like two encore users

but i ended up with this core

psychic/ghost/dark and steel/fairy/dragon

[weak vortex]

Can drop hatt and hammurott for gliscor and boots pult

[buoyant prawn]

i go double dragon?

[weak vortex]

Kyu can be a sub set

Ye that would be fine

[weak vortex]

Mb leave it as boots

Kyu set

Gl hope that helps tho

[buoyant prawn]

https://pokepast.es/03d8b4593baa943c

how about now

wait not sub

https://pokepast.es/d4e61698e15eef0c

there we go

[weak vortex]

Boots give kyu more lt longevity so that’s why I prefer it here since you have no removal

Ye looks fine

Gl brother

[dapper imp]

ima take your team

been intending to make a balance team that actually has offensive pressure compared to my current fat balance team

switched gliscor toxic with knock off and gking thunder wave with toxic (personal preference tho) cuz i like having a knocker in balance

[buoyant prawn]

i gave up on the team

not wasting 100 more turns fighting stall

[weak vortex]

Rip

[dapper imp]

Oh damn

What ladder pos are you?

[upbeat anchor]

https://pokepast.es/2acfd89f1b75c9c3 im not quite sure whats wrong with this team

[dapper imp]

Run breaking swipe if you’re using bulky gouging fire

But otherwise I feel like it looks fine

[pulsar tundra]

Gambit mu looks awful, it should probly be press>ww on skarm and tera fight focus>make it rain on ghol.

[upbeat anchor]

i was thinking dragon tail to force swaps for hazard damage

[dapper imp]

Ehhhh dragon tail is gimmicky on an offense oriented Mon ngl

[spiral fable]

Dragon tail works

It’s a more unorthodox set but’s it’s starting to see usage

[dapper imp]

oh

Interesting

Isn’t gouging getting suspected rn

[tender pecan]

yes it is

[deft thunder]

hello, pretty new to the more competitive side of the game and i tried to build a team of my own instead of always copying one. any pointers or criticism would be welcome
https://pokepast.es/50d00b51dd5b962f

[tender pecan]

ah, well this team doesn't seem to have much of a structure

galarian moltres is a HO mon, and not a very good one at that, banded rilla is more of a breaker rather than an HO mon unless you build around terrain, Heatran fits more balanced teams etc

[deft thunder]

oh i see

so i should stick more to one type of structure?

or rather why does a pokemon that is traditionally played in ho not functional with pokemon of other types of teams

(very noob question i know, feel free to link something that explains it rather than typing it out. i tried looking into team types a lot aswell but i didnt quite find an answer to that particular question yet)

[tender pecan]

well its mainly because certain structures want to achieve certain things/play in a certain way

a very simple example

HO or Hyper Offence is the most offensively dedicated a team can be, effectively disregarding any defensive backbone in favour of just outputting enough damage in such a short span of time that the game is won in a few turns.

the best offence is a good defence taken to its extreme

as a result it wants fast hard hitting mons that can set up and become very threatening very quickly and threaten to end games if they begin to snowball

so pokemon like heatran, who are slower, more defensively oriented, and lack any setup to achieve very high levels of damage output aren't considered options on HO

meanwhile banded rillaboom is typically not considered due to not having move flexibility and locking in can force you to switch which HO teams don't make switches often

[deft thunder]

ah so ho wants to setup one guy who then takes out everything until killed

so while rilla is an offensive pokemon it doesnt fit that

so its not for hyper offensive but rather other types of offense or balance

right?

[tender pecan]

nooot quite

on HO, every pokemon is a setup sweeper

aside from the lead slot, who is often there to set up hazards or screens and make a bit of progress before being sacked to allow something else to come in and begin wreaking havoc

there are some teams with only one or two setup win conditions but thats not HO

[deft thunder]

ah so it tries to capitalize on teams not having a sufficient answer to one of their pokemon which then can start setting up

and you need five cuz then you have more flexibility

got it

[tender pecan]

p much

[deft thunder]

so galar moltres would be best with a bunch of other setup sweepers

[spiral fable]

no

o nvm more messages lol

[tender pecan]

whilst I get wanting to build your own team, I would reccomend sample teams at first so you can get a feel for various playstyles.

you could then see how they operate, what mons they'd want, which mons compliment each other etc

[spiral fable]

you want five not because of the flexibility but because you don't want to give your opponent any chance to recover, set up hazards, or sweep with their own mons

[tender pecan]

^

its p much never give up pressure/momentum

[spiral fable]

like if i have 4 sweepers but then also a super passive defensive wall

my opponent can come in on the defensive wall, heal up their weakened walls, or set up a sweeper, then suddenly im on the back foot

[tender pecan]

and thats bad with a team like HO who has no defensive backbone or bulky progress maker to fall back to

[spiral fable]

even breakres like rillaboom struggle due to their banded nature, as you can come in on the banded move with a resist and do the same

[deft thunder]

i see

so i saw someone reccommend hatterene in ho

[spiral fable]

has its niches

[tender pecan]

I personally dislike it on HO but its usable

[spiral fable]

especially on hazard weak ho teams like screens

[tender pecan]

mainly as hazard denial

[spiral fable]

also softens your stall matchup

[deft thunder]

so you would use hatterene instead of a hazard setter or in addition to

?

[spiral fable]

in addition

a hatterene ho team would be something like
Ninetales Alola as your screens setter, then Darkrai, Roaroing Moon, Iron Moth, Hatterene, and Kingambit

actuallyprobbaly gouging over darkrai but wtv you get the point

[deft thunder]

so not every ho team needs a hazard setter

[spiral fable]

every ho teams needs a utility lead

but sometimes that utility is screens

or sun

[tender pecan]

not necessarily no

screens HO doesn't set hazards but it sets screens

[spiral fable]

or rain

[tender pecan]

the nice thing about that one is that torkoal has removal and hazard setup

[spiral fable]

yeah but lets be honest you're never getting those rocks

[tender pecan]

you miiight

on a stray switch or something

[deft thunder]

probably depends whether your sweepers need the chip damage to onehit or twohit certain other pokemon i guess?

[spiral fable]

more depedns on if you want to stack frailer sweepers that die in 1-2 hits anyways

[tender pecan]

^

[spiral fable]

or bulkier setup mons like gouging or gambit that can tank a few hits with screens

like before volc was banned screens volc was pretty nasty

[tender pecan]

screens also favours double dance mons who need more setup turns

[spiral fable]

or when bax was in the tier

[spiral fable]

^

[tender pecan]

so screens provides them that safety net to get two turns of setup rather than one

[spiral fable]

early dlc 2 saw latias double dance with stored power

[deft thunder]

double dance are moves that raise both defense and offense by 1?

or wait its just two setup moves right

like moltres with agility and nasty plot

ic ic

[spiral fable]

yes

[deft thunder]

so in the team i build the ones that dont fit are heatran and rillaboom?

is tusk an ho pokemon?

[spiral fable]

certain tusk sets yes

[deft thunder]

probably decent utility but you dont need that right

[spiral fable]

heatran and rillaboom are both grassy terrain mons

which technically are a ho style but not for this team

[deft thunder]

ok ye i read that they go well together and i had two slots open after i had moltres, hat, tusk and kingambit

so i thought put em in there

but then ill look for something else in these slots

and change my tusk setup

thanks guys

[brisk cedar]

No resists to a lot of attacks, very little breaking power, only 1 mid knocker

[tender pecan]

np

[deft thunder]

https://pokepast.es/9be3e8d784a10ac7 is this better?

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[deft thunder]

ive tried to incorporate what was said while leaving my initial idea (building a team around galar moltres) intact

[tender pecan]

this is ok, I like knock on tusk if ur using glimmora to rack up hazard damage but its fine

although gmoltres rly only works on screens

its a niche mon otherwise

[deft thunder]

i see so alolan ninetales is kind of a must..?

[tender pecan]

alo ninetales or deo speed dual screens

[deft thunder]

doesnt ninetales do what deoxys would do just in one turn less?

[tender pecan]

yes but deo S also has taunt and knock off

and is also much faster

ninetales still good mind you

it has encore

so you still have utility

and its blizzards hurt

[deft thunder]

ah so both have their place

when i looked at it i just saw 1 turn < 2 turns so ninetales > deoxys

[tender pecan]

it is personal preference

[deft thunder]

do i need to run sash on them?

or is it always clay

[tender pecan]

if its screens no light clay

its mandatory

[deft thunder]

ok so i guess if you sequence it right you cant get oneshot through a screen?

[tender pecan]

more like 5 turns is nowhere near enough to make screens worth it

so light clay is to maximise the benefit

and also yeah you won't get ohko'd through screens most likely

so why sash yk

[deft thunder]

ye i see

so i guess if i run taunt deoxys i dont really need hatterene?

cuz both are played for the same purpose right so i dont need both of them

also im somewhat new to the discord aswell so pls tell if i clutter the wrong channel with my questions

[tender pecan]

nah ur fine

hatterene can be used for extra insurance against hazards, and also behind screens hatterene can set up several times making it extremely threatening in the late game, but your speed tier is depressing at best

its up to you

[quick bluff]

https://pokepast.es/05747529910e59b0

inspired by mimilimi’s chansey fat, decided to build around chans and talon

[lost sandal]

https://pokepast.es/1c98d0ce1e1c794a
cant remember if i have sent this be4 but uhh any advice

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[fast island]

https://pokepast.es/e34e32e325e144ca

I tried using a new team

[fleet ferry]

Let me tell you, ever since I started using one of those sample teams, and modified it to my liking, I've gone up 200+, thank you very much for your help

[cloud gull]

change tusk to boots , kyurem to sub lefties , gambit to Tera ghost

[trail fossil]

https://pokepast.es/aae5f472f1a563d8

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[trail fossil]

I’m pretty happy with this team so far and wondered what improvements I could bring to it

[tender pecan]

yeah this looks like relatively standard BO, I'd maybe make gouging fire its more offensive set or maybe slot on boots just in case since whilst you have removal two of your big damage dealers are rock weak, but thats just what I'd personally do this is still valid

[trail fossil]

Thanks

[rare bison]

https://pokepast.es/4c346fc21e56f402

rate the team

[lethal garden]

https://pokepast.es/70843a3220c22216

Rate my team

[tropic ice]

#1059704283072831499

[lethal garden]

Sorry

[quick bluff]

bump

[dapper imp]

https://pokepast.es/80ff5053c359e4a1

Can anyone tell me what should go in great tusks moveslot?

Headlong rush ice spinner and rapid sun are reserved but I’m trying to decide between temper flare knock off or stone edge

Temper flare cuz it’s a sun team but I honestly don’t click on it much so I might just switch it to knock off or stone edge to have a better matchup vs moltres

I wanna use gouging fire before it gets banned

[spiral fable]

not a fan of double choice, wake is already a fine breaker and you can instead run ddance gouging which imo is more reliable anywayw

tusk should be bulk up, gives your team a very nice defensive and offensive option + speed control

[native smelt]

it wont get banned man (im on a life support supply of copium)

[spiral fable]

other than that, sure is sun

might honestly want to drop hatterene for something like slither wing if you want longer lasting pivot

[dapper imp]

What does slither wing do?

I thought it was bad in ou

[spiral fable]

first impression is neat + uturn + decent coverage + a cool av set that gives it some good bulk to pivot around

[dapper imp]

Eww defensive bug typing

How do you know so much about the meta btw

[spiral fable]

mostly just laddering/talking with other ou players/reading the forums (though you really gotta dig to look for the good stuff there)

[lost sandal]

sub lefties?

[spiral fable]

also suspect tests are a good way to catch up with current meta (though if gouging gets banned there will be a decent meta shift)

[spiral fable]

substitute leftovers

[lost sandal]

i meanyeah but theres no set

u mean subtect?

[spiral fable]

yes

[lost sandal]

would that be good for my team tho

boots tusk also

why do people run it

it takes 3% from rocks

[cloud gull]

Spikes

Tspikes

We s

Webs

[lost sandal]

again

webs dont affect it much

its tanky

just me tho

can replace it if you want

[spiral fable]

also you really dont want to be taking continous chip anyawys

like that 3% racks up fast, especally since you're likely switching into attacks as well

[dapper imp]

https://pokepast.es/508044139a05ecbc

[lost sandal]

ah

i see

[dapper imp]

Switched my team up per your recs

[spiral fable]

generally you really dont want to take chip unless you have to

[lost sandal]

but subtect kyurem? on my team?

[spiral fable]

lefties/covert cloak on tusk

• speed booster set

[dapper imp]

Booster on sun?

[lost sandal]

he means hp speed

[spiral fable]

no like the ev spread for speed booster

[lost sandal]

no atkk

[dapper imp]

Oh

[lost sandal]

@spiral fable @cloud gull would it be wise to run subtect kyurem on my team tho?

also i dont know the set

[cloud gull]

yes it would be

the set is in the suggested sets thing

[lost sandal]

isnt the hd boots 4 atk thing/ddance thing better

https://pokepast.es/304ddf1594cc93c5

changed it

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[mossy plaza]

https://pokepast.es/371c77bf71606d3e

[light agate]

Any ideas of Pokémon that I could add to play these two sets of Gouging Fire please?

Offense Gouging Fire Tera Dragon
https://pokepast.es/3253400fcc027c46

Offense Gouging Fire Tera Ground
https://pokepast.es/a272b203ea6fa953

[weak vortex]

If you are gonna build Sinistcha your approach with building it should be a bulkier one. This is an example a friend of mine made https://pokepast.es/1dfef7485c050643

[weak vortex]

We rate teams sorry we don’t build them

And make edits and such

[light agate]

I asked for this kind of thing especially to have some ideas to get both teams off to a good start.

[mossy plaza]

thx

[weak vortex]

Generally offensive sets you run on sun or hyper offense teams.

#comp-general any questions you have it will probably more appropriate for this channel.

[lost sandal]

https://pokepast.es/304ddf1594cc93c5
@spiral fable @cloud gull after trying this out, what does subtect even do for my team

[mossy plaza]

https://pokepast.es/4c0b5be14f91e159

is this good

[mossy plaza]

i also made a version of this team but with ghold over sinischa
https://pokepast.es/5354c4ab9b5ae758

[light agate]

Notice? https://pokepast.es/48ed6c7422b1e09e

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[bitter trout]

ima post stall cuz why not

[dull plume]

Haha you get it?

They’re stalling on posting the team

[dapper imp]

I posted a similar sun team above that you can use as a benchmark

[spiral fable]

^

frankly i would make the same suggestions so

[light agate]

I saw it but I probably prefer my team even if there are probably 2 or 3 small modifications to be made

[dapper imp]

Fair

I prefer h lilligant at least tho cuz it has better immediate wall breaking power and you can surprise g king with Tera blast for a ohko

[spiral fable]

both have thier merits

[spiral fable]

you sohuld still follow the same advice for tusk and gouging

and probably hatterene, but you can get away with it if you don't like slither

[light agate]

I have actually seen things like that but Venusaur is far from bad

[spiral fable]

vsnuaur is a better sweeper, hlilligant is a better cleaner

both are good

[modest osprey]

i wanted to build around kommo-o https://pokepast.es/7c44199e3ebad4e7

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[weak vortex]

It’s quite hard to make kommo function these days cause even after a boost it’s still outspeed by stuff like iron valiant, enamorus, booster tusk and some forms of priority. If you were to use it I say it would function best on webs. Although i dont know how good webs is at the moment so dont know how much mileage you’ll get out of it.

[spiral fable]

please dont use kommo-o

[weak vortex]

Highly agree with that

[spiral fable]

its just... not it

omniboost that still gets outsped at +1

[weak vortex]

You lose health using the same Omni boost which adds fuel to the fire

[modest osprey]

ive got booster speed moth and pult as the real speed control but i like the +2 kommo-o for its breaking

[spiral fable]

but like

it doesnt break 😭

you struggle into primarina, you struggle into ting lu, you completely blank into pex blissey clod

you're 50/50 with gking ig but even then you dont like future sight

you dont have a single winning matchup against spdef mons

[modest osprey]

ursa breaks most of those

[spiral fable]

but if your special attacker breaker... doesn't break spdef walls

why are you running it

and ursa has a whole LIST of issues by itself

Like let's compare it to other spattackers in the tier

Darkrai is extremely fast unboosted, packs nasty coverage to muscle through checks like Ting Lu and Primarina, and has a wide variety of sets that can flip traditional matchups through moves like wisp

Deoxys-S is more mixed than speical attacking, with moves like knock allowing it to punish walls like gking for trying to switch into Psycho Boost, as well as the fastest unboosted speed tier

Enamorus is extremely powerful with a strong typing, with a strong scarf set that offers both good revenge killing and utility through healing wish

Gholdengo has a broken ability that absorbs all status and blocks defog as well as being a spin blocker, with sets ranking from nasty plot breakers to hex twave defensive sets which fulfill a variety of roles on your team

etc etc

now you look at kommo-o

what does it offer?

a spattack breakre that cannot break any spdef walls, a typing prone to being revenged by one of the most common speed control options in the tier + a speed tier that ensures even after boosted you still get outsped

for what?

[modest osprey]

from my games so far the speed tier has been enough to outspeed enough and it hits hard enough to ohko most things

the things that it cant break ursa can break and the things it cant outspeed moth or pult can either outspeed or tank like moth into booster val

[spiral fable]

Look if you’re not willing to listen to the advice we give you I don’t know why you came here

This isn’t a channel for validation, this is a channel for advice

[modest osprey]

your advice was that my special attacker didnt break blissey

kommo-o and ursa are my breaking core

[spiral fable]

My advice was that your special attacker doesn’t break a single spdef wall

Every single spdef mon in the tier has at worst a 50/50 matchup, and at best a complete 100/0 matchup

The issue is not that it can’t break blissey, the issue is it can’t break Primarina, Ting Lu, Slowking-Galar, Toxapex, Clodsire, and Blissey

Once again, this is not a channel for validation, we will give you honest criticism of your teams and sometimes that criticism is “this is unviable you need to drop it”

[modest osprey]

drain punch breaks blissey and ting

[spiral fable]

Ok that’s great, now you have a worse matchup in Gking, Pex, and Primarina

[modest osprey]

its a good thing ive got 5 other teammates for those

[spiral fable]

You are missing the point

If your breaker losses 33% every time it tries to set up + hazard chip

It better be strong enough to crush entire teams 6-0

And Kommo-O isn’t

You are easily forced out, meaning after just two switches, two! Your kommo-o is dead weight

[modest osprey]

alo is getting it back up so it can setup more

and the things that wall kommo-o are free wishes for alo

[spiral fable]

Ok clearly you aren’t willing to listen

So I don’t know why you’re here

Want to argue Kommo-O’s viability? This isn’t the channel

You can make a long post on the forums about how this D rank mon somehow has hidden depths that no one has discovered over the past year, but until this gets proven in high level play it will remain a liability to 90% of teams

[modest osprey]

i know kommo-o isnt an s-tier mon thats gonna win spl i just wanted to get some thoughts on if the team had any major flaws

[spiral fable]

Yes

The major flaw is Kommo-O

[frozen hinge]

I get wanting to use what you like but ultimately these channels are for more seriously structured teams

You may have a better time asking for good partners in #comp-general

[dapper imp]

my personal policy is if you want to use less viable mons or goof around just use an alt or throwaway

but yea

it instadies to iron valient/enamorus

which are very common in ou

my recommendation is use kommo o in a webs team if you really REALLY wants to use it and give it close combat/earthquake as a coverage and make it a mixed attacker

and if you are making a serious team there are better mons to use to fill a valuable teamslot

[vapid bluff]

is this team viable?
https://pokepast.es/2fe450bb2b740333

[weak vortex]

I highly recommend samples the Mon choices are completely random and their individual sets are off as well.

[spiral fable]

unfortunately the tinkaton also does not fit

[dapper imp]

this team looks all over the place

[spiral fable]

in general, hyper offense wants to stack as many sweepers as it can to abuse its suicide lead

[dapper imp]

tinkaton is only good in balance in ou

[spiral fable]

tinktaon, though it tries, is not a sweeper

it gets outsped by most threats and is easily revenge killed + its mold breaker niche isn't good enough to make it

similarly, gliscor doesn't fit on hyper offense either

while specs wake only fits on sun, which this team does not

if you're new to this i would honestly recommend you check out thes amples first

laddering with them for a bit helps you get a grasp of what mons belong on what teams, and how to build common structures

you can also check out their analysis on the smogon dex website

!gen9ousamples

[viral sable]

Gen 9 OU Samples: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3712513/

[vapid bluff]

do you have any suggestion on what to replace

[spiral fable]

for both of yall, we would have to remake at least half the team, if not more

and at that point its not your team anymore

also, giving yall a new team would be basically the same as redirecting you to samples

so might as well cut out the middleman

[quick bluff]

bump again

[lost sandal]

🗣️

[sly mauve]

https://pokepast.es/2206d7520d98318c
suggestions?

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[lost sandal]

sets are wrong and im not sure what amongus does here

[sly mauve]

idk he looks cool

[lost sandal]

thats ur criteria?

[sly mauve]

idk what im doing, i need suggestions

[upbeat anchor]

https://pokepast.es/d9607480158ce345

Thoughts

[weak vortex]

Honestly not bad I would actually suggest Uturn moltres over tinkaton considering you already have rocks and it’s just not that great of a Mon. Moltres also helps into ghold and physical variants of ival which glowking despise.

[upbeat anchor]

thanks

[weak vortex]

Np

[weak vortex]

I suggest you use samples and read up on the vr

!gen9ousamples

[viral sable]

Gen 9 OU Samples: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/3712513/

[weak vortex]

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/sv-ou-indigo-disk-viability-ranking-thread.3734134/

It well help you build understanding of the ou metagame allowing with playing samples.

[sly mauve]

okay thanks

[weak vortex]

Np

[grave ginkgo]

https://pokepast.es/a4996b05e2323921

[weak vortex]

Hi this needs a ground and an electric immunity I think gliscor fills this role nicely since it looks like a bulkier team. Drop zama for it imo. And I would make iron moth alomomola. You can make garg a standard rocks tect set and turn this team into a hazard stack (I kind of see this vision and that’s what my mind is telling me)

Also give gambit boots

[grave ginkgo]

assault v alomomola or pivot alomomola?

[weak vortex]

Pivot

[plain island]

https://pokepast.es/6890436db36c8edb 👀

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[dapper imp]

not a rater but id make iron crown tera fighting

head smash does not fit in great tusk give it ice spinner and tera ground

i dont see any way to pivot weavile id personally try out zama instead cuz av crown cant wall stuff forever and this team looks pretty weak to kingambit

sinistcha only fits in bulkier/balance teams not offensive

replace with a wallbreaker for immediate power like raging bolt or ogerpon w

[plain island]

Tera dark was because I don’t have a strong dark ghost resist

And head smash was because Moltres was tough to break

[spiral fable]

you aren't supposed to break moltres with tusk

[dapper imp]

if you need to tera solely to deal with specific matchups thats probably your team

[junior harness]

You should just use gambit if you need a ghost and dark resist

[meager pawn]

https://pokepast.es/2afac24c194ad494

what are we thinking on this team

[dapper imp]

Max HP offensive bulk up tusk with leftovers to boost speed instead of attack

gouging fire is better as a sun dragon than roaring moon

give it choice band or dragon dance set

[spiral fable]

do not give it choice band

ddance

seed bomb is just worse giga drain on venusaur swap it out for earth power/sludge bomb

make wake speed booster instead of spattack boster

[dapper imp]

switch raging bolt with a pivot

[spiral fable]

im pretty iffy on bolt, would rather see seomthing like slither wing

[dapper imp]

like slither wing or hatterene

[spiral fable]

wait this venusaur is mixed what

go back to spattack

[dapper imp]

^

[dapper imp]

what happened to the choice band set

did it lose viability or something

[spiral fable]

sun has better options and its ass outside of sun

o yeah also lefties on venusaur instead of black sludge so you can actually tera into an offensive tera instead of stuck on poison

[weak vortex]

Make tusk bulk up tera steel

With lefties

Give torkoal tera flying

And yes band moon is 👎

[meager pawn]

How about a iron moth

[spiral fable]

no

[meager pawn]

Bc this is a sun style team

[spiral fable]

yes

which is why you shouldn't run moth

run vest slither wing with attack booster

[meager pawn]

What would the moveset be for it

[spiral fable]

uturn first impression eq then either flare blitz or low kick

[meager pawn]

So Evs would be speed atk and 4spD

And then adamant nature to boost atk since im assuming it will be a sweeper

[spiral fable]

no its a pivot

you're right that its adamant

but it should be a pivot with av that can come in and force other mons out, then uturn out itself

[meager pawn]

What are you thinking on the tusk idea how would this be built never used that style tusk just as a hazard clearer

[meager pawn]

And I’m running wake as a wall breaker

[spiral fable]

Wake should still be speed booster, spattack booster get outsped by too much and the damage boost isn’t really worth

[meager pawn]

So what do I switch to

[spiral fable]

…speed booster?

[meager pawn]

I’m fairly new to this as you can tell

[spiral fable]

244 spattack max speed

Timid nature, if you’re not already

[meager pawn]

And lose specs

[spiral fable]

Bulk up tusk can stick around longer and threaten more teams, as well as acting as a pseudo physical defense check

[spiral fable]

No keep specs

[meager pawn]

Thank you and how do I build the tusk sorry in advance but I really appreciate the help

[spiral fable]

Bulk up with Earthquake, Rapid Spin, Ice Spinner, leftovers/covert cloak (I prefer cloak but lefties gives you better longevity) and tera steel, 252 hp 252 speed 4 attack jolly nature

For future reference you can find most of this sets on smogon dex

Like this

https://www.smogon.com/dex/sv/pokemon/great-tusk/

[meager pawn]

Okay awesome thank you

[meager pawn]

And on the venasaur what should I do with the item after switching and how would I build this different to fit

[spiral fable]

Just run leftovers instead of black sludge

With tera fire, 252 special attack 252 speed timid nature growth giga drain sludge bomb weather ball

[meager pawn]

Alright I think I got it I’ll reupload for a once over

https://pokepast.es/b27f436739b7ec74

And the reason I’m using wake is bc gouging fire is banned in this instance

[spiral fable]

we told you to drop rmoon

also idk why gouging is banned in this instance (its still very much allowed in ou, for at least the next week)

[spiral fable]

is this for a metagame that is not OU?

[meager pawn]

Yes

[spiral fable]

then do not post teams in this channel

we do not help with arbitrary restrictions, please see rule 6

!nolegends

[viral sable]

See rule 6 of #1030567099703242903 message

[meager pawn]

Okay thank you my apologies

[tender pecan]

the final week 168 hours remain

I sure hope I haven't jinxed it and this'll age poorly if it doesn't get ousted

[vapid bluff]

https://pokepast.es/2b2376f12bb7e0ed
is this team viable? i tried to base it off of arcanine

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[rare bison]

I’ve spent a lot of time making this team as high damage output as possible for an ho team limiting myself to only 2 ou pokemon. Rate it

https://pokepast.es/7d2915f16c08e080

[dapper imp]

Roaring moon > Salamence

Booster energy more specifically

Why does kingambit have no evs?

For ribombee this is minor but you can give psychic noise/skill swap to handle other leads such as gliscor/glimmora

Idk how good greninja is in ou but there are better sweepers if you are using webs such as Ogerpon w who can also break and actually take advantage of webs

If you’re going ho you want to focus on one gimmick either webs or veil in your case

I’d personally go with offensive bulk up great tusk with boots/lefties so you can be a pseudo wall and sweeper simultaneously

[dapper imp]

Gouging my beloved

[hasty summit]

Heard that Water-Fire-Grass cores are good for balanced teams so i experimented a little. Criticism is welcome. https://pokepast.es/52f71bb525073529

Still new to teambuilding

[junior harness]

While that is true, iron moth isn’t really a balance mon

And hurricane iron moth isn’t real either

[hasty summit]

Fair. Idk what people usually use for Moth so i just slapped whatever

all moves are placeholders for potentially better moves

[hasty summit]

who to replace with? Which fire type would suit the team more?

[junior harness]

Oh and also, this team is anything but balance

No balance uses lead deo-S

[hasty summit]

okay..

[junior harness]

Balance generally has stuff like moltres and lando and stuff

[hasty summit]

what DOES a balance team use?

ah lando

doubling up on ground types is okay?

[junior harness]

Go look at sample teams

They give a really good idea on what good teams look like

[hasty summit]

i have been looking at them, and i have been trying to break it down into roles

what roles does a balanced team usually have

[junior harness]

Stuff like hazard setters

Walls

Breakers

You don’t have to have a single mon for every single role tho

[hasty summit]

of course of course

[junior harness]

Some mons can fit in more than one

Also

[hasty summit]

really, im trying to build a team around primarina.

[junior harness]

You want stuff like speed control

[hasty summit]

stuff like twave?

should i be using gholdengo?

[junior harness]

Priority or scarfers

Or booster speed mons

[hasty summit]

ohhh

like dragapult?

fast af mon

[junior harness]

That counts

And hazard removal if you are not running bootspam

[hasty summit]

i've seen that primarina can be played many ways, what role does she usually fall into?
Also, am i on the right track with water-fire-grass core?

[hasty summit]

heard great tusk was like the best at that

[junior harness]

Yeah, it fits on alotta teams

[hasty summit]

so would the team be better if i used some speed control instead of deoxys?

i really like the idea of dragapult

[junior harness]

Well, I am not a rater, but I am just giving out everything that I know for sure are facts

[spiral fable]

ehhhhhhhh

not really

[junior harness]

So uh

[spiral fable]

water fire grass cores kinda fall apart when we dont have a lot of good fire types

[junior harness]

Yeah this person over here knows more ask this person^

[spiral fable]

and the ones we do have are mostly offensive that dont share a lot of archetypes with the water or grass types

[hasty summit]

that makes sense

[spiral fable]

except heatran but its hot ass so

[hasty summit]

so how would i approach a balanced team with primarina?

[spiral fable]

depends on if your running boots or vest

[hasty summit]

i feel like it'll be a good setup sweeper so i run boots

with calm mind

[spiral fable]

hm

[junior harness]

We have gouging and moltres

Gouging might be gone soon but enjoy it while it lasts

[spiral fable]

ok well teambuilding in general should be in comp gen

but if you want quick tips on what to pair with calm mind primarina there's a list of teammates and checks on ites smogon dex page

[hasty summit]

oh awesome! Thanks for the resource

[reef bay]

https://pokepast.es/cbb9a29928cf1915
This is a bulky hazzard stack team with meow and valiant to use knock off, slow u turn gliscor and hex percharunt. This team has performed quite well on ladder but what do you guys think on this?

[normal sable]

https://pokepast.es/ddc17ded33366ced I love this team someone here helped me build a part of it is there any of it that can be more fine tuned or is this just a nice well rounded team

Been doing a good bit of the ladder on showdown and haven't seen any major problems but I would love to see if there is problems I didn't see

[dapper imp]

heatran is ass?

bruh was about to run it on my new offense hazard stack team

[spiral fable]

no i said that for fun

[junior harness]

It’s usable but it’s nowhere near as good as before

[dapper imp]

oh lmao

[spiral fable]

yes heatran is hot ass

[junior harness]

You know, 8 ground types

Holy shit, heatran probably

And competition with other fire types I guess

It’s dropping the ball and might just drop to UU again

[dapper imp]

oh

[lost sandal]

@spiral fable https://pokepast.es/c5833d526265c027 tried going screens with kyu and gouging, lmk your thoughts

[spiral fable]

you dont need to ping me

[lost sandal]

oh okay, you suggested it so i thought i should

[spiral fable]

anyways weakness policy iron crown is way too fishy not sure why you're runnning double boots but dont, run loaded dice physical ddance kyurem and tera dragon gouging, with bulk up tusk over iron crown to act as spinner and sweeper for this team

swap val to special

[lost sandal]

that makes my team autolose to enam or ival does it not

i have no fairy res

ill have to waste tera

or hope i live through veil

which i should unless they boost

[spiral fable]

swap out val for moth

[lost sandal]

okay

[spiral fable]

frankly i would drop gouging on this team for something else but you wanted to use it so ig we're sticking with him

[lost sandal]

yeah haha

people always say how annoying both kyu and gouging are

so i wanted to try them together XD

[lost sandal]

gouging boots or proto

[spiral fable]

proto

[lost sandal]

probably proto rights

kind of a hit or miss pokemon

also

should i run cc tusk or headlong

https://pokepast.es/5802cb4c20dea952
i guess this should work, i changed tb ground on moth to energy ball to deal with annoying water types

sam dozo alo mainly

[dapper imp]

My H Samurott + Sinistcha core hazard stack

[twin horizon]

https://pokepast.es/64f555a80fcade93 Hi all! Hit the mid 1500s-low 1600s with this team, would love to hear some insight for optimization

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[dapper imp]

https://pokepast.es/5e7992cd4aeebd6c

[ebon ember]

What to change in it https://pokepast.es/2de45f4b78441af0

[viral sable]

New [Gen 9] OU RMT @ruby crest, @green citrus, @dusky kindle, @wise knot, @weak vortex. I won't notify you again for at least 6 hours.

[tropic ice]

Looked at the wrong team, mb

Double specs is ambitious though, and can be exploited pretty easily

Yeah

your valiant probably shouldn't be choiced

for the same reason that two specs is sketchy

except you're HO, which is more sensitive to losing momentum

You can probably just be booster tusk

[ebon ember]

Can you tell me what to change?

Just valliant

[tropic ice]

Not sure, HO is pretty simple to build, just like slap on a suicide lead + 5 setup sweepers that take advantage of your lead, and make sure that there's no wall you can't muscle through

I'm not a rater though, so best take my advice with a grain of salt

[ebon ember]

Depends but usually no

[tropic ice]

It's not valiant specifically for this, it's really just any choiced mon, as if they bring in a resist, you're SOL, and have to switch out, which puts you on the back foot, esp if they double switch, and then you have no defensive speedbump or anything because you're HO

[ebon ember]

You need a team or 2-3:to support it I realised that it's just a risk, if it's the last Mon you are cooked because of tera

[tender pecan]

mmmmmmmmmm there's a lot of things here I don't fw with

@tropic ice you wanna keep going or should I chip in with my two cents

[tropic ice]

generally I won't say always, because I think I've heard of it working (scarf chi-yu speciffically, iirc)

[tropic ice]

Your two cents would be pretty good; my advice for this one would just be booster valiant & tusk

[tender pecan]

yeah glimm is good

[tropic ice]

yeah, it's pretty standard HO lead

[ebon ember]

It and riombee are probably the most common

[tropic ice]

Also Deo-S

[tender pecan]

nah ribombee fell off

its still good but more niche

[tropic ice]

and a-tales

[tender pecan]

yeah I can see that

but

generally specs val isn't on HO as a sweeper

and if ur gonna run it which I already wouldn't reccomend Trick over one of your moves is recommended

since trick gives you some counterplay into stall

it could very well do the opposite

[tropic ice]

Problem is, more often than not, you end up killing your own momentum, which on HO is death

[tender pecan]

as you could be forced out if you lock into the wrong move

I'd make it booster speed tbh

[tropic ice]

Booster SD is probably the way, though cm is a decent shout

[tender pecan]

there's a couple other things I'm not a huge fan of I think we already mentioned tusk

make that booster speed offensive bulk up

its a surprisingly amazing sweeper and provides rapid spin support in a pinch

its viable-ish

I wouldn't reccomend it tho

its on the vr so its not completely unviable

but ur lowkey better off using someone else

[lost sandal]

ceruledge is so mid

[tender pecan]

I also have a personal gripe with serperior

[lost sandal]

give it vacuum wave to make it viable

[tender pecan]

like I don't think its good

[lost sandal]

frfr

[tender pecan]

serp is perfectly usable however I would run substitute over synthesis

[lost sandal]

send team please

[tropic ice]

Not a rater; grain of salt
I've tried double specs before, and it's a cool concept but it's just way too easy for opponents to exploit, and then put you in a bad spot. I also don't really like booster tusk, I think it should probably just be offensive utility, with boots and knock, since I feel like it kind of does the same thing as weavile here, sweeping up broken teams, though I think that leans more personal preference

[ebon ember]

I changed it

[tender pecan]

^

yeah you do that

[ebon ember]

Its now cm booster

[lost sandal]

ok

[tender pecan]

you can use serp btw but serp has a lot of things that kinda stop it dead in its tracks

[lost sandal]

id run sub and tera bllast for dragon pulse and synthesis tbh but dragon pulse considering how many dragons there are is okay ig

[tender pecan]

which you'll need to play around carefully if you wanna get any use out of it

obviously unaware mons are your biggest issue but so are things like darkrai who outspeed as do many booster mons etc

knock off usually

its like

sd close combat knock off encore

[lost sandal]

only good unaware mons are clefable and dozo which get dealt with pretty well on this team tho

[tender pecan]

this does leave you kinda hopeless into opposing booster val unfortunately

[lost sandal]

i run spirit break personally

[tender pecan]

spirit break is an option but the bp hurts

encore helps you gain setup opps

for instance

[lost sandal]

helps vs stuff like val tho icl

[tender pecan]

say a raging bolt uses thunder clap

oop but you lock it into that with encore

now you just get to set up for free

I've used spirit break before

[lost sandal]

its 50/50 tbh

ive had the same thing done to me

[tropic ice]

I figured out what's bothering me about you team though: you have no hazards

[tender pecan]

the coverage is nicer but you really feel the 75 bp

[ebon ember]

Stealth rock great tusk?

[tender pecan]

mhm yeah I shouldn't keep you here lmfao

[lost sandal]

honestly

i looked at the original team

[tender pecan]

spirit break means you get walled by less but you have to find that setup turn more easily

[lost sandal]

its not at all bad

[lost sandal]

that comes easily tho

when people see ival

[tender pecan]

as IV? not super easily

[lost sandal]

they assume its special

they swap in glowking

and stuff

or chansey

or blissey

[tender pecan]

idk where your playing IV dawg

but if I see it

and its gonna set up

I just attack

it dies in like two hits

[lost sandal]

generally

[tropic ice]

not on an HO structure

[lost sandal]

you want to swap it against a tusk

or smth

[lost sandal]

^

they assume ur special and either swap to their special wall or burn tera

which is a W/W in my brain

well anyways nocturne

are you here

[tropic ice]

No I mean, I feel like SD val is very common on HO

More than cm

[tender pecan]

why on earth are you switching Iron Val in on tusk

bro gets annihilated by headlong rush

[lost sandal]

switching in as in sac

and then switch in

not directly ofc 💀

[tender pecan]

I mean yeah sure but then the setup turn is more of a 50/50

[lost sandal]

isnt that the casee with encore as well

if u predict them to use priority move but they use tbolt

its 50/50

[tender pecan]

correct but the play is much riskier for them then a great tusk

getting the call wrong loses you raging bolt getting a call wrong with tusk won't kill it

[tropic ice]

https://pokepast.es/56b6f48bb77aaf46

[tender pecan]

especially if ur physical val

cause tusk is not dying to spirit break

[lost sandal]

they dont know that tho

hehe

thats the thing about sd ival

[tender pecan]

yeah but again on HO sd is more expected because it has the higher damage outputs

if anything calm mind is kinda the oddball

since its damage output is lower

and also sacrifices knock off

this isn't the channel for this btw

[lost sandal]

https://pokepast.es/b36668c8f63c9e06
also how do you think this is

how do u deal with zenta

[lost sandal]

@tender pecan

[gentle venture]

val generally clicks knock off against opposing glowking after tera ghost and 1 calm mind boost glowking cant do anything against it and gets KOed if it even gets a little bit chipped down since shadow ball at that point does between 82 and 97

[gentle venture]

what is your game plan against stall

[lost sandal]

i have this really cool strategy

[gentle venture]

🐐

[lost sandal]

i hate stall, i hate versing stall, i hate stall users

[gentle venture]

at least run psyshock on darkrai

and change kyurem into the mixed set

[lost sandal]

for what?

ice beam?

[lost sandal]

i just love this set icl

[gentle venture]

yeah

[lost sandal]

ok

[tropic ice]

Zama looks rough; bolt can manage it, but serp needs boosts to muscle through it

Also, it's kinda gg if it gets an iron def in

[topaz narwhal]

why do u hate stall users

[tender pecan]

cause think about it

stall

remove the s you have tall

tall people agenda

(I'm 5'11)

[lost sandal]

lets think about this

uhh

how about

wasting precious time

using stall when theres better alternatives

being a nolifer

not letting me push

not letting me setup

tilting me

thats about it i guess, but this should not be talked about in this channel

[topaz narwhal]

how is it wasting

by what metric

should they just use mono explosion teams?

should they all just use ho?

[lost sandal]

theres like

100 move games

with stall

[topaz narwhal]

so

[lost sandal]

🙏 yes

[topaz narwhal]

theres 100 move games with balance

so you dont like them for

reason 1

[lost sandal]

wasting time

reason 2

[topaz narwhal]

because they…. dont play the game like you play it?

[lost sandal]

because uhh its just annoying to face?

[dull plume]

Yeah stall isn’t the enemy

[lost sandal]

its the stall users 😔

you are correct skittyrox

[dull plume]

Well I was a stall user for about a year

So no

[lost sandal]

thank god you left 😔 i pray for your mental health

[dull plume]

I used stall in a tour game about 2 weeks ago lmao

[lost sandal]

are the symptoms over 😔

[topaz narwhal]

nah not wasting time

[lost sandal]

no skill

[topaz narwhal]

“wasting time” is just a completely arbitrary statement

how is it no skill

elaborate

[lost sandal]

how is stall skill

[topaz narwhal]

since you can apply that to everything

[lost sandal]

you have answers for everything

physical move?

[topaz narwhal]

you are the one making the assertion

[lost sandal]

time to go corv

special

[topaz narwhal]

explain

[lost sandal]

blissey time

[topaz narwhal]

do you

if so

tell me why stall doesnt have

extremely high use rates in tours

or win rates

or why the stall mons arent ranked very highly

in any tier or any gen

do explain

[lost sandal]

cuz people like to be normal 🙏

[topaz narwhal]

so your saying the vr isnt based on whats good or jot

not

and its just on whatever is “normal” according to you

have you ever reversed your logic

some people dont like games ending in 10 turns

[lost sandal]

because

?

[topaz narwhal]

better?

i thought you just said

stall takes no skill

[storm karma]

ended up making stall cuz I liked them

[topaz narwhal]

and it has answers for everything

what changed

[topaz narwhal]

so

because stall encourages you to actually think when you play

its bad?

[lost sandal]

doesnt

[topaz narwhal]

yes

you said it doesnt take skill

if it doesnt take skill

[lost sandal]

better as in less no life approaches that are fun for opponent to play against and for u to play too

[topaz narwhal]

why dont you take stall and hit 2k on ladder if its so easy

[topaz narwhal]

fun is wholly subjective lol

i dont like playing against ho

i dont like playing against teams with fs glowking + breaker

i also dont like playing against stall

thats just preference, and everyone has preferences

[lost sandal]

what do you like playing against

[topaz narwhal]

does that mean i hate people who play that??

i like playing against literally anything that isnt that

[lost sandal]

admittidly a mistake on my part for saying that

people can change after all

[topaz narwhal]

ok

you still havent elaborated on why stall takes no skill

[lost sandal]

i literally did

[topaz narwhal]

and your response to why everyone doesnt load that

[lost sandal]

it has answers for everything

[topaz narwhal]

is because they want to be “normal”

[topaz narwhal]

then why dont people always load it and win

[lost sandal]

didnt u just answer that urself

[topaz narwhal]

point is

it still gets loaded

just not often

[lost sandal]

^

[topaz narwhal]

well if a person uses stall once

why dont they keep using it

if they prefer ot

are you saying theres no one that prefers using stall

because there is a whole discord dedicated to that

and if it can cover “everything”

why are there variations to it

and surely in top level tours

[lost sandal]

to be different

[topaz narwhal]

surely people will put aside their preferences to play what will always win since it takes no skill, correct?

[topaz narwhal]

ah

[lost sandal]

atleast i dont

[topaz narwhal]

and you are 100% sure about this

you have compared different versions of stalls

and concluded that the only reason they vary

is to seem different?

do you see how many holes there are in your logic when you come from an uneducated place?

[lost sandal]

probably

why would u keep changing teams when there are sample teams

why doesnt everyone use the same thing

this started out from me saying i hate stall and thats just a preference

but most of the people i have seen play pokemon agree with my preference

[topaz narwhal]

because every team has flaws

and issues

that can be circumvented in different ways

not because they just want to be different lol

sample teams are just teams that are easy to use and solid overall

[topaz narwhal]

No

its because you said you hate people who play stall

and stated 20 nonsense reasons why

[lost sandal]

^

[lost sandal]

i do not believe them to be nonsense

[topaz narwhal]

it was nonsense

[candid fog]

Ok so there's one key detail you're missing here

95%, or more, of players in actual tourneys and high quality games sweat Showdown for real

There, your entire logic is down

[gentle venture]

if you are talking about casual muh favorite crowd sure but from what ı seen most of the ladder players dont have strong opinions about stall at all

also stall being time-consuming argument is kinda fake since either you have tools to break stall or you don't some people keep playing even after they lose their wincon instead of forfeiting

[umbral adder]

https://pokepast.es/03b7b2ecde33fab6 ik this similar to the sub tera ground moon team but i wanted to try outrage gfire with gterrain

[dull plume]

If you load a ladder game and don’t have time to play stall that’s on you, not the player you’re loading against

[tender pecan]

what loses first my adhd or my HO core

[dull plume]

Both

[fierce basin]

Pls stop using sv OU rates as a chatroom

[dull plume]

This is compgen3

🔫

[dapper imp]

anyone see my team yet?

https://pokepast.es/809758d05ce3af2c

i wanna see if there are any optimizations i can make for it

[gentle venture]

switch tusk with rocks knock off gliscor turn the team into bootspam

otherwise this team blanks into opposing bootspam teams

and hamuroot is too frail to make progress with knock off on its own

[gentle venture]

or clefairy or smthn

[dapper imp]

Damn, really wanted to try out h Samurott in a team :/