In our game, we have datatables of asset references to blueprints
#ue4-general
south ridge
One datatable = one set
When using the blueprint set, you specify a set and a subset within it (alternatively, datatable is just a list of all things)
sage inlet
what i currently have in mind is to have a csv for weapon "templates", and probably create a blueprint object that can reference the weapon table to get it's parameters
livid haven
Yeah, potentially.
sage inlet
i don't plan on equipment being too dynamic so i feel this approach could keep it simple enough for me
livid haven
Again, data tables are really there to support a workflow from Excel/CSV etc. The kind of thing where a designer wants to look at all the data in one place and tweak it in the context of other values.
sage inlet
and that sounds just about right for what i'm looking for!
livid haven
Even potentially chart it in their table editor of choice to visualize a curve, like power.
Cool
Just don't try to make the data table be the entirety of your data - it's absurd to put asset references in a data table. You're either asking your designer to specify hard-coded asset references in text form in their Excel/CSV file... or asking someone to edit the imported tables to set those asset references, which means the next table import will nuke those asset references.
sage inlet
so the data table should only hold static values?
livid haven
I don't know what you mean by static values in this context.
sage inlet
i'm only going to input numbers and item names into the data table, that would probably be just fine right?
livid haven
Yeah, that sounds fine to me.
keen pawn
Hey guys just wondering if any of you can point me in the right direction here
have our game looking really nice apart from one lighting issue
for some reason im not getting the lighting that i desire when the directional lighting is blocked
it almost seems to have 0 bounces
you can see what i mean, the stuff coming through the windows looks great
floral heart
If you're not baking it with lightmass, it will have 0 boucnmes.
keen pawn
anything else not directly in its path has like 0 shadowing
floral heart
Also bounces.
keen pawn
ok havent heard of baking with lightmass before?
also is there a bounces setting that i can change
plush yew
Does your directional light need to move at all? Any day/night cycles?
floral heart
There is a bounces setting to change. Also, lightmass bakes every static light and stationary light when you build light, so you could very well be using lightmass already and it's something else wrong entirely.
keen pawn
erm no cycles needed atm although we would probably like to look into that in the future
where abouts is this bounce setting?
plush yew
Any dynamics lights such as lights that need to move?
floral heart
World Settings > Lightmass Settings
In 4.18 there's two bounce settings now, a general one (cheap) and one for skylights (expensive)
@trail atlas That's noble, but #lounge is more appropriate for political agendas.
trail atlas
gothca
floral heart
Are the spots movable?
keen pawn
nah static
i have just tweeked the bouces
bounces*
doing another build now
hmmm
still the same :(
floral heart
Are the objects movable?
plush yew
You won't be able to use lightmass if your stuff is movable
Lightmass is for static objects
cloud cobalt
Though Lightmass also bakes information for moving objects
But not directly lighting, yes.
floral heart
Focus on SSAO and possibly capsule shadows. A small number of shadow casting lights is possible, if your target hardware is gaming desktops.
keen pawn
hmmm
so basically my issue is, because the objects are movable it means the lighting wont display correctly?
plush yew
The lighting is correct, it's just not what you want
floral heart
Movable objects can only obstruct movable/stationary lights, because static lighting has to be baked on the assumption movable objects won't be there.
floral heart
SSAO and capsule shadows are ways to address this. SSAO is mediocre looking, but the most widely supported.
soft garden
buon giorno
frank escarp
distance field AO too
floral heart
I thought DFAO was only for skylights.
Though, now that you mention it, it looks like he's constrained to objects within a warehouse. Exclude the walls from DFAO and then the 'skylight' could use a cubemap of the warehouse interior.
frank escarp
DFAO works on interiors i think
quasi lake
Anykone knows why even if I closed the falling deceleration
My character still gets deceleration
The horizontal deceleration always appears
Anyone knows anything about air movement stuff?
paper kernel
lateral air friction
paper kernel
not falling
quasi lake
gesus
Thanks the god you
I love you bros,I love discord
Things not working right again,emmm
OK I know wth is going on
Braking friction also counts during falling state
Oh come on why a character would get friction in the air
Anyway found where the problem is I can change the friction during the air
inner merlin
Hi guys, im currently working on my masters degree and need some help, can anyone reccomend a tutorial for making a NPC shoot at the player? I have already blueprinted random patrols and to chase the player when the npc spots you but I am having trubble with finding a tutorial that just covers the shooting (the project is a first person shooter)
quasi lake
There you go
Official demo
In english it should be learning or study
@inner merlin
For a tutorial video
I recommend an ai series videos
This tutorial covers shooting and npc shoots at you
inner merlin
thank you @quasi lake ill have a look into it ๐
plush yew
anyone ever have tihs issue
where like
i have ultra dynamic sky, replicated in editor, and in a single landscape... but in a tiled landscape using world composoition its not replicating the changes
very strange!
digital root
whole quarry
@fierce tulip Thanks for the stream! I learned a lot again โค
fierce tulip
np, I enjoy explaining stuff while streaming. it helps understanding things better myself :p
kindred viper
@fierce tulip if you ever fancy doing a stream on bullet particle physics and trails, for things such as air distortion, trails from a rail gun, etc. I know this dude who would watch that. ๐
fierce tulip
i dont really do actual bullet/fps stuff, not really my forte. but i'll consider it ๐
plush yew
@fierce tulip happy bday man
shell jetty
Particle world there is luos birthday?
fierce tulip
last birthday I put all my marketplace stuff 33% off and every time someone followed my channel I would put on more ribbons and other crap on my head
paper kernel
๐ค
pallid compass
-does a flip-
Just got a new two bedroom house
to covert in to new studio
๐
paper kernel
cat meow fx pack is not on discount :sadface:
pallid compass
wth is meow fx pack ;o
surreal viper
now I kinda wanna build a game around these voices
but I have already too much to do ๐ข
pallid compass
dam im not finding anything super aweasome in cyber monday sale
god dam im so tempted to pick up luos four elements
TAKE MY PENNIES LUOS
wary wave
I might have picked up some of the pretty photoscanned assets, but none of them were on sale
pallid compass
what ones?
plush yew
@wary wave u ever had custom art done for ur game
some dude wants to charge me $400 for four sets of clothing which are skin bound to my skeleton
hon estly dont know if thats even a good deal
i feel like i could purchase FBX files from unity store
and do it myself
lmao
wary wave
all of my games have used custom art
wary wave
that's a very 'how long is a piece of string' question
$400 could be entirely appropriate depending on quality and time
plush yew
mhm
plush yew
Lol
wary wave
assuming a 10 hour job, it's $40 an hour, which isn't unreasonable
plush yew
but i mean...
i get paid $25 an hounr irl
lel
im not gonna pay someone more than what i get paidf
fuk that
pallid compass
true that
plush yew
unless u have worked on a AAA game
wary wave
if you want someone who is more skilled than you are, be prepared to pay them more than you earn, hehe
wary wave
wat
plush yew
i mean unless ur shitting mona lisa's out of ur ass
i ask someone to do art and they say "Can u tell me how it should look"
pallid compass
wat
pallid compass
Art artists, Technical artists, and creation artists are 3 dif things
wary wave
and also, if you have a client, you kind of want to meet their expectations
wary wave
you don't go to a programmer 'hey make a game for me' - and then get confused when they ask what kind of game it should be
plush yew
oh but dude
wary wave
ยฏ_(ใ)_/ยฏ
wary wave
wat
wary wave
it really isn't
plush yew
it is tho
pallid compass
wtf no its not lmao
plush yew
programmers get like $60-100k salary... Character artists get like $80-130k a year
according to indeed.com
๐
pallid compass
How long do u think
frosty copper
wary wave
like indeed.com is a reliable resource
pallid compass
because they really dont
wary wave
also Character artists are fairly specialised
pallid compass
Programmers are there from start to finish
plush yew
i mean lets all be honest here
ok so like
In reality, in game dev you could replace a programmer but getting a unique art style is sometimes irreplacable
plush yew
fml my spelling lel
plush yew
its true
pallid compass
do u know how hard it is to intergrate a programmer on already pre built system
plush yew
it happened at my last job lolol
they replaced
this one dude
and get someone cheaper
but he did the same shit
but they took him because he was cheaper
thats literally it
XD
frosty copper
can I just ask.
frosty copper
What the absolute fuck, did I come in to?
plush yew
@pallid compass not even lol
pallid compass
Man there is someone people in here that are x10 better programmer than me
pallid compass
but if i swapped positions with them using the GAS system from epic
whole quarry
Hey โ Watch that language ๐
pallid compass
it would take them weeks to catch up
frosty copper
@whole quarry Teh fookin' rools m8, say light profanities are okay. ๐
Unless I was speaking French somewhere? ๐ฎ
plush yew
@pallid compass i definitely agree
pallid compass
imo way harder to replace a programmer than a artist
if the project is already x deep
and isent simple af ofc
plush yew
at my current job theres literally one engineer for this product and if he were to die... that would literally be a loss of $5,000,000 for this company (they bought the software from another company as well as him lol)
I agree when it comes to unique products
but when it comes to something like unreal
frosty copper
I dunno @pallid compass , depends how well documented the code is imo~?
fierce tulip
hehe, one of the projects I worked on had to replace the lead coder almost at the end of the project. the guy almost had a breakdown due to how the other guy coded hehe
pallid compass
same can be said for artists then
cloud cobalt
I've never heard of a company that paid artists more than programmers on average
pallid compass
same
cloud cobalt
Hell, my previous job had basically twice the pay for programmers
plush yew
@fierce tulip im tellin u lol
also
why the fuck
are producers being paid
$82,000
pallid compass
bdoom i think uv gone mad bro
plush yew
WHAT THE LIVING FUCK?
a producer is literally just a dude who sits around telling peoplme what to do
... unless im mistaken
lmao
cloud cobalt
Because producers are directly responsible for how much money the project ends up costing
frosty copper
๐
pallid compass
cus if u dun goof, everyone suffers
cloud cobalt
Good producers are here to streamline the development and making sure no one idles for 6 months while other teams stay in crunch for all the project
Which is costly, on top of being bad for everyone
plush yew
yea
essentially what im saying
hes like
literally his job is to make sure ur not wasting company money
lol
that's it
but i feel like anyone could do that
cloud cobalt
I can testify that not many people are good at that job
pallid compass
u need experiance
pallid compass
and normally need to know a bit about every aspect of production right?
plush yew
they shouldnt be getting paid any more than an artist
wary wave
scheduling large complex projects isn't that easy
pallid compass
ima guess its also your job to help stream line and push for effective workflow and time
frosty copper
I honestly doubt if they were that useless, they would still be around in every project
cloud cobalt
If you need a producer on a project, his salary is pretty much irrelevant, because you're going to spend his annual salary on every week the project runs late
wary wave
managing a long chain of dependencies that involves tens (or more) people is a skill in itself
plush yew
honestly idk man
maybe im just pissed
that someones being paid more than me
and doing less work
wary wave
especially in an industry like games where things change on a woefully frequent basis
cloud cobalt
If you have a team of 50 people, one week of additional development is a full time year-long job value that you lost
Just math
surreal viper
less work lol
cloud cobalt
So when you have 100 people, and your producer makes the team 2% more efficient ? You've gained money
plush yew
mhm
frosty copper
"doing less work"
cloud cobalt
2% is really not a high bar
surreal viper
organizing stuff is work
wary wave
Producers don't tell you to work
they tell what needs to be worked on, by whom, and when
frosty copper
Saying "do work" is not the same as "we need X models"
^ what the terquioise guy said
plush yew
"Make these models because i dont have any skills to actually make models im just here to tell u to make models"
cloud cobalt
@plush yew I have to ask : have you ever worked professionally with a large team ? Talking 10+
pallid compass
god help u if u ever run your own company lmao
wary wave
even managing 4-5 people on a decent sized project is effort
frosty copper
^ can relate. x_x
pallid compass
i run small shitty company, with small studio
and even i have project manager
to make life easier
frosty copper
wary wave
but yeah, a producer is responsible for ensuring that the tools programmer has the tool ready to specification before the mesh assets go into it, all early enough that the level designers have it when they need it, etc
frosty copper
Turning story ideas into profitable films
Putting together a creative and talented cast and crew
Being responsible for all aspects of a film's production```
If that set of tasks isn't enough to warrant their paycheck, then I dunno what land you're living innow multiply that by 400 more features and across 20 people, and you have a producer's role
frosty copper
obviously translate the film shit to game shit
plush yew
I mean like honestly i just think of a producer as a waste of $80,000
thats just how i see it lol
wary wave
movie producers are not the same as game producers
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Taking that as a no...
plush yew
its a waste of 80k which could be spent on hiring another programmer or artist
@cloud cobalt yes
But not for games
frosty copper
Never said they were ambershee, however, that list provided on the site still proves true to Game Producers, no~?
wary wave
if you have one producer for 15 people, and your producer saves each of those people 3 weeks of time through smart scheduling and management, then that producer has just saved you 45 weeks of salaries
@frosty copper - not really
game producers are more of a project management role, with sometimes some crossover into other disciplines
wary wave
they're seldom involved with HR as an example
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Look up on Destiny, the original game. Game development is rebooted a year before it gets out ; months of work get torn out, half the playable area gets cut because no one has the time to do it anymore, the story gets gutted... On a $500M budget.
What's a $80K salary on that
frosty copper
Have experience of working in the film industry Game industry
Have a good business sense
Have a good understanding of finance
Have good creative vision
Be self-motivated
Be good at negotiating
Be good at motivating people
Be good at problem-solving
Understand the creative processes of filmmaking game development
Be able to secure finance for the production
Be able to prepare and control the production budget
Have excellent communication skills
Be able to work well under pressure and motivate the production team
Ensure compliance with regulations and codes of practice
Understand the relevant health and safety laws and procedures
plush yew
@cloud cobalt its nothing to a company which spits out dollar bills out of its ass
cloud cobalt
Not having a producer is exactly that - throwing money by the windows
plush yew
Its the same as .... Blizzard for example, that company can do no wrong anymore
they have so much money lol
@cloud cobalt paying someone $80,000 for a game which makes only $20,000,000 in 5 years is definitely not a good investment in my opinion though
wary wave
wat
frosty copper
then again there's more or less no set structure to game development anyway.. so... shrug
cloud cobalt
Anyway, you can keep thinking of management as a dead cost that has no value, but from my very limited experience of management and my larger experience of being managed, I'd much rather have a competent producer with the authority to make decisions
If only because in every project, you end up with people who ask mid-project "why not add this thing we saw in another game yesterday"
plush yew
Managers are useful because humans have a default to be lazy due to it being essential to surival... Would you want to be wasting a ton of calories if y oun don't know if you are going to have food tomorrow?
Humans are naturally lazy
And its a good thing.
frosty copper
O_o
cloud cobalt
Managers have nothing to do with laziness
plush yew
What
frank escarp
Managers make people work together
frosty copper
This conversation is about as consistent as a drunk fly's flight path
plush yew
the reason why u work is because of ur fear of being fired and then in turn not having money to pay your bills and buy food
frank escarp
you can only have managerless thing on very small teams
cloud cobalt
The purpose of a manager is to enpower his team, work for them, make sure they are productive and efficient
frank escarp
like 5 people max
cloud cobalt
Managers are not here to fire people
frosty copper
I'd say 3 people max in all honesty
frank escarp
after that amount, you need someone to take care of who does what
frosty copper
4 at a strong push
frank escarp
and tells guy A to do X, guy B to do Y, etc
that way the guys dont need to think wtf do i do now, or step on each other
manager just gives the work to everyone depending on his strenghts
frank escarp
if there is programming work, he sends it to the programmer, for art work, sends to the artist, etc
thats what a manager is supposed to do
frosty copper
Pffht, nah. Obviously the programmer does the artwork. ๐
frank escarp
when the company is bigger, then you have a manager that manages the managers
hierarchy as needed
in an AAA game, you would have a 10 strong team of Engine programmers
and they have their engine lead/enginemanager
plush yew
ok but think of it this way... you said "purpose of a manager is to enpower his team, work for them, make sure they are productive and efficient" What if people are self-empowered? What if they work on a given task if they receieve an email once a day (Do model X by Y), what if they are productive and reach the deadline by the email date?
plush yew
I'm just saying that you don't need a "manager" per say, a single person could be the team lead
You dont need any more
than a team leader
like thats it
frank escarp
and tells the correct people do it (like sending the math genius some weird algorithmic need, or sending the opengl guy some shader tasks)
a manager can only manage a given amount of people
plush yew
team lead sends emails to each person once a day or as needed to checkup on progress, as well as make new requirements..etc
frosty copper
Bdoom, I think you'll have a different tone when you've tried doing it in practice
frank escarp
if a manager manages too many people, then he stops being able to distribute work properly
and team productivity will drop
wary wave
"team lead sends emails to each person once a day or as needed to checkup on progress"
If you have a team of 150+ people, that's an awful lot of work
frank escarp
becouse a good manager needs to know each of the people he manages
to distribute the work well, to the strenghts of everyone
wary wave
also, if you have a small feature team (say 5 people), ideally your 'lead' is the most experienced, which means you want them doing development tasks, rather than being bogged down doing management
this is why you have dedicated managers
frank escarp
ive actually seen that happen
i knew a 18 year old kid in a team of 20
his sole job
plush yew
๐
frank escarp
was to distribute jobs
that is what he did, full time
and did it well
his job was to communicate beetween the 20 people, and distribute tasks well
wary wave
^ that's a producer, right there
frank escarp
yup
he was not the best coder, nor the best artist
he came from a QA stand point
but he was able to know people fairly well, and easily control their strenghts/weakneses
to distribute the work beetween them for maximum efficiency
pallid compass
@ashen brook Next time you can some free time can you boop me that shader, its your general reminder from me ๐ no rush
frank escarp
and yup, that is called a Producer
plush yew
I genuinely believe anyone here could do that
frank escarp
not anyone
wary wave
I think I probably could, but there are more important things for me to be doing
plush yew
@wary wave exactly my point though
frosty copper
Get one person to do it, as their sole job
wary wave
you don't hire a $120k engineer to not be doing any engineering, that's madness
frank escarp
needs to be someone that can understand people fairly well, and has an idea of everything in gamedev
frosty copper
or have a person who could do it, and cut their productivity
plush yew
If you are an artist, and you could also do a producing job... why should the producer be paid more than the artist?
frank escarp
that depends
frosty copper
Because they're the oil that lubricates the process?
wary wave
I wouldn't trust your average artist to manage a tin of beans
frank escarp
this kid did not get paid that much
cloud cobalt
Because the producer has a more valuable job, objectively
plush yew
WHY BE AN ARTIST? IF YOU CAN MAKE MORE MONEY HAVING LESS SKILLS?
frank escarp
the artists/programmers got more work. But this kid was indeed oil in the machine
he did have managers on top of him
frosty copper
Management skills aren't any less than an artists skills?
pallid compass
if u wann make money be a programmer
frank escarp
and Lead Artist and Lead PRogrammers and Lead Designer had more input on the whole thing that him
pallid compass
your trying to compare an apple and an orange
cloud cobalt
@plush yew There is basically zero skilled job that pays less than art, for starters
frank escarp
but he basically listened to those 3 and categorized what they said into small tasks, and then distributed them to the correct people
wary wave
Producers tend to average higher pay simply because it isn't an entry level position and requires an understanding of how a development team operates
frank escarp
unless its a lead artist or a visionary
you can fire him
and get a new one
at the drop of a hat
wary wave
so having them come from a QA background as an example isn't unusual
plush yew
mhm
frank escarp
a Producer on the other hand willl break the workflow for a while if you change him
becouse 90% of the work is knowing everyone on the team
and what they can do or not do
this is for teams that start getting bigger tho
in a team of like 4-5 people, having one of them being "Lead Whatever" goes well
this kid had producing as fulltime job becouse it was a team of 20 people
and it was in fact a fulltime job
pallid compass
off topic question
frank escarp
also, a good producer is worth his weight in gold
pallid compass
how do i put idea's forward for ue4?
frank escarp
becouse if he boosts productivity by 20%
on a team that gets paid 100.000k a month
then that guy creates 20.000k a month of value
thats why a producer gets paid quite a bit
frank escarp
they generate more "value" than an artist
plush yew
or maybe u could emaill them a feature request
kindred viper
Here is an argument for production and it's relative cost. Indie company A is a one man show. He/she makes games alone. That person has to do everything from textures to modelling to level design to programming, etc. That person also has to be the producer of that workflow/content. The time lost in pre-production alone could make the game an automatic loss. Which it often does. Now Indie Company B has 5 people to cover the various areas, and one producer. The game has infinitely more chances of success because 1. they have more people for async development and 2. They have someone who manages the shitty tasks you dont want to do as a programmer or artist.
pallid compass
They need mipmap scaler thing on the Map size view for material's
frank escarp
yup, that too
its interesting how much time i dealt with steam/psn/oculus store bullshit
just filling forms and all that crap
or dealing with mails
worn granite
If it were just as easy as reading the task list to the person in question, producers wouldn't be getting paid at all.
plush yew
Indie teams have to do not only that though...
worn granite
Its not just "Hey do your job dumbass"
plush yew
Indie teams have to do:
QA
Modeling / Art?
Advertising
Marketing
Conventions - subset of advertising/marketing
Sound Design?
UI? Would this be art?
like its a lot
worn granite
You're failing to account for all the work you don't see from the guy coming up and telling you to do something
plush yew
and im not even sure how to categorize it all
frank escarp
i have seen people dedicated to management bullshit in 5 people teams
3 people art, one people code, and the last people deals with mails, media, stores, etc
and producing
kindred viper
Henry Ford was not a genius but a smart man. What he did have, was the intelligence to know that he couldn't manage it all. So he hired people who could do the job and organise the things he couldn't do. You can't always rely on a programmer / artist / etc to actually know how to do the production stuff. I mean how many people here hate doing all that flowchart stuff or time management before a game? It's specialised and certain people are amazing at it. They should get paid appropriately in relative terms
plush yew
brb
frank escarp
actually im acting as both producer/manager/designer/programmer
and i find that if i act as a producer and create tasks to give myself, i am more productive
becouse often, you dont really have much of a idea of what to do
so if some days before i did know what i wanted to do this week, and put it in a task tracker in small tasks, if i dont know wtf to do i just take one and do it
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Indies don't have producers because they don't need to, and because they don't have the means to, generally speaking
Talking about indies with ~5-person teams
frank escarp
5 people teams still have a "Lead Whatever" who distributes work or whatever
but not fulltime
every single team that has 5 people and not a lead, is a fucking disaster
cloud cobalt
Yeah, you'll had someone to lead and also work on administrative stuff
frank escarp
becouse people start working on whatever they feel like doing
and it will be different stuff and go nowhere
plush yew
@frank escarp yeah i agree
though the thing is
ive had experience where even if u have someone doing that
nothing gets done
lul
frank escarp
do they get paid?
frank escarp
then something is failing hard there
plush yew
and did basically nothing
lmao
he was a senior engineer
he got fired tho
๐คฃ
comes in at 8 am, takes a 1 hour break, and leaves
cloud cobalt
Incompetent people are going to be incompetent
kindred viper
@frank escarp I've been working on my first solo game dev for years. From experience I picked up along the way, I inadvertently turned myself into a producer of sorts through necessity. I've been meticulous in planning out so much though, that I haven't actually got much done yet. It's not been long but usually by now I have a prototype. I mostly have documentation atm. ๐
worn granite
Seems you'd be mad at people like that rather than producers themselves.
plush yew
@worn granite definitely
frank escarp
@kindred viper you are doing it wrong
doing a game for years, speically if its a "first game" its a huuuuuuuuuge mistake
you need to make multiple games
to learn from them
kindred viper
@plush yew have you ever worked in the web development industry? I ask because I worked in SEO at one point and there were people who literally did nothing and got paid twice as much as me :/ I left web development shortly after realising that
plush yew
yeah
kindred viper
@frank escarp im not spending years on it. This will be 6 months tops if I can afford to outsource
worn granite
ah
kindred viper
last game I worked on by myself was using Project Anarchy engine from Havok. That was pretty cool
cloud cobalt
It's interesting to note that game development is generally not considered a great idea, financially. I mean, a large proportion of commercial projects fail, plenty of games don't live up to their investment, and working in the industry is rarely something you'd do for the money. That's a factor on why producers are important
cloud cobalt
The last thing you want in a project that's already hazardous financially is to work without a clear leadership on the timing & budget
kindred viper
I saw a post on facebook UE4 group once that asked "why did you become a game developer?" and one genius nailed it with "It seemed like a good idea at the time"
surreal viper
it still is
for me
after a few years ๐
if I would try to do anything else I would be bored to death
kindred viper
I enjoy what I do, it's not a good idea though unless you are successful, which I am not :p
pallid compass
I became a dev for 3 reasons, 1)I really love games they helped me alot growing up, 2) you can have massive postive impact on peoples lives, 3)being a general programmer makes me want to die
plush yew
idk if any of u have seen my project
frank escarp
@kindred viper project anarchy was GREAt
plush yew
but im contemplating dumping it lul
frank escarp
its just that ue4 released and roflstomped them
kindred viper
yeah true
frank escarp
and "mobile only?" wtf were they thinking
plush yew
8 months of work and its not finished because im stuck with needing technical art done
kindred viper
Considering all I had used before was UDK and the odd feature of other engines (like scaleform), it was really intuitive. Especially the LUA when it came to controlling objects
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Learn it
kindred viper
you cant learn technical art. You are gifted with the talent for it
plush yew
@cloud cobalt its like... clothing lel
frank escarp
tech art just needs you to learn both sides
and be smart enough to be able to link the knowledge
plush yew
๐
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Or dump the project and start a new one, taking into account what you can't do yourself
cloud cobalt
Ironically, do what a producer does and plan ahead for what you'll need
plush yew
release it tbh
i might want to like
pay someone to do the art
clean up all bugs
and release
because other than like 5 things
its done
pallid compass
lmao @cloud cobalt
kindred viper
I say programming is something anyone can learn, at the basic level at least. There are still things that I read in code and wonder how someone comes up with it. Rama's code has left me frazzled many times.
cloud cobalt
Rama is something else entirely
pallid compass
go read epic's GAS system, u will go blind marc
cloud cobalt
Though we have plenty of Rama-related nuggets in our codebase
plush yew
what is Rama
jk
hes the dude who makes the rainbow shit
haha
he seems pretty chill
i bet that guy smokes a lot of pot
worn granite
you mean Joy <thingname>
frank escarp
he is a hippie
kindred viper
I delved into gmpreussner's VLC plugin code once to learn some concepts. I did learn them but I dont think I would ever have been able to come up with it myself
frank escarp
like an ACTUAL hippie
wtf is a hippie doing programmer, i have no clue
modernization?
worn granite
idk not high enough to speculate on the connection there
pallid compass
I think iv prob learned the most from GAS system and peering inside engine files than anywhere else
makes u think outside the box
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Anyway, my point generally is that doing release-worthy games is hard, and making money on them is harder. If you're happy with your game, then go ahead and release it, people will tell you how good they think it is
That's kind of what Early Access is here for
plush yew
@cloud cobalt ive had about 333 people download it last time i checked
pallid compass
just dont do a wild card
plush yew
and most who gave feedback said it was good
but problem was a crash i had
and @heady summit helped me fix it lol
pallid compass
bugg knows all i swear to god
kindred viper
@livid haven knows more. talk about a fountain of knowledge
plush yew
@cloud cobalt yeah but its incomplete by my standards lel
no clothing?
my char is fucking nude
XD
coz its a survival game
but we never got clothing made...
worn granite
Just took a look at the youtube channel, looks early
plush yew
got tons of other shit made tho
pallid compass
oh jfc okay lets not even get started on @livid haven, dam this dude taught me 4d Math
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Then pick up assets from the marketplace, or pay someone
worn granite
i looks too early for EA IMO @cloud cobalt
cloud cobalt
What's the game like ?
pallid compass
make some protoclothing your self
worn granite
Pretty sure that's Bdoom maybe not
not to say it can't be a good base, just seems too early for shipping
cloud cobalt
Okay, don't release it.
plush yew
@worn granite it is, and i agree
i think its completely not ready
it has features but its definitely not up to standards iimo
fair violet
@plush yew scope for your own abilities- if you canโt make clothes assets and feel like you canโt learn them then youโd have to settle for something made by someone else. If you can scope your project so that it fits within your capabilities, youโll never be disappointed
worn granite
That's a good attitude to have, but be careful you take notice when it crosses the line into shippable
plush yew
@worn granite well yeah
frank escarp
pro tip. do the videos wel
fair violet
@pallid compass agreed
cloud cobalt
I think I already told you that some time ago @plush yew but a survival game is pretty impossible as a solo dev, and no one cares about being solo or not
plush yew
I was too lazy to edit it hah
frank escarp
F11 it anyway on playtest
pallid compass
also the market is saturated with survival games
plush yew
coz i didnt really expect anyone to watch it tbh
kindred viper
Im worried about working solo mostly because my artwork sucks. I have an art style in mind, but I can't make it. I need someone else but their vision might differ.
worn granite
high production value isn't something to discard, even for that kinda stuff
If its all slick you have way more material should you ever need it
have a track recorded of demonstrated caring and ability.
fair violet
Truth is if you are a solo dev you either have to bite the bullet and grind hard learning many difficult areas or else reduce scope / add numbers. Lots is feasible solo with enough time and dedication.
pallid compass
THIS ^
worn granite
Hell, maybe even attract a YT audience based solely on the videos
pallid compass
if ur solo dev and u want to be successful
u better be prepared to give up everything, and still fail.
plush yew
You know though...
the only hard thing ive found with this survival game so far
is AI
pallid compass
ey eoinobroin
plush yew
having 1000s of AI on a map
pallid compass
did i tell u
plush yew
is very difficult
worn granite
that's why you don't do that lol
fair violet
Awwww yeah ๐ nice one!
cloud cobalt
As someone who worked solo for a long time and still does a bit of everything...
- Learn both art and code
- Don't ever wait on a partner to do stuff, because even if you find one, you'll still need to work on all stuff
- Scope your project as if you were alone
pallid compass
if u guys dont mind me nuding the chat for few seconds, il show u
cloud cobalt
Same as what @fair violet said
plush yew
@worn granite not even sure how ARK does it
worn granite
@pallid compass Nuding?
plush yew
lmao
pallid compass
throwing few images
kindred viper
@fair violet thats why i worked in teams before I did a solo project. I wanted to learn as much as possible before I started. I've learned the technicalities of each area, even though im not very good at most of them. So I can string together a prototype and hopefully have other people come in and replace assets for quality purposes.
worn granite
got something on the brain there?
plush yew
looks difficult
worn granite
@plush yew its really not all that complicated.
cloud cobalt
The reason people mock "Doing a MMO" posts on the Internet is that no indie team can handle a real MMO, for many different reasons not all of the technical kind
Same for survival games, open-world...
plush yew
@worn granite honestly ive decided to scrap AI in its entirety
worn granite
they're probably doing the obvious solution to having way too many simulated AI
plush yew
and insteead im doing summoning lol
so players "summon" AI
that they can fight with
and use as pets...mounts..etc
plush yew
sometimes u dont have to "make it work" you can just reinvent a concept differently
worn granite
Cool concept if you can make it play
plush yew
and still do it lol
like ark does taming
and rnadom dinos in the wild
rust does random animals in the wild
so i wanna do magic + summoning
so essentially this lets me have an entire map with NO AI
lolol
fair violet
Yeah very true working in teams is a great way to expose yourself to techniques and workflows you otherwise might not have learned. The biggest thing that I learned is if you really want to achieve something to your own goals, donโt expect anyone else will care or help you get there- itโs on you. Plan like that and learn, piece by piece it comes together if your scope is reasonable.
pallid compass
@fair violet
plush yew
because i realized what i really liked was not taming, or killing ai... it was the concept of mounting and breeding that i liked
Xd
pallid compass
Every single scratch is places, no tiling scratches, 1 material, full control
fair violet
Lookin sexy^
pallid compass
Full tiling textures behind it as well
worn granite
Not surprised you're into mounting and breeding animals 
fair violet
Is that panel line texture?
plush yew
@worn granite ๐คฃ
pallid compass
no panel lines or anything yet, its our base unde coat
there is no grime mask
But scratch & grime mask's, 1 material, MF with id mask's
spanning 2-3 UV's
sits on low 125 instruction count too ๐
fair violet
Very nice! Love the efficiency!
worn granite
Oh man
pallid compass
because EA are out there mind
plush yew
they actually emailed me back :3
worn granite
you really don't want to get me started
plush yew
buit like
worn granite
on EA
pallid compass
y u doing this to ur self fam
worn granite
Haven't purchased an EA game in 5 years
plush yew
honestly i dont play many of their games
worn granite
^
worn granite
They like to buy up IP that does well, ruin the IP, and then discard it.
Typically breaking up the studios making it as well.
They've done that something like 15-20 times
That's not even talking about all the smaller shit.
pallid compass
god
anyone remember west wood studio's
who made the orignal command and conquer
and how EA fucked them in to oblivion
pallid compass
and they tried to make C&C 5 was it?
and they had community input
and because they didnt like that the community wanted
they scraped the game
shhh it be okay place, EA cant hurt anyone now
they they dun fucked star wars, and got burned by disney for it
worn granite
My hatred of EA has slowly built though, wasn't until I decided to not buy their games that I started looking into their handling of studios.
worn granite
dis game
pallid compass
not for long
worn granite
Where the attach point at?
plush yew
huh
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Back on topic, have you considered changing you art style ? Since you're not an artist and having a hard time doing something that looks high quality, maybe it could be a good idea.
Like the Astroneer Aesthetic for example
worn granite
he swings the axe and its like, idk, 250uu away from where it should be
worn granite
yeah I accidentally left autoplay on
plush yew
u know what would be nice tho
is if i could release it for like $10 and make it essentially fully moddable
cloud cobalt
plush yew
i know i would like that
plush yew
@worn granite its a mixture
of BP and C++
lol
widgets and ionventory system is bp
but steam auth is c++
and uhh
worn granite
Anything BP is probably going to be way harder to mod
plush yew
everything has a base class basically
worn granite
Not that I'd know for sure.
worn granite
Yeah. Not sure you can even do something like that for BP
Would be some kind of hack related to nativization if anything.
plush yew
yea
worn granite
Keep that idea tabbed for veritex 2 IMO
worn granite
veritex 3
shell jetty
astroneer bound
worn granite
Better to make dev friends become IRL friends
plush yew
LOl
cloud cobalt
I can actually list entirely too many of these
plush yew
Lel
worn granite
And he did, but not in terms of dev
worn granite
Doesn't seem too bad actually but its been a while since I looked at prices.
plush yew
haha
worn granite
wonder if these actually make espresso
worn granite
yeah I mean I can believe that one does
plush yew
Explain why this doesnt exist in unreal by default https://i.imgur.com/5CC8TMI.png
worn granite
plush yew
this shit is so useful imo
especially for mobile
the one i sent does the milk too
btw
lol
plush yew
@cloud cobalt servers for wat
worn granite
google analytics
cloud cobalt
For analytics
worn granite
you're literally using google's servers
cloud cobalt
oh, you mean what isn't Google Analytic in UE4 ?
plush yew
yea
cloud cobalt
Because you may not want it and it's trivial to implement yourself
cloud cobalt
Many consoles would forbid it
plush yew
yeah but thats an engine thing
if they dont support it
just dont add it... they can detect that shit anyways
there's a whole test consoles go through
some dude at my job worked at bethesda
he told me all about it
cloud cobalt
Seriously though, Analytics is trivial to implement
plush yew
forgot what he said tho LOL
worn granite
@plush yew got you one better than your last https://www.amazon.com/Breville-BES920XL-Boiler-Espresso-Machine/dp/B00I6JGGP0/ref=sr_1_39?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1511799635&sr=1-39
worn granite
for double the fun
plush yew
lol
man tho
these people on freelancer.com
send me "art" they did
but cant tell me
where its from
they say its in a cartoon
cant tell me the name of the cartoon
wtf is that?
straight up lying to me lmao
worn granite
yeah those people exist, good thing you're lookin out
plush yew
@worn granite dude i had some guy on there
ask me if i was a girl
im like
"Wtf does it matter"
im paying u to do a job?
or im potentially paying u
so fucking inappropriate imo
worn granite
shoulda been like "yeah wanna get paid with pics?" and then afterward found buff dudes pics to send and say "just kidding stop being a perv"
plush yew
LoL
yeah idk how like
thats ur first question
when my job posting is
"Need 3d models"
and the description is
about the models
and what they are for
lol
Also what's with all these "fake jobs"
worn granite
whatchu mean fake jobs?
plush yew
So like there's a ton of these jobs where its a literal scam
"buy our product, sell it for us, and let us take 60% of profits"
Lmao
pallid compass
god i love clean MF
loud valve
Hi guys!
How can I add a "create project" asset type from my vault to an existing project?
worn granite
If you could convince people to give you money for them to do work wouldn't you do it?
kindred viper
@loud valve just migrate what you need
worn granite
Maybe, maybe not
loud valve
so make a new project and the migrate to the existing project?
worn granite
they obviously exist so I guess there's bigger fish to fry
loud valve
Its weird UE pushes some of these features.. as it makes no sence to create a whole new project just for a car..
plucky river
Hey guys I have been trying to find a previous ue4 stream. I remember someone showing off particle effects in fortnite, especially animated meshes used in particle systems (to create little dust clouds beneath the character when they are jumping)
I looked through the VODs for the past year but couldn't find anything.
grim ore
@plucky river that one is more than a year ago, it was around the time fortnite was announced.
plush yew
i was wondering if anyone know's why i get a 'there is no disk in the drive. Please insert a disk into driveE:.' everytime i try to export a texture from my content browser
@frank escarp hiw would you go about getting a foot manager
Good
plush yew
@worn granite on a scale of 0 to 10 in terms of progress made how would you rate my game lol
It's been 8 months BTW
Also I've never really used this engine before this
worn granite
idk impossible to tell without watching everything you've put out. Even then might not have the full picture.
plush yew
Yeah
worn granite
From what I've seen maybe a 4
worn granite
you said progress, not efficiency
worn granite
I can't tell that whatsoever, you've given me no metrics to base that on.
cloud cobalt
@plush yew Rule of thumb : you do 80% of the work in 20% of the time, and the other way around.
bright wave
hi, someone here who knows why performance of pubg is so bad on so much hardware?
is unreal engine really so bad in multithreading?
frank escarp
fortnite runs well
cloud cobalt
@bright wave Open-world game with massive player count and zero optimization
worn granite
^
frank escarp
its just that pubg has zero optimization
worn granite
@plush yew give me a full spec and I can qoute you how long it'd take me
that's about all I can do
bright wave
should it not be the base (engine) which should be optimized?
bright wave
but fortnite has much less grafics??
cloud cobalt
The engine itself runs fine, but as a dev you need to work on performance too
plush yew
@worn granite I will when I get home
worn granite
IDK look into this yourself, you'll get far more knowledge out of that than talking to us @bright wave
worn granite
not about the amount of graphics
you can have a game with less graphics than fortnite run way worse than fortnite
bright wave
do you have any tips for tweaking the ini files to get better performance?
plush yew
@worn granite so true
worn granite
I mean I can get a certain minimalist prototype I've played recently to 200ms per frame within 30s of opening it.
bright wave
is it because of the polygon counts of fortnite?
plush yew
@bright wave learn the profiler tools
worn granite
You asking as a consumer or a dev @bright wave ?
worn granite
Its because of the priorities in development.
Poly count does play a role but the importance isn't what it used to be.
bright wave
kk
little coyote
Rendering passes too
worn granite
There are devs whose entire job it is to optimize so I dunno if I'd call them lazy or anything. (though they need to pony up for some specialists IMO)
bright wave
i have 8700k@4ghz, 16gb ddr4@4000, gtx 1080@2000, ssd -> runs good, but not perfect
plush yew
First thing
bright wave
8700k@5ghz^^