#virtual-reality | Unreal Source | Page 123

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:35 PM

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well that game could just set its own min spec to win10

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 7:35 PM

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yeah, but it couldn't on the oculus store

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:35 PM

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it couldnt?

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 7:35 PM

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they won't allow you to sell it with a win 10 requirement

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:36 PM

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oh

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 7:36 PM

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because they have that guaranteed min spec thing

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they have broken it in a couple cases but only for free apps

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(nvidia funhouse)

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:37 PM

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I think vulkan doesn't support MSAA currently in UE4

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forward seems to work

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but when I enable MSAA, it crashes

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 7:37 PM

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ah, that's unfortunate

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:37 PM

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I dont use MSAA, so I don't have to care 😄

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 7:38 PM

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yeah, I'm still on deferred

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I've got some big landscape stuff I'm working on and forward didn't support light functions for clouds correctly

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:38 PM

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and it doesn't support SSAO, so I'm also on deferred

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 7:39 PM

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and that silhoutte thing from MSAA looked really bad with lots of atmospheric fog

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:39 PM

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ah

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instanced stereo seems to work with vulkan

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well, havent tested if its really active, but it doesnt crash

wicked oak Jul 9, 2017, 7:40 PM

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isnt it pointless on vulkan?

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some tests for mobile VR said that you dont really need it

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:40 PM

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yeah its probably even stupid to have it enabled

wicked oak Jul 9, 2017, 7:40 PM

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as you can just "duplicate" the command buffer for one eye and put it on the other

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:40 PM

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more gpu time, and cpu time is fast anyways

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 7:40 PM

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well are all those LOD bugs fixed now though?

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instanced stereo was the only way to keep your eyes from seeing different LODs for a while right?

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:41 PM

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they fixed it with static meshes

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but they didnt fix it for HISMCs

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I fixed it manually there

wicked oak Jul 9, 2017, 7:41 PM

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lol

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 7:43 PM

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I'll try to package the project and see if performance of vulkan is better in packaged

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I dont expect it to be better there though

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vulkan is also quite spammy in the log

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so its clear its still in a "testing" state

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packaging will take a while, havent packaged anything yet with this build so it needs to compile shipping config first

full junco Jul 9, 2017, 8:09 PM

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performance is same in packaged

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:13 PM

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😦

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oh well, still sounds like a big improvement from 4.16

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:15 PM

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Hey everyone sorry to interrupt, this is a long shot, but is anyone getting strange behavior from planar reflections in PC VR?

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Or has it been stable for the most part for you guys

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:15 PM

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it has seemed ok to me

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what are you seeing?

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:16 PM

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Worse performance in packaged game vs play in editor, and super weird bug where looking away from the planar reflection, and looking back, will aternate bad performance vs good performance

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So if you're facing it and look away and then look back, the performance will go from good to bad or vice versa

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:18 PM

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hmm, haven't seen that

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with interleaved reprojection and ASW there is a lower threshold to activate than to deactivate

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turn those off and see if you see the same thing

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:18 PM

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Yeah, Googling didn't turn up any results either. It's probably a very specific issue with my project, can't think of what though

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Ah, I never develop with those on anyways so I can see frame rate issues

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:19 PM

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ok good

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yeah can't think of anything else

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other than find out if you are are CPU bound or GPU bound when the performance goes bad

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:20 PM

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It's a CPU issue

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:21 PM

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are you adding your whole scene into the capture or just movable actors?

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:21 PM

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Tried almost every combination of that, consistent behavior

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Even telling it to reflect only one object. It's almost definitely some unusual bug

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:22 PM

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have you tried a profiler capture?

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assuming it doesn't go away when you try to profile

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:25 PM

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have done yeah, that's how I figured it was a CPU issue, atleast if IIRC. Don't remember the specific logs though

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Might be worth doing again and posting here to see if anyone recognizes something?

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:27 PM

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you should be able to see a kind of toggling step function in the CPU usage as you look away and look back

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:27 PM

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Yes it's incredibly obvious in the graph

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:28 PM

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yeah, then see if the difference comes from one main area or not

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if it is just everything is uniformly slower, you are out of luck

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:28 PM

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It's a single room though, with a mirror covering one side

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That's what makes it so unusual

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There's definitely not one area that's more performance intensive than another, the level is too small for that

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I'll just get around to profiling again I guess, it's an issue that's followed me from .15 to .16 so I'm sure it's got to be tied to my project / level

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:30 PM

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yeah, also try packaged builds vs editor builds and see if it happens

pine nimbus Jul 9, 2017, 8:31 PM

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Oh yes, it ONLY happens in packaged

sturdy coral Jul 9, 2017, 8:31 PM

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ah right, sorry you mentioned that

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:57 AM

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is 4.17 going to have production ready Steam audio after all ?

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:03 AM

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probably

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:07 AM

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price cut fellas

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rift + touch at 400

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https://www.engadget.com/2017/07/10/oculus-limited-time-price-drop/

Engadget

Oculus Rift and Touch bundle temporarily on sale for $399

It's only for a limited time, so if you have the cash, take advantage of the offer now.

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:18 AM

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so they still don't get enough sales compared to vive

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:22 AM

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meanwhile, HTC isn't phased and is not gonna change the Vive's price by an inch

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:23 AM

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I would buy a rift at that price even though I have a vive. They are a nice peice of kit. It's the fact you have to deal with Oculus that is the issue for me :/

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:26 AM

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the hate for oculus is absolutely insane

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:27 AM

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I dont hate the hardware. I think it's excellent. I'm just peeved at their business end

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:27 AM

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@wicked oak they fucked up big time multiple times

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:28 AM

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facebook is the only way oculus could exist

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nothing around that

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a lot of utrahate is the palmer trump thing

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people STILL hate oculus as a whole for that

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:28 AM

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that I don't care honestly

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:28 AM

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that was just propaganda...

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the exclusives is another thing

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if they werent exclusives, they wouldnt exist

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at all

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and you can play with revive anyway

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:29 AM

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what I care of is that they used code from another company (even if zenimax execs are full of shit), and also used tech from Valve to build their HMD, without acknowledging it

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revive is great, but shouldn't exist tbh

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Oculus should have been opened from the start

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we had a big VR dev meetup the morning FB announced they bought oculus

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and man I felt uneasy that day

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mass confusion :/

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:31 AM

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the code from another company part is shit

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its just that they were the same guys, so they rewrote it from memory

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the tech for valve, well thats another thing

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that for sure

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zenimax just abuses it to get money

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see how they do their lawsuits on fucking texas

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the home of patent trolling

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:32 AM

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big companies tend to sue for everything in the USA

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:33 AM

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zenimax are complete pieces of shit

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paid mods

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:33 AM

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has anyone here used / developed for HyperReal yet? (chinese HMD). Cant seem to find any info about it other than a bit of promo.

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:33 AM

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lawsuiting mojang over the world Scrolls

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lausuiting people from using the world "prey" on a game

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@sharp swan chinese HMDs are fucking trash

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if they cant show a steamVR implementation, they are a scam company

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:34 AM

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this one is similar spec to oculus and seems to be the prime HMD over there though

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:35 AM

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VR + China = 😂

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remember AntVR

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😂 😂 😂

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:35 AM

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and how the fuck do they expect devs to use it with no unity implementation and no unreal implementation and no steamvr implementation

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its unusable lol

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:35 AM

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@jaunty shell this is a 300k contract so I don't really care if it blows. The money is important :p

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:35 AM

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other than some random demos

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:35 AM

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@wicked oak well zenimax attacks oculus, so I obviously have to like Zenimax even if they do bad stuff somewhere else

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:35 AM

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except that if oculus dies, PC vr dies

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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and I don't care at all about what politican palmer supports, I have enough other reasons to dislike oculus

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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steamVR would have no competition, and they wouldnt try to do shit

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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@wicked oak this has an unreal implementation, but it needs a manual SDK implementation and they didn't give us the how, just the code.

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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same thing with Vive

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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sure valve would just continue to do as they do now

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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if steamvr dies, oculus gets lazy

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lol

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its valve we are talking about

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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valve is fully into VR

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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they are also the laziest company on earth

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look at all the half assed stuff

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:36 AM

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valve has no competitive reason to do stuff like linux support for steamvr. they just want to bring it forward

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:37 AM

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having both companies competing so directly is getting us really cool stuff

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:37 AM

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if oculus dies, PC VR will benefit from it

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:37 AM

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remember Valve was 100% against timewarp

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in their slides they were like "do 90 fps, deal with it"

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:37 AM

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well they said devs should just make sure fps are good

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which isnt bad

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:37 AM

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they only implemented timewarp after oculus did

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:38 AM

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I still have never used any async warp stuff since my GPU doesnt support it

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:38 AM

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the Vive wands are also clearly rushed as controllers. They did it to take the upper hand from oculus (and damn they did it)

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:38 AM

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rushed, but still made the vive the better product

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so they had enough time to come up with kuckles that they had no reason to rush

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and even though their lighthouses already were way better than oculus tracking, there new version of them is even better

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:39 AM

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and meanwhile, oculus is dropping price and doing offers to compete against steam

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:39 AM

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so they dont need competition

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:39 AM

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you seem to forget that steam is the status quo, the monopoly of pc gaming

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Oculus store has some quality control

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steam doesnt

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they dont care

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they are the monopoly

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:39 AM

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steam is the monopoly because from the consumer side its 101% perfect

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:40 AM

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steam would do the absolutely minimum they could do, and they do so already

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embracing user skins for dota2 and CS and TF is not for being cool or whatever

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its becouse its cheap as fuck outsourcing

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and they screw those creators a lot

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they are on the verge of killing the professional dota2 modellers

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:40 AM

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well no one is forced to play dota or CS or TF. I never do.

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:41 AM

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they removed greenlight becouse it was too much effort to try to do quality control

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they dont have a proper support system becouse its too much effort

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they half-ass stuff like the steam machines

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without oculus going to facebook, steam wouldnt have released the vive

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at all

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or at least not at the time they did

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:42 AM

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sure they would have

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:42 AM

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no they wouldnt

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:42 AM

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even without facebook oculus would have had its own store

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and steam would never accept that

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:42 AM

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that wasnt the original plan

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the original plan was oculus doing the hardware, and the games still get sold on steam

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thats why valve helped oculus

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:42 AM

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I think that plan was changed way before they were bought by facebook though

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:42 AM

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oculus would do the role HTC does right now

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we need both companies, and if possible, more companies, to propel VR forward

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competition makes innovation fierce

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:44 AM

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and oculus hurt PC VR with not making PC VR automatically roomscale VR

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:44 AM

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look at PSVR compared to oculus or vive

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for its price, its half assed as hell

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come on, using the 6 year old move controllers? shitty as fuck tracking? all becouse after all, PSVR is a monopoly

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:44 AM

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PSVR is like those dollar store HMD's you slide a phone into :p

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:44 AM

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not as bad XD

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but they wont really compete

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becouse in their platform, is only psvr

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i see them doing a PSVR 2.0

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still for the ps4

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:45 AM

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they have to really

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:45 AM

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too much competition would be bad for PC VR. because then it would be way too much work for devs to support all different controllers etc

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:45 AM

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They probably planned to do it but were rushed. I mean they do need the PSPro for it. the screen percentage on the standard is vile

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:45 AM

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and the standards appear there. Oculus store vs steam store

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:45 AM

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as as long as all HMD manufacturers pretty much use the same display there isnt a need for competition there

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:45 AM

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ue4 abstracts both

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a PSVR 2.0 that was Pro only would be neat

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a shit thing on PSVR is that the tracking eats your performance

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it almost eats a full core out of 6, and a chunk of your gpu power

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:46 AM

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harsh

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:46 AM

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they need to do complicated computer vision

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becouse its on color on the big blue balls

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for rift, they can do a filter and they get ONLY the lights

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and they are smaller

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so less trouble trying to calculate their center

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best device, by FAR, for the psvr

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would be lighthouse

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:47 AM

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I want a console with perfect roomscale VR

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:47 AM

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lighthouse doesnt have any computation

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well it does

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but its some trivial math

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cameras have to do computer vision, wich is a lot harder

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:48 AM

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when are the new lighthouses released?

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:49 AM

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@wicked oak but is it better ?

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@full junco valve time ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:49 AM

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new lighthouse wont work with older devices

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:49 AM

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when those new lighthouses come out, im buying another 4 of the old ones on the cheap. Mocap ahoy !

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:50 AM

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well I would guess the comsumer version of the LG headset will come with the new lighthouses

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:51 AM

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but new devices will work with new lighthouses

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AND old ones

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:52 AM

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yup

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backwards compat, but not forward

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:52 AM

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@sharp swan you wont be able to chain then tho, that's only for v2.0

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:52 AM

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and the new lighthouses should be cheaper than the old ones

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half the price would be nice

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:53 AM

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yeah less components, less rotating stuff so less defects

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:53 AM

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nah they wont make them cheaper

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:53 AM

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@jaunty shell dont need to chain them. They are indepedent. Just need to track them and that can be solved with a bit of code. IKinema does it fine

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:53 AM

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they will make them same price and increase the profit

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:53 AM

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I dont think so

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valve has enough profits

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:54 AM

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@sharp swan you meant tracking pucks then, not lighthouses :p

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:54 AM

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what about HTC

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:54 AM

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the lighthouses are produced by valve or are they not?

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:54 AM

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HTC is one of the market actors

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they are the first, but there will be more to come

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SteamVR/lighthouse is a licensed tech, not something HTC made from scratch

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:54 AM

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@jaunty shell well I do have to deliver the tracking with it. Not sure about the Vive Tracker things. They look a bit bulky to me and expensive at £1290 a pop

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erm 120

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:55 AM

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1290 😂

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:55 AM

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I think HTC will also update the vive to ship with the new lighthouses. and also make the vive cheaper then

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:55 AM

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well you can also contact valve to get a devkit, and make your own accessories/mocap straps with the trackers integrated

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:56 AM

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once LG has released its headset, no one would have any reason to buy the HTC one any more

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 8:56 AM

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yeah sounds like a plan

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 8:57 AM

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lets hope LG's build quality is at least on par with the Vive

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 8:57 AM

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its better I think

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based on those reviews I read

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https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/03/hands-on-with-lgs-high-res-more-comfortable-steamvr-prototype/

Ars Technica

Hands-on with LG’s high-res, more comfortable SteamVR prototype

The HTC Vive gets some direct competition from a Korean competitor.

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https://www.cnet.com/products/lg-vr/preview/

CNET

Why LG's VR headset could be the best yet (first hands-on)

The LG VR (name TBD) joins the HTC Vive, Oculus Rift and Sony PlayStation VR in the ranks of high-end consumer VR headsets.

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better display, better ergonomics, if it ships with new lighthouses too then really no one has any reason to buy a vive

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 9:00 AM

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I hope they put little fans in the forehead area where the plastic covers. Because I sweat like a goon when I wear a Vive

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:00 AM

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😄

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you should also hope their headset doesn't deteriorate

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:00 AM

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summer + VR = 💦

junior grove Jul 10, 2017, 9:00 AM

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Worst thing about having friends, they sweat up your HMD

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:01 AM

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in the future HMDs will probably have active cooling

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 9:01 AM

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@junior grove we took a rift to a VR Expo and ran it through a couple of hundred people. I get scared to use it now in case it carries Ebola or something.

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:02 AM

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when displays are perfect they will need to find improvements to be able to sell new versions

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does LG have a website or something like that to apply for devkits of their headset?

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just that flip up feature alone would be great for developing

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:06 AM

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when i demoed my game, i had alcohol wipes, and lens wipes, to wipe the headset and keep it clean-ish

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i also had some of this face mask things

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:06 AM

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@full junco the Vive's DAS works well for the flip up thingy

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:06 AM

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for when someone in cosplay or REALLY heavy makeup wants to try

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:06 AM

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at least it stays in place on your forehead

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:06 AM

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@jaunty shell dont want to buy any deteriorating stuff

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:06 AM

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deteriorating das are a thing of the past 🙄

junior grove Jul 10, 2017, 9:06 AM

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It doesn't look like major improvement over the Vive , but it's nice to see more competition

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:07 AM

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@jaunty shell are they? I didnt read anything about HTC fixing it. you have a source?

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:07 AM

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mine was in the first batches from HTC and I didn't get the black stuff coming from the foam

junior grove Jul 10, 2017, 9:07 AM

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And a slightly higher resolution is definitely welcome

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:07 AM

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probably just a bad batch tbh

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:07 AM

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@jaunty shell everyone was affected, maybe you just dont sweat enough

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also, I read some people destroyed their vive pre when trying to install the DAS because its really not that great for a vive pre

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:08 AM

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eeh not everyone, lots of first orders, yes, but not everyone

junior grove Jul 10, 2017, 9:08 AM

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What is deteriorating ? Mine is early too and I have yet to have any issues with it

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:08 AM

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have they used the adaptater kit for the pre ?

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:09 AM

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yeah installing that adapter seems to be able to easily destroy the vive

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 9:09 AM

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welp

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:10 AM

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any I'm not sure I wanna take that risk just for some more comfort

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if my vive would be broken, I couldnt do anything

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:10 AM

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why dont you ask oculus for headsets?

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they still give headsets to devs if they can show cool stuff

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also same thing but for knuckles

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:13 AM

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I don't want to show oculus any cool stuff

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 9:13 AM

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me neither

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:14 AM

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and I don't want to have a rift, since I dislike oculus. I wouldnt use a rift for deving as I only plan to release on vive

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I will release on rift later, but its just easier to focus on vive for now

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:14 AM

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why the blatant hate

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oculus gives me money

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i have half my sales there

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 9:14 AM

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I would prefer a rift for development tbh. It's lighter, better suited for seated experience and the controllers are way more adaptable to game logic

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:14 AM

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well, not half. one third

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:15 AM

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@sharp swan but why should I use it if the game will only be played on vive

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:15 AM

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thats sales you are losing there due to fanboyism

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 9:15 AM

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yeah there is no reason to. Im just saying its easier to dev with. Vive is heavy and controllers need a reboot

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:15 AM

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@wicked oak no, I'm not "losing" any sales. the reason i'm not directly releasing for rift isnt due to my dislike of oculus, its due to not wanting the extra work of making sure it works on rift

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:16 AM

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unreal does it automagically with the interface

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you only really need to test it works

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and the one that works badly is the vive

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if it works on the vive it will be better on the rift

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:16 AM

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also I would probably always only make it compatible with rift through steamvr

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not through oculus store

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:16 AM

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they dont give you a contract that says you need to sell on oculus store

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but its another storefront, so more views, and more sales

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:17 AM

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I call some steamvr stuff directly that isnt supported in ue4 and stuff like that, and I wouldnt want to port that to oculus sdk

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:17 AM

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specially if your game is good enough to get into the "Games" list

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then skip it

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:17 AM

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I will release my game as early access, and I dont think it hurts to first have it a few months in early access vive-only and when then its a bit more polished care about supporting more hardware

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:17 AM

#

btw oculus store has much more visibility than steam this days

#

steam is being FAR too spammed

#

oculus at least has quality control

#

on the Gallery there are loads of games

#

but on the "Games" category, not at all

#

very few

#

becouse to get there you need to be perfect quality

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 9:18 AM

#

that is true

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:19 AM

#

getting into that Games category is a lot of possible sales

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:19 AM

#

I would like to get some knuckes though, but I also don't need those currently. I dont gain anything from playing around with knuckles, players dont have those yet

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 9:19 AM

#

im on Gallery wich is shit-section and i have one third of the total sales

#

but then you can offer knuckle support sooner. And have it in mind

#

stuff is easier to implement sooner in development

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:20 AM

#

I think there isnt even a date when consumers will see knuckles

#

and even then, most players will still have the old controllers

#

I'm fine with only supporting the 400k vive playerbase with old controllers

#

I will ask oculus for a rift after I released my game. then they will surely just send me one

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 9:23 AM

#

ask them for two. My address is P.O.Box 00

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 9:23 AM

#

if they wanna give me 5 I'll ask them for 5. the less money facebook has, the better the world will be 😛

sullen stirrup Jul 10, 2017, 10:17 AM

#

has anyone dug deep into this? https://youtu.be/YcfcFqaPcFU?t=10s

YouTube

Zulubo Productions

HTC Vive (PeopleGun) Inverse Kinematics arm + shoulder reconstruction

My first experiments with IK and the vive. Fairly funny how expressive a floating head and arms can be!

▶ Play video

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 10:19 AM

#

no but I have considered it

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 10:19 AM

#

i kind of did

#

for my Aquila 1.0 prototype

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwyKQL4wu6w

YouTube

Victor Blanco

ProjectAquilaPrototype2

Gameplay video from the Aquila prototype. This is not a game currently on sale, but just a small prototype i made to test some multiplayer features.

▶ Play video

#

i fight against other player there

#

he has topbody IK

#

i found that the hard part is the proportions and the lower body

#

echo arena gives you a really small lower body, and it just flies around with physics

#

the actuall collision is kind of a sphere around your neck

sullen stirrup Jul 10, 2017, 10:22 AM

#

are you doing some sort of prediction?

#

or does the entire chest rotate based off your hmd

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 10:22 AM

#

the torso is done with some really basic formulas

#

basically off the hmd

#

and then its hand IK

sullen stirrup Jul 10, 2017, 10:23 AM

#

I can't think of a reliable way of doing this realistically

#

🤔

pearl tangle Jul 10, 2017, 10:43 AM

#

you base it off the hands and the head, can't ever use just the head since the human body doesn't move like that at all

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 10:43 AM

#

yeah, mine was just a stopgap

pearl tangle Jul 10, 2017, 10:45 AM

#

finally launching this project we have been working on for a few months now. first internal event was on Friday. Big ass setup in Malaysia starting later this week.

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-S9chRCzyVU

YouTube

iris labs

Royal Caribbean HOLIDECK

▶ Play video

#

I wish unreal could handle the full 8k videos in the 360 stuff though. Annoying having to lower the quality of them

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 10:51 AM

#

based on the video I have no idea what it is

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 11:54 AM

#

Still don't get where this hate for Oculus I coming from

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 12:08 PM

#

rift just got a £200 price cut

#

£99 for limited time

#

£399

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 12:10 PM

#

Get it!

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 12:10 PM

#

you got one?

#

best to buy local or direct from oculus?

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 12:21 PM

#

I got mine for free from Oculus

#

But if I haven't gotten one, I'd efinitely get one now. Best buy would seem like a better bet since you could get projection plan and whatnot. Or Amazon.

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 12:43 PM

#

how much is a third camera though?

#

you need to compare price of rift+camera to vive

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 12:45 PM

#

3rd camera?

#

ok, heres hoping they have actual stock

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 1:08 PM

#

$59 on Amazon

#

so, $459 for the whole thing in US

#

comparing to Vive pricewise is pointless as even before this discount it was $200 cheaper than Vive

#

I'll probably get extra set of Touch to mess with objects tracking

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 1:12 PM

#

yeah its a nice price

#

the vive isnt twice as good, so its hard to justify paying twice as much

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 1:13 PM

#

Vive isn't any better than Rift at this point

#

(unless one doesn't have enough USB ports available)

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 1:15 PM

#

the vive still has better tracking

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 1:15 PM

#

@mighty carbon mah two USB port laptop would not be able to room scale the rift 🤔

#

and I would have to refrain from using a mouse

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 1:19 PM

#

use bluetooth mouse 😉

#

@full junco not better enough to be noticeable to end-users

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 1:20 PM

#

bluetooth is the devil 😂

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 1:20 PM

#

with a big enough room area its surely noticeable

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 1:20 PM

#

nothing better than a good ol' cable mouse

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 1:20 PM

#

or can oculus do 5x5 meters now?

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 1:21 PM

#

I don't have 5 x 5 m space, nor do many of consumers

full junco Jul 10, 2017, 1:22 PM

#

doesnt change that lighthouse tech is superior to oculus stuff

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 1:23 PM

#

the tech itself is more futureproof

granite jacinth Jul 10, 2017, 1:27 PM

#

hmmmmmmmm

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 1:27 PM

#

even Valve said that Constelation might be used in the future, not Lighthouse

granite jacinth Jul 10, 2017, 1:27 PM

#

I am getting my Rifts today

#

I should have bought 2 cameras

#

2 extra cameras

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 1:44 PM

#

better get extra Touch - use it for object trackers

#

@jaunty shell btw, if you have USB-C 3.1 (Thunderbolt) on your laptop, you can hook all 3 sensors to it

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 1:46 PM

#

ah well that's okay then

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 1:57 PM

#

valve didn't say constelation might be used in the future

#

Alan Yates just confirmed that camera tracking is the likely end goal

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 1:58 PM

#

isn't it the same thing ?

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 1:58 PM

#

but thats more likely to be inside out than a constellation system

#

he also said that the switch would happen when/if it made sense, meaning the tech is cheaper / better

#

currently lighthouses are cheaper, more convenient, and higher precision with better room volume.

#

also wondering just how well extra touch controllers are going to work for object / camera tracking considering you basically have to tape / velcro them together

#

it is something they hadn't initially considered

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:06 PM

#

eeh? 3D print a socket for the handle

#

just like they have it on Guitar Hero

#

in no way Lighthouse is cheaper than Constellation camera

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:08 PM

#

gen 2 lighthouse is dirt cheap for what it is

#

and you only need two for roomscale

#

regardless, you were arguing on what you said "valve" said, it was Alan Yates, and those were his words saying it is cheaper

#

while he works for them I wouldn't take his twitter as the official stance from Valve on anything

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:12 PM

#

lol, of course he will say it's cheaper.. Yet, it's not possible to be cheaper due to moving parts.

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 2:13 PM

#

lighthouse 2.0 only got one motor

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:14 PM

#

and camera for constellation has none

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 2:14 PM

#

still requires a bunch of camera sensors

#

I know these aren't expensive, but so are motors

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:15 PM

#

Lighthouse requires at least 2

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 2:15 PM

#

V1 does

#

V2 requires one

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:15 PM

#

for full 360 deg tracking ?

#

and V2 isn't even out yet

#

when it's out, and we see retail price, then we can restart this conversation \

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 2:16 PM

#

https://i0.wp.com/cdn.edgecast.steamstatic.com/steamcommunity/public/images/clans/25858291/aca486dcb1c5fa2f3ab4fb32cabe4c5329166bf0.jpg?resize=800%2C611

#

won't even need the IR blinks

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:16 PM

#

no matter how much better Vive's tracking is, there is nothing you can bring to the table to make $800 look more attractive than $459

#

(especially that for 99% of users tracking area is small and tracking quality will feel identical)

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 2:17 PM

#

well that's up to HTC or whatever SteamVR licensee to make a move

#

oculus did it first, good for them

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:19 PM

#

we aren't talking about consumer pricing

#

you were talking about future proofing and hardware capability

#

its obvious that oculus is trying to make up marketshare by dropping price and HTC isn't

#

let HTC kill itself if it wants to

#

there are other headsets coming out on SteamVR systems

#

that can choose their own path

#

hell i told a friend just today to take advantage of the rift drop and snap one up since he is in the market for VR

#

these are all Gen1 anyway, its gen2 that is important, whenever that break happens

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:31 PM

#

well, the whole point is that Rift is as good as Vive and now with $400 price tag it's what people should buy, no questions asked. I see a lot of people online actively advocating against getting Rift.

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:35 PM

#

those people typically have issues with oculus itself, not the hardware

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 2:37 PM

#

im pretty vocal against Oculus as a company but even I would buy a rift at that price. And I own a vive.

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:37 PM

#

my banks anti theft system blocked my order

#

is the usa at work yet?

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:38 PM

#

lol, fates conspired against you

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:39 PM

#

I cleared it with bank and messaged oculus to process again

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:40 PM

#

so, instead of ordering from Amazon or going to Best Buy you chose a route you were not recommended..

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:40 PM

#

no best buy here

#

local shop had sold out

#

and they weren't doing the offer yet

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 2:41 PM

#

vive keeps its price becouse a lot of people are hardcore oculus haters

#

so sales arent really stopping due to the competition from oculus

#

once they start seeing lost sales to oculus, THEN they will drop price

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:42 PM

#

I think vive will wait for new system nearer xmas

#

730 to 400 is quite a price drop

#

730 is what rift and touch would have cost at release

#

by using cc I'm protected if its just oculus dumping stock cos zenimax are crippling them

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:48 PM

#

some speculate the price drop is due to gen2 announcement

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:50 PM

#

not because sales are drying up and they've reduced costs?

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:50 PM

#

no idea

#

Zuk said he understands it's a long term game and he doesn't expect to see returns yet

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:51 PM

#

they just stated there would be no gen2 any time soon

#

if they lie and tons of people but this offer, they'll be pissed

#

buy

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:51 PM

#

well, that's what they say.. And then bam!, HTC still has no gen2 and Oculus offers it.. Who knows..

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:51 PM

#

kind of sucks for them that they can't do anything in china as well, that has to hurt sales considerably

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:51 PM

#

who no china?

#

why

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:52 PM

#

Oculus

#

pretty much banned out of china

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 2:52 PM

#

o.O

#

because of Facebook ?

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:52 PM

#

yeah

#

also explains why everything VR out of china is either their own headsets or vives

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 2:53 PM

#

well £399 brings it into PSVR territory

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:53 PM

#

oculus store isn't even available for china

#

they said they were trying to enter the market there, dunno what happened

granite jacinth Jul 10, 2017, 2:58 PM

#

@tired tree Seeing how Vive has such a huge presence there

#

I don't doubt that Rift is having a hard time there.

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 2:59 PM

#

well...oculus forums have people asking for the correct VPN settings in order to get their VR apps working in china......O.o

#

not exactly a smooth ride

granite jacinth Jul 10, 2017, 2:59 PM

#

Vive might be C-blocking them pretty good

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 3:01 PM

#

hmmm, 4.17 looks like it is in cleanup phase, should see the preview1 soon

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 3:02 PM

#

does it have production-ready Steam audio ?

jaunty shell Jul 10, 2017, 3:02 PM

#

oh man I wish Nvidia would move their butts and release a 4.16 VRworks branch 😂

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 3:03 PM

#

haven't tested it but there have been several commits related to steam audio and the valve guys promise of 4.17 being stable

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 3:05 PM

#

i'll keep my fingers crossed

#

https://forums.oculus.com/developer/discussion/54451/oculus-audio-sdk-1-16-available-now-new-format-for-downloading

Oculus

Oculus Discussion Forums

Join the Official Oculus Discussion Forums and talk about Oculus Rift, Oculus Touch, Samsung Gear VR, and virtual reality.

keen marten Jul 10, 2017, 4:07 PM

#

Hello.
How can I configure UE4 to work with the Gear VR Controller (position, orientation, touch pos, etc.)?

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 4:35 PM

#

so, for Oculus haters, here is how "bad" the company is: https://medium.com/@callumunderwood/going-indie-leaving-oculus-47c09b67f2ec

Medium

Going Indie: Leaving Oculus – Callum Underwood – Medium

Hi friends!

#

oh, and that's the guy who got me dev kit

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 4:38 PM

#

he also sent me 4 devkits

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 4:39 PM

#

fired for giving out too many devkits

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 4:40 PM

#

A consumer opinion, it is not.

#

nor is it a real game developer experience opinion

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 4:40 PM

#

@wintry escarp lol.. read the article..

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 4:40 PM

#

I did

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 4:40 PM

#

its nice they treat their empoloyees well tho

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 4:41 PM

#

he seemed to like working at oculus

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 4:41 PM

#

just wanted to go small, like when Oculus just started

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 4:41 PM

#

he probably has enough money to be able to dick around like that

#

look at the new job, it seems he did like looking and helping indies

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 4:41 PM

#

that's usually the case

#

people amass enough cash to not worry much about the future, and then go pursue their own dream

sharp swan Jul 10, 2017, 4:43 PM

#

im pursuing my dream with fuck all cash. Someone pay me !

normal thorn Jul 10, 2017, 5:05 PM

#

did you guys see Oculus w/ Touch is on sale now for $399?

#

https://www.oculus.com/rift/

Oculus Rift | Oculus

The Oculus Rift is a virtual reality system that completely immerses you inside virtual worlds. Oculus Rift is available now.

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 5:10 PM

#

😮

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 5:26 PM

#

someone must be doing a boxing game for vr by now

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 5:27 PM

#

plenty of them already

#

you just dont know about them

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 5:29 PM

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UZ6fqlZavo

YouTube

Road to VR

'Lone Echo' Launch Trailer

'Lone Echo' is a zero-G space adventure from Ready at Dawn that put you in the robotic shoes of Echo-1, a service android aboard a mining vessel just off the...

▶ Play video

#

10 more days

#

@wintry escarp if you get your Rift, you'll be able to enjoy that game 😃

#

seeing a lot of shit toward Rift after this sale event was announced

#

"death of Oculus", "death of VR", etc.

#

HTC's rabid fanboys shooting themselves in the foot

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 5:39 PM

#

no I wont

#

i will be running everything on lowest settings, gtx780 remember

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 5:39 PM

#

eeeh, it's not about lowest settings.. It's about presence

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 5:39 PM

#

its a present to myself

#

presents....get it

#

gets his coat

granite jacinth Jul 10, 2017, 6:27 PM

#

I am definitely a Vive fanboy

#

But..

#

I just got two free Rifts from Oculus

#

Sooo... Whatever

alpine torrent Jul 10, 2017, 6:31 PM

#

@granite jacinth so Vive2 and Rift2

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 6:43 PM

#

ok, i've ordered a rift....cleared it with bank and told oculus to push through the order. If i don't get one from that then i'm not meant to have one.

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 6:44 PM

#

just talked to co-worked who got Vive and now regrets it - he doesn't like wands and it loses tracking every now and then

#

(not a developer, end-user)

#

he first got PSVR, hated it.. Now got Vive. Like it more than PSVR, but not that much more. I told him about Rift on sale - he wants to get it now 😛

#

If only he just went for Rift to begin with, as I suggested 🙄

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 6:46 PM

#

the rift is better than the vive (vanilla vive)

#

but vive tracking is better

#

ive allways said that if you want to do HUGE room scale, get vive

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 6:46 PM

#

I just said his Vive loses tracking

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 6:46 PM

#

then rift better

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 6:48 PM

#

how do they stop cables getting tangled on games where you need to turn around?

#

you just have to turn long way around?

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 6:49 PM

#

@wicked oak "remember Valve was 100% against timewarp
in their slides they were like "do 90 fps, deal with it""

#

that isn't really true

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 6:49 PM

#

oh, they were

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 6:49 PM

#

they always said they wanted timewarp for hitches

#

and brief periods of low frame rate

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 6:50 PM

#

you sure? they were quite against timewarp

#

in fact, vive at the start was a disaster

#

becouse if you got close to 11 ms, it would drop you to 45 fps

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 6:50 PM

#

@wicked oak that's because they didn't have async timewarp for hitches

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 6:50 PM

#

so if you were past 9 ms, it would drop you automatically

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 6:50 PM

#

which they always said they wanted to add

#

all they could handle was brief slowdowns with the interleaved stuff, using it sustained was always a bad experience

#

using ATW sustained when you are below framerate is bad

#

it wasn't until ASW that that became tolerable IMO

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 6:54 PM

#

ASW need the new cards?

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 6:54 PM

#

@wicked oak before at 90hz with global update, a late time warp fixup was pretty much necessary to get below the hump

#

but just a late update of the projection matrices was pretty much enough once we got those features:

#

it was still necessary for GearVR, since it ran at 60Hz with rolling scanline

#

to get it near the threshold

#

"Even people that are inside the industry I could A/B test and the difference between 15 and 20 very few of them would be able to tell the difference."

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHLpKzUxjGk?t=11m33s

YouTube

UMKC School of Computing and Engineering

John Carmack Tech Talk with UMKC-SCE

To kick off our Spring 2017 Commencement, we asked honorary doctorate recipient, John Carmack, to speak to students and community members on campus here at U...

▶ Play video

#

Valve basically hit that threshold without using timewarp, but always said they still wanted it to handle hitches

#

their main thing in their talk and slides you were talking about was they advocated not always doing a late fixup, because it wasn't necessary if you were hitting frame rate

#

Oculus was doing a late fixup reprojection on every frame even if you were hitting frame rate at the time

#

(Oculus also predicts farther out, and then the fix up fixes missed predictions, I'm pretty sure Valve just didn't bother predicting out since they could hit real close to that 20-22ms threshold and not need it)

#

📎 reprojection.jpg

#

@wicked oak there's his slides: good for hitches, need positional for sustained, but it was an unsolved problem at the time

#

Oculus had put out a precursor to spacewarp that used the depth buffer, it still had the double ghosted imagery on some animations and it had problems filling holes and didn't work at all with translucency. ASW has solved most of that, but still can't handle like tons of layers of translucency, it is image based and just kind of gets the dominate motion

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 7:13 PM

#

@mighty carbon if his vive is losing tracking then he has it set up wrong.....pretty easy to load up a lighthouse skin and check for FOV overlaps

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 7:14 PM

#

@wintry escarp yeah I think it won't work on the 700 series

#

@wicked oak "they only implemented timewarp after oculus did" <-- and Oculus only did after Zenimax did 😛

#

@wicked oak "they are on the verge of killing the professional dota2 modellers" <--- and disney doesn't let you sell your own mickey mouse backpacks without paying them most of the margin

#

I definitely agree the vive came out earlier than it would have due to the oculus competition

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 7:19 PM

#

@tired tree I don't think he is that advanced.. Otherwise he's already Googled the solution. That being said, I didn't have any issues setting up Rift 360 deg. tracking, although it was tedious process.

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 7:19 PM

#

its the SAME thing....

#

his lighthouses aren't providing full coverage

#

same as if you set up rift cameras pointing half away from each other

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 7:20 PM

#

well, Rift setup app has clear visuals showing where to aim sensors. I don't know how it's done in Vive.

#

like, almost real-time feedback clear visuals

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 7:20 PM

#

if he followed the instructions he would be fine, just don't lord it around like its a steamVR issue

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 7:21 PM

#

UX design issue

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 7:21 PM

#

it also shows them when setting up

#

he obviously was in a rush

#

and has never corrected it

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 7:21 PM

#

maybe..

#

Just saying it's not all perfect with Vive and also depends on how user sets it up. So, in this case, I have better tracking than he does 😉

tired tree Jul 10, 2017, 7:22 PM

#

why do you even go on these pro oculus anti vive days here? this isn't the place where you keep running into your "fanatics", go argue where they are

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 7:23 PM

#

well, why not ? At least we get some conversation going here 😃

#

I blame John_Alcatraz for triggering these disputes 😛

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 7:25 PM

#

@wicked oak "the original plan was oculus doing the hardware, and the games still get sold on steam" <--- that wasn't the plan at least as soon as Oculus got VC (Eve Valkyrie exclusivity deal came soon after, and before facebook), and Valve still kept collaborating with them. You can see at dev days 2015 there was tension though, with Valve presenting openvr and Oculus not really seeming to take them up on it.

#

It also may never have really been the plan. Oculus raised more money in investments and loans than the entire kickstarter goal before the kickstarter even launched. I bet they didn't pitch investors with the same plan they pitched kickstarter backers with

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 7:28 PM

#

interesting

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 7:31 PM

#

@full junco lighthouses were produced by HTC and I think they made some pretty big improvements in reliability and cost savings (something about moving from harddrive motors to some other one with a different bearing)

#

@mighty carbon "even Valve said that Constelation might be used in the future, not Lighthouse" <--- that says nothing about today though. I do think it will ultimately be cheaper. But they need to put the processing on the camera itself with some kind of custom silicon or something (or wait on moore's law)

#

and like @tired tree said, if inside out is the future and can be made to work with motion controllers (apparently the hard part), they may not bother investing in on-board processing for the cameras

#

@mighty carbon "just wanted to go small, like when Oculus just started" <--- I think Callum joined after Facebook acquired Oculus, or right before

#

(he gave me a dev kit too =P)

#

on price drop: yeah that's huge, the first one to $600 wasn't really enough to turn thing because of all the extra cameras extensions and crap you needed to match vive

#

but at $400 even after you buy all that shit it is still a lot cheaper

#

There has been one Vive sale at around $600 in the past though (black friday). I could see HTC dropping it to that and still doing ok against $400, but they may need to go even lower

#

I'd say $600 with the audio strap would be competitive, but I think that thing is too much of a hidden cost cash cow for them to bundle it for now

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:03 PM

#

@sturdy coral vive needs to get money from each sale

#

oculus doesnt becouse they have the store

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:04 PM

#

@wicked oak how do you know that?

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:05 PM

#

people buy games on steam with the vive. Steam money goes to valve

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:05 PM

#

HTC could have made a deal with Valve on some cut of software sales over some timeframe, etc.

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:05 PM

#

uhm, thats a possibility

#

not sure about that tho

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:05 PM

#

@wicked oak Oculus doesn't care about store sales for now

#

from their public $500,000,000 software investment they are way in the hole

#

they aren't making up things on the store

#

it is a very long term bet

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 8:07 PM

#

$500 mill?

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:07 PM

#

@wintry escarp https://uploadvr.com/mark-zuckerberg-oculus-invested-250m-funding/

UploadVR

Mark Zuckerberg: "We've Invested $250M in Funding Oculus Content"

On stage at Oculus Connect this year, Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg stated the company had invested $250 million in content funding.

#

$250 as of connect 3, and they said they would invest another $250

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 8:08 PM

#

must be a lot still to be seen

#

unless that's mostly free rifts

#

i can see this price cut adding a lot of new users

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:12 PM

#

yeah, now it is finally close to "buy a second monitor, or buy VR?" price territory

#

I wonder if it will bait Valve and whoever else into announcing dates and details on knuckles and on headsets using the new sensors and basestations

#

if they don't announce good pricing too I don't know if that will be enough to dissuade people

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 8:33 PM

#

hopefully its not just oculus clearing stock before giving up on vr

mighty carbon Jul 10, 2017, 8:40 PM

#

it could be that

#

and Fb will have Oc as R&D division making VR for the following decade

#

scenario - Fb clears up stock of gen1 Rifts and let ecosystem evolve or die, while working on gen2 or next big thing

#

there is still a community of Sega Dreamcast and they still make games for it

#

Apparently Rift stock is sold out on Amazon

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:51 PM

#

that's something to think about..

#

connect 4 is in 2 and a half months

#

I don't think they will give up on VR, but whatever santa cruz becomes could be announced at that point

#

hopefully it has optional PC connectivity

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 8:53 PM

#

people will say no way they spent more than $2billion, but ms poured $5 billion into windows phone and its basically dead now

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:54 PM

#

I think Facebook spent close to $4 billion

#

in the zenimax trial they said after all the bonuses that were part of the acquisition it cost $3 billion

#

then they paid zenimax something like $300 million (ignoring what palmer and iribe paid personally)

#

then $500 million on content

#

and then R&D

#

("more than 5% of Facebook's total employees work for Oculus" https://uploadvr.com/5-percent-facebooks-employees-working-vrar/)

UploadVR

VR News, Events, and Talent | UploadVR

UploadVR is dedicated to bringing virtual reality technology to the consumer masses. We believe that VR technology is fundamentally transforming the way we learn, interact and understand the world around us.

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:57 PM

#

i wonder if they will show a Oculus with inside out tracking/wireless

#

what happened to that prototype

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:57 PM

#

yeah that's santa cruz

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:57 PM

#

but not as prototype, but about " we gunna sell it"

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:57 PM

#

yeah

#

I think they will, question in my mind is will it have pc connectivity as an option

#

what they showed last year was using gear vr chips at higher clock rates

#

because they had better cooling

#

even though the demos were scenes from dreamdeck they were all on a smartphone SoC

wicked oak Jul 10, 2017, 8:58 PM

#

my question is battery

#

are they going to put the battery on the head?

#

they are heavy and explode

#

better on a belt

#

and if you go belt, go all the way and put the circuits there too

#

super light headset

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 8:59 PM

#

yeah, as counter-weight could be ok, but people might be nervous after gearvr

#

I think belt pack is ideal too, like a walkman

#

could have active cooling then too

#

for something like google glass a belt pack would be too cumbersome, but for VR where it is taking up all of your attention anyway I think it is more than fine

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 9:03 PM

#

said it before, only the screen should be on your head, rest should be on a belt pack

#

also means you can upgrade each one seperately

#

so how they handle games where you need to turn around a lot? you just need to keep yourself untangled or did they come up with ports that can rotate

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 9:08 PM

#

@wintry escarp you mean in current headsets?

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 9:08 PM

#

yes

#

all ive used is gearvr with is untethered

#

which

sturdy coral Jul 10, 2017, 9:09 PM

#

@wintry escarp assuming you turn randomly, the net twist only grows as a the square root of the amount of turning you are doing

#

some games have made concessions for it

#

job simulator guys said they had some recipes that made you go from one place to another in a sequence

#

that would add a twist each time

#

so they rearranged it

#

the original vive cable is pretty good at not getting kinked because it had 3 cables side by side fused together, I've heard the new 3-in-1 gets kinked more, and Oculus does too

#

but i don't think either are as bad as something like super nintendo controller cables

wintry escarp Jul 10, 2017, 9:13 PM

#

i will leave it up to fate now

glossy agate Jul 10, 2017, 9:27 PM

#

VR fanny pack. Hope we can get it in retro 80s colors.

granite jacinth Jul 11, 2017, 12:15 AM

#

Come watch some Gamejam VR games on my stream: http://www.twitch.tv/victorburgosgames

Twitch

VictorBurgosGames - Twitch

#ue4jam #VR playthru #unrealengine #indiedev #ue4 #gamedev

▶ Play video

#

I am being assisted by my 7 year old

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 12:37 AM

#

https://twitter.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/884560655986151424

John Carmack (@ID_AA_Carmack)

@DamageOnAHit @GearVR_us @VulkanAPI We are still waiting for some extensions, but currently multiview GL is outperforming vulkan in the big game engines, so it isn't a loss.

#

this is what's up with Vulkan vs GL on mobile

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 1:10 AM

#

@mighty carbon I wonder if "the big game engines" includes id tech 6 😃

#

(tongue in cheek; id tech 5 came to mobile, but I'm not sure id tech 6 has any support left over)

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 1:13 AM

#

nah, he means Unity/UE4 (he already mentioned that to someone else a few weeks ago)

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:45 AM

#

@sturdy coral did/ does id tech 5 work well on mobile with vulkan?

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 1:46 AM

#

@pearl tangle nope, before its time

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:49 AM

#

did it perform well on mobile at all then?

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 1:50 AM

#

@pearl tangle yeah it was one of the most impressive things on ios at the time

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:51 AM

#

ah never tried it out. I would have figured iOS would run into memory issues with their whole gigantic texture stuff. I run into that problem a lot with iOS with ue4 even

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 1:51 AM

#

it actually worked well with that

#

mobile has very fast storage even compared to most contemporaneous laptops at the time

#

so the megatexture streaming stuff worked really well

#

and I think because the gpu shares system memory

#

carmack was able to do sparse texture/page fault stuff that didn't come to desktop GPUs until pretty recently

#

but I think it was also on some fixed paths and stuff I played a bit of it back then but didn't have an iphone so didn't play it very long

#

hah this toddler explains everything there is to know about VR disorientation:

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2UF-7BVf1zs&t=12m25s

YouTube

GDC

Designing to Minimize Simulation Sickness in VR Games

Simulation sickness, when a player feels sick after playing a game, has recently received more attention due to the promotion of VR headsets in the gaming sp...

▶ Play video

#

(at 12:25)

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 2:51 AM

#

where do you get sound fx for your projects?

keen iron Jul 11, 2017, 2:55 AM

#

Anyone mess with the VRExtension plugin? I downloaded the template demo but its just the executable. Is there a template project download somewhere?

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 2:56 AM

#

@mighty carbon buy 1 of the packs of the marketplace, there is a buttload on there

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 3:25 AM

#

hmm... no sounds I need and not whole a lot of variety

#

I guess I'll put my Google-fo skills to use

#

😛

keen iron Jul 11, 2017, 3:27 AM

#

freesound.org is helpful

#

found the project, just had to clone it off the bitbucket

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 4:01 AM

#

Yeah I just upgraded my project to the new vr expansion version with refactored character.

#

You have to download the template example not the actual test project link at the top.

#

@keen iron ^

#

It's the link just below plugin repository on the forum thread

keen iron Jul 11, 2017, 4:03 AM

#

i think i got it, its building rn

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 4:04 AM

#

Make sure to rename the folder to something shorter or it will fail.

keen iron Jul 11, 2017, 4:04 AM

#

ye, i installed the plugin on the other project i was working on

#

and made a blueprint from the VRCharacter class

#

but the camera just falls right to the floor of the landscape at the start no matter what i did with the capsule height, camera eye height settings etc. lol

#

hoping that i can find the answer to that in the example project

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 4:07 AM

#

Haha, yeah that's a strange problem. I'm just using the template as a base for mine and just modifying ripping until I have what I need.

keen iron Jul 11, 2017, 4:17 AM

#

hmm so i have it open and the pawn is set to none in settings

#

so i guess everything is coming form the Steam_Vr_PlayerController?

#

Im trying to figure out where i'd go to hack through it and cut out controls / features i don't want. @glossy agate Did you open up the Steam_VR_PlayerController script and just start taking things out or am I missing some Blueprint only way of doing things?

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 4:25 AM

#

Yeah, I think it was the game mode script that calls the char manually instead of there you would normally find it.

#

Just click content and search character the find the vive_character I think it's called. That's what I have been working currently to get what I want.

#

It's the main parent character

keen iron Jul 11, 2017, 4:27 AM

#

o i c, vive pawn character

#

cool ty, thought i was going to have to start chopping out chunks of code from the scripts

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 4:28 AM

#

For sure. Yeah, chopping up code is waaay beyond me haha.

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:26 AM

#

wow

#

Rift for $399 now PLUS $100 amazon gift card

#

now we're in the ballpark

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:30 AM

#

that is pretty damn good actually

wintry escarp Jul 11, 2017, 8:32 AM

#

amazon has no stock here

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:34 AM

#

limit one per customer, should be ebay profitable

#

I definitely have a couple friends who will finally buy in at this price

#

this is really good, should be a big user base boost

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:35 AM

#

yeah at that point it's a slightly more viable price but still don't know how much it will actually bring on new users. I'd say it's a relatively small percentage of people who were really interested in VR but didn't make the investment already.

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:35 AM

#

it is effectively $300 with this deal

#

with touch

#

that is beyond any expectation I had

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:36 AM

#

I just ordered 2 more of the zotak zbox 1070's mini PC's. They are great and small, sit well at a TV. If they did good bundles with those sorts of 1s it would be quite interesting

#

also keen to see when steam vr will work on steam OS, dedicated VR box will be an intriuging 1

#

📎 unknown.png

#

buy used for only $3 extra...

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:37 AM

#

hah

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:37 AM

#

must be because it comes with free sweat?

wintry escarp Jul 11, 2017, 8:37 AM

#

they need to fix that

#

vr would be great for cycle machines etc if they can stop them collecting sweat

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:38 AM

#

I wish there was a big competitor to amazon that would try to stick it to them by beating their prime day rift deal with a huge vive discount

#

walmart or something 😛

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:38 AM

#

yeah I have 1 of the Virzoom bikes. need to have a different cover on the headset of it for sure

#

https://www.amazon.com/Hyperkin-Freestep-Cable-Management-System-Oculus/dp/B073P7GJNP/ref=sr_1_12?ie=UTF8&qid=1499761903&sr=8-12&keywords=oculus+rift&refinements=p_n_shipping_option-bin%3A3242350011 has anybody used these at all?

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:38 AM

#

vive has constantly been $100 off off and on for about a year now

#

I want to pick up a new one just for the weight savings and would probably do it at $600

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:40 AM

#

im running wireless on mine at home now and the deluxe audio strap so relatively happy with it. but a bit lighter would always be handy

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:40 AM

#

are you able to use that well in dev?

#

use bigger batteries, etc.?

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:40 AM

#

the battery on it lasts about 4 or so hours so haven't really needed to. And can just swap it out with another battery and run indefinitely if I need to.

#

haven't tried doing dev work with it though. just been using it at home for actually playing games instead

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:42 AM

#

man I really want that too, if the weight can be shifted towards the back it might help counterbalance too

#

but I guess if it isn't right on top it gets some occlusion from your head?

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:43 AM

#

i've got the TPcast so its the battery on the short cord down to your pocket

#

you don't notice the bit on top of the head at all, its really light

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:44 AM

#

ah yeah I meant the weight of the unit and not the battery, that's good it is light

#

I really wonder what Oculus has up their sleeves for connect 4 now, it really does seem like they are clearing out inventory for something new

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:45 AM

#

id say they would be pushing their standalone 1. get a new market before other guys get into it

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 8:46 AM

#

@sturdy coral where do you see the $300?

#

https://puu.sh/wGRrp/467840d7da.png

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:46 AM

#

$400 and $100 amazon voucher he was talking about

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 8:46 AM

#

this is what I see at amazon.com

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:46 AM

#

@full junco you have to have prime

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:47 AM

#

📎 unknown.png

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 8:47 AM

#

@pearl tangle it doesnt say anything about the gift card there

#

@sturdy coral so its actually more expensive

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:47 AM

#

I think it may be already sold out

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 8:48 AM

#

for $300 I could have gotten some friends to buy it, yeah

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:48 AM

#

well still $400 outlay anyway

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:48 AM

#

📎 Untitled.jpg

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:48 AM

#

says that on mine too

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:48 AM

#

I got one

#

even though I already have one I just figured it would ebay if nothing else, but I will probably sell to a friend

#

so yeah if it is instantly out of stock at like 4AM in the morning it might not be that big of a thing for Vr adoption

#

$400 is still pretty good, but you really need at least three cameras

wintry escarp Jul 11, 2017, 8:51 AM

#

I wouldn't be doing any walking in it

#

no room

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:52 AM

#

I really wanted to buy like 10 for an arcade at that price =P, but then they have all those restrictions on commercial use

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:53 AM

#

would be good fun

#

gonna tidy up this project we built for a client and add some more improvements and gamification to it and then it's going to run in viveland in taiwan in their sports area

#

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4I6dPb_uLQ

YouTube

iris labs

BTVR

▶ Play video

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 8:53 AM

#

you dont need the 3 cameras

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:54 AM

#

whoa cool

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 8:54 AM

#

the 3 cameras is for bigger roomscale

#

i dont like the games that make me spin around as i get entangled. To play the oculus games, wich are designed to be forward facing, you are perfect with 2

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:55 AM

#

in my experience two cameras alone doesn't work well, but my corners are far enough apart that is stretching the range

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:55 AM

#

I can't play those. too used to the vive so can't do the forward facing only. hate teleporting around and having to control the direction

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:56 AM

#

yeah I've got 4 cameras, but only three hooked up right now from USB limitations

#

@wicked oak have you tried two cameras in an opposing config and had good luck with it?

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 8:58 AM

#

its my setup

#

works fine

#

i have the rift setup at my workstation, so i dont have that much space there

#

i use the vive on a different room where i can have more space

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:58 AM

#

the cable is just too short on it to do proper roomscale as well.

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 8:58 AM

#

mostly due to cabling with the cameras

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:59 AM

#

yeah, I'm using the vive breakout box to "kind of" extend it

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 8:59 AM

#

but i like the rift a lot more than the vive

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:59 AM

#

but it isn't a real extension

#

since it is stuck in place

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 8:59 AM

#

with just a long displayport/hdmi cable and longer USB cable I can get in a 6m*6m space without any issues

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 8:59 AM

#

other extensions have failed for me.. their whole wiring, USB, etc. situation is a clusterfuck

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 9:00 AM

#

i prefer the rift controllers and i like the comfort of the headset. hate the heat it puts out though

#

put the pro's of both headsets together and we will be at a pretty decent product

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:00 AM

#

I like vive comfort more the way it fits my face and glasses and stuff

#

but it is just too heavy for my busted neck

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 9:01 AM

#

thats why vive added the headstrap

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:01 AM

#

I got it, still too heavy

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 9:01 AM

#

it bridges the gap a bit

#

you have an older vive? newer ones shaved a lot of weight

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 9:01 AM

#

certainly allows you to sit the weight a little bit better on it.

#

yeah the newest 1s are lighter than the rift right?

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:01 AM

#

older, yeah I want one of the newer ones to see if it is a help

#

I have vive pre which is supposed to be extra heavy

#

a strap can't really change center of gravity though, it just mainly affects how the weight is distributed on your face

#

but the center of gravity is still out a good bit farther than on rift (at least on Vive Pre)

#

I wonder if any of the weight reduction affected that too, like if more weight came off from the front

#

the original teardowns the circuitboards had tons of shielding and stuff that might have gotten reduced

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 9:03 AM

#

I also only have a vive pre, would be interesting to know how much less weigth newer ones have

jaunty shell Jul 11, 2017, 9:03 AM

#

but the new ones come with a pretty simple packaging, where the first version came with a premium packaging 😄

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 9:03 AM

#

man, if only i could get a vive pre at its time...

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:04 AM

#

@full junco it is supposed to weigh 15% less

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 9:04 AM

#

i made Deathwave wich was trash, and then made DWVR as a vr port of it when i got my headset

#

i would have done DWVR directly from the start if i had an early vive

#

but couldnt get it

jaunty shell Jul 11, 2017, 9:05 AM

#

I had the opportunity to test a devkit (the one with the fugly wands) while working at Technicolor

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:05 AM

#

I got one of the pre-pre dev kits around october

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 9:05 AM

#

damn

#

almost a year before i got mine

jaunty shell Jul 11, 2017, 9:05 AM

#

it looked metal as fuck

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 9:05 AM

#

i got mine in august

#

took me 3 weeks after i got it to RELEASE VRMultigames

#

i had to buy a retail one, and not even one of the first batches

#

i bought it by reselling my rift CV1 for 800 euros

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:07 AM

#

I was planning on releasing a roomscale bullet hell in april a bit after launch.. then at GDC valve showed a roomscale bullet hell that everyone got for free

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 9:07 AM

#

lol

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:09 AM

#

that's how it goes.. like that mesh maker guy just straight out made his game free and open sourced it after google put out blocks

#

within a day or something

jaunty shell Jul 11, 2017, 9:10 AM

#

aim for niche markets :p

#

less but dedicated customers

#

less competition too

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:13 AM

#

it was fairly niche at the time

#

apparently up until a couple weeks before GDC Xortex worked liked the remote control drone you get as a prize in the main room in the lab, you didn't directly control it with your hands

#

but my stuff wasn't exactly like xortex or anything.. xortex was way better and there was no way I could compete in any time frame especially with free

jaunty shell Jul 11, 2017, 9:17 AM

#

well tbh, vortex is the only game of that genre in VR right now

#

and its not a "full" game by any mean, just a tech demo

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 9:26 AM

#

there have already been some clones

#

within a couple months

#

whoa they also itemized the amazon gift card, so only paid sales tax on the $300 cause gift cards are exempt

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 11:30 AM

#

So, if Rift sold out everywhere, I wonder how many more users we got in VR now

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 11:46 AM

#

GPUs should go down in price soon - Etherium crashed

patent stirrup Jul 11, 2017, 11:48 AM

#

ETH crashes and rebounds daily lol

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 11:49 AM

#

more like biweekly

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 11:52 AM

#

deal seems to be back

#

buying another lol

patent stirrup Jul 11, 2017, 11:53 AM

#

@wicked oak the big ones yeah, those are the ones I always double my eth in.

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 11:54 AM

#

you were right

#

its at 200 dollars now

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 11:54 AM

#

says limited to 1 per customer but seems to be 1 per checkout now

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 11:54 AM

#

im almost thinking of buyin a couple of them

#

becouse it will rebound for sure

patent stirrup Jul 11, 2017, 11:55 AM

#

@wicked oak do it really late or super early in the morning. It likes to crash around those times.

#

Eastern time for me.

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 12:01 PM

#

hah they fixed the bug

#

I think I got like 5 or 6 of them

#

ah no, only 3 went through

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 12:21 PM

#

I wonder how many units will collect dust before they are resold and how many were purchased by actual end-user

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 12:23 PM

#

I just wonder how they are able to do it this low without getting into anti-trust/dumping etc. territory

#

could just be prices coming down like phones I guess, it has been well over a year since launch

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 12:28 PM

#

Well, who is going to complain?

#

If they were leading in sales to being with, HTC could file against them.

#

But they way things are, no one is going to be concerned

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 12:29 PM

#

yeah, I don't know all the rules on dumping

#

you definitely can't use a monopoly in one area to establish one in another through bundling and stuff (like microsoft) but that isn't what they are doing

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 12:30 PM

#

Btw, another conspiracy theory is that Zeni might block sales after all and they are trying to get a rid of stock

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 12:30 PM

#

and I don't know that they have a social monopoly to the same degree as MS did

#

that would be nuts

#

if it was just their own sale I'd say plausible, but it seems like prime day would have been planned a good bit in advance

#

who knows though, amazon probably moves fast

#

just considering the xbox controller it is really crazy

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 12:32 PM

#

Best buy sells them cheap too

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 12:32 PM

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you can get a friend a rift and touch for like $260-270

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by selling the xbox controller

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I thought maybe when it came back in stock it was just selling a few remaining cancelled orders but it seems to be holding

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if they can stay in stock most of the day this could be really huge for VR adoption and online player counts

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 12:37 PM

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Connect is soon

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maybe they are cleaning inventory to offer a rift 1.5 later

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 12:38 PM

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could be.. a big resolution bump would make this gen look really dated really fast

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we're just barely there on resolution right now

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 12:39 PM

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wireless plz

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 12:51 PM

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out of stock again

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its still pretty early in the morning east coast; if they can end up going through a large part of the business day with it in stock this will have been the biggest VR news in a long time

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:09 PM

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wireless is as much as the headset if you want to get your hands on it now

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I could offload my TPcast if somebody had big enough wallets 😉 haha

winter venture Jul 11, 2017, 1:10 PM

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not happy with the tpcast?

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:10 PM

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yeah its pretty cool. definitely makes running around playing robo recall a lot better without having to worry about the cables

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but I don't actually have time to be playing VR games so much lately anyways and I have access to all of the hardware and can get more when I need them

winter venture Jul 11, 2017, 1:11 PM

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yeah i bet... i can't wait for wireless, but occlusion issues and battery life worried me with the tpcast

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:11 PM

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4 odd hours it's given me and then you can just swap out the battery so no real issues there

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I was able to still get tracking like 10m away from the thing too so didn't really have occlusion problems

winter venture Jul 11, 2017, 1:12 PM

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yeah i guess that's pretty good with a second battery

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:12 PM

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decent enough piece of kit for early stuff. could use some ergonomic fixes with the battery placement but its easy enough to have in your pocket. I would prefer self contained on the headset though to make it easier for events

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 1:13 PM

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i would love tpcast + a big-ish roomscale for shooters and games like Gorn

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:13 PM

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since it's still got a cable with that, just easier to manage

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yeah I have 4m*4m on it. It's good fun.

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need to try out some more stuff with it, haven't played too many games with it. Had it sitting there for like 2 months and only used it twice

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 1:26 PM

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@pearl tangle I'll trade you a rift + touch for tpcast

pearl tangle Jul 11, 2017, 1:31 PM

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already got 3 of those and never use them either :p hah

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 2:49 PM

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4.17 preview 1 is out !

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Audio is still in early access

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not really whole a lot of new stuff.. no mention of Vulkan for VR

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 2:57 PM

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The ‘Additional Meshes’ feature for previewing modular meshes now uses the ‘Copy Pose’ node instead of ‘MasterPose’. This means it can support meshes that do not share a Skeleton, and bones are copied by name.

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this is fucking huge

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it means you can have an arm mesh that has an arm skeleton

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and not a fullbody skeleton

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but will still attach just fine to a fullbody skeleton as submesh

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(Early Access) The new Unreal Audio engine now supports Android, PS4, Xbox One, iOS, and Mac OS.

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oh fuck yes

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gotta have to try that

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 2:58 PM

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@mighty carbon "Spectator screens are now supported on the Oculus and HTC Vive."

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 2:58 PM

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finally ill be able to have better sound

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New features and improvements are coming for development on XBox One, Nintendo Switch, and PS4. Since console code is not available for the Previews, details will be provided with the final 4.17 release.

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 2:59 PM

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thats the mixed / spectator system....its actually huge

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 2:59 PM

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you tease

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Stereo layers have been unified across all platforms, allowing developers to use them agnostically across any platform without worrying about functional differences between platforms.

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i wonder how well that works

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 3:03 PM

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@tired tree oh interesting.. So is that what we talked about the other day? (non-VR player doing something on the screen while VR player is in VR)

sharp swan Jul 11, 2017, 3:03 PM

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that would be interesting

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usually my wife just pulls my pants down when I have the vive headset on

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shes a troll sometimes

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 3:03 PM

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can have mixed reality, spectator screen, and one player on screen on in HMD with that system

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its fairly robust

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 3:04 PM

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cool

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 3:05 PM

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Mixed reality support is great for PR cause youtubers like it.

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More likely they will play your game (if it's good)

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 3:06 PM

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yup, its a marketing tool

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 3:07 PM

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oh sweet, a engine update with no relevent character movement changes

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 4:29 PM

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nothing special in this release for Gear VR..

wintry escarp Jul 11, 2017, 4:42 PM

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can you do your gearvr dev in the rift now, to save having to deploy to test things?

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 5:09 PM

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@wintry escarp Well, once you make sure your project deploys and run on Gear VR and all minimum requirements are implemented, the rest can be done using Rift + remote.

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(Remote is to emulate touchpad clicks)

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 5:27 PM

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const FGamepadKeyNames::Type SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_HandGrip("SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_HandGrip");

const FGamepadKeyNames::Type SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_IndexGrip("SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_IndexGrip");
const FGamepadKeyNames::Type SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_MiddleGrip("SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_MiddleGrip");
const FGamepadKeyNames::Type SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_RingGrip("SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_RingGrip");
const FGamepadKeyNames::Type SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_PinkyGrip("SteamVR_Knuckles_Left_PinkyGrip");

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knuckles support is in 4.17 too

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 5:31 PM

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nice

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I guess we'll find out about Steam Audio from final release notes

sharp swan Jul 11, 2017, 5:42 PM

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I really wish I was working on my VR game so I could try snag a pair from HTC.

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 5:43 PM

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they didn't promise full release for it in 4.17 @mighty carbon they said it would be "useable" / "stable"

sharp swan Jul 11, 2017, 5:49 PM

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those are silly names to use though. I mean ring grip? I don't wear rings. Do I lose an FGamepadKeyNames entry then? 😄 PinkyGrip? But my finger is brown as I sit on it all day. What is wrong with indexing it?

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 5:51 PM

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Mordentral did you request knuckles yet?

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 6:14 PM

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yeah but i'm not technically a "game dev" so no high hopes on my part

sharp swan Jul 11, 2017, 6:15 PM

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of course you are. Just register yourself self-employed, give yourself a business name and get a .com. Put up a page saying "new game coming soon exclusively on Vive" and point them to it :p

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 6:15 PM

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pfft

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ug...all this vulkan additions to steamvr means I have to compile the vulkan modules in now as well...

sharp swan Jul 11, 2017, 6:16 PM

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worth it tho

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 6:17 PM

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oh god no, having to add 999999 different events and axis...

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its allready annoying enough with Touch

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 7:19 PM

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OH FFS

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launcher versions of the engine don't include the OpenGL source files

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 7:32 PM

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o.O

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https://uploadvr.com/unity-nvidia-vrworks/

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it would be nice for UE4 to have it as standard feature, but meanwhile, https://github.com/NvPhysX/UnrealEngine/tree/VRWorks-Graphics-4.16

glossy agate Jul 11, 2017, 7:45 PM

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Anyone with an SLI setup try this yet? https://developer.nvidia.com/vrworks/graphics/vrsli

NVIDIA Developer

VRWorks - VR SLI

VR SLI provides increased performance for virtual reality apps where multiple GPUs can be assigned a specific eye to dramatically accelerate stereo rendering. With the GPU affinity API, VR SLI allows scaling for systems with more than 2 GPUs.

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 7:58 PM

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@mighty carbon why should they specifically mention vulkan for VR, its not like its super usable yet

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too few people care about linux

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@tired tree they merged knuckles support 4 days ago, you didnt see the commit? https://github.com/EpicGames/UnrealEngine/commit/ecba3636f684a73605603ca50ea70258f8552f6a

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sounded like you were surprised its in 4.17

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 8:06 PM

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4 days ago I was in my vacation :p

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 8:15 PM

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@full junco because I care about Vulkan on Windows ? 😃

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 8:15 PM

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Vulkan on Windows won't be relevant in 4.17 due to bad performance

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 8:16 PM

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😦

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 8:17 PM

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its great that it works though

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 8:32 PM

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@wicked oak are you going to test VRWorks for 4.16 ?

wicked oak Jul 11, 2017, 8:35 PM

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no

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im doing ps4 stuff

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probably later

full junco Jul 11, 2017, 8:44 PM

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if GPU prices wouldn't be crazy due to ethereum I would buy me a 10xx GPU just for being able to test the VRWorks stuff

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 8:50 PM

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VRworks is pretty sick to be honest

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"when it works correctly"

wintry escarp Jul 11, 2017, 9:15 PM

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rift will be here tomorrow

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 9:23 PM

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@tired tree is it a pain to build Editor from Nvidia branch ?

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 9:23 PM

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no harder than anything else

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 9:23 PM

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I'd definitely want to ship VRWorks build along with regular build

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 9:23 PM

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good luck with that if you don't plan to lock into a single version

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also if its not singleplayer, then you'd need to go into the subsystem and make some changes or servers wouldn't work cross builds

mighty carbon Jul 11, 2017, 9:25 PM

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nah, market is small as it is.. Better serve AMD users too

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btw, cool stuff https://assadollahi.de/2-3d-cams-1-2d-cam-on-the-dk2-pi3/

tired tree Jul 11, 2017, 9:25 PM

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vrworks is supposed to be fine with AMD IE: it doesn't use the features for them

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they hopefully have that actually working correctly now

sturdy coral Jul 11, 2017, 11:00 PM

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yeah I haven't heard of any problems, but haven't tested it on AMD

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Two Bone IK improvements including a ‘NoTwist’ option and an ‘Enable Debug Draw’ option.

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is that for forearm twist?

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Plugins may now declare dependencies on other plugins, allowing the engine to automatically enable and load anything they require. Dependencies can be listed in a .uplugin using with the same syntax as .uproject files.

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^-- that's nice

quartz bay Jul 11, 2017, 11:10 PM

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Does anyone have experience deploying APK's to google play with OBB attachments?

glossy agate Jul 12, 2017, 12:34 AM

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@sturdy coral is that for full body ik without having to use ikinema?

sturdy coral Jul 12, 2017, 12:35 AM

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You can use it as part of implementing full body ik

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But it is just for doing ik for two bones, like forearm and upper arm

glossy agate Jul 12, 2017, 12:55 AM

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Hmm was thinking of getting ikinema, but don't know if there was a comparable native setup I could use to save some money.

mighty carbon Jul 12, 2017, 12:58 AM

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@sturdy coral I thought it's for snapping partial mesh/skel to full body skel

sly elk Jul 12, 2017, 1:00 AM

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Does anyone know if the forward renderer is getting any new rendering features in the near future? Ideally some kind of dynamic AO or specular occlusion?

pearl tangle Jul 12, 2017, 1:13 AM

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@quartz bay yeah you just need to upload the OBB file to the play store along with it and it will handle it all for you

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@glossy agate the 2 bone IK system would allow you to build a full body IK rig but it's not going to be out of the box. Ikinema is good for what it does but it requires you to be running another piece of software at the same time to do it in realtime in the engine

quartz bay Jul 12, 2017, 1:16 AM

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@pearl tangle I don't see the UI for uploading the OBB files; Just APK files. Am I missing something obvious?

pearl tangle Jul 12, 2017, 1:17 AM

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you have to upload the APK file first

glossy agate Jul 12, 2017, 1:38 AM

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@pearl tangle would it work for MP? Trying to figure out what other games are using.

pearl tangle Jul 12, 2017, 1:54 AM

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yeah the IK stuff has been in there for a while. It just takes a lot of configuring. There is another IK plugin that somebody has been working on for quite a while that works with the vive. I think he wants a few hundred bucks for that 1 too

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but thats all in unreal so no external setup, not sure if it handles vive trackers though like ikinema orion does