#world-optimization | VRChat | Page 6

viral marsh Jul 19, 2018, 11:03 PM

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yes

fair agate Jul 19, 2018, 11:10 PM

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@median stag that’s exactly what I did in my first world

median stag Jul 20, 2018, 12:46 AM

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I remember you mentioning that you finally needed to learn proper lighting quite a while ago @fair agate
My question is mainly one of performance though, as i care more about removing lag than appearance

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The thought being, if rigidbodies and things like that are ignored by the light source, they won't need to be rendered under it?

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But i don't know how impactful ambient stuff can be.

fair agate Jul 20, 2018, 1:15 AM

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Not sure what you mean about rigidbodies—you have to remember that in Unity, visual appearance and physics are completely unrelated, rigidbody is just an abstract concept applied to a mesh that gives it a “mass” point. Nothing to do with lighting. But performance suffers with anything that needs to be calculated in real-time, so an unlit world and a baked world are about the same except maybe for load time.

median stag Jul 20, 2018, 6:02 AM

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I'm at my limit for how to get this map to function better... Structures are in occlusion and too close for LOD to help, gone through the other standard steps....
If i wasn't limited by complexity in my triggers, i feel i could lessen the burden by inactivating objects that aren't used.

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I want Udon

strange prism Jul 20, 2018, 6:03 AM

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Don't we all

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🍜

west crag Jul 20, 2018, 6:24 AM

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why is there an emoji for ramen but not for udon or soba

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it's not like it's better than the other two

strange prism Jul 20, 2018, 6:24 AM

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I don't have Nitro to make my own Udon emoji

west crag Jul 20, 2018, 6:25 AM

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this is a wider problem than just discord, I feel like noodle discrimination is going on inside Unicode itself

wanton hemlock Jul 21, 2018, 7:43 AM

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what's a VR-safe water effect?

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I used Unity's night water but a VR user reported that it looks really painful to him

lilac saddle Jul 21, 2018, 9:27 AM

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@wanton hemlock https://github.com/synlogic/Syns-Unity-Shaders

GitHub

synlogic/Syns-Unity-Shaders

Syns-Unity-Shaders - A set of shaders mainly created using ShaderForge for use in Unity.

wanton hemlock Jul 21, 2018, 9:40 AM

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thanks

inland vault Jul 21, 2018, 2:01 PM

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I have a free water shader I made

sweet sinew Jul 21, 2018, 5:30 PM

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Releasing a alpha version of my Trigger Logger https://i.imgur.com/EtzuqXQ.png
So I can get some more feedback and see how people have their trigger layout.
https://github.com/PhaxeNor/Trigger-Logger/releases

Imgur

GitHub

PhaxeNor/Trigger-Logger

Trigger-Logger - Unity Editor script for VRChat world development

strange prism Jul 21, 2018, 5:46 PM

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Yay a new release.

dense oracle Jul 21, 2018, 6:48 PM

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Will this screw my world? 😄

sweet sinew Jul 21, 2018, 6:58 PM

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Not unless you make changes yourself 😛

strange prism Jul 21, 2018, 7:02 PM

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Not sure how I feel about the warning on custom triggers being local only.

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Once you get the chaining check, that can probably be updated.

sweet sinew Jul 21, 2018, 7:05 PM

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Yea

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But it’s a alpha dev version so not really meant to be used properly yet

obsidian bobcat Jul 21, 2018, 9:34 PM

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Heyo, i'll keep my question short, since I thought it appropriate for this particular channel: Is there any way I can make my video player optimized?

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I have a video player on my world with the video player component disabled by default. When people press on a particular button of a remote, it enables the video player component of a certain video, and also a timer. Then when the timer ends (the timer is the same length as the video) it disables the video player component of said video.

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The primary problem is primarily Desync, but also a long load time into the world at the start. I think thats because I use clips instead of youtube links though..

wanton hemlock Jul 22, 2018, 2:15 PM

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how can I tell whether my textures or lighting is slowing down my room more?

lean lodge Jul 22, 2018, 2:22 PM

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Unity profiler

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You mean draw calls vs. lighting in general?

wanton hemlock Jul 22, 2018, 2:25 PM

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what am I looking for?

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VR users reported low framerates, but I don't know what might cause them

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I have some 2k textures, so that might be it

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I thought the lighting would be fine since it only has 2 realtime and 2 mixed lights, but I might be wrong

lean lodge Jul 22, 2018, 2:30 PM

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High-res textures do not cause lag

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Realtime lights definitely will, however

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Can't you bake all of those lights? Maybe put a single realtime directional light on a local toggle

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@wanton hemlock if both realtime lights are directional and both have shadows, that will definitely cause lag

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I just set all of my lights to baked. If I feel it's necessary, I add a very small directional light with hard shadows that only affect Player, PlayerLocal and MirrorReflection

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Since that can make stuff look nicer

wanton hemlock Jul 22, 2018, 2:32 PM

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alright, I'll have to fake the directional light then

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it's very minor, most of it is used to light the outside, which is static

lean lodge Jul 22, 2018, 2:34 PM

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What's the issue with baked lights though?

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I don't think you need realtime unless you actually need the depth texture that it brings

wanton hemlock Jul 22, 2018, 2:34 PM

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well my one directional light is mixed so that might be it

lean lodge Jul 22, 2018, 2:34 PM

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Mixed lights will still apply realtime lighting to non-static objects

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Try light probe groups instead

wanton hemlock Jul 22, 2018, 2:35 PM

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lemme show you my setup

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https://i.imgur.com/hepPUHM.jpg

Imgur

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all of these are baked lights, except for one each for the left and middle chandelier, which are realtime

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the one in the fireplace is mixed, and there's a directional light that is also mixed

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I was worried making every light on the chandelier mixed would be expensive, so I placed a single realtime light in the middle which doesn't light the environment, just the player and pickups

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there's only two things that bother me about the setup right now

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1, I only need dynamic shadows for the directional light when it shines through the windows

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2, the realtime lighting self-shadows the player model, even though casting a shadow onto the environment and tinting the player a darker/brighter color would be enough for me

winged sinew Jul 23, 2018, 4:34 AM

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You could look into projectors

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 5:50 AM

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Although it still needs improvement, my world has been accepted and made public. Thanks for the help, everyone.

lean lodge Jul 23, 2018, 2:08 PM

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Cool, congrats

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That means your world should perform pretty OK at least

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 2:26 PM

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I didn't get a performance warning on the spreadsheet

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but I did talk to a guy with a laptop without a headset who said his framerate crawled down to 11 fps

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is it possible to disable self-shadowing on an object?

lean lodge Jul 23, 2018, 2:32 PM

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You can disable casting and receiving shadows on the mesh renderer

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You can also set up the layers and culling masks on your lights so that the lights ignore certain objects for shadowing purposes

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 2:36 PM

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I would like my object to cast shadows onto other shadows

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it just doesn't need to shadow itself

lean lodge Jul 23, 2018, 2:37 PM

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Turn off "receive shadows" on the mesh renderer, that should work

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 2:37 PM

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how big is the impact from mixed point lihgts?

lean lodge Jul 23, 2018, 2:37 PM

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Same as any other realtime light. Probably not as heavy as directional, but it depends.

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It also depends on which layers it's casting shadows

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And whether those shadows are hard or soft, and how high quality they are

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 2:41 PM

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is there a way I can have it not cast shadows on the player, but cast the player's shadow on the scenery?

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 3:44 PM

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If you have the realtime lights not cast shadows you can use lightprobes to illuminate the area, but still light up the characters based on lications, it makes the area really good performance wise, i have not tested this but been thinking about it a lot to add to my map sometime.

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i think casting the shadows is the most processing hugging, and there is a lot of spaces you can do this trick that i can tell.

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but the less Realtime lights the more performance the map will run, the less amount of Baked maps also creates less draw calls for players.

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so keep the baked map Resolution/Image Size high

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 4:12 PM

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I'm experimenting with different mixed light setups

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there's 2 big problems for now

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one is that map has a massive island in the background that dramatically slows down the baking process, even with the lightmap scale set to 0

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the other one is that I need a mixed directional light for 4 spots in my room, where the moonlight shines into the building

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but I don't know how to properly fake it with point lights

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 4:18 PM

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oh, turn of shadows emitted from the Island also.

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if you cannot go to it

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you can use area light i think

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 4:20 PM

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to fake the directional light?

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 4:20 PM

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ye i think so ye

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never used it since my map is open

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but for indoor i would try

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 4:21 PM

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is it about as cheap as point lights?

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 4:21 PM

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it bakes inn

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just use lightprobes to get the area light to do its thing

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 4:22 PM

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area lights are baked only

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 4:23 PM

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i will need to add Lightprobes soon, after i get my Random sound playoff correct, and then make an Sign with some pointers, Portal and bake everything correct, and release.

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as i said

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Baked

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why you need realtime though?

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you can use spotlight with no shadows on it to create a low performance light i think

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or you can just create an shader that kind of translucent that is creating the moon beam, if you are looking for that kind of effect.

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just using an Mesh and a shader, then everything else is baked inn

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 4:26 PM

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I want players to be able to block the moonlight, I'm not interested in volumetric lighting for now

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 4:28 PM

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very "heavy" performance light then, since you need shadows to create that effect, just don't make the light as large scale or movable and it should be quite alright

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 4:29 PM

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I just want to know how I should tweak my spotlight settings so it looks like directional light

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 4:30 PM

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Dimmed i think, not used Spotlights either, don't have direct sources, only point lights since i have some lightposts 😄

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 4:41 PM

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@wanton hemlock If the island doesn't affect the lighting of the main part of the world you can make it not lightmap static.

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 5:35 PM

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but doesn't that slow down the realtime render?

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 5:35 PM

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Setting scale in lightmap to 0 already excludes them from having lightmaps.

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So they'll be lit real-time

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 5:36 PM

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when I did that it didn't get any lighting

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 5:57 PM

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Do you have light probes?

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 6:15 PM

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@wanton hemlock Also if the island is far enough away you can use a trick to bake it into a skybox

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 6:15 PM

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Uuuu, interesting.

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how you do that?

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 6:17 PM

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You make a copy of your scene and delete all of the foreground meshes. Put a reflection probe in the center set the resolution to 2K or 4K and bake it. Then use the reflection probe's texture in a cube map skybox.

lean lodge Jul 23, 2018, 6:18 PM

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Oh yeah, that's a good one lmao

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 6:18 PM

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oh, you can use the Reflection probe image, thats neat

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 6:18 PM

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I think Cubed told me that one.

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 6:18 PM

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ye, thats a neat trick

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 6:19 PM

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Reflection probes are basically cubemap cameras with some filtering built-in to blur out aliasing.

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 6:20 PM

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Thats cool, you can just construct your own scene and then bake it into a cube map for skybox :p

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 6:20 PM

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You can use an editor script to capture cubemaps but reflection probes are easy.

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 6:20 PM

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right.

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 6:21 PM

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Yeah as long as it's far away and your skybox isn't crazy detailed it'll work pretty well

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You could alternatively use cameras to bake 2D cutouts of the islands and put them on quads.

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There are assets for generating "impostors" if you'd rather an automated approach.

dense oracle Jul 23, 2018, 6:22 PM

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just starting out exploring some UI elements for the Map, since buttons is kinda Meh, i have many settings so want it in a neat tidy space, was asking in Worlds but no answer, was asking for if there is anything is should check out for when adding the VRC triggers to the mix, or is it straight forward adding the VRC trigger to the UI Buttons and such?

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ah thats nice, you could maybe even make it LOD into an island after you get close enough

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 6:25 PM

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Yeah, with LOD groups.

wanton hemlock Jul 23, 2018, 6:34 PM

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the island is right next to the walkable area but I'll have to remember that

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https://i.imgur.com/6eHhB1z.png

Imgur

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here's an overhead shot of the world, the orange spot is the walkable room

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since the island is a sculpted mesh with overhangs I can't use the terrain optimization

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 11:07 PM

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@wanton hemlock Is it one giant mesh?

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Also do you have proper non-overlapping UVs or auto-generated lightmap UVs?

buoyant forge Jul 23, 2018, 11:10 PM

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is having an extra uv for light map something that helpsperformance ?

scenic swallow Jul 23, 2018, 11:11 PM

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Unity uses the second UV set for lightmaps

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It's not optional, but Unity will generate them for you if you enable it in the mesh import settings, but it takes a long time for large meshes so you're better off doing it manually.

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If you don't have a second UV set I think it might copy the first UV set but I'm not sure.

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The lightmap UVs have to be non-overlapping to avoid artifacts.

buoyant forge Jul 23, 2018, 11:15 PM

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ah got it. i love the wealth of information you get here thanks

viral marsh Jul 23, 2018, 11:18 PM

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Unity does not copy the first UV map to the second for light maps. If a second one does not exist, and you don't generate them on import, then you have no UVs to use to lightmap.

winged sinew Jul 23, 2018, 11:34 PM

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If Unity doesn't find a second set of UVs it'll repeat the first

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Are UI canvases okay for performance? They seem to add a few draw calls

lean lodge Jul 24, 2018, 12:36 AM

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To be honest I have no idea how making lightmap UV's works. So you just make a second UV Map?

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 12:44 AM

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@lean lodge Yes, you just make another UV map in the mesh data in Blender

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Unwrap the UVs so none of them overlap

lean lodge Jul 24, 2018, 12:45 AM

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Wot

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 12:45 AM

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And preserve their sizes relative to each other.

lean lodge Jul 24, 2018, 12:45 AM

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Ah, alright

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That is interesting, but also seems like something Unity should be able to generate by itself

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And it usually does in my experience

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 12:45 AM

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It can, but you can get a better result if you do it by hand.

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You can end up with visible seams in the lighting if the UVs are too chopped up.

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Which automatic unwrapping often does.

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There's some feature to smooth them out but not until 2017.2 or 2017.3, I'm not sure which.

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And only with the progressive lightmapper which is still in preview until 2018.1

wanton hemlock Jul 24, 2018, 6:18 AM

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@tcl yes, yes and yes

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I suppose I shouldn't have Unity generate the mesh

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I'd like to separate the island mesh based on distance, especially since I'd like to texture the closest part but I don't know how to do it seamlessly

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 5:50 PM

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Hi guys, anyone knows why lightmap takes quarter of resolution when I bake it?

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Doesn't seem to affect the quality but still curious

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 7:34 PM

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@mental monolith Do you mean why it's for example 512x512 instead of 2048x2048?

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 7:35 PM

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I mean it's for example 2048x2048 but the actual lightmap bake is in the bottom left corner, taking quarter of the whole area

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so the rest is black

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 7:35 PM

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Ah, that's because you only have slightly more than 1024x1024 texels worth of lightmaps.

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 7:36 PM

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Alright, so it's not really worth generating it at 2048

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 7:36 PM

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No, it is

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The lightmap resolution setting determines the amount of texels per meter (basically quality) so you can decrease that slightly to try and fit it in a 1K atlas or increase it to take advantage of the extra space.

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You want to try to keep everything in one atlas because multiple atlases will split static batches.

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 7:38 PM

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Oh, I see

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Well it is small and it won't be any larger

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So I guess I can fiddle with it

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One more thing: is it normal that I have to bake with progressive lightmapper and with indirect lighting mode? Otherwise whatever I see in the preview in Unity is different than what's actually being baked

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(Lightmap is super bright but Unity shows no baking basically)

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 7:39 PM

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Also if you have compression enabled (which you probably should because lightmaps are fairly large) then the black area will compress a lot.

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Which shader are you using?

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 7:40 PM

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I turned off compression (trial and error I noticed it's 'glitching' some of the textures)

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Cubed

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 7:40 PM

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Cubed doesn't support lightmaps.

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 7:40 PM

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Hmm, but it still baked with that setting just fine

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 7:40 PM

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It doesn't read from them.

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So they will not show the lighting.

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You'll have to try another shader

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 7:42 PM

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Can I post pictures here?

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Let's try

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rip

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@scenic swallow Can I pm you pre-bake and after bake?

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Well, needless to say and however it works there is a change before bake and after bake and I can clearly see orange light baking in, in game too

scenic swallow Jul 24, 2018, 7:52 PM

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@mental monolith Go ahead, but I know Cubed's shader doesn't support lightmaps because I help "maintain" it.

mental monolith Jul 24, 2018, 7:57 PM

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I'm not trying to undermine at all, I'm newbie in this, may have clicked something random without understanding

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Baking it again

outer hedge Jul 25, 2018, 3:16 AM

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is there a way to bake lightmaps per group of meshes ? like a room with stuff in it will be in one lightmap and an other room in another lightmap ?

dense oracle Jul 25, 2018, 9:57 AM

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I just think the lightmap will assign a random ID for each object and just bake it, is there any reason to bake it in a group?

outer hedge Jul 25, 2018, 10:34 AM

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because TCL earlier said multiple atlas split batches

scenic swallow Jul 25, 2018, 3:51 PM

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You can create lightmap parameter files and set different system and baked tags. https://docs.unity3d.com/560/Documentation/Manual/LightmapParameters.html

Unity - Manual: Lightmap Parameters

The Unity Manual helps you learn and use the Unity engine. With the Unity engine you can create 2D and 3D games, apps and experiences.

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Then set the mesh renderers for each room to use the appropriate lightmap parameter file.

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@outer hedge

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Also, here's a Unity blog post with a list of scenarios that cause batches to break. https://blogs.unity3d.com/2017/04/03/how-to-see-why-your-draw-calls-are-not-batched-in-5-6/
The best way to figure out if and why your stuff isn't batching is the frame debugger.

Unity Technologies Blog

How to see why your draw calls are not batched in 5.6 – Unity Blog

I am sure that you know about Unity’s built-in Dynamic and Static Batching, which help reduce the number of draw calls in your game.
You can see Batching ...

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@dense oracle

dense oracle Jul 25, 2018, 4:02 PM

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Hmm, interesting, will check it out when i get home

outer hedge Jul 25, 2018, 4:35 PM

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@scenic swallow Very good info, thank you

wanton hemlock Jul 25, 2018, 8:00 PM

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the clustering speed of my bake has been getting glacial, is there a way to figure out where it gets stuck at?

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I've already disabled generate lightmap for the most frequently used and high res meshes but it still takes 15 minutes for the clustering itself

scenic swallow Jul 25, 2018, 8:14 PM

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@wanton hemlock If you have a lot of small meshes in your scene you can speed up light baking a lot by removing them from the lightmaps and letting them be lit with light probes.

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@wanton hemlock https://unity3d.com/learn/tutorials/topics/graphics/introduction-precomputed-realtime-gi

Unity

Introduction to Precomputed Realtime GI - Unity

Unity is the ultimate game development platform. Use Unity to build high-quality 3D and 2D games, deploy them across mobile, desktop, VR/AR, consoles or the Web, and connect with loyal and enthusiastic players and customers.

winged sinew Jul 26, 2018, 3:48 AM

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Has anyone attempted to used light probe proxy volumes to lower their draw calls?

high parcel Jul 26, 2018, 8:12 PM

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how do you fix this happening with prebaked lighting ? https://i.imgur.com/rZBWE4u.png

Imgur

lean lodge Jul 26, 2018, 8:18 PM

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Try slightly turning up the indirect resolution size in the lighting settings

high parcel Jul 26, 2018, 8:20 PM

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oh ok

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i had to turn direct down to 6 or 7

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baking times are long for some reason :Tc

barren gyro Jul 26, 2018, 8:23 PM

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yep, all bakes are

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try low quality first to get an idea then do your final bake before bed

high parcel Jul 26, 2018, 8:30 PM

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well im starting to use Light Probe groups :Tc

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will they help with bake times ?

lean lodge Jul 26, 2018, 8:42 PM

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Probably not, their purpose is to properly light up non-static objects (such as avatars)

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Make sure you add reflection probes too

high parcel Jul 26, 2018, 8:43 PM

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eh

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i tend to stay far away due to how forward uses reflection probes

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its done on a model bias

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not area

signal sinew Jul 26, 2018, 9:22 PM

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One question about occlusion. When I have someone walk into a house with opaque windows, how do I make the house occlude things beyond the walls? It seems that no matter what I do, the occlusion only affects objects outside of the field of view for my camera, rather than objects that are hidden behind others.

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I just feel like I'm doing something totally wrong.

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at* me of someone has an answer, thanks.

fair agate Jul 27, 2018, 2:07 AM

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@signal sinew you baked occlusion?you can use the visualizer

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Sounds like it is doing just the normal frustum culling

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 2:09 AM

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Is there a way to enable the type where things behind it an object are occluded as well?

fair agate Jul 27, 2018, 2:10 AM

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Occlusion tab in the inspector

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Starart with 2 occluder .25 hole and hit bake

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Assuming you’ve set stuff static

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 2:12 AM

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Yeah, I've fiddled with it for a bit but I couldn't make the stuff outside the house occlude while I had the camera inside of it.

fair agate Jul 27, 2018, 2:13 AM

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Is the house static?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 2:13 AM

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Yeah

fair agate Jul 27, 2018, 2:14 AM

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Hm

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Try putting an Occlusion area down around it

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 2:15 AM

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An Occlusion area? Sorry, I'm still new to this.

fair agate Jul 27, 2018, 2:23 AM

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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qumb0yv-e9c

YouTube

Stephenssart

Occlusion Culling In Unity3D-Pro Tutorial

i go through the steps in applying Occlusion Culling to your game in Unity3D Pro NOTE This is Feature in will be avalable in Unity5 Free as i have been told ...

▶ Play video

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This is how I learned

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 2:24 AM

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I'll check it when I'm back to my computer. I assume it works for the not pro version as well?

fair agate Jul 27, 2018, 2:39 AM

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Yep I have the free one

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 2:39 AM

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Unity 5.* have Occlusion included for free

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:07 AM

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Alright, that still seems to have me back at the issue I had. Cameras inside a building don't occlude things outside of the building while it is facing in that direction.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:08 AM

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Even in Visualize mode?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:09 AM

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Here, I'll get you a screenshot quick

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Well now nothings working

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And Unity crashed. One moment.

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https://i.gyazo.com/836ce73bf72c71539598fb22192e8f9e.jpg

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The camera is presently inside of a building with opaque windows, and my bake settings are set to default.

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While not occluding, the same scene looks like this:
https://i.gyazo.com/7dc15f64b9060802042191ced678b888.jpg

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:15 AM

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whats your bake settings?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:16 AM

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Default.
SO: 5
SH: 0.25
BT: 100

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:18 AM

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The building is fully static as well?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:19 AM

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Indeed

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:21 AM

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even after rebake?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:21 AM

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Yes

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Which it did for roughly 3 hours.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:23 AM

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try play with the SH size, make it a bit bigger

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But it should still cull it

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with the current

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:25 AM

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I bumped it up to 1 with no difference.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:26 AM

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SO down to 3?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:27 AM

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I dropped it to 2 and again no diference

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I feel like I'm doing something terribly wrong rather than it being bugged

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:28 AM

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Could be. When you do Visualize, do you get something like this? https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/416259331936485379/472243873046069258/2018-07-27_05-28-03.mp4

▶ Play video

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:30 AM

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https://i.gyazo.com/9b9d8e62f6b644d42054b2e6a137d5ec.mp4

▶ Play video

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I'm not entirely sure what I'm supposed to be looking for.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:36 AM

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Is your house mesh collider by any chance?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:36 AM

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Yeah, to save on draw calls I had it changed to a singular mesh.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:37 AM

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Yea, there is the issue then

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I might be wrong though

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:38 AM

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So mesh colliders don't do occlusion?

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That feels a bit off

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:38 AM

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they should

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It's just weird that your wall is ignored completely

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Enable your Visibility lines and see if it actually is stopped

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:43 AM

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I threw up a giant static cube in hopes it would do something
https://i.gyazo.com/853ecc44bd8df55f86e55fc56e6f585e.png

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:44 AM

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It's like your world is haunted. Not really sure what to do to be honest. Mine just worked out of the box.

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:44 AM

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Well

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Oof

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:44 AM

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Everything is it's own mesh right?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:45 AM

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Yeah

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Yeah, I go to a different world of mine and that works fine

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It all occludes correctly

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How on earth could if be getting stopped in that other one though? Lol

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:57 AM

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My guess is that it has to do with the objects used in the other one. But I am pretty new to culling myself

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 3:57 AM

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Don't cull yourself

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Sorry, I'm already regretting that joke.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 4:01 AM

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Haha

gray yacht Jul 27, 2018, 7:03 AM

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What layers do I keep on with a mirror to keep it really simple and render just players?

high parcel Jul 27, 2018, 10:15 AM

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just wondering do light group probes pick up baked lighting?

lean lodge Jul 27, 2018, 12:33 PM

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@high parcel yes

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Light probe groups are literally designed to do that

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They store information about the baked light and use it to light up dynamic objects such as players

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I think dynamic objects get the three closest light probe groups in a triangular fashion and average their light levels

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 12:59 PM

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^

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dont put 3 of them in a triangle in a shadow area 😄

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unless you want to go complete black

wanton hemlock Jul 27, 2018, 3:14 PM

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I'd like to speed up my baking process which currently takes a century, but won't disabling lightmap static on small objects to have them be lit by lightprobes eat RAM?

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 3:53 PM

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If you disable directional mode to non directional you can shorten the calculation a bit

wanton hemlock Jul 27, 2018, 3:56 PM

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how does that affect the lighting?

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 4:13 PM

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Directional lightmap is being calculated if you have Direct mode on, it will make an directional lightmap

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Its not always needed but some shaders can get uses out of it

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Thats the basic understanding i have from that setting

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Keep Lightprobes on Custom so you calculate them manually yourself

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And save the cubemaps wherever you want them

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This shortens the time calculating them everytime you bake, because the light setting bake always bakes them if they are not set to custom

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:17 PM

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@dense oracle @wanton hemlock You want directional lightmaps if you use any normal maps.

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:17 PM

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right, thats a good point

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didnt know Normal maps would use that or just the source of the light

wanton hemlock Jul 27, 2018, 6:18 PM

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I have 100% normalmaps

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:18 PM

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Or really any shader that cares about light direction which is most

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:18 PM

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mhm

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il keep that in my map

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will most likely have to split up my map for Night and Day World

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Since i cannot control the Ambient Light Color

wanton hemlock Jul 27, 2018, 6:19 PM

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Is there a way to further optimize static objects that aren't marked lightmap static

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:20 PM

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or maybe you have a way of controlling that with Standard Unity Assets TCL?

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since it is possible to activate realtime you should be able to control it with some animation i think, but there is no access to it

wanton hemlock Jul 27, 2018, 6:22 PM

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I need to optimize the lighting as much as possible, I've gotten a lot of reports of low framerates for VR and laptop users

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:25 PM

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I could help a bit if you want, not that experienced but wouldn't hurt to try.

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been poking around with the Light settings on my map forever now. :p

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:37 PM

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@dense oracle If you are using real-time lighting for your directional light you can use the skybox as the ambient source

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:37 PM

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but i would have to change the skybox right?

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:37 PM

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If you use a procedural skybox it will change automatically

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:37 PM

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i need it to change on the fly

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oh right

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hmm.

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:38 PM

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The procedural skybox uses the directional light angle to control the sun position

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:39 PM

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so basically i could just control the directional light source to make that happen then?

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:39 PM

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You will also want to generate lighting for pre-computed real-time GI as it is what is responsible for recalculating the real-time ambient and indirect lighting.

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:39 PM

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would need to check how to make that shader or find a skybox for that

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:40 PM

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@dense oracle Unity's default is procedural

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:40 PM

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ye but it is boring :p

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:40 PM

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The biggest issue with this is that it's really expensive if you want directional light shadows.

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:40 PM

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maybe i could use a box on top of that?

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nah no need for directional shadows

wanton hemlock Jul 27, 2018, 6:40 PM

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is there a way to upload a new version of a map without removing the current public one?

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:41 PM

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You need directional light shadows if you want interior spaces

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:41 PM

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i want only to change the Ambient light on the fly, so on the Night time on my map i would like it to not produce any ambient light. since most Avatars will glow with a bit of ambient light with baked Intensity map

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:41 PM

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Otherwise the directional light will light everything uniformly

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You might be able to work around that with some clever use of layers and multiple lights.

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:42 PM

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right. i only have outdoor for now, so thats alright

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ye, i try to be clever with that sort of thing, but have no knowledge of most, and you know, don't want to read all documentation.

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but when i get to that we will most likely already be soon transitioning to a new Unity version if we are lucky.

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:45 PM

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Most things will be relevant in the new version

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:45 PM

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its a Park so most lights dont need the shadows indoor, and i will mostly make outdoor stuff anyway 😃

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 6:45 PM

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The HD render pipeline changes a lot of things but that's a long way off, it doesn't even support VR right now.

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 6:45 PM

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ye, the basics i guess, but there is some handy tools that is handed down in the newer versions that both makes it easier and more advanced

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Currently creating a Animation that counts points with Variable Integers.
For use by anyone when i get to the point of releasing the map it should go with.
Should work with anything and can work the system into whatever with the current system we have now.
it will count even if you overshoot the Integer values. but its a bit slow, unless you feed the Integer values directly to the Digits.

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 7:14 PM

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Thanks for answering and having the solutions TCL. Reassuring to have you here around 😃

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 8:16 PM

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@sweet sinew it seems, from what I've tested, that the occlusion is very shader dependant and vastly prefers Standard Opaque shaders than anything custom.

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Basically, either I'm doing something wrong, or RealToon shaders don't allow for Occlusion Culling.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 8:32 PM

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Could be

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I use standard for all of mine

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 8:33 PM

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@signal sinew ~~Occlusion culling shouldn't be affected by shaders.~~ Apparently render queue does affect it, only opaque are included.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 8:34 PM

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I am very interested to know why the world wasn't culled properly though

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It culled what ever that wasn't in the view, but ignored walls and objects

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 8:35 PM

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It works fine when I have the texture set to standard, but stops when I have it swapped to Realtoon

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I guess I could always set up the Occlusions with the Standard shaders and swap to RealToon after baking them. Lol

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 8:38 PM

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Hmm, it seems only opaque materials are considered for occlusion culling.

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Are these walls or smaller objects in the scene?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 8:39 PM

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Basically, the camera is inside a house which is occluding the stuff outside.

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 8:40 PM

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Ah, yeah, if realtoon isn't opaque then it won't count for occlusion culling.

sweet sinew Jul 27, 2018, 8:40 PM

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Good to know then

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So culling is only supported with opaque?

signal sinew Jul 27, 2018, 8:41 PM

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It has a Default option, which I assumed was opaque.

scenic swallow Jul 27, 2018, 8:41 PM

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Baking occlusion with standard and then switching will work.

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If you don't need alpha test or transparency you can modify the shader to be opaque.

dense oracle Jul 27, 2018, 11:57 PM

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Nope, cannot change the Ambient light with the Skybox Shader, it does not change the ambient light intensity...

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tried from A to Z now... nothing

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you still glow in the dark when nighttime is on.

scenic swallow Jul 28, 2018, 12:03 AM

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@dense oracle Can you post a picture?

dense oracle Jul 28, 2018, 12:14 AM

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You mean of the setting or just what i mean about glowing in the dark?

scenic swallow Jul 28, 2018, 12:18 AM

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Glowing

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Actually both

dense oracle Jul 28, 2018, 12:19 AM

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Alright

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give me a few, need to rebake it and add the settings back

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https://i.imgur.com/XqC3Gon.png

Imgur

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https://i.imgur.com/aao1uYs.png

Imgur

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ive got an animation that animates the sun to point straight up, so it is not casting shadows

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https://i.imgur.com/hoW0Pyd.png

Imgur

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https://i.imgur.com/16Ux5YB.png

Imgur

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https://i.imgur.com/HUzUUMk.png

Imgur

scenic swallow Jul 28, 2018, 1:05 AM

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@dense oracle Do you have light probes?

dense oracle Jul 28, 2018, 1:12 AM

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Yes

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oh sec. gona check something

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well it seems they was disabled, but still it glows

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https://i.imgur.com/9pTlnxE.png

Imgur

scenic swallow Jul 28, 2018, 1:17 AM

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Hmm

dense oracle Jul 28, 2018, 2:26 AM

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Seems there is a trick here

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but wont be total black, bot good enough for me

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Intensity Multiplier up to 8

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Indirect Intensity on 0.01

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Bake that

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you get almost pitch black Intensity Maps

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https://i.imgur.com/xVoZmd7.png

Imgur

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and it still shows

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a bit, but it is so little that i can live with that

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if i should make it fully, i should just add the slightest of hue with light and it would be as in any night.

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but now the problem is to get the skybox to be what i want

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https://i.imgur.com/KdgAjkg.png

Imgur

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https://i.imgur.com/5RkcRdS.png

Imgur

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so it works but you have to have wonky settings

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took some time, and that my lightprobes was freaking turned off somehow :p

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https://i.imgur.com/4O40NyH.png

Imgur

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here is the settings if anyone want to see

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why can we not use custom skybox on our Camera :(((

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https://i.imgur.com/iiaD2AW.png

Imgur

west crag Jul 28, 2018, 5:39 AM

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mystery time - why would one static cube in the scene with Default-Material on it affect lighting on the opposite side of the room, 12 or so metres away?

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the cube is visibly too dim to contribute to lighting in any way

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https://imgur.com/a/hPJvew9

Imgur

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(second pic in there has the lighting result without the cube)

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(and third, which is even weirder)

dense oracle Jul 28, 2018, 10:50 AM

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well that setting is screwing with my lighting to much lol, took me a while before seeing it... think il just drop the whole Day and night Cycle, because it screws with performance...

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Now my map is a total nutjob since the materials i use is all over the place, will take away from developing the fun stuff...

fair agate Jul 28, 2018, 2:31 PM

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@west crag need more lightprobe density?

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:38 PM

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Question: so I have a world I mostly just use to sit around and have the walls covered in pictures with friends. I put in ceiling mirrors above the bed and couch since I often lay on the floor in body tracking and so I can still see what's going on. The mirrors have the anti aliasing on 2, are on a toggle and are turned off on default, but ever since I did this update to my world I only get up to 45fps instead of 60 in my world (in vr)

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does anyone have an idea what causes this? Or an Idea on how to improve?

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:39 PM

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If the fps is constantly on 45 it's fine

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:39 PM

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The world is entirely made in unity and is very cheaply made. I am working on a version I actually made in Blender and slowly put things in it too but I still would like to visit my old world as long as the new on is in WIP

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well it's not constantly

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:39 PM

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Don't remember what it was called, but there is something on SteamVR you have to turn off to have it be accurate

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:39 PM

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it's like, it doesn't get higher than 45 and if the world gets fuller it drops around sometimes even down to like 15-20

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I never had that before in the world that's the weird thing

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other people also said they are getting quiet low fps in my world

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:40 PM

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The thing where it doesn't get higher than 45 is common if you have turned off that one setting I can't remember what was called 😛

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:40 PM

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I do get 60 or even 90 fps in other worlds so yeah o:

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:40 PM

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But turn off layers in the mirror you don't need and make sure your light is baked

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:41 PM

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ooh it might be the light I added new light sources let me check...

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aaah mode was RealTime and not Baked could this be it?

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:42 PM

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Some of it yes. Mirrors them self can be laggy anyway.

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:42 PM

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okay actually all my lights are on RealTime I just noticed

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when I change Mode to Baked the light is kinda gone tho o:

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:42 PM

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Depending on the world size it can be fine

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:43 PM

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the world isn't too big it's like3 ~10x10 Square rooms shaped like an L I guess

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:43 PM

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But if you have multiple realtime lights, make sure you set them up properly so not all of them are on the players

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:43 PM

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do you happen to have any good tutorials about that? 😅 I actually don't know anything about lights tbh

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:44 PM

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There are tutorials, but they aren't specifically for VRChat, which require different settings.

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:45 PM

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hmm I see...

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How exactly do I "set them up properly" if I have 3 real time lights in one room?

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:45 PM

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Where are they located?

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:48 PM

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okay so;

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https://gyazo.com/a567fc76fea74e0e20dd97f050d813e9
The three red squares are like the 3 rooms the bottom one is outside and there is a directional light

Gyazo

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the three green spots are the three lights you can see in the screen shot and the one single green dot is one bigger light int he other room

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:50 PM

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Is the roof a plane? (one sided)

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:50 PM

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yeah but I actually put a second plane on it because people climbed up (with spamming space against the wall) the roof so you can stand there

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:51 PM

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Just remove the collider 😛 But if it's a plane you can just set your lights to bake and let the skybox light up the players

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:52 PM

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okay o: I'll give it a try o:

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:53 PM

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It's what I do for my world at least. But it's a outdoor world

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:54 PM

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okay... o:

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uhm the "Type" of the light is still Point, should I change it to Area when I make the Mode Baked?

sweet sinew Jul 28, 2018, 3:57 PM

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You can have it be point, just change it to bake

woeful mountain Jul 28, 2018, 3:57 PM

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okay

west crag Jul 28, 2018, 4:37 PM

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@fair agate I dunno, I kind of think I have enough...

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there's about 6 rows of them between the cube and the stuff being lit up

west crag Jul 28, 2018, 4:55 PM

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light probes are acting strangely in general though. I thought the ones closer to the light source would be brighter but it's practically the opposite

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I eventually went back to the workaround using an area light and that was behaving in the same way - the further from the light, the brighter you get

west crag Jul 28, 2018, 5:17 PM

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even did this experiment where I turned the emission of the floor up to an extreme level. https://imgur.com/a/O67hplL

Imgur

spark fulcrum Jul 29, 2018, 11:36 PM

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Hello

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Sooo

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I’m having problems with small interactable pickup objects bugging out as you hold them.

tame iron Jul 30, 2018, 1:37 AM

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quick question: do webm or mp4 on a screen affect the world performance a lot?

fair agate Jul 30, 2018, 1:44 AM

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@spark fulcrum naruko how so

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@tame iron in general, yes videoplayers are laggy

lilac saddle Jul 31, 2018, 2:24 AM

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#world-development

median stag Jul 31, 2018, 4:11 AM

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How much should i avoid mesh colliders? If i have a bunch of chairs that around ~ 100 tris, would it be better still to use boxes?

strange prism Jul 31, 2018, 4:17 AM

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If it can be easily represented with primitive colliders, I suggest using primitives. If it's a low poly mesh, you can keep it. Mesh colliders are the only way I know to have one sided colliders so there are uses. Just be careful as some colliders can get players stuck when there are gaps.

sick bane Jul 31, 2018, 1:26 PM

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how much does grass added to a terrain affect performance?

empty oar Jul 31, 2018, 1:32 PM

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It should be fine as long as you don't use a lot of grass and keep the draw distance low

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2d sprites are preferred obv

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The more you increase either of them the bigger the strain becomes

sharp palm Aug 1, 2018, 5:19 PM

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How can I test performance in my works as it would be for lower end PCs

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All my worlds keep getting PRFORMANCE ISSUE LOW FPS no matter how simple the world is and despite me and my friends getting 90 FPS constant in vr, dunno what to do anymore

sweet sinew Aug 1, 2018, 5:21 PM

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We need more information about your world. What does it contain? What are the light settings? Do you have a mirror? Do you have heavy particles? Is the world baked? And so on..

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I would suggest maybe joining the event for "Developer Meetup" (not a official dev meetup with vrchat) and test it there. We have all types of specs in there, from low end to high end and a lot of people that can give tips and help solve the issues it might have

sharp palm Aug 1, 2018, 5:33 PM

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its just 3 objects and a mirror. 2 of them are rooms and one is a mirror toggle (off by default). It has 8 baked lights, 2 reflection probes and an audio source

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where can i find more info about the meetup?

sweet sinew Aug 1, 2018, 5:34 PM

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vrchatevents.com

sharp palm Aug 1, 2018, 5:34 PM

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thank you! :-]

sweet sinew Aug 1, 2018, 5:36 PM

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If you could provide a world id I can take a look and see if I can find the cause

sharp palm Aug 1, 2018, 5:38 PM

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Sure give me a sec

sweet sinew Aug 1, 2018, 5:50 PM

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still waiting

naive pine Aug 2, 2018, 5:02 PM

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Hiya I’m wondering if anyone ever has issues with the test build option for when you’re trying to test a world. It doesn’t log me in and then my world doesn’t display properly when trying to test with my vive so it won’t actually run in vr

tame iron Aug 2, 2018, 11:45 PM

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hey got a performance question, will Two cameras with 2 different target textures hit the performance hard?

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 3:20 AM

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I still find it funny how some worlds get rejected for low fps and then other low fps worlds go straight through somehow

north delta Aug 3, 2018, 4:02 AM

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Because some worlds are good and have low fps and some worlds are bad with low fps

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 4:48 AM

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sometimes the bad ones get approved even with low fps

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maybe just because there is something interesting about it that appealed to the specific reviewer

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we keep getting this amazing flow of lag-free worlds with a solid colour, which is now at meme status, so they keep getting approved to prolong the life of the meme

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that stuff is genuinely hilarious

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:10 AM

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@west crag How many solid colour worlds have you seen?

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I made Blue

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:11 AM

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Hmm... three? (And I know lol

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:11 AM

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As a joke pointing out how absurd and boring the whole lag-free world thing is.

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:11 AM

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Yep

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I was considering making one called “free lag” with heavy shaders in it

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:12 AM

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Xiexe made Pink as a ripoff of Blue and also a joke on the "Why my shader pink?" meme.

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What was the other solid colour world?

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:13 AM

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Black I think, so I don’t really put it in the same category

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Is it less draw calls to just not clear the camera? 🤔

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I’d hope that nobody would approve something like that but one of my video test worlds ended up that way by accident once

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:17 AM

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TCL's world optimization guide:
Delete all mesh renderers in the world.
Delete all lights in the world.
Set the ambient light to a colour.
Set the camera to clear to a colour.

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That's it this channel can be closed now. We've reached the pinnacle of world optimization.

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Not clearing is actually two draw calls for some reason.

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Possibly due to double buffering.

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:19 AM

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Rats

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:19 AM

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Clearing to a colour is 1 draw call.

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So Blue is one draw call.

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:20 AM

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What about one draw call at the near plane with an opaque material so that no avatars draw either

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steps into evil territory

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:20 AM

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You could just set the far clip to the near clip.

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Or barely past it.

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:20 AM

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Oooo yes

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:21 AM

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It'll basically only render something in your eye

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And only maybe a ring of pixels at that.

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Can't get it made public though

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:21 AM

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Yeah of course

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:22 AM

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2-3 meters is far enough to let the menu render so that might be okay

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:22 AM

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That wouldn’t stop me making it for a joke and trying to get a few dozen people into it anyway

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:23 AM

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That'll make you really popular 😛

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:23 AM

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Assuming I could get online at a decent time to find that many people outside of private worlds

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:23 AM

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I just request invite on people until someone accepts.

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If everyone is in a private world.

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:24 AM

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like when people discovered that Mii world

scenic swallow Aug 3, 2018, 8:24 AM

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The one you can't talk in?

west crag Aug 3, 2018, 8:24 AM

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Yeah that one lol

west crag Aug 4, 2018, 6:54 AM

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so I had baked the lighting in my world, and a few people came in with black avatars. it turns out everyone was using Flat Lit Toon, and adding a real-time directional light fixes it. Is there a solution to this that doesn't require adding something which sucks for performance?

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(the directional light also improves the look of XSToon as a side-effect... but I think Xiexe is already working on making that work without it)

fair agate Aug 4, 2018, 8:03 AM

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Light probes?

west crag Aug 4, 2018, 10:59 AM

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got 'em

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got reflection probes too

dense oracle Aug 4, 2018, 12:30 PM

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Ambient color is what?

west crag Aug 4, 2018, 12:45 PM

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a dark grey

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actually it seems to be set to the skybox, which is dark grey

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and then that's set to baked too

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I noticed I can use Mixed mode too, which might be better than realtime at least

formal ember Aug 4, 2018, 11:20 PM

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Mixed mode will act like realtime and baked. So you'll get realtime shadows on everything that isn't static, and you'll get baked shadows on everything that is static.

teal mirage Aug 5, 2018, 8:53 AM

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why can't i get in to my world? it keeps putting me back to the hub

sweet sinew Aug 5, 2018, 8:54 AM

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Try detach the pipeline and upload it again

lean lodge Aug 5, 2018, 2:46 PM

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@west crag put a cube in the world

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See which probes it's affected by and how light they are

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Maybe it's too far into the floor

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Or maybe your world is actually just not lit correctly, what kind of shaders are on your geometry?

west crag Aug 5, 2018, 8:41 PM

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I was having issues getting the actual world to light things up properly so I'm still using a giant area light to light things up

#

as far as random objects dropped in the world go, though, I have a few test objects there and they all seem to be lit up fine. the sole issue I got was the shadows being absent for some shaders

#

nonetheless by adding the directional light at super low intensity, it did fix some avatars from being completely black, and also made cubed show a shadow at all

#

@formal ember and I even have shadows turned off on the directional light, since it's only there as a hack

formal ember Aug 5, 2018, 9:10 PM

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@west crag did you read thru my lighting tutorial?

west crag Aug 5, 2018, 9:10 PM

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yeah

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not before setting the lighting up though, lel

formal ember Aug 5, 2018, 9:18 PM

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headdesk

west crag Aug 5, 2018, 9:19 PM

#

the world is older than that

#

that is where I got the idea to use an area light to get around the emissive stuff not working though

#

although the more I investigate the emissive not working, the more mysterious the issue gets

formal ember Aug 5, 2018, 9:26 PM

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Honestly I would just redo the lighting in the world if you know more now

#

Instead of trying to get the old setup to work properly

west crag Aug 5, 2018, 9:28 PM

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I keep throwing dynamic objects in to test them though and it looks fine, so I'm really heavily leaning towards just blaming people's avatars :p

#

leaving the directional light off now, results are flat lit toon giving no shadow, and xstoon choosing its arbitrary direction, but the amount of light is fine, so I'll have to wait until I find out what shader the broken people are using now

stark bay Aug 6, 2018, 9:35 AM

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what can i do when generate lightmap UV's and baking light fucks up my normal maps?

formal ember Aug 6, 2018, 10:13 AM

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You don't have probes / your ambient color is pure black. My shader chooses arb direction when there is no directional light - Cubeds will be black entirely without probes or ambient color. @west crag

west crag Aug 6, 2018, 10:23 AM

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mm. but the sphere I put in which is using my copy of cubed's isn't black

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so now I have to interrogate the other visitors to find out what they're really using

#

even after turning off my directional light, it's still getting lit, it just shows no shadow

#

or no dark area, I guess .. I guess that's a shadow too, but not the same as the other kind

#

I might also start putting together an avatar with a bunch of test materials on it

#

the ambient colour probably really is dark, though, that's for sure

#

so anyone not using light probes on their avatar is probably going to suffer anyway

dense oracle Aug 6, 2018, 1:51 PM

#

Light probes is Map based and is baked with the baked textures not avatar, and ambient light should be using the intensity baked map texture as an baseline how much color it should use on the baked areas, if you have an dark spot on your map you can recolor that in the intensity map to be fully black. (Not tested this but is what i got from baking allot and testing out)

obsidian egret Aug 6, 2018, 11:36 PM

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how to cut down on map file size?

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 12:49 AM

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My terrain isn't effected by its baked map... is there any trick to this? a different terrain shader, etc to make it work

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I see its a problem thats been around a long time

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 12:59 AM

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what do i put object sync on to make sure the players can/cant see the mirror together? is it the mirror or the button?

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 12:59 AM

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You don't need object sync for that

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:00 AM

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i turned the mirror off using a button, when my friend joined he saw it still on

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so it got de-syned

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:00 AM

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@ripe dove You can't bake terrain itself, but you can change settings so shadows are baked "onto" it

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:01 AM

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hmm

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:01 AM

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same for another button i have to turn lights on/off

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:01 AM

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What buffers do you have on your triggers @maiden solar

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:02 AM

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default

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:02 AM

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What do you mean?

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:02 AM

#

https://answers.unity.com/questions/375632/how-can-i-bake-shadows-onto-terrain-from-direction.html

How can I bake shadows onto terrain from directional light? - Unit...

Unity is the ultimate game development platform. Use Unity to build high-quality 3D and 2D games, deploy them across mobile, desktop, VR/AR, consoles or the Web, and connect with loyal and enthusiastic players and customers.

#

@maiden solar If you have "AlwaysUnbuffered" then if someone else join they

#

will only see the default state

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:03 AM

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thanks

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:03 AM

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Unbuffered I meant

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:03 AM

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on the mirror, or the button?

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:03 AM

#

But you change the trigger to AlwaysBufferOne on the trigger

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:03 AM

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ohh, the trigger script 😛

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:03 AM

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Then who ever joins will trigger the last one, but that will require two buttons

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 1:04 AM

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Faking things with two buttons is fine though

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:04 AM

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yes

#

So one need to set it to false and the other need to set it to true

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:05 AM

#

but every time somebody joins the mirror will be on, until they click the button themselves?

#

or until somebody clicks the button*

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:05 AM

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No, if you use AlwaysBufferOne they will trigger the last one that was clicked in the instance

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So if Turn Off was clicked, it will be turned off

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:06 AM

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ahh i see, i think

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is there any way i can test this on my own? or would i have to get a friend to join?

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sorry, im totally new to unity 😛 i use ue4

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:09 AM

#

Create two buttons and add these settings (one on each)

Turn Off: https://i.imgur.com/EB8IvQ3.png

Turn On: https://i.imgur.com/PLNr26K.png

Imgur

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:10 AM

#

got it thanks 😃

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:10 AM

#

https://i.imgur.com/DpRtayH.jpg

Imgur

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:11 AM

#

Is that after baking or?

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:11 AM

#

after

#

but it shows on everything but the terrain

#

within VRC

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:12 AM

#

You have painted the terrain on?

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:12 AM

#

ya

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:13 AM

#

What does it look like in game?

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:13 AM

#

no lighting at all on terrain

#

shadows nor highlights

#

every other mesh does

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:17 AM

#

Set up another Directional light with mixed that doesn't cull the player layers

#

So you will have two, one for the environment and one for the player

#

You can do it with one too, but it can't have the player layers (for performance)

#

And make sure it's set to mixed

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:21 AM

#

so your suggest realtime lighting for the terrain

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:22 AM

#

Use mixed, so you will bake everything else but the terrain

#

It will show the shadows, but the shadows aren't moving

misty pecan Aug 7, 2018, 1:23 AM

#

Kibby, I know someone used a different shader for the terrain and was able to bake them that way. I don't remember the specifics, sorry

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:23 AM

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now that is information i'd love

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 1:23 AM

#

@scenic swallow might do though

#

He had a long discussion about it a while ago

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:23 AM

#

cause they definately bake just don't show in game

misty pecan Aug 7, 2018, 1:24 AM

#

AFAIK literally any shader other than the standard one should work

scenic swallow Aug 7, 2018, 1:24 AM

#

It seems like that's the case

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 1:24 AM

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(Only if the shader supports baking though)

scenic swallow Aug 7, 2018, 1:24 AM

#

I tried an example terrain shader out of Amplify Shader Editor and it worked

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:24 AM

#

ok

#

its been a week of me trying to figure this out now

#

i'll look it up

scenic swallow Aug 7, 2018, 1:25 AM

#

You might be limited to a simple four splat shader though

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:25 AM

#

im only using 3 textures

#

in the terrain as is

scenic swallow Aug 7, 2018, 1:26 AM

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That's what I used and it worked, I didn't try more.

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:26 AM

#

grass/soil/rock

#

am i going to have to repaint?

#

or will it accept the splats already there

scenic swallow Aug 7, 2018, 1:27 AM

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It should use the same splatmap

ripe dove Aug 7, 2018, 1:30 AM

#

perfect thanks...as i never changed the terrain shader before im guessing that's "material" under base terrain in terrain settings

scenic swallow Aug 7, 2018, 1:32 AM

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Yes

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:44 AM

#

how do i make my mirror toggle per person, instead of per server?

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 1:44 AM

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Make the buttons local

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:44 AM

#

how? 😛

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 1:45 AM

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Check the advanced check box and select local as the broadcast type

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:45 AM

#

thanks!!

#

can i group things is unity? to keep my hierarchy more clean?

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 1:59 AM

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Create an empty gameobject and name it.

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 1:59 AM

#

cool. thanks 😃

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 1:59 AM

#

I use empties as a folder structure in my projects

#

(Phaxe, you can answer too. I keep seeing you type but then stop)

sweet sinew Aug 7, 2018, 2:00 AM

#

You can also create empty with something like "======= NAME =======" and set the tag on that object to EditorOnly and it will only be in the editor

#

To categorize it better

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 2:01 AM

#

The editor only thing is also a good tip if you don't want to upload things in the map, but still want it in the project.

maiden solar Aug 7, 2018, 2:01 AM

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1 of my meshes are rotated, when i add it to the empty, it scewes up 😦

strange prism Aug 7, 2018, 2:01 AM

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Undo what you did and make sure these empties have a reset transform before putting things underneath it.

winged sinew Aug 7, 2018, 10:54 PM

#

What's the best way to ask Unity to lightmap this as one plane? It's made up of several meshes, but they're a mostly flat surface.(Buildings aside)
https://files.catbox.moe/5qp8lw.jpg

willow spoke Aug 8, 2018, 8:34 AM

#

Is it a lightmap problem? Looks like a texture problem

sweet sinew Aug 8, 2018, 8:35 AM

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Bad uv's

willow spoke Aug 8, 2018, 8:37 AM

#

Oh this was almost 12 hours ago lol.

lean lodge Aug 8, 2018, 2:32 PM

#

I think you should let Unity generate lightmap UV's or make them yourself in Blender

#

I heard it's pretty easy

winged sinew Aug 9, 2018, 4:10 AM

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Umm

#

I don't think you understand the problem

#

I want these meshes to be lightmapped as one

#

Unity is generating the UVs for them

willow spoke Aug 9, 2018, 4:23 AM

#

oh you're in baked lightmap view, that's why

#

Are all these meshes static? Baking your meshes might do the trick. Try this https://github.com/Kovnir/UnitySimplestMeshBaker

GitHub

Kovnir/UnitySimplestMeshBaker

UnitySimplestMeshBaker - Simple plugin that helps you bake several meshes to one in couple clicks.

winged sinew Aug 9, 2018, 5:29 AM

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Well of course they're static, they wouldn't have a light map if they weren't

#

Looks handy, I'll test

rugged mason Aug 9, 2018, 5:43 AM

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@willow spoke i know that probuilder can convert objects into pro builder objects and then lets you join the meshes as well =w=

#

not sure if that that efficient though

winged sinew Aug 9, 2018, 6:08 AM

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Sometimes PB has issues and will break the UVs of imported objects

lapis basin Aug 9, 2018, 3:18 PM

#

Does somebody know which rendering path gets used by vrchat? I would like to use deferred rendering, but i read today that Vrchat uses forward. (and does it change this on when loading the map?)

viral marsh Aug 9, 2018, 3:26 PM

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Keep it in forward. It is used for VR compatibility.

lapis basin Aug 9, 2018, 3:34 PM

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Hm ok, thanks!

mellow pawn Aug 11, 2018, 7:43 PM

#

Is there any way to reduce long world load times? I've been testing my world and trying to figure out what is causing the load time to be this long.

sweet sinew Aug 11, 2018, 7:56 PM

#

Long loading is usually related to audio stored in the project unloading into memory

#

(after finished download that is)

mellow pawn Aug 11, 2018, 8:05 PM

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is there an optimal music player to use for worlds that you can load in multiple songs?

sweet sinew Aug 11, 2018, 8:06 PM

#

SyncVideoPlayer

west crag Aug 11, 2018, 10:17 PM

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"optimal" 🤣

coral pewter Aug 12, 2018, 10:37 PM

#

anyone here?

astral sierra Aug 13, 2018, 1:10 AM

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nah

empty oar Aug 13, 2018, 2:23 AM

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If you need something just ask it. Someone could have replied in the time you waited

west crag Aug 13, 2018, 7:33 AM

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At work I deliberately delay my response by half an hour after someone saying “hi” on chat to encourage asking questions immediately

median meteor Aug 13, 2018, 11:36 AM

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yeah, people saying "hi" with nothing else or "it's quiet" generally makes me stay quiet out of spite.
I'm a bad person, I know. :b

high parcel Aug 13, 2018, 4:45 PM

#

would this particle system for firing kill fps? https://i.imgur.com/VlLHusl.gifv

Imgur

sweet sinew Aug 13, 2018, 4:49 PM

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It's a few bullets so no

high parcel Aug 13, 2018, 4:50 PM

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well

#

more on the fact that the trail is using volumtric shader ment for particles allowing it to be lit and shadowed and at large sizes or alot of particles using it can lag alot

#

iv used a bunch on this map im working on and its sorta opmitised

sweet sinew Aug 13, 2018, 4:53 PM

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It would be a case by case basis then. I wouldn't be too worried about it. Test it as is and see if it actually does lag

high parcel Aug 13, 2018, 4:53 PM

#

but heavily lowered it use to not receive shadows

#

just be lit by blend probes and other such lighting things as well as dyamic lights

#

also

#

directional lights works weirdly with it so it cant receive shadows from that light type

sweet sinew Aug 13, 2018, 4:54 PM

#

I wouldn't be too worried about it. In most worlds the lag comes from badly optimized avatars.

high parcel Aug 13, 2018, 4:55 PM

#

yeah

#

i need to find a way of making fake volumtric lights

#

that is dynamic with out being a special C# code

#

that vrc hasnt got white listed

torn crypt Aug 13, 2018, 5:19 PM

#

You'll probably be limited to shaders to create fake volumetrics - but lemme know if you figure out something because it was something I wanted to experiment with at some point

light yoke Aug 14, 2018, 2:47 AM

#

wow

west crag Aug 14, 2018, 8:04 AM

#

I’ve hacked together two kinds of fake volumetric glass effects so far and haven’t yet got anything I’m really happy with

#

The answer is always “just raymarch it” but I’m using it for walls of my entire home world so I can’t really get away with that for performance reasons

#

Fake volumetric light is something blog posts have covered a lot

high parcel Aug 14, 2018, 9:42 AM

#

iv got it "working"

#

but

#

it requires alot of particles in one system at a large size

#

around 100 particles

#

at like a size 10

high parcel Aug 14, 2018, 1:09 PM

#

i need a way of making it render at half res

#

tho

#

:Tc

lean lodge Aug 14, 2018, 1:13 PM

#

Change maximum size

#

Billboards have a minimum and maximum percentage of your screen that they can take up

high parcel Aug 14, 2018, 1:18 PM

#

yeah ik

#

i was thinking of maybe using render targets with 256x256

#

for depth

high parcel Aug 14, 2018, 6:36 PM

#

Iv gotten it to work at all angles now

#

but

#

you know billboard particles kinda ruins it

#

https://i.imgur.com/qc81mku.gifv

Imgur

lilac saddle Aug 16, 2018, 2:01 AM

#

Hello everyone, i have a large world and i want put a fisical setup panel where it changes the vision distance, there is a way to made it?

lean lodge Aug 16, 2018, 2:02 AM

#

I think you would have to change the clipping plane on the main camera

#

And set the main camera as reference camera in the world

#

But beyond that, I don't know

#

I don't know if that's even possible

lilac saddle Aug 16, 2018, 2:04 AM

#

yes, i do that, but i looking a way to change by triggers the vision distance

strange prism Aug 16, 2018, 2:05 AM

#

I don't think you can change the clipping plane during runtime since the reference camera values are copied, but we do not have access to the player's camera.

lean lodge Aug 16, 2018, 2:06 AM

#

I thought as much

strange prism Aug 16, 2018, 2:06 AM

#

We can still try with UI buttons, but I doubt the change would carry over.

lilac saddle Aug 16, 2018, 2:12 AM

#

well thank you :)

median stag Aug 16, 2018, 5:36 PM

#

Shouldn't be an issue with having like 400 object syncs if they're all disabled most of the time, right?

sweet sinew Aug 16, 2018, 5:38 PM

#

Object sync only sync when they are moved or been moved. So you can leave 400 of them enabled

strange prism Aug 16, 2018, 5:40 PM

#

Object sync also breaks when disabled at start. I’m not sure if they break if they are ever disabled too.

viral marsh Aug 16, 2018, 5:41 PM

#

When the component is disabled, or the object it is on?

sweet sinew Aug 16, 2018, 5:41 PM

#

object

viral marsh Aug 16, 2018, 5:41 PM

#

I have objects that are disabled upon load that seem to sync when activated.

#

Is this a new bug @strange prism? When you say break does it fully not work? Is it some issue I don't know about?

strange prism Aug 16, 2018, 5:45 PM

#

Oh, it happened a long time ago and I never tested again. If it’s fixed now then great and I’m sorry for spreading bad information.

lean lodge Aug 16, 2018, 5:46 PM

#

I don't think the component can even be disabled

viral marsh Aug 16, 2018, 5:47 PM

#

@strange prism It always seemed like it would be a bad idea to disable an object with object sync on it. But I did it anyway. I'm not sure it's good practice.

#

But it does seem to work.

#

Official best practices on this stuff would be nice. 🤔

#

(Speaking of known bugs)

#

😃

strange prism Aug 16, 2018, 5:52 PM

#

This was back in February, so who knows when it was fixed. Then again, I also didn’t know much about world building back then.

#

I’m wondering if it is similar to the issue with disabling portals at start. If they are disabled at start, everyone will be sent to a different instance, according to Mimi anyway.

teal mirage Aug 17, 2018, 9:05 AM

#

How to make my obj spawn back when fell out of the world?

sweet sinew Aug 17, 2018, 9:06 AM

#

Set the Object Behavior to Respawn in the Scene Descriptor (VRCWorld)

teal mirage Aug 17, 2018, 9:07 AM

#

vrclike

lilac saddle Aug 18, 2018, 10:31 AM

#

Anyone know why even with a box collider I keep falling through the box and the triggers don’t work anymore 👀👀👀

empty oar Aug 18, 2018, 11:03 AM

#

Is it set to trigger?

coral pewter Aug 18, 2018, 2:50 PM

#

hello
got a question about a wprld i created
when i visit my world, i can turn my head (in vr) and see my avatar's headless body! also, when i activate the menu using menu button on the controller, i cannot click on anything. I can see the menu but clicking on any meun item (say, worlds) doesn't work.
any ideas?

coral pewter Aug 18, 2018, 3:36 PM

#

anyone?

willow spoke Aug 18, 2018, 3:37 PM

#

sounds like the spawn is inside a collider

coral pewter Aug 18, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

isn't the spawn point the vrchat world prefab?

willow spoke Aug 18, 2018, 3:40 PM

#

it can be wherever, you specify it in the scene descriptor. If you don't set it at all I believe it goes to 0,0,0

coral pewter Aug 18, 2018, 3:41 PM

#

hmmm

#

i will go and have a check. thanks

#

where are the settings for spawn point in the descriptor, please?

willow spoke Aug 18, 2018, 3:47 PM

#

at the very top, in spawns. Expand that and change it from 0 if necessary

lean lodge Aug 18, 2018, 3:47 PM

#

It's the "Spawns" list yeah

#

You can enter a list of transforms

#

By default, this transform is set to the World prefab

coral pewter Aug 18, 2018, 3:49 PM

#

I'll have a fiddle. thanks

teal bone Aug 18, 2018, 3:49 PM

#

Is the spawn "fixed" when a player enters the world, or can the transform of the spawn be altered during runtime?

strange prism Aug 18, 2018, 4:10 PM

#

You can animate the spawn point to move it around.

coral pewter Aug 18, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

I think my problem was that I had a unity 1st person controller in the scene when i uploaded it to vrchat

lean lodge Aug 18, 2018, 4:11 PM

#

@strange prism would that work though?

#

It would work for respawns and stuff, but

#

For newly joining players it would have to sync before they spawn

strange prism Aug 18, 2018, 4:16 PM

#

I don’t think you can change it for new players. Might need to check what happens when you buffer the spawn movement.

signal sinew Aug 18, 2018, 6:27 PM

#

So, I've recently run into an issue with my occlusion in my world.
The issue being, well, it won't happen, resulting in two console errors:
(!) Error occurred in occluder data computation:
(!) Failure in split phase

Looking it up online said that it's because it ran out of memory due too large of a world and a small hole size, but by world hasn't gotten bigger, and I tried increasing the hole size to no avail.

#

Welp, nevermind. Seems restarting my computer worked. Lol

icy ferry Aug 19, 2018, 6:07 AM

#

@signal sinew does you have static marked objects on your scene?
i think occulision works only with static objects

viral marsh Aug 19, 2018, 5:00 PM

#

That’s true

lapis basin Aug 22, 2018, 12:50 PM

#

Quick question, when my world is uploaded, is vrchat recalculating the lightmap again?

#

I'm currently experimenting with the shadowmask mode and one directional mixed light, because i want to have specular highlights but baked shadows on static objects.

#

The problem i noticed is, that batching breaks on some models, when shadows on the dir light are activated, even when baked.

#

when i bake the dir light with shadows on, and after that turn off shadow on the dir light, specularity still works and also the batching works fine again. It seems like mixed lights still do some sort of shadow calculations even on baked objects..

lean lodge Aug 22, 2018, 12:58 PM

#

@lapis basin it shouldn't recalculate anything like that

#

You have Auto Generate turned off, right?

#

You should manually generate once you're actually going to upload

lapis basin Aug 22, 2018, 1:00 PM

#

@lean lodge sweet! thx

acoustic fern Aug 22, 2018, 6:50 PM

#

I've never seen this channel before but I feel like it's really important to say something that gets mixed up a ton with world optimization vs avatar optimization. You don't want to combine all the mesh of a world like you would an avatar. You want many mesh so occlusion works properly. Setting everything as static on non combined mesh lets unity do it's own mesh static mesh batching that will work with occlusion

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 6:52 PM

#

But, if you then light bake all those pieces, many don't get batched together.

#

Two objects in the view of the camera that are separate with the same materials and are marked batch static won't necessarily batch.

#

So there is a balance

acoustic fern Aug 22, 2018, 6:53 PM

#

I haven't experienced that before myself, but I also don't make small objects light map static

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 6:53 PM

#

Small objects don't occlude things 🤔

#

We are talking about things that occlude things

acoustic fern Aug 22, 2018, 6:54 PM

#

I don't understand the the light map stuff well but I've been told not to make small things light map static

lean lodge Aug 22, 2018, 6:57 PM

#

I agree with Mimi

acoustic fern Aug 22, 2018, 6:57 PM

#

So you're saying if to different things have the same material but you light map static it, they might not batch and it seems random? @viral marsh ?

lean lodge Aug 22, 2018, 6:57 PM

#

Regular mesh renderers have a ton of extra optimization options, most notably static batching

#

Which makes it harder to do occlusion culling if you have everything as one big mesh

#

Why not make small stuff lightmap static?

#

Maybe it'll take up more space on the lightmap textures? Lightmap static helps performance if you have any mixed or realtime lights though

acoustic fern Aug 22, 2018, 6:58 PM

#

Well, if everything is one big mesh, nothing will occluded. Owl said it's a balance too, not that either way is wrong or right

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 6:58 PM

#

Read this Rokk, it touches on the topic of small objects https://unity3d.com/learn/tutorials/topics/graphics/introduction-precomputed-realtime-gi

Unity

Introduction to Precomputed Realtime GI - Unity

Unity is the ultimate game development platform. Use Unity to build high-quality 3D and 2D games, deploy them across mobile, desktop, VR/AR, consoles or the Web, and connect with loyal and enthusiastic players and customers.

lean lodge Aug 22, 2018, 6:59 PM

#

I'd say combine meshes on stuff that's small and close by. An example I always found interesting is decorative bottles in a bar. You generally want the bottles on a shelf to be one mesh I thought

#

Alright, thanks

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 6:59 PM

#

Yea, that you want as one mesh. Unless it's pickup of course

#

It all depends on the size and where it's located

acoustic fern Aug 22, 2018, 7:00 PM

#

I mean, if they are all using the same atlased material, the bottles can just be static batched

#

That's technically more performant because half the bottles can be out of view and occluded

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 7:05 PM

#

lol

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https://blogs.unity3d.com/2017/04/03/how-to-see-why-your-draw-calls-are-not-batched-in-5-6/

Unity Technologies Blog

How to see why your draw calls are not batched in 5.6 – Unity Blog

I am sure that you know about Unity’s built-in Dynamic and Static Batching, which help reduce the number of draw calls in your game.
You can see Batching ...

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Look at all the stuff that breaks batching

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•  Additional Vertex Streams — the object has additional vertex streams set using MeshRenderer.additionalVertexStreams.
• Deferred Objects on Different Lighting Layers — the object is on a different light layer.
• Deferred Objects Split by Shadow Distance — one of the objects is within shadow distance, the other one is not.
• Different Combined Meshes — the object belongs to another combined static mesh.
• Different Custom Properties — the object has a different MaterialProperyBlock set.
• Different Lights — the object is affected by a different forward light.
• Different Materials — the object has a different material.
• Different Reflection Probes — the object is affected by a different reflection probe.
• Different Shadow Caster Hash — the objects either have different shadow caster shaders, or have different shader properties / keywords that affect the output of the shadow caster pass.

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• Different Shadow Receiving Settings — the objects either have different “Receive Shadows” settings, or some objects are within the shadow distance, while some other objects are not.
• Different Static Batching Flags — the object has different static batching settings.
• Dynamic Batching Disabled to Avoid Z-Fighting — dynamic batching is turned off in Player • Settings or disabled temporarily in the current context to avoid z-fighting.
• Instancing Different Geometries — rendering different meshes or sub-meshes with GPU instancing.
• Lightmapped Objects — the object uses a different light map or has different light map uv transformations within the same light map.
• Lightprobe Affected Objects — the object is affected by different light probes.
• Mixed Sided Mode Shadow Casters — objects have different “Cast Shadows” settings.
• Multipass — the object is using a multi-pass shader.
• Multiple Forward Lights — the object is affected by multiple forward lights.
• Non-instanceable Property Set — non-instanced properties are set for an instanced shader.
• Odd Negative Scaling — the object has odd negative scaling (e.g. (1, -1, 1)).

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• Shader Disables Batching — the shader explicitly disables batching with the “DisableBatching” tag.
• Too Many Indices in Dynamic Batch — there are too many indices (more than 32k) in a dynamic batch.
• Too Many Indices in Static Batch — there are too many indices in the combined mesh of a static batch. The limit is 48k indices on OpenGL ES, 32k on OSX and 64k on other platforms.
• Too Many Vertex Attributes for Dynamic Batching — a submesh we are trying to dynamically batch has more than 900 vertex attributes.
• Too Many Vertices for Dynamic Batching — a submesh we are trying to dynamically batch has more than 300 vertices.

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I find light probes and light maps to be the things that break batching a lot.

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Once you throw in multiple real time lights turned on at the same time that breaks it too

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 7:08 PM

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Just gonna post what TCL said a while back; https://i.imgur.com/MTl1oNB.png 😛

Imgur

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 7:08 PM

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Batching is brittle when you use all the features

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Exactly

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It's complicated

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Simple broad statements other than what TCL said, are not always easily applied in all cases.

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And for the record. Making those bottles under the bar one mesh is exactly how they are. I found from lots of testing it was the best option.

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Batching was always breaking

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(I'll also note a good number of the important limitations that break batching in that list are fixed/raised in Unity 2017 and 2018)

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Same goes for instancing I think.

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 7:14 PM

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So it's just a case by case set up. One thing might work for you, but not for another.

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 7:14 PM

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👍

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AND - The most important thing is that the client it self is super duper unoptimized

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The best way to optimize a world beyond deleting it as TCL says is to never put anyone in it.

astral sierra Aug 22, 2018, 7:16 PM

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Don't need to optimise if no one goes there

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 7:17 PM

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So pretty much 80% of the worlds in VRChat then ^_^

astral sierra Aug 22, 2018, 7:18 PM

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yep

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😢

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 7:18 PM

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😦

astral sierra Aug 22, 2018, 7:18 PM

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As much as I adore the pug, it would be nice if people broadened their horizons a bit, no offense.

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 7:19 PM

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That 80% rule is true of all media sadly 😦

astral sierra Aug 22, 2018, 7:19 PM

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Ye

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People flock to familiarity

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 7:20 PM

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What type of world it is does play a huge role though in if the world stays populated or not

astral sierra Aug 22, 2018, 7:20 PM

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To a degree

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Even if a world isnt the best variation of it. people will flock to it if they are familiar

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 7:22 PM

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Actually wonder if portal spawn destinations will make other worlds more active (https://vrchat.canny.io/feature-requests/p/give-portals-the-ability-to-set-a-destination-spawn-location)

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 7:23 PM

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I really want that to encourage people to explore more organically

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Or at least to attempt it.

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 7:25 PM

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Zarniwoop typing... (You guys are off topic now :P)

misty pecan Aug 22, 2018, 7:26 PM

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VoxStation has world portals that takes you to other places like that, and yes.

sweet sinew Aug 22, 2018, 7:26 PM

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But it could improve the worlds as people would jump to different places, meaning it would be less people in instance 😉

viral marsh Aug 22, 2018, 7:26 PM

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(sorry, last thing. It's not like that canny requests.)

barren gyro Aug 23, 2018, 5:49 PM

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Lol I'm at the point where I want to build a threadripper just for vrchat light baking.... ahhhh new gpu accelerated unity stuff needed so bad

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anyone know of a plugin for unity 5.6 to speed that up on gpu to bake directional lightmaps?

scenic swallow Aug 23, 2018, 7:00 PM

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@barren gyro There's some diminishing returns on core count with light baking.

barren gyro Aug 23, 2018, 7:03 PM

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indeed. Prorender and other things for the new unity hd render pipeline is giving me bloodlust

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I wonder if maybe setting up a scene in there and then exporting static lightmaps might actually save time

west crag Aug 24, 2018, 7:12 AM

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Woohoo, since nobody goes to my world, my world has become super optimised!

strange prism Aug 24, 2018, 7:13 AM

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So optimized!

frigid pumice Aug 24, 2018, 7:18 AM

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Not one frame wasted!

lilac saddle Aug 24, 2018, 11:05 AM

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One setting people constantly ignore - FAR CLIPPING PLANE (in main camera). Don't leave it at default values, they suck

sweet sinew Aug 24, 2018, 11:06 AM

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This depends on what type of world it is. Default settings is fine for small/medium open worlds. Large open worlds should adjust it to something that works best.

lilac saddle Aug 24, 2018, 11:12 AM

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If it's open, leaving it at 1000 is terrible. That's a tiny sphere to work with, especially for people who make large avatars.

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Some of my avatars are only usable on 2-3 worlds because of this

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Just try putting a proper scaled Star Destroyer in a world

lilac saddle Aug 24, 2018, 12:12 PM

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There's really no reason to leave it at small default values regardless of world size - if here's nothing here it simply won't render it either way.

lean lodge Aug 24, 2018, 12:48 PM

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Wait, you're saying the default far clipping plane is too small? @lilac saddle

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Isn't the default literally 1000?

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My far clipping plane is set to 100 because I don't need it to be any larger. If you really wanna show off obnoxiously large avatars like that, you should probably try a specialized world equipped to deal with that

inland vault Aug 24, 2018, 12:55 PM

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^

fallow flame Aug 24, 2018, 1:21 PM

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I set mine at 128000

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You can always make a new camera with different settings and place that in the VRChatWorld component. Might want to disable other cameras, they might cause performance issues if just left there. Btw my world is big enough to warrant the 128k view distance

inland vault Aug 24, 2018, 1:26 PM

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lmao

empty oar Aug 24, 2018, 8:37 PM

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I usually leave mine under 1000 because it helps with optimisation outside of occlusion

toxic plaza Aug 24, 2018, 8:49 PM

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128k? 😮 what kind of world are you making Caffeine? D:

fallow flame Aug 25, 2018, 5:07 AM

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It was a max-sized terrain generated with some asset store thing. It doesn't look too big, but climbing a mountain would take you like half an hour, and I have a few 1000 of them.
Falling the distance of a mountain takes about 30 seconds

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You can throw a huge object and see how it vanishes to nothing before finally hitting something. Anyways, I'm off for now

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 10:49 AM

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@lean lodge - it's kinda a problem when here's only 2-3 worlds capable of housing such large avatars. AS you say "obnoxiously large" avatars aren't any more performance hogs than tiny ones. Increasing the render distance doesn't negatively affect performance at all - check out Adventure World - it's massive with tons of stuff in it and runs smoohtly.

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And hte point of giant avatars isn't for them to be giant for the sake of size alone, but rather because of scale accuracy.

astral sierra Aug 25, 2018, 10:51 AM

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If render distance didn't affect performance it wouldn't be a thing

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 10:52 AM

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Frustum Culling is a quick and easy way to derender distant objects that you wouldn't be able to see anyway

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If your avatar is more than 1000 meters away it's probably too large to begin with.

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@lilac saddle need I remind you that the SDK limits to 5x7x5 meters for a reason?

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Your player object can't get culled as easily if you're that large

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 10:56 AM

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@lean lodge - If I models something like a Star Destroyer, then no, it being 1000 meters away is not "too big", it's too small. The thing is 2000 meters in length. The whole point of VR is to get to experience things one could not - that inclued the scale of thing. Sure I can have a mini Star Destroyer (and I do), but the point is showing off the true scale of things. I have a set-piece battle, it's supposed to be impressive in size, it is supposed to show off that fictional universe accurately.

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SDK limits are utter s**** in many ways.

astral sierra Aug 25, 2018, 10:57 AM

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You play their game, you follow their rules mate

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 10:58 AM

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Well sorry, but world creators set their clipping planes. Not every avatar works in every world. You can't have a star destroyer in the Great Pug, for example. It's an enclosed indoor area

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I'm sure you can find (or make) a world where you can see up to 10 kilometers away

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I'm probably gonna increase the clipping plane of mine a little bit more than just 100 though

toxic plaza Aug 25, 2018, 11:32 AM

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yup, just make your own private world with clipping plane high. You can test all your large avatars there for the scale and not try to bring it out in public worlds 👍

empty oar Aug 25, 2018, 1:42 PM

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Mate you're supposed to create an avatar not a massive freaking ship. I get you really insist on it for whatever reason, but you're at the wrong place.

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And like its said before. I don't think most people would be too happy to see a huge ship pop up in the first place.

astral sierra Aug 25, 2018, 1:43 PM

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^

toxic plaza Aug 25, 2018, 2:16 PM

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Stuff like that work better as worlds, like why not create the star destroyer for a world and let everyone experience it for themselves 😃 Worlds are great for things like this. You could have it appear in the world and take it one step further and let players fly towards it and board the ship.

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 2:18 PM

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Oh yeah, those drive systems prefabs would be perfect

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 6:57 PM

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@lean lodge Of course, I don't use those avatars in closed, internal worlds because here's no expectation for them to work. But most open worlds have short range. It's depressing to work on a great avatar only to have it only work on 2-3 worlds (no joke. I found 3 worlds so far)

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@toxic plaza - what's the point of making avatars if no one gets to see them?

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Also, while oyu cna make a worlkd for that, it is also very limtied in other regards.

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Set pieces convey the scale without the need for excessive details

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Also, the problem is when you make a world and no one visits it...with an avatar you can go where the people are

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 7:01 PM

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(Well, you just need to make a good world to get people to visit it)

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 7:02 PM

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A good world won't necessarily get visited much

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Unless it blows everything else out of the water in some regard

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 7:02 PM

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That all depends on how you define good

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I left it vague

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 7:02 PM

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There's a lot of good worlds out there that just aren't being visited much because there's no one in them

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It's a self sustaining cycle

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 7:03 PM

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Well, impressing the review team helps.

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 7:03 PM

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How so?

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You mean it'll get community spotlight?

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 7:03 PM

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Yes

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 7:03 PM

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As long as it doesn't have any copyrighted content that is

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But that's a grey area to begin with

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 7:03 PM

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Lol, or at least they don't know it is copyrighted

toxic plaza Aug 25, 2018, 7:52 PM

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@lilac saddle why is a world more limited than an avatar? You can also drop a portal where people are too and its less annoying than having a star ship destroyer take up the entire world when no one asked for it.
"what's the point of making avatars if no one gets to see them?" - what you're describing doesn't really sound like an avatar anyways xD Honestly, I think what you've described would work better as a world, give you more flexibility with what you can do too or you can just keep complaining and get annoyed that no one will cater their world for your avatar. You could even create a basic world like lag free box , knock the walls out and make the render distance huge. Just make sure to stick a mirror in there and it will be a popular world.

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 7:58 PM

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Making a world is pointless is people don't want to visit.

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 7:59 PM

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That's not our fault?

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 7:59 PM

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Also, I have tried several times to set the occlusion in my own world higher, but it still doesnt' work

sweet sinew Aug 25, 2018, 7:59 PM

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Occlusion and Camera clipping plane is two different things though

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 7:59 PM

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Is VR chat overriding my settings? What the hell is going on. Even in my own world it's not working

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 7:59 PM

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Hmm, but someone here mentioned having their far plane set to 128k

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 8:00 PM

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I have mine at 50000 and it's exactly as any default world . I tested it and noticed my model cust of at exact same places.

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 8:00 PM

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Did you set the camera as the reference camera in the scene descriptor?

lean lodge Aug 25, 2018, 8:00 PM

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Did you set the main camera as reference camera in the VRC_Scene Descriptor component?

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Oof

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 8:00 PM

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Actually, let me provide a screenshot

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@lean lodge .........

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DOH!

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 8:22 PM

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Woo... seems that i worked now

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Still, I'd appreciate i if more people made their worlds more render-distance friendly. It doesn't cost anyone anything to increase that number, it's just that no one seems to know about it. It really should be in the tutorials.

strange prism Aug 25, 2018, 8:24 PM

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It does cost though?

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It means more things will be drawn and can mess with occlusion culling.

lilac saddle Aug 25, 2018, 10:39 PM

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How can more things be drawn if you world is less than 1km in size already? Setting the draw distance to 50000000000000 will make no difference since there's nothing to draw - except things player bring in. Or if you have sea.

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Testing with 100000 distance and no performance changes in my world....despite people spamming effects and emotes

toxic plaza Aug 25, 2018, 11:54 PM

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you're assuming everyones world is smaller than the default amount though

fallow flame Aug 26, 2018, 12:07 AM

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I'm the one with it on 128k lol. Avatars shake a bit though, it seems that the feature of resetting the coordinate system doesn't work (it's a checkbox on the teleport trigger)

lilac saddle Aug 27, 2018, 1:13 AM

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Havin a world issue. I've made a world but every time i try going into my world it just sends me back home?

fair agate Aug 27, 2018, 2:10 AM

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Does it work in local test?

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If so, detach id and reupload

lilac saddle Aug 27, 2018, 2:40 AM

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For some reason its just a premade unity package. but when i do it without it it works perfectly fine. Im not sure.

lilac saddle Aug 27, 2018, 5:46 AM

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After hours of doing it i finally got it!

covert pewter Aug 27, 2018, 6:09 AM

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@empty oar Most poeple won't be happy to see a huge ship? Where did you get that statistic from? You made a poll I'm not aware off? Maybe you should stop assuming everyone shares your views. Do you think most peopel are happy with the current avatars? The onboxiously loud rap music and shaders that affect you even if you look way? The obscene particel spam avatars?

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And since when does anyone have to be happy with my avatar?

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They don't - it's not a requirement

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I've seen people deliberately chrash of block other people just because they didn't like that persons avatar, even if that person did nothing obnoxious and his avatar was normal (for example, plain old knuckles avatar user just talking about a movie with someone)

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So yeah, if someoen doesn't like my vatar, he's free to look in the other direction or block me

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@toxic plaza - nah, my world is larger tha most. If you want to test a big world, go to Adventure World. It is HUUUGE, fileld with particles and emmiters and models, has a huge render distance and I get no slowdowns ever. EVen when I bring in my most demanding model and spam them with a friend.

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@fallow flame - do the avatars shake normally or in some special case? I have my distance set to 100.000 and the only time I notice avatars "shake" is when they fly around the island on a jet fighter plane that goes stupidly fast

fallow flame Aug 27, 2018, 6:33 AM

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They shake all the time, but it gets worse every 1000 units they move from spawn. It could be because I have the far clip plane on 128k and near clip plane on something like 0.01

toxic plaza Aug 27, 2018, 8:40 AM

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they shake due to floating point errors. Its a combination of the world being far away from the origin point (0,0,0 in transform) or just way too big for unity and/or the scale of objects being bigger than 3 decimals from what I remember (like 100.829238420282 for example) The world is basically shrinking and eventually the instance will crash.

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pickups will also shake too if this is the case though

empty oar Aug 27, 2018, 2:14 PM

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^ the shaking cant be fixed. Its not a unity specific issue either. Besides TrashMan. What you're saying is "if others can annoy people with things, then why can't i?!", you may wanna think about it for a sec

lilac saddle Aug 27, 2018, 3:49 PM

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is it possible to have 3 VRCVideoSync players in the same world, if they only play music and not video?

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in regards to player desync

sharp palm Aug 27, 2018, 10:33 PM

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is it normal for 20 baked lights to cause 1200 draw calls?

willow spoke Aug 27, 2018, 11:14 PM

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No, not at all. Check out this video for a ton of tips on how to optimize that, it includes some stuff with lightmaps https://youtu.be/belVA1C013A

YouTube

Oculus

Oculus Connect 4 | Too Close to Draw Call: Pushing Unity to Max Pe...

Mobile VR optimization is a tricky process. Making frame rate while operating within strict thermal limitations is a tall order, even for veteran developers....

▶ Play video

sharp palm Aug 27, 2018, 11:31 PM

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Thank you, will check it out Rn

south socket Aug 28, 2018, 9:27 PM

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so, I'm splitting up the PSO2 hub right now

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I'm running into a weird thing here

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without the shop, the world size is 167 megs. With it, its 187 megs

bold nymph Aug 28, 2018, 9:34 PM

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in my RO worlds, the texture makes up the space, maybe shop and lobby shares some texture?

south socket Aug 28, 2018, 9:34 PM

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I think they do

bold nymph Aug 28, 2018, 9:35 PM

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animations also sometimes the culprit

south socket Aug 28, 2018, 9:37 PM

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huh, its the occlusion culling according to the log

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that makes a bit more sense there

bold nymph Aug 28, 2018, 9:50 PM

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🤔

south socket Aug 28, 2018, 9:58 PM

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yeah, kinda my reaction settling in

south socket Aug 28, 2018, 10:55 PM

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occlusion shouldnt be taking this long

strange prism Aug 28, 2018, 11:08 PM

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It can depending on your settings.

south socket Aug 28, 2018, 11:15 PM

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oh, it just finished

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took a good hour and a half there

supple nymph Aug 29, 2018, 2:32 AM

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Does anyone have good settings for mirrors in vrc i want to make it so everything is hidden excpet for everyone's avatars. like in the lag free box etc. also is there a way to make the avatars lite up they are dark in the reflection of the mirror.

strange prism Aug 29, 2018, 2:35 AM

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Avatars only settings: Mirror Reflection (you only) + Players (Everyone else)

limpid kayak Aug 29, 2018, 10:52 PM

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Noob question but does Unity benefit from using multiples of the same instance over many unique ones?

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Or if multiple objects use the same material or textures, they will share the resources for them?

lean lodge Aug 29, 2018, 10:55 PM

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You mean prefab instances? Yeah, Unity tends to benefit from that

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Multiple objects can share materials if they're marked static

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But it's better to have them as one mesh if that's the case

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If possible of course

limpid kayak Aug 29, 2018, 10:56 PM

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A map I'm working on might have many props like jars and chests of different sizes and I'm thinking of how to save on it. I guess they'd be static so one mesh should do

lean lodge Aug 29, 2018, 10:56 PM

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Static batching can take care of a lot of that for you, but making them one mesh is more reliable.

empty oar Aug 29, 2018, 10:57 PM

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Prefabs and materials (can) get instanced if you check it

lean lodge Aug 29, 2018, 10:57 PM

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Instancing is incompatible with static batching

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Instancing can be done for dynamic objects

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Such as pickups

empty oar Aug 29, 2018, 10:58 PM

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Yeah. My bad, I answered before reading everything.

limpid kayak Aug 29, 2018, 10:58 PM

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One plan was an instance with visemes or bones to change the shapes around and a material with different colours. So one jar could be made into several

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But I guess that would require an animator component

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Sorry, dumb ideas I thought were good way back

wise dagger Aug 29, 2018, 11:49 PM

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What setting would it be if some said they are having issues with tiny avatars rendering when they get close to their face? Aka a tiny avatars iser said they can't see their own hands unless they hold them all the way out

pearl temple Aug 29, 2018, 11:52 PM

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that should be the viewball on the avatar, not a world-specific setting

lean lodge Aug 29, 2018, 11:59 PM

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@wise dagger @pearl temple that is actually world-specific to some extent

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The default near clipping plane of the camera is 0.3 meters. You could decrease it to 0.1

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That is, if you even want to support avatars that small

pearl temple Aug 30, 2018, 12:00 AM

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ah, my bad, thought that was the default >.>

lean lodge Aug 30, 2018, 12:01 AM

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But I think bad things happen if you set it too close

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0.3 sounds fine to me

scenic swallow Aug 30, 2018, 12:08 AM

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VRChat restricts the near clip to between 0.05 and 0.01.

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The default is 0.05