So:
Grab / Idle / Point / Fist / Thumbs Up / Hand open (For touch pad or long grab) - Any more?
#virtual-reality
junior prism
mortal current
that console command doesn't seem to exist in the editor
mortal current
oh, just no autocomplete
junior prism
You know what would be cool?
For the PC / streaming side of things with VR, if they outputted 3D glasses signal
so you could see depth instead of one eye of the HMD
mortal current
hmd mirror 0 doesn't work in 4.14 it seems, the rest do
real needle
hmd mirror 0 turns off the preivew
mortal current
ooo
golden snow
There's a way to get a full-screen Vive desktop window, no annoying black bars.
Can modify it at the Engine Level and Editor, so it works in both
real needle
@golden snow Yeah I've done it, I can share the code if you want
golden snow
No thanks, we have it.
real needle
It's here if anyone else needs it: http://pastebin.com/VGpXLDdU
clever sky
I should probably bitch at Epic on answerhub to fix that Chaperone bound issue on packaged.
But you can 'work around' the problem by letting the user set the size of the bounds manually.
And bypass the check nodes.
Upvotes for visibility plz!
dry fjord
could do a room calibration from in-game
get them to walk towards the edge and mark the room edge from just before when the controller suddenly dropped down the z axis
junior prism
It was strange how I mentioned that in stream the other day without even knowing it was an issue
clever sky
@dry fjord Not a bad idea! Stand in a corner and calibrate!
junior prism
It'd be easier in game than the cailbration tool because we have access to the camera don't we?
clever sky
Well, if you need that, sure. But I was thinking that it'd be easy enough for anyone to do it just by standing near the chaperone floor bounds
Which will still come through because that's a SteamVR thing
Or they could just lift off the headset. Anyway they do it, it's pretty easy!
show's a bit of that boundary alteration
dry fjord
Get them to take off the headset and draw the bounds
I prefer clicking in the corners
It's all kinds of shit though, I wonder if we coughs just make a cpp plugin to fix the big
Bug
clever sky
Probably. But mainly it involves getting info from the SteamVR side properly.
I got no idea how to do that.
dry fjord
Copy the editor
clever sky
The editor?
dry fjord
The editor gets the bounds
clever sky
Ah yeah
dry fjord
It'll just be a context thing
Although why we don't just tag @eternal nexus is beyond me
Oops
π
clever sky
Nice. Can he do something about it? π
Can we spam all the epic staff or would that be rude?
dry fjord
Nick, can you tell us please if the chaperone bounds will be available to blueprints in packaged games soon? It's bugged at the moment and only shows in editor
Like is it on the epic radar?
Yes it'd be rude to spam
clever sky
Like a bat signal. Save us epic!
junior prism
Wait, @dry fjord You're having issues getting the bounds in BP?
I got it fine? 0-0
You watched me do it lmao
clever sky
@junior prism Did it work once you had the project packaged?
Because that's the issue.
dry fjord
yeah, works in editor, not in packaged
sturdy coral
@clever sky there are other problems with Chaperone bounds: if you start the game with your headset and controllers outside of tracking, you will never get valid bounds even when you later enter tracking. Happens to me in dev all the time when I move from my desk to my playspace, so I made a fix for it. Maybe it will fix the packaged issue as well.
It is also a required fix if you want to allow moving between multiple tracking universes (pairs of base stations) without exiting and receive updated bounds
dry fjord
Oooooo
clever sky
@sturdy coral Nice. Thanks for sharing that. Side question... so how do I use this fix? π
sturdy coral
@clever sky you mean how to apply the diff, or how to use the fix in blueprints (it changed the get bounds interface a bit)?
clever sky
the former... or both? Assume I have no idea what that file is (because I don't)
sturdy coral
it is a unix diff file, basically a file that puts a + in front of any line added, and a - on any line removed
it is the output from 'git diff'
you can just manually apply it in this case since it is so small, or with a unix shell you can apply it using the patch command
clever sky
Ah... so it modifies the source files for the steamVRcomponent?
sturdy coral
and with github's windows shell there is probably a way to do it too
clever sky
Ok. Cool. I'll look into it. Cheers for the pointer!
sturdy coral
yeah, it lists each file it modifies with a --- and a +++
--- is the old file, +++ is the new one
you can put it on pastebin or something and it will probably syntax highlight it for you
I'll put up a commit on github with it too, right now I have one but it is split across multiple commits
I'll probably put it as a pull request pretty soon, because I heard they are refactoring chaperone to support Oculus' guardian as well
and I want to make sure they have this bug fixed and it doesn't get enshrined into the interface
clever sky
Ah yeah. That makes sense. Thanks for the hard work!
sturdy coral
@clever sky np, here it is with syntax highlighting, new lines in green, removed lines in red: http://pastebin.com/xDbiC6vw
clever sky
Thanks. That helps!
sturdy coral
the lines that look like '@ -376,6 +381,7 @@ private:' tell you the line number of the old file vs the new file
and then the lines with --- and +++ tells you which file is being modified
then on the blueprint side basically GetBounds now has an additional return value, IsValid
so you can repeatedly call it in a loop until IsValid is true
clever sky
Ah cool. I was looking at those numbers and thinking... is that his room size?
Makes more sense this way!
sturdy coral
with the old way it would try to get the bounds at start up, cache them even if they were invalid, then never update them again
clever sky
Yeah, even if it doesn't fix the packaging issue, it helps - because I do notice that unreal likes to bug out with those bounds.
sturdy coral
yeah, I'll have to test packaging, because that would be a big issue for my game
clever sky
Forces a restart - not as bad for me as I imagine for you though, as my desk is right next to my play area
sturdy coral
I can say I have done packaged builds and I have a loop that is checking that they are valid before things start
and it has returned true
sturdy coral
but no idea if the packaged build bug would some how fake it into thinking it was valid or something
clever sky
Yeah. I'm using a less than ideal 'manual input' option right now.
sturdy coral
yeah, you don't want to force that on users π
clever sky
Trick them as part of the 'initial calibration process!' π
sturdy coral
heh
real needle
@sturdy coral Does that workflow help you when you want to update your source build to a newer version of the engine? I'm still getting used to working out of source and I haven't learned how to keep source in a way that allows me to pull updates without issues. I've been reverting to default, updated, and then added my changes back. It's quite tedious and I tend to stay away from source changes because of it.
sturdy coral
@real needle I haven't made any extensive changes so I'm not really sure, in this case it was split across two commits because it either auto merged wrong or I didn't resolve a conflict correctly. When I moved to 4.13 I just manually used git cherry-pick to bring in the few changes I had made.
I think generally moving from major engine versions you'll want to cherry pick or rebase all your changes and bring them over to the new version rather than just trying to merge the new version downwards, but I'm not much of a git expert
real needle
Neither am I, but you gave me something to google, thanks!
mortal current
has anyone noticed the vive floor being miscalibrated when running the vr preview? it seems that even after I correct it, the problem comes up again
mighty carbon
Do you think Zenimax can crush Oculus/Facebook ?
dry fjord
asking the important questions
mighty carbon
I read something (although it was from Polygon π ) about Carmack's HDD containing evidence against Oculus
and that Samsung was ordered to produce some evidence
makes me wonder if there is a great possibility of Rift/Touch going to Bethesda (or some new division of Zenimax) and becoming Bethesda-only platform
dry fjord
it's a simple civil dispute
either things carmack worked on at work belong to his employer or they don't
they just want to squeeze facebook for money and given how big VR can get it's worth the lawyers
they won't be able to sue and "take" oculus
but they will be able to demand substantial damages
facebook might decide to sell oculus as well as the burden of responding to litigation
mighty carbon
well, they do, depending on a buyer, things might change with how Oculus operates and who can get on Oculus Home, and so on
right now anyone can, given that they have decent project
worst case scenario - only AAA devs can (or publishers) + Oculus scientists leaving to greener pastures
I would hate to invest money into Oculus hardware at this point, until legal battle clears up π¦
dry fjord
someone was raging about how oculus is a "more curated experience without shovelware"
I dare say everyone here is locked out of oculus home if that's the case
it's more likely that the original statement was just stupid though
there's plenty of shovelware on oculus home
aren't you using a gearvr motorsep?
mighty carbon
I love Oculus for that (walled garden)
Yeah, I've been making something for Gear VR
but now that Samsung has been summoned to court too, I feel uneasy about Oculus in general
(and I am still pro-walled garden stores; just like Steam used to be not too long ago)
Steam has more shovelware than Oculus Store has
I also think that there gotta be a way to be not walled garden in general, but provide better visibility tools and features.
and do something about dumb review system
dry fjord
the "walled garden" added nothing of value. it's not like apple's walled garden where there's something to defend - your privacy
in general walled gardens aren't good unless they have a reason to exist other than exclusivity
oculus is poison in that regard
then they sell shovelware regardless so it becomes a technology court
which is about the most toxic thing I can imagine
ballmer wanted to hold technology court
to give an example
one major difference between oculus and steam - at least on steam you can see reviews
some things lauded on the oculus store got really shitty reviews on steam just for being bad games
for that reason I'd rather be in an open free market where anything has a chance and the consumer is simply protected as a matter of rights, rather than severely limiting what the consumer even sees
and when what they see is a duplicitous choice you basically have the north korea of VR
oculus says it's the best, blind fanboys say YES ITS THE BEST and nobody is the wiser, except the 90% of VR users who are actually on steam
grim condor
i do agree with you antidamage, but the market is still so small, only a few hundred thousand users, i think it is what happens in 2017 that will set up the marketplaces. Oculus still have time to do the right thing and as much as i love steam, it has its issues also
mighty carbon
Steam was a walled garden once
someone you keep ignoring that fact
yet, it was possible for indies to get in
grim condor
i remember exactly the same hate towards steam many years ago
mighty carbon
and once you got in, you were golden
once Steam opened floodgates, an average indie suddenly stopped making a living
your game now had to be either sensational, or you had to invest a lot into PR and marketing
which is still out of reach for many garage indies
dry fjord
the market is at around 6-7 million if you include gear VR
that's per device
I'm not ignoring the fact that steam WAS walled
clearly it was a bad idea
don't put words in my mouth and look at what it is now
live in the real world with the rest of us
dry fjord
you also can't just say "steam did xxx now nobody makes money"
mighty carbon
more money
dry fjord
vendors who can't move with a market will get shut out of profits
mighty carbon
do you have deep pockets? Good for you if you do. Average indie doesn't.
dry fjord
there's no such thing as a passive income. you at least have to be ready to re-tool and re-deploy
mighty carbon
that has nothing to do with visibility
dry fjord
if you think it's all about deep pockets, are you a genius or a moron for not seeking VC?
is everyone who seeks VC a genius and is everyone else a moron wasting their time?
did you seek VC?
mighty carbon
if only 5k of people know about your game, you aren't making any money. You can update every damn day and you still won't have much coverage
dry fjord
is there a way to solve that?
mighty carbon
walled garden
dry fjord
or should it all be easy and weighted in favour of developers who do nothing for themselves?
and when you can't get into the walled garden?
mighty carbon
make a good appealing game, get on, and get your income
dry fjord
speaking of walled gardens, how has "no shovelware" worked on ios?
I think we don't understand what a walled garden is
mighty carbon
if you can't get into walled garden, then maybe you should switch a field or go work at a day job
dry fjord
I mean what happens when YOU don't get in?
worse, what happens if your idea of fun and quality and someone else's don't match up?
mighty carbon
that's what I will do - switch business model and/or continue with my day job and become a statistic
dry fjord
so you're prepared to fail?
mighty carbon
they never match up
dry fjord
on an entirely avoidable clause?
I have to say, a lot of the devs in this discord have fixed ideas and you can see where their efforts will end. at least you recognise yours will.
mighty carbon
I already succeeded (and failed) - nothing new to me π
dry fjord
are you planning to fail the same way twice?
mighty carbon
Second time will be definitely different
dry fjord
I'm not going to say that VC is easy, it's a lot of work and putting yourself out there, but it's also your marketing budget.
mighty carbon
I didn't fail because I didn't manage to get into walled garden
I don't want to deal with VCs
last time I was talking to a publisher, my cut was similar to what I make on my day job and that was before taxes and no insurance
dry fjord
I think you'll find that you live or die based on whims when it comes to the oculus store. a lot of devs rely on long tail income and oculus won't allow you to have that. they'll want to keep it "fresh"
mighty carbon
what kind of business model is that?!
dry fjord
that is, if your assumption about them having more quality is true
I still assert that their "quality" games were shovelware and just there to take advantage of VR being new
don't bother with a publisher, do VC. find a reasonable split or find a new VC partner. in fact do angel investing, find someone who just loves the idea and is willing to risk the money for the sake of the idea.
mighty carbon
I don't deny Oculus Storm has some weird ass shit that I have no idea how it got there (maybe a proof of "it's who you know" privileges?)
dry fjord
that's the thing, it's a technology court
mighty carbon
is angel investing still around?! o.O
dry fjord
and it feels like oculus is being run by playing favourites
yes it is
especially when it comes to VR
mighty carbon
hmm
dry fjord
VR is one of those things where every investor feels like he should have his foot in the door
and there's not enough good projects to fund
mighty carbon
lol, is there a class "how and where to look for an angel investor" ? π
dry fjord
I'd start by reading some FAQs and guides on YCombinator
you have to know people to find people
get involved in a VC community
mighty carbon
that's why I'd rather have a partner who deals with all that junk.. With day job, family and not being in my 20's it's kinda impossible to juggle with development, art and getting into VC community
mighty carbon
lol
that's why walled garden is better
it's a much straighter path to success than anything else
(and sometimes to financial freedom)
dry fjord
development within your comfort zone will usually have the same outcome as the last time
sometimes that's good, sometimes that's bad
meh all of your success hinges on one thing though
and oculus are cunts to deal with
mighty carbon
and if Oculus deals with favoritism, then no, it's not the walled garden I imagined
dry fjord
just like steam were back in the day
mighty carbon
(and not the one I dealt with when Steam was walled garden)
mighty carbon
Valve didn't know me
also, I'd not be bitching about Steam if they just got their store fixed
dry fjord
when everything hinges on knowing someone, I'd sooner know a VC and pay my way in. way more chances at meeting the right someone. rather than appearing a gatekeeper to the only market.
mighty carbon
for you - maybe
not for me
there is a good book about success.. I forgot the exact title
but it outlines (with details and based on facts) why some people where they are, and some are nowhere, no matter the talent and their persistence
don't get me wrong, miracles happen
Minecraft is one of the good examples (although if you look deeper, there are roots to it that helped Minecraft to blow up big)
thinking back, I could have been in a better position after I released my game, if I just did certain things right (and if some of the circumstances were different). But I didn't, and that set me back, far back.
once thing for sure - diversification is critical
grim condor
failure is just early steps of success
mighty carbon
true, but the older you get, the less step you have left
clever sky
Oh minecraft.
The once in a century lightning strike of right thing at the right time.
dry fjord
Disregard Minecraft
clever sky
I thought it was originally meant to be a 3D Dwarf Fortress clone
Poor poor Dwarf Fortress. The deepest game in computer gaming, and only computer scientists and other really esoteric types would want to play π
Yeah, Dwarf Fortress is an example of how not to run an indy game.
Kinda. I mean the brothers are happy doing what they do, and they have just enough to get by.
But... the game could've moved along much faster and reached a broader audience if they'd have been willing to charge and hire people to work with them.
But maybe... maybe Dwarf Fortress is actually a training simulator for operators outside the Matrix. You know how they watch the green code and see the matrix? That's kinda how Dwarf Fortress' ascii art is to people... after a while, they just get it.
dry fjord
Maybe we're the machines
grim condor
thats some deep shit for a monday
mighty carbon
still Sunday here... Westworld show is getting better and better with every episode π
clever sky
Oh shibs westworld
fresh laurel
WEW LAD
clever sky
Looks like you grew a petri-dish world.
π
What's it for? urban planning?
Real-estate selector?
pearl tangle
it was a square tabletop 1 before but then after watching westworld i decided to make it round. it's an actual landscape in unreal too
its an urban planning thing
clever sky
Fancy
pearl tangle
clever sky
Which landscape in unreal is it?
Or do you mean it's an asset you've brought into unreal?
pearl tangle
clever sky
as opposed to a premade one from Epic, like landscape mountain
pearl tangle
the actual stuff is from satellite scans and other data but the landscape in there is an unreal landscape that has been shrunk down so it's room size but then you can shrink yourself in vr to move around it at different scales
clever sky
Nice.
pearl tangle
so the starting scale in the room has you at a 2000:1 scale
then you have a control panel in 1 controller so that you can change the background and detail layers and your scale
clever sky
How do you scale change in unreal? I thought it was by using the world scale setting
But you can't set that at run time... at least not with BP D:
pearl tangle
yeah you can
clever sky
Oh. What do you call?
pearl tangle
you just adjust the "world to metres" setting
clever sky
I wanted to do a thing where you could scale the world around in real time per tick
like pinch to zoom
pearl tangle
initially its 100. so can just scale it from that
clever sky
but in VR π
pearl tangle
clever sky
Yeah, I'm familiar with that setting. I just don't know how to set it in BP
pearl tangle
call the node "set world to meters scale"
pearl tangle
shouldn't have to if you just call it not off anything else
clever sky
Or just not call it from a world settings reference.
fresh laurel
Interesting
clever sky
That's what was tripping me up
I kept trying to drag it off the world settings reference π
pearl tangle
hah yeah its just its own setting
so a pinch to zoom is pretty easy actually. same way the vr editor works
clever sky
Cool.
Yeah, I had the code all set up ready to go, but couldn't find that node, so I scrubbed it D:
pearl tangle
im demoing this to people that have never used a vive before though so made it super simple and just use the buttons on a control panel
fresh laurel
Oh nice
Is that unreal landscape or no?
@pearl tangle - How did you set that up?
I am lagggging
pearl tangle
yeah its unreal landscape
fresh laurel
Ok
pearl tangle
just done with a heightmap imported from satellite data
fresh laurel
Sorry Should have been more specific - How did you set up the road network
Ok
What modifications did you need to make the the satellite data?
pearl tangle
nothing, you just import and image for the landscape. its just a basic heightmap
fresh laurel
ok
pearl tangle
only needed to make modifications to the other data to use the same projection methods so that everything matched up correctly
fresh laurel
Care to go into detail on the last bit?
I want to use satalite data for a project of mine.
pearl tangle
well the world is round and different map data uses different ways to compensate for that for flat images. google uses different methods than other mapping companies because people use it differently. so needed to change projection methods around so that my road information and stuff matched with the same methods as the google satellite images
fresh laurel
ok
clever sky
What's the road? A decal layer?
pearl tangle
I have 12 different layers of detail information. At the moment they are in there as decals projected onto the landscape but this is the proof of concept. full version will be pulling the data from a REST API and creating spline points for all that stuff
pearl tangle
well longer term is pulling in real time information. so will be using it to track fleet's, display real time energy and water usage and other stuff. at the moment it's being done in VR but will be converting it to AR once the tech gets a bit more advanced
fresh laurel
Awesome
dry fjord
oh god it's fucking halloween
got no decorations out, still fucktards are knocking loudly on my door
I might rig up a flamethrower
fresh laurel
How well does the world to meters work with the world compostion toolset in unreal?
fresh laurel
LOL
mighty carbon
how much RAM do I need for UE4 to run smoothly? I have 8Gb and 4.11 worked smoothly, but 4.13 runs like shit. freezing constantly, especially after I select an actor, or if I drop in an actor into the level (and with that it can take up to 15 min for short frequent freezes to subside). In other words it's unusable on my PC :/
pearl tangle
world to meters works fine. Just cant get it too small or camera clipping becomes a problem
fresh laurel
ok
pearl tangle
are you monitoring your ram usage @mighty carbon ?
mighty carbon
not particularly.. I did when Epic asked me to, but RAM usage didn't change during those freezes. CPU usage spiked to 100% though.
dry fjord
I just told my first group of them to fuck off. I am such a grumpy old man. I even took my shirt off to answer the door.
pearl tangle
give it a monitor and see if you are actually hitting capacity with your ram. with the new windows update im constantly sitting on 100% cpu usage
doesn't sound pedaphilic at all @dry fjord ...
mighty carbon
no, I am not hitting max capacity
pearl tangle
taking your shirt off to greet kids at the door
dry fjord
more hostile old man thing I reckon
it was the most redneck thing I had to hand
when in doubt, man boobs out
fresh laurel
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
dry fjord
see it scared headclot
fresh laurel
π
pearl tangle
or turned him on..
clever sky
His aneurysm exploded in wonderous delight at the sight of antidamage's man boobs
fresh laurel
Tempted to pick up the Art of Combat on the market place
pearl tangle
it looks interesting.
clever sky
Ah cool
dry fjord
20 is too old to be trick or treating
pearl tangle
thought you were talking about the VR game on steam
clever sky
@fresh laurel how well do you think Art Of Combat will work with VR games?
first person VR games
clever sky
What are you buying it for then? Some sort of third person fighting game? π
Haha π yeah.
fresh laurel
Yeah more than likely
clever sky
Fair call.
fresh laurel
MFW VR goes mainstream next year. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyJBPfQv1wQ
clever sky
But we've already been hit by the eternal september D:
fresh laurel
D:
clever sky
@sly chasm How's your Rift? Figured it out? Apparently you might want to check the HDMI connection to the Rift itself (not the end connecting it to the computer). The cable connects to the Rift headset sometime gets loose.
Just pop off the facial interface (foam insert) and then make sure the cable is properly pushed in.
mighty carbon
thinking about getting Intel Celeron Processor G3920 (Skylake architecture) for initial upgrade from my ancient AMD Phenom x3. Is it worth it?
(this isn't to run VR, but for working on VR project as my current PC is just not letting me work with UE4)
clever sky
Sounds painful and underpowered. Even for just working on VR.
But better than what you had before.
mighty carbon
it's about as bad as i3
and it's better than what I have now (quite a bit better)
plus Z170 would allow me eventually go for i7 and 32Gb of RAM
I can't work on anything right now with UE4 since it freezes for 10 sec all the time
dusky moon
Guys, Is there any 3D audio feature in UE that I'm missing ? my sounds in VR sound really flat π
junior prism
Are you using attenuation settings or play sound 2d?
If you're using play sound 2D, you need a slap π
mighty carbon
dusky moon
no I'm using attenuation but still it doesn't feel like 3d
sturdy coral
@dusky moon did you try the Oculus audio plugin?
turn it on then set your attenuation/spatialization settings to HRTF
dusky moon
@sturdy coral well I'm using the Vive , so that might not be for me ?!
sturdy coral
It is significantly better, it isn't perfect though.
dusky moon
awesome ... thanks man
hard light
Oculus audio plugin, you say?
I shall have a look into this
UE4's default audio is not exactly great
mighty carbon
I thought Epic actually added a lot of spatialized audio goodies in 4.12 and added more in 4.13 for PC / consoles
sturdy coral
I hope Google will finally improve android audio latency
mighty carbon
spatialized audio is 3D audio π
and it works for me in the Editor without any plugins
sturdy coral
@mighty carbon not necessarily; it is designed for speakers, etc.
mighty carbon
works in headphones just fine
sturdy coral
@mighty carbon HRTF audio is based on ear shape frequency attenuation, realistic occlusion from your chest and shoulders
I don't think the built in one does most of that
ideally with HRTF you can get something of this quality: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUDTlvagjJA (must listen with headphones/earbuds); but the Oculus plugin isn't quite there yet
sturdy coral
3D spatialization is now possible for stereo assets on PC, Xbox One and PS4 platforms. Stereo spatialization essentially spatializes each input source channel (e.g. Left and Right channels) as if they were mono-sources. The positions of the left and right channels are determined by the sound's emitter position offset by a 3D Stereo Spread, a new parameter in Sound Attenuation Settings.
that isn't the same at all
just lets you adjust the virtual stereo spread, doesn't do HRTF
sturdy coral
Right, I mentioned that above, the Oculus SDK is built in, you just have to turn on the plugin and set HRTF on your attenuation settings
I'm not sure what PSVR devs are using
spring pond
we shipped our vive only thing with the oculus audio SDK for UE4 π
mighty carbon
junior prism
normal thorn
anyone have experience with landscape actors being super slow for GPU?
not sure why this is happening but I'm not at 22ms with nothing visible except the landscape actor
turn that off and back to sub 11ms
probably something I'll just have to hunt down... seems to have to do with lighting the landscape.
pallid echo
@normal thorn How big is the landscape?
normal thorn
not huge
normal thorn
well I don't know when the issue started, b/c playback of everything is still smooth. But my stat unit says otherwise
so I'm going to try a restart
I'll check the profiler next tho
pallid echo
Everyone is different when it comes to noticing lag. For instance myself, I can instantly tell when I drop even a few frames. I have some friends though that can't tell the difference between 60 and 90FPS.
normal thorn
so off everything hidden, except landscale and lights and super slow, hide the lights still slower than I'd expect
yeah I've been testing it pretty steadily along the way tho
so its since whenever that last time I checked was
brb
sturdy coral
@normal thorn What does the shader complexity view look like? And what is taking up the biggest chunk of the GPU profiler view?
If you are on Vive things may seem smooth even though it is running bad because of the new async reprojection stuff, best way to tell is still to wave the controller in front of your face and see if it judders, or open the frame timing graph in steam VR
normal thorn
yeah judders on controllers, so yeah I know its bad
thing is I can hide all that except terrain and still get 22ms
gpu profiler says
which is odd that stat unit says 22ms
maybe b/c its 2x?
hide everything and I get this
except stationary diretional light, skylight, and landscape
lighting is baked
look straight up, 11ms, look at terrain 22ms
everything on except terrain, 11ms
hmm, Made a new project virtual reality template. Test, 11ms. Add terrain, sculpt quickly, play, fill view with terrain 21ms
you have to look around to find the bad fps but you can
same in 12.5 so hhmm
sturdy coral
@normal thorn what is the scene capture for? That can be really expensive. Going any amount over 11ms may kick in interleaved reprojection which may double the GPU number to 22ms. Turn off allow interleaved reprojection in steamvr performance settings, but leave on allow asynchronous reprojection, and see if the stat unit changes to something other than 22ms
@dry fjord yeah, I wish the new iphone allowed devs to get at the depth stream, or even to read from both cameras at once
could make for a decent device that lots would have
dry fjord
not a lot of good solutions
normal thorn
but stat unit says I'm at 22ms
sturdy coral
I've done it with kinect: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r7GtV0S7k8Q
dry fjord
I wasn't getting good depth results
I basically wanted a diffuse and depth map to use in POM
I need to spend more time on trying to extract depth from stereo photos with d4g
sturdy coral
@normal thorn that is interesting, before your scene was 8.98 ignoring the scene capture, now 11.31 =/
dry fjord
if this video ever loads I will lavish praise on your efforts, that first screen looks nice
sturdy coral
I don't think POM is the right tech for it, needs too many layers
normal thorn
no the 8.98 was hiding everything except terrain the scene capture was on the pawn so that still was in effect
sturdy coral
ah ok, so now if you hide everything does it run smooth enough?
normal thorn
well it runs smooth enough now, yes but why does stat unit say 22ms when I capture the frame it says 11ms
sturdy coral
I think it is just interleaved reprojection forces it to take up 22ms
in steam vr settings open performance and pull up the frame timing graph, and it should show that same 11.31ms
sturdy coral
you won't be able to control your users though, most will have interleaved on
sturdy coral
what do you see when you expand post processing in the profiler and sort by highest duration?
dry fjord
nah POM is good for the thing I'm using it for
I switch to real geometry up close
so I suspect I should just model everything
fuck photos
then I can render out a perfect depth map
and export the same scene
normal thorn
@sturdy coral hightest post process is tempralAA @ 0.61
sturdy coral
ah I thought you meant in the context of a mixed reality vid
normal thorn
per eye I think
sturdy coral
you mean for capture?
@normal thorn ah ok, yeah that is pretty normal
and your shader complexity doesn't look bad, I don't know what is hitting you
dry fjord
@sturdy coral nice mixed reality! did you do anything special to get the kinect transform relative to the world, or just set a location for the sensor to transform with?
because I am literally figuring that out right noiw
normal thorn
@sturdy coral thanks for your help there's a few optimizations I can do for sure
dry fjord
I've set an actor with a relative position to my motioncontrollerpawn that I'm using to adjust the kinect results
sturdy coral
I get a rough location by just putting a controller near it and recording it's
dry fjord
that's what I was thinking of doing next
sturdy coral
then hand tweaking in simulate mode
dry fjord
I'm up to trying to re-orient bones based on that offset
sturdy coral
but I changed techniques now to do it all with tessellated stuff
sturdy coral
and you can just calibrate it now by grabbing it and moving and rotating it
until it is in place
dry fjord
true
sturdy coral
so you can have your body in game
dry fjord
you mean the actual diffuse capture
I'm just trying to use it to rig an avatar
with the vive controllers and HMD being the anchors
sturdy coral
you could possibly auto align it by using the skeleton vs the HMD and motion controller positions
dry fjord
yep, that's what I'm doing
forearm bones become IK targets rather than canon positions
sturdy coral
which plugin are you using?
dry fjord
orient the body based on the HMD facing, so it never flips the wrong way, etc
kinect4unreal
you?
sturdy coral
I started with kinect4unreal, then the community one, but ended up having to rewrite it for perf
dry fjord
fair enough
sturdy coral
but I don't have any of the skeletal stuff implemented or anything
dry fjord
my main problem is I'm needing to have a hidden poseablekinectmesh and that's how I get the bone component positions
with just the kinectinterface I can only get joint orientation
which is fine for posing the mesh but useless if I want a bone position
it's not a big deal I guess
what's the community plugin?
sturdy coral
sturdy coral
I'm not sure it will work on 4.13, to get it compiling on 4.12 I had to rip out all of the skeletal stuff from it
because UE4 changed to some new multithreaded skeletal interface and I couldn't figure out how to cleanly merge
pallid echo
pallid echo
Eh, not really a find when I'm the one that posted the bug report. hahaha
More of a, "Been waiting"
pallid echo
Might as well be my first name.
Anywhere I go I introduce myself as Chris and everyone is like, "Oh cool yeah...blah blah"
I say BananaKing932 and everyone goes ape shit.
dry fjord
haha
pallid echo
Its probably not a good thing.
Like Allar just has to say his name and people want him
I gotta say my internet handle
wtf is that shit
lol
dry fjord
I wouldn't mind that level of celebrity
I have a bit of it, it already got me a couple of jobs
dry fjord
β€
midnight tree
are there any locomotion tutorials? trying to setup trackpad locomotion instead of the template provided teleport
granite jacinth
yeah they messing my desktop space up
dry fjord
sometimes there isn't even a task icon for steamvr for that to point to
@mighty carbon angel investors outnumber venture capitalists in VR
pretty much what I expected
there's a lot of interesting stuff in those infographics
almost everyone feels like they're underfunded and over half feel technically challenged
pearl tangle
well its a new technology so nobody is going to be an expert at it straight away
dry fjord
no it's not
not even close
it's just approaching affordability and commercial viability now
it's a bigger jump going from desktop to mobile 3d
what it says is that a lot of VR developers are fairly new overall
the platform is attracting both a lot of funding and a lot of talent but they're not always meeting up
as always there's a pretty good market for quality recruitment developing
we all know lots of VR devs now and how to gauge them, I'm half tempted to do it on the side.
fresh laurel
There was an error contacting the remote service
dry fjord
upvote it
clever sky
Sorry gave a better link
clever sky
Hahaha
clever sky
I thought you were having a stroke for a moment antidamage
'none of what he said made sense at all' sees screenshot 'oh. makes perfect sense'
dry fjord
it's a different person this time
I answered that guy's question Zap
they have everything they need to go on to fix this
clever sky
Cool. I was busy making a video to show them π
dry fjord
do that too! π
the best demo is their VR template though
whoever is familiar with that template can reproduce your steps
clever sky
Pretty much.
Why's shadowplay such a buggy jerk when uploading things?
Entire gallery has disappeared
On another issue... have you guys tried out RIPMotion?
Running in place movement demo for VR locomotion... released a while ago?
dry fjord
that sounds like the least likely form of locomotion I'll ever try
clever sky
Why's that?
clever sky
Ah... got a crook neck?
dry fjord
walking or running in place isn't a natural gait either
always
I have to take the HMD off to fix it every so often
really need a counter-weight probably
clever sky
So that's more an issue with the HMD design?
clever sky
With a more comfortable headset like the PSVR, would you try it?
clever sky
Haha.
dry fjord
even if I wasn't wearing anything running in place sounds shitty
I could be convinced but probably won't be. I'd rather use a moving floor treadmill thing.
clever sky
Hmmm
dry fjord
that I'd run on.
clever sky
What about an Omni?
dry fjord
the slide thing?
dry fjord
I don't think you want to try anything more than a fast walk in that
clever sky
Why's that?
dry fjord
it doesn'
t seem designed for a longer stride
it's teeny
if it were bigger, ok
but even then, when you walk you tend to stay upright
when you run you need to lean, if you're not actually moving you WILL fall over
if you're not leaning it's not a natural gait again
I can't stress strongly enough that an unnatural gait + repetition = injury
RSI
clever sky
Ah
dry fjord
I think walking in place would be better than the omni for potential RSI
I'm just guessing though
clever sky
Your gait must be huge!
dry fjord
I find people have sore feet just from using the vive as it is after an hour, including people like my trainer who is fit as hell
I have a shit gait
clever sky
Yeah, you need appropriate footwear for using the Vive for prolonged periods.
Like... a pair of crocs. π
Also, gotta use the appropriate foot motion. Push off with the balls of your feet when walking/running in place. Don't land hard on them... just use them as the natural suspension system they're supposed to be!
dry fjord
I make everyone take their shoes off. I really need to get that cable on the ceiling.
even in crocs I stand on it constantly
dry fjord
I think that it'll just feel like walking in place and therefore there's a small risk of expected motion not matching what you see
carpet
clever sky
Hmmm.
dry fjord
I'm going to rig something up eventually, the cord annoys the living shit out of me
clever sky
Yeah, that locomotion system I keep talking about - it's a walking/jogging/running in place system
But I've got something in there for you too buddy!
dry fjord
ah RIPmotion
clever sky
RIPMotion is the example
but yeah, that's not my implementation.
It's... not as good.
Because the range of motion is more abrupt.
And also because controlling direction is harder.
dry fjord
the touchpad controllers to the hips thing.. technical requirement?
dry fjord
I imagine it gives you the proper forward vector
but it's also stupidly shit to disable the controllers
clever sky
Exactly.
But no, my implementation allows full motion controller usage
you can even fire a rifle while using it.
Mainly I'm just asking so I can get an idea of the sort of messaging I need to sell this thing with.
I know not everyone out there is a fan of the idea of walking/running in place.
And that's cool. But I think if I can sell people on trying it for about 15 minutes, they'll be converted.
I've already converted a couple guys that kept ragging on it before trying out my system π
dry fjord
needs a video
needs to ensure that there's no motion sickness
that's basically it
make sure you try it with a variety of people in a variety of states of health
have some recommendations for usage limits
clever sky
Yeah sounds good.
Will have a feature introduction and explanation video.
But just put my super motion sick mum through the experience.
And... it doesn't work for her D:
At least not the running on spot bit.
But the rest of it works well π
Also, got some useful usage feedback. Gotta provide an option for people that really can't wrap their heads around controllers at all.
limber rivet
Anyone know if Playstation VR retail unit could work with UE4??
clever sky
You'll need a PS4 Dev Kit
for it to interface through
But as far as I'm aware, you don't need a different VR headset
limber rivet
guessing headtracking doesnt work eh
clever sky
That... and it probably won't output to the headset at all.
limber rivet
theres a way to hookup the pc to it. ill figure somethin out
clever sky
Someone's working on some drivers for it
Not sure what state it's in.
Not sure if that'll emulate PSVR development functionality though.
dry fjord
@clever sky your mum got motion sick?
sly chasm
@clever sky It's weird
clever sky
Yeah she did.
sly chasm
I went to a friend's house and it worked completely
clever sky
walking/running in place is vestibular disruption. It's not a bullet proof solution for motion sickness reduction.
If you're a more experienced user, it's fantastic.
clever sky
What do you mean?
dry fjord
send me something to try
clever sky
Ah
dry fjord
the motion is side to side, not forward. your middle ear is designed to detect that kind of anomalous movement
sly chasm
My friend's computer ran the rift perfectly
dry fjord
if anything I'd get sick quicker I imagine
sly chasm
no problems
clever sky
@sly chasm That sucks π well at least you know the Rift is ok
clever sky
@dry fjord Quite often what one thinks will happen and what does happen are very different things! π I'll strip out a project and package up the walking in place function for you.
sly chasm
and then my computer BSOD'd
clever sky
You'd consider yourself to be an experienced VR user?
@sly chasm Ah.... well... fuck π
dry fjord
cheers, I'll try it for 10 mins and let you know how bad it is
sly chasm
and it still doesnt work
dry fjord
extremely experienced. I know my limits.
clever sky
Cool beans.
dry fjord
I can handle about two-five minutes of phantom motion
and I have tried disrupting my middle ear with movement, doesn't help
let's see if specific movement helps
clever sky
Ok. Well, it certainly won't be right away.
Because I'll need to upload it, which will definetly take a while.
dry fjord
hahaha
nah I'm at work right now
I'll have to try it in a few hours
it's nearly hometime though
pearl tangle
@clever sky id be keen to give your locomotion a try
clever sky
Ok. I'll get you to sign an NDA too. It's a stripped out version though, meaning it's only the 'on the spot' component.
pallid echo
@clever sky Still need more guinea pigs?
clever sky
Just a limited release (i.e. people I actually know :P) at this time. Thanks for the interest though! Gonna drop it for a wide release hopefully at the end of the month.
clever sky
Just incorporating a climbing system in there right now π
clever sky
Yeah, hopefully it'll make waves!
Argh. Climbing is so much fun!
Need to set limits.
Like stamina π
pearl tangle
wouldn't stamina mostly be peoples own stamina anyways?
ive been meaning to check out Climbey on steam. looks like an interesting locomotion setup
junior prism
That's fucking awesome
pearl tangle
good they updated it for kinect v2. most scanning stuff hasn't updated from first kinect which was rubbish
clever sky
@pearl tangle Moving your arms around does take a little real stamina... but compared to real climbing, it's basically no stamina.
Want to emulate some 'realistic-ish' limitations to movement.
signal roost
Are there any guidelines for appropriate Triangle Counts for Meshes ON pc PLATFORM for VR?
pearl tangle
strap weights to the controllers maybe>?
triangles are not really the main constraints on PC, it's lighting and textures that start to cause problems.
signal roost
ok
I am developing a game that has massive units battling, i want to keep fps in vr. The units already have lods. Do you know any other optimization ways?
like this
there are 100 units in the scene , only skeletalm eshes playing idle for test
dry fjord
strange, showed up as images for me
must be edge
not able to show images yet
too hard
dry fjord
okay
And the power just went out
I hadn't saved
Scheduled outage too, I forgot
Fffffffg
junior prism
Arghhhh
junior prism
π
pearl tangle
@signal roost LOD's on your meshes and textures are the way to go. Get pretty agressive with the LOD's on them and only have the full resolution if they are <1m away and you should be getting ok
hard light
large amounts of skeletal meshes could sap performance pretty quickly
may want to do some benchmarking to see what you can actually achieve on target hardware
junior prism
Can always bake them into alembic shit
dusk vigil
So, I've started Unreal development, liking it, but VR work seems a bit funny, with the VR Preview window popping up and hiding everything else. I know I can Shift+F1 to get mouse control, and unhide my editor window, but that's a bit of a hassle to be doing that all the time. Any clues?
clever sky
If you figure it out, let me know. because I've just been dealing with it π
dusk vigil
A quick engine rebuild would apparently sort it out https://forums.unrealengine.com/showthread.php?78048-EPIC-Please-don-t-minimize-editor-during-VR-preview
But I am not keen to start doing stuff like that... Maybe I will just roll a quick non-VR character controller so I can do fast iteration without that hassle
sturdy coral
@signal roost look into vertex animation, there was a stream where they had a crowd of hundreds or thousands of guys running around generated from the particle system instead of actors
signal roost
i think its not suitable for my condition
i have soldiers play rich animations
need skeletal animation i think
and have independent ais
hard light
Google Cardboard apps - which template did people start with and why?
sturdy coral
yeah, may not work; or you could possibly only use it for very distant soldiers
shy merlin
anyone know basic character controller in blueprint?
trying to figure something relatively simple out
mighty carbon
why not to use FPS Template ?
shy merlin
I like having the character body, and doing IK to the head is really simple
here is my question
mighty carbon
then use TPS template and turn it into FPS Template
shy merlin
Yeah i have that functionality in, made the boom shorter and all that, but what icannot get is adjusting the controllers facing with the hmd
it was really simple in fps
I have it so left-right strafes, but i want the direction you are looking while moving forward to actually turn you
as it stands you can run foward, and look to the left and still be heading in the direction you where going
cannot find the proper node to input the HMD orientation to the 3rd person character
mighty carbon
well, just compare the two and see what you need to change in TPS template to make it FPS
there should be no boom for once (in FPS)
shy merlin
without the boom in TPS everything got weird, i just shorted it to 0
mighty carbon
camera is parented to an anchor in FPS
shy merlin
and it still deforms the skeletal mesh correctly
err not deforms
thats head ik
What is driving rotation of the character in TPS is a controller input, add controller input yaw, add controller input pitch
right, i did try doing a scene root in the viewport and anchoring the camera to it
fresh laurel
clever sky
Oh Tech people. You really don't have to talk shit about things you're not working on you know?
"We're not doing that, because we're awesome, and that's shit, obviously."
a year later
"We're doing it, because we're awesome, and it's amazing, obviously."
shy merlin
hahaha
mighty carbon
so $300, potentially low FOV, no motion controllers, and probably low res image
sounds like a solid plan
clever sky
Yooo what are these guys doinggggg?? http://www.nozon.com/presenz
fresh laurel
Β―_(γ)_/Β―
clever sky
prerendered Positional tracking VR videos?
fresh laurel
oh nice
clever sky
Sounds like they're doing prerendered lightspheres.
Kinda like Lytro's immerse camera. Except virtual.
But I thought the amount of data in a lightsphere was huuuuuuugggeeee
Anyway, Starbreeze (the guys behind the StarVR headset partnering up with IMAX have bought that company over.
So... maybe we get to see bad ass 3D movies in the cinemas in future. Imax is probably a great use case for that headset. Because I sure as hell don't want it on my head while I'm moving all over the room.
rare violet
Hey guys! Anyone have experience with VR Networking using motion controllers? I can get 2 players in the same world, update their position, or hmd position, or controllers positions, or any two of those, but whenever I try to do all three at the same time, it glitches out. Any ideas on getting all the data to replicate easily? It's all lan...even tried packaging all the data into a struct and passing one call at a time, but same issues
clever sky
That sounds like a bitch. But... are you sending data at full rate?
Or intermittently and lerping between positions?
Because I'd suggest trying that if you haven't already!
I can't say this with authority though, as I haven't done any VR networking stuff.
rare violet
how do i know if im sending at full rate?
clever sky
is it sending per tick?
rare violet
im doing an RPC on tick (eek i know, dont know another way to do it w/ motion controllers)
clever sky
Figure out some way of altering the rate of transmission
rare violet
i currently have a delay of 0.022 on each tick
bringing it down to about 45 calls per seccond ish
clever sky
that sounds like 90 ticks with a delay of 0.022.
rare violet
may ahve done the math wrong
its so weird because any 2 of the things being sent work perfectly
when I add the 3rd it just breaks down
clever sky
All of it?
rare violet
ahh!
like keep some index that counts up and decides which to send
i like that idea
clever sky
Yeah.
rare violet
i also think i updated some lan settings for network speed
clever sky
Cool. Alright! Good luck!
clever sky
and if it blows everything yup, I wasn't here!
clever sky
D:
rare violet
looking promising! building to test on multiple machines on lan! ty π
dude!! @clever sky thank u so much!! π
it worked!
clever sky
Niceeee
Glad to help.
Also glad to know if the issue ever hits me, I'll know how to solve it!
haha π
rare violet
π
vocal cobalt
Hey, has anybody put human rigged models into GearVR games? I have a model I bought off turbosquid and another I made with MakeHuman, but both just totally trash the framerate when I put them in my game.
rare violet
@vocal cobalt - I am not positive on this, but I know my 3D team puts models thru some sort of optimization web utility that removes all sorts of uneeded data and drops the vertex count
vocal cobalt
Yeah, Blender has Decimate and UE4 has Simplygon. I've used Decimate to significantly reduce the # of vertices. Do you know what the name of the utility is?
Is 31 bones too many for a rig in a mobile VR game?
wicked oak
ther is also InstaLOD
junior prism
UE4 has a built in one
and it's mad good
Also @dry fjord
Re-reading that infographic
"1.2% of people don't use 3D engines to develop for VR"
the fuck?
wicked oak
not even strange i think
Unity + Unreal
htcVive steam games are almost all Unity
and PSVR games are almost all UE4
junior prism
@wicked oak Are you talking about the infographic? (It's pinned)
wicked oak
yeah
most devs are unity or unreal
im even surprised 6% say they do stuff with cryengine
i come from Madrid Gaming Experience game convention
absolute shit tons of e-sports, and a huge part of it was covered with Vive demo stations
easily 20-30 of them
i was on the indie corner
shy merlin
im getting some weird functionality issues on my home computer, that doesnt happen with oculus on my work computer
vocal cobalt
@junior prism Are you talking about Simplygon?
shy merlin
one is, in simulation mode (not VR preview) the HMD stays active and messes with the camera
normally at work the HMD is sleeping when that sensor doesnt sense someone wearing it
junior prism
Good
700k to 2k with barely visible visual difference
Like absolutely mental shit
wicked oak
have you compared it to instaLOD and sympligon?
vocal cobalt
Does it just work?
dry fjord
I saw that too
vocal cobalt
Or is it like a plugin that has to be activated?
dry fjord
It's in the static mesh editor window with build settings etc
The 2% with no 3d engine are probably doing viewmaster
wicked oak
or a 360 movie
vocal cobalt
Going to LOD Import and saying Import LOD level 1 doesnt do anything π¦
maybe I don't get how LOD works, but I don't care how far away the camera is, I just need to get my model down to a lot lower polygons so it an actually render like it needs to
without dropping the framerate to like 30fps lol
It says auto mesh reduction is unavailable π¦
hard light
the infographic percentages also add up to 140%, so go figure, heh
(obviously it's because people could tick multiple boxes)
vocal cobalt
So it's not actually the poly count... looks like the rig is the problem π¦
even the classic ue4 mannequin animations cause juddering...
mighty carbon
like I said, there is a limit on bones and influence on mobile
there is mobile mannequin on Marketplace
get that one, try it
neon egret
Yo, does someone know how to actively change the PC Preview Window?
Aka, having different UI etc on it?
So that I have the 3D UI in my Vive, like normal, but the PC Preview window has custom UI
dry fjord
which part of the UI?
neon egret
Well any UI