#New work in progress section

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

slim widget
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Thought that it was gonna suck, but it's actually pretty decent. Atleast now you can keep the project updates all in one place. But I think there still should be some flex type section like the old work in progress where you could just post whatever you have made in unreal. Like new comers and beginner friendly because previous work in progress section had posts almost everyday.

woven copper
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You can post the same thing in there that you could before

slim widget
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yeah but not really

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you know what I mean - those random no caption posts of any kind of creativity small or big no matter

fathom stream
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the organization is nice but besides that it, otherwise it's just worse in every way. Videos and gifs not animating in the gallery makes it basically useless from the getgo, should just be deleted tbh.

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also looks like the op never updates with new pictures either so it's actually completely worthless if we're not allowed to make a new thread each time lol

grand sapphire
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Bumping this one again because while it seemed like a good idea I have noticed the interaction in there has dropped to virtually nothing like 15 posts since it released, compared to the old work in progress that has multiple a day.

slim widget
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yeah it's missing daily flex spam and beginners posting their stuff

craggy sigil
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I agree, I liked the chat in there as well, seeing how other people reacted to some of the posts in there. Now you have to open each post to see the chat, which is much less active.

fathom stream
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3 months later it's still completely dead but we're still using it lmao

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gg

slim widget
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yeah

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when you go away for a month or two, come back and still see the same posts it's pretty sad

wanton charm
slim widget
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oh yeah it was recently active

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but anyway it's still pretty dead so you still see the same old posts

wanton charm
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If you sort by recently active, that would explain why you frequently see the same posts.

slim widget
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yeah I know, that's what I meant by "it was recently active" or I should have probably said it was on recently active setting

wanton charm
slim widget
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it's dead if you compare it to the old type of it

wanton charm
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What gives you that impression?

slim widget
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when you scroll and see posted before 2days, 5days, 14days and so on

wanton charm
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Keep in mind: you're seeing things differently now. Before, all activity for the channel was in one scrolling feed. Now each project has its own post, so the activity is spread out.

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I've been watching the analytics since converting to a forum, and I have not seen a significant drop in activity for the channel.

slim widget
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50/50

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but it feels dead

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it's missing the convos when people could jump in and offer some advice or critique

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ofcourse sometimes in the old section it went into spam but still

wanton charm
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Indeed.

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So in the current form, you feel like you can't give advice for critique anymore?

slim widget
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you can but it's not as interactive as before

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that's what made old work of progress different, instead of the unreal engine forum work of progress/showcase section

wanton charm
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Hm. I wouldn't say it is less interactive, but the flow has changed. You scroll down instead of up, and you always see images first before conversations.

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Maybe removing conversation from the initial interaction is what feels off to you (and others).

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My primary intention was to make it easier to see all the cool things people are making. It's a different mindset: browse the posts, click on the ones that grab your eye, and begin chatting if you want to give advice/critique.

slim widget
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yeah it's good that way

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to keep people updated and stuff

wanton charm
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Yeah. And I was curious if people would post more updates for the same project since each one gets a whole thread now.

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And people interested in seeing them progress over time could follow that thread.

fathom stream
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sorting it by new shows just how dead it is

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5 posts yesterday

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2 the day before

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1 the day before that

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3 the daybefore that

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meanwhile "recently active" youre at 1 day ago after 5 entries

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idk what analytics youre looking at but that's absolutely dead

teal pilot
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In fairness that isn't exceptionally or dramatically less activity than the previous work-in-progress channel. However it is noticeably less activity nonetheless. I believe it's mostly due to people having to structure their introductory posts better than previously, before it was a lot of people just posting a screenshot and saying "made this", and mostly not being commented on or talked about beyond that.

The new system allows for a larger and continuous conversation to potentially take place, However the keyword is potential. Most posts are not living up to that potential.

My immediate reaction is not that this is better or worse than what we had before, but it does solve some of the existing problems and introduces a few new ones. I'd look at how to make the current system better, rather than going back to the previous more flawed system though.

I believe we can put more energy into how to make that experience better for both posters and viewers, and that would yield more satisfactory results.

fathom stream
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there is basically never a reason for a art wip to have an accompanying wall of text

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this is a visual medium, you take the screenshot and that's it outside of a few very specific edge cases

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maybe say like 3 words if there's something specific you want to draw attention to

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no serious artist is writing essays about their screenshot like this is a mandatory 5 paragraphs of text highschool assignment about the picture lmao

grand sapphire
slim widget
fathom stream
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the only people I ever see writing essays to go with their picture usually have utter garbage pictures

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outside of like really impressive coding accomplishments like here i made 1000 mannequins running around on the screen or w/e

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where anyone clicking the video would be sitting there like wtf is this garbage without the explanation

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a wall of text is basically never a positive lol

fathom stream
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which was always dead because people generally dont finish big projects every day

slim widget
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basically the newbie part of work in progress section has been killed and now you just need to keep it up and post more or less decent quality stuff

fathom stream
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im not new and I'm not using it anymore because it's just a shit format

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it's literally forums which no one uses anymore slapped into the glorified irc that everyone moved back to

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and given how much deader it is than before im clearly not the only one lol

grand sapphire
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Very true, but even in the old WIP channel I never noticed much about in progress environment art

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It is definitely deader than usual

fathom stream
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go open the archived thread lol

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literally half of the content is environment art

grand sapphire
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Scrolling up it now most of it is game stuff and finished art which is what the current one is

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Still not seeing much in progress updates on purely art

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I am sad though about it. While the new format has made it easier to keep up with things I like, there's just so much less activity

summer cradle
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It removes the "casual"ness of it, which is the entire point of DIscord, imo.

grand sapphire
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Yeah

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You shouldn't have to make a pitch to get some interaction

summer cradle
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It'd be better if threads were enabled for that channel

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I used threads a hell of a lot and never have issues.

fathom stream
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19 content posts in a week lol

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it's still deader than dead

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just get rid of it already geez

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it's an awful format for wip

potent solstice
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I think forums are entirely out of place for the most part in a platform like Discord, they serve a very niche purpose given its realtime nature.

With that said, we did muse on the choice to move these topics to forums over quite a large amount of time with a not insignificant input from a portion of the community.

It had made moderation and organization much easier.

While reverting this change might be a simple operation, the discontinuity that it creates, among other issues that come along with it, is a problem.

wanton charm
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#1054845120236757103 is one of our most popular channels. It is far from dead, and the format seems to be working just fine.

teal pilot
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it's the 8th most popular read channel on the server and as for chatters it's just below the 10th most popular channel

fathom stream
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3.8 a day

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literally every time i have gone and casually looked to see if you've gotten rid of this format yet it has been the same

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usually less lol

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when it was a regular channel there were far more people posting things

wanton charm
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I don't know what else to tell you. You are mistaken about the channel being dead.

fathom stream
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i literally just counted it

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now go to the old wip channel

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go back to the day before you closed it

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there's like 17 content posts

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in one day

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3.8 < 17

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there's probably like a duplicate or two from the same person because i just counted that in like 5 seconds

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but the difference is clear

wanton charm
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You need a larger data set than that to understand the difference. I have to get ready to host a meetup, but I will share some data with you later to give you a better idea.

fathom stream
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i mean i dont know what analytics youre looking at man

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but this is a server of nearly 100k

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and every time I have opened the new wip section since you added it the amount of content posts per day can be counted on one hand

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like i just looked at the polycount discord which has less than a 10th of the population of this one

grand sapphire
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By the same token though it's keeping engagement to one channel

fathom stream
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and their wip has the same level of activity lol

grand sapphire
fathom stream
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like it's a great format for final things but it's awful for random progress pictures of whatever someone happens to be working on at any given moment, doubly so if that progress picture is a gif since they dont embed on the thumbnail anymore

limpid remnant
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I also support this. There's been a few times I've been working on something and posted it to a different server because it was something that didn't deserve a whole thread like the current WIP channel but I still wanted to show off some dumb random thing I made

drifting summit
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also something to note is that the threads itself dont get much engagement. the volume of threads may be fine in some metric but most threads there get like 2-3 comments before they die out.

Now im aware this problem is exacerbated in a single channel but single channels work much better for free flowing organic conversations. To that effect i think a "casual WIP lounge" or something could be introduced. something where you can just show off part of your work along with others and not have to dedicate an entire thread to it

summer cradle
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A pinned post in teh forum where you can just post whatever might work?

wanton charm
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I am having trouble understanding. What is intimidating about creating a thread for your project and sharing multiple WIP shots there over time?

drifting summit
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a thread feels like it deserves more than just that

grand sapphire
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I can agree with that. It feels more like it's for continuos updates ant to follow a project, and is less friendly to "look at this cool thing" posts.

summer cradle
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A forum post is heavier and more formal than just a channel you chat in.

wanton charm
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Interesting. So it seems there are at least two different demographics here: one who wants to share a WIP screenshot or video and get serious feedback from their peers, and one who wants to casually interact with peers and frequently show things they are making, like sharing cool things with your friends.

summer cradle
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Something like that, yes.

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Or you get the people who want to be the former, but lack the confidence to do it.

fathom stream
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or one of those people who writes a huge block of text accompanying a usually mediocre uninteresting picture

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unless there is a good reason to actually include a paragraph of explanation there is hardly ever a reason to include any text whatsoever

wanton charm
fathom stream
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also that + the lack of animation in the thread format makes it objectively inferior for sharing lol

wanton charm
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And it seems we have completely different ideas of what it means to post a WIP shot and expect feedback.

wanton charm
fathom stream
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i mean gifs

wanton charm
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Gifs autoplay.

fathom stream
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no they dont

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not unless you open the thread lol

wanton charm
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My experience has been different.

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Scroll down until you see this post and tell me if it autoplays for you.

image.png
fathom stream
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ok that must be new

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because it didnt do that before

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hold that thought

wanton charm
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They added an accessibility setting for reduced motion a while back, so I thought maybe you had that enabled.

fathom stream
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gifs autoplay

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mp4s gifvs and videos do not

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so no it is still just objectively worsel ol

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autoplays

wanton charm
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That would be subjective, but I understand. You want videos to autoplay like a text channel.

fathom stream
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if i made a thread for it it wouldnt

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and ive been doing this a long time dude

wanton charm
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Doing what?

fathom stream
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i have NEVER before here seen a quick wip section

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where it was hey just make your own thread

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it was a big thread where people just posted whatever they happened to be working on at any given moment

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gamedev, modding, art etc etc

wanton charm
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I see. So are you expecting something like Polycount's WAYWO threads?

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As opposed to the dedicated threads people make?

fathom stream
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i mean im expecting something like what we had before and what literally every other discord does

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it was a BETTER format for hey this is what im doing right this second

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the thread system is GREAT for releases

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like massively better

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but it's awful for wip

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and the lack of proper embedding is also a huge negative

wanton charm
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You mean autoplay videos.

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That's a big plus for you in a WIP channel?

fathom stream
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videos like what i just posted yes

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discord channels embed gifv and mp4s like that

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the thread thumbnail does not

wanton charm
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Correct.

fathom stream
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literally the only time i use gifs is for unreal forums

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because for some reason in 2023 they still dont let you embed and autoplay modern formats

wanton charm
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Can't disagree with you there. Gifs are still really popular, but I agree mp4 and gifv are both far better.

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They look better and they're a lot smaller.

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I think people that still use gifs do so because it's what they know and they don't see a reason to change.

fathom stream
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i mean i dont see them outside of forum usage that doesnt allow better formats either lol

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or to get around twitter's godawful video compression

wanton charm
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Ugh, yeah. That's a whole different can of worms. Twitter video compression is terrible.

fathom stream
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but yeah like i specifically just dont use the wip section here anymore

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whenever i go to post something i remember oh ive got to make a thread and write some bullshit and this is more effort than I want to think about

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because I wanna go back to getting shit done

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please go back lol

wanton charm
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Right. So you like the old WIP channel because you prefer to just toss a screenshot or video of your latest thing without explanation, correct?

fathom stream
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yup

wanton charm
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In the old channel, how often did you browse other people's WIPs and give them feedback?

fathom stream
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i usually only opened it when i was going to post but if I saw something at the time that I liked or had something useful to say about id respond to it

wanton charm
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Interesting.

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Well, if there are more people like you (I am sure there are), then we need to figure out a different solution because a lot of people read the new WIP channel. The people on the other side of this coin — the people who browse WIPs to see what others are working on — seems to like the format.

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Maybe we can figure out a middle ground that is good for both demographics.

fathom stream
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just run them side by side

wanton charm
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Two channels? A WIP chat and a WIP forum?

fathom stream
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sure

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why not

wanton charm
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It could work. We've discussed that option. I am worried about UX in that case, because now there are two places to post WIP shots. That's not a great experience for someone who is new here.

fathom stream
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i want to say that this is a gamedev community and that limits the lower bound level user brain damage

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but previous experience has taught me that that is absolutely not true

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all I can really say is that anyone who is too stupid to be able to open both, see the different formats, and figure out which one is best to post in probably was never going to contribute anything worthwhile in the first place

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so I wouldnt worry about it

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just put them next to each other on the list so it's organized

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and people can click through both to read

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put a little blurb about oh this section is for regular projects or people who want to contain stuff in one thread for easy following

wanton charm
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We're going to discuss it more before reaching a decision, but if we do end up going the two-channel route, the forum will almost definitely be renamed. It would be ridiculous to leave them both as work-in-progress.

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Thanks for your input.

fathom stream
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call the thread one ongoing projects then or something to that effect

wanton charm
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I see people using it for basically dev logs. Maybe we will lean into that.

fathom stream
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that's a good use for it

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encourage people link from the chat channel to the their own thread so that they can follow them there idk

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i wouldnt use it for that because everyone has a twitter or w/e where you can follow them better

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but it's not far off from that experience i guess?

wanton charm
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I guess so. I thought the same thing. Why not do this on social media or your own website? But then again, to many, this is a social media channel and there are a lot of Unreal folks here, so people will want to post where the eyeballs are.

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Plus it's free to start a thread here.

grand sapphire
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I'd just like to throw my 2 cents in. Its understandable not wanting to run two channels so there could be a moderator pinned forum post that essentially acts like the old wip

potent solstice
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Otherwise we might have already done so.

grand sapphire
potent solstice
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Forums and Threads leave a lot to be desired, which is why this issue is an issue.

grand sapphire
potent solstice
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In my opinion, I dislike Threads (for use in this server) purely for their difficulty in moderation.

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Its easy enough to scan through a channel or forum topics

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But to enter each thread as well.

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Just multiplies the issue

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Granted, I havent read that feedback post in its entirety

grand sapphire
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Yeah that makese sense.

potent solstice
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I am taking it at face value

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Because of threads.

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So there maybe points being made that could change my opinion.

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But I doubt it lol

grand sapphire
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Which now sounds unfeasible because of the weird discord limit

potent solstice
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Runs into the same issue

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Threads also have the same limitation

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Forums are almost quite literally just dressed up Threads

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From a technical perspective

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AFAIK

grand sapphire
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Why can't discord just roll out a good implementation of a feature for once :/

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Oh i take that back, customisable channel lists were nice :P

potent solstice
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A question I also ask myself